Got my phone! + A comment and a Question
I got my phone, and I'm a happy guy! I learned one thing that might save someone else some time. I initially tried to do the dfu-util downloads of the kernel and rootfs from linux running via VMWare on a Windoze host. Although dfu-util definately could talk to the neo, it could not successfully download the images. Once I switched to a native linux box (running exactly the same OS version) I had no problems. Something that worries me is that at the end of the "Getting Started with your Neo1973" page in the wiki, it suggests backing up the original flash contents, because "... there are parts in the root filesystem that can't be distributed over internet so they are only found in the shipped ROM (see the GPS driver)." Now these first neos have been shipped with no rootfs at all (see wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/SH1). So we *have* to overwrite the rootfs before the device will boot. What does that mean vis a vis the parts of the filesystem which can't be distributed over the internet?How do we get those parts? Ken Young Smithsonian Astrophysical Observatory 60 Garden Street, MS 78 Phoney Dolson has a secret name. Cambridge, MA 02138 USA (617) 495-7330 [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: What happened to the order?
On 07/28/2007 Asbjørn Sannes wrote: > If I understood correctly orders within the U.S. was shipped first, > and then international developers would get their phones.. > > I have received three e-mails from openmoko: "AutoReply: OpenMoko > direct order", "Your OpenMoko direct order" (which I replyed to > YES_I_DO), and "Payment received: OpenMoko direct order". > > Since then I have heard nothing, but I can see from the "P1 Owners" > page that other higher numbered rts, ordering the exact same thing > (Advanced kit, B/S), to the exact same location (Oslo, Norway) have > received shipping notifications. > > Anyone else experienced this? Is my order gone? Am I waiting for > something that won't happen? > Is there something that I should have done that I have not? Let me check on this today. As I'm sure it's obvious to most of you now, we're having a heck of a time with logistics this first time around. Please accept my sincere apologies. I promise we will get much better really soon. -Sean ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Phone arrive! - Torx required?
On Sat, 28 Jul 2007, Jeff Rush wrote: > But I think I'm about to fail my geek status - can't figure out how to > insert the microSD card that came with it, without full disassembly of the > unit. Just slide the SIM card holder in the direction marked OPEN, and then hinge it out of the way, then slide the SD card holder in the OPEN direction and hinge it up as well. Don't use too much force since the whole assembly is a little bit fragile. Make sure you put the cards in the correct way around and then reverse the process. The holders should click back into place when hinged back down and slid into the LOCK position. Cheers, Paul ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Real Time Audio (SCHED_FIFO)
Esben > Yeah, I know PulseAudio, but that doesn't help interconnecting modules > in a real time fashion. tell us the big picture for what you want to do brad ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Phone arrive! - Torx required?
get on irc :) no, you don't need to open it up to get the card in. you gently slide the metal shield to unlock it On 7/27/07, Jeff Rush <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Yay, my basic Neo1973 arrived today. It looks quite cool smaller than I > expected and lightweight. > > But I think I'm about to fail my geek status - can't figure out how to insert > the microSD card that came with it, without full disassembly of the unit. I, > uh, don't own a Torx toolset and didn't order the advanced model with tools. > I later decided I should have, but when I found out that changes move you to > the back of the order line, I stayed with the basic unit. > > So, microSD installation w/o a Torx tool? And I guess a guitar pick as well, > to get at the back of the PCB? > > -Jeff > > ___ > OpenMoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community > ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
An idea of sorts
Hello to one and all, and allow me to present a few ideas for the Neo1973/Openmoko combination that will drive sales and support.Simply put, use the phone number as an unique identifier for the phone,that can be broadcast via wifi or bluetooth, and then, when you give someone your phone-number, the have this identifier. (Only if they have a compatible phone/OS combination) Then, when you are in range, you can text/IM/call them over bluetooth/wifi.To me, this would be the ultimate teenager tool. It bypasses the Telco limitsfrees the phone for many social uses, say parties, hanging out, etc. And here's the thing: this should be ideally transparent to the users of the phone what mode is being used. However, if concerned, there can be a simpleicon representing the mode used. This sort of application will seem inconsequential, but in reality, it is thesort of thing that will drive change. As wifi tech improves, battery life improves, a feature like this will be a killer deal. Have any of you read any of Vernor Vinge's Singularity novels? Wherein he postulates an interconnected world of a depth that is only dreamed of now.To me, a platform like OpenMoko has the possibility to drive change in sucha way, that the world will literally be changed. If thats not your goal, inany project, why do it? If it won't change the world, even a small portion of it, then you are doing something wrong. The future will be driven by those whom not only anticipate change, but drive it by their actions and goals. I want to help OpenMoko sinceI feel it can change the world.Do you?-Sincerely, Tyler. _ Discover the new Windows Vista http://search.msn.com/results.aspx?q=windows+vista&mkt=en-US&form=QBRE___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Phone arrive! - Torx required?
Yay, my basic Neo1973 arrived today. It looks quite cool smaller than I expected and lightweight. But I think I'm about to fail my geek status - can't figure out how to insert the microSD card that came with it, without full disassembly of the unit. I, uh, don't own a Torx toolset and didn't order the advanced model with tools. I later decided I should have, but when I found out that changes move you to the back of the order line, I stayed with the basic unit. So, microSD installation w/o a Torx tool? And I guess a guitar pick as well, to get at the back of the PCB? -Jeff ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: voice command line (was: ssh to a phone ... thats awesome !!)
> Actually, I had used a tool called cvoicecontrol sometime back for exactly > that, running scripts or cmds using voice. It wasnt very powerful in terms > of how well it could recognize, but was functional enough. > > http://www.kiecza.net/daniel/linux/ Unfortunately, cvoice control doesn't seem to compile anymore. I did not manage to debug this. But it's an interesting approach, also taken by http://perlbox.org/ You may find relevant info about speech recognition (and command-and-control dialog managers) here : http://wiki.tuxisalive.com/index.php/Speech_recognition ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Product naming / wiki page naming / restructuring
On Fri, Jul 27, 2007 at 01:25:26PM +0200, Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller wrote: OpenMoko-0.5 or whatever scheme is already in place. >>> >>> -2007 and -2008 so far. We might have 200x.y at some point. > > Hm. I think using year-names is not a good choice for software versions > (mainly talking about stable releases). I agree. wasn't my idea. In any case, it is what is in place now. > It psychologically forces you to do one major release every year. that's not true. > *every* new stable release should run on *all* older hardware (at least up > to 3 or 4 years!). this is an entirely different discussion and I would rather not want to mix that with the naming/versioning scheme debate. -- - Harald Welte <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://openmoko.org/ Software for the world's first truly open Free Software mobile phone ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Phone emulator under Gentoo?
# ls /usr/lib64/libSDL* /usr/lib64/libSDL-1.2.so.0 /usr/lib64/libSDL.la /usr/lib64/libSDL_net-1.2.so.0.0.7 /usr/lib64/libSDL_net.so /usr/lib64/libSDL-1.2.so.0.11.1 /usr/lib64/libSDLmain.a /usr/lib64/libSDL_net.a /usr/lib64/libSDL.so /usr/lib64/libSDL.a /usr/lib64/libSDL_net-1.2.so.0 /usr/lib64/libSDL_net.la That's what's on my system. Any new programs that I install with an SDL requirement install just fine. The qemu-neo1973 configure can't find it for some reason :( Nelson Castillo wrote: Also the developer version? I have the "libsdl1.2-dev" package in my Debian sid system. And I forgot to say that I built the emulator with this library. I hadn't it before I noticed it was missing. Regards, Nelson.- ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: 3G sim cards
On 28 Jul 2007, at 00:46, Xamindar wrote: Whao, I didn't know that. I assumed it at least had edge. That totally sucks if it is only has GPRS. What is going on with new phones these days? Seems like they are going backwards in speeds, i-phone and now this. HSDPA support? Why not? Is it licensing issues? HSDPA and 3G are current technologies, many vendors are big on NDAs etc, which is no good for this project. I guess in time this may change. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: 3G sim cards
Whao, I didn't know that. I assumed it at least had edge. That totally sucks if it is only has GPRS. What is going on with new phones these days? Seems like they are going backwards in speeds, i-phone and now this. HSDPA support? Why not? Is it licensing issues? Andreas Kostyrka wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 edge speeds? *lol* The GTA01 at least has pure classic GPRS. Andreas Xamindar wrote: I have a simple question related to 3G. Why doesn't the neo support 3G? I have had my Cingular 3G phone for a year now and I can't imagine ever going back to Edge speeds. And sence this phone has a 640x480 screen and powerful processor it is great for the faster speed network. I would really love to change my "3G phone+Zaurus" combination over to one openmoko phone. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.2 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFGqm52HJdudm4KnO0RAvwOAKC8zH50pNDZXDC5EIrMm2PJLIXj7gCfYVj0 X6lFm6Ymbsha1N9miTpr6Xs= =jS3r -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: voice command line (was: ssh to a phone ... thats awesome !!)
Hi, There is also pocketsphinx, mentioned in this thread: http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/community/2007-February/003790.html Gilles -- Oralux.org http://association.oralux.org ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: OpenMoko/GTA01 project advice
On 27 Jul 2007, at 23:56, Nelson Castillo wrote: We didn't know about CSD. Good. We are not trying to avoid any cost. We just care about the latency of the GPRS link which renders it rather unusable, at least in our country. As a mental model, you can think of the Neo as an Linux/ARM based PDA with an embedded GSM modem. Latency is a problem with TCP/IP over wireless. You can do a few things to try and improve this, adjust the window size etc.. if you are losing a lot of packets then you want retransmissions to be small chunks of data and not large ones. I'm sure there's plenty more you can do, plenty of information around on the web. You also mentioned hardware? if you can't wait for a Neo the Palm Treo 650 will boot OpenMoko, the screen is a bit small however. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: OpenMoko/GTA01 project advice
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Nelson Castillo wrote: > On 7/27/07, Andreas Kostyrka <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- > (cut) >>> * Will we be able to use the GSM directly? I am new to >>> this, and I'd like to know if we can make a GSM call >>> (to other Neo) and send arbitrary data. >> Yes and no. You cannot make a Voice call and send arbitrary data. You >> can make a data call (so called CSD) and send arbitrary data. Trouble is >> that this is clearly visible to the operator as the call is signaled >> differently, so if you are trying to avoid data call costs, it's not >> possible. > > We didn't know about CSD. Good. We are not trying to avoid any cost. We > just care about the latency of the GPRS link which renders it rather unusable, > at least in our country. I don't think that the latency of CSD is much better than the GPRS one. Plus CSD means 14400 bits per second at absolute best. Andreas > >> As a mental model, you can think of the Neo as an Linux/ARM based PDA >> with an embedded GSM modem. > > :) > > Regards. > -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.2 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFGqn/THJdudm4KnO0RAqvSAKDMZR0RJwIWQYxrCySb2crWBamD0ACfTx+v jk0jkUzz4FXOg/JeMLJSGso= =9Px0 -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: OpenMoko/GTA01 project advice
On 7/27/07, Andreas Kostyrka <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- (cut) > > * Will we be able to use the GSM directly? I am new to > > this, and I'd like to know if we can make a GSM call > > (to other Neo) and send arbitrary data. > > Yes and no. You cannot make a Voice call and send arbitrary data. You > can make a data call (so called CSD) and send arbitrary data. Trouble is > that this is clearly visible to the operator as the call is signaled > differently, so if you are trying to avoid data call costs, it's not > possible. We didn't know about CSD. Good. We are not trying to avoid any cost. We just care about the latency of the GPRS link which renders it rather unusable, at least in our country. > As a mental model, you can think of the Neo as an Linux/ARM based PDA > with an embedded GSM modem. :) Regards. -- http://arhuaco.org http://emQbit.com ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: What happened to the order?
On Friday 27 July 2007 16:14:49 Asbjørn Sannes wrote: > If I understood correctly orders within the U.S. was shipped first, and > then international developers would get their phones.. > > I have received three e-mails from openmoko: "AutoReply: OpenMoko direct > order", "Your OpenMoko direct order" (which I replyed to YES_I_DO), and > "Payment received: OpenMoko direct order". > > Since then I have heard nothing, but I can see from the "P1 Owners" page > that other higher numbered rts, ordering the exact same thing (Advanced > kit, B/S), to the exact same location (Oslo, Norway) have received > shipping notifications. > > Anyone else experienced this? Is my order gone? Am I waiting for > something that won't happen? > Is there something that I should have done that I have not? > > Any pointers appreciated :) > > Greetings, > Asbjørn Sannes > > > ___ > OpenMoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community AKAIK, if you ordered an Wht/Orange Neo, it was delayed until the second batch of 500. Only Blk/Orange units are currently shipping. Not sure if that applies to any of you... -Jason1 (ChooseOpen) ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: OpenMoko/GTA01 project advice
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Nelson Castillo wrote: > Hi. > > We are starting a project and we will use a > Neo GTA01 ( We are also waiting for it to ship :) ). > We will need at least two more, but we need to try > one first. > > We need to: > > * Make calls to send arbitrary data (We'd like to > use the GSM for data) > * Record voice messages on the phone and send them to > another user (via GSM) > > I have a few questions: > > * Will we be able to use the GSM directly? I am new to > this, and I'd like to know if we can make a GSM call > (to other Neo) and send arbitrary data. Yes and no. You cannot make a Voice call and send arbitrary data. You can make a data call (so called CSD) and send arbitrary data. Trouble is that this is clearly visible to the operator as the call is signaled differently, so if you are trying to avoid data call costs, it's not possible. As a mental model, you can think of the Neo as an Linux/ARM based PDA with an embedded GSM modem. Andreas -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.2 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFGqnAMHJdudm4KnO0RAqlDAJ0ZO/GtxHJdkJFBAZs/Evze8vE7MgCfRNRI c3Tb1aHLdzLq3syCTzjl6co= =1L6Z -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Phone emulator under Gentoo?
> Also the developer version? > I have the "libsdl1.2-dev" package in my Debian sid system. And I forgot to say that I built the emulator with this library. I hadn't it before I noticed it was missing. Regards, Nelson.- -- http://arhuaco.org http://emQbit.com ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: What happened to the order?
I'm in a similar situation, only I'm in Canada, not the US, and I ordered the non-advanced kit. But I also received the payment received email, but no shipping email as of yet. On 7/27/07, Jon Radel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > If I understood correctly orders within the U.S. was shipped first, and > > then international developers would get their phones.. > > Well, some U.S. phones were shipped firstthis doesn't seem to apply > to my #1881. > > > > > I have received three e-mails from openmoko: "AutoReply: OpenMoko direct > > order", "Your OpenMoko direct order" (which I replyed to YES_I_DO), and > > "Payment received: OpenMoko direct order". > > I got the first two. I sent "YES_I_DO" twice, the first time within 50 > minutes and then again 13 days later when I heard nothing further. > Still haven't heard anything about payment or shipping. > > > > Since then I have heard nothing, but I can see from the "P1 Owners" page > > that other higher numbered rts, ordering the exact same thing (Advanced > > kit, B/S), to the exact same location (Oslo, Norway) have received > > shipping notifications. > > Same thing I ordered, but to a U.S. address. > > > > > Anyone else experienced this? Is my order gone? Am I waiting for > > something that won't happen? > > Is there something that I should have done that I have not? > > > They're probably dancing just as fast as they can > > --Jon Radel > > ___ > OpenMoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community > > > ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Phone emulator under Gentoo?
On 7/27/07, Xamindar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Has anyone been able to get the emulator working under gentoo Linux? > When I try to configure it before making it, it fails on SDL. I > deffinately have SDL installed on my system. Also the developer version? I have the "libsdl1.2-dev" package in my Debian sid system. Regards. -- http://arhuaco.org http://emQbit.com ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: 3G sim cards
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 edge speeds? *lol* The GTA01 at least has pure classic GPRS. Andreas Xamindar wrote: > I have a simple question related to 3G. Why doesn't the neo support > 3G? I have had my Cingular 3G phone for a year now and I can't imagine > ever going back to Edge speeds. And sence this phone has a 640x480 > screen and powerful processor it is great for the faster speed network. > I would really love to change my "3G phone+Zaurus" combination over to > one openmoko phone. > > > ___ > OpenMoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.2 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFGqm52HJdudm4KnO0RAvwOAKC8zH50pNDZXDC5EIrMm2PJLIXj7gCfYVj0 X6lFm6Ymbsha1N9miTpr6Xs= =jS3r -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: What happened to the order?
> If I understood correctly orders within the U.S. was shipped first, and > then international developers would get their phones.. Well, some U.S. phones were shipped firstthis doesn't seem to apply to my #1881. > > I have received three e-mails from openmoko: "AutoReply: OpenMoko direct > order", "Your OpenMoko direct order" (which I replyed to YES_I_DO), and > "Payment received: OpenMoko direct order". I got the first two. I sent "YES_I_DO" twice, the first time within 50 minutes and then again 13 days later when I heard nothing further. Still haven't heard anything about payment or shipping. > Since then I have heard nothing, but I can see from the "P1 Owners" page > that other higher numbered rts, ordering the exact same thing (Advanced > kit, B/S), to the exact same location (Oslo, Norway) have received > shipping notifications. Same thing I ordered, but to a U.S. address. > > Anyone else experienced this? Is my order gone? Am I waiting for > something that won't happen? > Is there something that I should have done that I have not? They're probably dancing just as fast as they can --Jon Radel smime.p7s Description: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Phone emulator under Gentoo?
Has anyone been able to get the emulator working under gentoo Linux? When I try to configure it before making it, it fails on SDL. I deffinately have SDL installed on my system. Also, has anyone made an overlay or at least an ebuild for it? Thanks for any help. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: 3G sim cards
I have a simple question related to 3G. Why doesn't the neo support 3G? I have had my Cingular 3G phone for a year now and I can't imagine ever going back to Edge speeds. And sence this phone has a 640x480 screen and powerful processor it is great for the faster speed network. I would really love to change my "3G phone+Zaurus" combination over to one openmoko phone. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
OpenMoko/GTA01 project advice
Hi. We are starting a project and we will use a Neo GTA01 ( We are also waiting for it to ship :) ). We will need at least two more, but we need to try one first. We need to: * Make calls to send arbitrary data (We'd like to use the GSM for data) * Record voice messages on the phone and send them to another user (via GSM) I have a few questions: * Will we be able to use the GSM directly? I am new to this, and I'd like to know if we can make a GSM call (to other Neo) and send arbitrary data. * Will the power management issue be solved soon? I guess that we will need at least 8 hours of battery power. (I know we can also help, but I'd like to know if someone is working on it). On the other hand, we _will_ use the Neo, but we need to have another phones for backups (using other brands). I think we will help debug problems since we will be able to make comparisons. We need to be able to show a new product to our client, and he will not care if the Neo is ready or not. But we care and we will wait. So, a new question is: What other phone will allow us to test this functionality? Better if it's Linux based. We were planning to use a A1200, but this phone is no useful at all for what we're trying to do. I've read that you get a shell with a lot of SE-Linux stuff enabled, and that you cannot get to use the phone as you'd like to from the command line. I wonder if we can have access to the audio codecs (HW) and to the GSM in this phone. We'd rather use GSM for voice since GPRS latency is quite big (at least in our country). http://wiki.openezx.org/Project_Status Regards, Nelson.- -- http://arhuaco.org http://emQbit.com ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: What happened to the order?
I am in the same situation. Ortwin On 7/27/07, Asbjørn Sannes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > If I understood correctly orders within the U.S. was shipped first, and > then international developers would get their phones.. > > I have received three e-mails from openmoko: "AutoReply: OpenMoko direct > order", "Your OpenMoko direct order" (which I replyed to YES_I_DO), and > "Payment received: OpenMoko direct order". > > Since then I have heard nothing, but I can see from the "P1 Owners" page > that other higher numbered rts, ordering the exact same thing (Advanced > kit, B/S), to the exact same location (Oslo, Norway) have received > shipping notifications. > > Anyone else experienced this? Is my order gone? Am I waiting for > something that won't happen? > Is there something that I should have done that I have not? > > Any pointers appreciated :) > > Greetings, > Asbjørn Sannes > > > ___ > OpenMoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community > ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
3G sim cards
I agree. The neo should work with the largest US provider. I would be more than happy to mail my sim card to TW or to someplace where someone who knows more about the technology than me can look at it (as long as I can get it back lol). It would be nice to see the raw communication (if any) between the sim and the phone. IMO this is a very important issue and I hope the core neo engineers or openmoko developers will get time to look into it. (its filed on bugzilla as number 666) Harry ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
What happened to the order?
If I understood correctly orders within the U.S. was shipped first, and then international developers would get their phones.. I have received three e-mails from openmoko: "AutoReply: OpenMoko direct order", "Your OpenMoko direct order" (which I replyed to YES_I_DO), and "Payment received: OpenMoko direct order". Since then I have heard nothing, but I can see from the "P1 Owners" page that other higher numbered rts, ordering the exact same thing (Advanced kit, B/S), to the exact same location (Oslo, Norway) have received shipping notifications. Anyone else experienced this? Is my order gone? Am I waiting for something that won't happen? Is there something that I should have done that I have not? Any pointers appreciated :) Greetings, Asbjørn Sannes ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: voice command line (was: ssh to a phone ... thats awesome !!)
On 7/27/07, Mark <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > ssh is awesome, but in the future when your on the go it would be > handy to have all the commands (shell commands, common keywords and > programs in path) to be bindable to voice commands. Like voice > dialing, but for a shell. I know full blown speech recognition is > unlikely, but just commands seems doable. Does anyone have any > experience with voice learning? Actually, I had used a tool called cvoicecontrol sometime back for exactly that, running scripts or cmds using voice. It wasnt very powerful in terms of how well it could recognize, but was functional enough. http://www.kiecza.net/daniel/linux/ What do you guys think? > > Mark > > On 7/27/07, Tim Shannon <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > We need video, or it didn't happing. > > > > Just kidding, though seriously, I want to see more video online of the > > NEO1973 and open moko in action. > > > > > > On 7/27/07, Pranav Desai <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > > Hello All, > > > > > > I just got my Neo. Upgraded the kernel and rootfs and shortly I was > > ssh'ing in to a phone !! > > > > > > Now on to making a call :-) > > > > > > Enjoy! > > > > > > -- Pranav > > > > > > -- > > > http://pd.dnsalias.org > > > ___ > > > OpenMoko community mailing list > > > community@lists.openmoko.org > > > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community > > > > > > > > > > > > ___ > > OpenMoko community mailing list > > community@lists.openmoko.org > > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community > > > > > > ___ > OpenMoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community > -- -- http://pd.dnsalias.org ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Wiki application list.
Nelson Castillo wrote: On 7/27/07, Mark Eichin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: (cut) 3: How long does the device run on a battery? On an 850mAh nokia battery... maybe 3 hours mostly idle (not sure, I came back to find it dead.) Haven't timed it with the 1200mAh "real" battery, but basically, "power management isn't really there yet." Is it hard to do it? Would using NO_HZ in the kernel help? See the Neo1973 Power Managment page in the wiki. Basically - AIUI - there need to be custom drivers to vary the voltage and frequency of the CPU, to enable slow-mode, and to turn on and off various chip modules. Then, the hard part of getting it to resume from 'sleep' - which is the CPU completely off, and suspended to RAM in under a second or so. NO_HZ at this stage would do little. The CPU uses almost the same power when running flat out as when idle, but not in idle-mode. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Fwd: Wiki application list.
Mark Eichin wrote: I seem to have wiped out my GPS drivers and applications in my initial flash also. Had to - I didn't know of a way to back up before doing so. Same here - though given that the kernel couldn't find init, I'm not actually convinced that they *were* on the installed rootfs... Of course, I'd rather chime in on the reverse engineering effort, but http://projects.linuxtogo.org/projects/sphyrna is dead... Most of it is on the wiki on the Hammerhead/Protocol page. It's a collection of notes, not a driver. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: power management
On Friday 27 July 2007, Nelson Castillo wrote: > On 7/27/07, Mark Eichin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > On an 850mAh nokia battery... maybe 3 hours mostly idle (not sure, I > > came back to find it dead.) Haven't timed it with the 1200mAh "real" > > battery, but basically, "power management isn't really there yet." > > Is it hard to do it? Would using NO_HZ in the kernel help? If you mean a tickless kernel, then probably if it where available. Last I heard it was only available for 32bit x86, not even x86_64 is supported. In any case, I suspect the power saving stuff is more fundamental than that. From reading the Wiki, the Neo 1973 has a low power mode in which it goes to sleep, and turns of the screen, untill it receves and interupt from a device such as the GSM module or the touchscreen. The unfinished power management will be the necessary code to make the phone go to sleep after a minute or so of inactivity. A tickless kernel might save a few more percent on top of that, but it is sleep mode you need to get from 3 hours battery life to 5 days. -- David Pottage ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
voice command line (was: ssh to a phone ... thats awesome !!)
ssh is awesome, but in the future when your on the go it would be handy to have all the commands (shell commands, common keywords and programs in path) to be bindable to voice commands. Like voice dialing, but for a shell. I know full blown speech recognition is unlikely, but just commands seems doable. Does anyone have any experience with voice learning? What do you guys think? Mark On 7/27/07, Tim Shannon <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > We need video, or it didn't happing. > > Just kidding, though seriously, I want to see more video online of the > NEO1973 and open moko in action. > > > On 7/27/07, Pranav Desai <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > Hello All, > > > > I just got my Neo. Upgraded the kernel and rootfs and shortly I was > ssh'ing in to a phone !! > > > > Now on to making a call :-) > > > > Enjoy! > > > > -- Pranav > > > > -- > > http://pd.dnsalias.org > > ___ > > OpenMoko community mailing list > > community@lists.openmoko.org > > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community > > > > > > > ___ > OpenMoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community > > ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Fwd: Wiki application list.
> I seem to have wiped out my GPS drivers and applications in my initial flash > also. Had to - I didn't know of a way to back up before doing so. Same here - though given that the kernel couldn't find init, I'm not actually convinced that they *were* on the installed rootfs... Of course, I'd rather chime in on the reverse engineering effort, but http://projects.linuxtogo.org/projects/sphyrna is dead... ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: ssh to a phone ... thats awesome !!
We need video, or it didn't happing. Just kidding, though seriously, I want to see more video online of the NEO1973 and open moko in action. On 7/27/07, Pranav Desai <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Hello All, > > I just got my Neo. Upgraded the kernel and rootfs and shortly I was > ssh'ing in to a phone !! > > Now on to making a call :-) > > Enjoy! > > -- Pranav > > -- > http://pd.dnsalias.org > ___ > OpenMoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community > > ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Wiki application list.
On 7/27/07, Mark Eichin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: (cut) > > 3: How long does the device run on a battery? > > On an 850mAh nokia battery... maybe 3 hours mostly idle (not sure, I > came back to find it dead.) Haven't timed it with the 1200mAh "real" > battery, but basically, "power management isn't really there yet." Is it hard to do it? Would using NO_HZ in the kernel help? Waiting for our neo, N.- -- http://arhuaco.org http://emQbit.com ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Fwd: Wiki application list.
On 7/27/07, John Locke <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > GPS: CLI drivers/application got nuked in my initial flash (I put a note > of a way you can actually back this up before flashing on the > wiki--previously the instructions for backing it up required the device > to be running, but you couldn't boot without flashing) -- no idea. > (OpenMoko team--how can we get a copy of the GPS drivers?) I seem to have wiped out my GPS drivers and applications in my initial flash also. Had to - I didn't know of a way to back up before doing so. If you are referring to the backup instructions here: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Getting_Started_with_your_Neo1973#Initial_backup I still don't see the note about how to do this. I'll need a copy of the GPS drivers at some point too - I can live without them for the moment though. Thanks for the list - I've only spent about fifteen minutes with my phone. I can't seem to pry it away from my co-workers for the moment. Ricky ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
ssh to a phone ... thats awesome !!
Hello All, I just got my Neo. Upgraded the kernel and rootfs and shortly I was ssh'ing in to a phone !! Now on to making a call :-) Enjoy! -- Pranav -- http://pd.dnsalias.org ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: 3G sim cards
Chalk another one up for CME ERROR due to the cingular/att 'fireball' 3g sim card.. However, it is interesting to note, that I am getting CME ERROR 13 (sim failure), rather than CME ERROR 10 (sim not inserted). Just got my neo, so still trying.. :) -Scott Joe Pfeiffer wrote: Harrison Metzger writes: Many people (including I) have not been able to get the at&t 3g sim card (the one with the "3g fireball") working in our neos. The older cingular ones do work (they are "64K smart chip"). I dont care if it does 2g, I would like for my at&t sim card to work in the phone. According to the GSM modem it gives error CME 10 (sim card not inserted). any ideas? Many people (including I) have not been able to get the at&t 3g sim card (the one with the "3g fireball") working in our neos. The older cingular ones do work (they are "64K smart chip"). I dont care if it does 2g, I would like for my at&t sim card to work in the phone. According to the GSM modem it gives error CME 10 (sim card not inserted). any ideas? OK, several people have reported failure -- has anybody reported success? ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: whee!
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > > > Would it be possible to get some blueprints of the device? I don't need > > artist drawing, but it would be really really helpful to get the blueprints > > for the case (inside and outside) as soon as possible. > > There are reasonably high res pictures on the wiki already, aren't there? How long is one side, how broad is the other one? How big is the battery? I tought about creating a new case for my personal use as soon as possible. High resolution pictures aren't enough for a CNC machine. ;) ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Wiki application list.
> In the meantime, here's what I'm finding works: Excellent list. Note that this varies build-to-build, or at least has in the last few days. > I tried it out with my sim card, then moved it back to my old phone. I Same here - but after that (being in the US) I just dropped $10 cash at a T-mobile kiosk in a mall and walked away with a SIM card with a few minutes on it, so I can keep the "real" phone working. > 3: How long does the device run on a battery? On an 850mAh nokia battery... maybe 3 hours mostly idle (not sure, I came back to find it dead.) Haven't timed it with the 1200mAh "real" battery, but basically, "power management isn't really there yet." > > 4: is the uboot bootloader stable enough to make a basic model sufficient? > > > Seems to be. I've had 0 problems with the boot loader. I followed the > guidance on the wiki that says "with a phase I phone, don't flash the > boot loader unless you know what you're doing"... so I'm not touching it > until there's a substantially good reason. I've certainly replaced uImage and rootfs (you want to keep them in sync, the *modules* are all on the rootfs) a half dozen times using just the usb cable; the current uboot seems to be stable enough for the long term. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re:3G sim cards
Harrison Metzger writes: >Many people (including I) have not been able to get the at&t 3g sim card >(the one with the "3g fireball") working in our neos. The older cingular >ones do work (they are "64K smart chip"). I dont care if it does 2g, I would >like for my at&t sim card to work in the phone. According to the GSM modem >it gives error CME 10 (sim card not inserted). any ideas? >Many people (including I) have not been able to get the at&t 3g sim >card (the one with the "3g fireball") working in our neos. The older >cingular ones do work (they are "64K smart chip"). I dont care if it >does 2g, I would like for my at&t sim card to work in the phone. >According to the GSM modem it gives error CME 10 (sim card not >inserted). any ideas? OK, several people have reported failure -- has anybody reported success? ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: 3G sim cards
On 27 Jul 2007, at 18:19, Eric Johnson wrote: It'll be a bit of a blow if the phone won't work with the largest US GSM operators SIM cards! But it's not a finished product and it's good that this issue has been identified now. It was always going to be the time when these things get detected, ie. wider usage of the hardware. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: 3G sim cards
Harrison Metzger wrote: I'm not actually sure what number you need. On the (what I would call front side) side with NO contacts there is the iccid number which is long. On the back (side with contacts) their are 2 numbers: 71324 and 4021 (please don't clone my phone, lol). So we don't play email tag I'm on IRC (name calamous_), could you mind hopping on or messaging me if you are already. Sorry, I was doing it from memory and the first digit of the four seems to be the SIM vendor so I shouldn't have said beginning with a 2. The 71324 is the SKU for the AT&T latest UICC. The 4021 is the Vendor and Version number. Based at looking at some cards the vendor numbers are 2 - G&D 3 - Gemalto 4 - Oberthur I have access to a tool monitoring the communication between the SIM and the handset so I will be able to investigate this later. Unfortunately, they haven't charged my credit card yet so at best I will not have a device for a couple of weeks and I only have access to G&D and Gemalto UICCs. Hopefully someone else can help you in the meantime. It'll be a bit of a blow if the phone won't work with the largest US GSM operators SIM cards! ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Next batch of Neo1973s.
Sudharshan S <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote : > ..and Have anyone who had ordered their devices late (..as in their > order doesn't fall in the first 1000) been billed yet. FYI our rt# was > 3054. I am aware of the fact that the ticket number is not 2615 and nothing yet. But the first batch was split into two shipments. The second shipment should be arriving soon. Once the first batch is sold out it may be a month before the next lot is ready. --- G O Jones ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Wiki application list.
Frans Grotepass wrote: > I want to order a GTA-01, but some questions still remain. > > 1: What is the status of various developments in the applications. The wiki > lacks enough informaiton. Is something like this list possible? > > http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/IriverPort#Write_low_level_code_and_drivers > Nice... I can add something like this to the wiki over the weekend, if nobody gets there first. In the meantime, here's what I'm finding works: Sending calls: Works for a few calls before crashing, but you need to adjust things like volume through a shell (restore the alsa sound profile for what you'd like--headset volume, other speaker volume, ear speaker volume, etc). Receiving calls: Crashes for me when I accept call. No audible ring -- you need to be watching screen when the calls come in, or you'll never know. Voicemail indicator: doesn't exist. Contacts: Can copy evolution addressbook.db and see all contacts. Can edit contacts. Dial button on contact does not work, but otherwise this application is getting close to usable. Calendar: Can copy evolution calender and have it show up as main calendar, but the device does not have a concept of local time--all times are UTC. Because Evolution itself isn't consistent with calendar entries, individual items are listed in the top panel with the correct time, but in the calendar views offset back to UTC. Can create/edit events. Events in list appear in order created, not in order of time. Lower calendar display shows date but not month, and you cannot scroll forwards or backwards. It's also very easy to move a calendar event (too easy, this could happen accidentally and you'd lose track of when the event should happen!). There is a GUI for adding additional calendars, but adding a new web calendar does not actually do anything. (didn't try adding a local calendar). Calculator: Works fine. Basic arithmetic only. GPS: CLI drivers/application got nuked in my initial flash (I put a note of a way you can actually back this up before flashing on the wiki--previously the instructions for backing it up required the device to be running, but you couldn't boot without flashing) -- no idea. (OpenMoko team--how can we get a copy of the GPS drivers?) Mail: Dummy program only. Has hardcoded list of messages, but can't be configured or used. Tasks: This is a task manager program, and mostly works, but the main area doesn't resize to make room for the keyboard. RSS reader: Works, but not configurable--the list of subscribed news feeds are compiled into one of the source files. Web: Can load unencrypted pages by direct URL. Some links and form submissions crash the browser. Can't add bookmarks. GPRS: Can't figure out how to do this--I don't know if this is implemented at all. I don't have a data plan yet with my carrier, though. Bluetooth: Can turn on and see other devices with hcitool. Others have gotten Bluetooth Dund working, and I see instructions for a headset profile. I haven't verified this yet. Terminal: Works great! Has screen and lots of other decent Unix stuff. Control characters/backspaces appear as boxes in the device (not in remote shells)--needs slight tweaking of termcap files... SSH-server: Works fine, though I notice I can't seem to mount the filesystem using sshfs. rsync to and from the device works. Was able to use an ssh key, and set a root password. Application manager: Seems to work, but the specified ipkg repository doesn't exist, so it's mostly useless at the moment. GSM Antennae/Status applet: Seems to alternate between on and off on each boot. Seems to generally work, but click it a couple times and the whole status panel crashes. Media player: CLI application only (madplay). No ability to control playback. Volume control: CLI only (alsamixer), stored alsa volume profiles. > 2: To what extent is it possible to use the phone as my daily phone? Are the > basic apps good enough? > I tried it out with my sim card, then moved it back to my old phone. I think it's actually good enough to use as a very basic PDA right now, if you're just looking to make your contacts and calendar portable (my #1 need). Definitely can't replace a normal phone for daily use right now. > 3: How long does the device run on a battery? > Don't know. Though I notice the screen backlight actually shuts off after about 5 minutes of inactivity when plugged in, and about 20-30 minutes of inactivity when running on battery (the opposite of what you would want)! > 4: is the uboot bootloader stable enough to make a basic model sufficient? > Seems to be. I've had 0 problems with the boot loader. I followed the guidance on the wiki that says "with a phase I phone, don't flash the boot loader unless you know what you're doing"... so I'm not touching it until there's a substantially good reason. It's definitely fun to play around with, and there's lots of stuff to do in a shell. But there are some strange missing pieces, like no cron, no
Re: [UI/Graphics] Ever heard of graff ?
On Jul 27, 2007, at 2:53 PM, Florent THIERY wrote: http://files.mdk.am/demos/graff-demo-3.avi nice demo .. a lot of this can be done through cairographics too, incidentally, and i rather like cairo's progress on the pocket, lately, anyway .. exciting times to be building apps for linux machines. ; ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Next batch of Neo1973s.
On Thu, 2007-07-26 at 13:59 +0100, Ian Stirling wrote: > Best guesses from the uninformed are that >1000 orders have been made > for phones. (based on P1_Orders, ...) > And <1000 phones have been made. > > Have the next batch been ordered? > If so, approximately when are they due? ..and Have anyone who had ordered their devices late (..as in their order doesn't fall in the first 1000) been billed yet. FYI our rt# was 3054. I am aware of the fact that the ticket number is not an indication, but still Regards Sudharshan S ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [Germany] GSM Prepaid offer from "Tchibo": user2user calls free for next 24 months
Salve Ortwin! Sorry for my bad english - and missing activitiy on this list for the examens period... Ortwin Regel schrieb am Friday, den 27. July 2007 um 15:22h: > Only Tchibo - Tchibo calls are free, and only for 24 months if you buy > before 2007-08-09. Calls to old Tchibo sims and Sims sold after the promotion periode of 9.8.2007 will be charged with 5 Cent/Minute: Only Tchibo-promotion-SIM to Tchibo-promotion-SIM is free for the next 24 month. > To benefit from this you'd have to get two or more of > this offer and give one to everyone you phone often. Yes, but 5 Euro/SIM for such a solution is not much and developing/testing phone function could be nice to have two of such SIM cards. ;) To be absolutly accurate, the SIM is comming with an asset/balance of 1 Euro, valid for 12 month. I fear using this SIM longer then 12 month will make a rechage with the lowest amount of 10 Euro necessary. So this time-limted offer means for a developer: 2x5 = 10 Euro for using Tchibo-promotion-SIM to Tchibo-promotion-SIM for 12 month for month 13-24 you have to "invest" 2x10 Euro. > SMS are relatively expensive and I wasn't able to find anything about > data... Your are right, SMS are relatively expensive, my tip was not about the best tariff for all... Just about the possibility to do free calls from one to the another... And finaly, like all flat-rate tariffs, the contract "Allgemeine Geschäftsbedingungen" says, that stationary gatways to forward external calls are not allowed to do: 4.1 Der Kunde ist verpflichtet h) die Leistungen von O2 nur zum Aufbau selbstgewählter Verbindungen zu nutzen; ihm ist insbesondere nicht gestattet, mittels einer SIM-Karte von einem Dritten hergestellte Verbindungen Über Vermittlungs- oder Übertragungssysteme weiterzuleiten oder SIM-Karten in stationären Einrichtungen, gleich welcher Art, zu installieren oder unter Verwendung von SIM-Karten Telekommunikationsdienstleistungen anzubieten oder zu vermitteln. Ok, no stationary gatway... BTW this offer shows again that the tariffs have more and more special profiles - the one it very cheap with this - the other is very cheap with that - multiple SIM inside a phone would help to profit from A and B comfortable, without a second or third phone... > > It's a pity that the Neo doesn't have a second > > SIM card slot (and a second GSM tranceiver) so > > cheap GPRS connections like Medion Mobile 0,24Euro/MB > > needs to change the SIM or a second mobil (maybe > > with Bluetooth, maybe a second neo) Greetings, rob ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: whee!
On 07/27/2007 Mark Eichin wrote: > Mark Eichin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > > > > Advanced kit arrived, yay! > > > > > > Batteries and uSD cards were missing, boo! > > Ok, now I feel stupid. Guess you get to call me a muppet after all > :-} > > The batteries and cards were all wrapped together in one of the foam > cutouts. I don't know how I missed it this morning, when I got home I > went through every compartment to double check and they were right > there. (I think I saw "white, shiny" and thought "must be > documentation". Or maybe I just hadn't had my coffee yet.) Hehe...whew. I was just about to let somebody at the factory have it ;-) Glad you got Neo. Happy hacking. -Sean ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Product naming / wiki page naming / restructuring
On 7/27/07, Harald Welte <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > There might come > > > > Neo1974 or even > > Neo2007 > > Yes. And actually, nijutsu will also tell us about the Neo1907 at some > point :) > FIC vacuum cleaner? Camera? What about the Neo968? Neo1979? ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Wiki application list.
Frans Grotepass wrote: I want to order a GTA-01, but some questions still remain. 1: What is the status of various developments in the applications. The wiki lacks enough informaiton. Is something like this list possible? http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/IriverPort#Write_low_level_code_and_drivers There isn't really a similar one - yet. 2: To what extent is it possible to use the phone as my daily phone? Are the basic apps good enough? Haha. For the moment, and for some time in the future, a Nokia 1100 will be a considerably better phone. At the moment, most of the applications are unstable, and it is not really possible to place or recieve phones. 3: How long does the device run on a battery? 3-6 hours. The power managment is mostly unimplemented. Search on Power Managment on the wiki. In principle, it should last >36 hours with bluetooth active, and a week or so idle listening for calls, and 20 hours playing MP3. It is _NOT_ in this condition yet. 4: is the uboot bootloader stable enough to make a basic model sufficient? ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Data Link Disable Capability?
David S Gathright wrote: Thanks for the replies, all. I guess what I was wishing for was a 'built-in' way to disable the connection (call it 'economy mode' for the 'thrift-conscious'). I can settle for a hack, though, I suppose...as long as it's not too much of a pain (i.e. having to repeat N steps every N day/hours/etc). There are many 'least cost routing' ideas both for calls and data. GPRS is not implemented yet really. That's part of this. There is no way there won't be an option to miss it out. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
3G sim cards
On the IRC channel sunkist has confirmed this problem too. nibbler_de said that the sim card that at&t makes is definitely a Oberthur CS SIMphonIC 3G and that it is comparable with 2G phones still. but how come many people who tried this card all reported that it didn't work? I'm wondering if a hardware guy could look into this ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [Germany] GSM Prepaid offer from "Tchibo": user2user calls free for next 24 months
Only Tchibo - Tchibo calls are free, and only for 24 months if you buy before 2007-08-09. To benefit from this you'd have to get two or more of this offer and give one to everyone you phone often. SMS are relatively expensive and I wasn't able to find anything about data... Ortwin On 7/27/07, Robert Michel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Salve, > > sorry that this is only a tip for OpenMoko people > in Germany - there is a quite interesting > offer since today: > > Prepaid SIM for 5 Euro with free calls to other > SIMs (users) of this special sold offer for the > next 24 month. I haven't found a limitation of > minutes/month. > http://www.tchibo.de > :) > > I think there is something like "fair-use" > so when you/I use this offer less intensive > then some teenies > > > This offer use the network of O2 and it could > be that this free calls are only valid inside > the O2 network in Germany. If the mobil use > the D1 roaming inside Germany it could be that > this calls are not for free... (I will check this) > and realy cool would it be, when datacalls from > Tchibo-SIM to Tchibo-SIM would be free as well. > > The selling this special Prepaid-cards is anounced > to run until 9.8.2007. > > See also: > http://www.teltarif.de/arch/2007/kw30/s26634.html > > > BTW: the shops have mobils as well, I had the luck to > get a Nokia 1112 with Prepaid SIM for 20 Euro. > The battery BL-5CA of this mobil is Neo1973 compatible > (already tested) and has a charger that could > help when your are going to buy a stand alone > battery charger from Nokia or third-party vendor. > > The FIC GTC-01/GTA-01 battery is setting the > Nokia 1112 into "test mode" - so this > 20 Euro inc Prepaid-SIM offer is not realy > likly to work as "Second Battery for the neo, > Battery Charger and Prepaid-SIM" deal > > > But the sim itself (with a second sim of this > offer) would be very interesting to use with > the neo. > > It's a pity that the Neo doesn't have a second > SIM card slot (and a second GSM tranceiver) so > cheap GPRS connections like Medion Mobile 0,24Euro/MB > needs to change the SIM or a second mobil (maybe > with Bluetooth, maybe a second neo) > > Greetings, > rob > > > > > ___ > OpenMoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community > ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Wiki application list.
On 7/27/07, Frans Grotepass <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > I want to order a GTA-01, but some questions still remain. > > 1: What is the status of various developments in the applications. The > wiki > lacks enough informaiton. Is something like this list possible? GTA01 is an early stage devs version and the first phones only started arriving yesterday. The phone can make and receive phone calls and has some really basic apps like calendar, calculator, etc. UI still desperately needs attention. http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Developer_preview http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/IriverPort#Write_low_level_code_and_drivers Website is down. 2: To what extent is it possible to use the phone as my daily phone? Are the > basic apps good enough? Depends on what you can do without (temporarily of course). You can check it out under qemu - http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/OpenMoko_under_QEMU 3: How long does the device run on a battery? No one knows. Battery is 1200mAh for GTA01. Going by my phone with a dinky 850mAh and a few more features which lasts about 3.5 hrs with everything cranked, I'd say the neo will last about 5 hrs with everything cranked. Though power management was still a bit flaky last I checked (may have been fixed by now). 4: is the uboot bootloader stable enough to make a basic model sufficient? > It seems stable, but I don't know that it's enough for daily use. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
[UI/Graphics] Ever heard of graff ?
I never heard about it, but it looks interesting (following the physics-inspired/verlet integration ramble some months ago on this very list) http://www.mdk.org.pl/articles/2007/04/23/chapter-1-in-which-we-meet-graff Be sure to check out this one (scrolling list with inertia scrolling) http://files.mdk.am/demos/graff-demo-3.avi No mention of OpenGL ES, but software rendering seems to be sufficient on Nokia 770/800. Let's wait for more news of graff (any additional data would be appreciated), and code. But it looks definetly promising ! A python app, tracker backend, using graff (clutter/evas) as frontend, with gtk offscreen rendering and builtin mutimedia support (gstreamer or whatever lighter) ... Makes you want to have a GTA02 already :) Speaking of which * jnpatel's arena will be a clutter tracker frontend with direct webservices integration (ex: flickr). http://njpatel.blogspot.com/2007/03/im-not-even-supposed-to-be-here-today.html * some nice clutter toys news: http://njpatel.blogspot.com/2007/07/clutter-foo.html Any benchmarking news ? Regards, Florent ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Product naming / wiki page naming / restructuring
Gabriel Ambuehl <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote : > I don't think Ubuntu did very badly with (Y)Y.MM release naming. Except for > the Dapper slippage maybe, but that was warranted by any means... Plus you > can use future dates for unstable (right now the next Ubuntu release is > 7.10 I guess one thing to consider is OpenMoko is seperate to the hardware. OpenMoko is a phone OS core. Each vendor/project wishing to use it will select a version of OpenMoko and then add their own platform specific code where needed (boot code, hardware drivers, configuration). Therefore an OpenMoko solution will have two software versions, core and platform. So the Neo1973 information screen might show something like: OpenMoko core 1.0 Neo platform 1.1 Boot loader 1.3 Hardware revision 2 etc... --- G O Jones ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
[Germany] GSM Prepaid offer from "Tchibo": user2user calls free for next 24 months
Salve, sorry that this is only a tip for OpenMoko people in Germany - there is a quite interesting offer since today: Prepaid SIM for 5 Euro with free calls to other SIMs (users) of this special sold offer for the next 24 month. I haven't found a limitation of minutes/month. http://www.tchibo.de :) I think there is something like "fair-use" so when you/I use this offer less intensive then some teenies This offer use the network of O2 and it could be that this free calls are only valid inside the O2 network in Germany. If the mobil use the D1 roaming inside Germany it could be that this calls are not for free... (I will check this) and realy cool would it be, when datacalls from Tchibo-SIM to Tchibo-SIM would be free as well. The selling this special Prepaid-cards is anounced to run until 9.8.2007. See also: http://www.teltarif.de/arch/2007/kw30/s26634.html BTW: the shops have mobils as well, I had the luck to get a Nokia 1112 with Prepaid SIM for 20 Euro. The battery BL-5CA of this mobil is Neo1973 compatible (already tested) and has a charger that could help when your are going to buy a stand alone battery charger from Nokia or third-party vendor. The FIC GTC-01/GTA-01 battery is setting the Nokia 1112 into "test mode" - so this 20 Euro inc Prepaid-SIM offer is not realy likly to work as "Second Battery for the neo, Battery Charger and Prepaid-SIM" deal But the sim itself (with a second sim of this offer) would be very interesting to use with the neo. It's a pity that the Neo doesn't have a second SIM card slot (and a second GSM tranceiver) so cheap GPRS connections like Medion Mobile 0,24Euro/MB needs to change the SIM or a second mobil (maybe with Bluetooth, maybe a second neo) Greetings, rob ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Product naming / wiki page naming / restructuring
On Friday 27 July 2007 13:25:26 Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller wrote: > >>> OpenMoko-0.5 or whatever scheme is already in place. > >> > >> -2007 and -2008 so far. We might have 200x.y at some point. > > Hm. I think using year-names is not a good choice for software > versions (mainly talking about stable releases). > It psychologically forces you to do one major release every year. But > if you do it twice a year you run into troubles. I don't think Ubuntu did very badly with (Y)Y.MM release naming. Except for the Dapper slippage maybe, but that was warranted by any means... Plus you can use future dates for unstable (right now the next Ubuntu release is 7.10 pgpPhEgMGS19X.pgp Description: PGP signature ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Product naming / wiki page naming / restructuring
Harald Welte skrev: Hi! Since we're now working on the "phase 2 neo", i.e. what is now known officially as "Neo1973 GTA02", I'd like to address one issue: For many information in the public wiki, it is not clear whether it is 1) general information about the openmoko 2007 software 1b) information about future software plans, unrelated to old software. So old software should be tagged as 'OpenMoko 2007 Software' or similar. 2) general information common to the Neo1973 phones 3) information specific to Neo1973 GTA01 4) information specific to Neo1973 GTA02 The main two pieces need sooner or later be more distinctly separated. A) OpenMoko the distribution. Your 1) and 1b) go there. Together with sours code, bugtracker, general info of what chipset and standards that is needed/supported. B) Products/targets using OpenMoko. B1) Produkts officaly supporting the use of OpenMoko. Neo1973 will so far be alone here, and 2), 3) and 4) shuld end up here. together with (links to) the neo1973-qemu, binarys for the neo, repro targeting the neo etc. B2) Produkts with hackers port of OpenMoko... At least a list with links. The right name for B) is hard... but if it's target, then anything Neo1973 related should go to: /Target/Neo1973/ And everything outside /Target/ is general OpenMoko stuff. /LaH ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Product naming / wiki page naming / restructuring
OpenMoko-0.5 or whatever scheme is already in place. -2007 and -2008 so far. We might have 200x.y at some point. Hm. I think using year-names is not a good choice for software versions (mainly talking about stable releases). It psychologically forces you to do one major release every year. But if you do it twice a year you run into troubles. MS used Windows 95, NT, 2000, XP, Vista and Service Packs, etc. Apple uses 10.3 (Panther), 10.4 (Tiger), 10.5 (Leopard) and fractional numbers etc. What I really found confusing is Maemo and the Nokia tablets. I know that I have a N770 but I would have to spend too much time to find what is the latest release that runs on my device. So it is now used as a paperweight :-( If you take a look on PalmOS, I always hated that I cannot install my PalmOS version X.Y to my device, because it's only for new hardware. Yes, like Maemo 3.0 that is to my knowledge not available for the Nokia 770 (and if I do not spend the time to find out, how should a consumer do?). AFAIK, there will be only one software name for all (future) Neo devices, so how to name it and understand that you need *minimum* version 2008.0 to use with your device (for example) ? And the opposite, could you upgrade your Neo1973 GTA01v4 with the OpenMoko-2009.2 ? Yes, that is IMHO a very important requirement: *every* new stable release should run on *all* older hardware (at least up to 3 or 4 years!). But it *may* have limitations in supporting new features and provide some fall-back. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
RE: 3G sim cards
I don't have a Neo however I do have a AT&T 3G fireball card.I can definitely confirm that this works in much much older 2g handsets (I have a few older 2g handsets that I've traded up from over time). The newest at&t sim that came with my last new handset 6 months ago (cingular 8525-htc hermes) works in all the other older handsets. Regards, Dean Collins Cognation Pty Ltd [EMAIL PROTECTED] +1-212-203-4357 Ph +61-2-9016-5642 (Sydney in-dial). -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Eric Johnson Sent: Friday, 27 July 2007 1:48 AM To: Harrison Metzger Cc: community@lists.openmoko.org Subject: Re: 3G sim cards Harrison Metzger wrote: > Many people (including I) have not been able to get the at&t 3g sim > card (the one with the "3g fireball") working in our neos. The older > cingular ones do work (they are "64K smart chip"). I dont care if it > does 2g, I would like for my at&t sim card to work in the phone. > According to the GSM modem it gives error CME 10 (sim card not > inserted). any ideas? Well the AT&T 3G cards are definitely have both a SIM and USIM application on them and AT&T do a lot of device testing before approving the cards so it really should work. Can you say what the Vendor and Version Number of the UICC is? This is the 4 digit number beginning with a 2 under the "3g fireball" on the front of the card. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Product naming / wiki page naming / restructuring
Le vendredi 27 juillet 2007 à 18:24 +0800, Harald Welte a écrit : > > So, we will have > > > > Neo1973-1.0 = "GTA01" > > Neo1973-2.0 = "GTA02" > > well, please don't add numbers like 1.0/2.0, since that would just lead > to further confusion. I really think it makes sense to use one naming > scheme, and don't differentiate between 'inside the company' and 'outsid > the company' Strongly agree, but in the other hand, hardware naming should be simple enough to let people understand what devices they got. Let see other mobile product, they have brand, model and version (numbers). GTA01 is quite hard to remember, but could do the trick. For example, Palm got different hardware base (Zire, Tungsten, ...) and numbers (Zire 31/71/22, Tungsten T3/E3, ...). So hardware base models and revisions should have clear and simple naming scheme that let user know what devices they buy (and what they got inside). > > OpenMoko-0.5 or whatever scheme is already in place. > > -2007 and -2008 so far. We might have 200x.y at some point. If you take a look on PalmOS, I always hated that I cannot install my PalmOS version X.Y to my device, because it's only for new hardware. AFAIK, there will be only one software name for all (future) Neo devices, so how to name it and understand that you need *minimum* version 2008.0 to use with your device (for example) ? And the opposite, could you upgrade your Neo1973 GTA01v4 with the OpenMoko-2009.2 ? > > Each phase can also get a consumer-friendly nickname. > > Well, there only is one phase in which consumers get involved: phase 2. > What does it mean about revision and software naming ? Did you plan to have "developer" and "user" naming scheme ? This can be harder to implement, but probably easier to follow from a "normal user" (read non developer). As you said before, have a clear naming convention will help to organize stuff like documentation, wiki, filesnames and so on. Best regards -- Alexandre ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Product naming / wiki page naming / restructuring
Hi Nikolaus, thanks for your feedback. On Fri, Jul 27, 2007 at 12:02:26PM +0200, Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller wrote: > Well, I think we will have to separate > > a) different hardware variants (and subvariants) of the Neo yes. > b) different software variants (and subvariants) of OpenMoko yes. > There is good practice to use the dot notation. unfortunately that is not how we call our revisions so far :) > So, we will have > > Neo1973-1.0 = "GTA01" > Neo1973-2.0 = "GTA02" well, please don't add numbers like 1.0/2.0, since that would just lead to further confusion. I really think it makes sense to use one naming scheme, and don't differentiate between 'inside the company' and 'outsid the company' > There might come > > Neo1974 or even > Neo2007 Yes. And actually, nijutsu will also tell us about the Neo1907 at some point :) > and > OpenMoko-0.5 or whatever scheme is already in place. -2007 and -2008 so far. We might have 200x.y at some point. > If someone wants to refer to a class of versions/releases, just remove the > rightmost parts: > > Neo - meaning any hardware true. > Neo1973 - meaning any release true. > Neo1973-1 - meaning any version of GTA01 (if there are sub-versions) just call it 'Neo1973 GTA01' or even more specific 'Neo1973 GTA01Bv4' > OpenMoko - meaning any software release > OpenMoko-0 - meaning any developer releases > OpenMoko-1 - meaning the first official release yes, though the numbers are currently 2007/2008 > This ends up in a matrix of devices&software versions, e.g. (I have not > completed the list - that is your task) > > Phase 0 = Neo1973-1.0 + OpenMoko-0.1 > Phase 1 = Neo1973-1.1 + OpenMoko-0.3 > Phase 2 = Neo1973-2.0 + OpenMoko-1.0 > ... > Phase 117 = Neo2007-2.7 + OpenMoko-4.3 No, _every_ product will have it's own phase 0/1/2. It's just that GTA01 was so delayed, that we overlapped GTA01 and GTA02 phases, i.e. we will have phase 0 and 1 with GTA01, and phase 1 and 2 with GTA02. So for the next $product, we will again start with phase 0, then 1, then 2. The time scale between the phases will hopefully be massively accelerated. > Each phase can also get a consumer-friendly nickname. Well, there only is one phase in which consumers get involved: phase 2. -- - Harald Welte <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://openmoko.org/ Software for the world's first truly open Free Software mobile phone ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Product naming / wiki page naming / restructuring
Am 26.07.2007 um 17:53 schrieb Harald Welte: Hi! Since we're now working on the "phase 2 neo", i.e. what is now known officially as "Neo1973 GTA02", I'd like to address one issue: For many information in the public wiki, it is not clear whether it is 1) general information about the openmoko 2007 software 1b) information about future software plans, unrelated to old software. So old software should be tagged as 'OpenMoko 2007 Software' or similar. 2) general information common to the Neo1973 phones 3) information specific to Neo1973 GTA01 4) information specific to Neo1973 GTA02 Well, I think we will have to separate a) different hardware variants (and subvariants) of the Neo b) different software variants (and subvariants) of OpenMoko There is good practice to use the dot notation. So, we will have Neo1973-1.0 = "GTA01" Neo1973-2.0 = "GTA02" There might come Neo1974 or even Neo2007 and OpenMoko-0.5 or whatever scheme is already in place. If someone wants to refer to a class of versions/releases, just remove the rightmost parts: Neo - meaning any hardware Neo1973 - meaning any release Neo1973-1 - meaning any version of GTA01 (if there are sub-versions) OpenMoko - meaning any software release OpenMoko-0 - meaning any developer releases OpenMoko-1 - meaning the first official release This ends up in a matrix of devices&software versions, e.g. (I have not completed the list - that is your task) Phase 0 = Neo1973-1.0 + OpenMoko-0.1 Phase 1 = Neo1973-1.1 + OpenMoko-0.3 Phase 2 = Neo1973-2.0 + OpenMoko-1.0 ... Phase 117 = Neo2007-2.7 + OpenMoko-4.3 Each phase can also get a consumer-friendly nickname. This scheme can IMHO also be used to organize Wiki Pages and Subpages (links). Aliases can be used to map/link the existing page names to a new scheme. Nikolaus ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Re: greetings and a question
to, 2007-07-26 kello 22:07 -0700, tyler laing kirjoitti: > What I meant is, in the consumer version, will this be possible? And I > meant "driver", not drive. I'm sorry I wasn't clear enough in my first > question. Thanks for your time! First of all, the first respondent was in fact incorrect. Even the development version has Bluetooth, which _can_ be used for wireless networking between Neos and/or computers. The range is smaller than with WiFi, as is the bandwidth, but at least the latter is likely to be quite enough for most uses. The mass-market Neo's AR6K will add ad-hoc wifi capabilities, adding bandwidth and range at the cost of more power. Both will of course require connection setup control software, but that shouldn't be too much of a burden. -- Mikko Rauhala - [EMAIL PROTECTED] - http://www.iki.fi/mjr/> Transhumanist - WTA member - http://www.transhumanism.org/> Singularitarian - SIAI supporter - http://www.singinst.org/> ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Wiki application list.
I want to order a GTA-01, but some questions still remain. 1: What is the status of various developments in the applications. The wiki lacks enough informaiton. Is something like this list possible? http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/IriverPort#Write_low_level_code_and_drivers 2: To what extent is it possible to use the phone as my daily phone? Are the basic apps good enough? 3: How long does the device run on a battery? 4: is the uboot bootloader stable enough to make a basic model sufficient? ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: whee!
On 27/07/07, Mark Eichin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Mark Eichin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > > > Advanced kit arrived, yay! > > > > Batteries and uSD cards were missing, boo! > > Ok, now I feel stupid. Guess you get to call me a muppet after all :-} I reckon you were just trying to cheer us up while we wait for our phones ;) -Pete The batteries and cards were all wrapped together in one of the foam > cutouts. I don't know how I missed it this morning, when I got home I > went through every compartment to double check and they were right > there. (I think I saw "white, shiny" and thought "must be > documentation". Or maybe I just hadn't had my coffee yet.) > > Apologies to all involved! > > > ___ > OpenMoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community > ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
