[NSP] Re: Intonation
Thanks so much, John, Francis, I'll try climbing out of the ravine today. Colin On Tue, Jan 11, 2011 at 8:11 PM, John Liestman <[1]j...@liestman.com> wrote: Francis, you must have the earlier "pre-plateau" version! I have posted a pdf file version at [2]http://www.liestman.com/plateau.pdf for anyone to read that is so inclined. It is called "Drone Reeds and the Plateau of Stability" but it is truly the plateau of happiness if you can achieve it! Let me know if for some reason the link does not work and I will just email you (whoever "you" are . . . or is) a copy. Happy droning on the plateau! On 1/11/2011 12:18 PM, Francis Wood wrote: Colin, are you using composite drone reeds or all-cane ones? Adjustment techniques will, of course differ. Whatever you're using, I'd check the drone itself as a priority, checking that everything is sealing correctly (tuning beads are often suspect), that the bore is clean and smooth, and that the tone hole is entirely free of any invisible debris or excess lubrication, which often accumulates invisibly there. Any of these deficiencies will cause instability. I have John Liestman's excellent book, but probably an earlier version than the one you mentioned, since I can't find the reed advice on those or adjacent pages. I do recall reading John's remarks about the parameters of stability (I think he calls that area the 'Plateau of Happiness' or something similar) and this may be in a subsequent edition or even in an NPS Magazine article. It's very good information. Of course, it is one thing to adjust a good reed and an entirely different matter to spend ages on a drone reed that does not work well and never will. Unfortunately some drone reeds are not worthy of that attention. Pitch of almost any woodwind reed will rise with pressure. The ideal reed behaviour for NSPs is one where pitch changes relatively little, and evenly, with all drone reeds and the chanter reed behaving similarly. That's a rare but not impossible situation, requiring not only skill but luck. I suspect that as much success comes from knowing when to reject a reed, as knowing when and how to adjust it. Francis On 11 Jan 2011, at 12:40, Colin and Cheryl McNaught wrote: Following on from these sage comments, does anyone have ideas about what causes some drones to be significantly more pressure sensitive than others. By this I mean their pitch varies more for a given change in bag pressure. Once they are adjusted for pitch and pressure there doesn't seem to be anything else to tweak without spoiling the pitch/pressure set-ups. I have a set that is very stable and another that has a couple of drones that aren't and would like to improve them. I always try to play other pipe sets when at NSP get-togethers and it's been my experience that every set I have played has some quirky notes. I'm sure there's a reed dependency in this too. Making small (often unconscious) adjustments in bag pressure seems to be a part of playing this instrument well (just as embouchure adjustments on, e.g. oboe, flute). Consequently, a set of drones that is more stable can result in a 'sweeter' end result than one that isn't. Colin (McNaught) On Sat, Jan 8, 2011 at 7:05 PM,<[1][3]gibbonssoi...@aol.com> wrote: As many notes on an NSP chanter can be bent about a quarter tone without putting the drones far out - at least on a good reed day - I guess one difference between a good piper and a fairly good one is the former will squeeze notes into tune unconsciously and accurately, the latter consciously and only fairly accurately. I often think of singing the note, so I have an idea of the pitch in my head, to aim for. Listening to the chord with the drones - if these are in tune - also helps with some notes. It is the notes that harmonise with the drones which are most exposed if out of tune, so recognising a just 3rd or whatever tells you you've got there. The singing trick doesn't work so well if you are still thinking equal-tempered, mind. So chords are better. Long notes are good practice for this - I wonder if this is one reason Tom Clough liked playing hymn tunes? 'Oh God our Help in Ages Past' (aka St Anne, or 'The Goldfish') is a good one for this, dead slow. I sometimes use this to see if the drones are 'really' in
[NSP] Re: Intonation
Thanks John. It's a gem! Sunny up here on the plateau. Francis On 12 Jan 2011, at 01:11, John Liestman wrote: > Francis, you must have the earlier "pre-plateau" version! > > I have posted a pdf file version at http://www.liestman.com/plateau.pdf for > anyone to read that is so inclined. It is called "Drone Reeds and the Plateau > of Stability" but it is truly the plateau of happiness if you can achieve it! > Let me know if for some reason the link does not work and I will just email > you (whoever "you" are . . . or is) a copy. > > Happy droning on the plateau! > > > On 1/11/2011 12:18 PM, Francis Wood wrote: >> Colin, are you using composite drone reeds or all-cane ones? Adjustment >> techniques will, of course differ. >> >> Whatever you're using, I'd check the drone itself as a priority, checking >> that everything is sealing correctly (tuning beads are often suspect), that >> the bore is clean and smooth, and that the tone hole is entirely free of any >> invisible debris or excess lubrication, which often accumulates invisibly >> there. Any of these deficiencies will cause instability. >> >> I have John Liestman's excellent book, but probably an earlier version than >> the one you mentioned, since I can't find the reed advice on those or >> adjacent pages. I do recall reading >> John's remarks about the parameters of stability (I think he calls that area >> the 'Plateau of Happiness' or something similar) and this may be in a >> subsequent edition or even in an NPS Magazine article. It's very good >> information. >> >> Of course, it is one thing to adjust a good reed and an entirely different >> matter to spend ages on a drone reed that does not work well and never will. >> Unfortunately some drone reeds are not worthy of that attention. >> >> Pitch of almost any woodwind reed will rise with pressure. The ideal reed >> behaviour for NSPs is one where pitch changes relatively little, and evenly, >> with all drone reeds and the chanter reed behaving similarly. That's a rare >> but not impossible situation, requiring not only skill but luck. I suspect >> that as much success comes from knowing when to reject a reed, as knowing >> when and how to adjust it. >> >> Francis >> >> >> >> >> On 11 Jan 2011, at 12:40, Colin and Cheryl McNaught wrote: >> >>> Following on from these sage comments, does anyone have ideas about >>> what causes some drones to be significantly more pressure sensitive >>> than others. By this I mean their pitch varies more for a given change >>> in bag pressure. Once they are adjusted for pitch and pressure there >>> doesn't seem to be anything else to tweak without spoiling the >>> pitch/pressure set-ups. I have a set that is very stable and another >>> that has a couple of drones that aren't and would like to improve them. >>> >>> I always try to play other pipe sets when at NSP get-togethers and it's >>> been my experience that every set I have played has some quirky notes. >>>I'm sure there's a reed dependency in this too. Making small (often >>> unconscious) adjustments in bag pressure seems to be a part of playing >>> this instrument well (just as embouchure adjustments on, e.g. oboe, >>> flute). Consequently, a set of drones that is more stable can result >>> in a 'sweeter' end result than one that isn't. >>> >>> Colin (McNaught) >>> On Sat, Jan 8, 2011 at 7:05 PM,<[1]gibbonssoi...@aol.com> wrote: >>> >>> As many notes on an NSP chanter can be bent about a quarter tone >>> without putting the drones far out - at least on a good reed day - >>> I >>> guess one difference between a good piper and a fairly good one is >>> the >>> former will squeeze notes into tune unconsciously and accurately, >>> the >>> latter consciously and only fairly accurately. >>> I often think of singing the note, so I have an idea of the >>> pitch >>> in my head, to aim for. Listening to the chord with the drones - >>> if >>> these are in tune - also helps with some notes. It is the notes >>> that >>> harmonise with the drones which are most exposed if out of tune, >>> so >>> recognising a just 3rd or whatever tells you you've got there. The >>> singing trick doesn't work so well if you are still thinking >>> equal-tempered, mind. So chords are better. >>> Long notes are good practice for this - I wonder if this is >>> one >>> reason Tom Clough liked playing hymn tunes? 'Oh God our Help in >>> Ages >>> Past' (aka St Anne, or 'The Goldfish') is a good one for this, >>> dead >>> slow. >>> I sometimes use this to see if the drones are 'really' in tune. >>> When I started playing NSP after playing the flute for years, >>> my >>> embouchure would bend to try to bring notes in - ineffective of >>> itself, >>> but I found I was doing something useful as w
[NSP] Re: Intonation
Francis, you must have the earlier "pre-plateau" version! I have posted a pdf file version at http://www.liestman.com/plateau.pdf for anyone to read that is so inclined. It is called "Drone Reeds and the Plateau of Stability" but it is truly the plateau of happiness if you can achieve it! Let me know if for some reason the link does not work and I will just email you (whoever "you" are . . . or is) a copy. Happy droning on the plateau! On 1/11/2011 12:18 PM, Francis Wood wrote: Colin, are you using composite drone reeds or all-cane ones? Adjustment techniques will, of course differ. Whatever you're using, I'd check the drone itself as a priority, checking that everything is sealing correctly (tuning beads are often suspect), that the bore is clean and smooth, and that the tone hole is entirely free of any invisible debris or excess lubrication, which often accumulates invisibly there. Any of these deficiencies will cause instability. I have John Liestman's excellent book, but probably an earlier version than the one you mentioned, since I can't find the reed advice on those or adjacent pages. I do recall reading John's remarks about the parameters of stability (I think he calls that area the 'Plateau of Happiness' or something similar) and this may be in a subsequent edition or even in an NPS Magazine article. It's very good information. Of course, it is one thing to adjust a good reed and an entirely different matter to spend ages on a drone reed that does not work well and never will. Unfortunately some drone reeds are not worthy of that attention. Pitch of almost any woodwind reed will rise with pressure. The ideal reed behaviour for NSPs is one where pitch changes relatively little, and evenly, with all drone reeds and the chanter reed behaving similarly. That's a rare but not impossible situation, requiring not only skill but luck. I suspect that as much success comes from knowing when to reject a reed, as knowing when and how to adjust it. Francis On 11 Jan 2011, at 12:40, Colin and Cheryl McNaught wrote: Following on from these sage comments, does anyone have ideas about what causes some drones to be significantly more pressure sensitive than others. By this I mean their pitch varies more for a given change in bag pressure. Once they are adjusted for pitch and pressure there doesn't seem to be anything else to tweak without spoiling the pitch/pressure set-ups. I have a set that is very stable and another that has a couple of drones that aren't and would like to improve them. I always try to play other pipe sets when at NSP get-togethers and it's been my experience that every set I have played has some quirky notes. I'm sure there's a reed dependency in this too. Making small (often unconscious) adjustments in bag pressure seems to be a part of playing this instrument well (just as embouchure adjustments on, e.g. oboe, flute). Consequently, a set of drones that is more stable can result in a 'sweeter' end result than one that isn't. Colin (McNaught) On Sat, Jan 8, 2011 at 7:05 PM,<[1]gibbonssoi...@aol.com> wrote: As many notes on an NSP chanter can be bent about a quarter tone without putting the drones far out - at least on a good reed day - I guess one difference between a good piper and a fairly good one is the former will squeeze notes into tune unconsciously and accurately, the latter consciously and only fairly accurately. I often think of singing the note, so I have an idea of the pitch in my head, to aim for. Listening to the chord with the drones - if these are in tune - also helps with some notes. It is the notes that harmonise with the drones which are most exposed if out of tune, so recognising a just 3rd or whatever tells you you've got there. The singing trick doesn't work so well if you are still thinking equal-tempered, mind. So chords are better. Long notes are good practice for this - I wonder if this is one reason Tom Clough liked playing hymn tunes? 'Oh God our Help in Ages Past' (aka St Anne, or 'The Goldfish') is a good one for this, dead slow. I sometimes use this to see if the drones are 'really' in tune. When I started playing NSP after playing the flute for years, my embouchure would bend to try to bring notes in - ineffective of itself, but I found I was doing something useful as well, as the notes came more into tune (I pinched a non-existent thumbhole to get the top octave on the whistle, as well). That first set I had needed a bit of variable squeezing to bring some notes close to where they should be. Intonation is a mystery on most instruments, and the hardest part to get right. A related issue is tone c
[NSP] Re: Intonation
Colin, are you using composite drone reeds or all-cane ones? Adjustment techniques will, of course differ. Whatever you're using, I'd check the drone itself as a priority, checking that everything is sealing correctly (tuning beads are often suspect), that the bore is clean and smooth, and that the tone hole is entirely free of any invisible debris or excess lubrication, which often accumulates invisibly there. Any of these deficiencies will cause instability. I have John Liestman's excellent book, but probably an earlier version than the one you mentioned, since I can't find the reed advice on those or adjacent pages. I do recall reading John's remarks about the parameters of stability (I think he calls that area the 'Plateau of Happiness' or something similar) and this may be in a subsequent edition or even in an NPS Magazine article. It's very good information. Of course, it is one thing to adjust a good reed and an entirely different matter to spend ages on a drone reed that does not work well and never will. Unfortunately some drone reeds are not worthy of that attention. Pitch of almost any woodwind reed will rise with pressure. The ideal reed behaviour for NSPs is one where pitch changes relatively little, and evenly, with all drone reeds and the chanter reed behaving similarly. That's a rare but not impossible situation, requiring not only skill but luck. I suspect that as much success comes from knowing when to reject a reed, as knowing when and how to adjust it. Francis On 11 Jan 2011, at 12:40, Colin and Cheryl McNaught wrote: > Following on from these sage comments, does anyone have ideas about > what causes some drones to be significantly more pressure sensitive > than others. By this I mean their pitch varies more for a given change > in bag pressure. Once they are adjusted for pitch and pressure there > doesn't seem to be anything else to tweak without spoiling the > pitch/pressure set-ups. I have a set that is very stable and another > that has a couple of drones that aren't and would like to improve them. > > I always try to play other pipe sets when at NSP get-togethers and it's > been my experience that every set I have played has some quirky notes. >I'm sure there's a reed dependency in this too. Making small (often > unconscious) adjustments in bag pressure seems to be a part of playing > this instrument well (just as embouchure adjustments on, e.g. oboe, > flute). Consequently, a set of drones that is more stable can result > in a 'sweeter' end result than one that isn't. > > Colin (McNaught) > On Sat, Jan 8, 2011 at 7:05 PM, <[1]gibbonssoi...@aol.com> wrote: > > As many notes on an NSP chanter can be bent about a quarter tone > without putting the drones far out - at least on a good reed day - > I > guess one difference between a good piper and a fairly good one is > the > former will squeeze notes into tune unconsciously and accurately, > the > latter consciously and only fairly accurately. > I often think of singing the note, so I have an idea of the > pitch > in my head, to aim for. Listening to the chord with the drones - > if > these are in tune - also helps with some notes. It is the notes > that > harmonise with the drones which are most exposed if out of tune, > so > recognising a just 3rd or whatever tells you you've got there. The > singing trick doesn't work so well if you are still thinking > equal-tempered, mind. So chords are better. > Long notes are good practice for this - I wonder if this is > one > reason Tom Clough liked playing hymn tunes? 'Oh God our Help in > Ages > Past' (aka St Anne, or 'The Goldfish') is a good one for this, > dead > slow. > I sometimes use this to see if the drones are 'really' in tune. > When I started playing NSP after playing the flute for years, > my > embouchure would bend to try to bring notes in - ineffective of > itself, > but I found I was doing something useful as well, as the notes > came > more into tune (I pinched a non-existent thumbhole to get the top > octave on the whistle, as well). That first set I had needed a bit > of variable squeezing to bring some notes close to where they > should > be. > Intonation is a mystery on most instruments, and the hardest > part > to get right. A related issue is tone colour - finger vibrato > alters > the harmonics of a note substantially, changing the colour a lot; > pressure vibrato much less so. Taking a lower finger off the > chanter > may vary the pitch up or down, so you can use finger vibrato to > improve > the intonation as well as the colour. Or worsen the intonation, if > you > use the wrong finger. > Knowing which lower finger mov
[NSP] Re: Intonation
Thanks, I checked his book and it's pages 116 to 120 if anyone else is interested. Time to re-read it (pun intended). Colin On Tue, Jan 11, 2011 at 9:10 AM, Dave S <[1]david...@pt.lu> wrote: Hi, Years ago John Leistman wrote an article about balancing drone reeds, if you can find this article it will explain in great detail the why and wherefore of tuning drones --- and why each set is different. in short it's to do with the pressure each player uses and how and if they tune their drone reeds to the pressure they like to use to have their chanter "ring true" Dave S On 1/11/2011 1:40 PM, Colin and Cheryl McNaught wrote: Following on from these sage comments, does anyone have ideas about what causes some drones to be significantly more pressure sensitive than others. By this I mean their pitch varies more for a given change in bag pressure. Once they are adjusted for pitch and pressure there doesn't seem to be anything else to tweak without spoiling the pitch/pressure set-ups. I have a set that is very stable and another that has a couple of drones that aren't and would like to improve them. I always try to play other pipe sets when at NSP get-togethers and it's been my experience that every set I have played has some quirky notes. I'm sure there's a reed dependency in this too. Making small (often unconscious) adjustments in bag pressure seems to be a part of playing this instrument well (just as embouchure adjustments on, e.g. oboe, flute). Consequently, a set of drones that is more stable can result in a 'sweeter' end result than one that isn't. Colin (McNaught) On Sat, Jan 8, 2011 at 7:05 PM,<[1][2]gibbonssoi...@aol.com> wrote: As many notes on an NSP chanter can be bent about a quarter tone without putting the drones far out - at least on a good reed day - I guess one difference between a good piper and a fairly good one is the former will squeeze notes into tune unconsciously and accurately, the latter consciously and only fairly accurately. I often think of singing the note, so I have an idea of the pitch in my head, to aim for. Listening to the chord with the drones - if these are in tune - also helps with some notes. It is the notes that harmonise with the drones which are most exposed if out of tune, so recognising a just 3rd or whatever tells you you've got there. The singing trick doesn't work so well if you are still thinking equal-tempered, mind. So chords are better. Long notes are good practice for this - I wonder if this is one reason Tom Clough liked playing hymn tunes? 'Oh God our Help in Ages Past' (aka St Anne, or 'The Goldfish') is a good one for this, dead slow. I sometimes use this to see if the drones are 'really' in tune. When I started playing NSP after playing the flute for years, my embouchure would bend to try to bring notes in - ineffective of itself, but I found I was doing something useful as well, as the notes came more into tune (I pinched a non-existent thumbhole to get the top octave on the whistle, as well). That first set I had needed a bit of variable squeezing to bring some notes close to where they should be. Intonation is a mystery on most instruments, and the hardest part to get right. A related issue is tone colour - finger vibrato alters the harmonics of a note substantially, changing the colour a lot; pressure vibrato much less so. Taking a lower finger off the chanter may vary the pitch up or down, so you can use finger vibrato to improve the intonation as well as the colour. Or worsen the intonation, if you use the wrong finger. Knowing which lower finger moves which notes in which direction is something one ought to learn. I tend to use the same finger whatever, if it works. John -- To get on or off this list see list information at [2][3]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html -- References 1. mailto:[4]gibbonssoi...@aol.com 2. [5]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html - No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - [6]www.avg.com Version: 10.0.1191 / Virus Database: 1435/3372 - Release Date: 01/10/11 -- References 1. mailto:david...@pt.lu 2. mailto:gibbonssoi...@aol.com 3. http://www.cs.dartmouth
[NSP] Re: Intonation
Hi, Years ago John Leistman wrote an article about balancing drone reeds, if you can find this article it will explain in great detail the why and wherefore of tuning drones --- and why each set is different. in short it's to do with the pressure each player uses and how and if they tune their drone reeds to the pressure they like to use to have their chanter "ring true" Dave S On 1/11/2011 1:40 PM, Colin and Cheryl McNaught wrote: Following on from these sage comments, does anyone have ideas about what causes some drones to be significantly more pressure sensitive than others. By this I mean their pitch varies more for a given change in bag pressure. Once they are adjusted for pitch and pressure there doesn't seem to be anything else to tweak without spoiling the pitch/pressure set-ups. I have a set that is very stable and another that has a couple of drones that aren't and would like to improve them. I always try to play other pipe sets when at NSP get-togethers and it's been my experience that every set I have played has some quirky notes. I'm sure there's a reed dependency in this too. Making small (often unconscious) adjustments in bag pressure seems to be a part of playing this instrument well (just as embouchure adjustments on, e.g. oboe, flute). Consequently, a set of drones that is more stable can result in a 'sweeter' end result than one that isn't. Colin (McNaught) On Sat, Jan 8, 2011 at 7:05 PM,<[1]gibbonssoi...@aol.com> wrote: As many notes on an NSP chanter can be bent about a quarter tone without putting the drones far out - at least on a good reed day - I guess one difference between a good piper and a fairly good one is the former will squeeze notes into tune unconsciously and accurately, the latter consciously and only fairly accurately. I often think of singing the note, so I have an idea of the pitch in my head, to aim for. Listening to the chord with the drones - if these are in tune - also helps with some notes. It is the notes that harmonise with the drones which are most exposed if out of tune, so recognising a just 3rd or whatever tells you you've got there. The singing trick doesn't work so well if you are still thinking equal-tempered, mind. So chords are better. Long notes are good practice for this - I wonder if this is one reason Tom Clough liked playing hymn tunes? 'Oh God our Help in Ages Past' (aka St Anne, or 'The Goldfish') is a good one for this, dead slow. I sometimes use this to see if the drones are 'really' in tune. When I started playing NSP after playing the flute for years, my embouchure would bend to try to bring notes in - ineffective of itself, but I found I was doing something useful as well, as the notes came more into tune (I pinched a non-existent thumbhole to get the top octave on the whistle, as well). That first set I had needed a bit of variable squeezing to bring some notes close to where they should be. Intonation is a mystery on most instruments, and the hardest part to get right. A related issue is tone colour - finger vibrato alters the harmonics of a note substantially, changing the colour a lot; pressure vibrato much less so. Taking a lower finger off the chanter may vary the pitch up or down, so you can use finger vibrato to improve the intonation as well as the colour. Or worsen the intonation, if you use the wrong finger. Knowing which lower finger moves which notes in which direction is something one ought to learn. I tend to use the same finger whatever, if it works. John -- To get on or off this list see list information at [2]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html -- References 1. mailto:gibbonssoi...@aol.com 2. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html - No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 10.0.1191 / Virus Database: 1435/3372 - Release Date: 01/10/11
[NSP] Re: Intonation
Following on from these sage comments, does anyone have ideas about what causes some drones to be significantly more pressure sensitive than others. By this I mean their pitch varies more for a given change in bag pressure. Once they are adjusted for pitch and pressure there doesn't seem to be anything else to tweak without spoiling the pitch/pressure set-ups. I have a set that is very stable and another that has a couple of drones that aren't and would like to improve them. I always try to play other pipe sets when at NSP get-togethers and it's been my experience that every set I have played has some quirky notes. I'm sure there's a reed dependency in this too. Making small (often unconscious) adjustments in bag pressure seems to be a part of playing this instrument well (just as embouchure adjustments on, e.g. oboe, flute). Consequently, a set of drones that is more stable can result in a 'sweeter' end result than one that isn't. Colin (McNaught) On Sat, Jan 8, 2011 at 7:05 PM, <[1]gibbonssoi...@aol.com> wrote: As many notes on an NSP chanter can be bent about a quarter tone without putting the drones far out - at least on a good reed day - I guess one difference between a good piper and a fairly good one is the former will squeeze notes into tune unconsciously and accurately, the latter consciously and only fairly accurately. I often think of singing the note, so I have an idea of the pitch in my head, to aim for. Listening to the chord with the drones - if these are in tune - also helps with some notes. It is the notes that harmonise with the drones which are most exposed if out of tune, so recognising a just 3rd or whatever tells you you've got there. The singing trick doesn't work so well if you are still thinking equal-tempered, mind. So chords are better. Long notes are good practice for this - I wonder if this is one reason Tom Clough liked playing hymn tunes? 'Oh God our Help in Ages Past' (aka St Anne, or 'The Goldfish') is a good one for this, dead slow. I sometimes use this to see if the drones are 'really' in tune. When I started playing NSP after playing the flute for years, my embouchure would bend to try to bring notes in - ineffective of itself, but I found I was doing something useful as well, as the notes came more into tune (I pinched a non-existent thumbhole to get the top octave on the whistle, as well). That first set I had needed a bit of variable squeezing to bring some notes close to where they should be. Intonation is a mystery on most instruments, and the hardest part to get right. A related issue is tone colour - finger vibrato alters the harmonics of a note substantially, changing the colour a lot; pressure vibrato much less so. Taking a lower finger off the chanter may vary the pitch up or down, so you can use finger vibrato to improve the intonation as well as the colour. Or worsen the intonation, if you use the wrong finger. Knowing which lower finger moves which notes in which direction is something one ought to learn. I tend to use the same finger whatever, if it works. John -- To get on or off this list see list information at [2]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html -- References 1. mailto:gibbonssoi...@aol.com 2. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: Intonation
On 8 Jan 2011, gibbonssoi...@aol.com wrote: >Long notes are good practice for this - I wonder if this is one >reason Tom Clough liked playing hymn tunes? 'Oh God our Help in Ages >Past' (aka St Anne, or 'The Goldfish') is a good one for this, dead >slow. Tommy Breckons told me that Clough used "Drink to me only" for this type of thing, also for hearing the "ghostly third" on the drones. Julia To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: Intonation
As many notes on an NSP chanter can be bent about a quarter tone without putting the drones far out - at least on a good reed day - I guess one difference between a good piper and a fairly good one is the former will squeeze notes into tune unconsciously and accurately, the latter consciously and only fairly accurately. I often think of singing the note, so I have an idea of the pitch in my head, to aim for. Listening to the chord with the drones - if these are in tune - also helps with some notes. It is the notes that harmonise with the drones which are most exposed if out of tune, so recognising a just 3rd or whatever tells you you've got there. The singing trick doesn't work so well if you are still thinking equal-tempered, mind. So chords are better. Long notes are good practice for this - I wonder if this is one reason Tom Clough liked playing hymn tunes? 'Oh God our Help in Ages Past' (aka St Anne, or 'The Goldfish') is a good one for this, dead slow. I sometimes use this to see if the drones are 'really' in tune. When I started playing NSP after playing the flute for years, my embouchure would bend to try to bring notes in - ineffective of itself, but I found I was doing something useful as well, as the notes came more into tune (I pinched a non-existent thumbhole to get the top octave on the whistle, as well). That first set I had needed a bit of variable squeezing to bring some notes close to where they should be. Intonation is a mystery on most instruments, and the hardest part to get right. A related issue is tone colour - finger vibrato alters the harmonics of a note substantially, changing the colour a lot; pressure vibrato much less so. Taking a lower finger off the chanter may vary the pitch up or down, so you can use finger vibrato to improve the intonation as well as the colour. Or worsen the intonation, if you use the wrong finger. Knowing which lower finger moves which notes in which direction is something one ought to learn. I tend to use the same finger whatever, if it works. John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
