[OSM-talk] OpenStreetCam plugin

[James]

I've noticed that the arrow for each segment seems to be a bit random and
not actually pointing in the direction the camera is pointed in which can
make it hard to determine which imagery is which
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Re: [OSM-talk] Spam reporting

[James]

In those cases I just forward it to the DWG which can delete/ban the user
for repeated spam.

On Feb 24, 2017 6:28 AM, "Oleksiy Muzalyev" 
wrote:

> Here is a new spam entry, from February 23, 2017:
>
> http://www.openstreetmap.org/user/velpatasvir/diary
>
> It is an entry in Russian language but written via Google translator. It
> advertising some medicament produced in India.
>
> I do not see how I can remove or report it.
>
> Best regards,
> Oleksiy
>
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Re: [OSM-talk] SHA-1 collision announced by Google

[James]

It's been known for a while that sha1 can generate duplicates. What next
the announcement that MD5s have collisions too?

On Feb 24, 2017 3:39 PM, "Pine W"  wrote:

If you develop or run software that uses SHA-1, here's another reason to
upgrade to a more secure algorithm:

https://security.googleblog.com/2017/02/announcing-first-sha1-collision.html

Pine

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Re: [OSM-talk] SHA-1 collision announced by Google

[James]

The only one that wouldn't have collisions would be to hash every single
bit to produce a 1:1 copy of the file(pretty useless) or bigger. So yes all
hashes can create collisions, its more on the probability that it happens
to be as low as possible

On Feb 25, 2017 8:36 AM, "Nicolás Alvarez" <nicolas.alva...@gmail.com>
wrote:

> All hashes by their nature can have collisions. The news is there is a
> practical way to intentionally generate them. It's the first time this is
> done for SHA-1, at least publicly announced (it wouldn't surprise me if the
> NSA had secret techniques and computing power to do it already).
>
> On Feb 25, 2017, at 10:21, James <james2...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> It's been known for a while that sha1 can generate duplicates. What next
> the announcement that MD5s have collisions too?
>
> On Feb 24, 2017 3:39 PM, "Pine W" <wiki.p...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> If you develop or run software that uses SHA-1, here's another reason to
> upgrade to a more secure algorithm:
>
> https://security.googleblog.com/2017/02/announcing-first-sha
> 1-collision.html
>
> Pine
>
>
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Re: [OSM-talk] No changeset discussion box - Modified via wheelmap.org?

[James]

wasn't it like 30 minutes without activity it'll close?

On Wed, Mar 1, 2017 at 8:40 AM, Jakob Mühldorfer 
wrote:

> Hi Dave,
>
> this is usualy the case when the CS is not closed yet.
> https://help.openstreetmap.org/questions/29981/what-is-an-open-changeset
> Should be available after a while, but not sure the exact number until CS
> are automatically closed any more.
>
> Jakob
>
>
>
> Am 01.03.2017 um 14:33 schrieb Dave F:
>
>> Hi
>>
>> This changeset has no discussion box:
>> https://www.openstreetmap.org/changeset/46492338
>>
>> The user's other edits does. Is it due to it being via wheelmap
>> (created_by rosemary v0.4.4)?
>>
>> DaveF
>>
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Re: [OSM-talk] Fwd: [Wikidata] Significant change: new data type for geoshapes

[James]

very nice.

On Wed, Mar 29, 2017 at 2:39 PM, Pine W  wrote:

> Forwarding.
>
> Pine
>
>
> -- Forwarded message --
> From: Léa Lacroix 
> Date: Wed, Mar 29, 2017 at 4:34 AM
> Subject: [Wikidata] Significant change: new data type for geoshapes
> To: wikidata-t...@lists.wikimedia.org, "Discussion list for the Wikidata
> project." , pywiki...@lists.wikimedia.org
>
>
> Hello all,
>
> We’ve been working on a new data type that allows you to link to the 
> *geographical
> shapes* that are now stored on Commons. This data type will be deployed
> on Wikidata on *April 17th*.
>
> This data type refers to the geographical shapes that are enabled on
> Wikimedia Commons since the beginning of this year. Here you can find
> more information about this .
>
> The property creators will be able to create properties with this geoshape
> data type by selecting “Geographical shape” in the data type list.
>
> When the property is created, you can use it in statements, and when
> filling the value, if you start typing a string, you can choose the name of
> a geoshape in the list of what exists on Commons.
>
> [image: Screenshot test geoshape in Wikidata.png]
> 
>
>
> One thing to note: We currently do not export statements that use this
> datatype to RDF. They can therefore not be queried in the Wikidata Query
> Service. The reason is that we are still waiting for geoshapes to get
> stable URIs. This is handled in this ticket
> .
>
> Before the deployment, you can test it on http://test.wikidata.org (see
> for example the property “geotest” on Q22
> ).
> If you have any question, feel free to ask!
>
> Cheers,
>
> --
> Léa Lacroix
> Project Manager Community Communication for Wikidata
>
> Wikimedia Deutschland e.V.
> Tempelhofer Ufer 23-24
> 10963 Berlin
> www.wikimedia.de
>
> Wikimedia Deutschland - Gesellschaft zur Förderung Freien Wissens e. V.
>
> Eingetragen im Vereinsregister des Amtsgerichts Berlin-Charlottenburg
> unter der Nummer 23855 Nz. Als gemeinnützig anerkannt durch das Finanzamt
> für Körperschaften I Berlin, Steuernummer 27/029/42207.
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Re: [OSM-talk] Fixing broken multipolygons, some notes

[James]

Also if I remember correctly the whole point was to optimize/be able to
process osm data faster by not having to deal with so many errors(each case
can slow down the processing)

On Mar 19, 2017 7:23 AM, "Martin Koppenhoefer" 
wrote:

>
>
> sent from a phone
>
> > On 19 Mar 2017, at 10:03, Andreas Vilén  wrote:
> >
> > The main problem with Corine is that oftentimes the landuse data
> overlaps villages (which I found when I mapped mountain villages in
> southern Spain last week as well)
>
>
> whenever looking closeup at any corine data it was hardly possible to see
> the same borders they have in the aerial imagery. Often they resemble, but
> never (in the cases I looked at) the border was drawn where I'd expect a
> human mapper to draw it. The data doesn't seem suitable for small scale
> maps (small scale is what you typically observe on the ground)
>
> Cheers,
> Martin
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Re: [OSM-talk] Responding to vandalism

[James]

Even if we had a Git pull request sort of mechanism, who would "approve"
edits? DWG? They are volunteers and wouldn't have time to validate the
millions of changesets that would come in. On the opposite end of the
spectrum, people could just flat out deny good edits which would make many
leave. Putting a restriction on "new" accounts is easily bypassable by
creating an account make a couple(30+ good changesets(very small)) wait a
couple days, then deface the map. The more restrictions you put, the
smarter people will get (just look at CAPTCHA, for bots, people would
upload images of captchas to a service which real people would solve and
return the answer to the bots). It's OPENStreetMap, not CLOSEDStreetMap

On Thu, Mar 16, 2017 at 10:48 AM, Clifford Snow 
wrote:

>
> On Thu, Mar 16, 2017 at 6:47 AM, Manohar Erikipati 
> wrote:
>
>> - DWG currently acts promptly on incidents reported via email, but we
>> need a more accessible mechanism that allows new users to report such
>> incidents directly from the website or editors. The email details and
>> existence of DWG, is only available currently in the wiki [3]
>
> - Auto-blocking known vandals to prevent repeated attacks [4]
>
> - An organised repository to report and learn from previous attacks. There
>> seems to have been an effort to do this many years ago on the wiki [5]
>
> - More visibility, awareness of QA tools and history tab on the OSM
>> homepage. Most of the really powerful QA tools like osmhv and osmose are
>> only known to advanced users.
>
>
>
>> It would be great to hear more approaches that could protect the map
>> against common mistakes and intentional attacks. Much of the world lacks an
>> active mapping community, so it is up to a small set of power mappers to
>> catch and revert most of the bad edits [6]. Building better support systems
>> to respond to bad edits could help more experienced mappers focus on
>> community building activities.
>
>
> Manohar,
> My experience is most of these edits can be cleaned up easily with simple
> edits. Some need full reverting, which can be done using JOSM, while others
> need careful pruning of the bad but leaving the good. I've fixed numerous
> pokemon edits in Washington State. I've only had to go to DWG 2or 3 time. I
> don't think we need to involve DWG in every case.
>
> I've send changeset comments and messages. Other than one belligerent
> individual who promised to report me if I kept reverting his phony edits,
> I've never heard back from any of them. There have been a number of example
> of appropriate changeset comments posted on talk and talk-us that let the
> mapper know the behavior isn't appreciated but also encourages them to
> become an active contributor. I suspect pokemon players could become
> prolific mappers.
>
> A tool that flags new parks, don't just look for named parks, but all
> parks - some of the players haven't gotten the word that it's only named
> parks, and new water features would be useful. Right now Ian Dees has a bot
> running on slack [1] and IRC[2] that picks up new users from the changeset
> feed. Sure it would be nice of someone could develop a similar bot to watch
> for new users adding pokemon features. But until we have that tool we
> really need to encourage more people to watch edits in their area.
>
> Best,
> Clifford
>
> [1] https://osmus.slack.com/messages/new-mappers
> [2]  irc://irc.oftc.net #osm-bot
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --
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>
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Re: [OSM-talk] Responding to vandalism

[James]

People can't even be bothered to review osmcha, you think people will want
to approve changesets?

On Mar 16, 2017 1:07 PM, "Sebastiaan Couwenberg" <sebas...@xs4all.nl> wrote:

> On 03/16/2017 05:30 PM, James wrote:
> > and maintainers privileges, would be determined by whom? Other
> maintainers?
>
> Yes, the local community grants that privilege.
>
> When the local community is dysfunctional there is the overriding
> authority of OSMF WGs like DWG. Like we have the Technical Commitee in
> Debian or General Resolutions (project wide votes).
>
> > Then you have whats going on on Wikipedia Fr where it's controlled by a
> > small group of close friends that refuse anything outside their norms,
> > which is bad.
>
> Wikipedia is not a model that one should choose to model, Linux
> distributions are a much better role model.
>
> Kind Regards,
>
> Bas
>
> --
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Re: [OSM-talk] Responding to vandalism

[James]

and maintainers privileges, would be determined by whom? Other maintainers?
Then you have whats going on on Wikipedia Fr where it's controlled by a
small group of close friends that refuse anything outside their norms,
which is bad.

On Thu, Mar 16, 2017 at 12:17 PM, Bas Couwenberg <sebas...@xs4all.nl> wrote:

> On 2017-03-16 16:01, James wrote:
>
>> Even if we had a Git pull request sort of mechanism, who would "approve"
>> edits?
>>
>
> Anyone with maintainer priviledges in the respective local community. This
> privilege is earned by proving skill.
>
> Kind Regards,
>
> Bas
>
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Re: [OSM-talk] What can we offer local government?

[James]

The city of Ottawa already uses OSM in their opendata portal:
http://data.ottawa.ca/dataset/sledding-hills
http://data.ottawa.ca/dataset/neighbourhood-names
http://data.ottawa.ca/dataset/airport-runways
etc etc
But I doubt they know/care as their portal was built by a consultant and
not them.

On Wed, Mar 15, 2017 at 6:31 AM, joost schouppe 
wrote:

> Hi John,
>
> The page Clifford shared is of course an excellent resource (I started the
> article :)
> But your remarks are not very government-specific, so you probably won't
> find an answer there.
>
>
>
>> Both locations use more than one language.  Both seemed unaware that the
>>> map can be in languages other than English.  Apparently politically this
>>> can be very important.
>>>
>>
> There's many projects working on that problem. In Belgium we have a
> famously complicated situation. Especially Brussels is interesting, where
> both French and Dutch are used in the name=* field, split by " - " and with
> language in more or less random order. We're working on mono-lingual tiles
> to help with that:
> http://tile.openstreetmap.be/#map=12/50.84366/4.39113
>
>
>>
>>> Using R R.org apparently we can count things in the map.  Why anyone
>>> would want to do this is a mystery to me but apparently statistians make
>>> money from it so it must be useful to someone. Possibly local governments?
>>>
>>
> There are many ways to count thing on a map :)
> Just a random example: you might want to make a classification of
> different kinds of neighborhoods (sleeper village, city center,
> agricultural area, holiday area). You can do that completely automated for
> a whole country using OSM data (if it is complete enough)
>
>
> The contact from Ottawa was aware that the city paid for the maps it used
>>> on some of their web sites but wasn't sure about using OSM instead, the
>>> idea of not having a contract would be difficult to get across.
>>>
>>>
> Well yes, and there is no such thing as a free lunch. There are limits to
> the use of OSM.org tiles. Running your own tile server is often deemed too
> complicated by local governments. For bigger websites, they will often look
> at the likes of Mapbox.
>
>
>> Anyone any examples of how local government is using OSM?
>>>
>>
> What Clifford said :)
>
>
>> I understand part of the City of Ottawa, Ottawa Hydro does use OSM on its
>>> web site by the way.  Something my contact was unaware of.
>>>
>>>
> Typically, one branch of government has no clue what another branch is
> doing.
>
>
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> OpenStreetMap  |
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>  | Meetup
> 
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Re: [OSM-talk] What can we offer local government?

[James]

Baby steps First you get people using OSM as background maps(instead of
google), then maybe people will start to see  that you can do a lot more
with OSM data than just a background map.

On Wed, Mar 15, 2017 at 9:41 AM, joost schouppe <joost.schou...@gmail.com>
wrote:

> On the one hand, I find the use of OSM as a background map a slightly
> boring use-case. I'd like to see gov use actual data.
>
> On the other hand, it can actually be controversial within organisations.
> Because people will complain to the local government if they notice
> mistakes in the background map. So then government employees have to
> explain that that's not their job to fix, or maybe even actually fix things
> in OSM themselves.
> And you might also have a basemap built within the government services,
> which of course the data managers want to see used, if only to be able to
> get the public to point out mistakes.
>
> 2017-03-15 13:52 GMT+01:00 john whelan <jwhelan0...@gmail.com>:
>
>> Nice one James.
>>
>> Thanks John
>>
>> On 15 March 2017 at 08:38, James <james2...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> The city of Ottawa already uses OSM in their opendata portal:
>>> http://data.ottawa.ca/dataset/sledding-hills
>>> http://data.ottawa.ca/dataset/neighbourhood-names
>>> http://data.ottawa.ca/dataset/airport-runways
>>> etc etc
>>> But I doubt they know/care as their portal was built by a consultant and
>>> not them.
>>>
>>> On Wed, Mar 15, 2017 at 6:31 AM, joost schouppe <
>>> joost.schou...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Hi John,
>>>>
>>>> The page Clifford shared is of course an excellent resource (I started
>>>> the article :)
>>>> But your remarks are not very government-specific, so you probably
>>>> won't find an answer there.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Both locations use more than one language.  Both seemed unaware that
>>>>>> the map can be in languages other than English.  Apparently politically
>>>>>> this can be very important.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>> There's many projects working on that problem. In Belgium we have a
>>>> famously complicated situation. Especially Brussels is interesting, where
>>>> both French and Dutch are used in the name=* field, split by " - " and with
>>>> language in more or less random order. We're working on mono-lingual tiles
>>>> to help with that:
>>>> http://tile.openstreetmap.be/#map=12/50.84366/4.39113
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> Using R R.org apparently we can count things in the map.  Why anyone
>>>>>> would want to do this is a mystery to me but apparently statistians make
>>>>>> money from it so it must be useful to someone. Possibly local 
>>>>>> governments?
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>> There are many ways to count thing on a map :)
>>>> Just a random example: you might want to make a classification of
>>>> different kinds of neighborhoods (sleeper village, city center,
>>>> agricultural area, holiday area). You can do that completely automated for
>>>> a whole country using OSM data (if it is complete enough)
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> The contact from Ottawa was aware that the city paid for the maps it
>>>>>> used on some of their web sites but wasn't sure about using OSM instead,
>>>>>> the idea of not having a contract would be difficult to get across.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>> Well yes, and there is no such thing as a free lunch. There are limits
>>>> to the use of OSM.org tiles. Running your own tile server is often deemed
>>>> too complicated by local governments. For bigger websites, they will often
>>>> look at the likes of Mapbox.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Anyone any examples of how local government is using OSM?
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>> What Clifford said :)
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> I understand part of the City of Ottawa, Ottawa Hydro does use OSM on
>>>>>> its web site by the way.  Something my contact was unaware of.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>> Typically, one branch of government has no clue what another branch is
>>>> doing.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Joost Schouppe
>>>> OpenStreetMap <http://www.openstreetmap.org/user/joost%20schouppe/> |
>>>> Twitter <https://twitter.com/joostjakob> | LinkedIn
>>>> <https://www.linkedin.com/pub/joost-schouppe/48/939/603> | Meetup
>>>> <http://www.meetup.com/OpenStreetMap-Belgium/members/97979802/>
>>>>
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>>>>
>>>
>>>
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>>>
>>
>>
>
>
> --
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> OpenStreetMap <http://www.openstreetmap.org/user/joost%20schouppe/> |
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Re: [OSM-talk] Appropriate attribution to OSM in a mobile app

[James]

OSMAnd doesnt even have an attribution on map. There are multiple reference
to OSM/OSM editing in settings, but thats about it.

I'm aware it has "OSM" in the name, but still doesnt resolve the
attribution...

On Mar 20, 2017 7:01 AM, "Christoph Hormann"  wrote:

> On Monday 20 March 2017, Martin Koppenhoefer wrote:
> >
> > In a real world example, I have found an app which does credit OSM at
> > the bottom of the first screen (relatively tiny, I'd say same size as
> > is done in apps who provide constant attribution), but it vanishes as
> > soon as you move the map (i.e. almost instantly because you always
> > move the map). Also this attribution doesn't link or mention the ODbL
> > in any way.
> >
> > The other way to see OSM attribution is after clicking on settings,
> > then on about and then on "legal" (i.e. it is very hidden). The map
> > is the main feature of this app (its a tourist map guide).
>
> The ODbL is fairly clear on that in principle
>
> "You must include a notice associated with the Produced Work reasonably
> calculated to make any Person that uses, views, accesses, interacts
> with, or is otherwise exposed to the Produced Work aware that Content
> was obtained from the Database"
>
> There is a continuum of possibilities between flashing the attribution
> in tiny letters at the bottom for half a second during startup and
> having it displayed in big letters all the time.
>
> Quite often the situation is simple because other credits (like for the
> app creator or advertisements of any kind) are shown more prominently -
> this is not all right obviously.
>
> In most apps there are other good possibilities to make the user aware
> of OSM as a data source - like during other activities than plain map
> browsing - than an always on message on the map display.  Of course
> many app developers do not look for a good way to do this but just look
> for the least generous way to avoid getting sued.
>
> --
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> http://www.imagico.de/
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Re: [OSM-talk] Looking for "primary language" map

[James]

John I meant the name itself: Jeanne d'arc weather you say boulevard or
Boulevard it's pronounciation should be french same with Des Forest,
Decarie, Chateau, Charlemagne.
But then you have really english names like Tenth Line, Pheonix, Aquaview,
etc

So as I said generalizing won't help as well as south Montreal is very very
very English.

On Apr 10, 2017 8:59 PM, "john whelan" <jwhelan0...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Orleans is part of Ottawa and all street names signs are bilingual or in
> the process of being replaced by bilingual ones.  Certainly the street I
> live on in Orleans has a bilingual street name sign.  The English French
> question is very much political in Canada and I suspect much of the world.
>
> Montreal has a quite large English speaking community which is rare in
> Quebec.
>
> You could try looking at the street names to see if they are in English
> and have a second language name as well. name:fr for example.
>
> Cheerio John
>
> On 10 April 2017 at 20:47, James <james2...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Well it might not be as simple as you say...take for instance Ottawa.
>> It's in Ontario and pretty english. There is a suburb called Orléans in
>> which is pretty much "the french part of town" as most street signs will be
>> in french, but rest of Ottawa is pretty English(in terms of street signs)
>>
>>  So generilizing wont help you much...
>>
>> On Apr 10, 2017 8:27 PM, "Yuri Astrakhan" <yuriastrak...@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Exactly, and that's the map I need -- a set of shapes that define these
>>> region mapping: Quebec+New Brunswick => fr, the rest of USA/Canada => en,
>>> ...
>>> The shapes may overlap because that would make geojson smaller - I will
>>> simply use the first one.
>>>
>>> Having this map will allow me to determine the likely language of the
>>> "name" tag for any location, which in turn make for a better multilingual
>>> map.
>>>
>>> On Mon, Apr 10, 2017 at 8:20 PM James <james2...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Well many countries have multiple official languages, Canada is French
>>>> and English, but in practice is mostly Quebec and New brunswick...with
>>>> small patches of french throughout the rest
>>>>
>>>> On Apr 10, 2017 8:12 PM, "Yuri Astrakhan" <yuriastrak...@gmail.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> James, thanks, but I was hoping for the language regions shapefile,
>>>> e.g. in the GeoJSON form.  The list of official languages will require a
>>>> lot of work to convert into the merged shapes, and it still not very good,
>>>> as many countries have several official languages, e.g. Switzerland.
>>>>
>>>> On Mon, Apr 10, 2017 at 7:55 PM James <james2...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Also have you checked: https://en.wikipedia.
>>>> org/wiki/List_of_official_languages_by_country_and_territory
>>>>
>>>> On Apr 10, 2017 7:50 PM, "James" <james2...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> More like French for the entirety of the province of Quebec
>>>>
>>>> On Apr 10, 2017 7:38 PM, "Yuri Astrakhan" <yuriastrak...@gmail.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Does anyone know of an open source language map - basically a set of
>>>> geoshapes with the corresponding language code?  Country boundaries are not
>>>> needed - e.g. Canada and USA would be English with the exception of French
>>>> for Montreal area.
>>>>
>>>> This is needed to guesstimate what language the "name" tag is in.
>>>>
>>>> Does not have to be very precise (10-20 MB is more than enough)
>>>>
>>>> ___
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>>>> talk@openstreetmap.org
>>>> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
>>>>
>>>>
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Re: [OSM-talk] Looking for "primary language" map

[James]

More like French for the entirety of the province of Quebec

On Apr 10, 2017 7:38 PM, "Yuri Astrakhan"  wrote:

> Does anyone know of an open source language map - basically a set of
> geoshapes with the corresponding language code?  Country boundaries are not
> needed - e.g. Canada and USA would be English with the exception of French
> for Montreal area.
>
> This is needed to guesstimate what language the "name" tag is in.
>
> Does not have to be very precise (10-20 MB is more than enough)
>
> ___
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> talk@openstreetmap.org
> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
>
>
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Re: [OSM-talk] Looking for "primary language" map

[James]

You could try to look at the street qualifiers ex. Rue, boulevard, cercle,
croissant,etc placed before the street name would be french where as
English places it after the name

Xyz street
rue Xyz

On Apr 10, 2017 9:07 PM, "James" <james2...@gmail.com> wrote:

> John I meant the name itself: Jeanne d'arc weather you say boulevard or
> Boulevard it's pronounciation should be french same with Des Forest,
> Decarie, Chateau, Charlemagne.
> But then you have really english names like Tenth Line, Pheonix, Aquaview,
> etc
>
> So as I said generalizing won't help as well as south Montreal is very
> very very English.
>
> On Apr 10, 2017 8:59 PM, "john whelan" <jwhelan0...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Orleans is part of Ottawa and all street names signs are bilingual or in
>> the process of being replaced by bilingual ones.  Certainly the street I
>> live on in Orleans has a bilingual street name sign.  The English French
>> question is very much political in Canada and I suspect much of the world.
>>
>> Montreal has a quite large English speaking community which is rare in
>> Quebec.
>>
>> You could try looking at the street names to see if they are in English
>> and have a second language name as well. name:fr for example.
>>
>> Cheerio John
>>
>> On 10 April 2017 at 20:47, James <james2...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Well it might not be as simple as you say...take for instance Ottawa.
>>> It's in Ontario and pretty english. There is a suburb called Orléans in
>>> which is pretty much "the french part of town" as most street signs will be
>>> in french, but rest of Ottawa is pretty English(in terms of street signs)
>>>
>>>  So generilizing wont help you much...
>>>
>>> On Apr 10, 2017 8:27 PM, "Yuri Astrakhan" <yuriastrak...@gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Exactly, and that's the map I need -- a set of shapes that define these
>>>> region mapping: Quebec+New Brunswick => fr, the rest of USA/Canada => en,
>>>> ...
>>>> The shapes may overlap because that would make geojson smaller - I will
>>>> simply use the first one.
>>>>
>>>> Having this map will allow me to determine the likely language of the
>>>> "name" tag for any location, which in turn make for a better multilingual
>>>> map.
>>>>
>>>> On Mon, Apr 10, 2017 at 8:20 PM James <james2...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Well many countries have multiple official languages, Canada is French
>>>>> and English, but in practice is mostly Quebec and New brunswick...with
>>>>> small patches of french throughout the rest
>>>>>
>>>>> On Apr 10, 2017 8:12 PM, "Yuri Astrakhan" <yuriastrak...@gmail.com>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> James, thanks, but I was hoping for the language regions shapefile,
>>>>> e.g. in the GeoJSON form.  The list of official languages will require a
>>>>> lot of work to convert into the merged shapes, and it still not very good,
>>>>> as many countries have several official languages, e.g. Switzerland.
>>>>>
>>>>> On Mon, Apr 10, 2017 at 7:55 PM James <james2...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Also have you checked: https://en.wikipedia.
>>>>> org/wiki/List_of_official_languages_by_country_and_territory
>>>>>
>>>>> On Apr 10, 2017 7:50 PM, "James" <james2...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> More like French for the entirety of the province of Quebec
>>>>>
>>>>> On Apr 10, 2017 7:38 PM, "Yuri Astrakhan" <yuriastrak...@gmail.com>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Does anyone know of an open source language map - basically a set of
>>>>> geoshapes with the corresponding language code?  Country boundaries are 
>>>>> not
>>>>> needed - e.g. Canada and USA would be English with the exception of French
>>>>> for Montreal area.
>>>>>
>>>>> This is needed to guesstimate what language the "name" tag is in.
>>>>>
>>>>> Does not have to be very precise (10-20 MB is more than enough)
>>>>>
>>>>> ___
>>>>> talk mailing list
>>>>> talk@openstreetmap.org
>>>>> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
>>>>>
>>>>>
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>>>
>>>
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Re: [OSM-talk] Looking for "primary language" map

[James]

Well it might not be as simple as you say...take for instance Ottawa. It's
in Ontario and pretty english. There is a suburb called Orléans in which is
pretty much "the french part of town" as most street signs will be in
french, but rest of Ottawa is pretty English(in terms of street signs)

 So generilizing wont help you much...

On Apr 10, 2017 8:27 PM, "Yuri Astrakhan" <yuriastrak...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Exactly, and that's the map I need -- a set of shapes that define these
> region mapping: Quebec+New Brunswick => fr, the rest of USA/Canada => en,
> ...
> The shapes may overlap because that would make geojson smaller - I will
> simply use the first one.
>
> Having this map will allow me to determine the likely language of the
> "name" tag for any location, which in turn make for a better multilingual
> map.
>
> On Mon, Apr 10, 2017 at 8:20 PM James <james2...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Well many countries have multiple official languages, Canada is French
>> and English, but in practice is mostly Quebec and New brunswick...with
>> small patches of french throughout the rest
>>
>> On Apr 10, 2017 8:12 PM, "Yuri Astrakhan" <yuriastrak...@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>> James, thanks, but I was hoping for the language regions shapefile, e.g.
>> in the GeoJSON form.  The list of official languages will require a lot of
>> work to convert into the merged shapes, and it still not very good, as many
>> countries have several official languages, e.g. Switzerland.
>>
>> On Mon, Apr 10, 2017 at 7:55 PM James <james2...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> Also have you checked: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_official_
>> languages_by_country_and_territory
>>
>> On Apr 10, 2017 7:50 PM, "James" <james2...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> More like French for the entirety of the province of Quebec
>>
>> On Apr 10, 2017 7:38 PM, "Yuri Astrakhan" <yuriastrak...@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>> Does anyone know of an open source language map - basically a set of
>> geoshapes with the corresponding language code?  Country boundaries are not
>> needed - e.g. Canada and USA would be English with the exception of French
>> for Montreal area.
>>
>> This is needed to guesstimate what language the "name" tag is in.
>>
>> Does not have to be very precise (10-20 MB is more than enough)
>>
>> ___
>> talk mailing list
>> talk@openstreetmap.org
>> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
>>
>>
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Re: [OSM-talk] The Top Ten Tasks list

[James]

it's because http://www.CAcert.org(CAcert Inc.) is not in the recognized
issuers of your browser. It's like having a self-signed certificate.

On Fri, Apr 7, 2017 at 7:21 AM, Éric Gillet 
wrote:

> 2017-04-07 12:11 GMT+02:00 David Earl :
>
>> The link https://pads.ccc.de/k4rlFOGIHb reports an invalid https
>> certificate!
>>
>
> Worksforme
>
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Re: [OSM-talk] The Top Ten Tasks list

[James]

see my previous email about the root certificate authority not being a
trusted source of issuing certificates. Your connection is still encrypted
like a self-signed certificate, but because the browser hasn't added the
root CA to their list of trusted CAs that comply with the practices/audits
it tells you that it's "insecure"

On Fri, Apr 7, 2017 at 7:35 AM, john whelan  wrote:

> >Worksforme
>
> Whether it works or not is not the point.  It definitely shows an invalid
> certificate for me. This is simply poor security practise.
>
> Cheerio John
>
> On 7 April 2017 at 07:21, Éric Gillet  wrote:
>
>> 2017-04-07 12:11 GMT+02:00 David Earl :
>>
>>> The link https://pads.ccc.de/k4rlFOGIHb reports an invalid https
>>> certificate!
>>>
>>
>> Worksforme
>>
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>>
>
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Re: [OSM-talk] Looking for "primary language" map

[James]

Also have you checked:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_official_languages_by_country_and_territory

On Apr 10, 2017 7:50 PM, "James" <james2...@gmail.com> wrote:

> More like French for the entirety of the province of Quebec
>
> On Apr 10, 2017 7:38 PM, "Yuri Astrakhan" <yuriastrak...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Does anyone know of an open source language map - basically a set of
>> geoshapes with the corresponding language code?  Country boundaries are not
>> needed - e.g. Canada and USA would be English with the exception of French
>> for Montreal area.
>>
>> This is needed to guesstimate what language the "name" tag is in.
>>
>> Does not have to be very precise (10-20 MB is more than enough)
>>
>> ___
>> talk mailing list
>> talk@openstreetmap.org
>> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
>>
>>
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Re: [OSM-talk] Looking for "primary language" map

[James]

Well many countries have multiple official languages, Canada is French and
English, but in practice is mostly Quebec and New brunswick...with small
patches of french throughout the rest

On Apr 10, 2017 8:12 PM, "Yuri Astrakhan" <yuriastrak...@gmail.com> wrote:

> James, thanks, but I was hoping for the language regions shapefile, e.g.
> in the GeoJSON form.  The list of official languages will require a lot of
> work to convert into the merged shapes, and it still not very good, as many
> countries have several official languages, e.g. Switzerland.
>
> On Mon, Apr 10, 2017 at 7:55 PM James <james2...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Also have you checked: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_official_
>> languages_by_country_and_territory
>>
>> On Apr 10, 2017 7:50 PM, "James" <james2...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> More like French for the entirety of the province of Quebec
>>
>> On Apr 10, 2017 7:38 PM, "Yuri Astrakhan" <yuriastrak...@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>> Does anyone know of an open source language map - basically a set of
>> geoshapes with the corresponding language code?  Country boundaries are not
>> needed - e.g. Canada and USA would be English with the exception of French
>> for Montreal area.
>>
>> This is needed to guesstimate what language the "name" tag is in.
>>
>> Does not have to be very precise (10-20 MB is more than enough)
>>
>> ___
>> talk mailing list
>> talk@openstreetmap.org
>> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
>>
>>
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Re: [OSM-talk] Coordinates in OSM. Really annoying

[James]

Could be for precision:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Decimal_degrees#Precision

On Fri, Apr 21, 2017 at 10:28 AM, Dave F 
wrote:

> Hi
>
> This is one of my OSM bugbears: http://osm.duschmarke.de/bbox.html
>
> Is there /really/ any need for *six* coordinate formats? It's hard enough
> to learn a new process without basics like this tripping you up. Is there
> any reason why the developers of these programs can't talk to each other &
> simplify the situation?
>
> Cheers
> DaveF.
>
> ---
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>
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Re: [OSM-talk] Auto whitespace removal?

[James]

Honestly, I'm not sure why this wasnt built into JOSM or P2 or ID for that
matter as strip functions are readily available if not, very easy to code

Maybe you should open a bug report to request the feature. I think JOSM
warns you about it but still would be nice to have strip() auto applied to
all strings

On Mar 11, 2017 10:39 AM, "Dave F"  wrote:

> P2
>
> Do other editors have the ability to strip?
> Is there any server-side data verification?
>
> On 11/03/2017 15:11, Andy Mabbett wrote:
>
>> On 11 March 2017 at 14:47, Dave F  wrote:
>>
>> As I'm repeatedly guilty of leaving leading & trailing whitespace in tags,
>>> I'm mildly embarrassed when others come & mop up after me. Even if it's
>>> done
>>> with a bot. Is there not a way to automatically strip these tags on
>>> upload?
>>>
>> What editing tool are you using.
>>
>>
>
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Re: [OSM-talk] European Data Portal declares the CC-BY 4.0 and ODbL 1.0 compatible

[James]

Bht are they the owners of the data or just relicensors of existing geodata
that's been distributed. We need to make sure that they own all the data
and that there are no third party rights involved.

On Aug 3, 2017 7:32 AM, "Maurizio Napolitano"  wrote:

I discovered today a service made by the  European Data Portal (EDP)
where you can find the list of all the most used license for open data
in Europe.
The service offers a long list where, for each entry, you can have a
short description about permissions and restrictions of each license
and also the compatibility with the others.
If you read the information about che CC-BY 4.0
https://www.europeandataportal.eu/en/content/show-license?license_
id=CC-BY4.0
you find on the list of the compatible licenses also the ODC-ODbL 1.0.

But, the License Working Group (LWG) of the OSM Foundation explained
that there are some issues between these 2 licenses
https://blog.openstreetmap.org/2017/03/17/use-of-cc-by-data/

and now the suggestion is to ask the permission to import the data
distributed under cc-by 4.0.
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B3PN5zfbzThqeTdWR1l3SzJVcTg/view

The decision of the LWG is born after a discussion with the staff of
the Creative Commons.

The European Data Portal is an important reference for all the public
administrations of Europe. For this reason I think that it's better
start a discussione with the EDP's staff to have a common vision.

What do you think about?
Ciao



--
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http://de.straba.us

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Re: [OSM-talk] Decline in accuracy of capture date metadata in Bing imagery

[James]

"Best is to only map areas that you visit and verify yourself"

And the email thread was hot osm webinar


On Jul 25, 2017 1:24 PM, "Christoph Hormann" <o...@imagico.de> wrote:

> On Tuesday 25 July 2017, James wrote:
> > Griping about it on the mailing list won't really solve anything.
>
> I just wanted to share the observation and maybe see if this is possibly
> something that varies regionally and others have a different experience
> with it.
>
> No big deal.
>
> > To paraphrase you from another email chain:
> > https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Good_practice#Do_Not_Trace_from_O
> >utdated_Imagery
>
> Not sure what you want to say with that - both the link and the
> reference to 'another email chain'.
>
> --
> Christoph Hormann
> http://www.imagico.de/
>
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Re: [OSM-talk] Mystery structure on a South China Sea reef

[James]

Sérgio, that's what they want you to think. There's a secret elevator that
leads to an underground bunker 

On Aug 1, 2017 2:41 PM, "Sérgio V."  wrote:

> It's also there with Digital Globe Premium at:
> 
> 
> http://www.openstreetmap.org/edit#map=18/8.35838/115.23794
> I bet (a beer) it's a single family's private resort:
> What you see is a small bungalow with a wooden deck, a small boat 5m to
> Northeast, and two big beach umbrellas (one for the couple, the other for
> the children), like these:
> The blue one:
>
>
> 
> 
> http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Blue-Jumbrella-Giant-Umbrella-
> Parasol-5x5M-Crank-Handle-Commercial-Quality/272772644331
>
> And the white one:
>
> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/7-meter-Deluxe-big-patio-
> umbrellas/1870364994.html
>
> - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
>
> Sérgio - http://www.openstreetmap.org/user/smaprs
>
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Re: [OSM-talk] DigitalGlobe imagery for OSM editing

[James]

It says on the imagery api website that the average is like ~2 years, but
some places are updated twice a year. So depends on your location.

On Wed, May 10, 2017 at 3:44 AM, Paul Johnson  wrote:

> On Tue, May 9, 2017 at 1:30 PM, Kevin Bullock 
> wrote:
>
>> On behalf of DigitalGlobe: I’m pleased to announce the availability of
>> two new imagery layers from DigitalGlobe. These are available now in the
>> new iD Editor 2.2. release and will be soon available in JOSM.
>>
>
> How frequently will this imagery be updated?
>
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Re: [OSM-talk] JOSM data upload change

[James]

might be your upload settings? Are you uploading 1 item at a time vs say
100 or full changeset?


On Thu, May 11, 2017 at 12:42 PM, Palolo  wrote:

> Yesterday I noticed that JOSM would display a count for each object as it
> uploaded.
> 
>
> I for a small edit session with 900 features this takes a long time, what
> changed?
>
>
>
> --
> View this message in context: http://gis.19327.n8.nabble.
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Re: [OSM-talk] DigitalGlobe imagery for OSM editing

[James]

Just so that it is more clear, do we have to subscribe(paid model) to have
access to the imagery to edit in ID/JOSM? As in we would need to sign in
with a paid account to access the imagery layer in JOSM/ID; or is this
provided much like Bing and Mapbox already have done and provide this
service for free(of course in the context of editing for OSM)?

On Tue, May 9, 2017 at 2:30 PM, Kevin Bullock 
wrote:

> On behalf of DigitalGlobe: I’m pleased to announce the availability of two
> new imagery layers from DigitalGlobe. These are available now in the new iD
> Editor 2.2. release and will be soon available in JOSM.
>
> Longer read here: https://www.openstreetmap.org/user/@kevin_
> bullock/diary/41132
>
> Sincerely, Kevin Bullock
>
> https://www.openstreetmap.org/user/@kevin_bullock
> https://twitter.com/kevin_bullock
>
>
> This electronic communication and any attachments may contain confidential
> and proprietary information of DigitalGlobe, Inc. If you are not the
> intended recipient, or an agent or employee responsible for delivering this
> communication to the intended recipient, or if you have received this
> communication in error, please do not print, copy, retransmit, disseminate
> or otherwise use the information. Please indicate to the sender that you
> have received this communication in error, and delete the copy you
> received.
>
> DigitalGlobe reserves the right to monitor any electronic communication
> sent or received by its employees, agents or representatives.
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Re: [OSM-talk] If you run an instance HOT's OSM Tasking Manager 2 please read

[James]

how2fix?


On Tue, May 16, 2017 at 7:21 AM, Blake Girardot  wrote:

> Greetings,
>
> A security vulnerability has been identified in the latest version of
> the OSM Tasking Manager 2.
>
> Please contact me directly, off list and I will pass on the
> information on how to fix the issue.
>
> We will update the code in our GitHub repository in 2 weeks, but are
> holding off to give users time to make the fix locally first.
>
> Regards,
> Blake
>
> --
> 
> Blake Girardot
> HOTOSM Member - https://hotosm.org/users/blake_girardot
> skype: jblakegirardot
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Re: [OSM-talk] JOSM data upload change

[James]

Happened to me before during and upgrade. :)

On Thu, May 11, 2017 at 2:14 PM, Palolo <vaoma...@gmail.com> wrote:

> @James-2 Thanks, it took me a while to find the setting in Advanced
> Preferences.
> I don't know how that got changed, but I'm back functioning now.
> Thanks
>
>
>
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Re: [OSM-talk] HDYC, login requirement and "privacy"

[James]

As Michal said, forcing login wont stop "those that want to cause harm".
They will just login and harvest the data. They can also just scrape the
osm data, so I dont think this is an issue with  HDYC as much it is a
privacy concern with OSM data itself.

If you dont want to be associated with your edits: create a generic account
that has nothing to do with your usual usernames i.e. AnonymousUser001 or
OSMUser001 and never communicate about the work done on that account with
your main profile/email. That way you dissociate yourself from that user
and your social media accounts.


If people cant find a link between personal identifyable info(facebook,
twitter, email, linkedin) and the editing user there is no cause for alarm.

Worst case they will say: Oh there's an osm user that lives in this
areaso do 35 other users.

Basic internet anonymity 101...

On May 4, 2017 4:51 PM, "Christoph Hormann"  wrote:

> On Thursday 04 May 2017, Nicolás Alvarez wrote:
> >
> > > Just to make this clear since there are likely quite a few people
> > > reading here who will not be able or willing to parse the
> > > discussion on the German forum - discussion there was about privacy
> > > concerns w.r.t. editing metadata, which is what is the basis of
> > > Mixing this with the subject of openness of geodata and
> > > privacy concerns reagarding geodata (like mappers recording names
> > > from the doors of private homes etc.) is not really appropriate -
> > > two very different matters which need to be considered separately.
> >
> > I don't think Michał was mixing those two different matters.
>
> Michał made a connection to privacy concerns regarding Google StreetView
> which were exclusively about the recorded data and not about the
> recording metadata (which Google obviously has no interest in
> publishing).
>
> --
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Re: [OSM-talk] HDYC, login requirement and "privacy"

[James]

> So you think the German community should be required to proactively
> communicate any subject they discuss in German language channels to the
> international community?

We have to do this for imports, the least you could have done is brought it
up on the talk mailing list.

On May 4, 2017 4:41 PM, "Michał Brzozowski"  wrote:

> So you think the German community should be required to proactively
> communicate any subject they discuss in German language channels to the
> international community?

I think the tools are _de facto_ used by the whole OSM community
worldwide, that's why I think any sort of announcement would be
appropriate. I am realistic.

> Well - HDYC is a tool offered by Pascal Neis, AFAIK it is not even open
> source.  Pascal could turn it off any time if he wanted to and of
> course he can also put up constraints.

Keep in mind that I don't make it appear that my requests are based on
something formal, they're not. I simply hope that people will tell him
they don't agree with me and two already did ;)

I think it also emphasizes how open-source tools are important. There
are tons of obscure analysis pages which don't have their source
available.

For starters, there's a little known program called ChangesetMD which
allows you to load changeset and discussion metadata to Postgres.
However, this is changeset only and one won't be able to do all of the
analyses (bboxes alone often are inaccurate, also no info on tags).

Michał

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Re: [OSM-talk] HDYC, login requirement and "privacy"

[James]

What Michal said. Any body can download the OSM data and run the same
analysis. You agreed to contribute to OSM, if you want your online
footprint to be non-existant: unplug your internet.

On Thu, May 4, 2017 at 3:33 PM, Michał Brzozowski 
wrote:

> Many know Pascal Neis' site HDYC which displays detais about an OSM
> user, like first created node, activity area, edit stats and so on:
>
> http://hdyc.neis-one.org/
>
> Today to view any stats of a user you have to login with OSM.
> Pascal replied to me that this is related to this discussion on the
> German users forum:
>
> https://forum.openstreetmap.org/viewtopic.php?id=57813
>
> I don't like the idea how this was never introduced and discussed
> outside of the German forum.
> I think that such "privacy" measures are futile and go against the
> spirit of OSM - transparency.
>
> Maybe this is due to some "moral panic" in Germany revolving around
> privacy, just like StreetView ban - except it's made clear that your
> edits are public and you agree to it!
>
> Michał
>
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Re: [OSM-talk] Name challenge - what to call the new OSM+Wikidata service?

[James]

Mappy McDataFace+1

On Sep 17, 2017 8:05 PM, "Blake Girardot HOT/OSM" 
wrote:

Mappy McDataFace is a serious suggestion, please include it in any
official lists of proposals.

Cheers
Blake

On Sun, Sep 17, 2017 at 5:46 PM, Yuri Astrakhan 
wrote:
> One thing we should consider is the domain name.  I doubt we can afford
> woq.com :)
>
> These names were proposed
> woq   2
> wdoqs
> woqs
> q936
>
> And these proposed names have OSM in them, so likely are not good
according
> to Legal
> wosm  2
> wikosm
> wdosm
> wikidosm
>
> (P.S. Sorry for double - hit send too fast before fixing the first list)
>
> On Sun, Sep 17, 2017 at 5:45 PM, Yuri Astrakhan 
> wrote:
>>
>> One thing we should consider is the domain name.  I doubt we can afford
>> woq.com :)
>>
>> These names were proposed
>> woq   2
>> wdoqs
>> wdosm
>> woqs
>> q936
>>
>> And these proposed names have OSM in them, so likely are not good
>> according to Legal
>> wosm  2
>> wikosm
>> wikidosm
>>
>>
>> On Sun, Sep 17, 2017 at 5:10 PM, Simon Poole  wrote:
>>>
>>> I believe there is a slight misunderstanding, while remixing
>>> OpenStreetMap/OSM/etc in various ways may result in cutesy copycat
domain
>>> names they simply do not jibe well with reality.
>>>
>>> Not only does every single one of them weaken the standing of the marks
>>> themselves and make is increasingly difficult to take action against
misuse,
>>> they are further uncontrollable liabilities for the whole community. I
gave
>>> the example of OpenWeatherMap, but there are others that would be really
>>> painful if they ended up in the hands of your fav giant tech corp.
>>>
>>> That said, I'm not sure why you believe the policy has broken something,
>>> with the exception of a few local chapters, to my knowledge, the OSMF
has
>>> never granted a licence to anybody to use the marks in a domain name. As
>>> outlined in the FAQ we will be operating a grandfathering scheme to
legalize
>>> such use after the fact so actually making such use legit for the first
>>> time.
>>>
>>> And yes: WoQ would be a wonderful name for Yuris service and shows that
>>> it is completely possible to break out of the old schema of simply
copying
>>> OSM.
>>>
>>> Simon
>>>
>>>
>>> Am 17.09.2017 um 15:57 schrieb Yves:
>>>
>>> So, no OpenSparqlMap, then? :(
>>> Sad, this policy definitely broke something.
>>> Yves
>>>
>>> Le 17 septembre 2017 12:58:12 GMT+02:00, Blake Girardot
>>>  a écrit :

 Hi,

 How does this relate to the new draft trademark policy?

 I can't tell from the draft policy, but I believe that OSM at least is
 a protected mark, not sure about osm.

 But I do think Simone Poole asked the community to stop naming things
 with osm trademarks in them or variations on openstreetmap phrase.

 Cheers
 blake

 On Sat, Sep 16, 2017 at 5:11 PM, Yuri Astrakhan
  wrote:
>
>  The new service is getting more and more usage, but it lacks the most
>  important thing - a good name.  So far my two choices are:
>
>  * wikosm
>  * wikidosm
>
>  Suggestions?  Votes?  The service combines Wikidata and OpenStreetMap
>  databases, and uses SPARQL (query language) to search it, so might be
> good
>  to reflect that in the name.
>
>
> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Wikidata%2BOSM_
SPARQL_query_service
>
>  P.S.  I know this is the hardest problem after off-by-one and
> caching...
>
> 
>  talk mailing list
>  talk@openstreetmap.org
>  https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk


>>>
>>>
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>>>
>>>
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>>
>
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Re: [OSM-talk] WhatOSM, a guide for contribution tools

[James]

You would need to get approval from the OSMF if you wanted to still keep
WhatOSM

On Thu, Sep 21, 2017 at 2:14 PM, PanierAvide <panierav...@riseup.net> wrote:

> Thanks for pointing this out. I'm clearly not an expert of legal issues,
> so the following may probably not make sense.
>
> 
> The goal of this tool is to help new contributors, and making them more
> easily start contributing to OSM. If we give it an obscure name, not
> referring to OSM, then where is the link between this tool and OSM ? I
> understand legal issues, but I hope that we don't loose of sight that we
> are a community project, and we need some form of cohesion. Our tools don't
> share so much except that they edit OSM data or help people doing so.
> According to this policy, JOSM should have been named instead "Java Editor
> for you-know-which-map-I'm-talking-about" ? Doesn't make sense to me.
>
> However, if there is a way to keep the name and sign some sort of
> contract, implying that I will not misuse the name or so, no problem, that
> would be fair. But let's keep the fun in creating tools for OSM, and not
> being able to name it using OSM is clearly boring plus misleading for users.
> 
>
> Thanks for reading this nonsense, I'm totally open to find a way to solve
> this potential naming issue, if someone can give me some hints about it, it
> would be great.
>
> Regards,
>
> Adrien.
>
>
> Le 21/09/2017 à 19:53, James a écrit :
>
> You might want to reconsider the name as you started this project 2 weeks
> ago and XYZosm or osmXYZ or OpenXYZMap are "copyrighted" and goes against
> the new usage policy.
>
> On Thu, Sep 21, 2017 at 1:45 PM, PanierAvide <panierav...@riseup.net>
> wrote:
>
>> Hi everyone,
>>
>> As you may know, OSM has a whole set of tools allowing various thematic
>> editing and contribution. Every contributor can find something to do,
>> however when you are new to this world, you don't where these tools are and
>> which one is made for you.
>>
>> In order to make it easier discovering contribution tools, and find the
>> ones according to what you want to work on, I made a little web guide named
>> WhatOSM. When answering three questions (level of difficulty, available
>> time and if you are indoors/outdoors), you have a list of corresponding
>> tools. You can try it here :
>>
>> http://projets.pavie.info/whatosm/
>>
>> It can be used by new contributors, but also more experimented ones, who
>> don't know what to do anymore in their neighbourhood. It might be
>> interested to show this to people when doing mapping parties. User
>> interface works as well on desktop as on smartphone.
>>
>> This project is open source and is available on this repository :
>>
>> https://framagit.org/PanierAvide/WhatOSM
>>
>> You can contribute to it by proposing tools which allow contributing more
>> or less directly to OpenStreetMap. Also, if you speak English + another
>> language, you can help translating the application :
>>
>> https://www.transifex.com/openlevelup/whatosm/
>>
>> If you have any ideas or suggestions, let me know :-)
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>> Adrien.
>>
>> --
>> PanierAvide
>> Géomaticien & développeur
>>
>>
>> ___
>> talk mailing list
>> talk@openstreetmap.org
>> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
>>
>
>
>
> --
> 外に遊びに行こう！
>
>
> --
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>
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Re: [OSM-talk] WhatOSM, a guide for contribution tools

[James]

https://wiki.osmfoundation.org/wiki/Contact

On Thu, Sep 21, 2017 at 2:22 PM, PanierAvide <panierav...@riseup.net> wrote:

> As this is new, is there a dedicated email contact to reach people
> handling this ?
>
> Regards,
>
> Adrien.
>
>
> Le 21/09/2017 à 20:17, James a écrit :
>
> You would need to get approval from the OSMF if you wanted to still keep
> WhatOSM
>
> On Thu, Sep 21, 2017 at 2:14 PM, PanierAvide <panierav...@riseup.net>
> wrote:
>
>> Thanks for pointing this out. I'm clearly not an expert of legal issues,
>> so the following may probably not make sense.
>>
>> 
>> The goal of this tool is to help new contributors, and making them more
>> easily start contributing to OSM. If we give it an obscure name, not
>> referring to OSM, then where is the link between this tool and OSM ? I
>> understand legal issues, but I hope that we don't loose of sight that we
>> are a community project, and we need some form of cohesion. Our tools don't
>> share so much except that they edit OSM data or help people doing so.
>> According to this policy, JOSM should have been named instead "Java Editor
>> for you-know-which-map-I'm-talking-about" ? Doesn't make sense to me.
>>
>> However, if there is a way to keep the name and sign some sort of
>> contract, implying that I will not misuse the name or so, no problem, that
>> would be fair. But let's keep the fun in creating tools for OSM, and not
>> being able to name it using OSM is clearly boring plus misleading for users.
>> 
>>
>> Thanks for reading this nonsense, I'm totally open to find a way to solve
>> this potential naming issue, if someone can give me some hints about it, it
>> would be great.
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>> Adrien.
>>
>>
>> Le 21/09/2017 à 19:53, James a écrit :
>>
>> You might want to reconsider the name as you started this project 2 weeks
>> ago and XYZosm or osmXYZ or OpenXYZMap are "copyrighted" and goes against
>> the new usage policy.
>>
>> On Thu, Sep 21, 2017 at 1:45 PM, PanierAvide <panierav...@riseup.net>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Hi everyone,
>>>
>>> As you may know, OSM has a whole set of tools allowing various thematic
>>> editing and contribution. Every contributor can find something to do,
>>> however when you are new to this world, you don't where these tools are and
>>> which one is made for you.
>>>
>>> In order to make it easier discovering contribution tools, and find the
>>> ones according to what you want to work on, I made a little web guide named
>>> WhatOSM. When answering three questions (level of difficulty, available
>>> time and if you are indoors/outdoors), you have a list of corresponding
>>> tools. You can try it here :
>>>
>>> http://projets.pavie.info/whatosm/
>>>
>>> It can be used by new contributors, but also more experimented ones, who
>>> don't know what to do anymore in their neighbourhood. It might be
>>> interested to show this to people when doing mapping parties. User
>>> interface works as well on desktop as on smartphone.
>>>
>>> This project is open source and is available on this repository :
>>>
>>> https://framagit.org/PanierAvide/WhatOSM
>>>
>>> You can contribute to it by proposing tools which allow contributing
>>> more or less directly to OpenStreetMap. Also, if you speak English +
>>> another language, you can help translating the application :
>>>
>>> https://www.transifex.com/openlevelup/whatosm/
>>>
>>> If you have any ideas or suggestions, let me know :-)
>>>
>>> Regards,
>>>
>>> Adrien.
>>>
>>> --
>>> PanierAvide
>>> Géomaticien & développeur
>>>
>>>
>>> ___
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>>> talk@openstreetmap.org
>>> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> 外に遊びに行こう！
>>
>>
>> --
>> PanierAvide
>> Géomaticien & développeur
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> 外に遊びに行こう！
>
>
> --
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>
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Re: [OSM-talk] WhatOSM, a guide for contribution tools

[James]

You might want to reconsider the name as you started this project 2 weeks
ago and XYZosm or osmXYZ or OpenXYZMap are "copyrighted" and goes against
the new usage policy.

On Thu, Sep 21, 2017 at 1:45 PM, PanierAvide  wrote:

> Hi everyone,
>
> As you may know, OSM has a whole set of tools allowing various thematic
> editing and contribution. Every contributor can find something to do,
> however when you are new to this world, you don't where these tools are and
> which one is made for you.
>
> In order to make it easier discovering contribution tools, and find the
> ones according to what you want to work on, I made a little web guide named
> WhatOSM. When answering three questions (level of difficulty, available
> time and if you are indoors/outdoors), you have a list of corresponding
> tools. You can try it here :
>
> http://projets.pavie.info/whatosm/
>
> It can be used by new contributors, but also more experimented ones, who
> don't know what to do anymore in their neighbourhood. It might be
> interested to show this to people when doing mapping parties. User
> interface works as well on desktop as on smartphone.
>
> This project is open source and is available on this repository :
>
> https://framagit.org/PanierAvide/WhatOSM
>
> You can contribute to it by proposing tools which allow contributing more
> or less directly to OpenStreetMap. Also, if you speak English + another
> language, you can help translating the application :
>
> https://www.transifex.com/openlevelup/whatosm/
>
> If you have any ideas or suggestions, let me know :-)
>
> Regards,
>
> Adrien.
>
> --
> PanierAvide
> Géomaticien & développeur
>
>
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Re: [OSM-talk] DWG survey on organised editing

[James]

It was an example of "organised editing". If a "local group" invites
newbies/other people to edit a specific thing (sidewalks, buildings, roads
etc) does that policy cover them as well or are they counted more as
"normal mapping"? One could argue that: "We define other
organised mapping (or editing) as any editing that is also steered by a
third party, but where no money is paid.". A local group could tell the
group what and how to map as much as a outside company could do the same.
I'm asking where do you draw the line on who is an organised mapper vs
normal mapper(to which the new policy wouldn't apply)

On Wed, Sep 20, 2017 at 7:46 AM, Christoph Hormann <o...@imagico.de> wrote:

> On Wednesday 20 September 2017, James wrote:
> > Also does organised mapping include groups that hold little
> > mapathons? Example a local mapping group from Vancouver, Toronto,
> > Montreal or Ottawa decide to say map sidewalks in their city. It's an
> > organised event. Would they be included as well?
> >
> > The terms used in this survey seem a little vague and can be left to
> > interpretation.
>
> I think you are misunderstanding the idea of the survey here - this is
> not a vote on a regulation of organized editing, it is meant to gather
> opinions of OSM community members on the matter.  Classifying organized
> editing activities in a fine grained way would be beyond the scope of
> such a simple exploratory survey.
>
> You can be sure the DWG knows that there is a broad range of organized
> editing activities and that even within the definitions given for the
> survey there is room for interpretation.
>
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Re: [OSM-talk] DWG survey on organised editing

[James]

Thank you Frederik for the clearification, so a Stammtisch as you call it
would not be affected by the policy unless there was outside
influence(unexperienced mapper that says map this in osm, example:
political/voting districts(which is why the policy would be there to tell
them that this is not appropriate for osm))

On Wed, Sep 20, 2017 at 7:57 AM, Frederik Ramm <frede...@remote.org> wrote:

> Hi,
>
> On 20.09.2017 13:17, James wrote:
> > Also does organised mapping include groups that hold little mapathons?
> > Example a local mapping group from Vancouver, Toronto, Montreal or
> > Ottawa decide to say map sidewalks in their city. It's an organised
> > event. Would they be included as well?
> >
> > The terms used in this survey seem a little vague and can be left to
> > interpretation.
>
> It is likely that any policy we come up with later will also leave room
> for interpretation and this will be necessary to make it work.
>
> I think they key issues are choice and responsibility. If you have a
> group of experienced mappers getting together and doing something, then
> they are not "told by a third party what to map"; they do what they
> would otherwise do, just together. They act as individuals vis-a-vis the
> community, they feel responsible for their edits, and there's no need to
> put up rules. They're no different from a mapping party of old.
>
> If you have, on the other hand, a group of people who have never mapped
> and who "just follow orders" (whether written or spoken), and who when
> challenged about their edits would likely shrug and say "I just did what
> the lead sidewalk mapping guy said, you'll have to take it up with him",
> then that's clearly organised mapping.
>
> There's a grey area in between, especially since you might have both
> types of contributors mixed at an event, but also because you can choose
> different words to describe the same event.
>
> Certainly "organised" doesn't simply mean that someone gets a room an
> pizza. They would have to provide instruction and guidance too.
>
> Bye
> Frederik
>
> --
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Re: [OSM-talk] DWG survey on organised editing

[James]

Also does organised mapping include groups that hold little mapathons?
Example a local mapping group from Vancouver, Toronto, Montreal or Ottawa
decide to say map sidewalks in their city. It's an organised event. Would
they be included as well?

The terms used in this survey seem a little vague and can be left to
interpretation.

On Sep 20, 2017 7:09 AM, "john whelan"  wrote:

> In the case of organised mapping such as the Statistics Canada organised
> efforts whom would you like to respond?
>
> Remembering that some of the terms used in the survey such as change set
> are such that a senior manager wouldn't have the faintest idea of what the
> term means and some of the players may have moved on to other projects?
>
> Perhaps one question might be did you consult with local mappers before
> the project?
>
> Cheerio John
>
> On 20 September 2017 at 00:51, Paul Norman  wrote:
>
>> The Data Working Group is conducting a survey as part of its work on a
>> policy covering paid mapping.
>>
>> When OpenStreetMap started, it was largely a project of hobbyists
>> contributing to OSM in their spare time. They chose freely what to map
>> and which tools to use, and they took individual responsibility for
>> their contributions.
>>
>> The continuing growth and popularity of OSM have also brought more and
>> more organised mapping efforts, mostly in the form of companies setting
>> up paid data teams to improve OSM data in specific regions or for
>> specific use cases, but also unpaid groups like school classes that are
>> directed to work on OSM.
>>
>> These organised mapping efforts are an integral part of today's OSM
>> contribution landscape and, when done well, help make OSM better and
>> more widely known.
>>
>> In order to ensure good communication, and a level playing field,
>> between individual community members and organised editing groups, the
>> OSMF Data Working Group has been tasked with developing guidelines for
>> organised groups. These guidelines will above all set out some
>> transparency requirements for organised groups - things that are already
>> voluntarily followed by most groups today, like informing the mapping
>> community about which accounts edit for the team.
>>
>> We have prepared the following survey with a few questions about such a
>> policy to give us a better understanding of what the mapping community
>> expects from such a policy. The survey is aimed at everyone editing (or
>> planning to edit) in OSM, whether as individual mappers or as part of a
>> team, and your answers will help us in fleshing out a draft policy.
>>
>> Within the scope of the survey, and the policy to be written, we define
>> paid mapping (or paid editing) as any editing in OSM performed by
>> someone who is told by a third party what to map (and potentially also
>> how to map it) and who receives money in exchange. We define other
>> organised mapping (or editing) as any editing that is also steered by a
>> third party, but where no money is paid.
>>
>> The survey is available at https://osm-dwg.limequery.org/741554
>>
>> --
>> Paul Norman
>> For the OSM Data Working Group
>>
>>
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>>
>
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Re: [OSM-talk] Fixing wrong "adr:housenumber" keys

[James]

I dont see an issue fixing this obvious typo

On Sep 9, 2017 2:10 PM, "Nelson A. de Oliveira"  wrote:

> While taking a look at something related with addr:housenumber I saw
> http://overpass-turbo.eu/s/rAd that we have 18391 objects with a wrong
> adr:housenumber key (it's missing a "D" letter), with most of them
> (18385) located here
> https://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=15/-15.4339/28.2303
> They were all inserted/modified in changesets like
> https://www.openstreetmap.org/changeset/47730362
>
> May I fix this?
>
> I won't change anything else in this chageset (it will be only an
> automatic repair/replacement of "adr:housenumber" by
> "addr:housenumber")
>
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Re: [OSM-talk] Beach routing

[James]

Not really, with a roundabout, you have a way you can follow. Where as an
area, you'd calculate somewhat of the middle between the two edges to
generate a path, as you can't just route on the boundary of the polygon as
it might be unwalkable/doesnt make sense in reality

On Sep 6, 2017 7:24 AM, "Dave F"  wrote:

>
> On 29/08/2017 12:53, Philip Barnes wrote:
>
>> This really needs routers to be able to route over areas, the same issue
>> exists over large areas of grass such as found in parks or town squares.
>>
>
> Yes.
>
> There appears to be a reluctance to develop this. 'It's not a part of our
> plans at the moment' is the last response to my query.
> I'm unsure why. To me, the coding to traverse the boundary of an area
> would seem very similar to that used to navigate a roundabout.
>
> DaveF
>
>
>
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Re: [OSM-talk] Beach routing

[James]

Or just follow the same shape as border +/- say 1-4meters offset(keep it
inside the polygon)

On Wed, Sep 6, 2017 at 7:57 AM, Dave F  wrote:

> Sorry wanted to add this:
>
> With irregular shapes (crescent, for example) a check to see if the route
> is within the boundary & insert an extra node if required maybe be a bit
> more work but not impossible.
>
>
> DaveF
>
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Re: [OSM-talk] Label language on the Default stylesheet

[James]

I think Latin as default is disrespectful to areas like Japan which might
not be able to read Latin letters as they have kana for non-japanese words.
It's a bit biased to ask if Latin should be the default on a Latin based
list(letters not language).I'm sure there would be a different opinion if
you asked on talk-jp or any other list(non-latin)

Ideally it should be a layer per language: English everywhere, Japanese
everywhere, Arabic everywhere, etc etc

On Sep 25, 2017 6:02 AM, "Oleksiy Muzalyev" 
wrote:

> On 9/24/2017 11:01 PM, Matthijs Melissen wrote:
>
>> [...]For example, we have a label 北京市 for Beijing, a label موريتانيا for
>> Mauritania, and a label Magyarország for Hungary.
>>
>> The openstreetmap-carto team quite frequently receives requests to
>> (additionally) display labels in English (or in any case the
>> Latin-alphabet). [...]
>>
>
> Why not use the Latin language itself for an additional label to non-Latin
> alphabet titles? It is readily available in Google translator and also in
> Wikipedia. Here are these titles in Latin:
>
> https://la.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pechinum
>
> https://la.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hungaria
>
> https://la.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mauritania
>
> Best regards,
>
> Oleksiy
>
>
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Re: [OSM-talk] Label language on the Default stylesheet

[James]

That's why you could have text rendered via JavaScript and not in the JPG
itself

On Sep 25, 2017 6:37 AM, "Jo" <winfi...@gmail.com> wrote:

> 1000 - 7000 extra layers? That's give or take the number of languages in
> existence... depending on who you ask, but even adding 500 extra layers is
> not a practical endeavour.
>
> 2017-09-25 12:15 GMT+02:00 James <james2...@gmail.com>:
>
>> I think Latin as default is disrespectful to areas like Japan which might
>> not be able to read Latin letters as they have kana for non-japanese words.
>> It's a bit biased to ask if Latin should be the default on a Latin based
>> list(letters not language).I'm sure there would be a different opinion if
>> you asked on talk-jp or any other list(non-latin)
>>
>> Ideally it should be a layer per language: English everywhere, Japanese
>> everywhere, Arabic everywhere, etc etc
>>
>> On Sep 25, 2017 6:02 AM, "Oleksiy Muzalyev" <oleksiy.muzal...@bluewin.ch>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> On 9/24/2017 11:01 PM, Matthijs Melissen wrote:
>>>
>>>> [...]For example, we have a label 北京市 for Beijing, a label موريتانيا for
>>>> Mauritania, and a label Magyarország for Hungary.
>>>>
>>>> The openstreetmap-carto team quite frequently receives requests to
>>>> (additionally) display labels in English (or in any case the
>>>> Latin-alphabet). [...]
>>>>
>>>
>>> Why not use the Latin language itself for an additional label to
>>> non-Latin alphabet titles? It is readily available in Google translator and
>>> also in Wikipedia. Here are these titles in Latin:
>>>
>>> https://la.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pechinum
>>>
>>> https://la.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hungaria
>>>
>>> https://la.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mauritania
>>>
>>> Best regards,
>>>
>>> Oleksiy
>>>
>>>
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>>
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Re: [OSM-talk] # with color code

[James]

usually # specifies that it's a hexidecimal number vs a base 10 number.
When you have letters A-F it's obvious that it's hexidecimal and can be
implecitely converted.

The issue is when you don't have letters:
255

in hexadecimal 255 is
2*16^2
+
5*16^1
+
5*16^0
= 512+80+5=597

255 base 10 would be represented by ff in hex.

On Sep 28, 2017 12:08 PM, "Jack Armstrong dan...@sprynet.com" <
jacknst...@sprynet.com> wrote:

> It's been my experience that colors render just fine without a '#' before
> the code number. Is usage of a # prefix really necessary? What problems
> will occur if it isn't attached? Thanks :)
>
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Re: [OSM-talk] Mapping in HTML - a proposal for a new element

[James]

There has already been work like this started by Peter Rushforth over a
year ago:
https://www.w3.org/community/maps4html/author/prushfor/

On Thu, Aug 24, 2017 at 1:59 PM, Andy Mabbett 
wrote:

> My friend Terence Eden has proposed a new HTML element for maps:
>
>https://shkspr.mobi/blog/2017/08/mapping-in-html-a-proposal-
> for-a-new-element/
>
> I've already left some comments on his post.
>
> --
> Andy Mabbett
> @pigsonthewing
> http://pigsonthewing.org.uk
>
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Re: [OSM-talk] Mapping in HTML - a proposal for a new element

[James]

Specifically, that they have a working example:
https://www.w3.org/community/maps4html/



On Thu, Aug 24, 2017 at 2:22 PM, James <james2...@gmail.com> wrote:

> There has already been work like this started by Peter Rushforth over a
> year ago:
> https://www.w3.org/community/maps4html/author/prushfor/
>
> On Thu, Aug 24, 2017 at 1:59 PM, Andy Mabbett <a...@pigsonthewing.org.uk>
> wrote:
>
>> My friend Terence Eden has proposed a new HTML element for maps:
>>
>>https://shkspr.mobi/blog/2017/08/mapping-in-html-a-
>> proposal-for-a-new-element/
>>
>> I've already left some comments on his post.
>>
>> --
>> Andy Mabbett
>> @pigsonthewing
>> http://pigsonthewing.org.uk
>>
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>>
>
>
>
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Re: [OSM-talk] [Talk-us] Redacting 75, 000 street names contributed by user chdr

[James]

The odbl=clean could be a way to exclude road names from the removal,
though sources from the info should be given, whether Canvec, Mapillary,
OpenStreetCam or local survey

On Aug 27, 2017 3:29 PM, "john whelan"  wrote:

> There are a couple of issues here.  The first are our users, we don't
> normally think about them but deleting the names at the wrong point in
> OSMAND's cycle could mean missing street names for a period of time.
>
> Second is the problem of some data might be incorrect as a result of the
> source deliberately using invalid names.  The very clean way is to delete
> then retag.
>
> Verifying with a maproulette challenge would work well if we could trust
> all the mappers not to just tick the box either deliberately or by mistake.
>
> Since we have the location of the streets and we have other sources with a
> valid name which would probably vary by country could someone join the two
> together and verify the name in an automated way?  Leaving a much smaller
> list of street names to be verified manually?  I suspect Jamie could wave a
> magic wand for Quebec.
>
> I'm not saying we should do one thing or another here.  I'm attempting to
> analyse the problem and find a solution that impacts as few people as
> possible but gives us clean accurate data at the end of the process.
>
> If we go the verifying route could we take a page out of HOT's process and
> have someone verify them someone validate?
>
> Cheerio John
>
> On 27 Aug 2017 3:04 pm, "Nicolás Alvarez" 
> wrote:
>
>> I don't understand what people mean with 'verifying' objects. We're
>> not trying to find factually-incorrect data. The data is legally
>> tainted. It's questionable whether looking at the current names
>> imported from GMaps, comparing to another source, seeing they match
>> and marking them as "verified" will legally change anything. And it's
>> impossible to know if people are really verifying anything or just
>> blindly marking them as verified.
>>
>> I think the only clean way to solve this is to redact and then re-map
>> from legal sources.
>>
>> --
>> Nicolás
>>
>> 2017-08-27 14:39 GMT-03:00 Frederik Ramm :
>> > Steve:
>> >
>> > thank you for your work. I'll save your list. It appears that others
>> > might be eager to do the same, maybe we can find a good workflow for
>> > that. I wasn't expecting the community to start working on this
>> > pre-redaction but if people prefer that to fixing issues later, it is of
>> > course an option. I certainly prefer out-of-band "marking" of verified
>> > objects to adding a new tag to each!
>> >
>> > Tod:
>> >
>> > On 08/27/2017 07:31 PM, Tod Fitch wrote:
>> >> When you reviewed Orange County, how did you do it so quickly? The
>> only way I know to go through this is looking at each one, one at a time.
>> >
>> > I could of course make a page with links to the ways, even per county if
>> > that helps, or we could upload the list to some suitable tool. Ian
>> > mentioned MapRoulette but I'm not sure if that would make things easier.
>> > I'm certainly happy to try. Maybe Martijn would like to chip in about
>> > MapRoulette?
>> >
>> > Bye
>> > Frederik
>> >
>> > --
>> > Frederik Ramm  ##  eMail frede...@remote.org  ##  N49°00'09"
>> E008°23'33"
>> >
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Re: [OSM-talk] Redacting 75, 000 street names contributed by user chdr

[James]

If we validate via survey say in Canada, will we be able to remove the id
from the revert list? Canada has Canvec we can reference to as well as
OpenStreetCam and Mapillary

On Aug 27, 2017 9:50 AM, "Frederik Ramm"  wrote:

> Hi,
>
>in 2010 I was privately contacted by another OSM user with the
> suspicion that user "chdr" might be copying names from Google maps
> (there were few "easter eggs" in Oman that were only on Google and not
> in the real world, and they suddenly popped up on OSM). "chdr" was
> contacted at the time, but continued unfazed. In 2013 another mapper
> lodged a complaint with DWG about edits by chdr, and I emailed chdr
> asking him about his sources. At that point chdr stopped mapping. He
> never replied about his sources though, even when I set an ultimatum (of
> 31st August 2013) threatening to remove all names he contributed if he
> can't tell us his source. We do have to assume that all names
> contributed by chdr are copyright violations.
>
> (chdr has added names all around the world, making a harmless survey
> unlikely.)
>
> For various reasons I neglected to act on this, and was only reminded
> now, 5 years later, when DWG received a complaint from a user in Brazil
> where chdr has even used "source=google" occasionally. (But as I said,
> the suspicion is that Google was used throughout.)
>
> I have now compiled a list of all street names that were contributed by
> chdr and are still visible today; we're talking about almost 75,000
> street names world wide. The most affected countries are:
>
>   18023 "United States of America"
>   16345 "Mexico"
>   15109 "Brazil"
>6791 "RSA"
>2802 "Spain"
>2614 "Australia"
>1923 "Argentina"
>1673 "Nigeria"
>1569 "India"
>1441 "Canada"
> 954 "Malaysia"
> 744 "Botswana"
> 717 "Philippines"
> 619 "Indonesia"
> 553 "Italy"
> 414 "Turkey"
> 290 "Hungary"
> 284 "Chile"
> 250 "Kenya"
> 127 "Saudi Arabia"
> 107 "Paraguay"
> 106 "Panama"
> 100 "Morocco"
>
> I've left out those countries with less than 100 affected ways.
>
> For the US, I can break it down by state:
>
>5696 "Arizona"
>5116 "Texas"
>2294 "New York"
>1164 "District of Columbia"
> 740 "Iowa"
> 494 "Colorado"
> 416 "New Jersey"
> 339 "Illinois"
> 268 "Michigan"
> 239 "Pennsylvania"
> 181 "Missouri"
> 147 "Georgia"
> 129 "New Mexico"
> 123 "North Carolina"
> 115 "California"
> 106 "Virginia"
>
> The breakdown for Mexico:
>
>7749 "Baja California"
>2084 "Puebla"
>1964 "Chihuahua"
>1539 "Coahuila"
>1161 "Mexico"
>1040 "Chiapas"
> 342 "Tamaulipas"
> 241 "Sonora"
> 185 "San Luis Potosi"
> 129 "New Mexico"
>
> and Brazil:
>
>   10904 "São Paulo"
>2605 "Paraná"
> 945 "Rio de Janeiro"
> 270 "Rio Grande do Sul"
> 154 "Goiás"
>
> and South Africa:
>
>4422 "Gauteng"
> 750 "KwaZulu-Natal"
> 600 "Eastern Cape"
> 439 "Western Cape"
> 400 "Northern Cape"
> 179 "Mpumalanga"
>
> - each time leaving out a couple others under 100.
>
> We believe that only names, not geometries have been taken from other
> maps so we'll remove and redact the names only. In identifying "names
> contributed by chdr" I took care to really only pick up the names that
> were introduced by them, not names that were there before, and also when
> chdr split a way that had a name I will make sure that the newly created
> way doesn't count as "named by chdr". Additionally, I have ignored those
> cases where chdr simply performed a TIGER expansion (St->Street etc) of
> a name that was there before.
>
> My process has two weak points (that I am aware of):
>
> 1. It doesn't properly "follow" a chrdr-contributed name through way
> splits performed by other users; if someone has split a way created by
> chdr, then the name will remain on the bit that was created by this
> user. This is somewhat unsatisfying but after having manually checked a
> random sample I think the problem is small enough to be ignored.
>
> 2. It is possible that, like with a recent case in Switzerland where I
> had to do a similar redaction, some of these chdr-contributed names will
> have been confirmed by others in a survey, i.e. someone else surveyed
> the area and checked the name, but saw no need to change it in any way
> since it was already correct. Sadly my process will now remove the name
> even though, had the name not been there in the first place, that person
> could have added the name. This is not nice but I don't see how it could
> be avoided.
>
> Here's a list of way IDs affected, with country and state:
>
> http://www.remote.org/frederik/tmp/chdr.details
>
> I am trying to keep the damage to OSM to a minimum while at the same
> time respecting copyright. If anyone wants to spot check a few names in
> their area and can suggest a refinement of the process that would leave
> more names in place because 

Re: [OSM-talk] [Talk-us] Redacting 75, 000 street names contributed by user chdr

[James]

Indeed, with the geometry still remaining it will be easy to create a
maproulette task(s) to repair the damage

+1 for name tag redaction

On Aug 27, 2017 12:26 PM, "Ian Dees"  wrote:

> Frederik,
>
> Thanks for notifying us about this. I hope that you treat this as an
> import or automated edit and follow the rules you would expect to see the
> rest of the community follow. Please post samples of your changes, make a
> wiki page for posterity, and thanks for working to get buy-in from local
> community.
>
> Is your plan to revert changes to the name tag made by chdr or will you be
> completely removing the name tag? Personally, I would prefer to see the
> name tag completely removed so we can more easily come back and correct it.
> It might also be better to load this list you posted into maproulette or
> similar so we can systematically validate the name values on the ways.
>
> -Ian
>
> On Sun, Aug 27, 2017 at 8:49 AM, Frederik Ramm 
> wrote:
>
>> Hi,
>>
>>in 2010 I was privately contacted by another OSM user with the
>> suspicion that user "chdr" might be copying names from Google maps
>> (there were few "easter eggs" in Oman that were only on Google and not
>> in the real world, and they suddenly popped up on OSM). "chdr" was
>> contacted at the time, but continued unfazed. In 2013 another mapper
>> lodged a complaint with DWG about edits by chdr, and I emailed chdr
>> asking him about his sources. At that point chdr stopped mapping. He
>> never replied about his sources though, even when I set an ultimatum (of
>> 31st August 2013) threatening to remove all names he contributed if he
>> can't tell us his source. We do have to assume that all names
>> contributed by chdr are copyright violations.
>>
>> (chdr has added names all around the world, making a harmless survey
>> unlikely.)
>>
>> For various reasons I neglected to act on this, and was only reminded
>> now, 5 years later, when DWG received a complaint from a user in Brazil
>> where chdr has even used "source=google" occasionally. (But as I said,
>> the suspicion is that Google was used throughout.)
>>
>> I have now compiled a list of all street names that were contributed by
>> chdr and are still visible today; we're talking about almost 75,000
>> street names world wide. The most affected countries are:
>>
>>   18023 "United States of America"
>>   16345 "Mexico"
>>   15109 "Brazil"
>>6791 "RSA"
>>2802 "Spain"
>>2614 "Australia"
>>1923 "Argentina"
>>1673 "Nigeria"
>>1569 "India"
>>1441 "Canada"
>> 954 "Malaysia"
>> 744 "Botswana"
>> 717 "Philippines"
>> 619 "Indonesia"
>> 553 "Italy"
>> 414 "Turkey"
>> 290 "Hungary"
>> 284 "Chile"
>> 250 "Kenya"
>> 127 "Saudi Arabia"
>> 107 "Paraguay"
>> 106 "Panama"
>> 100 "Morocco"
>>
>> I've left out those countries with less than 100 affected ways.
>>
>> For the US, I can break it down by state:
>>
>>5696 "Arizona"
>>5116 "Texas"
>>2294 "New York"
>>1164 "District of Columbia"
>> 740 "Iowa"
>> 494 "Colorado"
>> 416 "New Jersey"
>> 339 "Illinois"
>> 268 "Michigan"
>> 239 "Pennsylvania"
>> 181 "Missouri"
>> 147 "Georgia"
>> 129 "New Mexico"
>> 123 "North Carolina"
>> 115 "California"
>> 106 "Virginia"
>>
>> The breakdown for Mexico:
>>
>>7749 "Baja California"
>>2084 "Puebla"
>>1964 "Chihuahua"
>>1539 "Coahuila"
>>1161 "Mexico"
>>1040 "Chiapas"
>> 342 "Tamaulipas"
>> 241 "Sonora"
>> 185 "San Luis Potosi"
>> 129 "New Mexico"
>>
>> and Brazil:
>>
>>   10904 "São Paulo"
>>2605 "Paraná"
>> 945 "Rio de Janeiro"
>> 270 "Rio Grande do Sul"
>> 154 "Goiás"
>>
>> and South Africa:
>>
>>4422 "Gauteng"
>> 750 "KwaZulu-Natal"
>> 600 "Eastern Cape"
>> 439 "Western Cape"
>> 400 "Northern Cape"
>> 179 "Mpumalanga"
>>
>> - each time leaving out a couple others under 100.
>>
>> We believe that only names, not geometries have been taken from other
>> maps so we'll remove and redact the names only. In identifying "names
>> contributed by chdr" I took care to really only pick up the names that
>> were introduced by them, not names that were there before, and also when
>> chdr split a way that had a name I will make sure that the newly created
>> way doesn't count as "named by chdr". Additionally, I have ignored those
>> cases where chdr simply performed a TIGER expansion (St->Street etc) of
>> a name that was there before.
>>
>> My process has two weak points (that I am aware of):
>>
>> 1. It doesn't properly "follow" a chrdr-contributed name through way
>> splits performed by other users; if someone has split a way created by
>> chdr, then the name will remain on the bit that was created by this
>> user. This is somewhat unsatisfying but after having manually checked a
>> random sample I think the problem is small enough to be ignored.
>>
>> 2. It is possible 

Re: [OSM-talk] Redacting 75, 000 street names contributed by user chdr

[James]

As Mr.Ramm said, there can be trap streets, which should be removed.

When I inspected the data, it seems most of it is in Québec and wouldnt be
hard to validate streetnames for 1400 something items.

On Aug 27, 2017 11:24 AM, "Paul Norman"  wrote:

> On 8/27/2017 7:26 AM, john whelan wrote:
>
>> I would suggest that any street names added by chdr in Canada were more
>> than likely derived from CANVEC sources
>>
>
> What makes you believe this to be so?
>
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Re: [OSM-talk] [Talk-us] Redacting 75, 000 street names contributed by user chdr

[James]

As Stewart has pointed out there are some changes that are valid(name
expansion). I think Mr.Ramm needs to revise his selection algorithm before
mass deletion

On Aug 28, 2017 6:05 AM, "joost schouppe"  wrote:

2017-08-28 10:27 GMT+02:00 Simon Poole :

> What surprises me most about the discussion up to now that it is
> centered around the impact on the US and Canada were the removals are
> rather small both relatively and absolute*, actually are more at the
> nuisance level than anything else, and can easily be added back, likely
> in a couple of days  from sources that are already pre-approved as
> reference material.
>
> Our concern should be more about Mexico, Brazil and other countries
> where it is at least not obvious to me if the local communities are
> aware of the issue and if we have any plan at all how we possibly could
> mitigate the impact.
>

I can't say I'm surprised by that myself. This is a conversation in
English, on a mailing list, bot things not very popular in Latin America.
I've posted this thread to the Latam telegram group, with an offer to
translate if needed.

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Re: [OSM-talk] Beach routing

[James]

"Dont tag for the rendered"

Routers should make beaches routable even though theres no clear path. Same
with indoor mapping: I'm not going to add a bunch of paths in something
already tagged as a corridor/hallway

On Aug 29, 2017 6:54 AM, "Jean-Marc Liotier"  wrote:

> Last week-end I went hiking along the coast from Honfleur to
> Trouville-sur-Mer. As I wondered what distance I walked, I turned to
> Openstreetmap routers... And did not find my answer: beaches are not
> considered as highways.
>
> I thought about adding paths to beach sections that I consider
> walkable... But, while some of those beaches have an identifiable path
> along their length, for the most part this would be tagging for the
> router.
>
> I fail to imagine a beach that is not walkable. So, should the routers
> use natural=beach the same way as highway=path+surface=(sand|gravel|*) ?
>
> The question of routing across natural=beach brings back the past debate
> about highway=pedestrian+area=yes - most routers do not route over
> areas.
>
> I just dug this thread, which goes along the same lines as my reflexions
> (https://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk-us/2014-July/013280.html)
> but does no definitely concludes either.
>
> My conclusion is that I should open wishlist entries for my favorite
> routers... Is it a good idea ?
>
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Re: [OSM-talk] a sample panoramic aerial image for 3D mapping made with the new DJI Spark quad-copter

[James]

Put it to 85 degrees and pitch the drone 5 degrees forward. Problem solved.

On Fri, Sep 1, 2017 at 10:24 AM, Oleksiy Muzalyev <
oleksiy.muzal...@bluewin.ch> wrote:

> On 9/1/2017 4:07 PM, Greg Morgan wrote:
>
>
>
> On Fri, Sep 1, 2017 at 6:37 AM, Oleksiy Muzalyev <
> oleksiy.muzal...@bluewin.ch> wrote:
>
>> I received today my new DJI Spark quad-copter and made a panoramic aerial
>> image with it:
>>
>> https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Aerial_photograp
>> hs_of_Geneva#/media/File:Geneva-aerial-panorama.jpg
>>
>> This aircraft is so small and light that some local regulations are not
>> even applicable for it, as the they are mostly for the UAVs from 0.5 kg up
>> to 30 kg (though the common sense and good piloting are always applicable).
>> Nevertheless the image is of a surprisingly good quality for a cloudy day,
>> and since it is panoramic it covers quite a large area.
>>
>> The 21 aerial photos for a panoramic image are taken automatically during
>> a flight, and then they are stitched together by the DJI Media Maker
>> software on a PC.
>>
>>  Oleksiy,
>
> Thanks for sharing.  Have you tried to vertical shots?  For example, I
> know of a new building.  I'd like to get building and the surrounding
> improvements.  It seems like a small UAV that you describe would do the job.
>
> Regards,
> Greg
>
> I did not try vertical shots yet. Though Spark cannot direct camera
> completely vertically down as Phantom can. It has got the gimbal pitch from
> -85 to 0 (-85 degrees is almost vertically down), and Phantom 3 & 4 has got
> from -90 to +30.
> But the advantage is that it weighs only 300 grams, very portable, and it
> is ready to fly almost instantly as folding propellers are fixed
> permanently, and smart-phone connects to the remote control via WiFi, no
> cables are necessary.
>
> Best regards,
>
> Oleksiy
>
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Re: [OSM-talk] a sample panoramic aerial image for 3D mapping made with the new DJI Spark quad-copter

[James]

Stock WIFI antennas have a ranges of about 32m (105feet) in optimal
conditions. So unless he has a booster that will be the limit

On Fri, Sep 1, 2017 at 11:12 AM, Martin Koppenhoefer  wrote:

>
>
> 2017-09-01 16:24 GMT+02:00 Oleksiy Muzalyev :
>
>>
>> But the advantage is that it weighs only 300 grams, very portable, and it
>> is ready to fly almost instantly as folding propellers are fixed
>> permanently, and smart-phone connects to the remote control via WiFi, no
>> cables are necessary.
>>
>
>
> did you try how high/far you can get before loosing the wifi connection?
>
> Cheers,
> Martin
>
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Re: [OSM-talk] Publishing bot code. GPL or AGPL?

[James]

You could always release it under Mozilla Public License 2.0 and that
explicitely requires people to offer source code.

On Tue, Oct 17, 2017 at 3:01 PM, Nicolás Alvarez 
wrote:

> 2017-10-17 13:27 GMT-03:00 Safwat Halaby :
> > I understand that GPLv3 has a loophole in which someone could modify
> > your GPL-licensed code, and then run it on a server which offers some
> > service. Since a service is being sent over the wire, and not the
> > executable itself, then they can keep their modified code private. AGPL
> > prevents this loophole.
> >
> > Does the same logic apply for OSM bots? Would someone using a
> > personally modified GPL'ed bot not have to publish it? Should I use
> > AGPL instead if I wish to force any bot user to publish the code?
>
> If I run a modified bot against the OSM server, that doesn't mean you
> are interacting with my bot over the network, so even with AGPL I'm
> not required to give you the source code.
>
> --
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Re: [OSM-talk] What would make MapRoulette better?

[James]

There's already a false positive button for that. Skip is for meh don't
want to do that right now.



On Sat, Nov 25, 2017 at 12:51 PM, Stefan Keller  wrote:

> Hi,
>
> 2017-11-24 22:18 GMT+01:00 Dave F :
> >
> > On 24/11/2017 07:59, joost schouppe wrote:
> >>
> >> For example, "Skipped" to me means "meh, didn't feel like doing this
> >> task".
> >
> > No! it's an option to ignore the task if the user doesn't think there's
> > anything wrong.
>
> No: "Skip" IMHO really means what Joost said.
> What you described is "False positive".
>
> -Stefan
>
>
> 2017-11-25 11:39 GMT+01:00 Dave F :
> > You need evidence that randomness combined with guesswork produces
> erroneous
> > output? Really? Look around, it's everywhere!
> >
> > DaveF
> >
> >
> > On 25/11/2017 01:37, Martijn van Exel wrote:
> >>
> >> I’d appreciate you back that statement up with some data that goes
> beyond
> >> some isolated examples, Dave.
> >>
> >>> On Nov 24, 2017, at 2:18 PM, Dave F 
> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> On 24/11/2017 07:59, joost schouppe wrote:
> 
>  For example, "Skipped" to me means "meh, didn't feel like doing this
>  task".
> >>>
> >>> No! it's an option to ignore the task if the user doesn't think there's
> >>> anything wrong. Maproulette is based on guesswork. A task doesn't mean
> >>> there's an error that definitely needs fixing
> >>>
> >>> There appears to be a compulsion by users to complete tasks in
> >>> Maproulette even when they have no *accurate* knowledge. This is
> wrong. It
> >>> adds *erroneous* data to OSM.
> >>>
> >>> There's a clue to Maproulette's randomness & uncertainty in its name.
> >>>
> >>> I believe a good way to improve OSM data is to ban Maproulette.
> >>>
> >>> DaveF
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> ---
> >>> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
> >>> https://www.avast.com/antivirus
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> ___
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> >>> talk@openstreetmap.org
> >>> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
> >
> >
> >
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Re: [OSM-talk] What would make MapRoulette better?

[James]

Yeah I'd like the skipped tasks to comeback eventually, sometimes I look at
objects and its either too complicated to fix for my current state of mind
or the imagery makes it hard but I'd like to get back to it eventually

On Nov 24, 2017 3:04 AM, "joost schouppe"  wrote:

> I've only started using Maproulette recently, but I'm really impressed
> with what you can do with it. It is the -perfect- user interface for the
> tasks we currently generate with the Road Completion Project [1].
> We're going to consume the generated metadata about Tasks for further
> steps in the analysis, which you can do using the API.  But as a Challenge
> manager, I miss doing some stuff in the Maproulette interface itself. For
> example, "Skipped" to me means "meh, didn't feel like doing this task". It
> seems they are removed from the Challenge as mapable objects. I'd like to
> be able to cycle through the skipped tasks and start fixing them myself, or
> giving a link to those often-a-bit-harder tasks to some mappers I trust
> with this. Or if I see that there's nothing special about the skipped
> tasks, I'd like to be able to set them all as regular tasks again.
> If anything of this is already possible, sorry! (I did read the manual :)
>
>
>
> 1: https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/WikiProject_Belgium/
> Road_completion_project
>
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Re: [OSM-talk] OSM Streak: edit the map every day

[James]

Good idea, is it normal you get a
"Error connecting to OSM API"?


On Dec 3, 2017 5:22 PM, "Ilya Zverev"  wrote:

> Wow, that is an awesome project! I envy you students for having such
> unusual OSM activities :) And thanks to you, now I know about the
> backrest=* tag. Everyone here could benefit from it.
>
> Can you write a blog post about the PoliMappers' Adventures? Maybe it
> could get published on blog.osm.org — CWG would decide that.
>
> Also, I'd format the wiki page to have the current quest in big letters at
> the top, maybe with a picture. That way people returning to it won't have
> to scroll down to find the next quest. You don't need any software for this
> adventure.
>
> The OSM Streak project is a bit different: it is automatic, and it doesn't
> make you learn much. The goal was to have a five-minute task for a day, so
> you don't have to plan your mapping. Just start an editor, click around for
> a minute, upload. Otherwise you'd get tired after a month or two.
>
> The source code is published on github: https://github.com/Zverik/osms
> treak
>
> Ilya
>
> 04.12.2017 00:46, Michał Brzozowski пишет:
>
>> Incidentally, that's what I envisioned, as well as did Polimappers [1].
>> Great minds think alike - all in a short period ;) But unlike me you
>> actually delivered, with software to support it.
>>
>> I planned to have 30 or more challenges in some succession, not limited
>> to mapping, but also showing the OSM ecosystem (like mapper communication,
>> notes/change inspection/QA). So basically creating a competent mapper with
>> "learning by doing".
>>
>> Is the source available somewhere?
>>
>> Michał
>>
>> [1] https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/PoliMappers/Adventures
>>
>> On Sun, Dec 3, 2017 at 9:27 PM, Ilya Zverev  i...@zverev.info>> wrote:
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> I am Ilya and I have been uploading changesets 15 days in a row. Not
>> because I'm so into it or somebody makes me: I've made a tool that
>> reminds me to do it. In a year I expect my HDYC activity chart to be
>> completely filled. And you can have the same too.
>>
>> Introducing OSM Streak: a website that gives you points for
>> submitting changesets each day:
>>
>> http://streak.osmz.ru/
>>
>> You get 1 point for the first changeset, and then you get more: for
>> example, I will receive 4 points for my next changeset tomorrow. And
>> that is not all: it gives you a random task each day, so you don't
>> stare at the map trying to come up with an idea. For completing a
>> task, you get an extra point. And when you map many days in a row,
>> you gain levels, which open more tasks.
>>
>> Forgetting to visit a website is expectable, so OSM Streak is also a
>> Telegram bot (find the link on the "Connect" page). With the bot,
>> you can forget about the website: it accepts changesets and sends
>> you tasks every day. Alternatively, you can subscribe to e-mail
>> notifications, which will be sent on 1:00 UTC.
>>
>> All the tasks and the website and the bot can (and should!) be
>> translated into your language. We have English and Russian, and I
>> would be very grateful for more translations:
>>
>> https://www.transifex.com/openstreetmap/osm-streak/
>> 
>>
>> Have a truly mappy new year,
>> Ilya
>>
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>>
>>
>>
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Re: [OSM-talk] OSM Streak: edit the map every day

[James]

Actually I find it great so far, one day it's buildings, one day it's
adding an unmapped road, takes people out of their usual mapping rut and
expands their breath of knowledge about osm(may have to use wiki to look
how to tag things

On Dec 5, 2017 5:52 AM, "Frederik Ramm"  wrote:

Hi,

On 03.12.2017 21:27, Ilya Zverev wrote:
> Introducing OSM Streak: a website that gives you points for submitting
> changesets each day:

Excellent!

I'm sure that before too long, you will receive many emails by people
who offer all kinds of excuses for not having edited on one particular
day and who beg you to allow them to make up for it without breaking
their "streak" ;)

Bye
Frederik

--
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Re: [OSM-talk] weeklyOSM #382 2017-11-07-2017-11-13

[James]

Seriously this is what 2017 has become? A bunch of snowflakes argueing
whoes feelings are hurt? Seriously grow up people, the world is not full of
cupcakes and rainbows.

"Yuri is perceived by many as unreasonable as before and tries to ignore
all the unwritten rules in OSM."

I was somewhat following that email thread and there were many people
sayong that yuri was unreasonable and that he was ignoring the rules for
mechanical edits. Journalists are allowed to summarize the general tone of
a situation without being perceived as "taking sides".

On Nov 17, 2017 10:49 PM, "Clifford Snow"  wrote:

> Andy,
>
> On Fri, Nov 17, 2017 at 4:10 PM, Andy Townsend  wrote:
>
>> On 17/11/2017 22:52, Clifford Snow wrote:
>>
>>
>> Frederik,
>> I think we are all thankful for the newsletter. And believe they are free
>> to publish to their own standards. However, because they use OSM resources
>> by publishing on our mailing lists they need respect our values. I don't
>> think asking a publication to be respectful to individuals is asking too
>> much.
>>
>>
>> Clifford,
>> Being "respectful" is a two-way street.  This is a situation that's been
>> going on for almost exactly a year now.  During that time this individual
>> has shown contempt for the OSM community, including on occasion telling
>> outright untruths.  Conversations with him were very repectful at first
>> (conducted in changeset discussions rather than on mailing lists), but it
>> gradually became clear that any statements such as "I have already stopped
>> changing any objects except" were simply worthless.  At some point you have
>> to call a lie a lie, and I can't think of a way of doing that without
>> "being disrespectful".
>>
>
> Absolutely. I'm only suggesting that as a community we strive to be
> respectful to everyone, all the time. That in no way mean that we condone
> bad behavior. I'm all for calling out such behavior even to the point of
> expelling/banning the person if reasonable attempts to get the person to
> change is futile. My basic belief is that all people have good intentions.
> Our community goal should be to bring out the best in everyone.
>
>
>>
>> Also, I have to object to the use of "they" and "our" in your comment.
>> The OSM Weekly is produced by and for people from the OSM community,
>> exactly the same community that the mailing lists are run by and for.  The
>> use of that sort of divisive language ("they") reminds me of a visit to
>> South Africa back in the 90s, and not in a good way.
>>
>
> Sorry for the poor choice of words. Now you see why I don't offer to edit
> or write for the OSM Weekly.  My grandfather, a former newspaper editor,
> would have been sadden by my lack of writing abilities.
>
> Best,
> Clifford
>
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Re: [OSM-talk] Serious JOSM performance degradation

[James]

have you tried with wireframe mode(ctrl+w)?

On Nov 11, 2017 5:11 PM, "Jan Martinec"  wrote:

> You can download somewhat-recent JOSM versions from
> https://josm.openstreetmap.de/download/ , I do see 12921 there. Also
> josm-latest, which is the testing version (currently 13101).
>
> Cheers,
> Honza "Piškvor" Martinec
>
> Dne 11. 11. 2017 22:15 napsal uživatel "john whelan" <
> jwhelan0...@gmail.com>:
>
> If you give it more memory sometimes that compensates on the CPU side by
> not requiring so much disk reading and writing.  Also there are almost
> certainly internal tables which work better in memory.  JAVA is a strange
> world of its own and with so many contributors and plugins I'm not sure
> anyone has a clear idea of exactly how JOSM works with in it.
>
> Not guaranteed but worth a try.
>
> Cheerio John
>
> On 11 November 2017 at 16:03, Safwat Halaby  wrote:
>
>> More details:
>>
>> JOSM 12712 has no issues.
>> Latest JOSM 13053 has issues.
>> Not sure how to download the intermediate version (12921).
>> It's a CPU starvation issue and not a memory overuse issue. (Core at
>> 100% for 10-30 seconds).
>>
>> Test case:
>>
>> Open up the attached file, try editing the ref or name of a stop.
>>
>> 12712 works flawlessly.
>> 13053 hangs for 10-30 seconds.
>
>
>
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Re: [OSM-talk] Effecting change in OpenStreetMap

[James]

I am a developer. I should not be expected to learn Psychology 101 to
improve OpenStreetMap.

Funny you should say that...I had to take Psychology 101 for my CS degree.
I see why now.

On Nov 21, 2017 12:02 PM, "Ilya Zverev"  wrote:

> Christoph Hormann wrote:
> >  Oh come on. I've been a mapper since 2010, I've hosted dozens of
> > > events, I've written many articles and tools, some of which you might
> > > have used, I'm on the Board currently, and still my proposals and
> > > pull requests fail again and again, because there is no trust in
> > > OpenStreetMap. There is nothing you can to to build up trust. Your
> > > ideas will never get acceptance, it's just nitpicking and "unwritten
> > > rules" all over.
> > I hope you are aware that with this you deny everyone who has ever
> voiced critique on any of your proposals and pull requests to have a
> competent opinion on the topic in question.
>
> I am not speaking about my proposals and pull requests here. I am
> highlighting a bigger issue that I see again and again. There is a core
> group made of people from UK and German-speaking countries, and everyone
> else. You will never become a part of the first group, not by writing
> software or articles, not by being elected anywhere, not by anything. You
> either have been in OSM in 2006 or not. You, Christoph, is not perceived as
> a part of that group. Which means you get to experience "this situation
> from both sides". Most of us do. Most people from the core group don't even
> see the problem and will deny any claims.
>
> This problem manifests itself in many small ways: one more nitpicking
> comment on your pull request, one more opposing comment on a proposal, one
> more vote on their Board ballot instead of yours. Everything they do is
> visible all over OSM. No matter what you do, it will be visible only in
> your local community. That is what the #craftmapper problem is, not a
> simple "do not import, go out and map". If they become irritated and leave,
> we will lose everything: servers, access to code, representation,
> organization. I know only one "craftmapper" who left — and more and more I
> am starting to think that was for the worse, contrary to mine and everyone
> else's opinions three years ago.
>
> You can mask the issue by saying "you have to be humble and listen to
> others more and understand there is always somebody who know better", but
> with that, you kill any trace of motivation to effect change in
> OpenStreetMap. Because people who know better will not try new things —
> they are worried that things we already have will break. The whole core
> services group (people who maintain code and servers) have been working in
> the life-support mode for years. Any change should conform to all the
> current policies of OSM, which virtually say "no changes". Any proposal
> should not contradict any of existing wiki pages, especially if existing
> wiki pages contradict each other.
>
> Trust is allowing other people to touch and possibly break what you love.
> We don't have it in the OSM. OSM is not Wikipedia, we don't have a "be
> bold" rule. As you explain, we have "be humble and listen to others" rule.
> Feels very similar to what women currently are fighting with in the third
> wave.
>
> > The key to solving this kind of problem is respectful and considerate
> communication, caring about each other's opinions and reasoning - and above
> all patience. People are always more likely to accept and support change if
> they come to realize the need for it themselves, at their own pace.
>
> I am a developer. I should not be expected to learn Psychology 101 to
> improve OpenStreetMap. What are you effectively saying is that you can push
> changes only by being an expert in social studies. If only such experts
> wrote pull requests. What we do need is more management standing between
> old and new developers — but that would imply more spending money on
> people, and we don't want to spend money on people, just on hardware.
>
> > And a rejected idea does not necessarily need to be considered failure.
> It is an opportunity to talk to the people who have rejected it,
> re-evaluating your assumptions and motives and maybe develop a better
> solution (or let others do that when they recognize the need). I have seen
> lots of examples where a failed attempt at something created the impulse
> for a better and successful solution.
>
> I don't care about failure of my proposals and pull requests. I care about
> OSM being an active, maintained, growing, ever-changing project. I believe
> I will see that — but I'd prefer it in 5 years, not in 50.
>
> Ilya
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Re: [OSM-talk] proposed mechanical edit - moving building=building to building=yes

[James]

I don't see a problem with this as the major concerns: big edit boundaries,
what does it affect? are taken care of by documentation

if building=building is not or was not a  wiki approved way of tagging,
this seems more on the side of linting osm tags than it does a "mass blind
edit"/import

On Fri, Jun 8, 2018, 1:22 PM Mateusz Konieczny, 
wrote:

> building=yes is a standard way to mark building without specifying its
> type. Editors wishing to specify building type would (directly or
> indirectly, for example using StreetComplete) look through buildings
> tagged as building=yes.
>
> building=building is an unexpected way to mark building without
> specifying its type and therefore retagging this duplicate to
> building=yes would improve tagging without any information loss.
>
> It would also (as an useful byproduct) remove this tag from popular
> values at https://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/keys/building#values and
> ensure that it will not become proposed as a valid value by an iD
> editor (at this moment threshold for building value is 14514 uses).
>
> Between 4000 and 5000 objects are expected to be edited. See
> https://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/tags/building=building#map for a
> geographic distribution.
>
> Changeset would be split into small areas to avoid continent-sized
> bounding boxes. As this tag is on buildings it is not expected that any
> object will force bounding box to be extremely large.
>
> For documentation page see
>
> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Mechanical_Edits/Mateusz_Konieczny_-_bot_account/moving_building%3Dbuilding_to_building%3Dyes
> For documentation of my previous proposals (including both proposals
> that failed to be approved and approved ones) see
>
> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Mechanical_Edits/Mateusz_Konieczny_-_bot_account
>
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Re: [OSM-talk] Remote Sensing / DOP / DIY people

[James]

drones, at least in Canada are even more regulated. You must fly at least
76.2m away from any building(due to privacy concerns), but have a maximum
flight height of 90m. You cannot fly within 5.5km of an aerodrome and 1.8km
of a heliport.
If you are flying non-recreationally(would collecting orthophotos be
considered non-rec.?) you need a license to operate. With the license I
believe you need a 10$ liability coverage. Where as a kite, you dont.

https://www.tc.gc.ca/eng/civilaviation/opssvs/flying-drone-safely-legally.html#tips

On Sun, Jun 3, 2018, 2:57 AM Simon Poole,  wrote:

>
>
> Am 02.06.2018 um 00:45 schrieb James:
>
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kite_aerial_photography#Picavet_suspension
>
> When I was looking at RC planes, the one that could hold a quality
> camera+fly for for a relatively long time is the skywalker X8(~200$ USD) +
> batteries, controllers and motors(~200-250) which comes out to about 450$
> US.
>
> Where as a kite and a picavet costs about 50$ for a good kite and some
> scrap wood.
>
> Only advantage is a drone can be flown over houses, but kite doesnt have
> any "no fly zones" except maybe power lines
>
>
> People tend to not realize it, but kites tend to be quite heavily
> regulated too and, at least in the couple of countries for which I've
> looked at the regulation, are legally limited in ways that don't make them
> particularly attractive as a remote sensing platform (obviously some of the
> issues are the same as with UAVs so it is unlikely that the regulators
> would leave big open holes in their rules in other countries).
>
> Simon
>
>
> On Fri, Jun 1, 2018, 6:38 PM Pierre Béland,  wrote:
>
>> I dont know what is picavet. But I dont think thatKite, or balloon or
>> similar flying objects could cover rapidly and systematically a rectangular
>> area, be stabilized and produce images of quality.
>>
>> The fix wings are still expansive but can produce rapidly very precise
>> imageries and elevation models. It would be interesting to examine the
>> faisability to develop such a project including both hardware and open
>> source software.
>>
>>
>> Pierre
>>
>>
>> Le vendredi 1 juin 2018 17 h 39 min 06 s HAE, James 
>> a écrit :
>>
>>
>> cheaper and simpler would be a kite and a picavet system. I was looking
>> into building a FPV, but just getting it to fly in a pattern gets expensive
>> quickly(even building from scratch)
>>
>> On Thu, May 31, 2018, 9:01 PM Florian Lohoff,  wrote:
>>
>>
>> Hi,
>> is there a Mailinglist for the Technical aspects of DIY Remote Sensing
>> e.g. Aerial imaging?
>>
>> I am talking about Drone/Copter/Autonomous flying like Sensefly Ebee
>> and the like.
>>
>> As a lot of people are not capable of buying of the shelve equipment
>> like the Ebee it might be interesting to get people together with
>> their DIY projects. Autonomous Fixed Wings could be build in the range
>> of 300€ - But then IMHO the hard part starts.
>>
>> Camera, Georeferencing the GeoTIFFs, creating a WMS service to be
>> able to use them with Josm etc. Getting together an Open Source
>> toolchain, docker containers, howtos etc
>>
>>
>> Here is a (German) walk through in building a FPV Wing. We wouldnt need
>> the FPV parts and this size is most likely not capable of carrying a
>> camera but its a start.
>>
>> https://blog.seidel-philipp.de/fpv-wing-aus-kopter-teilen-bauen-mit-inav/
>>
>>
>> For somebody who has dealt with electronics in the past its Buildable
>> but i am having a hard time getting it actually to fly.
>>
>> Flo
>> --
>> Florian Lohoff f...@zz.de
>>  UTF-8 Test: The  ran after a , but the  ran away
>> ___
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>> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
>>
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>
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Re: [OSM-talk] Remote Sensing / DOP / DIY people

[James]

cheaper and simpler would be a kite and a picavet system. I was looking
into building a FPV, but just getting it to fly in a pattern gets expensive
quickly(even building from scratch)

On Thu, May 31, 2018, 9:01 PM Florian Lohoff,  wrote:

>
> Hi,
> is there a Mailinglist for the Technical aspects of DIY Remote Sensing
> e.g. Aerial imaging?
>
> I am talking about Drone/Copter/Autonomous flying like Sensefly Ebee
> and the like.
>
> As a lot of people are not capable of buying of the shelve equipment
> like the Ebee it might be interesting to get people together with
> their DIY projects. Autonomous Fixed Wings could be build in the range
> of 300€ - But then IMHO the hard part starts.
>
> Camera, Georeferencing the GeoTIFFs, creating a WMS service to be
> able to use them with Josm etc. Getting together an Open Source
> toolchain, docker containers, howtos etc
>
>
> Here is a (German) walk through in building a FPV Wing. We wouldnt need
> the FPV parts and this size is most likely not capable of carrying a
> camera but its a start.
>
> https://blog.seidel-philipp.de/fpv-wing-aus-kopter-teilen-bauen-mit-inav/
>
>
> For somebody who has dealt with electronics in the past its Buildable
> but i am having a hard time getting it actually to fly.
>
> Flo
> --
> Florian Lohoff f...@zz.de
>  UTF-8 Test: The  ran after a , but the  ran away
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Re: [OSM-talk] Remote Sensing / DOP / DIY people

[James]

Still cant beat ~50$ for a good kite pieces of string and a block of wood

On Fri, Jun 1, 2018, 4:19 AM Florian Lohoff,  wrote:

> On Thu, May 31, 2018 at 11:12:49PM -0400, James wrote:
> > cheaper and simpler would be a kite and a picavet system. I was looking
> > into building a FPV, but just getting it to fly in a pattern gets
> expensive
> > quickly(even building from scratch)
>
> INav on a flight controller like the Omnibus F4 should be able to do
> that for you.
>
> Flo
> --
> Florian Lohoff f...@zz.de
>  UTF-8 Test: The  ran after a , but the  ran away
>
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Re: [OSM-talk] Remote Sensing / DOP / DIY people

[James]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kite_aerial_photography#Picavet_suspension

When I was looking at RC planes, the one that could hold a quality
camera+fly for for a relatively long time is the skywalker X8(~200$ USD) +
batteries, controllers and motors(~200-250) which comes out to about 450$
US.

Where as a kite and a picavet costs about 50$ for a good kite and some
scrap wood.

Only advantage is a drone can be flown over houses, but kite doesnt have
any "no fly zones" except maybe power lines

On Fri, Jun 1, 2018, 6:38 PM Pierre Béland,  wrote:

> I dont know what is picavet. But I dont think thatKite, or balloon or
> similar flying objects could cover rapidly and systematically a rectangular
> area, be stabilized and produce images of quality.
>
> The fix wings are still expansive but can produce rapidly very precise
> imageries and elevation models. It would be interesting to examine the
> faisability to develop such a project including both hardware and open
> source software.
>
>
> Pierre
>
>
> Le vendredi 1 juin 2018 17 h 39 min 06 s HAE, James 
> a écrit :
>
>
> cheaper and simpler would be a kite and a picavet system. I was looking
> into building a FPV, but just getting it to fly in a pattern gets expensive
> quickly(even building from scratch)
>
> On Thu, May 31, 2018, 9:01 PM Florian Lohoff,  wrote:
>
>
> Hi,
> is there a Mailinglist for the Technical aspects of DIY Remote Sensing
> e.g. Aerial imaging?
>
> I am talking about Drone/Copter/Autonomous flying like Sensefly Ebee
> and the like.
>
> As a lot of people are not capable of buying of the shelve equipment
> like the Ebee it might be interesting to get people together with
> their DIY projects. Autonomous Fixed Wings could be build in the range
> of 300€ - But then IMHO the hard part starts.
>
> Camera, Georeferencing the GeoTIFFs, creating a WMS service to be
> able to use them with Josm etc. Getting together an Open Source
> toolchain, docker containers, howtos etc
>
>
> Here is a (German) walk through in building a FPV Wing. We wouldnt need
> the FPV parts and this size is most likely not capable of carrying a
> camera but its a start.
>
> https://blog.seidel-philipp.de/fpv-wing-aus-kopter-teilen-bauen-mit-inav/
>
>
> For somebody who has dealt with electronics in the past its Buildable
> but i am having a hard time getting it actually to fly.
>
> Flo
> --
> Florian Lohoff f...@zz.de
>  UTF-8 Test: The  ran after a , but the  ran away
> ___
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Re: [OSM-talk] [Imports] Automated edit for bus lines in Paris area

[James]

Have you taken a look at this project?
https://github.com/CUTR-at-USF/gtfs-osm-sync

On Tue, Jun 5, 2018, 6:36 AM Johnparis,  wrote:

> Hi, Stefan, two steps required. The second is a lot easier than the first.
>
> 1) curate a database of exiting nodes. Choosing a unique key usually isn't
> difficult, especially if you are using GTFS data (stop_id is a good
> choice). Cross-check against routes already mapped.
> 2) write a proposal. You might want to wait till the feedback here is
> addressed! :)
>
> Cheers,
>
> John
>
> On Tue, Jun 5, 2018 at 8:57 AM, Stefan de Konink  wrote:
>
>> If this will be allowed, I would want to do the same for The Netherlands.
>>
>> Stefan
>>
>>
>> On dinsdag 5 juni 2018 06:45:22 CEST, Mateusz Konieczny wrote:
>>
>>> "Summary: Adding values for two existing tags to bus stops"
>>>
>>>  example edit changes three tags.
>>>
>>> The same in the proposed changes etc comment.
>>>
>>> "This provides a link between the OSM node and the STIF stop_id."
>>>
>>> And how this match is obtained?
>>>
>>> Is source code of program generating matches and making edit published
>>> somewhere?
>>>
>>> How edits will be split to avoid mega-edit changing thousands of objects
>>> with massive bounding box?
>>>
>>> I see no mention of changeset tags - and wiki recommends adding some.
>>>
>>> 5 Jun 2018, 00:15 by ok...@johnfreed.com:
>>> I am planning an automated edit to improve our coverage of two existing
>>> tags in the Paris region. The data source is the regional transit
>>> coordinating agency, Île-de-France Mobilité, formerly STIF.
>>>
>>> There is a question about wheelchair access that I would like feedback
>>> on.
>>>
>>> If there is no need for a significant change, I plan to implement this
>>> around June 20.
>>>
>>> Please make comments here or on the Discussion page attached to the
>>> proposal:
>>>
>>> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Automated_edits/johnparis
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>>
>>> John
>>>
>>> !DSPAM:1,5b16340e79641880612683!
>>>
>>
>> --
>> Stefan
>>
>>
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Re: [OSM-talk] proposed mechanical edit - moving FIXME=* to fixme=*

[James]

are there any overlap with FIXME and fixme as in an object tagged with
both? Is it possible or the osm API considers them the same(case
insensitive)?

If there are no overlaps I dont see an issue tagging this the proper way

On Mon, Jul 2, 2018, 1:44 PM Mateusz Konieczny, 
wrote:

> fixme tag is a standard way to mark fixmes.
> Editors wishing to finish mapping in their area would (directly or
> indirectly, for example using JOSM) look through objects tagged with
> fixme tags.
>
> FIXME tag is an unexpected way to mark fixmes, retagging this duplicate to
> fixme key would improve tagging without any information loss.
>
> It would make development of QA tools easier as authors would not need to
> discover and implement support for this duplicated key.
>
> Between X and Y objects are expected to be edited. See
> https://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/keys/FIXME#map for a
> geographic distribution.
>
> Changeset would be split into small areas to avoid continent-sized
> bounding boxes. As this tag may be on extremely large objects (for example
> relations representing long routes) it may be unavoidable to make some
> edits with very large bounding boxes.
>
> For documentation page see
>
> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Mechanical_Edits/Mateusz_Konieczny_-_bot_account/moving_FIXME_to_fixme
> For documentation of my previous proposals (including both proposals
> that failed to be approved and approved ones) see
>
> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Mechanical_Edits/Mateusz_Konieczny_-_bot_account
>
> Please comment - especially if there are any problems with this idea.
> Please also comment if you support this edit, in case of no response
> at all edit will not be made as there would be no evidence that
> this idea is supported.
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Re: [OSM-talk] How INSPIRE data are sold in your countries

[James]

Canada: Canvec data is free from NRCan

On Wed, May 2, 2018, 11:13 AM Honza Cibulka,  wrote:

> Hello,
>
> I am in the middle of court proceedings related to prices which Czech
> state GIS authority asks for INSPIRE data (for context, it´s about hundreds
> of thousands Euro for altimetry dataset, which is basically off reach for
> anyone).
>
>
>
> I want to know what is common practice among other EU countries, how your
> governments are setting prices of state-created GIS data, and how
> restrictive licensing terms are (our license basically forbids use of state
> data to create OSM).
>
>
>
> Of course I know that British Ordnance Survey maps are free for download,
> but I need more examples, preferable from countries with legal systems
> similar to us, like Slovakia, Germany, Austria, Hungary, Poland, Spain and
> others...
>
>
>
> Thanks for all info you could send me.
>
>
>
> Jan Cibulka
>
> tel.: +420 776 307 158
>
> datastory.cz
>
>
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Re: [OSM-talk] Wikimedia Maps deployment

[James]

also i believe a multi-lingual map will require vector tiles to be dynamic,
which is being worked on as well

On Thu, May 3, 2018, 3:36 AM Eugene Alvin Villar,  wrote:

> On Thu, May 3, 2018 at 2:50 PM, Daniel Koć  wrote:
>
>> It's also good that they were able to deploy multiple language versions
>> - we would hit this problem anyway, sooner or later, and I hope that
>> eventually we will be able to provide them too.
>>
>
> FWIW, multi-language maps is one of the Top Ten Tasks defined by the
> Engineering Working Group of the OSM Foundation.
> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Top_Ten_Tasks#Localized_map_rendering
>
> There's also the ongoing thread on this same mailing list:
> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk/2018-April/080560.html
>
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Re: [OSM-talk] Woods vs Forests

[James]

landuse= man made and maintained
natrual= it made itself(which is 99.9% of the time the case)

On Oct 27, 2017 5:27 AM, "Dave F"  wrote:

> You appear to be differentiating based on size & location which, seeing
> OSM's output is visual & geospatial seems unnecessary.
>
> *All* groups of trees are 'natural' so there should only be one primary
> tag. All "purposes" should be within sub-tags.
>
> DaveF
>
> On 27/10/2017 08:52, Tomas Straupis wrote:
>
>> Some info on how/why forest/wood tagging is used in Lithuania. I will
>> not give specific tags (forest vs wood, landuse vs natural etc),
>> because in my opinion that is a secondary issue. Let's say we have
>> tags F1 and F2.
>>
>> F1 is for general forests. Those are the ones depicted on small scale
>> maps (full country/region).
>>
>> F2 is for small wooded areas INSIDE other polygons, usually inside
>> residential, commercial, industrial zones.
>>
>> This approach ignores utility as such (managed, non managed, natural,
>> left for full nature cycles as mention in Oleksiy's post). This
>> information could be added as a sub-tag if needed for some thematic
>> maps or specific statistical calculations.
>>
>> What I'm saying is that maybe we should:
>> 1. first decide the PURPOSES of having "tree cluster" polygons tagged
>> separately.
>> 2. Then PRIORITISE the purposes (based on ACTUAL usage ignoring all
>> "it could theoretically be used to/for...")
>> 3. and then decide which info goes to primary tag, which goes to
>> secondary tag(s).
>> 4. And only THEN decide on actual tags (keys, values).
>> Doing it the other way round will take us back to this forest
>> discussion as it has been here for the last ten years like discussing
>> what the words "forest", "wood", "natural", "landuse", "landcover"
>> etc. actually mean.
>>
>>
>
> ---
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Re: [OSM-talk] OSM tagging validation lib

[James]

ID is javascript, JOSM is java. So right there I already see a
intercompatibility issue

On Dec 24, 2017 6:12 AM, "François Lacombe" 
wrote:

> Hi
>
> Here is an idea I got regarding tagging validation in editors (iD, JOSM,
> others).
> Subsequently to wiki proposal voting and cleanups, it's currently
> necessarily to open issues in each editor repository to ask for new tagging
> validation rules.
>
> It can sometimes be time consuming to develop those new rules and such a
> work is done independently by each project maintainer. While each project
> have its own specific components, background logic is the same.
>
> Would a new lib called like osmtagvalidator or so in charge of doing
> conform validation to wiki be useful?
> It may be shared by any project involved in osm editing and preserve its
> resources for other valuable developments.
>
> For me, validation doesn't prevent users to use tags they want, but only
> warn them about possible mistakes.
>
> How would devs and users feel about this?
>
> All the best
>
> François
>
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Re: [OSM-talk] "The Future of Free and Open-Source Maps" Slashdot.org , Saturday February 17, 2018

[James]

except it wouldnt be multiplatform and only run on windows 濫冷. Java is a
better alternative as it's a popular language and is multiplatform. C/c++
is a bit more complicated and not everyone can contribute.

On Feb 17, 2018 10:56 AM, "john whelan"  wrote:

> I think that highlights the point on the limited resources available on
> the resource side.
>
> What we have sort of works.  Could it be better?  Most probably.
>
> The JOSM editor is very nice but it runs over JAVA and JAVA has been
> recognised as a security problem and it not recommended for many
> corporations.
>
> Something in Visual Basic sorry Visual Studio Express might be more
> acceptable.
>
> Most commercial coding these days is done in Visual Studio for good
> reasons.  To change the database architecture and the associated
> infrastructure is a fairly large change.  There is a lot of investment in
> what we have but on the other hand the most valuable bit of what we have is
> the data and that can moved across.
>
> Will it happen.  Probably not.  Normally what causes this sort of change
> is money.  Things like support costs, what do we do when the guys who know
> this stuff disappear?  Can we demonstrate the code is clean and reliable?
> I don't think there is anyone looking at these sort of things.
>
> Cheerio John
>
> On 17 February 2018 at 09:45, Eugene Alvin Villar 
> wrote:
>
>> On Sat, Feb 17, 2018 at 9:53 PM, john whelan 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Possibly a technical working group to identify areas that could be
>>> improved or even if we were to start over again how would we do it from a
>>> technical point of view?  Funding would be a different problem.
>>>
>>
>> I believe the now-defunct Strategic Working Group (
>> https://wiki.osmfoundation.org/wiki/Strategic_Working_Group) is what you
>> are looking for?
>>
>> ~Eugene
>>
>
>
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Re: [OSM-talk] "The Future of Free and Open-Source Maps" Slashdot.org , Saturday February 17, 2018

[James]

You would need to install mono to run it and not everyone has mono or wants
it installed(thats the problem with Virtual Machine languages). We would
also have to rename it to Cosm. Doesn't have a nice ring to it ;).

On Feb 17, 2018 1:19 PM, "Mike N" <nice...@att.net> wrote:

> On 2/17/2018 11:01 AM, James wrote:
>
>> except it wouldnt be multiplatform and only run on windows 濫冷. Java is
>> a better alternative as it's a popular language and is multiplatform. C/c++
>> is a bit more complicated and not everyone can contribute.
>>
>
> That's no longer true - .Net is open source and generates multiplatform
> code and the C# language has an open source reference.
>
>  That being said, Java is quite suitable for JOSM, and the security issues
> would rarely if ever surface in JOSM.  The big question is how well does
> JOSM serve as an OSM editor?   Quite well by a number of indicators.
>
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Re: [OSM-talk] Is this legal to what philly.com is doing?

[James]

specifically:
http://philly.reprintmint.com/006-default.html?src=http%3A%2F%2Fmedia.philly.com%2Fimages%2F250*250%2Fdixon-390888-f-wp-content-uploads-2018-02-dixon-384405-e-wp-content-uploads-2018-02-new-map-1200x800.png=http%3A%2F%2Fmedia.philly.com%2Fimages%2Fdixon-390888-f-wp-content-uploads-2018-02-dixon-384405-e-wp-content-uploads-2018-02-new-map-1200x800.png=006=dixon-384405-e-wp-content-uploads-2018-02-new-map=The%20new%20congressional%20map%20released%20Monday%20by%20the%20Pennsylvania%20Supreme%20Court
.

On Feb 22, 2018 11:06 PM, "James Mast" <rickmastfa...@hotmail.com> wrote:

> http://www.philly.com/philly/news/politics/will-republicans-impeach-
> pennsylvania-supreme-court-justices-20180222.html
>
> (ignore what the article is about)
>
>
> Just happen to see a thumbnail and clicked on the article since I noticed
> the OSM base map.  Nowhere that I can find does it give credit to OSM for
> the use of it.
>
>
> Now, the part to where I was curious if this was legal (sans the lack of
> credit), is that they are 'selling' the uploaded image.  Is that allowed
> currently under the license that OSM has?
>
>
> Just thought I'd throw this out there for somebody more experienced in
> this sector.
>
>
>
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Re: [OSM-talk] Standard map style contributions

[James]

Lack of time due to real life preoccupations?

On Dec 28, 2017 8:45 AM, "Mateusz Konieczny" <matkoni...@gmail.com> wrote:

> If somebody tried contributing and missing documentation was what
> stopped him/her - what was missing?
>
> On Thu, 28 Dec 2017 08:34:34 -0500
> James <james2...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Although the rest seems like CSS or a variation there of the project
> > is big and they may not grasp everything. Proper documentation for me
> > is a major factor, if the project doesnt have
> > documentation(developement not user guides or at least well placed
> > comments) it helps people get into it faster as they know what parts
> > do what vs reading all of the project and guessing what parts do what.
> >
> > On Dec 28, 2017 8:25 AM, "Daniel Koć" <daniel@koć.pl> wrote:
> >
> > > W dniu 28.12.2017 o 14:04, James pisze:
> > >
> > >> not everyone knows lua scripting might be one of the major herdles
> > >>
> > >
> > > Is this what keeps you away from the code or there are some other
> > > obstacles? I'm most interested in hearing personal reasons,
> > > whatever they might be.
> > >
> > > Fortunately lua scripting is not needed most of the time. For
> > > example I never had to touch it, though I make a lot of changes in
> > > osm-carto, so I would not worry about it.
> > >
> > > --
> > > "My method is uncertain/ It's a mess but it's working" [F. Apple]
> > >
> > >
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> > >
>
>
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Re: [OSM-talk] Standard map style contributions

[James]

Although the rest seems like CSS or a variation there of the project is big
and they may not grasp everything. Proper documentation for me is a major
factor, if the project doesnt have documentation(developement not user
guides or at least well placed comments) it helps people get into it faster
as they know what parts do what vs reading all of the project and guessing
what parts do what.

On Dec 28, 2017 8:25 AM, "Daniel Koć" <daniel@koć.pl> wrote:

> W dniu 28.12.2017 o 14:04, James pisze:
>
>> not everyone knows lua scripting might be one of the major herdles
>>
>
> Is this what keeps you away from the code or there are some other
> obstacles? I'm most interested in hearing personal reasons, whatever they
> might be.
>
> Fortunately lua scripting is not needed most of the time. For example I
> never had to touch it, though I make a lot of changes in osm-carto, so I
> would not worry about it.
>
> --
> "My method is uncertain/ It's a mess but it's working" [F. Apple]
>
>
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Re: [OSM-talk] Standard map style contributions

[James]

not everyone knows lua scripting might be one of the major herdles

On Dec 28, 2017 5:49 AM, "Daniel Koć"  wrote:

> Hi,
>
> We have a lot of tickets waiting for solving in osm-carto (almost 400) and
> I'm interested how could we do it effectively.
>
> It's not realistic to expect that the core team would be able to catch up
> and that's why we took some care to help other people to contribute. Most
> important thing was preparing the Docker environment, which makes
> installing and testing a lot easier, but there are also some documents
> explaining the inner working of the project and even some very easy tasks
> to pick:
>
> https://github.com/gravitystorm/openstreetmap-carto/labels/
> good%20first%20issue
>
> However after almost half a year we still don't have too many
> contributions from other people and I'm curious what are the main obstacles
> which prevent it and what else could we possibly change to make it easier?
> There's also more basic question: how many people are interested in
> contributing to osm-carto at all?
>
>
> --
> "My method is uncertain/ It's a mess but it's working" [F. Apple]
>
>
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Re: [OSM-talk] Paper/Article about stagnation in OSM

[James]

A lot can happen in 10 years...

On Wed, Aug 1, 2018, 3:34 PM Mateusz Konieczny, 
wrote:

> 1. Sierpień 2018 21:27 od matkoni...@tutanota.com:
>
> 31. Lipiec 2018 23:49 od frede...@remote.org:
>
> an interesting read: "The social construction of technological stasis:
> The stagnating data structure in OpenStreetMap."
>
>
> It is hard for me to treat seriously something that has
>
>
> "Figure 6. Code revisions per month and person in OSM’s SVN repository (
> https://svn.openstreetmap.org)."
>
>
> graph ending in 2008.
>
>
> To be clear: I know that there are some attempts to cover activity after
> 2008
> but I would expect from research more than disjointed graphs that are
> impossible to compare.
>
>
> I know that it is not very easy to do, but I would expect something more
>
> than automatic github graphs provide from something that attempts to be
>
> a scientific research.
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Re: [OSM-talk] Fwd: 2 Great Lakes missing

[James]

Yeah those great "lakes" are such a massive relations... I think I can make
toast on my computer while it's calculating the errors. Thanks for fixing
it Selfish Seahorse

On Mon., Aug. 13, 2018, 9:12 a.m. SelfishSeahorse, <
selfishseaho...@gmail.com> wrote:

> On Mon, 13 Aug 2018 at 14:01, Christoph Hormann  wrote:
> >
> >
> > Note you can easily check if there are broken multipolygons in the OSM
> > inspector:
> >
> >
> http://tools.geofabrik.de/osmi/?view=areas=-84.14378=46.10509=8
> >
> > If a lake multipolygon is broken the lake outline will be shown as
> > context there and the location of the error usually in red (self
> > interaection) or magenta (ring not closed).
>
> Thanks for the tip; I din't think of it. Actually my computer had more
> difficulties to calculate that i had to find the errors. :-)
>
> Regards
> Markus
>
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Re: [OSM-talk] 2 Great Lakes missing

[James]

someone probably broke them again... happens quite often sadly...

On Thu., Aug. 9, 2018, 9:05 p.m. Daniel Koć,  wrote:

> Hi,
>
> Is anybody aware what happened to Lake Superior and Lake Huron?
>
> https://www.openstreetmap.org/relation/4039486
>
> https://www.openstreetmap.org/relation/1205151
>
>
> They were changed 20 and 3 days ago, respectively, and they stopped
> being rendered both on default and on humanitarian map.
>
>
> --
> "My method is uncertain/ It's a mess but it's working" [F. Apple]
>
>
>
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Re: [OSM-talk] API a lot slower?

[James]

https://twitter.com/OSM_Tech/status/1018447091423744000?s=20

On Tue, Jul 17, 2018, 5:46 AM Maarten Deen,  wrote:

> Is it just me or just today or is the API a lot slower after the move on
> sunday? I'm downloading a number of busrelations and it takes a lot
> longer than before the weekend.
>
> Regards,
> Maarten
>
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Re: [OSM-talk] Source 'NTIC' on S-Korea OSM data

[James]

Could it be:  Northern Technologies International Corporation? They seem to
have businesses(oil and energy) in korea. Either that or Tourist
Information Center?

On Thu, Jul 5, 2018, 6:00 PM Martijn van Exel,  wrote:

> Hi all,
> I was looking at source tags and noticing that a lot of ways have 'NTIC'
> as source for South Korea. Who knows what this source is?
> --
>   Martijn van Exel
>   m...@rtijn.org
>
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Re: [OSM-talk] Scientific paper on "Information Seeding"

[James]

>From what I understand TIGER data is very poor quality to begin with and is
at a federal level, this study doesnt take into account local GIS data(say
a city or a province/state data) which often is more accurate. It seems
fixated on one data import instance vs many in statististics their sample
size would be too small to draw a conclusion

On Mon, Jul 9, 2018, 5:05 AM Warin, <61sundow...@gmail.com> wrote:

> On 09/07/18 18:35, Christoph Hormann wrote:
> >
> > And if you want to know about how to successfully map and build a local
> > mapping community in a large and sparsely populated country and are fed
> > up with the namby-pamby western Europeans who don't know a thing about
> > this maybe talk to the Russians...
>
> Yep.
>
> 
>
> All to easy to be critical .. but so what?
> Getting people to contribute to the map is what it is about.
> There is one guy on Quilpie Queensland Australia who has made good
> contributions to the map - he is local .. so knows what is there.
> The edits may not be the 'best' but they do indicate what is there.. I've
> edited some of them to make them OSM 'better' but tried to keep the
> original information.
> Yet to contact him to let him know .. but good on him for putting his foot
> in the water.
> Don't think there is much chance of getting a local group out there ..
> unless you count 1 as a group.
> And maybe one is all it takes in smaller places.
> Officially Quilpie's population is less than 600.
>
>
>
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Re: [OSM-talk] Strava Cycling and Running Heatmap not working

[James]

403 is Forbidden
Possibly due to api endpoint changes.

On Thu, Mar 15, 2018, 3:34 PM Sérgio V.,  wrote:

> Perhaps due to this update?
>
> "...we are eager to introduce new ways we are protecting that data and the
> athletes who provide it:..."
>
> "...Roads and trails with very little activity will not show “heat” until
> several different athletes upload activities in that area..."
>
> "The heatmap remains available to the public, but only registered Strava
> athletes may zoom in to street-level details of activity on the heatmap."
>
> https://blog.strava.com/press/heatmap-updates/
>
>
> - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
>
> Sérgio - http://www.openstreetmap.org/user/smaprs
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Re: [OSM-talk] Please do not re-use old node IDs

[James]

@Yves unfortunately would be hard to implement as reverting
reuses/undeletes the object if I'm not mistaken. So someone could just
undelete a node than move it to where they need to.

On Mar 6, 2018 5:47 AM, "Yves"  wrote:

> Hi Frederik,
> For my curiosity, is it a feature of the API to:
> _ allow users to choose an ID?
> _ not re-assign an old ID?
> Yves
>
> Le 6 mars 2018 11:26:55 GMT+01:00, Frederik Ramm  a
> écrit :
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> we're all concerned about the environment these days. "Reduce, Reuse,
>> Recycle" is certainly something to strive for in the real world out there.
>>
>> However, for the second time now I've encountered a user who thought it
>> was a good idea to reclaim old node IDs for new edits. A couple of
>> long-deleted TIGER nodes were raised from the dead, and put to use in
>> mapping some new roads on the other side of the planet.
>>
>> This sounds like a funny/quirky thing to do, and looks harmless enough
>> on the surface. But anyone who ever looks at the history of things
>> *will* be totally confused. Nobody who works with historic data will
>> expect that a U.S. bus stop could become a tree in Romania. People are
>> bound to interpret this in any number of wrong ways. It also messes up
>> my full history extracts, where you'll now find the occasional German
>> hiking route in the California data extract because a node that used to
>> be in California is now part of a path that belongs to the hiking route.
>>
>> Long story short, please don't do it - let the API assign you new node
>> IDs to your stuff instead of building ingenious contraptions to recycle
>> old nodes.
>>
>> Thanks
>> Frederik
>>
>>
> Yves
>
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Re: [OSM-talk] [Osmf-talk] ODbL text

[James]

Just because you are not the curator of the license doesnt mean you cant
display the full legal text somewhere else...The text wont change. GPL,
LGPL, BSD, etc projects usually distribute their software with a license
text file with the full legal text and dont depend on 1 single point of
failure

On Sun, Apr 8, 2018, 8:13 AM Simon Poole, <si...@poole.ch> wrote:

>
>
> Am 08.04.2018 um 13:30 schrieb James:
>
> why not host it on the osmf website?
>
>
> Because we don't own the domain (which is what most references to the
> actual text use) and are not the curators of the licence (aka we could in
> principle simply covertly change the text of the license, having a third
> party publish the text is in principle a good idea for such reasons).
>
> Simon
>
> PS: that doesn't mean that having our own clean copy as a backup wouldn't
> be a good idea, but IMHO the pointer to archive.org is probably the best
> of all bad solutions right now.
>
>
> On Sun, Apr 8, 2018, 5:46 AM Simon Poole, <si...@poole.ch> wrote:
>
>> Currently I'm pointing to
>> http://web.archive.org/web/20180317184051/https://opendatacommons.org/licenses/odbl/
>> however as the opendatacommons.org links are all over the place that
>> isn't really a solution. OKI seems to be aware of the issue, but that is
>> about all what we know (they seem to be intending to move the site to a
>> static website, but there doesn't seem to be a time line or anything
>> available that would indicate if that will happen soon or in a decade).
>>
>> I'm sure waving some $ bills in the direction of OKI/Viderum would get it
>> fixed pronto, but it is obviously an undesirable situation that we are
>> depending on a third party that doesn't seem to be interested to provide a
>> stable link to our licence terms.
>>
>> Simon
>>
>> Am 04.04.2018 um 11:27 schrieb Martin Koppenhoefer:
>>
>>
>>
>> 2018-04-04 10:23 GMT+02:00 Javier Sánchez Portero <javiers...@gmail.com>:
>>
>>> Hello
>>>
>>> My name is Javier Sánchez, from Spain.
>>>
>>> The link to the ODbL 1.0 License [1] is not available since January.
>>> This is an annoyance if trying to ask for explicit permission to any data
>>> source. Is there any alternative reference? Should not be fine that OSMF
>>> provide a copy of the text in their site while opendatacommons.org is
>>> down?
>>>
>>> [1] https://opendatacommons.org/licenses/odbl/1.0/
>>>
>>> Regards, Javier
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> I agree we should host our own copy of the license.
>>
>> If you need the license text urgently, you can find it here in the
>> Internet Archive (not a general solution obviously):
>>
>> https://web.archive.org/web/20180316015654/https://opendatacommons.org/licenses/odbl/1.0/
>>
>> This is a snapshot from yesterday, so somehow they got through, but I
>> confirm I didn't ge the page either, Error 522.
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Martin
>>
>>
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Re: [OSM-talk] [Osmf-talk] ODbL text

[James]

why not host it on the osmf website?

On Sun, Apr 8, 2018, 5:46 AM Simon Poole,  wrote:

> Currently I'm pointing to
> http://web.archive.org/web/20180317184051/https://opendatacommons.org/licenses/odbl/
> however as the opendatacommons.org links are all over the place that
> isn't really a solution. OKI seems to be aware of the issue, but that is
> about all what we know (they seem to be intending to move the site to a
> static website, but there doesn't seem to be a time line or anything
> available that would indicate if that will happen soon or in a decade).
>
> I'm sure waving some $ bills in the direction of OKI/Viderum would get it
> fixed pronto, but it is obviously an undesirable situation that we are
> depending on a third party that doesn't seem to be interested to provide a
> stable link to our licence terms.
>
> Simon
>
> Am 04.04.2018 um 11:27 schrieb Martin Koppenhoefer:
>
>
>
> 2018-04-04 10:23 GMT+02:00 Javier Sánchez Portero :
>
>> Hello
>>
>> My name is Javier Sánchez, from Spain.
>>
>> The link to the ODbL 1.0 License [1] is not available since January. This
>> is an annoyance if trying to ask for explicit permission to any data
>> source. Is there any alternative reference? Should not be fine that OSMF
>> provide a copy of the text in their site while opendatacommons.org is
>> down?
>>
>> [1] https://opendatacommons.org/licenses/odbl/1.0/
>>
>> Regards, Javier
>>
>
>
>
> I agree we should host our own copy of the license.
>
> If you need the license text urgently, you can find it here in the
> Internet Archive (not a general solution obviously):
>
> https://web.archive.org/web/20180316015654/https://opendatacommons.org/licenses/odbl/1.0/
>
> This is a snapshot from yesterday, so somehow they got through, but I
> confirm I didn't ge the page either, Error 522.
>
> Cheers,
> Martin
>
>
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Re: [OSM-talk] weeklyOSM #403 2018-04-03-2018-04-09

[James]

the English page is in spanish for some reason..

On Fri, Apr 13, 2018, 1:59 PM weeklyteam,  wrote:

> The weekly round-up of OSM news, issue # 403,
> is now available online in English, giving as always a summary of all
> things happening in the openstreetmap world:
>
> http://www.weeklyosm.eu/en/archives/10227/
>
> Enjoy!
>
> weeklyOSM?
> who?: https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/WeeklyOSM#Available_Languages
> where?:
> https://umap.openstreetmap.fr/en/map/weeklyosm-is-currently-produced-in_56718#2/8.6/108.3
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Re: [OSM-talk] How do you mapping gender neutral toilets? What should the unisex tag mean?

[James]

not only that, bit generally in North America, men's washrooms are usually
dirtier than woamns washrooms

On Tue, Apr 24, 2018, 2:46 PM Kathleen Lu,  wrote:

> I think the most likely application may be the other way around, where
> transgender individuals concerned about harassment may purposefully seek
> out restrooms that are designated unisex in order to reduce the chances of
> encountering someone who might challenge whether they are using the
> "correct" restroom.
> -Kathleen
>
> On Tue, Apr 24, 2018 at 11:12 AM Frederik Ramm 
> wrote:
>
>> Hi,
>>
>> On 04/24/2018 08:02 PM, Tobias Zwick wrote:
>> > Why do you think it necessary to map at all if any particular toilet is
>> > segregated or not beyond whether I can go there as a man/woman? What is
>> > the application?
>>
>> I know people of both standard genders who would prefer using a toilet
>> that is for their gender's exclusive use over a toilet that is for all
>> genders.
>>
>> Their respective reasons for doing so are based on unflattering
>> stereotypes so I won't repeat them here, but there definitely *are*
>> people who do not only want to know "can I use that toilet" but also
>> "who else can use that toilet".
>>
>> Bye
>> Frederik
>>
>> --
>> Frederik Ramm  ##  eMail frede...@remote.org  ##  N49°00'09" E008°23'33"
>>
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Re: [OSM-talk] Vote cheating?

[James]

IPs can also be spoofed via proxys.

On Fri, Mar 16, 2018, 8:09 AM john whelan, <jwhelan0...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > You probably have to check the logfiles. Not sure if you can do this
> from within the wiki.
>
> Maarten
>
> I'm unable to think of a way to verify this.  The IP address might help
> but many people sometimes share the same IP address.
>
> Cheerio John
>
> On 16 March 2018 at 07:42, Maarten Deen <md...@xs4all.nl> wrote:
>
>> You probably have to check the logfiles. Not sure if you can do this from
>> within the wiki.
>>
>> Maarten
>>
>>
>> On 2018-03-16 12:38, john whelan wrote:
>>
>>> But how would you check this?
>>>
>>> Thanks John
>>>
>>> On 16 March 2018 at 07:31, Maarten Deen <md...@xs4all.nl> wrote:
>>>
>>> That is a different matter. This is about the possibility that on
>>>> person makes multiple wiki accunts and use those to vote (thereby
>>>> cheating the vote).
>>>>
>>>> I think it would be a good thing to check this.
>>>>
>>>> Maarten
>>>>
>>>> On 2018-03-16 12:18, James wrote:
>>>> You could also argue the opposite way: Not everyone in OSM edits
>>>> the
>>>> wiki, thus probably doesnt have an account, thus to participate,
>>>> they
>>>> need to create an account to vote
>>>>
>>>> On Fri, Mar 16, 2018, 7:16 AM Selfish Seahorse,
>>>> <selfishseaho...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Hi everyone
>>>>
>>>> I've remarked that there are wiki accounts that were only used to
>>>> participate in one proposed feature vote (or in multiple votes by
>>>> the
>>>> same user). How can we be sure that these are different users and
>>>> not
>>>> multiple wiki accounts of the same user for cheating in a vote?
>>>>
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>>>
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Re: [OSM-talk] OpenStreetMap Carto release v4.9.0

[James]

You're welcome :)

On Fri, Mar 23, 2018, 9:45 AM Daniel Koć,  wrote:

> Dear all,
>
> Today, v4.9.0 of the openstreetmap-carto stylesheet (the default
> stylesheet on the OSM website) has been released. Once changes are
> deployed on the openstreetmap.org it will take couple of days before all
> tiles show the new rendering.
>
> Changes include
>
> Major changes
> - A bug where closed ways with natural=cliff or natural=tree_row were
> not rendering has been fixed. This required fixing a transform bug. The
> fix will apply to all objects when they are created in OSM, but there is
> no migration for existing databases. Deployments will have to decide if
> the effects are serious enough to require them to reload the database.
>
> Changes
> - Adding place=square name rendering
> - Adding rendering for different types of towers and masts
> - Making gardens to use grass color with plant nursery pattern
> - Adding rendering for intermittent water bodies
> - Give oceans outline and simplify shapefiles on z0-7
> - Simplify (generalize) admin borders
> - Move natural=grassland and landuse=meadow earlier
> - Start rendering aerialway name
> - Adding icons for amenity=bbq, amenity=shower, leisure=sauna and
> advertising=column
> - Adding special icons for shop=dairy, shop=medical_supply and shop=music
> - Move amenity=toilets to higher zoom levels
> - Fixing some SVG icons artifacts
> - Make military=danger_area font dark pink and slanted
> - Changing rendering for construction=steps to distinguish it from roads
> - Changing label colour of private parking
> - Small documentation and code fixes
>
> Thanks to all the contributors for this release, including james2432,
> Penegal and jragusa, new contributors.
>
> For a full list of commits, see
> https://github.com/gravitystorm/openstreetmap-carto/compare/v4.8.0...v4.9.0
>
> As always, we welcome any bug reports at
> https://github.com/gravitystorm/openstreetmap-carto/issues
>
> --
> "My method is uncertain/ It's a mess but it's working" [F. Apple]
>
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Re: [OSM-talk] Vote cheating?

[James]

You could also argue the opposite way: Not everyone in OSM edits the wiki,
thus probably doesnt have an account, thus to participate, they need to
create an account to vote

On Fri, Mar 16, 2018, 7:16 AM Selfish Seahorse, 
wrote:

> Hi everyone
>
> I've remarked that there are wiki accounts that were only used to
> participate in one proposed feature vote (or in multiple votes by the
> same user). How can we be sure that these are different users and not
> multiple wiki accounts of the same user for cheating in a vote?
>
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Re: [OSM-talk] OSM SPAM detector

[James]

most but not all cases: undiscussed imports get reverted and when they get
the go ahead they would be marked as spam. Very bad way to train the
dataset vs ground truthed spam identification.

On Mar 5, 2018 9:50 AM, "Michał Brzozowski"  wrote:

Could we use something similar to detect generic vandalism by training on
reverted changesets? Many of them have "this changeset was reverted fully
or in part..." comments. Also, analyzing object history or detecting
created_by=reverter;JOSM * would give you more examples to train on.

* Unfortunately this persists for the whole JOSM session, so there will be
some false positives.

Michał

5 mar 2018 15:09 "Jason Remillard"  napisał(a):

> Hi,
>
> This weekend I put together a SPAM detector for OSM changesets.
>
> https://github.com/jremillard/osm-changeset-classification
>
> You don't need to be a developer to contribute, send over any SPAM'y
> changesets you come across via a github issue, a pull request, or even an
> email to me. I just need the changeset id.
>
> The code is currently hitting 99+% accuracy detecting the difference
> between 1500 random normal edits and 1500 sketchy changesets that Fredrick
> shared with the talk-us last last week. This is with zero tuning, so it
> looks like it will work well.
>
> Jason
>
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Re: [OSM-talk] OpenStreetMap Carto design

[James]

So what is intended to replace CartoCSS? Vector tiles?

On Fri, Jun 29, 2018, 5:42 AM Frederik Ramm,  wrote:

> Hi,
>
>without going into the finer details, I'd like to offer an outsider's
> view of OSM Carto development.
>
> When Andy first created OSM Carto, he set out a road map that has long
> been superseded but thanks to version control we can still look at it:
>
> https://github.com/gravitystorm/openstreetmap-carto/blob/v1.0.0/README.md
>
> Essentially it was:
>
> v1.0 - re-implement existing stuff in carto
> v2.0 - make it more suitable for further development and customisation
> v3.0 - tackle the ticket backlog
>
> What has happened instead is that the easier-to-handle v2.0 was
> reasonably successful in attracting volunteers, and now we have a small
> team instead of one person doing the style, which is great. But after a
> while this small team has started milking the toolchain for all it's
> got, and meanwhile the SQL queries are so complex that they threaten to
> nullify any effort that has gone into making the style accessible to new
> participants (or people who want to customise it).
>
> So the ease of participating or customising has more or less already
> gone down the drain; what's still good about OSM Carto is that at least
> you can easily install it as-is on your own infrastructure (I regularly
> do that for business clients), but I fear it is only a matter of time
> until this aspect of usability, too, will be abandoned, and you will
> have to run massive pre-computation jobs in order to even get your map
> off the ground...
>
> Personally speaking, the OSM Carto map has been good enough for me and
> all my use cases for years now. If anything, I found the inflation of
> icons and special cases a bit irritating. I would love it if OSM Carto
> could be split into a "bread and butter" style that is easy to work
> with, easy on the eye and easy to render, and a "cartography
> navel-gazing" add-on where we show off how we can render different track
> patterns depending on the pebble size. We could then offer both on
> openstreetmap.org (where the bread-and-butter style would be the default).
>
> But I'm not involved in OSM Carto development and I won't tell people
> how to do their job. Occasionally when I look at OSM Carto tickets I am
> in awe about how much work goes into seemingly minor things - how
> details are diligently discussed, tried, tested, discarded, done
> differently, until they finally come to fruition in a release one year
> later. It is great to see this much work and enthusiasm invested in OSM
> Carto, and if the price for that is complicated SQL queries then so be
> it - the "bread and butter" style I was thinking of could be made by
> someone else too.
>
> Bye
> Frederik
>
> --
> Frederik Ramm  ##  eMail frede...@remote.org  ##  N49°00'09" E008°23'33"
>
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Re: [OSM-talk] About OSM social implications and what can/should be displayed on the map (or not)

[James]

Not showing things on map to me is a form of censorship. I.E if a study
finds that the sight of trees triggers suicide by hanging do we start
removing all tree icons?

This sets a precedent to what can and can't be displayed on map. There are
some disputed boarders that are displayed differently in Google maps
depending on where you view it from(
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q9ZMub2UrKU ) and the reasons are mostly
political. The map should show "what is there" is my philosophy

On Fri, Jun 29, 2018, 11:30 AM Carlos Cámara, 
wrote:

> Dear all,
>
> After participating in this openstreetmap-carto issue
> 
> discussing to create an icon for casinos in which I stated that they should
> not be highlighted with an icon due to their grave consequences derived
> from gambling addiction (there are plenty of scientific literature about
> it), I was pointed out that OSM does not take "any ethical stance and
> display the world as it is."
>
> It is for that reason that I want to raise that particular topic to OSM
> community:
> Is that true? and if so, should it be that way?
>
> Long story short: although I am aware that it is a sensible and polemic
> issue, I think that such position does not make much sense in a project
> like OSM as I believe that OSM has a great social responsibility and
> opportunity as well. It is for that reason that we could be much more aware
> and sensitive to those matters and act accordingly.
>
> My reasons for such statement are the following ones:
>
> First: Any map is also a political act in terms that the mappers decide
> which information is displayed and which one is not, but also in the way we
> represent countries in terms of size and position (spoiler alert: countries
> are not like we represent them on the maps, and definitely are far
> different from the common web-mercator projection -more about that on this
> Wikipedia article  or, if
> even in this chapter of West Wing TV series
> ). This is to say that it is
> impossible to represent reality as it is due to the fact that it is
> impossible to project the Earth onto a flat surface without
> errors/distortions.  OSM is no exception to that and, as such, it has a
> cultural and techno-political perspective/bias even if we are not aware of
> that. We should not forget about that (and leads us to the following point).
>
> Second: The very foundations of OSM as a project are techno-political in
> terms that it was created to overcome the lack of certain geographical
> information about certain areas or topics. This is even more obvious in
> HOSM or the not-at-all-accidental use of open licenses from its very
> beginning.
>
> Third: by creating the map the way we love, we are also creating the world
> as we would love to live in. Since most of OSM contributors decide to share
> their free time with other mappers around the world in making the best
> possible map, we could infer (yes, I acknowledge certain bias here which
> would require much more research) that we would love to live in a world
> where sharing was considered as a positive value and change-driver for a
> better world which also promoted other positive values such as openness to
> information, collaboration, inclusiveness, communication and discussion
> (which, surprise, are OSM's pillars). Following that reasoning, I believe
> that OSM should set the grounds for a world aligned with their values by
> acting accordingly. It is doing so anyway, so why not to take some time to
> reflect on that instead of avoiding discussion based on the illusion that
> we are not taking part in this?
>
> Fourth: OSM has a complexity that makes it difficult for newcomers to
> wholly understand it (let alone to get involved). Part of these
> difficulties lie in the fact that OSM is, in fact, a complex ecosystem
> formed by a spatial database, a community, a map (or better, a series of
> maps), 3rd party apps... that cannot be appreciated at first sight, since
> many newcomers' first contact with OSM is the openstreetmap.org which, in
> fact, is even more complex than that as it is in turn based in several
> components such as nominatim, javascript libraries or renders such as
> carto, transport, HOSM...  What most of these people see there (and what
> they are likely looking for) is a map "similar to Google maps" yet
> different. This is to say that openstreetmap-carto is OSM's business card,
> which should serve as an entry point to the project to people from many
> conditions and hence, we have a responsibility in deciding what do we
> display and how we do it (I'm sure we are all more or less aware of that
> and there are great efforts and success in making it a great default
> renderer -I honestly love how fast it has improved in recent time).
>
> Unfortunately, even if someone completely agreed with all those points, I
>