[Biofuel] Fw: Bush Continues to Deal in Denial
In case you missed this article, here it is. Dubya is so out of touch, it's scary. Does he think we're alllacking any sort of memory? He rewrites history so easily and painlessly. Peace, D. Mindock Print This Story E-mail This Story What do you think? The t r u t h o u t Town Meeting is in progress. Join the debate! Go to Original Bush Continues to Deal in DenialBy Robert ScheerThe San Francisco Chronicle Wednesday 22 March 2006 On the third anniversary of the beginning of his Iraq catastrophe, President Bush yet again dealt in denial, but this time the carefully screened audience at the Cleveland City Club wasn't buying it. Perhaps most on target was an elderly gentleman who cited what he said were the three main reasons for going to war in Iraq - WMD, Iraq's ties to the Sept. 11, 2001, terrorists and the alleged purchase of nuclear material from Niger - and then noted dryly that all three of these rationales turned out to be false. "How do we restore confidence that Americans may have in their leaders and to be sure that the information they are getting now is correct?" he asked the president. How indeed? "That's a great question," began Bush by way of dissembling. "First, just if I may correct a misperception. I don't think we ever said - at least I know I didn't say - that there was a direct connection between Sept. 11 and Saddam Hussein." Really? So when he said in his May 1, 2003, "Mission Accomplished" speech on the deck of the aircraft carrier Abraham Lincoln that "we have removed an ally of al Qaeda," he meant a different gang with the same name as the one blamed for the attack on the World Trade Center twin towers and Pentagon? It is his way of finessing the firm conclusion of the bipartisan Sept. 11 commission that Hussein was an opponent of al Qaeda and never an ally. Yet that didn't stop Bush from again on Monday insisting that "the central front on the war on terror is Iraq." Meanwhile, that old "central front," wooly Afghanistan, is now all sewed up, Bush reassures. "Twenty-five million people are now free, and Afghanistan is no longer a safe haven for the terrorists." Apparently the president missed the director of the U.S. Defense Intelligence Agency, Gen. Michael Maples, giving testimony to Congress a few weeks ago that Taliban resurgence now presents "a greater threat to the Afghan central government's expansion of authority than at any point since late 2001." To be sure, occupied Iraq is useful to al Qaeda and its ilk - as a recruiting poster. In this and myriad other ways, the United States military's continued heavy-handed presence in Iraq strengthens the hands of extremists and demagogues who can appeal to latent Iraqi nationalism and Muslim pride. Yet we seem to have forgotten that terrorists don't really need Iraq as "a safe haven for terrorists to plot new attacks against our nation," as Bush put it - they are just as likely to be drawn from countries that are nominally our allies, such as the 15 hijackers recruited under the noses of the Bush family's sheikh friends in Saudi Arabia. Finally, for old times sake, Bush trotted out his now hoary excuses for those missing Iraqi WMD he so trumped up to get us psyched for a "pre-emptive" war three years ago, again blaming the deception on everyone except himself. "Like you, I asked that very same question, 'Where did we go wrong on intelligence?' " he plaintively responded to his questioner. "The truth of the matter is that the whole world thought that Saddam Hussein had weapons of mass destruction." Not so, most of the world thought it best to wait for the U.N. inspectors, then on the ground in Iraq, to complete their work before answering that question. Those inspectors had found no such evidence of WMD and this president knew full well that would likely be their final conclusion when he ordered the pre-emptive invasion. Yet he justified it by referring to the Sept. 11, 2001, attack warning, "We cannot wait for the final proof - the smoking gun - that could come in the form of a mushroom cloud." On Tuesday, the Associated Press reported that a treasure trove of translations of audio tapes of top-level Iraqi meetings involving Hussein, released at the request
Re: [Biofuel] Fw: How To Steal an Election
Don't get me wrong, I'm a fan of the open-source, publicly moderated type systems, however...I'll point out some flaws...First off, the wide reaching level of conspiracy you're suggesting with the idea that he rigged the vote would in NO WAY be challenged by any of these mechanisms...the only possible issue would be more people on the payroll...but even then... 1. I don't trust my elected type people to look @ the guts of the software in the voting machine, and I sure as HELL don't want it made public for scrutiny. I'm not saying they don't need better protection, as the DeBolt machines were given to hackers last year and within about 3 hours they had dialed in and modified information. But...There's WY too many people with WY too much to gain to have source code filed away in some public office. Besides, anyone who understands anything about real hacking will tell you that half the fun is NOT having the source code... 2. Elected officials have no chip to compare... Again...none of my legislators would know the difference between an eeprom and a cpu, so...what's the point? A separate leislative/controlling entity to do checks? First off, they already exist, and second offthey're a *cough* publicly funded group, no less susceptible to the degree of conspiracy you're suggesting. Now, furthermore, the chip in a vegas slot machine that they're talkng about is the random number generator algorithm stored on an eeprom. All they do is an MD5 footprint to compare that the right algorithm is on the chip...randomly, which is about twice a month per machine. A casino can lose hundreds of thousands of dollars a day from re-chipped machines, so they have more REASON to check, plus there's no random number generator in an election machine. Apples to oranges comparison. 3. You don't want to know how many programmers have histories. Seriously. I have a friend who was one of those people who, when finally busted, was told come work for us or go to prison. Now he makes $200,000 a year working for the company who busted him. DeBold and Wells Fargo have invested millions of dollars into the development of these machines. Consider the challenges...they have to be excruciatingly easy to use, very hard to open, extraordinarily easy to maintain, and capable of reporting every single daily interaction, all while maintaining the fun encryption that uses jumping keys in case the data stream gets intercepted. My point is that they've got safeguards in place to monitor the people on the teams...a slot employee can swap an eeprom and never get caught and his friends'll make hundreds of thousands of dollars. What's a programmer going to gain? Well, he'll definately get caught when the review team comes in, he'll get fired, lose his job, lose his entire career, and not be able to go to the machine and recoup his losses. 4. You want public information on how testing is done? Seriously? Let's tell all the people who want to circumvent the system EXACTLY where they're looking for security, and therefore exactly what's NOT scritinized as closely? Thanks but no thanks, private security firms charge a lot of money for a reason, and a lot of it is because they DON'T share the specifics of how they do their work. 5. This one's a dual edged sword. You don't necessarily want any tom dick or harry to be able to log-in/pop open the machine and say Yup Delores, your vote DID go to Kerry, not Bush, but you also need voters to feel secure in knowledge that when they pressed KERRY the machine's variables weren't swapped and the vote didn't go to Bush. They don't want a papertrail exactly, and none of us want barcoded ID's with which to vote...but in most cases if you trust the people who are paid $50 a DAY for 15 hours of working the polls over the machine w/ automatic tally, then I think your reasoning is flawed. I'm not saying the system is right yet, or that it doesn't need significantly more work, I'm saying I personally believe it's just as secure if not more, simply by being LESS acceptable to the random poll workers in your small town. Just my 2 cents, feel free to disagree to your hearts content. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
[Biofuel] Oil in Alberta
Ran across this on the BBC, interesting... http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/business/4649580.stm ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
[Biofuel] Around Skagit Valley
Ok, enough watching the list. As the price of fuel has steadily increased I have been gathering containers, pumps, hoses and fittings. and am ready to pursue gathering and manufacturing process. My dilemma is that although I have been reading/research and so forth, I learn better through observation and hands on. (Guess I'm afraid of failure.) So my question: Is there is someone around Mount Vernon, WA, who would be willing to show me their operation and allow me to watch the process and ask questions? especially with raw chemicals. I have read/heard of some commercial operation in bellingham. Don't know where and I haven't found it yet. This would be ok but they don't operate the same as us backyard guys. (or do they??) Thanks in advance Bill Thomas ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Fw: How To Steal an Election
Hi All, Although I tend to enbrace technology when it helps, what is the problem with giving each person a paper copy of their own vote. Then take this paper copy to another location at the voting place to be tabulated against the machine count as part of the voting process. This count would be the real count with the machine being the preliminary count. Just a thought. Tom Irwin From: Evergreen Solutions [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.orgSent: Fri, 24 Mar 2006 13:24:20 -0300Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Fw: "How To Steal an Election" Don't get me wrong, I'm a fan of the open-source, publicly moderated type systems, however...I'll point out some flaws...First off, the wide reaching level of conspiracy you're suggesting with the idea that "he rigged the vote" would in NO WAY be challenged by any of these mechanisms...the only possible issue would be more people on the payroll...but even then... 1. I don't trust my elected type people to look @ the guts of the software in the voting machine, and I sure as HELL don't want it made public for scrutiny. I'm not saying they don't need better protection, as the DeBolt machines were given to "hackers" last year and within about 3 hours they had dialed in and modified information. But...There's WY too many people with WY too much to gain to have source code filed away in some public office. Besides, anyone who understands anything about real hacking will tell you that half the fun is NOT having the source code... 2. "Elected officials have no chip to compare..." Again...none of my legislators would know the difference between an eeprom and a cpu, so...what's the point? A separate leislative/controlling entity to do checks? First off, they already exist, and second offthey're a *cough* publicly funded group, no less susceptible to the degree of conspiracy you're suggesting. Now, furthermore, the "chip" in a vegas slot machine that they're talkng about is the random number generator algorithm stored on an eeprom. All they do is an MD5 footprint to compare that the right algorithm is on the chip...randomly, which is about twice a month per machine. A casino can lose hundreds of thousands of dollars a day from re-chipped machines, so they have more REASON to check, plus there's no random number generator in an election machine. Apples to oranges comparison. 3. You don't want to know how many "programmers" have histories. Seriously. I have a friend who was one of those people who, when finally busted, was told "come work for us or go to prison." Now he makes $200,000 a year working for the company who busted him. DeBold and Wells Fargo have invested millions of dollars into the development of these machines. Consider the challenges...they have to be excruciatingly easy to use, very hard to open, extraordinarily easy to maintain, and capable of reporting every single daily interaction, all while maintaining the fun encryption that uses jumping keys in case the data stream gets intercepted. My point is that they've got safeguards in place to monitor the people on the teams...a slot employee can swap an eeprom and never get caught and his friends'll make hundreds of thousands of dollars. What's a programmer going to gain? Well, he'll definately get caught when the review team comes in, he'll get fired, lose his job, lose his entire career, and not be able to go to the machine and recoup his losses. 4. You want public information on how testing is done? Seriously? Let's tell all the people who want to circumvent the system EXACTLY where they're looking for security, and therefore exactly what's NOT scritinized as closely? Thanks but no thanks, private security firms charge a lot of money for a reason, and a lot of it is because they DON'T share the specifics of how they do their work. 5. This one's a dual edged sword. You don't necessarily want any tom dick or harry to be able to log-in/pop open the machine and say "Yup Delores, your vote DID go to Kerry, not Bush", but you also need voters to feel secure in knowledge that when they pressed KERRY the machine's variables weren't swapped and the vote didn't go to Bush. They don't want a papertrail exactly, and none of us want barcoded ID's with which to vote...but in most cases if you trust the people who are paid $50 a DAY for 15 hours of working the polls over the machine w/ automatic tally, then I think your reasoning is flawed. I'm not saying the system is right yet, or that it doesn't need significantly more work, I'm saying I personally believe it's just as secure if not more, simply by being LESS acceptable to the random poll workers in your small town. Just my 2 cents, feel free to disagree to your hearts content. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined
Re: [Biofuel] UAE, Saudi considering to move reserves out of dollar
Keith Addison wrote: http://www.middleeastforex.com/index.php?section=147 Hey Keith; Thanks much for posting this. It's a very interesting concept indeed. But still, I'm given to pause about the *real* effect of such a move, as I consider who actually backs the IMF, and who *really* holds all that IMF paper, and how deep the Sauds are into the IMF. There is a *lot* of talk about folks all over the world doing dastardly things to wreck the US Dollar's dominance. And that's all fine. But again, at the end of the day, who holds the paper? Pretty much all these folks are DEEP into the IMF for EVERYTHING they have. The IMF draws funds from the International Bank for Reconstruction and Development for it's 'investments' and the IBRD, now known as the World Bank, last I checked, was financially seeded by, and is pretty much trades in, US faux-multinational corporation-centric projects. At the end of the day, All these folks might move to a different currency, but the world's debt is held by the same players, so it really doesn't mean shit. Maybe it does, but international finance has never been one of my strong suites :-) - ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Fw: How To Steal an Election
Tom Irwin wrote: Hi All, Although I tend to enbrace technology when it helps, what is the problem with giving each person a paper copy of their own vote. It's a great idea! When I sell my vote, I'll have a receipt, so I can get paid easily! Just in case anyone cares, poll receipts were done away with a while back, exactly for this reason. -- ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Fw: How To Steal an Election
On a side note; How it's done! http://www.syngress.com/catalog/?pid=3100 A good read. In fact, I've really enjoyed all of Syngress publishing's cyberfiction. -- ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Around Skagit Valley
Hello Bill Ok, enough watching the list. As the price of fuel has steadily increased I have been gathering containers, pumps, hoses and fittings. and am ready to pursue gathering and manufacturing process. My dilemma is that although I have been reading/research and so forth, I learn better through observation and hands on. (Guess I'm afraid of failure.) A lot of people have told me that but they manage just fine anyway in the end. I think you might be making a mistake though: Where do I start? Start with the process, NOT with the processor. The processor comes later. -- Make your own biodiesel http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_make.html#start Really. Best Keith So my question: Is there is someone around Mount Vernon, WA, who would be willing to show me their operation and allow me to watch the process and ask questions? especially with raw chemicals. I have read/heard of some commercial operation in bellingham. Don't know where and I haven't found it yet. This would be ok but they don't operate the same as us backyard guys. (or do they??) Thanks in advance Bill Thomas ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Fw: How To Steal an Election
What's all this political crap got to do with HOCKEY??? LOL! Seriously, aren't you tinkering with the symptoms a bit? After your two most recent experiences (and everyone else's too!) and you're still considering voting? Wouldn't a massive boycott be more in order, among other things? The tide is turning, or it's already turned. Three or four years ago Americans who didn't swallow the party line were writing to me saying how alone and isolated they felt. Such good people. Now they're not alone and isolated and they're not just a minority either, millions of them are working and networking for change and I don't think they're going to take no for an answer. I really hope not. On the other hand a massive number of Americans know that the voting options don't cater for them, they're always saying so, and they're not just apathetic as so often alleged, they just aren't dumb. Enough of the people enough of the time, but it might not be enough anymore. Isn't it time for a very large and emphatic demonstration that nobody has a mandate either way, it's a fraud whether the poxy machines work or not? Don't vote! Or what, fool me three times? Or find a new Pigasus or something, or do all those things. The exit polls in Ohio showed a landslide for Kerry. But Bush somehow managed to win anyway. But Kerry, and Gore before him, would only have meant business as usual anyway,different band, same old song, everybody hates it. Don't you have any rock'n'roll? Best Keith Hi All, Although I tend to enbrace technology when it helps, what is the problem with giving each person a paper copy of their own vote. Then take this paper copy to another location at the voting place to be tabulated against the machine count as part of the voting process. This count would be the real count with the machine being the preliminary count. Just a thought. Tom Irwin From: Evergreen Solutions [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Fri, 24 Mar 2006 13:24:20 -0300 Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Fw: How To Steal an Election Don't get me wrong, I'm a fan of the open-source, publicly moderated type systems, however...I'll point out some flaws... First off, the wide reaching level of conspiracy you're suggesting with the idea that he rigged the vote would in NO WAY be challenged by any of these mechanisms...the only possible issue would be more people on the payroll...but even then... 1. I don't trust my elected type people to look @ the guts of the software in the voting machine, and I sure as HELL don't want it made public for scrutiny. I'm not saying they don't need better protection, as the DeBolt machines were given to hackers last year and within about 3 hours they had dialed in and modified information. But...There's WY too many people with WY too much to gain to have source code filed away in some public office. Besides, anyone who understands anything about real hacking will tell you that half the fun is NOT having the source code... 2. Elected officials have no chip to compare... Again...none of my legislators would know the difference between an eeprom and a cpu, so...what's the point? A separate leislative/controlling entity to do checks? First off, they already exist, and second offthey're a *cough* publicly funded group, no less susceptible to the degree of conspiracy you're suggesting. Now, furthermore, the chip in a vegas slot machine that they're talkng about is the random number generator algorithm stored on an eeprom. All they do is an MD5 footprint to compare that the right algorithm is on the chip...randomly, which is about twice a month per machine. A casino can lose hundreds of thousands of dollars a day from re-chipped machines, so they have more REASON to check, plus there's no random number generator in an election machine. Apples to oranges comparison. 3. You don't want to know how many programmers have histories. Seriously. I have a friend who was one of those people who, when finally busted, was told come work for us or go to prison. Now he makes $200,000 a year working for the company who busted him. DeBold and Wells Fargo have invested millions of dollars into the development of these machines. Consider the challenges...they have to be excruciatingly easy to use, very hard to open, extraordinarily easy to maintain, and capable of reporting every single daily interaction, all while maintaining the fun encryption that uses jumping keys in case the data stream gets intercepted. My point is that they've got safeguards in place to monitor the people on the teams...a slot employee can swap an eeprom and never get caught and his friends'll make hundreds of thousands of dollars. What's a programmer going to gain? Well, he'll definately get caught when the review team comes in, he'll get fired, lose his job, lose his entire career, and not be able to go to the machine and recoup his losses. 4. You want public
Re: [Biofuel] Fw: How To Steal an Election
As a way of "Correcting" the problems with all types of voting system(paper,punch cards,tally machines and such) Use Triple audit system like credit card transactions use. In the credit card world it goes - Initial transaction (electronic) - paper signature (now going local sig capture) - end of day reconciliation(electronic). 1) Electronic Voting machine toenter votes and register to the first electronic copy of the vote. (Copy #1 Electronic) 2) Print out a paper "Ballot" from the Electronic Voting machinewith votes registered.(Copy #2 Paper) - Voter can confirm that the votes were recorded correctly - Card would be encoded with a RSA type authentication signature for copy type attacks. - The Voters receipt would have the RSA type authentication signature - thus statically voter audits could be performed. 3)Voter feeds thepaper "Ballot"into a OCR vote counter. (Copy #3 Electronic) This system has 2 electronic copies for initial fraud detection. If designed right the two systems would be independent and separate. Thus remove the possibility of a single inside person hacking the system. The paper "Ballot"provides a physical ballot for recounts and fraud detection. Final vote tallies would require that all three copies match. Just a idea. Mark From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Tom IrwinSent: Friday, March 24, 2006 9:45 AMTo: Biofuel@sustainablelists.orgSubject: Re: [Biofuel] Fw: "How To Steal an Election" Hi All, Although I tend to enbrace technology when it helps, what is the problem with giving each person a paper copy of their own vote. Then take this paper copy to another location at the voting place to be tabulated against the machine count as part of the voting process. This count would be the real count with the machine being the preliminary count. Just a thought. Tom Irwin From: Evergreen Solutions [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.orgSent: Fri, 24 Mar 2006 13:24:20 -0300Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Fw: "How To Steal an Election" Don't get me wrong, I'm a fan of the open-source, publicly moderated type systems, however...I'll point out some flaws...First off, the wide reaching level of conspiracy you're suggesting with the idea that "he rigged the vote" would in NO WAY be challenged by any of these mechanisms...the only possible issue would be more people on the payroll...but even then... 1. I don't trust my elected type people to look @ the guts of the software in the voting machine, and I sure as HELL don't want it made public for scrutiny. I'm not saying they don't need better protection, as the DeBolt machines were given to "hackers" last year and within about 3 hours they had dialed in and modified information. But...There's WY too many people with WY too much to gain to have source code filed away in some public office. Besides, anyone who understands anything about real hacking will tell you that half the fun is NOT having the source code... 2. "Elected officials have no chip to compare..." Again...none of my legislators would know the difference between an eeprom and a cpu, so...what's the point? A separate leislative/controlling entity to do checks? First off, they already exist, and second offthey're a *cough* publicly funded group, no less susceptible to the degree of conspiracy you're suggesting. Now, furthermore, the "chip" in a vegas slot machine that they're talkng about is the random number generator algorithm stored on an eeprom. All they do is an MD5 footprint to compare that the right algorithm is on the chip...randomly, which is about twice a month per machine. A casino can lose hundreds of thousands of dollars a day from re-chipped machines, so they have more REASON to check, plus there's no random number generator in an election machine. Apples to oranges comparison. 3. You don't want to know how many "programmers" have histories. Seriously. I have a friend who was one of those people who, when finally busted, was told "come work for us or go to prison." Now he makes $200,000 a year working for the company who busted him. DeBold and Wells Fargo have invested millions of dollars into the development of these machines. Consider the challenges...they have to be excruciatingly easy to use, very hard to open, extraordinarily easy to maintain, and capable of reporting every single daily interaction, all while maintaining the fun encryption that uses jumping keys in case the data stream gets intercepted. My point is that they've got safeguards in place to monitor the people on the teams...a slot employee can swap an eeprom and never get caught and his friends'll make hundreds of thousands of dollars. What's a programmer going to gain? Well, he'll definately get caught when the review team comes in, he'll get fired, lose his job, lose his entire
Re: [Biofuel] Around Skagit Valley
Hi Bill,Keith is right. Start with small baby steps. Do not just learn how to do it, learn what is happening. Treat each success (and failure) as a learning expierence. *Watch* what you are doing. Gradually, increase batch volume. Learn, learn, learn. Failure is part of the fun!!! Do not be afraid of failure!I learn best by watching too, but no one can meet my schedule for completing such tasks. And for God's Sakes, have fun doing it!fred On 3/24/06, Keith Addison [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hello BillOk, enough watching the list.As the price of fuel has steadilyincreased I have been gathering containers, pumps, hoses and fittings.and am ready to pursue gathering and manufacturing process. My dilemma is that although I have been reading/research and so forth,I learn better through observation and hands on.(Guess I'm afraid offailure.)A lot of people have told me that but they manage just fine anyway in the end. I think you might be making a mistake though:Where do I start?Start with the process, NOT with the processor. The processor comes later.-- Make your own biodiesel http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_make.html#startReally.BestKeithSo my question: Is there is someone around Mount Vernon, WA,who wouldbe willing to show me their operation and allow me to watch the process and ask questions?especially with raw chemicals.I have read/heard of some commercial operation in bellingham.Don'tknow where and I haven't found it yet.This would be ok but they don'toperate the same as us backyard guys.(or do they??) Thanks in advanceBill Thomas___Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.orghttp://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.htmlSearch the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Around Skagit Valley
Howdy neighbour! If you ever take vacations out to Vancouver Island, let me know (the more advance warning I have the better) and you can watch me mix chemicals in my primitive, 'brain cooking' fashion. I'm in bee-yoo-tee-full Victoria. We might even have a decent processor up and running if this darned co-op thing ever gets off the ground. Maybe after this Sunday... Anyways, if you haven't made a litre of biodiesel in a pop bottle, I highly recommend that as a learning test. No fumes, small amounts of caustic methoxide, quick and easy to see your results; satisfying! THere's lots of instructions on the web; many call it the Dr. Pepper method. Good luck! Kenji Fuse 250.598.5991 PS. If you do contact me, make sure to mention that you're from the biofuels list so I'm not defensive or off-putting. On Fri, 24 Mar 2006, bill wrote: Ok, enough watching the list. As the price of fuel has steadily increased I have been gathering containers, pumps, hoses and fittings. and am ready to pursue gathering and manufacturing process. My dilemma is that although I have been reading/research and so forth, I learn better through observation and hands on. (Guess I'm afraid of failure.) So my question: Is there is someone around Mount Vernon, WA, who would be willing to show me their operation and allow me to watch the process and ask questions? especially with raw chemicals. I have read/heard of some commercial operation in bellingham. Don't know where and I haven't found it yet. This would be ok but they don't operate the same as us backyard guys. (or do they??) Thanks in advance Bill Thomas ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
[Biofuel] Fw: Leave No Mad Cow Behind
This is one of the reasons I don't eat beef. Not every cow is tested for mad cow disease, a brain disease that has no cure, and ensures a terrible death. If less than one-percent is tested then the odds areextremely good that a cow that has it will end up in our supermarkets. Cooking does not do any good. Prions are nearly impossible to "kill". Bon Appétit , D. Mindock = We test our kids, but not our cows. We force small farmers to put anRFID tag in every little critter under the NAIS program, but we forbidfarmers from testing cows for Mad Cow...what's wrong with this picture?http://www.wtol.com/Global/story.asp?s=4673849Government Won't Allow Mad Cow Tests; Meatpacker SuesWASHINGTON (AP) -- A Kansas meatpacker sued the government on Thursdayfor refusing to let the company test for mad cow disease in every animalit slaughters. Creekstone Farms Premium Beef says it has Japanesecustomers who want comprehensive testing.The Agriculture Department threatened criminal prosecution if Creekstonedid the tests, according to the company's lawsuit filed in U.S. DistrictCourt in Washington.Testing for mad cow disease in the United States is controlled by thedepartment, which tests about 1% of the 35 million cattle, or about350,000, that are slaughtered each year. The department is planning toreduce that level of testing. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Fw: How To Steal an Election
KEITH! Finally. Someone else has said it... But Kerry, and Gore before him, would only have meant business as usual anyway,different band, same old song, everybody hates it. Don't you have any rock'n'roll? While I certainly don't advocate *not* voting, I'm glad someone has pointed out that alternative elected individuals would not have meant a deviation from the status quo. My vision for 15 years down the roadyou have to slide the barcode of your governmentally issued ID to votewhich of course contains an stage-encrypted RFID and an algorithym based off some sort of a checksum against the DNA information recorded on the ID. Don't get me wrong, nobody's getting my DNA w/o a fight. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Fw: Leave No Mad Cow Behind
Welcome to Americalol, where our inspectors are paid by the company, not the government/USDA...same thing for miners and crop inspectors... If any of this is news to you, then you obviously haven't read Fast Food Nation, which does a very good job chronicling the conditions present in slaughterhouses. The trick w/ mad cow is that it can only be transmitted by cows who are allowed to eat the brain/spinal matter of infected cowsand cows aren't supposed to eat meatbut byproducts are cheap protein... But anyway, the chances of you getting MCD are significantly less than the chances of you getting E. Coli or intestinal wormsand it's estimated that 1 in 4 americans has worms from red meat But I eat it anyway, lol...but hopefully soon I'll be switching to small scale farmers and locally produced, grain/hay fed cattle (we have to make it to slaughtering season first). And guess what...there won't be any USDA inspections at ALL, and my eggs won't be pasteurized... ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Fw: How To Steal an Election
I think that the Repugs stealing the election to put Dubya in the WH shows that Kerry would have been better. Yeah, Kerry is a war machine backer, but Dubya is attacking the enviroment, dividing the country, running up unbelievable deficits, ad infinitum. Kerry's backing of the Iraqi war was totally dumb. But that was his only major fault. Dubya makes anyone look great in comparison. He is beyond the pale. (Cheney is a supreme conniver and is, of course, more dangerous than Dubya. Dubya is limited, but plays his role as a not too sharp (and thus somewhat unaccountable) Texas macho redneck very well.) Peace, D. Mindock P.S. I am no fan of Kerry, btw, but he would've been far gentler wrt environmental issues. I like Dennis Kucinich a whole lot. .- Original Message -From: Evergreen Solutions [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.orgSent: Friday, March 24, 2006 9:22 PMSubject: Re: [Biofuel] Fw: How To Steal an Election KEITH! Finally. Someone else has said it... But Kerry, and Gore before him, would only have meant business as usual anyway,different band, same old song, everybody hates it. Don't you have any rock'n'roll? While I certainly don't advocate *not* voting, I'm glad someone has pointed out that alternative elected individuals would not have meant a deviation from the status quo. My vision for 15 years down the roadyou have to slide the barcode of your governmentally issued ID to votewhich of course contains an stage-encrypted RFID and an algorithym based off some sort of a checksum against the DNA information recorded on the ID.! Don't get me wrong, nobody's getting my DNA w/o a fight. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
[Biofuel] Crower six-stroke engine
News: Hot rod engineer makes six-stroke engine 17 Mar 06 15:14Hot rod builder and former drag racer Bruce Crower has developed an engine that captures the energy usually lost in waste heat. The veteran engineer has been studying this problem for around 30 years, and has now come up with a solution. Crower's six-stroke engine works on the principle of water injection: after the exhaust stroke, as in a conventional four-stroke combustion cycle, water is injected into the cylinders. Both intake and exhaust valves are closed, the water quickly turns to steam and an additional - fifth - stroke adds to the cycle. The steam is then vented from the exhaust valve as a sixth stroke. Efficiency of the engine is said to have been improved by up to 40% and the engine is said to be only warm to the touch after running for an hour. As the water has a cooling effect, increased combustion ratios are possible, leading to improved efficiency and reduced carbon deposits in the combustion chamber. However, fuel vapourisation is a potential drawback and emissions may be increased. The power output in the conventional four strokes of the combustion cycle is also reduced by around a third, and the added weight of the containers for the water - it would need another tank alongside the petrol tank - also affects performance and consumption. Water could also have a detrimental effect on engine life and on catalytic converters. It's unlikely that such an engine would reach production in the near future - water injection has been tried before and the concept discarded - but Crower is to continue with his experimentation. http://www.channel4.com/4car/news/news-story.jsp?news_id=14227___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
[Biofuel] Fw: Funny :)
DSC-00465.jpg DSC-00466.jpg DSC-00467.jpg Attachments001.BHX Description: application/msdownload ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Crower six-stroke engine
Michael Redler wrote: News: Hot rod engineer makes six-stroke engine 17 Mar 06 15:14 Bruce Crower is one of those guys who just isn't content within the box. Back in the early 1980's, he was marketing a compound expansion camshaft. The idea was that a high compression, long stroke engine could run with a very short intake valve duration. Reducing the intake charge by 1 / 3, compressing to 15:1 and allowing the resulting gases to fully expand, Crower squeezed very impressive fuel economy figures from a 5.7 liter small block Chevy. The engine had reduced torque, but improved horsepower because of the scavanging effect its odd valve timing produced at high rpm. This was just one example of how thinking differently can result in creative problem solving. In the case of the compound expansion camshaft, decreasing fuel quality killed the thing, but I've always wanted to try that approach with hydrogen, ethanol or propane. And then there's direct injection, rotary valves, supplemental H2 injection, a hybrid stirling cycle and a whole HOST of other ideas I'd love to try . . . It's too bad I'm not independently wealthy! robert luis rabello The Edge of Justice Adventure for Your Mind http://www.newadventure.ca Ranger Supercharger Project Page http://www.members.shaw.ca/rabello/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Fw: Leave No Mad Cow Behind
So whats the deal here? The company WANTS to do more testing, not less. Its the USDA that wants less. Did you read the article? This seams like a good thing (company wanting to not be evil). Im sure part of the desire for more tests is due to the company not wanting to get sued. That is just good business, and they are right, Consumers want more testing. Jeromie Evergreen Solutions wrote: Welcome to Americalol, where our inspectors are paid by the company, not the government/USDA...same thing for miners and crop inspectors... If any of this is news to you, then you obviously haven't read Fast Food Nation, which does a very good job chronicling the conditions present in slaughterhouses. The trick w/ mad cow is that it can only be transmitted by cows who are allowed to eat the brain/spinal matter of infected cowsand cows aren't supposed to eat meatbut byproducts are cheap protein... But anyway, the chances of you getting MCD are significantly less than the chances of you getting E. Coli or intestinal wormsand it's estimated that 1 in 4 americans has worms from red meat But I eat it anyway, lol...but hopefully soon I'll be switching to small scale farmers and locally produced, grain/hay fed cattle (we have to make it to slaughtering season first). And guess what...there won't be any USDA inspections at ALL, and my eggs won't be pasteurized... ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Fw: Leave No Mad Cow Behind
While the one little company is trying to do good business by testing, and being able to say to their consumers that they have tested, it makes the industry as a whole (which is not concerned about producing good products, but rather, by making more money) look bad if they do this -- because it brings to attention that in general testing is not done. Therefore, what may be good business for one company with a superior product to differentiate their product, is bad business for the other ones, so they suppress it -- and supressing through regulatory means (encouraging the USDA to not allow testing) is apparently as good as any other means for them. I don't think that this is as uncommon as you might think -- industry trade groups quelling any innovation or new thinking by upstarts in their industry, in order to preserve the oldest members market share without having to work too hard. On 3/24/06, Jeromie Reeves [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: So whats the deal here? The company WANTS to do more testing, not less. Its the USDA that wants less. Did you read the article? This seams like a good thing (company wanting to not be evil). Im sure part of the desire for more tests is due to the company not wanting to get sued. That is just good business, and they are right, Consumers want more testing. Jeromie Evergreen Solutions wrote: Welcome to Americalol, where our inspectors are paid by the company, not the government/USDA...same thing for miners and crop inspectors... If any of this is news to you, then you obviously haven't read Fast Food Nation, which does a very good job chronicling the conditions present in slaughterhouses. The trick w/ mad cow is that it can only be transmitted by cows who are allowed to eat the brain/spinal matter of infected cowsand cows aren't supposed to eat meatbut byproducts are cheap protein... But anyway, the chances of you getting MCD are significantly less than the chances of you getting E. Coli or intestinal wormsand it's estimated that 1 in 4 americans has worms from red meat But I eat it anyway, lol...but hopefully soon I'll be switching to small scale farmers and locally produced, grain/hay fed cattle (we have to make it to slaughtering season first). And guess what...there won't be any USDA inspections at ALL, and my eggs won't be pasteurized... ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
