Re: [Vo]:e-cat replication by Celani
Couple of clarifications from an Italian speaker over on Talk Polywell: - Regarding the Gammas Celani stated that they are the final product of the reaction that can be removed (note: this was really not clear.) - Regarding the Catalyst, Celani thinks that it must be a metal like Platinum or Palladium. On 17 December 2011 12:45, Robert Lynn robert.gulliver.l...@gmail.com wrote: I've been informed of another typo/mistranslation. Celani has been working with (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Giuliano_Preparata) friend of Eugene Mallove http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qq6YY8eFeYIfeature=related one of the first mainstream science's physicist that believed in cold fusion and worked with Martin Fleischmann in Milan in the late 90's: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=35T-gAvaKn4: According to Celani the reaction between Ni and H would be catalyzed by PHONONS . The phonons are not particles but the points where it contacts the thermal-electromagnetic waves in phase, produced by thermal agitation in the lattice of nickel. Are points of summation of multiple heat waves produced by a variety of nickel atoms that vibrate at the same frequency ... these frequencies would provide hydrogen (as HYDRIDES?) the ability to overcome the Coulomb barrier and make the merger of its proton to the core of nickel (as I understand it). [Editor's note. I'm asking Celani verification of this and other points of his speech] The power density is very high, and some of his reactions Celani has exceeded 1400 watts per gram of nickel, which is higher than that of uranium fission in the cladding Zirconium.Although Celani you hear talk about technological reality, as it has exceeded 200% yield (ie COP=2) for two weeks. Celani has worked very hard with the great Japanese scientist Arata. The Japanese government has funded plenty of not only the research but also those of three foreign groups who have had full access to the laboratory by Arata. Celani was able to perform various types of experiment and measurement, even the craziest. Among these groups was that of MIT and INFN (Italian national institute of Nuclear Physics; Celani et al). Worked with the Arata DEUTERIUM ... but as the import and production of Deuterium prohibited by the peace agreements had to self-refine it with the sulfur-iodine cycle . Arata was also excess power of 60 watts, which is easily measurable. The improvement over Fleishman and Pons was when he abandoned the traditional Arata electrode foil. Not only that, the best layers were not perfectly flat, shiny but rather rough, porous, etc.. In short, had to increase the surface area of contact between palladium and deuterium. When he returned to Italy, Celani modified experiments (*along with Professor Giuliano Preparata*) and began to use wires of nickel and hydrogen at high pressure (eliminating water, oxygen and ' Oxonian ) He realized that the power increased by using highly porous nickel. He returned to Japan. There Arata began to experiment with nickel of every size possible. He found that the nickel nanopowder in aggregates of less than 20 Ångström you had the best reactions. Indeed, the reaction took place (although not as powerful) even at room temperature. As for gammas they are an end product of the reaction, not desired by Celani, that you can do without. By applying radio frequency (microwave) to dust (I did not know whether that of Rossi or his), he had a massive production of gamma rays, which Celani does not want and does not consider useful. As the catalyst for him are metals such as platinum or palladium (must resist the micro-points where the heat reaches thousands of degrees, ionizing hydrogen) Celani comes to scientific reality PROCESS. Celani says that the Greeks of today have passed Defaklion Rossi, from the technological point of view. [Editor's note. others believe that Defkalion has put together a nice frame and a beautiful body ... but do not have the engine]. He says that this attitude of secrecy is stupid [ed. Celani is understandably affected by a) not being invited to the demonstration of 28 October and 2) the negative response to the proposal of Rossi independent testing under the aegis of INFN], and in the end, continue along this road will not have the triumph of science and industrial deserves it. According to Celani, Rossi arrives to yield around 600%.
Re: [Vo]:e-cat replication by Celani
*- Regarding the Catalyst, Celani thinks that it must be a metal like Platinum or Palladium.* From this stantment, It can be clearly deduced that Celani does not trust Rossi. Rossi has stated that there is no precious metal in his reactor that is no Platinum or Palladium are used in the Rossi reactor. The special surface preparation of the nickel catalyst eliminates the need for Platinum or Palladium as a spill over catalyst in both the Rossi and Piantelli reactors. I take from this lack of understanding that Celani has no clue as to the general working principles of the Ni-H reactor type. On Mon, Dec 19, 2011 at 4:57 AM, Robert Lynn robert.gulliver.l...@gmail.com wrote: Couple of clarifications from an Italian speaker over on Talk Polywell: - Regarding the Gammas Celani stated that they are the final product of the reaction that can be removed (note: this was really not clear.) - Regarding the Catalyst, Celani thinks that it must be a metal like Platinum or Palladium. On 17 December 2011 12:45, Robert Lynn robert.gulliver.l...@gmail.com wrote: I've been informed of another typo/mistranslation. Celani has been working with (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Giuliano_Preparata) friend of Eugene Mallove http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qq6YY8eFeYIfeature=related one of the first mainstream science's physicist that believed in cold fusion and worked with Martin Fleischmann in Milan in the late 90's: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=35T-gAvaKn4: According to Celani the reaction between Ni and H would be catalyzed by PHONONS . The phonons are not particles but the points where it contacts the thermal-electromagnetic waves in phase, produced by thermal agitation in the lattice of nickel. Are points of summation of multiple heat waves produced by a variety of nickel atoms that vibrate at the same frequency ... these frequencies would provide hydrogen (as HYDRIDES?) the ability to overcome the Coulomb barrier and make the merger of its proton to the core of nickel (as I understand it). [Editor's note. I'm asking Celani verification of this and other points of his speech] The power density is very high, and some of his reactions Celani has exceeded 1400 watts per gram of nickel, which is higher than that of uranium fission in the cladding Zirconium.Although Celani you hear talk about technological reality, as it has exceeded 200% yield (ie COP=2) for two weeks. Celani has worked very hard with the great Japanese scientist Arata. The Japanese government has funded plenty of not only the research but also those of three foreign groups who have had full access to the laboratory by Arata. Celani was able to perform various types of experiment and measurement, even the craziest. Among these groups was that of MIT and INFN (Italian national institute of Nuclear Physics; Celani et al). Worked with the Arata DEUTERIUM ... but as the import and production of Deuterium prohibited by the peace agreements had to self-refine it with the sulfur-iodine cycle . Arata was also excess power of 60 watts, which is easily measurable. The improvement over Fleishman and Pons was when he abandoned the traditional Arata electrode foil. Not only that, the best layers were not perfectly flat, shiny but rather rough, porous, etc.. In short, had to increase the surface area of contact between palladium and deuterium. When he returned to Italy, Celani modified experiments (*along with Professor Giuliano Preparata*) and began to use wires of nickel and hydrogen at high pressure (eliminating water, oxygen and ' Oxonian ) He realized that the power increased by using highly porous nickel. He returned to Japan. There Arata began to experiment with nickel of every size possible. He found that the nickel nanopowder in aggregates of less than 20 Ångström you had the best reactions. Indeed, the reaction took place (although not as powerful) even at room temperature. As for gammas they are an end product of the reaction, not desired by Celani, that you can do without. By applying radio frequency (microwave) to dust (I did not know whether that of Rossi or his), he had a massive production of gamma rays, which Celani does not want and does not consider useful. As the catalyst for him are metals such as platinum or palladium (must resist the micro-points where the heat reaches thousands of degrees, ionizing hydrogen) Celani comes to scientific reality PROCESS. Celani says that the Greeks of today have passed Defaklion Rossi, from the technological point of view. [Editor's note. others believe that Defkalion has put together a nice frame and a beautiful body ... but do not have the engine]. He says that this attitude of secrecy is stupid [ed. Celani is understandably affected by a) not being invited to the demonstration of 28 October and 2) the negative response to
Re: [Vo]:e-cat replication by Celani
Celani knew enough to try to covertly obtain a radiation spectrum during the test run where Rossi left 2 holes through the lead shielding. When Rossi caught him, Celani said something like That is what Professors do, like that excused his conduct. I suggest it is Rossi that does not trust Celani. AG On 12/20/2011 7:15 AM, Axil Axil wrote: */- Regarding the Catalyst, Celani thinks that it must be a metal like Platinum or Palladium./* From this stantment, It can be clearly deduced that Celani does not trust Rossi. Rossi has stated that there is no precious metal in his reactor that is no Platinum or Palladium are used in the Rossi reactor. The special surface preparation of the nickel catalyst eliminates the need for Platinum or Palladium as a spill over catalyst in both the Rossi and Piantelli reactors. I take from this lack of understanding that Celani has no clue as to the general working principles of the Ni-H reactor type. On Mon, Dec 19, 2011 at 4:57 AM, Robert Lynn robert.gulliver.l...@gmail.com mailto:robert.gulliver.l...@gmail.com wrote: Couple of clarifications from an Italian speaker over on Talk Polywell: - Regarding the Gammas Celani stated that they are the final product of the reaction that can be removed (note: this was really not clear.) - Regarding the Catalyst, Celani thinks that it must be a metal like Platinum or Palladium. On 17 December 2011 12:45, Robert Lynn robert.gulliver.l...@gmail.com mailto:robert.gulliver.l...@gmail.com wrote: I've been informed of another typo/mistranslation. Celani has been working with (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Giuliano_Preparata) friend of Eugene Mallove http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qq6YY8eFeYIfeature=related http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qq6YY8eFeYIfeature=related one of the first mainstream science's physicist that believed in cold fusion and worked with Martin Fleischmann in Milan in the late 90's: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=35T-gAvaKn4: According to Celani the reaction between Ni and H would be catalyzed by PHONONS . The phonons are not particles but the points where it contacts the thermal-electromagnetic waves in phase, produced by thermal agitation in the lattice of nickel. Are points of summation of multiple heat waves produced by a variety of nickel atoms that vibrate at the same frequency ... these frequencies would provide hydrogen (as HYDRIDES?) the ability to overcome the Coulomb barrier and make the merger of its proton to the core of nickel (as I understand it). [Editor's note. I'm asking Celani verification of this and other points of his speech] The power density is very high, and some of his reactions Celani has exceeded 1400 watts per gram of nickel, which is higher than that of uranium fission in the cladding Zirconium.Although Celani you hear talk about technological reality, as it has exceeded 200% yield (ie COP=2) for two weeks. Celani has worked very hard with the great Japanese scientist Arata. The Japanese government has funded plenty of not only the research but also those of three foreign groups who have had full access to the laboratory by Arata. Celani was able to perform various types of experiment and measurement, even the craziest. Among these groups was that of MIT and INFN (Italian national institute of Nuclear Physics; Celani et al). Worked with the Arata DEUTERIUM ... but as the import and production of Deuterium prohibited by the peace agreements had to self-refine it with the sulfur-iodine cycle . Arata was also excess power of 60 watts, which is easily measurable. The improvement over Fleishman and Pons was when he abandoned the traditional Arata electrode foil. Not only that, the best layers were not perfectly flat, shiny but rather rough, porous, etc.. In short, had to increase the surface area of contact between palladium and deuterium. When he returned to Italy, Celani modified experiments (*along with Professor Giuliano Preparata*) and began to use wires of nickel and hydrogen at high pressure (eliminating water, oxygen and ' Oxonian ) He realized that the power increased by using highly porous nickel. He returned to Japan. There Arata began to experiment with nickel of every size possible. He found that the nickel nanopowder in aggregates of less than 20 Ångström you had the best reactions. Indeed, the reaction took place (although not as powerful) even at room temperature. As for gammas they are an end product of the reaction, not desired by Celani, that you can do without. By
Re: [Vo]:e-cat replication by Celani
Aussie Guy E-Cat aussieguy.e...@gmail.com wrote: Celani knew enough to try to covertly obtain a radiation spectrum during the test run where Rossi left 2 holes through the lead shielding. He told me he was sitting in the next room when the instruments registered a burst. He did not know about any holes. Shortly after the burst, someone came in and said: We finally got the machine to turn on, so come in and have a look. (Something like that, in Italian.) When Celani went in, Rossi was upset to see he was carrying two meters, and asked him to put them away. He did. I described this event here, and posted comments from Celani. I do not think it was covert. - Jed
Re: [Vo]:e-cat replication by Celani
Thanks for the clarification. Appreciated. I expect to be seeing these guys 1st Qtr 2012, so good to know more about what went on and who did what. AG On 12/20/2011 7:53 AM, Jed Rothwell wrote: Aussie Guy E-Cat aussieguy.e...@gmail.com mailto:aussieguy.e...@gmail.com wrote: Celani knew enough to try to covertly obtain a radiation spectrum during the test run where Rossi left 2 holes through the lead shielding. He told me he was sitting in the next room when the instruments registered a burst. He did not know about any holes. Shortly after the burst, someone came in and said: We finally got the machine to turn on, so come in and have a look. (Something like that, in Italian.) When Celani went in, Rossi was upset to see he was carrying two meters, and asked him to put them away. He did. I described this event here, and posted comments from Celani. I do not think it was covert. - Jed
Re: [Vo]:e-cat replication by Celani
I've been informed of another typo/mistranslation. Celani has been working with (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Giuliano_Preparata) friend of Eugene Mallove http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qq6YY8eFeYIfeature=related one of the first mainstream science's physicist that believed in cold fusion and worked with Martin Fleischmann in Milan in the late 90's: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=35T-gAvaKn4: According to Celani the reaction between Ni and H would be catalyzed by PHONONS http://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fonone . The phonons are not particles but the points where it contacts the thermal-electromagnetic waves in phase, produced by thermal agitation in the lattice of nickel. Are points of summation of multiple heat waves produced by a variety of nickel atoms that vibrate at the same frequency ... these frequencies would provide hydrogen (as HYDRIDES?) the ability to overcome the Coulomb barrier http://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barriera_di_Coulomb and make the merger of its proton to the core of nickel (as I understand it). [Editor's note. I'm asking Celani verification of this and other points of his speech] The power density is very high, and some of his reactions Celani has exceeded 1400 watts per gram of nickel, which is higher than that of uranium fission in the cladding Zirconium.Although Celani you hear talk about technological reality, as it has exceeded 200% yield (ie COP=2) for two weeks. Celani has worked very hard with the great Japanese scientist Arata. The Japanese government has funded plenty of not only the research but also those of three foreign groups who have had full access to the laboratory by Arata. Celani was able to perform various types of experiment and measurement, even the craziest. Among these groups was that of MIT and INFN (Italian national institute of Nuclear Physics; Celani et al). Worked with the Arata DEUTERIUM ... but as the import and production of Deuterium prohibited by the peace agreements had to self-refine it with the sulfur-iodine cycle http://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ciclo_zolfo-iodio . Arata was also excess power of 60 watts, which is easily measurable. The improvement over Fleishman and Pons was when he abandoned the traditional Arata electrode foil. Not only that, the best layers were not perfectly flat, shiny but rather rough, porous, etc.. In short, had to increase the surface area of contact between palladium and deuterium. When he returned to Italy, Celani modified experiments (*along with Professor Giuliano Preparata*) and began to use wires of nickel and hydrogen at high pressure (eliminating water, oxygen and ' Oxonianhttp://www.treccani.it/enciclopedia/ossonio/ ) He realized that the power increased by using highly porous nickel. He returned to Japan. There Arata began to experiment with nickel of every size possible. He found that the nickel nanopowder in aggregates of less than 20 Ångström you had the best reactions. Indeed, the reaction took place (although not as powerful) even at room temperature. As for gammas they are an end product of the reaction, not desired by Celani, that you can do without. By applying radio frequency (microwave) to dust (I did not know whether that of Rossi or his), he had a massive production of gamma rays, which Celani does not want and does not consider useful. As the catalyst for him are metals such as platinum or palladium (must resist the micro-points where the heat reaches thousands of degrees, ionizing hydrogen) Celani comes to scientific reality PROCESS. Celani says that the Greeks of today have passed Defaklion Rossi, from the technological point of view. [Editor's note. others believe that Defkalion has put together a nice frame and a beautiful body ... but do not have the engine]. He says that this attitude of secrecy is stupid [ed. Celani is understandably affected by a) not being invited to the demonstration of 28 October and 2) the negative response to the proposal of Rossi independent testing under the aegis of INFN], and in the end, continue along this road will not have the triumph of science and industrial deserves it. According to Celani, Rossi arrives to yield around 600%.
Re: [Vo]:e-cat replication by Celani
Good find. The Googleese is a bit hard to understand, was an extra bit at the end too where Celani says Dekaflion have now far surpassed Rossi. My minor edits to translation: According to Celani the reaction between Ni and H would be catalyzed by PHONONS http://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fonone . The phonons are not particles but the points where it contacts the thermal-electromagnetic waves in phase, produced by thermal agitation in the lattice of nickel. Are points of summation of multiple heat waves produced by a variety of nickel atoms that vibrate at the same frequency ... these frequencies would provide hydrogen (as HYDRIDES?) the ability to overcome the Coulomb barrierhttp://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barriera_di_Coulomb and make the merger of its proton to the core of nickel (as I understand it). [Editor's note. I'm asking Celani verification of this and other points of his speech] The power density is very high, and some of his reactions Celani has exceeded 1400 watts per gram of nickel, which is higher than that of uranium fission in the cladding Zirconium.Although Celani you hear talk about technological reality, as it has exceeded 200% yield (ie COP=2) for two weeks. Celani has worked very hard with the great Japanese scientist Arata. The Japanese government has funded plenty of not only the research but also those of three foreign groups who have had full access to the laboratory by Arata. Celani was able to perform various types of experiment and measurement, even the craziest. Among these groups was that of MIT and INFN (Italian national institute of Nuclear Physics; Celani et al). Worked with the Arata DEUTERIUM ... but as the import and production of Deuterium prohibited by the peace agreements had to self-refine it with the sulfur-iodine cycle http://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ciclo_zolfo-iodio . Arata was also excess power of 60 watts, which is easily measurable. The improvement over Fleishman and Pons was when he abandoned the traditional Arata electrode foil. Not only that, the best layers were not perfectly flat, shiny but rather rough, porous, etc.. In short, had to increase the surface area of contact between palladium and deuterium. When he returned to Italy, Celani modified experiments (prepared alongside) and began to use wires of nickel and hydrogen at high pressure (eliminating water, oxygen and ' Oxonian http://www.treccani.it/enciclopedia/ossonio/ ) He realized that the power increased by using highly porous nickel. He returned to Japan. There Arata began to experiment with nickel of every size possible. He found that the nickel nanopowder in aggregates of less than 20 Ångström you had the best reactions. Indeed, the reaction took place (although not as powerful) even at room temperature. As for gammas they are an end product of the reaction, not desired by Celani, that you can do without. By applying radio frequency (microwave) to dust (I did not know whether that of Rossi or his), he had a massive production of gamma rays, which Celani does not want and does not consider useful. As the catalyst for him are metals such as platinum or palladium (must resist the micro-points where the heat reaches thousands of degrees, ionizing hydrogen) Celani comes to scientific reality PROCESS. Celani says that the Greeks of today have passed Defaklion Rossi, from the technological point of view. [Editor's note. others believe that Defkalion has put together a nice frame and a beautiful body ... but do not have the engine]. He says that this attitude of secrecy is stupid [ed. Celani is understandably affected by a) not being invited to the demonstration of 28 October and 2) the negative response to the proposal of Rossi independent testing under the aegis of INFN], and in the end, continue along this road will not have the triumph of science and industrial deserves it. According to Celani, Rossi arrives to yield around 600%. On 16 December 2011 15:43, David ledin mathematic.analy...@gmail.comwrote: from 22pssi Celani has news of a new experiment that has been going on for a couple of weeks (I hope it details in some detail as soon as possible) to him as a very interesting results, but still in its infancy, some of his reactions has exceeded 1400 watts per gram of nickel, which is higher than that of uranium fission in the “cladding” Zirconium. Although Celani you hear talk about “technological reality”, as it has exceeded 200% yield for two weeks. Celani has worked very hard with the Japanese architect Arata great scientist. The Japanese government has funded plenty of not only the research but also those of three foreign groups who have had full access to the laboratory by Arata. Celani was able to perform various types of experiment and measurement, even the “craziest”. Arata was also excess power of 60 watts, which is easily measurable. The improvement over Fleishman and Pons was when he abandoned the traditional Arata electrode foil. In short, had to
Re: [Vo]:e-cat replication by Celani
On 2011-12-16 16:43, David ledin wrote: some of his reactions has exceeded 1400 watts per gram of nickel, which is higher than that of uranium fission in the “cladding” Zirconium. Although Celani you hear talk about “technological reality”, as it has exceeded 200% yield for two weeks. Well, this alone would be great news, if independently verified and replicated (particularly by scientists skeptic of LENR/cold fusion), and bring immediate great benefits to the entire field. By applying radio frequency (microwave) to dust (I did not know whether that of Smith or his), he had a massive production of gamma rays, which does not want Celani and does not consider useful. I disagree: they would be EXTREMELY useful as they would *clearly* indicate that nuclear reactions are occurring! Why is Celani dismissing them as some kind of annoyance? I don't get this. Aren't scientists and researchers like him struggling for acceptance on their results in the mainstream science community!? I'm astonished. Cheers, S.A.
Re: [Vo]:e-cat replication by Celani
That was report from a layman. Gamma rays are bad for most people. 2011/12/16 Akira Shirakawa shirakawa.ak...@gmail.com On 2011-12-16 16:43, David ledin wrote: some of his reactions has exceeded 1400 watts per gram of nickel, which is higher than that of uranium fission in the “cladding” Zirconium. Although Celani you hear talk about “technological reality”, as it has exceeded 200% yield for two weeks. Well, this alone would be great news, if independently verified and replicated (particularly by scientists skeptic of LENR/cold fusion), and bring immediate great benefits to the entire field. By applying radio frequency (microwave) to dust (I did not know whether that of Smith or his), he had a massive production of gamma rays, which does not want Celani and does not consider useful. I disagree: they would be EXTREMELY useful as they would *clearly* indicate that nuclear reactions are occurring! Why is Celani dismissing them as some kind of annoyance? I don't get this. Aren't scientists and researchers like him struggling for acceptance on their results in the mainstream science community!? I'm astonished. Cheers, S.A. -- Daniel Rocha - RJ danieldi...@gmail.com
Re: [Vo]:e-cat replication by Celani
At 09:06 AM 12/16/2011, Robert Lynn wrote: Celani says that the Greeks of today have passed Defaklion Rossi, from the technological point of view. [Editor's note. others believe that Defkalion has put together a nice frame and a beautiful body ... but do not have the engine]. Celani's table (in the zip file) lists Rossi as having a GAIN=600% and Defkalion=2500% -- but these are straight from their specifications. I couldn't see anything in Passi22's report or Celani's slides that Defkalion's figure had been verified by anyone.
