Re: Logging in MailReader 1.3

On 12/9/05, Frank W. Zammetti <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > F:\struts_current\apps> Mea culpa. I should have said to change to the current/build folder and run build-all. And I should have also said: For more on the Maven build, see * http://wiki.apache.org/struts/StrutsMaintenanceMaven -Ted. -

how can i use tabs in struts. please give me a reply

Hi, How can I use tabs in jsp pages in my struts application. Is there is any tab container stuff. Can anyone help me please. sony - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTE

Re: Chain questions

On 12/8/05, Martin Cooper <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > We don't have any of our own Action classes in the main app that's under > heavy development right now. It's all chains and commands. Most of our > action mappings correspond to a chain of two commands, where the first deals > with the incoming

DO NOT REPLY [Bug 37851] New: - Add support for XML properties files.

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Re: how can i use tabs in struts. please give me a reply

On 12/9/05, Sony Thomas <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > How can I use tabs in jsp pages in my struts application. Is there is > any tab container stuff. Can anyone help me please. I use Struts Menu: http://struts-menu.sourceforge.net/ Struts Layout is another option: http://struts.application

[OT] IDE Haters (Was Re: Logging in MailReader 1.3)

> Please keep in mind that there are still a good number of people who do > not use an IDE at all. Why on earth would you someone do such a thing? Seriously. I'd like to know :-) > Frank W. Zammetti sean - To unsubscribe, e-m

Re: how can i use tabs in struts. please give me a reply

On 12/9/05, Sony Thomas <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > How can I use tabs in jsp pages in my struts application. Is there is > any tab container stuff. Can anyone help me please. So, to summarize, after asking this question three times to two lists, the answers have been * http://ditchnet.org/tabs

Re: [OT] IDE Haters (Was Re: Logging in MailReader 1.3)

You realize of course that such a topic can only lead to an IDE war :) LOL! I've tried I think every major IDE out there, as well as plenty of lesser known ones. Some I've maybe not given a fair shake to because I found something that I *really* didn't like right away, but most of them I've s

Re: [OT] IDE Haters (Was Re: Logging in MailReader 1.3)

On Dec 9, 2005, at 8:02 AM, Sean Schofield wrote: Please keep in mind that there are still a good number of people who do not use an IDE at all. Why on earth would you someone do such a thing? Seriously. I'd like to know :-) Bragging rights, what else :-) There are occasions when I si

Re: [OT] IDE Haters (Was Re: Logging in MailReader 1.3)

Amen. At work I'm fond of saying "Eclipse is the devil". :) It gives you tons of power (tons!) and then every now and then sends you on a two hour hunt to figure why the right jars aren't getting picked up or some weird auto-format thing that can't be turned off (yet in this version or whate

Re: [OT] IDE Haters (Was Re: Logging in MailReader 1.3)

That's a good point Greg, and it applies for me too... I have a number of different IDEs installed, and on occassion I will use a feature of one or another... I've pulled stuff into IDEA and used its code inspectors for example. I've used an Eclipse plug-in here and there too. So it's not lik

Re: [OT] IDE Haters (Was Re: Logging in MailReader 1.3)

Ummm... I guess you guys don't do a lot of debugging then? You would rather imagine what a value was a certain point in time rather then actually know what is was? If you never make mistakes then there is no issue but if you think a value is 'x' it only take 5 seconds to be 100% sure. Of course

Re: [OT] IDE Haters (Was Re: Logging in MailReader 1.3)

Sean Schofield wrote: Ummm... I guess you guys don't do a lot of debugging then? You would rather imagine what a value was a certain point in time rather then actually know what is was? If you never make mistakes then there is no issue but if you think a value is 'x' it only take 5 seconds t

Re: [OT] IDE Haters (Was Re: Logging in MailReader 1.3)

There are plenty of way to debug. But what if you need to test Java 6 features BEFORE it's set in stone? (Like I tried it, reported a bug w/ JDIC and Sun fixed it). Does Java 6 work in your IDE? Groovy? ObjectiveC? WinFX? Does IDE work on Vista, OSX and Fedora? gVim does. (Graphical Visual Edit

Re: [OT] IDE Haters (Was Re: Logging in MailReader 1.3)

On 12/9/05, Paul Speed <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > This is a valid point and debuggers have really come a long way. I > still use the logging method personally because I've found debuggers > dull my ability to see the bugs early. Ah, well, you might not be using the "debugger" early enough :) I

Re: [OT] IDE Haters (Was Re: Logging in MailReader 1.3)

Yeah, I forgot the debugger point :) Like I said, I've been coding *a lot* of years (25+ at this point).. granted, most of that wasn't Java, but still... I've become extremely intuitive in my debugging approach. I don't say this with an ego... which is rare for me! :) ... but I can't tell you

Re: [OT] IDE Haters (Was Re: Logging in MailReader 1.3)

Sean Schofield wrote: I don't buy the argument that IDE's are slow. I agreed with that argument when the first java based IDE's emerged in the 90's but we're way past that point. You can also turn off most of the questionably helpful stuff that you are complaining about. Then what would be th

Re: [OT] IDE Haters (Was Re: Logging in MailReader 1.3)

netsql wrote: PS: Debug is for corporate newbies. Pros don't waste time on this, they do this new thing called unit testing ;-). Realy, when somone on my team is in debuger, I pull them in my office, and required that they improve test coverage more granular and more layers of indircection. Deb

Re: [OT] IDE Haters (Was Re: Logging in MailReader 1.3)

Paul Speed wrote: Plus, I type really fast. In the time it takes some programmers to figure out where they want to set their break-points, setup their watches, etc... I've already put my log statements in, recompiled, and started running. Me too :) I actually had the Army typing record at F

Re: [OT] IDE Haters (Was Re: Logging in MailReader 1.3)

> There are plenty of way to debug. But what if you need to test Java 6 > features BEFORE it's set in stone? > (Like I tried it, reported a bug w/ JDIC and Sun fixed it). > Does Java 6 work in your IDE? That's a pretty specialized case. I haven't tried it but I don't see why not. Most IDE's allo

Re: [OT] IDE Haters (Was Re: Logging in MailReader 1.3)

On 12/9/05, Frank W. Zammetti <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I long ago stopped trying to convince anyone that they should do things my > way, I don't think a lot of people could :) After all, how many developers can > look at the code for a little while and then say "ok, change X to Y and try >

Re: how can i use tabs in struts. please give me a reply

On 12/9/05, Ted Husted <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > And, do please keep questions like this on the Struts User list. (Sorry! That's twice this week I haven't noticed which list a mesage was posted to. :/ ) -- Wendy - To unsubs

Re: [OT] IDE Haters (Was Re: Logging in MailReader 1.3)

Sean Schofield wrote: An IDE can do anything a text editor can do that's for sure. It's maybe a minor quibble, but I would disagree with that. Go check the feature set of UltraEdit and find an IDE that has all those features. I've never seen an IDE with column mode for instance. Like I s

Re: [OT] IDE Haters (Was Re: Logging in MailReader 1.3)

Ted Husted wrote: On 12/9/05, Frank W. Zammetti <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: I long ago stopped trying to convince anyone that they should do things my way, I don't think a lot of people could :) After all, how many developers can look at the code for a little while and then say "ok, chang

Re: [OT] IDE Haters (Was Re: Logging in MailReader 1.3)

Frank I think deubuging is < unit testing. Plus it makes your code more readable. .V Frank W. Zammetti wrote: netsql wrote: Pros don't waste time on this, they do this new thing called unit testing ;-). Realy, when somone on my team is in debuger, I pull them in my office, and required that

Re: Chain questions

On 12/9/05, Ted Husted <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > On 12/8/05, Martin Cooper <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > We don't have any of our own Action classes in the main app that's under > > heavy development right now. It's all chains and commands. Most of our > > action mappings correspond to a chai

Re: [OT] IDE Haters (Was Re: Logging in MailReader 1.3)

Ted Husted wrote: This thread started with a comment that we should leave the debug logging in MailReader to appeal to the "lowest common denominator". But, I think this thread shows that extensive logging appeals to the other end of the spectrum :) I'd like to see the logging taken down a notc

Re: [OT] IDE Haters (Was Re: Logging in MailReader 1.3)

I don't see how they are comparable though... Unit testing will tell you if there is a bug (in either the unit test code or the code under test), and debugging is how you go about finding and correcting the bug. How is one worth less than the other? And what good is unit testing without deb

Re: [OT] IDE Haters (Was Re: Logging in MailReader 1.3)

Sean Schofield wrote: That's a pretty specialized case. I haven't tried it but I don't see why not. Most IDE's allow you to plug in your own JDK. It's not special to work on a JDK before it's supported at all. Eclipse took a long time to support JDK 5. Try it, it does not work in eclipse,

Re: [OT] IDE Haters (Was Re: Logging in MailReader 1.3)

I'm doing a build-all right now so that I can take a look at mailreader... I admit I haven't really looked at mailreader before much, so I'm not familiar with how much logging is in there (maybe a good thing to not be going in with any preconconceived notions). I'm a fan of logging, but I agre

Re: [OT] IDE Haters (Was Re: Logging in MailReader 1.3)

On 12/9/05, Don Brown <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I'd like to see the logging taken down a notch, but perhaps not completely > out. > IMO, Mailreader is there to demonstrate Struts best practices and the > logging > statements everywhere make one wonder :) Besides, it gives a false impression

Re: [OT] IDE Haters (Was Re: Logging in MailReader 1.3)

On 12/9/05, Frank W. Zammetti <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > (Wow, you guys weren't kidding, the build is taking FOREVER! I've done > it before a few months back, but I don't remember it taking this long... > I guess all the restructuring and such has an impact). It's building and acquiring all t

svn commit: r355547 - in /struts/apps/trunk/mailreader/src: java/org/apache/struts/apps/mailreader/actions/ webapp/ webapp/WEB-INF/

Author: husted Date: Fri Dec 9 09:30:09 2005 New Revision: 355547 URL: http://svn.apache.org/viewcvs?rev=355547&view=rev Log: MailReader Tour * Update tour through Registration.jsp * Some minor tweaks to code for explanation's sake Modified: struts/apps/trunk/mailreader/src/java/org/apach

Re: [OT] IDE Haters (Was Re: Logging in MailReader 1.3)

Bad news though... check this out... The system is out of resources. Consult the following stack trace for details. java.lang.OutOfMemoryError + | Building nightlies Struts Site | Memory: 253M/254M + build:start: di

Re: [OT] IDE Haters (Was Re: Logging in MailReader 1.3)

If you do incrementaled layers. Like read mail and save it to db, so you write functions: List lst = mailer.getNewMail(x); dbxyz.saveMail(lst); where you do you business work in one class (and you can tell its bus. since you only import your packages, never other packages in bus. layer). then

Re: [OT] IDE Haters (Was Re: Logging in MailReader 1.3)

My tact has always been that trace statement should only be used to trace entry, and perhaps exit, from a method. Anything within a method is either debug or info as appropriate, with error and fatal being self-explanatory. My reasoning is simply that if I have a particularly thorny issue I'm

Re: [OT] IDE Haters (Was Re: Logging in MailReader 1.3)

Heh, don't have time to read this whole thread right now, but I'd say this: The IDE and the tools are one of Java's key strengths. We should embrace those strengths. I'm always amazed by how many Java developers still don't even know how to debug, or launch Tomcat or Jetty or Resin from within the

Re: [OT] IDE Haters (Was Re: Logging in MailReader 1.3)

On 12/9/05, Frank W. Zammetti <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Bad news though... check this out... > > > The system is out of resources. > Consult the following stack trace for details. > java.lang.OutOfMemoryError > + > | Building nightlies Struts Site > | Memo

Re: [OT] IDE Haters (Was Re: Logging in MailReader 1.3)

Oh, and another point about IDEs: slowness. You can't just compare the speed of the Vi text editor to the speed of IDEA's text editor. It doesn't work that way. I can type psvm and get a full public static void main declaration printed out. I can press ctrl-insert and generate getters and setters

[Struts Wiki] Update of "StrutsMaintenanceMaven" by WendySmoak

Dear Wiki user, You have subscribed to a wiki page or wiki category on "Struts Wiki" for change notification. The following page has been changed by WendySmoak: http://wiki.apache.org/struts/StrutsMaintenanceMaven --

Re: [OT] IDE Haters (Was Re: Logging in MailReader 1.3)

On 12/9/05, Frank W. Zammetti <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Yeah, I forgot the debugger point :) > > Like I said, I've been coding *a lot* of years (25+ at this point).. > granted, most of that wasn't Java, but still... I've become extremely > intuitive in my debugging approach. I don't say this

Re: [OT] IDE Haters (Was Re: Logging in MailReader 1.3)

On 12/9/05, Patrick Lightbody <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >I can press > ctrl-enter and surround a method with a try/catch block and know that > my catch block is logging the exception properly without even typing > anything. I think my favorites are just managing the import statements, identifying

Re: [OT] IDE Haters (Was Re: Logging in MailReader 1.3)

Ah... what if there's a way to write LESS code? That would be less "bugs". getters/setters are so yesterday imo. But IDE just makes it institoalized, and now as layers evelve, you have all this CRUFT get/sets that are outdated. Collections is an imporbment, IMO. Ex: http://groovy.codehaus.org

Re: [shale] jsf-commons??

On 12/8/05, Martin Cooper <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > On 12/8/05, Mike Kienenberger <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > I think it makes the most sense to leave it under MyFaces. > > All of the tomahawk and sandbox components directly depend upon it, as > > does parts of the MyFaces implementatio

Re: [OT] IDE Haters (Was Re: Logging in MailReader 1.3)

Martin Cooper wrote: My turn to date myself, along with Frank. ;-) No wories, we're not women :) (Oh boy, I think I see Wendy getting ready to fire off a reply - LOL!) In my first programming job, I wrote my code on coding sheets. When I was done, those would go to a data entry group, who

Re: [OT] IDE Haters (Was Re: Logging in MailReader 1.3)

We check in our IDEA project files, which includes the code standards. Everyone uses those iml and ipr files. On 12/9/05, Ted Husted <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On 12/9/05, Patrick Lightbody <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >I can press > > ctrl-enter and surround a method with a try/catch block and

Re: [shale] jsf-commons??

On 12/9/05, Craig McClanahan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > On 12/8/05, Martin Cooper <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > On 12/8/05, Mike Kienenberger <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > > I think it makes the most sense to leave it under MyFaces. > > > All of the tomahawk and sandbox components d

Re: [OT] IDE Haters (Was Re: Logging in MailReader 1.3)

On 12/9/05, Frank W. Zammetti <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Martin Cooper wrote: > > Or maybe I'll claim that I use a UDE - CodeWright's tag line used to be > > "The Universal Development Environment". ;-) Like UltraEdit, it's > > customisable up the wazoo. Sadly, it was acquired by Borland not so

Re: [OT] IDE Haters (Was Re: Logging in MailReader 1.3)

On 12/9/05, Patrick Lightbody <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > We check in our IDEA project files, which includes the code standards. > Everyone uses those iml and ipr files. As long as everyone uses IDEA, that works. As long as someone is not using it, though, those files are going to get broken,

Re: [OT] IDE Haters (Was Re: Logging in MailReader 1.3)

It works well enough though. We have a few developers who don't use IDEA, but they know the rules and nothing has exploded so far. Then again, why isn't everyone using IDEA anyway? >:) On 12/9/05, Martin Cooper <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On 12/9/05, Patrick Lightbody <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

Re: [OT] IDE Haters (Was Re: Logging in MailReader 1.3)

On 12/9/05, Martin Cooper <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > As long as everyone uses IDEA, that works. As long as someone is not using > it, though, those files are going to get broken, because the people who > don't use IDEA won't be keeping them up to date. As far as the code formatting goes, in prac

Re: [OT] IDE Haters (Was Re: Logging in MailReader 1.3)

On 12/9/05, Martin Cooper <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > On 12/9/05, Frank W. Zammetti <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > My turn to date myself, along with Frank. ;-) Me too :-). In my first programming job, I wrote my code on coding sheets. When I was > done, those would go to a data entry group,

Re: [OT] IDE Haters (Was Re: Logging in MailReader 1.3)

On 12/9/05, Craig McClanahan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > On 12/9/05, Martin Cooper <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > On 12/9/05, Frank W. Zammetti <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > My turn to date myself, along with Frank. ;-) > > > Me too :-). > > In my first programming job, I wrote my code

Re: [OT] IDE Haters (Was Re: Logging in MailReader 1.3)

On 12/9/05, Martin Cooper <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > On 12/9/05, Craig McClanahan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > On 12/9/05, Martin Cooper <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > > On 12/9/05, Frank W. Zammetti <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > > My turn to date myself, along with Frank. ;-

Re: [OT] IDE Haters (Was Re: Logging in MailReader 1.3)

On 12/9/05, Frank W. Zammetti <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Martin Cooper wrote: > > My turn to date myself, along with Frank. ;-) > > No wories, we're not women :) (Oh boy, I think I see Wendy getting > ready to fire off a reply - LOL!) (You think I'm _that_ easily offended?!) I'm just enjoying

Re: [OT] IDE Haters (Was Re: Logging in MailReader 1.3)

Sounds like Wendy says it best. I definitely agree that a lot of Java users are at a point where they don't know what a class path is, much less the importance of ClassLoader hierarchies. It's unfortunate that "using an IDE" gets associated with that. It's good to get the word out that you can use

Re: [OT] IDE Haters (Was Re: Logging in MailReader 1.3)

Craig McClanahan wrote: * Debugging (I usually consider it an admission of defeat when I can't find bugs by visual inspection, but when you need this you need it BADLY) Did I ever tell you the story of the 48-hour marathon debug session I had leading up to a science fair in 10th grade? Le

Re: [OT] IDE Haters (Was Re: Logging in MailReader 1.3)

Wendy Smoak wrote: (You think I'm _that_ easily offended?!) Oh no, I know better :) You just happen to be the only woman I know on the lists, so you were used in the joke by default :) > I'm just enjoying the war stories, and trying to guess how old everyone is. When I start worrying abo

Re: [OT] IDE Haters (Was Re: Logging in MailReader 1.3)

Hmm... I set that, did a clean-all, then tried build-all again, but now the build seemed to lock up trying to get the 1.2.8 JAR... I went to the store for about an hour and when I came back it hadn't completed and was on that step. Then, Windows started complaining about running out of virtual

Re: [OT] Appropriate logging (was IDE Haters (Was Re: Logging in MailReader 1.3))

Is this taking the discussion further off topic or bringing it back towards it's starting point? ;-) Frank's comments below go more to the heart of what logging should or shouldn't be used for, which has been a bug-bear of mine for a while... The key thing is to remember, when writing log stat

RE: [OT] IDE Haters (Was Re: Logging in MailReader 1.3)

Frank W. Zammetti asked: > netsql wrote: > > PS: Debug is for corporate newbies. Pros don't waste time on this, > > they > > do this new thing called unit testing ;-). Realy, when > somone on my team > > is in debuger, I pull them in my office, and required that > they improve > > test coverag

Re: [OT] IDE Haters (Was Re: Logging in MailReader 1.3)

On 12/9/05, Patrick Lightbody <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I definitely agree that a lot of Java > users are at a point where they don't know what a class path is, much > less the importance of ClassLoader hierarchies. It's unfortunate that > "using an IDE" gets associated with that. There's "usi

svn commit: r355710 - in /struts/site/trunk/xdocs: javadoc.xml navigation.xml volunteers.xml

Author: wsmoak Date: Fri Dec 9 19:34:15 2005 New Revision: 355710 URL: http://svn.apache.org/viewcvs?rev=355710&view=rev Log: Minor documentation updates - unlinked the Maven-generated project overview page which is incomplete. - Reformatted and alphabetized entries in the menu and Javadoc index.

Re: [OT] IDE Haters (Was Re: Logging in MailReader 1.3)

On 12/9/05, Patrick Lightbody <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Sounds like Wendy says it best. I definitely agree that a lot of Java > users are at a point where they don't know what a class path is, much > less the importance of ClassLoader hierarchies. What is a classpath? Niall --