Re: running mail server at home
On 07/02/2008, [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: FYI, masquerading is a LINUX shit but openbsd rules with its PF power. FYI, masquerading is a generic term and a synonym for NATing, and not an invitation to diss Linux.
Re: running mail server at home
At 09:33 AM 2/8/2008 -0500, Jim Razmus wrote: * L. V. Lammert [EMAIL PROTECTED] [080207 13:30]: At 04:43 PM 2/7/2008 +, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: You can absolutely run a mail server at home. This is not rocket science and in fact, it is dumb easy to do. Try to follow these steps: 1. Get a domain name and look for registrars that can host it for you. For example, check this kind of services at www.no-ip.com. 2. Configure your ADSL router to re-direct SMTP and POP3 traffic to that server of yours running sendmail, spamd, mimedefang, clamd, spam-assassin, etc. You can even incorporate services like IMAP3 for you to be able to log-in into your mail server anywhere. Please stop spreading misinformation. Unless you have reverse DNS setup, ANY email server that adhering to standards should (and probably will) block your incoming email. If you want to run your own, that's great, but don't expect to use it reliably without either setting up the reverse DNS or forwarding through your ISPs email server(s). If you don't do that, you won't know be able to have any assurance that your email will be received properly. Lee I don't get your point Lee. I agreed with you that reverse DNS is necessary. I then stated it is possible to get ISP's to support you with this task. Where's the misinformation? Didn't mean to jump on you specifically, .. however your statement above (to which I was replying) *does* neglect to mention reverse DNS. In fact, it is dumb easy to do seems to give the impression that it's a trivial task, when it is not. I'm just trying to make sure that anyone considering setting up their own email server realizes that without the proper [willing] ISP and DNS configuration an email server is just not ready for prime time (i.e. the probability that your email will get through vs. the work to configure the server). I can't count the number of times someone we deal with has tried to send email, gets it rejected, and we find out in the logs that they are using a mis-configured server. With the 'hazardous' environment right now regarding SPAM/UCE, it is just not a simple task to set up a mail server properly. To give the impression otherwise is slightly irresponsible, *especially* if someone gets the impression that the mail server itself is the most important part (a cooperating ISP is far more important than the box itself). Lee
Re: running mail server at home
* Lori Barfield [EMAIL PROTECTED] [080207 12:41]: consumer IP space is really a problem for outgoing mail. at the very least, all the majors will add spam points to your messages and so your mail is a lot more likely to be bulked. even resold IP space at large colos is treated that way by default, and it causes heartburn for businesses. just having reverse DNS isn't good enough, either, because if it has a name that looks like dynamic IP space, that can also get your mail treated with prejudice. it's best to own your own reverse DNS so you can give it a realistic look. you can try to work with the major ISPs to get your IP(s) whitelisted, and try to convince folks to take them off their no-no lists as well, but that can be very time consuming and you'll have mixed results. bottom line is, check out the reputation of your IP space before buying it. you don't want the problem to start with. ...lori I second this! Ending up blacklisted by association was exactly the reason I dumped ATT. Huge swathes of their address space went into the blacklists from which there was no escape. And ATT did little to resolve it. Consequently, I voted with my dollar. I dropped their Internet service and phone service too. Now ATT gets not even a penny from me. Jim
Re: running mail server at home
* L. V. Lammert [EMAIL PROTECTED] [080207 13:30]: At 04:43 PM 2/7/2008 +, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: You can absolutely run a mail server at home. This is not rocket science and in fact, it is dumb easy to do. Try to follow these steps: 1. Get a domain name and look for registrars that can host it for you. For example, check this kind of services at www.no-ip.com. 2. Configure your ADSL router to re-direct SMTP and POP3 traffic to that server of yours running sendmail, spamd, mimedefang, clamd, spam-assassin, etc. You can even incorporate services like IMAP3 for you to be able to log-in into your mail server anywhere. Please stop spreading misinformation. Unless you have reverse DNS setup, ANY email server that adhering to standards should (and probably will) block your incoming email. If you want to run your own, that's great, but don't expect to use it reliably without either setting up the reverse DNS or forwarding through your ISPs email server(s). If you don't do that, you won't know be able to have any assurance that your email will be received properly. Lee I don't get your point Lee. I agreed with you that reverse DNS is necessary. I then stated it is possible to get ISP's to support you with this task. Where's the misinformation? I've been running this way for years. And I can speak from experience that without getting reverse DNS setup correctly, many email servers will reject your mail. They did reject mine until it was setup... ??? Jim
running mail server at home
I have a P3 box with 120GB HDD that's doing web, ssh and samba at the moment. I am planning setup sendmail, spamd, mimedefang, clamd and spam-assassin on this box along with web, ssh and samba. I was wondering if anyone has any experience with running a mail server at home. I want to know if I should use only one box or buy another box? Also, what sort of electricity bills will I run into? And also if is there anything else I would need to know. Thanks for any help.
Re: running mail server at home
Hi, Chris schrieb: And also if is there anything else I would need to know. For it to work properly at home you would, first, need a fixed IP address. Second, you can get problems because a lot of spam filters are blocking dynamic IP ranges or even IP ranges that look dynamic because of its PTR, so you would need to be able to change the PTR of your fixed IP to something like mail.yourdomain.tld instead of dsl-4433433.cust.provider.tld. Just rent a virtual system somewhere and put everything on it. That is a) cheaper than the electricity bill at home and b) more reliable. Michael
Re: running mail server at home
Chris [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I was wondering if anyone has any experience with running a mail server at home. It is doable with OpenBSD on the sort of box you describe. For small scale operations, it is possible to fit all those things on a single machine, if you like. For any useful mail handling you *will* need one or more fixed IP addresses, and you need to make very sure you have any and all forward and reverse DNS zones involving your kit set up correctly. Even then you may be bit by somebody else's goofs if your address range allocation is anything less than a /24[1]. Then you may or may not want to run all that many services on a single box (thing single point of failure), but once again it's doable for small-scale operations. You could probably improve reliability by going for a colocation somewhere or even a virtual machine in a controlled environment, as has already been suggested. So yes, a definite maybe ;) [1] http://bsdly.blogspot.com/2007/08/on-business-end-of-blacklist-oh.html -- Peter N. M. Hansteen, member of the first RFC 1149 implementation team http://bsdly.blogspot.com/ http://www.bsdly.net/ http://www.nuug.no/ Remember to set the evil bit on all malicious network traffic delilah spamd[29949]: 85.152.224.147: disconnected after 42673 seconds.
Re: running mail server at home
Lee's point about getting reverse DNS is not to be missed. It's important and possible. You'll just have to fight your way past first level tech support. It took me some work to get it myself, but in the end I got it. I ended up telling the first level guy that I _was_ running Windows, OpenBSD was a mis-statement, and yes I did reboot, yes that quickly, and finally got to second level who then gave me another number to call, etc, etc... Jim * [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] [080207 11:45]: You can absolutely run a mail server at home. This is not rocket science and in fact, it is dumb easy to do. Try to follow these steps: 1. Get a domain name and look for registrars that can host it for you. For example, check this kind of services at www.no-ip.com. 2. Configure your ADSL router to re-direct SMTP and POP3 traffic to that server of yours running sendmail, spamd, mimedefang, clamd, spam-assassin, etc. You can even incorporate services like IMAP3 for you to be able to log-in into your mail server anywhere. On Thu, 7 Feb 2008, Douglas A. Tutty wrote: On Thu, Feb 07, 2008 at 02:51:31AM -0800, Chris wrote: I have a P3 box with 120GB HDD that's doing web, ssh and samba at the moment. I am planning setup sendmail, spamd, mimedefang, clamd and spam-assassin on this box along with web, ssh and samba. I was wondering if anyone has any experience with running a mail server at home. In reality, you cannot run your own mail server at home. This would require: 1) DNS resolution for your domain name 2) Appropriate MX records 3) Valid REVERSE DNS for your IP #3 is usually the big factor for most ISPS, without it, you will not be able to send email to any 'sane' mail server. Lee Leland V. Lammert[EMAIL PROTECTED] Chief Scientist Omnitec Corporation Network/Internet Consultants www.omnitec.net
Re: running mail server at home
Absolutely, there is nothing hard about it and in fact it is very stupidly simple. Preaching about reverse lookups for these purposes is a sort of masochistic ignorance. I don't do reverse dns and most people get my email just fine. If you don't I probably don't care enough to hear about it. I have 5 static IPs at home that resolve. Nothing hard about it; I just refuse to pay $5/month for reverse lookups. On Thu, Feb 07, 2008 at 09:38:30AM -0600, L. V. Lammert wrote: On Thu, 7 Feb 2008, Douglas A. Tutty wrote: On Thu, Feb 07, 2008 at 02:51:31AM -0800, Chris wrote: I have a P3 box with 120GB HDD that's doing web, ssh and samba at the moment. I am planning setup sendmail, spamd, mimedefang, clamd and spam-assassin on this box along with web, ssh and samba. I was wondering if anyone has any experience with running a mail server at home. In reality, you cannot run your own mail server at home. This would require: 1) DNS resolution for your domain name 2) Appropriate MX records 3) Valid REVERSE DNS for your IP #3 is usually the big factor for most ISPS, without it, you will not be able to send email to any 'sane' mail server. Lee Leland V. Lammert[EMAIL PROTECTED] Chief Scientist Omnitec Corporation Network/Internet Consultants www.omnitec.net
Re: running mail server at home
Shane Harbour wrote: I beg to differ. It really depends on your ISP and how far you really want to go. I've run everything (DNS, mail, etc) out of my basement for 3 years now. Ditto. I've been running my own OBSD web/mail server in an old 1U SuperMicro server up my attic for about two years now without incident. It's just for my personal domains, so there is not a lot of traffic. I have an ATT-DSL account with 5 static IP's. Because it is not co-located, when the DSL line acts up (couple times a year, when it's hot, usually), my mail and websites go off-line, but when I was paying for hosting, sometimes the same thing would happen occasionally, anyhow. I have two SuperMicro servers, so if one has a mechanical failure, I have a back-up in place, but in the two years I have been running it, I have racked up more down-time playing with it myself, doing things like messing with my PF rules and other learning-related things, than all the downtime due to DSL and mechanical problems combined. -- -wittig http://www.robertwittig.com/ http://robertwittig.net/ http://robertwittig.org/ .
Re: running mail server at home
At 04:43 PM 2/7/2008 +, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: You can absolutely run a mail server at home. This is not rocket science and in fact, it is dumb easy to do. Try to follow these steps: 1. Get a domain name and look for registrars that can host it for you. For example, check this kind of services at www.no-ip.com. 2. Configure your ADSL router to re-direct SMTP and POP3 traffic to that server of yours running sendmail, spamd, mimedefang, clamd, spam-assassin, etc. You can even incorporate services like IMAP3 for you to be able to log-in into your mail server anywhere. Please stop spreading misinformation. Unless you have reverse DNS setup, ANY email server that adhering to standards should (and probably will) block your incoming email. If you want to run your own, that's great, but don't expect to use it reliably without either setting up the reverse DNS or forwarding through your ISPs email server(s). If you don't do that, you won't know be able to have any assurance that your email will be received properly. Lee
Re: running mail server at home
L. V. Lammert wrote: On Thu, 7 Feb 2008, Douglas A. Tutty wrote: In reality, you cannot run your own mail server at home. This would require: 1) DNS resolution for your domain name 2) Appropriate MX records 3) Valid REVERSE DNS for your IP #3 is usually the big factor for most ISPS, without it, you will not be able to send email to any 'sane' mail server. Dynamic DNS (e.g. dyndns.org) resolves 1 2. Your ISP's mail server, that likely allows (authenticated) relaying, can resolve #3. -Steve S.
Re: running mail server at home
Reliably? I been running it for 3 years already without single incident that those damn e-mails I'd sent reached their destinations at all. At 04:43 PM 2/7/2008 +, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: You can absolutely run a mail server at home. This is not rocket science and in fact, it is dumb easy to do. Try to follow these steps: 1. Get a domain name and look for registrars that can host it for you. For example, check this kind of services at www.no-ip.com. 2. Configure your ADSL router to re-direct SMTP and POP3 traffic to that server of yours running sendmail, spamd, mimedefang, clamd, spam-assassin, etc. You can even incorporate services like IMAP3 for you to be able to log-in into your mail server anywhere. Please stop spreading misinformation. Unless you have reverse DNS setup, ANY email server that adhering to standards should (and probably will) block your incoming email. If you want to run your own, that's great, but don't expect to use it reliably without either setting up the reverse DNS or forwarding through your ISPs email server(s). If you don't do that, you won't know be able to have any assurance that your email will be received properly. Lee
Re: running mail server at home
1. You must have DNS services somewhere. I am similarly setup abd I use www.zoneedit.com. Free and competent. 2. Most cable-based broadbands and DSL do have a fixed dns string. Mine is in the form of cable-modem-mac-cpe-mac.a.b.ips.com. Reverse look-up your own dynamic ip and see what it resolves to. Use this as input to your dns entries (zoneedit.com). 3. Strongly recommend also configuring spf and domain-key signing via your dns entries. This helps sane sites to not flag you as a spammer. -Original Message- From: L. V. Lammert [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Douglas A. Tutty [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: OpenBSD Misc misc@openbsd.org Subject: Re: running mail server at home Date: Thu, 7 Feb 2008 09:38:30 -0600 (CST) Delivered-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Thu, 7 Feb 2008, Douglas A. Tutty wrote: On Thu, Feb 07, 2008 at 02:51:31AM -0800, Chris wrote: I have a P3 box with 120GB HDD that's doing web, ssh and samba at the moment. I am planning setup sendmail, spamd, mimedefang, clamd and spam-assassin on this box along with web, ssh and samba. I was wondering if anyone has any experience with running a mail server at home. In reality, you cannot run your own mail server at home. This would require: 1) DNS resolution for your domain name 2) Appropriate MX records 3) Valid REVERSE DNS for your IP #3 is usually the big factor for most ISPS, without it, you will not be able to send email to any 'sane' mail server. Lee Leland V. Lammert[EMAIL PROTECTED] Chief Scientist Omnitec Corporation Network/Internet Consultants www.omnitec.net
Re: running mail server at home
L. V. Lammert wrote: Please stop spreading misinformation. Unless you have reverse DNS setup, ANY email server that adhering to standards should (and probably will) block your incoming email. It's also rather incorrect to simply state, You _must_ have reverse DNS to run a mail server at home. Do you know of many ISPs that don't have a smarthost for users to relay through? I haven't run into one yet, granted I've only had 4 different ISPs in the past 7 years... More accurate would be saying, You will _either_ need reverse DNS, or to relay through your ISP's smarthost. There is no absolute requirement for reverse DNS, it's simply one possible route to achieve what you desire (that your outgoing mails are accepted on a sanely configured remote mail server). Regards, Mark
Re: running mail server at home
On Thu, Feb 07, 2008 at 05:45:44PM -, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: If your ISP is blocking port 25, port 110, and port 143 both ways maybe it is high-time you consider changing internet service provider. There is no point paying them good money when what they are doing is basically blocking ports here and there. Mine blocks nothing. Many people are stuck with monopolistic evil ISPs without a choice, and those are the ones most likely to sell such crap as internet service... -- Jussi Peltola
Re: running mail server at home
On Thursday 07 February 2008, Marco Peereboom wrote: What you forget here is that most don't adhere to standards. I'm not sure it's a standard, but for many it (matching the servers helo name with the PTR record) is standard practice. Some then continue with a forward lookup and expect the A record to match the connecting IP. Last I looked the University of Michigan was one of several sites that used this level of email server identification before accepting email. In the past, before the days of major spam, one could always adjust to such paranoid security measures as messages were either received or bounced. But due to the increase in forged from addresses many servers no longer bounce such posts and just silently drop them. unfortunately your users, in many cases, will simply not know that mail was not delivered. -- Chris
Re: running mail server at home
Lori Barfield wrote: consumer IP space is really a problem for outgoing mail. at the very least, all the majors will add spam points to your messages and so your mail is a lot more likely to be bulked. even resold IP space at large colos is treated that way by default, and it causes heartburn for businesses. just having reverse DNS isn't good enough, either, because if it has a name that looks like dynamic IP space, that can also get your mail treated with prejudice. it's best to own your own reverse DNS so you can give it a realistic look. you can try to work with the major ISPs to get your IP(s) whitelisted, and try to convince folks to take them off their no-no lists as well, but that can be very time consuming and you'll have mixed results. bottom line is, check out the reputation of your IP space before buying it. you don't want the problem to start with. ...lori Gewt an ISP that doesnt block it and youre fine, Ive been using speakeasy for years, theyre pricey but they stay out of the way. Brian
Re: running mail server at home
On Thursday 07 February 2008, Lori Barfield wrote: just having reverse DNS isn't good enough, either, because if it has a name that looks like dynamic IP space, that can also get your mail treated with prejudice. Yes, I've seen that in practice as well. -- Chris
Re: running mail server at home
Douglas A. Tutty wrote: Well, as always, it depends. What do _you_ mean by a mail server? Do you mean that you want people to mail you directly and your mail to go out to the internet directly and bypass your ISP? If so, you'll need a fixed IP and help from you ISP since they normall block this for home users. Hey, my ISP says that their connection is only for one computer that I can't run a network on their hookup. I guess they've never heard of UNIX and masquerading. I run a mailserver in that I can mail internally and externally. However, the mail all goes out to my ISP's smart host and comes in with fetchmail. Doug. A p3 is plenty unless youre doing a VERY large quantity of mail.. Re the IP thing, a static IP and an ISP that doesn't block and is willing to change a reverse dns entry to match the forward are what I have done, seems to have worked ok for me. Smarthosting is not for me, I'll deliver direct.. Brian
Re: running mail server at home
Works for me and has for years. You would not see these emails if it didn't. What you forget here is that most don't adhere to standards. On Thu, Feb 07, 2008 at 11:26:17AM -0600, L. V. Lammert wrote: At 04:43 PM 2/7/2008 +, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: You can absolutely run a mail server at home. This is not rocket science and in fact, it is dumb easy to do. Try to follow these steps: 1. Get a domain name and look for registrars that can host it for you. For example, check this kind of services at www.no-ip.com. 2. Configure your ADSL router to re-direct SMTP and POP3 traffic to that server of yours running sendmail, spamd, mimedefang, clamd, spam-assassin, etc. You can even incorporate services like IMAP3 for you to be able to log-in into your mail server anywhere. Please stop spreading misinformation. Unless you have reverse DNS setup, ANY email server that adhering to standards should (and probably will) block your incoming email. If you want to run your own, that's great, but don't expect to use it reliably without either setting up the reverse DNS or forwarding through your ISPs email server(s). If you don't do that, you won't know be able to have any assurance that your email will be received properly. Lee
Re: running mail server at home
Lori Barfield wrote: consumer IP space is really a problem for outgoing mail. at the very least, all the majors will add spam points to your messages and so your mail is a lot more likely to be bulked. even resold IP space at large colos is treated that way by default, and it causes heartburn for businesses. just having reverse DNS isn't good enough, either, because if it has a name that looks like dynamic IP space, that can also get your mail treated with prejudice. it's best to own your own reverse DNS so you can give it a realistic look. you can try to work with the major ISPs to get your IP(s) whitelisted, and try to convince folks to take them off their no-no lists as well, but that can be very time consuming and you'll have mixed results. bottom line is, check out the reputation of your IP space before buying it. you don't want the problem to start with. ...lori My DSL provider in Arizona is Qwest. The basic service is $26 and for another $5 they will toss you a fixed IP address. As pointed out earlier you must have fixed IP address for all practical purposes. You may however set MTA even with dynamic IP but the chances are that most other MTA will bounce your mail. However some will not. Even with dynamic IP, I was able to send emails to my friends working for Apple. Apparently, Apple is not very afraid of the spam or they have crystal ball to see which dynamic IP addresses are legit. The Qwest internet speed in Arizona vary from 1.5-7 Mps pending how far is one's house is from their switch. I know that those speeds look funny to people from Europe and Japan but ISP providers in U. S. are monopolies thanks to the president Bush. A decent speed of 10-100Mps on T1 will cost you about $1400 a month. Qwest's modem blocks by default www hosting, MTA, and most other services. However it is trivial to log into the modem and unblock the ports. Qwest actually actively encourage customers to have fixed IP addresses for purpose of online gaming and conference hosting. I did run my own MTA with the proper domain name that can be purchased for about $10 a year. I had no problems receiving incoming mail and mixed success with sending mail. I did that because I wanted to learn a few things. My real MTA is at the University I work for and I fetch my mail via IMAP server to my local mail client as probably most people do. I would suggest that before you make definitive decision to run your own MTA you try to do dynamic mail hosting. I used free DynDNS services provided by DynDNS.com. The way that it works is that they run a honest MTA which does virtual hosting for many servers which do have only dynamic IP address. This is usually extra service you get from them as their main thing is virtual web hosting. Basic web and mail virtual hosting is free but their real objective is to get you sign for their paid services. Their MTA is completely legit and on the white list so your outgoing mail will never bounce. The big draw back in my eyes is that you must run something like opendd which is DynDNS client in order to update their server about your current IP address. The positive thing is that they will run spamassassin and clamav for you. Kind Regards, Predrag
Re: running mail server at home
On Feb 7, 2008 2:51 AM, Chris [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I have a P3 box with 120GB HDD that's doing web, ssh and samba at the moment. I am planning setup sendmail, spamd, mimedefang, clamd and spam-assassin on this box along with web, ssh and samba. I was wondering if anyone has any experience with running a mail server at home. I want to know if I should use only one box or buy another box? Also, what sort of electricity bills will I run into? And also if is there anything else I would need to know. I've done that with limited success. Works OK emailing servers that don't check much of anything. What I eventually did was set up TLS and relay through google. This worked for me because I was the only user of the system (gmail re-maps your email address) so YMMV. -B
Re: running mail server at home
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Reliably? I been running it for 3 years already without single incident that those damn e-mails I'd sent reached their destinations at all. Indeed it comes down to this for the OP... do you want to listen to one person telling you (very incorrectly) that it can't be done without reverse DNS, or listen to the dozens of replies that have made it abundantly clear that it's entirely possible, with years of real experience actually doing it to back it up?
Re: running mail server at home
Either you want to send or receive mail from anyone and from anywhere in cyberspace, that is irrefutably possible. Like I said, consider this site: www.no-ip.com I am not working for them but I had used their affordable services and it works well. One thing, if your ADSL router at home has either a dynamic or a public static IPv4 address your purpose is very doable. The keyword here is redirection. FYI, masquerading is a LINUX shit but openbsd rules with its PF power. On Thu, Feb 07, 2008 at 02:51:31AM -0800, Chris wrote: I have a P3 box with 120GB HDD that's doing web, ssh and samba at the moment. I am planning setup sendmail, spamd, mimedefang, clamd and spam-assassin on this box along with web, ssh and samba. I was wondering if anyone has any experience with running a mail server at home. I want to know if I should use only one box or buy another box? Also, what sort of electricity bills will I run into? And also if is there anything else I would need to know. Thanks for any help. Well, as always, it depends. What do _you_ mean by a mail server? Do you mean that you want people to mail you directly and your mail to go out to the internet directly and bypass your ISP? If so, you'll need a fixed IP and help from you ISP since they normall block this for home users. Hey, my ISP says that their connection is only for one computer that I can't run a network on their hookup. I guess they've never heard of UNIX and masquerading. I run a mailserver in that I can mail internally and externally. However, the mail all goes out to my ISP's smart host and comes in with fetchmail. Doug.
Re: running mail server at home
If your ISP is blocking port 25, port 110, and port 143 both ways maybe it is high-time you consider changing internet service provider. There is no point paying them good money when what they are doing is basically blocking ports here and there. On Thu, Feb 07, 2008 at 09:38:30AM -0600, L. V. Lammert wrote: In reality, you cannot run your own mail server at home. This would require: 1) DNS resolution for your domain name 2) Appropriate MX records 3) Valid REVERSE DNS for your IP #3 is usually the big factor for most ISPS, without it, you will not be able to send email to any 'sane' mail server. I have all of those on a home ADSL connection, although I doubt you can get that from many ISPs, mine is about 20% more expensive than the cheap ones and didn't even offer non-static IPs until about a year ago. If you use your ISP's smarthost you can probably get away without reverse DNS, I doubt mail servers are going to leave their mail undelivered because the receiving MX is in a dialup range. BTW, you forgot 4), the biggest obstacle with residential ISPs: blocking of port 25 both ways, which is luckily becoming more and more common, even to the point were the telecommunications regulation authority here officially recommends it to ISPs. Love the spammers and stupid users... -- Jussi Peltola
Re: running mail server at home
You can absolutely run a mail server at home. This is not rocket science and in fact, it is dumb easy to do. Try to follow these steps: 1. Get a domain name and look for registrars that can host it for you. For example, check this kind of services at www.no-ip.com. 2. Configure your ADSL router to re-direct SMTP and POP3 traffic to that server of yours running sendmail, spamd, mimedefang, clamd, spam-assassin, etc. You can even incorporate services like IMAP3 for you to be able to log-in into your mail server anywhere. On Thu, 7 Feb 2008, Douglas A. Tutty wrote: On Thu, Feb 07, 2008 at 02:51:31AM -0800, Chris wrote: I have a P3 box with 120GB HDD that's doing web, ssh and samba at the moment. I am planning setup sendmail, spamd, mimedefang, clamd and spam-assassin on this box along with web, ssh and samba. I was wondering if anyone has any experience with running a mail server at home. In reality, you cannot run your own mail server at home. This would require: 1) DNS resolution for your domain name 2) Appropriate MX records 3) Valid REVERSE DNS for your IP #3 is usually the big factor for most ISPS, without it, you will not be able to send email to any 'sane' mail server. Lee Leland V. Lammert[EMAIL PROTECTED] Chief Scientist Omnitec Corporation Network/Internet Consultants www.omnitec.net
Re: running mail server at home
On Thu, Feb 07, 2008 at 09:38:30AM -0600, L. V. Lammert wrote: In reality, you cannot run your own mail server at home. This would require: 1) DNS resolution for your domain name 2) Appropriate MX records 3) Valid REVERSE DNS for your IP #3 is usually the big factor for most ISPS, without it, you will not be able to send email to any 'sane' mail server. I have all of those on a home ADSL connection, although I doubt you can get that from many ISPs, mine is about 20% more expensive than the cheap ones and didn't even offer non-static IPs until about a year ago. If you use your ISP's smarthost you can probably get away without reverse DNS, I doubt mail servers are going to leave their mail undelivered because the receiving MX is in a dialup range. BTW, you forgot 4), the biggest obstacle with residential ISPs: blocking of port 25 both ways, which is luckily becoming more and more common, even to the point were the telecommunications regulation authority here officially recommends it to ISPs. Love the spammers and stupid users... -- Jussi Peltola
Re: running mail server at home
On Thu, 7 Feb 2008, Douglas A. Tutty wrote: On Thu, Feb 07, 2008 at 02:51:31AM -0800, Chris wrote: I have a P3 box with 120GB HDD that's doing web, ssh and samba at the moment. I am planning setup sendmail, spamd, mimedefang, clamd and spam-assassin on this box along with web, ssh and samba. I was wondering if anyone has any experience with running a mail server at home. In reality, you cannot run your own mail server at home. This would require: 1) DNS resolution for your domain name 2) Appropriate MX records 3) Valid REVERSE DNS for your IP #3 is usually the big factor for most ISPS, without it, you will not be able to send email to any 'sane' mail server. Lee Leland V. Lammert[EMAIL PROTECTED] Chief Scientist Omnitec Corporation Network/Internet Consultants www.omnitec.net
Re: running mail server at home
I run all my stuff at home and even do virtual hosting for web and mail for one of my wife's websites. I have a separate box for mail running postfix, dovecot, postgresql, clamd, and spamd. It's not a beefy box but still works well. Haven't really seen my electrical bill go up. I did have to get a server class DSL line so I could have static IPs. It was slightly higher but not by much. I also pay a small fee for my IP addresses. Regards, Shane Chris wrote: I have a P3 box with 120GB HDD that's doing web, ssh and samba at the moment. I am planning setup sendmail, spamd, mimedefang, clamd and spam-assassin on this box along with web, ssh and samba. I was wondering if anyone has any experience with running a mail server at home. I want to know if I should use only one box or buy another box? Also, what sort of electricity bills will I run into? And also if is there anything else I would need to know. Thanks for any help.
Re: running mail server at home
On Thu, Feb 07, 2008 at 02:51:31AM -0800, Chris wrote: I have a P3 box with 120GB HDD that's doing web, ssh and samba at the moment. I am planning setup sendmail, spamd, mimedefang, clamd and spam-assassin on this box along with web, ssh and samba. I was wondering if anyone has any experience with running a mail server at home. I want to know if I should use only one box or buy another box? Also, what sort of electricity bills will I run into? And also if is there anything else I would need to know. Thanks for any help. Well, as always, it depends. What do _you_ mean by a mail server? Do you mean that you want people to mail you directly and your mail to go out to the internet directly and bypass your ISP? If so, you'll need a fixed IP and help from you ISP since they normall block this for home users. Hey, my ISP says that their connection is only for one computer that I can't run a network on their hookup. I guess they've never heard of UNIX and masquerading. I run a mailserver in that I can mail internally and externally. However, the mail all goes out to my ISP's smart host and comes in with fetchmail. Doug.
Re: running mail server at home
I run all my stuff at home. My old firewall (just replace it) was a pentium pro 200 with 128MB; my mailserver is a PIII 800 and runs www, postfix, dovecot, mysql and some other junk. Works just fine. On Thu, Feb 07, 2008 at 02:51:31AM -0800, Chris wrote: I have a P3 box with 120GB HDD that's doing web, ssh and samba at the moment. I am planning setup sendmail, spamd, mimedefang, clamd and spam-assassin on this box along with web, ssh and samba. I was wondering if anyone has any experience with running a mail server at home. I want to know if I should use only one box or buy another box? Also, what sort of electricity bills will I run into? And also if is there anything else I would need to know. Thanks for any help.
Re: running mail server at home
Spreading misinformation? Look, I subscribe to an ISP with ADSL that provided me with public dynamic IP address. I register it to a registrar that offers dynamic hosting courtesy of www.no-ip.com and I am sending this email to you because of it. And you tell me that I am preaching something not doable? Oh common At 04:43 PM 2/7/2008 +, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: You can absolutely run a mail server at home. This is not rocket science and in fact, it is dumb easy to do. Try to follow these steps: 1. Get a domain name and look for registrars that can host it for you. For example, check this kind of services at www.no-ip.com. 2. Configure your ADSL router to re-direct SMTP and POP3 traffic to that server of yours running sendmail, spamd, mimedefang, clamd, spam-assassin, etc. You can even incorporate services like IMAP3 for you to be able to log-in into your mail server anywhere. Please stop spreading misinformation. Unless you have reverse DNS setup, ANY email server that adhering to standards should (and probably will) block your incoming email. If you want to run your own, that's great, but don't expect to use it reliably without either setting up the reverse DNS or forwarding through your ISPs email server(s). If you don't do that, you won't know be able to have any assurance that your email will be received properly. Lee
Re: running mail server at home
consumer IP space is really a problem for outgoing mail. at the very least, all the majors will add spam points to your messages and so your mail is a lot more likely to be bulked. even resold IP space at large colos is treated that way by default, and it causes heartburn for businesses. just having reverse DNS isn't good enough, either, because if it has a name that looks like dynamic IP space, that can also get your mail treated with prejudice. it's best to own your own reverse DNS so you can give it a realistic look. you can try to work with the major ISPs to get your IP(s) whitelisted, and try to convince folks to take them off their no-no lists as well, but that can be very time consuming and you'll have mixed results. bottom line is, check out the reputation of your IP space before buying it. you don't want the problem to start with. ...lori
Re: running mail server at home
On 2008/02/07 16:06, L. V. Lammert wrote: If you want to hack a setup together [lacking one of the DNS requirements like reverse lookup], it's important to know that your email *MIGHT* not get through, and there's nothing you can do about it. Same applies *with* all the requirements met these days. Loads of people drop mail on the floor without so much as a 550.
Re: running mail server at home
On Thu, 7 Feb 2008, Marco Peereboom wrote: Works for me and has for years. You would not see these emails if it didn't. What you forget here is that most don't adhere to standards. Didn't say it wouldn't work, .. but I, for one, don't want to have to call someone to make sure they get my email. Bottom line - there are many more issues to an setting up an email server than the machine itself. If you want to hack a setup together [lacking one of the DNS requirements like reverse lookup], it's important to know that your email *MIGHT* not get through, and there's nothing you can do about it. Lee
Re: running mail server at home
On Thu, Feb 07, 2008 at 05:49:58PM -, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Spreading misinformation? Look, I subscribe to an ISP with ADSL that provided me with public dynamic IP address. I register it to a registrar that offers dynamic hosting courtesy of www.no-ip.com and I am sending this email to you because of it. And you tell me that I am preaching something not doable? Oh common No, you are relaying it through a mailing list that happens to accept it. Getting mail through to the large webmail services, for example, is quite difficult from residential ranges. Claiming it is a good idea to run an outgoing MTA on a dynamic residential address is silly. It may work for you, but it does have its problems. People wishing to correspond with many companies whose IT people you don't control probably don't want to do it. -- Jussi Peltola
Re: running mail server at home
I stumbled today upon this while following a different article, maybe it is helpful to you http://www.kernel-panic.it/openbsd/mail/ I have a P3 box with 120GB HDD that's doing web, ssh and samba at the moment. I am planning setup sendmail, spamd, mimedefang, clamd and spam-assassin on this box along with web, ssh and samba. I was wondering if anyone has any experience with running a mail server at home. I want to know if I should use only one box or buy another box? Also, what sort of electricity bills will I run into? And also if is there anything else I would need to know. Thanks for any help.
Re: running mail server at home
L. V. Lammert wrote: On Thu, 7 Feb 2008, Marco Peereboom wrote: Works for me and has for years. You would not see these emails if it didn't. What you forget here is that most don't adhere to standards. Didn't say it wouldn't work, .. but I, for one, don't want to have to call someone to make sure they get my email. Bottom line - there are many more issues to an setting up an email server than the machine itself. If you want to hack a setup together [lacking one of the DNS requirements like reverse lookup], it's important to know that your email *MIGHT* not get through, and there's nothing you can do about it. Yes there is, but lots of good point have been raise here, including ISP that block ports that frankly they really should on connection for cable model for example, or home connection. Every ISP should just do it, and spam and virus propagation via emails would see a huge decline. I run an ISP and the point is that all that say, you should change ISP because of that, always forget the fact that 99% of the home users have no clue what they do and even less protect their computers. In most case, I even provide firewall free, not because I wouldn't love to get the income, I sure would love and need it, but the bottom line is that users need to be protected against their own stupidity really. Any why do I do that, because it does protect all the other users on my network as well as on the Internet, that's why. But also, anytime a user wants to run a mail server, or what ever at home, I have no problem with that and will always do rDNS for them as well as forward DNS too. And, I will sure hell not bill you for it. I was surprise to see Marco would be charge $5/month for that! The only requirements I have are pretty simple and that's in the contract as well. If you SPAM, I cut you off. No question asked and I will notify you to clean it up. If you are not responsible and I had rare case, but I did in the pass, I will simply terminate your contract and you go else where. You want to setup servers, no problem and in some cases, I will even help you or suggest things. As long as it is safe, properly configure and you act responsibly, then never will you ear from me. Sadly, almost every single ISP do not act responsibly and sadly as well, with how things are at times, they can't or do not have the resources to do so. And in the end, very sadly Marco is right and it will work in most cases, why. Because most ISP just do not do it right, or care anymore and in some cases, believe it or not, they don't even know! And, don't forget something as well. Part of the problem is also some users will beat everyone to death for saving one buck here and there and as such, many ISP just can't care anymore as much as they used to, if they did in the first place. How many users will complain and report SPAM to their ISP or others and these same one are also complaining if they are asked to clean their setup by their ISP, or block because their server got hacked and their ISP cut them off until the clean it up. In the end, it's a joint responsibility if you want and you need to find the right ISP that will work with you and help you as well, but these are not the cheapest one either and you need to asked yourself the question, what are you really looking for. You want cheap, then you get cheap, you want good, then don't expect to pay the lowest price. Anyway, I have been doing it for 15 years and I always get the same thing. Users what cheap and it takes time to built trust and confidence, but when it's there, they go no where and all my clients I get them by word of mouth only and they stay for years. Make that 10 years. You get what you pay for in the end, but also if you do your job right and you have the right ISP, they will work with you and if they don't then change. Best, Daniel
Re: running mail server at home
I don't do reverse dns and most people get my email just fine. If you don't I probably don't care enough to hear about it. I have 5 static IPs at home that resolve. Nothing hard about it; I just refuse to pay $5/month for reverse lookups. On Thu, Feb 07, 2008 at 09:38:30AM -0600, L. V. Lammert wrote: On Thu, 7 Feb 2008, Douglas A. Tutty wrote: On Thu, Feb 07, 2008 at 02:51:31AM -0800, Chris wrote: I have a P3 box with 120GB HDD that's doing web, ssh and samba at the moment. I am planning setup sendmail, spamd, mimedefang, clamd and spam-assassin on this box along with web, ssh and samba. I was wondering if anyone has any experience with running a mail server at home. In reality, you cannot run your own mail server at home. This would require: 1) DNS resolution for your domain name 2) Appropriate MX records 3) Valid REVERSE DNS for your IP #3 is usually the big factor for most ISPS, without it, you will not be able to send email to any 'sane' mail server. Lee Leland V. Lammert[EMAIL PROTECTED] Chief Scientist Omnitec Corporation Network/Internet Consultants www.omnitec.net
Re: running mail server at home
I beg to differ. It really depends on your ISP and how far you really want to go. I've run everything (DNS, mail, etc) out of my basement for 3 years now. Granted I had to switch ISPs in order to do so and upgrade to a server class DSL line. They even delegated control of my reverse DNS to me. It's all part of a standard package they provide. Again, it just comes down to your ISP and how far you really want to go. I'm sure there are quite a few on the list that do this. Regards, Shane L. V. Lammert wrote: On Thu, 7 Feb 2008, Douglas A. Tutty wrote: On Thu, Feb 07, 2008 at 02:51:31AM -0800, Chris wrote: I have a P3 box with 120GB HDD that's doing web, ssh and samba at the moment. I am planning setup sendmail, spamd, mimedefang, clamd and spam-assassin on this box along with web, ssh and samba. I was wondering if anyone has any experience with running a mail server at home. In reality, you cannot run your own mail server at home. This would require: 1) DNS resolution for your domain name 2) Appropriate MX records 3) Valid REVERSE DNS for your IP #3 is usually the big factor for most ISPS, without it, you will not be able to send email to any 'sane' mail server. Lee Leland V. Lammert[EMAIL PROTECTED] Chief Scientist Omnitec Corporation Network/Internet Consultants www.omnitec.net
Re: running mail server at home
On Thu, Feb 07, 2008 at 04:06:08PM -0600, L. V. Lammert wrote: On Thu, 7 Feb 2008, Marco Peereboom wrote: Works for me and has for years. You would not see these emails if it didn't. What you forget here is that most don't adhere to standards. Didn't say it wouldn't work, .. but I, for one, don't want to have to call someone to make sure they get my email. I don't care that much. Bottom line - there are many more issues to an setting up an email server than the machine itself. If you want to hack a setup together [lacking one of the DNS requirements like reverse lookup], it's important to know that your email *MIGHT* not get through, and there's nothing you can do about it. Right, the questions is do you or do you not care. Lee
Re: running mail server at home
At 04:54 PM 2/7/2008 -0600, Marco Peereboom wrote: On Thu, Feb 07, 2008 at 04:06:08PM -0600, L. V. Lammert wrote: On Thu, 7 Feb 2008, Marco Peereboom wrote: Works for me and has for years. You would not see these emails if it didn't. What you forget here is that most don't adhere to standards. Didn't say it wouldn't work, .. but I, for one, don't want to have to call someone to make sure they get my email. I don't care that much. Well, I'm certainly everyone knows that by now, and they also know what the issues are. I am, however, very surprised at the hacker mentality from someone on this project. Maybe it works, maybe it doesn't. Does that should like a good motto for this project? Sheesh. Lee
Re: running mail server at home
It's email. I am not sending a rocket to the moon. Like I said you either care or you don't. For me it is perfectly acceptable that someone won't get my email. This has nothing to do with the quality of my code. This also has no bearing whatsoever on the project. I fail to see why that needs to be mentioned. On Thu, Feb 07, 2008 at 05:39:18PM -0600, L. V. Lammert wrote: At 04:54 PM 2/7/2008 -0600, Marco Peereboom wrote: On Thu, Feb 07, 2008 at 04:06:08PM -0600, L. V. Lammert wrote: On Thu, 7 Feb 2008, Marco Peereboom wrote: Works for me and has for years. You would not see these emails if it didn't. What you forget here is that most don't adhere to standards. Didn't say it wouldn't work, .. but I, for one, don't want to have to call someone to make sure they get my email. I don't care that much. Well, I'm certainly everyone knows that by now, and they also know what the issues are. I am, however, very surprised at the hacker mentality from someone on this project. Maybe it works, maybe it doesn't. Does that should like a good motto for this project? Sheesh. Lee
Re: running mail server at home
On Thursday 07 February 2008 18:39:18 L. V. Lammert wrote: At 04:54 PM 2/7/2008 -0600, Marco Peereboom wrote: On Thu, Feb 07, 2008 at 04:06:08PM -0600, L. V. Lammert wrote: On Thu, 7 Feb 2008, Marco Peereboom wrote: Works for me and has for years. You would not see these emails if it didn't. What you forget here is that most don't adhere to standards. Didn't say it wouldn't work, .. but I, for one, don't want to have to call someone to make sure they get my email. I don't care that much. Well, I'm certainly everyone knows that by now, and they also know what the issues are. I am, however, very surprised at the hacker mentality from someone on this project. Maybe it works, maybe it doesn't. Does that should like a good motto for this project? Sheesh. Lee But thats the state of email today -- maybe it works, and maybe not. You can control your own email system but can't do anything about the hundreds of thousands of weirdly configed systems that are more-or-less broken. That isn't a motto. It's a realization that mail is hard to do, and making sure that you can talk with the folks you want is the most thing for a lot of people. --STeve Andre'
Re: running mail server at home
On Feb 7, 2008, at 7:38 AM, L. V. Lammert wrote: On Thu, 7 Feb 2008, Douglas A. Tutty wrote: On Thu, Feb 07, 2008 at 02:51:31AM -0800, Chris wrote: I have a P3 box with 120GB HDD that's doing web, ssh and samba at the moment. I am planning setup sendmail, spamd, mimedefang, clamd and spam- assassin on this box along with web, ssh and samba. I was wondering if anyone has any experience with running a mail server at home. In reality, you cannot run your own mail server at home. This would require: 1) DNS resolution for your domain name check - mine runs dns too 2) Appropriate MX records check 3) Valid REVERSE DNS for your IP and check - piece of cake with a business class dsl package. #3 is usually the big factor for most ISPS, without it, you will not be able to send email to any 'sane' mail server. Lee Leland V. Lammert[EMAIL PROTECTED] Chief Scientist Omnitec Corporation Network/Internet Consultants www.omnitec.net Ben Calvert Chief walrus Flying Walrus Communications, inc
