Re: [Vo]:Steorn: Orbo 28th October 2015 Transcript from Webinar

[Marcus Winckers]

I think frank ackland posted he received an invoice. I will mail Orbo
directly. Thanks.
Op 11 dec. 2015 11:29 schreef "Esa Ruoho" :

> I think I haven't seen a screenshot of someone receiving an email yet..
>
> Also, no info about shipping from ADGEX ELFE orders either.
>
> On 11 December 2015 at 11:26, Marcus Winckers  wrote:
>
>> Morning Esa,
>> Did you hear from others that they ordered or received an invoice?
>> I got my emails from them to wait for further instructions, but heard
>> nothing since Monday.
>> Marcus
>> Op 9 dec. 2015 07:06 schreef "Esa Ruoho" :
>>
>> Hi Marcus! Sure!
>>>
>>> I know at least two organizations who are going to purchase one. One is
>>> in Australia, and another is in Finland. The Finns have a crowdfund
>>> project.
>>> https://mesenaatti.me/en/steornin-ikiliikkujatekniikan-tutkimusprojekti/
>>> <-
>>> I'm trying to get in to record the electromagnetic fields + activities
>>> of both of the devices, the Ocube and the Ophone. I hope they'll sound
>>> juicy enough to be made electronic music out of.
>>>
>>>
>>> On 2 December 2015 at 16:14, Marcus Winckers 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 Hey Esa,

 I see  that you, like me, are interested in the Cube.  I  am planning
 on buying one  later in the day if possible. My christmass present for
 myself.  Shall we keep in touch and exchange thoughts and experiences?

 Marcus Winckers
 Utrecht
 Netherlands.
 Op 29 okt. 2015 07:38 schreef "Esa Ruoho" :

 If you guys like the internets more, the transcript is mirrored here:
> http://freeenergy.news/steorn/steorn-o-cube-webinar-full-transcript/
>
>
> On 29 October 2015 at 02:17, Esa Ruoho  wrote:
>
>> Hi, here's my transcript of the Orbo Steorn Webinar broadcast on the
>> 28th October 2015.
>>
>> If you use any of it, please credit accordingly.
>> the video is at http://orbo.com/
>> --
>>
>> Pat: Welcome to the Orbo Webinar. We're here today to introduce you
>> to the first Orbo product, the O-Cube. Orbo is a highly controversial
>> technology ... (Shaun places the O-Cube on the table) ..and we're going 
>> to
>> demonstrate the functionality of the O-Cube. Before we do that, however, 
>> we
>> want to just give you a brief flavour of who we are and the journey that
>> we've taken over the last fifteen years.
>> ---
>> Shaun: So, twelve and a half years ago, yeah? Tell me, how on earth,
>> you got into this crazy company.
>> Pat: The beginning's actually going back fourteen years ago, because,
>> what happened was, in 2001, I was looking to evaluate a particular piece 
>> of
>> technology, nothing to do with Steorn.. And, I didn't know how to 
>> evaluate
>> it, and I made a number of calls, and I was put in contact with 
>> yourselves.
>> So, I met Mike and yourself in 2001 and you looked at the proposition, 
>> the
>> technology we're looking at, and you evaluated it and you said look,
>> listen, this is not, you know, something to look at.. so, that was the 
>> way
>> it was left. And, I went to meet you then in April 2004 and the purpose 
>> of
>> that conversation was.. ahm..
>> Shaun: "Where's me fucking money" (laughs)
>> Pat: Well, it wasn't, it wasn't even at that, because I knew, like,
>> the proposition for what is.. But the point you were putting to me, was 
>> you
>> said, "Look, we're looking for a venture capital..".. you said to me, 
>> first
>> of all, you said to me, "I'm looking for a VC company", and what I did
>> was.. I.. The first thing I did probably before I even looked beyond them
>> was, I got a friend of mine who's a, you know, he's an engineer and I got
>> him to go in and spend some time with yourself and Mike and to evaluate
>> what it was. And.. I can remember walking out of Fumberly Court as it was
>> on a Friday afternoon and.. the two of yous were walking along side by
>> side.. I said "What you think?" and he just said "Can I invest?". And it
>> was, it was kind of like that, and I said "Are you serious?" and he said,
>> "Pat, If this is right" he said, "This is gonna to be very very serious."
>> 
>> Mike: So Shaun, looking a bit tired.. Understandable. Ten years
>> defending your claims and yourself. Ahm, give us a little bit of 
>> background
>> about Steorn, for a bit, new people tuning in today.
>> Shaun: Steorn was a company that you and me founded, Mike. Back in
>> 2000, and we started doing project management.. We were in the world of
>> fruit, a lot of bananas. And then we started developing technology for
>> others, as you know, that's when we developed forensic systems for
>> companies like Microsoft and credit card companies, and we did 

Re: [Vo]:Steorn: Orbo 28th October 2015 Transcript from Webinar

[Marcus Winckers]

Morning Esa,
Did you hear from others that they ordered or received an invoice?
I got my emails from them to wait for further instructions, but heard
nothing since Monday.
Marcus
Op 9 dec. 2015 07:06 schreef "Esa Ruoho" :

> Hi Marcus! Sure!
>
> I know at least two organizations who are going to purchase one. One is in
> Australia, and another is in Finland. The Finns have a crowdfund project.
> https://mesenaatti.me/en/steornin-ikiliikkujatekniikan-tutkimusprojekti/
> <-
> I'm trying to get in to record the electromagnetic fields + activities of
> both of the devices, the Ocube and the Ophone. I hope they'll sound juicy
> enough to be made electronic music out of.
>
>
> On 2 December 2015 at 16:14, Marcus Winckers  wrote:
>
>> Hey Esa,
>>
>> I see  that you, like me, are interested in the Cube.  I  am planning on
>> buying one  later in the day if possible. My christmass present for
>> myself.  Shall we keep in touch and exchange thoughts and experiences?
>>
>> Marcus Winckers
>> Utrecht
>> Netherlands.
>> Op 29 okt. 2015 07:38 schreef "Esa Ruoho" :
>>
>> If you guys like the internets more, the transcript is mirrored here:
>>> http://freeenergy.news/steorn/steorn-o-cube-webinar-full-transcript/
>>>
>>>
>>> On 29 October 2015 at 02:17, Esa Ruoho  wrote:
>>>
 Hi, here's my transcript of the Orbo Steorn Webinar broadcast on the
 28th October 2015.

 If you use any of it, please credit accordingly.
 the video is at http://orbo.com/
 --

 Pat: Welcome to the Orbo Webinar. We're here today to introduce you to
 the first Orbo product, the O-Cube. Orbo is a highly controversial
 technology ... (Shaun places the O-Cube on the table) ..and we're going to
 demonstrate the functionality of the O-Cube. Before we do that, however, we
 want to just give you a brief flavour of who we are and the journey that
 we've taken over the last fifteen years.
 ---
 Shaun: So, twelve and a half years ago, yeah? Tell me, how on earth,
 you got into this crazy company.
 Pat: The beginning's actually going back fourteen years ago, because,
 what happened was, in 2001, I was looking to evaluate a particular piece of
 technology, nothing to do with Steorn.. And, I didn't know how to evaluate
 it, and I made a number of calls, and I was put in contact with yourselves.
 So, I met Mike and yourself in 2001 and you looked at the proposition, the
 technology we're looking at, and you evaluated it and you said look,
 listen, this is not, you know, something to look at.. so, that was the way
 it was left. And, I went to meet you then in April 2004 and the purpose of
 that conversation was.. ahm..
 Shaun: "Where's me fucking money" (laughs)
 Pat: Well, it wasn't, it wasn't even at that, because I knew, like, the
 proposition for what is.. But the point you were putting to me, was you
 said, "Look, we're looking for a venture capital..".. you said to me, first
 of all, you said to me, "I'm looking for a VC company", and what I did
 was.. I.. The first thing I did probably before I even looked beyond them
 was, I got a friend of mine who's a, you know, he's an engineer and I got
 him to go in and spend some time with yourself and Mike and to evaluate
 what it was. And.. I can remember walking out of Fumberly Court as it was
 on a Friday afternoon and.. the two of yous were walking along side by
 side.. I said "What you think?" and he just said "Can I invest?". And it
 was, it was kind of like that, and I said "Are you serious?" and he said,
 "Pat, If this is right" he said, "This is gonna to be very very serious."
 
 Mike: So Shaun, looking a bit tired.. Understandable. Ten years
 defending your claims and yourself. Ahm, give us a little bit of background
 about Steorn, for a bit, new people tuning in today.
 Shaun: Steorn was a company that you and me founded, Mike. Back in
 2000, and we started doing project management.. We were in the world of
 fruit, a lot of bananas. And then we started developing technology for
 others, as you know, that's when we developed forensic systems for
 companies like Microsoft and credit card companies, and we did expert
 witnessing, in, fraud..
 Mike: (interrupts) So you get on..
 Shaun: And then one day..
 Mike: (interrupts) And then one day you're sitting there at your desk,
 magnets spinning around, and you decide: "I need an ad in the Economist".
 Shaun: One day we made a discovery, whatever you gonna call it, a
 mistake, depending on where you sit, where we went, yeah, look..
 We can get more energy out of these bizarre magnetic fields than we're
 putting in, isn't that really cool? And wouldn't it be great to build
 something that uses this, put it in the market, and hopefully make a lot of
 

Re: [Vo]:Steorn: Orbo 28th October 2015 Transcript from Webinar

[Marcus Winckers]

Well, they responded fast. They will send me an invoice later this day.
Lead time will be six weeks. I will wait for their email.
Op 11 dec. 2015 11:29 schreef "Esa Ruoho" :

> I think I haven't seen a screenshot of someone receiving an email yet..
>
> Also, no info about shipping from ADGEX ELFE orders either.
>
> On 11 December 2015 at 11:26, Marcus Winckers  wrote:
>
>> Morning Esa,
>> Did you hear from others that they ordered or received an invoice?
>> I got my emails from them to wait for further instructions, but heard
>> nothing since Monday.
>> Marcus
>> Op 9 dec. 2015 07:06 schreef "Esa Ruoho" :
>>
>> Hi Marcus! Sure!
>>>
>>> I know at least two organizations who are going to purchase one. One is
>>> in Australia, and another is in Finland. The Finns have a crowdfund
>>> project.
>>> https://mesenaatti.me/en/steornin-ikiliikkujatekniikan-tutkimusprojekti/
>>> <-
>>> I'm trying to get in to record the electromagnetic fields + activities
>>> of both of the devices, the Ocube and the Ophone. I hope they'll sound
>>> juicy enough to be made electronic music out of.
>>>
>>>
>>> On 2 December 2015 at 16:14, Marcus Winckers 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 Hey Esa,

 I see  that you, like me, are interested in the Cube.  I  am planning
 on buying one  later in the day if possible. My christmass present for
 myself.  Shall we keep in touch and exchange thoughts and experiences?

 Marcus Winckers
 Utrecht
 Netherlands.
 Op 29 okt. 2015 07:38 schreef "Esa Ruoho" :

 If you guys like the internets more, the transcript is mirrored here:
> http://freeenergy.news/steorn/steorn-o-cube-webinar-full-transcript/
>
>
> On 29 October 2015 at 02:17, Esa Ruoho  wrote:
>
>> Hi, here's my transcript of the Orbo Steorn Webinar broadcast on the
>> 28th October 2015.
>>
>> If you use any of it, please credit accordingly.
>> the video is at http://orbo.com/
>> --
>>
>> Pat: Welcome to the Orbo Webinar. We're here today to introduce you
>> to the first Orbo product, the O-Cube. Orbo is a highly controversial
>> technology ... (Shaun places the O-Cube on the table) ..and we're going 
>> to
>> demonstrate the functionality of the O-Cube. Before we do that, however, 
>> we
>> want to just give you a brief flavour of who we are and the journey that
>> we've taken over the last fifteen years.
>> ---
>> Shaun: So, twelve and a half years ago, yeah? Tell me, how on earth,
>> you got into this crazy company.
>> Pat: The beginning's actually going back fourteen years ago, because,
>> what happened was, in 2001, I was looking to evaluate a particular piece 
>> of
>> technology, nothing to do with Steorn.. And, I didn't know how to 
>> evaluate
>> it, and I made a number of calls, and I was put in contact with 
>> yourselves.
>> So, I met Mike and yourself in 2001 and you looked at the proposition, 
>> the
>> technology we're looking at, and you evaluated it and you said look,
>> listen, this is not, you know, something to look at.. so, that was the 
>> way
>> it was left. And, I went to meet you then in April 2004 and the purpose 
>> of
>> that conversation was.. ahm..
>> Shaun: "Where's me fucking money" (laughs)
>> Pat: Well, it wasn't, it wasn't even at that, because I knew, like,
>> the proposition for what is.. But the point you were putting to me, was 
>> you
>> said, "Look, we're looking for a venture capital..".. you said to me, 
>> first
>> of all, you said to me, "I'm looking for a VC company", and what I did
>> was.. I.. The first thing I did probably before I even looked beyond them
>> was, I got a friend of mine who's a, you know, he's an engineer and I got
>> him to go in and spend some time with yourself and Mike and to evaluate
>> what it was. And.. I can remember walking out of Fumberly Court as it was
>> on a Friday afternoon and.. the two of yous were walking along side by
>> side.. I said "What you think?" and he just said "Can I invest?". And it
>> was, it was kind of like that, and I said "Are you serious?" and he said,
>> "Pat, If this is right" he said, "This is gonna to be very very serious."
>> 
>> Mike: So Shaun, looking a bit tired.. Understandable. Ten years
>> defending your claims and yourself. Ahm, give us a little bit of 
>> background
>> about Steorn, for a bit, new people tuning in today.
>> Shaun: Steorn was a company that you and me founded, Mike. Back in
>> 2000, and we started doing project management.. We were in the world of
>> fruit, a lot of bananas. And then we started developing technology for
>> others, as you know, that's when we developed forensic systems for
>> companies like 

Re: [Vo]:Steorn: Orbo 28th October 2015 Transcript from Webinar

[Esa Ruoho]

I think I haven't seen a screenshot of someone receiving an email yet..

Also, no info about shipping from ADGEX ELFE orders either.

On 11 December 2015 at 11:26, Marcus Winckers  wrote:

> Morning Esa,
> Did you hear from others that they ordered or received an invoice?
> I got my emails from them to wait for further instructions, but heard
> nothing since Monday.
> Marcus
> Op 9 dec. 2015 07:06 schreef "Esa Ruoho" :
>
> Hi Marcus! Sure!
>>
>> I know at least two organizations who are going to purchase one. One is
>> in Australia, and another is in Finland. The Finns have a crowdfund
>> project.
>> https://mesenaatti.me/en/steornin-ikiliikkujatekniikan-tutkimusprojekti/
>> <-
>> I'm trying to get in to record the electromagnetic fields + activities of
>> both of the devices, the Ocube and the Ophone. I hope they'll sound juicy
>> enough to be made electronic music out of.
>>
>>
>> On 2 December 2015 at 16:14, Marcus Winckers  wrote:
>>
>>> Hey Esa,
>>>
>>> I see  that you, like me, are interested in the Cube.  I  am planning on
>>> buying one  later in the day if possible. My christmass present for
>>> myself.  Shall we keep in touch and exchange thoughts and experiences?
>>>
>>> Marcus Winckers
>>> Utrecht
>>> Netherlands.
>>> Op 29 okt. 2015 07:38 schreef "Esa Ruoho" :
>>>
>>> If you guys like the internets more, the transcript is mirrored here:
 http://freeenergy.news/steorn/steorn-o-cube-webinar-full-transcript/


 On 29 October 2015 at 02:17, Esa Ruoho  wrote:

> Hi, here's my transcript of the Orbo Steorn Webinar broadcast on the
> 28th October 2015.
>
> If you use any of it, please credit accordingly.
> the video is at http://orbo.com/
> --
>
> Pat: Welcome to the Orbo Webinar. We're here today to introduce you to
> the first Orbo product, the O-Cube. Orbo is a highly controversial
> technology ... (Shaun places the O-Cube on the table) ..and we're going to
> demonstrate the functionality of the O-Cube. Before we do that, however, 
> we
> want to just give you a brief flavour of who we are and the journey that
> we've taken over the last fifteen years.
> ---
> Shaun: So, twelve and a half years ago, yeah? Tell me, how on earth,
> you got into this crazy company.
> Pat: The beginning's actually going back fourteen years ago, because,
> what happened was, in 2001, I was looking to evaluate a particular piece 
> of
> technology, nothing to do with Steorn.. And, I didn't know how to evaluate
> it, and I made a number of calls, and I was put in contact with 
> yourselves.
> So, I met Mike and yourself in 2001 and you looked at the proposition, the
> technology we're looking at, and you evaluated it and you said look,
> listen, this is not, you know, something to look at.. so, that was the way
> it was left. And, I went to meet you then in April 2004 and the purpose of
> that conversation was.. ahm..
> Shaun: "Where's me fucking money" (laughs)
> Pat: Well, it wasn't, it wasn't even at that, because I knew, like,
> the proposition for what is.. But the point you were putting to me, was 
> you
> said, "Look, we're looking for a venture capital..".. you said to me, 
> first
> of all, you said to me, "I'm looking for a VC company", and what I did
> was.. I.. The first thing I did probably before I even looked beyond them
> was, I got a friend of mine who's a, you know, he's an engineer and I got
> him to go in and spend some time with yourself and Mike and to evaluate
> what it was. And.. I can remember walking out of Fumberly Court as it was
> on a Friday afternoon and.. the two of yous were walking along side by
> side.. I said "What you think?" and he just said "Can I invest?". And it
> was, it was kind of like that, and I said "Are you serious?" and he said,
> "Pat, If this is right" he said, "This is gonna to be very very serious."
> 
> Mike: So Shaun, looking a bit tired.. Understandable. Ten years
> defending your claims and yourself. Ahm, give us a little bit of 
> background
> about Steorn, for a bit, new people tuning in today.
> Shaun: Steorn was a company that you and me founded, Mike. Back in
> 2000, and we started doing project management.. We were in the world of
> fruit, a lot of bananas. And then we started developing technology for
> others, as you know, that's when we developed forensic systems for
> companies like Microsoft and credit card companies, and we did expert
> witnessing, in, fraud..
> Mike: (interrupts) So you get on..
> Shaun: And then one day..
> Mike: (interrupts) And then one day you're sitting there at your desk,
> magnets spinning around, and you decide: "I need an ad in the Economist".
> Shaun: One day we made a 

Re: [Vo]:Steorn: Orbo 28th October 2015 Transcript from Webinar

[Jed Rothwell]

Frank Acland  wrote:


> Yes, I got an invoice and placed an order. Had to do it via bank wire,
> since the Orbo webshop is not up and running yet.
>

Thank you for taking the trouble, and for running the risk that they will
not ship anything to you. Please let us know how it goes.

- Jed

Re: [Vo]:Steorn: Orbo 28th October 2015 Transcript from Webinar

[Frank Acland]

Yes, I got an invoice and placed an order. Had to do it via bank wire,
since the Orbo webshop is not up and running yet.

Frank

On Fri, Dec 11, 2015 at 4:33 AM, Marcus Winckers 
wrote:

> Well, they responded fast. They will send me an invoice later this day.
> Lead time will be six weeks. I will wait for their email.
> Op 11 dec. 2015 11:29 schreef "Esa Ruoho" :
>
>> I think I haven't seen a screenshot of someone receiving an email yet..
>>
>> Also, no info about shipping from ADGEX ELFE orders either.
>>
>> On 11 December 2015 at 11:26, Marcus Winckers 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Morning Esa,
>>> Did you hear from others that they ordered or received an invoice?
>>> I got my emails from them to wait for further instructions, but heard
>>> nothing since Monday.
>>> Marcus
>>> Op 9 dec. 2015 07:06 schreef "Esa Ruoho" :
>>>
>>> Hi Marcus! Sure!

 I know at least two organizations who are going to purchase one. One is
 in Australia, and another is in Finland. The Finns have a crowdfund
 project.
 https://mesenaatti.me/en/steornin-ikiliikkujatekniikan-tutkimusprojekti/
 <-
 I'm trying to get in to record the electromagnetic fields + activities
 of both of the devices, the Ocube and the Ophone. I hope they'll sound
 juicy enough to be made electronic music out of.


 On 2 December 2015 at 16:14, Marcus Winckers 
 wrote:

> Hey Esa,
>
> I see  that you, like me, are interested in the Cube.  I  am planning
> on buying one  later in the day if possible. My christmass present for
> myself.  Shall we keep in touch and exchange thoughts and experiences?
>
> Marcus Winckers
> Utrecht
> Netherlands.
> Op 29 okt. 2015 07:38 schreef "Esa Ruoho" :
>
> If you guys like the internets more, the transcript is mirrored here:
>> http://freeenergy.news/steorn/steorn-o-cube-webinar-full-transcript/
>>
>>
>> On 29 October 2015 at 02:17, Esa Ruoho  wrote:
>>
>>> Hi, here's my transcript of the Orbo Steorn Webinar broadcast on the
>>> 28th October 2015.
>>>
>>> If you use any of it, please credit accordingly.
>>> the video is at http://orbo.com/
>>> --
>>>
>>> Pat: Welcome to the Orbo Webinar. We're here today to introduce you
>>> to the first Orbo product, the O-Cube. Orbo is a highly controversial
>>> technology ... (Shaun places the O-Cube on the table) ..and we're going 
>>> to
>>> demonstrate the functionality of the O-Cube. Before we do that, 
>>> however, we
>>> want to just give you a brief flavour of who we are and the journey that
>>> we've taken over the last fifteen years.
>>> ---
>>> Shaun: So, twelve and a half years ago, yeah? Tell me, how on earth,
>>> you got into this crazy company.
>>> Pat: The beginning's actually going back fourteen years ago,
>>> because, what happened was, in 2001, I was looking to evaluate a 
>>> particular
>>> piece of technology, nothing to do with Steorn.. And, I didn't know how 
>>> to
>>> evaluate it, and I made a number of calls, and I was put in contact with
>>> yourselves. So, I met Mike and yourself in 2001 and you looked at the
>>> proposition, the technology we're looking at, and you evaluated it and 
>>> you
>>> said look, listen, this is not, you know, something to look at.. so, 
>>> that
>>> was the way it was left. And, I went to meet you then in April 2004 and 
>>> the
>>> purpose of that conversation was.. ahm..
>>> Shaun: "Where's me fucking money" (laughs)
>>> Pat: Well, it wasn't, it wasn't even at that, because I knew, like,
>>> the proposition for what is.. But the point you were putting to me, was 
>>> you
>>> said, "Look, we're looking for a venture capital..".. you said to me, 
>>> first
>>> of all, you said to me, "I'm looking for a VC company", and what I did
>>> was.. I.. The first thing I did probably before I even looked beyond 
>>> them
>>> was, I got a friend of mine who's a, you know, he's an engineer and I 
>>> got
>>> him to go in and spend some time with yourself and Mike and to evaluate
>>> what it was. And.. I can remember walking out of Fumberly Court as it 
>>> was
>>> on a Friday afternoon and.. the two of yous were walking along side by
>>> side.. I said "What you think?" and he just said "Can I invest?". And it
>>> was, it was kind of like that, and I said "Are you serious?" and he 
>>> said,
>>> "Pat, If this is right" he said, "This is gonna to be very very 
>>> serious."
>>> 
>>> Mike: So Shaun, looking a bit tired.. Understandable. Ten years
>>> defending your claims and yourself. Ahm, give us a little bit of 
>>> background
>>> about Steorn, for a bit, new people 

[Vo]:The test for monopoles

[Axil Axil]

Holmlid has seen mesons produced in his experiment. This is called
 magnetic monopoles catalyzed nucleon decay Seeing protons and neutrons
turn into mesons is a test for the existence of the monopole.

See

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proton_decay

"Some beyond-the-Standard Model grand unified theories (GUTs) explicitly
break the baryon number symmetry, allowing protons to decay via the Higgs
particle, magnetic monopoles or new X bosons. Proton decay is one of the
few unobserved effects of the various proposed GUTs. To date, all attempts
to observe these events have failed."



Holmlid has seen 12 billion mesons produce with each laser shot.

[Vo]:Tri Alpha Energy web site

[a.ashfield]

Tri Alpha Energy now has a web site.  http://www.trialphaenergy.com/

Re: [Vo]:Steorn: Orbo 28th October 2015 Transcript from Webinar

[Esa J. Ruoho]

My mate running the crowdfund project has also sent a bank transfer ( 
https://mesenaatti.me/en/steornin-ikiliikkujatekniikan-tutkimusprojekti/ )

Sent from some iDevice. Written by Esa.

> On 11 Dec 2015, at 16:42, Jed Rothwell  wrote:
> 
> Frank Acland  wrote:
>  
>> Yes, I got an invoice and placed an order. Had to do it via bank wire, since 
>> the Orbo webshop is not up and running yet.
> 
> Thank you for taking the trouble, and for running the risk that they will not 
> ship anything to you. Please let us know how it goes.
> 
> - Jed
> 

Re: [Vo]:Tri Alpha Energy web site

[Jed Rothwell]

Jones Beene  wrote:


> Lennart- simply because a large amount of energy ia applied to the fuel at
> the start to achieve “ignition.” Yes, it is true that some devices which
> are labeled as LENR also require plasmas which are relatively hot – at
> least they cannot really be called “cold” (as opposed to small scale).
> Mizuno’s glow discharge would be an example.
>

I agree.

Perhaps as we learn more, this will turn out to be a false distinction, or
an arbitrary dividing line. But based on current knowledge, I think there
are fundamental differences between something like the Tri Alpha Device and
LENR, and Beene has described the most important difference.

This is not LENR, although it may be valuable. Still . . . I would hate to
see any kind of plasma fusion succeed now if it meant the end of cold
fusion. No matter how safe or useful the plasma fusion reactor may be, I
expect it will still be expensive. I think cold fusion has many intrinsic
advantages, so it would be a shame to abandon it.

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -


To change the subject, here is something I have been thinking about for
some time.

"It would be a shame to abandon it." You can say the same about solar
energy. (Or wind, gas or coal I suppose.) If cold fusion starts to succeed,
people who have devoted years of effort to solar will surely feel regret.
They will say: "Let's hang on to this! There might still be a niche market
for solar!" No, sorry, probably not.

Those people will resemble sailing ship captains in the late 19th century,
who saw the end of their era approaching. They understood, of course, that
steamships were much better in many ways. But naturally they still had
regrets, and a feeling of nostalgia. Around 1935 when my father was in the
merchant marine on a freighter in the Atlantic out of New York, they came
upon a full rigged sailing ship, probably one of the last. The captain of
the steamship hailed the sailing ship, and then slowed down and down, and
steered a course slowly around it, twice. Then he finally pulled out and
headed to the destination. A romantic gesture. My father said the captain
seemed sad, and lost in memories of his youth. I suppose he was in his 50s
and remembered the late 19th century when the harbors at New York still had
many sailing ships. See:

http://www.shorpy.com/files/images/SHORPY_4a09256a.preview.jpg

(I expect these had steel hulls and auxiliary engines. They were still in
use because it was cheaper -- you did not need coal.)

People usually invest a measure of emotion and love in their jobs and in
the tools they use. You can't help it. I recall a bumper sticker on a big
truck on the highway, "A man and his truck -- it's a beautiful thing."

- Jed

Re: [Vo]:1200 MW compressed air storage

[Jed Rothwell]

 wrote:


> Just a thought:- I wonder if an arrangement could be made with some
> industries
> (e.g. Aluminium producers) where they took a lot of cheap power when it was
> available and less, expensive power, when it wasn't.


I expect some power companies have arrangements like that.

In Atlanta now that we have smart meters, Georgia Power offers a discount
"nights and weekends" rate. The catch is, they charge a lot more during
peak hours in the summer. The rate is 5 cents/kwh off-peak, and 20 cents at
peak.

http://www.georgiapower.com/residential/rate-plans/nights-weekends.cshtml

"Georgia Power's peak period is from 2-7 p.m. on summer weekdays for the
months June - September."

- Jed

Re: [Vo]: How many atoms to make condensed matter?

[Eric Walker]

On Fri, Dec 11, 2015 at 3:17 PM,  wrote:

The implication being that as particles go slower, their De Broglie
> wavelength increases, thus so does the distance at which the force reversal
> applies. This looks a lot like the increase in cross section for slower
> neutrons.


Indeed.  That is interesting.  The charge requirement seems like an
unnecessary addition, but I like the general direction.

The intuition for me is that the nuclear force might present a broadband
spectrum of sorts, and that this spectrum can have resonances at different
frequencies.  In high-energy particle physics, we see the resonances at
high frequencies.  Perhaps at much lower frequencies (analogous to but not
the same as radio waves), you'd also find resonances.

Eric

Re: [Vo]:1200 MW compressed air storage

[mixent]

In reply to  Jed Rothwell's message of Thu, 10 Dec 2015 15:52:49 -0500:
Hi,
[snip]
>This describes 1200 MW for 48 hours, in compressed air stored in salt
>caves. It resembles pumped hydroelectric storage.
>
>http://www.renewableenergyworld.com/articles/2015/12/1-200-mw-compressed-air-project-evaluated-for-utah-site.html

Just a thought:- I wonder if an arrangement could be made with some industries
(e.g. Aluminium producers) where they took a lot of cheap power when it was
available and less, expensive power, when it wasn't. IOW a form of demand side
management. It could be a way of mitigating the requirement for storage, making
renewables more useful. Perhaps they already do this?
Regards,

Robin van Spaandonk

http://rvanspaa.freehostia.com/project.html

Re: [Vo]: How many atoms to make condensed matter?

[mixent]

In reply to  Eric Walker's message of Wed, 9 Dec 2015 21:50:31 -0600:
Hi,
[snip]
>On Wed, Dec 9, 2015 at 9:00 PM,  wrote:
>
>The nuclear force is very short range.
>
>
>Here is where I'm inclined to part with conventional wisdom.  Consider that
>1 barn is the approximate area of a medium-sized nucleus presented to an
>oncoming neutron, that nuclei such as 135Xe have neutron-capture cross
>sections of 1e6 barns, and that with a neutron the Coulomb interaction is
>not involved.  It seems to me that the nuclear force must be working at
>longer distance than the usual 1 fm that is mentioned.  Perhaps a more
>nuanced analysis would show that it works on very fast nuclei at short
>distances and on slower-moving nuclei at longer distances.
>
>Eric

Interesting that you mention this. It brings to mind the theory of CC (kicked
off the list), where the force between like charged particles reverses when they
are separated by less than their De Broglie wavelength in the center of mass
frame. The implication being that as particles go slower, their De Broglie
wavelength increases, thus so does the distance at which the force reversal
applies. This looks a lot like the increase in cross section for slower
neutrons. (Assuming that neutrons comprise charged particles.)

Regards,

Robin van Spaandonk

http://rvanspaa.freehostia.com/project.html

RE: [Vo]:Tri Alpha Energy web site

[Jones Beene]

From: Lennart Thornros 

 

Jones,

Why is disqualified as LENR/CF?

 

 

 

Lennart- simply because a large amount of energy ia applied to the fuel at the 
start to achieve “ignition.” Yes, it is true that some devices which are 
labeled as LENR also require plasmas which are relatively hot – at least they 
cannot really be called “cold” (as opposed to small scale). Mizuno’s glow 
discharge would be an example. 

 

However, the scale and cost of LENR devices can invariably be reduced 
significantly. That seems to be the distinction. For LENR, we are usually 
talking about a reactor which can involve high temperature (as in a laser 
pulse) but small size and low cost.

 

In the case of Tri-Alpha, the large device you see in the video will need to be 
scaled up considerably for breakeven, and will likely cost hundreds of millions 
of dollars.

 

Re: [Vo]: How many atoms to make condensed matter?

[mixent]

In reply to  David Roberson's message of Wed, 9 Dec 2015 22:06:19 -0500:
Hi,
[snip]
>Guys, what would you expect to happen if the identity of individual nucleons 
>is lost once they enter the nucleus?  Since each is supposed to be constructed 
>from 3 quarks, it may be logical to assume that nearby nucleons behave as one 
>greater one composed of 6 or more quarks.  How would one prove that each 
>proton and neutron keeps its identity separate?
>
>Dave
As far as the arguments I presented regarding both Coulomb & nuclear force, it
wouldn't make any difference, even if it were "soup". The total number of
sub-particles (quarks if you prefer), would remain unchanged, as would their
charge, and I had already assumed a more or less random distribution.
Regards,

Robin van Spaandonk

http://rvanspaa.freehostia.com/project.html

Re: [Vo]:Tri Alpha Energy web site

[Lennart Thornros]

Thank You Jones and Ed.

On this other note; Sailboats beats stinkers any day:)


Best Regards ,
Lennart Thornros


lenn...@thornros.com
+1 916 436 1899

Whatever you vividly imagine, ardently desire, sincerely believe and
enthusiastically act upon, must inevitably come to pass. (PJM)


On Fri, Dec 11, 2015 at 2:23 PM, Jed Rothwell  wrote:

> Jones Beene  wrote:
>
>
>> Lennart- simply because a large amount of energy ia applied to the fuel
>> at the start to achieve “ignition.” Yes, it is true that some devices which
>> are labeled as LENR also require plasmas which are relatively hot – at
>> least they cannot really be called “cold” (as opposed to small scale).
>> Mizuno’s glow discharge would be an example.
>>
>
> I agree.
>
> Perhaps as we learn more, this will turn out to be a false distinction, or
> an arbitrary dividing line. But based on current knowledge, I think there
> are fundamental differences between something like the Tri Alpha Device and
> LENR, and Beene has described the most important difference.
>
> This is not LENR, although it may be valuable. Still . . . I would hate to
> see any kind of plasma fusion succeed now if it meant the end of cold
> fusion. No matter how safe or useful the plasma fusion reactor may be, I
> expect it will still be expensive. I think cold fusion has many intrinsic
> advantages, so it would be a shame to abandon it.
>
> - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
>
>
> To change the subject, here is something I have been thinking about for
> some time.
>
> "It would be a shame to abandon it." You can say the same about solar
> energy. (Or wind, gas or coal I suppose.) If cold fusion starts to succeed,
> people who have devoted years of effort to solar will surely feel regret.
> They will say: "Let's hang on to this! There might still be a niche market
> for solar!" No, sorry, probably not.
>
> Those people will resemble sailing ship captains in the late 19th century,
> who saw the end of their era approaching. They understood, of course, that
> steamships were much better in many ways. But naturally they still had
> regrets, and a feeling of nostalgia. Around 1935 when my father was in the
> merchant marine on a freighter in the Atlantic out of New York, they came
> upon a full rigged sailing ship, probably one of the last. The captain of
> the steamship hailed the sailing ship, and then slowed down and down, and
> steered a course slowly around it, twice. Then he finally pulled out and
> headed to the destination. A romantic gesture. My father said the captain
> seemed sad, and lost in memories of his youth. I suppose he was in his 50s
> and remembered the late 19th century when the harbors at New York still had
> many sailing ships. See:
>
> http://www.shorpy.com/files/images/SHORPY_4a09256a.preview.jpg
>
> (I expect these had steel hulls and auxiliary engines. They were still in
> use because it was cheaper -- you did not need coal.)
>
> People usually invest a measure of emotion and love in their jobs and in
> the tools they use. You can't help it. I recall a bumper sticker on a big
> truck on the highway, "A man and his truck -- it's a beautiful thing."
>
> - Jed
>
>

Re: [Vo]:Tri Alpha Energy web site

[Terry Blanton]

At $2,000 per liter, He3 is presently in high demand.  Maybe this is
why Russia is looking at a permanent base on the moon?

[Vo]:Electric Rocket-like Propulsion Patent Application by Banduric

[Ron Kita]

Greetings Vortex-L,

No results are given:
http://pdfaiw.uspto.gov/.aiw?PageNum=0=20140009098=2E022445F1EE=http%3A%2F%2Fappft.uspto.gov%2Fnetacgi%2Fnph-Parser%3FSect1%3DPTO2%2526Sect2%3DHITOFF%2526p%3D1%2526u%3D%25252Fnetahtml%25252FPTO%25252Fsearch-bool.html%2526r%3D1%2526f%3DG%2526l%3D50%2526co1%3DAND%2526d%3DPG01%2526s1%3D%252522banduric%252Brichard%252522%2526OS%3D%252522banduric%252Brichard%252522%2526RS%3D%252522banduric%252Brichard%252522

Ad astra,
Ron Kita,Chiralex
Doylestown, PA

[Vo]:LENR INFO AND DEFENDING MY MEMES

[Peter Gluck]

http://egooutpeters.blogspot.ro/2015/12/dec-11-2015-lenr-info-defending-my-own.html

easy to understand my comments; unfortunately aso easy to misunderstand
them- blogging is risky a bit...

Peter

-- 
Dr. Peter Gluck
Cluj, Romania
http://egooutpeters.blogspot.com

[Vo]:Re: CMNS: LENR INFO AND DEFENDING MY MEMES

[Ludwik Kowalski]

1) Yes indeed. 

2) See Comment #1, at 

http://scienceblogs.com/startswithabang/2015/12/10/why-trust-a-theory-physicists-and-philosophers-debate-synopsis/?utm_source=feedburner_medium=email_campaign=Feed%3A+ScienceblogsPhysicalScience+%28ScienceBlogs+Channel+%3A+Physical+Science%29

from Peter's blog.

Ludwik
=

On Dec 11, 2015, at 12:44 PM, Edmund Storms wrote:

> Peter, let me ask some common sense questions, which seem to be lacking in 
> LENR these days. First, why are the isotope shifts of nickel reported by 
> Rossi 's collaborators being discussed as if they are real? We have no reason 
> to believe this claimed behavior.  This is not scientific information 
> subjected to replication and careful analysis? Why not discussion information 
> that has good support and use this to propose an explanation.  
> 
> Why does Axil claim Holmlid sees mesons when in fact he only interprets a 
> stage behavior by using the meson idea? Good science results when people 
> correctly report what is observed and the conclusions.  Sloppy reading of 
> what is reported keeps distracting the discussion from what is real. Can we 
> please discuss what has been observed rather than what is imagined?
> 
> Ed Storms 
> 
> 
> On Dec 11, 2015, at 10:20 AM, Peter Gluck wrote:
> 
>> 
>> http://egooutpeters.blogspot.ro/2015/12/dec-11-2015-lenr-info-defending-my-own.html
>> 
>> easy to understand my comments; unfortunately aso easy to misunderstand 
>> them- blogging is risky a bit...
>> 
>> Peter
>> 
>> -- 
>> Dr. Peter Gluck
>> Cluj, Romania
>> http://egooutpeters.blogspot.com
>> 
>> -- 
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
>> "CMNS" group.
>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
>> email to cmns+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
>> To post to this group, send email to c...@googlegroups.com.
>> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/cmns.
>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
> 
> 
> -- 
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
> "CMNS" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
> email to cmns+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
> To post to this group, send email to c...@googlegroups.com.
> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/cmns.
> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

Re: [Vo]:Re: CMNS: LENR INFO AND DEFENDING MY MEMES

[Axil Axil]

http://scitation.aip.org/content/aip/journal/rsi/86/8/10.1063/1.4928109

Holmlid's paper discribing how he detected pions which focuses on the
equipment used. The paper was peer reviewed by the *Review of Scientific
Instruments.*

*If the findings do not fit into theory, just ignore it.*

On Fri, Dec 11, 2015 at 1:08 PM, Ludwik Kowalski <
kowals...@mail.montclair.edu> wrote:

> 1) Yes indeed.
>
> 2) See Comment #1, at
>
>
> http://scienceblogs.com/startswithabang/2015/12/10/why-trust-a-theory-physicists-and-philosophers-debate-synopsis/?utm_source=feedburner_medium=email_campaign=Feed%3A+ScienceblogsPhysicalScience+%28ScienceBlogs+Channel+%3A+Physical+Science%29
>
> from Peter's blog.
>
> Ludwik
> =
>
> On Dec 11, 2015, at 12:44 PM, Edmund Storms wrote:
>
> Peter, let me ask some common sense questions, which seem to be lacking in
> LENR these days. First, why are the isotope shifts of nickel reported by
> Rossi 's collaborators being discussed as if they are real? We have no
> reason to believe this claimed behavior.  This is not scientific
> information subjected to replication and careful analysis? Why not
> discussion information that has good support and use this to propose an
> explanation.
>
> Why does Axil claim Holmlid sees mesons when in fact he only interprets a
> stage behavior by using the meson idea? Good science results when people
> correctly report what is observed and the conclusions.  Sloppy reading of
> what is reported keeps distracting the discussion from what is real. Can we
> please discuss what has been observed rather than what is imagined?
>
> Ed Storms
>
>
> On Dec 11, 2015, at 10:20 AM, Peter Gluck wrote:
>
>
>
> http://egooutpeters.blogspot.ro/2015/12/dec-11-2015-lenr-info-defending-my-own.html
>
> easy to understand my comments; unfortunately aso easy to misunderstand
> them- blogging is risky a bit...
>
> Peter
>
> --
> Dr. Peter Gluck
> Cluj, Romania
> http://egooutpeters.blogspot.com
>
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> "CMNS" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
> email to cmns+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
> To post to this group, send email to c...@googlegroups.com.
> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/cmns.
> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
>
>
>
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> "CMNS" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
> email to cmns+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
> To post to this group, send email to c...@googlegroups.com.
> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/cmns.
> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
>
>
>

Re: [Vo]:Tri Alpha Energy web site

[Lennart Thornros]

Jones,
Why is disqualified as LENR/CF?


Best Regards ,
Lennart Thornros


lenn...@thornros.com
+1 916 436 1899

Whatever you vividly imagine, ardently desire, sincerely believe and
enthusiastically act upon, must inevitably come to pass. (PJM)


On Fri, Dec 11, 2015 at 10:35 AM, Jones Beene  wrote:

> -Original Message-
> From: a.ashfield
>
> Tri Alpha Energy now has a web site.
>
> http://www.trialphaenergy.com/
>
>
> Slick. No, beyond slick. But this is not LENR, and only differs from hot
> magnetic containment fusion in the simplicity of the system, and of course
> the aneutronic fuel.
>
> The promo video looks almost "too perfect" to be real ... as if it was it
> produced by Hollywood for an upcoming film using actors instead of
> scientists. This is suspicious but if it has not been staged (such as: for
> use as a prelude to an IPO) then it could be a game changer. Certainly a
> ton of money has been poured into the hardware.
>
> As for the science- the claim is to fuse boron with protons in plasma
> phase. Usually this requires lasers, but this is different. If true, it
> would be an ideal solution, since boron-11 is the most promising form of
> aneutronic fusion... if indeed they can completely avoid neutrons. The
> video shows techies working inside the reactor, so (assuming this has not
> been staged by Hollywood) there is indeed no neutron activation.
>
> Yet - how far are they from breakeven? That detail seems to have been
> carefully avoided.
>
>
>
>

Re: [Vo]:Steorn: Orbo 28th October 2015 Transcript from Webinar

[Frank Acland]

Will do, Jed.

On Fri, Dec 11, 2015 at 8:42 AM, Jed Rothwell  wrote:

> Frank Acland  wrote:
>
>
>> Yes, I got an invoice and placed an order. Had to do it via bank wire,
>> since the Orbo webshop is not up and running yet.
>>
>
> Thank you for taking the trouble, and for running the risk that they will
> not ship anything to you. Please let us know how it goes.
>
> - Jed
>
>


-- 
Frank Acland
Publisher, E-Cat World 

RE: [Vo]:Tri Alpha Energy web site

[Jones Beene]

-Original Message-
From: a.ashfield 

Tri Alpha Energy now has a web site.  

http://www.trialphaenergy.com/


Slick. No, beyond slick. But this is not LENR, and only differs from hot 
magnetic containment fusion in the simplicity of the system, and of course the 
aneutronic fuel. 

The promo video looks almost "too perfect" to be real ... as if it was it 
produced by Hollywood for an upcoming film using actors instead of scientists. 
This is suspicious but if it has not been staged (such as: for use as a prelude 
to an IPO) then it could be a game changer. Certainly a ton of money has been 
poured into the hardware.

As for the science- the claim is to fuse boron with protons in plasma phase. 
Usually this requires lasers, but this is different. If true, it would be an 
ideal solution, since boron-11 is the most promising form of aneutronic 
fusion... if indeed they can completely avoid neutrons. The video shows techies 
working inside the reactor, so (assuming this has not been staged by Hollywood) 
there is indeed no neutron activation. 

Yet - how far are they from breakeven? That detail seems to have been carefully 
avoided.

Re: [Vo]:Steorn: Orbo 28th October 2015 Transcript from Webinar

[Terry Blanton]

I finally received my closed-loop SMOT!  Thanks, Greg!

(not)