date:20191119

Further to Timimi use

In FireFox I can browse to a folder location such 
as file:///C:/Data/TW5/Development and see the files there, such that 
clicking on empty5.1.19.tw would open that file in the browser and Timimi 
is engaged and works. This means both explorer (other platforms equivalent) 
and directory browsing in the browser provide a file manager for tiddlywiki 
files. Especially if we set a standard folder such as documents/tiddlywiki 
or in windows file:///C:/Users/username/Documents/tiddlywiki/

Regards
Tony

On Wednesday, November 20, 2019 at 1:41:31 PM UTC+11, TonyM wrote:
>
> Mark,
>
> I am however keen to see if there is an easier way. Timimi is easy to 
> install and currently works on FireFox and the following oS
>
>- Debian based systems - Debian, Ubuntu, Elementary, Mint etc
>- Arch based systems - Arch Linux, Antergos, Manjaro etc
>- Windows 7 and later.
>
> If we could find a way, perhaps even crowdsource its development on other 
> key browsers then we should have a fairly universal solution.
>
> Currently Timimi needs Firefox, an Add on and 
>
> Part of its universality comes from the fact Timimi allows tiddlywikis to 
> be treated as documents on any platform, thus leveraging the basic computer 
> skills most users have. Using a .tw file would help further, adding an 
> association to a browser such as FireFox with the Timimi add on whether or 
> not it is the default for html files.
>
>
>
>
>
> On Wednesday, November 20, 2019 at 11:09:35 AM UTC+11, Mark S. wrote:
>>
>> I think it's also as minimalist as it's going to get for users. Most 
>> users can install software. Most users know how to use a browser and 
>> install extensions.
>>
>> There is no save mechanism with TW. That's the simple fact. Any attempt 
>> to work around that fact will add complexity one way or the other. 
>> So the next best thing is to come up with a process that uses steps the 
>> user is already familiar with.
>>
>> On Tuesday, November 19, 2019 at 1:53:00 PM UTC-8, TonyM wrote:
>>>
>>> Mark
>>>
>>> Thanks for finding another method, this is out of the box as they say. I 
>>> wonder if the setup can be automated. 
>>>
>>> I am sure you can see this is minimalist as far as its changes to the 
>>> users computer but not minimalist as far as the complexity to a new user.
>>>
>>> Great response though
>>> Tony
>>>
>>>

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[tw5] Re: The last word in Saving?

All,

This is proving to be a great repository of ideas, savings mechanisms and
exploring the possibilities.

One method I have being wondering about is how TiddlyServer handles single
file wikis. Clearly it makes use of node for the folder based wikis and the
wikis appear at http:/ipaddress/virtual/folder but this requires the
somewhat cumbersome settings.json file.

I wonder if an executable install of a subset of TiddlyServer/or Node, to
save tiddlywikis at a standard location eg Documents/TiddlyWiki and a link
to eg: http:/ipaddress:8081/ where Documents/TiddlyWiki is the root folder
and supporting files like node installed elsewhere, such that it serves
single File Wikis (at least). With a custom association perhaps we could
Double click a tw file and it will open at http:/ipaddress:8081/twname.tw
or http:/ipaddress:8081/foldername/twname.tw

In this case it is one install script per Operating system and this is
minimised using node and a fixed tiddlywiki folder. This would be mostly
browser independent.

The ability to be online in a wiki and and some how use the download or
default save, to save a wiki to the above documents/tiddlywiki would make
access to and saving future wikis and editions simple.

Just further ideas
Tony

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[tw5] Re: The last word in Saving?

Mark,

I am however keen to see if there is an easier way. Timimi is easy to 
install and currently works on FireFox and the following oS

   - Debian based systems - Debian, Ubuntu, Elementary, Mint etc
   - Arch based systems - Arch Linux, Antergos, Manjaro etc
   - Windows 7 and later.

If we could find a way, perhaps even crowdsource its development on other 
key browsers then we should have a fairly universal solution.

Currently Timimi needs Firefox, an Add on and 

Part of its universality comes from the fact Timimi allows tiddlywikis to 
be treated as documents on any platform, thus leveraging the basic computer 
skills most users have. Using a .tw file would help further, adding an 
association to a browser such as FireFox with the Timimi add on whether or 
not it is the default for html files.





On Wednesday, November 20, 2019 at 11:09:35 AM UTC+11, Mark S. wrote:
>
> I think it's also as minimalist as it's going to get for users. Most users 
> can install software. Most users know how to use a browser and install 
> extensions.
>
> There is no save mechanism with TW. That's the simple fact. Any attempt to 
> work around that fact will add complexity one way or the other. 
> So the next best thing is to come up with a process that uses steps the 
> user is already familiar with.
>
> On Tuesday, November 19, 2019 at 1:53:00 PM UTC-8, TonyM wrote:
>>
>> Mark
>>
>> Thanks for finding another method, this is out of the box as they say. I 
>> wonder if the setup can be automated. 
>>
>> I am sure you can see this is minimalist as far as its changes to the 
>> users computer but not minimalist as far as the complexity to a new user.
>>
>> Great response though
>> Tony
>>
>>

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[tw5] Re: TW "Tiddler DB" Strategy

There are many ways to put things together in TW. It kind of depends on how 
monolithic the structure 
you're attempting to create is.

Here's one way.

In terms of traditional relational databases, you can think of all tiddlers 
that have the same tag
as being rows in a table. The fields of each such tiddler are the fields of 
the "table". The title
should be thought of as an ID field, and not, unfortunately,as a title. Use 
"caption" and "description"
as the actual title fields. 

Tag/Tables can form parent-child relations via reference fields. So you 
might have several items
tagged as "Project". Then you might have several tiddlers tagged as 
"Tasks". Each tiddler tagged
as "Task" can contain a reference back to the original project tiddler. For 
instance, you might
have a field "projid" that contains the name of the "parent" tiddler that 
is tagged with "Project".

Using nested list widgets, you can present the information in the Projects 
and child Tasks
much the way you would in various report tools.

Project A
   Task A1
   Task  A2
Project B
  Task B1
  Task B2

The display doesn't have to show the tags or the reference fields that are 
structuring the data.

There are other people that would tag each task with the "parent" tiddler, 
but that quickly leads to 
tag pollution.

So, there's one approach. It really depends a lot on what you are trying to 
accomplish. I'm sure others
will chime in with their thoughts.

On Tuesday, November 19, 2019 at 4:59:48 PM UTC-8, Qalisto wrote:
>
> Hello, I am new to TW.
>
> It seems, I should have discovered it long ago.  (I had been using an app 
> for Windows called *ConnectedText.  *But, it lacks the killer feature of 
> TW which is single HTML distribution.*)*
>
> I have a question about the strategy for rational and flexible access to 
> Tiddlers.
>
> It seems to me that for Core Business interests that it may be wise to 
> just create Tiddlers as "info Lego blocks" into a "Core Bus. TW" as Tiddler 
> repository.
>
> Then, by using the correct coding or Tagging strategy, to be able to 
> extract a list of Tiddlers which one may wish to include in ... say 
> "Project A" (while the same Tiddlers may *also* be employed in "Project B".
>
> So, given the bewildering set of system, user, shadow Tiddlers, I am 
> wondering if anyone more experienced has a system which will:
>
> (1) Enable a single Tiddler to be coded in a way that will identify it as 
> in the family of say "Project A" and also "Project B" if it is a common 
> info bit.
>
> (2) Hide that multi-project coding since I will want to compile the family 
> of Tiddlers as a business presentation and leave the content "tidy"
>
> (3) And be able to order the extracted Tiddlers from the Core TW File in 
> the desired order of presentation
>
> Of course creating an "NY Public Library" of Tiddlers may be unwise.  I 
> don't know at what point a TW file becomes too fat and thus unwieldy. But, 
> I plan to create distinct ones where possible.
>
> There seems to be multiple solutions spread about various user URLs.  And 
> I am sure I could divine this with hours of research and trial and error.  
>
> I just wonder if someone *has been where I want to go *and can kindly 
> *share* a shortcut.
>
> Thanks for any help. ## Q ##
>

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[tw5] TW "Tiddler DB" Strategy

2019-11-19 Thread Qalisto

Hello, I am new to TW.

It seems, I should have discovered it long ago. (I had been using an app
for Windows called *ConnectedText. *But, it lacks the killer feature of TW
which is single HTML distribution.*)*

I have a question about the strategy for rational and flexible access to
Tiddlers.

It seems to me that for Core Business interests that it may be wise to just
create Tiddlers as "info Lego blocks" into a "Core Bus. TW" as Tiddler
repository.

Then, by using the correct coding or Tagging strategy, to be able to
extract a list of Tiddlers which one may wish to include in ... say
"Project A" (while the same Tiddlers may *also* be employed in "Project B".

So, given the bewildering set of system, user, shadow Tiddlers, I am
wondering if anyone more experienced has a system which will:

(1) Enable a single Tiddler to be coded in a way that will identify it as
in the family of say "Project A" and also "Project B" if it is a common
info bit.

(2) Hide that multi-project coding since I will want to compile the family
of Tiddlers as a business presentation and leave the content "tidy"

(3) And be able to order the extracted Tiddlers from the Core TW File in
the desired order of presentation

Of course creating an "NY Public Library" of Tiddlers may be unwise. I
don't know at what point a TW file becomes too fat and thus unwieldy. But,
I plan to create distinct ones where possible.

There seems to be multiple solutions spread about various user URLs. And I
am sure I could divine this with hours of research and trial and error.

I just wonder if someone *has been where I want to go *and can kindly
*share* a shortcut.

Thanks for any help. ## Q ##

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[tw5] Re: The last word in Saving?

I think it's also as minimalist as it's going to get for users. Most users 
can install software. Most users know how to use a browser and install 
extensions.

There is no save mechanism with TW. That's the simple fact. Any attempt to 
work around that fact will add complexity one way or the other. 
So the next best thing is to come up with a process that uses steps the 
user is already familiar with.

On Tuesday, November 19, 2019 at 1:53:00 PM UTC-8, TonyM wrote:
>
> Mark
>
> Thanks for finding another method, this is out of the box as they say. I 
> wonder if the setup can be automated. 
>
> I am sure you can see this is minimalist as far as its changes to the 
> users computer but not minimalist as far as the complexity to a new user.
>
> Great response though
> Tony
>
>

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[tw5] Re: Two-way linking: footnote of related tiddlers, issues, references

HC Haase,
 

> Does this mean that it is performance heavy? what if you were to us this 
> with simple filters extensively in many tiddlers, would this take a hit on 
> performance?
>

Performance depends on two things:

- How many tiddlers are open? 
- How many tiddlers are given this special field?
- How long do the specified filters take?

The more the slower. I have to try (but not now) what happens if, for 
example, only one tiddler is open but 100 have the same filter in the field 
(for example "[search [a]]"). If I guess, the wiki will slow down. If it 
does not slow down, only the number of opened tiddlers and the complexity 
of the filters will affect the performance.

Do you think performance could be optimised some how?
>

See the discussion with TonyM.
 

> what about using the indexed filters in search, or is that irrelevant here?
>

It is up to the filter to use this feature. 

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[tw5] Re: Two-way linking: footnote of related tiddlers, issues, references

TiddlyTweeter, 

I could click a link in a wiki, to say a footnote, go to it and THEN click 
> the visited footnote to RETURN to exactly where the link is I navigated to 
> the footnote from originally?
>

I'm not sure I understand your question, so here's a concrete example:

https://bimlas.gitlab.io/#Proper%20shebang%20line:%5B%5BProper%20shebang%20line%5D%5D%20%5B%5BCommand%20line%20arguments%20parser%20in%20Python%5D%5D
 

The "Proper shebang line" tiddler has a "condition-to-show-in-footnote" 
field, which contains the "[search[#!/usr/bin/]]" filter, so for those 
tiddlers, where the search term is found ("Command line arguments parser in 
Python" for example), a link to the "proper shebang line" tiddler appears 
in the footnote. The footnote of the "Proper shebang line" lists which 
tiddlers appear (so simply the output of the filter).

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[tw5] Re: Two-way linking: footnote of related tiddlers, issues, references

HC Haase,
 

> Two-way linking (forward linking)
>

Let's call it "conditional linking", btw "future linking" seems right as 
well. :) Maybe "conditional tagging" (see bellow).
 

> how do this differ from tags? tags (it you explore them) also show 
> relation between tiddlers from different points in time ...
>

It's right.
 

> ... and could also be used as link to future potential tiddlers.
>

In fact, the tag does not link to the potential tiddler, but on the 
contrary, the tiddler indicates that he belongs to this tag. So in the 
tiddler you have to determine which "groups" it belongs to. Conditional 
linking, on the other hand, is created on the basis of a filter, a group of 
tiddlers meeting the same criteria. When it comes to comparing with a tag, 
conditional linking is a tag that determines who belongs to it.
 

> How do this differ from a search? as I understand, the filter that you 
> define is the same as a search, right?
>

Yep. I've used exactly searching expression, but you can use whatever 
filter you want ([tag[x]custom-field[y]...]).
 

> any way, what are your thoughts in this direction?
>

Originally, I didn't have any goals with this solution, I just wanted to 
publish it, but it seems that more people are interested in it, so it's 
worth developing. 

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[tw5] Re: Two-way linking: footnote of related tiddlers, issues, references

TonyM,

> My method would allow you to turn on or off the display of the related
> tiddlers that *your solution provides* to all or no tiddlers.
>

Ok, now I understand what you mean.

I like the basic idea because it would speed up wiki, but the point of the
solution is to make sure that the tiddlers that match the filter showing
the related tiddler link, because it is in some way related to what is
currently displayed. (I hope Translator translates well what I mean :D) So
if for example (as in the opening post) I have a tiddler about the correct
format of the shebang line of a shell script then a link to this should be
visible when I read a note about a specific shell script.

While writing this, I recalled when I use this two-way link: when I create
a tiddler for a new experience (like a shell script I found on the
Internet), saving it, the appearing link to the shebang at the bottom
reminds me to check the first line of the new shell script. So, first of
all, it serves as a kind of warning. In such cases, it would be almost
better to have the link appear in edit mode, but when reading the wiki, it
could be disabled as your solution does.

On the other hand, there are times when I constantly want the link to
appear because it reminds me of something that is not an integral part of
the currently read tiddler, but is closely related to it. For example, the
description of the Timimi plugin is closely related to the Download Saver +
unique Firefox profile solution, but the latter is not about Timimi, so I
just want to list a link. Although I could create a link within the text,
but with this "forward link" (as HC Haase put it) I can automatically link
the Firefox solution to any other save options. In these cases, I would not
want to hide the link.

And by the end, I think I now fully understand what you are saying. So, for
example, if I have a Timimi tiddler that contains a shell script as well, I
could set up a "blacklisted related tiddlers" field in this (contains title
of the shebang line tiddler), so that these (shebang line) would be not
listed? I think this seems like a good idea and it really speeds up the
things.

To be honest, the global disable option does not make sense because I need
to remember to see if there is a related tiddler, even though their purpose
is to remind me by their own.

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[tw5] Re: The last word in Saving?

David,

Your suggested approach looks similar to other installs and uses a path many 
will be familiar with so it has merit. Now lets think what saver we include.

By the way I would like to see the zip contain the online wiki with content 
including user changes and the saver so they continue working. Or something 
similar.

Regards
Tony

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[tw5] Re: The last word in Saving?

Mark

Thanks for finding another method, this is out of the box as they say. I wonder 
if the setup can be automated. 

I am sure you can see this is minimalist as far as its changes to the users 
computer but not minimalist as far as the complexity to a new user.

Great response though
Tony

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[tw5] Re: Two-way linking: footnote of related tiddlers, issues, references

I have not had time to try this yet.

Bimlas, when you say "two way linking" do you mean that I could click a 
link in a wiki, to say a footnote, go to it and THEN click the visited 
footnote to RETURN to exactly where the link is I navigated to the footnote 
from originally? The point being having reciprocal linking. If so: GREAT.

In TW, of course, the issue is most of the "page" is not visible unless 
explicitly invoked.

Just asking
TT

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[tw5] Re: Passing tiddler fields as parameters of a widget

This worked for me:

\define removetag(type user)
<$fieldmangler tiddler="Draft of 'Añadir $type$' by $user$" >
<$button message="tm-remove-tag" param="TEST">Remove TEST tag

\end

<>

Where the original tiddler before being opened for edit was "Añadir text" 
Just to be clear, the tiddler needs to be opened for editing in order for 
this to work (for it to have the name "Draft of 'Añadir text' by Jose"

Good luck!

On Tuesday, November 19, 2019 at 7:24:40 AM UTC-8, Littleagle Thoronaug 
wrote:
>
> Hi there!
>
> I'm using TW5 in a single file, version 5.1.21 and I want to pass the 
> content of a field as a parameter of a widget. I tried transcluding, using 
> variables, using parameters of a macro but none of them seem to work. This 
> is what I tried:
>
> <$fieldmangler tiddler="Draft of 'Añadir $type$' by 
> {{$:/status/UserName!!text}}" >
> or 
> <$fieldmangler tiddler="Draft of 'Añadir $type$' by <>" >
> or
> <$fieldmangler tiddler="Draft of 'Añadir $type$' by $(uservar)$" >
> even
> <$fieldmangler tiddler="Draft of 'Añadir $type$' by $user$" >
>
> where "user" is a parameter of a macro inside of which is the 
> $fieldmangler widget.
>
> I need this to remove a tag in that Draft of using $action-sendmessage 
> widget.
>
> Thanks in advance.
>
>
>

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[tw5] Re: The last word in Saving?

Ok. This seems to be working. Knock on silicon. It's about as easy as it's 
going to get.

1. Install firefox (ignore what I said about browser-agnostic)
2. Create a profile for TW files and boot with it the following steps
3. In the settings, set your download dir to the the root of your system 
(usually C:\)
4. Reboot FF with profile
5. In the add-ons, look for PMarios' file-backups. Install.
6. Reboot FF with profile
7. Create a short-cut for the FF with profile, if desired.

Now any TW files inside your main file system will use the file-backups to 
save. You can make
other profiles if you have other drives (e.g. flash drives) where you need 
to save. Note that if you
change your download directory, you may have to reboot FF.

Think of FF-with-profile as its own app.

No executables are required except FF. No additional servers or processes 
running. No configuration files.

On Sunday, November 17, 2019 at 7:03:52 PM UTC-8, TonyM wrote:
>
> Folks,
>
> This post is seeking input from the community to overcome what I perceive 
> to be the last big issue in saving. It may seem only suited to experienced 
> users but perhaps you know something we don't, so please be brave and 
> contribute.
>
> I may have an opportunity in coming months to work with a team of 
> videographers in their off season. They do "things for good" and my thought 
> was to build a nice application (on tiddlywiki) for people to explore how 
> they or their business can participate in reaching the *Sustainable 
> Development Goals (SDG's)*. This will promote the SDG's, their work, my 
> work and the power of TiddlyWiki, but there seems to me, to still be an 
> elephant in the room - saving.
>
> *How do we enable saving tiddlywikis for naive and casual users?*
>
> To be sure, I am across most saving mechanisms, and some are very good and 
> quite easy to set up a very sophisticated solution, I use Timimi, 
> TiddlyServer, TiddlyDesktop and Bob.exe 
>
> Imagine someone visits my SDG app online
>
>- They could use it and apply changes but not save it
>- With local storage and save some changes in the browser but they may 
>be lost later
>- They Can download it easily enough, even with their in browser or 
>local storage content
>- But if they wish to open it again, make changes and save they then 
>need to consider this https://tiddlywiki.com/#GettingStarted - scary 
>for many.
>
> Basically I think tiddlywiki is brilliant and we have lots of wonderful 
> options for saving, once someone gets involved with the ecosystem, I 
> believe any nodeJS solution is hard to secure on the internet and like 
> NoteSelf we have to manage the server, but it seems we are so close to a 
> better single file solution (My Opinion).
>  
> I know some saving mechanisms come close to helping *naive and casual 
> users* however their remains a need to take unfamiliar steps, that can be 
> quite fragile, especially to those not overly computer literate. Saving 
> under downloads folders, running batches and installing local apps are all 
> impediments to *naive and casual users* in my view, as this becomes 
> Operating system dependant, demands more trust, will not work in many 
> locked down cases and more.
>
> I am starting this thread to try and inspire some serious creativity to 
> overcome this barrier. Here are some ideas floating in my head but I am 
> keen to hear from you.
>
>- Any idea is a good idea
>- A diversity of ideas in needed
>- We may need to "think outside the box"
>- Can an existing solution be better engineered to meet these goals?
>
> Some of my own musings
>
>- One approach may be to never download the whole wiki, but store the 
>changes in a separate file that is automatically loaded over the in 
> browser 
>one, and saved only by saving changes back to the nominated file.
>- Building all the necessary content to install Timimi or another 
>saver from the single wiki (No other document or external info required) 
>Not yet chrome and IE
>- A Form of bob.exe/TiddlyDesktop that can be loaded with a custom 
>tiddlywiki that shows only that wiki unless some settings are changed in 
>the control panel. Ie a single local installable.
>- A Way of packaging a TiddlyWiki with Node.exe and hosting on a port 
>that will not clash with other server hosts, perhaps an packaged extension 
>of TiddlySaver.
>- I was inspired to open this up to the community after playing with 
> bookmarklets 
>and Jeremy's solution 
>
> 
>  because 
>javascript can be loaded into bookmarks I wonder if it could be used to 
>save changes to local tiddlywiki files and reimport on click. 
>- I also looked at solutions such as 
>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IMacros which suggests there may be 
>other ways to achieve the desired

[tw5] Tidgraph - Initial Depth?

2019-11-19 Thread Ste Wilson

Or not... 
Do a search here for "Tidgraph question" as i seem unable to get the link from 
a search on mobile. Grrr

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[tw5] Re: TiddlyWiki editor stopped responding to keystrokes

2019-11-19 Thread Me Ath home

Same here using Chrome.

How did you fix this please ? 

On Tuesday, November 19, 2019 at 2:19:50 AM UTC+1, Alan Finger wrote:
>
> That blew it up completely. I was able to roll the entire directory back 
> to before I started having trouble and that seemed to fix the problem.
>
> Alan
>
> On Sunday, November 17, 2019 at 10:21:45 PM UTC-5, TonyM wrote:
>>
>> Alan,
>>
>> Do you have any plugins that use the text area?. Install codemirror 
>> editor and see if its still a problem. It does not use a simple text area.
>>
>> Tony
>>
>> On Sunday, November 17, 2019 at 7:36:01 AM UTC+11, Alan Finger wrote:
>>>
>>> Hi,
>>>
>>> I'm using TiddlyWiki5 on node js. The tiddler text editor has suddenly 
>>> stopped accepting keystrokes. Markdown inserts work normally and all other 
>>> fields can be typed into. This is consistent across several different 
>>> browsers and computers. Any ideas how to troubleshoot?
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>> Alan
>>>
>>

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[tw5] Tidgraph - Initial Depth?

2019-11-19 Thread Ste Wilson

I asked the same question some time ago :)

See 
https://groups.google.com/forum/m/#!searchin/tiddlywiki/Tidgraph/tiddlywiki/v7Fs-q3LCKA

Ste

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[tw5] Passing tiddler fields as parameters of a widget

2019-11-19 Thread Littleagle Thoronaug

Hi there!

I'm using TW5 in a single file, version 5.1.21 and I want to pass the 
content of a field as a parameter of a widget. I tried transcluding, using 
variables, using parameters of a macro but none of them seem to work. This 
is what I tried:

<$fieldmangler tiddler="Draft of 'Añadir $type$' by 
{{$:/status/UserName!!text}}" >
or 
<$fieldmangler tiddler="Draft of 'Añadir $type$' by <>" >
or
<$fieldmangler tiddler="Draft of 'Añadir $type$' by $(uservar)$" >
even
<$fieldmangler tiddler="Draft of 'Añadir $type$' by $user$" >

where "user" is a parameter of a macro inside of which is the $fieldmangler 
widget.

I need this to remove a tag in that Draft of using $action-sendmessage 
widget.

Thanks in advance.


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[tw5] Re: The last word in Saving?

2019-11-19 Thread David Gifford

Hi Tony

Could there be a second version of tiddlywiki.com/empty.html that when you 
click the download button, you download a zip file with the saver file 
included, and a popup in empty.html with brief instructions? That way there 
could be a dead simple download with a saver, and a lighter download with 
no saver for those who just need a TW file.

Dave

On Sunday, November 17, 2019 at 9:03:52 PM UTC-6, TonyM wrote:
>
> Folks,
>
> This post is seeking input from the community to overcome what I perceive 
> to be the last big issue in saving. It may seem only suited to experienced 
> users but perhaps you know something we don't, so please be brave and 
> contribute.
>
> I may have an opportunity in coming months to work with a team of 
> videographers in their off season. They do "things for good" and my thought 
> was to build a nice application (on tiddlywiki) for people to explore how 
> they or their business can participate in reaching the *Sustainable 
> Development Goals (SDG's)*. This will promote the SDG's, their work, my 
> work and the power of TiddlyWiki, but there seems to me, to still be an 
> elephant in the room - saving.
>
> *How do we enable saving tiddlywikis for naive and casual users?*
>
> To be sure, I am across most saving mechanisms, and some are very good and 
> quite easy to set up a very sophisticated solution, I use Timimi, 
> TiddlyServer, TiddlyDesktop and Bob.exe 
>
> Imagine someone visits my SDG app online
>
>- They could use it and apply changes but not save it
>- With local storage and save some changes in the browser but they may 
>be lost later
>- They Can download it easily enough, even with their in browser or 
>local storage content
>- But if they wish to open it again, make changes and save they then 
>need to consider this https://tiddlywiki.com/#GettingStarted - scary 
>for many.
>
> Basically I think tiddlywiki is brilliant and we have lots of wonderful 
> options for saving, once someone gets involved with the ecosystem, I 
> believe any nodeJS solution is hard to secure on the internet and like 
> NoteSelf we have to manage the server, but it seems we are so close to a 
> better single file solution (My Opinion).
>  
> I know some saving mechanisms come close to helping *naive and casual 
> users* however their remains a need to take unfamiliar steps, that can be 
> quite fragile, especially to those not overly computer literate. Saving 
> under downloads folders, running batches and installing local apps are all 
> impediments to *naive and casual users* in my view, as this becomes 
> Operating system dependant, demands more trust, will not work in many 
> locked down cases and more.
>
> I am starting this thread to try and inspire some serious creativity to 
> overcome this barrier. Here are some ideas floating in my head but I am 
> keen to hear from you.
>
>- Any idea is a good idea
>- A diversity of ideas in needed
>- We may need to "think outside the box"
>- Can an existing solution be better engineered to meet these goals?
>
> Some of my own musings
>
>- One approach may be to never download the whole wiki, but store the 
>changes in a separate file that is automatically loaded over the in 
> browser 
>one, and saved only by saving changes back to the nominated file.
>- Building all the necessary content to install Timimi or another 
>saver from the single wiki (No other document or external info required) 
>Not yet chrome and IE
>- A Form of bob.exe/TiddlyDesktop that can be loaded with a custom 
>tiddlywiki that shows only that wiki unless some settings are changed in 
>the control panel. Ie a single local installable.
>- A Way of packaging a TiddlyWiki with Node.exe and hosting on a port 
>that will not clash with other server hosts, perhaps an packaged extension 
>of TiddlySaver.
>- I was inspired to open this up to the community after playing with 
> bookmarklets 
>and Jeremy's solution 
>
> 
>  because 
>javascript can be loaded into bookmarks I wonder if it could be used to 
>save changes to local tiddlywiki files and reimport on click. 
>- I also looked at solutions such as 
>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IMacros which suggests there may be 
>other ways to achieve the desired results.
>- IPFS, BeakerBrowser, CouchDB or saving to a MYSQL or even a 
>wordpress database?
>
>
> All I want for Christmas is a simple way for *naive and casual users *to 
> save their tiddlywiki (again and again)
>
> Yours Sincerely
> Tony
>

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[tw5] Re: Dealing with repetitive titles?

2019-11-19 Thread Maddog Noriko

I'll have to explore the template idea too. I've already got many wikis 
planned...can't type as fast as I can think stuff up.

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[tw5] Re: Dealing with repetitive titles?

2019-11-19 Thread Maddog Noriko

Thank you for the reply. I think using the "room description" is the best 
route...for now. I can't believe how powerful tiddlywiki is in such a small 
package. Utterly awesome.

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[tw5] Re: The last word in Saving?

Where is BOB is this discussion?

Just wondering. It seems very pertinent.
Node based, or node wrapped in EXE, with CLOUD possibilities.

Best wishes
TT

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[tw5] Re: Two-way linking: footnote of related tiddlers, issues, references

2019-11-19 Thread HC Haase


>
>
> *Attention*! Use a simple filter that doesn't take much time to execute, 
> otherwise the wiki may become slow (for example, don't use the Kin filter 
> ).
>

Does this mean that it is performance heavy? what if you were to us this 
with simple filters extensively in many tiddlers, would this take a hit on 
performance? (thinking especially of TW running on a phone). 

Do you think performance could be optimised some how? what about using the 
indexed filters in search, or is that irrelevant here?

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[tw5] Re: Two-way linking: footnote of related tiddlers, issues, references

2019-11-19 Thread HC Haase

This is interesting. It sounds like @bimlas and @tonyM could cook up a
really nice feature!

I think this gives some nice opposites to see connection that was otherwise
hidden. It could make some emergence in the system of knowledge (tiddlers).

could we discuss what this actually is? I am not quite sure.

In TW we have tags, links and backlinks as the main relation between
tiddlers

tags
can be hierarchies as in the TOC, and more network oriented. it gives us
categories

links
is a stronger relation that tags, it gives us a direct connection to
another tiddler.

backlinks
are also links, but not as intentional as normal links, thus these could
bring some emergence and show connection you forgot.

Two-way linking (forward linking)
This mechanism that you are making has the potential to link to the future
so we could call it forward linking (future linking also sound cool). It
makes a link that appear when a matching tiddler is made in the future (and
also for existing ones), a potential linking. I think this has the
potential for creating emergence and show connection that were not obvious
to you.
BUT
how do this differ from tags? tags (it you explore them) also show relation
between tiddlers from different points in time, and could also be used as
link to future potential tiddlers. However the forward linking makes this
explicit without any user action.
How do this differ from a search? as I understand, the filter that you
define is the same as a search, right? So you could say that this provides
a communication, where pas you can make a search for future you (wow time
travel).

I have the feeling that this could be something more than tags and search,
but I am not quite sure. I think there is some interesting potential here.

any way, what are your thoughts in this direction?

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[tw5] Re: The last word in Saving?

Thanks Okido.

This points it one direction I have being thinking about. A simplified node 
install perhaps. Do you control which wiki is hosted with scripts?

can you see a version of your solution being easy to setup for new users?

Thanks for your perspective.

Tony 

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[tw5] Re: The last word in Saving?

2019-11-19 Thread okido

Hi Tony,

Let me share my experience as a long time TW user.

I started with TWclassic on a usb stick and Firefox portable.

This gave me a lot of freedom, it was easy to move the files around between
Linux and Windows systems without needing admin rights.

Read, write actions to the file system was easy and I made some TWc’s that
relied on this heavily.

More restrictive browsers made me think how to overcome the the problem of
restricted access to the file system as some of my TWc got broken.

Secondly whenever I promoted TWc as a tool to make work lighter and easier
I stumbled over the saving issue’s.

I tried most savers but was not satisfied, in most cases they did not run
out of the box. TiddlyDesktop came close to what I needed.

However, I use only TWc and I did not want to have the TW5 code overhead in
TiddlyDesktop.
So I decided to switch to NW.js and wrote a saver
for TWc, access to the file system
is very easy.

I can move the TWC files between Linux and Windows again and all
functionality is restored, the same functionality as when I started years
ago. In one instance of NW.js you can open as many TWc’s as you need, they
run in independent windows. I must say that NW.js runs stable and it is
fast.

Still there is file structure dependency, you cannot put your file in any
location and run it from there. Files in folders downstream from the NW.js
application work out of the box.

For me the way to go is to make use of the relation between file extension
and default application.

A file with an extension like .tw will be opened by the default application
that in my use case will be NW.js.

For me TWc has become a framework now that I use in NW.js. This delivers me
flexible applications for note taking, project management, data analysis
and report creation.

Browsers I hardly use anymore for TWc.

Have a nice day, Okido

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Re: [tw5] Re: New plugin: Highlight searched text

2019-11-19 Thread HC Haase

You are awesome! 
alas you are right, the jump to dont work in jds material theme :(
I would guess that the theme could be modified to show more in the search 
bar.. maybe @JD could give us a hint :)

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[tw5] Re: Dealing with repetitive titles?

2019-11-19 Thread Jed Carty

For my notes I use namespaces, for most RPG locations that I have had notes 
on this worked well because you can do things like 'Obelisk of 
Obliteration/Room 1'and  'Pinnacle of Mild Peril/Room 1' for the titles. 
Then use tags or other fields to let you organise things.

As a side note, templates are very useful for things like this.
You make a template that displays the room information in a way that is 
useful and then make each room tiddler just contain the required 
information in its fields. Someone on the forums here made/is making a wiki 
with all of the free DnD 5 content in it. Last I saw it was very well done 
and may be a good place to look for inspiration or for things to reuse.

And as an even more off-topic side note, I made Bob to get around the 
desire to put everything into one wiki, it lets you create a lot of wikis 
and can have an easy list of all of them in your wikis.
I changed from having one wiki with all the rpg info in it to one per 
module/scenario.
https://github.com/OokTech/TW5-BobEXE/releases/tag/1.3.1

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[tw5] Re: The last word in Saving?

Ciao TonyM

Couple of footnotes to this ... 

TonyM wrote:
>
> One avenue I have toyed with is saving tiddlywiki files with the .tw 
> extension and installing a local binary, that on open it loads it into a 
> "TiddlyDesktop like app" with no additional chrome or wiki selection, just 
> that wiki. Of course this solution will need a multi-os install binary. The 
> advantage with this is you are not loosing the knowledge it is a tiddlywiki 
> file by keeping it as a tw file so it does not just revert to the default 
> browser. The wiki then becomes a "document" that the Operating system 
> associates with the local binary.
>

I'd say that software on mobile phones is rather good at "wrapping" the TW 
"document". I assume its still using a "browser" inside Quinoid, Quine & 
Tiddloid (?) but they provide examples of the near seamless experience you 
are referring to.

And the issue with a "wrapper" for TW on main desktops I think is broadly 
solved by TiddlyDesktop (though there are issues on its portability that 
would need solving).
It might be worth experimenting with TD to see if it can be tweaked to 
fully match your objective?

Best wishes
Josiah

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[tw5] Re: The last word in Saving?