subject:"Re\: \[TruthTalk\] Garden Atonement"

Re: [TruthTalk] Garden Atonement

2005-12-14 Thread Kevin Deegan

Blaine what is all this Talk about PAYING for SINS in the GARDEN? And what is this great drops of Blood sweat thing have to do with Atonement?"The Savior ATONED for our sins by suffering in Gethsemane and by giving his life on the cross. It is impossible for us to fully understand how he suffered for all of our sins. In the Garden of Gethsemane, the weight of our sins caused him to feel such agony and heartbreak that be bled from every pore (see DC 19:18-19)." Gospel Principles, Corporation of the President of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, 1979, pg. 66"Jesus then went into the Garden of Gethsemane. There
he suffered most. He suffered greatly on the cross, of course, but other men had died by crucifixion; in fact, a man hung on either side of him as he died on the cross. But no man, nor set of men, nor all men put together, ever suffered what the Redeemer suffered in the garden. He went there to pray and suffer'" (Conference Report, Marion Romney, First Presidency,October 1953, Pg.35). "suffered as only as God would suffer, bearing our griefs, carrying our sorrows, being wounded for our transgressions, voluntarily submitting Himself to the iniquity of us all, just as Isaiah prophesied." "It was in Gethsemane that Jesus took on Himself the sins of the world, in Gethsemane that His pain was equivalent to the cumulative burden of all men, in Gethsemane that He descended below all things so that all could repent and come to Him" (Teachings of Ezra Taft Benson, pg.15).
"Forgiveness is available because Christ the Lord sweat great drops of blood in Gethsemane as he bore the incalculable weight of the sins of all who ever had or ever would repent" ("The Promised Messiah," Bruce R. McConkie pg. 337) "In a garden called Gethsemane, outside Jerusalem's walls, in agony beyond compare, he took upon himself the sins of all men on condition of repentance." ("The Promised Messiah," Mormon Apostle Bruce R. McConkie pg. 552) "And as he came out of the Garden, delivering himself voluntarily into the hands of wicked men, the victory had been won. There remained yet the shame and the pain of his attest, his trials, and his cross. But all these were overshadowed by the agonies and sufferings in Gethsemane. It was on the cross that he 'suffered death in the flesh,' even
as many have suffered agonizing deaths, but it was in Gethsemane that "he suffered the pain of all men, that all men might repent and come unto him." "The Mortal Messiah," McConkie pg. 127-128Jesus paid for all our sins when He suffered in the Garden of Gethsemane. Laurel Rohlfing, Sharing Time: The Atonement, Friend, Mar. 1989, 39BYU professor Robert J. Matthews, who on page 282 of his book, A Bible! A Bible!, wrote, It was in Gethsemane, on the slopes of the Mount of Olives, that Jesus made his perfect atonement by the shedding of his blood-more so than on the cross. Apostle Bruce McConkie, stated, Where and under what circumstances was the atoning sacrifice of the Son of God made? Was it on the Cross of Calvary or in the Garden of Gethsemane? It is to the Cross of Christ that most
Christians look when centering their attention upon the infinite and eternal atonement. And certainly the sacrifice of our Lord was completed when he was lifted up by men; also, that part of his life and suffering is more dramatic and, perhaps, more soul stirring. But in reality the pain and suffering, the triumph and grandeur, of the atonement took place primarily in Gethsemane, (Doctrinal New Testament Commentary 1:774)The Savior began shedding His blood for all mankind, not on the cross but in the Garden of Gethsemane. (Russell M. Nelson, His Mission and Ministry, New Era, Dec. 1999)the preaching of the CROSSis to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God 1 Co 1:18Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:Now Kevin, we don't despise crosses, we just like stars better. :) BlainerbJesus paid for all our sins when He suffered in the Garden of Gethsemane. Laurel Rohlfing, Sharing Time: The Atonement, Friend, Mar. 1989, 39"The Savior atoned for our sins by suffering in Gethsemane and by giving his life on the cross. It is impossible for us to fully understand how he suffered for all of our sins. In the Garden of Gethsemane, the weight of our sins caused him to feel such agony and heartbreak that be bled
from every pore (see DC 19:18-19)." Gospel Principles, Corporation of the President of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, 1979, pg. 66BYU professor Robert J. Matthews, who on page 282 of his book, A Bible! A Bible!, wrote, It was in Gethsemane, on the slopes of the Mount of Olives, that Jesus made his perfect atonement by the shedding of his blood-more so than on the cross. Apostle Bruce McConkie, stated, Where and under what circumstances was the atoning sacrifice of the Son of God made? Was it on the Cross of Calvary or in the Garden of

Re: [TruthTalk] Garden Atonement

2005-12-14 Thread Lance Muir

THE VICARIOUS HUMANITY OF CHRIST WOULD MOST
ASSUREDLY INCLUDE THE GARDEN, kevin!

- Original Message -
From:
Kevin
Deegan
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org

Sent: December 14, 2005 07:46
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Garden
Atonement

Blaine what is all this Talk about
PAYING for SINS in the GARDEN?
And what is this great drops of
Blood sweat thing have to do with Atonement?

"The Savior ATONED for our sins by
suffering in Gethsemane and by giving his life on the cross. It is
impossible for us to fully understand how he suffered for all of our sins.
In the Garden of Gethsemane, the weight of our sins caused him to
feel such agony and heartbreak that be bled from every
pore (see DC 19:18-19)." Gospel Principles, Corporation
of the President of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, 1979, pg.
66

"Jesus then went into the Garden of Gethsemane. There he suffered
most. He suffered greatly on the cross, of course, but other men had
died by crucifixion; in fact, a man hung on either side of him as he died on
the cross. But no man, nor set of men, nor all men put together, ever suffered
what the Redeemer suffered in the garden. He went there to pray and suffer'"
(Conference Report, Marion Romney, First Presidency,October 1953,
Pg.35).
"suffered as only as God would suffer, bearing our griefs,
carrying our sorrows, being wounded for our transgressions, voluntarily
submitting Himself to the iniquity of us all, just as Isaiah
prophesied."
"It was in Gethsemane that Jesus took on Himself
the sins of the world, in Gethsemane that His pain was equivalent to
the cumulative burden of all men, in Gethsemane that He descended below all
things so that all could repent and come to Him" (Teachings of Ezra Taft
Benson, pg.15).

"Forgiveness is available because Christ the Lord sweat great drops of blood in Gethsemane as he
bore the incalculable weight of the sins of all who ever had
or ever would repent" ("The Promised Messiah," Bruce R. McConkie pg.
337)
"In a garden called Gethsemane, outside Jerusalem's
walls, in agony beyond compare, he took upon himself the sins of all
men on condition of repentance." ("The Promised Messiah,"
Mormon Apostle Bruce R. McConkie pg. 552)
"And as he came out of the Garden, delivering himself voluntarily into
the hands of wicked men, the victory had been won. There remained yet the
shame and the pain of his attest, his trials, and his cross.
But all these were overshadowed by the agonies and sufferings in
Gethsemane. It was on the cross that he
'suffered death in the flesh,' even as many have suffered agonizing deaths,
but it was in Gethsemane that "he suffered the pain of all
men, that all men might repent and come unto him." "The Mortal
Messiah," McConkie pg. 127-128

Jesus paid for all our sins when He suffered in the Garden of
Gethsemane. Laurel Rohlfing, Sharing Time: The Atonement, Friend,
Mar. 1989, 39

BYU professor Robert J. Matthews, who on page 282 of his book, A Bible! A
Bible!, wrote, It was in Gethsemane, on the slopes of the Mount of Olives,
that Jesus made his perfect atonement by the shedding of his
blood-more so than on the cross.

Apostle Bruce McConkie, stated, Where and
under what circumstances was the atoning sacrifice of the Son
of God made? Was it on the Cross of Calvary or in the Garden of Gethsemane? It
is to the Cross of Christ that most Christians look when centering their
attention upon the infinite and eternal atonement. And certainly the sacrifice
of our Lord was completed when he was lifted up by men; also, that part of his
life and suffering is more dramatic and, perhaps, more soul stirring. But
in reality the pain and suffering, the triumph and grandeur, of the atonement
took place primarily in Gethsemane, (Doctrinal New Testament
Commentary 1:774)

The Savior began shedding His blood for all mankind, not on the
cross but in the Garden of Gethsemane. (Russell M. Nelson, His
Mission and Ministry, New Era, Dec. 1999)

the preaching of the
CROSSis to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are
saved it is the power of God 1 Co 1:18

Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

Now Kevin, we don't despise crosses, we just like
stars better. :) Blainerb

Jesus paid for all our sins when He suffered in the Garden of
Gethsemane. Laurel Rohlfing, Sharing Time: The Atonement, Friend,
Mar. 1989, 39

"The Savior atoned for our sins by
suffering in Gethsemane and by giving his life on the cross. It
is impossible for us to fully understand how he suffered for all of our
sins. In the Garden of Gethsemane, the weight of our sins caused
him to feel

Re: [TruthTalk] Garden Atonement

2005-12-14 Thread Kevin Deegan

The WHAT?ROTFLLance Muir [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: THE VICARIOUS HUMANITY OF CHRIST WOULD MOST ASSUREDLY INCLUDE THE GARDEN, kevin!- Original Message - From: Kevin Deegan To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: December 14, 2005 07:46 Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Garden AtonementBlaine what is all this Talk about PAYING for SINS in the GARDEN? And what is this great drops of Blood sweat thing have to do with Atonement?"The Savior ATONED for our sins by suffering in Gethsemane and by giving his life on the cross. It is impossible for us to fully understand how he suffered for all of our sins. In the Garden of Gethsemane, the weight of our sins caused him to feel such agony and heartbreak that be bled from every pore (see DC 19:18-19)." Gospel Principles, Corporation of the President of the Church of Jesus Christ of
Latter-day Saints, 1979, pg. 66"Jesus then went into the Garden of Gethsemane. There he suffered most. He suffered greatly on the cross, of course, but other men had died by crucifixion; in fact, a man hung on either side of him as he died on the cross. But no man, nor set of men, nor all men put together, ever suffered what the Redeemer suffered in the garden. He went there to pray and suffer'" (Conference Report, Marion Romney, First Presidency,October 1953, Pg.35). "suffered as only as God would suffer, bearing our griefs, carrying our sorrows, being wounded for our transgressions, voluntarily submitting Himself to the iniquity of us all, just as Isaiah prophesied." "It was in Gethsemane that Jesus took on Himself the sins of the world, in Gethsemane that His pain was equivalent to the cumulative burden of all men, in
Gethsemane that He descended below all things so that all could repent and come to Him" (Teachings of Ezra Taft Benson, pg.15). "Forgiveness is available because Christ the Lord sweat great drops of blood in Gethsemane as he bore the incalculable weight of the sins of all who ever had or ever would repent" ("The Promised Messiah," Bruce R. McConkie pg. 337) "In a garden called Gethsemane, outside Jerusalem's walls, in agony beyond compare, he took upon himself the sins of all men on condition of repentance." ("The Promised Messiah," Mormon Apostle Bruce R. McConkie pg. 552) "And as he came out of the Garden, delivering himself voluntarily into the hands of wicked men, the victory had been won. There remained yet the shame and the pain of his attest, his trials, and his cross. But all these were
overshadowed by the agonies and sufferings in Gethsemane. It was on the cross that he 'suffered death in the flesh,' even as many have suffered agonizing deaths, but it was in Gethsemane that "he suffered the pain of all men, that all men might repent and come unto him." "The Mortal Messiah," McConkie pg. 127-128Jesus paid for all our sins when He suffered in the Garden of Gethsemane. Laurel Rohlfing, Sharing Time: The Atonement, Friend, Mar. 1989, 39BYU professor Robert J. Matthews, who on page 282 of his book, A Bible! A Bible!, wrote, It was in Gethsemane, on the slopes of the Mount of Olives, that Jesus made his perfect atonement by the shedding of his blood-more so than on the cross. Apostle Bruce McConkie, stated, Where and under what circumstances was the
atoning sacrifice of the Son of God made? Was it on the Cross of Calvary or in the Garden of Gethsemane? It is to the Cross of Christ that most Christians look when centering their attention upon the infinite and eternal atonement. And certainly the sacrifice of our Lord was completed when he was lifted up by men; also, that part of his life and suffering is more dramatic and, perhaps, more soul stirring. But in reality the pain and suffering, the triumph and grandeur, of the atonement took place primarily in Gethsemane, (Doctrinal New Testament Commentary 1:774)The Savior began shedding His blood for all mankind, not on the cross but in the Garden of Gethsemane. (Russell M. Nelson, His Mission and Ministry, New Era, Dec. 1999)the preaching of the
CROSSis to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God 1 Co 1:18Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:Now Kevin, we don't despise crosses, we just like stars better. :) BlainerbJesus paid for all our sins when He suffered in the Garden of Gethsemane. Laurel Rohlfing, Sharing Time: The Atonement, Friend, Mar. 1989, 39"The Savior atoned for our sins by suffering in Gethsemane and by giving his life on the cross. It is impossible for us to fully
understand how he suffered for all of our sins. In the Garden of Gethsemane, the weight of our sins caused him to feel such agony and heartbreak that be bled from every pore (see DC 19:18-19)." Gospel Principles, Corporation of the President of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, 1979, pg. 6

Re: [TruthTalk] Garden Atonement

2005-12-14 Thread Lance Muir

Please pick yourself up from the floor then, let me
know that what I wrote is not understood by you, should this be the
case.

- Original Message -
From:
Kevin
Deegan
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org

Sent: December 14, 2005 08:30
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Garden
Atonement

The WHAT?

ROTFLLance Muir [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:

THE VICARIOUS HUMANITY OF CHRIST WOULD MOST
ASSUREDLY INCLUDE THE GARDEN, kevin!

- Original Message -
From:
Kevin Deegan
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org

Sent: December 14, 2005 07:46
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Garden
Atonement

Blaine what is all this Talk
about PAYING for SINS in the GARDEN?
And what is this great drops
of Blood sweat thing have to do with Atonement?

"The Savior ATONED for our sins
by suffering in Gethsemane and by giving his life on the cross.
It is impossible for us to fully understand how he suffered for all of our
sins. In the Garden of Gethsemane, the weight of our sins caused
him to feel such agony and heartbreak that be bled
from every pore (see DC 19:18-19)." Gospel
Principles, Corporation of the President of the Church of Jesus Christ of
Latter-day Saints, 1979, pg. 66

"Jesus then went into the Garden of Gethsemane. There he
suffered most. He suffered greatly on the cross, of course, but
other men had died by crucifixion; in fact, a man hung on either side of
him as he died on the cross. But no man, nor set of men, nor all men put
together, ever suffered what the Redeemer suffered in the garden. He went
there to pray and suffer'" (Conference Report, Marion Romney, First
Presidency,October 1953, Pg.35).
"suffered as only as God would suffer, bearing our griefs,
carrying our sorrows, being wounded for our transgressions, voluntarily
submitting Himself to the iniquity of us all, just as Isaiah
prophesied."
"It was in Gethsemane that Jesus took on
Himself the sins of the world, in Gethsemane that His pain was
equivalent to the cumulative burden of all men, in Gethsemane that He
descended below all things so that all could repent and come to Him"
(Teachings of Ezra Taft Benson, pg.15).

"Forgiveness is available because Christ the Lord sweat great drops of blood in Gethsemane as
he bore the incalculable weight of the sins of all who
ever had or ever would repent" ("The Promised Messiah," Bruce R. McConkie
pg. 337)
"In a garden called Gethsemane, outside Jerusalem's
walls, in agony beyond compare, he took upon himself the sins of
all men on condition of repentance." ("The Promised
Messiah," Mormon Apostle Bruce R. McConkie pg. 552)
"And as he came out of the Garden, delivering himself voluntarily
into the hands of wicked men, the victory had been won. There remained yet
the shame and the pain of his attest, his trials, and his
cross. But all these were overshadowed by the agonies and
sufferings in Gethsemane. It was on
the cross that he 'suffered death in the flesh,' even as many have
suffered agonizing deaths, but it was in Gethsemane that "he suffered the
pain of all men, that all men might repent and come unto
him." "The Mortal Messiah," McConkie pg. 127-128

Jesus paid for all our sins when He suffered in the Garden of
Gethsemane. Laurel Rohlfing, Sharing Time: The Atonement,
Friend, Mar. 1989, 39

BYU professor Robert J. Matthews, who on page 282 of his book, A
Bible! A Bible!, wrote, It was in Gethsemane, on the slopes of the Mount
of Olives, that Jesus made his perfect atonement by the
shedding of his blood-more so than on the cross.

Apostle Bruce McConkie, stated, Where and
under what circumstances was the atoning sacrifice of the
Son of God made? Was it on the Cross of Calvary or in the Garden of
Gethsemane? It is to the Cross of Christ that most Christians look when
centering their attention upon the infinite and eternal atonement. And
certainly the sacrifice of our Lord was completed when he was lifted up by
men; also, that part of his life and suffering is more dramatic and,
perhaps, more soul stirring. But in reality the pain and suffering, the
triumph and grandeur, of the atonement took place primarily in
Gethsemane, (Doctrinal New Testament Commentary
1:774)

The Savior began shedding His blood for all mankind, not on
the cross but in the Garden of Gethsemane. (Russell M.
Nelson, His Mission and Ministry, New Era,

Re: [TruthTalk] Garden Atonement

2005-12-14 Thread knpraise

If you think this to be little more than funny,   you know no more about 
the old rugged cross than does our friend, Blaine.

jd



 -- Original message --
From: Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 The WHAT?

   ROTFL
 
 Lance Muir [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
   THE VICARIOUS HUMANITY OF CHRIST WOULD MOST ASSUREDLY INCLUDE THE 
 GARDEN, kevin!
 - Original Message - 
   From: Kevin Deegan 
   To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org 
   Sent: December 14, 2005 07:46
   Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Garden Atonement
   
 
   Blaine what is all this Talk about PAYING for SINS in the GARDEN?
   And what is this great drops of Blood sweat thing have to do with Atonement?

   The Savior ATONED for our sins by suffering in Gethsemane and by giving 
 his 
 life on the cross. It is impossible for us to fully understand how he 
 suffered 
 for all of our sins. In the Garden of Gethsemane, the weight of our sins 
 caused 
 him to feel such agony and heartbreak that be bled from every pore (see DC 
 19:18-19).  Gospel Principles, Corporation of the President of the Church of 
 Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, 1979, pg. 66

   Jesus then went into the Garden of Gethsemane. There he suffered most. He 
 suffered greatly on the cross, of course, but other men had died by 
 crucifixion; 
 in fact, a man hung on either side of him as he died on the cross. But no 
 man, 
 nor set of men, nor all men put together, ever suffered what the Redeemer 
 suffered in the garden. He went there to pray and suffer' (Conference 
 Report, 
 Marion Romney, First Presidency, October 1953, Pg.35). 
   
  suffered as only as God would suffer, bearing our griefs, carrying our 
 sorrows, being wounded for our transgressions, voluntarily submitting Himself 
 to 
 the iniquity of us all, just as Isaiah prophesied. 
   It was in Gethsemane that Jesus took on Himself the sins of the world, in 
 Gethsemane that His pain was equivalent to the cumulative burden of all men, 
 in 
 Gethsemane that He descended below all things so that all could repent and 
 come 
 to Him (Teachings of Ezra Taft Benson, pg.15). 

   Forgiveness is available because Christ the Lord sweat great drops of 
 blood 
 in Gethsemane as he bore the incalculable weight of the sins of all who ever 
 had 
 or ever would repent (The Promised Messiah, Bruce R. McConkie pg. 337)
   In a garden called Gethsemane, outside Jerusalem's walls, in agony beyond 
 compare, he took upon himself the sins of all men on condition of 
 repentance.  
 (The Promised Messiah, Mormon Apostle Bruce R. McConkie pg. 552)
 
   And as he came out of the Garden, delivering himself voluntarily into the 
 hands of wicked men, the victory had been won. There remained yet the shame 
 and 
 the pain of his attest, his trials, and his cross. But all these were 
 overshadowed by the agonies and sufferings in Gethsemane. It was on the cross 
 that he 'suffered death in the flesh,' even as many have suffered agonizing 
 deaths, but it was in Gethsemane that he suffered the pain of all men, that 
 all 
 men might repent and come unto him. The Mortal Messiah, McConkie pg. 
 127-128
 Jesus paid for all our sins when He suffered in the Garden of Gethsemane. 
 Laurel Rohlfing, Sharing Time: The Atonement, Friend, Mar. 1989, 39

   BYU professor Robert J. Matthews, who on page 282 of his book, A Bible! A 
 Bible!, wrote, It was in Gethsemane, on the slopes of the Mount of Olives, 
 that 
 Jesus made his perfect atonement by the shedding of his blood-more so than on 
 the cross. 

   Apostle Bruce McConkie, stated, Where and under what circumstances was the 
 atoning sacrifice of the Son of God made? Was it on the Cross of Calvary or 
 in 
 the Garden of Gethsemane? It is to the Cross of Christ that most Christians 
 look 
 when centering their attention upon the infinite and eternal atonement. And 
 certainly the sacrifice of our Lord was completed when he was lifted up by 
 men; 
 also, that part of his life and suffering is more dramatic and, perhaps, more 
 soul stirring. But in reality the pain and suffering, the triumph and 
 grandeur, 
 of the atonement took place primarily in Gethsemane, (Doctrinal New 
 Testament 
 Commentary 1:774)

   The Savior began shedding His blood for all mankind, not on the cross but 
 in 
 the Garden of Gethsemane.  (Russell M. Nelson, His Mission and Ministry, 
 New 
 Era, Dec. 1999)

 
   the preaching of the CROSS is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us 
 which are saved it is the power of God 1 Co 1:18

   Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 Now Kevin, we don't despise crosses, we just like stars better.  :) 
 Blainerb

   Jesus paid for all our sins when He suffered in the Garden of Gethsemane. 
 Laurel Rohlfing, Sharing Time: The Atonement, Friend, Mar. 1989, 39

   The Savior atoned for our sins by suffering in Gethsemane and by giving 
 his 
 life on the cross

Re: [TruthTalk] Garden Atonement

2005-12-14 Thread Judy Taylor




But apparently it leaves us bereft in our own personal 
mess at least in your economy Lance since
you are wanting to allude to and/or point out or at 
least have others confess their own sinon TT ... 
For what purpose?

On Wed, 14 Dec 2005 07:49:17 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

  THE VICARIOUS HUMANITY OF CHRIST WOULD MOST 
  ASSUREDLY INCLUDE THE GARDEN, kevin!
  
From: Kevin Deegan 

Blaine what is all this Talk 
about PAYING for SINS in the GARDEN?
And what is this great drops of 
Blood sweat thing have to do with Atonement?

"The Savior ATONED for our sins by 
suffering in Gethsemane and by giving his life on the cross. It 
is impossible for us to fully understand how he suffered for all of our 
sins. In the Garden of Gethsemane, the weight of our sins caused 
him to feel such agony and heartbreak that be bled from 
every pore (see DC 19:18-19)." Gospel Principles, 
Corporation of the President of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day 
Saints, 1979, pg. 66

"Jesus then went into the Garden of Gethsemane. There he 
suffered most. He suffered greatly on the cross, of course, but 
other men had died by crucifixion; in fact, a man hung on either side of him 
as he died on the cross. But no man, nor set of men, nor all men put 
together, ever suffered what the Redeemer suffered in the garden. He went 
there to pray and suffer'" (Conference Report, Marion Romney, First 
Presidency,October 1953, Pg.35). 
"suffered as only as God would suffer, bearing our griefs, 
carrying our sorrows, being wounded for our transgressions, voluntarily 
submitting Himself to the iniquity of us all, just as Isaiah 
prophesied."
"It was in Gethsemane that Jesus took on 
Himself the sins of the world, in Gethsemane that His pain was 
equivalent to the cumulative burden of all men, in Gethsemane that He 
descended below all things so that all could repent and come to Him" 
(Teachings of Ezra Taft Benson, pg.15). 

"Forgiveness is available because Christ the Lord sweat great drops of blood in Gethsemane as he 
bore the incalculable weight of the sins of all who ever 
had or ever would repent" ("The Promised Messiah," Bruce R. McConkie pg. 
337)
"In a garden called Gethsemane, outside Jerusalem's 
walls, in agony beyond compare, he took upon himself the sins of all 
men on condition of repentance." ("The Promised Messiah," 
Mormon Apostle Bruce R. McConkie pg. 552)
"And as he came out of the Garden, delivering himself voluntarily into 
the hands of wicked men, the victory had been won. There remained yet the 
shame and the pain of his attest, his trials, and his 
cross. But all these were overshadowed by the agonies and 
sufferings in Gethsemane. It was on the 
cross that he 'suffered death in the flesh,' even as many have suffered 
agonizing deaths, but it was in Gethsemane that "he suffered the pain of all 
men, that all men might repent and come unto him." "The 
Mortal Messiah," McConkie pg. 127-128

Jesus paid for all our sins when He suffered in the Garden of 
Gethsemane. Laurel Rohlfing, Sharing Time: The Atonement, Friend, 
Mar. 1989, 39

BYU professor Robert J. Matthews, who on page 282 of his book, A Bible! 
A Bible!, wrote, It was in Gethsemane, on the slopes of the Mount of 
Olives, that Jesus made his perfect atonement by the 
shedding of his blood-more so than on the cross. 

Apostle Bruce McConkie, stated, Where and 
under what circumstances was the atoning sacrifice of the 
Son of God made? Was it on the Cross of Calvary or in the Garden of 
Gethsemane? It is to the Cross of Christ that most Christians look when 
centering their attention upon the infinite and eternal atonement. And 
certainly the sacrifice of our Lord was completed when he was lifted up by 
men; also, that part of his life and suffering is more dramatic and, 
perhaps, more soul stirring. But in reality the pain and suffering, the 
triumph and grandeur, of the atonement took place primarily in 
Gethsemane, (Doctrinal New Testament Commentary 1:774)

The Savior began shedding His blood for all mankind, not on the 
cross but in the Garden of Gethsemane. (Russell M. Nelson, 
His Mission and Ministry, New Era, Dec. 1999)

the preaching of the 
CROSSis to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are 
saved it is the power of God 1 Co 1:18

Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:

  Now Kevin, we don't despise crosses, we just 
  like stars better. :) Blainerb
  
  Jesus paid for all our sins when He suffered in the Garden of 
  Gethsemane. Laurel Rohlfing, Sharing Time: The Atonement, 
  Friend, Mar. 1989, 39
  
  "The Savior atoned for our sins 
  by suffering in

Re: [TruthTalk] Garden Atonement

2005-12-14 Thread Lance Muir

SOK, Judith, I have every confidence that you
don't

- Original Message -
From:
Judy
Taylor
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org

Cc: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org

Sent: December 14, 2005 08:48
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Garden
Atonement

Just what is the "direct question" Lance? I
don't recall you ever being direct about anything.

On Wed, 14 Dec 2005 08:45:52 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:

FWIW (not much, say many), you are as elusive
as the Mormons when it comes to a direct replay to a direct question. 'Slip
slidin' away'

From: Judy Taylor

But apparently it leaves us bereft in our own
personal mess at least in your economy Lance since
you are wanting to allude to and/or point out or
at least have others confess their own sinon TT ...
For what purpose?

On Wed, 14 Dec 2005 07:49:17 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:

THE VICARIOUS HUMANITY OF CHRIST WOULD MOST
ASSUREDLY INCLUDE THE GARDEN, kevin!

From: Kevin Deegan

Blaine what is all this
Talk about PAYING for SINS in the GARDEN?
And what is this great
drops of Blood sweat thing have to do with Atonement?

"The Savior ATONED for our
sins by suffering in Gethsemane and by giving his
life on the cross. It is impossible for us to fully understand how
he suffered for all of our sins. In the Garden of
Gethsemane, the weight of our sins caused him to feel such agony and
heartbreak that be bled from every pore
(see DC 19:18-19)." Gospel Principles, Corporation of
the President of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints,
1979, pg. 66

"Jesus then went into the Garden of Gethsemane. There he
suffered most. He suffered greatly on the cross, of course,
but other men had died by crucifixion; in fact, a man hung on either
side of him as he died on the cross. But no man, nor set of men, nor
all men put together, ever suffered what the Redeemer suffered in the
garden. He went there to pray and suffer'" (Conference Report, Marion
Romney, First Presidency,October 1953, Pg.35).
"suffered as only as God would suffer, bearing our
griefs, carrying our sorrows, being wounded for our transgressions,
voluntarily submitting Himself to the iniquity of us all, just as
Isaiah prophesied."
"It was in Gethsemane that Jesus took on
Himself the sins of the world, in Gethsemane that His pain
was equivalent to the cumulative burden of all men, in Gethsemane that
He descended below all things so that all could repent and come to
Him" (Teachings of Ezra Taft Benson, pg.15).

"Forgiveness is available because Christ the Lord sweat great drops of blood in Gethsemane
as he bore the incalculable weight of the sins of all
who ever had or ever would repent" ("The Promised Messiah," Bruce R.
McConkie pg. 337)
"In a garden called Gethsemane, outside
Jerusalem's walls, in agony beyond compare, he took upon
himself the sins of all men on condition of
repentance." ("The Promised Messiah," Mormon Apostle Bruce R.
McConkie pg. 552)
"And as he came out of the Garden, delivering himself voluntarily
into the hands of wicked men, the victory had been won. There remained
yet the shame and the pain of his attest, his trials, and his
cross. But all these were overshadowed by the agonies
and sufferings in Gethsemane. It
was on the cross that he 'suffered death in the flesh,' even as many
have suffered agonizing deaths, but it was in Gethsemane that "he
suffered the pain of all men, that all men might
repent and come unto him." "The Mortal Messiah," McConkie pg.
127-128

Jesus paid for all our sins when He suffered in the
Garden of Gethsemane. Laurel Rohlfing, Sharing Time: The
Atonement, Friend, Mar. 1989, 39

BYU professor Robert J. Matthews, who on page 282 of his book, A
Bible! A Bible!, wrote, It was in Gethsemane, on the slopes of the
Mount of Olives, that Jesus made his perfect
atonement by the shedding of his blood-more so than
on the cross.

Apostle Bruce McConkie, stated, Where
and under what circumstances was the atoning
sacrifice of the Son of God made? Was

Re: [TruthTalk] Garden Atonement

2005-12-14 Thread Lance Muir

I just checked out the definition of 'foolish'. B4
Torrance Kevin, it 'the vicarious humanity of Christ' was present throughout
Scripture.

- Original Message -
From:
Kevin
Deegan
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org

Sent: December 14, 2005 08:38
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Garden
Atonement

Where was this B4 Torrance?
This explains a lot about your postmodern Psychiatry/Anthropology
you call a "theology"Lance Muir [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote: