[Wikisource-l] Re: can't create account-- want to help validate a text

[billinghurst]

Lodge an unblock request at the talk page of your IP address, and we can 
sort out a temporary relief so you can create an account.


User the template  https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Template:Unblock in 
the form ...

{{unblock|1=your request  etc. etc.}}

and you can add a ping for my account   {{ping|billinghurst}} to get my 
attention


Please don't email me as that isn't going to provide the information to 
get around the block.


-- billinghurst



-- Original Message --
From: "Casper Oswald" 
To: wikisource-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Sent: 27/10/2021 6:35:46 AM
Subject: [Wikisource-l] can't create account-- want to help validate a 
text



Hi,

I know this is a little like reply-all-ing, but I can’t figure out to create an 
account— all IP addresses available to me are blocked, including IP address of 
my home service without a VPN. Can anyone help me sign up.

Thanks,

cmo
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[Wikisource-l] Fw: The Wikipedia Library: Search feature now available!

[billinghurst]

FYI

-- Forwarded Message --
From: "Wikipedia Library Card Platform" 


To: billinghurstw...@gmail.com
Sent: 8/10/2021 4:31:09 AM
Subject: The Wikipedia Library: Search feature now available!

Hi,

The Wikipedia Library team is excited to announce that a centralized 
search tool is now available to all users eligible to use the library!


Instead of needing to search across individual collections one-by-one, 
you’ll now be able to search content from across a wide range of 
collections from one search bar. This search tool uses the EBSCO 
Discovery Service software and contains a wide array of filtering and 
advanced search options.


To check which collections are indexed, we’ve also added icons and 
filters to My Library. Search pulls content from almost all of the 
collections which are accessible by default for eligible users (the 
Library Bundle). This means you can search with the confidence that 
every result will be accessible to you. In the future, we plan to enable 
users to turn off this limit, so that you could also search across 
collections which require individual applications, but we can’t 
guarantee that you’ll be able to access all results in this mode, as 
this depends on your individual authorizations.


To check out the search tool just head over to 
https://wikipedialibrary.wmflabs.org/, log in, and you’ll find the 
search bar at the top of your screen.


We hope you find this feature useful, and would love to hear your 
feedback at 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Talk:Library_Card_platform/Search.


Finally, as a reminder, we’re planning to start rolling out an on-wiki 
notification to editors who are eligible to use the library in the near 
future. Users will only receive the notification once. Please check 
https://translatewiki.net/w/i.php?title=Special:MessageGroupStats=ext-thewikipedialibrary 
to see if you can help translate the notification text!


Thanks,

The Wikipedia Library team

wikipedialibr...@wikimedia.org
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[Wikisource-l] Re: Submit a session for WikidataCon 2021

[billinghurst]

Do we think that there is anything special that we are wanting to get 
onto the agenda?


I know that I still have my needs around data input and autocompletion
* improved data input from the Wikisource (something better than WEF), 
ie. better author creation for more pertinent fields; ability to add 
subpages of works more easily with auto-completed data to quicken data 
input
* improved ability to interlink between WS <=> Commons <=> WD <=> WP; 
including continued improvements to citation templates
* from WD, or from WS, create a linked Author page, in a new improved 
way than I can from Phe's tool that does an enWP lookup
* better search functionality for people; something that allows me to 
search based on birth year, and death year, and maybe fuzzy versions of 
years


-- billinghurst

-- Original Message --
From: "Bodhisattwa Mandal" 
To: "discussion list for Wikisource, the free library" 


Sent: 30/09/2021 5:49:05 PM
Subject: [Wikisource-l] Submit a session for WikidataCon 2021


Hello all,

After the first two editions in 2017 
<https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Wikidata:WikidataCon_2017> and 2019 
<https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Wikidata:WikidataCon_2019>, the 
WikidataCon is taking place again from 29 October to 31 October 2021, 
but this time it will be an online event. You can find the details in 
the event page here - 
https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Wikidata:WikidataCon_2021
The call for proposals to present a session on the second and third day 
of the conference is now open until 20 October 2021 (midnight anywhere 
on earth). You are welcome to submit a session in this link - 
https://pretalx.com/wdcon21/submit/beTaVM/info/


The program will have tracks like Sister Project, GLAM, Reimaging 
Wikidata, Tips and Tools which can very well accommodate the 
Wikisource-Wikidata integration and other related works.


Regards,

Bodhisattwa

(On behalf of WikidataCon 2021)



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Re: [Wikisource-l] Wikisource Conference in Warsaw 2020/2021

[billinghurst]

Whilst 2020 has benefits, they are not benefits that would enable me to 
attend,  Cannot get away to 2021. :-(   It effectively becomes two weeks 
away for me when you take into account travel time, the days held, and 
recovery time, and I cannot manage that in 2020 at that time.  (and yes 
I know that it isn't about me)


Happy to contribute.

-- billinghurst

-- Original Message --
From: "Jon Harald Søby" 
To: "discussion list for Wikisource, the free library" 


Sent: 18/12/2019 11:20:08 PM
Subject: Re: [Wikisource-l] Wikisource Conference in Warsaw 2020/2021

This is a great initiative, I'm very happy to learn about it. I think 
autumn 2020 would be better – sooner rather than later.
I'd be happy to serve in a committee as well if more people are needed. 
:-)


ons. 18. des. 2019 kl. 10:05 skrev Natalia Szafran-Kozakowska 
:

Hi all
I confirm that as Wikimedia Poland we are very happy to help you with 
the conference and even more happy to see your wonderful community in 
Warsaw!
As Claudia mentioned we already had a great conversation with WMAT to 
get to know a bit more about their experience and to learn how to 
bring the best from Vienna to Warsaw. I'm happy that so many of you 
want to engage in the process and I already have a lot of good 
feelings about this event.
The most important thing for now is to decide on the date which would 
work best for you. As Ankry mentioned - in order to have it in Autumn 
2020 we need to fill the grant application till February 10th (which 
is perfectly doable). Having it later - in Spring 2021 gives us more 
preparation time but there is a risk of losing some energy overtime.
But it is up to your community to decide - WMPL is more than happy to 
be the fiscal sponsor in both cases :)



śr., 18 gru 2019 o 07:59 balaji  napisał(a):

Hello Ankry,

Thanks for initiating this. With many issues around wikisource and  
much chance of learning from each other community it is right time we 
have a separate conference dedicated for wikisource.


Please count me in for any help regarding organising the conference.

Regards,
J. Balaji.
User:Balajijagadesh

On Wed, Dec 18, 2019 at 1:24 AM Mardetanha 
 wrote:
I am also happy to hear such good news. and Thanks for WMPL for 
support and help.

Mardetanha


On Tue, Dec 17, 2019 at 12:28 PM Garád, Claudia 
 wrote:

Hi all,

this is great news - I'm really excited by the prospect of a 
Wikisource Conference in Warsaw!


WMAT has already had a long call with Nathalia to share our 
experiences from organising the 2015 edition and of course we are 
here to support the next conference as best as we can!


Cheers

Claudia



Am 17.12.2019 um 05:43 schrieb Bodhisattwa Mandal:

Hi Ankry,

Thanks for taking up the initiative to organise the much needed 
conference. Wikisource is now a much more visible project in India 
compared to 2015, when we participated in the last conference. 
It's gaining importance within the Indian academic and librarian 
circles. We already have some partnerships in different parts of 
India and hopefully there will be a major partnership news coming 
soon regarding Wikisource .


Anyway, in this regard, I personally feel 2021 is bit far away. If 
this is not much a problem for WMPL or the user group, we can go 
for Autumn 2020 as it would be great for Indian communities to 
interact with the larger community and gain more knowledge at this 
vital time of growth. Please be assured, that any help needed from 
our side as Indian Wikisource communities and affiliates 
supporting Wikisource projects will be provided whenever needed.


Regards,
Bodhisattwa


On Tue, 17 Dec 2019, 04:51 Ankry,  wrote:

Hi all,

As some of you already noticed, we were talking on Saturday not 
only about Wikimedia Summit, but also about plans concerning 
Wikisource Conference sequel. The first Wikisource Conference 
took place in Vienna in 2015. Maybe, five years later, it is good 
time to organize the next event?


The only way for this to happen is to receive a grant from WMF. 
Recently, I have got a confirmation from my chapter that 
Wikimedia Polska is willing to help us to apply for the grant and 
to organize Wikimedia Conference in Warsaw as a fiscal sponsor 
<https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Grants:Fiscal_sponsorships>. 
(AFAIK this is the same procedure that was applied to the 
conference in Vienna).


What they need from us? We need:

to organize various commitees (Organizing Commitee, Program 
Commitee, Grant Comission, etc); the discussion on Saturday 
showed that there are people among us who want help in theese. Of 
course the more people, the betterto decide when we want the 
Conference. There are two possible dates: Autumn 2020 (likely 
September) and Spring 2021 (likely May); we need to decide which 
one is preferred and the decision is a bit urgent as for the near 
term the deadline for grant application is 10 February (however 
it is a realistic plan). At the moment this question i

Re: [Wikisource-l] PDF preview missing (429 Error generating thumbnail)

[billinghurst]

There has been an issue with the image intensity of PDF being too high 
for thumbnail generation which I believe that some have solved by 
resampling at a lower rate.  There was some discussion in English WS's 
Scriptorium within the past half year where people were asking for 
fixes, if you want the full detail.


-- billinghurst

-- Original Message --
From: "Lars Aronsson" 
To: "Wikimedia developers" ; 
"Wikisource" 

Sent: 26/09/2019 6:56:51 PM
Subject: [Wikisource-l] PDF preview missing (429 Error generating 
thumbnail)



On September 16, ten days ago, I got a relapse and started to
contribute to Wikisource again. I found some nice PDF files
and uploaded them to Commons, a total of 81 issues of the
official gazette of Finland from the winter 1878. I have
since then been proofreading several pages from the first
week of March (when the peace at San Stefano was signed), e.g.
https://sv.wikisource.org/wiki/Finlands_Allmänna_Tidning_1878-03-05

But previews (thumbnails) have been generated for none of these
81 PDF files. I am able to proofread the text (embedded in the PDF)
only because I keep local copies of the PDFs that I can view.
https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Finlands_Allmänna_Tidning_1878

On September 17, I asked about this problem on the Help desk,
https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Commons:Help_desk#PDF_previews_missing
and a kind person registered the problem in Phabricator,
https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T151202
but then nothing has happened in more than a week.
So there is not only a problem in generating thumbnails, but
also in responding to a reported problem.

I don't even know if there is a technical problem with the
PDF files I uploaded or if this is a temporary technical
problem on Commons. (But since I can view the local files,
I assume the files are okay.)


--   Lars Aronsson (l...@aronsson.se)
  Linköping, Sweden



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Re: [Wikisource-l] Pages where template include size is exceeded

[billinghurst]

The templates "Dotted TOC ..." were experimental templates that were 
never finished and are notoriously inefficient. I refuse to use them. Do 
simpler tables and don't worry about the dot leaders.


-- Billinghurst

-- Original Message --
From: "balaji" <balajijagad...@gmail.com>
To: "discussion list for Wikisource, the free library" 
<wikisource-l@lists.wikimedia.org>

Sent: 7/04/2018 4:04:20 PM
Subject: [Wikisource-l] Pages where template include size is exceeded


Hi,
 I have created a transclusion page in ta.wikisource where some 
pages are not displayed. A localised category which in English means 
"Pages where template include size is exceeded"


https://translatewiki.net/wiki/MediaWiki:Post-expand-template-inclusion-category

https://translatewiki.net/wiki/MediaWiki:Post-expand-template-inclusion-category/ta

The page is  https://ta.wikisource.org/s/8wuc

What to be done for all the pages to be displayed.

Regards,
J. Balaji
(User:Balajijagadesh)___
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Re: [Wikisource-l] Wikidata property for non-fiction characters

[billinghurst]

Aren't they just called people? What are you looking to achieve?
depicts(P180) <https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Property:P180>statement is 
subject of(P805) <https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Property:P805>

subject has role(P2868) <https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Property:P2868>
owner of(P1830) <https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Property:P1830>
dedicated to(P825) <https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Property:P825>
identity of subject in context(P4649) 
<https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Property:P4649>

patron(P1962) <https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Property:P1962>
I predominantly use P805 where it is a chapter, or biographical entry 
about a person, so if you can give more context


-- Billinghurst

-- Original Message --
From: "Bodhisattwa Mandal" <bodhisattwa.rg...@gmail.com>
To: "discussion list for Wikisource, the free library" 
<wikisource-l@lists.wikimedia.org>

Sent: 7/04/2018 12:03:09 AM
Subject: [Wikisource-l] Wikidata property for non-fiction characters


Hi,

is there any Wikidata property for characters depicted in non-fiction 
literatures? I found Properties like characters (P674) for fictions, 
depicts (P180) for works like paintings, main subject (P921) for 
primary topic of a work, but couldn't find something for non-fictions. 
Am I missing something?


--
Bodhisattwa
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[Wikisource-l] Frankenstein's 200th birthday

[billinghurst]

A thought bubble that I shared on enWS was whether the broader Wikisource
community had an interest in getting English language and available
translations online in 2018.  I thought it would be a bit of a wikimedia
talking point if we could do soemthing for such an iconic work.

For non-English languages are there scans available of public domain
translations? I know that enWS and frWS have 1831 editions,  though not
scan-supported.

Regards, Billinghurst
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Re: [Wikisource-l] Do we have tools for offline collaboration?

[billinghurst]

Though that would defeat the purpose of online proofreading with account 
verification. Some of the true value of our online process is that 
contribution builds a level of trust and knowledge and that is reflected 
in both our patrolling and the allocation of autopatrolled status.  Also 
how would you have access to templates, and components like that from 
off-line?


Also we generally cannot download the images separately as that is 
usually part of the later clean-up where people have the technical 
skills.


So yes, there is the capacity to have the text and proofread the text, 
that actual checking the text against the image is not the sole 
component of proofreading, and further it would not be at all helpful 
for validation.


-- billinghurst

-- Original Message --
From: "mathieu stumpf guntz" <psychosl...@culture-libre.org>
To: "discussion list for Wikisource, the free library" 
<wikisource-l@lists.wikimedia.org>

Sent: 25/03/2018 1:58:32 AM
Subject: [Wikisource-l] Do we have tools for offline collaboration?


Hello,

A person in a local Wikisource workshop asked me if we could download 
all material of a specific work to proofread it offline. So download 
both the pictures and the OCRed text. Additionaly I think it would be 
good to provide tool to at least have side by side plain text and 
pictures.


So, are you aware of anything close to such a tool? :)

Cheers
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Re: [Wikisource-l] Can any local language Wikisource release their few books in CC BY-NC-ND 3.0

[billinghurst]

Below is part of your answer, the statements are old and may be more 
statements that official policy of the board.  If you want a direct 
answer for the Foundation's existing policy, then I would suggest 
writing to le...@wikimedia.org and ask for them to direct you to the 
current policy.


-- billinghurst


https://wikisource.org/wiki/Wikisource:Copyright_policy
Non-commercial licenses
Although Wikisource itself does not make commercial use of works, its 
license does allow redistributors to make such commercial use. 
Therefore, works with non-commercial licenses are prohibited from 
Wikisource.


Such licenses are prohibited by decision of the President of the 
Wikimedia Foundation, as indicated by the 2004 message by Jimbo Wales 
<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jimbo_Wales> entitled "WikiEN-l, Use of 
noncommercial-only images 
<http://mail.wikimedia.org/pipermail/wikien-l/2004-April/012156.html>". 
In 2006, Jimbo Wales explicitly confirmed in #wikimedia 
 that this decision applied to 
Wikisource, declaring that "Noncommercial-only licenses are basically 
the same thing as torturing kittens." Angela 
<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Angela>, board member, has also 
explicitly stated noncommercial licenses are unacceptable; see 
"Foundation-l, Juriwiki-l, Re: Copyright complaints 
<http://mail.wikipedia.org/pipermail/foundation-l/2006-February/006015.html>".





-- Original Message --
From: "Jayanta Nath" <jayanta...@gmail.com>
To: "discussion list for Wikisource, the free library" 
<wikisource-l@lists.wikimedia.org>

Sent: 4/02/2018 11:35:34 PM
Subject: Re: [Wikisource-l] Can any local language Wikisource release 
their few books in CC BY-NC-ND 3.0


I have met few Bengali Writer and family member of writer who had died. 
 .


Few of them ready to give us for permission to us.  But they are not to 
agree to release it  Creative Commons Attribution-ShareAlike License 
<https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/3.0/>;  
https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/3.0/ 
<https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/3.0/>


Their main concern about commercial use of their text, if derivative in 
translation, it will be not any issue of them. They have no issue for 
published at Wikisource.  So what should be the licence and how we 
published in Bengali Wikisource?


But they are ready to release all their book at  
Attribution-NonCommercial-NoDerivs 3.0 Unported (CC BY-NC-ND 3.0). 
https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-nd/3.0/ 
<https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-nd/3.0/> or any equal 
license.



On Sun, Feb 4, 2018 at 5:59 PM, Nicolas VIGNERON 
<vigneron.nico...@gmail.com> wrote:

(quickly as I'm not on my computer)

Indeed, local projects can have an Exemption Doctrine Policy (EDP) : 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Non-free_content 
<https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Non-free_content> but this is not 
something really encouraged.


Can you maybe provide some context, why do you need CC BY-NC-ND?

Cdlt, ~nicolas

2018-02-04 11:31 GMT+01:00 Jayanta Nath <jayanta...@gmail.com>:

Dear All,

I need some clarification. I know that Wikisource release our content 
CC BY-SA 3.0.  Can any local language Wikisource release their few 
books in CC BY-NC-ND 3.0. ( Attribution-NonCommercial-NoDerivs 3.0 
Unported) by approving by the local policy?? OR We have to approved 
by WMF.



Regards,
Jayanta Nath


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Re: [Wikisource-l] Bengali Wikisource Search result, retrun from Commons image, not from Local.

[billinghurst]

https://bn.wikisource.org/w/index.php?search=intitle%3Areligion+local%3A=%E0%A6%AC%E0%A6%BF%E0%A6%B6%E0%A7%87%E0%A6%B7%3A%E0%A6%85%E0%A6%A8%E0%A7%81%E0%A6%B8%E0%A6%A8%E0%A7%8D%E0%A6%A7%E0%A6%BE%E0%A6%A8=advanced=1=1



I can see them

-- Original Message --
From: "Jayanta Nath" 
To: "discussion list for Wikisource, the free library" 


Sent: 25/12/2017 7:37:30 PM
Subject: [Wikisource-l] Bengali Wikisource Search result, retrun from 
Commons image, not from Local.


Bengali Wikisource Search result, retrun from Commons image, not from 
Local.


Here is below link of search result
https://bn.wikisource.org/w/index.php?search=intitle%3AReligion=Special:Search=advanced=1=1=6awbgihj0673wlyxxhy6qu32z

There are many local PDF/djvu files with word of intitle:Religion, but 
no result found.


Regards,

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Re: [Wikisource-l] wikisource "work" pages or "multiple editions" pages

[billinghurst]

Anika,

That is matter long resolved in my opinion with the change in the 
default search namespaces that the communities made, and similarly with 
our redefining content namespaces. While main namespace will always take 
preference to the other nss in results, they show up pretty quickly 
where you have an intitle: match.


At enWS I would say that we lost more searches to subpages, so with the 
ability to change your search preferences with subphrase matches, much 
of that is addressed (though it is not the default search configuration 
at this point).


The completion suggester 
<https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Special:MyLanguage/Extension:CirrusSearch/CompletionSuggester> 
is an algorithm for search suggestions with better typo correction and 
search relevance.

Default (recommended)
Corrects up to two typos. Resolves close redirects.
Subphrase matching (recommended for longer page titles)
Corrects up to two typos. Resolves close redirects. Matches subphrase in 
titles.

Strict mode (advanced)
No typo correction. No accent folding. Strict matching.
Redirect mode (advanced)
No typo correction. Resolves close redirects.
Redirect mode with subphrase matching (advanced)
No typo correction. Resolves close redirects. Matches subphrase in 
titles.


Regards, Billinghurst


-- Original Message --
From: "Anika Born" <wikian...@wikipedia.de>
To: "discussion list for Wikisource, the free library" 
<wikisource-l@lists.wikimedia.org>

Sent: 2/11/2017 6:37:29 PM
Subject: Re: [Wikisource-l] wikisource "work" pages or "multiple 
editions" pages


2017-11-01 16:40 GMT+01:00 Nicolas VIGNERON 
<vigneron.nico...@gmail.com>:


From afar, the Opera: pages on it.ws are very close to the pages with 
the template {{Éditions}} on fr.ws or the template {{Versions}} on 
en.ws (and similar system elsewhere).


The main difference is having a separate namespace A second major 
difference is that the templates on fr.ws and en.ws are very light 
while the {{Opera}} template took data from Wikidata (but that's an 
independent problem, it's possible to change the {{Éditions}} or 
{{Versions}} templates to do exactly the same thing without having a 
specific namespace).


I'm almost convinced too, but in order to create a new namespace on a 
project you have to convinced the local community. That's why I'm 
still playing the Devil's advocate role and want to learn about the 
inconvenients of this system


A reason why there are no different namespaces for work-, edition-, 
author-, list- and other portal pages in de.ws is the ws-search. When 
you are looking for "Goethe" in the (simple) search (as readers may do) 
on WS, you might get to
* 
https://de.wikisource.org/wiki/Tafellied,_zu_Goethe%E2%80%99s_Geburtstage 
but not to
* https://de.wikisource.org/wiki/Johann_Wolfgang_von_Goethe 
<https://de.wikisource.org/wiki/Johann_Wolfgang_von_Goethe#Bibliographien> 
with all the interesting stuff, if that page was in another 
namespace...


So there was the desition to use templates (and categories) for these 
different kind of pages: 
https://de.wikisource.org/wiki/Wikisource:Seiten_zu_Autoren,_Texten,_Themen,_Listen


I think German Wikisource Community won't give this up and switch to 
using multiple namespaces (besides Wikisource: and Page:namespace).


Best
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[Wikisource-l] Fw[2]: Re[2]: WikidataCon 2017

[billinghurst]

oops, circulated reply settings weren't correct yesterday ...

(clearly I need to go to bed, THIS one)

-- Forwarded Message --
From: "billinghurst" <billinghurstw...@gmail.com>
To: "wikisourc...@list.wikimedia.org" <wikisourc...@list.wikimedia.org>
Sent: 25/10/2017 11:06:37 PM
Subject: Fw: Re[2]: [Wikisource-l] WikidataCon 2017

oops, circulated reply settings weren't correct yesterday ...

-- Forwarded Message --
From: "billinghurst" <billinghurstw...@gmail.com>
To: "Gerard Meijssen" <gerard.meijs...@gmail.com>
Sent: 24/10/2017 11:48:51 PM
Subject: Re[2]: [Wikisource-l] WikidataCon 2017

Gerard,

Then ... what would be valuable is a tool that can change the interwiki 
badge. At the moment, there are no tools that enable us to be able to 
change a work from not proofread, to proofread, to validated.   We know 
the status of each work at the respective Wikisource through the Index: 
ns page, so we should be able to botify pushing that status through to 
the interwiki.  There was a technical inability that prevented it being 
done from memory. and I have a ticket there somewhere in the phabricator 
morass for Wikidata.


For example enW validated works are at 
https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Special:PagesWithBadges?badge=Q20748093   
 [I know that I have incrementally changing flags for the works that I 
have done, but as a manual process it just takes time. ]


Taking the validated and proofread works (from Index namespace at enWS) 
would give you 4000 works.Once that is done, we can then also start 
pulling that data back to the wikis, and with good templating we can 
then look utilise that on Author pages.


Regards, Billinghurst


-- Original Message --
From: "Gerard Meijssen" <gerard.meijs...@gmail.com>
To: "billinghurst" <billinghurstw...@gmail.com>; "discussion list for 
Wikisource, the free library" <wikisource-l@lists.wikimedia.org>

Sent: 23/10/2017 10:48:45 PM
Subject: Re: [Wikisource-l] WikidataCon 2017


Hoi,
A Wikipedia matra is be bold and another is that things are a work in 
progress. In my opinion, what we need is the name of a book, its author 
and the fact that people can read it. All the other stuff like what 
"version" is a particular book pales in comparison. We should not let 
the quest for perfection be the enemy of the good.


Also Archive.org and Open Library are two different entities. Both the 
Open Library and the Internet Archive have their own identifiers for 
authors and they are not necessarily linked. We are talking about books 
from the Open Library and they are available as an E-book or a PDF.


My problem is not with Open Library, my problem is that we do not know 
what is available from Wikisource as a finished good ready for reading. 
In the end what we advertise is the author the book, versions are 
secondary.

Thanks,
GerardM

On 23 October 2017 at 12:36, billinghurst <billinghurstw...@gmail.com> 
wrote:

Hi Nicolas,

Still my biggest issues/hurdles for good data are
capture of information from WS to WD — it just is hard work, WEF tool 
is still not sufficiently alignedthe ever problematic inability to 
link WP book to WS edition through Wikidatathat cannot capture 
information for Wikidata at archive.org, and relate that through to 
the file at Commons, and then the edition at Wikisource (or pick 
another starting point and interrelate0the inability to create an 
edition from a book/work, the inability to create a work from an 
edition
Maybe you can even ask what we need to improve to get bots to run 
through and autocapture, is our meta-data in headers not suitable? 
What is it that is problematic?


Thanks for asking.

-- billinghurst (being so remote for the action )


-- Original Message --
From: "Nicolas VIGNERON" <vigneron.nico...@gmail.com>
To: "discussion list for Wikisource, the free library" 
<wikisource-l@lists.wikimedia.org 
<mailto:wikisource-l@lists.wikimedia.org>>

Sent: 23/10/2017 7:30:44 PM
Subject: [Wikisource-l] WikidataCon 2017


Hi all,

For information, the WikidataCon is this week-end in Berlin. While 
there is no talk nominatively around Wikisource, there is some 
intervention on relation subjects (inventaire.io, WikiCite, German 
National Library, FRBR, and so on).


The event is sold out, but you can follow remotely some of the 
presentation (link will be added here : 
https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Wikidata:WikidataCon_2017/Program/Remote 
<https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Wikidata:WikidataCon_2017/Program/Remote> 
).


I'll be there and I'll be happy to talk about Wikisource, who else 
will be there?


Cdlt, ~nicolas


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[Wikisource-l] Fw: Re[2]: Validated works on kowikisource?

[billinghurst]

oops, circulated reply settings weren't correct yesterday ...

-- Forwarded Message --
From: "billinghurst" <billinghurstw...@gmail.com>
To: "discussion list for Wikisource, the free library" 
<wikisource-l@lists.wikimedia.org>

Sent: 12/10/2017 6:21:28 PM
Subject: Re[2]: [Wikisource-l] Validated works on kowikisource?

The validation flag for wikisource on wikidata is a manual switch, and 
none of the available external tools/toys are able to tweak it at this 
point of time.


-- billinghurst

-- Original Message --
From: "Gerard Meijssen" <gerard.meijs...@gmail.com>
To: "discussion list for Wikisource, the free library" 
<wikisource-l@lists.wikimedia.org>

Sent: 12/10/2017 5:14:15 PM
Subject: Re: [Wikisource-l] Validated works on kowikisource?


Hoi,
What does it take to get the validation-status in Wikidata. If anything 
it is the most important attribute. Knowing what people can read trumps 
everything.

Thanks,
 GerardM

On 12 October 2017 at 07:22, Sam Wilson <s...@samwilson.id.au> wrote:
Nope. The validation-status data is unlikely to ever be in Wikidata. 
The tool below gets this information from category-membership of Index 
pages.



On Thu, 12 Oct 2017, at 01:18 PM, Gerard Meijssen wrote:

Hoi,
Is there a query in Wikidata for all the validated and complete books 
in Wikisource?

Thanks,
  GerardM

On 12 October 2017 at 06:14, Sam Wilson <s...@samwilson.id.au> wrote:

> No validated works found for ko

The ws-cat-browser is saying it can't find any validated and 
categorized

mainspace works on kowikisource.

Is this correct? Is there any meant to be anything in the
validated-index category?
https://ko.wikisource.org/wiki/%EB%B6%84%EB%A5%98:%EA%B2%80%EC%A6%9D%EB%90%9C_%EC%83%89%EC%9D%B8 
<https://ko.wikisource.org/wiki/%EB%B6%84%EB%A5%98:%EA%B2%80%EC%A6%9D%EB%90%9C_%EC%83%89%EC%9D%B8>


Thanks,
Sam.

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Re: [Wikisource-l] Validated works on kowikisource?

[billinghurst]

The validation flag for wikisource on wikidata is a manual switch, and 
none of the available external tools/toys are able to tweak it at this 
point of time.


-- billinghurst

-- Original Message --
From: "Gerard Meijssen" <gerard.meijs...@gmail.com>
To: "discussion list for Wikisource, the free library" 
<wikisource-l@lists.wikimedia.org>

Sent: 12/10/2017 5:14:15 PM
Subject: Re: [Wikisource-l] Validated works on kowikisource?


Hoi,
What does it take to get the validation-status in Wikidata. If anything 
it is the most important attribute. Knowing what people can read trumps 
everything.

Thanks,
 GerardM

On 12 October 2017 at 07:22, Sam Wilson <s...@samwilson.id.au> wrote:
Nope. The validation-status data is unlikely to ever be in Wikidata. 
The tool below gets this information from category-membership of Index 
pages.



On Thu, 12 Oct 2017, at 01:18 PM, Gerard Meijssen wrote:

Hoi,
Is there a query in Wikidata for all the validated and complete books 
in Wikisource?

Thanks,
  GerardM

On 12 October 2017 at 06:14, Sam Wilson <s...@samwilson.id.au> wrote:

> No validated works found for ko

The ws-cat-browser is saying it can't find any validated and 
categorized

mainspace works on kowikisource.

Is this correct? Is there any meant to be anything in the
validated-index category?
https://ko.wikisource.org/wiki/%EB%B6%84%EB%A5%98:%EA%B2%80%EC%A6%9D%EB%90%9C_%EC%83%89%EC%9D%B8 
<https://ko.wikisource.org/wiki/%EB%B6%84%EB%A5%98:%EA%B2%80%EC%A6%9D%EB%90%9C_%EC%83%89%EC%9D%B8>


Thanks,
Sam.

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Re: [Wikisource-l] Wikisource for Alaska Native Elder stories?

[billinghurst]

Recording the oral history, especially of those peoples that didn't
use a published medium is one that has been mentioned though never
progressed to a conclusion. I am presuming that this is because it is
a limited group of people, and the thought of shepherding it through
is burdensome to newbies.

To me it is primarily a matter for old/mul wikisource as they are the
wiki that caters for small language groups, and predominantly
(exclusively?) all our small languages are at https://wikisource.org.
So I wouldn't want to be speak authoritatively for that community. I
think that it would mean an adaptation to our existing scope, though
would think that there is scope for the community to reasonably expand
scope.

That said, I can talk about our (existing) principles. We are a
library and we have been reproducing public domain and freely licensed
works. We do this with a two step process of two proofreads by
different people as a validated process.

For these languages
* we don't have a language configuration existing
=> so that wiki would need to address that.
* The wiki may also want to consider whether such works would be in
the main namespace
=> if not, they may seek to separate to an oral history-type namespace


So my questions would be
* Are we talking about recordings?  Or are we talking about typed
transcriptions. Presumably one or the other uploaded to Commons
=> Transcriptions in djvu are easy as they can fit within our
back-of-house tools
=> Recordings will require thinking about the process of workflow,
especially in a language
Either way, presumably something that can be work with after being

If you are talking about "no" transcriptions and a place to present
hosted (local or commons), then our visual infrastructure is not
configured to focus on voice, so that would require an extension of
our approach.

If you are talking a combination of visual/pictographic and audio,
that will require an amalgam of approaches.

All sounds possible, though it is going to take good discussions with
plenty of to and fro, and possibly directly with the parties.

I suggest that translations into English which would be at English
Wikisource, rely on answers in the above questions before you can even
step through to the peculiarities of another wiki.

Regards, Billinghurst

On Wed, Feb 24, 2016 at 7:15 PM, Pine W <wiki.p...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi Nicolas,
>
> I am guessing that the languages will be in Alaska Native languages
> primarily, perhaps with some alternative translations in English.
>
> My guess is that there will be a mix of oral stories with stories that are
> represented in images like totem poles.
>
> Would you have some time on Sunday when we could meet? I can message you
> off-list to set up a time.
>
> Pine
>
> On Tue, Feb 23, 2016 at 11:45 PM, Nicolas VIGNERON
> <vigneron.nico...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>> 2016-02-24 8:32 GMT+01:00 Pine W <wiki.p...@gmail.com>:
>>>
>>> Hi Wikisourcers,
>>>
>>> We in Cascadia Wikimedians have been contacted regarding the topic of
>>> Wikimedia resources that could be used to host materials related to Alaska
>>> Native Elder stories. I'm familiar with Wikisource largely from what I've
>>> heard about it. I've only made one edit. Is there an experienced Wikisourcer
>>> who might be available for me to meet with via IRC or Hangouts sometime, so
>>> that I can get familiar with the basics and provide appropriate guidance
>>> regarding the possibility of uploading Alaska Native Elder stories to
>>> Wikisource?
>>>
>>> Thanks!
>>>
>>> Pine
>>
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> Great news !
>>
>> I'm seasoned but probably not the best suited but I can help (via IRC and
>> at least for the basics).
>> Some questions first, to help understand what we're talking about and how
>> to best deal with it :
>> - In what language are these stories ?
>> - Is it books or oral literature ?
>>
>> Cdlt, ~nicolas
>>
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Re: [Wikisource-l] Vote for Google OCR-Wikisource integration in 2015 community wishlist

[billinghurst]

Apologies for not replying earlier.

I have managed to get the attention of WMF staff and they have pushed this
to the right section within WMF to talk to Google.

I suggest that we give them a week to get their head around the issues, and
be able to ask questions.

This falls into the important, though not screamingly urgent, category.

We should have a Phabricator ticket for this. So we can track better.

--Billinghurst

On Mon, 22 Feb 2016 03:13 Bodhisattwa Mandal <bodhisattwa.rg...@gmail.com>
wrote:

> Hi,
>
> Of course, I am aware that Google' s goal does not match with ours. But I
> am talking about possibility of any negotiation in this matter because we
> don't have other options but to use the Google OCR tool. If we had other
> better OCR options, I would not raise the issue.
>
> By the way, we are not using Cloud Vision API for the script now, so still
> we are doing it without paying any money, but this shows that may be in
> near future, we have to pay them. I am just being cautious in advance.
>
> There may or may not be any negotiation, either way, we will utilise the
> Google OCR fully as far as we can. We will find other ways to do it.
>
> Regards,
> On Feb 21, 2016 9:04 PM, "Mathieu Stumpf Guntz" <
> psychosl...@culture-libre.org> wrote:
>
>>
>>
>> Le 20/02/2016 13:07, Federico Leva (Nemo) a écrit :
>>
>>> Bodhisattwa Mandal, 19/02/2016 18:02:
>>>
>>>> And when we were getting some hope, Google announced that they will
>>>> charge for doing OCR using their drive.
>>>> https <https://cloud.google.com/vision/>
>>>>
>>>
>>> Makes sense.
>>>
>>>
>>>> Is there any chance that WMF will go for negotiation with Google so that
>>>> we can do the mass OCR free of charge?
>>>>
>>>
>>> What makes you think that Google's goals may match with ours?
>>>
>> Just asking will produce more certainty than speculating on matching
>> agendas. :)
>>
>>>
>>> Nemo
>>>
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Re: [Wikisource-l] Index page move with corresponding Page: move

[billinghurst]

I would think that pywikibot (through Wikisource-bot or your own
version) would be able to make the moves of Index and Page pretty
easily. Wikisource-bot doesn't have move rights at Commons, however,
that is not insurmountable, nor a pre-requisite. As Ankry said, the
other issue is if you have already transcluded pages as then your main
ns pages will need to be modified, though that is usually not
insurmountable either.

If Wikisource-bot (hosted on toolllabs) is of interest to your
community, we can give it a trial, and you can work out whether it is
a worthwhile for longer term use.

Regards, Billinghurst

On Sun, Jan 24, 2016 at 5:36 PM, Jayanta Nath <jayanta...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> Are there ant tool / bot to Index page move with corresponding Page: move.
> We need to rename/move some index page. How could we do?
>
> Regards,
> Jayanta Nath
>
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Re: [Wikisource-l] Template help needed

[billinghurst]

English Wikisource has documentation too. See

https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Help:Footnotes_and_endnotes

To note that you can use multiple versions of  if the
reference carries on.  Also to note that you cannot use numbers in the
ref name, the extension doesn't play, so at enWS we would usually do
something like   where it is the initial page and
continue it. I have never seen two footnotes start and continue from
the same page, so it is pretty safe.

-- Billinghurst

On Mon, Jan 18, 2016 at 6:37 PM, Ankry <an...@mif.pg.gda.pl> wrote:
>> Hi,
>>
>> I need a template solution for the following proof-reading problem I faced
>> in Bengali Wikisource.
>>
>> There is a reference in Page 1 which is continued in Page 2. I have used
>> the following code in Page 1:-
>>
>>  Text of Page 1 reference and text of Page 2
>> reference
>>
>> It was okay while proof-reading, but when it was transcluded in mainspace,
>> its not working. There the text of Page 2 reference is not shown.
>>
>> Can anyone help me with a solution? Do we need some more templates?
>> Thanks.
>
> This is supported by cite extention internally. Just use:
> ... on the following page(s), as described
> here:
>   
> https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:Cite#Merging_two_texts_into_a_single_reference
>
> Ankry
>
>
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Re: [Wikisource-l] Template help needed

[billinghurst]

I don't see *two* footnotes start and continue from the one page, I
just see one footnote start on 18 to19, and another start on 19 to 20.
I don't see see two footnotes continue start on 18 or 19 and both
continue to subsequent pages.

-- billinghurst

On Tue, Jan 19, 2016 at 12:42 AM, Ankry <an...@mif.pg.gda.pl> wrote:
> Billinghurst wrote:
>> To note that you can use multiple versions of  if the
>> reference carries on.  Also to note that you cannot use numbers in the
>> ref name, the extension doesn't play, so at enWS we would usually do
>> something like   where it is the initial page and
>> continue it. I have never seen two footnotes start and continue from
>> the same page, so it is pretty safe.
>
> It happens. See
>
> https://pl.wikisource.org/wiki/Strona:Cesarz_Juljan_Apostata_i_jego_satyra_Symposion.djvu/16
>
> https://pl.wikisource.org/wiki/Strona:Cesarz_Juljan_Apostata_i_jego_satyra_Symposion.djvu/17
>
> Ankry
>
>
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Re: [Wikisource-l] Template help needed

[billinghurst]

Ah okay. Slightly different situation than I was trying to explain.


That is just butt ugly. I can think of some tricky ways to do it in a
presentation space so it sort of is like that, but all ultimately
pointless for main namespace. I would simply move it forward a page
and add a  about why in the footer of both pages.
Ultimately that is a typesetting matter, not the author's intent, so
why waste time going picture perfect.

-- billinghurst

On Tue, Jan 19, 2016 at 1:50 AM, Ankry <an...@mif.pg.gda.pl> wrote:
> See footnotes 15 & 16:
>
> footnote 15 starts on page 16 and continues on 17
> footnote 16 is referenced at page 16, so it starts as empty footnote on
> page 16 also and continues on 17 (full footnote text there)
>
> If you can suggest another solution, I will be intrigued.
>
> Ankry
>
>> I don't see *two* footnotes start and continue from the one page, I
>> just see one footnote start on 18 to19, and another start on 19 to 20.
>> I don't see see two footnotes continue start on 18 or 19 and both
>> continue to subsequent pages.
>>
>> -- billinghurst
>>
>> On Tue, Jan 19, 2016 at 12:42 AM, Ankry <an...@mif.pg.gda.pl> wrote:
>>> Billinghurst wrote:
>>>> To note that you can use multiple versions of  if the
>>>> reference carries on.  Also to note that you cannot use numbers in the
>>>> ref name, the extension doesn't play, so at enWS we would usually do
>>>> something like   where it is the initial page and
>>>> continue it. I have never seen two footnotes start and continue from
>>>> the same page, so it is pretty safe.
>>>
>>> It happens. See
>>>
>>> https://pl.wikisource.org/wiki/Strona:Cesarz_Juljan_Apostata_i_jego_satyra_Symposion.djvu/16
>>>
>>> https://pl.wikisource.org/wiki/Strona:Cesarz_Juljan_Apostata_i_jego_satyra_Symposion.djvu/17
>>>
>>> Ankry
>>>
>>>
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Re: [Wikisource-l] Import 80mb+ file size to commons through ia-upload

[billinghurst]

Try using url2commons on toollabs; it is OAuth too. You will need to create
a filled-in {{book}} manually.

If that fails take the template and let me know where you have poked it and
I will import the file directly.

On Wed, 28 Oct 2015 04:55 Jayanta Nath  wrote:

> Hi all,
>
> How do I import 80mb+ file size to commons through  ia-upload? During
> import , the tool got error gar-beg, Can anyone try to import
> https://archive.org/details/UpendraKishoreRachanaSamagra to common
> through  ia-upload?
>
> Regards,
> Jayanatanth
> BNWS
>
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Re: [Wikisource-l] Large uploads to Wikisource

[billinghurst]

Also to note that User:Dominic was a wikimedian in residence with NARA in
the States and had a large number of files uploaded, and components of
transcription project for those uploads.. They have their own template at
Commons, so you should be able to dig them up.

Regards, Billinghurst

On Thu, Oct 15, 2015 at 9:18 PM Arne Wossink <woss...@wikimedia.nl> wrote:

> Hi all,
>
> Wikimedia Nederland has recently approached by several institutions that
> would like to do uploads of source material. Wikisource would be the
> preferred platform for this as the material would be searchable (which it
> wouldn't be if it was only uploaded as pdf to Commons).
>
> I would like to know if there have been previous projects involving large
> uploads by institutions, and if there's any documentation on how to proceed
> with these.
>
> Thanks!
>
> Arne Wossink
>
> Projectleider / Project Lead Wikimedia Nederland
>
> Tel. +31 (0)6 11000505
>
> *Postadres*:
> * Bezoekadres:*
> Postbus 167Mariaplaats 3
> 3500 AD  Utrecht Utrecht
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Re: [Wikisource-l] Analysed Layout and Text Object (ALTO)

[billinghurst]

I don't disagree that this should be part of our long term vision, and
those who can track this and advise the community on its development and
implementation. That said, I don't see how we would be exporting to this or
expanding to this in the wiki form.

I have concerns that we have so many basic issues unresolved, and little
developer time, as such the mundane tasks are not being addressed. :-/

Regards, Billinghurst

On Mon, Oct 5, 2015 at 10:04 PM Federico Leva (Nemo) <nemow...@gmail.com>
wrote:

> I'm finding this document quite useful:
>
> http://www.succeed-project.eu/sites/default/files/deliverables/Succeed_600555_WP4_D4.1_RecommendationsOnFormatsAndStandards_v1.1.pdf
>
> See description of ALTO pasted below, which is a followup to
>
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/wikisource-l/2014-September/002081.html
> . We should find a way to convert the transcribed books' HTML to ALTO
> format. :)
>
> Some libraries are apparently using
> http://www.primaresearch.org/tools/Aletheia which seems an augmented
> (but unfree?!) version of ScanTailor with some different purpose.
>
> Nemo
>
> Principles
> ALTO stores layout information and OCR recognized text of pages of any
> kind of printed
> documents like books, journals and newspapers. ALTO can detail technical
> metadata for
> describing the layout and content of physical resources (text,
> illustrations, graphics).
> ALTO describes a content page with different views:
> The Description section helps to describe some general settings and
> information
> of the ALTO file (measurement units, file name, etc.), and the
> production process
> itself (processing steps, software used, dates and actors, etc.)
> The Layout section contains what‟s on the page. A page is divided into
> several
> regions (print space; left, right, top and bottom margins). For each
> region, all
> objects are listed which have been detected inside: text blocks,
> illustrations,
> graphical elements, composed blocks. Each object previously identified
> is defined
> by generic attributes: width, height, text content (for the String
> element).
> Besides, the reading order of all the elements can be managed.
> Each ALTO file may also contain a style section where different styles (for
> paragraphs and fonts) are listed.
> Use cases
> ALTO is one of the most common formats used by libraries for converting
> text from
> images. It‟s used both to deliver digitized contents and to preserve
> these contents.
> In a delivery perspective, the ability of ALTO to store the text content
> coordinates in a
> page allows the overlay of image and text (multilayer PDF) and highlight
> search words
> in a query.
>
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Re: [Wikisource-l] GLAM Ghana

[billinghurst]

Hi Raphael,

Fantastic news. Good job on what you have done so far.

Can you identify which language wikis can be of greatest support to you? I
know that English will be among them. We probably get a landing page set up
for your GLAM.

English Wikisource has few African WSers, and I cannot remember any from
Ghana, so there will be plenty of spaces to fill!!!

I would be recommending that you be identifying key historical documents
and works that your community wants for it's needs and those that it would
like to highlight to the world. Having something that is scanned and can be
uploaded to Commons, have the metadata at Wikidata, a transcription at
Wikisource and be referenced and featured at Wikipedia, and could be the
basis for learning at Wikiversity, could show the diversity of Wikimedia's
sites and various opportunities. If that is possible, then some short
documents could even be processed completely at the event.

I will do some more reading and thinking, and put my mind to how enWS could
have information/support available. (We haven't excelled in that space, we
have usually preferred the doing.)

Some housekeeping.
* Ensure that one or two key people have advanced rights, equivalent or
greater than account creator. Ask at [[m:SRP]] for account creator rights
if no advanced rights are held. Ping me if necessary.
* If it is going to be a big crowd, then we should be seeking the IP range
of the venue and getting WMF to white list that range for that time. Phab
ticket.

Billinghurst

On Wed, 9 Sep 2015 05:34 Raphael Berchie <rberc...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Hello everyone this is a project we intend incorporating Wikisource and
> will need suggestions comments and endorsement.Please find the link of the
> project below.
>
> GLAM_GHANA <https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Grants:PEG/GLAM_GHANA>
> Regards
>
> *Raphael Berchie*
> Marketing Manager Farm Fresh Dairies <http://www.bioplasticsghana.com>
> Wikimedian <https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_Ghana>,Open Advocate,
> Climate Change Activist,Blogger <http://rberchie.blogspot.com/>
> P.O Box CT 10469
> Cantonments Accra
> Ghana
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Re: [Wikisource-l] Badges for Wikisource [[phabricator:T97014]]

[billinghurst]

I went and added a badge to   https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q20850489

Regards, Billinghurst

On Thu, Aug 20, 2015 at 8:18 PM billinghurst billinghurstw...@gmail.com
wrote:

 Following work by WMDE at Wikidata, there will now be the ability to
 tag/badge works at Wikidata as to their proofread status.  The badges have
 been kept simple, and should reflect the colour that is used for a work's
 page status.

 I recommended an implementation of three
 * incomplete (be it not be proofread, or problematic)
 * proofread once
 * proofread twice = validated

 This will mean that we should be looking to an agreed approach to its use.
 I suggest that this have some onwiki work, with a discussion to follow at
 Wikisource Wien Workabout (WWW)

 Regards, Billinghurst

 The detail ...

 Add default badges for Wikisource

 With site css, each Wikisource community can override
 these defaults.

 The defaults are coloured circles. To start with, these match
 what we have for Wikibase Repo (e.g. Wikidata), except not (yet?)
 have one for 'not proofread'.

 * problematic / incomplete
 * proofread
 * validated

 Bug: T97014
 Change-Id: I5ad5270866a0a5b8fbc7a19b194f800c2b0e9a8a
 ---
 A resources/images/badge-notproofread.png
 A resources/images/badge-notproofread.svg
 A resources/images/badge-problematic.png
 A resources/images/badge-problematic.svg
 A resources/images/badge-proofread.png
 A resources/images/badge-proofread.svg
 A resources/images/badge-validated.png
 A resources/images/badge-validated.svg
 M resources/skins/cologneblue/wikimedia-badges.css
 M resources/skins/modern/wikimedia-badges.css
 M resources/skins/monobook/wikimedia-badges.css
 M resources/skins/vector/wikimedia-badges.css
 12 files changed, 86 insertions(+), 1 deletion(-)


 To view the specific changes, visit https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/229199



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[Wikisource-l] Badges for Wikisource [[phabricator:T97014]]

[billinghurst]

Following work by WMDE at Wikidata, there will now be the ability to
tag/badge works at Wikidata as to their proofread status.  The badges have
been kept simple, and should reflect the colour that is used for a work's
page status.

I recommended an implementation of three
* incomplete (be it not be proofread, or problematic)
* proofread once
* proofread twice = validated

This will mean that we should be looking to an agreed approach to its use.
I suggest that this have some onwiki work, with a discussion to follow at
Wikisource Wien Workabout (WWW)

Regards, Billinghurst

The detail ...

Add default badges for Wikisource

With site css, each Wikisource community can override
these defaults.

The defaults are coloured circles. To start with, these match
what we have for Wikibase Repo (e.g. Wikidata), except not (yet?)
have one for 'not proofread'.

* problematic / incomplete
* proofread
* validated

Bug: T97014
Change-Id: I5ad5270866a0a5b8fbc7a19b194f800c2b0e9a8a
---
A resources/images/badge-notproofread.png
A resources/images/badge-notproofread.svg
A resources/images/badge-problematic.png
A resources/images/badge-problematic.svg
A resources/images/badge-proofread.png
A resources/images/badge-proofread.svg
A resources/images/badge-validated.png
A resources/images/badge-validated.svg
M resources/skins/cologneblue/wikimedia-badges.css
M resources/skins/modern/wikimedia-badges.css
M resources/skins/monobook/wikimedia-badges.css
M resources/skins/vector/wikimedia-badges.css
12 files changed, 86 insertions(+), 1 deletion(-)


To view the specific changes, visit https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/229199
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Re: [Wikisource-l] Badges for Wikisource [[phabricator:T97014]]

[billinghurst]

???

Are you asking whether we can put a WD link on that index page to the item,
yes, though it wouldn't be automated. Not certain that I see much value to
such a link.

On Thu, 20 Aug 2015 21:29 Alex Brollo alex.bro...@gmail.com wrote:

 Very interesting; so Index page/Index pages is/are properties of an
 edition item. One question: is it possible to show somehow the link to
 edition related item into wikisource Index page, i.e. into
 https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Index:The_Garden_of_Romance_-_1897.djvu ?

 Alex

 2015-08-20 12:26 GMT+02:00 billinghurst billinghurstw...@gmail.com:

 I went and added a badge to   https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q20850489

 Regards, Billinghurst

 On Thu, Aug 20, 2015 at 8:18 PM billinghurst billinghurstw...@gmail.com
 wrote:

 Following work by WMDE at Wikidata, there will now be the ability to
 tag/badge works at Wikidata as to their proofread status.  The badges have
 been kept simple, and should reflect the colour that is used for a work's
 page status.

 I recommended an implementation of three
 * incomplete (be it not be proofread, or problematic)
 * proofread once
 * proofread twice = validated

 This will mean that we should be looking to an agreed approach to its
 use. I suggest that this have some onwiki work, with a discussion to follow
 at Wikisource Wien Workabout (WWW)

 Regards, Billinghurst

 The detail ...

 Add default badges for Wikisource

 With site css, each Wikisource community can override
 these defaults.

 The defaults are coloured circles. To start with, these match
 what we have for Wikibase Repo (e.g. Wikidata), except not (yet?)
 have one for 'not proofread'.

 * problematic / incomplete
 * proofread
 * validated

 Bug: T97014
 Change-Id: I5ad5270866a0a5b8fbc7a19b194f800c2b0e9a8a
 ---
 A resources/images/badge-notproofread.png
 A resources/images/badge-notproofread.svg
 A resources/images/badge-problematic.png
 A resources/images/badge-problematic.svg
 A resources/images/badge-proofread.png
 A resources/images/badge-proofread.svg
 A resources/images/badge-validated.png
 A resources/images/badge-validated.svg
 M resources/skins/cologneblue/wikimedia-badges.css
 M resources/skins/modern/wikimedia-badges.css
 M resources/skins/monobook/wikimedia-badges.css
 M resources/skins/vector/wikimedia-badges.css
 12 files changed, 86 insertions(+), 1 deletion(-)


 To view the specific changes, visit https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/229199



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Re: [Wikisource-l] Wikisource Conference, Wien, November 20-22

[billinghurst]

Interestingly while we have a number of Australians who are very active in
the enWS space, I doubt that we will all (any?) will be able to make the
trek to Vienna, as fantastic as that would be.

It would be good if there was some capacity for a limited internet session
for those who cannot attend. The sort of thing that would be useful is a
bit of a round table where we have a bit of an agenda, and maybe use of the
collaborative notes tools.  Sort of things we could have is
* where will the Wikisources be in a year? In five years?
* what is it that we have to have, and what would we like to have?
* what would make our transcription process transformative rather than
transactional?  Or is that even possible

If we promote and plan it properly, we may even be able to get a session to
have the WMF involved with their teams for where and how they plan to
support and progress the sisters in general, and specifically what do they
have in place/mind for the Wikisources  to foster development.

I see that on the agenda is an idea for Wikidata for Wikisource. I would
like to see some planning for what can be done for a three way process for
the injection of the data into Wikidata (work, edition and author), while
at the same time uploading the file to Commons, and getting the data to the
WS


I also see that the Wikidata for Wikisource, may also have the perspective
of Wikisource for Wikidata as this needs to be a two way process, and the
tools at the moment focus on the WPs interaction, but what tools do we need
to make ''our'' data more resilient and integrated.

Regards, Billinghurst

On Sat, Aug 8, 2015 at 12:40 AM Andrea Zanni zanni.andre...@gmail.com
wrote:

 Dear all,
 thanks to Wikimedia Österreich we are organizing the first international
 Wikisource Conference, which will be held in Wien, Austria, from November
 20 till 22, this year.

 We are finalizing the application for a WMF grant, and would like to
 receive some feedbacks:
 https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Grants:PEG/WCUG/Wikisource_Conference_2015

 Hopefully, everything will go for the better and we will receive the money.
 From there, a lot of work have to be done!

 Here there is the page for the conference on Meta:

 https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikisource_Community_User_Group/Wikisource_Conference_2015

 It's up to *you* to come up with a program for the conference :-)
 Seriously: it's important that this will be a community event, and
 community curated too.
 We will have many things to discuss, and we hope it will be great event.
 And yes: if everything goes as expected, there will be scholarships, but
 it's crucial that we involve our Chapters.
 More on this soon.

 Spend some time in the weekend to give us some honest feedback!
 I hope you are excited about this as we are.

 Thanks

 Andrea, David, Claudia

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Re: [Wikisource-l] Gadgets broken around the place js errors

[billinghurst]

I believe that the same issue exists at enWS

[Maniphest] T108437: Added button groups to Wikieditor toolbar failing
to appear following MW update
https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T108437


On Sun, Aug 9, 2015 at 8:04 AM Luiz Augusto lugu...@gmail.com wrote:

 Don't know if it's related but I've just noticed that proofread tools
 section have disappeared from enhanced toolbar on some subdomains (pt,fr)
 but it's still working at en.

 Any thoughts?

 On Fri, Aug 7, 2015 at 9:24 AM, billinghurst billinghurstw...@gmail.com
 wrote:

 Following reports of gadgets being broken and javascript errors I have
 had to do some editing on enWS at
   https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/MediaWiki:Gadgets-definition
 and to note that I did similar at Meta.

 I have basically made every gadget utilise ResourceLoader. Whether it is
 right or wrong, it has stopped the errors.

 I am told that the OCR tool button and the horizontal layout button have
 disappeared, and I think that might be for the new toolbar, I have no issue
 in the old toolbar. More info will come if anything comes to light.

 Regards, Billinghurst

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Re: [Wikisource-l] more to edition(s) - edition or translation of

[billinghurst]

Nahum,

I suppose the predominant part of my discussion was focusing on published
translations, rather than WS-generated translations.

1) because many famous works  have  (famous) published translations, each
with their own translator(s), date of publication, publisher, ... all
worthy of noting and WD'ing.

2) you can only link to one work per wiki at WD, and as an example of an
issue , I know of numbers of Chekov's works that enWS hosts where we have
multiple published translations. So enWS needs a means for link generation
for many to one (at ruWS), or for English language works, we may need a one
to any.

When it comes to WS-generated translations, I can see that we may or may
not wish to call those translations their own edition.  If a translation
passes a notability check of its own edition,  then separate, if not, maybe
then it comes off the other original language work. (Maybe leave that
decision with the xxWS to determine???).

What I am hoping to see is a tool that provides the maximum flexibity and
credibility for the WSes,  yet gives best visibility and  authority at WD.

Billinghurst

On Tue, 28 Jul 2015 12:35 Nahum Wengrov novar...@gmail.com wrote:

 Wait a minute.
 If a work esists in, say, ru.wikisource,
 And then someone translates that work and posts his translation under a
 free license in he.wikisource,
 I am not to link the hebrew version to its source in ru.ws on wikidata,
 But to create a seperate wikidata entry for it?
 This makes zero sense to me, and we never did it this way on he.wikisource.

 On Sun, Jul 26, 2015 at 2:25 PM, billinghurst billinghurstw...@gmail.com
 wrote:


 Thought that the pasted discussion from WD is of interest and adds to our
 recent discussion on interwikis/interlanguage links.


 https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Wikidata:Project_chat#Wikidata_discourages_interwiki_links

 Wikidata discourages interwiki links

 Looking at Zhuangzi (Q1074987) https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q1074987
 *Zhuanhgzi*, I see that this data item is only for the work as it exists
 in Chinese. The work as translated into English is a separate data item,
 and the French Wikisource translation is another data item.

 Effectively, this means that Wikidata discourages interwiki links to and
 between Wikisource projects, because they will never be part of the same
 data item. Further, anyone seeking a translation of a work into another
 language must first come to Wikidata and surf the links even to find out if
 translations of a work in another language exist on Wikisource; it is not
 possible to do that from any Wikisource directly.

 I thought the whole point of moving the links to Wikidata was to promote
 connections between projects, not to eliminate them. But perhaps I am
 wrong. --EncycloPetey https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/User:EncycloPetey (
 talk https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/User_talk:EncycloPetey) 02:19, 26
 July 2015 (UTC)
 @EncycloPetey https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/User:EncycloPetey: There
 are other ways to create interwiki by the help of Wikidata. See s:sv:Bibeln
 1917 https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/sv:Bibeln_1917 where I have made
 some tests with the Bible (Q1845) https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q1845.
 The interwiki is created by the help of a Lua-module that follows edition(s)
 (P747) https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Property:P747 and edition or
 translation of (P629) https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Property:P629. The
 big advantage is that it makes possible to create intewiki to more than one
 page in every project. For example, that page have 13 links to
 enwikisource. -- Innocent bystander
 https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/User:Innocent_bystander (talk
 https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/User_talk:Innocent_bystander) 05:49, 26
 July 2015 (UTC) @Innocent bystander
 https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/User:Innocent_bystander:This is very
 interesting, what template (and Lua-module) do you use ? it should be done
 for all wikisources, that often have a lot of translated texts :) --
 Hsarrazin https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/User:Hsarrazin (talk
 https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/User_talk:Hsarrazin) 09:43, 26 July 2015
 (UTC) @Hsarrazin https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/User:Hsarrazin: It's 
 s:sv:Modul:Sandlåda/Innocent
 bystander
 https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/sv:Modul:Sandl%C3%A5da/Innocent_bystander
 who today is included in s:sv:Mall:Titel
 https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/sv:Mall:Titel, a template that can be
 found in almost every page on svsource. Observe that the module is not
 secured against loops in the P747/P629-hierarcy. It also needs support by
 the interwiki-extra-class in s:sv:MediaWiki:Common.js
 https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/sv:MediaWiki:Common.js, otherwise you
 cannot have more than one interwiki in each page. -- Innocent bystander
 https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/User:Innocent_bystander (talk
 https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/User_talk:Innocent_bystander) 10:11, 26
 July 2015 (UTC)BTW, another thing the code does: It makes it possible to
 have interwiki to the Text-namespaces in als

[Wikisource-l] more to edition(s) - edition or translation of

[billinghurst]

Thought that the pasted discussion from WD is of interest and adds to our
recent discussion on interwikis/interlanguage links.

https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Wikidata:Project_chat#Wikidata_discourages_interwiki_links

Wikidata discourages interwiki links

Looking at Zhuangzi (Q1074987) https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q1074987
*Zhuanhgzi*, I see that this data item is only for the work as it exists in
Chinese. The work as translated into English is a separate data item, and
the French Wikisource translation is another data item.

Effectively, this means that Wikidata discourages interwiki links to and
between Wikisource projects, because they will never be part of the same
data item. Further, anyone seeking a translation of a work into another
language must first come to Wikidata and surf the links even to find out if
translations of a work in another language exist on Wikisource; it is not
possible to do that from any Wikisource directly.

I thought the whole point of moving the links to Wikidata was to promote
connections between projects, not to eliminate them. But perhaps I am
wrong. --EncycloPetey https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/User:EncycloPetey (
talk https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/User_talk:EncycloPetey) 02:19, 26 July
2015 (UTC)
@EncycloPetey https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/User:EncycloPetey: There are
other ways to create interwiki by the help of Wikidata. See s:sv:Bibeln 1917
https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/sv:Bibeln_1917 where I have made some
tests with the Bible (Q1845) https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q1845. The
interwiki is created by the help of a Lua-module that follows edition(s)
(P747) https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Property:P747 and edition or
translation of (P629) https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Property:P629. The
big advantage is that it makes possible to create intewiki to more than one
page in every project. For example, that page have 13 links to
enwikisource. -- Innocent bystander
https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/User:Innocent_bystander (talk
https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/User_talk:Innocent_bystander) 05:49, 26
July 2015 (UTC) @Innocent bystander
https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/User:Innocent_bystander:This is very
interesting, what template (and Lua-module) do you use ? it should be done
for all wikisources, that often have a lot of translated texts :) --
Hsarrazin https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/User:Hsarrazin (talk
https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/User_talk:Hsarrazin) 09:43, 26 July 2015
(UTC) @Hsarrazin https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/User:Hsarrazin: It's
s:sv:Modul:Sandlåda/Innocent
bystander
https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/sv:Modul:Sandl%C3%A5da/Innocent_bystander
who today is included in s:sv:Mall:Titel
https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/sv:Mall:Titel, a template that can be
found in almost every page on svsource. Observe that the module is not
secured against loops in the P747/P629-hierarcy. It also needs support by
the interwiki-extra-class in s:sv:MediaWiki:Common.js
https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/sv:MediaWiki:Common.js, otherwise you
cannot have more than one interwiki in each page. -- Innocent bystander
https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/User:Innocent_bystander (talk
https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/User_talk:Innocent_bystander) 10:11, 26
July 2015 (UTC)BTW, another thing the code does: It makes it possible to
have interwiki to the Text-namespaces in als/bar/frr/pflwikis. -- Innocent
bystander https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/User:Innocent_bystander (talk
https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/User_talk:Innocent_bystander) 10:18, 26
July 2015 (UTC)
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Re: [Wikisource-l] OCR as a service?

[billinghurst]

OCR is available by a javascript. Numbers of wikisources have it enabled as
a gadget, though I cannot speak for all the wikis. I presume it relates to
the languages available in the OCR.

Script is noted at
https://wikisource.org/wiki/Wikisource:Shared_Scripts

Regards, Billinghurst

On Sun, Jul 12, 2015 at 7:23 PM Asaf Bartov abar...@wikimedia.org wrote:

 On Sat, Jul 11, 2015 at 8:44 AM, Nicolas VIGNERON 
 vigneron.nico...@gmail.com wrote:

 Hi,

 I'm not a techie so I'm not sure to know what is OCR-as-service but you
 should ask Tpt and Phe who have OCR stuff on the tool labs (to know what is
 behind tools like http://tools.wmflabs.org/phetools/ocr.php ).


 Thanks for the pointer!  I don't see any documentation on how to feed
 images to it, though, and no pointer to the source code to figure it out on
 my own.  Help?

 A.
 --
 Asaf Bartov
 Wikimedia Foundation http://www.wikimediafoundation.org

 Imagine a world in which every single human being can freely share in the
 sum of all knowledge. Help us make it a reality!
 https://donate.wikimedia.org
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Re: [Wikisource-l] Github repository

[billinghurst]

Thrasibule appears to have uploaded to ocr-tools, so we can ask there for a
starter.

-- Billinghurst

On Tue, 7 Jul 2015 15:51 David Cuenca Tudela dacu...@gmail.com wrote:

 Does anybody know who is operating this repository?
 https://github.com/Wikisource

 Would it be possible to add more admins to make it the official repository
 for Wikisource scripts?

 Thanks!
 Micru
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Re: [Wikisource-l] At wikidata: dissociation of book and edition hiding links between WP and WS

[billinghurst]

The issue with the approach is:

* The article page at the WP already exists for notable books, such so does
the WD page, and it will be for the instance of a book.

* We create edition pages, so for notable books we are already at a point
of difference.

Presumably from WP we want the ability to link to the WS book via an
infobox or a {{Wikisource ...}} template based on the WD data without the
need to edit it ever again. It is an indirect link.

Similarly there is the situation reversed from WS to the WP from the header
template linking where it is all controlled from the template sucking WD.

We are wanting this whether the link is on the interwiki is on the the one
WD page or on two as originally described.

Re one edition, so one page that may the case mostly now, the more notable
a work, the less likely that is to be the case.

Regards, Billinghurst

On Mon, 29 Jun 2015 19:59 Nicolas VIGNERON vigneron.nico...@gmail.com
wrote:

 2015-06-29 11:46 GMT+02:00 Magnus Manske magnusman...@googlemail.com:

 Not sure I see the problem.


 Same for me.

 1. A Wikidata (Qx) item is an edition of another Wikidata item (Qy)
 2. Qx (the edition) has an associated (e.g. English) Wikisource page
 3. Qx and/or Qy have an associated (English) Wikipedia page


 It's a bit more complex than that but I agree.

 A large number (a majority?) of works have only one edition, in this case
 there is only one item on Wikidata, it's even easier : no problem.
 There is disambig-like pages on wikisources for works. In this case, no
 problem again, you can link Wikipedia and Wikisource directly :
 https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q83186
 Somtimes, there is wikipedia article about editions, again there is no
 problem here.

 https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Wikidata:WikiProject_Books is very useful,
 most of the cases are describe and explain.

 Cdlt, ~nicolas
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Re: [Wikisource-l] Wikidata property for Index pages. Bot needed!

[billinghurst]

ugh google mobile inbox doesn't seem to thread well, but let us see how it
manages.

-- billinghurst

On Fri, 26 Jun 2015 09:34 Sam Wilson s...@samwilson.id.au wrote:

This is great.

I'm not yet really up on Wikidata, but why's it a URL? How does the scan
file (Commons)(P996) property work? This one is doing a similar thing to
that. I guess we can't have a Wikisource Index data type though. :(


I agree that it seems a little weird, it knows it is a WS, language
dropdown would have been nice.  That said it is a URL as it needs to point
to a language, the sister and a filename and at this time with the current
technology that means is a URL. The body there cannot do wiki select then
file look up.

Scan points to the file, and index the index. There are elements of
duplication (and more more more) which I don't understand,  so others will
need to address that aspect.


Anyway, what I wanted to ask was whether anyone could tell me how one can
get from an Index page, to the mainspace work's page (to get the Wikidata
item for the work)? Because at the moment it's a matter of following the
link found in the #ws-title table cell — and sometimes there's more than
one link there, so it gets confusing. Also, many editions span more than
one Index.


Now that we have the arbitrary linking we can include a field in the Index
ns template to do linking BUT I would much prefer a means to auto link,
otherwise a bot to do. For those I am going to need to speak to someone
clueful.

Ah... or is that what's going to be solved with this property? Because at
the moment, there's no hard and fast way to do this, but if every index
was referenced in Wikidata from an edition's page, then it'd be simple. Is
that the idea?

 shrug I missed the rationale beyond here is an idea ...  We have to
have edition pages for all first, and who knows where that is currently
situated.

Of course, a script would perhaps just update the unambiguous cases, and
leave the odd ones to us humans.

 umm err  in my experience  the odd ones are the humans 

(Sorry, I'm not being very coherent... I'll start learning more about
wikidata I think!)

-sam.

On Fri, June 26, 2015 4:56 am, David Cuenca Tudela wrote:
 Just recently a new Wikidata property for linking with the Index page has
 been created
 https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Property:P1957

 An example of its use can be seen here:
 https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q15839163

 In theory it should be possible to import it automatically. Is anyone
 capable of writing a bot for importing it?

 Cheers,
 Micru
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Re: [Wikisource-l] Wikidata property for Index pages. Bot needed!

[billinghurst]

I don't write though happy to watch/maintain, and sometimes adapt. We have
wikisourcebot sitting at Labs with multiple maintainers if someone needs
the vehicle.

-- billinghurst

On Fri, 26 Jun 2015 06:57 David Cuenca Tudela dacu...@gmail.com wrote:

 Just recently a new Wikidata property for linking with the Index page has
 been created
 https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Property:P1957

 An example of its use can be seen here:
 https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q15839163

 In theory it should be possible to import it automatically. Is anyone
 capable of writing a bot for importing it?

 Cheers,
 Micru
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Re: [Wikisource-l] Fwd: [Wikimedia-l] Renewal of the Recognition to Wikisource Community User Group

[billinghurst]

CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP!!!

On Sun, Jun 21, 2015 at 8:58 PM Andrea Zanni zanni.andre...@gmail.com
wrote:

 YES!
 :-)

 Thanks Micru for applying the renewal, and all the community for the
 results achieved in 2014.

 Aubrey

 -- Forwarded message --
 From: Carlos M. Colina ma...@wikimedia.org.ve
 Date: Sun, Jun 21, 2015 at 9:52 AM
 Subject: [Wikimedia-l] Renewal of the Recognition to Wikisource Community
 User Group
 To: wikimedi...@lists.wikimedia.org


 Dear all,

 On behalf of the Affiliations Committee, I am honoured to announce the
 renewal of the recognition of Wikisource Community User Group as a
 Wikimedia User Group. They have been working hard this past year and it is
 the Affiliations Committee's opinion that they meet the criteria for having
 their user group status renewed indefinitely, starting the date of
 publication of the resolution.

 Congratulations!!!


 1:
 https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Affiliations_Committee/Resolutions/Renewals/Wikisource_Community_User_Group_-_June_2015
 --
 *Jülüjain wane mmakat* ein kapülain tü alijunakalirua jee wayuukanairua
 junain ekerolaa alümüin supüshuwayale etijaanaka. Ayatashi waya junain.
 Carlos M. Colina
 Socio, A.C. Wikimedia Venezuela | RIF J-40129321-2 | www.wikimedia.org.ve
 http://wikimedia.org.ve
 Chair, Wikimedia Foundation Affiliations Committee
 Phone: +972-52-4869915
 Twitter: @maor_x
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Re: [Wikisource-l] Wikidata and Wikisource. Arbitrary access? Badges?

[billinghurst]

There are numbers of badges that I would consider
* Featured works
* Proofread of the (timeperiod), for enWS it is one a month

Ultimately I am looking to have to have Wikidata to populate/build
listings of authors, eg.
https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Wikisource:Authors-D
and
https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Portal:British_Museum
and
https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Portal:British_Museum  (staff as authors bit)

Re states of works, Proofread, Validated (sure), though less need for
not proofread, as I wonder whether it warrants noting.  Definitely not
percentages.  Whether a work's validation is supported by a scanned
text.

I know that enWS would like to be able to generate a list of works by
month of validation by automated process, and you can do more
decoratively with scan images, text, author name, blah blah though
drawing information by arbitrary data pulls.

Regards, Billinghurst

On Tue, Jun 2, 2015 at 1:47 AM, David Cuenca Tudela dacu...@gmail.com wrote:
 Arbitrary access has been enabled in all Wikisources, is anybody doing
 anything with it that can be replicated in all Wikisources?

 And regarding badges, there is this ticket open:
 https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T97014

 Which badges do we need in Wikidata? I was thinking of:
 - Proofread
 - Validated
 - Export ready

 Any thoughts on this? Can they be filled up by bot?

 Thanks
 Micru

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Re: [Wikisource-l] Wikidata and Wikisource. Arbitrary access? Badges?

[billinghurst]

Not certain about these as badges and would rather hasten slowly see
what they look like, get feedback prior to launching further. I was
more trying to identify some of the arbitrary components that you want
to be able to pull.

In the end to identify when an Index: flicks to validated, that the
system could be able to then identify that a work has now should be
'promoted' to complete for the main ns would be magic, and ultimately
have the tweet go out through twitter of that news. From there that
people can wander through related works in a list, etc. is value.

I need better thinking time, and inspiration time. Definitely that we
may poke at the WMAU crowd if their conference gets off the ground in
October.

Regards, Billinghurst

On Wed, Jun 3, 2015 at 12:16 AM, David Cuenca Tudela dacu...@gmail.com wrote:
 Hi Billinghurst,
 Good idea about the featured works, I will add it to the list. Regarding
 proofread of the (timeperiod) it seems something better managed locally in
 wiki, maybe with a category.

 Listings of authors, institutions, publisers, etc is something that should
 be possible to do once the queries are available.

 Should we add a badge for Suporting scan available? Or can we just assume
 that if the item has the property scan file (Commons)(P996) then it is a
 book with a scan?

 Regards,
   - Micru

 On Tue, Jun 2, 2015 at 4:06 PM, billinghurst billinghurstw...@gmail.com
 wrote:

 There are numbers of badges that I would consider
 * Featured works
 * Proofread of the (timeperiod), for enWS it is one a month

 Ultimately I am looking to have to have Wikidata to populate/build
 listings of authors, eg.
 https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Wikisource:Authors-D
 and
 https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Portal:British_Museum
 and
 https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Portal:British_Museum  (staff as authors
 bit)

 Re states of works, Proofread, Validated (sure), though less need for
 not proofread, as I wonder whether it warrants noting.  Definitely not
 percentages.  Whether a work's validation is supported by a scanned
 text.

 I know that enWS would like to be able to generate a list of works by
 month of validation by automated process, and you can do more
 decoratively with scan images, text, author name, blah blah though
 drawing information by arbitrary data pulls.

 Regards, Billinghurst

 On Tue, Jun 2, 2015 at 1:47 AM, David Cuenca Tudela dacu...@gmail.com
 wrote:
  Arbitrary access has been enabled in all Wikisources, is anybody doing
  anything with it that can be replicated in all Wikisources?
 
  And regarding badges, there is this ticket open:
  https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T97014
 
  Which badges do we need in Wikidata? I was thinking of:
  - Proofread
  - Validated
  - Export ready
 
  Any thoughts on this? Can they be filled up by bot?
 
  Thanks
  Micru
 
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 Etiamsi omnes, ego non

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[Wikisource-l] VIAF aligning to Wikidata is helpful for Wikisource

[billinghurst]

From the Wikidata weekly newsletter, I was led to the VIAF blog
post[1] which talks about how VIAF is going to re-orientate their
linking from English Wikipedia to Wikidata. This should have a
positive effect for the Wikisources in general, and non-English WSes
especially, in making more overt the authors that you have in your
wikis.

We should also be aware of the issue that (more?) people will arrive
at our pages directly via WD.

[http://outgoing.typepad.com/outgoing/2015/03/moving-to-wikidata.html]

Regards, Andrew
PS. Some of the more WD-aligned personnel will presumably already know this.

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Re: [Wikisource-l] Wikisource Community User Group Report

[billinghurst]

I have added some dot points of the components that I can remember,
and from memory we have done things like

* Google Books - archive.org - Commons uploads
* ia-upload bot had an update with labs

and those who have some detail would be worthwhile adding this.

Beyond the population of the report, what is it that you think that is
needed for the Wikisource CUG itself?  From your experience of this in
the last year, and with you and Micru unable to do what you did this
year, what needs to you see need filling? What commitment would be
needed?

If we can identify specific needs, we can put these back to individual
communities, and we can especially give a shove to the enWS community
which can be solely focused on its own needs as it has some people
resource, though less so in the developer space.  So I suppose it
would be useful to get your insights onto that page as the leader of
the inaugural group, and what you see that it needs to go forward for
the group, and we can use that same information back to our
communities.

Regards, Billinghurst

On Thu, Jan 8, 2015 at 8:26 PM, Andrea Zanni zanni.andre...@gmail.com wrote:
 Dear Wikisourcerors,
 I'm writing you because as a Wikisource Community User Group we'd need to
 ask for renewal.

 TL:DR:
 go here and write:
 https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikisource_Community_User_Group/2014_Report

 

 For those of you who are not aware of this Wikimedia politics,
 User Groups are affiliates of the Wikimedia movements, recognized groups of
 individuals that officially state their existent as a community.

 The advantages of such a situation is that we are recognized as a
 representatives of Wikisource communities around the world.
 It is a much better situation regarding lobbying, advocacy, and even, if
 needed grantmaking.
 For example, last year Micru could come in Berlin for the Wikimedia
 Conference.
 Every Wikimania, the group of wikisourcerors grows bigger and bigger.
 There's still a long way to go, but we don't need, in my humble opinion, to
 draw back. It is important to continue to grow in organization and impact as
 an international community.
 We'll win, eventually :-).


 The issue though is that from March I'm president of a Chapter (and I have
 much to do), and Micru is on a loong wiki break.
 We didn't follow through as we wanted the User Group.
 On 31st november, the one-year term of recognition given by the AffCom in
 the resolution of last year has ended.

 If we want to continue, we need to apply for a renewal.
 These are the riteria we have to comply to. [1] We can do it. The
 Affiliation Committee is very proud of us :-)



 We'd basically need to write a 2014 report:
 an annual report of our activities telling our experience during this year
 as affiliates. Our achievements, fails, needs, insights and suggestions.
 Besides, we can tell our plans for the next year.

 My humble opinion is that we can put under the umbrella of the Wikisource
 Community User Group things that we do as single communities or individuals,
 for the profit of the whole Wikisource and Wikimedia movement.

 For example, things we did this year:
 we did the Wikisource Birthday proofreading contests, (which is BIG [2] :-),
 and we need to continue doing more and more).
 we helped Siko in evaluating the IEG proposals related to Wikisource (I
 did).
 We are maintaining the migration of WS related tickets from Bugzilla to
 Phabricator (thanks Billinghusrt!),
 and we are discussing the perennial problem of structured data on WS (thanks
 all!)
 An I'm not mentioning the hidden but precious work of Phe, Tpt, Ricordisamoa
 and other coders who maintain the Proofread Extensions, do Wikidata things
 and more.

 So, in the end.
 PLEASE, help me fill this report here:
 https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikisource_Community_User_Group/2014_Report

 Write whatever we, as a community of wikisourcerors, have done.
 Put also important things you havedone in your local wiki. If it's too
 local, we'll delete it, but it's also a good opportunity to learn stuff from
 each other!

 Thanks!

 Aubrey




 [1] https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_user_groups/Requirements
 [2]
 https://tools.wmflabs.org/phetools/graphs/Wikisource_-_validated_pages_per_day.png

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[Wikisource-l] Phabricator project for Wikisource

[Wiki Billinghurst]

With the recent conversion of Bugzilla to Phabricator, I requested the
conversion[1] of our tracking bug to be a project[2], with the basic
premise that a [tag = project], and we are a community working across
multiple languages, and that some of our individual efforts spread
outside of Wikisource, and sometimes the outer efforts flow inside.

Anyway part of the discussion comes to the point that we are not
unique among the sisters with that request/idea, and there is a
thought about nomenclature, for which the following post points to
that aspect.

Being a person of simple thoughts, I would be happy for our project to
be called (wait for it) ... Wikisource, though that doesn't allow for
any future aspects, and others will have valuable input.  So I point
you to the general nomenclature discussion [3] and my specific request
[1] that is lacking a name in the request.

Regards, Billinghurst
PS. Apologies for the noise for those who are already cc'd the phabricator post.

[1] https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T78498
[2] https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Phabricator/Help#Creating_a_project
[3] https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T78482

-- Forwarded message --
From: Qgil no-re...@phabricator.wikimedia.org
Date: Mon, Dec 15, 2014 at 9:35 PM
Subject: [Maniphest] [Changed CC] T78482: -Radar projects for
Wikimedia family projects and languages + MediaWiki Stakeholders
To: billinghurstw...@gmail.com


Qgil added subscribers: Rillke, Steinsplitter, Billinghurst, Praveenp.
Qgil added a comment.

In https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T78482#846850, @Nemo_bis wrote:

 I have no idea what radar means here.


A Wiktionary project in phabricator could also be a project used by
the Wiktionary community to organize their work. This is why I'm
proposing -Radar to identify tags used to collect tasks //on the
radar// of a community. Could be another word, or could be no word if
you think it's not needed.

 Tags aren't inherently more elegant than tracking bugs. For instance, 
 https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T43492 used to be an on-wiki page, which I 
 converted to a tracking bug, which worked well because cc'ing yourself is 
 equivalent to watchlisting a page. Watching a project, instead, brings you a 
 ton of notifications for all tasks past and future: yes, there side ways but 
 they're not as easy.



 So, if the aim is to *replace* on-wiki lists, let's make this the summary.


Fair point. A notification like Send me an email when a task is
assigned to projects X, Y, Z is possible with Herald
(https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T630), and I expect most advanced
users to set one for themselves to fill the current gap of
notifications between joining (almost no notification) and watching
(all notifications) a project.

In any case, you are right that the main change is to move on-wiki
lists of tasks to Phabricator. I have edited the description to make
this more clear.

I think nowadays an own tag project is a better solution for a new
list, but tracking tasks also do the work, and they are indeed easier
to subscribe to. Maybe the difference is whether you want to organize
the tasks tracked in a workboard or not.

 Then ask one by one what their requirements are for such a replacement. 
 Adding *additional* lists, instead, is out of question.


The maintainers of these lists are CCed here, please help if I have
missed someone.

I guess you mean that i.e. it is out of question to create a
Commons-Radar project paralel to
https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Commons:Bugs still exists?
Absolutely. New lists could be started by communities that have none,
though.


TASK DETAIL
  https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T78482

REPLY HANDLER ACTIONS
  Reply to comment or attach files, or !close, !claim, !unsubscribe or
!assign username.

EMAIL PREFERENCES
  https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/settings/panel/emailpreferences/

To: Qgil
Cc: Aklapper, Qgil, Tpt, Micru, Ricordisamoa, Rdicerb, He7d3r, Carlb,
Quiddity, Krenair, Glaisher, Reedy, Nemo_bis, MZMcBride,
MarkAHershberger, Vriullop, Toniher, Arnaugir, GPHemsley, jayvdb,
Darkdadaah, Raymond, Gryllida, scfc, Krinkle, marcoil, Rillke,
Steinsplitter, Billinghurst, Praveenp, Jdforrester-WMF, Rfarrand,
Keegan, wikibugs-l

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[Wikisource-l] Tool to check transclusions of index pages? (something not manual)

[Wiki Billinghurst]

Anyone know of a tool or a ready means that can check for works (that
are proofread) for the amount/percentage transcluded?  I am wondering
how many works may be out there that have plenty of work done on them
but sitting there needing transcluding.

It seems that a tool that can do that sort of analysis, or that could
project that data to an Index: page would be useful.

To note that MZM did create the checker tool on toollabs to manually
run a check on an index page, however, that level of reaction is only
useful for a detailed analysis of a work.

While I am mumbling about wishes, I would still love to have the
ability to project the transcription status of a work (the ribbon)
onto a page rather than having to poke [[Special:IndexPages]]

Regards, Billinghurst

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Re: [Wikisource-l] What is our next major hurdle, or where we need most development assistance

[Wiki Billinghurst]

In thinking further about this, I think one of our major hurdles in
getting casual transcription is the formatting and templates aspects.
So is the migration to Visual Editor one of our major progression
points?

Regards, Billinghurst

On Sun, Nov 23, 2014 at 9:08 PM, Nicolas VIGNERON
vigneron.nico...@gmail.com wrote:
 2014-11-23 2:55 GMT+01:00 Wiki Billinghurst billinghurstw...@gmail.com:

 What do we see as the next components for Wikisource?

 What are our major hurdles for system development?

 If we were offered development help where do people think that we
 should be making use of that help?  Is it incremental fixes,
 transactional changes, or are we wanting transformational changes,
 completely new features, and new opportunities?

 Regards, Billinghurst


 Not sure but I think improving what we already have is more a priority (ePub
 / PDF export - on the fly ? - book/page namespaces, better OCR, Wikidata
 integration ?).

 Plus, you can find some profitable infos on
 http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikisource_Community_User_Group/Wikisource_survey_report
 ; it's a bit old but still relevant.

 Cdlt, ~nicolas

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[Wikisource-l] What is our next major hurdle, or where we need most development assistance

[Wiki Billinghurst]

What do we see as the next components for Wikisource?

What are our major hurdles for system development?

If we were offered development help where do people think that we
should be making use of that help?  Is it incremental fixes,
transactional changes, or are we wanting transformational changes,
completely new features, and new opportunities?

Regards, Billinghurst

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Re: [Wikisource-l] Wikisource 11th Anniversary Contest

[Wiki Billinghurst]

No discussion at enWS, though we generally are continually running
with something, though not heard anyone mentioned 11th anniversary.

The thought that I did had that may be of interest was a coordinated
xwiki transcription of the same work in multiple languages, and if one
work is finished at one wiki, we could encourage that work to be
completed at other wikis.

Regards, Billinghurst

On Mon, Nov 3, 2014 at 9:41 AM, Andrea Zanni zanni.andre...@gmail.com wrote:
 Hello guys,
 are you preparing for the contest?
 Can we use this mailing list to coordinate and understand how many contests
 will be there?

 It would be nice if we could coordinate, or at least use shared scripts and
 tools.
 Maybe it's better to have an overview of what is needed to run the contest.

 WHAT DO YOU NEED
 * a collection of books to be proofread
 this is really easy :-)

 * a Wikisource contest page
 like this one:
 https://it.wikisource.org/wiki/Wikisource:Undicesimo_compleanno_di_Wikisource

 * some social media coverage
 you can use social media etc., we always try to convince the it.wikipedia to
 use their SiteNotice... Of course, you must also use your own Wikisource
 sitenotice.

 * some awards
 if you have a national Wikimedia chapter, it's good to ask for few bucks. In
 Italy, we awarded 3 prizes with just 100 euros (50 euros worth book voucher
 as a 1st prize, 30 and 20 for 2nd and 3rd).

 * a way to count validated and proofread pages.
 If I'm not mistaken, the code is here: http://pastebin.com/Vk6ikCUg

 WHAT YOU NEED TO DECIDE

 * time
 In Italy, we wanted to go from 24 November at 00.01 till 1st December at
 23.59.

 * scoring
 In it.source, we will probably award 3 points for every proofread page and 1
 point for every validated page.

 * awards
 Last year, it.source only allowed to validate pages (and not to proofread).
 We awarded the first prize to the user who validated more pages.
 The second and the third prizes instead were randomly extracted from the
 others: but the more pages a user validated, the more chances he had.
 Every validated page (or point) counts as a lottery ticket: the more I have,
 the more chances too.

 Cristian Cantoro made also this awesome tool to pick the 3 winners, we
 should adapt it for every contest: http://balist.es/wscontest/

 I believe everything can be easily adapted if you both allow to proofread
 and validate at the same time

 I really hope many Wikisources will be present this year :-)

 Aubrey


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[Wikisource-l] mul: interwiki now exists

[Wiki Billinghurst]

It quietly happened in the mediawiki release last week {git #f0d86f92
- Add additional interwiki links as requested in various bugs (bug
16962, bug 21915)} [1] that the mul: interwiki has appeared for the
wikisources to be able to point to wikisource.org.  So we can now do
[[:mul:XXxx]] and it appears in interwiki links as More
languages. We will have a number of places, especially in the project
namespace where we need to do some additions.

Now to see how we can get mul: working for Wikidata.

Regards, Billinghurst

[1] https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/MediaWiki_1.24/wmf22#WikimediaMaintenance

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Re: [Wikisource-l] Add wiki data for old wikisoure

[Wiki Billinghurst]

My understanding is that there is a blocking issue for mul identified in

  https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=32189
and that needs staff review for things to progress.

You may wish to start rattling the cage with Rob Lanphier's team to see if
they can get their review done. I have already tried waving it with a staff
member, however, it may be that we need to push publicly where it is
seen. Asking nicely fails.

Regards, Billinghurst


On Mon, Sep 15, 2014 at 4:25 PM, Alex Brollo alex.bro...@gmail.com wrote:

 Really, simply  to add mul to the list of included languages should be
 sufficient (in the double significance of no specified language - multiple
 languages). The old prefix would be perhaps better, since it's already
 in use into Iwpage transclusion. English could be linked to mul as
 default language for translation issues of interface. Is this so terribly
 difficult? Is there really a hard  techno issue, or the whole matter is
 mainly a matter of policy? The latter case would be very disturbing.

 Alex

 2014-09-13 22:05 GMT+02:00 Federico Leva (Nemo) nemow...@gmail.com:

 Alex Brollo, 07/08/2014 15:33:
  Bug 62717 https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=62717 - Move
  oldwikisource on www.wikisource.org http://www.wikisource.org to
  mul.wikisource.org http://mul.wikisource.org, and I encourage any of
  you, reading these posts, to do the same.

 This bug title (mul vs. www) sounds rather silly. Focusing on a specific
 solution rather than the goal you want to achieve is generally
 considered a bad practice for bug reporters.
 We have several OldWikisource issues related to the fact that MediaWiki
 should recognise it as mul language and provide standard support for
 such a case, but being forced to also change the subdomain seems
 extremely weird. That said, if we manage to get some progress that way I
 can only be happy. :-)

 Nemo

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[Wikisource-l] Help:Sheet music — follow-up to the discussion at Wikimania2014

[Wiki Billinghurst]

At WM2014 when we had the Wikisource meet-up, there was mention of having
better help pages for music notation to align with [[mw:Extension:Score]].
I would like to point to the existing pages at English Wikisource that
other wikisources may wish to use as the basis of local language pages. To
note that these pages have no interwikis, so it could be that other
languages either do not have such pages, or we lack some interwikis. (And I
cannot remember whether we can or cannot iwlink these pages through WD)

Following is the pages, and the sections within them.

Regards, Billinghurst

[[s:en:Help:Sheet music]]  has redirect Help:Music, Help:Score
1 Overview
2 Transcribing music
3 General notes on writing with Score
4 Maintenance templates
5 LilyPond
5.1 Basic LilyPond notation
5.2 Lyrics
5.3 More LilyPond notation
6 ABC notation
6.1 Notes
6.2 Header lines
7 Audible output
8 External links
8.1 LilyPond
8.2 ABC

[[s:en:Help:LilyPond]]
1 Commands
2 Notes
2.1 Relative notes
2.2 Absolute notes
2.3 Accidentals
2.4 Polyphony
2.5 Repetition
3 Multiple staves
3.1 Staff group
3.2 Grand staff
3.3 Nested staves
4 Lyrics
4.1 Manual durations
4.1.1 Associated voice
4.2 Additional notes
5 Partial measures
6 Key signatures
7 Repeats
8 External links


[[s:en:Help:List of musical symbols]]
1 Simple
2 Accidentals
3 Clefs
4 Rhythm and key
5 Dynamics
6 Articulations
7 Ornaments
8 Repetition
9 Bar lines
10 Other
11 See also
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Re: [Wikisource-l] Scanner purchase

[Wiki Billinghurst]

Micru,

As a question re uploaded works to Commons. Are we labelling these in
some way as needing to have Index: pages at the WSes, and by language
of work? If not, then it would seem that we may need to do some
curatorial work to
can we identify .djvu files at Commons that are not linked to indices.
Thinking about how we can make things easier for ourselves.

Regards, Billinghurst


On Wed, Sep 10, 2014 at 1:01 AM, David Cuenca dacu...@gmail.com wrote:


 On Tue, Sep 9, 2014 at 3:59 AM, scann scannopo...@gmail.com wrote:

 BUT I would like to have
 someone writing some pieces of code to be able to scan  upload:
 which means, to scan your book and be able to upload it automatically
 to wikimedia commons  wikisource, using the same control system,
 specially with no command line interface.


 Have you tried the Book Uploader Bot? It is a project created by Rohit (in
 CC) for his GSoC.
 http://tools.wmflabs.org/bub/index

 It takes some available images from digital libraries, uploads them to
 Internet Archive (which converts to djvu and adds OCR), and then notify the
 user with a link to transfer the file to Commons when the file is ready.

 If you want to use the same workflow for Spreads, you would need to add an
 option to BUB to upload an image batch and request the metadata from the
 user. It doesn't seem that hard considering that most of the work has been
 done.

 Cheers,
 Micru


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[Wikisource-l] Wikisource-bot running on toollabs

[Wiki Billinghurst]

Wishing to inform the broader community that I have set up a shared project
Wikisource-bot to undertake archiving of talk pages on English Wikisource
(similar to MiszaBot, and ArchiverBot in other places). Presently I am
taking the bot through the bot approval process for English Wikisource.

It is also intended that this bot will take over at English Wikisource to
do the patrol work that was previously undertaken by JVbot in a past time.
John has offered to set the bot up when he has the time.

So the invitation is there for archiving talk pages at other wikis if you
have the need. I  am happy to do the set up, though would require someone
at the local community to usher the bot through any local approvals, or I
could look for a global bot right (I am not fully acquainted with all the
WSes bot approval processes).

As bots at ToolLabs can be operated by shared maintainers, then if you have
some great ideas, we can look to utilise the space, and share the
maintenance.

Regards, Billinghurst
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[Wikisource-l] Fwd: [[Bugzilla:70253]] Ability to set a category to display linked page by {{SUBPAGENAME}} rather than {{PAGENAME}}

[Wiki Billinghurst]

https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=70253

Following up on one of our discussion points at WM2014, I talked about the
categorisation of compendium works, and the ineffectiveness of the current
system approach.

Anyway, as discussed at that time, numbers of us said that we would find it
useful if we could have an alternate means to display categories, I have
submitted that bugzilla, and invite you to peruse it as covering the points
that we need, and for you to make any suggestions that would make the
proposal better, more fully functional and more broadly useful.

Regards, Billinghurst
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Re: [Wikisource-l] Fwd: [Wikimediaindia-l] 20 volumes (8376 pages) of Tamil Encylopedia released under Creative Commons

[Wiki Billinghurst]

(Not that this is not self-evident)

First steps have to be
* Get the digital copies
* Upload to commons and get all the copyright stuff done (so we can keep
the deletion maggots away)
* Get the index pages created, with pagelists

After that it would seem that there needs to be gamification, and what is
the 'reward'.

Our Indian colleagues have given us some great examples of what has been
done, and some of the benefits that have come from it.  So what follows is
some random thoughts just to put out there, and to be plus'd or minuse'd
by
the community as they see fit. This is just a stream of green hat thinking
...

As there is no OCR, we could look to a scoring system based on a
combination of ...
* characters added (filesize increase)
* starting a page
* advancing to proofread status
* advancing to validate status

We could look to
* individual scoring
* team scoring

An issue for team scoring is that if we had this overt for schools,
classes, age groups, then we have a point of identification, and possibly
some problem for predatory behaviour on kids. So teams would need to have
a
level of self-ownership. Using the previous conversation in the thread
about education tool, there could be a value in team scoring availability
in that (through facebook) it takes the gamification outside of Wikisource,
in that teams can self-organise. We would just need to organise to enable
teams and a scoring system.

We could give 'awards' for individual scores, and acknowledge teams. That
said, what scope is there for getting some recognition from the releasing
agency of the works for any team achievement?

Also to note that this is going to be a long term project, we want to have
lots of milestone awards. Recognition by month, and by year. Looking to
celebrate 1k 10k, 100k edit +++  As WMF is trying to push into these
markets, one would hope that we could look to getting a series of
microgrants/microawards that could be utilised for some recognition as a
final goal.

So we would need to find some vols in the broader space who can help us
build some tools, or maybe that is part of a thought in a grant
application. Any tool we would want to be generic so that all places can
look to utilise for any other gamification.

Anyway, just my thought bubbles.

Regards, Billinghurst



On Sun, Aug 31, 2014 at 4:33 AM, Yann Forget yan...@gmail.com wrote:

 FYI. Yann

 -- Forwarded message --
 From: Ravishankar ravidre...@gmail.com
 Date: 2014-08-30 20:10 GMT+05:30
 Subject: [Wikimediaindia-l] 20 volumes (8376 pages) of Tamil
 Encylopedia released under Creative Commons
 To: Wikimedia India Community list wikimediaindi...@lists.wikimedia.org


 Hi,

 Tamil Development Board (an autonomous institution under Government of
 Tamilnadu) releases its Encyclopedia (10 volumes, 7407 pages) and
 Children's Encyclopedia (10 volumes, 969 pages) under Creative Commons
 license. Tamil Wikipedians lead by Prof. C. R. Selvakumar and Prof. P.
 R. Nakkeeran, (Director, Tamil Virtual Academy) spearheaded this
 initiative coinciding with Tamil Wikipedia's 10 years celebrations.

 An official confirmation (in Tamil) can be seen at


 https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/46/Letter_from_Tamil_Development_Board_donating_20_volumes_of_encyclopedia_in_Tamil_under_Creative_Commons_license.jpeg

 Scanned copies of these works are already available at

 http://tamilvu.org/library/kulandaikal/lku00/html/lku00ind.htm

 At Tamil Wikipedia, we are discussing how we can get this content
 typed and transferred to WikiSource. Doing so can be a good model to
 encourage more such works to be released in public domain.

 Following are two options I can think of:

 1. Volunteers type all the content. Besides taking years to complete,
 this won't do justice for the value of time of volunteers who can do
 more valuable work than typing mechanically.

 A program like IT@School present in Kerala or a contest can encourage
 more people to join this effort but not all communities can't emulate
 this model successfully.

 2. Request WMF to give a grant to the owner of the content and let
 them hand over the typed content to Wikisource volunteers who will
 upload and wikify the content.

 This will ensure maintaining the spirit of volunteerism and yet
 getting the work done in a professional and time bound manner.

 Numerous works in Wikisource are such ready made content uploaded
 already in the web through other projects like Project Gutenberg.

 If providing grants to non-Wikimedia organizations is an issue, a
 grant towards this can be given to community / chapter who will then
 outsource the typing work.

 I welcome community's input on any other model for this as India has
 vast amount of literature and works like this are waiting to be
 transfered to Wikisource. This is one area where we can add lot of
 content to Wiki projects at once.

 Ravi


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[Wikisource-l] Some recent bugzilla additions from enWS

[Wiki Billinghurst]

Hi all,

Part of one of my promises at WM2014 was to better communicate components
of our actions at enWS to the broader community.

We have submitted bugs for ...

1. Turning webfonts back on for
enWS.https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=69655
Initially the request for fraktur fonts alone, so we could do blackletter.
However when having a conversation with WMF's Languages and
Internationalisation team they encouraged me to just request for a
reinstatement of the complete webfonts package. This has now had the patch
awaiting for review. This actually replicates what heWS has already done,
so it is not exactly trail-blazing.

One outcome that I have semi-committed to do is to create a help page for
some of the fonts that are not full language fonts, but are able to be
generated with this reinstalled process.  At this stage it would have to
live on enWS (due to enablement), however, if there was a local
conversation at OLDWIKISOURCE for a similar function, it would make more
sense to host it there. Hint! hint! to that community, and really should
have all those fonts.

2. General interwiki language link to oldwikisource is required
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=32189
This is the bug to get the mul: interlanguage prefix functioning. It is
blocked by another change that is waiting for review, and I am told to nag
Reedy, and/or others to progress it, which I am doing. Others may wish to
keep a lookout for those mentioned in the bug and see if they can get their
attention in IRC if they seem them active.

3. Increasing search weighting on namespaces other than main
namespacehttps://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=69771
We have found that authors in our author namespace rank pretty low in a
search compared to their works, so we have asked that we increase the
weighting for our Author: ns (ns:102). I made comment in the bugzilla that
this may be of interest to other WSes. To note that I have previously
discussed this with Nik at WM2014, and reported at our WS meeting that I
would be lodging this bugzilla. {{done}}

4. Refining typeahead search results for subpages at English
Wikisourcehttps://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=69658
For our biographical works where they are subpages we want to find them
when typing, not necessarily after a search. Another that was discussed at
WM2014, again which may have broader interest. {{done}}

5. Exploring tweaking of English Wikisource header templates for better
search results https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=69772
Question to Nik to see if we can use some of our 'metadata' in templates,
eg. microformat, or other bits, in smarter ways in CirrusSearch. Again
discussed at WM2014, and how asked to progress questions.

Regards, Billinghurst

PS. I still have other homework to submit, and as I get through the
backlog of tasks, it will get done. Just prioritising at the moment.
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Re: [Wikisource-l] Wikisource core feature is broken for more than 50 hours

[billinghurst]

On Tue, 06 May 2014 09:27:22 +0200, Federico Leva (Nemo)
nemow...@gmail.com wrote:
 Luiz Augusto, 06/05/2014 00:35:
 https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=64622

 In short, we on all Wikisource wikis are unable to start working
 
 I've emailed Robla now, but it's hard to make forecasts. Perhaps someone

 with noratelimit rights (sysop, crat or bot flag mostly) can fire up a 
 bot to trigger thumbnail creation of all (new) Wikisource files? What 
 are the most common required sizes? It looks hard to even work around 
 this...
 
 Nemo
 
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My understanding is that this is now resolved. There was a configuration
issue to the squids so that they use the XFF rather than internal IP
addresses.

Regards, Billinghurst

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Re: [Wikisource-l] Need Import templates from EN.WS

[billinghurst]

I am presuming that Nemo bis is referring to the ability for imports to
include all templates, which is, if it works, an interesting extension on
the process, and not one that I have seen documented.

As a steward, I have the rights to import into your wiki, if there is a
consensus for the importation.  I had a look at the enWS category, and
there is a lot there that you will not want/need (especially in subcats),
so it would be preferable to prepare a list of those that you want.

@MF-W, bnWS already has the transwiki components configured from enWS.

Regards, Billinghurst

On Mon, 14 Apr 2014 00:31:53 +0530, Jayanta Nath jayanta...@gmail.com
wrote:
 @Nemo, Thank you for your comments,could you please give me more help?
How
 to transclude all templates  in page A?
 
 
 On Mon, Apr 14, 2014 at 12:07 AM, Federico Leva (Nemo)
 nemow...@gmail.comwrote:
 
 Jayanta Nath, 13/04/2014 17:39:

  I can do this by one by one. We have no XML import rights.


 Transwiki import is enough to import any amount of pages. Just
transclude
 them all in page A and import page A recursively.

 Nemo


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Re: [Wikisource-l] Special:ProofreadIndexOai

[billinghurst]

Luiz,

I don't see it listed at
  https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Special:OAuthListConsumers
which is where all approved clients are listed at this time (though the
plan is to move the process to meta at some point).

Regards, Billinghurst



On Wed, 19 Feb 2014 18:54:18 -0300, Luiz Augusto lugu...@gmail.com
wrote:
 I've just found [[Special:ProofreadIndexOai]] and loved it!
 
 Firstly, why this special page isn't listed at [[Special:SpecialPages]]?
 
 Second, [1] points to [2], that returns a 404 error.
 
 Oka, now I'll ask the most important thing: how to implement it!? =)
 
 The doc page [3] mentions a page stored in the MediaWiki namespace, but
 that page is almost empty on it.wikisource and don't ever was created on
 en.wikisource. Those domains contains DC fields such as title, creator,
 issued.
 
 The MediaWiki page was also ever created on pt.wikisource, but all
metadata
 that it returns to me is type and format.
 
 
 As a side note, I really love all efforts done in ProofreadPage
extension.
 It's amazing that a plugin developed entirely in a volunteer basis, with
 little or none input from the main product (MediaWiki) developer team,
has
 achieved such level of quality and complexity.
 
 But, please, give some love and attention to maintain it's
documentation.
 Do it remembering that it will be crucial for small Wikisources, since
most
 of the time only one or two users retains all the very specific
knowledge
 necessary to try to develop and atract new users for that subdomain.
 
 Reverse engineering to discover how something works is a time consuming
 task, like all the remaining core tasks. At the end, those local experts
 users ends in getting no fun contributing to Wikisource because firstly
 needs to do lots of additional and sometimes bureaucratic work if really
 wants to not being the only user in such wiki.
 
 We all are in the same boat, trying to colect works in copyleft or
public
 domain in a project that the main organization behind we (Wikimedia
 Foundation) neither try to help us or know how to help us (in fact,
mostly
 of us, myself included, don't know also on what can be helped), please
help
 each other on what is possible.
 
 [what a melodramatic message I just wrote LOL]
 
 
 
 [1] -

https://wikisource.org/wiki/Special:ProofreadIndexOai?verb=ListRecordsmetadataPrefix=prp_qdc
 
 [2] - http://mediawiki.org/xml/proofreadpage/qdc/
 
 [3] - https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:Proofread_Page#OAI-PMH

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Re: [Wikisource-l] Fwd: [Wikidata-l] Wikisource enabled on test.wikidata.org

[billinghurst]

I see it there

...
Wikisource pages linked to this item(2 entries)
LanguageCodeLinked page 
বাংলা   bnwikisourceলেখক:রবীন্দ্রনাথ ঠাকুর  
English enwikisourceAuthor:Rabindranath Tagore  

Did you move off the page and return?  If you do that you need to refresh
the page as browsers seem to show the original cached version.

Regards, Billinghurst


On Fri, 10 Jan 2014 14:58:08 +0530, Jayanta Nath jayanta...@gmail.com
wrote:
 The error was The specified article could not be found on the
 corresponding site. details was The external client site did not
provide
 page information
 
 
 On Fri, Jan 10, 2014 at 2:05 PM, Lydia Pintscher 
 lydia.pintsc...@wikimedia.de wrote:
 
 On Fri, Jan 10, 2014 at 7:46 AM, Jayanta Nath jayanta...@gmail.com
 wrote:
  I have tried for this
 
  https://test.wikidata.org/wiki/Q268
 
  but https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Author:Rabindranath_Tagore this
cant
 add
  in for enwikisource.!

 It is in the item now. I am not sure what was wrong without more
 detail. Did you get an error message? If it happens again in the
 future please let me know and write down the error message you get.


 Cheers
 Lydia

 --
 Lydia Pintscher - http://about.me/lydia.pintscher
 Product Manager for Wikidata

 Wikimedia Deutschland e.V.
 Tempelhofer Ufer 23-24
 10963 Berlin
 www.wikimedia.de

 Wikimedia Deutschland - Gesellschaft zur Förderung Freien Wissens e. V.

 Eingetragen im Vereinsregister des Amtsgerichts Berlin-Charlottenburg
 unter der Nummer 23855 Nz. Als gemeinnützig anerkannt durch das
 Finanzamt für Körperschaften I Berlin, Steuernummer 27/681/51985.


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Re: [Wikisource-l] Issues with ProofreadPage

[billinghurst]

Gday Tpt,

I would like to thank you for all the work that you have been doing to
firstly convert the ProofreaPage extension away from the javascript
methodology, into the new schema.  Then all the time that you have spent
bug fixing this past week. It probably sounds as though we are complaining
at times with raising issues, but to let you know personally that I think
that the work that you have been doing for the editing community, and then
for the reading community, is magnificent.

So that big thank you to you, and to those who have helped problem solve
this past week. Really appreciated.

Regards Billinghurst

On Tue, 10 Dec 2013 21:34:09 +0100, Thomas Tanon thoma...@hotmail.fr
wrote:
 Hi!
 
 Some improvements and bug corrections have been deployed some minutes
ago
 as part of MediaWiki 1.23wmf6:
 
 Here is a list of fixed issues:
 * A JavaScript fatal error in Page: pages editing interface is solved
for
 Internet Explorer 8 or less and old Safari versions.
 * Mediawiki:proofreadpage_default_header and
 Mediawiki:proofreadpage_default_footer and text layer extraction now
works
 for Page: pages without index.
 * It is possible again to zoom in on mouse scroll.
 * The level change summary tag is now added when you click on the level
 selector (it’s what was done before the new Page: pages editing
interface
 deployment)
 
 Here is the remaining known issues (thanks to report ones that haven’t
 been listed here):
 * Fatal error on submit for a very few pages (a correction is on review)
 * the issue with gadget that Aubrey have reported here (I think that the
 solution is more on the gadget side that on the extension one)
 * It isn't possible to edit only the body of a page throw the API
 * The body content editing area doesn’t fit the scan height in vertical
 editing mode. I’m looking for a clean way to fix this problem.
 * The tab order in Page: pages editing interface is strange. A
correction
 for it is ready and will be deployed soon.
 
 Thomas
 
 Le 6 déc. 2013 à 23:53, Alex Brollo alex.bro...@gmail.com a écrit :
 
 Thanks Thomas but I can't write php, just a little of python and
 javascript.
 But more or less I can read it (if statements are simple) , thanks for
 link.
 
 Alex
 
 
 2013/12/6 Thomas Tanon thoma...@hotmail.fr
 The trim final routine is done automatically by the Wikitext content
 representation. So, it have been very easy to implement. If you are
 interested, here is the internal representation of a Page: page:

https://git.wikimedia.org/blob/mediawiki%2Fextensions%2FProofreadPage.git/8435e3855decbebc809280edffc9013b38b1f349/includes%2Fpage%2FProofreadPageContent.php
 About automatic addition of the references tag, it’s a good idea. Feel
 free to hack the extension (you are really invited to do so :-)) or to
 fill a bug on bugzilla.
 Thomas
 
 Le 6 déc. 2013 à 14:28, Alex Brollo alex.bro...@gmail.com a écrit :
 
 Hi!
 No, there isn’t any doc about it. The Proofread Page doc is very
messy
 and work on documentation is something really needed (it’s something
 that any advanced editor of Wikisource can do).
 # yes the bottom of nsPage body is trimmed (it’s normal normalisation
 of wikitext content). If it breaks pages we can disable this
 normalisation.
 # you can add a default footer content in Mediawiki:proofread
 page_default_footer (it doesn’t works currently because of a bug but
it
 should be fixed soon (in the worst case at next Tuesday deployment)).

 If you want to customize this value for a specific index, just add a
 new field called 'Footer’ (the ID is important) in
 MediaWiki:Proofreadpage_index_data_config with header:true.
 en.wikisource use this feature.
 # basically yes
 # yes you have to if you use the action=edit API. I’m working on an
 other API action that will allow to edit only the body and/or the
 proofreading level (and that will be used also by the VisualEditor
when
 it’ll be integrated)
 
by Thomas 
 
 Thanks for details; usually we are learning by try and learn and
 explicit details like those you give save hours of tries!
 
 # trimming bottom of the page: IMHO it's an excellent idea. The simple
 trick to add (manually or by a script launched at onSubmit event) a
 tl|nop at the bottom of the page when needed to force the closure of a
 paragraph at the bottom of the page and saves many transclusion
issues.
 # in the meantime, since we have to activate such a final cleanup
 routine, it would be easy to take a look to body text and to add a
 references tag (after a new line) into the footer only when needed
(t.i.
 when text contains a ref tag or a template building a ref tag - an
 infrequent case.
 # I only use wikipedia.Page .put() method to edit pages by bot, I
don't
 know if it uses API action=edit, but anyone writing by itself scripts
to
 edit nsPage is used to test carefully the header-body-footer stuff so
 that here some try-and-learn will clarify the matter.
 
 I'm going to copy-and-paste your  message as soon as this
 unavoidable bug

Re: [Wikisource-l] Issues with ProofreadPage

[billinghurst]

There are two things that we can do to better inform
1) use the new MassMessage tool, and utilise a defined list at a defined
wiki. We would have the list have all the WSes resspective Scriptoriums or
their equivalents. I would suggest that this is the preferred means, as we
can utilise mulWS Wikisource:Proofread Page for the place to host full
explanation to text and links to Bugzillas, testing environment and what we
want people to do
2) We can look to use the CentralNotice function at meta to put something
on each WS wiki central notice filed.  Just need to work through the
translation functions, and not overdo the use.  This would be best for
important messages.

Regards, Billinghurst

On Thu, 5 Dec 2013 15:22:23 +0100, Thomas Tanon thoma...@hotmail.fr
wrote:
 Hi!
 I’ve send a message here a week before the deployment calling for tests
on
 test2.wikipedia.org.
 The en.wikisource community had put a warning after this email on their
 scriptorium and centralize bug reports. It was very easy for me to see
the
 bugs that affect us.
 I believe that the best way to help us is to do as they does, put a
 warning on your scriptorium, centralize bug reports their and, if you
can,
 translate them on bugzilla.
 Here is the link to submit a bug for ProofreadPage:

https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/enter_bug.cgi?product=MediaWiki%20extensionscomponent=ProofreadPage
 Thomas
 
 Le 5 déc. 2013 à 15:09, Andrea Zanni zanni.andre...@gmail.com a écrit
:
 
 Thank you Thomas, 
 I will copy and paste this message on the Italian Scriptorium.
 
 I perfectly know that the maintenance work of the (beloved)
 Proofreadpage extension falls almost on you and other brave heroes,
 and I would like to thank you for that.
 
 My question in fact is:
 how could we help you? I'm not very skilled with bugzilla and I do not
 code,
 but I am an admin on it.source and I can put a big red message on the
 sitenotice everytime there is a deployment.
 
 I suggest that, one two days in advance, you developers use this list
to
 announce a deployment,
 so the community is ready to tackle problems and issues. 
 It is frustrating for everyone if we have issues and we do not know
why, 
 and it is frustrating for you as well to run and fix the issues and
also
 try to explain why and how.
 
 This mailing list is here for these kind of things:
 please use it, and let us help you when we can. 
 
 Thanks!
 
 Aubrey
 
  
 
 
 
 On Thu, Dec 5, 2013 at 2:56 PM, Thomas Tanon thoma...@hotmail.fr
wrote:
 Hi everyone!
 
 I’m really sorry for all the issues affecting Wikisources. A fix for
 most of them have just been deployed (it have been an hard work) and
I’ll
 try to fix all the remaining ones for the next Tuesday deployment.
 
 Here is a list of the fixed issues:
 * The image didn’t appear for Page: pages that are member of a
multipage
 file but that haven’t as Index: page a page called
Index:NAME_OF_THE_DJVU
 (it have affected mostly pl.wikisource)
 * A part of some Page: pages body content appeared as part of their
 footer in edit mode when those pages contains a noinclude tag
 * The color of the link to a Page: page was red in the Index: page when
 its level category name contained a whitespace (to fix this issue a
purge
 of each Page: page affected is required)
 * The creation of a Page: page using the API caused a fatal error
 * An indentation was displayed on the first paragraph of a Page: page
 
 Here is the remaining known issues (thanks to report ones that haven’t
 been listed here):
 * The Page: pages edit summary contains twice the proofreading level
 change tag. A fix for it is on review that will let the software adds
the
 tag on Page: page saving (the tag won’t be visible during the editing
 process.
 * The addition of default header and footer content adds a strange
 string instead of tags like references /. A fix for it is on review
 * The body textarea on Page: pages editing is too big. I’m working on a
 fix that would use the size defined in User preferences instead.
 * Fatal error on submit for a very few pages (a fix is on review)
 * It isn’t possible anymore to zoom in with a mouse. I’m working on a
 fix
 * the issue with gadget that Aubrey have reported here (I think that
the
 solution is more on the gadget side that on the extension one)
 * It’s not possible to edit only the body of a page throw the API
 
 I’m going to work on automatized tests in the next weeks in order to
 avoid a so major number of bugs the next times.
 
 Sorry again,
 
 Thomas
 
 PS: For people that ignore it, the maintenance work of the
ProofreadPage
 extension is mostly done by volunteers like you. So, please be kind
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Re: [Wikisource-l] [Wikidata-l] next sister project: Wikisource

[billinghurst]

As a side issue, as any transcluded work will have an index page, and a
file page at Commons, hopefully with any available data there will be some
available tricks.

* having a means to import the {{book}} data from Commons to Wikidata
would be really useful, whether the work is at Wikisource or not, and if it
is at Wikisource, there should be the obvious connections, or exception
reports if they are not.

Similarly,
* for new works I see that it would be easier to 1) enter the metadata
from a [book} form at WD which could then lead the way to loading the work
at Commons with a {{book}} template that calls the properties, and can
populate the Index namespace pages at the Wikisource. This has the value of
being able to hopefully import book metadata from other sources at whatever
point of time.

enWS would normally have a work at a base name, and if there was a
requirement to {{disambiguate}} or {{versions}} or {{translations}} that
name becomes disambiguation (or whatever), the following preference occurs
  Base page {{disambiguate}}  Author differentiation {{version}} 
Author/Translator differentiation {{translations}}  Author (Translations
 || Versions)



Question.  How would you think that we will handle translations of a work?


A base work will be in a language and have that reference to the language
of the work

So that work may have a translation, and the it may be from a known or
unknown edition of a work.  Are we having a translation of ... and that
may be on the base name, or maybe against an edition of the base?  Or do
you see that a translation (or each translation) of a work is a new base
work as it has a new author, and they would have a link like is a
translation of and we could capture the edition information capture there.
(knowing that both the original work and the translation can go to
editions)

As another note, there are times where the translation of a work is done
by Wikisource volunteers, so we will know the edition, however, the
translator is not an individual so how will we have a property that manages
collective translation.

Regards, Billinghurst


On Tue, 5 Nov 2013 01:12:07 +0100, David Cuenca dacu...@gmail.com wrote:
 Yes, that would be it: one work-item (acting as hub), x edition items
 connected to the work-item, each edition-item connected to its
 corresponding Wikisource page with a sitelink and, on Wikisource, an
 auto-generated nav bar that lists all sitelinks from all edition-items
on
 the left (equivalent to the current interwiki link list). If there is
more
 than one edition per language author citation (P835) or author (P50)
 value can be shown next to the language name. For connecting works with
 editions we already have edition (P747) and edition of (P629).
 
 On Wikisource I don't think it is necessary to have always a work
page,
 this only happens when there is more than one edition for any given
 language. The most important part is to automate the creation of a
 work-item on Wikidata whenever is needed to link one edition to another
 (same or different languages) and, of course, show the generated nav bar
on
 all edition pages .
 
 Wikipedia(s) will be connected to the work-items as usual.
 Template:Infobox book needs some work to be able to show work- and
 edition-item data. I have started a proposal for this task as a possible
 Code-In, but maybe the second part needs arbitrary item access.
 https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Google_Code-In#Lua_templates
 
 --Micru
 
 
 
 On Mon, Nov 4, 2013 at 5:15 PM, Daniel Kinzler
 daniel.kinz...@wikimedia.dewrote:
 
 This sounds feasible, yes.

 If I understand correctly, you want one item for each work (or work
 expression?), and one for each edition of that work. The editions would
 link
 back to the work with a is-edition-of property (or the other way
around:
 the
 work item would have an editions statement for each edition; I prefer
 the
 former in principle, but must advise you to go with the latter
initially
 -
 that
 way it will work without queries).

 On wikisource, there would be a page about the work, which the
work-item
 would
 have a sitelink to. On that wiki page, you would use lua to list all
the
 editions. Each edition-item may in turn have a sitelink to a wikisource
 page
 about that edition (right?) and you want to use these to automatically
 generate
 a navigation bar.

 Yes, that should work with what we have available in Lua already.

 -- daniel

 Am 04.11.2013 16:59, schrieb David Cuenca:
  Actually a query or Lua would be much better solution for Wikisource
 instead of
  sitelinks  (well, author pages can have sitelinks that is no
problem).
 
  According to the data model that we have been defining for Wikisource
 [1] there
  should be a top-level item (work item) representing all the editions
 that a text
  has, then there should be sub-items for each edition (example of a
book
 with
  several translations [2]). Each one of those sub-items is the one
that
 should be
  connected with a sitelink

Re: [Wikisource-l] Mailing list administrator

[billinghurst]

On Tue, 5 Nov 2013 11:28:10 +0100, Andrea Zanni zanni.andre...@gmail.com
wrote:
 Hi all.
 I would like to raise the issue that this mailing list *seems* not to
have
 active administrators/moderators.
 
 As per suggestion of Asaf, I asked zhaladsar (who seems to be the only
 admiin) several times (in these months) to be co-administrator. He never
 replied.
 Also, some users seem to have problems too (es
 https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Aubrey#Wikisource_User_Group)
 
 How can we solve this?
 I'd like to be an admin of the list, I don't know
 * if you are OK with it
 * how to do this (maybe a bug in bugzilla?)
 
 Aubrey

I am pretty certain that I have seen Zhaladshar around the traps, though
wouldn't swear to it.  Have you tried a message on his enWS user page?  if
all else fails, then I would think that a bugzilla request though depending
on what the bug is to be.  If it was to get a new admin, then I would think
that there should be a specific discussion, probably two, list and mulWS
proposing a spill if the admin is otherwise lost.

Regards, Billinghurst

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Re: [Wikisource-l] [Wikidata-l] next sister project: Wikisource

[billinghurst]

On Tue, 5 Nov 2013 17:27:02 +0100, Andrea Zanni zanni.andre...@gmail.com
wrote:
 About this:
 
 On Tue, Nov 5, 2013 at 2:13 PM, David Cuenca dacu...@gmail.com wrote:
 
 Connecting new uploaded books with Wikidata: again this is very related
 to
 the above. As a first preparatory step, one GsoC of this year worked on
 using templates (like commons:Template:Book) directly with the
 UploadWizard. It generates the form according to a template, which in
 turn
 could create both a Wikidata item and a Wikisource page when the
uploaded
 file is a book. However this has been stalled due to this RFC on
Commons:


https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Commons:Requests_for_comment/How_Commons_should_deal_with_TemplateData

 
 how this concerns us?
 
 Sorry, but I don't really understand this TemplateData issue.
 Uploading books directly from Wikisource (entering all the important
 metadata, that would go to Commons, Wikisource and Wikidata) is a
crucial
 *feature* that we absolutely need.
 What is the problem, here, specifically?
 
 Thanks!
 
 Aubrey

From my point of view, an upload form should be focused at Wikidata more
than at Commons, anything else is back-to-front.

If we are talking about a published work that it is published is its own
notability and transcends whether it is at Wikisource, Commons, or
Wikipedia, such that it is published makes it Wikidata-able (to coin a
word). We can easily support this statement as copyright alone will prevent
a work from appearing at Wikisource or WikiCommons, and similarly some
published works may not be individually notable for Wikipedia, but may be
so for other reference, thinking here of things that have a DOI.

*Then* comes the issue of which site wishes to utilise the data.  So
having Wikidata as the primary entry point to enter book data, and then
call it from other places as required seems the logical place to start for
any new work at any of the places.

Regards Billinghurst

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Re: [Wikisource-l] Wikisource for archival transcription

[billinghurst]

On Thu, 19 Sep 2013 07:20:48 -0500, Ben Brumfield benwb...@gmail.com
wrote:
 I'll be presenting on crowdsourced transcription at the Midwest Archives
 Conference Fall Symposium next week and would like to spend some time on
 Wikisource and examples of small-to-medium sized archives working with
 Wikisource to transcribe handwritten material.
 
 I know about the US NARA-Wikisource example--though it's a bit too big
to
 be relevant for my audience--and really like the Archives departmental
des
 Alpes-Maritimes on Wikisource.fr  (see

http://fr.wikisource.org/wiki/Wikisource:Partenariats/Archives_D%C3%A9partementales_des_Alpes-Maritimesand

http://manuscripttranscription.blogspot.com/2012/04/french-departmental-archive-on.html)
 
 
 Are there other good examples of libraries and archives working with
 Wikisource for handwritten material I should point to?  Are there how
tos
 similar to the GLAM-Wiki guides?  I'm fine dealing with French, German,
or
 Spanish, but suspect my audience would prefer Engish-language projects.
 
 Ben
 http://manuscripttranscription.blogspot.com/

Ben,

Speak to John Vandenberg, he has somewhat recently set up
  https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Wikisource:WikiProject SLQ
based around the provision of images from the State Library of Queensland.

We also had a crew from University of Colorado Museum of Natural History
(if I remember correctly) working on
  https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Field_Notes_of_Junius_Henderson

Regards, Billinghurst

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Re: [Wikisource-l] Is nsPage merely a proofreading tool?

[billinghurst]

On Sun, 25 Aug 2013 07:46:22 +0200, Alex Brollo alex.bro...@gmail.com
wrote:
 Into a recent talk at en.source Scriptorium, it has been told that
nsPage
 can be viewed merely as a proofreading tool, the ns0 transclusion/text
 being the real core of source content.
 
 I have a different opinion, since I see nsPage code as the real core of
 source content, ns0 being merely a derived content, that could be
obtained
 with complete automation with a set of data wrapped into a Lua/Scribunto
 set of structural data (wrapping any needed data for header template and
 for pages tag), so that any ns0 page/subpage could be obtained with a
 template {{Derive|index base page name}}.
 
 Giving to nsPage such a core content role, it will be much simpler to
wrap
 into it TEI data, and any POV related to different styles of
 chapter/sections structure/naming could be avoided; html rendering will
be
 unchanged, so saving IMHO conversion in ePub.
 
 What do you think about?
 
 Alex brollo

I am fairly certain that 95% of our transcribers would have little or no
concept about which you are talking, and I am not certain that I do either.
Once we get out of the scope of the obvious, further suggestions start to
be difficult.

The concept that we utilise at enWS is that
* Page: ns is a working, non-presentation area. It is a means for
formatting text for transclusion to the main ns (for straight
transcription) and for translation (for WS sourced translations).
* Main ns is the presentation layer of the work produced by the author.

We are not into the slavish concept of the page as produced by the
printer as its own entity beyond it being a carriage for the text. I would
think that any further interpretation about structural data is getting too
weighed down in other considerations, not the concept of the capturing of
the words of an author.

Regards, Billinghurst

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Re: [Wikisource-l] About texts without supporting files and Index: pages

[billinghurst]

On Tue, 11 Jun 2013 12:16:54 +0530, Aarti K. Dwivedi
ellydwivedi2...@gmail.com wrote:
 A slighly off-topic question: Even if we modify the extension to
proofread
 books which do not have scans( I am assuming books that were born
digital
 ), against what
 will these books be proofread?
 

I am not sure why we are looking to proofread a digital only file, unless
of course it never had a text layer and it had to be OCR'd.  Proofreading
surely only relates to scanned images where there has been the need to
proofread.

Regards, Billinghurst

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Re: [Wikisource-l] Playing with Lua, javascript and pagelist tag

[billinghurst]

On Fri, 7 Jun 2013 14:44:06 +0200, Andrea Zanni zanni.andre...@gmail.com
wrote:
 On Fri, Jun 7, 2013 at 2:01 PM, billinghurst billinghu...@gmail.com
 wrote:
 
 I don't agree that it should be fully automated by any stretch of the
 imagination.  I can see that it is an option that some may wish to use,
 but
 I dislike the limitations, and do not see it working as the only means
to
 use.

 
 Well, I think that the bot/Lua/extension/whatever could show to the user
a
 window with the structure of the book as it would be created.
 The user could change some things, or Cancel the automatic transclusion.
 
 I don't know: to me, avoiding the burden of taking care of different
 namesapces, with diffirent templates needed and strange tags (eg
pagelist)
 should be an aim for us, if we want the layman to understand Wikisource
and
 contribute.
 I myself can't upload and create a whole book from the scan to the ns0
 transclusion without mistakes or forgetting important things.
 Wikisource *is* difficult,
 Too much, IMHO.
 
 Aubrey

I am not saying that it isn't part of the choice, I am just saying that it
should not be enforced. I am explaining choice, not commenting on the
development of the proposed tool and its availability. At a point of time,
I may use it. Of course you make mistakes, we all do, and they are not just
in the pages stuff.  I make more mistakes in Page: ns than I do in main. 
I see mistakes in the published books, including mistakes in ToC. Humans
while they make mistakes, also are able to error resolve.

English Wikisource has more components in its headers, and is able to
adapt its {{header}} components more dynamically.  Having the ability to
tweak enables presentation to how it suits a work, and its readibility; to
this point of time, I find the automated process too restricting.

Regards, Billinghurst

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Re: [Wikisource-l] Reunification of Wikisources

[billinghurst]

Read the archives
 https://wikisource.org/wiki/Wikisource:Scriptorium
or there are still a few of the old timers around, though they are getting
hard to distinguish from Ents.

Lack of shared templates/modules is not the reason to re-merge, that is a
reason to push hard on WMF for the capability. I definitely agree that is
it a missing capacity, especially when we have a shared tool, and can
demonstrate already that a shared script facility is beneficial. I would
suggest that a bugzilla be launched to request that wikisource.org be setup
to house shared scripts, include modules, or a commons area for us. PUSH
PUSH PUSH as we know that it is the squeaky wheel that gets oiled. We can
offer to be the pilot. To me it is about availability, we know that the
system can support files of the same name (local vs commons), so there is
no need for only a central module, it can seem to co-exist with local.  I
could present the argument that enWS utilises more templates from enWP than
those from other WSes. To me an available common module space is a
no-brainer, though I more favour a Commons approach, than a WS-focused
approach.

Small communities is not a reason unify. They have the scope to move back
to wikisource.org if they so wish.

Multi-lingual books are already welcomed at wikisource.org, we don't need
to unify to do those.

As I said, you have started the conversation with a solution, then hunt
for the argument.  If we Identify all the issues, the solutions could be
unification, or it could be a number of other steps.

Regards, Billinghurst

On Sun, 2 Jun 2013 00:06:32 -0400, David Cuenca dacu...@gmail.com wrote:
 Hi Billinghurst,
 
 Thanks for your sharing your concerns and sorry if I didn't outline the
 problems in my email. I thought the main ones were already well-known,
 namely:
 - Redundancy of templates/modules, everything has to be done again for
each
 language Wikisource and it is not easy to benefit from the advances from
 other communities
 - Having small disperse communities makes harder to keep their tools
 up-to-date and to share know-how
 - Hard to have cross-language projects (like multi-lingual books)
 
 While on the Amsterdam Hackathon I asked several people about why the
 project was split, but I didn't get a clear answer. I can imagine that
it
 was because back in the day there were no easy ways of localizing
 templates, documentation, etc. but if you find any conversation or
decision
 in the archives, please do share it.
 
 If we, as Wikisource users, should push harder to get components to
 strengthen our community, then it is a good thing to start this debate
to
 know what is wanted.
 The proposed centralization of modules (see below), it is only one way
of
 approaching it, however I think it is important to consider all options
to
 make sure it is the best way.
 
 Cheers,
 David --Micru
 
 On Sat, Jun 1, 2013 at 9:40 PM, billinghurst billinghu...@gmail.com
 wrote:
 
 This seems more like a solution in search of a problem.

 What is the problem?
 How is the current situation not working?
 What are you trying to solve?
 Where is the review of why the split to language communities?
 What are the benefits?

 If this is about shared tools, or better integration of specific
 components, then let us isolate the problems, then work to the
solution.
 Pushing harder on WMF to get components that strengthen our community,
 provide a better product, and more resource productve, and are part of
 their ultimate plan is worthwhile. Starting with a solution isn't going
 to
 get the best result.

 Regards, Billinghurst



 On Sat, 1 Jun 2013 20:22:38 -0400, David Cuenca dacu...@gmail.com
 wrote:
  Hi Jane, hi Alex,
 
  Yes, I agree with you that a centralized Wikisource would be quite
  meaningful, specially now that projects like Wikidata have shown that
  it
 is
  possible to have both localization and centralization living in
  harmony.
  I know that Doug (cc'ed) did some experiments with this goal in mind,
 but I
  have no idea how far he is now.
  Apart from the technical challenge, it also worries me the social
 aspect.
  Wikisourcerors from each Wikisource and have lived in isolation from
 each
  other for a long time. How would be a reunification perceived by the
  different communities? Would it be something wanted?
 
  Andrea and me have the pending task of contacting the communities, so
 this
  is something that we should bring up among other important topics
(like
 the
  creation of a Wikisource User Group:
  http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_User_Groups)
 
  The OPW is a grant program for students similar to Google Summer of
  Code
  focused on helping bring more female contributors to open source
 projects.
  https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Outreach_Program_for_Women
  So yes, it is a gendergap project, but we can offer
wikisource-related
  projects as we did with GsoC.
 
  David --Micru
 
  PS: Some of those plates are quite scary... I love them :)
 
 
  On Sat, Jun 1, 2013 at 4

Re: [Wikisource-l] Reunification of Wikisources

[billinghurst]

This seems more like a solution in search of a problem.

What is the problem?
How is the current situation not working?
What are you trying to solve?
Where is the review of why the split to language communities?
What are the benefits?

If this is about shared tools, or better integration of specific
components, then let us isolate the problems, then work to the solution.
Pushing harder on WMF to get components that strengthen our community,
provide a better product, and more resource productve, and are part of
their ultimate plan is worthwhile. Starting with a solution isn't going to
get the best result.

Regards, Billinghurst



On Sat, 1 Jun 2013 20:22:38 -0400, David Cuenca dacu...@gmail.com wrote:
 Hi Jane, hi Alex,
 
 Yes, I agree with you that a centralized Wikisource would be quite
 meaningful, specially now that projects like Wikidata have shown that it
is
 possible to have both localization and centralization living in harmony.
 I know that Doug (cc'ed) did some experiments with this goal in mind,
but I
 have no idea how far he is now.
 Apart from the technical challenge, it also worries me the social
aspect.
 Wikisourcerors from each Wikisource and have lived in isolation from
each
 other for a long time. How would be a reunification perceived by the
 different communities? Would it be something wanted?
 
 Andrea and me have the pending task of contacting the communities, so
this
 is something that we should bring up among other important topics (like
the
 creation of a Wikisource User Group:
 http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_User_Groups)
 
 The OPW is a grant program for students similar to Google Summer of Code
 focused on helping bring more female contributors to open source
projects.
 https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Outreach_Program_for_Women
 So yes, it is a gendergap project, but we can offer wikisource-related
 projects as we did with GsoC.
 
 David --Micru
 
 PS: Some of those plates are quite scary... I love them :)
 
 
 On Sat, Jun 1, 2013 at 4:12 AM, Jane Darnell jane...@gmail.com wrote:
 
 Hi David and Alex,
 I am also starting to think that one project would be a whole lot
 simpler, especially given the lack of cross-referencing between
 projects, which would be nice to have in the wikisource of many
 popular wikipedia languages - especially for translated texts.

 Years ago, while researching an urban legend, I took some photographs
 of the engravings and the table of contents of a Latin book and its
 Dutch translation a century later. At the time I was toying with the
 idea of cross referencing the stories but realized quickly there was
 no way to do this on Wikisource. I put my scans here:


http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Observationes_Medicae_by_Nicolaes_Tulp

 Wouldn't it be easier to have just one Wikisource and have all
 language-related information reside in interface layers and for the
 language of texts, the category structure? This would make the Lua
 interface easier to achieve and work on.

 David, do you mean by Outreach Program for Women to refer to a
 specific wikisource project other than the general ones we have for
 the gendergap project?

 Jane

 2013/5/31, Alex Brollo alex.bro...@gmail.com:
  I agree fully Micru.
  Obviously, my dream is something much simpler and clear-cut: a unique
  wikisource for all languages, since an unique project for any textual
 media
  is needed IMHO just as a common project for any non-textual media is
  running: Commons; and a common project for data now exists: Wikidata.
 
  And now, let's go to explore Lua a little bit more I presume,
that
  mw.loaderData() can  read a table of Lua functions too, if I
understand
 Lua
  table features. So, shared modules could perhaps be hosted into one
  data
  module only. Let's try 
 
  Alex
 
 
 
 
  2013/5/31 David Cuenca dacu...@gmail.com
 
  Hi all,
 
  After a talk with Brad Jorsch during the Hackathon (thanks again
Brad
 for
  your patience), it became clear to me that Lua modules can be
  localized
  either by using system messages or by getting the project language
  code
  (mw.getContentLanguage().getCode()) and then switching the message.
  This
  second option is less integrated with the translation system, but
can
  serve
  as intermediate step to get things running.
 
  For Wikisource it would be nice to have a central repository
(sitting
  on
  wikisource.org) of localized Lua modules and associated templates.
The
  documentation could be translated using Extension:Translate. These
  modules,
  templates and associated documentation would be then synchronized
with
  all
  the language wikisources that subscribe to an opt-in list. Users
would
 be
  then advised to modify the central module, thus all language
versions
  would
  benefit of the improvements. This could be the first experiment of
 having
  a
  centralized repository of modules.
 
  What do you think of this? Would be anyone available to mentor an
  Outreach
  Program for Women project

Re: [Wikisource-l] Lua modules for Wikisource

[billinghurst]

On Mon, 20 May 2013 17:54:08 +0200, Andrea Zanni
zanni.andre...@gmail.com
wrote:
 Hi all,
 is there any Wikisource which had Lua deployed?
 I'm looking for a book/header templates re-written in Lua to copy and
 localize :-)
 (so far, I've seen only this one in the Italian Wikipedia
 http://it.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Modulo:Tracceaction=edit)
 And I'd love to see Book and Creator templates on Commons Lua-style :-)
 
 Aubrey


It is my understanding, though maybe it is a misunderstanding, that there
will be a common place for xwiki modules, and gadgets, though I think that
it is only slated for 'at some point of time'.

In asking ... 

https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Requests_for_comment/Global_bits_and_pieces

has been created with conversations from other places

Regards, Billinghurst

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Re: [Wikisource-l] RfC on Wikidata about books metadata

[billinghurst]

I am pretty certain that I saw that Jarekt was involved with the book task
force. I definitely saw his name on the page, and I know that I have
pointed at some specific components to them.

Regards, Billinghurst


On Fri, 17 May 2013 12:45:28 +0200, Alex Brollo alex.bro...@gmail.com
wrote:
 If I can add a comment, I suggest that Commons should be included into
 wikidata net as soon as possible, since it shares with wikidata its
feature
 of being a unique container and book metadata are already shared
between
 all wikisource projects and Commons for a central group of works (the
 proofread ones). I suggest too to keep wikidata staff in contact with
 Jarekt, who works hardly  into Commons and is particularly interested
about
 books and creators (i.e. authors).
 
 In my opinion, the fast inclusion of Commons into Wikidata net will
solve
 most issues of wikisource projects too.
 
 Alex
 
 
 2013/5/17 Andrea Zanni zanni.andre...@gmail.com
 

 On Fri, May 17, 2013 at 11:56 AM, Ed Summers e...@pobox.com wrote:

 Can you provide more information about what decision needs to be made
 about the relationship between Wikidata and Wikisource?


 I will try, and hopefully Micru (who knows Wikidata much better than
me)
 will follow up.

 Wikidata right know is integrated with Wikipedia only.
 Sister projects (as Wikisource) are now not taken in consideration,
 because each one is different and must be taken iin consideration
 indipendently.
 This is at least the opinion of the development tem (whom we speak to
 several times).

 One of the main issue is that, right know,
 Wikidata will store books metadata for Wikipedia pages, and that, in
FRBR
 jargon, are work metadata (see

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Functional_Requirements_for_Bibliographic_Records
 )
 Wikipedia articles, in most cases, talk about books in general (The
 Hamlet, Don Quixote, etc.).

 Wikisource, on the other end, works with editions (manifestation in
 FRBR), which need more metadata
 (edition, year of the edition, language, translator, etc.)
 This is the very same issues of djvu files on Commons, which store
 metadata into the Book template.

 Now,
  the problem is that, as I said before, Wikidata doen't talk with
Commons
 and Wikisource (yet).
 And it's a duty of the community to decide *how*, for example, store
 edition metadata in Wikidata.

 We, for example, could create an item for every book edition we use in
 Wikisource/Commons.
 Or we could use *qualifiers*, and add these data in the main item
related
 to the book.
 The latter is Micru's proposal, and he made a mockup:
 https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Q4115189oldid=35796153

 I think it's the best proposal, as today,
 and if you agree you can support it:


https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Wikidata:Requests_for_comment/References_and_sources#How_to_store_edition_data


 I hope this clarification helped a bit.

 Aubrey







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[Wikisource-l] Missing project ideas for GSOC

[billinghurst]

It was suggested to me that the Wikisources should be paying attention to
the opportunity available through WMF's participation in Google Summer of
Code.

I have started a discussion at
https://wikisource.org/wiki/Wikisource:Scriptorium#Wikisources_asked_for_ideas_re:_Google_Summer_of_Code

Regards, Billinghurst

 Original Message 
Subject: [Wikitech-l] Missing project ideas for GSOC
Date: Wed, 20 Mar 2013 16:43:23 -0700
From: Quim Gil q...@wikimedia.org
Reply-To: Wikimedia developers wikitec...@lists.wikimedia.org
Organization: Wikimedia Foundation
To: Wikimedia developers wikitec...@lists.wikimedia.org

It's time to start defining what we want our Google Summer of Code to be
all about. Let's look at the ideas we are proposing to potential students:

https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Mentorship_programs/Possible_projects

Many of the ideas listed there are too generic (Write an extension),
improvements of existing features (Improve Extension:CSS) or
work-in-progress tasks (Fix Parsoid bugs). Many others are not
directly related with development, and therefore not suitable either for
GSOC.

After this filtering, we seem to be left with:

* Article evolution playback tool idea
* An easy way to share wiki content on social media services
* Write an extension to support XML Sitemaps without using command line
* Extension:OEmbedProvider
* Add support for x3d 3D files to MediaWiki
* Allow smoother and easier Wikimedia Commons pictures discovery
* Build an interwiki notifications framework and implement it for
InstantCommons
* Automatic category redirects

(If you think your project should also be considered here please speak
up!)

Most of these projects seem to be extension (and PHP?) centric. Can we
have more diversity? Maybe gadgets and templates are too simple for a
GSOC project? What about the mobile front? Do we have skin development
projects that could make it here? Anything in the DevOps area? Anything
the MediaWiki core maintainers would like to see happening?

It would be also nice to have more candidates benefiting specific
Wikimedia projects. Beyond Wikipedia, we have several proposals related
to Commons. Wikidata seems to be joining soon. What else? Could this be
a chance to help Wiktionary, Wikibooks or any other project with
specific needs craving for tech attention?

Also to the many students that have already showed their interest: feel
free pushing your project ideas now!

-- 
Quim Gil
Technical Contributor Coordinator @ Wikimedia Foundation
http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/User:Qgil

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Re: [Wikisource-l] Wikisource-l Digest, Vol 179, Issue 1

[billinghurst]

On Wed, 23 Jan 2013 Dimce Grozdanoski 12:00:50 +,
Hi all,

I'm new to wikisource.

I look for help how to upload large collection of books, about 130
volumes of books in Macedonian and it's translation in English.

If some one have some suggestions how to do it at the best way in short
time.

Best regards,
Dimce Grozdanoski
Wikimedia Macedonia




Hi Dimce,

==Upload==
* Djvu or PDF files with scanned text layers are best.
* I am presuming that all works are in the public domain in both the US
and the place of publication
* (if previous is okay) Files are uploaded to Commons, and we look to use
the {{book}} template [1]
* There are some reasonable instructions and explanations at English
Wikipedia for many aspects.[2]
This gets the files in place, and if we have used {{book}} the meta data
available

==Local creations==
For each work an Index: file will need to be created. Not sure about
Macedonian wiki, but for enWS, putting a list of the works uploaded to
commons, or pointing to your uploads, and asking for help at
Scriptorium[3] will elicit assistance. BUT you say Macdeonian and English
translations, so presumably both are not on the same scanned page.  This
adds some complexity, so we need some understanding of what specifically is
available.

If you the files are big, and/or you have upload issues, then with that
many files, they can be burnt onto media and sent to WMF for upload.  Note
this will take effort and coordination.


[1] https://commons.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?title=Template:
[2] https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Help:Proofreading
[3] https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Wikisource:Scriptorium

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[Wikisource-l] Fwd: [Wikitech-ambassadors] Local discussions about how to improve communication between users and developers

[billinghurst]

Not sure whether the Wikisource community saw this email from Guillaume. 
I was thinking that maybe we should as a community be looking to avail
ourselves of this opportunity to reinvigorate how we collaborate, at least
on the holistic issues that we face through use of Mediawiki.  We seem to
have all wandered off to our own little communities, and doing less in the
way of sharing.

I would like to propose that we set up something as a standalone subject
within the Wikisource: namespace, or as a subpage of
Wikisource:Scriptorium.  I was thinking that each subject could be a
separate subpage, allowing discussion on talk pages.  Then summarising back
to the main page which could be reflected back to the WMF community as per
the below subject requests.

Things that I see that we could also look to better as a community
* Discussions on extensions that could be universally useful
* Configurations of tools that have a cross language interest
* Better utilising some of the great work that Tpt has been doing on
ProofreadPage
* Bug issues as we now have regular updates
* Better support the smaller WS communities who don't have the people or
knowledge resources taht come with a biger community

I know that there has been stuff that has been happening at frWS and enWS
that has been shared between us, but we should be doing more broadly.

Regards, Andrew


 Original Message 
Subject: [Wikitech-ambassadors] Local discussions about how to improve
communication between users and developers
Date: Fri, 7 Dec 2012 17:03:52 +0100
From: Guillaume Paumier gpaum...@wikimedia.org
To: Coordination of technology deployments across languages/projects
wikitech-ambassad...@lists.wikimedia.org
Reply-To: Coordination of technology deployments across languages/projects
wikitech-ambassad...@lists.wikimedia.org

Greetings,

Summary: I'm trying to get comments and ideas on how to improve
communication between developers and Wikimedia editors, and I'd like
to ask the help of people on this list to ask your local communities
what they think, and post the results of those discussions here.

Longer version:

Communication between Wikimedia contributors and tech people
(primarily MediaWiki developers, but also designers and other
engineers) hasn't always been ideal. In recent years, Wikimedia
employees have made efforts to become more transparent, but what I'd
like to discuss today is how we can better engage in true
collaboration and 2-way discussion, not just reports and
announcements. It's easy to post a link to a new feature that's
already been implemented, and tell users Please provide feedback!.
It's much more difficult to truly collaborate every step of the way,
from the early planning to deployment.

Some big tech projects sponsored by the Wikimedia Foundation are
lucky enough to have a Community Liaison who can spend a lot of time
discussing with editors, basically incarnating this 2-way
communication channel between users and engineering staff. But one
person can only do so much: they have to focus on a handful of
features, and primarily discusses with the English Wikipedia
community. We want to be able to do this for dozens of engineering
projects with hundreds of wikis, in many languages, and truly
collaborate to build new features together. Hiring hundreds of
Community Liaisons isn't really a viable option.

There are probably things in the way we do tech stuff (e.g. new
software features and deployments) that drive editors insane. You
probably have lots of ideas about what the ideal situation should be,
and how to get there: What can the developer community (staff and
volunteers) do to get there? (in the short term, medium term, long
term?) What can users do to get there?

Instead of just postulating that The problem is X and The solution
is obviously Y, I've started an extensive consultation process to
learn from users, to hear you, to listen to your complaints and your
ideas on how to fix the issues. I'm hoping that this open and
collaborative thinking process will yield better results than a
one-sided analysis.

An preliminary consultation took place last month with projects in
English and French. I've summarized the initial findings and
proposals:
https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Technical_communications/Fall_2012_consultation#Phase_2:_Summary_and_wider_outreach

I'm hoping that we can now expand this consultation to more projects
and more languages, with your help. It isn't feasible for me to launch
a discussion on each wiki in each language, but I'm hoping that you
can help me spread this message and start those discussions with your
local communities.

I realize this will take some of your time, but I think it's worth
spending a little time to discuss this now in order to make big
improvements later on how we communicate with each other.

I'm available to answer comments, concerns and questions.

Many thanks for your help!

-- 
Guillaume Paumier
Technical Communications Manager — Wikimedia Foundation

Re: [Wikisource-l] @deWS Scans with image missing

[billinghurst]

 What's the problem? If in a whole book single scans are lacking, you
 can see them in the category easily with this red marker.

 Feel free to provide the lacking page scan instead of posing silly
 questions like the Commons administrator idiots. Thank you.

Hi Klaus,

The issue is at this point of time, you have a construct of images that
are all duplicates of the same file.  You are about to see the images
deleted as duplicate
https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Commons:Deletion_policy, and when
someone tried to illustrate an issue, you were insulting.  Excellent.

Regards, Andrew

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[Wikisource-l] @deWS Scans with image missing

[billinghurst]

Would someone at deWS be so kind to have a look at 
  File:Der Sagenschatz des Königreichs Sachsen (Grässe) 360.gif
 
https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Der_Sagenschatz_des_K%C3%B6nigreichs_Sachsen_%28Gr%C3%A4sse%29_360.gif

and work out what is happening with that and likely to be the appropriate
solution.

At the moment, the only real choice is to delete it unless there is better
guidance.  Thanks.
Regards, Andrew

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[Wikisource-l] Old newspapers in Google News

[billinghurst]

I just stumbled across that Google News now has old newspapers stored
within it.

http://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=1302dat=18870430id=vcJPIBAJsjid=V5MDIBAJpg=2118,4436727

Now I am probably late to the ball, I just hadn't seen a conversation
before, and wondered on the extent, both in language and in age.  Anyone
else managed to have a look see?

Regards, Andrew

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[Wikisource-l] Fwd: [Bug 21653] Creating a PDF with collection extension does not render the pages tag hook from proofread page extension

[billinghurst]

This looks like very good news.  We can but wait and maybe slightly ask to
see when it will be incorporated to WMF's mw rollout.

Regards, Andrew

 Original Message 
Subject: [Bug 21653] Creating a PDF with collection extension does not
render the pages tag hook from proofread page extension
Date: Wed, 11 Jan 2012 21:54:13 +
From: bugzilla-dae...@wikimedia.org
To: billinghu...@gmail.com

https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=21653

Ralf Schmitt r...@brainbot.com changed:

   What|Removed |Added

 Status|NEW |RESOLVED
 Resolution||FIXED

--- Comment #16 from Ralf Schmitt r...@brainbot.com 2012-01-11 21:54:13
UTC ---
implemented in mwlib 0.13.2, which is already live on pdf cluster.

please report further issues on github:
https://github.com/pediapress/mwlib/issues/new

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Re: [Wikisource-l] Image filter on Wikisource

[Billinghurst]

On 24 Sep 2011 at 11:15, John Vandenberg wrote:

 The image filter that the WMF is planning is intended to be deployed
 on all Wikimedia projects.  A lot of the design and discussion is
 about Wikipedia, and primarily English Wikipedia.  I think we need to
 petition for Wikisource to be exempt from this tool.
 
 http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_Forum#Image_filter_on_Wikisource
 
 http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Requests_for_comment/Image_filter_on_Wikisource
 

I don't think that we should petition any such thing, if people have a choice 
to have the 
filter turned on, then let them make that choice.  We just need to explain the 
consequences.

Regards, Andrew

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[Wikisource-l] (Fixed) [Bug 28574] Proofread doesn't add buttons to wikiEditor

[Billinghurst]

To let people know that WikiEditor toolbar now includes a dropin Proofread 
section.  I 
know that we are going to need to do some work on the gadget that toggles the 
headers to 
be open by default, however, it is great to have some progress. :-)

Regards, Andrew

--- Forwarded message follows ---
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=28574

Brion Vibber br...@wikimedia.org changed:

   What|Removed |Added

 Status|NEW |RESOLVED
 Resolution||FIXED

--- Comment #8 from Brion Vibber br...@wikimedia.org 2011-07-15 22:06:51 UTC 
---
Merged to REL1_17 r92319 - tested locally.

Merged to 1.17wmf1 r92321.

Merged to REL1_18 r92323.

Fix should go live shortly.

--- Comment #9 from Brion Vibber br...@wikimedia.org 2011-07-15 22:14:21 UTC 
---
Confirmed fix live at
http://de.wikisource.org/w/index.php?title=Seite:Arthur_Schnitzler_%E2%80%93_Flucht_in_die
_Finsternis_%E2%80%93_141.jpgaction=edit

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[Wikisource-l] English Wikisource running consensus process for new Checkuser

[Billinghurst]

I would like to inform the Wikisource community that haunts the mailing list 
that a 
nomination has been made to appoint a CheckUser for English Wikisource.  A 
similar 
announcement has been placed at Wikisource:Scriptorium.

The nomination is for Spangineer, and it can be located at
http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Wikisource:Administrators#Nominations_for_Checkuser
The community is invited to participate in the process.

As background John Vandenberg has voluntarily returned his bit during his 
annual 
confirmation.

Regards, Andrew


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Re: [Wikisource-l] Back to the Scroll

[Billinghurst]

Hi Magnus,

The tool has choked on something for
 
http://toolserver.org/~magnus/book2scroll/index.html?lang=enfile=Mrs_Caudle%2527s_curtain_lectures.djvustartpage=1
might it be the apostrophe in the url?  This url just shows the one page, and 
no 
subsequent pages, and that is for whichever starting page one feeds into the 
url.

Regards Andrew


On 16 Aug 2010 at 13:22, Magnus Manske wrote:

 On Mon, Aug 16, 2010 at 1:02 PM, Alex Brollo alex.bro...@gmail.com wrote:
  Thanks!
 
  I just tried to build a template like this:
 
  [[File:Library-logo-blue-outline.png|30px|link=http://toolserver.org/~magnus/book2scroll/index.html
  ?lang=itfile={{urlencode:{{PAGENAME]], to be used into Index: pages.
 
  But urlencode converts spaces into +, where your script doesn't like the
  output of urlencode... it only likes names where spaces are replaced by
  underscores.
 
  How can I obtain this transformation by a parser function/by a template? Or:
  can you modify the scripts, so that url encoded titles are accepted too?
 
  I apologyze, if my question is banal.
 
 Not at all, though
 http://toolserver.org/~magnus/book2scroll/index.html?lang=itfile=De%27+matematici+italiani+anteriori+all%27invenzione+della+stampa.djvu
 seems to work fine. You can also try {{PAGENAMEE}} (note the two E).
 
 Note that sometimes, the Index: name is not the same at the actual
 .djvu file, so you should allow attribute {{{1}}} to be the filename
 (PAGENAME by default), and maybe the start page as {{{2}}}, default
 1. That would also allow for the template to be used anywhere, not
 just on the index page.
 
 Cheers,
 Magnus
 
 
 



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Re: [Wikisource-l] Improvements

[Billinghurst]

Michael,

The mean reasons that we were looking to standardise chapter names is that we 
are now 
getting to the stage where we are putting in references to future books that we 
are 
planning to work upon.  Ahead of time we don't know chapter names, or even if 
they have 
names, plus the references themselves usually refer to something like Ch.2, so 
they are 
already in that format. Some of that conversation is at 
http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Wikisource_talk:Naming_conventions
in all its glory.

That is not to say that we don't use the chapter name in the header, as we do, 
it is just 
not in the subpage name.

Poems? Poetry?  Don't even know what that is! ;-)

Regards Andrew - poetry free zone

On 12 May 2010 at 7:17, Michael Jörgens wrote:

 This may work on chapters, but I dislike replacing the true name by a
 number. And it wo't work on Books with poems were this two pointers got to
 the name of the previous and next poem. And it won't work on magazines, with
 lot of articles in.
 
 2010/5/11 Billinghurst billinghu...@gmail.com
 
  Lars,
 
  On enWS if you have the preload headers gadget activated it does this for
  you, RIDER, for
  the subpages for Chapters to work I believe that it needs for the Title
  page to have the
  links and it identifies where it is on the list and does prev/next.  If
  necessary I can
  try and work it out from Remember the Dot's script.
 
  At enWS, we started (though didn't complete) a naming convention
  discussion, though from
  that many of us are now defaulting to Chapter 1 .. 10 .. XX, rather than
  other variations
  (abbreviations, no chapter names, roman numerals, etc.) I have utilised
  Pathoschild's
  regex script to build a little function() to identify the current page, and
  then do the
  subsequent pages.  So it needs me to click on my function link, however, it
  is fairly
  simply achieved.
 
  Regards Andrew
 
  On 10 May 2010 at 10:39, Lars Aronsson wrote:
 
   Is it true that {{header|previous= |next= }} must be filled
   in manually for each chapter? Couldn't this be automated
   in the same way as ProofreadPage links  and  in a
   linear sequence, if you provide the table of contents in
   a central place? If that TOC contained the page number
   intervals and sections,  everything in the  chapter page
   could be automated, right?
  
   Is it true that full text search leads to to the Page:
   and not to the main namespace page that transcludes it?
   And that the former has no link to the latter?
  
   If I search the right understanding of the machine,
   I find
   http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Page:The_Kinematics_of_Machinery.djvu/24
   but I don't find
   http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/The_Kinematics_of_Machinery/Introduction
  
   How could that be improved? Is another Extension necessary?
  
  
   --
 Lars Aronsson (l...@aronsson.se)
 Aronsson Datateknik - http://aronsson.se
  
  
  
  
  
 
 
 
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