RE: [Vo]:Those EMP weapons (and your cellphone) could actually be doing more personal harm than previously thought
We were using an Agilent N5230A for all our testing: http://www.home.agilent.com/en/pd-415192/4-port-pna-l-series Key Features Specifications - Integrated 4-port, balanced measurements - 103 dB dynamic range and 0.004 dB trace noise - 4.5 usec/point measurement speed, 32 channels, 16,001 points - Automatic port extension automatically corrects for in-fixture measurements All fully automated via code running on a PC to eliminate human error when running tests… This thing can scan from 300Khz to 20Ghz and sample 16,000 frequencies in 7 seconds, making a simultaneous reflection and transmission measurement at each frequency! The calibration process, if done properly, eliminates all spurious reflections from connectors and cables, so what you get is a measurement at a ‘reference plane’, which is your DUT… “Do I understand properly that you have a forward moving RF signal that is at some level, and that the reflections must not cause the primary signal amplitude to vary by more than .01 dB?” No. The changes in the electrical properties of biological tissue (the finger in our testing) when your glucose goes from 80mg/dL to 100mg/dL is probably less than .01dB! Sensitivity with the diabetics we tested ranged from 20mg/dL to about 40… FDA requirements are somewhat in flux, but they are about 10mg/dL when your glucose gets below 80mg/dL, so we aren’t too far from regulatory. RE: More Fun with More Power!!! A friend’s early career was as a technician at a commercial radio station (50KW)… said occasionally the amp would go into oscillations and the 4 or 6 inch copper buss-bar from the amp to the base of the antenna would end up in small, fairly regular-sized pieces! Ampere-Neumann electrodynamics? See http://arxiv.org/abs/physics/0012029 -mark From: David Roberson [mailto:dlrober...@aol.com] Sent: Monday, December 10, 2012 11:11 PM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: [Vo]:Those EMP weapons (and your cellphone) could actually be doing more personal harm than previously thought It sounds like you are being RF level starved Mark! I was working on a PIN diode band switch once where I felt like I could measure to that degree of accuracy. I am not sure that I could actually reach that level of performance since any equipment reflection totally over whelmed the signal. You need to play with more power if you want to have some fun. I once received an RF burn from a 100 watt VHF transmitter that I was load pulling. That put a hurt on me! Do I understand properly that you have a forward moving RF signal that is at some level, and that the reflections must not cause the primary signal amplitude to vary by more than .01 dB? Wow! Dave -Original Message- From: MarkI-ZeroPoint zeropo...@charter.net To: vortex-l vortex-l@eskimo.com Sent: Tue, Dec 11, 2012 1:13 am Subject: RE: [Vo]:Those EMP weapons (and your cellphone) could actually be doing more personal harm than previously thought Dave: I sent you the paper PDF via personal email so you can see if there’s enough detail to answer your questions… I’m used to dealing with signals .01dB, so when I see a signal that is ‘several dBs’ above what is expected, that’s a good thing!! J -Mark From: David Roberson [mailto:dlrober...@aol.com mailto:dlrober...@aol.com? ] Sent: Monday, December 10, 2012 6:25 PM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: [Vo]:Those EMP weapons (and your cellphone) could actually be doing more personal harm than previously thought Mark, you are working on an interesting project and I wish you great success. As you suggest, biological tissue is assumed to be very lossy and for that reason the levels due to resonances can not become too large I would think. Standing waves exist due to reflections that reinforce each other. If the material is very lossy then a wave reflecting off the far surface must by definition be reduced significantly before it returns to the opposite source surface. Any triple transit reflections would pretty much be unimportant. If you assume that the reflection is attenuated by 6 dB, which is 3 dB for each path, the maximum would be 3.5 dB above the input level. This calculation is assuming a low loss case of 3 dB so I would think that any reasonable attenuation would result in relatively little excess. Do you recall any examples supplied by the paper that can be analyzed? I bet they do not assume much attenuation before the first reflection even though the wavelength is still fairly long at those frequencies. Dave -Original Message- From: MarkI-ZeroPoint zeropo...@charter.net To: vortex-l vortex-l@eskimo.com Sent: Mon, Dec 10, 2012 8:28 pm Subject: RE: [Vo]:Those EMP weapons (and your cellphone) could actually be doing more personal harm than previously thought As a few here are aware, I’ve been involved in a technology which uses (very LOW power) RF and microwave
Re: [Vo]:Energy Stored Within MFMP Celani Cell
On 2012-12-11 05:02, David Roberson wrote: I am seeking a bit of feedback from the Vortex crowd. For more feedback, next time try writing a new thread (by writing a new post to the mailing list at vortex-l@eskimo.com with the write function or its equivalent in your email client) instead of replying to existing posts (with the reply function) when starting a new discussion about MFMP. All your threads so far are nested inside other ones, which makes them difficult to spot for people who use email clients in threaded mode, and also off-topic to those you're mistakenly replying to. Cheers, S.A.
Re: [Vo]:Thoughts on reading the Papp patent - #2.
Abd ul-Rahman Lomax Mon, 10 Dec 2012 19:42:40 -0800 At 08:36 AM 12/10/2012, chan.fusion.po...@gmail.com wrote: FYI: http://papp.scienceontheweb.net/Forming.html www.free-energy-info.co.uk/P2.pdf BTW Trying to pass off LENR as a business when you admit it is your hobby to avoid paying taxes to the IRS is a ploy used by the dishonest born or lucky Rich and that is illegal, JR. Vortex is read by citizens ready to earn IRS rewards. Just pay your taxes! Chan SNIP Gaming the system: http://www.mail-archive.com/vortex-l@eskimo.com/msg72990.html http://www.mail-archive.com/vortex-l@eskimo.com/msg73002.html Just pay your taxes!
Re: [Vo]:Energy Stored Within MFMP Celani Cell
Thanks for the advice Akira. I have typically been using a response to another vortex email as a template. I changed the subject and was unaware that this would not work. It seems strange that this occurs, but now I understand. Dave -Original Message- From: Akira Shirakawa shirakawa.ak...@gmail.com To: vortex-l vortex-l@eskimo.com Sent: Tue, Dec 11, 2012 4:00 am Subject: Re: [Vo]:Energy Stored Within MFMP Celani Cell On 2012-12-11 05:02, David Roberson wrote: I am seeking a bit of feedback from the Vortex crowd. For more feedback, next time try writing a new thread (by writing a new post to the mailing list at vortex-l@eskimo.com with the write function or its equivalent in your email client) instead of replying to existing posts (with the reply function) when starting a new discussion about MFMP. All your threads so far are nested inside other ones, which makes them difficult to spot for people who use email clients in threaded mode, and also off-topic to those you're mistakenly replying to. Cheers, S.A.
Re: [Vo]:Thoughts on reading the Papp patent - #2.
I gather “chan.fusion” is accusing Mr. Rothwell of using the lenr-canr website specifically for the purposes of a tax dodge. Oh, give me a tax break! I think not. Regards Steven Vincent Johnson www.OrionWorks.com www.zazzle.com/orionworks
Re: [Vo]:Thoughts on reading the Papp patent - #2.
OrionWorks - Steven V Johnson svj.orionwo...@gmail.com wrote: I gather “chan.fusion” is accusing Mr. Rothwell of using the lenr-canr website specifically for the purposes of a tax dodge. I missed that. This would be the world's worst tax dodge, since it costs me a lot more than I can reduce in taxes in the best case. This would make about as much sense as the facetious two for one lottery, where every $2 ticket automatically wins $1. As it happens, the IRS audited me years ago. A nice woman there explained what records I need to keep, and so on. The IRS does not care about the nature of a business. I expect you could actually run a business evaluating massage parlors. As long as you record expenses correctly and people pay you for the information, it is a business. The only problem I face is when I make no income at all. The IRS says that is a hobby. I think that editing papers and maintaining a web site would be the world's most boring hobby. - Jed
Re: [Vo]:Thoughts on reading the Papp patent - #2.
One can read these optimistic noises with only a day to go as implying that they are delaying any public demonstration of their engine until January's CES show in Vegas. It all hinges on the meaning of the phrase the show as binding to the temporal context of the PowerGen show -- or binding to the prior paragraph's reference to January's CES show in Vegas. On Mon, Dec 10, 2012 at 12:10 PM, a.ashfield a.ashfi...@verizon.net wrote: Inteligentry is still making optimistic noises with only a day to go *Wow!! It looks like we'll be busy with News and Media for several months. We are getting invites to other shows as well.!!* We may take a *big booth* at the *CES* show here in Vegas in January. *ANY LICENSEE want to JOIN us?. WARNING, CES is a BIG show*!! This is one *of Many* such *requests* we are getting from all over the world. The funny thing is I only sent out *one* little *video* to a *friend of mine* in a *news* organization, on the promise he won't go public with it till the show. All of a sudden, we are getting *calls*, from producers, all over the world to *appear* on their programs or allow them to do a *video* story about us. *Funny thing* is they all *understand*why we want silence till the show and all are *voluntarily* adhering to our *request*. See http://www.inteligentry.com/
Re: [Vo]:Thoughts on reading the Papp patent - #2.
From James: One can read these optimistic noises with only a day to go as implying that they are delaying any public demonstration of their engine until January's CES show in Vegas. It all hinges on the meaning of the phrase the show as binding to the temporal context of the PowerGen show -- or binding to the prior paragraph's reference to January's CES show in Vegas. Boy! Do I have a bad feeling about this outfit. I sure hope I’m proven wrong, but at present I’m inclined not to trust them any farther than I could pee upwind. Regards Steven Vincent Johnson www.OrionWorks.com www.zazzle.com/orionworks
[Vo]:Re: PowerGen Plennary Session Is Being Broadcast Live
Erratum: That was the Opening Keynote Session. It is now over. The PGI Plenary Session will be Thursday at 9am. The exhibit floor just opened but there is no live stream from there AFAIK. On Tue, Dec 11, 2012 at 9:41 AM, James Bowery jabow...@gmail.com wrote: http://www.power-gen.com/index.html
Re: [Vo]:Thoughts on reading the Papp patent - #2.
Actually, if one reads the entire tome JR posted at http://inteligentry.com/report.html there are a couple of contingencies that must be met before demonstrations either live or via video: 1) There is the matter of pending patents which sets some sort of contingency that may block demonstration. It is unclear exactly what minimum condition must be met here but it could be (in JR's word) years. 2) There is the matter of manufacturers desiring no release of information until they have met some sort of contingency. It is unclear exactly what minimum condition must be met here, too. JR's concluding statement: *No real hurry really*. On Tue, Dec 11, 2012 at 10:10 AM, OrionWorks - Steven V Johnson svj.orionwo...@gmail.com wrote: From James: One can read these optimistic noises with only a day to go as implying that they are delaying any public demonstration of their engine until January's CES show in Vegas. It all hinges on the meaning of the phrase the show as binding to the temporal context of the PowerGen show -- or binding to the prior paragraph's reference to January's CES show in Vegas. Boy! Do I have a bad feeling about this outfit. I sure hope I’m proven wrong, but at present I’m inclined not to trust them any farther than I could pee upwind. Regards Steven Vincent Johnson www.OrionWorks.com www.zazzle.com/orionworks
Re: [Vo]:Thoughts on reading the Papp patent - #2.
At 09:44 AM 12/11/2012, OrionWorks - Steven V Johnson wrote: I gather âchan.fusionâ is accusing Mr. Rothwell of using the lenr-canr website specifically for the purposes of a tax dodge. Oh, give me a tax break! I think not. Yeah. I would assume that Jed is using another approach. That is a charitable activity. It is definitely *not* a profit-making business. (If it were, he would be much more exposed to liability if he errs and puts up a paper without explicity copyright owner permission, which can happen, given his methods. He depends on author assurances, and he's found that actually soliciting publisher permission is mostly a waste of time. There is no cheese in it for publishers, they ignore the requests, even if they don't really care. Mostly what Jed posts is preprints and most of the publishers allow those. They mostly don't allow an actual as-published PDF. Krivit takes a different approach, which is also sort-of legal: he publishes under a claim of fair use. Jed does not do this. Krivit, again, is operating as a noprofit. That he might be getting a salary from his organizatioh does not negate that. Both Krivit and Rothwell can deal with legal issues, rather easily, by following the DCMA takedown rules. Essentially, if the copyright owner objects, take the material down first and ask questions later. A for-profit publisher might have much more legal responsibility, given the profit motive. As to operating nonprofit, it's a bit more involved, but a nonprofit organization can pay expenses. This can also happen without actual incorporation, it's merely less solid and more likely to be challenged. Unincorporated association. There are rules about deducting donations to the nonprofit. Jed is asking for donations toward expenses. These don't just directly help. If there are significant donations not from him, he might be more able to deduct his own donations. It can get complicated. Lenr-canr.org itself is a legitimate nonprofit activity. It does not quality as a business, my guess. I have no idea of chan.fusion was talking about Jed. He certainly was not explicit.
Re: [Vo]:OT (Holiday Spirit): Christmas Flash Mob... or Group Mind occasionally waking up?
Vorts, Flocking seems to be a bottom up emergent property of lots of natural systems that can be modeled using complexity theory. It's been awhile since I read it but I belive it's covered in: At home in the Universe by Stuart Kauffman. A really interesting book by the way. A quick search turns up: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flocking_(behavior) It looks like Craig Reynolds is the originator of the modeling. Ron --On Monday, December 10, 2012 9:07 PM -0500 David Roberson dlrober...@aol.com wrote: Your post brings back a memory from a year or so ago. Someone made a model of bird flocks similar to what you are describing where they tried different behavior criteria. I think that they actually came up with a good match to what is observed. I wish I could remember where that article was located. Dave -Original Message- From: OrionWorks - Steven Vincent Johnson orionwo...@charter.net To: vortex-l vortex-l@eskimo.com Sent: Mon, Dec 10, 2012 8:12 pm Subject: RE: [Vo]:OT (Holiday Spirit): Christmas Flash Mob... or Group Mind occasionally waking up? From Harry: it would be interesting to track the position of one bird within the flock. Yes, it would! I suspect technology is advanced and miniaturized enough that we could easily fit locator chips on several starlings. Start collecting data. Regards, Steven Vincent Johnson www.OrionWorks.com www.zazzle.com/orionworks
Re: [Vo]:Thoughts on reading the Papp patent - #2.
Just to be clear on something I recently opined. It’s one thing to express a personal opinion of extreme doubt and suspicion, as I have recently done. It’s quite another thing to assume one’s personal opinion is the correct one that other’s should emulate. If there is the slightest chance that this outfit has something valid, I do not wish to in any impede them (financially or politically) in their efforts to bring such a new technology out into the open. OTOH, simply based on just the general appearance they exude… and all I know is that I want to run in the opposite direction as fast as I can. I’m left with a subjective impression that what this all seems to boil down to is: “We need more money to get our baby off the ground”. Maybe they do… maybe they truly do. But not with my money. It would be useful to locate a competent individual or organization that has performed due-diligence on this outfit. Does such an animal exist? Would they willing to go on the record and express what they have surmised? Regards Steven Vincent Johnson www.OrionWorks.com www.zazzle.com/orionworks
Re: [Vo]:Thoughts on reading the Papp patent - #2.
At 10:54 AM 12/11/2012, Jed Rothwell wrote: OrionWorks - Steven V Johnson mailto:svj.orionwo...@gmail.comsvj.orionwo...@gmail.com wrote: I gather chan.fusion is accusing Mr. Rothwell of using the lenr-canr website specifically for the purposes of a tax dodge. I missed that. This would be the world's worst tax dodge, since it costs me a lot more than I can reduce in taxes in the best case. This would make about as much sense as the facetious two for one lottery, where every $2 ticket automatically wins $1. As it happens, the IRS audited me years ago. A nice woman there explained what records I need to keep, and so on. The IRS does not care about the nature of a business. I expect you could actually run a business evaluating massage parlors. As long as you record expenses correctly and people pay you for the information, it is a business. The only problem I face is when I make no income at all. The IRS says that is a hobby. I think that editing papers and maintaining a web site would be the world's most boring hobby. Jed, it's nonprofit, that's rather obvious. You may be a *writer* for profit. And your web site might be considered part of that business, so it's not impossible. You can make no profit at all, for extended times. I posted a link to a page that examines the real rules in detail. Some businesses never make a profit, but if it can be shown that the goal is the *possibility* of profit, it can still be a business. That there is no profit in three years out of five, if that's the default standard, merely establishes a kind of presumption. It's not a fixed rule. Yes. There are businesses that evaluate other businesses, they send testers. People love these jobs! They go to restaurants and order meals and then report how they were treated. They stay in hotels, ditto. In theory, a massage parlor might hire them; or they could, also, do this completely independently and write reports, and, say, sell advertising on a web site with the reports. The key is conducting yourself as a business, as mentioned. Read the link I gave, it does explain more of how the IRS will judge a business that does not show a profit, because some don't. For example, Blacklight Power has probably never shown a profit, so far, but I'm quite sure it's considered a business. RD business is specifically considered in the standards for judging. Such business is highly speculative and might *usually* fail to find profit. And still be a great business idea. Start a hundred of these businesses and do it right, you might get very rich indeed. Better have deep pockets, though! The 3/5 rule is an easy default test that is easily judged from tax returns. It is by no means conclusive. Basically, if you *do* make a profit three out of five years, you *are* a business, unless it were shown that the books were being cooked in some way to artificially create this impression, and the IRS will rarely look that closely. Jed, I'd look at your activity as an editor. Are you paid? Even if you were paid something small, this could establish your writing as a business activity, and then you could deduct expenses, such as travelling to conferences. A writer in a field might engage in some otherwise nonprofit activity as a correlate with the business, or for publicity, for example. Because lenr-canr.org is clearly a nonprofit activity in itself -- it could be incorporated and operated as a 501(c)(3) nonprofit organization, qualified to receive tax-deductible donations -- that might be kept separate from your editing business. I don't know enough about your specifics to go beyond this.
[Vo]:New Energy Paradigm Shift 2012 Art Show
Enjoy the ten artists who responded to the call for new energy inspired work. Your feedback will help determine the show prizes given on Dec 22. http://coldfusionnow.org/gallery/shift-2012-gallery/ Enjoy! -- Ruby Carat r...@coldfusionnow.org mailto:r...@coldfusionnow.org United States 1-707-616-4894 Skype ruby-carat www.coldfusionnow.org http://www.coldfusionnow.org
Re: [Vo]:Thoughts on reading the Papp patent - #2.
Inteligentry announced this Popper kit, earlier this year, with a huge fanfare, to allow people to test the technology. Great idea, really. What happened? http://www.plasmerg.com/kits.html Currently, the page says that the original kit is not available. Not to worry, it is being replaced with a Better Kit. The Better Kit will be available, it's promised, at the CES show, January 8. Did anyone build and test the kit and show energy generation? Not reported. Instead, the plasmerg page cited, like many pages produced by this man, is full of attacks on others, and confident plans to Defeat Them! This is beyond Bad Feeling. There are a series of entrepreneurs in the alternative energy field who are, even their supporters sometimes freely acknowledge. Crazy as a Loon. The kit page has a huge amount of detail that is totally irrelevant to the Kit. He makes the point that the kit isn't an engine. That's right. So what is all that information doing there about his engine controller? This is the situation: if there is no energy produced in a single cycle in the popper, and that could rather easily be measured, there is nothing on which to base an engine. After all, an engine like this is merely a series of pops. If each one is not producing energy, the collection of them is not. That's why most of us involved with cold fusion aren't focusing on devices that produce massive energy. It's dangerous, for starters, until the reactions are well understood. A small device that produces a little power could generally be, in principle, scaled up. But first, *is there any effect to scale up?* The Popper Kit was a great idea, if the effect behind it were real, and the Popper, studied carefully, would show that. We must strongly suspect that it did *not* show that, and that is the default explanation for why the kit was cancelled. It makes no business sense. The kits were being sold at a price that should have more than covered expenses and a quite decent profit. I've proposed demonstration kit sales for many technologies. Some sort of need to improve technology to make it practical is often asserted. It's a total red herring. If one cannot make and sell a demonstration kit, one does not have a technology that is even close to ready for commercial application. Kits can be sold for investigational use. They can come with all kinds of warnings about risk. They don't even have to be particularly reliable, if this is disclosed -- and if a kit is cheap, basically, it might well be disclosed that one must run N of these to have M% chance of seeing results. Kits are a fast way to share developing technology. But I don't think Plasmerg/Inteligentry actually has a developing technology. If they did, their behavior would make no sense. No, there is a default hypothesis that can't just be set aside here: John Rohner is nuts. This is a basic question about the Popper. Was the Popper capable of demonstrating the effect? If so, it was useful and it makes no sense to stop selling it. If not, then *why was it sold in the first place? Did they ever test it? Do they sell stuff without having tested it? If so, can they be trusted *at all*? There is comment on Russ, who has lengthy videos where he talks and talks with little substance. Waste of time to watch them. He's offered his popper kit for sale. He never tested it. Maybe he realized how much work would be involved (the kit is not complete, and, good question: why not? Could that be to actually discourage testing? An incomplete kit may sit and gather dust for a long time, maybe forever.) (I write and write, and sometimes people think it's without substance! While I don't think so, I'd never do this with a video, because it takes a lot of time to view a video, and my target audience for what I write can scan a post of mine in minutes or less. Videos can be great, but chatty videos can be *awful* unless one is personally enamoured of a speaker.)
[Vo]:Blacklight...
Mills: We will announce some substantial developments at some point. Craig Original Message Subject:Re: [SocietyforClassicalPhysics] End of Year Date: Tue, 11 Dec 2012 09:07:46 -0500 From: Randell Mills rmi...@blacklightpower.com Reply-To: societyforclassicalphys...@yahoogroups.com To: societyforclassicalphys...@yahoogroups.com societyforclassicalphys...@yahoogroups.com We will announce some substantial developments at some point. On Dec 10, 2012, at 6:07 PM, Hum wrote: Hi Dr. Mills, Are you still anticipating a PR by the end of the year detailing results of 100W CIHT? I look forward to the update when you release it. Mark Yahoo! Groups Links __._,_.___ Reply via web post http://groups.yahoo.com/group/SocietyforClassicalPhysics/post;_ylc=X3oDMTJxa2c3bmUxBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzE2MDExODI1BGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNTA4MzQxMgRtc2dJZAMxMzA1BHNlYwNmdHIEc2xrA3JwbHkEc3RpbWUDMTM1NTI1MDc4OA--?act=replymessageNum=1305 Reply to sender mailto:rmi...@blacklightpower.com?subject=Re%3A%20%5BSocietyforClassicalPhysics%5D%20End%20of%20Year Reply to group mailto:societyforclassicalphys...@yahoogroups.com?subject=Re%3A%20%5BSocietyforClassicalPhysics%5D%20End%20of%20Year Start a New Topic http://groups.yahoo.com/group/SocietyforClassicalPhysics/post;_ylc=X3oDMTJmM21uYmZuBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzE2MDExODI1BGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNTA4MzQxMgRzZWMDZnRyBHNsawNudHBjBHN0aW1lAzEzNTUyNTA3ODg- Messages in this topic http://groups.yahoo.com/group/SocietyforClassicalPhysics/message/1304;_ylc=X3oDMTM1NTQ0Y3RoBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzE2MDExODI1BGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNTA4MzQxMgRtc2dJZAMxMzA1BHNlYwNmdHIEc2xrA3Z0cGMEc3RpbWUDMTM1NTI1MDc4OAR0cGNJZAMxMzA0 (2) Recent Activity: Visit Your Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/SocietyforClassicalPhysics;_ylc=X3oDMTJmZmMyc3I0BF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzE2MDExODI1BGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNTA4MzQxMgRzZWMDdnRsBHNsawN2Z2hwBHN0aW1lAzEzNTUyNTA3ODg- Yahoo! Groups http://groups.yahoo.com/;_ylc=X3oDMTJldDNhOHR0BF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzE2MDExODI1BGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNTA4MzQxMgRzZWMDZnRyBHNsawNnZnAEc3RpbWUDMTM1NTI1MDc4OA-- Switch to: Text-Only mailto:societyforclassicalphysics-traditio...@yahoogroups.com?subject=Change%20Delivery%20Format:%20Traditional, Daily Digest mailto:societyforclassicalphysics-dig...@yahoogroups.com?subject=Email%20Delivery:%20Digest . Unsubscribe mailto:societyforclassicalphysics-unsubscr...@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe . Terms of Use http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ . Send us Feedback mailto:ygroupsnotificati...@yahoogroups.com?subject=Feedback%20on%20the%20redesigned%20individual%20mail%20v1 . __,_._,___
Re: [Vo]:Blacklight...
Craig cchayniepub...@gmail.com wrote: Mills: We will announce some substantial developments at some point. How informative! Things would be so different, if they were not as they are. - Jed
RE: [Vo]:New Energy Paradigm Shift 2012 Art Show
Hi Ruby, Thank You for this. The range of contributions, depending on one's point of view, goes from the sublime to the almost ridiculous - but one work clearly stands out for me (but an art critic I am not). It stands out the sense of actively adding surprising insight through art. Vortices in Plasmonic Waves Owen Geiger Digital Animation Adding art to science as real insight, how so - you ask.? Geiger's animation helps to explain the Manelas device (which is a derivative of the Floyd Sweet device) in a way that is difficult to describe verbally. http://e-catsite.com/manelas-device/ If a picture is worth a thousand words, an animation could be worth 10,000. Unfortunately, Arthur has suffered a severe health problem, with the result that it is almost as if fate does not want this technology to appear yet. A similar health malady befell Floyd Sweet. Coincidence? Jones From: Ruby Enjoy the ten artists who responded to the call for new energy inspired work. Your feedback will help determine the show prizes given on Dec 22. http://coldfusionnow.org/gallery/shift-2012-gallery/ Enjoy!
Re: [Vo]:Blacklight...
Hi, I hijack a little that thread to ask you all, what are your various opinion on their claimed technology of LENR to electricity direct conversion (CIHT). I don't see any other paper or lab results that are similar. Anomalous heat, transmutation, and radiations are quite validated , but device producing electricity are not yet seen... The claim of validation are quite individual reports of quick testing... what are your opinions. tnaks in advance for your informations and opinions. 2012/12/11 Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.com Craig cchayniepub...@gmail.com wrote: Mills: We will announce some substantial developments at some point. How informative! Things would be so different, if they were not as they are. - Jed
Re: [Vo]:Blacklight...
In reply to Alain Sepeda's message of Tue, 11 Dec 2012 21:03:10 +0100: Hi, IMO, Mills is not LENR. It is what he says it is. Hydrinos. However I suspect that most of LENR is mediated by Hydrinos too ;) Hi, I hijack a little that thread to ask you all, what are your various opinion on their claimed technology of LENR to electricity direct conversion (CIHT). I don't see any other paper or lab results that are similar. Anomalous heat, transmutation, and radiations are quite validated , but device producing electricity are not yet seen... The claim of validation are quite individual reports of quick testing... what are your opinions. tnaks in advance for your informations and opinions. [snip] Regards, Robin van Spaandonk http://rvanspaa.freehostia.com/project.html
Re: [Vo]:Thoughts on reading the Papp patent - #2.
Abd ul-Rahman Lomax a...@lomaxdesign.com wrote: Yeah. I would assume that Jed is using another approach. That is a charitable activity. It is definitely *not* a profit-making business. Actually, LENR-CANR.org has no legal existence at all. It is informal. However, I get some money from the New Energy Foundation. About half my expenses, which are $6,000 to $10,000 per year. It is up the New Energy Foundation to keep things square with Uncle Sam. I doubt anyone would say my activities fall outside of what they are allowed to fund. I had to deal with the IRS years ago before the New Energy Foundation was founded, back when it was Gene and me. - Jed
Re: [Vo]:Thoughts on reading the Papp patent - #2.
Answer at bottom:James Bowery Wrote on Mon, 10 Dec 2012 10:07:00 -0800On Mon, Dec 10, 2012 at 11:25 AM, Cy Cle c...@inbox.lv wrote: No working Papp engine will be displayed or videos shown. It has not been replicated as yet. Rohner brothers do not understood the mechanisms of Papp's engine. Perhaps they should try to contact Chan. 1) How would Chan know? 2) Your statement, as fact, that no working Papp engine will be displayed or videos shown at the PowerGen conference contradicts very specific, explicit and statements to the contrary by the Intelligentry/PTP Licensing folks. This goes beyond "puffery" -- well beyond. It doesn't matter whether they have subsequently deleted such statements from electronic media (or not). Do you have specific information not available to the rest of us, other than your confidence in your physical theory?See Chan comments on Dec 10 at:http://open-source-energy.org/forum/showthread.php?tid=659page=56Take note of the references he cited listed below:http://papp.scienceontheweb.net/ http://papp.scienceontheweb.net/Forming.htmlhttp://file.seekpart.com/keywordpdf/2011/5/21/201152135132261.pdfAll is available but lazy windbreakers never check. If the shoe fits, wear it.Always on the Beat
Re: [Vo]:Thoughts on reading the Papp patent - #2.
This guy checked: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DHn5gTtLGkc the technology cited at: http://www.oocities.org/waterfuel111/water_explosion_menu.html which was cited by: http://papp.scienceontheweb.net/Forming.html item 12 He apparently didn't want to release his technology because it would harm the world economy. The legendary Chevrolet El Camino was not available to be shown because his wife made him encase it in concrete. Now, you might say that this is a case of simply going after a weak argument when there are many other strong arguments, so I'm being unfair. However, this is the first argument I investigated that Chan presented. Bad luck? On Tue, Dec 11, 2012 at 2:58 PM, Cy Cle c...@inbox.lv wrote: Answer at bottom: James Bowery Wrote on Mon, 10 Dec 2012 10:07:00 -0800 On Mon, Dec 10, 2012 at 11:25 AM, Cy Cle c...@inbox.lv wrote: No working Papp engine will be displayed or videos shown. It has not been replicated as yet. Rohner brothers do not understood the mechanisms of Papp's engine. Perhaps they should try to contact Chan. 1) How would Chan know? 2) Your statement, as fact, that no working Papp engine will be displayed or videos shown at the PowerGen conference contradicts very specific, explicit and statements to the contrary by the Intelligentry/PTP Licensing folks. This goes beyond puffery -- well beyond. It doesn't matter whether they have subsequently deleted such statements from electronic media (or not). Do you have specific information not available to the rest of us, other than your confidence in your physical theory? See Chan comments on Dec 10 at: http://open-source-energy.org/forum/showthread.php?tid=659page=56 Take note of the references he cited listed below: http://papp.scienceontheweb.net/ http://papp.scienceontheweb.net/Forming.html http://file.seekpart.com/keywordpdf/2011/5/21/201152135132261.pdf All is available but lazy windbreakers never check. If the shoe fits, wear it. Always on the Beat
Re: [Vo]:Thoughts on reading the Papp patent - #2.
At 12:42 PM 12/11/2012, OrionWorks - Steven V Johnson wrote: Just to be clear on something I recently opined. Itâs one thing to express a personal opinion of extreme doubt and suspicion, as I have recently done. Itâs quite another thing to assume oneâs personal opinion is the correct one that otherâs should emulate. Sure. However, I've just pointed to the obvious. If there is the slightest chance that this outfit has something valid, I do not wish to in any impede them (financially or politically) in their efforts to bring such a new technology out into the open. There is some chance that there is something valid about the Papp engine. It's a serious mystery. Papp was an enigma, clearly crazy as well. However, he did some demonstrations. It's always possible they were thoroughly rigged. It's simply never been demonstrated. Some knowledgeable and not-naive people have been impressed. Which doesn't prove anything, because a sophisticated con, in demonstrations that are not thoroughly open, can fool anyone. That's why we want independent demonstrations. Some want fully-independent ones, but demonstrations using a kit or the like, supplied by the inventor, can be possible, as long as those examining the thing can *fully* investigate the kit! OTOH, simply based on just the general appearance they exude and aall I know is that I want to run in the opposite direction as fast as I can. Iâm left with a subjective impression that what this all seems to boil down to is: âWe need more money to get our baby off the groundâ. Maybe they do maybe they truly do. They could say so. But what they actually do is to claim that they have something already. They actually did have Popper kits. The question is whether or not they worked, that is, sure, they might pop. the piston would move, perhaps. But how much energy went into compression and/or the spark activation, compared to how much work was done moving the piston? I've seen no analysis. But not with my money. It wouldd be useful to locate a competent individual or organization that has performed due-diligence on this outfit. Does such an animal exist? Would they willing to go on the record and express what they have surmised? What we have is Sterling Allen, who cut John Rohner a lot of slack. And who is now about as negative as I can imagine him getting. http://pesn.com/2012/12/10/9602241_Inteligentry_Egg-on-Face_PowerGen/
RE: [Vo]:Thoughts on reading the Papp patent - #2.
From Abd: ... What we have is Sterling Allen, who cut John Rohner a lot of slack. And who is now about as negative as I can imagine him getting. http://pesn.com/2012/12/10/9602241_Inteligentry_Egg-on-Face_PowerGen/ http://pesn.com/2012/12/10/9602241_Inteligentry_Egg-on-Face_PowerGen/ Yeah, I just read Sterling's report. IMO, Sterling is competent enough to make an assessment of Mr. Rohner's intentions. I think Mr. Rohner is sincere in what he believes. But sincerely deluded. I think Sterling hit it on the nail. What I see is an incredibly deluded individual. I think Mr. Rohner has managed to cocoon himself within a glittering fantasy world of his own making, a fantasy where he imagines he has truly developed a free energy device. It's an exciting fantasy, if only it were true. When I first looked at John Rohner's website, particularly the long rambling streams of text, the first thing that hit me was an overwhelming feeling that I was reading nothing more than pure and unadulterated bullshit. Much of what's portrayed is but a long conscious stream of Rohner's fantasies being playing out. For a while I, too, thought I had developed a free energy device. I gotta tell ya, it's one hell of a psychic aphrodisiac - to honestly believe that one has developed something as incredible as a free energy machine. Suddenly, I felt a huge responsibility to get my mission completed before I died. One certainly doesn't want to be accidentally run over by a truck, not before I had accomplished a major mission in life! Alas, when my bubble was finally popped (and fortunately for me I did the popping myself!), it was quite the slam dunk! It was an incredible learning experience. Painful, but in the end, worth it. There's are deep lessons in all of this. It's not just Rohner's lessons, which he is currently avoiding. It's the lessons of everyone else who have chosen to hitch a ride on Rohner's imaginary coattails. Some will graduate. Some won't. Regards, Steven Vincent Johnson www.OrionWorks.com www.zazzle.com/orionworks
Re: [Vo]:Thoughts on reading the Papp patent - #2.
On Tue, Dec 11, 2012 at 4:22 PM, Abd ul-Rahman Lomax a...@lomaxdesign.comwrote: They could say so. But what they actually do is to claim that they have something already. They actually did have Popper kits. The question is whether or not they worked, that is, sure, they might pop. the piston would move, perhaps. But how much energy went into compression and/or the spark activation, compared to how much work was done moving the piston? I've seen no analysis. I think it is Bob Rohner's company that has the kits, and he appears to be making them available, contrary to John Rohner's wishes, if I remember correctly. It also looks like Bob Rohner's kit is the one that Russ Gries is testing out in the youtube videos [1]. I also believe it was Bob Rohner that demonstrated a device to Michael McKubre. Eric [1] http://pesn.com/2012/10/02/9602199_Russ_Gries_runs_Bob_Rohners_Noble_Gas_Popper_replication_on_Hydrogen/
Re: [Vo]:Thoughts on reading the Papp patent - #2.
FYI: See: http://open-source-energy.org/forum/showthread.php?tid=659page=56 Copy below: Today, 12:26 AM Post: #1120 Chan Offline Junior Member ** Posts: 20 Joined: Sep 2012 Reputation: 0 Warning Level: 0% RE: Let's build A Popper Noble Gas Engine AKA Ppap Engine. Russ, Papp dissociates deoxygenated water to produce a corona containing atomic hydrogen and applies a burst of electrons via capacitors to create a plasma of H + - = H- which rapidly expands because of electrostatic repulsion. RWG dissociates H2 to produce a corona containing atomic hydrogen and applies a burst of electrons via capacitors to create a plasma of H + - = H- which rapidly expands because of electrostatic repulsion. Congratulations! That is a patentable discovery. It's all about explosive bursts into high energy plasma, shall we say clouds. You did this. Please do not neglect chamber shape (Toroids Referenced) electromagnet field influences and radio frequency injection. Electronics are important but of a secondary nature, mostly already studied and solved by yourself. May God continue to guide you and nurture your gifts to proceed to even more fundamental discoveries. Chan
