Re: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL..
All I have to say is things have a way of coming around... That was a comment to you, and nobody here knows the B.S. Comments you've sent me off list because I don't send personal emails to lists. I am leaving the list after this email. I only came back on because I saw your email in the archives. Stop now and the argument stops here. Take that however you like. --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com.
Re: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL..
Apologies to the list for the noise, my bad! Bill - Original Message - From: Joshua Levitsky [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, July 29, 2003 6:28 AM Subject: Re: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL.. All I have to say is things have a way of coming around... That was a comment to you, and nobody here knows the B.S. Comments you've sent me off list because I don't send personal emails to lists. I am leaving the list after this email. I only came back on because I saw your email in the archives. Stop now and the argument stops here. Take that however you like. --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com. --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com.
Re: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL..
As was stated in an earlier post, this is a technical discussion list which has no place for posts like this. So please quit your whining and confrontational comments and try to keep it professional. Otherwise, take it off list. Bill - Original Message - From: Joshua Levitsky [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, July 27, 2003 5:53 PM Subject: Re: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL.. - Original Message - From: Smart Business Lists [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Joshua Levitsky [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, July 27, 2003 8:26 PM Subject: Re: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL.. Sunday, July 27, 2003 you wrote: JL I'm not trying to make this an argument. That's funny. It's snappy remarks like that which make a person not want to even offer any help. I never initiated any personal attacks. Your remark won't make me start doing so on this thread. I honestly wasn't trying to argue anything. I was trying to make points, and others were making points. I felt that some points were not entirely truthful so I made notes. None of my notes were nasty like yours. -Josh --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com. --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com.
RE: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL..
Jason, The mechanism is perhaps there since user-specific ip4r lookups are in place, but this may be a one-way identifier. The implication is they do not, imho, based on their site's overview text. The only way to tell is to individually evaluate email messages, or ask them directly :( Matt Robertson [EMAIL PROTECTED] MSB Designs, Inc. http://mysecretbase.com --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com.
RE: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL..
I do a ROUTETO with no problems. At their request I sent them instructions for config'ing Imail 8 and Declude. So if they get put up and they're wrong its probably my fault :D Here's what I sent them: Here is the Imail 8 mail server configuration info: --- 1. Choose the AntiSpam folder for the domain that you want to bounce spam to Trustic 2. Click the Content Filtering tab. 3. For Statistical and Phrase Filtering (assuming they are enabled) set the Action to Forward To and the action address as your Trustic account bounce address. 4. Click Apply. 5. Click the Content Filtering (HTML) tab. 6. For Feature Filtering and URL Domain Black List (assuming they are enabled) set the Action to Forward To and the action address as your Trustic account bounce address. 7. Click Apply. 8. Stop and restart your Imail smtp service. You may need to do this from the Windows control panel Services applet after closing Imail Administrator for the changes to take immediate effect. Here is the Declude configuration info (Declude is a very common Imail anti-spam add-in). -- 1. In the Declude Global.cfg file, create a new ip4r test. For example: TRUSTIC ip4r XXX-X.query.trustic.com * 0 0 Replace the 'X' values with your Trustic account number. This will set up Trustic with a tentative weight of zero. After reviewing the results to ensure they are satisfactory change the first zero to the weight of your choice. 2. To send Trustic your (confirmed!) spam (typically only that which has received very heavy weighting and you are certain contains no false positives) Use the ROUTETO command in your $default$.junkmail file. For example, if ordinarily you have a WEIGHT30 test that deletes the message, i.e. WEIGHT30 DELETE Change it to WEIGHT30 ROUTETO [EMAIL PROTECTED] Where again you replace the 'X' values with your Trustic account number -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jason Newland Sent: Monday, July 28, 2003 9:05 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL.. has anyone been able to auto-send them your held spam? I have tried using the ROUTETO command, but I get an error when I use the forward address, and an error when I use the bounce address. Can anyone shed some light on the proper way to send them the held e-mails for submission? Thanks Jason - Original Message - From: Matt Robertson [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, July 28, 2003 10:42 AM Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL.. As a followup on this, I've been told by Trustic that they are considering discontinuing the use of the positive ip4r test. After about 12 hours of using the proper ip4r test I'm seeing only negative entries, which is what I should be seeing. At the moment I'm sending them all of my super-heavyweight Declude spam that I know isn't a false positive, plus my Imail spam stuff where, again, I know I've got as close to a perfect track record as I can get. Haven't had the chance to look at the logs yet to see what their test is picking up. Matt Robertson [EMAIL PROTECTED] MSB Designs, Inc. http://mysecretbase.com --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com. --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com. --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com.
Re: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL..
Hey Matt, thanks for the Trustic update and config info, this is very helpful! Bill - Original Message - From: Matt Robertson [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, July 28, 2003 9:32 AM Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL.. I do a ROUTETO with no problems. At their request I sent them instructions for config'ing Imail 8 and Declude. So if they get put up and they're wrong its probably my fault :D Here's what I sent them: Here is the Imail 8 mail server configuration info: --- 1. Choose the AntiSpam folder for the domain that you want to bounce spam to Trustic 2. Click the Content Filtering tab. 3. For Statistical and Phrase Filtering (assuming they are enabled) set the Action to Forward To and the action address as your Trustic account bounce address. 4. Click Apply. 5. Click the Content Filtering (HTML) tab. 6. For Feature Filtering and URL Domain Black List (assuming they are enabled) set the Action to Forward To and the action address as your Trustic account bounce address. 7. Click Apply. 8. Stop and restart your Imail smtp service. You may need to do this from the Windows control panel Services applet after closing Imail Administrator for the changes to take immediate effect. Here is the Declude configuration info (Declude is a very common Imail anti-spam add-in). -- 1. In the Declude Global.cfg file, create a new ip4r test. For example: TRUSTIC ip4r XXX-X.query.trustic.com * 0 0 Replace the 'X' values with your Trustic account number. This will set up Trustic with a tentative weight of zero. After reviewing the results to ensure they are satisfactory change the first zero to the weight of your choice. 2. To send Trustic your (confirmed!) spam (typically only that which has received very heavy weighting and you are certain contains no false positives) Use the ROUTETO command in your $default$.junkmail file. For example, if ordinarily you have a WEIGHT30 test that deletes the message, i.e. WEIGHT30 DELETE Change it to WEIGHT30 ROUTETO [EMAIL PROTECTED] Where again you replace the 'X' values with your Trustic account number -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jason Newland Sent: Monday, July 28, 2003 9:05 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL.. has anyone been able to auto-send them your held spam? I have tried using the ROUTETO command, but I get an error when I use the forward address, and an error when I use the bounce address. Can anyone shed some light on the proper way to send them the held e-mails for submission? Thanks Jason - Original Message - From: Matt Robertson [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, July 28, 2003 10:42 AM Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL.. As a followup on this, I've been told by Trustic that they are considering discontinuing the use of the positive ip4r test. After about 12 hours of using the proper ip4r test I'm seeing only negative entries, which is what I should be seeing. At the moment I'm sending them all of my super-heavyweight Declude spam that I know isn't a false positive, plus my Imail spam stuff where, again, I know I've got as close to a perfect track record as I can get. Haven't had the chance to look at the logs yet to see what their test is picking up. Matt Robertson [EMAIL PROTECTED] MSB Designs, Inc. http://mysecretbase.com --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com. --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com. --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com. --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe
Re: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL..
- Original Message - From: Matt Robertson [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, July 28, 2003 11:32 AM Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL.. 2. To send Trustic your (confirmed!) spam (typically only that which has received very heavy weighting and you are certain contains no false positives) Use the ROUTETO command in your $default$.junkmail file. For example, if ordinarily you have a WEIGHT30 test that deletes the message, i.e. WEIGHT30 DELETE Change it to WEIGHT30 ROUTETO [EMAIL PROTECTED] Where again you replace the 'X' values with your Trustic account number When I set this up, I get the following error in my SMTP log file: 07:28 11:53 SMTP-(0470) processing C:\IMail\spool\Q54b20182006c927c.SMD 07:28 11:53 SMTP-(0470) Trying mx.trustic.com (0) 07:28 11:53 SMTP-(0470) Connect mx.trustic.com [66.151.128.22:25] (1) 07:28 11:53 SMTP-(0470) 220 w02.trustic.com ESMTP 07:28 11:53 SMTP-(0470) EHLO areatech.com 07:28 11:53 SMTP-(0470) 250-w02.trustic.com 07:28 11:53 SMTP-(0470) 250-PIPELINING 07:28 11:53 SMTP-(0470) 250 8BITMIME 07:28 11:53 SMTP-(0470) MAIL FROM:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 07:28 11:53 SMTP-(0470) 250 ok 07:28 11:53 SMTP-(0470) RCPT To:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 07:28 11:53 SMTP-(0470) rl-recv: connection reset 07:28 11:53 SMTP-(0470) 07:28 11:53 SMTP-(0470) QUIT 07:28 11:53 SMTP-(0470) rl-recv: connection reset 07:28 11:53 SMTP-(0470) 07:28 11:53 SMTP-(0470) requeuing C:\IMail\spool\Q54b20182006c927c.SMD R0 T1 07:28 11:53 SMTP-(0470) finished C:\IMail\spool\Q54b20182006c927c.SMD status=3 Thanks for the help Jason --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com.
Re: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL..
Thank you for the heads-up, that's great news! And I'm sure it will be much appreciated by everyone. :-) Bill - Original Message - From: Joshua Levitsky [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Bill Landry [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, July 28, 2003 3:49 PM Subject: Re: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL.. You know what Bill? Fuck you. I'm off the list. I have no interest in dealing with assholes like you. It's a waste of my time. --- Re: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL.. From: Bill Landry Subject: Re: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL.. Date: Mon, 28 Jul 2003 00:04:05 -0700 As was stated in an earlier post, this is a technical discussion list which has no place for posts like this. So please quit your whining and confrontational comments and try to keep it professional. Otherwise, take it off list. Bill --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com.
Re: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL..
I just registered and turned it on, and it seems to have a lot of spam IPs listed. I'll keep an eye out for false positives. Bill -Original Message- From: Joshua Levitsky Sent: Sun, 27 Jul 2003 10:43:24 -0400 Subject: Re: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL.. - Original Message - From: Smart Business Lists [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Joshua Levitsky [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, July 27, 2003 9:20 AM Subject: Re: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL.. Saturday, July 26, 2003 you wrote: JL http://www.trustic.com/ JL Trustic is a new solution to the problem of unsolicited email. It is going to be a subscription service - Companies, and individuals who receive a large amount of email will be required to pay for access to the block list. Yes, but it depends on what large is. It was created by the guy that made Yahoo's groups before Yahoo owned them. I am willing to try it during the beta and block some mail, and hope that it has a setup like Spamcop for pricing. I actually donate to spamcop to make submissions. I would be willing to give Trustic something to help them stay in business. Not a lot... but something and right now it is free so give it a try... -Josh --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com. --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com.
Re: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL..
- Original Message - From: Bill B. [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, July 27, 2003 10:50 AM Subject: Re: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL.. I just registered and turned it on, and it seems to have a lot of spam IPs listed. I'll keep an eye out for false positives. One nice thing is if you have a FP then you can login to trustic, and change that IP to trust it. --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com.
RE: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL..
Yes, same here, I noticed that it is tagging IP's that have not been caught by easynet or osirusoft. Another really cool thing about this service, is the stat report they send you at the end of the day, tells you what IP's they blocked for you, what IP's you gave a good positive, and other general stat. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Bill B. Sent: Sunday, July 27, 2003 4:50 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL.. I just registered and turned it on, and it seems to have a lot of spam IPs listed. I'll keep an eye out for false positives. Bill -Original Message- From: Joshua Levitsky Sent: Sun, 27 Jul 2003 10:43:24 -0400 Subject: Re: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL.. - Original Message - From: Smart Business Lists [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Joshua Levitsky [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, July 27, 2003 9:20 AM Subject: Re: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL.. Saturday, July 26, 2003 you wrote: JL http://www.trustic.com/ JL Trustic is a new solution to the problem of unsolicited email. It is going to be a subscription service - Companies, and individuals who receive a large amount of email will be required to pay for access to the block list. Yes, but it depends on what large is. It was created by the guy that made Yahoo's groups before Yahoo owned them. I am willing to try it during the beta and block some mail, and hope that it has a setup like Spamcop for pricing. I actually donate to spamcop to make submissions. I would be willing to give Trustic something to help them stay in business. Not a lot... but something and right now it is free so give it a try... -Josh --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com. --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com. --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com.
Re: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL..
Joshua, Sunday, July 27, 2003 you wrote: JL Yes, but it depends on what large is. It seems to me the statement applies to all businesses. JL It was created by the guy that made Yahoo's groups before Yahoo JL owned them. Well, that isn't exactly a confidence builder for me for various reasons. But it is especially negative since it is going to be a subscription service. JL I am willing to try it during the beta and block some mail, and JL hope that it has a setup like Spamcop for pricing. The problem I have is that I have no way of knowing the cost of this service since the subscription price remains unpublished. I don't care how good this thing is if I can't afford it. Terry Fritts --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com.
Re: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL..
Hmm... I wonder how effectively that data could be used to generate lists of IPs to block at the firewall level. That'll be interesting to look at. Bill -Original Message- From: Omar K. Sent: Sun, 27 Jul 2003 18:32:53 +0200 Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL.. Yes, same here, I noticed that it is tagging IP's that have not been caught by easynet or osirusoft. Another really cool thing about this service, is the stat report they send you at the end of the day, tells you what IP's they blocked for you, what IP's you gave a good positive, and other general stat. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Bill B. Sent: Sunday, July 27, 2003 4:50 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL.. I just registered and turned it on, and it seems to have a lot of spam IPs listed. I'll keep an eye out for false positives. Bill -Original Message- From: Joshua Levitsky Sent: Sun, 27 Jul 2003 10:43:24 -0400 Subject: Re: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL.. - Original Message - From: Smart Business Lists [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Joshua Levitsky [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, July 27, 2003 9:20 AM Subject: Re: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL.. Saturday, July 26, 2003 you wrote: JL http://www.trustic.com/ JL Trustic is a new solution to the problem of unsolicited email. It is going to be a subscription service - Companies, and individuals who receive a large amount of email will be required to pay for access to the block list. Yes, but it depends on what large is. It was created by the guy that made Yahoo's groups before Yahoo owned them. I am willing to try it during the beta and block some mail, and hope that it has a setup like Spamcop for pricing. I actually donate to spamcop to make submissions. I would be willing to give Trustic something to help them stay in business. Not a lot... but something and right now it is free so give it a try... -Josh --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com. --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com. --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com. --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com.
Re: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL..
- Original Message - From: Omar K. [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, July 27, 2003 12:32 PM Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL.. Yes, same here, I noticed that it is tagging IP's that have not been caught by easynet or osirusoft. Another really cool thing about this service, is the stat report they send you at the end of the day, tells you what IP's they blocked for you, what IP's you gave a good positive, and other general stat. Also when you feel comfortable that they are always getting the IP out of your emails you forward you can go in your profile on Trustic, and turn off those IP validation emails. I did about 150 emails with the validation and then I submitted 1000 emails after turning it off. Nice thing was I am able to go to Trustic and look through all the records to make adjustments for anything that might have submitted wrong. Nothing did submit wrong except for mail I forwarded from my Hotmail account. I reported the problem to them. Hotmail delivers mail from the outside to a Hotmail server and then to your Hotmail mailbox server so Trustic thinks the mail came from Hotmail but it really should look at the second received line. I'm sure they'll take another look at their logic. No mail to my Imail server was recorded wrong as near as I can tell. -Josh --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com.
Re: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL..
- Original Message - From: Smart Business Lists [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Joshua Levitsky [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, July 27, 2003 11:40 AM Subject: Re: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL.. The problem I have is that I have no way of knowing the cost of this service since the subscription price remains unpublished. I don't care how good this thing is if I can't afford it. Each to his own. I like to have a positive outlook on things. Right now Trustic is free. Submitting to Trustic is just forwarding spam. I already forward spam to spamcop, so all I'm doing is adding another address to submit spam to. If Trustic costs money later and I can't afford it or don't want to pay then well I'll stop using Trustic, and I'll be happy that I helped contribute to another spam prevention system. I am happy to help along any system that will help put an end to spam. Even if I'm not using Trustic in the end it will lessen spam because ISPs will have to stop spammers to send mail to the many companies that will use Trustic. Either way. Just wanted to tell the list about something cool. Nobody has to use it if they don't want to. Just thought it looked promising. -Josh --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com.
Re: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL..
- Original Message - From: Bill B. [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, July 27, 2003 11:29 AM Subject: Re: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL.. Hmm... I wonder how effectively that data could be used to generate lists of IPs to block at the firewall level. That'll be interesting to look at. You should send them a message on their contact form about maybe an XML export of records.. or I guess you could do a zone xfer and then export from that data to something your firewall would know what to do with unless your firewall can use DNS records for blocking. (That would be a cool firewall feature.) -Josh --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com.
Re: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL..
I was thinking more along the lines of seeing in the report that particular IPs send us 100% spam, so then I'd manually add those IPs to our firewall rules. But I just signed up today and I haven't seen my first Trustic report yet, so I don't know whats possible yet. Bill -Original Message- From: Joshua Levitsky Sent: Sun, 27 Jul 2003 12:13:12 -0400 Subject: Re: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL.. - Original Message - From: Bill B. [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, July 27, 2003 11:29 AM Subject: Re: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL.. Hmm... I wonder how effectively that data could be used to generate lists of IPs to block at the firewall level. That'll be interesting to look at. You should send them a message on their contact form about maybe an XML export of records.. or I guess you could do a zone xfer and then export from that data to something your firewall would know what to do with unless your firewall can use DNS records for blocking. (That would be a cool firewall feature.) -Josh --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com. --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com.
RE: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL..
I've just started forwarding spam to them, but only the stuff that comes in from Imail's content filtering, which is basically just sweeping up after Declude (and it STILL bags about 10% of the survivors!). One thing I was REALLY not happy about was their method of adding default positives (i.e. the originally posted test). Basically if no one has said anything bad about a server it gets an automatic positive. I plugged this into Declude and gave a blast of positives -- all to spam that apparently hadn't made it into their system yet. By the time I got it shut off I'd given out 47 'false' positives. That's not very smart logic and a great way to loosen up your spam rules. Much smarter to control the trusted entries yourself via other means (i.e. Declude whitelist or make your own trusted whitelist in Declude with a negative weight). It seems to me that, with this system at least, what you want to do is 1. Stay MILES away from that auto-positive list to prevent weighting spammer IPs as valid. 2. Forward spam to your account's Trustic bounce address. Put up with the validation messages for a day or so and then let the thing run on its own. 3. Att a test into Declude for the Trustic NEG list. Weight it zero or light until it proves itself. 4. Stay MILES away from that auto-positive list to prevent weighting spammer IPs as valid. Matt Robertson [EMAIL PROTECTED] MSB Designs, Inc. http://mysecretbase.com --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com.
Re: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL..
- Original Message - From: Matt Robertson [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, July 27, 2003 1:35 PM Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL.. One thing I was REALLY not happy about was their method of adding default positives (i.e. the originally posted test). Basically if no one has said anything bad about a server it gets an automatic positive. I plugged this into Declude and gave a blast of positives -- all to spam that apparently hadn't made it into their system yet. By the time I got it shut off I'd given out 47 'false' positives. That's not very smart logic and a great way to loosen up your spam rules. Much smarter to control the trusted entries yourself via other means (i.e. Declude whitelist or make your own trusted whitelist in Declude with a negative weight). You can use the DNS entry that doesn't have POS- on the front and you won't give positives for mail servers that haven't been seen by Trustic before. I am going to suggest to them that there be a neutral setting. I understand they want to build a very complete list of mail servers so admins can take responsibility for their servers. If new servers were added as neutral then they would get a good list of lots of servers and weighting wouldn't be affected. Would also be nice if they gave one result for bad (which they do 127.0.0.2) and another result for positive and yet another for trusted positive. Then I could give positive weights for trusted positives and take away spam points from servers I say are good. -Josh --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com.
RE: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL..
I just verified a piece of spam that originated from a dialup IP. Now its in my list and I see Trustic has listed that IP as a trusted server... Its loaded with automatic recommendations from that stupid auto-positive list. In fact the last four spams come from servers marked as 'Trusted'. Looks like the people using automatic whitelisting are overwhelming the blacklisters who actually send mail... A losing battle. ESPECIALLY since I had Declude ROUTETO my high-weight spam to my Trustic bounce address... Where it promptly gave them all positive recommendations until I got it shut off. Beta indeed. Matt Robertson [EMAIL PROTECTED] MSB Designs, Inc. http://mysecretbase.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Joshua Levitsky Sent: Sunday, July 27, 2003 10:54 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL.. - Original Message - From: Matt Robertson [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, July 27, 2003 1:35 PM Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL.. One thing I was REALLY not happy about was their method of adding default positives (i.e. the originally posted test). Basically if no one has said anything bad about a server it gets an automatic positive. I plugged this into Declude and gave a blast of positives -- all to spam that apparently hadn't made it into their system yet. By the time I got it shut off I'd given out 47 'false' positives. That's not very smart logic and a great way to loosen up your spam rules. Much smarter to control the trusted entries yourself via other means (i.e. Declude whitelist or make your own trusted whitelist in Declude with a negative weight). You can use the DNS entry that doesn't have POS- on the front and you won't give positives for mail servers that haven't been seen by Trustic before. I am going to suggest to them that there be a neutral setting. I understand they want to build a very complete list of mail servers so admins can take responsibility for their servers. If new servers were added as neutral then they would get a good list of lots of servers and weighting wouldn't be affected. Would also be nice if they gave one result for bad (which they do 127.0.0.2) and another result for positive and yet another for trusted positive. Then I could give positive weights for trusted positives and take away spam points from servers I say are good. -Josh --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com. --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com.
Re: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL..
- Original Message - From: Matt Robertson [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, July 27, 2003 2:44 PM Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL.. I just verified a piece of spam that originated from a dialup IP. Now its in my list and I see Trustic has listed that IP as a trusted server... Its loaded with automatic recommendations from that stupid auto-positive list. In fact the last four spams come from servers marked as 'Trusted'. Looks like the people using automatic whitelisting are overwhelming the blacklisters who actually send mail... A losing battle. ESPECIALLY since I had Declude ROUTETO my high-weight spam to my Trustic bounce address... Where it promptly gave them all positive recommendations until I got it shut off. It's marked trusted but is it trusted and there is a negative on the left or is it trusted and there is a positive on the left? (In the first column there are plus signs and minus signs.) Also the email address submission only gives negatives... no positives not sure how you could ROUTETO and have positives as a result. -Josh --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com.
RE: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL..
*I* manually marked them as negatives, and my one manual entry showed up as such correctly But that IP had four more entries showing the automated 'default positive' entries, and apparently that was enough to get this dialup IP listed as 'trusted' within the system... And as I noted its not alone. Yes, I know the address submission is *supposed* to give only negatives, but I got something like 8 positives in before I shut it off (They got plus signs). I keep my Declude entries set to Verbose so I can follow what gets sent out and see what it wound up being when it arrives at Trustic. Mail volume is low today so I can follow along pretty closely. I'd leave this service alone for awhile so they can get their act together. They may call this a beta but it looks like it should still be an alpha. That method of auto-whitelisting is clearly something that wasn't thought through. All you have to do is look at a Trustic log and check out all the 'trusted' dialup and broadband IPs to see that. Sorry to sound so negative, but its just really a frustrating lesson in what happens when I don't think stuff through. The 'positive' list method of theirs is so deeply flawed its hard to see how anyone could put something like that out on the market... Automatically giving positive entries just because something isn't in a blacklist yet. How ridiculous. Most of the anti-spam battle is about discovering new IPs every day, and those IPs will change tomorrow. All their system will do is get server admins to let spam through. Could that have been the idea in the first place? Who knows anything about these guys? Matt Robertson [EMAIL PROTECTED] MSB Designs, Inc. http://mysecretbase.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Joshua Levitsky Sent: Sunday, July 27, 2003 12:32 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL.. - Original Message - From: Matt Robertson [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, July 27, 2003 2:44 PM Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL.. I just verified a piece of spam that originated from a dialup IP. Now its in my list and I see Trustic has listed that IP as a trusted server... Its loaded with automatic recommendations from that stupid auto-positive list. In fact the last four spams come from servers marked as 'Trusted'. Looks like the people using automatic whitelisting are overwhelming the blacklisters who actually send mail... A losing battle. ESPECIALLY since I had Declude ROUTETO my high-weight spam to my Trustic bounce address... Where it promptly gave them all positive recommendations until I got it shut off. It's marked trusted but is it trusted and there is a negative on the left or is it trusted and there is a positive on the left? (In the first column there are plus signs and minus signs.) Also the email address submission only gives negatives... no positives not sure how you could ROUTETO and have positives as a result. -Josh --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com. --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com.
Re: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL..
- Original Message - From: Matt Robertson [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, July 27, 2003 4:08 PM Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL.. Could that have been the idea in the first place? Who knows anything about these guys? While I can only speak of how I have interacted with them. (I have had a positive experience.) I have to say that your last sentence is just meant to slander them through the implication that they aren't legit. If you look at http://www.trustic.com/about/management you will see they have a real brain on their management team. Mark Fletcher is a smart guy, and a legitimate guy. You shouldn't say something like that last sentence to back up your argument that the service is Beta. It just weakens every point you put in your emails prior to that. -Josh --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com.
Re: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL..
- Original Message - From: Matt Robertson [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, July 27, 2003 4:08 PM Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL.. I'd leave this service alone for awhile so they can get their act together. They may call this a beta but it looks like it should still be an alpha. That method of auto-whitelisting is clearly something that wasn't thought through. All you have to do is look at a Trustic log and check out all the 'trusted' dialup and broadband IPs to see that. Wouldn't you get mad if one spam submitted marked your server as a spammer? Isn't that the argument people make against SpamCop? If 1000 servers got mail from your server and one guy said you had spam from your server then Trustic wouldn't block you where SpamCop might because SpamCop doesn't give credit for all the good things your server has done. There's a learning period that goes in to any intelligent blacklist. Right now there are only about 350,000 IPs in their database. One of the top blocked sites only has 3 emails that were submitted to get it on the blocked list. It needs more volume to be accurate. I personally have 2000 records as negatives, and 37 records that I have submitted as positives to help with the accuracy. Those trusted dialup and broadband IPs are trusted because people have gotten mail but not gotten to submit the spam back to Trustic so the proper action is to trust them. Also your Trustic ranking controls how much your negatives count in the system. I'm a 0.33 ranking. If you are lower than your reports count for less towards making a server untrusted. -Josh --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com.
RE: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL..
Indeed, I think you should forward your legit concerns to them if you truly want to make a positive difference. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Joshua Levitsky Sent: Sunday, July 27, 2003 10:32 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL.. - Original Message - From: Matt Robertson [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, July 27, 2003 4:08 PM Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL.. Could that have been the idea in the first place? Who knows anything about these guys? While I can only speak of how I have interacted with them. (I have had a positive experience.) I have to say that your last sentence is just meant to slander them through the implication that they aren't legit. If you look at http://www.trustic.com/about/management you will see they have a real brain on their management team. Mark Fletcher is a smart guy, and a legitimate guy. You shouldn't say something like that last sentence to back up your argument that the service is Beta. It just weakens every point you put in your emails prior to that. -Josh --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com. --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com.
RE: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL..
Omar K. wrote: Indeed, I think you should forward your legit concerns to them if you truly want to make a positive difference. It was precisely the desire to make a positive difference that motivated me to describe my experience to the list. For my part I appreciate it if an early adopter subs his/her toe and warns me about it before I go off and waste my own time making the same mistake. I know what you meant was for me to provide feedback to the trustic people, and I've done that as well. Matt Robertson [EMAIL PROTECTED] MSB Designs, Inc. http://mysecretbase.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Omar K. Sent: Sunday, July 27, 2003 2:56 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL.. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Joshua Levitsky Sent: Sunday, July 27, 2003 10:32 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL.. - Original Message - From: Matt Robertson [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, July 27, 2003 4:08 PM Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL.. Could that have been the idea in the first place? Who knows anything about these guys? While I can only speak of how I have interacted with them. (I have had a positive experience.) I have to say that your last sentence is just meant to slander them through the implication that they aren't legit. If you look at http://www.trustic.com/about/management you will see they have a real brain on their management team. Mark Fletcher is a smart guy, and a legitimate guy. You shouldn't say something like that last sentence to back up your argument that the service is Beta. It just weakens every point you put in your emails prior to that. -Josh --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com. --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com. --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com.
RE: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL..
I can understand how you'd be defensive since you recommended them to the list, but this has nothing to do with sentiment and everything to do with empirical observation of specific results. I'm sorry you feel the way you do, but don't bandy about words like 'slander' when clearly they don't belong in the conversation. The following servers are trusted by Trustic. I only used tested this service for about 1 1/2 hours so I have a pretty short list (90 entries, 47 of which were slammed in via their automated positive procedure). If I had the time to waste I'd go thru the whole list and I'm sure I'd find more jewels. I pulled these out of just the first two screens: 63.149.203.45 5 automated positive recommendations and a trusted server. But here they're listed on THIRTEEN separate lines http://www.dnsstuff.com/tools/ip4r.ch?ip=63.149.203.45 pd9eb978c.dip.t-dialin.net (217.235.151.140) http://www.dnsstuff.com/tools/ip4r.ch?ip=217.235.151.140 Dial-in, huh? Quite a list on the other spam services. Trustic lists them as trusted. user-0can757.cable.mindspring.com (24.171.156.167) another home cable modem listed like crazy but trusted at trustic http://www.dnsstuff.com/tools/ip4r.ch?ip=24.171.156.167 61.99.1.113 same story here http://www.dnsstuff.com/tools/ip4r.ch?ip=61.99.1.113 pcp03063004pcs.newlaf01.mi.comcast.net ( 68.41.175.131 ) home dsl cable IP pcp515079pcs.nash01.tn.comcast.net ( 68.53.145.237 ) home dsl cable IP d.hm02.com ( 207.158.1.214 ) 4 positive *automated* entries, but listed in SpamCop and sent me spam mm12.metamailoffers.com ( 207.134.3.243 ) read the domain name. Wonder what they do. They also have two automated favorable positives user-0can757.cable.mindspring.com ( 24.171.156.167 ) another home dsl service with an automated positive and trusted status. mtiwmhc14.worldnet.att.net ( 204.127.131.114 ) This one sent me 3 spams directly today. Then a 4th came thru relayed by another server thru this one. Trustic's system gives only the last IP a minus rating and all previous ones a positive, so *I* gave it an automatic positive the fourth time it spammed me. What does it all mean? First of all I don't care how smart the guy is who founded this system. Trustic as it presently performs doesn't belong in my production environment, which the Trustic people are up front about, at least (betas after all should be used only in development and staging environments). From what I can see the system should be labeled more of a public alpha, rather than a beta. It has holes which you can drive a mail truck through. Matt Robertson [EMAIL PROTECTED] MSB Designs, Inc. http://mysecretbase.com --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com.
Re: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL..
- Original Message - From: Matt Robertson [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, July 27, 2003 7:14 PM Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL.. 63.149.203.45 5 automated positive recommendations and a trusted server. But here they're listed on THIRTEEN separate lines http://www.dnsstuff.com/tools/ip4r.ch?ip=63.149.203.45 http://www.trustic.com/ip?ip=63.149.203.45+ You were one of the positives and you didn't bother to submit spam to make it not trusted. pd9eb978c.dip.t-dialin.net (217.235.151.140) http://www.dnsstuff.com/tools/ip4r.ch?ip=217.235.151.140 Dial-in, huh? Quite a list on the other spam services. Trustic lists them as trusted. http://www.trustic.com/ip?ip=217.235.151.140 Again you never bothered to forward spam to them. What's your point exactly about the IP being on other lists? That has nothing to do with this list. If every entry was on every list then you could use a single blacklist, and that's it. Why do you use more than one blacklist??? I know I use them because each has different things to offer and I weight tests based on what each RBL can provide me with. user-0can757.cable.mindspring.com (24.171.156.167) another home cable modem listed like crazy but trusted at trustic http://www.dnsstuff.com/tools/ip4r.ch?ip=24.171.156.167 http://www.trustic.com/ip?ip=24.171.156.167 Here there was 1 default positive and 1 spam mail that you submitted. Should they mark this a spammer simply because 1 email says a good thing and 1 email says a bad thing? That would hardly seem fair. Would you want people not to get mail from you because the Trustic list had 1 record of good mail a 1 record of bad mail for your server? 61.99.1.113 same story here http://www.dnsstuff.com/tools/ip4r.ch?ip=61.99.1.113 http://www.trustic.com/ip?ip=61.99.1.113 Again you never bothered to submit a spam report. How can you complain without bothering to report spam? pcp03063004pcs.newlaf01.mi.comcast.net ( 68.41.175.131 ) home dsl cable IP http://www.trustic.com/ip?ip=68.41.175.131 Again you never bothered to submit a spam report. How can you complain? pcp515079pcs.nash01.tn.comcast.net ( 68.53.145.237 ) home dsl cable IP http://www.trustic.com/ip?ip=68.53.145.237 This is another where there is one spam (from you) and one positive from another person. Not sure why they would block a host on only that data so of course it is trusted. d.hm02.com ( 207.158.1.214 ) 4 positive *automated* entries, but listed in SpamCop and sent me spam http://www.trustic.com/ip?ip=207.158.1.214 Here there are 4 positives and 2 negatives. Why wouldn't this be trusted? mm12.metamailoffers.com ( 207.134.3.243 ) read the domain name. Wonder what they do. They also have two automated favorable positives http://www.trustic.com/ip?ip=207.134.3.243 2 positives to your 1 negative. What does it all mean? First of all I don't care how smart the guy is who founded this system. Trustic as it presently performs doesn't belong in my production environment, which the Trustic people are up front about, at least (betas after all should be used only in development and staging environments). From what I can see the system should be labeled more of a public alpha, rather than a beta. It has holes which you can drive a mail truck through. More like you don't really understand how a trust system should work. This isn't meant to use blacklists from other people. This is meant to be a circle of trust. If people get mail and never bother to submit spam then the hosts that send the mail are trusted. You didn't bother to submit spam to some of the very hosts you are complaining are trusted. I'm not trying to make this an argument. I'm really just trying to offer counter points to what I feel is flawed logic. I am going to stop now as I don't want this to be a war. If anyone needs any help using Trustic feel free to contact me off-list. I encourage any of you that try it to submit feedback on the site one way or the other. I'm sure they will take all feedback in to consideration during the beta period. I would encourage anyone that has read this far to look at the following untrusted servers to see how it will work when people actually submit spam to the system... http://www.trustic.com/ip/61.159.235.36 http://www.trustic.com/ip/4.46.141.148 http://www.trustic.com/ip/12.212.51.189 http://www.trustic.com/ip/66.138.22.121 http://www.trustic.com/ip/12.98.2.128 The last one should be of particular interest. See I have a 0.41 trust level now so with my single negative report the server is blacklisted, but that is because there are -no- positive entries for the server. Basically when you participate then your input is weighted more heavily. -Josh --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list
Re: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL..
Sunday, July 27, 2003 you wrote: JL I'm not trying to make this an argument. That's funny. --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com.
Re: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL..
- Original Message - From: Smart Business Lists [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Joshua Levitsky [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, July 27, 2003 8:26 PM Subject: Re: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL.. Sunday, July 27, 2003 you wrote: JL I'm not trying to make this an argument. That's funny. It's snappy remarks like that which make a person not want to even offer any help. I never initiated any personal attacks. Your remark won't make me start doing so on this thread. I honestly wasn't trying to argue anything. I was trying to make points, and others were making points. I felt that some points were not entirely truthful so I made notes. None of my notes were nasty like yours. -Josh --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com.
Re: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL..
I have been reading all the posts about TRUSTIC. I really dont want to say ,its bad or good , because this not the right time to make comments about. It's a new service , the database should get bigger in time ,the site must be popular and be used by a big number of server admin and then WE CAN SEE HOW IT WORKS. There are always some bugs , some tricks to abuse the site ETC. What i can suggest is that , people interested in this service can flag mails in the header to see the evolution of the service, we should consider the qualtiy in time. Today we get 100 False P. Tommorow we can get 50 F.P or 150 F.P Lets wait and see :) Regards Rifat Levis - Original Message - From: Joshua Levitsky [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, July 28, 2003 2:58 AM Subject: Re: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL.. - Original Message - From: Matt Robertson [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, July 27, 2003 7:14 PM Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL.. 63.149.203.45 5 automated positive recommendations and a trusted server. But here they're listed on THIRTEEN separate lines http://www.dnsstuff.com/tools/ip4r.ch?ip=63.149.203.45 http://www.trustic.com/ip?ip=63.149.203.45+ You were one of the positives and you didn't bother to submit spam to make it not trusted. pd9eb978c.dip.t-dialin.net (217.235.151.140) http://www.dnsstuff.com/tools/ip4r.ch?ip=217.235.151.140 Dial-in, huh? Quite a list on the other spam services. Trustic lists them as trusted. http://www.trustic.com/ip?ip=217.235.151.140 Again you never bothered to forward spam to them. What's your point exactly about the IP being on other lists? That has nothing to do with this list. If every entry was on every list then you could use a single blacklist, and that's it. Why do you use more than one blacklist??? I know I use them because each has different things to offer and I weight tests based on what each RBL can provide me with. user-0can757.cable.mindspring.com (24.171.156.167) another home cable modem listed like crazy but trusted at trustic http://www.dnsstuff.com/tools/ip4r.ch?ip=24.171.156.167 http://www.trustic.com/ip?ip=24.171.156.167 Here there was 1 default positive and 1 spam mail that you submitted. Should they mark this a spammer simply because 1 email says a good thing and 1 email says a bad thing? That would hardly seem fair. Would you want people not to get mail from you because the Trustic list had 1 record of good mail a 1 record of bad mail for your server? 61.99.1.113 same story here http://www.dnsstuff.com/tools/ip4r.ch?ip=61.99.1.113 http://www.trustic.com/ip?ip=61.99.1.113 Again you never bothered to submit a spam report. How can you complain without bothering to report spam? pcp03063004pcs.newlaf01.mi.comcast.net ( 68.41.175.131 ) home dsl cable IP http://www.trustic.com/ip?ip=68.41.175.131 Again you never bothered to submit a spam report. How can you complain? pcp515079pcs.nash01.tn.comcast.net ( 68.53.145.237 ) home dsl cable IP http://www.trustic.com/ip?ip=68.53.145.237 This is another where there is one spam (from you) and one positive from another person. Not sure why they would block a host on only that data so of course it is trusted. d.hm02.com ( 207.158.1.214 ) 4 positive *automated* entries, but listed in SpamCop and sent me spam http://www.trustic.com/ip?ip=207.158.1.214 Here there are 4 positives and 2 negatives. Why wouldn't this be trusted? mm12.metamailoffers.com ( 207.134.3.243 ) read the domain name. Wonder what they do. They also have two automated favorable positives http://www.trustic.com/ip?ip=207.134.3.243 2 positives to your 1 negative. What does it all mean? First of all I don't care how smart the guy is who founded this system. Trustic as it presently performs doesn't belong in my production environment, which the Trustic people are up front about, at least (betas after all should be used only in development and staging environments). From what I can see the system should be labeled more of a public alpha, rather than a beta. It has holes which you can drive a mail truck through. More like you don't really understand how a trust system should work. This isn't meant to use blacklists from other people. This is meant to be a circle of trust. If people get mail and never bother to submit spam then the hosts that send the mail are trusted. You didn't bother to submit spam to some of the very hosts you are complaining are trusted. I'm not trying to make this an argument. I'm really just trying to offer counter points to what I feel is flawed logic. I am going to stop now as I don't want this to be a war. If anyone needs any help using Trustic feel free to contact me off-list. I encourage any of you that try it to submit feedback on the site one way or the other. I'm sure they will take all feedback
Re: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL..
Why don't you guys give it a rest. On 07/27/03 8:53pm you wrote... - Original Message - From: Smart Business Lists [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Joshua Levitsky [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, July 27, 2003 8:26 PM Subject: Re: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL.. Sunday, July 27, 2003 you wrote: JL I'm not trying to make this an argument. That's funny. It's snappy remarks like that which make a person not want to even offer any help. I never initiated any personal attacks. Your remark won't make me start doing so on this thread. I honestly wasn't trying to argue anything. I was trying to make points, and others were making points. I felt that some points were not entirely truthful so I made notes. None of my notes were nasty like yours. -Josh --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com. --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com.
RE: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL..
http://www.trustic.com/ip?ip=63.149.203.45+ You were one of the positives and you didn't bother to submit spam to make it not trusted. Wrong repeatedly. I sent spam to them as I've already said. All of it at one point. As you later note this is becoming a pi$$ing match and that doesn't belong here. This is a technical discussion and lets keep it that way. Part of what is now clearly confusion here stemmed from the (your?) original recommendation to use the pos ip4r test. A careful reading of the Trustic DNS Query information shows this to be the opposite of what you're supposed to do. My fault for not reading the docs carefully and pulling code out of a list message. If you follow the path of the mail when using that test coupled to a mail filter program like Declude you'll see that mail gets counted twice, assuming you use ROUTETO to send spam back to Trustic. Perhaps when using the proper ip4r test the system isn't so screwed up. Was it you who recommended the pos ip4r test for use with Declude? Matt Robertson [EMAIL PROTECTED] MSB Designs, Inc. http://mysecretbase.com --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com.
RE: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL..
All tiffs aside :), Can I get some clarity on the operation here? If I personally submit an e-mail that says 10.10.10.10 is a spammer IP, and that same address has 10 positives and 1 negative (Me). I understand that the IP will probably be trusted, but is there something in the background that when I do a lookup that returns a fail? Since I, the person asking has submitted the only negative. Conversely, a non-submitter would get a pass on that IP since they are going on what others are saying? Sorry if that is confusing Also, there is a TON of things on the documentation side of things that still need to be filled out on the site (yes I have sent them the recommendations),. Let's just hope they are responsive. And finally, this seems like it will get better with user participation Jason --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com.
RE: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL..
Josh, What is the entry you have put in your config file? (If you don't mind sharing) Thanks Jason -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Joshua Levitsky Sent: Saturday, July 26, 2003 9:11 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL.. This is kind of cool... I'm using it now as an RBL... http://www.trustic.com/ Trustic is a new solution to the problem of unsolicited email. By aggregating recommendations from its large community of members, Trustic maintains a list of email servers that can't be trusted to prevent spam. This makes Trustic more reliable, accurate, and up-to-date than other block lists. In addition, Trustic provides an appeal process for machines listed as untrusted. --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com. --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com.
RE: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL..
Sounds interesting, for how long have you been using it ? Do you have any stats? -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Joshua Levitsky Sent: Sunday, July 27, 2003 4:11 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL.. This is kind of cool... I'm using it now as an RBL... http://www.trustic.com/ Trustic is a new solution to the problem of unsolicited email. By aggregating recommendations from its large community of members, Trustic maintains a list of email servers that can't be trusted to prevent spam. This makes Trustic more reliable, accurate, and up-to-date than other block lists. In addition, Trustic provides an appeal process for machines listed as untrusted. --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com. --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com.
Re: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL..
They give you 2 DNS servers to query. They are custom to your account. One of them is just like any other RBL, but the other will add positive ratings to the RBL so long as nobody has reported something negative about the IP yet. You can flag IPs as Positive (they can switch to negative if people post negatives for the IP) or you can make IPs a Trusted Positive so they will never show up to you as blacklisted. I am using the DNS server that adds positives to anything that has never been reported. Below is my line from my global.cfg, but I changed the number not to be mine... TRUSTIC ip4r pos-234-11.query.trustic.com * 12 0 I have been playing only for a little bit with it, but it seems cool. I especially like the Trusted Positive feature. This is something that other RBLs are lacking. Sometimes an RBL is really really good, but they blacklist a few servers that you need to get mail from. I like being able to make a Trusted Positive for the exceptions, and being able to give a high weight to the RBL test. -Josh - Original Message - From: Jason Newland [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, July 26, 2003 10:43 PM Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL.. Josh, What is the entry you have put in your config file? (If you don't mind sharing) Thanks Jason -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Joshua Levitsky Sent: Saturday, July 26, 2003 9:11 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL.. This is kind of cool... I'm using it now as an RBL... http://www.trustic.com/ Trustic is a new solution to the problem of unsolicited email. By aggregating recommendations from its large community of members, Trustic maintains a list of email servers that can't be trusted to prevent spam. This makes Trustic more reliable, accurate, and up-to-date than other block lists. In addition, Trustic provides an appeal process for machines listed as untrusted. --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com. --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com. --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com.
Re: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL..
Just briefly. The service is still in beta. I don't have any stats yet. If you want to try it without risking anything just add the test with a zero weight or something low. That's what I do when I want to see if a test is picking stuff up, and I look through legit mail to see if it is picking that up too... which would be bad. -Josh - Original Message - From: Omar K. [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, July 26, 2003 11:48 PM Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL.. Sounds interesting, for how long have you been using it ? Do you have any stats? -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Joshua Levitsky Sent: Sunday, July 27, 2003 4:11 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [Declude.JunkMail] New spamcop style RBL.. This is kind of cool... I'm using it now as an RBL... http://www.trustic.com/ Trustic is a new solution to the problem of unsolicited email. By aggregating recommendations from its large community of members, Trustic maintains a list of email servers that can't be trusted to prevent spam. This makes Trustic more reliable, accurate, and up-to-date than other block lists. In addition, Trustic provides an appeal process for machines listed as untrusted. --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com. --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com. --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com.
