Re: [darktable-user] Re: Problem when I open raw files to edit on DARKTABLE

[Patrick Shanahan]

* Jean-Luc CECCOLI  [02-02-18 15:10]:
> Hello,
> 
>  
> 
> In addition to Peter and Patrick posts, and I think this has been discussed 
> many times - here and elsewhere -, it all depends on one's tastes.
> 
> Some people will love the out-of-the-camera jpegs, while others will hate 
> them.
> 
> The fact that 999 will say they like an output very much doesn't mean you 
> will have to like it too.
> 
> All people don't feel the same looking at the same scene.
> 
> RAW allows to process photos according to one's tastes and feelings.
> 
> I think, with no intention of injuring anyone, that jpegs are for people who 
> don't want to bother with processing, or who need instant outputs.
> 
> Should I go further, I would compare RAW is family cooking, and jpeg with 
> industrial food.
> 
> The cameras embedded software make excellent industrial food, Darktable helps 
> you cook excellent home-made recipes, should you take the time to learn 
> cooking.
> 
>  
> 
> Regards,
> 
>  
> 
> J.-Luc
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
> > Message du 02/02/18 12:55
> > De : "Diego Queres" 
> > A : "Peter Cripps" 
> 
> > Copie à : darktable-user@lists.darktable.org
> > Objet : Re: [darktable-user] Re: Problem when I open raw files to edit on 
> > DARKTABLE
> > 
> >
> Yes I understand. Because opening the file and it being different from jpg 
> causes certain frustration.
> >
> 
> >
> I'll test another softwares too, to see the result.
> 
> 
> >
> 2018-02-02 0:33 GMT-02:00 Peter Cripps 
> :
> >
> 
> 
> > I see Jean-Luc has made a couple of interesting posts. All I have to add is 
> > that I opened your .CR2 file, and I do see the same effects that you 
> > observe. This is on 2.4.1, Linux Mint 18.3. I also opened the file using 
> > Lightroom, and again saw an initial image much darker than the .jpeg, with 
> > some noise.
> 
> > I was able to match the jpeg pretty well by increasing exposure, reducing 
> > highlights, and tweaking levels. And profiled denoise did an excellent job, 
> > as Jean-Luc observed.
> 
> > In the past, several people have pointed out that the raw files are just a 
> > starting point, and you wouldn't necessarily expect them to match the jpeg. 
> > But I will say that I find it convenient if they do look very similar, 
> > especially if the in-camera jpeg processing is good.
> > 
> 
> 
> 
> > 
> > 
> 
> > 
> > 
> 
> > 
> >
> 
> 
> >
> On 02/01/2018 07:58 AM, Diego Queres wrote:
> >
> 
> Ok,
> 
> >
> I'll attach the original cr2 file. And the jpg file.
> 
> >
> I suspect the problem can be color profile (or something like it)... 
> 
> >
> Maybe Darktable has problems to identify it... and let the picture darker. 
> 
> >
> I test open CR2 file with Picture Viewer and shows the picture ok.
> When I open on Shotwell or Darktable, the picture shows darker and with 
> noise...
> 
> >
> But i don't know the exactly problem...
> 
> >
> I use Darktable 2.4.0. Ubuntu 16.04.
> 
> >
> 
> >
> 
>  IMG_0337.CR2
> 
>  IMG_0337.JPG
> 
> >
> 
> >
> 
> 
> >
> 2018-01-31 20:12 GMT-02:00 Peter Cripps 
> :
> >
> 
> 
> > Can you post the .CR2 file for that picture? I saw the .CR2 that you posted 
> > earlier, but it was a different image; the roses weren't pure red like 
> > these.
> >
> 
> 
> >
> On 01/31/2018 01:56 PM, Diego Queres wrote:
> >
> 
> See the pictures:
> >
> 
> 
> > 
> > 
> >  darktable user mailing list to unsubscribe send a mail to 
> > darktable-user+unsubscr...@lists.darktable.org 
> > 
> 
> 
> 
> >
> 
> > 
> >  darktable user mailing list to unsubscribe send a mail to 
> > darktable-user+unsubscr...@lists.darktable.org 
> >
> 
> > 
> > 
> >  darktable user mailing list to unsubscribe send a mail to 
> > darktable-user+unsubscr...@lists.darktable.org 
> >
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> >
> 
> > 
> >  darktable user mailing list to unsubscribe send a mail to 
> > darktable-user+unsubscr...@lists.darktable.org 
> >
> 
> darktable user mailing list
> to unsubscribe send a mail to darktable-user+unsubscr...@lists.darktable.org
> 


AND, if you really like the in-camera jpgs that much or better, it is a
simple thing to save them rather than take the trouble to process the
raw's in in darktable.  if you want the look of the jpg instead of the
look from darktable, take the jpg and save effort and time.

I fail to understand the need for discussion.  every raw processing
software "except" that from the camera manufacturer shows a different jpg
when not showing the embeded one, and all suffer the same problem.  not
having access to the manufacturer's process(es).

develop or not, like or not.  IT IS A CHOICE for you.

-- 

Re: [darktable-user] history stack still containing disabled modules after compression - why?

[Jean-Luc CECCOLI]

Hello,

 

Don't know if I really understood the problem... anyway...

When I want to remove an instance of a module form the history, for example the 
Exposure, I add a deactivated version of it on the top of the history.

So, I have Exposure activated somewhere in the middle of the stack, and the 
same deactivated at the top.

I select the top or the stack, compress the history, which removes the 
activated instance and lets the deactivated one still on the top.

Then, I select the module straight under the deactivated one, compress the 
history and... I'm happy.

DT doesn't work nor look the same as other photo processing softwares, that's 
why it is DT - enjoy !

 

Regards,

 

J.-Luc

 

 

 

 

> Message du 02/02/18 14:32
> De : "Harald" 
> A : darktable-user@lists.darktable.org
> Copie à : 
> Objet : Re: [darktable-user] history stack still containing disabled modules 
> after compression - why?
> 
> I do think I am talking about a 3. type of use cases...
> 
> There are for sure many reasons or use cases why not to remove a
> disabled module during the photo processing work flow.
> 
> My point is, that at a final step, at the end of the work flow, all the
> selections and decisions have been made already. Then and only then I do
> want to do the final compress and clean.
> 
> At that point in time a remove of unused or disabled modules would be
> very helpful.
> 
> Only this clean stack might be the basis for a new style or used for
> copying further.
> 
> Not arrived yet at this final step, in between or during the work flow,
> there is no need for removing the entries for disabled modules...
> 
> ... and at that time no need to compress the history stack but at the
> end of the process.
> 
> Haribo M
> Am 01.02.2018 um 16:46 schrieb Remco Viëtor:
> > On jeudi 1 février 2018 15:18:27 CET Matthew Harrison wrote:
> >> Why would compress history stack do that? It shouldn't be too hard to
> >> check if a module is in the default list and leave disabled copies of those
> >> when cleaning up whilst removing the others.
> >>
> > The current implementation of "compress history stack" has one important 
> > propery: it does /nothing/ that influences your edit session, it only 
> > removes 
> > modules that cannot have an effect. Removing modules that are turned off 
> > breaks 
> > that.
> >
> > Use case: you want to use e.g. equaliser or profiled denoise, perhaps with 
> > some 
> > parametric or user mask. Good, no problem, just a bit time consuming to set 
> > up 
> > to your liking. Then you want to convert to black and white, or play with 
> > some 
> > colour changes. 
> > Both equaliser and profiled denoise are quite slow (imply a lot of 
> > calculation). So while you want to play with the conversions, it can be 
> > nice 
> > to turn those two off. 
> > But after playing with colour conversions, you can end up with a lot of 
> > unused 
> > modules in the history, 
> >
> > So please leave modules that are just turned off in the stack on 
> > compressing.
> > Perhaps add an option to remove all unused modules (unused == unreachable 
> > or 
> > turned off).
> >
> > Remco
> > 
> > darktable user mailing list
> > to unsubscribe send a mail to darktable-user+unsubscr...@lists.darktable.org
> >
> >
> 
> 
> darktable user mailing list
> to unsubscribe send a mail to darktable-user+unsubscr...@lists.darktable.org
> 
>

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Re: [darktable-user] Re: Problem when I open raw files to edit on DARKTABLE

[Jean-Luc CECCOLI]

Hello,

 

In addition to Peter and Patrick posts, and I think this has been discussed 
many times - here and elsewhere -, it all depends on one's tastes.

Some people will love the out-of-the-camera jpegs, while others will hate them.

The fact that 999 will say they like an output very much doesn't mean you will 
have to like it too.

All people don't feel the same looking at the same scene.

RAW allows to process photos according to one's tastes and feelings.

I think, with no intention of injuring anyone, that jpegs are for people who 
don't want to bother with processing, or who need instant outputs.

Should I go further, I would compare RAW is family cooking, and jpeg with 
industrial food.

The cameras embedded software make excellent industrial food, Darktable helps 
you cook excellent home-made recipes, should you take the time to learn cooking.

 

Regards,

 

J.-Luc

 

 

 

 

> Message du 02/02/18 12:55
> De : "Diego Queres" 
> A : "Peter Cripps" 

> Copie à : darktable-user@lists.darktable.org
> Objet : Re: [darktable-user] Re: Problem when I open raw files to edit on 
> DARKTABLE
> 
>
Yes I understand. Because opening the file and it being different from jpg 
causes certain frustration.
>

>
I'll test another softwares too, to see the result.


>
2018-02-02 0:33 GMT-02:00 Peter Cripps 
:
>


> I see Jean-Luc has made a couple of interesting posts. All I have to add is 
> that I opened your .CR2 file, and I do see the same effects that you observe. 
> This is on 2.4.1, Linux Mint 18.3. I also opened the file using Lightroom, 
> and again saw an initial image much darker than the .jpeg, with some noise.

> I was able to match the jpeg pretty well by increasing exposure, reducing 
> highlights, and tweaking levels. And profiled denoise did an excellent job, 
> as Jean-Luc observed.

> In the past, several people have pointed out that the raw files are just a 
> starting point, and you wouldn't necessarily expect them to match the jpeg. 
> But I will say that I find it convenient if they do look very similar, 
> especially if the in-camera jpeg processing is good.
> 



> 
> 

> 
> 

> 
>


>
On 02/01/2018 07:58 AM, Diego Queres wrote:
>

Ok,

>
I'll attach the original cr2 file. And the jpg file.

>
I suspect the problem can be color profile (or something like it)... 

>
Maybe Darktable has problems to identify it... and let the picture darker. 

>
I test open CR2 file with Picture Viewer and shows the picture ok.
When I open on Shotwell or Darktable, the picture shows darker and with noise...

>
But i don't know the exactly problem...

>
I use Darktable 2.4.0. Ubuntu 16.04.

>

>

 IMG_0337.CR2

 IMG_0337.JPG

>

>


>
2018-01-31 20:12 GMT-02:00 Peter Cripps 
:
>


> Can you post the .CR2 file for that picture? I saw the .CR2 that you posted 
> earlier, but it was a different image; the roses weren't pure red like these.
>


>
On 01/31/2018 01:56 PM, Diego Queres wrote:
>

See the pictures:
>


> 
>  
> darktable user mailing list to unsubscribe send a mail to 
> darktable-user+unsubscr...@lists.darktable.org 
> 



>

>  
> darktable user mailing list to unsubscribe send a mail to 
> darktable-user+unsubscr...@lists.darktable.org 
>

> 
>  
> darktable user mailing list to unsubscribe send a mail to 
> darktable-user+unsubscr...@lists.darktable.org 
>





>

>  
> darktable user mailing list to unsubscribe send a mail to 
> darktable-user+unsubscr...@lists.darktable.org 
>

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Re: [darktable-user] history stack still containing disabled modules after compression - why?

[Harald]

I do think I am talking about a 3. type of use cases...

There are for sure many reasons or use cases why not to remove a
disabled module during the photo processing work flow.

My point is, that at a final step, at the end of the work flow, all the
selections and decisions have been made already. Then and only then I do
want to do the final compress and clean.

At that point in time a remove of unused or disabled modules would be
very helpful.

Only this clean stack might be the basis for a new style or used for
copying further.

Not arrived yet at this final step, in between or during the work flow,
there is no need for removing the entries for disabled modules...

... and at that time no need to compress the history stack but at the
end of the process.

Haribo M
Am 01.02.2018 um 16:46 schrieb Remco Viëtor:
> On jeudi 1 février 2018 15:18:27 CET Matthew Harrison wrote:
>>  Why would compress history stack do that? It shouldn't be too hard to
>> check if a module is in the default list and leave disabled copies of those
>> when cleaning up whilst removing the others.
>>
> The current implementation of "compress history stack" has one important 
> propery: it does /nothing/ that influences your edit session, it only removes 
> modules that cannot have an effect. Removing modules that are turned off 
> breaks 
> that.
>
> Use case: you want to use e.g. equaliser or profiled denoise, perhaps with 
> some 
> parametric or user mask. Good, no problem, just a bit time consuming to set 
> up 
> to your liking. Then you want to convert to black and white, or play with 
> some 
> colour changes. 
> Both equaliser and profiled denoise are quite slow (imply a lot of 
> calculation). So while you want to play with the conversions, it can be nice 
> to turn those two off.  
> But after playing with colour conversions, you can end up with a lot of 
> unused 
> modules in the history, 
>
> So please leave modules that are just turned off in the stack on compressing.
> Perhaps add an option to remove all unused modules (unused == unreachable or 
> turned off).
>
> Remco
> 
> darktable user mailing list
> to unsubscribe send a mail to darktable-user+unsubscr...@lists.darktable.org
>
>


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Re: [darktable-user] Re: Problem when I open raw files to edit on DARKTABLE

[Diego Queres]

Yes I understand. Because opening the file and it being different from jpg
causes certain frustration.

I'll test another softwares too, to see the result.

2018-02-02 0:33 GMT-02:00 Peter Cripps :

> I see Jean-Luc has made a couple of interesting posts. All I have to add
> is that I opened your .CR2 file, and I do see the same effects that you
> observe. This is on 2.4.1, Linux Mint 18.3. I also opened the file using
> Lightroom, and again saw an initial image much darker than the .jpeg, with
> some noise.
>
> I was able to match the jpeg pretty well by increasing exposure, reducing
> highlights, and tweaking levels. And profiled denoise did an excellent job,
> as Jean-Luc observed.
>
> In the past, several people have pointed out that the raw files are just a
> starting point, and you wouldn't necessarily expect them to match the jpeg.
> But I will say that I find it convenient if they do look very similar,
> especially if the in-camera jpeg processing is good.
>
>
>
>
>
> On 02/01/2018 07:58 AM, Diego Queres wrote:
>
> Ok,
>
> I'll attach the original cr2 file. And the jpg file.
>
> I suspect the problem can be color profile (or something like it)...
>
> Maybe Darktable has problems to identify it... and let the picture darker.
>
> I test open CR2 file with Picture Viewer and shows the picture ok.
> When I open on Shotwell or Darktable, the picture shows darker and with
> noise...
>
> But i don't know the exactly problem...
>
> I use Darktable 2.4.0. Ubuntu 16.04.
>
>
> ​
>  IMG_0337.CR2
> 
> ​​
>  IMG_0337.JPG
> 
> ​
>
>
> 2018-01-31 20:12 GMT-02:00 Peter Cripps :
>
>> Can you post the .CR2 file for that picture? I saw the .CR2 that you
>> posted earlier, but it was a different image; the roses weren't pure red
>> like these.
>>
>> On 01/31/2018 01:56 PM, Diego Queres wrote:
>>
>> See the pictures:
>>
>>
>>
>> 
>> darktable user mailing list to unsubscribe send a mail to
>> darktable-user+unsubscr...@lists.darktable.org
>>
>
>
> 
> darktable user mailing list to unsubscribe send a mail to
> darktable-user+unsubscr...@lists.darktable.org
>
>
>
> 
> darktable user mailing list to unsubscribe send a mail to
> darktable-user+unsubscr...@lists.darktable.org
>


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Re: [darktable-user] Right click to favourite a module

[Tobias Ellinghaus]

Am Freitag, 2. Februar 2018, 01:30:43 CET schrieb Alex Delaforce:
> Hi All,
> 2.4.1 on two Windows 10 machines
> 
> On my work machine I right click a module title bar and select favourite.
> On my home machine I have to go to the 'more module' list to favourite as
> right click doesn't work.

What about clicking the icon with the three lines with the left mouse button? 
Or right clicking elsewhere in the module?

> I thought I had 2.4.1 on both machines - am I just wrong with my version or
> is there a setting I am missing?

There shouldn't be a setting involved. You can see the version of darktable in 
the top left corner of the window, please check that it's 2.4.1.

> Can I just say generally, I am really appreciative of all the dev and debug
> work that is done to give us Darktable - the program  is an absolute joy to
> use. Brilliant stuff - thanks to all.

:-)

> Cheers
> Alex

Tobias

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Re: [darktable-user] history stack still containing disabled modules after compression - why?

[André Felipe Carvalho]

I agree with this scenario: Should not remove disabled module in history
stack when compressing it.

But I would like to be able to remove any module I want in the history
stack (right-click on it and choosing delete, for instance).
I've filed a request on redmine about it:
https://redmine.darktable.org/issues/11269#change-30820

Best regards,
André



2018-02-01 18:13 GMT-02:00 thokster :

> Am 01.02.2018 um 19:25 schrieb Pascal Obry:
>
>> Another scenario as to why the disabled modules should not be removed.
>>
>> You hesitate between two ways of removing noise (profil denoise, or
>> non-local means). One is disabled but you've tweaked the other quite a
>> bit on the image and *may want* to enable it and disable the other.
>> This is a common scenario for me. So I do not want the compress history
>> stack to remove the disabled modules.
>>
>> +1
>
>
> 
> 
> darktable user mailing list
> to unsubscribe send a mail to darktable-user+unsubscribe@lis
> ts.darktable.org
>
>


-- 
André Felipe

https://www.flickr.com/photos/andrefelipecarvalho/


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Re: Fw: Re: [darktable-user] importing from lightroom catalog

[Roman Lebedev]

On Fri, Feb 2, 2018 at 12:56 PM, Maud Vande Veire
 wrote:
> Hello,
Hi.

> I did add a full sample set of the Panasonic DMC-LX7.
Sadly, no. The sample set did not have 4:3 sample, but two 1:1 samples..

> And I did add the file that has the pixel problems in Darktable. Togetter 
> sith the Lightroom and Darktable xml files.
> I hope this is what you asked for.
Yeah, fixed that already.

> Best,
> Maud
Roman.

> Sent with ProtonMail Secure Email.
>
>
>  Original Message 
>  On 25 January 2018 12:01 PM, Roman Lebedev  wrote:
>
>>On Thu, Jan 25, 2018 at 1:50 PM, Maud Vande Veire
>>maudvandeve...@protonmail.com wrote:
>>>Hello,
>>>Here you have one of the files with the lightroom and darktable xmp files.
>>>Hm, interesting.
>> Like i asked, please do contribute the full sample set for that camera to 
>> RPU.
>>
>>>Thanks a lot,
>>> Maud
>>>Roman.
>>
>>>Sent with ProtonMail Secure Email.
>>> Original Message 
>>> On 23 January 2018 12:04 PM, Roman Lebedev lebedev...@gmail.com wrote:
>>>On Tue, Jan 23, 2018 at 1:51 PM, Maud Vande Veire
>>>maudvandeve...@protonmail.com wrote:
>>> Lucky guess though, Canon 700D did have the issue you described.
>>>I'm sorry. This is all very new.
>>> I was a bit confused about the camera .
>>>It is a Panasonic DMC-LX7.
>>>But for that camera i don't see any problems.
>>> Perhaps you may want to share the raw+xmp.
>>>Also, please contribute the full raw sample set for
>>> that camera to https://raw.pixls.us/
>>> See https://discuss.pixls.us/t/raw-samples-wanted/5420
>>>Maud
>>>Roman.
>>>
>>>darktable user mailing list to unsubscribe send a mail to
>>>darktable-user+unsubscr...@lists.darktable.org
>>>
>>

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