Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link
I will second this, I would love to hear it! -Cameron -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Travis Johnson Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2009 10:32 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link Isn't that the purpose of a public forum? :) Travis Microserv Jeff Ehman wrote: All, When comparing exactly apples to apples, there is about a 10-20% premium for a Dragonwave product. There are plenty of threads on this topic. I would be happy to grab a bunch for you so hit me off off-list. It really depends on your application for which product you would like to go with. I would be more than happy to walk you through everything. I try to refrain from stating opinions in a public forum. -Jeff -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Brad Belton Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2009 6:36 PM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link Hello Daniel, Can you elaborate in what way the Dragonwave performance is much better? Do you have a comparison chart you can share with us explaining how a Dragonwave stacks up against competing products. Namely Trango in this case. Exactly how close is close when you mention pricing between the two products? Close is a relative term don't you agree? So, are we talking $5, $50, $500, $5000? Look forward to your responses. Thank you, Brad -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of 3-dB Networks Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2009 6:25 PM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link Well... I'd be happy to quote you a Dragonwave link... I think you will be surprised how close it comes to the Trango pricing... and I think the performance is much better (I don't want to rehash that whole thread). We also will take care of all of the licensing work for you. Hit me offlist if you like. Daniel White 3-dB Networks http://www.3dbnetworks.com -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Andrew Niemantsverdriet Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2009 10:08 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link I am looking for a good place to get an 18ghz link, where do you guys suggest. Ideally the company would also procure the licence for us. I am thinking I want the Trango APEX because of it cost / performance. So if anybody has suggestions on a good company to use I am all ears! Thanks, _ /-\ ndrew WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ This message is intended only for the use of the individual or entity to which it is addressed and may contain information that is privileged, confidential and exempt from disclosure under applicable law. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, or the employee or agent responsible for delivery of the message to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us immediately by telephone at 630-344-1586. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/
Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link
I'll get this posted later today. Unbelievably busy this morning. Give me some time. -Jeff -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Cameron Kilton Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 7:40 AM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link I will second this, I would love to hear it! -Cameron -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Travis Johnson Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2009 10:32 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link Isn't that the purpose of a public forum? :) Travis Microserv Jeff Ehman wrote: All, When comparing exactly apples to apples, there is about a 10-20% premium for a Dragonwave product. There are plenty of threads on this topic. I would be happy to grab a bunch for you so hit me off off-list. It really depends on your application for which product you would like to go with. I would be more than happy to walk you through everything. I try to refrain from stating opinions in a public forum. -Jeff -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Brad Belton Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2009 6:36 PM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link Hello Daniel, Can you elaborate in what way the Dragonwave performance is much better? Do you have a comparison chart you can share with us explaining how a Dragonwave stacks up against competing products. Namely Trango in this case. Exactly how close is close when you mention pricing between the two products? Close is a relative term don't you agree? So, are we talking $5, $50, $500, $5000? Look forward to your responses. Thank you, Brad -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of 3-dB Networks Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2009 6:25 PM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link Well... I'd be happy to quote you a Dragonwave link... I think you will be surprised how close it comes to the Trango pricing... and I think the performance is much better (I don't want to rehash that whole thread). We also will take care of all of the licensing work for you. Hit me offlist if you like. Daniel White 3-dB Networks http://www.3dbnetworks.com -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Andrew Niemantsverdriet Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2009 10:08 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link I am looking for a good place to get an 18ghz link, where do you guys suggest. Ideally the company would also procure the licence for us. I am thinking I want the Trango APEX because of it cost / performance. So if anybody has suggestions on a good company to use I am all ears! Thanks, _ /-\ ndrew WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ This message is intended only for the use of the individual or entity to which it is addressed and may contain information that is privileged, confidential and exempt from disclosure under applicable law. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, or the employee or agent responsible for delivery of the message to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us immediately by telephone at 630-344-1586. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link
Brad, Go back through the list achieves... I think I have made my stance on why Dragonwave is better in my opinion than Trango. I've installed nine Trango Giga links... so my opinion is based on my own personal experience... not just the Dragonwave marketing material. I didn't repost these comments because many got tired of the whole Dragonwave/Trango battle on the list. I sent this to someone earlier though... I could come up with more reasons if you wish... or just go back through the achieves. - Volume of product sold - Dragonwave sold $50 million dollars worth of equipment last year... by all reports Trango sold only 100 links or so. It is not unreasonable to think that Trango may not last in the market, especially with them ditching their point to multi-point product. - Dragonwave 6GHz, 11GHz, 18GHz, 23GHz, 24GHz, and 38GHz is all available now. - Lower power consumption - Field Proven - Firmware releases are stable... Trango has only been in the field for about a year now, and firmware by many accounts is still buggy. - CLI/GUI - Trango GUI is not useable, all commands must come from the CLI. Often these commands are confusing to use. Dragonwave can be configured either way easily. - LED Alignment/Voltmeter Alignment - LED Alignment on Trango gear is not as accurate as voltmeter on Dragonwave... can make aligning difficult links that much harder (since you only have two digits vs. four). From my own personal experience on this one. - Better link margins when using the High Power product - Trango 18GHz equipment does not cover the full band... I can dig up the e-mail I sent to the list about this. - Dragonwave does not have a waveguide adapter between the dish and the ODU... this caused a few problems on the massive Trango deployment I did (9 links) The price difference is in the sub-$1k range. I don't quote pricing on the list unless it is an advertised special. If you want a quote... hit me offlist. Daniel White 3-dB Networks http://www.3dbnetworks.com -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Brad Belton Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2009 10:06 PM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link Hello Daniel, Well, that is disappointing as I was hoping for more substance from you to back up your statements regarding close in price and performance much better. Instead you've chosen to throw a stone at a competing product and run the other way. I guess we'll have to chalk up your comments as all show and no go... Best, Brad -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of 3-dB Networks Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2009 10:49 PM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link I'm going to go with Jeff on this one... there has been multiple threads on this topic... I think it has been beat to death. If you want to talk about it offlist I'd be happy to. As far as the price difference... I'd be happy to quote the Dragonwave and let you compare it to the published Trango deals... but my personal opinion is that you are not paying a premium for the Dragonwave name... compared to what I would consider the benefits. Daniel White 3-dB Networks http://www.3dbnetworks.com -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Jeff Ehman Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2009 8:08 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link All, When comparing exactly apples to apples, there is about a 10-20% premium for a Dragonwave product. There are plenty of threads on this topic. I would be happy to grab a bunch for you so hit me off off-list. It really depends on your application for which product you would like to go with. I would be more than happy to walk you through everything. I try to refrain from stating opinions in a public forum. -Jeff -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Brad Belton Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2009 6:36 PM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link Hello Daniel, Can you elaborate in what way the Dragonwave performance is much better? Do you have a comparison chart you can share with us explaining how a Dragonwave stacks up against competing products. Namely Trango in this case. Exactly how close is close when you mention pricing between the two products? Close is a relative term don't you agree? So, are we talking $5, $50, $500, $5000? Look forward to your responses. Thank you, Brad -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of 3-dB Networks Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2009 6:25 PM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link Well... I'd be happy to quote you a Dragonwave link... I think you will be surprised how close it comes to the Trango
Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link
I have to run out into the field to work on a Bridgewave link (people pay good money for that :-). I'll answer this tonight. Daniel White 3-dB Networks http://www.3dbnetworks.com From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Travis Johnson Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2009 10:32 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link Hi, I have a better idea someone compile a simple side-by-side comparison of the Dragonwave vs. Trango 18ghz radios. List all the benefits of each radio, and then also list the current price for a comparable speed for each. I'm not familiar with the current Dragonwave product, so I will only list the benefits of the Trango APEX system (of which I currently have 3 running as our main backbone backhauls): (1) Radio mounted signal display for alignment (2) Optional fiber port (only have to buy the fiber module to plug in) (3) Various channel sizes (10, 20, 28, 40, 50, 80 mhz wide) (4) up to +20db power output (5) Jumbo packets via GigE (6) PoE (-48v) (7) In-band or out-of-band management (8) Separate GigE port for management (9) Rapid Port Shutdown (10) 1+1 redundancy (using a single antenna) (11) Dual power supplies (either PoE port can supply the power) (12) 2 year warranty standard (can be upgraded to 3 year, overnight replacement for $2,000 per link) (13) Price (currently $9,995 with 2ft dishes and frequency coordination. FCC fees are about $1,300 extra). Travis Microserv 3-dB Networks wrote: I'm going to go with Jeff on this one... there has been multiple threads on this topic... I think it has been beat to death. If you want to talk about it offlist I'd be happy to. As far as the price difference... I'd be happy to quote the Dragonwave and let you compare it to the published Trango deals... but my personal opinion is that you are not paying a premium for the Dragonwave name... compared to what I would consider the benefits. Daniel White 3-dB Networks http://www.3dbnetworks.com -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Jeff Ehman Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2009 8:08 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link All, When comparing exactly apples to apples, there is about a 10-20% premium for a Dragonwave product. There are plenty of threads on this topic. I would be happy to grab a bunch for you so hit me off off-list. It really depends on your application for which product you would like to go with. I would be more than happy to walk you through everything. I try to refrain from stating opinions in a public forum. -Jeff -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Brad Belton Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2009 6:36 PM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link Hello Daniel, Can you elaborate in what way the Dragonwave performance is much better? Do you have a comparison chart you can share with us explaining how a Dragonwave stacks up against competing products. Namely Trango in this case. Exactly how close is close when you mention pricing between the two products? Close is a relative term don't you agree? So, are we talking $5, $50, $500, $5000? Look forward to your responses. Thank you, Brad -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of 3-dB Networks Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2009 6:25 PM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link Well... I'd be happy to quote you a Dragonwave link... I think you will be surprised how close it comes to the Trango pricing... and I think the performance is much better (I don't want to rehash that whole thread). We also will take care of all of the licensing work for you. Hit me offlist if you like. Daniel White 3-dB Networks http://www.3dbnetworks.com -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Andrew Niemantsverdriet Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2009 10:08 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link I am looking for a good place to get an 18ghz link, where do you guys suggest. Ideally the company would also procure the licence for us. I am thinking I want the Trango APEX because of it cost / performance. So if anybody has suggestions on a good company to use I am all ears! Thanks, _ /-\ ndrew --- - WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ --- - WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Service vehicle
You can still drive a hybrid... http://www.internationaltrucks.com/portal/site/ITrucks/menuitem.a1d4a3932b46e05831f8e968121010a0/?vgnextoid=945d07aafbfe6110VgnVCM1085d0eb0aRCRD UPS also has some of their trucks powered by International hybrid technology. I think the one our local center had was getting over 40 mpg. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com -- From: Mark Nash markl...@uwol.net Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2009 9:15 PM To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Subject: Re: [WISPA] Service vehicle I always thought of buying a hybrid... ...then putting it in the bed of my truck and hauling it around just to say that I take my hybrid everywhere I go... Mark Nash UnwiredWest 78 Centennial Loop Suite E Eugene, OR 97401 541-998- 541-998-5599 fax http://www.unwiredwest.com - Original Message - From: D. Ryan Spott rsp...@cspott.com To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2009 6:38 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Service vehicle Made me think of a license plate holder I saw on an SUV: Buy a hybrid, I need your gas! ryan D. Ryan Spott rsp...@cspott.com On Feb 10, 2009, at 6:33 PM, Travis Johnson wrote: If it makes you feel better, today we only got 8mpg while pulling our sno-cat (with a Duramax even) at 80mph down the freeway. ;) Travis Microserv Mark Nash wrote: LOL I was just thinking about revitalizing this thread as I was speeding across our valley here because one of our techs called in sick. Had 4 appointments to keep...about 120 miles to cover... ...and MY service truck is an F350/V10 - crew cab - full bed. ...I get 10 on a good day. :) Mark Nash UnwiredWest 78 Centennial Loop Suite E Eugene, OR 97401 541-998- 541-998-5599 fax http://www.unwiredwest.com - Original Message - From: Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181 o...@odessaoffice.com To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2009 8:44 AM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Service vehicle fyi, it's not a van... http://www.leasetrader.com/photos/actual98286/640x480/GMC-Envoy-XL-Sport-Utility.jpeg I wanted a red or blue one with a v8 (327 and those one's HAUL). Had to settle for a completely loaded white one though. Leather, DVD for the kids, heated seats and seat backs, blinkers on the mirrors, air ride suspension (this rig rides better than any car I've ever had) etc. It's also nearly a foot and a half longer than the standard version. So when you get one make sure you look for the one with the 3rd seat. http://shop.ebay.com/items/_W0QQ_dmptZMotorsQ5fCarQ5fTruckQ5fPartsQ5fAccessories?_nkw=gmc+envoy+xl_sacat=0_fromfsb=_trksid=m270.l1313_odkw=gmc+envoy_osacat=0 These are the same thing as the Chevy Trailblazer. The XUV version looks pretty interesting too. I ALMOST got one of them, didn't like the sales guy though so I walked out on the deal. http://www.familycar.com/RoadTests/GMC-XUV/Photos.htm They have some of those on ebay too: http://shop.ebay.com/items/__xuv?_trkparms=72%253A317%257C66%253A2%257C65%253A12%257C39%253A1_dmpt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories_trksid=p3286.c0.m14_pgn=2 laters, Marlon (509) 982-2181 (408) 907-6910 (Vonage)Consulting services 42846865 (icq)WISP Operator since 1999! o...@odessaoffice.com www.odessaoffice.com/wireless www.odessaoffice.com/marlon/cam - Original Message - From: Josh Luthman j...@imaginenetworksllc.com To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, February 04, 2009 11:13 AM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Service vehicle If we could get a van like that financed I would be in heaven - my main benefit is just as you said, everything stays warm. Steel and cold just do not mix. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 Those who don't understand UNIX are condemned to reinvent it, poorly. --- Henry Spencer On Wed, Feb 4, 2009 at 1:18 PM, Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181 o...@odessaoffice.com wrote: I just picked up an '04 GMC Envoy XL. It's the one with the 3rd seat. I'm only getting 16 to 17 mpg with it but it's cheap to insure and is totally loaded. It was just over $13k for a 50,000 mile rig with no real flaws. I did end up having to replace the radiator already, but that didn't show up at first. The ladder sits on top nicely and is easy to reach. Everything else sits well inside. As a bonus all of my tools etc. stay warm in the winter and cold in the summer. The 4 wheel drive has been really nice this winter too. Best of all? No one else drives around with a ladder on top of one. EVERYONE knows my rig. That alone is a nice sales too. Marlon (509) 982-2181 (408) 907-6910 (Vonage)Consulting services 42846865 (icq)
Re: [WISPA] Service vehicle
I thought it should go faster too. ;-) I don't know what year Travis's truck is, but a variant of one of these ought to help that 80 mph limitation. http://bankspower.com/products/show/43/3 - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com -- From: RickG rgunder...@gmail.com Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2009 11:16 PM To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Subject: Re: [WISPA] Service vehicle I believe the 8mpg but 80mph? -RickG On Tue, Feb 10, 2009 at 9:33 PM, Travis Johnson t...@ida.net wrote: If it makes you feel better, today we only got 8mpg while pulling our sno-cat (with a Duramax even) at 80mph down the freeway. ;) Travis Microserv Mark Nash wrote: LOL I was just thinking about revitalizing this thread as I was speeding across our valley here because one of our techs called in sick. Had 4 appointments to keep...about 120 miles to cover... ...and MY service truck is an F350/V10 - crew cab - full bed. ...I get 10 on a good day. :) Mark Nash UnwiredWest 78 Centennial Loop Suite E Eugene, OR 97401 541-998- 541-998-5599 fax http://www.unwiredwest.com - Original Message - From: Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181 o...@odessaoffice.com To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2009 8:44 AM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Service vehicle fyi, it's not a van... http://www.leasetrader.com/photos/actual98286/640x480/GMC-Envoy-XL-Sport-Utility.jpeg I wanted a red or blue one with a v8 (327 and those one's HAUL). Had to settle for a completely loaded white one though. Leather, DVD for the kids, heated seats and seat backs, blinkers on the mirrors, air ride suspension (this rig rides better than any car I've ever had) etc. It's also nearly a foot and a half longer than the standard version. So when you get one make sure you look for the one with the 3rd seat. http://shop.ebay.com/items/_W0QQ_dmptZMotorsQ5fCarQ5fTruckQ5fPartsQ5fAccessories?_nkw=gmc+envoy+xl_sacat=0_fromfsb=_trksid=m270.l1313_odkw=gmc+envoy_osacat=0 These are the same thing as the Chevy Trailblazer. The XUV version looks pretty interesting too. I ALMOST got one of them, didn't like the sales guy though so I walked out on the deal. http://www.familycar.com/RoadTests/GMC-XUV/Photos.htm They have some of those on ebay too: http://shop.ebay.com/items/__xuv?_trkparms=72%253A317%257C66%253A2%257C65%253A12%257C39%253A1_dmpt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories_trksid=p3286.c0.m14_pgn=2 laters, Marlon (509) 982-2181 (408) 907-6910 (Vonage)Consulting services 42846865 (icq)WISP Operator since 1999! o...@odessaoffice.com www.odessaoffice.com/wireless www.odessaoffice.com/marlon/cam - Original Message - From: Josh Luthman j...@imaginenetworksllc.com To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, February 04, 2009 11:13 AM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Service vehicle If we could get a van like that financed I would be in heaven - my main benefit is just as you said, everything stays warm. Steel and cold just do not mix. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 Those who don't understand UNIX are condemned to reinvent it, poorly. --- Henry Spencer On Wed, Feb 4, 2009 at 1:18 PM, Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181 o...@odessaoffice.com wrote: I just picked up an '04 GMC Envoy XL. It's the one with the 3rd seat. I'm only getting 16 to 17 mpg with it but it's cheap to insure and is totally loaded. It was just over $13k for a 50,000 mile rig with no real flaws. I did end up having to replace the radiator already, but that didn't show up at first. The ladder sits on top nicely and is easy to reach. Everything else sits well inside. As a bonus all of my tools etc. stay warm in the winter and cold in the summer. The 4 wheel drive has been really nice this winter too. Best of all? No one else drives around with a ladder on top of one. EVERYONE knows my rig. That alone is a nice sales too. Marlon (509) 982-2181 (408) 907-6910 (Vonage)Consulting services 42846865 (icq)WISP Operator since 1999! o...@odessaoffice.com www.odessaoffice.com/wireless www.odessaoffice.com/marlon/cam - Original Message - From: Josh Luthman j...@imaginenetworksllc.com To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Monday, February 02, 2009 7:46 AM Subject: [WISPA] Service vehicle What does everyone use for a service vehicle? We have an 1999 f250 that is at the end of it's road. It has the cabinets and ladder racks to put al our stuff in. Our tower climber for those picky tower owners has a brand new Dodge. If you haven't seen these check them out. If we could afford these I wouldn't be asking :( -- Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340
Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link
Hmmm...sure sounds like you have an inordinate amount of service work on your linksgrin I'm working on a response to your other post with a line item side by side comparison between Dragonwave and Trango, but it will probably be tomorrow before it's posted. Best, Brad -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of 3-dB Networks Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 8:43 AM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link I have to run out into the field to work on a Bridgewave link (people pay good money for that :-). I'll answer this tonight. Daniel White 3-dB Networks http://www.3dbnetworks.com From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Travis Johnson Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2009 10:32 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link Hi, I have a better idea someone compile a simple side-by-side comparison of the Dragonwave vs. Trango 18ghz radios. List all the benefits of each radio, and then also list the current price for a comparable speed for each. I'm not familiar with the current Dragonwave product, so I will only list the benefits of the Trango APEX system (of which I currently have 3 running as our main backbone backhauls): (1) Radio mounted signal display for alignment (2) Optional fiber port (only have to buy the fiber module to plug in) (3) Various channel sizes (10, 20, 28, 40, 50, 80 mhz wide) (4) up to +20db power output (5) Jumbo packets via GigE (6) PoE (-48v) (7) In-band or out-of-band management (8) Separate GigE port for management (9) Rapid Port Shutdown (10) 1+1 redundancy (using a single antenna) (11) Dual power supplies (either PoE port can supply the power) (12) 2 year warranty standard (can be upgraded to 3 year, overnight replacement for $2,000 per link) (13) Price (currently $9,995 with 2ft dishes and frequency coordination. FCC fees are about $1,300 extra). Travis Microserv 3-dB Networks wrote: I'm going to go with Jeff on this one... there has been multiple threads on this topic... I think it has been beat to death. If you want to talk about it offlist I'd be happy to. As far as the price difference... I'd be happy to quote the Dragonwave and let you compare it to the published Trango deals... but my personal opinion is that you are not paying a premium for the Dragonwave name... compared to what I would consider the benefits. Daniel White 3-dB Networks http://www.3dbnetworks.com -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Jeff Ehman Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2009 8:08 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link All, When comparing exactly apples to apples, there is about a 10-20% premium for a Dragonwave product. There are plenty of threads on this topic. I would be happy to grab a bunch for you so hit me off off-list. It really depends on your application for which product you would like to go with. I would be more than happy to walk you through everything. I try to refrain from stating opinions in a public forum. -Jeff -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Brad Belton Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2009 6:36 PM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link Hello Daniel, Can you elaborate in what way the Dragonwave performance is much better? Do you have a comparison chart you can share with us explaining how a Dragonwave stacks up against competing products. Namely Trango in this case. Exactly how close is close when you mention pricing between the two products? Close is a relative term don't you agree? So, are we talking $5, $50, $500, $5000? Look forward to your responses. Thank you, Brad -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of 3-dB Networks Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2009 6:25 PM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link Well... I'd be happy to quote you a Dragonwave link... I think you will be surprised how close it comes to the Trango pricing... and I think the performance is much better (I don't want to rehash that whole thread). We also will take care of all of the licensing work for you. Hit me offlist if you like. Daniel White 3-dB Networks http://www.3dbnetworks.com -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Andrew Niemantsverdriet Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2009 10:08 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link I am looking for a good place to get an 18ghz link, where do you guys suggest. Ideally the company would also procure the licence for us. I am thinking I want the Trango APEX because of it cost / performance. So if anybody has suggestions on a good company to use I am all ears!
Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link
We are in Baltimore and now have Sprint WiMax to compete against in the residential market. Hearing a lot of people say how great it was, I decided to check it out. What I found was that they have prioritized nearly every major speed test site. Running tests to those sites show 4-6+ Mbps down and about 1.2-2Mbps up. Running the same test to our speed test site yields only 512k or so. Web surfing feels like 512k as well. Doing transfers to different places doesn't match the speed test results either. It seems like the only metric people use to determine how good of a connection they have is to run speed tests. While people in the know would run iperfs and FTP transfers, everyone else just surfs to site and clicks check my speed. On Wed, Feb 11, 2009 at 11:06 AM, Brad Belton b...@belwave.com wrote: Hmmm...sure sounds like you have an inordinate amount of service work on your linksgrin I'm working on a response to your other post with a line item side by side comparison between Dragonwave and Trango, but it will probably be tomorrow before it's posted. Best, Brad -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of 3-dB Networks Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 8:43 AM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link I have to run out into the field to work on a Bridgewave link (people pay good money for that :-). I'll answer this tonight. Daniel White 3-dB Networks http://www.3dbnetworks.com From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Travis Johnson Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2009 10:32 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link Hi, I have a better idea someone compile a simple side-by-side comparison of the Dragonwave vs. Trango 18ghz radios. List all the benefits of each radio, and then also list the current price for a comparable speed for each. I'm not familiar with the current Dragonwave product, so I will only list the benefits of the Trango APEX system (of which I currently have 3 running as our main backbone backhauls): (1) Radio mounted signal display for alignment (2) Optional fiber port (only have to buy the fiber module to plug in) (3) Various channel sizes (10, 20, 28, 40, 50, 80 mhz wide) (4) up to +20db power output (5) Jumbo packets via GigE (6) PoE (-48v) (7) In-band or out-of-band management (8) Separate GigE port for management (9) Rapid Port Shutdown (10) 1+1 redundancy (using a single antenna) (11) Dual power supplies (either PoE port can supply the power) (12) 2 year warranty standard (can be upgraded to 3 year, overnight replacement for $2,000 per link) (13) Price (currently $9,995 with 2ft dishes and frequency coordination. FCC fees are about $1,300 extra). Travis Microserv 3-dB Networks wrote: I'm going to go with Jeff on this one... there has been multiple threads on this topic... I think it has been beat to death. If you want to talk about it offlist I'd be happy to. As far as the price difference... I'd be happy to quote the Dragonwave and let you compare it to the published Trango deals... but my personal opinion is that you are not paying a premium for the Dragonwave name... compared to what I would consider the benefits. Daniel White 3-dB Networks http://www.3dbnetworks.com -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Jeff Ehman Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2009 8:08 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link All, When comparing exactly apples to apples, there is about a 10-20% premium for a Dragonwave product. There are plenty of threads on this topic. I would be happy to grab a bunch for you so hit me off off-list. It really depends on your application for which product you would like to go with. I would be more than happy to walk you through everything. I try to refrain from stating opinions in a public forum. -Jeff -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Brad Belton Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2009 6:36 PM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link Hello Daniel, Can you elaborate in what way the Dragonwave performance is much better? Do you have a comparison chart you can share with us explaining how a Dragonwave stacks up against competing products. Namely Trango in this case. Exactly how close is close when you mention pricing between the two products? Close is a relative term don't you agree? So, are we talking $5, $50, $500, $5000? Look forward to your responses. Thank you, Brad -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of 3-dB Networks Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2009 6:25 PM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link
Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link
Hmm nice idea ... :-) Anyone gave a list of the most popular sites? Gino A. Villarini g...@aeronetpr.com Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp. tel 787.273.4143 fax 787.273.4145 -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of can...@believewireless.net Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 12:16 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link We are in Baltimore and now have Sprint WiMax to compete against in the residential market. Hearing a lot of people say how great it was, I decided to check it out. What I found was that they have prioritized nearly every major speed test site. Running tests to those sites show 4-6+ Mbps down and about 1.2-2Mbps up. Running the same test to our speed test site yields only 512k or so. Web surfing feels like 512k as well. Doing transfers to different places doesn't match the speed test results either. It seems like the only metric people use to determine how good of a connection they have is to run speed tests. While people in the know would run iperfs and FTP transfers, everyone else just surfs to site and clicks check my speed. On Wed, Feb 11, 2009 at 11:06 AM, Brad Belton b...@belwave.com wrote: Hmmm...sure sounds like you have an inordinate amount of service work on your linksgrin I'm working on a response to your other post with a line item side by side comparison between Dragonwave and Trango, but it will probably be tomorrow before it's posted. Best, Brad -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of 3-dB Networks Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 8:43 AM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link I have to run out into the field to work on a Bridgewave link (people pay good money for that :-). I'll answer this tonight. Daniel White 3-dB Networks http://www.3dbnetworks.com From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Travis Johnson Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2009 10:32 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link Hi, I have a better idea someone compile a simple side-by-side comparison of the Dragonwave vs. Trango 18ghz radios. List all the benefits of each radio, and then also list the current price for a comparable speed for each. I'm not familiar with the current Dragonwave product, so I will only list the benefits of the Trango APEX system (of which I currently have 3 running as our main backbone backhauls): (1) Radio mounted signal display for alignment (2) Optional fiber port (only have to buy the fiber module to plug in) (3) Various channel sizes (10, 20, 28, 40, 50, 80 mhz wide) (4) up to +20db power output (5) Jumbo packets via GigE (6) PoE (-48v) (7) In-band or out-of-band management (8) Separate GigE port for management (9) Rapid Port Shutdown (10) 1+1 redundancy (using a single antenna) (11) Dual power supplies (either PoE port can supply the power) (12) 2 year warranty standard (can be upgraded to 3 year, overnight replacement for $2,000 per link) (13) Price (currently $9,995 with 2ft dishes and frequency coordination. FCC fees are about $1,300 extra). Travis Microserv 3-dB Networks wrote: I'm going to go with Jeff on this one... there has been multiple threads on this topic... I think it has been beat to death. If you want to talk about it offlist I'd be happy to. As far as the price difference... I'd be happy to quote the Dragonwave and let you compare it to the published Trango deals... but my personal opinion is that you are not paying a premium for the Dragonwave name... compared to what I would consider the benefits. Daniel White 3-dB Networks http://www.3dbnetworks.com -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Jeff Ehman Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2009 8:08 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link All, When comparing exactly apples to apples, there is about a 10-20% premium for a Dragonwave product. There are plenty of threads on this topic. I would be happy to grab a bunch for you so hit me off off-list. It really depends on your application for which product you would like to go with. I would be more than happy to walk you through everything. I try to refrain from stating opinions in a public forum. -Jeff -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Brad Belton Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2009 6:36 PM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link Hello Daniel, Can you elaborate in what way the Dragonwave performance is much better? Do you have a comparison chart you can share with us explaining how a Dragonwave stacks up against competing products. Namely Trango in this case. Exactly how
Re: [WISPA] Service vehicle
Any faster than 80 mph and you get stopped, then you just lost way more time than you would have gained from speeding. Kevin Safelink Internet -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Mike Hammett Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 8:15 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Service vehicle I thought it should go faster too. ;-) I don't know what year Travis's truck is, but a variant of one of these ought to help that 80 mph limitation. http://bankspower.com/products/show/43/3 - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com -- From: RickG rgunder...@gmail.com Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2009 11:16 PM To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Subject: Re: [WISPA] Service vehicle I believe the 8mpg but 80mph? -RickG On Tue, Feb 10, 2009 at 9:33 PM, Travis Johnson t...@ida.net wrote: If it makes you feel better, today we only got 8mpg while pulling our sno-cat (with a Duramax even) at 80mph down the freeway. ;) Travis Microserv Mark Nash wrote: LOL I was just thinking about revitalizing this thread as I was speeding across our valley here because one of our techs called in sick. Had 4 appointments to keep...about 120 miles to cover... ...and MY service truck is an F350/V10 - crew cab - full bed. ...I get 10 on a good day. :) Mark Nash UnwiredWest 78 Centennial Loop Suite E Eugene, OR 97401 541-998- 541-998-5599 fax http://www.unwiredwest.com - Original Message - From: Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181 o...@odessaoffice.com To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2009 8:44 AM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Service vehicle fyi, it's not a van... http://www.leasetrader.com/photos/actual98286/640x480/GMC-Envoy-XL-Sp ort-Utility.jpeg I wanted a red or blue one with a v8 (327 and those one's HAUL). Had to settle for a completely loaded white one though. Leather, DVD for the kids, heated seats and seat backs, blinkers on the mirrors, air ride suspension (this rig rides better than any car I've ever had) etc. It's also nearly a foot and a half longer than the standard version. So when you get one make sure you look for the one with the 3rd seat. http://shop.ebay.com/items/_W0QQ_dmptZMotorsQ5fCarQ5fTruckQ5fPartsQ5f Accessories?_nkw=gmc+envoy+xl_sacat=0_fromfsb=_trksid=m270.l1313_ odkw=gmc+envoy_osacat=0 These are the same thing as the Chevy Trailblazer. The XUV version looks pretty interesting too. I ALMOST got one of them, didn't like the sales guy though so I walked out on the deal. http://www.familycar.com/RoadTests/GMC-XUV/Photos.htm They have some of those on ebay too: http://shop.ebay.com/items/__xuv?_trkparms=72%253A317%257C66%253A2%25 7C65%253A12%257C39%253A1_dmpt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories_tr ksid=p3286.c0.m14_pgn=2 laters, Marlon (509) 982-2181 (408) 907-6910 (Vonage)Consulting services 42846865 (icq)WISP Operator since 1999! o...@odessaoffice.com www.odessaoffice.com/wireless www.odessaoffice.com/marlon/cam - Original Message - From: Josh Luthman j...@imaginenetworksllc.com To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, February 04, 2009 11:13 AM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Service vehicle If we could get a van like that financed I would be in heaven - my main benefit is just as you said, everything stays warm. Steel and cold just do not mix. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 Those who don't understand UNIX are condemned to reinvent it, poorly. --- Henry Spencer On Wed, Feb 4, 2009 at 1:18 PM, Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181 o...@odessaoffice.com wrote: I just picked up an '04 GMC Envoy XL. It's the one with the 3rd seat. I'm only getting 16 to 17 mpg with it but it's cheap to insure and is totally loaded. It was just over $13k for a 50,000 mile rig with no real flaws. I did end up having to replace the radiator already, but that didn't show up at first. The ladder sits on top nicely and is easy to reach. Everything else sits well inside. As a bonus all of my tools etc. stay warm in the winter and cold in the summer. The 4 wheel drive has been really nice this winter too. Best of all? No one else drives around with a ladder on top of one. EVERYONE knows my rig. That alone is a nice sales too. Marlon (509) 982-2181 (408) 907-6910 (Vonage)Consulting services 42846865 (icq)WISP Operator since 1999! o...@odessaoffice.com www.odessaoffice.com/wireless www.odessaoffice.com/marlon/cam - Original Message - From: Josh Luthman j...@imaginenetworksllc.com To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Monday, February 02, 2009 7:46 AM Subject: [WISPA]
Re: [WISPA] Service vehicle
I pass cops with laser (not radar) doing 80 mph when the speed limit is 65 mph. Many Interstates in other states are 75 mph. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 Those who don't understand UNIX are condemned to reinvent it, poorly. --- Henry Spencer On Wed, Feb 11, 2009 at 12:36 PM, Kevin Neal ke...@safelink.net wrote: Any faster than 80 mph and you get stopped, then you just lost way more time than you would have gained from speeding. Kevin Safelink Internet -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Mike Hammett Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 8:15 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Service vehicle I thought it should go faster too. ;-) I don't know what year Travis's truck is, but a variant of one of these ought to help that 80 mph limitation. http://bankspower.com/products/show/43/3 - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com -- From: RickG rgunder...@gmail.com Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2009 11:16 PM To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Subject: Re: [WISPA] Service vehicle I believe the 8mpg but 80mph? -RickG On Tue, Feb 10, 2009 at 9:33 PM, Travis Johnson t...@ida.net wrote: If it makes you feel better, today we only got 8mpg while pulling our sno-cat (with a Duramax even) at 80mph down the freeway. ;) Travis Microserv Mark Nash wrote: LOL I was just thinking about revitalizing this thread as I was speeding across our valley here because one of our techs called in sick. Had 4 appointments to keep...about 120 miles to cover... ...and MY service truck is an F350/V10 - crew cab - full bed. ...I get 10 on a good day. :) Mark Nash UnwiredWest 78 Centennial Loop Suite E Eugene, OR 97401 541-998- 541-998-5599 fax http://www.unwiredwest.com - Original Message - From: Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181 o...@odessaoffice.com To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2009 8:44 AM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Service vehicle fyi, it's not a van... http://www.leasetrader.com/photos/actual98286/640x480/GMC-Envoy-XL-Sp ort-Utility.jpeg I wanted a red or blue one with a v8 (327 and those one's HAUL). Had to settle for a completely loaded white one though. Leather, DVD for the kids, heated seats and seat backs, blinkers on the mirrors, air ride suspension (this rig rides better than any car I've ever had) etc. It's also nearly a foot and a half longer than the standard version. So when you get one make sure you look for the one with the 3rd seat. http://shop.ebay.com/items/_W0QQ_dmptZMotorsQ5fCarQ5fTruckQ5fPartsQ5f Accessories?_nkw=gmc+envoy+xl_sacat=0_fromfsb=_trksid=m270.l1313_ odkw=gmc+envoy_osacat=0 These are the same thing as the Chevy Trailblazer. The XUV version looks pretty interesting too. I ALMOST got one of them, didn't like the sales guy though so I walked out on the deal. http://www.familycar.com/RoadTests/GMC-XUV/Photos.htm They have some of those on ebay too: http://shop.ebay.com/items/__xuv?_trkparms=72%253A317%257C66%253A2%25 7C65%253A12%257C39%253A1_dmpt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories_tr ksid=p3286.c0.m14_pgn=2 laters, Marlon (509) 982-2181 (408) 907-6910 (Vonage)Consulting services 42846865 (icq)WISP Operator since 1999! o...@odessaoffice.com www.odessaoffice.com/wireless www.odessaoffice.com/marlon/cam - Original Message - From: Josh Luthman j...@imaginenetworksllc.com To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, February 04, 2009 11:13 AM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Service vehicle If we could get a van like that financed I would be in heaven - my main benefit is just as you said, everything stays warm. Steel and cold just do not mix. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 Those who don't understand UNIX are condemned to reinvent it, poorly. --- Henry Spencer On Wed, Feb 4, 2009 at 1:18 PM, Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181 o...@odessaoffice.com wrote: I just picked up an '04 GMC Envoy XL. It's the one with the 3rd seat. I'm only getting 16 to 17 mpg with it but it's cheap to insure and is totally loaded. It was just over $13k for a 50,000 mile rig with no real flaws. I did end up having to replace the radiator already, but that didn't show up at first. The ladder sits on top nicely and is easy to reach. Everything else sits well inside. As a bonus all of my tools etc. stay warm in the winter and cold in the summer. The 4 wheel drive has been really nice this winter too. Best of all? No one else drives around with a
Re: [WISPA] Service vehicle
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Speed_limits_in_the_United_States Texas goes as high as 80 mph. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com -- From: Josh Luthman j...@imaginenetworksllc.com Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 11:38 AM To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Subject: Re: [WISPA] Service vehicle I pass cops with laser (not radar) doing 80 mph when the speed limit is 65 mph. Many Interstates in other states are 75 mph. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 Those who don't understand UNIX are condemned to reinvent it, poorly. --- Henry Spencer On Wed, Feb 11, 2009 at 12:36 PM, Kevin Neal ke...@safelink.net wrote: Any faster than 80 mph and you get stopped, then you just lost way more time than you would have gained from speeding. Kevin Safelink Internet -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Mike Hammett Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 8:15 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Service vehicle I thought it should go faster too. ;-) I don't know what year Travis's truck is, but a variant of one of these ought to help that 80 mph limitation. http://bankspower.com/products/show/43/3 - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com -- From: RickG rgunder...@gmail.com Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2009 11:16 PM To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Subject: Re: [WISPA] Service vehicle I believe the 8mpg but 80mph? -RickG On Tue, Feb 10, 2009 at 9:33 PM, Travis Johnson t...@ida.net wrote: If it makes you feel better, today we only got 8mpg while pulling our sno-cat (with a Duramax even) at 80mph down the freeway. ;) Travis Microserv Mark Nash wrote: LOL I was just thinking about revitalizing this thread as I was speeding across our valley here because one of our techs called in sick. Had 4 appointments to keep...about 120 miles to cover... ...and MY service truck is an F350/V10 - crew cab - full bed. ...I get 10 on a good day. :) Mark Nash UnwiredWest 78 Centennial Loop Suite E Eugene, OR 97401 541-998- 541-998-5599 fax http://www.unwiredwest.com - Original Message - From: Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181 o...@odessaoffice.com To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2009 8:44 AM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Service vehicle fyi, it's not a van... http://www.leasetrader.com/photos/actual98286/640x480/GMC-Envoy-XL-Sp ort-Utility.jpeg I wanted a red or blue one with a v8 (327 and those one's HAUL). Had to settle for a completely loaded white one though. Leather, DVD for the kids, heated seats and seat backs, blinkers on the mirrors, air ride suspension (this rig rides better than any car I've ever had) etc. It's also nearly a foot and a half longer than the standard version. So when you get one make sure you look for the one with the 3rd seat. http://shop.ebay.com/items/_W0QQ_dmptZMotorsQ5fCarQ5fTruckQ5fPartsQ5f Accessories?_nkw=gmc+envoy+xl_sacat=0_fromfsb=_trksid=m270.l1313_ odkw=gmc+envoy_osacat=0 These are the same thing as the Chevy Trailblazer. The XUV version looks pretty interesting too. I ALMOST got one of them, didn't like the sales guy though so I walked out on the deal. http://www.familycar.com/RoadTests/GMC-XUV/Photos.htm They have some of those on ebay too: http://shop.ebay.com/items/__xuv?_trkparms=72%253A317%257C66%253A2%25 7C65%253A12%257C39%253A1_dmpt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories_tr ksid=p3286.c0.m14_pgn=2 laters, Marlon (509) 982-2181 (408) 907-6910 (Vonage)Consulting services 42846865 (icq)WISP Operator since 1999! o...@odessaoffice.com www.odessaoffice.com/wireless www.odessaoffice.com/marlon/cam - Original Message - From: Josh Luthman j...@imaginenetworksllc.com To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, February 04, 2009 11:13 AM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Service vehicle If we could get a van like that financed I would be in heaven - my main benefit is just as you said, everything stays warm. Steel and cold just do not mix. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 Those who don't understand UNIX are condemned to reinvent it, poorly. --- Henry Spencer On Wed, Feb 4, 2009 at 1:18 PM, Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181 o...@odessaoffice.com wrote: I just picked up an '04 GMC Envoy XL. It's the one with the 3rd seat. I'm only getting 16 to 17 mpg with it but it's cheap to insure and is totally loaded. It was just over $13k for a 50,000 mile rig
Re: [WISPA] test
I have noticed that some of my replies go directly to the sender instead of the list. I have caught it doing it when I click reply and in the To: box going to the original sender instead of wirel...@wispa.org. Not sure if it is something on my end or the list. Scottie -- Original Message -- From: Phil Curnutt pcurn...@gmail.com Reply-To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 16:36:45 -0700 And it went through. Phil On Tue, Feb 10, 2009 at 4:28 PM, Blair Davis the...@wmwisp.net wrote: I've sent several replies to the list today and none of them have shown up. So here is a test. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] Wireless High Speed Broadband service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as $30.00/mth. Check out www.info-ed.com/wireless.html for information. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
[WISPA] Need Help with MUD
Need Help Has anyone installed wireless in rental complex? Problem is the owner has bulk cable coming into the complex, and wonders if cable company would cut his service if we connect to his router and distribute internet service to his renters. He is having problems with cable company and wants to purchase our CPE for tenants and charge them for internet service, thus going around cable service, and providing internet to his customers Thanks bcoch...@cloh.com Robert C. Cochran Sales Department ConnectlinkTurnkey Wireless Wide-Area Network Solutions P. O. Box 128 406 2nd Avenue Chesapeake, Ohio 45619 Free 1-877-779-5465 ext 303 Local 740-867-5095 ext 303 VOIP 304-521-6809 Fax 740-867-6359 Email mailto:bcoch...@cloh.com bcoch...@cloh.com Tri-State's Best and largest Internet Service Provider, Off Site Backup, Security Cameras, and Digital Telephone Service If you wish to be removed from this communication list, please return this email. Confidentiality Note: The information Contained in this message is or may be privileged and confidential This message (and any associated files) is intended only for the use of the individual or entity to which it is sent and may contain information that is confidential, subject to copyright or constitutes a trade secret. If you are not the intended recipient you are hereby notified that any dissemination, copying or distribution of this message, or files associated with this message,is strictly prohibited. If you have received this message in error, please notify us immediately by replying to the message and deleting it from your computer or other office equipment. Messages sent to and from us may be monitored. Internet communications, fax communications cannot be guaranteed to be secure or error-free or virus-free as information could be intercepted, corrupted, lost, destroyed, arrive late or incomplete, or contain viruses. Therefore, we do not accept responsibility, liability for any errors or omissions that are present in this message, or any attachment, that have arisen as a result of e-mail transmission. The security of Internet e-mail/fax is not guaranteed and there is no assurance that a message will be delivered in a timely manner or at all. If verification is required, please request a hard-copy version. Any views or opinions presented are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of the company. Additionally, e-mail/fax should not contain time-sensitive or action-oriented instructions such as buy or sell orders, funds transfer instructions, or other items requiring more formal communication. E-mail/fax messages are subject to monitoring and retention by Connectlink, as well as examination by regulators, and there can be no expectation of privacy with respect to such e-mail/fax communications, whether personal or business related. Thank You. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
[WISPA] Service in Mt. Carmel IL
Hi all, I got a service request from someone in Mt. Carmel IL. They said their friend has us and told them to go to accessusa.net - which is a domain I own, but it goes to my web site for DC Access. Anyone serve this area? If so, contact me offlist and I'll give you her contact info. Thanks Martha -- Martha Huizenga DC Access, LLC 202-546-5898 */Friendly, Local, Affordable, Internet!/**/ Connecting the Capitol Hill Community /* WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
[WISPA] Angry IP Scanner
We have used angry IPSCANNER for years around the office for years to do odds and ends IP scans. Norton Anti-everything hates it and the new 2009 version wont let me exclude it. Anybody have a program like it (windows) that I might Try that you like. Steve Barnes Executive Manager PCS-WIN RCWiFi Wireless Internet Service WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Angry IP Scanner
Have you used the one in the Mtiks? ryan Steve Barnes wrote: We have used angry IPSCANNER for years around the office for years to do odds and ends IP scans. Norton Anti-everything hates it and the new 2009 version wont let me exclude it. Anybody have a program like it (windows) that I might Try that you like. Steve Barnes Executive Manager PCS-WIN RCWiFi Wireless Internet Service WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Angry IP Scanner
Win32... NetScan l...@lan Mikrotik's ip-scan RULES Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 Those who don't understand UNIX are condemned to reinvent it, poorly. --- Henry Spencer On Wed, Feb 11, 2009 at 1:52 PM, D. Ryan Spott rsp...@cspott.com wrote: Have you used the one in the Mtiks? ryan Steve Barnes wrote: We have used angry IPSCANNER for years around the office for years to do odds and ends IP scans. Norton Anti-everything hates it and the new 2009 version wont let me exclude it. Anybody have a program like it (windows) that I might Try that you like. Steve Barnes Executive Manager PCS-WIN RCWiFi Wireless Internet Service WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Angry IP Scanner
I would upgrade your AV before tossing AngryIP out. =-) Give the windows port of nmap a go. Steve Barnes wrote: We have used angry IPSCANNER for years around the office for years to do odds and ends IP scans. Norton Anti-everything hates it and the new 2009 version wont let me exclude it. Anybody have a program like it (windows) that I might Try that you like. Steve Barnes Executive Manager PCS-WIN RCWiFi Wireless Internet Service WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Angry IP Scanner
Ohh! nmap is by FAR the best! ryan jree...@18-30chat.net wrote: I would upgrade your AV before tossing AngryIP out. =-) Give the windows port of nmap a go. Steve Barnes wrote: We have used angry IPSCANNER for years around the office for years to do odds and ends IP scans. Norton Anti-everything hates it and the new 2009 version wont let me exclude it. Anybody have a program like it (windows) that I might Try that you like. Steve Barnes Executive Manager PCS-WIN RCWiFi Wireless Internet Service WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Angry IP Scanner
A better recommendation would be to switch from Norton. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com -- From: Steve Barnes st...@pcswin.com Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 12:52 PM To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Subject: [WISPA] Angry IP Scanner We have used angry IPSCANNER for years around the office for years to do odds and ends IP scans. Norton Anti-everything hates it and the new 2009 version wont let me exclude it. Anybody have a program like it (windows) that I might Try that you like. Steve Barnes Executive Manager PCS-WIN RCWiFi Wireless Internet Service WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Angry IP Scanner
Actually I really like the 2009 Norton Products. It eats 10% of the memory Norton 2008 did and kicks butt on finding stuff. I've been giving AVG away and they called me and said that's a NO-NO besides that makes no revenue stream. I sold 20 copies last week and have had 2 of them call and say that it has cleaned the malware Antivirus 2009 and the new variant Antivirus 360. AVG and others have not been able to do that. Steve Barnes Executive Manager PCS-WIN RCWiFi Wireless Internet Service -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Mike Hammett Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 2:06 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Angry IP Scanner A better recommendation would be to switch from Norton. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com -- From: Steve Barnes st...@pcswin.com Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 12:52 PM To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Subject: [WISPA] Angry IP Scanner We have used angry IPSCANNER for years around the office for years to do odds and ends IP scans. Norton Anti-everything hates it and the new 2009 version wont let me exclude it. Anybody have a program like it (windows) that I might Try that you like. Steve Barnes Executive Manager PCS-WIN RCWiFi Wireless Internet Service WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Angry IP Scanner
Ryan, We can be nmap buddies! Surprised someone else uses that for whitehat purposes =) Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 Those who don't understand UNIX are condemned to reinvent it, poorly. --- Henry Spencer On Wed, Feb 11, 2009 at 2:03 PM, D. Ryan Spott rsp...@cspott.com wrote: Ohh! nmap is by FAR the best! ryan jree...@18-30chat.net wrote: I would upgrade your AV before tossing AngryIP out. =-) Give the windows port of nmap a go. Steve Barnes wrote: We have used angry IPSCANNER for years around the office for years to do odds and ends IP scans. Norton Anti-everything hates it and the new 2009 version wont let me exclude it. Anybody have a program like it (windows) that I might Try that you like. Steve Barnes Executive Manager PCS-WIN RCWiFi Wireless Internet Service WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Angry IP Scanner
I like to use Avast. It has a nice boot time scanner that will run before Windows loads anything. It runs when scandisk would otherwise run. I don't think it's missed anything yet. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com -- From: Steve Barnes st...@pcswin.com Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 1:14 PM To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Subject: Re: [WISPA] Angry IP Scanner Actually I really like the 2009 Norton Products. It eats 10% of the memory Norton 2008 did and kicks butt on finding stuff. I've been giving AVG away and they called me and said that's a NO-NO besides that makes no revenue stream. I sold 20 copies last week and have had 2 of them call and say that it has cleaned the malware Antivirus 2009 and the new variant Antivirus 360. AVG and others have not been able to do that. Steve Barnes Executive Manager PCS-WIN RCWiFi Wireless Internet Service -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Mike Hammett Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 2:06 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Angry IP Scanner A better recommendation would be to switch from Norton. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com -- From: Steve Barnes st...@pcswin.com Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 12:52 PM To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Subject: [WISPA] Angry IP Scanner We have used angry IPSCANNER for years around the office for years to do odds and ends IP scans. Norton Anti-everything hates it and the new 2009 version wont let me exclude it. Anybody have a program like it (windows) that I might Try that you like. Steve Barnes Executive Manager PCS-WIN RCWiFi Wireless Internet Service WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Angry IP Scanner
Run Linux, no anti virus software... Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 Those who don't understand UNIX are condemned to reinvent it, poorly. --- Henry Spencer On Wed, Feb 11, 2009 at 2:17 PM, Mike Hammett wispawirel...@ics-il.netwrote: I like to use Avast. It has a nice boot time scanner that will run before Windows loads anything. It runs when scandisk would otherwise run. I don't think it's missed anything yet. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com -- From: Steve Barnes st...@pcswin.com Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 1:14 PM To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Subject: Re: [WISPA] Angry IP Scanner Actually I really like the 2009 Norton Products. It eats 10% of the memory Norton 2008 did and kicks butt on finding stuff. I've been giving AVG away and they called me and said that's a NO-NO besides that makes no revenue stream. I sold 20 copies last week and have had 2 of them call and say that it has cleaned the malware Antivirus 2009 and the new variant Antivirus 360. AVG and others have not been able to do that. Steve Barnes Executive Manager PCS-WIN RCWiFi Wireless Internet Service -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Mike Hammett Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 2:06 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Angry IP Scanner A better recommendation would be to switch from Norton. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com -- From: Steve Barnes st...@pcswin.com Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 12:52 PM To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Subject: [WISPA] Angry IP Scanner We have used angry IPSCANNER for years around the office for years to do odds and ends IP scans. Norton Anti-everything hates it and the new 2009 version wont let me exclude it. Anybody have a program like it (windows) that I might Try that you like. Steve Barnes Executive Manager PCS-WIN RCWiFi Wireless Internet Service WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Angry IP Scanner
I'll refrain from entering Linux vs. Windows. ;-) - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com -- From: Josh Luthman j...@imaginenetworksllc.com Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 1:19 PM To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Subject: Re: [WISPA] Angry IP Scanner Run Linux, no anti virus software... Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 Those who don't understand UNIX are condemned to reinvent it, poorly. --- Henry Spencer On Wed, Feb 11, 2009 at 2:17 PM, Mike Hammett wispawirel...@ics-il.netwrote: I like to use Avast. It has a nice boot time scanner that will run before Windows loads anything. It runs when scandisk would otherwise run. I don't think it's missed anything yet. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com -- From: Steve Barnes st...@pcswin.com Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 1:14 PM To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Subject: Re: [WISPA] Angry IP Scanner Actually I really like the 2009 Norton Products. It eats 10% of the memory Norton 2008 did and kicks butt on finding stuff. I've been giving AVG away and they called me and said that's a NO-NO besides that makes no revenue stream. I sold 20 copies last week and have had 2 of them call and say that it has cleaned the malware Antivirus 2009 and the new variant Antivirus 360. AVG and others have not been able to do that. Steve Barnes Executive Manager PCS-WIN RCWiFi Wireless Internet Service -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Mike Hammett Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 2:06 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Angry IP Scanner A better recommendation would be to switch from Norton. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com -- From: Steve Barnes st...@pcswin.com Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 12:52 PM To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Subject: [WISPA] Angry IP Scanner We have used angry IPSCANNER for years around the office for years to do odds and ends IP scans. Norton Anti-everything hates it and the new 2009 version wont let me exclude it. Anybody have a program like it (windows) that I might Try that you like. Steve Barnes Executive Manager PCS-WIN RCWiFi Wireless Internet Service WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
Re: [WISPA] Angry IP Scanner
l...@lan http://www.lookatlan.com/ D. Ryan Spott wrote: Have you used the one in the Mtiks? ryan Steve Barnes wrote: We have used angry IPSCANNER for years around the office for years to do odds and ends IP scans. Norton Anti-everything hates it and the new 2009 version wont let me exclude it. Anybody have a program like it (windows) that I might Try that you like. Steve Barnes Executive Manager PCS-WIN RCWiFi Wireless Internet Service WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ Internal Virus Database is out of date. Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com Version: 8.0.233 / Virus Database: 270.10.17/1934 - Release Date: 2/4/2009 8:24 AM -- Scott Reed Sr. Systems Engineer GAB Midwest 1-800-363-1544 x4000 Cell: 260-273-7239 WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Angry IP Scanner
Check your firewall logs... we can be +best+ buddies... (j/k) As for antivirus, just use http://www.clamwin.com/ or http://www.clamav.net/ Pretty slick, in windows, it stays put in a small icon by the clock instead of the standard of AV now-a-days where they all scream: LOOK AT ME!!! LOOK AT ME!!! I AM PROTECTING YOUR COMPUTER!!! LOOK AT ME LOOK AT ME!!! PAY ME A SUBSCRIPTION FEE!!! LOOK LOOK! I BLOCKED YOUR OUTGOING MAIL RANDOMLY!! CALL YOUR ISP, THEY SPEAK THE ENGRISH GOOD AND DONT CHARGE $5 A MINUTE! Sigh.. Why do people put up with that garbage! ryan Josh Luthman wrote: Ryan, We can be nmap buddies! Surprised someone else uses that for whitehat purposes =) Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 Those who don't understand UNIX are condemned to reinvent it, poorly. --- Henry Spencer On Wed, Feb 11, 2009 at 2:03 PM, D. Ryan Spott rsp...@cspott.com wrote: Ohh! nmap is by FAR the best! ryan jree...@18-30chat.net wrote: I would upgrade your AV before tossing AngryIP out. =-) Give the windows port of nmap a go. Steve Barnes wrote: We have used angry IPSCANNER for years around the office for years to do odds and ends IP scans. Norton Anti-everything hates it and the new 2009 version wont let me exclude it. Anybody have a program like it (windows) that I might Try that you like. Steve Barnes Executive Manager PCS-WIN RCWiFi Wireless Internet Service WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Angry IP Scanner
I would love to use Linux but being a PC retailer as well I don't want to support multiple OS's. Besides my bosses pet 12 year old accounting program requires windows and barely runs in it. Steve Barnes Executive Manager PCS-WIN RCWiFi Wireless Internet Service -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Mike Hammett Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 2:22 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Angry IP Scanner I'll refrain from entering Linux vs. Windows. ;-) - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com -- From: Josh Luthman j...@imaginenetworksllc.com Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 1:19 PM To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Subject: Re: [WISPA] Angry IP Scanner Run Linux, no anti virus software... Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 Those who don't understand UNIX are condemned to reinvent it, poorly. --- Henry Spencer On Wed, Feb 11, 2009 at 2:17 PM, Mike Hammett wispawirel...@ics-il.netwrote: I like to use Avast. It has a nice boot time scanner that will run before Windows loads anything. It runs when scandisk would otherwise run. I don't think it's missed anything yet. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com -- From: Steve Barnes st...@pcswin.com Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 1:14 PM To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Subject: Re: [WISPA] Angry IP Scanner Actually I really like the 2009 Norton Products. It eats 10% of the memory Norton 2008 did and kicks butt on finding stuff. I've been giving AVG away and they called me and said that's a NO-NO besides that makes no revenue stream. I sold 20 copies last week and have had 2 of them call and say that it has cleaned the malware Antivirus 2009 and the new variant Antivirus 360. AVG and others have not been able to do that. Steve Barnes Executive Manager PCS-WIN RCWiFi Wireless Internet Service -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Mike Hammett Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 2:06 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Angry IP Scanner A better recommendation would be to switch from Norton. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com -- From: Steve Barnes st...@pcswin.com Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 12:52 PM To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Subject: [WISPA] Angry IP Scanner We have used angry IPSCANNER for years around the office for years to do odds and ends IP scans. Norton Anti-everything hates it and the new 2009 version wont let me exclude it. Anybody have a program like it (windows) that I might Try that you like. Steve Barnes Executive Manager PCS-WIN RCWiFi Wireless Internet Service WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA
Re: [WISPA] Angry IP Scanner
Virtualization. Not only does it make things a lot easier to backup and move. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 Those who don't understand UNIX are condemned to reinvent it, poorly. --- Henry Spencer On Wed, Feb 11, 2009 at 2:27 PM, Steve Barnes st...@pcswin.com wrote: I would love to use Linux but being a PC retailer as well I don't want to support multiple OS's. Besides my bosses pet 12 year old accounting program requires windows and barely runs in it. Steve Barnes Executive Manager PCS-WIN RCWiFi Wireless Internet Service -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Mike Hammett Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 2:22 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Angry IP Scanner I'll refrain from entering Linux vs. Windows. ;-) - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com -- From: Josh Luthman j...@imaginenetworksllc.com Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 1:19 PM To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Subject: Re: [WISPA] Angry IP Scanner Run Linux, no anti virus software... Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 Those who don't understand UNIX are condemned to reinvent it, poorly. --- Henry Spencer On Wed, Feb 11, 2009 at 2:17 PM, Mike Hammett wispawirel...@ics-il.netwrote: I like to use Avast. It has a nice boot time scanner that will run before Windows loads anything. It runs when scandisk would otherwise run. I don't think it's missed anything yet. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com -- From: Steve Barnes st...@pcswin.com Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 1:14 PM To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Subject: Re: [WISPA] Angry IP Scanner Actually I really like the 2009 Norton Products. It eats 10% of the memory Norton 2008 did and kicks butt on finding stuff. I've been giving AVG away and they called me and said that's a NO-NO besides that makes no revenue stream. I sold 20 copies last week and have had 2 of them call and say that it has cleaned the malware Antivirus 2009 and the new variant Antivirus 360. AVG and others have not been able to do that. Steve Barnes Executive Manager PCS-WIN RCWiFi Wireless Internet Service -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Mike Hammett Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 2:06 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Angry IP Scanner A better recommendation would be to switch from Norton. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com -- From: Steve Barnes st...@pcswin.com Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 12:52 PM To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Subject: [WISPA] Angry IP Scanner We have used angry IPSCANNER for years around the office for years to do odds and ends IP scans. Norton Anti-everything hates it and the new 2009 version wont let me exclude it. Anybody have a program like it (windows) that I might Try that you like. Steve Barnes Executive Manager PCS-WIN RCWiFi Wireless Internet Service WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today!
Re: [WISPA] Angry IP Scanner
What about the Mac OS? I has Linuxy goodness with lots of apps. Greg On Feb 11, 2009, at 3:01 PM, Josh Luthman wrote: Virtualization. Not only does it make things a lot easier to backup and move. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 Those who don't understand UNIX are condemned to reinvent it, poorly. --- Henry Spencer On Wed, Feb 11, 2009 at 2:27 PM, Steve Barnes st...@pcswin.com wrote: I would love to use Linux but being a PC retailer as well I don't want to support multiple OS's. Besides my bosses pet 12 year old accounting program requires windows and barely runs in it. Steve Barnes Executive Manager PCS-WIN RCWiFi Wireless Internet Service -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless- boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Mike Hammett Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 2:22 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Angry IP Scanner I'll refrain from entering Linux vs. Windows. ;-) - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com -- From: Josh Luthman j...@imaginenetworksllc.com Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 1:19 PM To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Subject: Re: [WISPA] Angry IP Scanner Run Linux, no anti virus software... Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 Those who don't understand UNIX are condemned to reinvent it, poorly. --- Henry Spencer On Wed, Feb 11, 2009 at 2:17 PM, Mike Hammett wispawirel...@ics-il.netwrote: I like to use Avast. It has a nice boot time scanner that will run before Windows loads anything. It runs when scandisk would otherwise run. I don't think it's missed anything yet. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com -- From: Steve Barnes st...@pcswin.com Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 1:14 PM To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Subject: Re: [WISPA] Angry IP Scanner Actually I really like the 2009 Norton Products. It eats 10% of the memory Norton 2008 did and kicks butt on finding stuff. I've been giving AVG away and they called me and said that's a NO-NO besides that makes no revenue stream. I sold 20 copies last week and have had 2 of them call and say that it has cleaned the malware Antivirus 2009 and the new variant Antivirus 360. AVG and others have not been able to do that. Steve Barnes Executive Manager PCS-WIN RCWiFi Wireless Internet Service -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org ] On Behalf Of Mike Hammett Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 2:06 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Angry IP Scanner A better recommendation would be to switch from Norton. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com -- From: Steve Barnes st...@pcswin.com Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 12:52 PM To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Subject: [WISPA] Angry IP Scanner We have used angry IPSCANNER for years around the office for years to do odds and ends IP scans. Norton Anti-everything hates it and the new 2009 version wont let me exclude it. Anybody have a program like it (windows) that I might Try that you like. Steve Barnes Executive Manager PCS-WIN RCWiFi Wireless Internet Service WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/
Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link
Just to clear up a few points... Daniel's claim of number of Trango's units shipped is WAY off. He has no way of knowing what we have shipped. Trango is a private company and as such we dont divulge specifics, but I can tell you that the actual shipments are FAR greater and a very significant portion of the links shipped have gone outside the US and as such you wont see them show up in the FCC database. Our overall numbers of links shipped may be small compared to Ceragon and the big guys but the product has gained widespread acceptance, traction and is quickly gaining momentum. Why else would our competitors be acting so nervous? Trango has firmly established itself with TrangoLINK-GIGA and APEX in the WISP market. Now we are also gaining excellent traction with counties, states, cities, utilities, as well as the US Military... These entities traditionally deploylargest quantities of wireless backhaul sytems, compared to mobile operators who deploy by far the most. (although most mobile operator deployments are still strictly TDM). There is no stopping Trango. We will continue to peck away at Dragonwave's marketshare and gradually we'll be taking larger and larger portions of it. Dragonwave did not ship $50mil last year, it was closer to $40Mil - and by the way they are losing tons of money quarter-after-quarter. Trango is, and has always been profitable. I actually don't have a side-by side comparison of the two products handy. We really should put one together. Truth is there are many similarities and also some key differences. For those who may not be aware, Trango offers two primary product lines: TrangoLINK-GIGA and TrangoLINK-APEX. GIGA is our split architecture system which offers 4 GigE Ports (Dragonwave 1), 8 T1 ports (Dragonwave zero). The APEX is the all outdoor POE product which offers a GigE port as well as a plug-in slot for a fiber SFP module. I have never been able to determine how the Dragonwave optical option works...but I dont think it is anything as simple as APEX (Daniel feel free to provide details). Both of the traffic ports (optical and GigE copper) on the APEX can be used simultaneously. GIGA and APEX both offer port priority and QoS functionality as well as rapid port shutdown. The multiple port option allows users to completely segregate traffic from one port to the next. Dragonwave does not have this feature.The APEX offers TRUE Hitless ACM which is Adaptive Coding Modulation which means the system will move to slower modulations without taking any hits. I don't believe that Horizon Compact offers hitless ACM. Daniel, feel free to correct me if I am wrong. Regarding the GIGA, one other point which comes up often is that the Dragonwave split solution (Airpair) allows only for very short (300 ft?) IF cable runs. TrangoLINK-GIGA allows for 1000 ft of cable. As for Daniel's other points: -Products available now: TrangoLINK-GIGA 6, 11, 18, 23 GHz. APEX 18, 11 GHz. 23 Ghz coming next month. -Power Consumption: TrangoLINK-APEX power consumption is lower than Horizon Compact High power version although higher than Horizon standard power version, which stands to reason. -Field Proven: Latest releases of GIGA and APEX firmware highly stable. TrangoLINK-GIGA has been in the field for 18 months now. -CLI/GUI: You can do a full link setup using only the GUI interface on GIGA and APEX although admitedly the CLI has more functionality. Our firware engineers will enhance this in future releases. The CLI is very much like a Cisco interface and most users are very comfortable in the CLI. -LED Allignment - the allignment tool has received rave reviews from most installers. One thing I'd like to mention is that our newer ODUs coming out, and all APEX models have built-in power detector in the ODU to make the RSSI readouts more responsive than in the earlier ODUs. So the LED indicator that Daniel used on his nine-link deployment has improved greatly in that it is highly responsive. Daniel if you get a chance to do another allignment I am sure you will love the LED allignment tool on the newer radios. - APEX output power 3-8 dB better than Horizon compact standard model. Horizon HP version 2.5 dB better than APEX at higher modulations (better at lower modulation). - Trango 18 Ghz covers 17.7 GHz - 18.14 19.265 - 19.7 GHz. This is 440 MHz of spectrum.. I dont know the DW spec on this, but I do know that I've never heard of a license being declined because there's not enough channels availble in the radio. - Daniel is the only one I've heard of complaining about the waveguide transition between he ODU and the antenna. It requires four little screws to put it in. Not a big deal. The only reason we don't attach it here in the factory is to enable the user the option to use a waveguide adapter (instead of the transition) in the event they want to connect the ODU to piece of flex waveguide so that it can be used with any dish with a waveguide flange. -
Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link
So when you build a Trango backhaul network you hope they don't ruin you like they did for us trying to do use 700 dollar CPEs. I have not used Trango backhaul products due to the horrible experience, cost and support for the Acess 5800 and 5830 products. On 2/11/09, John Seaman j...@trangosys.com wrote: Just to clear up a few points... Daniel's claim of number of Trango's units shipped is WAY off. He has no way of knowing what we have shipped. Trango is a private company and as such we dont divulge specifics, but I can tell you that the actual shipments are FAR greater and a very significant portion of the links shipped have gone outside the US and as such you wont see them show up in the FCC database. Our overall numbers of links shipped may be small compared to Ceragon and the big guys but the product has gained widespread acceptance, traction and is quickly gaining momentum. Why else would our competitors be acting so nervous? Trango has firmly established itself with TrangoLINK-GIGA and APEX in the WISP market. Now we are also gaining excellent traction with counties, states, cities, utilities, as well as the US Military... These entities traditionally deploylargest quantities of wireless backhaul sytems, compared to mobile operators who deploy by far the most. (although most mobile operator deployments are still strictly TDM). There is no stopping Trango. We will continue to peck away at Dragonwave's marketshare and gradually we'll be taking larger and larger portions of it. Dragonwave did not ship $50mil last year, it was closer to $40Mil - and by the way they are losing tons of money quarter-after-quarter. Trango is, and has always been profitable. I actually don't have a side-by side comparison of the two products handy. We really should put one together. Truth is there are many similarities and also some key differences. For those who may not be aware, Trango offers two primary product lines: TrangoLINK-GIGA and TrangoLINK-APEX. GIGA is our split architecture system which offers 4 GigE Ports (Dragonwave 1), 8 T1 ports (Dragonwave zero). The APEX is the all outdoor POE product which offers a GigE port as well as a plug-in slot for a fiber SFP module. I have never been able to determine how the Dragonwave optical option works...but I dont think it is anything as simple as APEX (Daniel feel free to provide details). Both of the traffic ports (optical and GigE copper) on the APEX can be used simultaneously. GIGA and APEX both offer port priority and QoS functionality as well as rapid port shutdown. The multiple port option allows users to completely segregate traffic from one port to the next. Dragonwave does not have this feature.The APEX offers TRUE Hitless ACM which is Adaptive Coding Modulation which means the system will move to slower modulations without taking any hits. I don't believe that Horizon Compact offers hitless ACM. Daniel, feel free to correct me if I am wrong. Regarding the GIGA, one other point which comes up often is that the Dragonwave split solution (Airpair) allows only for very short (300 ft?) IF cable runs. TrangoLINK-GIGA allows for 1000 ft of cable. As for Daniel's other points: -Products available now: TrangoLINK-GIGA 6, 11, 18, 23 GHz. APEX 18, 11 GHz. 23 Ghz coming next month. -Power Consumption: TrangoLINK-APEX power consumption is lower than Horizon Compact High power version although higher than Horizon standard power version, which stands to reason. -Field Proven: Latest releases of GIGA and APEX firmware highly stable. TrangoLINK-GIGA has been in the field for 18 months now. -CLI/GUI: You can do a full link setup using only the GUI interface on GIGA and APEX although admitedly the CLI has more functionality. Our firware engineers will enhance this in future releases. The CLI is very much like a Cisco interface and most users are very comfortable in the CLI. -LED Allignment - the allignment tool has received rave reviews from most installers. One thing I'd like to mention is that our newer ODUs coming out, and all APEX models have built-in power detector in the ODU to make the RSSI readouts more responsive than in the earlier ODUs. So the LED indicator that Daniel used on his nine-link deployment has improved greatly in that it is highly responsive. Daniel if you get a chance to do another allignment I am sure you will love the LED allignment tool on the newer radios. - APEX output power 3-8 dB better than Horizon compact standard model. Horizon HP version 2.5 dB better than APEX at higher modulations (better at lower modulation). - Trango 18 Ghz covers 17.7 GHz - 18.14 19.265 - 19.7 GHz. This is 440 MHz of spectrum.. I dont know the DW spec on this, but I do know that I've never heard of a license being declined because there's not enough channels availble in the radio. - Daniel is the only one I've heard of complaining about the waveguide
Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link
And people wonder why I dont post to the list often. There are some old horror stories out there but far more success stories of succesful WISPs using Trango equipment. Josh, I am sorry to hear you had a bad experience in the past. By the way we are currently having a promotion on the 5830s.. with some of the best pricing we have ever offered on this product. If anyone is interested in the promos let us or CTI know. John -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Josh Luthman Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 12:12 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link So when you build a Trango backhaul network you hope they don't ruin you like they did for us trying to do use 700 dollar CPEs. I have not used Trango backhaul products due to the horrible experience, cost and support for the Acess 5800 and 5830 products. On 2/11/09, John Seaman j...@trangosys.com wrote: Just to clear up a few points... Daniel's claim of number of Trango's units shipped is WAY off. He has no way of knowing what we have shipped. Trango is a private company and as such we dont divulge specifics, but I can tell you that the actual shipments are FAR greater and a very significant portion of the links shipped have gone outside the US and as such you wont see them show up in the FCC database. Our overall numbers of links shipped may be small compared to Ceragon and the big guys but the product has gained widespread acceptance, traction and is quickly gaining momentum. Why else would our competitors be acting so nervous? Trango has firmly established itself with TrangoLINK-GIGA and APEX in the WISP market. Now we are also gaining excellent traction with counties, states, cities, utilities, as well as the US Military... These entities traditionally deploylargest quantities of wireless backhaul sytems, compared to mobile operators who deploy by far the most. (although most mobile operator deployments are still strictly TDM). There is no stopping Trango. We will continue to peck away at Dragonwave's marketshare and gradually we'll be taking larger and larger portions of it. Dragonwave did not ship $50mil last year, it was closer to $40Mil - and by the way they are losing tons of money quarter-after-quarter. Trango is, and has always been profitable. I actually don't have a side-by side comparison of the two products handy. We really should put one together. Truth is there are many similarities and also some key differences. For those who may not be aware, Trango offers two primary product lines: TrangoLINK-GIGA and TrangoLINK-APEX. GIGA is our split architecture system which offers 4 GigE Ports (Dragonwave 1), 8 T1 ports (Dragonwave zero). The APEX is the all outdoor POE product which offers a GigE port as well as a plug-in slot for a fiber SFP module. I have never been able to determine how the Dragonwave optical option works...but I dont think it is anything as simple as APEX (Daniel feel free to provide details). Both of the traffic ports (optical and GigE copper) on the APEX can be used simultaneously. GIGA and APEX both offer port priority and QoS functionality as well as rapid port shutdown. The multiple port option allows users to completely segregate traffic from one port to the next. Dragonwave does not have this feature.The APEX offers TRUE Hitless ACM which is Adaptive Coding Modulation which means the system will move to slower modulations without taking any hits. I don't believe that Horizon Compact offers hitless ACM. Daniel, feel free to correct me if I am wrong. Regarding the GIGA, one other point which comes up often is that the Dragonwave split solution (Airpair) allows only for very short (300 ft?) IF cable runs. TrangoLINK-GIGA allows for 1000 ft of cable. As for Daniel's other points: -Products available now: TrangoLINK-GIGA 6, 11, 18, 23 GHz. APEX 18, 11 GHz. 23 Ghz coming next month. -Power Consumption: TrangoLINK-APEX power consumption is lower than Horizon Compact High power version although higher than Horizon standard power version, which stands to reason. -Field Proven: Latest releases of GIGA and APEX firmware highly stable. TrangoLINK-GIGA has been in the field for 18 months now. -CLI/GUI: You can do a full link setup using only the GUI interface on GIGA and APEX although admitedly the CLI has more functionality. Our firware engineers will enhance this in future releases. The CLI is very much like a Cisco interface and most users are very comfortable in the CLI. -LED Allignment - the allignment tool has received rave reviews from most installers. One thing I'd like to mention is that our newer ODUs coming out, and all APEX models have built-in power detector in the ODU to make the RSSI readouts more responsive than in the earlier ODUs. So the LED indicator that Daniel used on
Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link
Can I ask an honest question about the PTP licensed gear? Tell us about the tech support department. Is it just Timo (sp?)? How many other employees are there for support? Randy John Seaman wrote: And people wonder why I dont post to the list often. There are some old horror stories out there but far more success stories of succesful WISPs using Trango equipment. Josh, I am sorry to hear you had a bad experience in the past. By the way we are currently having a promotion on the 5830s.. with some of the best pricing we have ever offered on this product. If anyone is interested in the promos let us or CTI know. John -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Josh Luthman Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 12:12 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link So when you build a Trango backhaul network you hope they don't ruin you like they did for us trying to do use 700 dollar CPEs. I have not used Trango backhaul products due to the horrible experience, cost and support for the Acess 5800 and 5830 products. On 2/11/09, John Seaman j...@trangosys.com wrote: Just to clear up a few points... Daniel's claim of number of Trango's units shipped is WAY off. He has no way of knowing what we have shipped. Trango is a private company and as such we dont divulge specifics, but I can tell you that the actual shipments are FAR greater and a very significant portion of the links shipped have gone outside the US and as such you wont see them show up in the FCC database. Our overall numbers of links shipped may be small compared to Ceragon and the big guys but the product has gained widespread acceptance, traction and is quickly gaining momentum. Why else would our competitors be acting so nervous? Trango has firmly established itself with TrangoLINK-GIGA and APEX in the WISP market. Now we are also gaining excellent traction with counties, states, cities, utilities, as well as the US Military... These entities traditionally deploylargest quantities of wireless backhaul sytems, compared to mobile operators who deploy by far the most. (although most mobile operator deployments are still strictly TDM). There is no stopping Trango. We will continue to peck away at Dragonwave's marketshare and gradually we'll be taking larger and larger portions of it. Dragonwave did not ship $50mil last year, it was closer to $40Mil - and by the way they are losing tons of money quarter-after-quarter. Trango is, and has always been profitable. I actually don't have a side-by side comparison of the two products handy. We really should put one together. Truth is there are many similarities and also some key differences. For those who may not be aware, Trango offers two primary product lines: TrangoLINK-GIGA and TrangoLINK-APEX. GIGA is our split architecture system which offers 4 GigE Ports (Dragonwave 1), 8 T1 ports (Dragonwave zero). The APEX is the all outdoor POE product which offers a GigE port as well as a plug-in slot for a fiber SFP module. I have never been able to determine how the Dragonwave optical option works...but I dont think it is anything as simple as APEX (Daniel feel free to provide details). Both of the traffic ports (optical and GigE copper) on the APEX can be used simultaneously. GIGA and APEX both offer port priority and QoS functionality as well as rapid port shutdown. The multiple port option allows users to completely segregate traffic from one port to the next. Dragonwave does not have this feature.The APEX offers TRUE Hitless ACM which is Adaptive Coding Modulation which means the system will move to slower modulations without taking any hits. I don't believe that Horizon Compact offers hitless ACM. Daniel, feel free to correct me if I am wrong. Regarding the GIGA, one other point which comes up often is that the Dragonwave split solution (Airpair) allows only for very short (300 ft?) IF cable runs. TrangoLINK-GIGA allows for 1000 ft of cable. As for Daniel's other points: -Products available now: TrangoLINK-GIGA 6, 11, 18, 23 GHz. APEX 18, 11 GHz. 23 Ghz coming next month. -Power Consumption: TrangoLINK-APEX power consumption is lower than Horizon Compact High power version although higher than Horizon standard power version, which stands to reason. -Field Proven: Latest releases of GIGA and APEX firmware highly stable. TrangoLINK-GIGA has been in the field for 18 months now. -CLI/GUI: You can do a full link setup using only the GUI interface on GIGA and APEX although admitedly the CLI has more functionality. Our firware engineers will enhance this in future releases. The CLI is very much like a Cisco interface and most users are very comfortable in the CLI. -LED Allignment -
Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link
HUH? Someone at Trango held a gun to your head and made you purchase their gear? I don't get this message at all? Travis Microserv Josh Luthman wrote: So when you build a Trango backhaul network you hope they don't ruin you like they did for us trying to do use 700 dollar CPEs. I have not used Trango backhaul products due to the horrible experience, cost and support for the Acess 5800 and 5830 products. On 2/11/09, John Seaman j...@trangosys.com wrote: Just to clear up a few points... Daniel's claim of number of Trango's units shipped is WAY off. He has no way of knowing what we have shipped. Trango is a private company and as such we dont divulge specifics, but I can tell you that the actual shipments are FAR greater and a very significant portion of the links shipped have gone outside the US and as such you wont see them show up in the FCC database. Our overall numbers of links shipped may be small compared to Ceragon and the big guys but the product has gained widespread acceptance, traction and is quickly gaining momentum. Why else would our competitors be acting so nervous? Trango has firmly established itself with TrangoLINK-GIGA and APEX in the WISP market. Now we are also gaining excellent traction with counties, states, cities, utilities, as well as the US Military... These entities traditionally deploylargest quantities of wireless backhaul sytems, compared to mobile operators who deploy by far the most. (although most mobile operator deployments are still strictly TDM). There is no stopping Trango. We will continue to peck away at Dragonwave's marketshare and gradually we'll be taking larger and larger portions of it. Dragonwave did not ship $50mil last year, it was closer to $40Mil - and by the way they are losing tons of money quarter-after-quarter. Trango is, and has always been profitable. I actually don't have a side-by side comparison of the two products handy. We really should put one together. Truth is there are many similarities and also some key differences. For those who may not be aware, Trango offers two primary product lines: TrangoLINK-GIGA and TrangoLINK-APEX. GIGA is our split architecture system which offers 4 GigE Ports (Dragonwave 1), 8 T1 ports (Dragonwave zero). The APEX is the all outdoor POE product which offers a GigE port as well as a plug-in slot for a fiber SFP module. I have never been able to determine how the Dragonwave optical option works...but I dont think it is anything as simple as APEX (Daniel feel free to provide details). Both of the traffic ports (optical and GigE copper) on the APEX can be used simultaneously. GIGA and APEX both offer port priority and QoS functionality as well as rapid port shutdown. The multiple port option allows users to completely segregate traffic from one port to the next. Dragonwave does not have this feature.The APEX offers TRUE "Hitless" ACM which is Adaptive Coding Modulation which means the system will move to slower modulations without taking any hits. I don't believe that Horizon Compact offers hitless ACM. Daniel, feel free to correct me if I am wrong. Regarding the GIGA, one other point which comes up often is that the Dragonwave split solution (Airpair) allows only for very short (300 ft?) IF cable runs. TrangoLINK-GIGA allows for 1000 ft of cable. As for Daniel's other points: -Products available now: TrangoLINK-GIGA 6, 11, 18, 23 GHz. APEX 18, 11 GHz. 23 Ghz coming next month. -Power Consumption: TrangoLINK-APEX power consumption is lower than Horizon Compact High power version although higher than Horizon standard power version, which stands to reason. -Field Proven: Latest releases of GIGA and APEX firmware highly stable. TrangoLINK-GIGA has been in the field for 18 months now. -CLI/GUI: You can do a full link setup using only the GUI interface on GIGA and APEX although admitedly the CLI has more functionality. Our firware engineers will enhance this in future releases. The CLI is very much like a Cisco interface and most users are very comfortable in the CLI. -LED Allignment - the allignment tool has received rave reviews from most installers. One thing I'd like to mention is that our newer ODUs coming out, and all APEX models have built-in power detector in the ODU to make the RSSI readouts more responsive than in the earlier ODUs. So the LED indicator that Daniel used on his nine-link deployment has improved greatly in that it is highly responsive. Daniel if you get a chance to do another allignment I am sure you will love the LED allignment tool on the newer radios. - APEX output power 3-8 dB better than Horizon compact standard model. Horizon HP version 2.5 dB better than APEX at higher modulations (better at lower modulation). - Trango 18 Ghz covers 17.7 GHz - 18.14 19.265 - 19.7 GHz. This is 440 MHz of spectrum.. I dont know the DW spec on this, but I do know that I've never heard of a license being declined because there's not enough channels
Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link
Hi Randy, There are three people in our support group..plus me and Ray. We're a small sales and upport team.. but that's how a company stays profitable in tough economic times. We'll add support resources as needed and as the installed base grows. John -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Randy Cosby Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 12:29 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link Can I ask an honest question about the PTP licensed gear? Tell us about the tech support department. Is it just Timo (sp?)? How many other employees are there for support? Randy John Seaman wrote: And people wonder why I dont post to the list often. There are some old horror stories out there but far more success stories of succesful WISPs using Trango equipment. Josh, I am sorry to hear you had a bad experience in the past. By the way we are currently having a promotion on the 5830s.. with some of the best pricing we have ever offered on this product. If anyone is interested in the promos let us or CTI know. John -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Josh Luthman Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 12:12 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link So when you build a Trango backhaul network you hope they don't ruin you like they did for us trying to do use 700 dollar CPEs. I have not used Trango backhaul products due to the horrible experience, cost and support for the Acess 5800 and 5830 products. On 2/11/09, John Seaman j...@trangosys.com wrote: Just to clear up a few points... Daniel's claim of number of Trango's units shipped is WAY off. He has no way of knowing what we have shipped. Trango is a private company and as such we dont divulge specifics, but I can tell you that the actual shipments are FAR greater and a very significant portion of the links shipped have gone outside the US and as such you wont see them show up in the FCC database. Our overall numbers of links shipped may be small compared to Ceragon and the big guys but the product has gained widespread acceptance, traction and is quickly gaining momentum. Why else would our competitors be acting so nervous? Trango has firmly established itself with TrangoLINK-GIGA and APEX in the WISP market. Now we are also gaining excellent traction with counties, states, cities, utilities, as well as the US Military... These entities traditionally deploylargest quantities of wireless backhaul sytems, compared to mobile operators who deploy by far the most. (although most mobile operator deployments are still strictly TDM). There is no stopping Trango. We will continue to peck away at Dragonwave's marketshare and gradually we'll be taking larger and larger portions of it. Dragonwave did not ship $50mil last year, it was closer to $40Mil - and by the way they are losing tons of money quarter-after-quarter. Trango is, and has always been profitable. I actually don't have a side-by side comparison of the two products handy. We really should put one together. Truth is there are many similarities and also some key differences. For those who may not be aware, Trango offers two primary product lines: TrangoLINK-GIGA and TrangoLINK-APEX. GIGA is our split architecture system which offers 4 GigE Ports (Dragonwave 1), 8 T1 ports (Dragonwave zero). The APEX is the all outdoor POE product which offers a GigE port as well as a plug-in slot for a fiber SFP module. I have never been able to determine how the Dragonwave optical option works...but I dont think it is anything as simple as APEX (Daniel feel free to provide details). Both of the traffic ports (optical and GigE copper) on the APEX can be used simultaneously. GIGA and APEX both offer port priority and QoS functionality as well as rapid port shutdown. The multiple port option allows users to completely segregate traffic from one port to the next. Dragonwave does not have this feature.The APEX offers TRUE Hitless ACM which is Adaptive Coding Modulation which means the system will move to slower modulations without taking any hits. I don't believe that Horizon Compact offers hitless ACM. Daniel, feel free to correct me if I am wrong. Regarding the GIGA, one other point which comes up often is that the Dragonwave split solution (Airpair) allows only for very short (300 ft?) IF cable runs. TrangoLINK-GIGA allows for 1000 ft of cable. As for Daniel's other points: -Products available now: TrangoLINK-GIGA 6, 11, 18, 23 GHz. APEX 18, 11 GHz. 23 Ghz coming next month. -Power Consumption: TrangoLINK-APEX power consumption is lower than Horizon Compact High power version although higher than Horizon standard power
Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link
From my viewpoint, I can say that I know several WISPs of late that might not have touched Trango PMP products (mostly due to perceptions of waffling company policies that forced price fluctuations and random changes), but love the Trango PTP products. I think it is a fair assessment that Trango's entry in to the PTP space with as a value play has wildly upset the apple cart of established players who historically counted on massive margin. I've been certainly impressed with the rapid uptake of the product across verticals, which is not an easy feat. Patrick Leary Aperto Networks 813.426.4230 mobile -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of John Seaman Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 12:32 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link Hi Randy, There are three people in our support group..plus me and Ray. We're a small sales and upport team.. but that's how a company stays profitable in tough economic times. We'll add support resources as needed and as the installed base grows. John -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Randy Cosby Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 12:29 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link Can I ask an honest question about the PTP licensed gear? Tell us about the tech support department. Is it just Timo (sp?)? How many other employees are there for support? Randy John Seaman wrote: And people wonder why I dont post to the list often. There are some old horror stories out there but far more success stories of succesful WISPs using Trango equipment. Josh, I am sorry to hear you had a bad experience in the past. By the way we are currently having a promotion on the 5830s.. with some of the best pricing we have ever offered on this product. If anyone is interested in the promos let us or CTI know. John -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Josh Luthman Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 12:12 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link So when you build a Trango backhaul network you hope they don't ruin you like they did for us trying to do use 700 dollar CPEs. I have not used Trango backhaul products due to the horrible experience, cost and support for the Acess 5800 and 5830 products. On 2/11/09, John Seaman j...@trangosys.com wrote: Just to clear up a few points... Daniel's claim of number of Trango's units shipped is WAY off. He has no way of knowing what we have shipped. Trango is a private company and as such we dont divulge specifics, but I can tell you that the actual shipments are FAR greater and a very significant portion of the links shipped have gone outside the US and as such you wont see them show up in the FCC database. Our overall numbers of links shipped may be small compared to Ceragon and the big guys but the product has gained widespread acceptance, traction and is quickly gaining momentum. Why else would our competitors be acting so nervous? Trango has firmly established itself with TrangoLINK-GIGA and APEX in the WISP market. Now we are also gaining excellent traction with counties, states, cities, utilities, as well as the US Military... These entities traditionally deploylargest quantities of wireless backhaul sytems, compared to mobile operators who deploy by far the most. (although most mobile operator deployments are still strictly TDM). There is no stopping Trango. We will continue to peck away at Dragonwave's marketshare and gradually we'll be taking larger and larger portions of it. Dragonwave did not ship $50mil last year, it was closer to $40Mil - and by the way they are losing tons of money quarter-after-quarter. Trango is, and has always been profitable. I actually don't have a side-by side comparison of the two products handy. We really should put one together. Truth is there are many similarities and also some key differences. For those who may not be aware, Trango offers two primary product lines: TrangoLINK-GIGA and TrangoLINK-APEX. GIGA is our split architecture system which offers 4 GigE Ports (Dragonwave 1), 8 T1 ports (Dragonwave zero). The APEX is the all outdoor POE product which offers a GigE port as well as a plug-in slot for a fiber SFP module. I have never been able to determine how the Dragonwave optical option works...but I dont think it is anything as simple as APEX (Daniel feel free to provide details). Both of the traffic ports (optical and GigE copper) on the APEX can be used simultaneously. GIGA and APEX both offer port priority and QoS functionality as well as rapid port shutdown. The multiple port option allows users to completely segregate traffic from one port to the next.
Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link
I didn't purchase Trango to begin with, the company was acquired =) I just find it hard to make any money off of a customer paying $50/mo when I have to spend $700 on a CPE. I was told (this is word of mouth, no proof) that the CPEs were reasonably priced in the past and for whatever reason were skyrocketed. If it takes a year for an ROI for every customer there is no way starting companies can do this. If you can even get the unit cut in half to $350 that is still twice our MikroTik cost. As far as performance goes they're not bad at all. I find the peak of 7 megs with these products workable. The enclosure is beautiful - simple and it works. The dual polarity built in antennas is quite simply an amazing feature. The priority feature that significantly improves the number of capable SUs per AP is what really separates it from 802.11a. I've heard of 100 customers on a single AP. I am by no means blaming you, John, but the decision makers at Trango. If you had to do it, you had to do it. I may have had the worst experience out there, but I am warning everyone out there of my experiences as that is what the lists are for - sharing experience and knowledge. I was part of the company when we had a Trango point to point link but I never saw it myself - it died and we replaced it with Redline An50s. I don't know if it was hardware failure, lightning or even a totally different frequency. The only facts I have are: Trango, point to point, it was required we replaced it. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 Those who don't understand UNIX are condemned to reinvent it, poorly. --- Henry Spencer On Wed, Feb 11, 2009 at 3:31 PM, John Seaman j...@trangosys.com wrote: Hi Randy, There are three people in our support group..plus me and Ray. We're a small sales and upport team.. but that's how a company stays profitable in tough economic times. We'll add support resources as needed and as the installed base grows. John -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Randy Cosby Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 12:29 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link Can I ask an honest question about the PTP licensed gear? Tell us about the tech support department. Is it just Timo (sp?)? How many other employees are there for support? Randy John Seaman wrote: And people wonder why I dont post to the list often. There are some old horror stories out there but far more success stories of succesful WISPs using Trango equipment. Josh, I am sorry to hear you had a bad experience in the past. By the way we are currently having a promotion on the 5830s.. with some of the best pricing we have ever offered on this product. If anyone is interested in the promos let us or CTI know. John -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Josh Luthman Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 12:12 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link So when you build a Trango backhaul network you hope they don't ruin you like they did for us trying to do use 700 dollar CPEs. I have not used Trango backhaul products due to the horrible experience, cost and support for the Acess 5800 and 5830 products. On 2/11/09, John Seaman j...@trangosys.com wrote: Just to clear up a few points... Daniel's claim of number of Trango's units shipped is WAY off. He has no way of knowing what we have shipped. Trango is a private company and as such we dont divulge specifics, but I can tell you that the actual shipments are FAR greater and a very significant portion of the links shipped have gone outside the US and as such you wont see them show up in the FCC database. Our overall numbers of links shipped may be small compared to Ceragon and the big guys but the product has gained widespread acceptance, traction and is quickly gaining momentum. Why else would our competitors be acting so nervous? Trango has firmly established itself with TrangoLINK-GIGA and APEX in the WISP market. Now we are also gaining excellent traction with counties, states, cities, utilities, as well as the US Military... These entities traditionally deploylargest quantities of wireless backhaul sytems, compared to mobile operators who deploy by far the most. (although most mobile operator deployments are still strictly TDM). There is no stopping Trango. We will continue to peck away at Dragonwave's marketshare and gradually we'll be taking larger and larger portions of it. Dragonwave did not ship $50mil last year, it was closer to $40Mil - and by the way they are losing tons of money quarter-after-quarter. Trango is, and has always been profitable. I actually don't have a side-by side comparison of the two
Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link
That was exactly my point, Patrick. With the PMP products they flip flopped. They started making PTP products - what's to say they won't do the same thing to those who have these deployed? Fool me one shame on you, fool me twice... Also, how is the support with the PTP products? I have been listening in on all licensed PTP equipment but I am not even around to shopping. All the backhauls are currently 5GHz which I would like to replace over the coming months, years. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 Those who don't understand UNIX are condemned to reinvent it, poorly. --- Henry Spencer On Wed, Feb 11, 2009 at 3:42 PM, Patrick Leary ple...@apertonet.com wrote: From my viewpoint, I can say that I know several WISPs of late that might not have touched Trango PMP products (mostly due to perceptions of waffling company policies that forced price fluctuations and random changes), but love the Trango PTP products. I think it is a fair assessment that Trango's entry in to the PTP space with as a value play has wildly upset the apple cart of established players who historically counted on massive margin. I've been certainly impressed with the rapid uptake of the product across verticals, which is not an easy feat. Patrick Leary Aperto Networks 813.426.4230 mobile -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of John Seaman Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 12:32 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link Hi Randy, There are three people in our support group..plus me and Ray. We're a small sales and upport team.. but that's how a company stays profitable in tough economic times. We'll add support resources as needed and as the installed base grows. John -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Randy Cosby Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 12:29 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link Can I ask an honest question about the PTP licensed gear? Tell us about the tech support department. Is it just Timo (sp?)? How many other employees are there for support? Randy John Seaman wrote: And people wonder why I dont post to the list often. There are some old horror stories out there but far more success stories of succesful WISPs using Trango equipment. Josh, I am sorry to hear you had a bad experience in the past. By the way we are currently having a promotion on the 5830s.. with some of the best pricing we have ever offered on this product. If anyone is interested in the promos let us or CTI know. John -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Josh Luthman Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 12:12 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link So when you build a Trango backhaul network you hope they don't ruin you like they did for us trying to do use 700 dollar CPEs. I have not used Trango backhaul products due to the horrible experience, cost and support for the Acess 5800 and 5830 products. On 2/11/09, John Seaman j...@trangosys.com wrote: Just to clear up a few points... Daniel's claim of number of Trango's units shipped is WAY off. He has no way of knowing what we have shipped. Trango is a private company and as such we dont divulge specifics, but I can tell you that the actual shipments are FAR greater and a very significant portion of the links shipped have gone outside the US and as such you wont see them show up in the FCC database. Our overall numbers of links shipped may be small compared to Ceragon and the big guys but the product has gained widespread acceptance, traction and is quickly gaining momentum. Why else would our competitors be acting so nervous? Trango has firmly established itself with TrangoLINK-GIGA and APEX in the WISP market. Now we are also gaining excellent traction with counties, states, cities, utilities, as well as the US Military... These entities traditionally deploylargest quantities of wireless backhaul sytems, compared to mobile operators who deploy by far the most. (although most mobile operator deployments are still strictly TDM). There is no stopping Trango. We will continue to peck away at Dragonwave's marketshare and gradually we'll be taking larger and larger portions of it. Dragonwave did not ship $50mil last year, it was closer to $40Mil - and by the way they are losing tons of money quarter-after-quarter. Trango is, and has always been profitable. I actually don't have a side-by side comparison of the two products handy. We really should put one together. Truth is there are many similarities and also some key differences. For those who may not be aware, Trango offers
Re: [WISPA] Angry IP Scanner
D. Ryan Spott wrote: As for antivirus, just use http://www.clamwin.com/ or http://www.clamav.net/ ClamAV was designed as a mail-scanning package, and it shows. There's no real-time scan component for Windows, and historically it's done a poor job of detecting things that aren't normally transmitted via email. Anyway, I'm very much on the AVG bandwagon - for end-users it's free, for business customers it's reasonably-priced, and it's less annoying and intrusive than most of the other options. David Smith MVN.net WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Angry IP Scanner
I used to use AVG - it was a simple install and forget. 6 months ago they started nagging and making it difficult for those lesser knowledged users. Switched to Avast for now. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 Those who don't understand UNIX are condemned to reinvent it, poorly. --- Henry Spencer On Wed, Feb 11, 2009 at 3:56 PM, David E. Smith d...@mvn.net wrote: D. Ryan Spott wrote: As for antivirus, just use http://www.clamwin.com/ or http://www.clamav.net/ ClamAV was designed as a mail-scanning package, and it shows. There's no real-time scan component for Windows, and historically it's done a poor job of detecting things that aren't normally transmitted via email. Anyway, I'm very much on the AVG bandwagon - for end-users it's free, for business customers it's reasonably-priced, and it's less annoying and intrusive than most of the other options. David Smith MVN.net WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Angry IP Scanner
ClamAV seems to have on demand scanning. It grabs garbage from my end users hrm... ryan Josh Luthman wrote: I used to use AVG - it was a simple install and forget. 6 months ago they started nagging and making it difficult for those lesser knowledged users. Switched to Avast for now. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 Those who don't understand UNIX are condemned to reinvent it, poorly. --- Henry Spencer On Wed, Feb 11, 2009 at 3:56 PM, David E. Smith d...@mvn.net wrote: D. Ryan Spott wrote: As for antivirus, just use http://www.clamwin.com/ or http://www.clamav.net/ ClamAV was designed as a mail-scanning package, and it shows. There's no real-time scan component for Windows, and historically it's done a poor job of detecting things that aren't normally transmitted via email. Anyway, I'm very much on the AVG bandwagon - for end-users it's free, for business customers it's reasonably-priced, and it's less annoying and intrusive than most of the other options. David Smith MVN.net WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link
The only reason we don't attach it here in the factory is to enable the user the option to use a waveguide adapter (instead of the transition) in the event they want to connect the ODU to piece of flex waveguide so that it can be used with any dish with a waveguide flange. Good feature for those who want to upgrade pre-existing installed slower DS-3 type radios with new state of the art IP, using already installed dish. As someone who has now used both the Trango and Dragonwave products, I can honestly say they are both very fine products, and a buyer couldn't possibly go wrong with either purchase decission. But, we have reached a point where a buyer does not HAVE TO accept a significant technical compromise anymore to gain a better price. I will not get into a debate of which product is better, as there are very tiny differences that might be more or less preferable dependant on the buyer's application or personal preference. But I will say, Dragonwave will lose sales, if they try to keep their price higher, and at minimum are at a stage requiring price matching. There was a time that Dragonwave was considered the premium product, but today there are many buyers that would argue the opposite that Trango is now becomming the more premium product. I'll leave that decission to the prospective buyer. What I'd like to see from Dragonwave, is for them to give their distributors better prices consistently by default, so they can be more competitive. I think their quality resellers deserve that assistance, and the markup they add to generate sales. What I'd like to see from Trango, is for them to embrace 24Ghz, and add it to their collection. There is a Huge market for this, to empower WISPs to close deals and isntall links without delay. (even if they were converted to 23Ghz licensed down the road). What would be really cool, is a 23Ghz unit that was wideband and supported 23Ghz through 24Ghz, where software implemented the neccessary power reductions at 24Ghz unlicensed to keep it legal, when the channel was selected. I do not know if that is technically acheivable or not, without compromise. Tom DeReggi RapidDSL Wireless, Inc IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband - Original Message - From: John Seaman j...@trangosys.com To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 3:07 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link Just to clear up a few points... Daniel's claim of number of Trango's units shipped is WAY off. He has no way of knowing what we have shipped. Trango is a private company and as such we dont divulge specifics, but I can tell you that the actual shipments are FAR greater and a very significant portion of the links shipped have gone outside the US and as such you wont see them show up in the FCC database. Our overall numbers of links shipped may be small compared to Ceragon and the big guys but the product has gained widespread acceptance, traction and is quickly gaining momentum. Why else would our competitors be acting so nervous? Trango has firmly established itself with TrangoLINK-GIGA and APEX in the WISP market. Now we are also gaining excellent traction with counties, states, cities, utilities, as well as the US Military... These entities traditionally deploylargest quantities of wireless backhaul sytems, compared to mobile operators who deploy by far the most. (although most mobile operator deployments are still strictly TDM). There is no stopping Trango. We will continue to peck away at Dragonwave's marketshare and gradually we'll be taking larger and larger portions of it. Dragonwave did not ship $50mil last year, it was closer to $40Mil - and by the way they are losing tons of money quarter-after-quarter. Trango is, and has always been profitable. I actually don't have a side-by side comparison of the two products handy. We really should put one together. Truth is there are many similarities and also some key differences. For those who may not be aware, Trango offers two primary product lines: TrangoLINK-GIGA and TrangoLINK-APEX. GIGA is our split architecture system which offers 4 GigE Ports (Dragonwave 1), 8 T1 ports (Dragonwave zero). The APEX is the all outdoor POE product which offers a GigE port as well as a plug-in slot for a fiber SFP module. I have never been able to determine how the Dragonwave optical option works...but I dont think it is anything as simple as APEX (Daniel feel free to provide details). Both of the traffic ports (optical and GigE copper) on the APEX can be used simultaneously. GIGA and APEX both offer port priority and QoS functionality as well as rapid port shutdown. The multiple port option allows users to completely segregate traffic from one port to the next. Dragonwave does not have this feature.The APEX offers TRUE Hitless ACM which is Adaptive Coding Modulation which means the system will move to slower modulations
Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link
Thanks Tom, we're not convinced about 24 GHz... the power limits are very low. We are looking at it but we're trying to size up the 24 GHz market before we make the commitment to pursue this frequency. I do know that in Canada there is good demnand for 24 GHz (since licensing fees are extremely high) .. but here is the US, the licensing costs are so low that most users prefer to go with licensed band.. at least that has been our perception of the market so far. I would like to hear others view points on 24 GHz. John -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Tom DeReggi Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 12:13 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link The only reason we don't attach it here in the factory is to enable the user the option to use a waveguide adapter (instead of the transition) in the event they want to connect the ODU to piece of flex waveguide so that it can be used with any dish with a waveguide flange. Good feature for those who want to upgrade pre-existing installed slower DS-3 type radios with new state of the art IP, using already installed dish. As someone who has now used both the Trango and Dragonwave products, I can honestly say they are both very fine products, and a buyer couldn't possibly go wrong with either purchase decission. But, we have reached a point where a buyer does not HAVE TO accept a significant technical compromise anymore to gain a better price. I will not get into a debate of which product is better, as there are very tiny differences that might be more or less preferable dependant on the buyer's application or personal preference. But I will say, Dragonwave will lose sales, if they try to keep their price higher, and at minimum are at a stage requiring price matching. There was a time that Dragonwave was considered the premium product, but today there are many buyers that would argue the opposite that Trango is now becomming the more premium product. I'll leave that decission to the prospective buyer. What I'd like to see from Dragonwave, is for them to give their distributors better prices consistently by default, so they can be more competitive. I think their quality resellers deserve that assistance, and the markup they add to generate sales. What I'd like to see from Trango, is for them to embrace 24Ghz, and add it to their collection. There is a Huge market for this, to empower WISPs to close deals and isntall links without delay. (even if they were converted to 23Ghz licensed down the road). What would be really cool, is a 23Ghz unit that was wideband and supported 23Ghz through 24Ghz, where software implemented the neccessary power reductions at 24Ghz unlicensed to keep it legal, when the channel was selected. I do not know if that is technically acheivable or not, without compromise. Tom DeReggi RapidDSL Wireless, Inc IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband - Original Message - From: John Seaman j...@trangosys.com To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 3:07 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link Just to clear up a few points... Daniel's claim of number of Trango's units shipped is WAY off. He has no way of knowing what we have shipped. Trango is a private company and as such we dont divulge specifics, but I can tell you that the actual shipments are FAR greater and a very significant portion of the links shipped have gone outside the US and as such you wont see them show up in the FCC database. Our overall numbers of links shipped may be small compared to Ceragon and the big guys but the product has gained widespread acceptance, traction and is quickly gaining momentum. Why else would our competitors be acting so nervous? Trango has firmly established itself with TrangoLINK-GIGA and APEX in the WISP market. Now we are also gaining excellent traction with counties, states, cities, utilities, as well as the US Military... These entities traditionally deploylargest quantities of wireless backhaul sytems, compared to mobile operators who deploy by far the most. (although most mobile operator deployments are still strictly TDM). There is no stopping Trango. We will continue to peck away at Dragonwave's marketshare and gradually we'll be taking larger and larger portions of it. Dragonwave did not ship $50mil last year, it was closer to $40Mil - and by the way they are losing tons of money quarter-after-quarter. Trango is, and has always been profitable. I actually don't have a side-by side comparison of the two products handy. We really should put one together. Truth is there are many similarities and also some key differences. For those who may not be aware, Trango offers two primary product lines: TrangoLINK-GIGA and TrangoLINK-APEX. GIGA is our split architecture system which offers 4 GigE Ports (Dragonwave 1), 8 T1 ports (Dragonwave zero). The APEX is
Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link
Josh, No one will disagree that the Flip-Flopping price structures with the Trango PTMP lines was very annoying. And to be honest, the industry and I know it cost Trango customers. But there is a flip side, to identify value. For example, 99.9% of my original installed Trango gear (starting in 2001) is still in service, generating Revenue, and surviving interference better than any new product line on the market that I have used, for my application and circumstances. Many early generation WISPs (sub yr 2000) argued a likely need to change/upgrade technology every 3 years, and a new WISP should plan for such. I'm going on 8 years now, without the need to replace gear. And I charge a lot more than $50/month. That is an amazing value proposition, that I never predicted when I made the decission to buy into the Trango solution. I underestimated what it would take to make sales, and I did not meet my benchmarks as planned. I'm just glad I didn't underestimate the need to use Trango, because if I had to replace gear in 3 years, I would have been out of business today. I attribute the longevity of their product line to fine quality components internally and good engineering. I believe Trango is putting the same heart into their new PTP lines, and I do not doubt for a second that the product line will have the longevity that my business financial model requires. Again, I'm not suggesting which product you should buy, or which will have better value for you. You should evaluate all PTP options. But I am suggesting that you don't sell yourself short, by making the decission for the wrong reasons. With PtMP system, you are locking yourself into a platform for future buying decissions. With PTP you are not. You can change buying patterns link by links, as you see fit, without abandoning previous investments.. Tom DeReggi RapidDSL Wireless, Inc IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband - Original Message - From: Josh Luthman j...@imaginenetworksllc.com To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 3:51 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link That was exactly my point, Patrick. With the PMP products they flip flopped. They started making PTP products - what's to say they won't do the same thing to those who have these deployed? Fool me one shame on you, fool me twice... Also, how is the support with the PTP products? I have been listening in on all licensed PTP equipment but I am not even around to shopping. All the backhauls are currently 5GHz which I would like to replace over the coming months, years. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 Those who don't understand UNIX are condemned to reinvent it, poorly. --- Henry Spencer On Wed, Feb 11, 2009 at 3:42 PM, Patrick Leary ple...@apertonet.com wrote: From my viewpoint, I can say that I know several WISPs of late that might not have touched Trango PMP products (mostly due to perceptions of waffling company policies that forced price fluctuations and random changes), but love the Trango PTP products. I think it is a fair assessment that Trango's entry in to the PTP space with as a value play has wildly upset the apple cart of established players who historically counted on massive margin. I've been certainly impressed with the rapid uptake of the product across verticals, which is not an easy feat. Patrick Leary Aperto Networks 813.426.4230 mobile -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of John Seaman Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 12:32 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link Hi Randy, There are three people in our support group..plus me and Ray. We're a small sales and upport team.. but that's how a company stays profitable in tough economic times. We'll add support resources as needed and as the installed base grows. John -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Randy Cosby Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 12:29 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link Can I ask an honest question about the PTP licensed gear? Tell us about the tech support department. Is it just Timo (sp?)? How many other employees are there for support? Randy John Seaman wrote: And people wonder why I dont post to the list often. There are some old horror stories out there but far more success stories of succesful WISPs using Trango equipment. Josh, I am sorry to hear you had a bad experience in the past. By the way we are currently having a promotion on the 5830s.. with some of the best pricing we have ever offered on this product. If anyone is interested in the promos let us or CTI know. John -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org
Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link
Trango has a way of destroying their reputation even when their product is not at fault. We've had them offer us volume discounts only later to see the same price offered without a volume requirement as part of a promotion. I can't get a modern firmware for our older 5010s that operate in 5.2 because the new firmware turns on DFS even though our radios are grandfathered. It is sad they never updated their Atlas platform. -Matt On Feb 11, 2009, at 3:51 PM, Josh Luthman wrote: That was exactly my point, Patrick. With the PMP products they flip flopped. They started making PTP products - what's to say they won't do the same thing to those who have these deployed? Fool me one shame on you, fool me twice... Also, how is the support with the PTP products? I have been listening in on all licensed PTP equipment but I am not even around to shopping. All the backhauls are currently 5GHz which I would like to replace over the coming months, years. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 Those who don't understand UNIX are condemned to reinvent it, poorly. --- Henry Spencer On Wed, Feb 11, 2009 at 3:42 PM, Patrick Leary ple...@apertonet.com wrote: From my viewpoint, I can say that I know several WISPs of late that might not have touched Trango PMP products (mostly due to perceptions of waffling company policies that forced price fluctuations and random changes), but love the Trango PTP products. I think it is a fair assessment that Trango's entry in to the PTP space with as a value play has wildly upset the apple cart of established players who historically counted on massive margin. I've been certainly impressed with the rapid uptake of the product across verticals, which is not an easy feat. Patrick Leary Aperto Networks 813.426.4230 mobile -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless- boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of John Seaman Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 12:32 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link Hi Randy, There are three people in our support group..plus me and Ray. We're a small sales and upport team.. but that's how a company stays profitable in tough economic times. We'll add support resources as needed and as the installed base grows. John -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless- boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Randy Cosby Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 12:29 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link Can I ask an honest question about the PTP licensed gear? Tell us about the tech support department. Is it just Timo (sp?)? How many other employees are there for support? Randy John Seaman wrote: And people wonder why I dont post to the list often. There are some old horror stories out there but far more success stories of succesful WISPs using Trango equipment. Josh, I am sorry to hear you had a bad experience in the past. By the way we are currently having a promotion on the 5830s.. with some of the best pricing we have ever offered on this product. If anyone is interested in the promos let us or CTI know. John -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Josh Luthman Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 12:12 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link So when you build a Trango backhaul network you hope they don't ruin you like they did for us trying to do use 700 dollar CPEs. I have not used Trango backhaul products due to the horrible experience, cost and support for the Acess 5800 and 5830 products. On 2/11/09, John Seaman j...@trangosys.com wrote: Just to clear up a few points... Daniel's claim of number of Trango's units shipped is WAY off. He has no way of knowing what we have shipped. Trango is a private company and as such we dont divulge specifics, but I can tell you that the actual shipments are FAR greater and a very significant portion of the links shipped have gone outside the US and as such you wont see them show up in the FCC database. Our overall numbers of links shipped may be small compared to Ceragon and the big guys but the product has gained widespread acceptance, traction and is quickly gaining momentum. Why else would our competitors be acting so nervous? Trango has firmly established itself with TrangoLINK-GIGA and APEX in the WISP market. Now we are also gaining excellent traction with counties, states, cities, utilities, as well as the US Military... These entities traditionally deploylargest quantities of wireless backhaul sytems, compared to mobile operators who deploy by far the most. (although most mobile operator deployments are still strictly TDM). There is no stopping Trango. We will continue to peck
Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link
Matt, there is no DFS detector in the Atlas5010. It was not a firmware issue, but rather a hardware limitation. That is why we released the 5055, aka the TrangoLINK-45 which is essentially the same product as the Atlas but has DFS support for the UNII band. If you bought the 5010s before the FCC cutoff in 2006 then you are legally allowed to use the 5.2/5.3 GHz band with the 5010. The old firmware for the 5010s that operates without DFS is available on our archived FW download page. Promotions will come and go. I am pretty sure all the vendors have engaged in promos at one time or another where the promo price is equivalent to, or better than standard volume based pricing. In your case it may have been unfurtunate timing where the promos came out shortly after the volume purchase. John -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Matt Liotta Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 1:54 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link Trango has a way of destroying their reputation even when their product is not at fault. We've had them offer us volume discounts only later to see the same price offered without a volume requirement as part of a promotion. I can't get a modern firmware for our older 5010s that operate in 5.2 because the new firmware turns on DFS even though our radios are grandfathered. It is sad they never updated their Atlas platform. -Matt On Feb 11, 2009, at 3:51 PM, Josh Luthman wrote: That was exactly my point, Patrick. With the PMP products they flip flopped. They started making PTP products - what's to say they won't do the same thing to those who have these deployed? Fool me one shame on you, fool me twice... Also, how is the support with the PTP products? I have been listening in on all licensed PTP equipment but I am not even around to shopping. All the backhauls are currently 5GHz which I would like to replace over the coming months, years. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 Those who don't understand UNIX are condemned to reinvent it, poorly. --- Henry Spencer On Wed, Feb 11, 2009 at 3:42 PM, Patrick Leary ple...@apertonet.com wrote: From my viewpoint, I can say that I know several WISPs of late that might not have touched Trango PMP products (mostly due to perceptions of waffling company policies that forced price fluctuations and random changes), but love the Trango PTP products. I think it is a fair assessment that Trango's entry in to the PTP space with as a value play has wildly upset the apple cart of established players who historically counted on massive margin. I've been certainly impressed with the rapid uptake of the product across verticals, which is not an easy feat. Patrick Leary Aperto Networks 813.426.4230 mobile -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless- boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of John Seaman Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 12:32 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link Hi Randy, There are three people in our support group..plus me and Ray. We're a small sales and upport team.. but that's how a company stays profitable in tough economic times. We'll add support resources as needed and as the installed base grows. John -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless- boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Randy Cosby Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 12:29 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link Can I ask an honest question about the PTP licensed gear? Tell us about the tech support department. Is it just Timo (sp?)? How many other employees are there for support? Randy John Seaman wrote: And people wonder why I dont post to the list often. There are some old horror stories out there but far more success stories of succesful WISPs using Trango equipment. Josh, I am sorry to hear you had a bad experience in the past. By the way we are currently having a promotion on the 5830s.. with some of the best pricing we have ever offered on this product. If anyone is interested in the promos let us or CTI know. John -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Josh Luthman Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 12:12 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link So when you build a Trango backhaul network you hope they don't ruin you like they did for us trying to do use 700 dollar CPEs. I have not used Trango backhaul products due to the horrible experience, cost and support for the Acess 5800 and 5830 products. On 2/11/09, John Seaman j...@trangosys.com wrote: Just to clear up a few points... Daniel's claim of number of Trango's units shipped is WAY off. He has no way of knowing what we
Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link
I will say this, I found this interesting just this morning... I have many AN50 links. They work very very well. Love this product very much myself. The AN80 is the replacement product. A WISP bought 24 radios (12 links) of AN80s expecting them to be equally as good if not better. The price was definitely better. Time and time again these things caused problems and were replaced with Orthogon and the problem was solved. Just thought I would share that. Just because of that one company's horror story I doubt very much I will ever investigate using that product. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 Those who don't understand UNIX are condemned to reinvent it, poorly. --- Henry Spencer On Wed, Feb 11, 2009 at 3:41 PM, Tom DeReggi wirelessn...@rapiddsl.netwrote: Josh, No one will disagree that the Flip-Flopping price structures with the Trango PTMP lines was very annoying. And to be honest, the industry and I know it cost Trango customers. But there is a flip side, to identify value. For example, 99.9% of my original installed Trango gear (starting in 2001) is still in service, generating Revenue, and surviving interference better than any new product line on the market that I have used, for my application and circumstances. Many early generation WISPs (sub yr 2000) argued a likely need to change/upgrade technology every 3 years, and a new WISP should plan for such. I'm going on 8 years now, without the need to replace gear. And I charge a lot more than $50/month. That is an amazing value proposition, that I never predicted when I made the decission to buy into the Trango solution. I underestimated what it would take to make sales, and I did not meet my benchmarks as planned. I'm just glad I didn't underestimate the need to use Trango, because if I had to replace gear in 3 years, I would have been out of business today. I attribute the longevity of their product line to fine quality components internally and good engineering. I believe Trango is putting the same heart into their new PTP lines, and I do not doubt for a second that the product line will have the longevity that my business financial model requires. Again, I'm not suggesting which product you should buy, or which will have better value for you. You should evaluate all PTP options. But I am suggesting that you don't sell yourself short, by making the decission for the wrong reasons. With PtMP system, you are locking yourself into a platform for future buying decissions. With PTP you are not. You can change buying patterns link by links, as you see fit, without abandoning previous investments.. Tom DeReggi RapidDSL Wireless, Inc IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband - Original Message - From: Josh Luthman j...@imaginenetworksllc.com To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 3:51 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link That was exactly my point, Patrick. With the PMP products they flip flopped. They started making PTP products - what's to say they won't do the same thing to those who have these deployed? Fool me one shame on you, fool me twice... Also, how is the support with the PTP products? I have been listening in on all licensed PTP equipment but I am not even around to shopping. All the backhauls are currently 5GHz which I would like to replace over the coming months, years. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 Those who don't understand UNIX are condemned to reinvent it, poorly. --- Henry Spencer On Wed, Feb 11, 2009 at 3:42 PM, Patrick Leary ple...@apertonet.com wrote: From my viewpoint, I can say that I know several WISPs of late that might not have touched Trango PMP products (mostly due to perceptions of waffling company policies that forced price fluctuations and random changes), but love the Trango PTP products. I think it is a fair assessment that Trango's entry in to the PTP space with as a value play has wildly upset the apple cart of established players who historically counted on massive margin. I've been certainly impressed with the rapid uptake of the product across verticals, which is not an easy feat. Patrick Leary Aperto Networks 813.426.4230 mobile -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of John Seaman Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 12:32 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link Hi Randy, There are three people in our support group..plus me and Ray. We're a small sales and upport team.. but that's how a company stays profitable in tough economic times. We'll add support resources as needed and as the installed base grows. John -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org
Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link
On Feb 11, 2009, at 5:02 PM, John Seaman wrote: Matt, there is no DFS detector in the Atlas5010. It was not a firmware issue, but rather a hardware limitation. That is why we released the 5055, aka the TrangoLINK-45 which is essentially the same product as the Atlas but has DFS support for the UNII band. If you bought the 5010s before the FCC cutoff in 2006 then you are legally allowed to use the 5.2/5.3 GHz band with the 5010. The old firmware for the 5010s that operates without DFS is available on our archived FW download page. I don't want the old firmware... I have that. I want the new firmware, but that disables 5.2 on my 5010s. Trango should provide modern firmware that properly handles grandfathered radios. Promotions will come and go. I am pretty sure all the vendors have engaged in promos at one time or another where the promo price is equivalent to, or better than standard volume based pricing. In your case it may have been unfurtunate timing where the promos came out shortly after the volume purchase. I agree the timing was unfortunate. We have never bought another Trango radio since that time, so who really suffered in this case? -Matt WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Service in Mt. Carmel IL
The local provider is likely Access Us http://www.accessus.net. I serve about 60 miles west of there. Scriv On Wed, Feb 11, 2009 at 12:30 PM, Martha Huizenga mar...@dcaccess.netwrote: Hi all, I got a service request from someone in Mt. Carmel IL. They said their friend has us and told them to go to accessusa.net - which is a domain I own, but it goes to my web site for DC Access. Anyone serve this area? If so, contact me offlist and I'll give you her contact info. Thanks Martha -- Martha Huizenga DC Access, LLC 202-546-5898 */Friendly, Local, Affordable, Internet!/**/ Connecting the Capitol Hill Community /* WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Angry IP Scanner
dump norton. we did years ago. Steve Barnes wrote: We have used angry IPSCANNER for years around the office for years to do odds and ends IP scans. Norton Anti-everything hates it and the new 2009 version wont let me exclude it. Anybody have a program like it (windows) that I might Try that you like. Steve Barnes Executive Manager PCS-WIN RCWiFi Wireless Internet Service WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Angry IP Scanner
we don't give AVG away, we just provide a link to it. Steve Barnes wrote: Actually I really like the 2009 Norton Products. It eats 10% of the memory Norton 2008 did and kicks butt on finding stuff. I've been giving AVG away and they called me and said that's a NO-NO besides that makes no revenue stream. I sold 20 copies last week and have had 2 of them call and say that it has cleaned the malware Antivirus 2009 and the new variant Antivirus 360. AVG and others have not been able to do that. Steve Barnes Executive Manager PCS-WIN RCWiFi Wireless Internet Service -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Mike Hammett Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 2:06 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Angry IP Scanner A better recommendation would be to switch from Norton. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com -- From: "Steve Barnes" st...@pcswin.com Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 12:52 PM To: "WISPA General List" wireless@wispa.org Subject: [WISPA] Angry IP Scanner We have used angry IPSCANNER for years around the office for years to do odds and ends IP scans. Norton Anti-everything hates it and the new 2009 version wont let me exclude it. Anybody have a program like it (windows) that I might Try that you like. Steve Barnes Executive Manager PCS-WIN RCWiFi Wireless Internet Service WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link
Well, I'll add a couple comments, before the group chimes in I agree, that in MORE cases, people will chose 23Ghz licensed over 24Ghz. But that does not negate the 24Ghz model potential. For 24Ghz, 2ft Dish configurations are going to be MUCH more effective. And as well, Lower modulations/speeds will likely occur per link, in order to reach further distances. But doing 1.5 miles at 99.999% is doable with 24Ghz at 100mbps, with multiple channels to choose from. (mine was 1.7 miles long). I'd argue that 24Ghz has more channel selections than 2.4Ghz, 900Mhz, and much larger ability for spectrum reuse. 24Ghz is an ideal choice for getting a LARGE number of PTP links into a small area. This is the fact WISPS are running out of Last Mile spectrum. The demand for higher speeds has come fast. WISPs need to start migrating profitable high capacity customers OFF of their 5.8Ghz PtMP sectors, so the capacity is available for their lower capacity higher volume target subscriber base. For many, there is no longer an option to add 5.8G APs, growth instead is acheived by moving large cpacity customers to new High capacity technologies, which today is only possible w/ PTP. The first thing to understand is There is absolutely a market and demand for increasing capacity to customers within a 1.5 mile radius. ANY provider in a URBAN or SUBURBAN market will have this demand. For example, in DC its only like 3 miles side to side, and narrow beamwidth links are needed. 60-80Ghz promised a solution, but never delivered. Low cost links are limited to .5 miles, and EXPENSIVE (3X cost of Horizon) gear can extend up to 2 miles. The second thing to understand is... Why would we choose 24Ghz over 23Ghz?. The questions to ask are... and answers following 1) Do we need licensed protection, in all cases? And the answer is No, we have 200 tenant buildings served with Unlicenced 5.x today. 2) Will WISPs pay $10K for an Unlicensed solution, for a unique solution if they need to? The answer is yes. People have been paying $10k for Redline and Orthogon PTPs for years. 3) Will WISPs do everything possible to save a dollar? The answer is yes, we have been trained to do that since birth :-) 4) Is $3000 License Costs a signficant amount to save for a WISP? Absolutely, yes. $3000 would buy 1-2 Trango TLink45s, dependant on Promos. Remember most WISPs are still funded through cash flow. $3000 is a small fortune. This comment is with the premise that 24Ghz product would be sold for equal or less money than its 23Ghz licensed counterpart. Trango nor WISPs have any benefit to giving our hard earned money to the FCC and licensing consultants. Take note that based on current Trango prices, a $3000 savings is like a 25% savings of the total link. Many buyers have chosen Trango over their previous vendor Dragonwave for as little as a 10% savings. What would a WISP do to save 25%? 5) Note... Grant money will usually buy equipment not licenses.. Leasing companies will approve leases for Equipment, and rarely for licenses taht can't be reposessed. A WISP could buy more radios with grant/lease money, if they were not limited by cash flow constraints to buy licenses. 6) Are there any reasons 24Ghz might be favored over 23Ghz? Answer yes. The very nature of WISPs are to deploy fast. Licensing takes advanced planning and often adds 2 months to the process. I will say that 50% of the sales our company made to date were because we could get a link to the customer Sooner. We didn't need to plan, we just executed action. It is a convenience factor. 24Ghz offers A) The ability to STOCK inventory on hand, without knowing in advance where it will be used. B) The ability to immediately place orders, without waiting for Freq Coords. C) 23Ghz does not allow temporary install after Freq Coord and application stage, and are not legally allowed to be deployed until after the license is actually granted, and I beleive has an additional step (by FCC to determine channel availabilty) beyond the initial end user ordered Freq coord, before the FCC can grant the license. D) The ability to immediately go install. ONLY thing needing done before installing, is a quick 5 minute path calc, with large odds success will be reached. 7) Does 24Ghz scale? Answer is yes. 24Ghz will scale significantly higher than 23Ghz. Because 24Ghz is lower tx power (about 20 db lower), it will allow a much larger number of radios to be installed within a given region without interference. A 23Ghz licenses is not guaranteed to be available. Its important to note that 23Ghz licenses requires that licensees are guaranteed a large minimum dynamic range (SNR), at minimum level Quality of service. So to guarantee someone can get non-interference at 256QAM (30db SNR) and -30db rssi, and 30 db of fade margin. This makes it much more possible for a new link to show that it would interfere with an existing
Re: [WISPA] Service in Mt. Carmel IL
Yep they have a POP there. Rob Summers takes care of that area. rob.summ...@accessus.net Jim John Scrivner wrote: The local provider is likely Access Us http://www.accessus.net. I serve about 60 miles west of there. Scriv On Wed, Feb 11, 2009 at 12:30 PM, Martha Huizenga mar...@dcaccess.netwrote: Hi all, I got a service request from someone in Mt. Carmel IL. They said their friend has us and told them to go to accessusa.net - which is a domain I own, but it goes to my web site for DC Access. Anyone serve this area? If so, contact me offlist and I'll give you her contact info. Thanks Martha -- Martha Huizenga DC Access, LLC 202-546-5898 */Friendly, Local, Affordable, Internet!/**/ Connecting the Capitol Hill Community /* WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link
I second what Tom says. We need another affordable 24GHz solution. On Wed, Feb 11, 2009 at 5:47 PM, Tom DeReggi wirelessn...@rapiddsl.netwrote: Well, I'll add a couple comments, before the group chimes in I agree, that in MORE cases, people will chose 23Ghz licensed over 24Ghz. But that does not negate the 24Ghz model potential. For 24Ghz, 2ft Dish configurations are going to be MUCH more effective. And as well, Lower modulations/speeds will likely occur per link, in order to reach further distances. But doing 1.5 miles at 99.999% is doable with 24Ghz at 100mbps, with multiple channels to choose from. (mine was 1.7 miles long). I'd argue that 24Ghz has more channel selections than 2.4Ghz, 900Mhz, and much larger ability for spectrum reuse. 24Ghz is an ideal choice for getting a LARGE number of PTP links into a small area. This is the fact WISPS are running out of Last Mile spectrum. The demand for higher speeds has come fast. WISPs need to start migrating profitable high capacity customers OFF of their 5.8Ghz PtMP sectors, so the capacity is available for their lower capacity higher volume target subscriber base. For many, there is no longer an option to add 5.8G APs, growth instead is acheived by moving large cpacity customers to new High capacity technologies, which today is only possible w/ PTP. The first thing to understand is There is absolutely a market and demand for increasing capacity to customers within a 1.5 mile radius. ANY provider in a URBAN or SUBURBAN market will have this demand. For example, in DC its only like 3 miles side to side, and narrow beamwidth links are needed. 60-80Ghz promised a solution, but never delivered. Low cost links are limited to .5 miles, and EXPENSIVE (3X cost of Horizon) gear can extend up to 2 miles. The second thing to understand is... Why would we choose 24Ghz over 23Ghz?. The questions to ask are... and answers following 1) Do we need licensed protection, in all cases? And the answer is No, we have 200 tenant buildings served with Unlicenced 5.x today. 2) Will WISPs pay $10K for an Unlicensed solution, for a unique solution if they need to? The answer is yes. People have been paying $10k for Redline and Orthogon PTPs for years. 3) Will WISPs do everything possible to save a dollar? The answer is yes, we have been trained to do that since birth :-) 4) Is $3000 License Costs a signficant amount to save for a WISP? Absolutely, yes. $3000 would buy 1-2 Trango TLink45s, dependant on Promos. Remember most WISPs are still funded through cash flow. $3000 is a small fortune. This comment is with the premise that 24Ghz product would be sold for equal or less money than its 23Ghz licensed counterpart. Trango nor WISPs have any benefit to giving our hard earned money to the FCC and licensing consultants. Take note that based on current Trango prices, a $3000 savings is like a 25% savings of the total link. Many buyers have chosen Trango over their previous vendor Dragonwave for as little as a 10% savings. What would a WISP do to save 25%? 5) Note... Grant money will usually buy equipment not licenses.. Leasing companies will approve leases for Equipment, and rarely for licenses taht can't be reposessed. A WISP could buy more radios with grant/lease money, if they were not limited by cash flow constraints to buy licenses. 6) Are there any reasons 24Ghz might be favored over 23Ghz? Answer yes. The very nature of WISPs are to deploy fast. Licensing takes advanced planning and often adds 2 months to the process. I will say that 50% of the sales our company made to date were because we could get a link to the customer Sooner. We didn't need to plan, we just executed action. It is a convenience factor. 24Ghz offers A) The ability to STOCK inventory on hand, without knowing in advance where it will be used. B) The ability to immediately place orders, without waiting for Freq Coords. C) 23Ghz does not allow temporary install after Freq Coord and application stage, and are not legally allowed to be deployed until after the license is actually granted, and I beleive has an additional step (by FCC to determine channel availabilty) beyond the initial end user ordered Freq coord, before the FCC can grant the license. D) The ability to immediately go install. ONLY thing needing done before installing, is a quick 5 minute path calc, with large odds success will be reached. 7) Does 24Ghz scale? Answer is yes. 24Ghz will scale significantly higher than 23Ghz. Because 24Ghz is lower tx power (about 20 db lower), it will allow a much larger number of radios to be installed within a given region without interference. A 23Ghz licenses is not guaranteed to be available. Its important to note that 23Ghz licenses requires that licensees are guaranteed a large minimum dynamic range (SNR), at minimum level Quality of service. So to guarantee someone can get
Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link
I'll go with this, Tom has made very valid points. -Cameron I second what Tom says. We need another affordable 24GHz solution. On Wed, Feb 11, 2009 at 5:47 PM, Tom DeReggi wirelessn...@rapiddsl.netwrote: Well, I'll add a couple comments, before the group chimes in I agree, that in MORE cases, people will chose 23Ghz licensed over 24Ghz. But that does not negate the 24Ghz model potential. For 24Ghz, 2ft Dish configurations are going to be MUCH more effective. And as well, Lower modulations/speeds will likely occur per link, in order to reach further distances. But doing 1.5 miles at 99.999% is doable with 24Ghz at 100mbps, with multiple channels to choose from. (mine was 1.7 miles long). I'd argue that 24Ghz has more channel selections than 2.4Ghz, 900Mhz, and much larger ability for spectrum reuse. 24Ghz is an ideal choice for getting a LARGE number of PTP links into a small area. This is the fact WISPS are running out of Last Mile spectrum. The demand for higher speeds has come fast. WISPs need to start migrating profitable high capacity customers OFF of their 5.8Ghz PtMP sectors, so the capacity is available for their lower capacity higher volume target subscriber base. For many, there is no longer an option to add 5.8G APs, growth instead is acheived by moving large cpacity customers to new High capacity technologies, which today is only possible w/ PTP. The first thing to understand is There is absolutely a market and demand for increasing capacity to customers within a 1.5 mile radius. ANY provider in a URBAN or SUBURBAN market will have this demand. For example, in DC its only like 3 miles side to side, and narrow beamwidth links are needed. 60-80Ghz promised a solution, but never delivered. Low cost links are limited to .5 miles, and EXPENSIVE (3X cost of Horizon) gear can extend up to 2 miles. The second thing to understand is... Why would we choose 24Ghz over 23Ghz?. The questions to ask are... and answers following 1) Do we need licensed protection, in all cases? And the answer is No, we have 200 tenant buildings served with Unlicenced 5.x today. 2) Will WISPs pay $10K for an Unlicensed solution, for a unique solution if they need to? The answer is yes. People have been paying $10k for Redline and Orthogon PTPs for years. 3) Will WISPs do everything possible to save a dollar? The answer is yes, we have been trained to do that since birth :-) 4) Is $3000 License Costs a signficant amount to save for a WISP? Absolutely, yes. $3000 would buy 1-2 Trango TLink45s, dependant on Promos. Remember most WISPs are still funded through cash flow. $3000 is a small fortune. This comment is with the premise that 24Ghz product would be sold for equal or less money than its 23Ghz licensed counterpart. Trango nor WISPs have any benefit to giving our hard earned money to the FCC and licensing consultants. Take note that based on current Trango prices, a $3000 savings is like a 25% savings of the total link. Many buyers have chosen Trango over their previous vendor Dragonwave for as little as a 10% savings. What would a WISP do to save 25%? 5) Note... Grant money will usually buy equipment not licenses.. Leasing companies will approve leases for Equipment, and rarely for licenses taht can't be reposessed. A WISP could buy more radios with grant/lease money, if they were not limited by cash flow constraints to buy licenses. 6) Are there any reasons 24Ghz might be favored over 23Ghz? Answer yes. The very nature of WISPs are to deploy fast. Licensing takes advanced planning and often adds 2 months to the process. I will say that 50% of the sales our company made to date were because we could get a link to the customer Sooner. We didn't need to plan, we just executed action. It is a convenience factor. 24Ghz offers A) The ability to STOCK inventory on hand, without knowing in advance where it will be used. B) The ability to immediately place orders, without waiting for Freq Coords. C) 23Ghz does not allow temporary install after Freq Coord and application stage, and are not legally allowed to be deployed until after the license is actually granted, and I beleive has an additional step (by FCC to determine channel availabilty) beyond the initial end user ordered Freq coord, before the FCC can grant the license. D) The ability to immediately go install. ONLY thing needing done before installing, is a quick 5 minute path calc, with large odds success will be reached. 7) Does 24Ghz scale? Answer is yes. 24Ghz will scale significantly higher than 23Ghz. Because 24Ghz is lower tx power (about 20 db lower), it will allow a much larger number of radios to be installed within a given region without interference. A 23Ghz licenses is not guaranteed to be available. Its important to note that 23Ghz licenses requires that licensees are guaranteed a large minimum
Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link
Brad, I'm not a WISP'er anymore... sales manager over here at 3-dB. I still get out though and install gear for people... :-) I am out of the office more though than I care to be... too many jobs stacking up! Daniel White 3-dB Networks http://www.3dbnetworks.com -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Brad Belton Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 9:07 AM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link Hmmm...sure sounds like you have an inordinate amount of service work on your linksgrin I'm working on a response to your other post with a line item side by side comparison between Dragonwave and Trango, but it will probably be tomorrow before it's posted. Best, Brad -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of 3-dB Networks Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 8:43 AM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link I have to run out into the field to work on a Bridgewave link (people pay good money for that :-). I'll answer this tonight. Daniel White 3-dB Networks http://www.3dbnetworks.com From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Travis Johnson Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2009 10:32 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link Hi, I have a better idea someone compile a simple side-by-side comparison of the Dragonwave vs. Trango 18ghz radios. List all the benefits of each radio, and then also list the current price for a comparable speed for each. I'm not familiar with the current Dragonwave product, so I will only list the benefits of the Trango APEX system (of which I currently have 3 running as our main backbone backhauls): (1) Radio mounted signal display for alignment (2) Optional fiber port (only have to buy the fiber module to plug in) (3) Various channel sizes (10, 20, 28, 40, 50, 80 mhz wide) (4) up to +20db power output (5) Jumbo packets via GigE (6) PoE (-48v) (7) In-band or out-of-band management (8) Separate GigE port for management (9) Rapid Port Shutdown (10) 1+1 redundancy (using a single antenna) (11) Dual power supplies (either PoE port can supply the power) (12) 2 year warranty standard (can be upgraded to 3 year, overnight replacement for $2,000 per link) (13) Price (currently $9,995 with 2ft dishes and frequency coordination. FCC fees are about $1,300 extra). Travis Microserv 3-dB Networks wrote: I'm going to go with Jeff on this one... there has been multiple threads on this topic... I think it has been beat to death. If you want to talk about it offlist I'd be happy to. As far as the price difference... I'd be happy to quote the Dragonwave and let you compare it to the published Trango deals... but my personal opinion is that you are not paying a premium for the Dragonwave name... compared to what I would consider the benefits. Daniel White 3-dB Networks http://www.3dbnetworks.com -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Jeff Ehman Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2009 8:08 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link All, When comparing exactly apples to apples, there is about a 10-20% premium for a Dragonwave product. There are plenty of threads on this topic. I would be happy to grab a bunch for you so hit me off off-list. It really depends on your application for which product you would like to go with. I would be more than happy to walk you through everything. I try to refrain from stating opinions in a public forum. -Jeff -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Brad Belton Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2009 6:36 PM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link Hello Daniel, Can you elaborate in what way the Dragonwave performance is much better? Do you have a comparison chart you can share with us explaining how a Dragonwave stacks up against competing products. Namely Trango in this case. Exactly how close is close when you mention pricing between the two products? Close is a relative term don't you agree? So, are we talking $5, $50, $500, $5000? Look forward to your responses. Thank you, Brad -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of 3-dB Networks Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2009 6:25 PM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link Well... I'd be happy to quote you a Dragonwave link... I think you will be surprised how close it comes to the Trango pricing... and I think the performance is much better (I don't want to rehash that whole thread). We also will take care of all of the licensing work for you. Hit me offlist if you like. Daniel White 3-dB Networks http://www.3dbnetworks.com -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org
Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link
Comments inline Before anyone reads further... I have the upmost respect for John... and I honestly believe Trango has done many things right over the years. I'll also be the first one to say that the Trango PTP products will work... but to me the price difference isn't enough to switch to Trango. I'd also like to point out... I only defend Dragonwave because I think it is the best product on the market from my personal experience. I've installed Trango, Dragonwave, Harris, Ceragon, and PCOM gear... and have had the best experiences with Dragonwave. I only preach what I know works, from my own personal experience. Daniel White 3-dB Networks http://www.3dbnetworks.com -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of John Seaman Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 1:08 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link Just to clear up a few points... Daniel's claim of number of Trango's units shipped is WAY off. He has no way of knowing what we have shipped. Trango is a private company and as such we dont divulge specifics, but I can tell you that the actual shipments are FAR greater and a very significant portion of the links shipped have gone outside the US and as such you wont see them show up in the FCC database. Trango being a private company is the number one reason people don't know what is going on over there John. You can claim your profitable all day long and selling thousands of links... but saying most of them have shipped overseas doesn't help anything. So what we can do is look at the FCC database... and if you do that anyone can clearly see there isn't too much of the stuff out there. Our overall numbers of links shipped may be small compared to Ceragon and the big guys but the product has gained widespread acceptance, traction and is quickly gaining momentum. Why else would our competitors be acting so nervous? Are they really? Yes Dragonwave is becoming more competitive in their pricing... but other than that I haven't seen moves by any other vendor that shows nervousness. Personally I've heard more trepidation over Motorola entering the market. On a side note... I just got a lot of the pre-release documents on their product line... man does it look promising... and surprisingly at a reasonable price point (meaning in the same space as Dragonwave/Trango... of course who knows until the final pricing is announced) Trango has firmly established itself with TrangoLINK-GIGA and APEX in the WISP market. But that is a very very limited market... Now we are also gaining excellent traction with counties, states, cities, utilities, as well as the US Military... These entities traditionally deploylargest quantities of wireless backhaul sytems, compared to mobile operators who deploy by far the most. (although most mobile operator deployments are still strictly TDM). I'd love to hear some case studies and whitepapers... I do know of one local city that purchased a few... so I'm not saying your wrong... but I'd for one like to hear more. BTW... I'd argue the point that most mobile operators are strictly TDM... many are doing Psudeowire solutions now. There is no stopping Trango. Not to be a smart ass here... but is that way happened with the OFDM PTMP product line? I think it's interesting that the bread and butter portion of the business is bleeding like crazy... I'm seeing WISP after WISP ditch their Trango gear for Motorola/Mikrotik/3.65... can the PTP business sustain Trango? We will continue to peck away at Dragonwave's marketshare and gradually we'll be taking larger and larger portions of it. Not going to argue the fact that you have taken some of Dragonwave's market share... but the latest numbers I have seen still put Dragonwave leaps and bounds ahead of anyone else. Dragonwave did not ship $50mil last year, it was closer to $40Mil - and by the way they are losing tons of money quarter-after-quarter. Trango is, and has always been profitable. Well you can read Dragonwave's latest financial statement here... http://www.dragonwaveinc.com/docs/corporate/DragonWave_Financial%20Statement s_Nov30%202008.pdf So it does say gross sales was at 30 million CDN for three quarters... Dragonwave operates on a weird year end. Anyways I used the 50 mil from what I was told off the cuff by a Dragonwave rep... anyways its probably fair to say it is somewhere between 40 and 50 mil... I can't do that for Trango... so how does anyone know how profitable you guys are? I'd also argue that Dragonwave appears to be spending money investing in the company... and unlike Trango... I haven't heard of them laying off batches of employees. Anyways they gotta be doing something right... and I don't think anyone is questioning they will be around 5 years from now... yet many (not just me) have doubts about Trango... I actually don't have a side-by side comparison of the two products handy. We
Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link
Tom, you need a hobby. :-p - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com -- From: Tom DeReggi wirelessn...@rapiddsl.net Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 4:47 PM To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Subject: Re: [WISPA] Need 18ghz link Well, I'll add a couple comments, before the group chimes in I agree, that in MORE cases, people will chose 23Ghz licensed over 24Ghz. But that does not negate the 24Ghz model potential. For 24Ghz, 2ft Dish configurations are going to be MUCH more effective. And as well, Lower modulations/speeds will likely occur per link, in order to reach further distances. But doing 1.5 miles at 99.999% is doable with 24Ghz at 100mbps, with multiple channels to choose from. (mine was 1.7 miles long). I'd argue that 24Ghz has more channel selections than 2.4Ghz, 900Mhz, and much larger ability for spectrum reuse. 24Ghz is an ideal choice for getting a LARGE number of PTP links into a small area. This is the fact WISPS are running out of Last Mile spectrum. The demand for higher speeds has come fast. WISPs need to start migrating profitable high capacity customers OFF of their 5.8Ghz PtMP sectors, so the capacity is available for their lower capacity higher volume target subscriber base. For many, there is no longer an option to add 5.8G APs, growth instead is acheived by moving large cpacity customers to new High capacity technologies, which today is only possible w/ PTP. The first thing to understand is There is absolutely a market and demand for increasing capacity to customers within a 1.5 mile radius. ANY provider in a URBAN or SUBURBAN market will have this demand. For example, in DC its only like 3 miles side to side, and narrow beamwidth links are needed. 60-80Ghz promised a solution, but never delivered. Low cost links are limited to .5 miles, and EXPENSIVE (3X cost of Horizon) gear can extend up to 2 miles. The second thing to understand is... Why would we choose 24Ghz over 23Ghz?. The questions to ask are... and answers following 1) Do we need licensed protection, in all cases? And the answer is No, we have 200 tenant buildings served with Unlicenced 5.x today. 2) Will WISPs pay $10K for an Unlicensed solution, for a unique solution if they need to? The answer is yes. People have been paying $10k for Redline and Orthogon PTPs for years. 3) Will WISPs do everything possible to save a dollar? The answer is yes, we have been trained to do that since birth :-) 4) Is $3000 License Costs a signficant amount to save for a WISP? Absolutely, yes. $3000 would buy 1-2 Trango TLink45s, dependant on Promos. Remember most WISPs are still funded through cash flow. $3000 is a small fortune. This comment is with the premise that 24Ghz product would be sold for equal or less money than its 23Ghz licensed counterpart. Trango nor WISPs have any benefit to giving our hard earned money to the FCC and licensing consultants. Take note that based on current Trango prices, a $3000 savings is like a 25% savings of the total link. Many buyers have chosen Trango over their previous vendor Dragonwave for as little as a 10% savings. What would a WISP do to save 25%? 5) Note... Grant money will usually buy equipment not licenses.. Leasing companies will approve leases for Equipment, and rarely for licenses taht can't be reposessed. A WISP could buy more radios with grant/lease money, if they were not limited by cash flow constraints to buy licenses. 6) Are there any reasons 24Ghz might be favored over 23Ghz? Answer yes. The very nature of WISPs are to deploy fast. Licensing takes advanced planning and often adds 2 months to the process. I will say that 50% of the sales our company made to date were because we could get a link to the customer Sooner. We didn't need to plan, we just executed action. It is a convenience factor. 24Ghz offers A) The ability to STOCK inventory on hand, without knowing in advance where it will be used. B) The ability to immediately place orders, without waiting for Freq Coords. C) 23Ghz does not allow temporary install after Freq Coord and application stage, and are not legally allowed to be deployed until after the license is actually granted, and I beleive has an additional step (by FCC to determine channel availabilty) beyond the initial end user ordered Freq coord, before the FCC can grant the license. D) The ability to immediately go install. ONLY thing needing done before installing, is a quick 5 minute path calc, with large odds success will be reached. 7) Does 24Ghz scale? Answer is yes. 24Ghz will scale significantly higher than 23Ghz. Because 24Ghz is lower tx power (about 20 db lower), it will allow a much larger number of radios to be installed within a given region without interference. A 23Ghz licenses is not guaranteed to be
Re: [WISPA] Service vehicle
Sooner or later, someone will do a 1/2 ton diesel electric hybrid truck , and it should be able to do at least 40 mpg if they do it right. It looks like these guys might be the ones to do it. http://www.autoblog.com/2008/02/11/mahindra-appalachian-diesel-pickup-arrives-in-us-next-year-dies/ John Mark Nash wrote: I always thought of buying a hybrid... ...then putting it in the bed of my truck and hauling it around just to say that I take my hybrid everywhere I go... Mark Nash UnwiredWest 78 Centennial Loop Suite E Eugene, OR 97401 541-998- 541-998-5599 fax http://www.unwiredwest.com - Original Message - From: D. Ryan Spott rsp...@cspott.com To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2009 6:38 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Service vehicle Made me think of a license plate holder I saw on an SUV: Buy a hybrid, I need your gas! ryan D. Ryan Spott rsp...@cspott.com On Feb 10, 2009, at 6:33 PM, Travis Johnson wrote: If it makes you feel better, today we only got 8mpg while pulling our sno-cat (with a Duramax even) at 80mph down the freeway. ;) Travis Microserv Mark Nash wrote: LOL I was just thinking about revitalizing this thread as I was speeding across our valley here because one of our techs called in sick. Had 4 appointments to keep...about 120 miles to cover... ...and MY service truck is an F350/V10 - crew cab - full bed. ...I get 10 on a good day. :) Mark Nash UnwiredWest 78 Centennial Loop Suite E Eugene, OR 97401 541-998- 541-998-5599 fax http://www.unwiredwest.com - Original Message - From: Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181 o...@odessaoffice.com To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2009 8:44 AM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Service vehicle fyi, it's not a van... http://www.leasetrader.com/photos/actual98286/640x480/GMC-Envoy-XL-Sport-Utility.jpeg I wanted a red or blue one with a v8 (327 and those one's HAUL). Had to settle for a completely loaded white one though. Leather, DVD for the kids, heated seats and seat backs, blinkers on the mirrors, air ride suspension (this rig rides better than any car I've ever had) etc. It's also nearly a foot and a half longer than the standard version. So when you get one make sure you look for the one with the 3rd seat. http://shop.ebay.com/items/_W0QQ_dmptZMotorsQ5fCarQ5fTruckQ5fPartsQ5fAccessories?_nkw=gmc+envoy+xl_sacat=0_fromfsb=_trksid=m270.l1313_odkw=gmc+envoy_osacat=0 These are the same thing as the Chevy Trailblazer. The XUV version looks pretty interesting too. I ALMOST got one of them, didn't like the sales guy though so I walked out on the deal. http://www.familycar.com/RoadTests/GMC-XUV/Photos.htm They have some of those on ebay too: http://shop.ebay.com/items/__xuv?_trkparms=72%253A317%257C66%253A2%257C65%253A12%257C39%253A1_dmpt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories_trksid=p3286.c0.m14_pgn=2 laters, Marlon (509) 982-2181 (408) 907-6910 (Vonage)Consulting services 42846865 (icq)WISP Operator since 1999! o...@odessaoffice.com www.odessaoffice.com/wireless www.odessaoffice.com/marlon/cam - Original Message - From: Josh Luthman j...@imaginenetworksllc.com To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, February 04, 2009 11:13 AM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Service vehicle If we could get a van like that financed I would be in heaven - my main benefit is just as you said, everything stays warm. Steel and cold just do not mix. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 Those who don't understand UNIX are condemned to reinvent it, poorly. --- Henry Spencer On Wed, Feb 4, 2009 at 1:18 PM, Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181 o...@odessaoffice.com wrote: I just picked up an '04 GMC Envoy XL. It's the one with the 3rd seat. I'm only getting 16 to 17 mpg with it but it's cheap to insure and is totally loaded. It was just over $13k for a 50,000 mile rig with no real flaws. I did end up having to replace the radiator already, but that didn't show up at first. The ladder sits on top nicely and is easy to reach. Everything else sits well inside. As a bonus all of my tools etc. stay warm in the winter and cold in the summer. The 4 wheel drive has been really nice this winter too. Best of all? No one else drives around with a ladder on top of one. EVERYONE knows my rig. That alone is a nice sales too. Marlon (509) 982-2181 (408) 907-6910 (Vonage)Consulting services 42846865 (icq)WISP Operator since 1999! o...@odessaoffice.com www.odessaoffice.com/wireless www.odessaoffice.com/marlon/cam - Original Message - From: Josh Luthman j...@imaginenetworksllc.com To: WISPA General
