[SLUG] Doing a demo of Ubuntu at my place of work
Hi all, The company I have been working at now (for a bit over 6 mths now) is a largish (~$150Mil/year) national IT company deal in everything from Hardware, Software and services. But...very Windows centric much to my disappointment. Needless to say word has spread in the Office I am ..the Linux guy The Owner of the company has gave Linux thought and some how was tipped over the edge recently and called a meeting with a few key staff members hers and . me. So I am now doing a demo of Ubuntu in the Friday morning sales meeting! Any tips or points for catching the attention of mostly IT 'dumb' ales staff ? I am thinking Beryl/Compiz, the mention of no spyware and viruses and the backing of big name companies like Dell, IBM and Novell. Any advice welcome; really want to do the best for Linux and open source here and get it into this company. Thanks -- -- Regards David -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Doing a demo of Ubuntu at my place of work
David Ward wrote: Any tips or points for catching the attention of mostly IT 'dumb' ales staff ? I am thinking Beryl/Compiz, the mention of no spyware and viruses and the backing of big name companies like Dell, IBM and Novell. Beryl/Compiz is of no use to sales persons. Find out quickly what sofware they are using and look around for some applications that they can use as alternatives if they were running under Ubuntu. Demo those. Open Office naturally comes to mind with presentations, word processing - PDF and spreadsheets. If they use web absed apps show that these will run under Firefox. Be fair and show the problems that can arise e.g. transfering complex Word docs back and forth. Mike -- Michael Lake Computational Research Support Unit Science Faculty, UTS Ph: 9514 2238 -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Doing a demo of Ubuntu at my place of work
On Tue, 2007-04-17 at 17:30 +1000, David Ward wrote: Hi all, The Owner of the company has gave Linux thought and some how was tipped over the edge recently and called a meeting with a few key staff members hers and . me. So I am now doing a demo of Ubuntu in the Friday morning sales meeting! Any tips or points for catching the attention of mostly IT 'dumb' ales staff ? I am thinking Beryl/Compiz, the mention of no spyware and viruses and the backing of big name companies like Dell, IBM and Novell. Any advice welcome; really want to do the best for Linux and open source here and get it into this company. The big one for lots of people is virii, but it's really hard to convince them that they don't need Mr.Norton. If you just blandly tell them that virus isn't a problem, it won't sink in. If you can convert time/effort for virus protection into dollars, that might help. Lots of windows users are convinced that the reason all the virus's affect Windows is because of the 95% factor. Last figures I read were - 64000 Windows viruses, 40 Mac viruses, 20 Linux viruses. I have no idea if it's right, but it sounds good and it blows apart the 95% factor ;-) You could try spelling out all the well publicised virii that you were able to happily not worry about. A lot will depend on what they use the computers for: web apps? database? fileserving? Word processing? If you are personally using your machine for everything the company needs, then just go through your typical day in front of them. There's nothing like seeing it work. Another nice touch is to do an #apt-get install - think of something cute and useful. It can be pretty impressive. Pointy Heads worry about support. Hey, when was the last time you tried to get support from Microsoft!!! List several reputable linux support companies in Sydney. It isn't hard to do. I often impress people by telling them that Google runs on linux. That has a pretty good wow(tm) factor. -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Doing a demo of Ubuntu at my place of work
On Tue, 17 Apr 2007, david [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Another nice touch is to do an #apt-get install - think of something cute and useful. It can be pretty impressive. I don't think you would want to scare off people with a command line. If you want to show it, also back it up with how easy it is to do the same thing in a GUI tool like Synaptic. -- If you have any access to a [Windows] system, you can likely gain administrative access. - Mark Burnett, SecurityFocus, 2005-02-23 pgpThm2UClogD.pgp Description: PGP signature -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Doing a demo of Ubuntu at my place of work
On Tue, 17 Apr 2007, Michael Lake [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: David Ward wrote: Any tips or points for catching the attention of mostly IT 'dumb' ales staff ? I am thinking Beryl/Compiz, the mention of no spyware and viruses and the backing of big name companies like Dell, IBM and Novell. Beryl/Compiz is of no use to sales persons. Maybe not, but they look pretty. Polish and glitter are important parts of any end-user oriented technology. Be fair and show the problems that can arise e.g. transfering complex Word docs back and forth. Being truthful is good. OpenOffice can handle most Word files thrown at it, and it probably has even better support for older Word formats than modern versions of Office. However, if someone is expecting it to fully support Word macros then they are going to be sorely disappointed. -- Even before enabling the servers, Windows based machines contain numerous exploitable holes allowing attackers to not only access the system but also execute arbitrary code. ... The UNIX and Linux variants present a much more robust exterior to the outside. Even when the pre-configured server binaries are enabled, each system generally maintained its integrity against remote attacks. - Matthew Vea, 2006 Operating System Vulnerability Summary, 2007-03-26 pgpildinLo5J0.pgp Description: PGP signature -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Doing a demo of Ubuntu at my place of work
On Tue, 17 Apr 2007, David Ward [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi all, The company I have been working at now (for a bit over 6 mths now) is a largish (~$150Mil/year) national IT company deal in everything from Hardware, Software and services. But...very Windows centric much to my disappointment. Needless to say word has spread in the Office I am ..the Linux guy The Owner of the company has gave Linux thought and some how was tipped over the edge recently and called a meeting with a few key staff members hers and . me. So I am now doing a demo of Ubuntu in the Friday morning sales meeting! Any tips or points for catching the attention of mostly IT 'dumb' ales staff ? I am thinking Beryl/Compiz, the mention of no spyware and viruses and the backing of big name companies like Dell, IBM and Novell. Any advice welcome; really want to do the best for Linux and open source here and get it into this company. You could send them to CeBIT[1], where there will be plenty of people talking about and demonstrating FOSS at the Linux Australia stand :) [1] http://www.cebit.com.au/ -- Tired of slowness, bugs, crashes, viruses, trojans, spyware, adware, malware... ? Take back your computer. http://www.whylinuxisbetter.net pgpv2rILPTHkD.pgp Description: PGP signature -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Doing a demo of Ubuntu at my place of work
On Tue, 17 Apr 2007, David Ward [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Any tips or points for catching the attention of mostly IT 'dumb' ales staff ? I am thinking Beryl/Compiz, the mention of no spyware and viruses and the backing of big name companies like Dell, IBM and Novell. People will feel intimidated if they feel that they have to give something up. Show them that this is not the case. There are plenty of ways to have Windows apps and FOSS co-exist peacefully, including: * running FOSS apps on Windows (e.g. Firefox, Thunderbird, OpenOffice) before trying Linux * dual-booting * virtualisation * WINE The important thing is to fully determine what they do with their computers, so that you can offer a total solution. There might be some things that just have to be done on Windows, but the rest might work fine on Linux. I'm currently preparing some handouts to give away at CeBIT. Here are some links from them: http://www.whylinuxisbetter.net/ http://www.getgnulinux.org/ http://makethemove.net/ http://www.dwheeler.com/oss_fs_why.html BTW, it's a little-known fact that for many people Thunderbird plus the Lightning extension can make a viable alternative to Outlook :) -- GNU/Linux: because I reboot less often than Windows users reinstall. pgpN1DGY030NH.pgp Description: PGP signature -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Doing a demo of Ubuntu at my place of work
On Tue, 17 Apr 2007 17:30:45 +1000 [EMAIL PROTECTED] (David Ward) wrote: Hi all, The company I have been working at now (for a bit over 6 mths now) is a largish (~$150Mil/year) national IT company deal in everything from Hardware, Software and services. But...very Windows centric much to my disappointment. Needless to say word has spread in the Office I am ..the Linux guy The Owner of the company has gave Linux thought and some how was tipped over the edge recently and called a meeting with a few key staff members hers and . me. So I am now doing a demo of Ubuntu in the Friday morning sales meeting! Any tips or points for catching the attention of mostly IT 'dumb' ales staff ? I am thinking Beryl/Compiz, the mention of no spyware and viruses and the backing of big name companies like Dell, IBM and Novell. Any advice welcome; really want to do the best for Linux and open source here and get it into this company. Thanks - Regards David oooh, what fun! For a sales meeting presentation for Linux, then use a sales approach! Slides demonstrating features and showing benefits of the feature. This is to show the *value* of the feature. eg feature may be Open Source, benefit is feature is ext3 file system, benefit is . suggestions for features / benefits please! Have a slide that benchmarks the two systems. ie make a table having columns with each choice (OS in this case) and rows describing qualities such as: Licence Fees ($) IT maintenance (hrs?) Downtime for installing new software (reboots, hrs?) Security (virii, permissions..?) Support (open vs closed source...) User base (web servers, Google...) Hardware requirements (older hardware...vs expensive new box to run vista) ...more suggestions of a benchmarking qualities, please! If each category can be expressed in $ or person-hrs then you have magic Total Cost of Ownership ! Be prepared for objections, which are really inquires for more information. eg: the code is public domain, so it can be cracked and is insecure answer: so your concern is security?explain Open Source model, use Apache as example of success. eg: so many distros, not just one distributor... answer: so your concern is ? (what is the real objection? usually security) eg: it can't do the same as such-and-such softwareeg desktop publisher software answer: what do you use this softw for? find appropriate soln or can use wine or a virtual machine. ...more suggestions of possible objection/solutions please!. Then close by putting it back to them to make a decision: what else is needed? when? thoughts on a trial? how big? how long? how to measure outcomes? criteria for success? ..more suggestions for closing, please!... - R -- Please, if possible, don't send me MS Word or Powerpoint attachments. Send plain text, rich text format, html, or pdf instead. Why? See: http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/sylvester-response.html -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Doing a demo of Ubuntu at my place of work
On 17/04/07, Sridhar Dhanapalan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, 17 Apr 2007, David Ward [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Any tips or points for catching the attention of mostly IT 'dumb' ales staff ? I am thinking Beryl/Compiz, the mention of no spyware and viruses and the backing of big name companies like Dell, IBM and Novell. People will feel intimidated if they feel that they have to give something up. In that light - maybe try to find out what they think Linux looks like before the show and if they expect it to be green-screen and lots of typing while they like to use the GUI to the limit then maybe stress the GUI options of Linux. --Amos -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
[SLUG] Bigpond NextG on Linux (Ubuntu)?
I've been using Telstra's Maxon CDMA for internet access while on the road - slow, semi-reliable. The Telstra phone bunnies are telling me it's time to upgrade to NextG. I've had a google around on Whirlpool, pulled up this Quozl's guide at [1], which seems to indicate it works; I'm interested in ppl's experiences before I take the plunge and submit myself to the next round of Telstra pain... [1] http://quozl.linux.org.au/bp3-usb/ -- Sonia Hamilton | GNU/Linux - 'free' as in | free speech, not free beer. -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Bigpond NextG on Linux (Ubuntu)?
I'm using the CDMA as well at the moment (2 Windows machines, 1 linux machine, 6 mac-based embedded devices), and I agree, slow and semi-reliable. At the moment I have to keep a permanent ping running to prevent the connection falling off. So while Quozl's information does seem sufficient, the result (at least for me) has not inspired huge trust in a reliable solution. HOWEVER, we have some NextG cards we're currently using on Windows (can't transition the Macs yet since the drivers are still too buggy for release) and I can tell you it's a world of difference. Connects in no time flat, quite responsive, decent data rate. And from my testing, better coverage in tight urban spaces. One of our CDMA modems is deep in an inner city shopping plaza inside a building, and only phones home about 6 out of the 24 times it should daily. The connection keeps falling off. In comparison, the NextG modem I tested on the laptop seemed to connect quite effortlessly. So nothing but good things so far with the network, at least in areas where you get the good towers. Haven't tried in country areas yet. So assuming you can get the device itself working and stable, by all means make the move. But if you can do be absolutely sure you can jump through the necessary hoops to get it working before you commit to moving. I won't be transitioning the linux server to the new network though, it's moving to some other weird connection into the Telstra WAN segment we're doing our stuff on. 1.5 meg and not before time :) Adam K Sonia Hamilton wrote: I've been using Telstra's Maxon CDMA for internet access while on the road - slow, semi-reliable. The Telstra phone bunnies are telling me it's time to upgrade to NextG. I've had a google around on Whirlpool, pulled up this Quozl's guide at [1], which seems to indicate it works; I'm interested in ppl's experiences before I take the plunge and submit myself to the next round of Telstra pain... [1] http://quozl.linux.org.au/bp3-usb/ -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Bigpond NextG on Linux (Ubuntu)?
On 2007.04.18 00:37 Adam Kennedy wrote: So nothing but good things so far with the network, at least in areas where you get the good towers. Haven't tried in country areas yet. Up our way (Mid North Coast) the response has been universal -- NextG is crap. Most who were coerced by Telstra into converting their mobiles are trying to convert back to CDMA. But, since Telstra hasn't listened to customers for three-quarters of a century, they are getting nowhere. Of course, if we **really** need reliable communications Telstra has this wonderful thing (read: prohibitively expensive and ssllooww) with satellites ... Robert Thorsby -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Doing a demo of Ubuntu at my place of work
Hi, My thoughts below: --- David Ward [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Any tips or points for catching the attention of mostly IT 'dumb' ales staff ? 1. A typical question will be, can we dual-boot windoze and Ubuntu, initially? Need to give them time to migrate. 2. Do you want to give a demo of Samba? 3. Mention the important of open documentation standards (.odp or .pdf), and use of Openoffice for their day-to-day activites. 4. Network printing support demo will be helpful. 5. Firefox or Iceweasel browser that they can use. 6. For IT folks, they will want to run both windoze and GNU/Linux servers until they fully migrate. You might want to give them time for the learning curve. 7. Can show demo of different services (FTP, ssh, cvs, backups etc.), and how to use it on Ubuntu. 8. If IT doesn't know scripting, they might not appreciate the power of scripting, initially. If you can demo some scripts, it will be helpful. 9. Demo of USB support, some external hard-disk. Most of them don't know that it is plug-and-play. 10. Demo of Live-CD for rescue purpose. I am thinking Beryl/Compiz, the mention of no spyware and viruses and the backing of big name companies like Dell, IBM and Novell. Red Hat, HP, Google, Yahoo. Regards, SK -- Shakthi Kannan http://www.shakthimaan.com __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
[SLUG] Linux users in Canberra and photography
Hi Slug, Is there a users group in Canberra? I am a photography student at ANU. Issues with colour management has come up recently in my work flow. I want to have some recommendations on a) how to calibrate my Flat Screen NVidia Monitor? b) what kind of screen monitor calibration tools should I use and what software? c) how do I calibrate my HP Photosmart 7760 Printer to give a very close print to what I see on my screen? My computer is an Asus A6T Series Gaming Laptop. I am running Suse Linux 10.2 on this machine. Are there anyone who can give advice or have set up colour management for photography using a linux set up? You need not rush with replies, as I will be on vacation for a month. However, any info is welcome, eg. howtos, websites, even contacts other photographers working with linux would be welcome. Thanks Snappy Sharon. Sharon Doig in Canberra - Australia E: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Make your mark and achieve success or, if need be, die in the attempt. Miriam Leslie Send instant messages to your online friends http://au.messenger.yahoo.com -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Doing a demo of Ubuntu at my place of work
On Tue, 17 Apr 2007, Shakthi Kannan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 3. Mention the important of open documentation standards (.odp or .pdf), and use of Openoffice for their day-to-day activites. You should stress the importance of open standards, as well as open source, and how well they go together. Open standards ensures long-term data independence for the business, and makes switching between software and operating systems much more trivial. -- I don't see why we need to stand by and watch a country go communist due to the irresponsibility of its people. The issues are much too important for the Chilean voters to be left to decide for themselves. - Henry Kissinger, regarding Salvador Allende's election in Chile pgpC1MkX6dMAC.pgp Description: PGP signature -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Doing a demo of Ubuntu at my place of work
david wrote: On Tue, 2007-04-17 at 17:30 +1000, David Ward wrote: Hi all, The Owner of the company has gave Linux thought and some how was tipped over the edge recently and called a meeting with a few key staff members hers and . me. snip If you can convert time/effort for virus protection into dollars, that might help. Lots of windows users are convinced that the reason all the virus's affect Windows is because of the 95% factor. Last figures I read were - 64000 Windows viruses, 40 Mac viruses, 20 Linux viruses. I have no idea if it's right, but it sounds good and it blows apart the 95% factor ;-) You could try spelling out all the well publicised virii that you were able to happily not worry about. snip Viruses were certainly the driver for my own switch to Linux and you could do the simple sums of cost of virus software downtime to do whatever it is you do to prevent them effectiveness of this approach/projected cost/opportunity cost over the next 5 years :-) You might also have to talk about Open source and in my view, Apache is the pinup of Open Source and the Web. April 2007 Web Server Survey In the April 2007 survey we received responses from 113,658,468 sites, an increase of 3.2 million sites from last month's survey. Apache continues to be the most widely-used web server, powering more than 66.9 million sites, compared to 35.3 million sites using Microsoft server software. http://news.netcraft.com/archives/web_server_survey.html PC based Applications are real practical issue. But the reality is that most people use browsing/email/WP/Spreadsheets/Presentation software. Most people in large organisations have little understanding of networks or even operating systems so, I agree with the posting about showing them Google. Ofcourse Browser interfaced applications are a non issue. And don't forget there are different audiences - the Mac lovers who have fought of the PC people for years, the accountants and bean counters, the innovators who are frustrated with the IT departmentand ofcourse existing license/support/maintenance agreements some are alies some are foes. Depends how well they are serving the organisation at present. The project would have to consider document/email conversion and ofcourse the actual upgrade process. Not sure where people stand on dual operation, but I think people have to go cold turkey and feel the pain for a little while. There are ofcourse different flavours of Linux and the issue of support would also come up. Are there any figures on installed base of each? Marghanita -- Marghanita da Cruz http://www.ramin.com.au/ Telephone: 0414-869202 -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Linux users in Canberra and photography
On Tue, 17 Apr 2007, Sharon Doig [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Is there a users group in Canberra? CLUG: http://www.clug.org.au/ They meet at your very own university :) I am a photography student at ANU. Issues with colour management has come up recently in my work flow. I want to have some recommendations on a) how to calibrate my Flat Screen NVidia Monitor calibration tools should I use and what software? If you have an Nvidia graphics card, and are using their proprietary drivers, you can use their nvidia-settings tool. c) how do I calibrate my HP Photosmart 7760 Printer to give a very close print to what I see on my screen? Try http://www.linux-foundation.org/en/OpenPrinting -- Tired of slowness, bugs, crashes, viruses, trojans, spyware, adware, malware... ? Take back your computer. http://www.whylinuxisbetter.net pgpvCKEiNY6vP.pgp Description: PGP signature -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Doing a demo of Ubuntu at my place of work
On 18/04/07, Sridhar Dhanapalan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, 17 Apr 2007, Shakthi Kannan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 3. Mention the important of open documentation standards (.odp or .pdf), and use of Openoffice for their day-to-day activites. You should stress the importance of open standards, as well as open source, and how well they go together. Open standards ensures long-term data independence for the business, and makes switching between software and operating systems much more trivial. I'm not sure how many points will he get for stressing open standards - remember where the people he's going to talk to are (expected to) come from: All they'll care about is that they'll be able to keep reading and writing documents which already exist in the system and send/received with their outside contacts, with as little disruption to the office work as possible during and after the transition period. The bottom line, IMHO, is that they'll care much more about inter-operability with MS stuff (documents, Exchange or its replacement, web sites, etc) than about standard document formats which should be readable ten years later. Being able to read documents ten years from now might be an understandable argument for people like you and me, who understand the technical issues, maybe have a historical perspective of the technology/internet world over the past 20 years, and know that there is an alternative, but for the average office user and even average office IT worker they hardly have a meaning. Just my 0.02$. Cheers, --Amos -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Doing a demo of Ubuntu at my place of work
On Tue, Apr 17, 2007 at 05:33:35PM +1000, Michael Lake wrote: Beryl/Compiz is of no use to sales persons. Find out quickly what sofware they are using and look around for some applications that they can use as alternatives if they were running under Ubuntu. Demo those. Michael hit the nail on the head. Most medium-large businesses are interested in Linux and FOSS because of potential cost reductions in infrastructure. To a business, bling like Compiz is a flashy distraction that doesn't add significant value to the software stack. Show them how to emulate their existing environment with FOSS. Work out what software they're using and find Linux equivalents. For things that you can't find equivalents for, show them Windows Terminal Services support. Focus on the basics. FOSS usually betters equivalent Windows software in this field. Show web browsers, email, IM, office apps - the things people use day in day out in the business. Software speaks louder than words - show them the system in action! If you feel you need slides, run your demo from OpenOffice. If you're feeling adventurous, try integrating the presentation into parts of the system you're demoing (a web page in Firefox with key points, a Tomboy note, an email you sent yourself in Evolution, an SVG you knocked up in Inkscape - the sky's your limit). My suggested attack plan: - show the basics (web browsers, email, office, etc) - show the volume of software available (synaptic is your friend here!) - show integration with existing infrastructure (terminal services, emulation, virtualisation) - explain to them that while the software is free, it's going to be a big commitment to go down the FOSS path - give them LiveCDs to play around with Be fair and show the problems that can arise e.g. transfering complex Word docs back and forth. Be pragmatic and realistic as possible. Admit shortcomings Start small and focus on one area that you *know* you can excel in. Once you have success there, move up to something a bit bigger. It's the domino effect, baby. Lindsay -- http://slug.org.au/ (the Sydney Linux Users Group) http://holmwood.id.au/~lindsay/ (me) -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Bigpond NextG on Linux (Ubuntu)?
Robert Thorsby wrote: On 2007.04.18 00:37 Adam Kennedy wrote: So nothing but good things so far with the network, at least in areas where you get the good towers. Haven't tried in country areas yet. Up our way (Mid North Coast) the response has been universal -- NextG is crap. Most who were coerced by Telstra into converting their mobiles are trying to convert back to CDMA. I should probably add that my comments ONLY apply to the use of NextG for data with those USB NextG modems. If we're talking mobile phones on NextG, I've switched from Vodafone (paid by me) to NextG (paid by company) and the Motorola Razr whateveritis phones (that I'm told are the best of a bad lot) are horrid. It has quite possible the worst user interface I've ever seen on a mobile device. What the hell were the designers thinking. Adam K -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Bigpond NextG on Linux (Ubuntu)?
Adam Kennedy wrote: If we're talking mobile phones on NextG, I've switched from Vodafone (paid by me) to NextG (paid by company) and the Motorola Razr whateveritis phones (that I'm told are the best of a bad lot) are horrid. It has quite possible the worst user interface I've ever seen on a mobile device. What the hell were the designers thinking. I trialed a Motorola L6 for about a week and its UI was considerably worse than my ancient Nokia. I work with a womain who messes about with a lot of phones (part of her job) and she says that the Nokia UIs are *way* better than that of other mobile phone brands. Erik -- +---+ Erik de Castro Lopo +---+ The plural of anecdotes is not data. -- Lee Revell on LAD mailing list -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
[SLUG] RE:Bigpond NextG on Linux (Ubuntu)?
Don't know about 3G or using mobile phone's for Net access, but I too had a CDMA phone ( transferred from GSM for better reception 3 years ago after moving home)., and none of the following is really relevant to the above post. When I received Telstra's email re discontinuance of CDMA I did a LOT of research re carriers and phones. Discovered on Telstra's web site that they had FREE handset ( 2 choices) for CDMA Customers to switch to GSM.. I got a Sagem Myc2-3 handset for Free, had my phone number swapped and even had my prepaid expirey extended by 2 years. Telstra obviously desperate to keep customers. Deal now gone - handset costs $50 now. Thought Sagem phone was crap because I couldn't hear ring-tone, but discovered that some included tones were much louder than others. Switched tones and am now keeping phone for present. Sagem phone has Net access etc, none of which I use as I only utilise phone for receiving calls. Definitely don't need 3G, even when it soon becomes available as pre-paid. Telstra assured me that GSM will be around for a long while ( if you believe that, then you'll believe anything). Just posted this for info as it may suit some people as an interim FREE solution while they investigate other alternatives. Also, swapped my Mum to Virgin prepaid as she makes only a few short calls a week, and Telstra have halved their pre-paid periods ( effectively doubling the price for low-usage customers). Bill Subject: [SLUG] Bigpond NextG on Linux (Ubuntu)? From: Sonia Hamilton [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2007 22:21:24 +1000 To: slug@slug.org.au To: slug@slug.org.au I've been using Telstra's Maxon CDMA for internet access while on the road - slow, semi-reliable. The Telstra phone bunnies are telling me it's time to upgrade to NextG. I've had a google around on Whirlpool, pulled up this Quozl's guide at [1], which seems to indicate it works; I'm interested in ppl's experiences before I take the plunge and submit myself to the next round of Telstra pain... [1] http://quozl.linux.org.au/bp3-usb/ -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] RE:Bigpond NextG on Linux (Ubuntu)?
On Wed, 18 Apr 2007 11:33:02 +1000 bill [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Don't know about 3G or using mobile phone's for Net access, but I too had a CDMA phone ( transferred from GSM for better reception 3 years ago after moving home)., and none of the following is really relevant to the above post. SNIP Also, swapped my Mum to Virgin prepaid as she makes only a few short calls a week, and Telstra have halved their pre-paid periods ( effectively doubling the price for low-usage customers). so that it now costs $15/month even if you don't use the damned things at all! I haven't tried this yet, but it looks very interesting: http://www.ecomtel.com.au/cgi-bin/go/web?rm=mobilekey=pings They use the Telstra network. You buy a block of minutes and can share them over multiple phones anytime for six months. Cheers (and bugger Telstra), Alan Bill Subject: [SLUG] Bigpond NextG on Linux (Ubuntu)? From: Sonia Hamilton [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2007 22:21:24 +1000 To: slug@slug.org.au To: slug@slug.org.au I've been using Telstra's Maxon CDMA for internet access while on the road - slow, semi-reliable. The Telstra phone bunnies are telling me it's time to upgrade to NextG. I've had a google around on Whirlpool, pulled up this Quozl's guide at [1], which seems to indicate it works; I'm interested in ppl's experiences before I take the plunge and submit myself to the next round of Telstra pain... [1] http://quozl.linux.org.au/bp3-usb/ -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html -- Alan L Tyreehttp://www2.austlii.edu.au/~alan Tel: +61 2 4782 2670Mobile: +61 427 486 206 Fax: +61 2 4782 7092FWD: 615662 -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Doing a demo of Ubuntu at my place of work
On Wed, Apr 18, 2007 at 12:07:08PM +1000, Howard Lowndes wrote: Be pragmatic and realistic as possible. Admit shortcomings Start small and focus on one area that you *know* you can excel in. Once you have success there, move up to something a bit bigger. There are two issues here: a) using open source applications and b) using open standards. Why not use OOo but with .doc and .xls as the default Save options until such time as a more urgent need to move to open standards appears on the horizon. For a lot of businesses this is a perfectly reasonable choice. It's insane to try and do a clean cut to OpenDocument or any other document format without piloting it first. You wouldn't do a clean switch to MS Office and MS formats from OpenOffice and OpenDocument, and vice versa. You build familiarity with the software, and then focus on changing data formats for the right reasons. Small moves. However, there is an urgent business need for open standards, and that's vendor lock-in. (that's a topic for a whole other thread though :-) Lindsay -- http://slug.org.au/ (the Sydney Linux Users Group) http://holmwood.id.au/~lindsay/ (me) -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] An interesting thought on virus liability
On 18/04/07, Howard Lowndes [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I am thinking that I should recommend to my client that he maintains a dedicated PC under engineering control for the purpose of these transfers. What are your thoughts. Sounds reasonable. Maybe it's worth checking on pilot forums on how others address this. It reminds me hearing from an ex-MS employee that the only way MS managed to burn gold CD's without getting them infected by viruses was to use Solaris machines for that task... --Amos -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
[SLUG] Re: [LINK] An interesting thought on virus liability
Howard Lowndes wrote: My concern is that I don't believe the problem of possible database corruption in the transfer process due to an introduced virus has been addressed and given the potential for a corrupted database resulting in a catastrophic incident, I find the thought disturbing. I am thinking that I should recommend to my client that he maintains a dedicated PC under engineering control for the purpose of these transfers. What are your thoughts. How long is a piece of string? What is the intent of the person who wrote the virus? Your concern is valid since it is possible for a virus to do *anything*. Ask youself what is the possibility of a virus being written with the intent of corrupting a database. What purpose would it serve? There is another possibly, and this happens far more often. Many viruses are copied and adapted by kiddies who wouldn't know a stack overflow from an easter egg. Their viruses have unintended consequences and these are the real worry. They could unintentionally alter the memory management or buffer pool used by a database causing data corruption. I shudder to think what would happen to an aviation guidance system if there were even a few bytes of control or program data accidentally corrupted as the side effect of a virus. cheers rickw -- _ Rick Welykochy || Praxis Services Windows accelerator: G*m1*m2/r^2 -- with apologies to John Clear -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
[SLUG] Amaya
I'm running Debian Sid and trying to install Amaya. Well, easy to install, of course, but when I try to run it: [EMAIL PROTECTED]:~$ amaya 12:59:19: Deleted stale lock file '/home/alant/.amaya-alant'. Xlib: extension GLX missing on display :0.0. Xlib: extension GLX missing on display :0.0. Xlib: extension GLX missing on display :0.0. FATAL ERROR : Your OpenGL implementation does not support needed features! Xlib: extension GLX missing on display :0.0. *** Amaya: Irrecoverable error ***Segmentation fault I don't find this to informative. What packages do I need to make this fly? Thanks, Alan -- Alan L Tyreehttp://www2.austlii.edu.au/~alan Tel: +61 2 4782 2670Mobile: +61 427 486 206 Fax: +61 2 4782 7092FWD: 615662 -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
recommended internet wireless (was: [SLUG] Bigpond NextG on Linux (Ubuntu)?)
* On Wed, Apr 18, 2007 at 06:52:40AM +1000, Robert Thorsby wrote: Up our way (Mid North Coast) the response has been universal -- NextG is crap. Most who were coerced by Telstra into converting their mobiles are trying to convert back to CDMA. But, since Telstra hasn't listened to customers for three-quarters of a century, they are getting nowhere. Well, I want it mainly for Sydney use and very occasionally outside Sydney (and I could use internet cafes), so I might look at other solutions. Anyone got any thumbs up/down on wireless internet services for Linux (eg unwired.com.au, iBurst)? -- Sonia Hamilton | GNU/Linux - 'free' as in | free speech, not free beer. -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Amaya
On Wed, Apr 18, 2007 at 01:06:12PM +1000, Alan L Tyree wrote: I'm running Debian Sid and trying to install Amaya. Well, easy to install, of course, but when I try to run it: [EMAIL PROTECTED]:~$ amaya 12:59:19: Deleted stale lock file '/home/alant/.amaya-alant'. Xlib: extension GLX missing on display :0.0. Xlib: extension GLX missing on display :0.0. Xlib: extension GLX missing on display :0.0. FATAL ERROR : Your OpenGL implementation does not support needed features! Xlib: extension GLX missing on display :0.0. *** Amaya: Irrecoverable error ***Segmentation fault I don't find this to informative. What packages do I need to make this fly? Looks like Amaya comes in a non-GL version; but you're using the GL version. Maybe Sid has the non-GL version packaged, or there is an option to use. You could also look into getting GL/DRI drivers for your graphics card, but that would be a longer and possibly unrewarding route. Matt -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Linux users in Canberra and photography
I shoot with analogue gear, and very rarely do any post-processing. But hopefully I can throw a few useful pointers out there. On Tue, 2007-04-17 at 23:29 +1000, Sharon Doig wrote: I am a photography student at ANU. Issues with colour management has come up recently in my work flow. I want to have some recommendations on a) how to calibrate my Flat Screen NVidia Monitor? b) what kind of screen monitor calibration tools should I use and what software? I use a manual method for gamma correction[1] using the xgamma utility that should be included with your distribution already. To the best of my knowledge, hardware devices like Spyders aren't supported under Linux at all. For full colour profiling, you should start by checking out little cms[2]. It provides utilities to help generate ICC colour profiles, which individual image editors are expected to know how to read (more often than not, they also use lcms to do so). As far as applications go, while GIMP is the posterchild for Linux image editing, I wouldn't recommend it for truly serious work. Mostly because it doesn't handle 16-bit channels. If that matters to you, then the best option at the moment seems to be CinePaint[3], which started life as a fork of GIMP aimed at motion picture editing. Browsing through Wikipedia's entry on linux colour management[4] can also be pretty constructive. c) how do I calibrate my HP Photosmart 7760 Printer to give a very close print to what I see on my screen? If you're not using the HPLIP[5] package for your printer, then you should be. It has full support for your model printer, including utilities for colour calibration. Browsing their documentation should set you on the right track. Are there anyone who can give advice or have set up colour management for photography using a linux set up? Incidentally, if there is, then I for one would love to see a SLUG talk about end-to-end digital photography workflow in Linux. Even something about managing large image libraries would be neat. [1] - http://applications.linux.com/article.pl?sid=05/02/07/2244242 is one reasonably good description. [2] - http://www.littlecms.com/ [3] - http://www.cinepaint.org/ [4] - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linux_color_management [5] - http://hplip.sourceforge.net/ Hope that helps, -- Pete -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: recommended internet wireless (was: [SLUG] Bigpond NextG on Linux (Ubuntu)?)
On Wed, 18 Apr 2007, Sonia Hamilton wrote: * On Wed, Apr 18, 2007 at 06:52:40AM +1000, Robert Thorsby wrote: Up our way (Mid North Coast) the response has been universal -- NextG is crap. Most who were coerced by Telstra into converting their mobiles are trying to convert back to CDMA. But, since Telstra hasn't listened to customers for three-quarters of a century, they are getting nowhere. Well, I want it mainly for Sydney use and very occasionally outside Sydney (and I could use internet cafes), so I might look at other solutions. Anyone got any thumbs up/down on wireless internet services for Linux (eg unwired.com.au, iBurst)? By far the best value and service stability (compared to unwired) I have found is with 3. $49.95 for 1GB of downloads on a HDPSA connection. Good coverage and linux compatible (2.6.19 kernel onwards however simple patch needed to identify card for previous versions of kernel). Fast connection, I got over 2MB/s with a broadband test. 3 also gives the modem away free if you have a 2 year contract or you pay $10 per month for modem on 1 year contract. I got recommended the service from a SLUG member. Regards -- Joseph Goncalves mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 66D6 71CF 87F9 6B17 6824 C692 9FF0 1DAF 7DAE E661 -- Bender: Tell the Donbot I'm quitting organized crime. From now on I'll stick to the regular kind. -- Sonia Hamilton | GNU/Linux - 'free' as in | free speech, not free beer. pgpgA446dX7IV.pgp Description: PGP signature -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: recommended internet wireless (was: [SLUG] Bigpond NextG on Linux (Ubuntu)?)
This one time, at band camp, Sonia Hamilton wrote: Anyone got any thumbs up/down on wireless internet services for Linux (eg unwired.com.au, iBurst)? The ethernet-based unwired modem works but the service is highly variable depending on your location. In some places it's great, others it's terrible. It has quite high latency. -- Rev Simon Rumble [EMAIL PROTECTED] www.rumble.net The surest way to make a monkey of a man is to quote him. - Robert Benchley -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: recommended internet wireless (was: [SLUG] Bigpond NextG on Linux (Ubuntu)?)
This one time, at band camp, Joseph Goncalves wrote: By far the best value and service stability (compared to unwired) I have found is with 3. $49.95 for 1GB of downloads on a HDPSA connection. Good coverage and linux compatible (2.6.19 kernel onwards however simple patch needed to identify card for previous versions of kernel). Fast connection, I got over 2MB/s with a broadband test. 3 also gives the modem away free if you have a 2 year contract or you pay $10 per month for modem on 1 year contract. I got recommended the service from a SLUG member. Yes for Sydney metro this seems like a very good deal. I plan to see if I can get it and use my existing 3G mobile over Bluetooth. Will see how I go. -- Rev Simon Rumble [EMAIL PROTECTED] www.rumble.net A politician is like a nappy. He should be changed regularly, and for the same reason - Column 8, Sydney Morning Herald -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: recommended internet wireless (was: [SLUG] Bigpond NextG on Linux (Ubuntu)?)
On 18/04/07, Rev Simon Rumble [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: This one time, at band camp, Joseph Goncalves wrote: By far the best value and service stability (compared to unwired) I have found is with 3. $49.95 for 1GB of downloads on a HDPSA connection. Good coverage and linux compatible (2.6.19 kernel onwards however simple patch needed to identify card for previous versions of kernel). Fast connection, I got over 2MB/s with a broadband test. 3 also gives the modem away free if you have a 2 year contract or you pay $10 per month for modem on 1 year contract. I got recommended the service from a SLUG member. Yes for Sydney metro this seems like a very good deal. I plan to see if I can get it and use my existing 3G mobile over Bluetooth. Will see how I go. Not just in Sydney Metro - IRCing from a bus halfway between Byron Bay and the Gold Coast is quite useful[1] too :) [1] for certain values of 'useful' -- There is nothing more worthy of contempt than a man who quotes himself - Zhasper, 2004 -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
[SLUG] RE:Bigpond NextG on Linux (Ubuntu)?
Hi Alan Thanks for the link. May be the way to go for me when Mum and I next need to top-up. Bill so that it now costs $15/month even if you don't use the damned things at all! I haven't tried this yet, but it looks very interesting: http://www.ecomtel.com.au/cgi-bin/go/web?rm=mobilekey=pings They use the Telstra network. You buy a block of minutes and can share them over multiple phones anytime for six months. Cheers (and bugger Telstra), Alan -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
[SLUG] Re: recommended internet wireless
Rev Simon Rumble wrote: This one time, at band camp, Sonia Hamilton wrote: Anyone got any thumbs up/down on wireless internet services for Linux (eg unwired.com.au, iBurst)? The ethernet-based unwired modem works but the service is highly variable depending on your location. In some places it's great, others it's terrible. It has quite high latency. Have to agree, I gave up on the unwired modem after struggling to get a reliable service about 18 months back. But things can change over time. I am very happy with my desktop I-Burst access bridge via a router for added security. Had good experience in both Sydney and Canberra with a couple of users on the ethernet LAN. It is shaped, so when you use up your quota you can buy more or just put up with a slow service until the end of the month - when it is reset. Marghanita -- Marghanita da Cruz http://www.ramin.com.au/ Telephone: 0414-869202 -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
[SLUG] P2P question re Stealthed Ports
I have emule set up and working OK - I just downloaded a Linux .iso torrent without problem though it was slower than I think it should be. I do realise that the download speed depends upon my settings. connection speed and number of available seeders I have the appropriate ports forwarded on my modem/router, but a check with a Security site shows them as being stealthed On the Web I found the following info:- -- An open port is a port which accepts incoming traffic. In order to use a service on a host, the port must be open. If the port is not open the service is unavailable. A closed port does not accept incoming traffic. If a client tries to connect to a closed port, the host sends back a message to the client. This way the client is notified that the host exists but that the port is closed. A stealth port does not accept incoming traffic. In contrast to a closed port, a stealth port does not report anything back to the client. As nothing is sent back to the client, the client can not tell whether there exists a host on the given IP or not. --- Am I correct in thinking that the statement A stealth port does not accept incoming traffic. refers to traffic originating elsewhere other than as a result of a request from my system? or should the appropriate ports be open rather than stealthed Thanks for info\references\links Bill -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
