Re: What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event | AppleVis

[Scott Granados]

David, I always learn something new from your posts, thank you.

Very interesting the numbers you provided.  Less than 0.1%, wow!

> On Oct 29, 2016, at 5:05 AM, David Chittenden <dchitten...@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> Yep, blindness, which includes vision level of 20/200 (6/60) is less than 
> 0.5% of the total population. So, less than 0.5% of Apple's customers use 
> VoiceOver. In fact, using numbers I was able to find a few years ago, I 
> calculated that only one in one thousand people use VoiceOver becouse their 
> vision is that bad (0.1%).
> 
> The myth that 1 in 5 people, or 20% of people, have disabilities is actually 
> a gross exageration. When I worked in the disability office at a university, 
> 13% to 14% of the student body had disabilities, and 11.5% to 12.5% had 
> cognitive (mental) or emotional disabilities. Roughly 4% had physical 
> disabilities. The disparity covers those who had both physical and cognitive 
> disabilities.
> 
> The 20% number is based on the estimation statement that, 20% of people will 
> experience a significant disability for at least six consecutive months 
> during their lifetime. So, why is this 20% number, or 1 in 5 regularly used? 
> Because, it looks better for funding and for lobbying.
> 
> David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
> Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
> Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On 29/10/2016, at 18:29, Simon Fogarty <si...@blinky-net.com> wrote:
>> 
>> On this one,
>> 
>> I'd really suggest that people watch the start of the presentation if they 
>> haven't seen it already,
>> 
>> Apple has a video at the start of the presentation which displays what they 
>> are doing with regard to accessibility for the disabled, not just blind / VI 
>> but  other forms of disability also.
>> 
>> I don't know of any other main stream technology company that takes 
>> accessibility in to account like apple do with their products,
>> 
>> I said main stream, FS and gw micro aren't mainstream 
>> 
>> The disabled are only a small percentage of the apple user environment 
>> -Original Message-
>> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
>> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Tim Kilburn
>> Sent: Saturday, 29 October 2016 8:10 AM
>> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>> Subject: Re: What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event | AppleVis
>> 
>> Hi,
>> 
>> It's OK to express concern, it's OK to wonder, but people need to realize 
>> that these decisions are not made without accessibility in mind.  If a 
>> change is made such as the removal of the F-keys, then there will just be 
>> different keystrokes to accomplish task that originally required those 
>> F-keys.  No need to jump on a band-wagon saying that we, as a blind 
>> community, are being left out in the cold.  That's simply unfair and 
>> unproductive.  Those of us who have older Mac models where the Function bar 
>> is not present should see no change in behavior, as the MacOS will just know 
>> that your specific Mac isn't capable of Function Bar actions..  It's no 
>> different than what happens now when you connect a non-Apple keyboard, the 
>> MacOS figures it out and your media keys etc. don't function like they do on 
>> an Apple keyboard.
>> 
>> Just as a prediction, because I'd rather look forward positively, with the 
>> introduction of a finger-print sensor on the power button, might it be 
>> possible that the power button become similar to the Home button on an iOS 
>> device.  That is, VO could be invoked by a triple-tap on the power button?  
>> If Apple is moving towards less differentiation between the iOS and MacOS 
>> experience, it's possible.There are usually all sorts of options to make 
>> things work, maybe different than what we're accustomed to, but 
>> possibilities none-the-less.
>> 
>> Later...
>> 
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>> On Oct 28, 2016, at 12:36 PM, E.T. <ancient.ali...@icloud.com> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Progress is not without pain. What would be better, stagnation? If Apple 
>>> was 100% focused on the blind user share of the market, it might be 
>>> different?
>>> 
>>> History repeats itself, over and over. Look at the headphone jack, how much 
>>> grief that caused right up to release day. And as soon as release day came 
>>> and went, that noise died with a whimper. So too will the noise about the 
>>> TouchBar.
>>> 
>>> And next year this cycle will repeat again...and again.
>>> 
>>> From E.T.'s Keybo

Re: What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event | AppleVis

[Scott Granados]

There’s even a touch bar simulator for developers with out a real touch bar.

> On Oct 29, 2016, at 1:25 AM, Simon Fogarty <si...@blinky-net.com> wrote:
> 
> There will be no change,
> 
> It's only in the notebook line that the touch bar is currently appearing.
> 
> Think about this,
> 
> Sierra is out already 
> And the use of it with a standard keyboard hasn't changed from what we've 
> been use to over the passed god knows how many years.
> 
> I would think that an extended keyboard with a touch bar gets made available 
> sometime in the near future.
> 
> But for now  the iMac and mac mini will have to continue to use the standard 
> keyboards.
> 
> 
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of christopher hallsworth
> Sent: Saturday, 29 October 2016 8:10 AM
> To: Macvisionaries <macvisionaries@googlegroups.com>
> Subject: Re: What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event | AppleVis
> 
> There was no mention of any of their desktops being refreshed so it looks 
> like you will have to stick with old to ancient hardware, for now at least.
>> On 28 Oct 2016, at 19:33, Kawal Gucukoglu <kgli...@icloud.com> wrote:
>> 
>> So what will happen for those people who have I Mac and Mac Mini's who have 
>> not changed their computers for a number of years as there will be no touch 
>> bars etc.  So how will that be accommodated?  I have not listened to the 
>> event as yet.
>> 
>> Kawal.
>>> On 28 Oct 2016, at 19:06, christopher hallsworth <challswor...@icloud.com> 
>>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Well you know what? Found out through the VoiceOver Getting Started Guide 
>>> that as part of the new and changed key commands set for VoiceOver under 
>>> macOS Sierra, VO-- (hyphen) will decrease the system volume and vo-= 
>>> (equals) will increase the system volume. Actually, I will correct this by 
>>> saying vo-- (hyphen) is definitely new, but vo-= (equals) is actually a 
>>> changed one from whatever it was before.
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> On 28 Oct 2016, at 17:21, - <dandun...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Apple will almost certainly be forced to add yet another keystroke for 
>>>> doing what now is the direct press of a function key,  volume for example.
>>>> 
>>>> This is because when you cram multiple levels of function into a touch bar 
>>>> there has to be a way to choose among levels.
>>>> 
>>>> There are far far too many pretzel keypresses now without adding more.
>>>> On Fri, 28 Oct 2016, gs wrote:
>>>> 
>>>>> I care about access to the function keys in general and not just what 
>>>>> currently happens when one presses Command F5. I use the function keys 
>>>>> for adjusting screen brightness and volume, etc. I wonder how all the 
>>>>> other items currently available via the function keys will be handled?
>>>>> 
>>>>> On Oct 28, 2016, at 6:37 AM, Brandt Steenkamp 
>>>>> <brandt.steenk...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>> There we go,
>>>>> 
>>>>> Triple-tapping power sounds like the most consistent and logical way to 
>>>>> go.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Holding command down and tapping the touch bar also sounds okay, but not 
>>>>> like something apple would do.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Warm regards,
>>>>> 
>>>>> Brandt Steenkamp
>>>>> 
>>>>> Sent from my Macbook Pro
>>>>> 
>>>>> Contact:
>>>>> 
>>>>> Phone:
>>>>> Private: +27 (0)60 525 9181  For technical 
>>>>> support with iOS: +27 (0)78 120 5013 
>>>>> 
>>>>> Email: brandt.steenk...@gmail.com 
>>>>> <mailto:brandt.steenk...@gmail.com>
>>>>> 
>>>>> Twitter: @brandtsteenkamp <http://www.twitter.com/brandtsteenkamp>
>>>>>> On 28 Oct 2016, at 11:21 AM, Ray Foret jr <rforet7...@comcast.net 
>>>>>> <mailto:rforet7...@comcast.net>> wrote:
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> IF Apple is truly going for consistancy, I have a feeling I know how we 
>>>>>> will turn on Voice Over with the new touch bar.  I don?t know this for 
>>>>>> sure:  but, I?d be willing to guess that to turn on Voice Over, you 
>>>>>> simpl

Re: What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event | AppleVis

[David Chittenden]

Yep, blindness, which includes vision level of 20/200 (6/60) is less than 0.5% 
of the total population. So, less than 0.5% of Apple's customers use VoiceOver. 
In fact, using numbers I was able to find a few years ago, I calculated that 
only one in one thousand people use VoiceOver becouse their vision is that bad 
(0.1%).

The myth that 1 in 5 people, or 20% of people, have disabilities is actually a 
gross exageration. When I worked in the disability office at a university, 13% 
to 14% of the student body had disabilities, and 11.5% to 12.5% had cognitive 
(mental) or emotional disabilities. Roughly 4% had physical disabilities. The 
disparity covers those who had both physical and cognitive disabilities.

The 20% number is based on the estimation statement that, 20% of people will 
experience a significant disability for at least six consecutive months during 
their lifetime. So, why is this 20% number, or 1 in 5 regularly used? Because, 
it looks better for funding and for lobbying.

David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
Sent from my iPhone

> On 29/10/2016, at 18:29, Simon Fogarty <si...@blinky-net.com> wrote:
> 
> On this one,
> 
> I'd really suggest that people watch the start of the presentation if they 
> haven't seen it already,
> 
> Apple has a video at the start of the presentation which displays what they 
> are doing with regard to accessibility for the disabled, not just blind / VI 
> but  other forms of disability also.
> 
> I don't know of any other main stream technology company that takes 
> accessibility in to account like apple do with their products,
> 
> I said main stream, FS and gw micro aren't mainstream 
> 
> The disabled are only a small percentage of the apple user environment 
> -Original Message-
> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Tim Kilburn
> Sent: Saturday, 29 October 2016 8:10 AM
> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
> Subject: Re: What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event | AppleVis
> 
> Hi,
> 
> It's OK to express concern, it's OK to wonder, but people need to realize 
> that these decisions are not made without accessibility in mind.  If a change 
> is made such as the removal of the F-keys, then there will just be different 
> keystrokes to accomplish task that originally required those F-keys.  No need 
> to jump on a band-wagon saying that we, as a blind community, are being left 
> out in the cold.  That's simply unfair and unproductive.  Those of us who 
> have older Mac models where the Function bar is not present should see no 
> change in behavior, as the MacOS will just know that your specific Mac isn't 
> capable of Function Bar actions..  It's no different than what happens now 
> when you connect a non-Apple keyboard, the MacOS figures it out and your 
> media keys etc. don't function like they do on an Apple keyboard.
> 
> Just as a prediction, because I'd rather look forward positively, with the 
> introduction of a finger-print sensor on the power button, might it be 
> possible that the power button become similar to the Home button on an iOS 
> device.  That is, VO could be invoked by a triple-tap on the power button?  
> If Apple is moving towards less differentiation between the iOS and MacOS 
> experience, it's possible.There are usually all sorts of options to make 
> things work, maybe different than what we're accustomed to, but possibilities 
> none-the-less.
> 
> Later...
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On Oct 28, 2016, at 12:36 PM, E.T. <ancient.ali...@icloud.com> wrote:
>> 
>>  Progress is not without pain. What would be better, stagnation? If Apple 
>> was 100% focused on the blind user share of the market, it might be 
>> different?
>> 
>>  History repeats itself, over and over. Look at the headphone jack, how much 
>> grief that caused right up to release day. And as soon as release day came 
>> and went, that noise died with a whimper. So too will the noise about the 
>> TouchBar.
>> 
>>  And next year this cycle will repeat again...and again.
>> 
>> From E.T.'s Keyboard...
>> Without H2O there is no life!
>> ancient.ali...@icloud.com
>> 
>>> On 10/28/2016 9:21 AM, - wrote:
>>> 
>>> Apple will almost certainly be forced to add yet another keystroke 
>>> for doing what now is the direct press of a function key,  volume for 
>>> example.
>>> 
>>> This is because when you cram multiple levels of function into a 
>>> touch bar there has to be a way to choose among levels.
>>> 
>>> There are far far too many pretzel keypresses now without adding more.
>>>> On

RE: What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event | AppleVis

[Simon Fogarty]

Hi Scott,

 What your saying re the watch,

I have the series 2 and it's performance is much better than the Origional 
which I also have 

 As I don't need 2 very good watchs that do pretty much the same thing I'm 
going to give my nephew who turns 18 in November the original watch  
With the hope he will get years of use out of it 

My current notebook will go to one of my neaces if they haven't got a newer one 
before I do.

Otherwise I'll probably keep it for a travel device 
-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of Scott Granados
Sent: Saturday, 29 October 2016 2:20 PM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event | AppleVis

First off and most importantly, do tell Sabahattin hello and I hope he’s well, 
it’s been a while.  Like you, I too would listen to him, he’s a very smart and 
technically skilled fellow. I have a great deal of respect for him and hope 
he’s well.

Next, one of the good things about Apple is they have a higher than average 
resale value.  Even though  I do well, I do sell off old equipment or donate it 
to family or less fortunate.  There’s another fellow on the Android list who I 
know is on hard times for example and I’ve been sending him old network 
equipment so he can keep things going and decrease his costs.  So I get that.  
All I mean to say is companies don’t support things over time because they just 
can’t as the product as changed to much.  As long as something is serving it’s 
need though by all means go with it.  Nobody would argue against working with 
what you have available.
An iMac is a major investment.  The iMac especially is at the top end 
of the consumer price spectrum.  You load one up with all the features and 
you’re headed to 4000 dollars US or more before you know it.  That’s a lot of  
chaching.  
I know you didn’t buy the watch because of the camera.  I’ve held the 
new one, I disagree it feels like a toy but I love the one I have and will be 
upgrading just for the speed and will hand my present model down to my father 
who loves technology but doesn’t have the funds to buy the gadgets he wants.  
He loves showing them off to his friends though so I’m more than happy to keep 
him in equipment.  I remember how hard he worked so I had the things I needed 
as a kid so it’s the absolute least i can do in return.

Your iMac will do fine until you need to upgrade it in the future when you have 
a specific reason to.  I am also sure you can sell it off or give it to someone 
less fortunate who would benefit.
 

> On Oct 28, 2016, at 4:49 PM, Kawal Gucukoglu <kgli...@icloud.com> wrote:
> 
> Never believe what someone says about buying gadgets as although I might buy 
> the latest I phone, I am definitely not buying the latest I watch.  I 
> cancelled my orders for the watch when Sabahattin told me that he did not 
> think too much about the watch as he said that the watch reminded him of a 
> toy and the watches were running a bit better but still slow.  He's another 
> person who I'd trust telling me what he really thinks about Apple products 
> but at times he goes on about putting windows on his machines and going to 
> Microsoft, but he will not do it.  I remember because of seeing his first Mac 
> Book which had that funny voice on it that whispered that I decided to get on 
> to the Apple wagon.
> 
> I think I told you the other day I'd wait for a watch with a Camera on it.
> 
> I also know Scott if a brand new I Mac came out in a few years with something 
> special on it, no doubt I'd get it but just now, my computers are running 
> just fine with the latest Operating systems.  If I am to buy the latest 
> computers then I need to sell computers at a good and reasonable price.
>> On 28 Oct 2016, at 21:16, Scott Granados <scott.grana...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> 
>> Nobody says you have to, you’re missing the point.  As long as it works for 
>> you use it.  Apple seems to run on 4 or 5 year cycles with both the phones 
>> and to some degree the computers.  The big cutoffs seem to be when they 
>> change processor types either from RISK to Intel and so forth.  Your 2012 
>> iMac will do fine for a few more years.  You only have to upgrade when you 
>> want or are able to upgrade.  Sierra should run just fine on that machine.  
>> Apple doesn’t have to change it’s pricing model just because you don’t make 
>> enough.:)  They fill a market and if nobody buys their gear they will change 
>> but that’s not the case.  They sell millions of units so obviously have 
>> something right.  There’s nobody saying your computer needs replacing, use 
>> it in good health as long as you like.  Just at some point technology 
>> dictates that it will be to old to update.
>>

RE: What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event | AppleVis

[Simon Fogarty]

Hi,

I work with a number of iMacs at work that are from 2016 back to 2011 and a 
couple that are 2009 
I have a mac mini on my desk which is 2012 but I only received in 2014 
These machines all still work great but  in some cases the OS isn't the latest 
but it's working fine and gives me or my colleagues the ability to go back to 
something older if we need it.

 You make do with what you've got 



-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of Kawal Gucukoglu
Sent: Saturday, 29 October 2016 9:02 AM
To: Macvisionaries <macvisionaries@googlegroups.com>
Subject: Re: What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event | AppleVis

So what about my I Mac Scott?  I think you remember what type of processor and 
what kind of memory I have, is that too old although it does run with no 
problems.  Do apple say that a late 2012 I Mac and a 2014 MacMini will not able 
to run new software?  I'm not being unreasonable, I'm being practical, as one 
can't buy a new piece of kit every two or three years depending on one's 
circumstances.  Unlike a person who has a well paid job and who may get a good 
salary I'd say yes, you could.  But for someone who may not have a job or that 
the job does not keep up-to-date with pay because of a charity or something 
cannot buy a computer every two or three years.  This is what is called 
practical Scott.
> On 28 Oct 2016, at 20:52, Scott Granados <scott.grana...@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> Kawal, it’s not that easy now come on that’s just unreasonable.
> 
> Computers grow old like everything else.  That G4 processor your Mac used to 
> have isn’t usable with new software.  The compilers don’t work and it’s just 
> impractical.  During the keynote yesterday they mentioned that the current 
> MacBook Pro is over 6.5 million times faster than the original MacBook sold.  
> Not twice as fast, not ten times as fast, 6.5 million times as fast.  It’s 
> just not practical to expect that old hardware is usable for anything other 
> than a museum piece or boat anchor. 
> 
> Using your logic we’d still be jamming punch cards in to Univac just because 
> it still works.  Sorry but no go.  
> 
> Here’s a fun fact illustrating my point.  Your iPhone has more computing 
> power than the entire Apollo program did in the history of it’s existence.  
> In fact, your iPhone has more computer power than existed in the known 
> universe up through sometime in the early 80s.  I personally have turned old 
> macs in to fish tanks which is about all you can do with some old hardware 
> and my mother’s basement is a small museum including a PDP-11 and several 
> high end work stations that today aren’t even worth the power they consume.  
> It’s just progress.
> 
>> On Oct 28, 2016, at 3:46 PM, Kawal Gucukoglu <kgli...@icloud.com> wrote:
>> 
>> A way of saying, get rid of your computer.  Why on earth should one get rid 
>> of a computer if it's going strong, no need to not let it update.  No wonder 
>> we live in a throw-away society as manufacturers encourage land fills and 
>> alike for Governments to say that there is no place to build houses etc, 
>> because we need land to accommodate rubbish and so on.  It's manufacturers 
>> faults that 1: we are getting unhealthier because of bad food that is 
>> produced.  2: there is not enough space to accommodate the growing 
>> population because manufacturers are wishing for people to buy new computers 
>> and so we won't let your computer which is in perfect condition to update 
>> but we have decided that you need another regardless if you can afford it or 
>> not.  Oh wow.
>> 
>> Kawal.
>>> On 28 Oct 2016, at 20:32, Scott Granados <scott.grana...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> 
>>> It won’t be, nothing changes you do things as you always have.  At some 
>>> point, your computer just won’t receive any more updates.  The operating 
>>> system will eventually not be compatible because it’s to new.  Sort of the 
>>> standard way of things happening.
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> On Oct 28, 2016, at 2:33 PM, Kawal Gucukoglu <kgli...@icloud.com> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> So what will happen for those people who have I Mac and Mac Mini's who 
>>>> have not changed their computers for a number of years as there will be no 
>>>> touch bars etc.  So how will that be accommodated?  I have not listened to 
>>>> the event as yet.
>>>> 
>>>> Kawal.
>>>>> On 28 Oct 2016, at 19:06, christopher hallsworth 
>>>>> <challswor...@icloud.com> wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>> Well you know what? Found out through the VoiceOver Gettin

RE: What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event | AppleVis

[Simon Fogarty]

On this one,

I'd really suggest that people watch the start of the presentation if they 
haven't seen it already,

Apple has a video at the start of the presentation which displays what they are 
doing with regard to accessibility for the disabled, not just blind / VI but  
other forms of disability also.

 I don't know of any other main stream technology company that takes 
accessibility in to account like apple do with their products,

 I said main stream, FS and gw micro aren't mainstream 

The disabled are only a small percentage of the apple user environment 
-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of Tim Kilburn
Sent: Saturday, 29 October 2016 8:10 AM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event | AppleVis

Hi,

It's OK to express concern, it's OK to wonder, but people need to realize that 
these decisions are not made without accessibility in mind.  If a change is 
made such as the removal of the F-keys, then there will just be different 
keystrokes to accomplish task that originally required those F-keys.  No need 
to jump on a band-wagon saying that we, as a blind community, are being left 
out in the cold.  That's simply unfair and unproductive.  Those of us who have 
older Mac models where the Function bar is not present should see no change in 
behavior, as the MacOS will just know that your specific Mac isn't capable of 
Function Bar actions..  It's no different than what happens now when you 
connect a non-Apple keyboard, the MacOS figures it out and your media keys etc. 
don't function like they do on an Apple keyboard.

Just as a prediction, because I'd rather look forward positively, with the 
introduction of a finger-print sensor on the power button, might it be possible 
that the power button become similar to the Home button on an iOS device.  That 
is, VO could be invoked by a triple-tap on the power button?  If Apple is 
moving towards less differentiation between the iOS and MacOS experience, it's 
possible.There are usually all sorts of options to make things work, maybe 
different than what we're accustomed to, but possibilities none-the-less.

Later...
 

Sent from my iPhone

> On Oct 28, 2016, at 12:36 PM, E.T. <ancient.ali...@icloud.com> wrote:
> 
>   Progress is not without pain. What would be better, stagnation? If Apple 
> was 100% focused on the blind user share of the market, it might be different?
> 
>   History repeats itself, over and over. Look at the headphone jack, how much 
> grief that caused right up to release day. And as soon as release day came 
> and went, that noise died with a whimper. So too will the noise about the 
> TouchBar.
> 
>   And next year this cycle will repeat again...and again.
> 
> From E.T.'s Keyboard...
>  Without H2O there is no life!
> ancient.ali...@icloud.com
> 
>> On 10/28/2016 9:21 AM, - wrote:
>> 
>> Apple will almost certainly be forced to add yet another keystroke 
>> for doing what now is the direct press of a function key,  volume for 
>> example.
>> 
>> This is because when you cram multiple levels of function into a 
>> touch bar there has to be a way to choose among levels.
>> 
>> There are far far too many pretzel keypresses now without adding more.
>>> On Fri, 28 Oct 2016, gs wrote:
>>> 
>>> I care about access to the function keys in general and not just 
>>> what currently happens when one presses Command F5. I use the 
>>> function keys for adjusting screen brightness and volume, etc. I 
>>> wonder how all the other items currently available via the function keys 
>>> will be handled?
>>> 
>>> On Oct 28, 2016, at 6:37 AM, Brandt Steenkamp 
>>> <brandt.steenk...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> 
>>> There we go,
>>> 
>>> Triple-tapping power sounds like the most consistent and logical way 
>>> to go.
>>> 
>>> Holding command down and tapping the touch bar also sounds okay, but 
>>> not like something apple would do.
>>> 
>>> Warm regards,
>>> 
>>> Brandt Steenkamp
>>> 
>>> Sent from my Macbook Pro
>>> 
>>> Contact:
>>> 
>>> Phone:
>>> Private: +27 (0)60 525 9181  For technical 
>>> support with iOS: +27 (0)78 120 5013 
>>> 
>>> Email: brandt.steenk...@gmail.com 
>>> <mailto:brandt.steenk...@gmail.com>
>>> 
>>> Twitter: @brandtsteenkamp <http://www.twitter.com/brandtsteenkamp>
>>>> On 28 Oct 2016, at 11:21 AM, Ray Foret jr <rforet7...@comcast.net 
>>>> <mailto:rforet7...@comcast.net>> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> IF Apple is 

RE: What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event | AppleVis

[Simon Fogarty]

On this one,

I'd really suggest that people watch the start of the presentation if they 
haven't seen it already,

Apple has a video at the start of the presentation which displays what they are 
doing with regard to accessibility for the disabled, not just blind / VI but  
other forms of disability also.

 I don't know of any other main stream technology company that takes 
accessibility in to account like apple do with their products,

 I said main stream, FS and gw micro aren't mainstream 

The disabled are only a small percentage of the apple user environment 
-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of Tim Kilburn
Sent: Saturday, 29 October 2016 8:10 AM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event | AppleVis

Hi,

It's OK to express concern, it's OK to wonder, but people need to realize that 
these decisions are not made without accessibility in mind.  If a change is 
made such as the removal of the F-keys, then there will just be different 
keystrokes to accomplish task that originally required those F-keys.  No need 
to jump on a band-wagon saying that we, as a blind community, are being left 
out in the cold.  That's simply unfair and unproductive.  Those of us who have 
older Mac models where the Function bar is not present should see no change in 
behavior, as the MacOS will just know that your specific Mac isn't capable of 
Function Bar actions..  It's no different than what happens now when you 
connect a non-Apple keyboard, the MacOS figures it out and your media keys etc. 
don't function like they do on an Apple keyboard.

Just as a prediction, because I'd rather look forward positively, with the 
introduction of a finger-print sensor on the power button, might it be possible 
that the power button become similar to the Home button on an iOS device.  That 
is, VO could be invoked by a triple-tap on the power button?  If Apple is 
moving towards less differentiation between the iOS and MacOS experience, it's 
possible.There are usually all sorts of options to make things work, maybe 
different than what we're accustomed to, but possibilities none-the-less.

Later...
 

Sent from my iPhone

> On Oct 28, 2016, at 12:36 PM, E.T. <ancient.ali...@icloud.com> wrote:
> 
>   Progress is not without pain. What would be better, stagnation? If Apple 
> was 100% focused on the blind user share of the market, it might be different?
> 
>   History repeats itself, over and over. Look at the headphone jack, how much 
> grief that caused right up to release day. And as soon as release day came 
> and went, that noise died with a whimper. So too will the noise about the 
> TouchBar.
> 
>   And next year this cycle will repeat again...and again.
> 
> From E.T.'s Keyboard...
>  Without H2O there is no life!
> ancient.ali...@icloud.com
> 
>> On 10/28/2016 9:21 AM, - wrote:
>> 
>> Apple will almost certainly be forced to add yet another keystroke 
>> for doing what now is the direct press of a function key,  volume for 
>> example.
>> 
>> This is because when you cram multiple levels of function into a 
>> touch bar there has to be a way to choose among levels.
>> 
>> There are far far too many pretzel keypresses now without adding more.
>>> On Fri, 28 Oct 2016, gs wrote:
>>> 
>>> I care about access to the function keys in general and not just 
>>> what currently happens when one presses Command F5. I use the 
>>> function keys for adjusting screen brightness and volume, etc. I 
>>> wonder how all the other items currently available via the function keys 
>>> will be handled?
>>> 
>>> On Oct 28, 2016, at 6:37 AM, Brandt Steenkamp 
>>> <brandt.steenk...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> 
>>> There we go,
>>> 
>>> Triple-tapping power sounds like the most consistent and logical way 
>>> to go.
>>> 
>>> Holding command down and tapping the touch bar also sounds okay, but 
>>> not like something apple would do.
>>> 
>>> Warm regards,
>>> 
>>> Brandt Steenkamp
>>> 
>>> Sent from my Macbook Pro
>>> 
>>> Contact:
>>> 
>>> Phone:
>>> Private: +27 (0)60 525 9181  For technical 
>>> support with iOS: +27 (0)78 120 5013 
>>> 
>>> Email: brandt.steenk...@gmail.com 
>>> <mailto:brandt.steenk...@gmail.com>
>>> 
>>> Twitter: @brandtsteenkamp <http://www.twitter.com/brandtsteenkamp>
>>>> On 28 Oct 2016, at 11:21 AM, Ray Foret jr <rforet7...@comcast.net 
>>>> <mailto:rforet7...@comcast.net>> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> IF Apple is 

RE: What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event | AppleVis

[Simon Fogarty]

There will be no change,

 It's only in the notebook line that the touch bar is currently appearing.

 Think about this,

 Sierra is out already 
And the use of it with a standard keyboard hasn't changed from what we've been 
use to over the passed god knows how many years.

I would think that an extended keyboard with a touch bar gets made available 
sometime in the near future.

But for now  the iMac and mac mini will have to continue to use the standard 
keyboards.



-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of christopher hallsworth
Sent: Saturday, 29 October 2016 8:10 AM
To: Macvisionaries <macvisionaries@googlegroups.com>
Subject: Re: What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event | AppleVis

There was no mention of any of their desktops being refreshed so it looks like 
you will have to stick with old to ancient hardware, for now at least.
> On 28 Oct 2016, at 19:33, Kawal Gucukoglu <kgli...@icloud.com> wrote:
> 
> So what will happen for those people who have I Mac and Mac Mini's who have 
> not changed their computers for a number of years as there will be no touch 
> bars etc.  So how will that be accommodated?  I have not listened to the 
> event as yet.
> 
> Kawal.
>> On 28 Oct 2016, at 19:06, christopher hallsworth <challswor...@icloud.com> 
>> wrote:
>> 
>> Well you know what? Found out through the VoiceOver Getting Started Guide 
>> that as part of the new and changed key commands set for VoiceOver under 
>> macOS Sierra, VO-- (hyphen) will decrease the system volume and vo-= 
>> (equals) will increase the system volume. Actually, I will correct this by 
>> saying vo-- (hyphen) is definitely new, but vo-= (equals) is actually a 
>> changed one from whatever it was before.
>> 
>> 
>>> On 28 Oct 2016, at 17:21, - <dandun...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Apple will almost certainly be forced to add yet another keystroke for 
>>> doing what now is the direct press of a function key,  volume for example.
>>> 
>>> This is because when you cram multiple levels of function into a touch bar 
>>> there has to be a way to choose among levels.
>>> 
>>> There are far far too many pretzel keypresses now without adding more.
>>> On Fri, 28 Oct 2016, gs wrote:
>>> 
>>>> I care about access to the function keys in general and not just what 
>>>> currently happens when one presses Command F5. I use the function keys for 
>>>> adjusting screen brightness and volume, etc. I wonder how all the other 
>>>> items currently available via the function keys will be handled?
>>>> 
>>>> On Oct 28, 2016, at 6:37 AM, Brandt Steenkamp <brandt.steenk...@gmail.com> 
>>>> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> There we go,
>>>> 
>>>> Triple-tapping power sounds like the most consistent and logical way to go.
>>>> 
>>>> Holding command down and tapping the touch bar also sounds okay, but not 
>>>> like something apple would do.
>>>> 
>>>> Warm regards,
>>>> 
>>>> Brandt Steenkamp
>>>> 
>>>> Sent from my Macbook Pro
>>>> 
>>>> Contact:
>>>> 
>>>> Phone:
>>>> Private: +27 (0)60 525 9181  For technical 
>>>> support with iOS: +27 (0)78 120 5013 
>>>> 
>>>> Email: brandt.steenk...@gmail.com 
>>>> <mailto:brandt.steenk...@gmail.com>
>>>> 
>>>> Twitter: @brandtsteenkamp <http://www.twitter.com/brandtsteenkamp>
>>>>> On 28 Oct 2016, at 11:21 AM, Ray Foret jr <rforet7...@comcast.net 
>>>>> <mailto:rforet7...@comcast.net>> wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>> IF Apple is truly going for consistancy, I have a feeling I know how we 
>>>>> will turn on Voice Over with the new touch bar.  I don?t know this for 
>>>>> sure:  but, I?d be willing to guess that to turn on Voice Over, you 
>>>>> simply touch or press the power button three times quickly if Voice Over 
>>>>> is off.  OF course, you might be able to do it with Siri, or, here?s 
>>>>> another guess:  press the command key and anywhere on the touch bar.  IF 
>>>>> voice Over is off, it will know that you are trying to turn on Voice 
>>>>> Over.  My best guess, however, would be to quickly touch the power button 
>>>>> three times.  Makes the most sense and keeps things logical and easy.
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>>&g

Re: What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event | AppleVis

[Scott Granados]

First off and most importantly, do tell Sabahattin hello and I hope he’s well, 
it’s been a while.  Like you, I too would listen to him, he’s a very smart and 
technically skilled fellow. I have a great deal of respect for him and hope 
he’s well.

Next, one of the good things about Apple is they have a higher than average 
resale value.  Even though  I do well, I do sell off old equipment or donate it 
to family or less fortunate.  There’s another fellow on the Android list who I 
know is on hard times for example and I’ve been sending him old network 
equipment so he can keep things going and decrease his costs.  So I get that.  
All I mean to say is companies don’t support things over time because they just 
can’t as the product as changed to much.  As long as something is serving it’s 
need though by all means go with it.  Nobody would argue against working with 
what you have available.
An iMac is a major investment.  The iMac especially is at the top end 
of the consumer price spectrum.  You load one up with all the features and 
you’re headed to 4000 dollars US or more before you know it.  That’s a lot of  
chaching.  
I know you didn’t buy the watch because of the camera.  I’ve held the 
new one, I disagree it feels like a toy but I love the one I have and will be 
upgrading just for the speed and will hand my present model down to my father 
who loves technology but doesn’t have the funds to buy the gadgets he wants.  
He loves showing them off to his friends though so I’m more than happy to keep 
him in equipment.  I remember how hard he worked so I had the things I needed 
as a kid so it’s the absolute least i can do in return.

Your iMac will do fine until you need to upgrade it in the future when you have 
a specific reason to.  I am also sure you can sell it off or give it to someone 
less fortunate who would benefit.
 

> On Oct 28, 2016, at 4:49 PM, Kawal Gucukoglu  wrote:
> 
> Never believe what someone says about buying gadgets as although I might buy 
> the latest I phone, I am definitely not buying the latest I watch.  I 
> cancelled my orders for the watch when Sabahattin told me that he did not 
> think too much about the watch as he said that the watch reminded him of a 
> toy and the watches were running a bit better but still slow.  He's another 
> person who I'd trust telling me what he really thinks about Apple products 
> but at times he goes on about putting windows on his machines and going to 
> Microsoft, but he will not do it.  I remember because of seeing his first Mac 
> Book which had that funny voice on it that whispered that I decided to get on 
> to the Apple wagon.
> 
> I think I told you the other day I'd wait for a watch with a Camera on it.
> 
> I also know Scott if a brand new I Mac came out in a few years with something 
> special on it, no doubt I'd get it but just now, my computers are running 
> just fine with the latest Operating systems.  If I am to buy the latest 
> computers then I need to sell computers at a good and reasonable price.
>> On 28 Oct 2016, at 21:16, Scott Granados  wrote:
>> 
>> Nobody says you have to, you’re missing the point.  As long as it works for 
>> you use it.  Apple seems to run on 4 or 5 year cycles with both the phones 
>> and to some degree the computers.  The big cutoffs seem to be when they 
>> change processor types either from RISK to Intel and so forth.  Your 2012 
>> iMac will do fine for a few more years.  You only have to upgrade when you 
>> want or are able to upgrade.  Sierra should run just fine on that machine.  
>> Apple doesn’t have to change it’s pricing model just because you don’t make 
>> enough.:)  They fill a market and if nobody buys their gear they will change 
>> but that’s not the case.  They sell millions of units so obviously have 
>> something right.  There’s nobody saying your computer needs replacing, use 
>> it in good health as long as you like.  Just at some point technology 
>> dictates that it will be to old to update.
>> 
>> And for someone crying poverty she’s always buying the new phone and had an 
>> order in for the watch and went to the Apple store on release day.  You’re 
>> probably doing just fine, you’re highly intelligent, you can decide when it 
>> makes sense to upgrade for you and your budget and until then what you have 
>> will suit you well.  Progress is just that, the new stuff replaces the old.  
>> Hey I still have a 1960s Porsche that I restored so nothing says you have to 
>> get the latest and greatest all the time, there’s value in the old as well 
>> just don’t expect the features will be the same. My old Porsche doesn’t even 
>> have air conditioning but it still drives well and in some circles is worth 
>> more because it’s a classic.  You’ll be fine.  and hey I got to meet Carlos 
>> Santana because we parked in front of his house in San Francisco in a 1971 
>> VW Super Beatle that he liked so much he 

Re: What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event | AppleVis

[Kawal Gucukoglu]

Never believe what someone says about buying gadgets as although I might buy 
the latest I phone, I am definitely not buying the latest I watch.  I cancelled 
my orders for the watch when Sabahattin told me that he did not think too much 
about the watch as he said that the watch reminded him of a toy and the watches 
were running a bit better but still slow.  He's another person who I'd trust 
telling me what he really thinks about Apple products but at times he goes on 
about putting windows on his machines and going to Microsoft, but he will not 
do it.  I remember because of seeing his first Mac Book which had that funny 
voice on it that whispered that I decided to get on to the Apple wagon.

I think I told you the other day I'd wait for a watch with a Camera on it.

I also know Scott if a brand new I Mac came out in a few years with something 
special on it, no doubt I'd get it but just now, my computers are running just 
fine with the latest Operating systems.  If I am to buy the latest computers 
then I need to sell computers at a good and reasonable price.
> On 28 Oct 2016, at 21:16, Scott Granados  wrote:
> 
> Nobody says you have to, you’re missing the point.  As long as it works for 
> you use it.  Apple seems to run on 4 or 5 year cycles with both the phones 
> and to some degree the computers.  The big cutoffs seem to be when they 
> change processor types either from RISK to Intel and so forth.  Your 2012 
> iMac will do fine for a few more years.  You only have to upgrade when you 
> want or are able to upgrade.  Sierra should run just fine on that machine.  
> Apple doesn’t have to change it’s pricing model just because you don’t make 
> enough.:)  They fill a market and if nobody buys their gear they will change 
> but that’s not the case.  They sell millions of units so obviously have 
> something right.  There’s nobody saying your computer needs replacing, use it 
> in good health as long as you like.  Just at some point technology dictates 
> that it will be to old to update.
> 
> And for someone crying poverty she’s always buying the new phone and had an 
> order in for the watch and went to the Apple store on release day.  You’re 
> probably doing just fine, you’re highly intelligent, you can decide when it 
> makes sense to upgrade for you and your budget and until then what you have 
> will suit you well.  Progress is just that, the new stuff replaces the old.  
> Hey I still have a 1960s Porsche that I restored so nothing says you have to 
> get the latest and greatest all the time, there’s value in the old as well 
> just don’t expect the features will be the same. My old Porsche doesn’t even 
> have air conditioning but it still drives well and in some circles is worth 
> more because it’s a classic.  You’ll be fine.  and hey I got to meet Carlos 
> Santana because we parked in front of his house in San Francisco in a 1971 VW 
> Super Beatle that he liked so much he came out and tried to buy it from me so 
> nothing says you have to get rid of the old just don’t expect it to work like 
> the new.
> 
> 
> 
>> On Oct 28, 2016, at 4:02 PM, Kawal Gucukoglu  wrote:
>> 
>> So what about my I Mac Scott?  I think you remember what type of processor 
>> and what kind of memory I have, is that too old although it does run with no 
>> problems.  Do apple say that a late 2012 I Mac and a 2014 MacMini will not 
>> able to run new software?  I'm not being unreasonable, I'm being practical, 
>> as one can't buy a new piece of kit every two or three years depending on 
>> one's circumstances.  Unlike a person who has a well paid job and who may 
>> get a good salary I'd say yes, you could.  But for someone who may not have 
>> a job or that the job does not keep up-to-date with pay because of a charity 
>> or something cannot buy a computer every two or three years.  This is what 
>> is called practical Scott.
>>> On 28 Oct 2016, at 20:52, Scott Granados  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Kawal, it’s not that easy now come on that’s just unreasonable.
>>> 
>>> Computers grow old like everything else.  That G4 processor your Mac used 
>>> to have isn’t usable with new software.  The compilers don’t work and it’s 
>>> just impractical.  During the keynote yesterday they mentioned that the 
>>> current MacBook Pro is over 6.5 million times faster than the original 
>>> MacBook sold.  Not twice as fast, not ten times as fast, 6.5 million times 
>>> as fast.  It’s just not practical to expect that old hardware is usable for 
>>> anything other than a museum piece or boat anchor. 
>>> 
>>> Using your logic we’d still be jamming punch cards in to Univac just 
>>> because it still works.  Sorry but no go.  
>>> 
>>> Here’s a fun fact illustrating my point.  Your iPhone has more computing 
>>> power than the entire Apollo program did in the history of it’s existence.  
>>> In fact, your iPhone has more computer power than existed in the known 
>>> 

Re: What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event | AppleVis

[Brandt Steenkamp]

I actually have a small keyboard for my iPad Mini, that does not have function 
keys.

I am sitting with that keyboard, typing this. The FN key with the numbers dash 
and = keys does the same as the function keys. In short, yes, tech older than 
me is getting fazed out, but so what. So were the Match lock, wheel lock and 
flint lock.

If you really want f keys, use a standard keyboard you pick out of your old 
tech pile. Most everyone has at least one keyboard lying around being useless.

Warm regards,

Brandt Steenkamp

Sent from my Macbook Pro

Contact:

Phone:
Private: +27 (0)60 525 9181 
For technical support with iOS: +27 (0)78 120 5013 

Email: brandt.steenk...@gmail.com 

Twitter: @brandtsteenkamp 
> On 28 Oct 2016, at 9:10 PM, Tim Kilburn  wrote:
> 
> Hi,
> 
> It's OK to express concern, it's OK to wonder, but people need to realize 
> that these decisions are not made without accessibility in mind.  If a change 
> is made such as the removal of the F-keys, then there will just be different 
> keystrokes to accomplish task that originally required those F-keys.  No need 
> to jump on a band-wagon saying that we, as a blind community, are being left 
> out in the cold.  That's simply unfair and unproductive.  Those of us who 
> have older Mac models where the Function bar is not present should see no 
> change in behavior, as the MacOS will just know that your specific Mac isn't 
> capable of Function Bar actions..  It's no different than what happens now 
> when you connect a non-Apple keyboard, the MacOS figures it out and your 
> media keys etc. don't function like they do on an Apple keyboard.
> 
> Just as a prediction, because I'd rather look forward positively, with the 
> introduction of a finger-print sensor on the power button, might it be 
> possible that the power button become similar to the Home button on an iOS 
> device.  That is, VO could be invoked by a triple-tap on the power button?  
> If Apple is moving towards less differentiation between the iOS and MacOS 
> experience, it's possible.There are usually all sorts of options to make 
> things work, maybe different than what we're accustomed to, but possibilities 
> none-the-less.
> 
> Later...
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On Oct 28, 2016, at 12:36 PM, E.T.  wrote:
>> 
>>  Progress is not without pain. What would be better, stagnation? If Apple 
>> was 100% focused on the blind user share of the market, it might be 
>> different?
>> 
>>  History repeats itself, over and over. Look at the headphone jack, how much 
>> grief that caused right up to release day. And as soon as release day came 
>> and went, that noise died with a whimper. So too will the noise about the 
>> TouchBar.
>> 
>>  And next year this cycle will repeat again...and again.
>> 
>> From E.T.'s Keyboard...
>> Without H2O there is no life!
>> ancient.ali...@icloud.com
>> 
>>> On 10/28/2016 9:21 AM, - wrote:
>>> 
>>> Apple will almost certainly be forced to add yet another keystroke for
>>> doing what now is the direct press of a function key,  volume for example.
>>> 
>>> This is because when you cram multiple levels of function into a touch
>>> bar there has to be a way to choose among levels.
>>> 
>>> There are far far too many pretzel keypresses now without adding more.
 On Fri, 28 Oct 2016, gs wrote:
 
 I care about access to the function keys in general and not just what
 currently happens when one presses Command F5. I use the function keys
 for adjusting screen brightness and volume, etc. I wonder how all the
 other items currently available via the function keys will be handled?
 
 On Oct 28, 2016, at 6:37 AM, Brandt Steenkamp
  wrote:
 
 There we go,
 
 Triple-tapping power sounds like the most consistent and logical way
 to go.
 
 Holding command down and tapping the touch bar also sounds okay, but
 not like something apple would do.
 
 Warm regards,
 
 Brandt Steenkamp
 
 Sent from my Macbook Pro
 
 Contact:
 
 Phone:
 Private: +27 (0)60 525 9181 
 For technical support with iOS: +27 (0)78 120 5013 
 
 Email: brandt.steenk...@gmail.com 
 
 Twitter: @brandtsteenkamp 
> On 28 Oct 2016, at 11:21 AM, Ray Foret jr  > wrote:
> 
> IF Apple is truly going for consistancy, I have a feeling I know how
> we will turn on Voice Over with the new touch bar.  I don?t know this
> for sure:  but, I?d be willing to guess that to turn on Voice Over,
> you simply touch or press the power button three times quickly if
> Voice Over is off.  OF course, you might be able to do it with Siri,
> or, here?s another guess:  press the 

Re: What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event | AppleVis

[Scott Granados]

Nobody says you have to, you’re missing the point.  As long as it works for you 
use it.  Apple seems to run on 4 or 5 year cycles with both the phones and to 
some degree the computers.  The big cutoffs seem to be when they change 
processor types either from RISK to Intel and so forth.  Your 2012 iMac will do 
fine for a few more years.  You only have to upgrade when you want or are able 
to upgrade.  Sierra should run just fine on that machine.  Apple doesn’t have 
to change it’s pricing model just because you don’t make enough.:)  They fill a 
market and if nobody buys their gear they will change but that’s not the case.  
They sell millions of units so obviously have something right.  There’s nobody 
saying your computer needs replacing, use it in good health as long as you 
like.  Just at some point technology dictates that it will be to old to update.

And for someone crying poverty she’s always buying the new phone and had an 
order in for the watch and went to the Apple store on release day.  You’re 
probably doing just fine, you’re highly intelligent, you can decide when it 
makes sense to upgrade for you and your budget and until then what you have 
will suit you well.  Progress is just that, the new stuff replaces the old.  
Hey I still have a 1960s Porsche that I restored so nothing says you have to 
get the latest and greatest all the time, there’s value in the old as well just 
don’t expect the features will be the same. My old Porsche doesn’t even have 
air conditioning but it still drives well and in some circles is worth more 
because it’s a classic.  You’ll be fine.  and hey I got to meet Carlos Santana 
because we parked in front of his house in San Francisco in a 1971 VW Super 
Beatle that he liked so much he came out and tried to buy it from me so nothing 
says you have to get rid of the old just don’t expect it to work like the new.



> On Oct 28, 2016, at 4:02 PM, Kawal Gucukoglu  wrote:
> 
> So what about my I Mac Scott?  I think you remember what type of processor 
> and what kind of memory I have, is that too old although it does run with no 
> problems.  Do apple say that a late 2012 I Mac and a 2014 MacMini will not 
> able to run new software?  I'm not being unreasonable, I'm being practical, 
> as one can't buy a new piece of kit every two or three years depending on 
> one's circumstances.  Unlike a person who has a well paid job and who may get 
> a good salary I'd say yes, you could.  But for someone who may not have a job 
> or that the job does not keep up-to-date with pay because of a charity or 
> something cannot buy a computer every two or three years.  This is what is 
> called practical Scott.
>> On 28 Oct 2016, at 20:52, Scott Granados  wrote:
>> 
>> Kawal, it’s not that easy now come on that’s just unreasonable.
>> 
>> Computers grow old like everything else.  That G4 processor your Mac used to 
>> have isn’t usable with new software.  The compilers don’t work and it’s just 
>> impractical.  During the keynote yesterday they mentioned that the current 
>> MacBook Pro is over 6.5 million times faster than the original MacBook sold. 
>>  Not twice as fast, not ten times as fast, 6.5 million times as fast.  It’s 
>> just not practical to expect that old hardware is usable for anything other 
>> than a museum piece or boat anchor. 
>> 
>> Using your logic we’d still be jamming punch cards in to Univac just because 
>> it still works.  Sorry but no go.  
>> 
>> Here’s a fun fact illustrating my point.  Your iPhone has more computing 
>> power than the entire Apollo program did in the history of it’s existence.  
>> In fact, your iPhone has more computer power than existed in the known 
>> universe up through sometime in the early 80s.  I personally have turned old 
>> macs in to fish tanks which is about all you can do with some old hardware 
>> and my mother’s basement is a small museum including a PDP-11 and several 
>> high end work stations that today aren’t even worth the power they consume.  
>> It’s just progress.
>> 
>>> On Oct 28, 2016, at 3:46 PM, Kawal Gucukoglu  wrote:
>>> 
>>> A way of saying, get rid of your computer.  Why on earth should one get rid 
>>> of a computer if it's going strong, no need to not let it update.  No 
>>> wonder we live in a throw-away society as manufacturers encourage land 
>>> fills and alike for Governments to say that there is no place to build 
>>> houses etc, because we need land to accommodate rubbish and so on.  It's 
>>> manufacturers faults that 1: we are getting unhealthier because of bad food 
>>> that is produced.  2: there is not enough space to accommodate the growing 
>>> population because manufacturers are wishing for people to buy new 
>>> computers and so we won't let your computer which is in perfect condition 
>>> to update but we have decided that you need another regardless if you can 
>>> afford it or not.  Oh wow.
>>> 
>>> Kawal.
 On 

Re: What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event | AppleVis

[Kawal Gucukoglu]

So what about my I Mac Scott?  I think you remember what type of processor and 
what kind of memory I have, is that too old although it does run with no 
problems.  Do apple say that a late 2012 I Mac and a 2014 MacMini will not able 
to run new software?  I'm not being unreasonable, I'm being practical, as one 
can't buy a new piece of kit every two or three years depending on one's 
circumstances.  Unlike a person who has a well paid job and who may get a good 
salary I'd say yes, you could.  But for someone who may not have a job or that 
the job does not keep up-to-date with pay because of a charity or something 
cannot buy a computer every two or three years.  This is what is called 
practical Scott.
> On 28 Oct 2016, at 20:52, Scott Granados  wrote:
> 
> Kawal, it’s not that easy now come on that’s just unreasonable.
> 
> Computers grow old like everything else.  That G4 processor your Mac used to 
> have isn’t usable with new software.  The compilers don’t work and it’s just 
> impractical.  During the keynote yesterday they mentioned that the current 
> MacBook Pro is over 6.5 million times faster than the original MacBook sold.  
> Not twice as fast, not ten times as fast, 6.5 million times as fast.  It’s 
> just not practical to expect that old hardware is usable for anything other 
> than a museum piece or boat anchor. 
> 
> Using your logic we’d still be jamming punch cards in to Univac just because 
> it still works.  Sorry but no go.  
> 
> Here’s a fun fact illustrating my point.  Your iPhone has more computing 
> power than the entire Apollo program did in the history of it’s existence.  
> In fact, your iPhone has more computer power than existed in the known 
> universe up through sometime in the early 80s.  I personally have turned old 
> macs in to fish tanks which is about all you can do with some old hardware 
> and my mother’s basement is a small museum including a PDP-11 and several 
> high end work stations that today aren’t even worth the power they consume.  
> It’s just progress.
> 
>> On Oct 28, 2016, at 3:46 PM, Kawal Gucukoglu  wrote:
>> 
>> A way of saying, get rid of your computer.  Why on earth should one get rid 
>> of a computer if it's going strong, no need to not let it update.  No wonder 
>> we live in a throw-away society as manufacturers encourage land fills and 
>> alike for Governments to say that there is no place to build houses etc, 
>> because we need land to accommodate rubbish and so on.  It's manufacturers 
>> faults that 1: we are getting unhealthier because of bad food that is 
>> produced.  2: there is not enough space to accommodate the growing 
>> population because manufacturers are wishing for people to buy new computers 
>> and so we won't let your computer which is in perfect condition to update 
>> but we have decided that you need another regardless if you can afford it or 
>> not.  Oh wow.
>> 
>> Kawal.
>>> On 28 Oct 2016, at 20:32, Scott Granados  wrote:
>>> 
>>> It won’t be, nothing changes you do things as you always have.  At some 
>>> point, your computer just won’t receive any more updates.  The operating 
>>> system will eventually not be compatible because it’s to new.  Sort of the 
>>> standard way of things happening.
>>> 
>>> 
 On Oct 28, 2016, at 2:33 PM, Kawal Gucukoglu  wrote:
 
 So what will happen for those people who have I Mac and Mac Mini's who 
 have not changed their computers for a number of years as there will be no 
 touch bars etc.  So how will that be accommodated?  I have not listened to 
 the event as yet.
 
 Kawal.
> On 28 Oct 2016, at 19:06, christopher hallsworth 
>  wrote:
> 
> Well you know what? Found out through the VoiceOver Getting Started Guide 
> that as part of the new and changed key commands set for VoiceOver under 
> macOS Sierra, VO-- (hyphen) will decrease the system volume and vo-= 
> (equals) will increase the system volume. Actually, I will correct this 
> by saying vo-- (hyphen) is definitely new, but vo-= (equals) is actually 
> a changed one from whatever it was before.
> 
> 
>> On 28 Oct 2016, at 17:21, -  wrote:
>> 
>> 
>> Apple will almost certainly be forced to add yet another keystroke for 
>> doing what now is the direct press of a function key,  volume for 
>> example.
>> 
>> This is because when you cram multiple levels of function into a touch 
>> bar there has to be a way to choose among levels.
>> 
>> There are far far too many pretzel keypresses now without adding more.
>> On Fri, 28 Oct 2016, gs wrote:
>> 
>>> I care about access to the function keys in general and not just what 
>>> currently happens when one presses Command F5. I use the function keys 
>>> for adjusting screen brightness and volume, etc. I 

Re: What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event | AppleVis

[Scott Granados]

Kawal, it’s not that easy now come on that’s just unreasonable.

Computers grow old like everything else.  That G4 processor your Mac used to 
have isn’t usable with new software.  The compilers don’t work and it’s just 
impractical.  During the keynote yesterday they mentioned that the current 
MacBook Pro is over 6.5 million times faster than the original MacBook sold.  
Not twice as fast, not ten times as fast, 6.5 million times as fast.  It’s just 
not practical to expect that old hardware is usable for anything other than a 
museum piece or boat anchor. 

Using your logic we’d still be jamming punch cards in to Univac just because it 
still works.  Sorry but no go.  

Here’s a fun fact illustrating my point.  Your iPhone has more computing power 
than the entire Apollo program did in the history of it’s existence.  In fact, 
your iPhone has more computer power than existed in the known universe up 
through sometime in the early 80s.  I personally have turned old macs in to 
fish tanks which is about all you can do with some old hardware and my mother’s 
basement is a small museum including a PDP-11 and several high end work 
stations that today aren’t even worth the power they consume.  It’s just 
progress.
 
> On Oct 28, 2016, at 3:46 PM, Kawal Gucukoglu  wrote:
> 
> A way of saying, get rid of your computer.  Why on earth should one get rid 
> of a computer if it's going strong, no need to not let it update.  No wonder 
> we live in a throw-away society as manufacturers encourage land fills and 
> alike for Governments to say that there is no place to build houses etc, 
> because we need land to accommodate rubbish and so on.  It's manufacturers 
> faults that 1: we are getting unhealthier because of bad food that is 
> produced.  2: there is not enough space to accommodate the growing population 
> because manufacturers are wishing for people to buy new computers and so we 
> won't let your computer which is in perfect condition to update but we have 
> decided that you need another regardless if you can afford it or not.  Oh wow.
> 
> Kawal.
>> On 28 Oct 2016, at 20:32, Scott Granados  wrote:
>> 
>> It won’t be, nothing changes you do things as you always have.  At some 
>> point, your computer just won’t receive any more updates.  The operating 
>> system will eventually not be compatible because it’s to new.  Sort of the 
>> standard way of things happening.
>> 
>> 
>>> On Oct 28, 2016, at 2:33 PM, Kawal Gucukoglu  wrote:
>>> 
>>> So what will happen for those people who have I Mac and Mac Mini's who have 
>>> not changed their computers for a number of years as there will be no touch 
>>> bars etc.  So how will that be accommodated?  I have not listened to the 
>>> event as yet.
>>> 
>>> Kawal.
 On 28 Oct 2016, at 19:06, christopher hallsworth  
 wrote:
 
 Well you know what? Found out through the VoiceOver Getting Started Guide 
 that as part of the new and changed key commands set for VoiceOver under 
 macOS Sierra, VO-- (hyphen) will decrease the system volume and vo-= 
 (equals) will increase the system volume. Actually, I will correct this by 
 saying vo-- (hyphen) is definitely new, but vo-= (equals) is actually a 
 changed one from whatever it was before.
 
 
> On 28 Oct 2016, at 17:21, -  wrote:
> 
> 
> Apple will almost certainly be forced to add yet another keystroke for 
> doing what now is the direct press of a function key,  volume for example.
> 
> This is because when you cram multiple levels of function into a touch 
> bar there has to be a way to choose among levels.
> 
> There are far far too many pretzel keypresses now without adding more.
> On Fri, 28 Oct 2016, gs wrote:
> 
>> I care about access to the function keys in general and not just what 
>> currently happens when one presses Command F5. I use the function keys 
>> for adjusting screen brightness and volume, etc. I wonder how all the 
>> other items currently available via the function keys will be handled?
>> 
>> On Oct 28, 2016, at 6:37 AM, Brandt Steenkamp 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> There we go,
>> 
>> Triple-tapping power sounds like the most consistent and logical way to 
>> go.
>> 
>> Holding command down and tapping the touch bar also sounds okay, but not 
>> like something apple would do.
>> 
>> Warm regards,
>> 
>> Brandt Steenkamp
>> 
>> Sent from my Macbook Pro
>> 
>> Contact:
>> 
>> Phone:
>> Private: +27 (0)60 525 9181 
>> For technical support with iOS: +27 (0)78 120 5013 
>> 
>> Email: brandt.steenk...@gmail.com 
>> 
>> Twitter: @brandtsteenkamp 
>>> On 28 Oct 2016, at 11:21 AM, Ray 

Re: What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event | AppleVis

[Kawal Gucukoglu]

A way of saying, get rid of your computer.  Why on earth should one get rid of 
a computer if it's going strong, no need to not let it update.  No wonder we 
live in a throw-away society as manufacturers encourage land fills and alike 
for Governments to say that there is no place to build houses etc, because we 
need land to accommodate rubbish and so on.  It's manufacturers faults that 1: 
we are getting unhealthier because of bad food that is produced.  2: there is 
not enough space to accommodate the growing population because manufacturers 
are wishing for people to buy new computers and so we won't let your computer 
which is in perfect condition to update but we have decided that you need 
another regardless if you can afford it or not.  Oh wow.

Kawal.
> On 28 Oct 2016, at 20:32, Scott Granados  wrote:
> 
> It won’t be, nothing changes you do things as you always have.  At some 
> point, your computer just won’t receive any more updates.  The operating 
> system will eventually not be compatible because it’s to new.  Sort of the 
> standard way of things happening.
> 
> 
>> On Oct 28, 2016, at 2:33 PM, Kawal Gucukoglu  wrote:
>> 
>> So what will happen for those people who have I Mac and Mac Mini's who have 
>> not changed their computers for a number of years as there will be no touch 
>> bars etc.  So how will that be accommodated?  I have not listened to the 
>> event as yet.
>> 
>> Kawal.
>>> On 28 Oct 2016, at 19:06, christopher hallsworth  
>>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Well you know what? Found out through the VoiceOver Getting Started Guide 
>>> that as part of the new and changed key commands set for VoiceOver under 
>>> macOS Sierra, VO-- (hyphen) will decrease the system volume and vo-= 
>>> (equals) will increase the system volume. Actually, I will correct this by 
>>> saying vo-- (hyphen) is definitely new, but vo-= (equals) is actually a 
>>> changed one from whatever it was before.
>>> 
>>> 
 On 28 Oct 2016, at 17:21, -  wrote:
 
 
 Apple will almost certainly be forced to add yet another keystroke for 
 doing what now is the direct press of a function key,  volume for example.
 
 This is because when you cram multiple levels of function into a touch bar 
 there has to be a way to choose among levels.
 
 There are far far too many pretzel keypresses now without adding more.
 On Fri, 28 Oct 2016, gs wrote:
 
> I care about access to the function keys in general and not just what 
> currently happens when one presses Command F5. I use the function keys 
> for adjusting screen brightness and volume, etc. I wonder how all the 
> other items currently available via the function keys will be handled?
> 
> On Oct 28, 2016, at 6:37 AM, Brandt Steenkamp 
>  wrote:
> 
> There we go,
> 
> Triple-tapping power sounds like the most consistent and logical way to 
> go.
> 
> Holding command down and tapping the touch bar also sounds okay, but not 
> like something apple would do.
> 
> Warm regards,
> 
> Brandt Steenkamp
> 
> Sent from my Macbook Pro
> 
> Contact:
> 
> Phone:
> Private: +27 (0)60 525 9181 
> For technical support with iOS: +27 (0)78 120 5013 
> 
> Email: brandt.steenk...@gmail.com 
> 
> Twitter: @brandtsteenkamp 
>> On 28 Oct 2016, at 11:21 AM, Ray Foret jr > > wrote:
>> 
>> IF Apple is truly going for consistancy, I have a feeling I know how we 
>> will turn on Voice Over with the new touch bar.  I don?t know this for 
>> sure:  but, I?d be willing to guess that to turn on Voice Over, you 
>> simply touch or press the power button three times quickly if Voice Over 
>> is off.  OF course, you might be able to do it with Siri, or, here?s 
>> another guess:  press the command key and anywhere on the touch bar.  IF 
>> voice Over is off, it will know that you are trying to turn on Voice 
>> Over.  My best guess, however, would be to quickly touch the power 
>> button three times.  Makes the most sense and keeps things logical and 
>> easy.
>> 
>> 
>>> On Oct 28, 2016, at 2:01 AM, christopher hallsworth 
>>> > wrote:
>>> 
>>> 
 
 http://www.applevis.com/blog/apple-apple-tv-news/what-we-got-apples-october-2016-event#comment-form
  
 
 
 What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event
 Submitted by mehgcap on 27 October, 2016 - 16:28 and last modified on 
 27 October, 2016 - 19:18
 

Re: What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event | AppleVis

[Scott Granados]

A definite +1.

I always enjoy reading Tim’s posts as well, very good content there.

> On Oct 28, 2016, at 3:40 PM, Kawal Gucukoglu  wrote:
> 
> I'd like to compliment your posts Tim.  Out of all the people on this list, 
> I'd say you speak a lot of sense and have so much knowledge to contribute.  
> Not that this means I don't listen to other's on this list as I do and others 
> who have much to contribute too.  But, Tim, I always read your messages and 
> look forward to your common sense.
> 
> Kawal.
>> On 28 Oct 2016, at 20:10, Tim Kilburn  wrote:
>> 
>> Hi,
>> 
>> It's OK to express concern, it's OK to wonder, but people need to realize 
>> that these decisions are not made without accessibility in mind.  If a 
>> change is made such as the removal of the F-keys, then there will just be 
>> different keystrokes to accomplish task that originally required those 
>> F-keys.  No need to jump on a band-wagon saying that we, as a blind 
>> community, are being left out in the cold.  That's simply unfair and 
>> unproductive.  Those of us who have older Mac models where the Function bar 
>> is not present should see no change in behavior, as the MacOS will just know 
>> that your specific Mac isn't capable of Function Bar actions..  It's no 
>> different than what happens now when you connect a non-Apple keyboard, the 
>> MacOS figures it out and your media keys etc. don't function like they do on 
>> an Apple keyboard.
>> 
>> Just as a prediction, because I'd rather look forward positively, with the 
>> introduction of a finger-print sensor on the power button, might it be 
>> possible that the power button become similar to the Home button on an iOS 
>> device.  That is, VO could be invoked by a triple-tap on the power button?  
>> If Apple is moving towards less differentiation between the iOS and MacOS 
>> experience, it's possible.There are usually all sorts of options to make 
>> things work, maybe different than what we're accustomed to, but 
>> possibilities none-the-less.
>> 
>> Later...
>> 
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>> On Oct 28, 2016, at 12:36 PM, E.T.  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Progress is not without pain. What would be better, stagnation? If Apple 
>>> was 100% focused on the blind user share of the market, it might be 
>>> different?
>>> 
>>> History repeats itself, over and over. Look at the headphone jack, how much 
>>> grief that caused right up to release day. And as soon as release day came 
>>> and went, that noise died with a whimper. So too will the noise about the 
>>> TouchBar.
>>> 
>>> And next year this cycle will repeat again...and again.
>>> 
>>> From E.T.'s Keyboard...
>>> Without H2O there is no life!
>>> ancient.ali...@icloud.com
>>> 
 On 10/28/2016 9:21 AM, - wrote:
 
 Apple will almost certainly be forced to add yet another keystroke for
 doing what now is the direct press of a function key,  volume for example.
 
 This is because when you cram multiple levels of function into a touch
 bar there has to be a way to choose among levels.
 
 There are far far too many pretzel keypresses now without adding more.
> On Fri, 28 Oct 2016, gs wrote:
> 
> I care about access to the function keys in general and not just what
> currently happens when one presses Command F5. I use the function keys
> for adjusting screen brightness and volume, etc. I wonder how all the
> other items currently available via the function keys will be handled?
> 
> On Oct 28, 2016, at 6:37 AM, Brandt Steenkamp
>  wrote:
> 
> There we go,
> 
> Triple-tapping power sounds like the most consistent and logical way
> to go.
> 
> Holding command down and tapping the touch bar also sounds okay, but
> not like something apple would do.
> 
> Warm regards,
> 
> Brandt Steenkamp
> 
> Sent from my Macbook Pro
> 
> Contact:
> 
> Phone:
> Private: +27 (0)60 525 9181 
> For technical support with iOS: +27 (0)78 120 5013 
> 
> Email: brandt.steenk...@gmail.com 
> 
> Twitter: @brandtsteenkamp 
>> On 28 Oct 2016, at 11:21 AM, Ray Foret jr > > wrote:
>> 
>> IF Apple is truly going for consistancy, I have a feeling I know how
>> we will turn on Voice Over with the new touch bar.  I don?t know this
>> for sure:  but, I?d be willing to guess that to turn on Voice Over,
>> you simply touch or press the power button three times quickly if
>> Voice Over is off.  OF course, you might be able to do it with Siri,
>> or, here?s another guess:  press the command key and anywhere on the
>> touch bar.  IF voice Over is off, it will know that you are trying to
>> turn on Voice Over.  My best guess, however, would 

Re: What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event | AppleVis

[Scott Granados]

Christopher, ghz mean nothing.  Clock rate hasn’t mattered in processors since 
probably the early to mid 90s.  What would be a more meaningful number are 
flops or some other real measure of work done but the oscillation rate of the 
control crystal doesn’t matter a hill of beans with modern instruction sets.  I 
remember when this became really apparent when Dec released it’s alpha chips 
that were doing things at 400 mhz that 1.0 ghz intel and AMD processors 
couldn’t even dream of.  It’s all about the instruction sets, pipelines and 
arithmetic characteristics.  That was one of the reasons Intel gave Will I. Am. 
from the black eyed peas a job.  He figured out a faster way to execute square 
routes in silicon which is a huge deal for performance.:)  As a random side 
note, he’s also the first musician to debut a new track from a distant planet 
as he programmed one of his songs as the landing indicator for the mars rover 
but I digress.

> On Oct 28, 2016, at 3:32 PM, christopher hallsworth  
> wrote:
> 
> What? And this is only running at the very least a 1.1 GHZ intel M3 
> processor? That sounds *real* slow to me.
> 
> 
>> On 28 Oct 2016, at 10:52, Sandi Jazmin Kruse  wrote:
>> 
>> I wanna add to this, if you use the Mac book, not the mac book pro,
>> but the Fanless  design, it may seem small, underrated, but it is so
>> powerful that  it can semi consistently run latest model of flight
>> sims in winddows 7, settings are real weather, full realism turned on,
>> and over 120 FPS. It was not build for this however, but it can do it.
>> 
>> 
>> On 10/28/16, Ray Foret jr  wrote:
>>> IF Apple is truly going for consistancy, I have a feeling I know how we will
>>> turn on Voice Over with the new touch bar.  I don’t know this for sure:
>>> but, I’d be willing to guess that to turn on Voice Over, you simply touch or
>>> press the power button three times quickly if Voice Over is off.  OF course,
>>> you might be able to do it with Siri, or, here’s another guess:  press the
>>> command key and anywhere on the touch bar.  IF voice Over is off, it will
>>> know that you are trying to turn on Voice Over.  My best guess, however,
>>> would be to quickly touch the power button three times.  Makes the most
>>> sense and keeps things logical and easy.
>>> 
>>> 
 On Oct 28, 2016, at 2:01 AM, christopher hallsworth
  wrote:
 
 
> 
> http://www.applevis.com/blog/apple-apple-tv-news/what-we-got-apples-october-2016-event#comment-form
> 
> 
> What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event
> Submitted by mehgcap on 27 October, 2016 - 16:28 and last modified on 27
> October, 2016 - 19:18
> 
>  
> Hello Again
> 
> Today, Apple held a press event it called "Hello Again". The company
> announced a new accessibility website, a new Apple TV feature, and a
> long-awaited update to its MacBook computers. It may have missed the
> back-to-school shoppers, but today's announcements arrive just in time
> for the holiday shopping frenzy. There are some major changes to the
> MacBook line-up on the way, and while much of what you're about to read
> is awesome, you may not like all of it. But there's a great deal to like
> about the latest offerings from Apple, and I yell at articles to quit
> rambling in their intros and get on with it just as much as you do, so
> let's get on with it!
> 
> Accessibility Kick-Off
> 
> To my surprise, Apple started the presentation with a video highlighting
> accessibility features of its products. This led to Tim Cook's announcing
> a "whole new website" focused on Apple's accessibility efforts. As of the
> time of this writing, we haven't had a chance to fully explore this new
> website , but it's always great to
> see the spotlight shown on all the work Apple does to make their devices
> as usable, to as many people, as they can. It’s also great to see that
> the AppleVis Community is featured on Apple’s new Accessibility Portal as
> somewhere people should go to obtain more information and support. Thank
> you, Apple!
> 
> Get Entertained on Apple TV
> 
> No, there's not a new Apple TV coming out, but there is a new way to find
> something to watch on the box you already have. It's a new app from
> Apple, called--appropriately enough--TV. Yep, just those two letters.
> Interestingly, Apple offers this app on not just Apple TV, but your iOS
> devices as well, letting you browse and play content on any of your
> devices. But what, exactly, does the app do?
> 
> TV pulls together any shows or movies you're already watching on your

Re: What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event | AppleVis

[E.T.]

   That was much more to the point and concise. (smiles)

From E.T.'s Keyboard...
  Without H2O there is no life!
ancient.ali...@icloud.com

On 10/28/2016 12:33 PM, Scott Granados wrote:

It’s been going on since the 70s with Apple.

Round and Round we go.


On Oct 28, 2016, at 2:36 PM, E.T.  wrote:

  Progress is not without pain. What would be better, stagnation? If Apple was 
100% focused on the blind user share of the market, it might be different?

  History repeats itself, over and over. Look at the headphone jack, how much 
grief that caused right up to release day. And as soon as release day came and 
went, that noise died with a whimper. So too will the noise about the TouchBar.

  And next year this cycle will repeat again...and again.

From E.T.'s Keyboard...
 Without H2O there is no life!
ancient.ali...@icloud.com

On 10/28/2016 9:21 AM, - wrote:


Apple will almost certainly be forced to add yet another keystroke for
doing what now is the direct press of a function key,  volume for example.

This is because when you cram multiple levels of function into a touch
bar there has to be a way to choose among levels.

There are far far too many pretzel keypresses now without adding more.
On Fri, 28 Oct 2016, gs wrote:


I care about access to the function keys in general and not just what
currently happens when one presses Command F5. I use the function keys
for adjusting screen brightness and volume, etc. I wonder how all the
other items currently available via the function keys will be handled?

On Oct 28, 2016, at 6:37 AM, Brandt Steenkamp
 wrote:

There we go,

Triple-tapping power sounds like the most consistent and logical way
to go.

Holding command down and tapping the touch bar also sounds okay, but
not like something apple would do.

Warm regards,

Brandt Steenkamp

Sent from my Macbook Pro

Contact:

Phone:
Private: +27 (0)60 525 9181 
For technical support with iOS: +27 (0)78 120 5013 

Email: brandt.steenk...@gmail.com 

Twitter: @brandtsteenkamp 

On 28 Oct 2016, at 11:21 AM, Ray Foret jr > wrote:

IF Apple is truly going for consistancy, I have a feeling I know how
we will turn on Voice Over with the new touch bar.  I don?t know this
for sure:  but, I?d be willing to guess that to turn on Voice Over,
you simply touch or press the power button three times quickly if
Voice Over is off.  OF course, you might be able to do it with Siri,
or, here?s another guess:  press the command key and anywhere on the
touch bar.  IF voice Over is off, it will know that you are trying to
turn on Voice Over.  My best guess, however, would be to quickly
touch the power button three times.  Makes the most sense and keeps
things logical and easy.



On Oct 28, 2016, at 2:01 AM, christopher hallsworth
> wrote:




http://www.applevis.com/blog/apple-apple-tv-news/what-we-got-apples-october-2016-event#comment-form



What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event
Submitted by mehgcap on 27 October, 2016 - 16:28 and last modified
on 27 October, 2016 - 19:18

 
Hello Again

Today, Apple held a press event it called "Hello Again". The
company announced a new accessibility website, a new Apple TV
feature, and a long-awaited update to its MacBook computers. It may
have missed the back-to-school shoppers, but today's announcements
arrive just in time for the holiday shopping frenzy. There are some
major changes to the MacBook line-up on the way, and while much of
what you're about to read is awesome, you may not like all of it.
But there's a great deal to like about the latest offerings from
Apple, and I yell at articles to quit rambling in their intros and
get on with it just as much as you do, so let's get on with it!

Accessibility Kick-Off

To my surprise, Apple started the presentation with a video
highlighting accessibility features of its products. This led to
Tim Cook's announcing a "whole new website" focused on Apple's
accessibility efforts. As of the time of this writing, we haven't
had a chance to fully explore this new website
, but it's always great to see
the spotlight shown on all the work Apple does to make their
devices as usable, to as many people, as they can. It?s also great
to see that the AppleVis Community is featured on Apple?s new
Accessibility Portal as somewhere people should go to obtain more
information and support. Thank you, Apple!

Get Entertained on Apple TV

No, there's not a new Apple TV coming out, but there is a new way
to find something to watch on the box you already have. It's a new
app from Apple, called--appropriately enough--TV. Yep, just those
two 

Re: What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event | AppleVis

[Kawal Gucukoglu]

I'd like to compliment your posts Tim.  Out of all the people on this list, I'd 
say you speak a lot of sense and have so much knowledge to contribute.  Not 
that this means I don't listen to other's on this list as I do and others who 
have much to contribute too.  But, Tim, I always read your messages and look 
forward to your common sense.

Kawal.
> On 28 Oct 2016, at 20:10, Tim Kilburn  wrote:
> 
> Hi,
> 
> It's OK to express concern, it's OK to wonder, but people need to realize 
> that these decisions are not made without accessibility in mind.  If a change 
> is made such as the removal of the F-keys, then there will just be different 
> keystrokes to accomplish task that originally required those F-keys.  No need 
> to jump on a band-wagon saying that we, as a blind community, are being left 
> out in the cold.  That's simply unfair and unproductive.  Those of us who 
> have older Mac models where the Function bar is not present should see no 
> change in behavior, as the MacOS will just know that your specific Mac isn't 
> capable of Function Bar actions..  It's no different than what happens now 
> when you connect a non-Apple keyboard, the MacOS figures it out and your 
> media keys etc. don't function like they do on an Apple keyboard.
> 
> Just as a prediction, because I'd rather look forward positively, with the 
> introduction of a finger-print sensor on the power button, might it be 
> possible that the power button become similar to the Home button on an iOS 
> device.  That is, VO could be invoked by a triple-tap on the power button?  
> If Apple is moving towards less differentiation between the iOS and MacOS 
> experience, it's possible.There are usually all sorts of options to make 
> things work, maybe different than what we're accustomed to, but possibilities 
> none-the-less.
> 
> Later...
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On Oct 28, 2016, at 12:36 PM, E.T.  wrote:
>> 
>>  Progress is not without pain. What would be better, stagnation? If Apple 
>> was 100% focused on the blind user share of the market, it might be 
>> different?
>> 
>>  History repeats itself, over and over. Look at the headphone jack, how much 
>> grief that caused right up to release day. And as soon as release day came 
>> and went, that noise died with a whimper. So too will the noise about the 
>> TouchBar.
>> 
>>  And next year this cycle will repeat again...and again.
>> 
>> From E.T.'s Keyboard...
>> Without H2O there is no life!
>> ancient.ali...@icloud.com
>> 
>>> On 10/28/2016 9:21 AM, - wrote:
>>> 
>>> Apple will almost certainly be forced to add yet another keystroke for
>>> doing what now is the direct press of a function key,  volume for example.
>>> 
>>> This is because when you cram multiple levels of function into a touch
>>> bar there has to be a way to choose among levels.
>>> 
>>> There are far far too many pretzel keypresses now without adding more.
 On Fri, 28 Oct 2016, gs wrote:
 
 I care about access to the function keys in general and not just what
 currently happens when one presses Command F5. I use the function keys
 for adjusting screen brightness and volume, etc. I wonder how all the
 other items currently available via the function keys will be handled?
 
 On Oct 28, 2016, at 6:37 AM, Brandt Steenkamp
  wrote:
 
 There we go,
 
 Triple-tapping power sounds like the most consistent and logical way
 to go.
 
 Holding command down and tapping the touch bar also sounds okay, but
 not like something apple would do.
 
 Warm regards,
 
 Brandt Steenkamp
 
 Sent from my Macbook Pro
 
 Contact:
 
 Phone:
 Private: +27 (0)60 525 9181 
 For technical support with iOS: +27 (0)78 120 5013 
 
 Email: brandt.steenk...@gmail.com 
 
 Twitter: @brandtsteenkamp 
> On 28 Oct 2016, at 11:21 AM, Ray Foret jr  > wrote:
> 
> IF Apple is truly going for consistancy, I have a feeling I know how
> we will turn on Voice Over with the new touch bar.  I don?t know this
> for sure:  but, I?d be willing to guess that to turn on Voice Over,
> you simply touch or press the power button three times quickly if
> Voice Over is off.  OF course, you might be able to do it with Siri,
> or, here?s another guess:  press the command key and anywhere on the
> touch bar.  IF voice Over is off, it will know that you are trying to
> turn on Voice Over.  My best guess, however, would be to quickly
> touch the power button three times.  Makes the most sense and keeps
> things logical and easy.
> 
> 
>> On Oct 28, 2016, at 2:01 AM, christopher hallsworth
>> > wrote:
>> 
>> 

Re: What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event | AppleVis

[Scott Granados]

Actually Robbin, this is not true.  The last quarter released by apple which 
was just a few days ago showed 45 million iPhones sold.  This only included 2 
weeks of the iPhone 7+ sales which are way ahead of schedule due to in part the 
self destruction of Samsung.  Apple makes over a billion dollars per day on 
iPhone sales believe it or not.  The only slipping areas are in emerging 
markets where there ar some economic headwinds.  I’ll be the first to say Apple 
needs to develop something new and revolutionary to keep the growth rate going 
but right now the iPhone is by far the largest line item and the 7 is a much 
bigger hit than even Apple projected.  You are right that a year ago to the 
last earnings report, year over year there was a decline but this was projected 
do to the 6S running it’s course.  When you add the 7 back in they are most 
definitely back on track.


> On Oct 28, 2016, at 3:06 PM, Robin  wrote:
> 
> you DoKnow that Apple's Sales of its iPhones are Slippin'
> Don't Cha?
> And, it's only been about 1Month since its Release Referrin'To TheRelease of 
> the iPhone7 & iPhone7+
> 
> EvenWith Samsung's SNAFU of its GalaxyNote7, it's Still TheKing 
> AsItPertainsTo MobilePhones
> ImagineThat
> with All of TheLosses DueTo its Note7 Battery & OtherRelatedIssues ThisYear
> JustSayin'
> At 11:36 AM 10/28/2016, you wrote:
>>   Progress is not without pain. What would be better, stagnation? If Apple 
>> was 100% focused on the blind user share of the market, it might be 
>> different?
>> 
>>   History repeats itself, over and over. Look at the headphone jack, how 
>> much grief that caused right up to release day. And as soon as release day 
>> came and went, that noise died with a whimper. So too will the noise about 
>> the TouchBar.
>> 
>>   And next year this cycle will repeat again...and again.
>> 
>> From E.T.'s Keyboard...
>>  Without H2O there is no life!
>> ancient.ali...@icloud.com
>> 
>> On 10/28/2016 9:21 AM, - wrote:
>>> 
>>> Apple will almost certainly be forced to add yet another keystroke for
>>> doing what now is the direct press of a function key,  volume for example.
>>> 
>>> This is because when you cram multiple levels of function into a touch
>>> bar there has to be a way to choose among levels.
>>> 
>>> There are far far too many pretzel keypresses now without adding more.
>>> On Fri, 28 Oct 2016, gs wrote:
>>> 
 I care about access to the function keys in general and not just what
 currently happens when one presses Command F5. I use the function keys
 for adjusting screen brightness and volume, etc. I wonder how all the
 other items currently available via the function keys will be handled?
 
 On Oct 28, 2016, at 6:37 AM, Brandt Steenkamp
  wrote:
 
 There we go,
 
 Triple-tapping power sounds like the most consistent and logical way
 to go.
 
 Holding command down and tapping the touch bar also sounds okay, but
 not like something apple would do.
 
 Warm regards,
 
 Brandt Steenkamp
 
 Sent from my Macbook Pro
 
 Contact:
 
 Phone:
 Private: +27 (0)60 525 9181 
 For technical support with iOS: +27 (0)78 120 5013 
 
 Email: brandt.steenk...@gmail.com 
 
 Twitter: @brandtsteenkamp 
> On 28 Oct 2016, at 11:21 AM, Ray Foret jr  > wrote:
> 
> IF Apple is truly going for consistancy, I have a feeling I know how
> we will turn on Voice Over with the new touch bar.  I don?t know this
> for sure:  but, I?d be willing to guess that to turn on Voice Over,
> you simply touch or press the power button three times quickly if
> Voice Over is off.  OF course, you might be able to do it with Siri,
> or, here?s another guess:  press the command key and anywhere on the
> touch bar.  IF voice Over is off, it will know that you are trying to
> turn on Voice Over.  My best guess, however, would be to quickly
> touch the power button three times.  Makes the most sense and keeps
> things logical and easy.
> 
> 
>> On Oct 28, 2016, at 2:01 AM, christopher hallsworth
>> > wrote:
>> 
>> 
>>> 
>>> http://www.applevis.com/blog/apple-apple-tv-news/what-we-got-apples-october-2016-event#comment-form
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event
>>> Submitted by mehgcap on 27 October, 2016 - 16:28 and last modified
>>> on 27 October, 2016 - 19:18
>>> 
>>>  
>>> Hello Again
>>> 
>>> Today, Apple held a press event it called "Hello Again". The
>>> 

Re: What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event | AppleVis

[Scott Granados]

It’s been going on since the 70s with Apple.

Round and Round we go.

> On Oct 28, 2016, at 2:36 PM, E.T.  wrote:
> 
>   Progress is not without pain. What would be better, stagnation? If Apple 
> was 100% focused on the blind user share of the market, it might be different?
> 
>   History repeats itself, over and over. Look at the headphone jack, how much 
> grief that caused right up to release day. And as soon as release day came 
> and went, that noise died with a whimper. So too will the noise about the 
> TouchBar.
> 
>   And next year this cycle will repeat again...and again.
> 
> From E.T.'s Keyboard...
>  Without H2O there is no life!
> ancient.ali...@icloud.com
> 
> On 10/28/2016 9:21 AM, - wrote:
>> 
>> Apple will almost certainly be forced to add yet another keystroke for
>> doing what now is the direct press of a function key,  volume for example.
>> 
>> This is because when you cram multiple levels of function into a touch
>> bar there has to be a way to choose among levels.
>> 
>> There are far far too many pretzel keypresses now without adding more.
>> On Fri, 28 Oct 2016, gs wrote:
>> 
>>> I care about access to the function keys in general and not just what
>>> currently happens when one presses Command F5. I use the function keys
>>> for adjusting screen brightness and volume, etc. I wonder how all the
>>> other items currently available via the function keys will be handled?
>>> 
>>> On Oct 28, 2016, at 6:37 AM, Brandt Steenkamp
>>>  wrote:
>>> 
>>> There we go,
>>> 
>>> Triple-tapping power sounds like the most consistent and logical way
>>> to go.
>>> 
>>> Holding command down and tapping the touch bar also sounds okay, but
>>> not like something apple would do.
>>> 
>>> Warm regards,
>>> 
>>> Brandt Steenkamp
>>> 
>>> Sent from my Macbook Pro
>>> 
>>> Contact:
>>> 
>>> Phone:
>>> Private: +27 (0)60 525 9181 
>>> For technical support with iOS: +27 (0)78 120 5013 
>>> 
>>> Email: brandt.steenk...@gmail.com 
>>> 
>>> Twitter: @brandtsteenkamp 
 On 28 Oct 2016, at 11:21 AM, Ray Foret jr > wrote:
 
 IF Apple is truly going for consistancy, I have a feeling I know how
 we will turn on Voice Over with the new touch bar.  I don?t know this
 for sure:  but, I?d be willing to guess that to turn on Voice Over,
 you simply touch or press the power button three times quickly if
 Voice Over is off.  OF course, you might be able to do it with Siri,
 or, here?s another guess:  press the command key and anywhere on the
 touch bar.  IF voice Over is off, it will know that you are trying to
 turn on Voice Over.  My best guess, however, would be to quickly
 touch the power button three times.  Makes the most sense and keeps
 things logical and easy.
 
 
> On Oct 28, 2016, at 2:01 AM, christopher hallsworth
> > wrote:
> 
> 
>> 
>> http://www.applevis.com/blog/apple-apple-tv-news/what-we-got-apples-october-2016-event#comment-form
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event
>> Submitted by mehgcap on 27 October, 2016 - 16:28 and last modified
>> on 27 October, 2016 - 19:18
>> 
>>  
>> Hello Again
>> 
>> Today, Apple held a press event it called "Hello Again". The
>> company announced a new accessibility website, a new Apple TV
>> feature, and a long-awaited update to its MacBook computers. It may
>> have missed the back-to-school shoppers, but today's announcements
>> arrive just in time for the holiday shopping frenzy. There are some
>> major changes to the MacBook line-up on the way, and while much of
>> what you're about to read is awesome, you may not like all of it.
>> But there's a great deal to like about the latest offerings from
>> Apple, and I yell at articles to quit rambling in their intros and
>> get on with it just as much as you do, so let's get on with it!
>> 
>> Accessibility Kick-Off
>> 
>> To my surprise, Apple started the presentation with a video
>> highlighting accessibility features of its products. This led to
>> Tim Cook's announcing a "whole new website" focused on Apple's
>> accessibility efforts. As of the time of this writing, we haven't
>> had a chance to fully explore this new website
>> , but it's always great to see
>> the spotlight shown on all the work Apple does to make their
>> devices as usable, to as many people, as they can. It?s also great
>> to see that the AppleVis Community is featured on Apple?s new
>> 

Re: What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event | AppleVis

[Scott Granados]

It won’t be, nothing changes you do things as you always have.  At some point, 
your computer just won’t receive any more updates.  The operating system will 
eventually not be compatible because it’s to new.  Sort of the standard way of 
things happening.


> On Oct 28, 2016, at 2:33 PM, Kawal Gucukoglu  wrote:
> 
> So what will happen for those people who have I Mac and Mac Mini's who have 
> not changed their computers for a number of years as there will be no touch 
> bars etc.  So how will that be accommodated?  I have not listened to the 
> event as yet.
> 
> Kawal.
>> On 28 Oct 2016, at 19:06, christopher hallsworth  
>> wrote:
>> 
>> Well you know what? Found out through the VoiceOver Getting Started Guide 
>> that as part of the new and changed key commands set for VoiceOver under 
>> macOS Sierra, VO-- (hyphen) will decrease the system volume and vo-= 
>> (equals) will increase the system volume. Actually, I will correct this by 
>> saying vo-- (hyphen) is definitely new, but vo-= (equals) is actually a 
>> changed one from whatever it was before.
>> 
>> 
>>> On 28 Oct 2016, at 17:21, -  wrote:
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Apple will almost certainly be forced to add yet another keystroke for 
>>> doing what now is the direct press of a function key,  volume for example.
>>> 
>>> This is because when you cram multiple levels of function into a touch bar 
>>> there has to be a way to choose among levels.
>>> 
>>> There are far far too many pretzel keypresses now without adding more.
>>> On Fri, 28 Oct 2016, gs wrote:
>>> 
 I care about access to the function keys in general and not just what 
 currently happens when one presses Command F5. I use the function keys for 
 adjusting screen brightness and volume, etc. I wonder how all the other 
 items currently available via the function keys will be handled?
 
 On Oct 28, 2016, at 6:37 AM, Brandt Steenkamp  
 wrote:
 
 There we go,
 
 Triple-tapping power sounds like the most consistent and logical way to go.
 
 Holding command down and tapping the touch bar also sounds okay, but not 
 like something apple would do.
 
 Warm regards,
 
 Brandt Steenkamp
 
 Sent from my Macbook Pro
 
 Contact:
 
 Phone:
 Private: +27 (0)60 525 9181 
 For technical support with iOS: +27 (0)78 120 5013 
 
 Email: brandt.steenk...@gmail.com 
 
 Twitter: @brandtsteenkamp 
> On 28 Oct 2016, at 11:21 AM, Ray Foret jr  > wrote:
> 
> IF Apple is truly going for consistancy, I have a feeling I know how we 
> will turn on Voice Over with the new touch bar.  I don?t know this for 
> sure:  but, I?d be willing to guess that to turn on Voice Over, you 
> simply touch or press the power button three times quickly if Voice Over 
> is off.  OF course, you might be able to do it with Siri, or, here?s 
> another guess:  press the command key and anywhere on the touch bar.  IF 
> voice Over is off, it will know that you are trying to turn on Voice 
> Over.  My best guess, however, would be to quickly touch the power button 
> three times.  Makes the most sense and keeps things logical and easy.
> 
> 
>> On Oct 28, 2016, at 2:01 AM, christopher hallsworth 
>> > wrote:
>> 
>> 
>>> 
>>> http://www.applevis.com/blog/apple-apple-tv-news/what-we-got-apples-october-2016-event#comment-form
>>>  
>>> 
>>> 
>>> What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event
>>> Submitted by mehgcap on 27 October, 2016 - 16:28 and last modified on 
>>> 27 October, 2016 - 19:18
>>> 
>>>  
>>> Hello Again
>>> 
>>> Today, Apple held a press event it called "Hello Again". The company 
>>> announced a new accessibility website, a new Apple TV feature, and a 
>>> long-awaited update to its MacBook computers. It may have missed the 
>>> back-to-school shoppers, but today's announcements arrive just in time 
>>> for the holiday shopping frenzy. There are some major changes to the 
>>> MacBook line-up on the way, and while much of what you're about to read 
>>> is awesome, you may not like all of it. But there's a great deal to 
>>> like about the latest offerings from Apple, and I yell at articles to 
>>> quit rambling in their intros and get on with it just as much as you 
>>> do, so let's get on with it!
>>> 
>>> Accessibility Kick-Off
>>> 
>>> To my surprise, Apple started the presentation with a video 
>>> 

Re: What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event | AppleVis

[christopher hallsworth]

What? And this is only running at the very least a 1.1 GHZ intel M3 processor? 
That sounds *real* slow to me.


> On 28 Oct 2016, at 10:52, Sandi Jazmin Kruse  wrote:
> 
> I wanna add to this, if you use the Mac book, not the mac book pro,
> but the Fanless  design, it may seem small, underrated, but it is so
> powerful that  it can semi consistently run latest model of flight
> sims in winddows 7, settings are real weather, full realism turned on,
> and over 120 FPS. It was not build for this however, but it can do it.
> 
> 
> On 10/28/16, Ray Foret jr  wrote:
>> IF Apple is truly going for consistancy, I have a feeling I know how we will
>> turn on Voice Over with the new touch bar.  I don’t know this for sure:
>> but, I’d be willing to guess that to turn on Voice Over, you simply touch or
>> press the power button three times quickly if Voice Over is off.  OF course,
>> you might be able to do it with Siri, or, here’s another guess:  press the
>> command key and anywhere on the touch bar.  IF voice Over is off, it will
>> know that you are trying to turn on Voice Over.  My best guess, however,
>> would be to quickly touch the power button three times.  Makes the most
>> sense and keeps things logical and easy.
>> 
>> 
>>> On Oct 28, 2016, at 2:01 AM, christopher hallsworth
>>>  wrote:
>>> 
>>> 
 
 http://www.applevis.com/blog/apple-apple-tv-news/what-we-got-apples-october-2016-event#comment-form
 
 
 What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event
 Submitted by mehgcap on 27 October, 2016 - 16:28 and last modified on 27
 October, 2016 - 19:18
 
  
 Hello Again
 
 Today, Apple held a press event it called "Hello Again". The company
 announced a new accessibility website, a new Apple TV feature, and a
 long-awaited update to its MacBook computers. It may have missed the
 back-to-school shoppers, but today's announcements arrive just in time
 for the holiday shopping frenzy. There are some major changes to the
 MacBook line-up on the way, and while much of what you're about to read
 is awesome, you may not like all of it. But there's a great deal to like
 about the latest offerings from Apple, and I yell at articles to quit
 rambling in their intros and get on with it just as much as you do, so
 let's get on with it!
 
 Accessibility Kick-Off
 
 To my surprise, Apple started the presentation with a video highlighting
 accessibility features of its products. This led to Tim Cook's announcing
 a "whole new website" focused on Apple's accessibility efforts. As of the
 time of this writing, we haven't had a chance to fully explore this new
 website , but it's always great to
 see the spotlight shown on all the work Apple does to make their devices
 as usable, to as many people, as they can. It’s also great to see that
 the AppleVis Community is featured on Apple’s new Accessibility Portal as
 somewhere people should go to obtain more information and support. Thank
 you, Apple!
 
 Get Entertained on Apple TV
 
 No, there's not a new Apple TV coming out, but there is a new way to find
 something to watch on the box you already have. It's a new app from
 Apple, called--appropriately enough--TV. Yep, just those two letters.
 Interestingly, Apple offers this app on not just Apple TV, but your iOS
 devices as well, letting you browse and play content on any of your
 devices. But what, exactly, does the app do?
 
 TV pulls together any shows or movies you're already watching on your
 video apps, as well as offering the next or newest episodes in TV series.
 This isn't just iTunes, either; it can work with ShowTime, CBS, HBO Now,
 and others, which makes it simple to keep up with any entertainment
 you're watching. The app also shows you your iTunes purchases or new
 video apps. It can even play content without you needing to know which
 app the content is in; tell Siri to play a particular show or game and
 that's all you need. But don't get too excited, because while the app is
 free, it won't be here until the end of the year.
 
 Prose about the Pro
 
 The MacBook Pro was the star of the show today. It got a major
 makeover--the first since the 2013 model dropped the disk drive--and
 there's a lot of great stuff on and inside it. Yet, there's also a change
 you may not like.
 
 Inevitable Updates
 
 First, the fun part: the updates we all expected, and that Apple almost
 had to make. The Pro is now slightly lighter and thinner, while the
 battery life remains at ten hours; no surprise there. It's also 

Re: What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event | AppleVis

[christopher hallsworth]

I would agree with the triple tap power idea.
> On 28 Oct 2016, at 11:37, Brandt Steenkamp  wrote:
> 
> There we go,
> 
> Triple-tapping power sounds like the most consistent and logical way to go.
> 
> Holding command down and tapping the touch bar also sounds okay, but not like 
> something apple would do.
> 
> Warm regards,
> 
> Brandt Steenkamp
> 
> Sent from my Macbook Pro
> 
> Contact:
> 
> Phone:
> Private: +27 (0)60 525 9181
> For technical support with iOS: +27 (0)78 120 5013
> 
> Email: brandt.steenk...@gmail.com
> 
> Twitter: @brandtsteenkamp
> 
>> On 28 Oct 2016, at 11:21 AM, Ray Foret jr  wrote:
>> 
>> IF Apple is truly going for consistancy, I have a feeling I know how we will 
>> turn on Voice Over with the new touch bar.  I don’t know this for sure:  
>> but, I’d be willing to guess that to turn on Voice Over, you simply touch or 
>> press the power button three times quickly if Voice Over is off.  OF course, 
>> you might be able to do it with Siri, or, here’s another guess:  press the 
>> command key and anywhere on the touch bar.  IF voice Over is off, it will 
>> know that you are trying to turn on Voice Over.  My best guess, however, 
>> would be to quickly touch the power button three times.  Makes the most 
>> sense and keeps things logical and easy.
>> 
>> 
>>> On Oct 28, 2016, at 2:01 AM, christopher hallsworth 
>>>  wrote:
>>> 
>>> 
 
 http://www.applevis.com/blog/apple-apple-tv-news/what-we-got-apples-october-2016-event#comment-form
 
 What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event
 Submitted by mehgcap on 27 October, 2016 - 16:28 and last modified on 27 
 October, 2016 - 19:18
 
 
 Hello Again
 
 Today, Apple held a press event it called "Hello Again". The company 
 announced a new accessibility website, a new Apple TV feature, and a 
 long-awaited update to its MacBook computers. It may have missed the 
 back-to-school shoppers, but today's announcements arrive just in time for 
 the holiday shopping frenzy. There are some major changes to the MacBook 
 line-up on the way, and while much of what you're about to read is 
 awesome, you may not like all of it. But there's a great deal to like 
 about the latest offerings from Apple, and I yell at articles to quit 
 rambling in their intros and get on with it just as much as you do, so 
 let's get on with it!
 
 Accessibility Kick-Off
 
 To my surprise, Apple started the presentation with a video highlighting 
 accessibility features of its products. This led to Tim Cook's announcing 
 a "whole new website" focused on Apple's accessibility efforts. As of the 
 time of this writing, we haven't had a chance to fully explore this new 
 website, but it's always great to see the spotlight shown on all the work 
 Apple does to make their devices as usable, to as many people, as they 
 can. It’s also great to see that the AppleVis Community is featured on 
 Apple’s new Accessibility Portal as somewhere people should go to obtain 
 more information and support. Thank you, Apple!
 
 Get Entertained on Apple TV
 
 No, there's not a new Apple TV coming out, but there is a new way to find 
 something to watch on the box you already have. It's a new app from Apple, 
 called--appropriately enough--TV. Yep, just those two letters. 
 Interestingly, Apple offers this app on not just Apple TV, but your iOS 
 devices as well, letting you browse and play content on any of your 
 devices. But what, exactly, does the app do?
 
 TV pulls together any shows or movies you're already watching on your 
 video apps, as well as offering the next or newest episodes in TV series. 
 This isn't just iTunes, either; it can work with ShowTime, CBS, HBO Now, 
 and others, which makes it simple to keep up with any entertainment you're 
 watching. The app also shows you your iTunes purchases or new video apps. 
 It can even play content without you needing to know which app the content 
 is in; tell Siri to play a particular show or game and that's all you 
 need. But don't get too excited, because while the app is free, it won't 
 be here until the end of the year.
 
 Prose about the Pro
 
 The MacBook Pro was the star of the show today. It got a major 
 makeover--the first since the 2013 model dropped the disk drive--and 
 there's a lot of great stuff on and inside it. Yet, there's also a change 
 you may not like.
 
 Inevitable Updates
 
 First, the fun part: the updates we all expected, and that Apple almost 
 had to make. The Pro is now slightly lighter and thinner, while the 
 battery life remains at ten hours; no surprise there. It's also adopted 
 the USB-C ports we first saw in the Retina MacBook last year. The new Pro 
 

Re: What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event | AppleVis

[Tim Kilburn]

Hi,

It's OK to express concern, it's OK to wonder, but people need to realize that 
these decisions are not made without accessibility in mind.  If a change is 
made such as the removal of the F-keys, then there will just be different 
keystrokes to accomplish task that originally required those F-keys.  No need 
to jump on a band-wagon saying that we, as a blind community, are being left 
out in the cold.  That's simply unfair and unproductive.  Those of us who have 
older Mac models where the Function bar is not present should see no change in 
behavior, as the MacOS will just know that your specific Mac isn't capable of 
Function Bar actions..  It's no different than what happens now when you 
connect a non-Apple keyboard, the MacOS figures it out and your media keys etc. 
don't function like they do on an Apple keyboard.

Just as a prediction, because I'd rather look forward positively, with the 
introduction of a finger-print sensor on the power button, might it be possible 
that the power button become similar to the Home button on an iOS device.  That 
is, VO could be invoked by a triple-tap on the power button?  If Apple is 
moving towards less differentiation between the iOS and MacOS experience, it's 
possible.There are usually all sorts of options to make things work, maybe 
different than what we're accustomed to, but possibilities none-the-less.

Later...
 

Sent from my iPhone

> On Oct 28, 2016, at 12:36 PM, E.T.  wrote:
> 
>   Progress is not without pain. What would be better, stagnation? If Apple 
> was 100% focused on the blind user share of the market, it might be different?
> 
>   History repeats itself, over and over. Look at the headphone jack, how much 
> grief that caused right up to release day. And as soon as release day came 
> and went, that noise died with a whimper. So too will the noise about the 
> TouchBar.
> 
>   And next year this cycle will repeat again...and again.
> 
> From E.T.'s Keyboard...
>  Without H2O there is no life!
> ancient.ali...@icloud.com
> 
>> On 10/28/2016 9:21 AM, - wrote:
>> 
>> Apple will almost certainly be forced to add yet another keystroke for
>> doing what now is the direct press of a function key,  volume for example.
>> 
>> This is because when you cram multiple levels of function into a touch
>> bar there has to be a way to choose among levels.
>> 
>> There are far far too many pretzel keypresses now without adding more.
>>> On Fri, 28 Oct 2016, gs wrote:
>>> 
>>> I care about access to the function keys in general and not just what
>>> currently happens when one presses Command F5. I use the function keys
>>> for adjusting screen brightness and volume, etc. I wonder how all the
>>> other items currently available via the function keys will be handled?
>>> 
>>> On Oct 28, 2016, at 6:37 AM, Brandt Steenkamp
>>>  wrote:
>>> 
>>> There we go,
>>> 
>>> Triple-tapping power sounds like the most consistent and logical way
>>> to go.
>>> 
>>> Holding command down and tapping the touch bar also sounds okay, but
>>> not like something apple would do.
>>> 
>>> Warm regards,
>>> 
>>> Brandt Steenkamp
>>> 
>>> Sent from my Macbook Pro
>>> 
>>> Contact:
>>> 
>>> Phone:
>>> Private: +27 (0)60 525 9181 
>>> For technical support with iOS: +27 (0)78 120 5013 
>>> 
>>> Email: brandt.steenk...@gmail.com 
>>> 
>>> Twitter: @brandtsteenkamp 
 On 28 Oct 2016, at 11:21 AM, Ray Foret jr > wrote:
 
 IF Apple is truly going for consistancy, I have a feeling I know how
 we will turn on Voice Over with the new touch bar.  I don?t know this
 for sure:  but, I?d be willing to guess that to turn on Voice Over,
 you simply touch or press the power button three times quickly if
 Voice Over is off.  OF course, you might be able to do it with Siri,
 or, here?s another guess:  press the command key and anywhere on the
 touch bar.  IF voice Over is off, it will know that you are trying to
 turn on Voice Over.  My best guess, however, would be to quickly
 touch the power button three times.  Makes the most sense and keeps
 things logical and easy.
 
 
> On Oct 28, 2016, at 2:01 AM, christopher hallsworth
> > wrote:
> 
> 
>> 
>> http://www.applevis.com/blog/apple-apple-tv-news/what-we-got-apples-october-2016-event#comment-form
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event
>> Submitted by mehgcap on 27 October, 2016 - 16:28 and last modified
>> on 27 October, 2016 - 19:18
>> 
>>  
>> Hello Again
>> 
>> Today, Apple held a press event it called "Hello 

Re: What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event | AppleVis

[christopher hallsworth]

There was no mention of any of their desktops being refreshed so it looks like 
you will have to stick with old to ancient hardware, for now at least.
> On 28 Oct 2016, at 19:33, Kawal Gucukoglu  wrote:
> 
> So what will happen for those people who have I Mac and Mac Mini's who have 
> not changed their computers for a number of years as there will be no touch 
> bars etc.  So how will that be accommodated?  I have not listened to the 
> event as yet.
> 
> Kawal.
>> On 28 Oct 2016, at 19:06, christopher hallsworth  
>> wrote:
>> 
>> Well you know what? Found out through the VoiceOver Getting Started Guide 
>> that as part of the new and changed key commands set for VoiceOver under 
>> macOS Sierra, VO-- (hyphen) will decrease the system volume and vo-= 
>> (equals) will increase the system volume. Actually, I will correct this by 
>> saying vo-- (hyphen) is definitely new, but vo-= (equals) is actually a 
>> changed one from whatever it was before.
>> 
>> 
>>> On 28 Oct 2016, at 17:21, -  wrote:
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Apple will almost certainly be forced to add yet another keystroke for 
>>> doing what now is the direct press of a function key,  volume for example.
>>> 
>>> This is because when you cram multiple levels of function into a touch bar 
>>> there has to be a way to choose among levels.
>>> 
>>> There are far far too many pretzel keypresses now without adding more.
>>> On Fri, 28 Oct 2016, gs wrote:
>>> 
 I care about access to the function keys in general and not just what 
 currently happens when one presses Command F5. I use the function keys for 
 adjusting screen brightness and volume, etc. I wonder how all the other 
 items currently available via the function keys will be handled?
 
 On Oct 28, 2016, at 6:37 AM, Brandt Steenkamp  
 wrote:
 
 There we go,
 
 Triple-tapping power sounds like the most consistent and logical way to go.
 
 Holding command down and tapping the touch bar also sounds okay, but not 
 like something apple would do.
 
 Warm regards,
 
 Brandt Steenkamp
 
 Sent from my Macbook Pro
 
 Contact:
 
 Phone:
 Private: +27 (0)60 525 9181 
 For technical support with iOS: +27 (0)78 120 5013 
 
 Email: brandt.steenk...@gmail.com 
 
 Twitter: @brandtsteenkamp 
> On 28 Oct 2016, at 11:21 AM, Ray Foret jr  > wrote:
> 
> IF Apple is truly going for consistancy, I have a feeling I know how we 
> will turn on Voice Over with the new touch bar.  I don?t know this for 
> sure:  but, I?d be willing to guess that to turn on Voice Over, you 
> simply touch or press the power button three times quickly if Voice Over 
> is off.  OF course, you might be able to do it with Siri, or, here?s 
> another guess:  press the command key and anywhere on the touch bar.  IF 
> voice Over is off, it will know that you are trying to turn on Voice 
> Over.  My best guess, however, would be to quickly touch the power button 
> three times.  Makes the most sense and keeps things logical and easy.
> 
> 
>> On Oct 28, 2016, at 2:01 AM, christopher hallsworth 
>> > wrote:
>> 
>> 
>>> 
>>> http://www.applevis.com/blog/apple-apple-tv-news/what-we-got-apples-october-2016-event#comment-form
>>>  
>>> 
>>> 
>>> What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event
>>> Submitted by mehgcap on 27 October, 2016 - 16:28 and last modified on 
>>> 27 October, 2016 - 19:18
>>> 
>>>  
>>> Hello Again
>>> 
>>> Today, Apple held a press event it called "Hello Again". The company 
>>> announced a new accessibility website, a new Apple TV feature, and a 
>>> long-awaited update to its MacBook computers. It may have missed the 
>>> back-to-school shoppers, but today's announcements arrive just in time 
>>> for the holiday shopping frenzy. There are some major changes to the 
>>> MacBook line-up on the way, and while much of what you're about to read 
>>> is awesome, you may not like all of it. But there's a great deal to 
>>> like about the latest offerings from Apple, and I yell at articles to 
>>> quit rambling in their intros and get on with it just as much as you 
>>> do, so let's get on with it!
>>> 
>>> Accessibility Kick-Off
>>> 
>>> To my surprise, Apple started the presentation with a video 
>>> highlighting accessibility features of its products. This led to Tim 
>>> Cook's announcing a "whole new website" 

Re: What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event | AppleVis

[Robin]

you DoKnow that Apple's Sales of its iPhones are Slippin'
Don't Cha?
And, it's only been about 1Month since its Release Referrin'To 
TheRelease of the iPhone7 & iPhone7+


EvenWith Samsung's SNAFU of its GalaxyNote7, it's Still TheKing 
AsItPertainsTo MobilePhones

ImagineThat
with All of TheLosses DueTo its Note7 Battery & OtherRelatedIssues ThisYear
JustSayin'
At 11:36 AM 10/28/2016, you wrote:
   Progress is not without pain. What would be better, stagnation? 
If Apple was 100% focused on the blind user share of the market, it 
might be different?


   History repeats itself, over and over. Look at the headphone 
jack, how much grief that caused right up to release day. And as 
soon as release day came and went, that noise died with a whimper. 
So too will the noise about the TouchBar.


   And next year this cycle will repeat again...and again.

From E.T.'s Keyboard...
  Without H2O there is no life!
ancient.ali...@icloud.com

On 10/28/2016 9:21 AM, - wrote:


Apple will almost certainly be forced to add yet another keystroke for
doing what now is the direct press of a function key,  volume for example.

This is because when you cram multiple levels of function into a touch
bar there has to be a way to choose among levels.

There are far far too many pretzel keypresses now without adding more.
On Fri, 28 Oct 2016, gs wrote:


I care about access to the function keys in general and not just what
currently happens when one presses Command F5. I use the function keys
for adjusting screen brightness and volume, etc. I wonder how all the
other items currently available via the function keys will be handled?

On Oct 28, 2016, at 6:37 AM, Brandt Steenkamp
 wrote:

There we go,

Triple-tapping power sounds like the most consistent and logical way
to go.

Holding command down and tapping the touch bar also sounds okay, but
not like something apple would do.

Warm regards,

Brandt Steenkamp

Sent from my Macbook Pro

Contact:

Phone:
Private: +27 (0)60 525 9181 
For technical support with iOS: +27 (0)78 120 5013 

Email: brandt.steenk...@gmail.com 

Twitter: @brandtsteenkamp 

On 28 Oct 2016, at 11:21 AM, Ray Foret jr > wrote:

IF Apple is truly going for consistancy, I have a feeling I know how
we will turn on Voice Over with the new touch bar.  I don?t know this
for sure:  but, I?d be willing to guess that to turn on Voice Over,
you simply touch or press the power button three times quickly if
Voice Over is off.  OF course, you might be able to do it with Siri,
or, here?s another guess:  press the command key and anywhere on the
touch bar.  IF voice Over is off, it will know that you are trying to
turn on Voice Over.  My best guess, however, would be to quickly
touch the power button three times.  Makes the most sense and keeps
things logical and easy.



On Oct 28, 2016, at 2:01 AM, christopher hallsworth
> wrote:




http://www.applevis.com/blog/apple-apple-tv-news/what-we-got-apples-october-2016-event#comment-form



What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event
Submitted by mehgcap on 27 October, 2016 - 16:28 and last modified
on 27 October, 2016 - 19:18

 
Hello Again

Today, Apple held a press event it called "Hello Again". The
company announced a new accessibility website, a new Apple TV
feature, and a long-awaited update to its MacBook computers. It may
have missed the back-to-school shoppers, but today's announcements
arrive just in time for the holiday shopping frenzy. There are some
major changes to the MacBook line-up on the way, and while much of
what you're about to read is awesome, you may not like all of it.
But there's a great deal to like about the latest offerings from
Apple, and I yell at articles to quit rambling in their intros and
get on with it just as much as you do, so let's get on with it!

Accessibility Kick-Off

To my surprise, Apple started the presentation with a video
highlighting accessibility features of its products. This led to
Tim Cook's announcing a "whole new website" focused on Apple's
accessibility efforts. As of the time of this writing, we haven't
had a chance to fully explore this new website
, but it's always great to see
the spotlight shown on all the work Apple does to make their
devices as usable, to as many people, as they can. It?s also great
to see that the AppleVis Community is featured on Apple?s new
Accessibility Portal as somewhere people should go to obtain more
information and support. Thank you, Apple!

Get Entertained on Apple TV

No, there's not a new Apple TV coming out, but there is a new way
to find something to watch on the box you already have. It's a 

Re: What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event | AppleVis

[E.T.]

   Progress is not without pain. What would be better, stagnation? If 
Apple was 100% focused on the blind user share of the market, it might 
be different?


   History repeats itself, over and over. Look at the headphone jack, 
how much grief that caused right up to release day. And as soon as 
release day came and went, that noise died with a whimper. So too will 
the noise about the TouchBar.


   And next year this cycle will repeat again...and again.

From E.T.'s Keyboard...
  Without H2O there is no life!
ancient.ali...@icloud.com

On 10/28/2016 9:21 AM, - wrote:


Apple will almost certainly be forced to add yet another keystroke for
doing what now is the direct press of a function key,  volume for example.

This is because when you cram multiple levels of function into a touch
bar there has to be a way to choose among levels.

There are far far too many pretzel keypresses now without adding more.
On Fri, 28 Oct 2016, gs wrote:


I care about access to the function keys in general and not just what
currently happens when one presses Command F5. I use the function keys
for adjusting screen brightness and volume, etc. I wonder how all the
other items currently available via the function keys will be handled?

On Oct 28, 2016, at 6:37 AM, Brandt Steenkamp
 wrote:

There we go,

Triple-tapping power sounds like the most consistent and logical way
to go.

Holding command down and tapping the touch bar also sounds okay, but
not like something apple would do.

Warm regards,

Brandt Steenkamp

Sent from my Macbook Pro

Contact:

Phone:
Private: +27 (0)60 525 9181 
For technical support with iOS: +27 (0)78 120 5013 

Email: brandt.steenk...@gmail.com 

Twitter: @brandtsteenkamp 

On 28 Oct 2016, at 11:21 AM, Ray Foret jr > wrote:

IF Apple is truly going for consistancy, I have a feeling I know how
we will turn on Voice Over with the new touch bar.  I don?t know this
for sure:  but, I?d be willing to guess that to turn on Voice Over,
you simply touch or press the power button three times quickly if
Voice Over is off.  OF course, you might be able to do it with Siri,
or, here?s another guess:  press the command key and anywhere on the
touch bar.  IF voice Over is off, it will know that you are trying to
turn on Voice Over.  My best guess, however, would be to quickly
touch the power button three times.  Makes the most sense and keeps
things logical and easy.



On Oct 28, 2016, at 2:01 AM, christopher hallsworth
> wrote:




http://www.applevis.com/blog/apple-apple-tv-news/what-we-got-apples-october-2016-event#comment-form



What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event
Submitted by mehgcap on 27 October, 2016 - 16:28 and last modified
on 27 October, 2016 - 19:18

 
Hello Again

Today, Apple held a press event it called "Hello Again". The
company announced a new accessibility website, a new Apple TV
feature, and a long-awaited update to its MacBook computers. It may
have missed the back-to-school shoppers, but today's announcements
arrive just in time for the holiday shopping frenzy. There are some
major changes to the MacBook line-up on the way, and while much of
what you're about to read is awesome, you may not like all of it.
But there's a great deal to like about the latest offerings from
Apple, and I yell at articles to quit rambling in their intros and
get on with it just as much as you do, so let's get on with it!

Accessibility Kick-Off

To my surprise, Apple started the presentation with a video
highlighting accessibility features of its products. This led to
Tim Cook's announcing a "whole new website" focused on Apple's
accessibility efforts. As of the time of this writing, we haven't
had a chance to fully explore this new website
, but it's always great to see
the spotlight shown on all the work Apple does to make their
devices as usable, to as many people, as they can. It?s also great
to see that the AppleVis Community is featured on Apple?s new
Accessibility Portal as somewhere people should go to obtain more
information and support. Thank you, Apple!

Get Entertained on Apple TV

No, there's not a new Apple TV coming out, but there is a new way
to find something to watch on the box you already have. It's a new
app from Apple, called--appropriately enough--TV. Yep, just those
two letters. Interestingly, Apple offers this app on not just Apple
TV, but your iOS devices as well, letting you browse and play
content on any of your devices. But what, exactly, does the app do?

TV pulls together any shows or movies you're already watching on
your video apps, as well as offering the next or newest episodes in

Re: What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event | AppleVis

[Kawal Gucukoglu]

So what will happen for those people who have I Mac and Mac Mini's who have not 
changed their computers for a number of years as there will be no touch bars 
etc.  So how will that be accommodated?  I have not listened to the event as 
yet.

Kawal.
> On 28 Oct 2016, at 19:06, christopher hallsworth  
> wrote:
> 
> Well you know what? Found out through the VoiceOver Getting Started Guide 
> that as part of the new and changed key commands set for VoiceOver under 
> macOS Sierra, VO-- (hyphen) will decrease the system volume and vo-= (equals) 
> will increase the system volume. Actually, I will correct this by saying vo-- 
> (hyphen) is definitely new, but vo-= (equals) is actually a changed one from 
> whatever it was before.
> 
> 
>> On 28 Oct 2016, at 17:21, -  wrote:
>> 
>> 
>> Apple will almost certainly be forced to add yet another keystroke for doing 
>> what now is the direct press of a function key,  volume for example.
>> 
>> This is because when you cram multiple levels of function into a touch bar 
>> there has to be a way to choose among levels.
>> 
>> There are far far too many pretzel keypresses now without adding more.
>> On Fri, 28 Oct 2016, gs wrote:
>> 
>>> I care about access to the function keys in general and not just what 
>>> currently happens when one presses Command F5. I use the function keys for 
>>> adjusting screen brightness and volume, etc. I wonder how all the other 
>>> items currently available via the function keys will be handled?
>>> 
>>> On Oct 28, 2016, at 6:37 AM, Brandt Steenkamp  
>>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> There we go,
>>> 
>>> Triple-tapping power sounds like the most consistent and logical way to go.
>>> 
>>> Holding command down and tapping the touch bar also sounds okay, but not 
>>> like something apple would do.
>>> 
>>> Warm regards,
>>> 
>>> Brandt Steenkamp
>>> 
>>> Sent from my Macbook Pro
>>> 
>>> Contact:
>>> 
>>> Phone:
>>> Private: +27 (0)60 525 9181 
>>> For technical support with iOS: +27 (0)78 120 5013 
>>> 
>>> Email: brandt.steenk...@gmail.com 
>>> 
>>> Twitter: @brandtsteenkamp 
 On 28 Oct 2016, at 11:21 AM, Ray Foret jr > wrote:
 
 IF Apple is truly going for consistancy, I have a feeling I know how we 
 will turn on Voice Over with the new touch bar.  I don?t know this for 
 sure:  but, I?d be willing to guess that to turn on Voice Over, you simply 
 touch or press the power button three times quickly if Voice Over is off.  
 OF course, you might be able to do it with Siri, or, here?s another guess: 
  press the command key and anywhere on the touch bar.  IF voice Over is 
 off, it will know that you are trying to turn on Voice Over.  My best 
 guess, however, would be to quickly touch the power button three times.  
 Makes the most sense and keeps things logical and easy.
 
 
> On Oct 28, 2016, at 2:01 AM, christopher hallsworth 
> > wrote:
> 
> 
>> 
>> http://www.applevis.com/blog/apple-apple-tv-news/what-we-got-apples-october-2016-event#comment-form
>>  
>> 
>> 
>> What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event
>> Submitted by mehgcap on 27 October, 2016 - 16:28 and last modified on 27 
>> October, 2016 - 19:18
>> 
>>  
>> Hello Again
>> 
>> Today, Apple held a press event it called "Hello Again". The company 
>> announced a new accessibility website, a new Apple TV feature, and a 
>> long-awaited update to its MacBook computers. It may have missed the 
>> back-to-school shoppers, but today's announcements arrive just in time 
>> for the holiday shopping frenzy. There are some major changes to the 
>> MacBook line-up on the way, and while much of what you're about to read 
>> is awesome, you may not like all of it. But there's a great deal to like 
>> about the latest offerings from Apple, and I yell at articles to quit 
>> rambling in their intros and get on with it just as much as you do, so 
>> let's get on with it!
>> 
>> Accessibility Kick-Off
>> 
>> To my surprise, Apple started the presentation with a video highlighting 
>> accessibility features of its products. This led to Tim Cook's 
>> announcing a "whole new website" focused on Apple's accessibility 
>> efforts. As of the time of this writing, we haven't had a chance to 
>> fully explore this new website , but 
>> it's always great to see the spotlight shown on all the work Apple does 
>> to make their devices as usable, to as many people, as they 

Re: What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event | AppleVis

[christopher hallsworth]

Well you know what? Found out through the VoiceOver Getting Started Guide that 
as part of the new and changed key commands set for VoiceOver under macOS 
Sierra, VO-- (hyphen) will decrease the system volume and vo-= (equals) will 
increase the system volume. Actually, I will correct this by saying vo-- 
(hyphen) is definitely new, but vo-= (equals) is actually a changed one from 
whatever it was before.


> On 28 Oct 2016, at 17:21, -  wrote:
> 
> 
> Apple will almost certainly be forced to add yet another keystroke for doing 
> what now is the direct press of a function key,  volume for example.
> 
> This is because when you cram multiple levels of function into a touch bar 
> there has to be a way to choose among levels.
> 
> There are far far too many pretzel keypresses now without adding more.
> On Fri, 28 Oct 2016, gs wrote:
> 
>> I care about access to the function keys in general and not just what 
>> currently happens when one presses Command F5. I use the function keys for 
>> adjusting screen brightness and volume, etc. I wonder how all the other 
>> items currently available via the function keys will be handled?
>> 
>> On Oct 28, 2016, at 6:37 AM, Brandt Steenkamp  
>> wrote:
>> 
>> There we go,
>> 
>> Triple-tapping power sounds like the most consistent and logical way to go.
>> 
>> Holding command down and tapping the touch bar also sounds okay, but not 
>> like something apple would do.
>> 
>> Warm regards,
>> 
>> Brandt Steenkamp
>> 
>> Sent from my Macbook Pro
>> 
>> Contact:
>> 
>> Phone:
>> Private: +27 (0)60 525 9181 
>> For technical support with iOS: +27 (0)78 120 5013 
>> 
>> Email: brandt.steenk...@gmail.com 
>> 
>> Twitter: @brandtsteenkamp 
>>> On 28 Oct 2016, at 11:21 AM, Ray Foret jr >> > wrote:
>>> 
>>> IF Apple is truly going for consistancy, I have a feeling I know how we 
>>> will turn on Voice Over with the new touch bar.  I don?t know this for 
>>> sure:  but, I?d be willing to guess that to turn on Voice Over, you simply 
>>> touch or press the power button three times quickly if Voice Over is off.  
>>> OF course, you might be able to do it with Siri, or, here?s another guess:  
>>> press the command key and anywhere on the touch bar.  IF voice Over is off, 
>>> it will know that you are trying to turn on Voice Over.  My best guess, 
>>> however, would be to quickly touch the power button three times.  Makes the 
>>> most sense and keeps things logical and easy.
>>> 
>>> 
 On Oct 28, 2016, at 2:01 AM, christopher hallsworth 
 > wrote:
 
 
> 
> http://www.applevis.com/blog/apple-apple-tv-news/what-we-got-apples-october-2016-event#comment-form
>  
> 
> 
> What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event
> Submitted by mehgcap on 27 October, 2016 - 16:28 and last modified on 27 
> October, 2016 - 19:18
> 
>  
> Hello Again
> 
> Today, Apple held a press event it called "Hello Again". The company 
> announced a new accessibility website, a new Apple TV feature, and a 
> long-awaited update to its MacBook computers. It may have missed the 
> back-to-school shoppers, but today's announcements arrive just in time 
> for the holiday shopping frenzy. There are some major changes to the 
> MacBook line-up on the way, and while much of what you're about to read 
> is awesome, you may not like all of it. But there's a great deal to like 
> about the latest offerings from Apple, and I yell at articles to quit 
> rambling in their intros and get on with it just as much as you do, so 
> let's get on with it!
> 
> Accessibility Kick-Off
> 
> To my surprise, Apple started the presentation with a video highlighting 
> accessibility features of its products. This led to Tim Cook's announcing 
> a "whole new website" focused on Apple's accessibility efforts. As of the 
> time of this writing, we haven't had a chance to fully explore this new 
> website , but it's always great to 
> see the spotlight shown on all the work Apple does to make their devices 
> as usable, to as many people, as they can. It?s also great to see that 
> the AppleVis Community is featured on Apple?s new Accessibility Portal as 
> somewhere people should go to obtain more information and support. Thank 
> you, Apple!
> 
> Get Entertained on Apple TV
> 
> No, there's not a new Apple TV coming out, but there is a new way to find 
> something to watch on the box you already have. It's a new app from 
> Apple, 

Re: What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event | AppleVis

[-]

Apple will almost certainly be forced to add yet another keystroke for 
doing what now is the direct press of a function key,  volume for example.


This is because when you cram multiple levels of function into a touch bar 
there has to be a way to choose among levels.


There are far far too many pretzel keypresses now without adding more.
On Fri, 28 Oct 2016, gs wrote:


I care about access to the function keys in general and not just what currently 
happens when one presses Command F5. I use the function keys for adjusting 
screen brightness and volume, etc. I wonder how all the other items currently 
available via the function keys will be handled?

On Oct 28, 2016, at 6:37 AM, Brandt Steenkamp  
wrote:

There we go,

Triple-tapping power sounds like the most consistent and logical way to go.

Holding command down and tapping the touch bar also sounds okay, but not like 
something apple would do.

Warm regards,

Brandt Steenkamp

Sent from my Macbook Pro

Contact:

Phone:
Private: +27 (0)60 525 9181 
For technical support with iOS: +27 (0)78 120 5013 

Email: brandt.steenk...@gmail.com 

Twitter: @brandtsteenkamp 

On 28 Oct 2016, at 11:21 AM, Ray Foret jr > wrote:

IF Apple is truly going for consistancy, I have a feeling I know how we will 
turn on Voice Over with the new touch bar.  I don?t know this for sure:  but, 
I?d be willing to guess that to turn on Voice Over, you simply touch or press 
the power button three times quickly if Voice Over is off.  OF course, you 
might be able to do it with Siri, or, here?s another guess:  press the command 
key and anywhere on the touch bar.  IF voice Over is off, it will know that you 
are trying to turn on Voice Over.  My best guess, however, would be to quickly 
touch the power button three times.  Makes the most sense and keeps things 
logical and easy.



On Oct 28, 2016, at 2:01 AM, christopher hallsworth > wrote:




http://www.applevis.com/blog/apple-apple-tv-news/what-we-got-apples-october-2016-event#comment-form
 


What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event
Submitted by mehgcap on 27 October, 2016 - 16:28 and last modified on 27 
October, 2016 - 19:18

 
Hello Again

Today, Apple held a press event it called "Hello Again". The company announced 
a new accessibility website, a new Apple TV feature, and a long-awaited update to its 
MacBook computers. It may have missed the back-to-school shoppers, but today's 
announcements arrive just in time for the holiday shopping frenzy. There are some major 
changes to the MacBook line-up on the way, and while much of what you're about to read is 
awesome, you may not like all of it. But there's a great deal to like about the latest 
offerings from Apple, and I yell at articles to quit rambling in their intros and get on 
with it just as much as you do, so let's get on with it!

Accessibility Kick-Off

To my surprise, Apple started the presentation with a video highlighting accessibility features 
of its products. This led to Tim Cook's announcing a "whole new website" focused on 
Apple's accessibility efforts. As of the time of this writing, we haven't had a chance to fully 
explore this new website , but it's always great to 
see the spotlight shown on all the work Apple does to make their devices as usable, to as many 
people, as they can. It?s also great to see that the AppleVis Community is featured on Apple?s 
new Accessibility Portal as somewhere people should go to obtain more information and support. 
Thank you, Apple!

Get Entertained on Apple TV

No, there's not a new Apple TV coming out, but there is a new way to find 
something to watch on the box you already have. It's a new app from Apple, 
called--appropriately enough--TV. Yep, just those two letters. Interestingly, 
Apple offers this app on not just Apple TV, but your iOS devices as well, 
letting you browse and play content on any of your devices. But what, exactly, 
does the app do?

TV pulls together any shows or movies you're already watching on your video 
apps, as well as offering the next or newest episodes in TV series. This isn't 
just iTunes, either; it can work with ShowTime, CBS, HBO Now, and others, which 
makes it simple to keep up with any entertainment you're watching. The app also 
shows you your iTunes purchases or new video apps. It can even play content 
without you needing to know which app the content is in; tell Siri to play a 
particular show or game and that's all you need. But don't get too excited, 
because while the app is free, it won't be here until the end of the year.

Prose about the Pro

The MacBook Pro was 

Re: What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event | AppleVis

[Blee Blat]

I'm sure they have something. It's like everything else. I personally can use a 
touchscreen just fine but use a bluetooth keyboard if I'd like to type a lot of 
stuff quickly. You'll just have to figure out what your workflow is. I'm sure 
someone will get us a physical description once these start shipping. Not too 
many programs use function keys all that much these days. I mostly only use 
escape for vi in a terminal because command w is less finger movement and 
generally closes things most of the time. But volume control gets used a lot 
here, so how they implement that would be good to know. I'm sure nobody wants 
to knock their head off their ears or accidentally mute something. I'll not see 
this personally most likely for a bit since the current Mac is running lovely, 
but it's good to know. On a related note, if there was a good terminal app for 
iOS, I could probably get by with an iPad for most of what I'm doing.

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Re: What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event | AppleVis

[Scott Granados]

Probably similar to the way touch screens are handled now under voice over.  
You’ll probably flick or touch near the spot.  Maybe there will be some sort of 
tactile indicator.  I can’t wait to try one out.

> On Oct 28, 2016, at 7:34 AM, gs  wrote:
> 
> I care about access to the function keys in general and not just what 
> currently happens when one presses Command F5. I use the function keys for 
> adjusting screen brightness and volume, etc. I wonder how all the other items 
> currently available via the function keys will be handled?
> 
> On Oct 28, 2016, at 6:37 AM, Brandt Steenkamp  > wrote:
> 
> There we go,
> 
> Triple-tapping power sounds like the most consistent and logical way to go.
> 
> Holding command down and tapping the touch bar also sounds okay, but not like 
> something apple would do.
> 
> Warm regards,
> 
> Brandt Steenkamp
> 
> Sent from my Macbook Pro
> 
> Contact:
> 
> Phone:
> Private: +27 (0)60 525 9181 
> For technical support with iOS: +27 (0)78 120 5013 
> 
> Email: brandt.steenk...@gmail.com 
> 
> Twitter: @brandtsteenkamp 
>> On 28 Oct 2016, at 11:21 AM, Ray Foret jr > > wrote:
>> 
>> IF Apple is truly going for consistancy, I have a feeling I know how we will 
>> turn on Voice Over with the new touch bar.  I don’t know this for sure:  
>> but, I’d be willing to guess that to turn on Voice Over, you simply touch or 
>> press the power button three times quickly if Voice Over is off.  OF course, 
>> you might be able to do it with Siri, or, here’s another guess:  press the 
>> command key and anywhere on the touch bar.  IF voice Over is off, it will 
>> know that you are trying to turn on Voice Over.  My best guess, however, 
>> would be to quickly touch the power button three times.  Makes the most 
>> sense and keeps things logical and easy.
>> 
>> 
>>> On Oct 28, 2016, at 2:01 AM, christopher hallsworth 
>>> > wrote:
>>> 
>>> 
 
 http://www.applevis.com/blog/apple-apple-tv-news/what-we-got-apples-october-2016-event#comment-form
  
 
 
 What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event
 Submitted by mehgcap on 27 October, 2016 - 16:28 and last modified on 27 
 October, 2016 - 19:18
 
  
 Hello Again
 
 Today, Apple held a press event it called "Hello Again". The company 
 announced a new accessibility website, a new Apple TV feature, and a 
 long-awaited update to its MacBook computers. It may have missed the 
 back-to-school shoppers, but today's announcements arrive just in time for 
 the holiday shopping frenzy. There are some major changes to the MacBook 
 line-up on the way, and while much of what you're about to read is 
 awesome, you may not like all of it. But there's a great deal to like 
 about the latest offerings from Apple, and I yell at articles to quit 
 rambling in their intros and get on with it just as much as you do, so 
 let's get on with it!
 
 Accessibility Kick-Off
 
 To my surprise, Apple started the presentation with a video highlighting 
 accessibility features of its products. This led to Tim Cook's announcing 
 a "whole new website" focused on Apple's accessibility efforts. As of the 
 time of this writing, we haven't had a chance to fully explore this new 
 website , but it's always great to see 
 the spotlight shown on all the work Apple does to make their devices as 
 usable, to as many people, as they can. It’s also great to see that the 
 AppleVis Community is featured on Apple’s new Accessibility Portal as 
 somewhere people should go to obtain more information and support. Thank 
 you, Apple!
 
 Get Entertained on Apple TV
 
 No, there's not a new Apple TV coming out, but there is a new way to find 
 something to watch on the box you already have. It's a new app from Apple, 
 called--appropriately enough--TV. Yep, just those two letters. 
 Interestingly, Apple offers this app on not just Apple TV, but your iOS 
 devices as well, letting you browse and play content on any of your 
 devices. But what, exactly, does the app do?
 
 TV pulls together any shows or movies you're already watching on your 
 video apps, as well as offering the next or newest episodes in TV series. 
 This isn't just iTunes, either; it can work with ShowTime, CBS, HBO Now, 
 and others, which makes it simple to keep up with any entertainment you're 
 watching. The app also shows you your iTunes purchases or new video 

Re: What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event | AppleVis

[Scott Granados]

I wrote a letter to accessibility, let’s see what we get for an answer.  
Hopefully they will shed some light on this.


> On Oct 28, 2016, at 6:37 AM, Brandt Steenkamp  
> wrote:
> 
> There we go,
> 
> Triple-tapping power sounds like the most consistent and logical way to go.
> 
> Holding command down and tapping the touch bar also sounds okay, but not like 
> something apple would do.
> 
> Warm regards,
> 
> Brandt Steenkamp
> 
> Sent from my Macbook Pro
> 
> Contact:
> 
> Phone:
> Private: +27 (0)60 525 9181 
> For technical support with iOS: +27 (0)78 120 5013 
> 
> Email: brandt.steenk...@gmail.com 
> 
> Twitter: @brandtsteenkamp 
>> On 28 Oct 2016, at 11:21 AM, Ray Foret jr > > wrote:
>> 
>> IF Apple is truly going for consistancy, I have a feeling I know how we will 
>> turn on Voice Over with the new touch bar.  I don’t know this for sure:  
>> but, I’d be willing to guess that to turn on Voice Over, you simply touch or 
>> press the power button three times quickly if Voice Over is off.  OF course, 
>> you might be able to do it with Siri, or, here’s another guess:  press the 
>> command key and anywhere on the touch bar.  IF voice Over is off, it will 
>> know that you are trying to turn on Voice Over.  My best guess, however, 
>> would be to quickly touch the power button three times.  Makes the most 
>> sense and keeps things logical and easy.
>> 
>> 
>>> On Oct 28, 2016, at 2:01 AM, christopher hallsworth 
>>> > wrote:
>>> 
>>> 
 
 http://www.applevis.com/blog/apple-apple-tv-news/what-we-got-apples-october-2016-event#comment-form
  
 
 
 What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event
 Submitted by mehgcap on 27 October, 2016 - 16:28 and last modified on 27 
 October, 2016 - 19:18
 
  
 Hello Again
 
 Today, Apple held a press event it called "Hello Again". The company 
 announced a new accessibility website, a new Apple TV feature, and a 
 long-awaited update to its MacBook computers. It may have missed the 
 back-to-school shoppers, but today's announcements arrive just in time for 
 the holiday shopping frenzy. There are some major changes to the MacBook 
 line-up on the way, and while much of what you're about to read is 
 awesome, you may not like all of it. But there's a great deal to like 
 about the latest offerings from Apple, and I yell at articles to quit 
 rambling in their intros and get on with it just as much as you do, so 
 let's get on with it!
 
 Accessibility Kick-Off
 
 To my surprise, Apple started the presentation with a video highlighting 
 accessibility features of its products. This led to Tim Cook's announcing 
 a "whole new website" focused on Apple's accessibility efforts. As of the 
 time of this writing, we haven't had a chance to fully explore this new 
 website , but it's always great to see 
 the spotlight shown on all the work Apple does to make their devices as 
 usable, to as many people, as they can. It’s also great to see that the 
 AppleVis Community is featured on Apple’s new Accessibility Portal as 
 somewhere people should go to obtain more information and support. Thank 
 you, Apple!
 
 Get Entertained on Apple TV
 
 No, there's not a new Apple TV coming out, but there is a new way to find 
 something to watch on the box you already have. It's a new app from Apple, 
 called--appropriately enough--TV. Yep, just those two letters. 
 Interestingly, Apple offers this app on not just Apple TV, but your iOS 
 devices as well, letting you browse and play content on any of your 
 devices. But what, exactly, does the app do?
 
 TV pulls together any shows or movies you're already watching on your 
 video apps, as well as offering the next or newest episodes in TV series. 
 This isn't just iTunes, either; it can work with ShowTime, CBS, HBO Now, 
 and others, which makes it simple to keep up with any entertainment you're 
 watching. The app also shows you your iTunes purchases or new video apps. 
 It can even play content without you needing to know which app the content 
 is in; tell Siri to play a particular show or game and that's all you 
 need. But don't get too excited, because while the app is free, it won't 
 be here until the end of the year.
 
 Prose about the Pro
 
 The MacBook Pro was the star of the show today. It got a major 
 makeover--the first since the 2013 model dropped the disk drive--and 
 there's a lot of great 

Re: What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event | AppleVis

[Donna Goodin]

Hi,

I get the concerns about this, but I would just remind everyone that there were 
a lot of very similar discussions when the early iPhones became popular.  I 
remember lots of folks saying that blind people would never be able to use a 
touch phone as easily as we can use a phone with a tactile keyboard.  Apple has 
clearly disproven that.  Though the adjustment wasn't pain-free, now I can't 
imagine going back to one of those old keyboard driven phones.  Will it be 
different?  Yes.  But over and over again, Apple has shown its commitment to 
making their products accessible, as evidenced in the opening video for 
yesterday's event.  We all may have to learn some new ways to do some of the 
things we used to do with function keys, but I for one have no doubt that there 
will be a way to accomplish those tasks on the new MacBooks.
Cheers,
Donna
  
> On Oct 28, 2016, at 6:34 AM, gs  wrote:
> 
> I care about access to the function keys in general and not just what 
> currently happens when one presses Command F5. I use the function keys for 
> adjusting screen brightness and volume, etc. I wonder how all the other items 
> currently available via the function keys will be handled?
> 
> On Oct 28, 2016, at 6:37 AM, Brandt Steenkamp  > wrote:
> 
> There we go,
> 
> Triple-tapping power sounds like the most consistent and logical way to go.
> 
> Holding command down and tapping the touch bar also sounds okay, but not like 
> something apple would do.
> 
> Warm regards,
> 
> Brandt Steenkamp
> 
> Sent from my Macbook Pro
> 
> Contact:
> 
> Phone:
> Private: +27 (0)60 525 9181 
> For technical support with iOS: +27 (0)78 120 5013 
> 
> Email: brandt.steenk...@gmail.com 
> 
> Twitter: @brandtsteenkamp 
>> On 28 Oct 2016, at 11:21 AM, Ray Foret jr > > wrote:
>> 
>> IF Apple is truly going for consistancy, I have a feeling I know how we will 
>> turn on Voice Over with the new touch bar.  I don’t know this for sure:  
>> but, I’d be willing to guess that to turn on Voice Over, you simply touch or 
>> press the power button three times quickly if Voice Over is off.  OF course, 
>> you might be able to do it with Siri, or, here’s another guess:  press the 
>> command key and anywhere on the touch bar.  IF voice Over is off, it will 
>> know that you are trying to turn on Voice Over.  My best guess, however, 
>> would be to quickly touch the power button three times.  Makes the most 
>> sense and keeps things logical and easy.
>> 
>> 
>>> On Oct 28, 2016, at 2:01 AM, christopher hallsworth 
>>> > wrote:
>>> 
>>> 
 
 http://www.applevis.com/blog/apple-apple-tv-news/what-we-got-apples-october-2016-event#comment-form
  
 
 
 What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event
 Submitted by mehgcap on 27 October, 2016 - 16:28 and last modified on 27 
 October, 2016 - 19:18
 
  
 Hello Again
 
 Today, Apple held a press event it called "Hello Again". The company 
 announced a new accessibility website, a new Apple TV feature, and a 
 long-awaited update to its MacBook computers. It may have missed the 
 back-to-school shoppers, but today's announcements arrive just in time for 
 the holiday shopping frenzy. There are some major changes to the MacBook 
 line-up on the way, and while much of what you're about to read is 
 awesome, you may not like all of it. But there's a great deal to like 
 about the latest offerings from Apple, and I yell at articles to quit 
 rambling in their intros and get on with it just as much as you do, so 
 let's get on with it!
 
 Accessibility Kick-Off
 
 To my surprise, Apple started the presentation with a video highlighting 
 accessibility features of its products. This led to Tim Cook's announcing 
 a "whole new website" focused on Apple's accessibility efforts. As of the 
 time of this writing, we haven't had a chance to fully explore this new 
 website , but it's always great to see 
 the spotlight shown on all the work Apple does to make their devices as 
 usable, to as many people, as they can. It’s also great to see that the 
 AppleVis Community is featured on Apple’s new Accessibility Portal as 
 somewhere people should go to obtain more information and support. Thank 
 you, Apple!
 
 Get Entertained on Apple TV
 
 No, there's not a new Apple TV coming out, but there is a new way to find 
 something to watch on the box you already have. It's a new app from Apple, 
 

Re: What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event | AppleVis

[gs]

I care about access to the function keys in general and not just what currently 
happens when one presses Command F5. I use the function keys for adjusting 
screen brightness and volume, etc. I wonder how all the other items currently 
available via the function keys will be handled?

On Oct 28, 2016, at 6:37 AM, Brandt Steenkamp  
wrote:

There we go,

Triple-tapping power sounds like the most consistent and logical way to go.

Holding command down and tapping the touch bar also sounds okay, but not like 
something apple would do.

Warm regards,

Brandt Steenkamp

Sent from my Macbook Pro

Contact:

Phone:
Private: +27 (0)60 525 9181 
For technical support with iOS: +27 (0)78 120 5013 

Email: brandt.steenk...@gmail.com 

Twitter: @brandtsteenkamp 
> On 28 Oct 2016, at 11:21 AM, Ray Foret jr  > wrote:
> 
> IF Apple is truly going for consistancy, I have a feeling I know how we will 
> turn on Voice Over with the new touch bar.  I don’t know this for sure:  but, 
> I’d be willing to guess that to turn on Voice Over, you simply touch or press 
> the power button three times quickly if Voice Over is off.  OF course, you 
> might be able to do it with Siri, or, here’s another guess:  press the 
> command key and anywhere on the touch bar.  IF voice Over is off, it will 
> know that you are trying to turn on Voice Over.  My best guess, however, 
> would be to quickly touch the power button three times.  Makes the most sense 
> and keeps things logical and easy.
> 
> 
>> On Oct 28, 2016, at 2:01 AM, christopher hallsworth > > wrote:
>> 
>> 
>>> 
>>> http://www.applevis.com/blog/apple-apple-tv-news/what-we-got-apples-october-2016-event#comment-form
>>>  
>>> 
>>> 
>>> What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event
>>> Submitted by mehgcap on 27 October, 2016 - 16:28 and last modified on 27 
>>> October, 2016 - 19:18
>>> 
>>>  
>>> Hello Again
>>> 
>>> Today, Apple held a press event it called "Hello Again". The company 
>>> announced a new accessibility website, a new Apple TV feature, and a 
>>> long-awaited update to its MacBook computers. It may have missed the 
>>> back-to-school shoppers, but today's announcements arrive just in time for 
>>> the holiday shopping frenzy. There are some major changes to the MacBook 
>>> line-up on the way, and while much of what you're about to read is awesome, 
>>> you may not like all of it. But there's a great deal to like about the 
>>> latest offerings from Apple, and I yell at articles to quit rambling in 
>>> their intros and get on with it just as much as you do, so let's get on 
>>> with it!
>>> 
>>> Accessibility Kick-Off
>>> 
>>> To my surprise, Apple started the presentation with a video highlighting 
>>> accessibility features of its products. This led to Tim Cook's announcing a 
>>> "whole new website" focused on Apple's accessibility efforts. As of the 
>>> time of this writing, we haven't had a chance to fully explore this new 
>>> website , but it's always great to see 
>>> the spotlight shown on all the work Apple does to make their devices as 
>>> usable, to as many people, as they can. It’s also great to see that the 
>>> AppleVis Community is featured on Apple’s new Accessibility Portal as 
>>> somewhere people should go to obtain more information and support. Thank 
>>> you, Apple!
>>> 
>>> Get Entertained on Apple TV
>>> 
>>> No, there's not a new Apple TV coming out, but there is a new way to find 
>>> something to watch on the box you already have. It's a new app from Apple, 
>>> called--appropriately enough--TV. Yep, just those two letters. 
>>> Interestingly, Apple offers this app on not just Apple TV, but your iOS 
>>> devices as well, letting you browse and play content on any of your 
>>> devices. But what, exactly, does the app do?
>>> 
>>> TV pulls together any shows or movies you're already watching on your video 
>>> apps, as well as offering the next or newest episodes in TV series. This 
>>> isn't just iTunes, either; it can work with ShowTime, CBS, HBO Now, and 
>>> others, which makes it simple to keep up with any entertainment you're 
>>> watching. The app also shows you your iTunes purchases or new video apps. 
>>> It can even play content without you needing to know which app the content 
>>> is in; tell Siri to play a particular show or game and that's all you need. 
>>> But don't get too excited, because while the app is free, it won't be here 
>>> until the end of the year.
>>> 
>>> Prose about the Pro
>>> 
>>> The MacBook Pro was the star of the show today. It got a major 
>>> makeover--the first since the 2013 model dropped the disk 

Re: What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event | AppleVis

[Brandt Steenkamp]

There we go,

Triple-tapping power sounds like the most consistent and logical way to go.

Holding command down and tapping the touch bar also sounds okay, but not like 
something apple would do.

Warm regards,

Brandt Steenkamp

Sent from my Macbook Pro

Contact:

Phone:
Private: +27 (0)60 525 9181 
For technical support with iOS: +27 (0)78 120 5013 

Email: brandt.steenk...@gmail.com 

Twitter: @brandtsteenkamp 
> On 28 Oct 2016, at 11:21 AM, Ray Foret jr  wrote:
> 
> IF Apple is truly going for consistancy, I have a feeling I know how we will 
> turn on Voice Over with the new touch bar.  I don’t know this for sure:  but, 
> I’d be willing to guess that to turn on Voice Over, you simply touch or press 
> the power button three times quickly if Voice Over is off.  OF course, you 
> might be able to do it with Siri, or, here’s another guess:  press the 
> command key and anywhere on the touch bar.  IF voice Over is off, it will 
> know that you are trying to turn on Voice Over.  My best guess, however, 
> would be to quickly touch the power button three times.  Makes the most sense 
> and keeps things logical and easy.
> 
> 
>> On Oct 28, 2016, at 2:01 AM, christopher hallsworth > > wrote:
>> 
>> 
>>> 
>>> http://www.applevis.com/blog/apple-apple-tv-news/what-we-got-apples-october-2016-event#comment-form
>>>  
>>> 
>>> 
>>> What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event
>>> Submitted by mehgcap on 27 October, 2016 - 16:28 and last modified on 27 
>>> October, 2016 - 19:18
>>> 
>>>  
>>> Hello Again
>>> 
>>> Today, Apple held a press event it called "Hello Again". The company 
>>> announced a new accessibility website, a new Apple TV feature, and a 
>>> long-awaited update to its MacBook computers. It may have missed the 
>>> back-to-school shoppers, but today's announcements arrive just in time for 
>>> the holiday shopping frenzy. There are some major changes to the MacBook 
>>> line-up on the way, and while much of what you're about to read is awesome, 
>>> you may not like all of it. But there's a great deal to like about the 
>>> latest offerings from Apple, and I yell at articles to quit rambling in 
>>> their intros and get on with it just as much as you do, so let's get on 
>>> with it!
>>> 
>>> Accessibility Kick-Off
>>> 
>>> To my surprise, Apple started the presentation with a video highlighting 
>>> accessibility features of its products. This led to Tim Cook's announcing a 
>>> "whole new website" focused on Apple's accessibility efforts. As of the 
>>> time of this writing, we haven't had a chance to fully explore this new 
>>> website , but it's always great to see 
>>> the spotlight shown on all the work Apple does to make their devices as 
>>> usable, to as many people, as they can. It’s also great to see that the 
>>> AppleVis Community is featured on Apple’s new Accessibility Portal as 
>>> somewhere people should go to obtain more information and support. Thank 
>>> you, Apple!
>>> 
>>> Get Entertained on Apple TV
>>> 
>>> No, there's not a new Apple TV coming out, but there is a new way to find 
>>> something to watch on the box you already have. It's a new app from Apple, 
>>> called--appropriately enough--TV. Yep, just those two letters. 
>>> Interestingly, Apple offers this app on not just Apple TV, but your iOS 
>>> devices as well, letting you browse and play content on any of your 
>>> devices. But what, exactly, does the app do?
>>> 
>>> TV pulls together any shows or movies you're already watching on your video 
>>> apps, as well as offering the next or newest episodes in TV series. This 
>>> isn't just iTunes, either; it can work with ShowTime, CBS, HBO Now, and 
>>> others, which makes it simple to keep up with any entertainment you're 
>>> watching. The app also shows you your iTunes purchases or new video apps. 
>>> It can even play content without you needing to know which app the content 
>>> is in; tell Siri to play a particular show or game and that's all you need. 
>>> But don't get too excited, because while the app is free, it won't be here 
>>> until the end of the year.
>>> 
>>> Prose about the Pro
>>> 
>>> The MacBook Pro was the star of the show today. It got a major 
>>> makeover--the first since the 2013 model dropped the disk drive--and 
>>> there's a lot of great stuff on and inside it. Yet, there's also a change 
>>> you may not like.
>>> 
>>> Inevitable Updates
>>> 
>>> First, the fun part: the updates we all expected, and that Apple almost had 
>>> to make. The Pro is now slightly lighter and thinner, while the battery 
>>> life remains at ten hours; no surprise there. It's also adopted the USB-C 
>>> ports we first saw 

Re: What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event | AppleVis

[Sandi Jazmin Kruse]

I wanna add to this, if you use the Mac book, not the mac book pro,
but the Fanless  design, it may seem small, underrated, but it is so
powerful that  it can semi consistently run latest model of flight
sims in winddows 7, settings are real weather, full realism turned on,
and over 120 FPS. It was not build for this however, but it can do it.


On 10/28/16, Ray Foret jr  wrote:
> IF Apple is truly going for consistancy, I have a feeling I know how we will
> turn on Voice Over with the new touch bar.  I don’t know this for sure:
> but, I’d be willing to guess that to turn on Voice Over, you simply touch or
> press the power button three times quickly if Voice Over is off.  OF course,
> you might be able to do it with Siri, or, here’s another guess:  press the
> command key and anywhere on the touch bar.  IF voice Over is off, it will
> know that you are trying to turn on Voice Over.  My best guess, however,
> would be to quickly touch the power button three times.  Makes the most
> sense and keeps things logical and easy.
>
>
>> On Oct 28, 2016, at 2:01 AM, christopher hallsworth
>>  wrote:
>>
>>
>>>
>>> http://www.applevis.com/blog/apple-apple-tv-news/what-we-got-apples-october-2016-event#comment-form
>>> 
>>>
>>> What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event
>>> Submitted by mehgcap on 27 October, 2016 - 16:28 and last modified on 27
>>> October, 2016 - 19:18
>>>
>>>  
>>> Hello Again
>>>
>>> Today, Apple held a press event it called "Hello Again". The company
>>> announced a new accessibility website, a new Apple TV feature, and a
>>> long-awaited update to its MacBook computers. It may have missed the
>>> back-to-school shoppers, but today's announcements arrive just in time
>>> for the holiday shopping frenzy. There are some major changes to the
>>> MacBook line-up on the way, and while much of what you're about to read
>>> is awesome, you may not like all of it. But there's a great deal to like
>>> about the latest offerings from Apple, and I yell at articles to quit
>>> rambling in their intros and get on with it just as much as you do, so
>>> let's get on with it!
>>>
>>> Accessibility Kick-Off
>>>
>>> To my surprise, Apple started the presentation with a video highlighting
>>> accessibility features of its products. This led to Tim Cook's announcing
>>> a "whole new website" focused on Apple's accessibility efforts. As of the
>>> time of this writing, we haven't had a chance to fully explore this new
>>> website , but it's always great to
>>> see the spotlight shown on all the work Apple does to make their devices
>>> as usable, to as many people, as they can. It’s also great to see that
>>> the AppleVis Community is featured on Apple’s new Accessibility Portal as
>>> somewhere people should go to obtain more information and support. Thank
>>> you, Apple!
>>>
>>> Get Entertained on Apple TV
>>>
>>> No, there's not a new Apple TV coming out, but there is a new way to find
>>> something to watch on the box you already have. It's a new app from
>>> Apple, called--appropriately enough--TV. Yep, just those two letters.
>>> Interestingly, Apple offers this app on not just Apple TV, but your iOS
>>> devices as well, letting you browse and play content on any of your
>>> devices. But what, exactly, does the app do?
>>>
>>> TV pulls together any shows or movies you're already watching on your
>>> video apps, as well as offering the next or newest episodes in TV series.
>>> This isn't just iTunes, either; it can work with ShowTime, CBS, HBO Now,
>>> and others, which makes it simple to keep up with any entertainment
>>> you're watching. The app also shows you your iTunes purchases or new
>>> video apps. It can even play content without you needing to know which
>>> app the content is in; tell Siri to play a particular show or game and
>>> that's all you need. But don't get too excited, because while the app is
>>> free, it won't be here until the end of the year.
>>>
>>> Prose about the Pro
>>>
>>> The MacBook Pro was the star of the show today. It got a major
>>> makeover--the first since the 2013 model dropped the disk drive--and
>>> there's a lot of great stuff on and inside it. Yet, there's also a change
>>> you may not like.
>>>
>>> Inevitable Updates
>>>
>>> First, the fun part: the updates we all expected, and that Apple almost
>>> had to make. The Pro is now slightly lighter and thinner, while the
>>> battery life remains at ten hours; no surprise there. It's also adopted
>>> the USB-C ports we first saw in the Retina MacBook last year. The new Pro
>>> includes four of them, and any of them can be used to charge the machine,
>>> which is a great touch if your outlet is opposite the power jack of your
>>> Mac. The audio jack, fortunately, hasn't gone anywhere, so there's 

Re: What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event | AppleVis

[Ray Foret jr]

IF Apple is truly going for consistancy, I have a feeling I know how we will 
turn on Voice Over with the new touch bar.  I don’t know this for sure:  but, 
I’d be willing to guess that to turn on Voice Over, you simply touch or press 
the power button three times quickly if Voice Over is off.  OF course, you 
might be able to do it with Siri, or, here’s another guess:  press the command 
key and anywhere on the touch bar.  IF voice Over is off, it will know that you 
are trying to turn on Voice Over.  My best guess, however, would be to quickly 
touch the power button three times.  Makes the most sense and keeps things 
logical and easy.


> On Oct 28, 2016, at 2:01 AM, christopher hallsworth  
> wrote:
> 
> 
>> 
>> http://www.applevis.com/blog/apple-apple-tv-news/what-we-got-apples-october-2016-event#comment-form
>>  
>> 
>> 
>> What We Got from Apple's October 2016 Event
>> Submitted by mehgcap on 27 October, 2016 - 16:28 and last modified on 27 
>> October, 2016 - 19:18
>> 
>>  
>> Hello Again
>> 
>> Today, Apple held a press event it called "Hello Again". The company 
>> announced a new accessibility website, a new Apple TV feature, and a 
>> long-awaited update to its MacBook computers. It may have missed the 
>> back-to-school shoppers, but today's announcements arrive just in time for 
>> the holiday shopping frenzy. There are some major changes to the MacBook 
>> line-up on the way, and while much of what you're about to read is awesome, 
>> you may not like all of it. But there's a great deal to like about the 
>> latest offerings from Apple, and I yell at articles to quit rambling in 
>> their intros and get on with it just as much as you do, so let's get on with 
>> it!
>> 
>> Accessibility Kick-Off
>> 
>> To my surprise, Apple started the presentation with a video highlighting 
>> accessibility features of its products. This led to Tim Cook's announcing a 
>> "whole new website" focused on Apple's accessibility efforts. As of the time 
>> of this writing, we haven't had a chance to fully explore this new website 
>> , but it's always great to see the 
>> spotlight shown on all the work Apple does to make their devices as usable, 
>> to as many people, as they can. It’s also great to see that the AppleVis 
>> Community is featured on Apple’s new Accessibility Portal as somewhere 
>> people should go to obtain more information and support. Thank you, Apple!
>> 
>> Get Entertained on Apple TV
>> 
>> No, there's not a new Apple TV coming out, but there is a new way to find 
>> something to watch on the box you already have. It's a new app from Apple, 
>> called--appropriately enough--TV. Yep, just those two letters. 
>> Interestingly, Apple offers this app on not just Apple TV, but your iOS 
>> devices as well, letting you browse and play content on any of your devices. 
>> But what, exactly, does the app do?
>> 
>> TV pulls together any shows or movies you're already watching on your video 
>> apps, as well as offering the next or newest episodes in TV series. This 
>> isn't just iTunes, either; it can work with ShowTime, CBS, HBO Now, and 
>> others, which makes it simple to keep up with any entertainment you're 
>> watching. The app also shows you your iTunes purchases or new video apps. It 
>> can even play content without you needing to know which app the content is 
>> in; tell Siri to play a particular show or game and that's all you need. But 
>> don't get too excited, because while the app is free, it won't be here until 
>> the end of the year.
>> 
>> Prose about the Pro
>> 
>> The MacBook Pro was the star of the show today. It got a major makeover--the 
>> first since the 2013 model dropped the disk drive--and there's a lot of 
>> great stuff on and inside it. Yet, there's also a change you may not like.
>> 
>> Inevitable Updates
>> 
>> First, the fun part: the updates we all expected, and that Apple almost had 
>> to make. The Pro is now slightly lighter and thinner, while the battery life 
>> remains at ten hours; no surprise there. It's also adopted the USB-C ports 
>> we first saw in the Retina MacBook last year. The new Pro includes four of 
>> them, and any of them can be used to charge the machine, which is a great 
>> touch if your outlet is opposite the power jack of your Mac. The audio jack, 
>> fortunately, hasn't gone anywhere, so there's no need to worry about getting 
>> USB sound cards or mics plus a bunch of adaptors. Those four USB-C (also 
>> called Thunderbolt 3--same thing) are all the ports you get, though. No 
>> standard USB, no Mini Display, no card reader, and, sadly, no more MagSafe.
>> 
>> Speaking of audio, the speakers are louder and, Apple claims, sound better 
>> than ever. Oh, and the storage is twice as fast as before, while the ram has 
>>