[Zope-dev] Login problems

[nagendra prasad]

Hi,
We have installed zope-2.6.2b2-1.i386.rpm downloaded
from zope.org.
we have used red-carpet (ximian product) to install 
the zope on red hat 8 linux .
But we r unable to login, coz, redcarpet takes care of
the complete installation process, including the
choice of uname & pwd.
We have followed the steps in security.txt & the
details in
http://www.zope.org/Documentation/Books/ZopeBook/current/Security.stx
 
HOw ever , we are unable to login. We are also unable
to find either inituser or access file in zope's root
folder.
Plz help us to resolve this.
Thanks
Prasad


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Re: [Zope-dev] Versions: should they die?

[Guido van Rossum]

> Perhaps Jeremy could run through his reasons for wanting them to
> stay around again?

That's not necessary.  They could stay in ZODB (certainly cutting them
out of ZODB3 now would be more work than leaving them in) but be
disabled in ZMI.

--Guido van Rossum (home page: http://www.python.org/~guido/)

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Re: [Zope-dev] Versions: should they die?

[Oliver Bleutgen]

Paul Winkler wrote:
To anyone not following the "Problem committing  zope 'version' objects"
thread on [EMAIL PROTECTED]:  It's been proposed that Versions should be
at least stamped in the ZMI with big warnings, or possibly disabled
altogether.  Numerous users have been bit by the fact that versions
basically do not work as advertised, leading in various cases to zodb 
corruption or work that can't be saved.  There are other security issues
that Oliver Bleutgen raised privately which I won't state here.

Comments?  Could we get at least some warnings in the ZMI before
2.6.2 final?
As I see it, you either have to disable the versioning functionality 
completely, or live with it. Raising a warning when people for instance 
add a Version object just gives the impression that you are safe if you 
don't use the Version product, which is wrong.

If the version functionality would be disabled by default and could be 
enabled by a startup parameter without impacting performance, then this 
would be the way to go IMHO.

cheers,
oliver
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Re: [Zope-dev] Versions: should they die?

[Lennart Regebro]

Paul Winkler wrote:
To anyone not following the "Problem committing  zope 'version' objects"
thread on [EMAIL PROTECTED]:  It's been proposed that Versions should be
at least stamped in the ZMI with big warnings, or possibly disabled
altogether.  Numerous users have been bit by the fact that versions
basically do not work as advertised, leading in various cases to zodb 
corruption or work that can't be saved.  There are other security issues
that Oliver Bleutgen raised privately which I won't state here.
Well, as they are, even when they are working, they are practically 
useless, since almost all even slightly complex use of Zope involves 
catalogs, and when using versions and catalogs, the catalog immediately 
gets blocked from outside change as soon as you reindex something in a 
version.

So I have no problems with versions getting dropped altogether in 2.7.

To have versions you really need a way to branch object versions and 
then merge them again. This COULD be implemented in the ZODB, but it 
might just as well be implemented on a higher level, and I'm not 
completely sure that the ZODB solution is wrong. But it is not nessecary.

Comments?  Could we get at least some warnings in the ZMI before
2.6.2 final?
I think that would be good.



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Re: [Zope-dev] Conflict Errors; how to track them down?

[Jamie Heilman]

Chris Withers wrote:
> Dieter Maurer wrote:
> >
> >The attached patch to "Zope/App/startup.py" provides this
> >additional information.
> 
> Where's the patch?

http://marc.theaimsgroup.com/?l=zope-dev&m=105466926610469&q=p3

-- 
Jamie Heilman   http://audible.transient.net/~jamie/
"I was in love once -- a Sinclair ZX-81.  People said, "No, Holly, she's 
 not for you." She was cheap, she was stupid and she wouldn't load 
 -- well, not for me, anyway."  -Holly

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Re: [Zope-dev] Versions: should they die?

[Chris Withers]

Paul Winkler wrote:
Comments?  
They really should die. They cause nothing but pain and suffering.

Could we get at least some warnings in the ZMI before
2.6.2 final?
I do hope so. I'd also like to see them becoming an explicit configuration 
option in 2.7 and not appear in any UI's unless they have been explicitly turned 
on...

Perhaps Jeremy could run through his reasons for wanting them to stay around again?

cheers,

Chris

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Re: [Zope-dev] Conflict Errors; how to track them down?

[Chris Withers]

Dieter Maurer wrote:
The attached patch to "Zope/App/startup.py" provides this
additional information.
Where's the patch?

cheers,

Chris

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Re: [Zope-dev] Versions: should they die?

[Anthony Baxter]

>>> Guido van Rossum wrote
> IMO versions do nothing except complexify the code.  I believe it's an
> official Zope Corp position to discourage them for new projects.  Yet
> Jeremy Hylton seems to think that they are somehow useful and has
> carefully preserved them in ZODB 4 (== Zope 3).  If it were up to me,
> they would have been gone, with a big helping of YAGNI!

Worse yet, they _seem_ like a neat/useful solution. But they're not - 
it's a path that leads to madness and despair. I'd prefer the approach
of making you change some code in lib/python/ to enable them, with them
disabled by default.


-- 
Anthony Baxter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>   
It's never too late to have a happy childhood.


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Re: [Zope-dev] Versions: should they die?

[Andy McKay]

> IMO versions do nothing except complexify the code.  I believe it's an
> official Zope Corp position to discourage them for new projects.  Yet
> Jeremy Hylton seems to think that they are somehow useful and has
> carefully preserved them in ZODB 4 (== Zope 3).  If it were up to me,
> they would have been gone, with a big helping of YAGNI!

I think its worth pointing out that the main part of the problem with
versions is how they are implemented in Zope 2, not as they exist in the
ZODB. It might be fine and useful in the ZODB, in fact I remember some
use cases Jeremy pointed out that did sound useful.

The main problem really is the Zope implementation for example: you can
lock any object in a version that doesn't exists, it uses cookies,
trouble committing... etc.
-- 
  Andy McKay


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Re: [Zope-dev] Versions: should they die?

[Guido van Rossum]

> To anyone not following the "Problem committing  zope 'version' objects"
> thread on [EMAIL PROTECTED]:  It's been proposed that Versions should be
> at least stamped in the ZMI with big warnings, or possibly disabled
> altogether.  Numerous users have been bit by the fact that versions
> basically do not work as advertised, leading in various cases to zodb 
> corruption or work that can't be saved.  There are other security issues
> that Oliver Bleutgen raised privately which I won't state here.
> 
> Comments?  Could we get at least some warnings in the ZMI before
> 2.6.2 final?

IMO versions do nothing except complexify the code.  I believe it's an
official Zope Corp position to discourage them for new projects.  Yet
Jeremy Hylton seems to think that they are somehow useful and has
carefully preserved them in ZODB 4 (== Zope 3).  If it were up to me,
they would have been gone, with a big helping of YAGNI!

--Guido van Rossum (home page: http://www.python.org/~guido/)

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[Zope-dev] Versions: should they die?

[Paul Winkler]

To anyone not following the "Problem committing  zope 'version' objects"
thread on [EMAIL PROTECTED]:  It's been proposed that Versions should be
at least stamped in the ZMI with big warnings, or possibly disabled
altogether.  Numerous users have been bit by the fact that versions
basically do not work as advertised, leading in various cases to zodb 
corruption or work that can't be saved.  There are other security issues
that Oliver Bleutgen raised privately which I won't state here.

Comments?  Could we get at least some warnings in the ZMI before
2.6.2 final?

-- 

Paul Winkler
http://www.slinkp.com
Look! Up in the sky! It's THE COSMIC!
(random hero from isometric.spaceninja.com)

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Re: [Zope-dev] "Bad reference to" ... how to find object references?

[Dieter Maurer]

Bjorn Stabell wrote at 2003-6-3 11:04 +0800:
 > During packing, we're seing errors such as the ones attached below.  Can
 > someone give a description how to track down which objects have these
 > broken references?  Such help would be much appreciated...

Maybe the "fsrefs.py" script.

A short time ago, someone wrote a HowTo about the resolution
of dangling references in the ZODB. Search the archives or
google for it.


Dieter

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Re: [Zope-dev] Conflict Errors; how to track them down?

[Dieter Maurer]

Bjorn Stabell wrote at 2003-6-3 11:08 +0800:
 > Except for SARS, another problem that's been plagueing us for months are
 > seemingly random Conflict Errors.  We see about 10 every day on our Zope
 > 2.6.1, and they can happen on any page.  In most cases they are not
 > related to pages that actually updated anything (AFAIK), although we do
 > use SESSIONS (but no frames).  Any clue how to track down which objects
 > are having problems, what's causing this?
 > 
 > --
 > 2003-06-03T09:08:10 INFO(0) ZODB conflict error at
 > /VirtualHostBase/http/www.beijingsammies.com:80/sammies/VirtualHostRoot/
 > (7 conflicts since startup at 2003-06-02T13:15:05) 

The log message for conflict errors is far less instructive than
it could be (almost without any effort).

  It should indicate whether it is a ReadConflictError or
  a (Write)ConflictError.

  It should tell which object caused the conflict.


The attached patch to "Zope/App/startup.py" provides this
additional information.

Please file a feature request to "".


Dieter

--- startup.py~	2003-02-28 16:59:25.0 +0100
+++ startup.py	2003-03-17 11:13:28.0 +0100
@@ -140,9 +140,9 @@
 global conflict_errors
 conflict_errors = conflict_errors + 1
 method_name = REQUEST.get('PATH_INFO', '')
-err = ('ZODB conflict error at %s '
+err = ('ZODB conflict error at %s: %s'
'(%s conflicts since startup at %s)')
-LOG(err % (method_name, conflict_errors, startup_time),
+LOG(err % (method_name, str(v), conflict_errors, startup_time),
 INFO, '')
 LOG('Conflict traceback', BLATHER, '', error=sys.exc_info())
 raise ZPublisher.Retry(t, v, traceback)

Re: [Zope-dev] Conflict Errors; how to track them down?

[Shane Hathaway]

Bjorn Stabell wrote:
In any case, is there no way to find out more detailed information about
why a conflict happened?  There must be some oids somewhere?
I don't know of a way.  In a conflict, the transaction gets aborted, so 
the only data left is the log entry.

Shane

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