[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS (and disable it by default)
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 Bug 46306 depends on bug 60306, which changed state. Bug 60306 Summary: TypeError: mw.uls is undefined on [[mw:Special:Translate]] https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=60306 What|Removed |Added Status|ASSIGNED|RESOLVED Resolution|--- |WORKSFORME -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS (and disable it by default)
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 --- Comment #119 from Andre Klapper aklap...@wikimedia.org --- To everybody: Please think a moment if you really have to add a comment here. Many things have already been brought up and every comment creates bugmail. The situation and the plans are already covered in comment 115. (In reply to comment #116) Please make ULS enabled by default for all Indian language Wikipedias. Different topic - see discuss in bug 60323 instead, please. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 --- Comment #82 from Gerrit Notification Bot gerritad...@wikimedia.org --- Change 92562 merged by jenkins-bot: Add user preference to enable ULS https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/92562 -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 --- Comment #83 from Gerrit Notification Bot gerritad...@wikimedia.org --- Change 108666 had a related patch set uploaded by Ori.livneh: Add user preference to enable ULS https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/108666 -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 --- Comment #84 from Gerrit Notification Bot gerritad...@wikimedia.org --- Change 108666 merged by jenkins-bot: Add user preference to enable ULS https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/108666 -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 --- Comment #84 from Gerrit Notification Bot gerritad...@wikimedia.org --- Change 108666 merged by jenkins-bot: Add user preference to enable ULS https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/108666 --- Comment #85 from Gerrit Notification Bot gerritad...@wikimedia.org --- Change 108667 had a related patch set uploaded by Ori.livneh: Add user preference to enable ULS https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/108667 -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 --- Comment #86 from Nemo federicol...@tiscali.it --- Legoktm said: I haven't actually tested it, but from a quick glance in Translate's code, the module 'ext.translate.special.translate' is loaded, which has a dependency upon 'ext.uls.init', which means ULS would be loaded regardless of the user preference. Was this tested? -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 --- Comment #87 from Gerrit Notification Bot gerritad...@wikimedia.org --- Change 108667 merged by jenkins-bot: Add user preference to enable ULS https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/108667 -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 Nemo federicol...@tiscali.it changed: What|Removed |Added CC||billinghu...@gmail.com Blocks||35925 --- Comment #88 from Nemo federicol...@tiscali.it --- The deploy lacked l10n. The checkbox uls-preference is unchecked by default it seems, no idea what it does though. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 --- Comment #89 from Nemo federicol...@tiscali.it --- Created attachment 14350 -- https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/attachment.cgi?id=14350action=edit Translate missing language selection (In reply to comment #86) Legoktm said: I haven't actually tested it, but from a quick glance in Translate's code, the module 'ext.translate.special.translate' is loaded, which has a dependency upon 'ext.uls.init', which means ULS would be loaded regardless of the user preference. Was this tested? Apparently not. I confirm Translate is broken. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 Nemo federicol...@tiscali.it changed: What|Removed |Added Keywords||code-update-regression CC||aklap...@wikimedia.org, ||gpaum...@wikimedia.org, ||hf...@wikimedia.org, ||ksni...@wikimedia.org, ||mhernan...@wikimedia.org, ||ro...@wikimedia.org --- Comment #90 from Nemo federicol...@tiscali.it --- No idea what to do, adding a few platform product fundraising comm people + Andre so that the affected parties decide something. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 Andre Klapper aklap...@wikimedia.org changed: What|Removed |Added Priority|Lowest |Immediate Assignee|legoktm.wikipe...@gmail.com |o...@wikimedia.org -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 Andre Klapper aklap...@wikimedia.org changed: What|Removed |Added See Also||https://bugzilla.wikimedia. ||org/show_bug.cgi?id=60281 -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 --- Comment #92 from MZMcBride b...@mzmcbride.com --- (In reply to comment #89) Apparently not. I confirm Translate is broken. Did you enable the new ULS user preference? Is Translate still broken with the new user preference enabled? -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 --- Comment #91 from MZMcBride b...@mzmcbride.com --- Andre: can you please explain why you marked this bug report as immediate? Isn't this bug report now most appropriately marked resolved/fixed? I'm not sure there are still patches to review. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 --- Comment #93 from Kunal Mehta (Legoktm) legoktm.wikipe...@gmail.com --- (In reply to comment #89) Was this tested? Apparently not. I confirm Translate is broken. I tested this back in October and it worked fine for me locally, but there have been a ton of changes to ULS since then. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 --- Comment #94 from Kunal Mehta (Legoktm) legoktm.wikipe...@gmail.com --- (In reply to comment #92) (In reply to comment #89) Apparently not. I confirm Translate is broken. Did you enable the new ULS user preference? Is Translate still broken with the new user preference enabled? Enabling the preference makes Translate work fine, however the expectation (or at least mine was) was that Translate would continue to work regardless of preference setting. Still investigating. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 MZMcBride b...@mzmcbride.com changed: What|Removed |Added See Also|https://bugzilla.wikimedia. | |org/show_bug.cgi?id=60281 | CC||gerard.meijs...@gmail.com --- Comment #95 from MZMcBride b...@mzmcbride.com --- *** Bug 60281 has been marked as a duplicate of this bug. *** -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 --- Comment #96 from Lydia Pintscher lydia.pintsc...@wikimedia.de --- ULS provides vital functionality on Wikidata. We need it and need it enabled by default. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 --- Comment #97 from MZMcBride b...@mzmcbride.com --- (In reply to comment #96) ULS provides vital functionality on Wikidata. We need it and need it enabled by default. Is the Wikidata team willing to donate engineering resources to help fix ULS so that it can be re-enabled by default? As I understand it, ULS was disabled due to ongoing and severe performance problems. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 --- Comment #98 from Lydia Pintscher lydia.pintsc...@wikimedia.de --- I can't say without knowing what is needed. Until it was disabled I wasn't aware of any issues with it on Wikidata. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 --- Comment #99 from Erik Moeller e...@wikimedia.org --- Lydia: The main performance issues have been with the automatic font loading behavior. It should be possible to restore the base functionality (language selection, input methods) very soon. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 --- Comment #100 from praveenp me.prav...@gmail.com --- Personally I am thankful to those made this change, although uls-preference is bit cryptic ;-). But like the complex structure of ULS (which unnecessarily mixed totally different requirements together), disabling it completely is also problematic. Webfonts and fancy scripts are more than a hurdle to most users but IME is a useful feature to most non-Latin users. Even though it was a less responsive, heavy, less distinguishable whether enabled or not script than old Narayam. By disabling a default input method, Indic wikis where pushed atleast somewhere before 2009. :-( IMO If possible, break ULS into different pieces or atleast make a more descriptive options to disable ULS which helps users to disable / enable components without affecting any other component. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 --- Comment #101 from Gerrit Notification Bot gerritad...@wikimedia.org --- Change 108698 had a related patch set uploaded by Legoktm: Make ext.uls.mediawiki depend upon ext.uls.init https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/108698 -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 --- Comment #102 from Kunal Mehta (Legoktm) legoktm.wikipe...@gmail.com --- (In reply to comment #96) ULS provides vital functionality on Wikidata. We need it and need it enabled by default. Change-Id: Ia4b865d41311e2436bb6a86593fb61eaf64891cc Someone will need to assess whether doing so will cause another load spike upon bits. (In reply to comment #101) Change 108698 had a related patch set uploaded by Legoktm: Make ext.uls.mediawiki depend upon ext.uls.init https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/108698 This should fix integration with the Translate extension. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 --- Comment #103 from Isarra zhoris...@gmail.com --- (In reply to comment #100) IMO If possible, break ULS into different pieces or atleast make a more descriptive options to disable ULS which helps users to disable / enable components without affecting any other component. THIS. Preferably the first bit. Although that should probably be a different bug. Or is it already? -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 --- Comment #104 from Nemo federicol...@tiscali.it --- (In reply to comment #103) (In reply to comment #100) IMO If possible, break ULS into different pieces [...] THIS. Preferably the first bit. Although that should probably be a different bug. Or is it already? If that's the first bit you refer to, it was already possible; what this bug was mostly about is the (possibility of) a complete disabling, including the ULS trigger which is the only piece without a disabling feature. Later it turned into a bug about the default state, though. Making disabling/enabling of some features require less clicks would be e.g. bug 46044; while on the visibility of the trigger little can be done: some indic wikis would like it more prominent and some others less, the compromise was the (inter)language area. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 --- Comment #105 from Gerrit Notification Bot gerritad...@wikimedia.org --- Change 108698 merged by jenkins-bot: Make ext.uls.mediawiki depend upon ext.uls.init https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/108698 -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 --- Comment #106 from Gerrit Notification Bot gerritad...@wikimedia.org --- Change 108707 had a related patch set uploaded by Legoktm: Make ext.uls.mediawiki depend upon ext.uls.init https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/108707 -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 --- Comment #107 from Gerrit Notification Bot gerritad...@wikimedia.org --- Change 108709 had a related patch set uploaded by Legoktm: Make ext.uls.mediawiki depend upon ext.uls.init https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/108709 -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 --- Comment #108 from Gerrit Notification Bot gerritad...@wikimedia.org --- Change 108709 merged by jenkins-bot: Make ext.uls.mediawiki depend upon ext.uls.init https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/108709 -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 --- Comment #109 from Gerrit Notification Bot gerritad...@wikimedia.org --- Change 108707 merged by jenkins-bot: Make ext.uls.mediawiki depend upon ext.uls.init https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/108707 -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 Ori Livneh o...@wikimedia.org changed: What|Removed |Added Status|PATCH_TO_REVIEW |RESOLVED Resolution|--- |FIXED -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 MZMcBride b...@mzmcbride.com changed: What|Removed |Added Keywords|code-update-regression | Priority|Immediate |Normal -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 Nemo federicol...@tiscali.it changed: What|Removed |Added See Also||https://bugzilla.wikimedia. ||org/show_bug.cgi?id=56433 -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 Nemo federicol...@tiscali.it changed: What|Removed |Added See Also||https://bugzilla.wikimedia. ||org/show_bug.cgi?id=42157, ||https://bugzilla.wikimedia. ||org/show_bug.cgi?id=42371, ||https://bugzilla.wikimedia. ||org/show_bug.cgi?id=48532, ||https://bugzilla.wikimedia. ||org/show_bug.cgi?id=48533 See Also||https://bugzilla.wikimedia. ||org/show_bug.cgi?id=51102, ||https://bugzilla.wikimedia. ||org/show_bug.cgi?id=41542 -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 Nemo federicol...@tiscali.it changed: What|Removed |Added Blocks||56292 -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 --- Comment #110 from Nemo federicol...@tiscali.it --- *** Bug 56433 has been marked as a duplicate of this bug. *** -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS (and disable it by default)
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 Nemo federicol...@tiscali.it changed: What|Removed |Added Summary|Add option to disable ULS |Add option to disable ULS ||(and disable it by default) -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS (and disable it by default)
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 Nemo federicol...@tiscali.it changed: What|Removed |Added Depends on||60306 --- Comment #111 from Nemo federicol...@tiscali.it --- (In reply to comment #89) Apparently not. I confirm Translate is broken. And still is, I'm told: bug 60306. This bug is not properly fixed until bug 60306 is, but I suppose reopening this report would just make everything even more messy. Sigh. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS (and disable it by default)
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 Philippe Verdy verd...@wanadoo.fr changed: What|Removed |Added CC||verd...@wanadoo.fr --- Comment #112 from Philippe Verdy verd...@wanadoo.fr --- So apparently what is wanted is: * Possibility for users to disable ULS completely: - This can be made temporarily for the session (including for non-loggeg in users - the ULS icon disappears - on page refresh, the ULS javascript is no longer loaded of it is just a stub - For logged in users, the ULS feature is within the Gadgets preferences * With URL still ebabled, we can disable each of its 5 features (keeping its associated settings) - disable the icon at the top: the gadget preferens are still accessible in user preferences or by following a link that allows reopenng the ULS dialog to reenable the icon - diable/enable input methods assistants - diable/enable per-langage font overrides (all languages in one operation, but keep their settings so that we can enable them again without having to reconfigure them all) - disable only webfonts (per-language font overrides may continue to work if they are effective, but users may have to install these fonts); this includes the Autonym font But I don't see any point for enabling/disabling the user language selection if ULS is still active, even uf the icon is hidden at top of page. It is a grear thing that we can switch the UI lanuage without having to visit the full User prefenreces pages: two clicks for switching. For non logged-in users, the possibility of switching the UI language is a key feature, notably on multilingual sites like Commons, Incubator, and Beta Wikiversity. But the UI language selection is not really a key feature of ULS, it just offers a smart dialog equivalent to the Language selection combobox of the user preferences. For this reason I think it should be kept (and probably the icon at top of page too). And yes trying to reduce the footprint of ULS in terms of bandwidth added to load a page should be a priority (but this is not exclusive to ULS, other gadgets or accessibility features (often very desirable) should be minimized as well. There's only one situation where ULS should be disabled completely in user preferenes within Gadgets: incompatibilities or problems with the user's own assistive technologies (using external tools, e.g. Braille readers) or some security tools (that may filter some javascripts conditionnally, or could modify them on the flow so that they could be broken) or form input assistants (e.g. password fillers...= or when it causes compatibility problems with some simpler devices (e.g. on some smart TVs or settop boxes, or smartphones, that embed a basic web browser often full of bugs and never updated, such as Opera Mini, or Opera Embedded, or Basic Android browser). Note that for smartphones, Wikimedia may offer a mobile version of the wiki which uses a simpler interface. In //*.m.wikipedia.org for example UTL cannot work, even if users are logged in, but the mobile version requires another ULS implementation. But mobiles visitings the mobile version of the wiki still have the option to visit the web version, and the web version should continue to work, and ULS should not add too much fullprint; You don't need to live in rural thirld world area to test this: use a basic Android smartphone to connect via a Wifi hotspot (NOT Wifi N or not connected to a fast broadband), then look with an indoor 3G+/HSDPA connection (which may switch to 3G/UMTS or even to 2G+/EDGE or 2G/GPRS with poor reception) -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS (and disable it by default)
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 MZMcBride b...@mzmcbride.com changed: What|Removed |Added Blocks||56433 -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS (and disable it by default)
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 --- Comment #113 from billinghurst billinghu...@gmail.com --- The Wikisources were using the functionality of ULS within templates as a means to show these character sets as per the works being replicated, and this enabled these different character sets, easily even something like the blackletter font-family:'UnifrakturMaguntia' Having this functionality OFF by default means that the Wikisources cannot know that the font will show unless we convince people to turn it on (somehow), and to even be able to notify them how to do it. Out of my technical grasp of how to now implement this, and for the broader communities to have to nut out the issue, from a bugzilla report about which they know nothing is not helpful. NOTE ABOUT PROCESS That this disabling out of the normal release cycle, and without information to the wikis is quite problematic. If changes like this are going to happen, it would be good for solutions to be provided prior to the change, for the change to communicated. We have have a forum for such things, and it wasn't used. It is not a case of the whipping boy, but this is a repeat of earlier instances, and a massive case of g face palm with lashings of deja vu. How is WMF going to demonstrate that they will utilise the processes that they have advocated for such changes where the impact is broad? -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS (and disable it by default)
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 --- Comment #114 from billinghurst billinghu...@gmail.com --- https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Universal_Language_Selector needs updating by someone who has their head around what is happening. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS (and disable it by default)
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 --- Comment #115 from Erik Moeller e...@wikimedia.org --- What's going to happen next is that ULS will be re-enabled, but with _automatic_ font loading disabled by default. You'll be able to enable _automatic_ font loading within the ULS user interface. Once that version of ULS is deployed, we'll do additional data-gathering before any kind of progressive re-enablement of automatic font downloading. It's the font download component that can cause huge latency issues, and has been the main reason for ULS being completely disabled temporarily. The Wikisource use case is probably the most innocuous, but we also want to do some additional work on the JavaScript footprint required to deliver that functionality, especially if that JavaScript footprint needs to be loaded by non-Wikisource users as well. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS (and disable it by default)
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 Pavanaja U B pavan...@vishvakannada.com changed: What|Removed |Added CC||pavan...@vishvakannada.com --- Comment #116 from Pavanaja U B pavan...@vishvakannada.com --- Please make ULS enabled by default for all Indian language Wikipedias. It was like that till yesterday. From yesterday, ULS is available only after someone enables it from his/her preferences. That means no one can search Indian language Wikipedias without logging in because one can change the preferences only after logging in. This new change is seriously affecting the use of Indian language Wikipedias. Not many Indians are familiar with installing third party IMEs or enabling the IMEs given in the OS (Windows). ULS was helping such people. Hence I request to make ULS enabled by default for Indic Wikipedias. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS (and disable it by default)
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 --- Comment #117 from Erik Moeller e...@wikimedia.org --- Pavanaja, the previous input method behavior will be restored once ULS is re-enabled. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS (and disable it by default)
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 --- Comment #118 from Gerard Meijssen gerard.meijs...@gmail.com --- Erik you did not consider 7 to 10% of a population who are dyslexic. You consider all the use cases as secondary and in the mean time you stop providing a service. WHY -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS (and disable it by default)
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 Nemo federicol...@tiscali.it changed: What|Removed |Added See Also||https://bugzilla.wikimedia. ||org/show_bug.cgi?id=60323 -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS (and disable it by default)
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 Nemo federicol...@tiscali.it changed: What|Removed |Added See Also||https://bugzilla.wikimedia. ||org/show_bug.cgi?id=45964 -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS (and disable it by default)
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 Runa Bhattacharjee run...@gmail.com changed: What|Removed |Added Blocks||60329 -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 --- Comment #81 from Eduard Braun eduard.bra...@gmx.de --- (In reply to comment #75) I think you summed up the issue very well Erik capturing most of the problems around ULS. Following some of my thoughts regarding your post: 1) Does ULS have an unacceptable performance impact on some users which needs to be mitigated; That depends on the definition of unacceptable. *After most of the serious performance issues are solved now performance is probably acceptable on most hardware given a sufficiently fast internet connection. *On old hardware or a slow internet connection performance is still insufficient as mentioned above. *For people who never use any of the features of ULS the the performance impact can always be considered unacceptable - why use substantial processing power, memory and bandwidth for an unused feature? 2) Does ULS include functionality that is simply irrelevant for some users while cluttering UI; Definetly yes! The only language feature I ever used is setting UI language - and I did that only once in the my user preferences. Therefore ULS is completely redundant for me. Regarding cluttering I'm especially annoyed on Commons (which has the language name written out prominently on top of the page. Since I set different languages on Commons (English) and my home Wiki (German) I often see distracting Language changed from ... pop-ups when navigating from German Wikipedia to Commons via interwikilinks. 3) Is there a specific third party vs. WMF issue here. I don't think so. I'm not active on any third party Wiki that would use ULS. I'm having these Issues on WMF Wikis! It's possible to force use of system fonts; however, I don't see an option to disable font-loading altogether. Having that be an option within ULS itself may be useful for users of slow connections. Has that been discussed? Not really. I mentioned it once but it wasn't really considered. But it would be definitly a step into the right direction. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306
--- Comment #79 from Ori Livneh o...@wikimedia.org ---
(In reply to comment #76)
We should try to figure out why people hate ULS so much that they want to
actively disable it.
I think that this is a useful frame (though 'hate' is a bit extreme).
There is a marked discrepancy between our (the developer community, broadly
defined) understanding of ULS performance and user's reports of their
experiences.
The explanation that I think is most convincing is this one:
- There are still serious performance issues with ULS.
- Users can sense that something is wrong, but they don't always have the means
to express it in a technically precise way.
- Developers want to fix problems, but we're not measuring anything that shows
the problems clearly.
- The point of reference for input tools and font rendering is the native
capabilities implemented in the OS.
- Anything implemented in JavaScript and interpreted at page load is going to
be several orders of magnitude slower.
There is a wide band of performance degradation that leaves
you irritated and aware that something is not as it should, but unable to
pinpoint the source of irritation. I've been able to identify one example: the
language input selection interface. Something is causing the browser to
repeatedly recalculate styles while the interface is active, which makes the
browser appear sluggish and unresponsive. This is especially noticeable when
scrolling. I recorded a short screencast showing how one might go about
diagnosing this issue:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpagev=JprXNc9Ei2A
(YouTube; sorry.)
I suspect that this is not an isolated issue, and that there's a lot that we
need to investigate. If you want to take a stab at the scroll issue, you might
find this resource helpful:
http://theamazingweb.net/2013/09/10/debugging-and-fixing-janky-scrolling-with-paul-irish/
Please be nice to the Language Engineering team; they put in a lot of work into
making ULS excellent in all the aspects that our development infrastructure is
good at disclosing. There is a collective engineering responsibility here to
get a handle on user-perceived latency and to integrate it into our code review
and acceptance testing processes. In our defense the tooling for doing this
kind of work is really in its infancy. (That scroll bottleneck detection tool?
It's in the dev channel of Chrom{e/ium}; I don't think it's even in beta yet!)
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[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 --- Comment #80 from MZMcBride b...@mzmcbride.com --- Thank you very much for the analysis, Ori. For now, I've filed bug 56433 to consider temporarily scaling back the deployment of ULS to Wikimedia wikis. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 --- Comment #77 from Kunal Mehta (Legoktm) legoktm.wikipe...@gmail.com --- (In reply to comment #75) There are several separate issues here: 1) Does ULS have an unacceptable performance impact on some users which needs to be mitigated; Yes. 2) Does ULS include functionality that is simply irrelevant for some users while cluttering UI; Irrelevant for some users, yes. I don't personally think it is cluttering the UI. 3) Is there a specific third party vs. WMF issue here. I think the third point is a red herring. If we agree that there are real issues to be solved, then we should solve them for everyone, not just hypothetical third party ULS users who have a hypothetical interest in offering users ULS while also offering them the option to disable it on a per-user basis. Okay. The first point, performance, has been an ongoing issue with ULS. The initial release of ULS caused insane amount of font-loading to occur on pageviews with language links. That issue was unfortunately unresolved far too late, which probably caused a lot of users to identify ULS with negative performance impact. Loading of fonts for sidebar links has been disabled since late September, and the new autonym font should offer a solution for this issue once and for all: https://blog.wikimedia.org/2013/10/28/the-autonym-font-for-language-names/ This is by far the biggest performance issue with ULS -- we're talking about megabytes of payload on some pages. I suspect, though, that even with the autonym font, we need to continue to improve font-loading behavior. It's possible to force use of system fonts; however, I don't see an option to disable font-loading altogether. Having that be an option within ULS itself may be useful for users of slow connections. Has that been discussed? I don't think so. While webfonts are pretty large, ULS itself is also large. The JS/CSS payload is less of an issue, and the team has already made some optimizations, though there's probably still room to do more lazy-loading so that ULS truly only adds payload to page requests when actually used. I've CC'd Ori on this bug from his perspective as Performance Engineer, though there are probably other relevant bugs where this discussion is occurring/should occur. I disagree that JS/CSS payload is less of an issue. On the latest master of ULS + MediaWiki master, the top 4 entries in mw.loader.inspect() are from ULS: 'jquery.uls', 'jquery.uls.data', 'ext.uls.init', and 'ext.uls.webfonts.repository' (118.67KB total). The next extension on the list that I have installed is Echo, which has a total of 14.79KB (not including common dependencies like mediawiki.jQueryMsg). On enwiki's main page the results are similar, except for jquery.ui being loaded from somewhere, but I understand that's already on its way out (bug 47145). Regarding the question if ULS should be disable-able for some users altogether, the reason I'd argue against it is that ULS is basically a core site feature: changing the UI language and language settings. It's like hiding a part of the preferences section. It's where ULS has impact that goes _beyond_ what you'd expect from a preferences/selection feature that preferences or changes to the default behavior are more appropriate. I disagree. You can go to Special:Preferences and change your language settings there. ULS even conveniently adds a link in that section to open the ULS language selection pane. For people who don't change their language settings every few minutes or ever, that feature isn't needed. In addition to the font issue, the only other aspect of ULS where that's true is arguably the input method selection. This is really the only part of ULS that adds true clutter to the page, because it pops up in every edit field, taunting you with a feature that may be completely irrelevant to you. It _can_ be disabled and hidden with a single click from the menu. I know the UX folks have thought about a way to make the selection control itself less annoying, e.g. embedding it into form fields rather than having it come up on focus below the field. IMO we should be focusing on improvements like this. I like that option because there's a way to turn it off. For people who find it useful, they can keep it enabled, but for people who don't, they can turn it off. The rest of ULS needs an option like this too, simply because not everyone needs/uses/wants it. Right now wikis are resorting to ugly hacks like https://en.wiktionary.org/w/index.php?title=MediaWiki:Common.jsoldid=23352360 to disable ULS. Providing a sane off switch is an improvement. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 --- Comment #78 from MZMcBride b...@mzmcbride.com --- Adding a user preference should be considered a last resort. The reality is that most site visitors can't set user preferences at all and most logged-in users will never know about or set this user preference. We must focus on having sane default behavior. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 --- Comment #61 from Siebrand Mazeland s.mazel...@xs4all.nl --- *** Bug 56292 has been marked as a duplicate of this bug. *** -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. You are the assignee for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 Siebrand Mazeland s.mazel...@xs4all.nl changed: What|Removed |Added Status|REOPENED|RESOLVED Resolution|--- |WONTFIX -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. You are the assignee for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 praveenp me.prav...@gmail.com changed: What|Removed |Added Blocks||56295 -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. You are the assignee for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 praveenp me.prav...@gmail.com changed: What|Removed |Added Status|RESOLVED|REOPENED Resolution|WONTFIX |--- --- Comment #62 from praveenp me.prav...@gmail.com --- Siebrand, Please don't close bugs like this, which is requested by many communities repeatedly, just because you don't support it. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. You are the assignee for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 Andre Klapper aklap...@wikimedia.org changed: What|Removed |Added Status|REOPENED|RESOLVED Resolution|--- |WONTFIX --- Comment #63 from Andre Klapper aklap...@wikimedia.org --- There have been no new arguments provided to reopen this ticket. Comment 46 and comment 47 have not been answered. In general, maintainers of projects are free to decide what functionality they implement and what not. Hence please keep this ticket as WONTFIX for the time being. Bugzilla also allows to add comments without changing the status. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. You are the assignee for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 --- Comment #64 from praveenp me.prav...@gmail.com --- But you people are getting paid for solving bugs not WONTFIX it ignoring communities. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. You are the assignee for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 --- Comment #65 from praveenp me.prav...@gmail.com --- But you people are getting paid for solving bugs, instead of WONTFIX it ignoring communities. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. You are the assignee for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 --- Comment #66 from Eduard Braun eduard.bra...@gmx.de --- You want a very good reason (in addition to the many reasons that were already given before but which are seemingly ignored by the devs)? Lately I had to rely on a very slow and unstable wireless connection. The HTML part of pages was usually loaded. CSS and especially JS parts often timed out, though (and as far as I know ULS is a huge piece of JS adding substantial amounts of CSS). As a result Wikipedia got totally unusable for me, while many other pages being more lightweight did still work without problem. So get off your high horse - not everybody has access to a 100 MBit cable connection nowadays. It's a shame Wikipedia is not suitable for low bandwith connections because of nice-to-have but not necessary extensions like ULS. If I had the possibility to disable all the unnecessary cruft which ULS is only a part of I could have possibly continued to use Wikipedia. Since there currently is no such possibility I had to do my research somewhere else. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. You are the assignee for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 --- Comment #67 from MZMcBride b...@mzmcbride.com --- (In reply to comment #63) In general, maintainers of projects are free to decide what functionality they implement and what not. This is not completely true. Siebrand can certainly decide how to spend his own time, but he cannot dictate to others how to spend theirs. This does not seem like a situation in which patches won't be accepted. In fact, it seems to be exactly the opposite: patches are desperately needed to make ULS less of a burden to users. This issue has been split out to bug 56292. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. You are the assignee for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 Bartosz Dziewoński matma@gmail.com changed: What|Removed |Added CC||hexm...@gmail.com --- Comment #68 from Bartosz Dziewoński matma@gmail.com --- (In reply to comment #65) But you people are getting paid for solving bugs, instead of WONTFIX it ignoring communities. This is a fallacy; sometimes, a WONTFIX is the appropriate solution, and project managers are also paid for making hard decisions and WONTFIXing bugs. (I've already expressed my opinion on whether it is appropriate here.) Alas, this is clearly not going to happen for Wikimedia wikis for reasons which are unconvincing to me; but unless somebody convinces the Board of Trustees or someone with comparable decisive power, we can't do anything about it. *However*, that doesn't stop the option itself from being implemented – even if it's not made available for Wikimedia wikis – so maintainers of third-party wikis who have a different set of priorities than WMF can make this extension available as opt-in or opt-out, not mandatory. I am CC-ing Mark Hershberger (hexmode), MediaWiki release manager, and asking for his input. I would suggest reopening the bug again, making it clear that this would be third-party only, and setting it to lowest priority to indicate that WMF teams are not going to spend any resources on it. I'm also imploring Siebrand to actually reply one more time instead of just closing the bug with no explanation, as it seems to me that Isarra's intention was exactly what I said above. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. You are the assignee for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 --- Comment #69 from Gerrit Notification Bot gerritad...@wikimedia.org --- Change 92562 had a related patch set uploaded by Legoktm: Add user preference to enable ULS https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/92562 -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. You are the assignee for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 Gerrit Notification Bot gerritad...@wikimedia.org changed: What|Removed |Added Status|RESOLVED|PATCH_TO_REVIEW Resolution|WONTFIX |--- -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. You are the assignee for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 Nemo federicol...@tiscali.it changed: What|Removed |Added Priority|Normal |Lowest Severity|normal |enhancement -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. You are the assignee for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 Kunal Mehta (Legoktm) legoktm.wikipe...@gmail.com changed: What|Removed |Added CC||legoktm.wikipe...@gmail.com Assignee|wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia. |legoktm.wikipe...@gmail.com |org | --- Comment #70 from Kunal Mehta (Legoktm) legoktm.wikipe...@gmail.com --- It wasn't my intention to re-open the bug, sorry. I agree with most of what the people above (Bartosz, Isarra, etc) have said, and am willing to work on the patch to get this bug resolved. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. You are the assignee for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 --- Comment #71 from Erik Moeller e...@wikimedia.org --- (In reply to comment #66) CSS and especially JS parts often timed out, though (and as far as I know ULS is a huge piece of JS adding substantial amounts of CSS) If that's the real issue, the answer here is further optimizing ULS load and performance characteristics and eliminating the need for a preference. Are there other reasons to want a preference beyond performance? -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 Mark A. Hershberger m...@everybody.org changed: What|Removed |Added Priority|Lowest |Normal Status|PATCH_TO_REVIEW |RESOLVED CC||m...@everybody.org Resolution|--- |WONTFIX Severity|enhancement |normal --- Comment #72 from Mark A. Hershberger m...@everybody.org --- Comment #65 is a succinct expression of the frustratione that users sometimes end up feeling when the Foundation changes Wikipedia and its sister sites in unexpected ways. If other sites use ULS, then it makes sense to keep track of this issue. As far as testing on low bandwidth connections, there is Bug #55842 for this issue. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 Mark A. Hershberger m...@everybody.org changed: What|Removed |Added Priority|Normal |Lowest Status|RESOLVED|PATCH_TO_REVIEW Resolution|WONTFIX |--- Severity|normal |enhancement --- Comment #73 from Mark A. Hershberger m...@everybody.org --- The performance was an issue, but also the font issue. If it really is causing editors to leave mlwiki, then it should be addressed. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 --- Comment #74 from Isarra zhoris...@gmail.com --- (In reply to comment #71) (In reply to comment #66) CSS and especially JS parts often timed out, though (and as far as I know ULS is a huge piece of JS adding substantial amounts of CSS) If that's the real issue, the answer here is further optimizing ULS load and performance characteristics and eliminating the need for a preference. Are there other reasons to want a preference beyond performance? It's a real issue. Another, more general, issue is that it adds an extra interface and fonts that for many users simply serves no purpose, or even makes things worse. There is enough clutter as is; when it comes to added features with specific use cases, folks should be able to remove what they don't use. Essentially this is a gadget in extension form, and follows, or should follow, many of the same principles. (It's true that if the first issue is resolved, it would then be more feasible for users to just hide that interface and such if desired, but such an approach is rather poor practice in the long run especially with relatively large objects such as this.) -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 Erik Moeller e...@wikimedia.org changed: What|Removed |Added CC||o...@wikimedia.org --- Comment #75 from Erik Moeller e...@wikimedia.org --- There are several separate issues here: 1) Does ULS have an unacceptable performance impact on some users which needs to be mitigated; 2) Does ULS include functionality that is simply irrelevant for some users while cluttering UI; 3) Is there a specific third party vs. WMF issue here. I think the third point is a red herring. If we agree that there are real issues to be solved, then we should solve them for everyone, not just hypothetical third party ULS users who have a hypothetical interest in offering users ULS while also offering them the option to disable it on a per-user basis. The first point, performance, has been an ongoing issue with ULS. The initial release of ULS caused insane amount of font-loading to occur on pageviews with language links. That issue was unfortunately unresolved far too late, which probably caused a lot of users to identify ULS with negative performance impact. Loading of fonts for sidebar links has been disabled since late September, and the new autonym font should offer a solution for this issue once and for all: https://blog.wikimedia.org/2013/10/28/the-autonym-font-for-language-names/ This is by far the biggest performance issue with ULS -- we're talking about megabytes of payload on some pages. I suspect, though, that even with the autonym font, we need to continue to improve font-loading behavior. It's possible to force use of system fonts; however, I don't see an option to disable font-loading altogether. Having that be an option within ULS itself may be useful for users of slow connections. Has that been discussed? The JS/CSS payload is less of an issue, and the team has already made some optimizations, though there's probably still room to do more lazy-loading so that ULS truly only adds payload to page requests when actually used. I've CC'd Ori on this bug from his perspective as Performance Engineer, though there are probably other relevant bugs where this discussion is occurring/should occur. Regarding the question if ULS should be disable-able for some users altogether, the reason I'd argue against it is that ULS is basically a core site feature: changing the UI language and language settings. It's like hiding a part of the preferences section. It's where ULS has impact that goes _beyond_ what you'd expect from a preferences/selection feature that preferences or changes to the default behavior are more appropriate. In addition to the font issue, the only other aspect of ULS where that's true is arguably the input method selection. This is really the only part of ULS that adds true clutter to the page, because it pops up in every edit field, taunting you with a feature that may be completely irrelevant to you. It _can_ be disabled and hidden with a single click from the menu. I know the UX folks have thought about a way to make the selection control itself less annoying, e.g. embedding it into form fields rather than having it come up on focus below the field. IMO we should be focusing on improvements like this. Improving the user experience in this fashion also makes sure we reach all users, and not just the small percentage who are annoyed enough to change a preference. Preferences are a form of clutter, too, and we should be very thoughtful and intentional when we add them. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 --- Comment #76 from MZMcBride b...@mzmcbride.com --- Erik and others: bug 56292 focuses on making ULS more lightweight and more performant. I think adding a user preference is a last resort. We should try to figure out why people hate ULS so much that they want to actively disable it. I'd also encourage you to look at mw.loader.inspect(). :-) Just run it from a developer console and look at the output. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 Isarra zhoris...@gmail.com changed: What|Removed |Added Status|RESOLVED|REOPENED Resolution|WONTFIX |--- --- Comment #58 from Isarra zhoris...@gmail.com --- Reopening; no reason that I could find was given for closing this bug as it currently stands, and this is indeed an issue given the nature of the extension. Useful as it may be for some folks, it can be just as problematic for others for all manner of reasons. Neither group should be ignored. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. You are the assignee for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 --- Comment #59 from MZMcBride b...@mzmcbride.com --- (In reply to comment #58) Reopening; no reason that I could find was given for closing this bug as it currently stands, and this is indeed an issue given the nature of the extension. I'm not sure what you mean by this is an indeed an issue. Can you elaborate? Useful as it may be for some folks, it can be just as problematic for others for all manner of reasons. Problematic how? --- At 59 comments, this bug is pretty complex and difficult to follow. I'd strongly recommend filing a new bug that can answer the above questions. :-) -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. You are the assignee for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 --- Comment #60 from Isarra zhoris...@gmail.com --- (In reply to comment #59) (In reply to comment #58) Reopening; no reason that I could find was given for closing this bug as it currently stands, and this is indeed an issue given the nature of the extension. I'm not sure what you mean by this is an indeed an issue. Can you elaborate? Useful as it may be for some folks, it can be just as problematic for others for all manner of reasons. Problematic how? --- At 59 comments, this bug is pretty complex and difficult to follow. I'd strongly recommend filing a new bug that can answer the above questions. :-) As I understand it, any new bug for the exact same topic would just be closed as a duplicate. Which is stupid; I agree that a new bug to try to focus the discussion is probably be in order, since most of this doesn't really go anywhere. I filed Bug 56292 for basically the same reasons (and it might answer some of those questions), but it's a slightly different, slightly more general issue. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. You are the assignee for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 --- Comment #57 from John Mark Vandenberg jay...@gmail.com --- Adblock does deactivate ULS. The correct incantatio is the rule: wikipedia.org/w/api.php?action=ulslocalizationlanguage= To disable downloading WMF webfonts, use this rule: bits.wikimedia.org/*/extensions/UniversalLanguageSelector/data/fontrepo To disable all webfonts 1) Mozilla Firefox Open about:config Set gfx.downloadable_fonts.enabled to false. 2) Google Chrome Right Click Chrome's launcher icon, click Properties. At the end of the launcher string add the following: --disable-remote-fonts (without quotes). -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. You are the assignee for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 --- Comment #52 from Nemo federicol...@tiscali.it --- This user claims to have successfully disabled ULS by using Adblock, with three rules: https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Village_pump_%28technical%29diff=562972847oldid=562970770 -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. You are the assignee for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 --- Comment #53 from Viswaprabha viswapra...@gmail.com --- https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia%3AHelp_deskoldid=562961777#Odd_lag -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. You are the assignee for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 --- Comment #54 from Viswaprabha viswapra...@gmail.com --- It is a shame that some third party site adblock has to come to the rescue of veteran Wikipedians! -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. You are the assignee for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 --- Comment #55 from Nemo federicol...@tiscali.it --- (In reply to comment #54) It is a shame that some third party site adblock has to come to the rescue of veteran Wikipedians! Well, that was a Firefox extension fixing a problem for a Firefox user, it doesn't sound so inconceivable (surely better than a reformat, ouch). -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. You are the assignee for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 --- Comment #56 from Bartosz Dziewoński matma@gmail.com --- Viswaprabha, that is probably caused by bug 49935. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. You are the assignee for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 Nemo federicol...@tiscali.it changed: What|Removed |Added CC||g...@wikimedia.org --- Comment #45 from Nemo federicol...@tiscali.it --- Sorry for adding to the meta-discussion... (In reply to comment #40) Please keep this in mind: I've been told to join the tech-ambassadors mailing list in order to follow upcoming technical changes, but the two recent really major technical changes (VE and ULS) haven't been mentioned on that list at all. Risker, ULS was announced with http://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/wikitech-ambassadors/2013-June/000271.html As regards last minute notifications, it's true that Greg's Deployment Highlights missed a couple of cc in the last two rounds, that should be easy to fix (cc'ed him in case you didn't tell him already). -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. You are the assignee for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 --- Comment #46 from Erik Moeller e...@wikimedia.org --- (In reply to comment #44) In Malayalam Wikipedia, we are currently having poll to build a community consensus to decide whether or not the ULS extension should initially present.. as disabled. As soon as we reach a consensus, we will file another bug regarding that. Hi Ajay, it would help (and we can take it to https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Talk:Universal_Language_Selector if folks would prefer that) if you could explain what the issues are. The issue I can infer from the discussion concerns fonts. If the default font is really not a good choice, then it can be changed separately to the system font without disabling ULS, just like it is on Tamil Wikipedia. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. You are the assignee for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 --- Comment #47 from Siebrand s.mazel...@xs4all.nl --- It's possible to add the following to [[MediaWiki:Common.js]] to override the ULS default configuration: $.webfonts.repository.languages.ml = [system, Meera, AnjaliOldLipi]; This will change the default font to text tagged ml from the current default to no default (i.e. a user's system font), and will make subsequent array members available as options in the font choice dialog. We advise against adding font names there that are not in the MediaWiki UniversalLanguageSelector font repo [1]. [1] https://git.wikimedia.org/tree/mediawiki%2Fextensions%2FUniversalLanguageSelector.git/HEAD/data%2Ffontrepo%2Ffonts -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. You are the assignee for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 --- Comment #48 from Bartosz Dziewoński matma@gmail.com --- (In reply to comment #43) Unfortunately it's impossible to reliably detect what fonts are present on a user's system, so we're often faced with the choice of initializing a freely licensed font, which may override a locally present font, or having some users not be able to view the page _at all_. It is possible, just hard to implement well. But it's a solved problem these days. http://www.lalit.org/lab/javascript-css-font-detect/ -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. You are the assignee for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 --- Comment #49 from Viswaprabha viswapra...@gmail.com --- AFAIK, A well implemented DOM model can even detect the rendering dimensions, not just the kind of available fonts, on the output screen. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. You are the assignee for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 --- Comment #50 from Viswaprabha viswapra...@gmail.com --- Oh, the comment#48 above is a very good demonstration of what I mentioned in comment#49! -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. You are the assignee for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 --- Comment #51 from Viswaprabha viswapra...@gmail.com --- I presume the only needed change in code for one of the issues mentioned in our community page, is to simple remove a * from the line shown here: https://git.wikimedia.org/blob/mediawiki%2Fextensions%2FUniversalLanguageSelector/20033e4fbf0c4743df5162f10c67c0751c414608/data%2Ffontrepo%2Ffonts%2FMeera%2Ffont.ini#L2 This will keep Meera being self-initiated as the preferred default font during the Webpage loading. The required change is similar to https://git.wikimedia.org/commitdiff/mediawiki%2Fextensions%2FUniversalLanguageSelector/e726f016153727d82ef1652dbe7bb4fd426035e5 -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. You are the assignee for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 --- Comment #40 from Risker risker...@gmail.com --- (In reply to comment #36) Comment 33 explained already: High-level discussions about ULS are better suited on the mailing list at https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/mediawiki-i18n If you would like to discuss what Wikimedia the Tech company is doing wrong, please do it but at https://meta.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikimedia_Forum Can we now please stay ontopic? Bugzilla is not a forum. There's no right place, Andre, and we all know that. We ask for something to be fixed anywhere, and we're told to write a bugzilla, even for high level matters. And then if we write a bugzilla about an issue that nobody wants to address, we're told to join some mailing list that has no authority to address the issue, or post on some noticeboard that also has no authority to address the issue and probably isn't even being watched by anyone who *can* address the issue. Or we can post on MediaWikiWiki, where non-techs are pretty routinely ignored. Please keep this in mind: I've been told to join the tech-ambassadors mailing list in order to follow upcoming technical changes, but the two recent really major technical changes (VE and ULS) haven't been mentioned on that list at all. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. You are the assignee for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 --- Comment #41 from Viswaprabha viswapra...@gmail.com --- So, actually, what is bugzilla? A place to play ping-pong? Or where we play ON TOPIC laurel Hardy? Sorry for asking, but I am still very Wikipedian and still very a man on the King's side. Only just confused too much about this non-Forum being part of the 'free' Wikimedia! Please do not pinch me or strangle. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. You are the assignee for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 --- Comment #42 from Helder mybugs.m...@gmail.com --- You may want to talk about this on IRC, since there will be an office hour about ULS next week: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/IRC_office_hours#Upcoming_office_hours -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. You are the assignee for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 Erik Moeller e...@wikimedia.org changed: What|Removed |Added CC||e...@wikimedia.org --- Comment #43 from Erik Moeller e...@wikimedia.org --- The discussion on ml.wikipedia.org seems to be about defaulting to the system font, rather than setting a font that doesn't work well for many users. That's a change that was already made for Tamil Wikipedia. Unfortunately it's impossible to reliably detect what fonts are present on a user's system, so we're often faced with the choice of initializing a freely licensed font, which may override a locally present font, or having some users not be able to view the page _at all_. That said, if the overwhelming consensus in the Malayalam community is that the provided font is inferior to the system font installed on many users' systems, it seems sensible to default to the system font instead, like we did for Tamil. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. You are the assignee for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 --- Comment #44 from Ajay Balachandran drajay1...@yahoo.com --- (In reply to comment #43) The discussion on ml.wikipedia.org seems to be about defaulting to the system font, rather than setting a font that doesn't work well for many users. That's a change that was already made for Tamil Wikipedia. Unfortunately it's impossible to reliably detect what fonts are present on a user's system, so we're often faced with the choice of initializing a freely licensed font, which may override a locally present font, or having some users not be able to view the page _at all_. That said, if the overwhelming consensus in the Malayalam community is that the provided font is inferior to the system font installed on many users' systems, it seems sensible to default to the system font instead, like we did for Tamil. This bug was filed to provide an option to disable ULS to all those who want it disabled. This is not limited to Malayalam Wikipedia. In Malayalam Wikipedia, we are currently having poll to build a community consensus to decide whether or not the ULS extension should initially present.. as disabled. As soon as we reach a consensus, we will file another bug regarding that. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. You are the assignee for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 --- Comment #39 from Andre Klapper aklap...@wikimedia.org --- (In reply to comment #38 by Ajay) If you click the Status link next to Status:RESOLVED WONTFIX, it explains that WONTFIX means The problem described is a bug which will never be fixed. Comment 33 said disabling ULS completely is not planned and will not happen. Comment 20 said Except for input methods, all other ULS functionalities will have no user interface that allows it to be disabled. (In reply to comment #37 by Isarra) If this is off-topic, then please point to somewhere specific where it would be on-topic and appropriate Done that already, see comment 33 (though not sure what your this is - I refered to high-level Wikimedia is doing something wrong debates). -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. You are the assignee for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 Ajay Balachandran drajay1...@yahoo.com changed: What|Removed |Added CC||drajay1...@yahoo.com --- Comment #26 from Ajay Balachandran drajay1...@yahoo.com --- I find the problem mentioned by Eduard Braun very annoying. The flickering ULS link is a major irritant. The entire process of editing has become more time consuming as well. I want to be able to switch ULS off completely. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. You are the assignee for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 46306] Add option to disable ULS
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=46306 --- Comment #27 from Nemo federicol...@tiscali.it --- (In reply to comment #26) The flickering ULS link is a major irritant. The entire process of editing has become more time consuming as well. I want to be able to switch ULS off completely. In your case, why isn't it enough to disable the input methods and choose system font? That basically disables everything, except the presence of the gear/settings icon. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. You are the assignee for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
