Re: [MBZ] Tranny questions
http://190rev.net/forums/showthread.php?t=37987 This seems to be pretty good directions for installing the new K1 springs, etc. Gerry From: Hendrik Fay heni...@ozemail.com.au Pretty certain that the K1 spring kit is only for 722.3/4 trannies and only fixes the 2-3 flare. Have no experience with the 722.1 boxes but flaring can be caused by a slow change over, worn clutches, brake band 2 sticking and perhaps low operating pressure. At this stage I would suggest that a rebuild is not in order but a look inside the pan to see if there are metal particles is in order. I have had good success with Fuchs titan D3 semi-synthetic ATF. Modulator adjustment is related to all gears and while adjustment will mask a problem it does not fix it. Shift timing is determined by control pressure, nothing to do with the modulator. You really need to find someone who is an expert on these boxes and will not just tell you that you need another box. Hendrik who is losing his sanity trying to get auto boxes to work 100% Larry T wrote: I put one of Rusty's ATs in last summer (by local shop) and must concur - they are awesome with great prices. I may have mentioned this, but my local MB Dealer was willing to install a outside vendor's rebuilt AT just like the local Indy did (but the dealer wanted $1250 Vs $650). When I was talking to Rusty about the AT he said he'd sold thousands over the last ~20 years and had only 3 problems!! That's incredible! 2 of the problems were the fault of the installer and the other was something external that could be easily repaired. All 3 problems were minor BTW. When I asked the rebuilder what kind of ATF to use he said Dexron III. I was hoping to use M1 ATF but went with the rebuilder recommendation. They also say to use 24K ATF change intervals Vs 30K that MB says to use. Have a good weekend - LarryT 91 300D On 1/27/2012 10:08 AM, Alex Chamberlain wrote: On Fri, Jan 27, 2012 at 5:38 AM, Tim Cbb...@crone.us wrote: Mine goes to a high RPM with no load, then drops back to normal once it makes it into gear. I included that line because I realize that might be something completely different than what I thought it was called. :) Sounds like a really ghastly case of flaring. Normally you just get a little vrrr as the engine revs up a little for an instant during upshifts---that condition can often be cured by proper modulator adjustment, a fluid change, and running a while with synthetic ATF. But the best cure for what you're describing, Tim, is often one of Rusty's rebuilt trannies installed by a competent shop (or on your own, if you have the right equipment). Alex On 1/26/2012 4:43 PM, Tim C wrote: 1) Anyone know if the K1 spring upgrade (126-270-44-77) will fit in a 722.118? Rusty wasn't sure, and the internet seems littered with folks having this question unanswered. :/ 2) My transmission is flaring* and yesterday I realized that, after adjusting the accelerator throw some months ago, I didn't adjust the pushrod to the transmission's vacuum valve. I shortened the pushrod a bit, and it is a bit better. I am hoping the trend will continue as I make it shorter... However, this leaves me with two questions: a) How likely that I did permanent damage? I guess I was telling the transmission I was always at WOT? Not really sure what the vacuum valve is doing in practice. [Fluid was replaced 8-10 months ago, I'll do it again soon anyway since I have a slow leak I want to track down.] b) Why would it shift early with a pushrod that was too long? Seems like it should be the other way. *I think it's flaring, basically the engine spins before it goes through (I think) 1-2 and 2-3, especially if I'm accelerating above 40%. If I force it to hold gear with the floor shift, it shifts perfectly at a higher RPM. Thanks! -Tim ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com - No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 10.0.1416 / Virus Database: 2109/4771 - Release Date: 01/27/12 ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Tranny questions
Can't help with the spring questions but you comment about flaring, basically the engine spins before it goes through (I think) 1-2 and 2-3, IMO Flaring is when the clutches do not completely engage quickly - you are basically slipping the clutch as it shifts - to put it in Manual Tranny mode - But that may be what you meant by engine spins ? LarryT 91 300D On 1/26/2012 4:43 PM, Tim C wrote: 1) Anyone know if the K1 spring upgrade (126-270-44-77) will fit in a 722.118? Rusty wasn't sure, and the internet seems littered with folks having this question unanswered. :/ 2) My transmission is flaring* and yesterday I realized that, after adjusting the accelerator throw some months ago, I didn't adjust the pushrod to the transmission's vacuum valve. I shortened the pushrod a bit, and it is a bit better. I am hoping the trend will continue as I make it shorter... However, this leaves me with two questions: a) How likely that I did permanent damage? I guess I was telling the transmission I was always at WOT? Not really sure what the vacuum valve is doing in practice. [Fluid was replaced 8-10 months ago, I'll do it again soon anyway since I have a slow leak I want to track down.] b) Why would it shift early with a pushrod that was too long? Seems like it should be the other way. *I think it's flaring, basically the engine spins before it goes through (I think) 1-2 and 2-3, especially if I'm accelerating above 40%. If I force it to hold gear with the floor shift, it shifts perfectly at a higher RPM. Thanks! -Tim a newbie in so many ways :) ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Tranny questions
On Jan 27, 2012 7:16 AM, Larry T l02tur...@comcast.net wrote: Can't help with the spring questions but you comment about flaring, basically the engine spins before it goes through (I think) 1-2 and 2-3, IMO Flaring is when the clutches do not completely engage quickly - you are basically slipping the clutch as it shifts - to put it in Manual Tranny mode - But that may be what you meant by engine spins ? Mine goes to a high RPM with no load, then drops back to normal once it makes it into gear. I included that line because I realize that might be something completely different than what I thought it was called. :) I haven't driven a stick in at least 20 years, so I don't remember if the engine revs in the scenario you describe? Thanks, Tim LarryT 91 300D On 1/26/2012 4:43 PM, Tim C wrote: 1) Anyone know if the K1 spring upgrade (126-270-44-77) will fit in a 722.118? Rusty wasn't sure, and the internet seems littered with folks having this question unanswered. :/ 2) My transmission is flaring* and yesterday I realized that, after adjusting the accelerator throw some months ago, I didn't adjust the pushrod to the transmission's vacuum valve. I shortened the pushrod a bit, and it is a bit better. I am hoping the trend will continue as I make it shorter... However, this leaves me with two questions: a) How likely that I did permanent damage? I guess I was telling the transmission I was always at WOT? Not really sure what the vacuum valve is doing in practice. [Fluid was replaced 8-10 months ago, I'll do it again soon anyway since I have a slow leak I want to track down.] b) Why would it shift early with a pushrod that was too long? Seems like it should be the other way. *I think it's flaring, basically the engine spins before it goes through (I think) 1-2 and 2-3, especially if I'm accelerating above 40%. If I force it to hold gear with the floor shift, it shifts perfectly at a higher RPM. Thanks! -Tim a newbie in so many ways :) ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Tranny questions
Tim C wrote: Mine goes to a high RPM with no load, then drops back to normal once it makes it into gear. I included that line because I realize that might be something completely different than what I thought it was called. :) I conclude that your clutch pack gets 100 shifts worth of wear every time that happens. I haven't driven a stick in at least 20 years, so I don't remember if the engine revs in the scenario you describe? Only if some fool hits the throttle while the clutch is disengaged. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Tranny questions
Thanks Mitch, that's very helpful. -Tim Hopefully still has a couple years then On Jan 27, 2012 9:00 AM, Mitch Haley m...@voyager.net wrote: Tim C wrote: Mine goes to a high RPM with no load, then drops back to normal once it makes it into gear. I included that line because I realize that might be something completely different than what I thought it was called. :) I conclude that your clutch pack gets 100 shifts worth of wear every time that happens. I haven't driven a stick in at least 20 years, so I don't remember if the engine revs in the scenario you describe? Only if some fool hits the throttle while the clutch is disengaged. __**_ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/**archive/http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/**mailman/listinfo/mercedes_**okiebenz.comhttp://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Tranny questions
On Fri, Jan 27, 2012 at 5:38 AM, Tim C bb...@crone.us wrote: Mine goes to a high RPM with no load, then drops back to normal once it makes it into gear. I included that line because I realize that might be something completely different than what I thought it was called. :) Sounds like a really ghastly case of flaring. Normally you just get a little vrrr as the engine revs up a little for an instant during upshifts---that condition can often be cured by proper modulator adjustment, a fluid change, and running a while with synthetic ATF. But the best cure for what you're describing, Tim, is often one of Rusty's rebuilt trannies installed by a competent shop (or on your own, if you have the right equipment). Alex ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Tranny questions
I put one of Rusty's ATs in last summer (by local shop) and must concur - they are awesome with great prices. I may have mentioned this, but my local MB Dealer was willing to install a outside vendor's rebuilt AT just like the local Indy did (but the dealer wanted $1250 Vs $650). When I was talking to Rusty about the AT he said he'd sold thousands over the last ~20 years and had only 3 problems!! That's incredible! 2 of the problems were the fault of the installer and the other was something external that could be easily repaired. All 3 problems were minor BTW. When I asked the rebuilder what kind of ATF to use he said Dexron III. I was hoping to use M1 ATF but went with the rebuilder recommendation. They also say to use 24K ATF change intervals Vs 30K that MB says to use. Have a good weekend - LarryT 91 300D On 1/27/2012 10:08 AM, Alex Chamberlain wrote: On Fri, Jan 27, 2012 at 5:38 AM, Tim Cbb...@crone.us wrote: Mine goes to a high RPM with no load, then drops back to normal once it makes it into gear. I included that line because I realize that might be something completely different than what I thought it was called. :) Sounds like a really ghastly case of flaring. Normally you just get a little vrrr as the engine revs up a little for an instant during upshifts---that condition can often be cured by proper modulator adjustment, a fluid change, and running a while with synthetic ATF. But the best cure for what you're describing, Tim, is often one of Rusty's rebuilt trannies installed by a competent shop (or on your own, if you have the right equipment). Alex ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Tranny questions
Pretty certain that the K1 spring kit is only for 722.3/4 trannies and only fixes the 2-3 flare. Have no experience with the 722.1 boxes but flaring can be caused by a slow change over, worn clutches, brake band 2 sticking and perhaps low operating pressure. At this stage I would suggest that a rebuild is not in order but a look inside the pan to see if there are metal particles is in order. I have had good success with Fuchs titan D3 semi-synthetic ATF. Modulator adjustment is related to all gears and while adjustment will mask a problem it does not fix it. Shift timing is determined by control pressure, nothing to do with the modulator. You really need to find someone who is an expert on these boxes and will not just tell you that you need another box. Hendrik who is losing his sanity trying to get auto boxes to work 100% Larry T wrote: I put one of Rusty's ATs in last summer (by local shop) and must concur - they are awesome with great prices. I may have mentioned this, but my local MB Dealer was willing to install a outside vendor's rebuilt AT just like the local Indy did (but the dealer wanted $1250 Vs $650). When I was talking to Rusty about the AT he said he'd sold thousands over the last ~20 years and had only 3 problems!! That's incredible! 2 of the problems were the fault of the installer and the other was something external that could be easily repaired. All 3 problems were minor BTW. When I asked the rebuilder what kind of ATF to use he said Dexron III. I was hoping to use M1 ATF but went with the rebuilder recommendation. They also say to use 24K ATF change intervals Vs 30K that MB says to use. Have a good weekend - LarryT 91 300D On 1/27/2012 10:08 AM, Alex Chamberlain wrote: On Fri, Jan 27, 2012 at 5:38 AM, Tim Cbb...@crone.us wrote: Mine goes to a high RPM with no load, then drops back to normal once it makes it into gear. I included that line because I realize that might be something completely different than what I thought it was called. :) Sounds like a really ghastly case of flaring. Normally you just get a little vrrr as the engine revs up a little for an instant during upshifts---that condition can often be cured by proper modulator adjustment, a fluid change, and running a while with synthetic ATF. But the best cure for what you're describing, Tim, is often one of Rusty's rebuilt trannies installed by a competent shop (or on your own, if you have the right equipment). Alex On 1/26/2012 4:43 PM, Tim C wrote: 1) Anyone know if the K1 spring upgrade (126-270-44-77) will fit in a 722.118? Rusty wasn't sure, and the internet seems littered with folks having this question unanswered. :/ 2) My transmission is flaring* and yesterday I realized that, after adjusting the accelerator throw some months ago, I didn't adjust the pushrod to the transmission's vacuum valve. I shortened the pushrod a bit, and it is a bit better. I am hoping the trend will continue as I make it shorter... However, this leaves me with two questions: a) How likely that I did permanent damage? I guess I was telling the transmission I was always at WOT? Not really sure what the vacuum valve is doing in practice. [Fluid was replaced 8-10 months ago, I'll do it again soon anyway since I have a slow leak I want to track down.] b) Why would it shift early with a pushrod that was too long? Seems like it should be the other way. *I think it's flaring, basically the engine spins before it goes through (I think) 1-2 and 2-3, especially if I'm accelerating above 40%. If I force it to hold gear with the floor shift, it shifts perfectly at a higher RPM. Thanks! -Tim ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
[MBZ] Tranny questions
1) Anyone know if the K1 spring upgrade (126-270-44-77) will fit in a 722.118? Rusty wasn't sure, and the internet seems littered with folks having this question unanswered. :/ 2) My transmission is flaring* and yesterday I realized that, after adjusting the accelerator throw some months ago, I didn't adjust the pushrod to the transmission's vacuum valve. I shortened the pushrod a bit, and it is a bit better. I am hoping the trend will continue as I make it shorter... However, this leaves me with two questions: a) How likely that I did permanent damage? I guess I was telling the transmission I was always at WOT? Not really sure what the vacuum valve is doing in practice. [Fluid was replaced 8-10 months ago, I'll do it again soon anyway since I have a slow leak I want to track down.] b) Why would it shift early with a pushrod that was too long? Seems like it should be the other way. *I think it's flaring, basically the engine spins before it goes through (I think) 1-2 and 2-3, especially if I'm accelerating above 40%. If I force it to hold gear with the floor shift, it shifts perfectly at a higher RPM. Thanks! -Tim a newbie in so many ways :) ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
RE: [MBZ] Tranny Questions
Looks like I'm WAY overdue on mine. Is the AC-Delco filter kit I can get from my local O'Reilly store adequate for the job, or do I need to order from Rusty and wait a few days? Where's a good place to get M1 ATF? WalMart doesn't carry it here Royce Engler 1985 300TD Turbo 265K -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Mitch Haley Sent: Tuesday, June 21, 2005 5:46 PM To: Mercedes mailing list Subject: Re: [MBZ] 722.120 Tranny Questions John Robbins wrote: Listers, Got a couple of questions about my tranny... car has 275k miles on it (presumably tranny does as well. Mobil 1 ATF. I changed my tranny fluid and filter 30k miles ago... am I supposed to change the filter this go around or just the fluid? With dino, I do fluid at 15 and filter at 30k. If I were you, I'd do both at 30k. Another problem is that my kickdown doesn't work. The kickdown switch works, the overboost protection circuit works, and the kickdown solenoid is new (replaced it myself), but the stupid thing doesn't kickdown! How's the wiring fuse? (probably not the fuse, my 116 kills the tach and fuel gauge when the kickdown blows the fuse) ___ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] For new parts see www.buymbparts.com For repairs see www.oldworldauto.com To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net
Re: [MBZ] Tranny Questions
order from rusty Royce Engler wrote: Looks like I'm WAY overdue on mine. Is the AC-Delco filter kit I can get from my local O'Reilly store adequate for the job, or do I need to order from Rusty and wait a few days? Where's a good place to get M1 ATF? WalMart doesn't carry it here Royce Engler 1985 300TD Turbo 265K -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Mitch Haley Sent: Tuesday, June 21, 2005 5:46 PM To: Mercedes mailing list Subject: Re: [MBZ] 722.120 Tranny Questions John Robbins wrote: Listers, Got a couple of questions about my tranny... car has 275k miles on it (presumably tranny does as well. Mobil 1 ATF. I changed my tranny fluid and filter 30k miles ago... am I supposed to change the filter this go around or just the fluid? With dino, I do fluid at 15 and filter at 30k. If I were you, I'd do both at 30k. Another problem is that my kickdown doesn't work. The kickdown switch works, the overboost protection circuit works, and the kickdown solenoid is new (replaced it myself), but the stupid thing doesn't kickdown! How's the wiring fuse? (probably not the fuse, my 116 kills the tach and fuel gauge when the kickdown blows the fuse) ___ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] For new parts see www.buymbparts.com For repairs see www.oldworldauto.com To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net ___ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] For new parts see www.buymbparts.com For repairs see www.oldworldauto.com To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net -- Kaleb C. Striplin/Claremore, OK 89 560SEL, 87 300SDL, 87 300SDL, 85 380SE, 85 300D, 81 300TD, 81 240D, 81 240D, 76 240D, 76 300D, 74 240D, 69 250 Okie Benz Auto parts-email for used parts
