Re: Keyboard navigation scheduler
Allen, On 23-10-2003 11:03, you [A] wrote in mid:[EMAIL PROTECTED]: A 10/22/2003, 5:26 AM: Peter said in Keyboard navigation scheduler PF For example, in previous versions I had TB set up to move to next PF unread message when i hit ( ' ) A Hmn, you're right . . . if you configure it to move to the next unread A on pressing ( ' ), nothing happens unless you are in the message list A pane. However, configured to use ctrl+alt+right as the shortcut key it A moves on to the next unread message without regard to what pane you are A in. Sorry, for some reason I missed your reply. A bug, then? I think it should be possible, PF Same with navigating between the 3 panes. Before this could be done PF with TAB or SHIFT+TAB. Now, it does not always work. (Disclaimer: I PF have just tried it in 2.01.3 and here it seems to work). A On my 2.01.3 I have no trouble with this -- it navigates among panes as A expected. Yeah, here it does, too. Except then you have clicked on a URL and sort of selected a part of the message. Then it doesn't work - which is fairly OK. -- greeting Best regards /greeting author Peter Fjelsten /author thebat version 2.01.3 /thebat version os Windows XP 5.1.2600 Service Pack 1/os Current version is 2.01.3 | Using TBUDL information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Keyboard navigation scheduler
10/28/2003, 5:27 AM: Peter said in Keyboard navigation scheduler A Hmn, you're right . . . if you configure it to move to the next unread A on pressing ( ' ), nothing happens unless you are in the message list A pane. However, configured to use ctrl+alt+right as the shortcut key it A moves on to the next unread message without regard to what pane you are A in. PF A bug, then? I think it should be possible, It seems like a bug, yes -- I can't imagine why it would work with some keys configured while not with others . . . A On my 2.01.3 I have no trouble with this -- it navigates among panes as A expected. PF Yeah, here it does, too. Except then you have clicked on a URL and sort PF of selected a part of the message. Then it doesn't work - which is PF fairly OK. Are you viewing html messages? If so, it could just be that you're tabbing amongst links rather than panes. Or do you mean that it's halting altogether? It used to for me, and would require a mouse click to get it to respond to the keyboard again, but this issue stopped with 2.01.3 . . . -- Peace, be well J Allen R Day http://protempore.org I always like to know everything about my new friends, and nothing about my old ones. -Oscar Wilde The Bat! 2.01.7, BayesIt! 0.4gm | Windows XP Service Pack 1 build 2600 Current version is 2.01.3 | Using TBUDL information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Keyboard navigation scheduler
Allen, On 28-10-2003 19:50, you [A] wrote in mid:[EMAIL PROTECTED]: PF A bug, then? I think it should be possible, A It seems like a bug, yes -- I can't imagine why it would work with some A keys configured while not with others . . . OK. I'll post a report. PF Yeah, here it does, too. Except then you have clicked on a URL and PF sort of selected a part of the message. Then it doesn't work - PF which is fairly OK. A Are you viewing html messages? Not often. Text is default. A It used to for me, and would require a mouse click to get it to A respond to the keyboard again, but this issue stopped with 2.01.3 . . A . Yes I think something has changed lately. -- greeting Best regards /greeting author Peter Fjelsten /author thebat version 2.01.3 /thebat version os Windows XP 5.1.2600 Service Pack 1/os Current version is 2.01.3 | Using TBUDL information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Keyboard navigation scheduler
10/22/2003, 5:26 AM: Peter said in Keyboard navigation scheduler PFFor example, in previous versions I had TB set up to move to PFnext unread message when i hit ( ' ) Hmn, you're right . . . if you configure it to move to the next unread on pressing ( ' ), nothing happens unless you are in the message list pane. However, configured to use ctrl+alt+right as the shortcut key it moves on to the next unread message without regard to what pane you are in. PF Same with navigating between the 3 panes. Before this could be done PF with TAB or SHIFT+TAB. Now, it does not always work. (Disclaimer: I PF have just tried it in 2.01.3 and here it seems to work). On my 2.01.3 I have no trouble with this -- it navigates among panes as expected. One thing to make note of is that if you are viewing an html message with links, once you get to the message-view pane tabbing will take you through the links before moving on to the folder pane. PF I would like to be able to set the scheduler to run backups. Am I PF right when I say this cannot be done at the moment? Quite certain this is not possible, yet -- but, yes, it would be a nice inclusion. PF Also, it would be nice to be able to run backup minimised (while PF working with TB). This isn't possible either, right? AFAIK, no, it's not possible -- but, do you mean mean have the Backup happening in the background while still allowing you to work with TB? If so, that would be a very difficult thing as it's hard to back something up while data is still being manipulated within it . . . -- Peace, be well J Allen R Day http://protempore.org The Bat! 2.01.3, BayesIt! 0.4gm | Windows XP Service Pack 1 build 2600 At 18 our convictions are hills from which we look; At 45 they are caves in which we hide. -F. Scott Fitzgerald pgp0.pgp Description: PGP signature Current version is 2.01.3 | Using TBUDL information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Keyboard navigation scheduler
TheBat-users, Since version 2, I think keyboard navigation has suffered. That or I don't know how to make it behave as it did pre-2. For example, in previous versions I had TB set up to move to next unread message when i hit ( ' ), but now I cannot get this to work when focus is in the preview pane (where I read all my mail). Does anyone know why this is? Same with navigating between the 3 panes. Before this could be done with TAB or SHIFT+TAB. Now, it does not always work. (Disclaimer: I have just tried it in 2.01.3 and here it seems to work). I would like to be able to set the scheduler to run backups. Am I right when I say this cannot be done at the moment? Also, it would be nice to be able to run backup minimised (while working with TB). This isn't possible either, right? -- greeting Best regards /greeting author Peter Fjelsten /author thebat version 2.01.3 /thebat version os Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 1 /os Current version is 2.01.3 | Using TBUDL information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Keyboard navigation
Hello Joe. At 9:16 PM on Sunday, January 06, 2002 you wrote the following in response to my comments on the posted subject 'Keyboard navigation': I've been following the philosophical discussion on common sense that you've been having with Thomas which emanated from my question -- very interesting. Joe I've enjoyed it, too, but I think we're about to get the Joe hook. We have I moved my response over to TBOT @ [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Jan Rifkinson Ridgefield, CT USA TB! V1.54 Beta/22/W2K_SP2/PGP Key ID: 0x3F14A060 -- Archives : http://tbudl.thebat.dutaint.com Moderators : mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] TBTech List: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Unsubscribe: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Latest Vers: 1.53d FAQ: http://faq.thebat.dutaint.com
Re: Keyboard navigation
Hello Thomas, 6 Jan 2002, 07:17:02, you wrote to TBUDL: TF I use alt-F2 rather than hitting the Check All button with the TF mouse, Is there a Check all button? I see only the check mail button, and that checks only current account unless you click the down arrow and select Check Mail for All, and that is really tedious. So when the keyboard shortcut Alt-F2 was documented on this menu, I stadet using the shortcut and have never used that button since. But I do think default behaviour shold be Check mail for all accounts for that button, and individual accounts just by the drop down menu. -- Best regards, Ottar Grimstad, Norway mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://home.online.no/~ottgrims Using The Bat! 1.54 Beta/24 on Windows 98 version 4,10 -- Archives : http://tbudl.thebat.dutaint.com Moderators : mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] TBTech List: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Unsubscribe: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Latest Vers: 1.53d FAQ: http://faq.thebat.dutaint.com
Re[2]: Keyboard navigation
Sunday, January 06, 2002, 12:17:02 AM, you wrote: Hello Joe, On Sat, 5 Jan 2002 14:55:52 -0600 GMT (06/01/2002, 04:55 +0800 GMT), Joe Finocchiaro wrote: Just curious: how do you conclude this is a fact? JF I think this falls into the realm of common sense, Jan. I have long decided that there is no such thing as common sense. My own common sense tells me that you don't really believe that. :) If you stay within one culture, say, USA, most people (still not all) will agree on what is common sense (ask Dear Abby, for example). Once you go across cultures, none of it applies. Do not assume all people think like Americans - most don't. ;-) Until they discover that all human beings aren't really the same species after all, Thomas, I'm going to assume that we're all much more alike than we are different. And I think it makes sense (common or otherwise) to the overwhelming majority of people that the *easier* you make something to use, the more likely it is that people will use it. I think that applies equally well to Americans, Italians, Africans, Germans, Russians, Chinese, Indians, Mexicans, Pushtuns, Turks, Arabs, Apache Indians, Eskimos, Aborigines everywhere, etc. No, it probably doesn't apply to, say, Mike Tyson, but then I'm not sure that he's a human being. That said, I agree wth syv that the keyboard shortcuts should be documented, and I agree with you that there is no way I can remember all of them. I am certainly not a Mouse Guy, hell, I'm not even a GUI person. But you're still a human being, which means that you'll naturally migrate to whichever way(s) is(are) easiest for you. Unless you were denied breast milk as a baby. But the jury is still out on that one. I use alt-F2 rather than hitting the Check All button with the mouse, but I perfectly agree that the mouse made many things a lot easier for people advancing in age g. I'm pushing 60, Thomas. And I represent the generations of human beings still out there who didn't cut their teeth on computers. Yes, you can teach an old dog new tricks, but they will always hate you for it. :) FWIW the keyboard shortcuts crtl-C and crtl-V are *not* intuitive. Okay. Maybe you're right about that. But those commands were among the first ones I was ever taught. And they remain at least universal, if not intuitive, thanks to Bill Gates. Bit we use them a lot, and they are the same in every proggie. That's why we remember them. Well, they are at least a little intuitive. C=copy; X=cut; V=vaste. :) When windows was jsut new, WordPerfect was still a rather well-known word processing software. It used keyboard shortcuts like no other, and a friend of mine, being a legal secretary and therefore having to type a lot, used it and loved it. I could never quite remember all these crtl-F5 and shit-F4 and all these, and preferred Word:clicke-ti-click. Yep. You're basically a GUI Guy. But you've got a little Keyboard Guy blood in you, too. So those family reunions will probably get a little heated. Have you decided how you will raise your children yet? And I think the WordPerfect program was essentially a conspiracy against old men with fat fingers. I think certain folks (i.e., women) probably didn't want us to ever have the ability to communicate with each other. There you go. On the question: What's better - mouse or keyboard, I contradict myself. Bottom line: I use both. ;-) Me, too. I think maybe you misunderstood me. I don't think one method is inherently better than the other. It's just that, for some of us anyway, one method is much *easier* than the other. And that difference (Viva la difference!) should at least be acknowledged by the great Bat! team, especially if its objective is to sell more copies of TB! On the other hand, if its objective is to write the best little program that no one ever heard of, or uses, they should keep doing exactly what they're doing now. I may not know much about computers, but I know my marketing. -- Joe Finocchiaro mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Archives : http://tbudl.thebat.dutaint.com Moderators : mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] TBTech List: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Unsubscribe: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Latest Vers: 1.53d FAQ: http://faq.thebat.dutaint.com
Re: Keyboard navigation
Hello Joe, On Sun, 6 Jan 2002 10:23:31 -0600 GMT (07/01/2002, 00:23 +0800 GMT), Joe Finocchiaro wrote: I have long decided that there is no such thing as common sense. JF My own common sense tells me that you don't really believe that. I should have written down the things that happened in my office when I didn't properly instruct my people, thinking the detail I left out wasn't worth mentioning, because it is due to common sense. And of course they did it differently. When I remember an example from the office, I will let you now. It was a big problem for me in the beginning, but I have now been in the Far East for so long that I don't realise these differences easily any more. What we call common sense is a product of our upbringing and experience, and basic things change with cultures. An example would be the following: Common sense tells you that people usually eat with knife and fork. Common sense tells other people that you eat with chopsticks. On highway signs depicting a restaurant, a plate surrounded by a knife and a fork will be shown in Germany; a rice bowl and two chopsticks are shown over here. Both are intelligible within their respecive cultures; a German highway-sign designer, never having been in Taiwan, may just use the wrong picture - due to his common sense. JF Until they discover that all human beings aren't really the same JF species after all, Thomas, I'm going to assume that we're all much JF more alike than we are different. We all eat. We just do it differently. ;-) JF And I think it makes sense (common or otherwise) to the overwhelming JF majority of people that the *easier* you make something to use, the JF more likely it is that people will use it. Correct, but for some people easy means something else than for others. Thai people (at least outside of the big cities) often find it easier to sit on the floor and cannot understand why Westerners prefer to sit on chairs. JF No, it probably doesn't apply to, say, Mike Tyson, but then I'm not JF sure that he's a human being. LOL! JF But you're still a human being, which means that you'll naturally JF migrate to whichever way(s) is(are) easiest for you. Yes, but that is a personal decision and cannot be generalised. At least not across the whole world. I use alt-F2 rather than hitting the Check All button with the mouse, but I perfectly agree that the mouse made many things a lot easier for people advancing in age g. JF I'm pushing 60, Thomas. And I represent the generations of human JF beings still out there who didn't cut their teeth on computers. I hope you don't feel insulted; I actually meant myself, using the mouse more and more. I'll be 40 in a couple of days. I was reluctant to use the mouse when I first had to use Windows. But I think this has more to do with what you are used to, rather than what is easier. Many power users prefer to use the keyboard, because they find it faster and more precise. My problem is remembering the 150 or so keyboard shortcuts TB alone offers, and that is not the only program I use. FWIW the keyboard shortcuts crtl-C and crtl-V are *not* intuitive. JF Okay. Maybe you're right about that. But those commands were among JF the first ones I was ever taught. And they remain at least universal, JF if not intuitive, thanks to Bill Gates. That's what I'm saying. ;-) It's what you are used to that counts. JF Well, they are at least a little intuitive. C=copy; X=cut; V=vaste. ;-) JF Yep. You're basically a GUI Guy. But you've got a little Keyboard JF Guy blood in you, too. Thanks. Must be in my genes. :-) JF Have you decided how you will raise your children yet? You mean on the keyboard or the mouse? g JF And I think the WordPerfect program was essentially a conspiracy JF against old men with fat fingers. I think certain folks (i.e., women) JF probably didn't want us to ever have the ability to communicate with JF each other. LOL! There you go. On the question: What's better - mouse or keyboard, I contradict myself. Bottom line: I use both. ;-) JF Me, too. JF I think maybe you misunderstood me. I don't think one method is JF inherently better than the other. It's just that, for some of us JF anyway, one method is much *easier* than the other. This I can agree to. JF And that difference (Viva la difference!) should at least be JF acknowledged by the great Bat! team, especially if its objective is to JF sell more copies of TB! Yes, there is agreement that every function should be accessible via the mouse or the keyboard. I think that is good programming practice nowadays. JF I may not know much about computers, but I know my marketing. No doubt about your marketing knowledge, but I think you know more about computers that you want to let on. ;-) f'up2: tbot -- Cheers, Thomas. Moderator der deutschen The Bat! Beginner Liste. On the other hand, you have different fingers. Message reply created with The Bat! 1.54 Beta/25 under Chinese Windows 98 4.10
Re: Keyboard navigation
Hello Joe. At 3:55 PM on Saturday, January 05, 2002 you wrote the following in regards to my comments to Syv on the posted subject 'Keyboard navigation': syv These are the kind of things that make sure that syv TB is not commercial success! Jan Just curious: how do you conclude this is a fact? Joe I think this falls into the realm of common sense, Joe Jan. I've been following the philosophical discussion on common sense that you've been having with Thomas which emanated from my question -- very interesting. This whole branch probably belongs on TBOT, but anyway, I just wanted to jump back in here for a moment to say that the real question I was asking was how Syv had determined for an absolute *fact* that TB! was not a Cx success. After all, what Microsoft or Syv (or anyone -- I'm not picking on you, Syv) considers a Cx success is not necessary the benchmark. Personally I think TB! is already a success because its here, it works better than all/most email clients currently on the market has so many devoted users even tho it has limited resources for advertising marketing. Can it use more users? Sure. Will it get them? Probably... as we all proselytize the world to The Bat. In addition, I would imagine you'd agree that success can change with age. What one considers a success @ 20 yrs of age can be very different from what one considers a success @ 60 yrs of age. That's called perspective. However, I hope for the sake of RitLabs that TB! is at least successful enough presently to keep the RITLab families in food, clothing under a heated roof besides providing the fellows the freedom to continue TB's march towards the ultimate success that Svy others think it can achieve. Oh, BTW, I certainly agree that easier makes for more popular. OE fits that description, doesn't it? :-) -- Jan Rifkinson Ridgefield, CT USA TB! V1.54 Beta/22/W2K_SP2/PGP Key ID: 0x3F14A060 -- Archives : http://tbudl.thebat.dutaint.com Moderators : mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] TBTech List: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Unsubscribe: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Latest Vers: 1.53d FAQ: http://faq.thebat.dutaint.com
Re[2]: Keyboard navigation
On Sunday, January 06, 2002 , Jan Rifkinson wrote the following in regards to: [Keyboard navigation] Clarifications: 1. TB is a great product. I use it every day and some of my customers too. 2. The #1 downfall of TB is the documentation or the lack of it. On regular basis my customers have to fight TB to get it do what they need, then somewhere on the list somebody mentions: ...but that's build-in... just use Ctrl-Shift-Alt 3. I could have sold quite a few more, if there were some decent help files. 4. I could have sold a lot more, if there were some great help files. +-- JR Hello Joe. JR At 3:55 PM on Saturday, January 05, 2002 you wrote the JR following in regards to my comments to Syv on the JR posted subject 'Keyboard navigation': syv These are the kind of things that make sure that syv TB is not commercial success! Jan Just curious: how do you conclude this is a fact? Joe I think this falls into the realm of common sense, Joe Jan. JR I've been following the philosophical discussion on JR common sense that you've been having with Thomas JR which emanated from my question -- very interesting. JR This whole branch probably belongs on TBOT, but JR anyway, I just wanted to jump back in here for a JR moment to say that the real question I was asking was JR how Syv had determined for an absolute *fact* that JR TB! was not a Cx success. After all, what Microsoft JR or Syv (or anyone -- I'm not picking on you, Syv) JR considers a Cx success is not necessary the JR benchmark. JR Personally I think TB! is already a success because JR its here, it works better than all/most email clients JR currently on the market has so many devoted users JR even tho it has limited resources for advertising JR marketing. Can it use more users? Sure. Will it get JR them? Probably... as we all proselytize the world to JR The Bat. JR In addition, I would imagine you'd agree that success JR can change with age. What one considers a success @ JR 20 yrs of age can be very different from what one JR considers a success @ 60 yrs of age. That's called JR perspective. JR However, I hope for the sake of RitLabs that TB! is JR at least successful enough presently to keep the JR RITLab families in food, clothing under a heated JR roof besides providing the fellows the freedom to JR continue TB's march towards the ultimate success that JR Svy others think it can achieve. JR Oh, BTW, I certainly agree that easier makes for JR more popular. OE fits that description, doesn't it? JR :-) +-- [EMAIL PROTECTED] +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ REAL PROBLEMS / REAL SOLUTION ISSN: 1492-7829 Technical information on Windows and networking http://www.911networks.com Copyright 1999-2002 by 911networks.com - All Rights Reserved +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ -- Archives : http://tbudl.thebat.dutaint.com Moderators : mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] TBTech List: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Unsubscribe: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Latest Vers: 1.53d FAQ: http://faq.thebat.dutaint.com
Re[2]: Keyboard navigation
Sunday, January 06, 2002, 11:17:26 AM, you wrote: [...] What we call common sense is a product of our upbringing and experience, and basic things change with cultures. An example would be the following: Common sense tells you that people usually eat with knife and fork. Common sense tells other people that you eat with chopsticks. On highway signs depicting a restaurant, a plate surrounded by a knife and a fork will be shown in Germany; a rice bowl and two chopsticks are shown over here. Both are intelligible within their respecive cultures; a German highway-sign designer, never having been in Taiwan, may just use the wrong picture - due to his common sense. In my opinion, those aren't really examples of common sense, Thomas. Cultural conventions, or habits, perhaps, but not common sense. Here's some examples of common sense: It would be common sense for a merchant to sell chop sticks in Japan, but not knives and forks. Just as it would be common sense for a merchant to sell knives and forks in America, but not chop sticks. It would be common sense for a merchant in, say, Timbuktu, to sell pillows to sit on, rather than, say, Barc-a-loungers. If you were going to sell cars in Great Britain, would you try to sell them with the steering wheel on the left? Or on the right? Common sense can also be wrong. E.g., just a few years ago, it wouldn't have made any sense at all to most people that someone would pay $14.00 to mail a letter somewhere if you could guarantee delivery the next day. Then along came Fred Smith and Federal Express to prove everyone wrong. JF And I think it makes sense (common or otherwise) to the overwhelming JF majority of people that the *easier* you make something to use, the JF more likely it is that people will use it. Correct, but for some people easy means something else than for others. Thai people (at least outside of the big cities) often find it easier to sit on the floor and cannot understand why Westerners prefer to sit on chairs. See above. JF But you're still a human being, which means that you'll naturally JF migrate to whichever way(s) is(are) easiest for you. Yes, but that is a personal decision and cannot be generalised. At least not across the whole world. Au contraire. I think it can be generalized around the world, and across all cultures. For example, do you know anyone who is intentionally working on an invention, tool, device, program, etc. that makes something *harder* to do? I think it's what separates human beings from the other life forms. From the day humans climbed down from the trees, we've been trying to find ways (e.g., with tools) to do things more easily. I use alt-F2 rather than hitting the Check All buttonith the mouse, but I perfectly agree that the mouse made many things a lot easier for people advancing in age g. JF I'm pushing 60, Thomas. And I represent the generations of human JF beings still out there who didn't cut their teeth on computers. I hope you don't feel insulted; You're going to have to do much more than that to insult me, Thomas. I'm virtually insult-proof. I actually meant myself, using the mouse more and more. I'll be 40 in a couple of days. I was reluctant to use the mouse when I first had to use Windows. But I think this has more to do with what you are used to, rather than what is easier. Many power users prefer to use the keyboard, because they find it faster and more precise. My problem is remembering the 150 or so keyboard shortcuts TB alone offers, and that is not the only program I use. You're actually helping to make my case, Thomas. A really good program would allow power users to use the keyboard extensively, as well as allow klutzes like me to use the mouse extensively. There are many more klutzes out there than there are power users. That is precisely why Bill Gates is today the richest man in the world. FWIW the keyboard shortcuts crtl-C and crtl-V are *not* intuitive. JF Okay. Maybe you're right about that. But those commands were among JF the first ones I was ever taught. And they remain at least universal, JF if not intuitive, thanks to Bill Gates. That's what I'm saying. ;-) It's what you are used to that counts. No, Thomas, what counts is having the ability to CHOOSE the way you want to use a program, and not being forced to learn something that you have no desire, or time, to learn. It's the difference between playing in a niche market, or in a mass market. JF Yep. You're basically a GUI Guy. But you've got a little Keyboard JF Guy blood in you, too. Thanks. Must be in my genes. :-) And we surely wouldn't want to try to fool Mother Nature, would we? JF Have you decided how you will raise your children yet? You mean on the keyboard or the mouse? g Yes. JF I think maybe you misunderstood me. I don't think one method is JF inherently better than the other. It's just that, for some of us JF anyway, one method is much *easier* than the other.
Re: Keyboard navigation
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Hi Joe, On 07 January 2002 at 19:47:42 -0600 (which was 01:47 where I live) Joe Finocchiaro wrote to Thomas F and made these points: As Dirty Harry Callahan used to say, A man's got to know his limitations. moderator As the moderator used to say This one's rambled way off topic. Please take it to TBOT. Thanks guys ;-). /moderator - -- Cheers -- .\\arck D. Pearlstone -- List moderator ~~~ \ BrainStorm - free thinking - www: http://www.brainstormsw.com / \ PGP Key ID: 0x929DCDA0 | www: http://www.silverstones.com / · TB! v1.54 Beta/25-14F4B4B2 on Windows NT 5.0.2195 Service Pack 2 · -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.0.6 (MingW32) Comment: For info see http://www.gnupg.org iD8DBQE8OQITOeQkq5KdzaARArfwAJ9vlMUMj5+YW5te2MJua3OZdh4hJwCgz392 o9F1/2Hgo+c75vfuX9K9yR4= =hhba -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- Archives : http://tbudl.thebat.dutaint.com Moderators : mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] TBTech List: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Unsubscribe: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Latest Vers: 1.53d FAQ: http://faq.thebat.dutaint.com
Re: Keyboard navigation
Hello syv. At 10:12 PM on Friday, January 04, 2002 you wrote the following on the posted subject 'Keyboard navigation': syv These are the kind of things that make sure that TB is not syv commercial success! Just curious: how do you conclude this is a fact? -- Jan Rifkinson Ridgefield, CT USA TB! V1.54 Beta/22/W2K_SP2/PGP Key ID: 0x3F14A060 -- Archives : http://tbudl.thebat.dutaint.com Moderators : mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] TBTech List: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Unsubscribe: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Latest Vers: 1.53d FAQ: http://faq.thebat.dutaint.com
Re[2]: Keyboard navigation
Saturday, January 05, 2002, 2:05:07 PM, you wrote: Hello syv. At 10:12 PM on Friday, January 04, 2002 you wrote the following on the posted subject 'Keyboard navigation': syv These are the kind of things that make sure that TB is not syv commercial success! Just curious: how do you conclude this is a fact? I think this falls into the realm of common sense, Jan. Probably no one likes TB! more than myself --now-- but it's a very hard program to learn how to use well. So many of TB!s best features are totally undocumented, making it extremely hard for most novices to realize/discover all of the many neat things they can do with it that they can't do with any other e-mail program out there. Many folks just give up in frustration, like I almost did. Fortunately, I'm as stubborn as I am stupid. My own initial frustration was ameliorated *only* by the patience and assistance of many members of *this* mail list, especially the moderators. Without it/them, I'd have long ago chucked TB! into that giant waste bin in the sky. From day one, I've said that the most important person missing from the great TB! team was a great technical writer. I still believe that. -- Joe Finocchiaro mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Archives : http://tbudl.thebat.dutaint.com Moderators : mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] TBTech List: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Unsubscribe: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Latest Vers: 1.53d FAQ: http://faq.thebat.dutaint.com
Re[2]: Keyboard navigation
On Saturday, January 05, 2002 , Jan Rifkinson wrote the following in regards to: [Keyboard navigation] +-- JR Hello syv. JR At 10:12 PM on Friday, January 04, 2002 you wrote the JR following on the posted subject 'Keyboard navigation': syv These are the kind of things that make sure that TB is not syv commercial success! JR Just curious: how do you conclude this is a fact? +-- Because nobody heard about TB! On the other hand, I have already sold 14 copies to customers of mine, once I demonstrate to them the mass mailing feature and no IE HTML which make it much more difficult to get a virus. [EMAIL PROTECTED] +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ REAL PROBLEMS / REAL SOLUTION ISSN: 1492-7829 Technical information on Windows and networking http://www.911networks.com Copyright 1999-2002 by 911networks.com - All Rights Reserved +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ -- Archives : http://tbudl.thebat.dutaint.com Moderators : mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] TBTech List: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Unsubscribe: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Latest Vers: 1.53d FAQ: http://faq.thebat.dutaint.com
Re: Keyboard navigation
Hello Joe, On Sat, 5 Jan 2002 14:55:52 -0600 GMT (06/01/2002, 04:55 +0800 GMT), Joe Finocchiaro wrote: Just curious: how do you conclude this is a fact? JF I think this falls into the realm of common sense, Jan. I have long decided that there is no such thing as common sense. If you stay within one culture, say, USA, most people (still not all) will agree on what is common sense (ask Dear Abby, for example). Once you go across cultures, none of it applies. Do not assume all people think like Americans - most don't. ;-) That said, I agree wth syv that the keyboard shortcuts should be documented, and I agree with you that there is no way I can remember all of them. I am certainly not a Mouse Guy, hell, I'm not even a GUI person. I use alt-F2 rather than hitting the Check All button with the mouse, but I perfectly agree that the mouse made many things a lot easier for people advancing in age g. FWIW the keyboard shortcuts crtl-C and crtl-V are *not* intuitive. Bit we use them a lot, and they are the same in every proggie. That's why we remember them. When windows was jsut new, WordPerfect was still a rather well-known word processing software. It used keyboard shortcuts like no other, and a friend of mine, being a legal secretary and therefore having to type a lot, used it and loved it. I could never quite remember all these crtl-F5 and shit-F4 and all these, and preferred Word: clicke-ti-click. There you go. On the question: What's better - mouse or keyboard, I contradict myself. Bottom line: I use both. ;-) -- Cheers, Thomas. Moderator der deutschen The Bat! Beginner Liste. Analogies in writing are like feathers on a snake. Message reply created with The Bat! 1.54 Beta/25 under Chinese Windows 98 4.10 Build 67766446 A using an AMD Athlon K7 1.2GHz, 128MB RAM -- Archives : http://tbudl.thebat.dutaint.com Moderators : mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] TBTech List: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Unsubscribe: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Latest Vers: 1.53d FAQ: http://faq.thebat.dutaint.com
Keyboard navigation
Where can I find help about keyboard navigation using TB? Also I'd like to ask if I have a folder open and press the Enter key to open a HTML message, how do I go to the message window without using the mouse? The best I can get is to tab to the HTML icon on the margin. I simply cannot access the main message window. -- Best regards, Costas mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Archives : http://tbudl.thebat.dutaint.com Moderators : mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] TBTech List: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Unsubscribe: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Latest Vers: 1.53d FAQ: http://faq.thebat.dutaint.com
Re[2]: Keyboard navigation
On Friday, January 04, 2002 , Raj wrote the following in regards to: [Keyboard navigation] Why isn't this in help file? I can't find it either under key... or short... These are the kind of things that make sure that TB is not a commercial success! +-- R Costas, R On Fri, 4 Jan 2002, at 19:26:51 [GMT +0200] (which was 10:56 PM where I live) you R wrote: CP Where can I find help about keyboard navigation using TB? R http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/shortcut_eng.html +-- [EMAIL PROTECTED] +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ REAL PROBLEMS / REAL SOLUTION ISSN: 1492-7829 Technical information on Windows and networking http://www.911networks.com Copyright 1999-2002 by 911networks.com - All Rights Reserved +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ -- Archives : http://tbudl.thebat.dutaint.com Moderators : mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] TBTech List: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Unsubscribe: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Latest Vers: 1.53d FAQ: http://faq.thebat.dutaint.com
Re[2]: Keyboard navigation
Hello Raj, Saturday, January 05, 2002, 4:08:48 AM, you wrote: CP Where can I find help about keyboard navigation using TB? http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/shortcut_eng.html That's wonderful! The Bat uses Wordstar navigation. That surely takes me back to a different age... -- Best regards, Costasmailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Archives : http://tbudl.thebat.dutaint.com Moderators : mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] TBTech List: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Unsubscribe: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Latest Vers: 1.53d FAQ: http://faq.thebat.dutaint.com
More on Keyboard Navigation
Hello, everyone. I have been using the space bar to read through messages. This works pretty well if messages are not threaded, except that I need to use Ctrl-] at times to jump to the next unread message. The problem I have is this: The space bar only seems to work if the folder is sorted in time DESCENDING order. If I sort in ascending order, when I finish reading a message, the space bar takes me to a message I've already read. Is there any way around this? Thanks. Regards, Keith Russell mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] -- -- View the TBUDL archive at http://tbudl.thebat.dutaint.com To send a message to the list moderation team click here: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe from TBUDL, click below and send the generated message. mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] --
Re: More on Keyboard Navigation
Hello, Ali. On Thursday, October 07, 1999, 3:06:21 PM, you wrote: [snip] Yet another reason why I stay away from the spacebar. Guess I'll need to start experimenting with the arrows! Is there any way around this? Get with the program and sort your messages in descending order. Uhgm, sorry, just joking. :-)) ;-). Actually, I've already resorted to this. It isn't a major issue, because I've been working for years with them in descending order. Lately, though, as I've been switching back and forth, testing different clients and trying out new features, I haven't taken the time to organize my folders as well as I like. And scrolling down through hundreds of messages to get to today's, every time I access the folder, IS a pain. There's no work around it AFAIK. Too bad... I don't suppose there's a list of features planned for 2.0 anywhere, is there? Keith mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] -- -- View the TBUDL archive at http://tbudl.thebat.dutaint.com To send a message to the list moderation team click here: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe from TBUDL, click below and send the generated message. mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] --
