Re: [WSG] Embedding Flash
Johan's frontpage with the embedded Flash feature http://www.assetnow.com/anx/index.cfm/1,8,20,html works splendidly on my Safari 1.2.3 on Mac OS X3.4 Albert -- On Sep 21, 2004, at 1:31 AM, Johan Steenkamp wrote: I used the Satay method on this page which validates to XHTML Strict. Works in IE, FireFox, Netscape 7.2, Opera 7.x on Win - not sure about other OS. http://www.assetnow.com/anx/index.cfm/1,8,20,html Johan www.assetnow.com Original Message From: Ian Fenn [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Tue, Sep-21-2004 12:29 PM Subject: [WSG] Embedding Flash Hi, Can anyone recommend a way of embedding flash in a xhtml strict page? I've tried the flash javay and flash satay methods detailed at alistapart.com but they both seem to have issues, namely in some browsers nothing is displayed... not the flash... nor the back-up image? Is there are preferred and more reliable method around now? All the best, -- Ian ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ Proud presenters of Web Essentials 04 http://we04.com/ Web standards, accessibility, inspiration, knowledge To be held in Sydney, September 30 and October 1, 2004 See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ Proud presenters of Web Essentials 04 http://we04.com/ Web standards, accessibility, inspiration, knowledge To be held in Sydney, September 30 and October 1, 2004 See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ Proud presenters of Web Essentials 04 http://we04.com/ Web standards, accessibility, inspiration, knowledge To be held in Sydney, September 30 and October 1, 2004 See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Embedding Flash
My browser Safari 1.2.3 works just fine with Flash embed apparently in Satay context. I also had no trouble getting a live Flash with Macromedia default, Flash Satay, and Hixie as per Mark's chart/s. I must have a Mystical, Magical Mystery iMac (Summer 2000), OS X3.4 Albert On Sep 22, 2004, at 9:22 PM, Ian Fenn wrote: Hi Mark, A bit late maybe but I recently did some browser testing on this: http://markl.f2o.org/experiments/flashvars/ http://markl.f2o.org/experiments/FlashTransparent/ Many thanks! Your results look similar to mine. I've been testing for two days. Aargh! Unfortunately it seems the best solution is to use JavaScript to detect the existence (and correct version) of flash and then use document.write to deliver the appropriate object or embed. Only safari seems to have a problem. All the best, -- Ian ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ Proud presenters of Web Essentials 04 http://we04.com/ Web standards, accessibility, inspiration, knowledge To be held in Sydney, September 30 and October 1, 2004 See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ Proud presenters of Web Essentials 04 http://we04.com/ Web standards, accessibility, inspiration, knowledge To be held in Sydney, September 30 and October 1, 2004 See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] fixed background...
I haven't tried putting it in the body...I'll toy around with that. If that doesn't work, I'll test that javascript that Peter sent. Thanks. Anybody have some pointers as to why it's not doing it in FF? I'm sorry if I'm missing some basic list etiquette...am I supposed to post the code, or was the URL good enough (www.drzeus.net/redesign/cslewis) ? Thanks. ~john _ Dr. Zeus Web Development http://www.DrZeus.net content without clutter Parker Torrence wrote: On Tue, 28 Sep 2004 10:27:43 +0100, john [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Ladies and Gentlemen: I'm attempting my first fixed background, and I have one question and need one solution to a problem. question: is it supposed to work in IE? It only seems to work for me in IE, if it is the background of body Have you tried that yet? ~parker ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ Proud presenters of Web Essentials 04 http://we04.com/ Web standards, accessibility, inspiration, knowledge To be held in Sydney, September 30 and October 1, 2004 See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ Proud presenters of Web Essentials 04 http://we04.com/ Web standards, accessibility, inspiration, knowledge To be held in Sydney, September 30 and October 1, 2004 See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Embedding Flash
Ian Your site, House Doctor, is working well in its Flash features, both the moving hand in the clock (ad) and the pix-rotation portrait. I'm working my way up the backlog I've accumulated on this Flash Embed thread, so my sends may seem to arrive out of a time warp. Oh yeah, I'm on Safari 1.2.3 iMac OS X3.4; have noted James Ellis' article and flagged it, but have not yet detected what my version of Flash Player is. I think tho that it's not standalone but Macromedia-related. Albert - On Sep 23, 2004, at 6:55 AM, Ian Fenn wrote: I wrote: Unfortunately it seems the best solution is to use JavaScript to detect the existence (and correct version) of flash and then use document.write to deliver the appropriate object or embed. Only safari seems to have a problem. Actually it looks like I got that wrong. Safari is working now. According to browsercam, both Opera 6.0 (Macintosh) and Mozilla 1.6 (Win XP) display a large white space where the movie should be. Netscape 7.0 (Windows 2000) displays nothing at all. You can see the results here: http://www.browsercam.com/public.aspx?proj_id=99668 However, I've installed Mozilla 1.6 and Netscape 7.0 here (Windows XP) and the page displays properly. Can anyone check these for me? The url is http://www.housedoctor.co.uk/ All the best, -- Ian ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ Proud presenters of Web Essentials 04 http://we04.com/ Web standards, accessibility, inspiration, knowledge To be held in Sydney, September 30 and October 1, 2004 See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ Proud presenters of Web Essentials 04 http://we04.com/ Web standards, accessibility, inspiration, knowledge To be held in Sydney, September 30 and October 1, 2004 See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Embedding Flash
Rimantas - I'm hoping that, along with classitis and divitis, you are not also excluding gedraitis. Yrs, Albert -- On Sep 23, 2004, at 8:26 PM, Rimantas Liubertas wrote: And yes, validation beauty is only skin deep. I will strongly prefer clean (content separated from presentation, markup is semantic, all is accessible) code with no !DOCTYPE to valid but bloated, table-ridden page suffering from classitis and divitis. ... Using Flash you can still provide alternative content for those who cannot see it. Why not to use this possibility? Regards, Rimantas ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ Proud presenters of Web Essentials 04 http://we04.com/ Web standards, accessibility, inspiration, knowledge To be held in Sydney, September 30 and October 1, 2004 See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] fixed background...
Boy, do I feel sheepish. I get all caught up in ID's and side panels and what not...and the answer is as simple as...well...it's simple. A BODY background. Just a BODY background. (memo to myself...Keep It Simple Stupid). Thanks for not laughing... ;) ~john _ Dr. Zeus Web Development http://www.DrZeus.net content without clutter john wrote: I haven't tried putting it in the body...I'll toy around with that. If that doesn't work, I'll test that javascript that Peter sent. Thanks. ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ Proud presenters of Web Essentials 04 http://we04.com/ Web standards, accessibility, inspiration, knowledge To be held in Sydney, September 30 and October 1, 2004 See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
[WSG] Web Site Structure Suggestions, Second Post!
To the many members of WSG: This is my second post on this same subject, and I'm hoping that this time I'll be able to get a response. :-) I have built up a design in Photoshop, which you can view here or here. I'm looking to get help on how I should write up the structure for the site, as I'm a bit confused about the best way to attack it. So far, this is what I have. !DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD XHTML 1.0 Transitional//EN" "http://www.w3.org/TR/xhtml1/DTD/xhtml1-transitional.dtd" html xmlns="http://www.w3.org/1999/xhtml" head titleJezzJournal *new*/title meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8" / /head body div id="container" div id="header" h1 id="header-text"JezzJournal/h1 /div div id="sidebar" sidebar links. /div div id="navigation" links. /div div id="content" all sorts of content here /div /div /body /html What do you think? Would what I have be best for what I'm trying to accomplish? -- Jeremy S. Author of JezzJournal Co-Founder of Effuse inline: getfirefox.gif
Re: [WSG] Web Site Structure Suggestions, Second Post!
you forgot the charset: meta http-equiv=Content-type content=text/html; charset=iso-8859-1 / otherwise looks fine Neerav Bhatt http://www.bhatt.id.au Web Development IT consultancy Mobile: +61 (0)403 8000 27 http://www.bhatt.id.au/blog/ - Ramblings Thoughts http://www.bookcrossing.com/mybookshelf/neerav Jeremy S. (WSG) wrote: To the many members of WSG: This is my second post on this same subject, and I'm hoping that this time I'll be able to get a response. :-) I have built up a design in Photoshop, which you can view here http://www.effuse.org/forum/viewtopic.php?p=462#462 or here http://www.affectus.net/images/temp/design5.jpg. I'm looking to get help on how I should write up the structure for the site, as I'm a bit confused about the best way to attack it. So far, this is what I have. !DOCTYPE html PUBLIC -//W3C//DTD XHTML 1.0 Transitional//EN http://www.w3.org/TR/xhtml1/DTD/xhtml1-transitional.dtd; http://www.w3.org/TR/xhtml1/DTD/xhtml1-transitional.dtd html xmlns=http://www.w3.org/1999/xhtml; http://www.w3.org/1999/xhtml head titleJezzJournal *new*/title meta http-equiv=Content-Type content=text/html; / /head body div id=container div id=header h1 id=header-textJezzJournal/h1 /div div id=sidebar sidebar links. /div div id=navigation links. /div div id=content all sorts of content here /div /div /body /html What do you think? Would what I have be best for what I'm trying to accomplish? -- *Jeremy S.* Author of JezzJournal http://jezzjournal.com Co-Founder of Effuse http://effuse.org Get Firefox! http://www.spreadfirefox.com/?q=affiliatesid=3740t=65 ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ Proud presenters of Web Essentials 04 http://we04.com/ Web standards, accessibility, inspiration, knowledge To be held in Sydney, September 30 and October 1, 2004 See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
[WSG] Unwanted extra space
I'm just started working on my third table-free website and I'm trying to pay attention to standards but I'm stumped by a couple of spacing details and would appreciate some help. See www.zebragraphics.co.uk/ragamuffin. CSS is at www.zebragraphics.co.uk/ragamuffin/styles/main.css First, I have extra space above and below the banner image - I just want 10px space, same as at the sides. Second, I've added a 15px top margin to the content div to get some space between the navigation and first heading, but IE6 Windows seems to add more. I know, it's Windows, but why this is happening? Last, IE5.3 Mac adds some white space below the footer, ie between the footer background colour and the container div border. That's it for now except for a very important disclaimer: I did NOT choose the name for this company! :-) Many thanks, Mary ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ Proud presenters of Web Essentials 04 http://we04.com/ Web standards, accessibility, inspiration, knowledge To be held in Sydney, September 30 and October 1, 2004 See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
[WSG] IE problem with CSS tabs
Hello, Group. I have a curious problem. I am creating this site with CSS tabs, and making it so that the tab is on while visiting that page. Well, it works in Firefox just fine, but in IE it's not...when on the server. When viewing it on the local drive, it looks good. http://www.drzeus.net/redesign/cslewis/ Thanks! -- ~john _ Dr. Zeus Web Development http://www.DrZeus.net content without clutter ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ Proud presenters of Web Essentials 04 http://we04.com/ Web standards, accessibility, inspiration, knowledge To be held in Sydney, September 30 and October 1, 2004 See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
RE: [WSG] Unwanted extra space
G'day First, I have extra space above and below the banner image - I just want 10px space, The banner image sits inside a paragraph. Paragraphs have margins, unless you set them to zero in your css. Easiest fix is to lose the paragraph - the image can go directly in the div. Second, I've added a 15px top margin to the content div to get some space between the navigation and first heading, but IE6 Windows seems to add more. I see more in Firefox as well. Approximately 28 pixels. Check margins and padding on the navcontainer and navlist. Can't help you with Mac issues but maybe it's a similar issue. One thing that can help in finding these problems is to put a (light) background on each div and see whether the space is inside or outside the div. Hope this helps -- Bert Doorn, Web Developer Better Web Design www.bwdzine.com Fast-loading, user-friendly websites ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ Proud presenters of Web Essentials 04 http://we04.com/ Web standards, accessibility, inspiration, knowledge To be held in Sydney, September 30 and October 1, 2004 See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Unwanted extra space
Thats a bug of IE.
I use to apply this css hack to fix some bugs of IE
Ex.
div#nameofyourdiv
{
here... put the propreties that ALL the other browsers recognizes..
}
* html body div#nameofyourdiv
{
put here the properties that only IE will recognize.
}
Genau Lopes Júnior
WebDesigner
¬¬¬
http://www.meucarronovo.com.br
- Original Message -
From: Bert [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2004 10:12 AM
Subject: RE: [WSG] Unwanted extra space
G'day
First, I have extra space above and below the banner image - I just want
10px space,
The banner image sits inside a paragraph. Paragraphs have margins, unless
you set them to zero in your css. Easiest fix is to lose the paragraph - the
image can go directly in the div.
Second, I've added a 15px top margin to the content div to get
some space between the navigation and first heading, but IE6
Windows seems to add more.
I see more in Firefox as well. Approximately 28 pixels. Check margins and
padding on the navcontainer and navlist.
Can't help you with Mac issues but maybe it's a similar issue.
One thing that can help in finding these problems is to put a (light)
background on each div and see whether the space is inside or outside the
div.
Hope this helps
--
Bert Doorn, Web Developer
Better Web Design
www.bwdzine.com
Fast-loading, user-friendly websites
**
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See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
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**
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See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
for some hints on posting to the list getting help
**
RE: [WSG] Unwanted extra space
Title: RE: [WSG] Unwanted extra space Hi Mary You have a padding of 10px in the banner div. Also Padding 10px in the navcontainer div. Try altering the padding rule for the navcontainer to: padding: 0 10px; if this doesn't shrink the whitespace enough, try the same rule in the banner div as well. A little trick to help iron out these problems is to apply a single pixel solid border rule around the offending divs using a contrast colour to the main design. If each div has a separate colour code it is easy to see where the offending whitespace is coming from. Once you are happy that you have the issues solved, then remove the borders (you can also even use small margins which can help just to pull everything out a little). Try applying this technique to some old style table based layouts by adding a border attribute to all tables ... its very effective in demonstrating the advantages of css-p over table based layouts to clients. I haven't tried it on your design but the IE interpretation of the box model could be the culprit of the 15px top margin problem. Try the Tantek Box Model Hack to fix the problem. There is a 'be kind to opera rule' which should follow this in the style sheet just to keep Opera happy. I haven't found the answer for the whitespace below the footer yet but I'll let you know when I do because its yet to be solved on my current project. HTH Peter -Original Message- From: Mary Wright [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: 29 September 2004 13:28 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [WSG] Unwanted extra space I'm just started working on my third table-free website and I'm trying to pay attention to standards but I'm stumped by a couple of spacing details and would appreciate some help. See www.zebragraphics.co.uk/ragamuffin. CSS is at www.zebragraphics.co.uk/ragamuffin/styles/main.css First, I have extra space above and below the banner image - I just want 10px space, same as at the sides. Second, I've added a 15px top margin to the content div to get some space between the navigation and first heading, but IE6 Windows seems to add more. I know, it's Windows, but why this is happening? Last, IE5.3 Mac adds some white space below the footer, ie between the footer background colour and the container div border. That's it for now except for a very important disclaimer: I did NOT choose the name for this company! :-) Many thanks, Mary ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ Proud presenters of Web Essentials 04 http://we04.com/ Web standards, accessibility, inspiration, knowledge To be held in Sydney, September 30 and October 1, 2004 See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
[WSG] Slicing With Photoshop
Hi, I have some questions about slicing in photoshop. First of all, I noticed that when I slice and save it with the css settings instead of tables, photoshop uses the x and the y axis thingy to put the layout in order which means everyhting cannot move ... I wanted to know how to center the layout if it was not a whole page...? Second, I want to know what the default layout settings, the width is. I sometimes try 800*600 but I hate it because it is too small and wanted to know what the default if for people with 1024*768 or whatever it is... Thanks Olajide Olaolorun -- Personal: www.olajideolaolorun.com www.empirex.net Business: www.tripleolabs.com www.tripleostudios.com Projects: www.uniformserver.com ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ Proud presenters of Web Essentials 04 http://we04.com/ Web standards, accessibility, inspiration, knowledge To be held in Sydney, September 30 and October 1, 2004 See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Slicing With Photoshop
To move your sliced images to another place on the page, place all the stuff ImageReady (Photoshop) generates inside another div !-- generated slices here --/div, give the enclosing division position: relative and control its position on the page as you wish. I don't understand your question about default layout settings. If you're asking how wide to make your total image before you slice it, you would be better off using 800x600 since statistics indicate that more people use that setting than the higher ones. However, it depends on your audience. It may be that most of the people who view your site will use a higher setting on their screen and you can get away with creating a larger graphic. Olajide Olaolorun wrote: Hi, I have some questions about slicing in photoshop. First of all, I noticed that when I slice and save it with the css settings instead of tables, photoshop uses the x and the y axis thingy to put the layout in order which means everyhting cannot move ... I wanted to know how to center the layout if it was not a whole page...? Second, I want to know what the default layout settings, the width is. I sometimes try 800*600 but I hate it because it is too small and wanted to know what the default if for people with 1024*768 or whatever it is... Thanks Olajide Olaolorun ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ Proud presenters of Web Essentials 04 http://we04.com/ Web standards, accessibility, inspiration, knowledge To be held in Sydney, September 30 and October 1, 2004 See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
[WSG] Are empty divs okay?
I am working on my second CSS XHTML site.
Home page thus far: http://sonze.com/lange/index.html
CSS for the page: http://sonze.com/lange/css/master.css
I have some empty div tags to be able to make a graphic a background
image since this presentation is common to all pages.
For example in my html:
div id=header3/div
My CSS for header3 is as follows:
#header3
{
position: relative;
width: 836px;
height: 37px;
margin: 0 auto;
padding: 0px;
background: #2A331F url(../img/header3.gif) no-repeat;
}
Since I this is only my second site using Web Standards, I'm unsure if
leaving a div tag empty is okay or not. Or is there another method I
should be using?
Thank you very much,
Shane Helm
**
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Web standards, accessibility, inspiration, knowledge
To be held in Sydney, September 30 and October 1, 2004
See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
for some hints on posting to the list getting help
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[WSG] Preventing flash of unstyled content
Hello everyone, Does anybody know how to prevent the flash of (CSS)unstyled content that appears when a page is loading and the browser is yet to download and apply the stylesheet to the web page? I know I read about a technique for preventing this somewhere (maybe o on this list) but I can't remember. So can someone point me in the right direction? Thanks David ___ Do you Yahoo!? Declare Yourself - Register online to vote today! http://vote.yahoo.com ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ Proud presenters of Web Essentials 04 http://we04.com/ Web standards, accessibility, inspiration, knowledge To be held in Sydney, September 30 and October 1, 2004 See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Are empty divs okay?
Hi Shane,
Well, I don't know if it is okay but I've done it on more than one occasion.
I have noticed that Internet explorer puts a nasty margin on empty divs,
that might be something to watch out for.
J
Shane Helm wrote:
I am working on my second CSS XHTML site.
Home page thus far: http://sonze.com/lange/index.html
CSS for the page: http://sonze.com/lange/css/master.css
I have some empty div tags to be able to make a graphic a background
image since this presentation is common to all pages.
For example in my html:
div id=header3/div
My CSS for header3 is as follows:
#header3
{
position: relative;
width: 836px;
height: 37px;
margin: 0 auto;
padding: 0px;
background: #2A331F url(../img/header3.gif) no-repeat;
}
Since I this is only my second site using Web Standards, I'm unsure if
leaving a div tag empty is okay or not. Or is there another method I
should be using?
Thank you very much,
Shane Helm
**
The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/
Proud presenters of Web Essentials 04 http://we04.com/
Web standards, accessibility, inspiration, knowledge
To be held in Sydney, September 30 and October 1, 2004
See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
for some hints on posting to the list getting help
**
**
The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/
Proud presenters of Web Essentials 04 http://we04.com/
Web standards, accessibility, inspiration, knowledge
To be held in Sydney, September 30 and October 1, 2004
See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
for some hints on posting to the list getting help
**
Re: [WSG] Are empty divs okay?
Thanks John.
Is there anyway to avoid the IE nasty margin. Should I put something
in the div to avoid it? Would nbsp or a transparent gif or something
help? How have you avoided the problem?
Thanks for your time,
Shane
On Sep 29, 2004, at 12:55 PM, John Oxton wrote:
Hi Shane,
Well, I don't know if it is okay but I've done it on more than one
occasion.
I have noticed that Internet explorer puts a nasty margin on empty
divs, that might be something to watch out for.
J
Shane Helm wrote:
I am working on my second CSS XHTML site.
Home page thus far: http://sonze.com/lange/index.html
CSS for the page: http://sonze.com/lange/css/master.css
I have some empty div tags to be able to make a graphic a background
image since this presentation is common to all pages.
For example in my html:
div id=header3/div
My CSS for header3 is as follows:
#header3
{
position: relative;
width: 836px;
height: 37px;
margin: 0 auto;
padding: 0px;
background: #2A331F url(../img/header3.gif) no-repeat;
}
Since I this is only my second site using Web Standards, I'm unsure
if leaving a div tag empty is okay or not. Or is there another
method I should be using?
Thank you very much,
Shane Helm
**
The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/
Proud presenters of Web Essentials 04 http://we04.com/
Web standards, accessibility, inspiration, knowledge
To be held in Sydney, September 30 and October 1, 2004
See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
for some hints on posting to the list getting help
**
**
The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/
Proud presenters of Web Essentials 04 http://we04.com/
Web standards, accessibility, inspiration, knowledge
To be held in Sydney, September 30 and October 1, 2004
See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
for some hints on posting to the list getting help
**
**
The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/
Proud presenters of Web Essentials 04 http://we04.com/
Web standards, accessibility, inspiration, knowledge
To be held in Sydney, September 30 and October 1, 2004
See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
for some hints on posting to the list getting help
**
Re: [WSG] Preventing flash of unstyled content
knowing the name of the problem is half-way to finding a solution already... http://www.google.com/search?q=%22flash+of+unstyled+content%22 Patrick David wrote: Hello everyone, Does anybody know how to prevent the flash of (CSS)unstyled content that appears when a page is loading and the browser is yet to download and apply the stylesheet to the web page? I know I read about a technique for preventing this somewhere (maybe o on this list) but I can't remember. So can someone point me in the right direction? Thanks David ___ Do you Yahoo!? Declare Yourself - Register online to vote today! http://vote.yahoo.com ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ Proud presenters of Web Essentials 04 http://we04.com/ Web standards, accessibility, inspiration, knowledge To be held in Sydney, September 30 and October 1, 2004 See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** -- _ re·dux (adj.): brought back; returned. used postpositively [latin : re-, re- + dux, leader; see duke.] www.splintered.co.uk | www.photographia.co.uk http://redux.deviantart.com ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ Proud presenters of Web Essentials 04 http://we04.com/ Web standards, accessibility, inspiration, knowledge To be held in Sydney, September 30 and October 1, 2004 See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Are empty divs okay?
At 11:35 AM 9/29/2004, Shane Helm wrote:
I have some empty div tags to be able to make a graphic a background image
since this presentation is common to all pages.
For example in my html:
div id=header3/div
My CSS for header3 is as follows:
#header3
{
position: relative;
width: 836px;
height: 37px;
margin: 0 auto;
padding: 0px;
background: #2A331F url(../img/header3.gif) no-repeat;
}
Since I this is only my second site using Web Standards, I'm unsure if
leaving a div tag empty is okay or not. Or is there another method I
should be using?
Shane,
Consider using h1-h6 for headlines on your page. Semantically they mean
headings while a div is merely an anonymous division. Your page should
make sense when your stylesheet is missing. If you view your page without
CSS or images, does it lose meaning without the headline showing? If so,
here's an alternative way to mark that up:
h3spanFrog Doggies/span/h3
h3
{
background: ...;
}
h3 span
{
display: none;
}
If CSS is enabled, the image displays and the text is suppressed.
If CSS isn't enabled, the text displays but not the image.
Where this image replacement solution fails is in user agents in which
CSS is enabled but images are suppressed.
Paul
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Web standards, accessibility, inspiration, knowledge
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See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
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Re: [WSG] Preventing flash of unstyled content
http://www.bluerobot.com/web/css/fouc.asp David wrote: Does anybody know how to prevent the flash of (CSS)unstyled content that appears when a page is loading and the browser is yet to download and apply the stylesheet to the web page? ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ Proud presenters of Web Essentials 04 http://we04.com/ Web standards, accessibility, inspiration, knowledge To be held in Sydney, September 30 and October 1, 2004 See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
[WSG] best way to format Skip Nav link
Hi there group of gurus and list lurkers. What's the best way to fomat a skip navigation link at the top of a page so it doesn't appear in modern/styled browsers, but is still accessible to small-screen / mobile platforms and reduced-ability environments (screen readers and the like)? I've seen different approaches, but am getting confused by the details I pick up here and there. display:none; visibility: hide; height:1px; width:1px; position:absolue; top: -20px left:0; Thanks in advance for your input. -- Brian Duchek =-=-=-=-=-=-=-= e: [EMAIL PROTECTED] c: 847.809.2140 w: www.inquiline.com =-=-=-=-=-=-=-= ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ Proud presenters of Web Essentials 04 http://we04.com/ Web standards, accessibility, inspiration, knowledge To be held in Sydney, September 30 and October 1, 2004 See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
RE: [WSG] best way to format Skip Nav link
hi on a side note, I was in an accessibility seminar and they suggested using the term skip to main content because it sounds the best when vocalized by a screen reader. Ted -Original Message- From: Brian Duchek [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2004 2:11 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [WSG] best way to format Skip Nav link Hi there group of gurus and list lurkers. What's the best way to fomat a skip navigation link at the top of a page so it doesn't appear in modern/styled browsers, but is still accessible to small-screen / mobile platforms and reduced-ability environments (screen readers and the like)? I've seen different approaches, but am getting confused by the details I pick up here and there. display:none; visibility: hide; height:1px; width:1px; position:absolue; top: -20px left:0; Thanks in advance for your input. -- Brian Duchek =-=-=-=-=-=-=-= e: [EMAIL PROTECTED] c: 847.809.2140 w: www.inquiline.com =-=-=-=-=-=-=-= ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ Proud presenters of Web Essentials 04 http://we04.com/ Web standards, accessibility, inspiration, knowledge To be held in Sydney, September 30 and October 1, 2004 See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ Proud presenters of Web Essentials 04 http://we04.com/ Web standards, accessibility, inspiration, knowledge To be held in Sydney, September 30 and October 1, 2004 See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Web Site Structure Suggestions, Second Post!
personally i wouldnt use the H1 for your jezzjournal i would call that something else like logo div or whatever and use the H1 for the title of the post so that the h1 is not the same on every page. Otherwise you have set it up almost exactly the way i would do it... jackie ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ Proud presenters of Web Essentials 04 http://we04.com/ Web standards, accessibility, inspiration, knowledge To be held in Sydney, September 30 and October 1, 2004 See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
[WSG] PNGs and IE windows
Could someone please explain what I can and can't do with a PNG image in IE Windows? I have a logo with a soft drop shadow that works everywhere except IE Win. In IE, there is a gray box that where the transparency should be. So I tried one with a solid drop shadow and the transparent part of the PNG still shows gray. I've read that I can't use alpha transparencies with IE, but I'm not sure how IE defines alpha transparencies. Any help will be appreciated. Thanks to this list, I've had three or four questions answered without ever asking, in the four days I've been a part. I only wish I felt more able to answer some questions myself... Wayne Godfrey ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ Proud presenters of Web Essentials 04 http://we04.com/ Web standards, accessibility, inspiration, knowledge To be held in Sydney, September 30 and October 1, 2004 See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
RE: [WSG] Web Site Structure Suggestions, Second Post!
I like to use the H1 for image replacement and change the h1 tag for search engine optimized words that are still appropriate for those with the style sheet turned off. So, I agree with the first setup. Ted -Original Message- From: Jackie Reid [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2004 3:16 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [WSG] Web Site Structure Suggestions, Second Post! personally i wouldnt use the H1 for your jezzjournal i would call that something else like logo div or whatever and use the H1 for the title of the post so that the h1 is not the same on every page. Otherwise you have set it up almost exactly the way i would do it... jackie ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ Proud presenters of Web Essentials 04 http://we04.com/ Web standards, accessibility, inspiration, knowledge To be held in Sydney, September 30 and October 1, 2004 See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ Proud presenters of Web Essentials 04 http://we04.com/ Web standards, accessibility, inspiration, knowledge To be held in Sydney, September 30 and October 1, 2004 See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] best way to format Skip Nav link
Brian What's the best way to fomat a skip navigation link at the top of a Brian page so it doesn't appear in modern/styled browsers, but is still Brian accessible to small-screen / mobile platforms and reduced-ability Brian environments (screen readers and the like)? Hi Brian Another way of thinking about it is that it *should* be visible to everyone, including those with modern browsers. For eaxmple, someone might be: - perfectly sighted - using ther latest version of IE/Mozilla - mobility impaired and unable to use a mouse They would use the keyboard to navigate around a site. I'm sure they would appreciate a visible skip to content link to save them tabbing through the navigation on each page. My take is that the visible skip link really isn't incorporated much into designs. I imagine mainly due to ignorance and/or a belief that such things look ugly. I'm hopeful that soon they will be incorporated into designs in, of course, the most tasteful way :) Bottom line, if you can add it to the design, it's a good thing to do. Regards Mike Brown SIGNIFY LTD :: the logic behind ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ Proud presenters of Web Essentials 04 http://we04.com/ Web standards, accessibility, inspiration, knowledge To be held in Sydney, September 30 and October 1, 2004 See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Are empty divs okay?
Thanks Paul.
I haven't defined my h1-h6 styles yet just because I haven't gotten
that far yet, but I will. I can change my header3 id to something
more semantic. I currently was just using it to define a background
image that needs no image replacement because it is not an actual text
header, but it is part of the interface design. Maybe I should title
it something more like interface3.
Therefore my question still exists:
For example in my html:
div id=interface3/div
My CSS for interface3 would be as follows:
#interface3
{
position: relative;
width: 836px;
height: 37px;
margin: 0 auto;
padding: 0px;
background: #2A331F url(../img/header3.gif) no-repeat;
}
If I use this, is it okay to leave the div empty as in div
id=background3/div or should I fill the div with something that
the user will never see even if CSS is enabled or not. Make sense?
John Oxten mentioned that this may cause a nasty margin in IE. Can
this be avoided and what is the proper way or is it fine to leave it
empty? Does a non-breaking space make a difference with the IE
problem?
My reference files for the question keeping in mind that header3
would be changed to something more semantic like interface3:
Home page thus far: http://sonze.com/lange/index.html
CSS for the page: http://sonze.com/lange/css/master.css
Thanks again guys,
Shane
My basic question is, Is it okay to leave a div empty in order just to
show a background image?
On Sep 29, 2004, at 1:13 PM, Paul Novitski wrote:
At 11:35 AM 9/29/2004, Shane Helm wrote:
I have some empty div tags to be able to make a graphic a background
image since this presentation is common to all pages.
For example in my html:
div id=header3/div
My CSS for header3 is as follows:
#header3
{
position: relative;
width: 836px;
height: 37px;
margin: 0 auto;
padding: 0px;
background: #2A331F url(../img/header3.gif) no-repeat;
}
Since I this is only my second site using Web Standards, I'm unsure
if leaving a div tag empty is okay or not. Or is there another
method I should be using?
Shane,
Consider using h1-h6 for headlines on your page. Semantically they
mean headings while a div is merely an anonymous division. Your
page should make sense when your stylesheet is missing. If you view
your page without CSS or images, does it lose meaning without the
headline showing? If so, here's an alternative way to mark that up:
h3spanFrog Doggies/span/h3
h3
{
background: ...;
}
h3 span
{
display: none;
}
If CSS is enabled, the image displays and the text is suppressed.
If CSS isn't enabled, the text displays but not the image.
Where this image replacement solution fails is in user agents in
which CSS is enabled but images are suppressed.
Paul
**
The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/
Proud presenters of Web Essentials 04 http://we04.com/
Web standards, accessibility, inspiration, knowledge
To be held in Sydney, September 30 and October 1, 2004
See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
for some hints on posting to the list getting help
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The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/
Proud presenters of Web Essentials 04 http://we04.com/
Web standards, accessibility, inspiration, knowledge
To be held in Sydney, September 30 and October 1, 2004
See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
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**
Re: [WSG] PNGs and IE windows
My understanding is that while IE Win supports the display of PNG files, it doesn't support any of their transparency features. If you want to use transparency for images in a cross-browser safe way, GIF is really your only option. I wouldn't be holding my breath for IE to catch up either ... Cheers, Kevin Futter On 30/9/04 8:48 AM, Wayne Godfrey [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Could someone please explain what I can and can't do with a PNG image in IE Windows? I have a logo with a soft drop shadow that works everywhere except IE Win. In IE, there is a gray box that where the transparency should be. So I tried one with a solid drop shadow and the transparent part of the PNG still shows gray. I've read that I can't use alpha transparencies with IE, but I'm not sure how IE defines alpha transparencies. Any help will be appreciated. Thanks to this list, I've had three or four questions answered without ever asking, in the four days I've been a part. I only wish I felt more able to answer some questions myself... Wayne Godfrey ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ Proud presenters of Web Essentials 04 http://we04.com/ Web standards, accessibility, inspiration, knowledge To be held in Sydney, September 30 and October 1, 2004 See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ Proud presenters of Web Essentials 04 http://we04.com/ Web standards, accessibility, inspiration, knowledge To be held in Sydney, September 30 and October 1, 2004 See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
[WSG] Yahoo CSS'ing
http://9rules.com/whitespace/css_redesigns/yahoo_css_redesign.php ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ Proud presenters of Web Essentials 04 http://we04.com/ Web standards, accessibility, inspiration, knowledge To be held in Sydney, September 30 and October 1, 2004 See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
[WSG] print style sheet question
Is there a way to make a check box and radio button print with an empty box instead of
a filled, black box?
Here's a page with an example:
http://v4.csatravelprotection.com/csa/packinglist.do
I tried adding this to the print style sheet
checkbox {background-color:#fff !important;}
but it didn't seem to help.
Thanks
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Web standards, accessibility, inspiration, knowledge
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See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
for some hints on posting to the list getting help
**
Re: [WSG] AOHell
On 9/28/04 7:08 PM Ryan Christie [EMAIL PROTECTED] sent this out: AOL browser is uses the IE engine, does it not? Yes. Most home users using Windows would still be using the IE driven version of the AOL browser (not sure about Mac). One thing worth considering when developing for AOL is the way it handles images. Over slower connections AOL will convert the JPG format into the more compressed ART file format for faster download speeds. IE by itself doesn't do this, of course. So, it's not enough just to say just test in IE, since it's rendering engine is IE, which I once thought. That approach comes with a caveat. You have to actually test on an AOL account to really see any affect of this (or any other) behavior (versus just running a local AOL browser, which I did for years). For the type of sites most members of the list are building (XHTML/CSS with optimized imagery, etc.), I doubt it's much different. But every time I visit my mother-in-law (she 60), and I want to sneak away and check the golf scores, Dominey's Flash-based jpg import at the top of pga.com/openchampionship/2003/ or /2004 doesn't render. Never has. But I still get the scores (which are good ol' html). -Tim ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ Proud presenters of Web Essentials 04 http://we04.com/ Web standards, accessibility, inspiration, knowledge To be held in Sydney, September 30 and October 1, 2004 See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] PNGs and IE windows
Kevin Futter wrote: My understanding is that while IE Win supports the display of PNG files, it doesn't support any of their transparency features. If you want to use transparency for images in a cross-browser safe way, GIF is really your only option. I wouldn't be holding my breath for IE to catch up either ... PNG-8 works fine (1 bit transparency, like GIF) in IE. It's PNG-24 (8 bit transparency) that IE struggles to understand, but there are tricks that can be used http://www.alistapart.com/articles/pngopacity/ Depending on your needs, you can also just use a PNG-8 and then replace it with a PNG-24 in capable browsers (either via javascript or purely via CSS, e.g. http://www.splintered.co.uk/experiments/19/ ) Patrick _ re·dux (adj.): brought back; returned. used postpositively [latin : re-, re- + dux, leader; see duke.] www.splintered.co.uk | www.photographia.co.uk http://redux.deviantart.com ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ Proud presenters of Web Essentials 04 http://we04.com/ Web standards, accessibility, inspiration, knowledge To be held in Sydney, September 30 and October 1, 2004 See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
RE: [WSG] gBrowser from Google
WaSP reckons its unlikely, or the product of hallucinogenic substances: http://www.webstandards.org/buzz/archive/2004_09.html#a000446 8P David -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Greer, Ben Sent: Wednesday, 29 September 2004 11:24 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: [WSG] gBrowser from Google There's also the rumour of the google browser bug that was in Bugzilla (but then was made private and no longer appears): http://www.deftone.com/blogzilla/archives/google_browser.html -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Jason Turnbull Sent: Wednesday, 29 September 2004 8:03 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: [WSG] gBrowser from Google [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I was recently told by a friend that there is talk of a browser to be released soon by Google called gBrowser I have googled for any news on it, and what support for standards it may have, but haven't really heard much.. Its been reported they have hired 4 IE developers http://www.masternewmedia.org/news/2004/09/22/google_browser_c oming.htm And the fact that Mozilla Developer Day was held at Google has people speculating what they have planned http://www.kottke.org/04/08/the-google-browser Regards Jason ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ Proud presenters of Web Essentials 04 http://we04.com/ Web standards, accessibility, inspiration, knowledge To be held in Sydney, September 30 and October 1, 2004 See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** This message is intended for the addressee named and may contain privileged information or confidential information or both. If you are not the intended recipient please delete it and notify the sender. ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ Proud presenters of Web Essentials 04 http://we04.com/ Web standards, accessibility, inspiration, knowledge To be held in Sydney, September 30 and October 1, 2004 See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ Proud presenters of Web Essentials 04 http://we04.com/ Web standards, accessibility, inspiration, knowledge To be held in Sydney, September 30 and October 1, 2004 See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Safari problem and fieldset
On my Safari 1.2.3, I see no problem. A good frontpage, but didn't delve deeper. Regards, Albert -- Imagination is more important than knowledge. - Einstein - On Sep 27, 2004, at 11:54 AM, Kim Kruse wrote: Hi, On this page http://www.mouseriders.dk/kontakt.php (and the other forms in the section) I have a problem with the form fields being pushed down in the field set. It seems that the side img below the sidenav is causing the problem. I don't see anything in the sideimg rule that might cause this... do you? Kind regards Kim ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ Proud presenters of Web Essentials 04 http://we04.com/ Web standards, accessibility, inspiration, knowledge To be held in Sydney, September 30 and October 1, 2004 See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help * ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ Proud presenters of Web Essentials 04 http://we04.com/ Web standards, accessibility, inspiration, knowledge To be held in Sydney, September 30 and October 1, 2004 See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Yahoo CSS'ing
Nick Lo wrote: http://9rules.com/whitespace/css_redesigns/yahoo_css_redesign.php Good writeup- but I must say yahoo has done a horid job so far. HTML Errors: 223 The css validates, but it is horrid. in 2 days, how could one ever remember what #v or where#v #v4.h appears in the document? IMO, they need to get some developers in there who actually know what they're doing. ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ Proud presenters of Web Essentials 04 http://we04.com/ Web standards, accessibility, inspiration, knowledge To be held in Sydney, September 30 and October 1, 2004 See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Slicing With Photoshop
Second, I want to know what the default layout settings, the width is. I sometimes try 800*600 but I hate it because it is too small and wanted to know what the default if for people with 1024*768 or whatever it is... I'm assuming you are asking what the best default monitor resolution you are going to lay-out your webpage for. If you look at rought stats: http://www.w3schools.com/browsers/browsers_stats.asp It shows that aroung 1/3 of browsers have are using 800x600. And roughly 4/5 have either 1024x768 or 800x600. If you want a lay-out that looks ok with almost everybody, try making an 800x600 layout that can adapt to 1024x768. - regnard mail2web - Check your email from the web at http://mail2web.com/ . ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ Proud presenters of Web Essentials 04 http://we04.com/ Web standards, accessibility, inspiration, knowledge To be held in Sydney, September 30 and October 1, 2004 See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] AOHell
Tim Shortt wrote: You have to actually test on an AOL account to really see any affect of this (or any other) behavior (versus just running a local AOL browser, which I did for years). If you're really, really committed (or just masochistic) to testing it, but want to avoid having to actually get an AOL account, you can also run your own server http://www.aolserver.com/ and do testing on your local setup under true battle conditions...either that, or you have an secret desire to delve into Tcl development ;) Patrick _ re·dux (adj.): brought back; returned. used postpositively [latin : re-, re- + dux, leader; see duke.] www.splintered.co.uk | www.photographia.co.uk http://redux.deviantart.com ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ Proud presenters of Web Essentials 04 http://we04.com/ Web standards, accessibility, inspiration, knowledge To be held in Sydney, September 30 and October 1, 2004 See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Yahoo CSS'ing
Brian Cummiskey wrote: Good writeup- but I must say yahoo has done a horid job so far. HTML Errors: 223 The css validates, but it is horrid. in 2 days, how could one ever remember what #v or where#v #v4.h appears in the document? IMO, they need to get some developers in there who actually know what they're doing. I think you're missing the point...agreed the code is well shoddy, but, as Scrivs says, this is a major step forward for the web. If the best/most popular site on the web is tableless and moving towards complete web standards, then it becomes very easy for us to sell tableless/web standards to our clients: Client: Why should I use web standards on my site? Us: Well - yahoo.com is built that way. Its one of the most visited sites on the web. Surely they know what they're doing...?... etc I say good on em! It takes balls to completely recode a site as massive as yahoo without tables. Darren http://www.webdeveloper.co.nz/ ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ Proud presenters of Web Essentials 04 http://we04.com/ Web standards, accessibility, inspiration, knowledge To be held in Sydney, September 30 and October 1, 2004 See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
RE: [WSG] IE problem with CSS tabs
John,
1. You've got your selectors a bit mixed up, they should be:
#tabmenu .active a { ... } and
#tabmenu .active a:link { ... } etc
instead of
#tabmenu a.active { ... } and
#tabmenu a.active:link { ... } etc
Then, the border and background for #tabmenu a.active:link is overriding the
border and background for #tabmenu a.active.
If you change
#tabmenu a.active:link {
color: #000;
background: #fff;
font-size: 0.8em;
font-weight: normal;
border: 1px solid #69F;
padding: 2px;
margin: 2px;
text-decoration: none;
}
to something like
#tabmenu .active a:link{
color: #000;
font-size: 0.8em;
font-weight: normal;
padding: 2px;
margin: 2px;
text-decoration: none;
}
...it should fix things. Works for me anyhow.
You could go one step further to reduce redundant markup:
#tabmenu .active a {
font-size: 0.8em;
font-weight: normal;
color: #000;
padding: 2px;
margin: 2px;
text-decoration: none;
z-index: 30;
}
#tabmenu .active a:link {
background: #ffc;
border-top: 1px solid #ffc;
}
#tabmenu .active a:hover {
background:#c60;
border-top: 1px solid #c60;
}
David
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of john
Sent: Wednesday, 29 September 2004 10:49 PM
To: web standards group
Subject: [WSG] IE problem with CSS tabs
Hello, Group.
I have a curious problem. I am creating this site with CSS tabs, and making
it so that the tab is on while visiting that page. Well, it works in
Firefox just fine, but in IE it's not...when on the server.
When viewing it on the local drive, it looks good.
http://www.drzeus.net/redesign/cslewis/
Thanks!
--
~john
_
Dr. Zeus Web Development
http://www.DrZeus.net
content without clutter
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Re: [WSG] AOHell
Patrick H. Lauke wrote: If you're really, really committed (or just masochistic) to testing it, but want to avoid having to actually get an AOL account, you can also run your own server http://www.aolserver.com/ and do testing on your local setup under true battle conditions...either that, or you have an secret desire to delve into Tcl development ;) I stand corrected on this point! Thanks for the tip, Patrick. I'll look into this. -Tim ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ Proud presenters of Web Essentials 04 http://we04.com/ Web standards, accessibility, inspiration, knowledge To be held in Sydney, September 30 and October 1, 2004 See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Yahoo CSS'ing
I agree it appears that way now but I think it's a little too easy/early to suggest it is and will end up that way. In that respect it'll be interesting to watch it develop. On a site of this massive scale I'd be very surprised if there are not a bunch of pretty screwed on heads knocking together. Also the transition must involve some messy intermediate stages as in break it before you can fix it. On the other hand sometimes it is surprising how even biggies seem to make odd decisions. Nick http://9rules.com/whitespace/css_redesigns/yahoo_css_redesign.php Good writeup- but I must say yahoo has done a horid job so far. HTML Errors: 223 The css validates, but it is horrid. in 2 days, how could one ever remember what #v or where#v #v4.h appears in the document? IMO, they need to get some developers in there who actually know what they're doing. ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ Proud presenters of Web Essentials 04 http://we04.com/ Web standards, accessibility, inspiration, knowledge To be held in Sydney, September 30 and October 1, 2004 See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] increasing font size breaking layout
Cesar - Web users interested in your services will not be able to get much help if their browser is Safari 1.2.3. Sorry, but on this browser your site is a mess. Maybe someone else on the list can advise you what to do to make it Safari-accessible. Yours, Albert -- On Sep 28, 2004, at 4:41 AM, cesar | cesargarcia.com wrote: Yes, if all elements are proportional the layouts never break, increase or decrease size as same the font. Take a look: http://www.gestoriagarcia.net It's my latest work, incerase or decrease the size. Sorry for my english. cesar | cesargarcia.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ Proud presenters of Web Essentials 04 http://we04.com/ Web standards, accessibility, inspiration, knowledge To be held in Sydney, September 30 and October 1, 2004 See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** -Mensaje original- De: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] En nombre de Andrew Thompson Enviado el: martes, 28 de septiembre de 2004 8:33 Para: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Asunto: Re: [WSG] increasing font size breaking layout My understanding is that if all elements are relative/proportional, the layouts should never break. -- On Tuesday, 28 September 2004 4:14 PM, Focas, Grant [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I was wondering if people had any opinions on when its acceptable if at all for a layout to break when users increase font size. Sites I am working on look fine if text is increased or decreased 1 or 2 times but when they are increased repeatedly the layout goes a bit whacky in some browsers (Netscape 6.2 on PC, IE5 Mac). Specifically, elements which are absolutely positioned get overlapped by wrapped list navigation. It seems to me that this only happens when text gets extremely large on small resolution screens and therefore I shouldn't worry too much, but is extreme all in the eye of the beholder? Grant Focas ** This message is intended for the addressee named and may contain privileged information or confidential information or both. If you are not the intended recipient please delete it and notify the sender. ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ Proud presenters of Web Essentials 04 http://we04.com/ Web standards, accessibility, inspiration, knowledge To be held in Sydney, September 30 and October 1, 2004 See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ Proud presenters of Web Essentials 04 http://we04.com/ Web standards, accessibility, inspiration, knowledge To be held in Sydney, September 30 and October 1, 2004 See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ Proud presenters of Web Essentials 04 http://we04.com/ Web standards, accessibility, inspiration, knowledge To be held in Sydney, September 30 and October 1, 2004 See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ Proud presenters of Web Essentials 04 http://we04.com/ Web standards, accessibility, inspiration, knowledge To be held in Sydney, September 30 and October 1, 2004 See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] IE 5.2 Mac and Site Issues - Any Help Appreciated
Thanks for pointing out the issues I was having. I have made the suggested changes and really appreciated the time y'all took to look at the site and suggest a solution. Thanks again - Susan On Tue, 28 Sep 2004 03:05:05 +, James Ellis [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Susan I'd suggest requesting some screenshots from her of your site. Apple has a support article on this at their website. This should help you pinpoint the all broken problem. If she is using OSX, suggest that she uses a better browser (that's what I do for users with this OS). OS8 and 9 are another matter - these unfortunates have no other browser choices apart from the older Mozilla 1.02 and Netscape 7.00 I believe. From past experiences with this piece of software I've found that turning floats off on it can help, also if you use floats then setting them to a fixed width can assist. Of course that may screw the layout for the 95% of browsers that get it right. You could also investigate completely hiding the CSS from the browser so that users get a unstyled page but with accessible content. HTH James Susan R. Grossman wrote: my sister (in Maine and very non-computer savy) who uses ie 5.2 mac told me the site was all broken. ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ Proud presenters of Web Essentials 04 http://we04.com/ Web standards, accessibility, inspiration, knowledge To be held in Sydney, September 30 and October 1, 2004 See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** -- Susan R. Grossman [EMAIL PROTECTED] ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ Proud presenters of Web Essentials 04 http://we04.com/ Web standards, accessibility, inspiration, knowledge To be held in Sydney, September 30 and October 1, 2004 See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Yahoo CSS'ing
Darren Wood wrote: I think you're missing the point...agreed the code is well shoddy, but, as Scrivs says, this is a major step forward for the web. If the best/most popular site on the web is tableless and moving towards complete web standards, then it becomes very easy for us to sell tableless/web standards to our clients: Client: Why should I use web standards on my site? Us: Well - yahoo.com is built that way. Its one of the most visited sites on the web. Surely they know what they're doing...?... etc Understandable- but at the same time, IMO, I'd rather see them have a table-ridden, quirks mode site than a table-less site that is developped poorly as an example site. ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ Proud presenters of Web Essentials 04 http://we04.com/ Web standards, accessibility, inspiration, knowledge To be held in Sydney, September 30 and October 1, 2004 See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
