Re: [Sugar-devel] Eager to work in fixing the UI of sugarizer.

[MR. OPTIMIST]

Thanks for your feedback sir !

On Sun, 19 Mar, 2023, 23:20 Lionel Laské,  wrote:

> Hi,
>
> Thanks for your suggestions.
> To optimize the process and avoid mail pollution, if you want to suggest
> some improvements, please open an issue here
>  (one by suggestion) and
> wait for our reply.
>
> However, to complete other answers from the list, I think that before
> doing suggestions you should take in consideration few things about
> Sugar/Sugarizer
> - It's targeted for children between 6 and 12, some of them can't read (so
> we tend to avoid "text") and some of them have never used a computer before
> (so applying what you think as "usual" icon is not necessarily a good idea).
> - It works both on computer and touch devices so concept of tooltip and
> cursor are not always appropriate
> - It was thought for children that could have visual disability so a
> colorful screen is not always the best thing to do
> - We expect that children could focus on activities so we tend to avoid
> multiple windows
>
> It's nice to have suggestions from beginners. By the way I tend to
> privilegiate suggestions coming from the field (children, teachers) from
> suggestions coming from tech guys.
> We're doing software for education, not for tech people.
>
> Regards.
>
>Lionel
>
>
> Le mer. 15 mars 2023 à 15:27, MR. OPTIMIST  a écrit :
>
>> Hello Lionel sir and sugar community,
>> I have proposed few changes to Sugarizer UI and I guess few
>> changes are worth adopting. I would be thankful if you once check the
>> document, if you find  that changes will actually make difference to the UI
>> and user experience then please give your feedback. So that i can
>> contribute to the proposed changes.
>> I have proposed changes and given them numerical identification and also
>> shared the document in editable format so you find any changes can be made
>> please give your feedback.
>>
>> Document link:: Click me to open !!
>> 
>>
>> Thank you.
>>
>> On Wed, Mar 15, 2023 at 1:22 AM James Cameron  wrote:
>>
>>> Thanks.  I looked at the document previously and saw some of the
>>> proposed changes are immediately suitable for being proposed in our usual
>>> workflow, but I'm not the person who will be approving the changes, so I
>>> won't be specific about them.
>>>
>>> I am maintainer of the GTK Implode activity, but your changes are for
>>> the Sugarizer version.
>>>
>>> On Tue, Mar 14, 2023 at 02:03:05AM +0530, MR. OPTIMIST wrote:
>>> > Hello James Cameron sir,
>>> >  Thanks for your feedback. I agree with you that sugar is an
>>> > educational  platform and it does not look like flooding things on the
>>> internet
>>> > but user experience plays a vital role in any of the platforms be it
>>> commercial
>>> > or non profitable. Just a simple question: will you use a phone with
>>> no broken
>>> > or no display, Same is user experience. So if we can improve, why
>>> shouldn't we
>>> > improve ?
>>> >
>>> > Also I would be thankful if you kindly let me know which of the
>>> proposed
>>> > changes seems to reasonable So that I can further proceed with further
>>> > contribution.
>>> > Proposed document link:-[1]click me to open
>>> >
>>> > On Tue, Mar 14, 2023 at 1:29 AM James Cameron <[2]qu...@laptop.org>
>>> wrote:
>>> >
>>> > Some of the changes proposed seem reasonable, but they aren't in
>>> the right
>>> > form for review; they need to be pull requests against the
>>> appropriate
>>> > repository.
>>> >
>>> > I don't think we're using the older design review committee
>>> process any
>>> > longer, and it should not be revived.  The pull request review
>>> process is
>>> > sufficient.  In the case of Sugarizer, that's the process that
>>> Lionel has
>>> > preferred.
>>> >
>>> > However, as someone who works in science research, the proposal
>>> does not
>>> > seem to have been researched, but is rather a collection of ideas
>>> that
>>> > would be suitable for changing Sugarizer using A/B testing for the
>>> goal of
>>> > increasing engagement and selling advertising.  Neither of these
>>> are
>>> > intended, it's an educational project.  Sugar and Sugarizer don't
>>> have to
>>> > look like everything else on the internet, and starting with that
>>> premise
>>> > is an error.
>>> >
>>> > On Mon, Mar 13, 2023 at 04:35:27PM +0530, MR. OPTIMIST wrote:
>>> > > Thanks Alex Sir,
>>> > > Your response to email is very much
>>> appreciated.
>>> > Sorry
>>> > > for the late reply.
>>> > >
>>> > > I love to mention that I have used sugarizer for many days and I
>>> also
>>> > know that
>>> > > its UI has been designed with the vision that it's gonna be used
>>> by
>>> > childrens.
>>> > > My point is that sugarizer was developed back in 2013 and the

Re: [Sugar-devel] Eager to work in fixing the UI of sugarizer.

[Lionel Laské]

Hi,

Thanks for your suggestions.
To optimize the process and avoid mail pollution, if you want to suggest
some improvements, please open an issue here
 (one by suggestion) and wait
for our reply.

However, to complete other answers from the list, I think that before doing
suggestions you should take in consideration few things about
Sugar/Sugarizer
- It's targeted for children between 6 and 12, some of them can't read (so
we tend to avoid "text") and some of them have never used a computer before
(so applying what you think as "usual" icon is not necessarily a good idea).
- It works both on computer and touch devices so concept of tooltip and
cursor are not always appropriate
- It was thought for children that could have visual disability so a
colorful screen is not always the best thing to do
- We expect that children could focus on activities so we tend to avoid
multiple windows

It's nice to have suggestions from beginners. By the way I tend to
privilegiate suggestions coming from the field (children, teachers) from
suggestions coming from tech guys.
We're doing software for education, not for tech people.

Regards.

   Lionel


Le mer. 15 mars 2023 à 15:27, MR. OPTIMIST  a écrit :

> Hello Lionel sir and sugar community,
> I have proposed few changes to Sugarizer UI and I guess few
> changes are worth adopting. I would be thankful if you once check the
> document, if you find  that changes will actually make difference to the UI
> and user experience then please give your feedback. So that i can
> contribute to the proposed changes.
> I have proposed changes and given them numerical identification and also
> shared the document in editable format so you find any changes can be made
> please give your feedback.
>
> Document link:: Click me to open !!
> 
>
> Thank you.
>
> On Wed, Mar 15, 2023 at 1:22 AM James Cameron  wrote:
>
>> Thanks.  I looked at the document previously and saw some of the proposed
>> changes are immediately suitable for being proposed in our usual workflow,
>> but I'm not the person who will be approving the changes, so I won't be
>> specific about them.
>>
>> I am maintainer of the GTK Implode activity, but your changes are for the
>> Sugarizer version.
>>
>> On Tue, Mar 14, 2023 at 02:03:05AM +0530, MR. OPTIMIST wrote:
>> > Hello James Cameron sir,
>> >  Thanks for your feedback. I agree with you that sugar is an
>> > educational  platform and it does not look like flooding things on the
>> internet
>> > but user experience plays a vital role in any of the platforms be it
>> commercial
>> > or non profitable. Just a simple question: will you use a phone with no
>> broken
>> > or no display, Same is user experience. So if we can improve, why
>> shouldn't we
>> > improve ?
>> >
>> > Also I would be thankful if you kindly let me know which of the proposed
>> > changes seems to reasonable So that I can further proceed with further
>> > contribution.
>> > Proposed document link:-[1]click me to open
>> >
>> > On Tue, Mar 14, 2023 at 1:29 AM James Cameron <[2]qu...@laptop.org>
>> wrote:
>> >
>> > Some of the changes proposed seem reasonable, but they aren't in
>> the right
>> > form for review; they need to be pull requests against the
>> appropriate
>> > repository.
>> >
>> > I don't think we're using the older design review committee process
>> any
>> > longer, and it should not be revived.  The pull request review
>> process is
>> > sufficient.  In the case of Sugarizer, that's the process that
>> Lionel has
>> > preferred.
>> >
>> > However, as someone who works in science research, the proposal
>> does not
>> > seem to have been researched, but is rather a collection of ideas
>> that
>> > would be suitable for changing Sugarizer using A/B testing for the
>> goal of
>> > increasing engagement and selling advertising.  Neither of these are
>> > intended, it's an educational project.  Sugar and Sugarizer don't
>> have to
>> > look like everything else on the internet, and starting with that
>> premise
>> > is an error.
>> >
>> > On Mon, Mar 13, 2023 at 04:35:27PM +0530, MR. OPTIMIST wrote:
>> > > Thanks Alex Sir,
>> > > Your response to email is very much
>> appreciated.
>> > Sorry
>> > > for the late reply.
>> > >
>> > > I love to mention that I have used sugarizer for many days and I
>> also
>> > know that
>> > > its UI has been designed with the vision that it's gonna be used
>> by
>> > childrens.
>> > > My point is that sugarizer was developed back in 2013 and the
>> internet
>> > > revolution at the time was very less in comparison to 2023. The
>> UI and Ux
>> > terms
>> > > were not that considerable at that time and everyone didn't had
>> access to
>> > the
>> > > mobile 

Re: [Sugar-devel] Eager to work in fixing the UI of sugarizer.

[MR. OPTIMIST]

Hello Lionel sir and sugar community,
I have proposed few changes to Sugarizer UI and I guess few
changes are worth adopting. I would be thankful if you once check the
document, if you find  that changes will actually make difference to the UI
and user experience then please give your feedback. So that i can
contribute to the proposed changes.
I have proposed changes and given them numerical identification and also
shared the document in editable format so you find any changes can be made
please give your feedback.

Document link:: Click me to open !!


Thank you.

On Wed, Mar 15, 2023 at 1:22 AM James Cameron  wrote:

> Thanks.  I looked at the document previously and saw some of the proposed
> changes are immediately suitable for being proposed in our usual workflow,
> but I'm not the person who will be approving the changes, so I won't be
> specific about them.
>
> I am maintainer of the GTK Implode activity, but your changes are for the
> Sugarizer version.
>
> On Tue, Mar 14, 2023 at 02:03:05AM +0530, MR. OPTIMIST wrote:
> > Hello James Cameron sir,
> >  Thanks for your feedback. I agree with you that sugar is an
> > educational  platform and it does not look like flooding things on the
> internet
> > but user experience plays a vital role in any of the platforms be it
> commercial
> > or non profitable. Just a simple question: will you use a phone with no
> broken
> > or no display, Same is user experience. So if we can improve, why
> shouldn't we
> > improve ?
> >
> > Also I would be thankful if you kindly let me know which of the proposed
> > changes seems to reasonable So that I can further proceed with further
> > contribution.
> > Proposed document link:-[1]click me to open
> >
> > On Tue, Mar 14, 2023 at 1:29 AM James Cameron <[2]qu...@laptop.org>
> wrote:
> >
> > Some of the changes proposed seem reasonable, but they aren't in the
> right
> > form for review; they need to be pull requests against the
> appropriate
> > repository.
> >
> > I don't think we're using the older design review committee process
> any
> > longer, and it should not be revived.  The pull request review
> process is
> > sufficient.  In the case of Sugarizer, that's the process that
> Lionel has
> > preferred.
> >
> > However, as someone who works in science research, the proposal does
> not
> > seem to have been researched, but is rather a collection of ideas
> that
> > would be suitable for changing Sugarizer using A/B testing for the
> goal of
> > increasing engagement and selling advertising.  Neither of these are
> > intended, it's an educational project.  Sugar and Sugarizer don't
> have to
> > look like everything else on the internet, and starting with that
> premise
> > is an error.
> >
> > On Mon, Mar 13, 2023 at 04:35:27PM +0530, MR. OPTIMIST wrote:
> > > Thanks Alex Sir,
> > > Your response to email is very much
> appreciated.
> > Sorry
> > > for the late reply.
> > >
> > > I love to mention that I have used sugarizer for many days and I
> also
> > know that
> > > its UI has been designed with the vision that it's gonna be used by
> > childrens.
> > > My point is that sugarizer was developed back in 2013 and the
> internet
> > > revolution at the time was very less in comparison to 2023. The UI
> and Ux
> > terms
> > > were not that considerable at that time and everyone didn't had
> access to
> > the
> > > mobile phones and internet, But as of now in 2023 the childrens
> from 1 or
> > even
> > > less than that start using technical devices and the UX is what
> first
> > thing
> > > that they interact with like games and other applications.So the
> UI of
> > > sugarizer is not matching with the need of today's generation which
> > reduces the
> > > user interest (research) to use the platform. So my point is we
> can work
> > to
> > > enhance its UI to meet today's need and increase the interaction
> time of
> > the
> > > users of our product.
> > >
> > > Considering my skills, I'm a second year engineering student and a
> self
> > > learner, I have done multiple projects on AI based applications and
> > developed 2
> > > websites as of now. To authenticate my words hereby i have listed
> all my
> > > projects in my github account and link of my github account is:-
> > > [1] [3]https://www.github/Anujverma89
> > >
> > > Considering what part of the product and UI can be modified to
> give new
> > user
> > > experience, I have done research and explained it in the given pdf
> you
> > can view
> > > it thoroughly.
> > > Here is the link :-
> > > [2]Click me to open !!
> > >
> > > Your suggestions on changeable topics(UI) will be highly
> 

Re: [Sugar-devel] Eager to work in fixing the UI of sugarizer.

[James Cameron]

Thanks.  I looked at the document previously and saw some of the proposed 
changes are immediately suitable for being proposed in our usual workflow, but 
I'm not the person who will be approving the changes, so I won't be specific 
about them.

I am maintainer of the GTK Implode activity, but your changes are for the 
Sugarizer version.

On Tue, Mar 14, 2023 at 02:03:05AM +0530, MR. OPTIMIST wrote:
> Hello James Cameron sir, 
>          Thanks for your feedback. I agree with you that sugar is an
> educational  platform and it does not look like flooding things on the 
> internet
> but user experience plays a vital role in any of the platforms be it 
> commercial
> or non profitable. Just a simple question: will you use a phone with no broken
> or no display, Same is user experience. So if we can improve, why shouldn't we
> improve ?   
> 
> Also I would be thankful if you kindly let me know which of the proposed
> changes seems to reasonable So that I can further proceed with further
> contribution.
> Proposed document link:-[1]click me to open
> 
> On Tue, Mar 14, 2023 at 1:29 AM James Cameron <[2]qu...@laptop.org> wrote:
> 
> Some of the changes proposed seem reasonable, but they aren't in the right
> form for review; they need to be pull requests against the appropriate
> repository.
> 
> I don't think we're using the older design review committee process any
> longer, and it should not be revived.  The pull request review process is
> sufficient.  In the case of Sugarizer, that's the process that Lionel has
> preferred.
> 
> However, as someone who works in science research, the proposal does not
> seem to have been researched, but is rather a collection of ideas that
> would be suitable for changing Sugarizer using A/B testing for the goal of
> increasing engagement and selling advertising.  Neither of these are
> intended, it's an educational project.  Sugar and Sugarizer don't have to
> look like everything else on the internet, and starting with that premise
> is an error.
> 
> On Mon, Mar 13, 2023 at 04:35:27PM +0530, MR. OPTIMIST wrote:
> > Thanks Alex Sir,
> >                         Your response to email is very much appreciated.
> Sorry
> > for the late reply.
> >
> > I love to mention that I have used sugarizer for many days and I also
> know that
> > its UI has been designed with the vision that it's gonna be used by
> childrens.
> > My point is that sugarizer was developed back in 2013 and the internet
> > revolution at the time was very less in comparison to 2023. The UI and 
> Ux
> terms
> > were not that considerable at that time and everyone didn't had access 
> to
> the
> > mobile phones and internet, But as of now in 2023 the childrens from 1 
> or
> even
> > less than that start using technical devices and the UX is what first
> thing
> > that they interact with like games and other applications.So the UI of
> > sugarizer is not matching with the need of today's generation which
> reduces the
> > user interest (research) to use the platform. So my point is we can work
> to
> > enhance its UI to meet today's need and increase the interaction time of
> the
> > users of our product.
> >
> > Considering my skills, I'm a second year engineering student and a self
> > learner, I have done multiple projects on AI based applications and
> developed 2
> > websites as of now. To authenticate my words hereby i have listed all my
> > projects in my github account and link of my github account is:- 
> > [1] [3]https://www.github/Anujverma89
> >
> > Considering what part of the product and UI can be modified to give new
> user
> > experience, I have done research and explained it in the given pdf you
> can view
> > it thoroughly.
> > Here is the link :-
> > [2]Click me to open !! 
> >
> > Your suggestions on changeable topics(UI) will be highly appreciated !! 
> > Thank You..
> >
> > On Sat, Mar 11, 2023 at 12:18 AM Alex Perez <[3][4]ape...@alexperez.com>
> wrote:
> >
> >     Anuj,
> >
> >     I appreciate your enthusiasm, and welcome. Before any UI re-design
> would be
> >     considered, we would require detailed written analysis of what the
> goals
> >     are for such a re-design, what's "wrong" with the current design, 
> and
> what
> >     your qualifications are for making what are largely subjective
> changes.
> >     While everyone has opinions on UI design, engineers are often
> infamous for
> >     designing awful user interfaces. Please share with us what sorts
> >     qualifications you possess that would qualify you to make UI design
> changes
> >     to Sugar/Sugarizer.
> >
> >     Have you ever used Sugar for more than a few hours, or a day? If so,
> which

Re: [Sugar-devel] Eager to work in fixing the UI of sugarizer.

[Chihurumnaya Ibiam]

The aim of sharing the design wiki page was to show you a design document
which contains lots of information,
yours doesn't have to be that way but it should give you an idea of what a
similar document should look like.

I don't think the old design review committee process should be revived.

I agree with James too, the document doesn't seem have been researched.

You should open a PR on sugarizer to continue the discussion there, it's
easier when there's something to test.

-- 

Ibiam Chihurumnaya
ib...@sugarlabs.org



On Mon, Mar 13, 2023 at 8:35 PM MR. OPTIMIST  wrote:

> Hello  Chihurumnaya sir,
>   Thanks for your feedback and reply to my email. I went
> through the guidelines based on which UI of the sugarizer is made. And
> except color principles i find the design proposal is okay and changes can
> be made(My opinion). All the suggestions in UI changes were made to enhance
> the navigation  experience and reduce navigation time, increase interaction
> time. I have clearly mentioned reasons why UI needs to be changed and
> proposed with effective changes that can be made.
>
> I wish to make a contribution to the following changes proposed by me.I
> also wish to keep contributing to sugar activities in future.
> Sir can this proposal make space in the gsoc idea list of sugar labs.
>
> proposed changes document link:- Click me to open !!
> 
>
> Thank you !
>
> On Mon, Mar 13, 2023 at 7:49 PM Chihurumnaya Ibiam 
> wrote:
>
>> Hi Anuj,
>>
>> While I think that changes can be made to the UI of Sugar/Sugarizer,
>> there are processes they should follow and ideas behind why
>> these processes exist, the design team
>>  page on the wiki contains
>> really helpful information.
>>
>> The document you've shared contains changes to the UI but doesn't explain
>> the reason behind those changes besides
>> "they look better" and design decisions aren't just based on something
>> looking better.
>>
>> There's also the issue of completing the UI change and maintenance,
>> maintenance is a really huge part of changes to software
>> and if someone comes and says we should change something, from previous
>> experience they usually just suggest that change and
>> aren't ready to maintain it so leaving more work to the existing
>> maintainers if the change is made.
>>
>> You've done some research like you've mentioned but the document you
>> shared doesn't show the research you've done but just
>> UI changes, it'll be helpful to point us to it.
>>
>> Hope this helps.
>>
>> --
>>
>> Ibiam Chihurumnaya
>> ib...@sugarlabs.org
>>
>>
>>
>> On Mon, Mar 13, 2023 at 12:05 PM MR. OPTIMIST 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Thanks Alex Sir,
>>> Your response to email is very much appreciated.
>>> Sorry for the late reply.
>>>
>>> I love to mention that I have used sugarizer for many days and I also
>>> know that its UI has been designed with the vision that it's gonna be used
>>> by childrens. My point is that sugarizer was developed back in 2013 and the
>>> internet revolution at the time was very less in comparison to 2023. The UI
>>> and Ux terms were not that considerable at that time and everyone didn't
>>> had access to the mobile phones and internet, But as of now in 2023 the
>>> childrens from 1 or even less than that start using technical devices and
>>> the UX is what first thing that they interact with like games and other
>>> applications.So the UI of sugarizer is not matching with the need of
>>> today's generation which reduces the user interest (research) to use the
>>> platform. So my point is we can work to enhance its UI to meet today's need
>>> and increase the interaction time of the users of our product.
>>>
>>> Considering my skills, I'm a second year engineering student and a self
>>> learner, I have done multiple projects on AI based applications and
>>> developed 2 websites as of now. To authenticate my words hereby i have
>>> listed all my projects in my github account and link of my github account
>>> is:-
>>> https://www.github/Anujverma89
>>>
>>>
>>> Considering what part of the product and UI can be modified to give new
>>> user experience, I have done research and explained it in the given pdf you
>>> can view it thoroughly.
>>> Here is the link :-
>>> Click me to open !!
>>> 
>>>
>>>
>>> Your suggestions on changeable topics(UI) will be highly appreciated !!
>>> Thank You..
>>>
>>> On Sat, Mar 11, 2023 at 12:18 AM Alex Perez 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 Anuj,

 I appreciate your enthusiasm, and welcome. Before any UI re-design
 would be considered, we would require detailed written analysis of what the
 goals are for such a re-design, what's "wrong" with the current design, and
 what your qualifications are for making what are 

Re: [Sugar-devel] Eager to work in fixing the UI of sugarizer.

[MR. OPTIMIST]

Hello James Cameron sir,
 Thanks for your feedback. I agree with you that sugar is an
educational  platform and it does not look like flooding things on the
internet but user experience plays a vital role in any of the platforms be
it commercial or non profitable. Just a simple question: will you use a
phone with no broken or no display, Same is user experience. So if we can
improve, why shouldn't we improve ?

Also I would be thankful if you kindly let me know which of the proposed
changes seems to reasonable So that I can further proceed with further
contribution.
Proposed document link:-click me to open


On Tue, Mar 14, 2023 at 1:29 AM James Cameron  wrote:

> Some of the changes proposed seem reasonable, but they aren't in the right
> form for review; they need to be pull requests against the appropriate
> repository.
>
> I don't think we're using the older design review committee process any
> longer, and it should not be revived.  The pull request review process is
> sufficient.  In the case of Sugarizer, that's the process that Lionel has
> preferred.
>
> However, as someone who works in science research, the proposal does not
> seem to have been researched, but is rather a collection of ideas that
> would be suitable for changing Sugarizer using A/B testing for the goal of
> increasing engagement and selling advertising.  Neither of these are
> intended, it's an educational project.  Sugar and Sugarizer don't have to
> look like everything else on the internet, and starting with that premise
> is an error.
>
> On Mon, Mar 13, 2023 at 04:35:27PM +0530, MR. OPTIMIST wrote:
> > Thanks Alex Sir,
> > Your response to email is very much appreciated.
> Sorry
> > for the late reply.
> >
> > I love to mention that I have used sugarizer for many days and I also
> know that
> > its UI has been designed with the vision that it's gonna be used by
> childrens.
> > My point is that sugarizer was developed back in 2013 and the internet
> > revolution at the time was very less in comparison to 2023. The UI and
> Ux terms
> > were not that considerable at that time and everyone didn't had access
> to the
> > mobile phones and internet, But as of now in 2023 the childrens from 1
> or even
> > less than that start using technical devices and the UX is what first
> thing
> > that they interact with like games and other applications.So the UI of
> > sugarizer is not matching with the need of today's generation which
> reduces the
> > user interest (research) to use the platform. So my point is we can work
> to
> > enhance its UI to meet today's need and increase the interaction time of
> the
> > users of our product.
> >
> > Considering my skills, I'm a second year engineering student and a self
> > learner, I have done multiple projects on AI based applications and
> developed 2
> > websites as of now. To authenticate my words hereby i have listed all my
> > projects in my github account and link of my github account is:-
> > [1] https://www.github/Anujverma89
> >
> > Considering what part of the product and UI can be modified to give new
> user
> > experience, I have done research and explained it in the given pdf you
> can view
> > it thoroughly.
> > Here is the link :-
> > [2]Click me to open !!
> >
> > Your suggestions on changeable topics(UI) will be highly appreciated !!
> > Thank You..
> >
> > On Sat, Mar 11, 2023 at 12:18 AM Alex Perez <[3]ape...@alexperez.com>
> wrote:
> >
> > Anuj,
> >
> > I appreciate your enthusiasm, and welcome. Before any UI re-design
> would be
> > considered, we would require detailed written analysis of what the
> goals
> > are for such a re-design, what's "wrong" with the current design,
> and what
> > your qualifications are for making what are largely subjective
> changes.
> > While everyone has opinions on UI design, engineers are often
> infamous for
> > designing awful user interfaces. Please share with us what sorts
> > qualifications you possess that would qualify you to make UI design
> changes
> > to Sugar/Sugarizer.
> >
> > Have you ever used Sugar for more than a few hours, or a day? If so,
> which
> > elements do you feel should be changed? If you have not used Sugar
> > extensively, I would argue that you likely lack sufficient
> experience to
> > propose such changes.
> >
> > The Sugar/Sugarizer UI was primarily designed for children of a
> specific
> > age range. Almost all design decisions stem from that basic premise.
> Have
> > you considered this?
> >
> > Regards,
> > Alex Perez
> >
> > MR. OPTIMIST wrote on 3/10/23 10:24 AM:
> >
> > Hello everyone !
> >  I am Anuj Verma from Maharashtra, India
> majoring in
> > computer science and engineering.  I have worked in
> multiple projects
> > and web applications 

Re: [Sugar-devel] Eager to work in fixing the UI of sugarizer.

[James Cameron]

Some of the changes proposed seem reasonable, but they aren't in the right form 
for review; they need to be pull requests against the appropriate repository.

I don't think we're using the older design review committee process any longer, 
and it should not be revived.  The pull request review process is sufficient.  
In the case of Sugarizer, that's the process that Lionel has preferred.

However, as someone who works in science research, the proposal does not seem 
to have been researched, but is rather a collection of ideas that would be 
suitable for changing Sugarizer using A/B testing for the goal of increasing 
engagement and selling advertising.  Neither of these are intended, it's an 
educational project.  Sugar and Sugarizer don't have to look like everything 
else on the internet, and starting with that premise is an error.

On Mon, Mar 13, 2023 at 04:35:27PM +0530, MR. OPTIMIST wrote:
> Thanks Alex Sir,
>                         Your response to email is very much appreciated. Sorry
> for the late reply.
> 
> I love to mention that I have used sugarizer for many days and I also know 
> that
> its UI has been designed with the vision that it's gonna be used by childrens.
> My point is that sugarizer was developed back in 2013 and the internet
> revolution at the time was very less in comparison to 2023. The UI and Ux 
> terms
> were not that considerable at that time and everyone didn't had access to the
> mobile phones and internet, But as of now in 2023 the childrens from 1 or even
> less than that start using technical devices and the UX is what first thing
> that they interact with like games and other applications.So the UI of
> sugarizer is not matching with the need of today's generation which reduces 
> the
> user interest (research) to use the platform. So my point is we can work to
> enhance its UI to meet today's need and increase the interaction time of the
> users of our product.
> 
> Considering my skills, I'm a second year engineering student and a self
> learner, I have done multiple projects on AI based applications and developed 
> 2
> websites as of now. To authenticate my words hereby i have listed all my
> projects in my github account and link of my github account is:- 
> [1] https://www.github/Anujverma89
> 
> Considering what part of the product and UI can be modified to give new user
> experience, I have done research and explained it in the given pdf you can 
> view
> it thoroughly.
> Here is the link :-
> [2]Click me to open !! 
> 
> Your suggestions on changeable topics(UI) will be highly appreciated !! 
> Thank You..
> 
> On Sat, Mar 11, 2023 at 12:18 AM Alex Perez <[3]ape...@alexperez.com> wrote:
> 
> Anuj,
> 
> I appreciate your enthusiasm, and welcome. Before any UI re-design would 
> be
> considered, we would require detailed written analysis of what the goals
> are for such a re-design, what's "wrong" with the current design, and what
> your qualifications are for making what are largely subjective changes.
> While everyone has opinions on UI design, engineers are often infamous for
> designing awful user interfaces. Please share with us what sorts
> qualifications you possess that would qualify you to make UI design 
> changes
> to Sugar/Sugarizer.
> 
> Have you ever used Sugar for more than a few hours, or a day? If so, which
> elements do you feel should be changed? If you have not used Sugar
> extensively, I would argue that you likely lack sufficient experience to
> propose such changes.
> 
> The Sugar/Sugarizer UI was primarily designed for children of a specific
> age range. Almost all design decisions stem from that basic premise. Have
> you considered this?
> 
> Regards,
> Alex Perez
> 
> MR. OPTIMIST wrote on 3/10/23 10:24 AM:
> 
> Hello everyone !
>                  I am Anuj Verma from Maharashtra, India majoring in
> computer science and engineering.  I have worked in multiple projects
> and web applications including AI projects.
> I have checked the sugarizer, it's pretty good but I believe it's UI
> can be improved. Like we 
> can add links to words as well as icons, we can improve icons as well
> which is less user friendly(in my opinion).I have experience of 
> working
> with many projects but have not worked on open source yet. I'm
> writing to seek further comments and be open to constructive feedback
> and criticism. Your response to this mail will be highly appreciated.
> 
> References:
> 
> [1] https://www.github/Anujverma89
> [2] 
> https://docs.google.com/document/d/1OwG09QhO8nHJqQmccXhI2sKYx5LnEGaEVoW5rv5BN5Q/edit?usp=sharing
> [3] mailto:ape...@alexperez.com

> ___
> Sugar-devel mailing list
> Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org
> http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel

___

Re: [Sugar-devel] Eager to work in fixing the UI of sugarizer.

[MR. OPTIMIST]

Hello  Chihurumnaya sir,
  Thanks for your feedback and reply to my email. I went
through the guidelines based on which UI of the sugarizer is made. And
except color principles i find the design proposal is okay and changes can
be made(My opinion). All the suggestions in UI changes were made to enhance
the navigation  experience and reduce navigation time, increase interaction
time. I have clearly mentioned reasons why UI needs to be changed and
proposed with effective changes that can be made.

I wish to make a contribution to the following changes proposed by me.I
also wish to keep contributing to sugar activities in future.
Sir can this proposal make space in the gsoc idea list of sugar labs.

proposed changes document link:- Click me to open !!


Thank you !

On Mon, Mar 13, 2023 at 7:49 PM Chihurumnaya Ibiam 
wrote:

> Hi Anuj,
>
> While I think that changes can be made to the UI of Sugar/Sugarizer, there
> are processes they should follow and ideas behind why
> these processes exist, the design team
>  page on the wiki contains
> really helpful information.
>
> The document you've shared contains changes to the UI but doesn't explain
> the reason behind those changes besides
> "they look better" and design decisions aren't just based on something
> looking better.
>
> There's also the issue of completing the UI change and maintenance,
> maintenance is a really huge part of changes to software
> and if someone comes and says we should change something, from previous
> experience they usually just suggest that change and
> aren't ready to maintain it so leaving more work to the existing
> maintainers if the change is made.
>
> You've done some research like you've mentioned but the document you
> shared doesn't show the research you've done but just
> UI changes, it'll be helpful to point us to it.
>
> Hope this helps.
>
> --
>
> Ibiam Chihurumnaya
> ib...@sugarlabs.org
>
>
>
> On Mon, Mar 13, 2023 at 12:05 PM MR. OPTIMIST  wrote:
>
>> Thanks Alex Sir,
>> Your response to email is very much appreciated.
>> Sorry for the late reply.
>>
>> I love to mention that I have used sugarizer for many days and I also
>> know that its UI has been designed with the vision that it's gonna be used
>> by childrens. My point is that sugarizer was developed back in 2013 and the
>> internet revolution at the time was very less in comparison to 2023. The UI
>> and Ux terms were not that considerable at that time and everyone didn't
>> had access to the mobile phones and internet, But as of now in 2023 the
>> childrens from 1 or even less than that start using technical devices and
>> the UX is what first thing that they interact with like games and other
>> applications.So the UI of sugarizer is not matching with the need of
>> today's generation which reduces the user interest (research) to use the
>> platform. So my point is we can work to enhance its UI to meet today's need
>> and increase the interaction time of the users of our product.
>>
>> Considering my skills, I'm a second year engineering student and a self
>> learner, I have done multiple projects on AI based applications and
>> developed 2 websites as of now. To authenticate my words hereby i have
>> listed all my projects in my github account and link of my github account
>> is:-
>> https://www.github/Anujverma89
>>
>>
>> Considering what part of the product and UI can be modified to give new
>> user experience, I have done research and explained it in the given pdf you
>> can view it thoroughly.
>> Here is the link :-
>> Click me to open !!
>> 
>>
>>
>> Your suggestions on changeable topics(UI) will be highly appreciated !!
>> Thank You..
>>
>> On Sat, Mar 11, 2023 at 12:18 AM Alex Perez  wrote:
>>
>>> Anuj,
>>>
>>> I appreciate your enthusiasm, and welcome. Before any UI re-design would
>>> be considered, we would require detailed written analysis of what the goals
>>> are for such a re-design, what's "wrong" with the current design, and what
>>> your qualifications are for making what are largely subjective changes.
>>> While everyone has opinions on UI design, engineers are often infamous for
>>> designing awful user interfaces. Please share with us what sorts
>>> qualifications you possess that would qualify you to make UI design changes
>>> to Sugar/Sugarizer.
>>>
>>> Have you ever used Sugar for more than a few hours, or a day? If so,
>>> which elements do you feel should be changed? If you have not used Sugar
>>> extensively, I would argue that you likely lack sufficient experience to
>>> propose such changes.
>>>
>>> The Sugar/Sugarizer UI was primarily designed for children of a
>>> specific age range. Almost all design decisions stem from that basic
>>> premise. Have you 

Re: [Sugar-devel] Eager to work in fixing the UI of sugarizer.

[Chihurumnaya Ibiam]

Hi Anuj,

While I think that changes can be made to the UI of Sugar/Sugarizer, there
are processes they should follow and ideas behind why
these processes exist, the design team
 page on the wiki contains
really helpful information.

The document you've shared contains changes to the UI but doesn't explain
the reason behind those changes besides
"they look better" and design decisions aren't just based on something
looking better.

There's also the issue of completing the UI change and maintenance,
maintenance is a really huge part of changes to software
and if someone comes and says we should change something, from previous
experience they usually just suggest that change and
aren't ready to maintain it so leaving more work to the existing
maintainers if the change is made.

You've done some research like you've mentioned but the document you shared
doesn't show the research you've done but just
UI changes, it'll be helpful to point us to it.

Hope this helps.

-- 

Ibiam Chihurumnaya
ib...@sugarlabs.org



On Mon, Mar 13, 2023 at 12:05 PM MR. OPTIMIST  wrote:

> Thanks Alex Sir,
> Your response to email is very much appreciated.
> Sorry for the late reply.
>
> I love to mention that I have used sugarizer for many days and I also know
> that its UI has been designed with the vision that it's gonna be used by
> childrens. My point is that sugarizer was developed back in 2013 and the
> internet revolution at the time was very less in comparison to 2023. The UI
> and Ux terms were not that considerable at that time and everyone didn't
> had access to the mobile phones and internet, But as of now in 2023 the
> childrens from 1 or even less than that start using technical devices and
> the UX is what first thing that they interact with like games and other
> applications.So the UI of sugarizer is not matching with the need of
> today's generation which reduces the user interest (research) to use the
> platform. So my point is we can work to enhance its UI to meet today's need
> and increase the interaction time of the users of our product.
>
> Considering my skills, I'm a second year engineering student and a self
> learner, I have done multiple projects on AI based applications and
> developed 2 websites as of now. To authenticate my words hereby i have
> listed all my projects in my github account and link of my github account
> is:-
> https://www.github/Anujverma89
>
>
> Considering what part of the product and UI can be modified to give new
> user experience, I have done research and explained it in the given pdf you
> can view it thoroughly.
> Here is the link :-
> Click me to open !!
> 
>
>
> Your suggestions on changeable topics(UI) will be highly appreciated !!
> Thank You..
>
> On Sat, Mar 11, 2023 at 12:18 AM Alex Perez  wrote:
>
>> Anuj,
>>
>> I appreciate your enthusiasm, and welcome. Before any UI re-design would
>> be considered, we would require detailed written analysis of what the goals
>> are for such a re-design, what's "wrong" with the current design, and what
>> your qualifications are for making what are largely subjective changes.
>> While everyone has opinions on UI design, engineers are often infamous for
>> designing awful user interfaces. Please share with us what sorts
>> qualifications you possess that would qualify you to make UI design changes
>> to Sugar/Sugarizer.
>>
>> Have you ever used Sugar for more than a few hours, or a day? If so,
>> which elements do you feel should be changed? If you have not used Sugar
>> extensively, I would argue that you likely lack sufficient experience to
>> propose such changes.
>>
>> The Sugar/Sugarizer UI was primarily designed for children of a specific
>> age range. Almost all design decisions stem from that basic premise. Have
>> you considered this?
>>
>> Regards,
>> Alex Perez
>>
>> MR. OPTIMIST wrote on 3/10/23 10:24 AM:
>>
>> Hello everyone !
>>  I am Anuj Verma from Maharashtra, India majoring in
>> computer science and engineering.  I have worked in multiple projects and
>> web applications including AI projects.
>> I have checked the sugarizer, it's pretty good but I believe it's UI can
>> be improved. Like we
>> can add links to words as well as icons, we can improve icons as well
>> which is less user friendly(in my opinion).I have experience of working
>> with many projects but have not worked on open source yet. I'm writing to
>> seek further comments and be open to constructive feedback and criticism.
>> Your response to this mail will be highly appreciated.
>>
>>
>> ___
> Sugar-devel mailing list
> Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org
> http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
>
___
Sugar-devel mailing list
Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org

Re: [Sugar-devel] Eager to work in fixing the UI of sugarizer.

[MR. OPTIMIST]

Thanks Alex Sir,
Your response to email is very much appreciated.
Sorry for the late reply.

I love to mention that I have used sugarizer for many days and I also know
that its UI has been designed with the vision that it's gonna be used by
childrens. My point is that sugarizer was developed back in 2013 and the
internet revolution at the time was very less in comparison to 2023. The UI
and Ux terms were not that considerable at that time and everyone didn't
had access to the mobile phones and internet, But as of now in 2023 the
childrens from 1 or even less than that start using technical devices and
the UX is what first thing that they interact with like games and other
applications.So the UI of sugarizer is not matching with the need of
today's generation which reduces the user interest (research) to use the
platform. So my point is we can work to enhance its UI to meet today's need
and increase the interaction time of the users of our product.

Considering my skills, I'm a second year engineering student and a self
learner, I have done multiple projects on AI based applications and
developed 2 websites as of now. To authenticate my words hereby i have
listed all my projects in my github account and link of my github account
is:-
https://www.github/Anujverma89


Considering what part of the product and UI can be modified to give new
user experience, I have done research and explained it in the given pdf you
can view it thoroughly.
Here is the link :-
Click me to open !!



Your suggestions on changeable topics(UI) will be highly appreciated !!
Thank You..

On Sat, Mar 11, 2023 at 12:18 AM Alex Perez  wrote:

> Anuj,
>
> I appreciate your enthusiasm, and welcome. Before any UI re-design would
> be considered, we would require detailed written analysis of what the goals
> are for such a re-design, what's "wrong" with the current design, and what
> your qualifications are for making what are largely subjective changes.
> While everyone has opinions on UI design, engineers are often infamous for
> designing awful user interfaces. Please share with us what sorts
> qualifications you possess that would qualify you to make UI design changes
> to Sugar/Sugarizer.
>
> Have you ever used Sugar for more than a few hours, or a day? If so, which
> elements do you feel should be changed? If you have not used Sugar
> extensively, I would argue that you likely lack sufficient experience to
> propose such changes.
>
> The Sugar/Sugarizer UI was primarily designed for children of a specific
> age range. Almost all design decisions stem from that basic premise. Have
> you considered this?
>
> Regards,
> Alex Perez
>
> MR. OPTIMIST wrote on 3/10/23 10:24 AM:
>
> Hello everyone !
>  I am Anuj Verma from Maharashtra, India majoring in
> computer science and engineering.  I have worked in multiple projects and
> web applications including AI projects.
> I have checked the sugarizer, it's pretty good but I believe it's UI can
> be improved. Like we
> can add links to words as well as icons, we can improve icons as well
> which is less user friendly(in my opinion).I have experience of working
> with many projects but have not worked on open source yet. I'm writing to
> seek further comments and be open to constructive feedback and criticism.
> Your response to this mail will be highly appreciated.
>
>
>
___
Sugar-devel mailing list
Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org
http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel

Re: [Sugar-devel] Eager to work in fixing the UI of sugarizer.

[Alex Perez]

Anuj,

I appreciate your enthusiasm, and welcome. Before any UI re-design would
be considered, we would require detailed written analysis of what the
goals are for such a re-design, what's "wrong" with the current design,
and what your qualifications are for making what are largely subjective
changes. While everyone has opinions on UI design, engineers are often
infamous for designing awful user interfaces. Please share with us what
sorts qualifications you possess that would qualify you to make UI
design changes to Sugar/Sugarizer.

Have you ever used Sugar for more than a few hours, or a day? If so,
which elements do you feel should be changed? If you have not used Sugar
extensively, I would argue that you likely lack sufficient experience to
propose such changes.

The Sugar/Sugarizer UI was primarily designed for children of a specific
age range. Almost all design decisions stem from that basic premise.
Have you considered this?

Regards,
Alex Perez

MR. OPTIMIST wrote on 3/10/23 10:24 AM:
> Hello everyone !
>                  I am Anuj Verma from Maharashtra, India majoring in
> computer science and engineering.  I have worked in multiple projects
> and web applications including AI projects.
> I have checked the sugarizer, it's pretty good but I believe it's UI
> can be improved. Like we 
> can add links to words as well as icons, we can improve icons as well
> which is less user friendly(in my opinion).I have experience of
> working with many projects but have not worked on open source yet. I'm
> writing to seek further comments and be open to constructive feedback
> and criticism. Your response to this mail will be highly appreciated.
>

___
Sugar-devel mailing list
Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org
http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel

[Sugar-devel] Eager to work in fixing the UI of sugarizer.

[MR. OPTIMIST]

Hello everyone !
 I am Anuj Verma from Maharashtra, India majoring in
computer science and engineering.  I have worked in multiple projects and
web applications including AI projects.
I have checked the sugarizer, it's pretty good but I believe it's UI can be
improved. Like we
can add links to words as well as icons, we can improve icons as well which
is less user friendly(in my opinion).I have experience of working with many
projects but have not worked on open source yet. I'm writing to seek
further comments and be open to constructive feedback and criticism. Your
response to this mail will be highly appreciated.

Thank you
___
Sugar-devel mailing list
Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org
http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel