Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-06-09 Thread Bruno Medeiros via Digitalmars-d
On 05/06/2015 23:07, Iain Buclaw via Digitalmars-d wrote: On 5 Jun 2015 20:55, Bruno Medeiros via Digitalmars-d digitalmars-d@puremagic.com mailto:digitalmars-d@puremagic.com wrote: On 29/05/2015 19:35, H. S. Teoh via Digitalmars-d wrote: [...] This isn't the first time I've seen

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-06-05 Thread Jacob Carlborg via Digitalmars-d
On 2015-06-03 12:37, Ola Fosheim =?UTF-8?B?R3LDuHN0YWQi?= ola.fosheim.grostad+dl...@gmail.com wrote: Now really? C was designed at a time where you couldn't even hold the source file in memory, so there is not even a need for an explicit AST. C can essentially be streamed in separate passes:

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-06-05 Thread Bruno Medeiros via Digitalmars-d
On 29/05/2015 19:35, H. S. Teoh via Digitalmars-d wrote: [...] This isn't the first time I've seen this, in basically every benchmark featuring D I have to submit a patch/make a comment that dmd shouldn't be used. Make no mistake, this is damaging to D's reputation - how well does D's native

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-06-05 Thread Iain Buclaw via Digitalmars-d
On 5 Jun 2015 20:55, Bruno Medeiros via Digitalmars-d digitalmars-d@puremagic.com wrote: On 29/05/2015 19:35, H. S. Teoh via Digitalmars-d wrote: [...] This isn't the first time I've seen this, in basically every benchmark featuring D I have to submit a patch/make a comment that dmd

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-06-05 Thread weaselcat via Digitalmars-d
On Friday, 5 June 2015 at 22:07:48 UTC, Iain Buclaw wrote: On 5 Jun 2015 20:55, Bruno Medeiros via Digitalmars-d digitalmars-d@puremagic.com wrote: On 29/05/2015 19:35, H. S. Teoh via Digitalmars-d wrote: [...] This isn't the first time I've seen this, in basically every benchmark

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-06-05 Thread Iain Buclaw via Digitalmars-d
On 6 June 2015 at 01:20, weaselcat via Digitalmars-d digitalmars-d@puremagic.com wrote: On Friday, 5 June 2015 at 22:07:48 UTC, Iain Buclaw wrote: On 5 Jun 2015 20:55, Bruno Medeiros via Digitalmars-d digitalmars-d@puremagic.com wrote: On 29/05/2015 19:35, H. S. Teoh via Digitalmars-d

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-06-04 Thread Paulo Pinto via Digitalmars-d
On Thursday, 4 June 2015 at 03:04:31 UTC, ketmar wrote: On Wed, 03 Jun 2015 12:20:28 +, Paulo Pinto wrote: Now really? C was designed at a time where you couldn't even hold the source file in memory, so there is not even a need for an explicit AST. C can essentially be streamed in

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-06-04 Thread Dan Olson via Digitalmars-d
ketmar ket...@ketmar.no-ip.org writes: yes, i remember lightning fast compile times with turbo pascal. yet the code it produced was really awful: it was even unable to fold constants sometimes! I remember it being in a single DOS .COM (was it TURBO.COM?) only about 40k which included the

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-06-03 Thread via Digitalmars-d
On Wednesday, 3 June 2015 at 07:50:53 UTC, Paulo Pinto wrote: On Wednesday, 3 June 2015 at 07:05:37 UTC, Dicebot wrote: Project size is irrelevant here. I had 500 line C++ project that took 10 minutes to compile (hello boost::spirit). It is impossible for C++ to compile faster than D by

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-06-03 Thread Paulo Pinto via Digitalmars-d
On Wednesday, 3 June 2015 at 07:05:37 UTC, Dicebot wrote: Project size is irrelevant here. I had 500 line C++ project that took 10 minutes to compile (hello boost::spirit). It is impossible for C++ to compile faster than D by design. Any time it seems so you either aren't comparing same thing

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-06-03 Thread via Digitalmars-d
sure what you mean. A theoretical compiler doesn't matter; what actual compilers do does. Of course it does, it defines how far you can go in a concurrent build process before hitting an unsurpassable bottle-neck. (not that I personally care, as I find both C++ and D compilers to be fast

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-06-03 Thread Atila Neves via Digitalmars-d
There are lots of features in D, that C++ does not have, that will make separate compilation and partial evaluation/incomplete types difficult. So C++ is faster than D by design, even when the compiler isn't. I've tried to parse that last sentence a few times and I'm not sure what you mean.

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-06-03 Thread via Digitalmars-d
On Wednesday, 3 June 2015 at 11:06:39 UTC, weaselcat wrote: it can get even better if you properly modularize your projects instead of having 1-2 files that build slow, which causes a lot of waiting. Yes, sure. You can probably get the same build speeds as with C if you organize your code in

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-06-03 Thread via Digitalmars-d
On Wednesday, 3 June 2015 at 11:35:43 UTC, weaselcat wrote: ah yes, those famous fast C build times. Excuse me while I go take half an hour to build GDB. Heh... It is possible to write very fast C compilers with high concurrency in builds, if there is a market for it, but most people want

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-06-03 Thread via Digitalmars-d
On Wednesday, 3 June 2015 at 07:05:37 UTC, Dicebot wrote: It is impossible for C++ to compile faster than D by design. Any time it seems so you either aren't comparing same thing or get misinformed. Or do straightforward separate compilation. There are lots of features in D, that C++ does not

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-06-03 Thread Shachar Shemesh via Digitalmars-d
On 02/06/15 21:56, weaselcat wrote: On Monday, 1 June 2015 at 15:40:55 UTC, Steven Schveighoffer wrote: My original statement was obviously exaggerated, I would not put up with days-long compile times, I'd find another way to do development. But compile time is not as important to me as it is

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-06-03 Thread Dicebot via Digitalmars-d
Project size is irrelevant here. I had 500 line C++ project that took 10 minutes to compile (hello boost::spirit). It is impossible for C++ to compile faster than D by design. Any time it seems so you either aren't comparing same thing or get misinformed. Or do straightforward separate

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-06-03 Thread weaselcat via Digitalmars-d
On Wednesday, 3 June 2015 at 09:21:55 UTC, Ola Fosheim Grøstad wrote: On Wednesday, 3 June 2015 at 07:05:37 UTC, Dicebot wrote: It is impossible for C++ to compile faster than D by design. Any time it seems so you either aren't comparing same thing or get misinformed. Or do straightforward

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-06-03 Thread weaselcat via Digitalmars-d
On Wednesday, 3 June 2015 at 11:25:50 UTC, Ola Fosheim Grøstad wrote: On Wednesday, 3 June 2015 at 11:06:39 UTC, weaselcat wrote: it can get even better if you properly modularize your projects instead of having 1-2 files that build slow, which causes a lot of waiting. Yes, sure. You can

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-06-03 Thread Steven Schveighoffer via Digitalmars-d
On 6/3/15 3:50 AM, Paulo Pinto wrote: On Wednesday, 3 June 2015 at 07:05:37 UTC, Dicebot wrote: Project size is irrelevant here. I had 500 line C++ project that took 10 minutes to compile (hello boost::spirit). It is impossible for C++ to compile faster than D by design. Any time it seems so

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-06-03 Thread Steven Schveighoffer via Digitalmars-d
On 6/3/15 10:19 AM, Paulo Pinto wrote: On Wednesday, 3 June 2015 at 14:08:33 UTC, Steven Schveighoffer wrote: On 6/3/15 3:50 AM, Paulo Pinto wrote: On Wednesday, 3 June 2015 at 07:05:37 UTC, Dicebot wrote: Project size is irrelevant here. I had 500 line C++ project that took 10 minutes to

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-06-03 Thread Paulo Pinto via Digitalmars-d
On Wednesday, 3 June 2015 at 14:08:33 UTC, Steven Schveighoffer wrote: On 6/3/15 3:50 AM, Paulo Pinto wrote: On Wednesday, 3 June 2015 at 07:05:37 UTC, Dicebot wrote: Project size is irrelevant here. I had 500 line C++ project that took 10 minutes to compile (hello boost::spirit). It is

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-06-03 Thread Paulo Pinto via Digitalmars-d
On Wednesday, 3 June 2015 at 10:37:24 UTC, Ola Fosheim Grøstad wrote: On Wednesday, 3 June 2015 at 07:50:53 UTC, Paulo Pinto wrote: On Wednesday, 3 June 2015 at 07:05:37 UTC, Dicebot wrote: Project size is irrelevant here. I had 500 line C++ project that took 10 minutes to compile (hello

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-06-03 Thread via Digitalmars-d
On Wednesday, 3 June 2015 at 12:20:29 UTC, Paulo Pinto wrote: Yes really, specially when comparing with Turbo Pascal, Delphi, Modula-2, Oberon and a few other languages not tied to UNIX linker model. Yeah, I agree that the implementation for Turbo Pascal was good for the hardware it ran on.

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-06-03 Thread Iain Buclaw via Digitalmars-d
On 3 June 2015 at 13:35, weaselcat via Digitalmars-d digitalmars-d@puremagic.com wrote: On Wednesday, 3 June 2015 at 11:25:50 UTC, Ola Fosheim Grøstad wrote: On Wednesday, 3 June 2015 at 11:06:39 UTC, weaselcat wrote: it can get even better if you properly modularize your projects instead

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-06-03 Thread via Digitalmars-d
On Wednesday, 3 June 2015 at 15:14:47 UTC, Iain Buclaw wrote: You're probably doing it wrong and accidentally building all of binutils instead. Use 'make all-gdb' and enjoy faster builds :-p Or use TCC. :^P

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-06-03 Thread ketmar via Digitalmars-d
On Wed, 03 Jun 2015 11:35:41 +, weaselcat wrote: On Wednesday, 3 June 2015 at 11:25:50 UTC, Ola Fosheim Grøstad wrote: On Wednesday, 3 June 2015 at 11:06:39 UTC, weaselcat wrote: it can get even better if you properly modularize your projects instead of having 1-2 files that build slow,

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-06-03 Thread ketmar via Digitalmars-d
On Wed, 03 Jun 2015 12:20:28 +, Paulo Pinto wrote: Now really? C was designed at a time where you couldn't even hold the source file in memory, so there is not even a need for an explicit AST. C can essentially be streamed in separate passes: cpp-cc-asm-linking If compiling C is slow,

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-06-02 Thread Shachar Shemesh via Digitalmars-d
On 01/06/15 18:40, Steven Schveighoffer wrote: On 5/30/15 2:38 PM, Shachar Shemesh wrote: So given that a compiler actually *works* (i.e. produces valid binaries), is speed of compilation better than speed of execution of the resulting binary? There is no answer to that question. During

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-06-02 Thread Dicebot via Digitalmars-d
On Monday, 1 June 2015 at 15:40:55 UTC, Steven Schveighoffer wrote: But if we are talking the difference between a compiler taking 10 minutes to produce a binary that is 20% faster than a compiler that takes 1 minute, what is the threshold of pain you are willing to accept? My preference is

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-06-02 Thread weaselcat via Digitalmars-d
On Monday, 1 June 2015 at 15:40:55 UTC, Steven Schveighoffer wrote: My original statement was obviously exaggerated, I would not put up with days-long compile times, I'd find another way to do development. But compile time is not as important to me as it is to others. -Steve I think if

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-06-02 Thread Manu via Digitalmars-d
On 2 June 2015 at 19:42, Shachar Shemesh via Digitalmars-d digitalmars-d@puremagic.com wrote: On 01/06/15 18:40, Steven Schveighoffer wrote: On 5/30/15 2:38 PM, Shachar Shemesh wrote: So given that a compiler actually *works* (i.e. produces valid binaries), is speed of compilation better

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-06-01 Thread Iain Buclaw via Digitalmars-d
On 1 Jun 2015 09:25, Shachar Shemesh via Digitalmars-d digitalmars-d@puremagic.com wrote: On 30/05/15 21:44, Iain Buclaw via Digitalmars-d wrote: Got any bug reports to back that up? I should probably run the testsuite with optimisations turned on sometime. The latest one (the one that

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-06-01 Thread Shachar Shemesh via Digitalmars-d
On 30/05/15 21:44, Iain Buclaw via Digitalmars-d wrote: Got any bug reports to back that up? I should probably run the testsuite with optimisations turned on sometime. The latest one (the one that stung my code) is http://bugzilla.gdcproject.org/show_bug.cgi?id=188. In general, the bugs

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-06-01 Thread Steven Schveighoffer via Digitalmars-d
On 5/30/15 2:38 PM, Shachar Shemesh wrote: On 30/05/15 03:57, Steven Schveighoffer wrote: But I don't see how speed of compiler should sacrifice runtime performance. Our plan was to compile with DMD during the development stage, and then switch to GDC for code intended for deployment. This

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-05-31 Thread Shachar Shemesh via Digitalmars-d
On 31/05/15 02:08, Manu via Digitalmars-d wrote: On 31 May 2015 at 04:39, Shachar Shemesh via Digitalmars-d digitalmars-d@puremagic.com wrote: On 30/05/15 11:00, Iain Buclaw via Digitalmars-d wrote: When he says Windows, he means MSVC, gcc backend will never support interfacing that ABI (at

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-05-31 Thread Manu via Digitalmars-d
On 31 May 2015 at 17:59, Shachar Shemesh via Digitalmars-d digitalmars-d@puremagic.com wrote: On 31/05/15 02:08, Manu via Digitalmars-d wrote: On 31 May 2015 at 04:39, Shachar Shemesh via Digitalmars-d digitalmars-d@puremagic.com wrote: On 30/05/15 11:00, Iain Buclaw via Digitalmars-d wrote:

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-05-30 Thread Iain Buclaw via Digitalmars-d
On 30 May 2015 at 20:38, Shachar Shemesh via Digitalmars-d digitalmars-d@puremagic.com wrote: On 30/05/15 03:57, Steven Schveighoffer wrote: I saw the slide from Liran that shows your compiler requirements :) I can see why it's important to you. Then you misunderstood Liran's slides.

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-05-30 Thread weaselcat via Digitalmars-d
On Saturday, 30 May 2015 at 17:00:18 UTC, Márcio Martins wrote: Would clang's thread-sanitizer and address-sanitizer be adaptable and usable with D as well? these are already usable from LDC. make sure you use the -gcc=clang flag.

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-05-30 Thread Shachar Shemesh via Digitalmars-d
On 30/05/15 11:00, Iain Buclaw via Digitalmars-d wrote: When he says Windows, he means MSVC, gcc backend will never support interfacing that ABI (at least I see no motivation as of writing). I thought that's what MINGW was. A gcc backend that interfaces with the Windows ABI. Isn't it?

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-05-30 Thread Iain Buclaw via Digitalmars-d
On 30 May 2015 19:05, via Digitalmars-d digitalmars-d@puremagic.com wrote: On Saturday, 30 May 2015 at 14:29:56 UTC, ketmar wrote: On Sat, 30 May 2015 12:00:57 +, Kyoji Klyden wrote: So personally I vote that speed optimizations on DMD are a waste of time at the moment. it's not only

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-05-30 Thread via Digitalmars-d
On Saturday, 30 May 2015 at 14:29:56 UTC, ketmar wrote: On Sat, 30 May 2015 12:00:57 +, Kyoji Klyden wrote: So personally I vote that speed optimizations on DMD are a waste of time at the moment. it's not only waste of time, it's unrealistic to make DMD backend's quality comparable to

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-05-30 Thread Shachar Shemesh via Digitalmars-d
On 30/05/15 03:57, Steven Schveighoffer wrote: I saw the slide from Liran that shows your compiler requirements :) I can see why it's important to you. Then you misunderstood Liran's slides. Our compile resources problem isn't with GDC. It's with DMD. Single object compilation requires more

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-05-30 Thread Manu via Digitalmars-d
On 31 May 2015 at 04:39, Shachar Shemesh via Digitalmars-d digitalmars-d@puremagic.com wrote: On 30/05/15 11:00, Iain Buclaw via Digitalmars-d wrote: When he says Windows, he means MSVC, gcc backend will never support interfacing that ABI (at least I see no motivation as of writing). I

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-05-30 Thread Manu via Digitalmars-d
On 30 May 2015 1:41 pm, weaselcat via Digitalmars-d digitalmars-d@puremagic.com wrote: On Saturday, 30 May 2015 at 03:24:45 UTC, Rikki Cattermole wrote: Both you and ketmer are evil. I'm liking these ideas... Now we just need some pretty and nice packages for e.g. Windows for ldc with

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-05-30 Thread Iain Buclaw via Digitalmars-d
On 30 May 2015 05:25, ketmar via Digitalmars-d digitalmars-d@puremagic.com wrote: On Sat, 30 May 2015 11:43:07 +1000, Manu via Digitalmars-d wrote: * I don't mean to down-play GDC, but it can't give us Windows or iOS, which are critical targets. just to note: ARM is supported in GDC

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-05-30 Thread Kai Nacke via Digitalmars-d
On Friday, 29 May 2015 at 19:04:05 UTC, weaselcat wrote: Maybe this should be brought up on LDC's issue tracker(that is, slower compilation times compared to dmd.) Although it might have already been discussed. We are aware of this: https://github.com/ldc-developers/ldc/issues/830 Regards,

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-05-30 Thread Kai Nacke via Digitalmars-d
On Friday, 29 May 2015 at 19:04:05 UTC, weaselcat wrote: Not to mention that GDC and LDC benefit heavily from GCC and LLVM respectively, these aren't exactly one man projects(e.g, Google, Redhat, Intel, AMD etc contribute heavily to GCC and LLVM is basically Apple's baby.) Google, Intel,

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-05-30 Thread Kyoji Klyden via Digitalmars-d
Honestly I've never taken DMD to be the production compiler. I've always left that to the GNU compilers. GDC has all the magic and years of work with it's backend, so I'm not sure how dmd can compare. As others of said, it's really the frontend that DMD is providing that matters; once you have

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-05-30 Thread ketmar via Digitalmars-d
On Sat, 30 May 2015 12:00:57 +, Kyoji Klyden wrote: So personally I vote that speed optimizations on DMD are a waste of time at the moment. it's not only waste of time, it's unrealistic to make DMD backend's quality comparable to GDC/LDC. it will require complete rewrite of backend and

dmd makes D appear slow

2015-05-29 Thread weaselcat via Digitalmars-d
In nearly every benchmark I see D in, the default compiler used is dmd which runs computationally intense tasks 4-5x+ slower than GDC/LDC example of a random blog post I found: http://vaskir.blogspot.com/2015/04/computing-cryptography-hashes-rust-vs-f.html D is up to 10x(!) slower than Rust.

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-05-29 Thread Dicebot via Digitalmars-d
On Friday, 29 May 2015 at 18:38:20 UTC, H. S. Teoh wrote: This will probably offend some people, but I think LDC/GDC should be the default download on dlang.org, and dmd should be provided as an alternative for those who want the latest language version and don't mind the speed compromise.

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-05-29 Thread ketmar via Digitalmars-d
On Fri, 29 May 2015 11:58:09 -0700, H. S. Teoh via Digitalmars-d wrote: On Fri, May 29, 2015 at 06:50:02PM +, Dicebot via Digitalmars-d wrote: On Friday, 29 May 2015 at 18:38:20 UTC, H. S. Teoh wrote: This will probably offend some people, but I think LDC/GDC should be the default

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-05-29 Thread ketmar via Digitalmars-d
On Fri, 29 May 2015 23:29:39 +, weaselcat wrote: On Friday, 29 May 2015 at 23:19:36 UTC, ketmar wrote: On Fri, 29 May 2015 20:02:47 +, Martin Krejcirik wrote: dmd - reference compiler, Digital Mars backend - best for latest dlang features, fast compile times gdc - GNU

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-05-29 Thread ketmar via Digitalmars-d
On Fri, 29 May 2015 20:02:47 +, Martin Krejcirik wrote: dmd - reference compiler, Digital Mars backend - best for latest dlang features, fast compile times gdc - GNU gcc backend based compiler - best for portability and compatibility with gnu tools ldc - LLVM

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-05-29 Thread Idan Arye via Digitalmars-d
On Friday, 29 May 2015 at 19:16:45 UTC, Steven Schveighoffer wrote: On 5/29/15 12:58 PM, H. S. Teoh via Digitalmars-d wrote: On Fri, May 29, 2015 at 06:50:02PM +, Dicebot via Digitalmars-d wrote: On Friday, 29 May 2015 at 18:38:20 UTC, H. S. Teoh wrote: This will probably offend some

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-05-29 Thread weaselcat via Digitalmars-d
On Friday, 29 May 2015 at 23:19:36 UTC, ketmar wrote: On Fri, 29 May 2015 20:02:47 +, Martin Krejcirik wrote: dmd - reference compiler, Digital Mars backend - best for latest dlang features, fast compile times gdc - GNU gcc backend based compiler - best for portability and

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-05-29 Thread weaselcat via Digitalmars-d
On Friday, 29 May 2015 at 22:05:27 UTC, Idan Arye wrote: For the development cycle too? I've had LDC edge out dmd in compilation times during development cycle. dmd sees zero boost from separate object compilation. Using DCD as an example(because it has not-long not-short build times,)

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-05-29 Thread Steven Schveighoffer via Digitalmars-d
On 5/29/15 4:05 PM, Idan Arye wrote: On Friday, 29 May 2015 at 19:16:45 UTC, Steven Schveighoffer wrote: On 5/29/15 12:58 PM, H. S. Teoh via Digitalmars-d wrote: On Fri, May 29, 2015 at 06:50:02PM +, Dicebot via Digitalmars-d wrote: On Friday, 29 May 2015 at 18:38:20 UTC, H. S. Teoh

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-05-29 Thread weaselcat via Digitalmars-d
On Saturday, 30 May 2015 at 03:24:45 UTC, Rikki Cattermole wrote: Both you and ketmer are evil. I'm liking these ideas... Now we just need some pretty and nice packages for e.g. Windows for ldc with debugger full support and we will be good. Last time I looked llvm still needs a lot of work

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-05-29 Thread Rikki Cattermole via Digitalmars-d
On 30/05/2015 3:36 p.m., weaselcat wrote: On Saturday, 30 May 2015 at 03:24:45 UTC, Rikki Cattermole wrote: Both you and ketmer are evil. I'm liking these ideas... Now we just need some pretty and nice packages for e.g. Windows for ldc with debugger full support and we will be good. Last time

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-05-29 Thread Manu via Digitalmars-d
On 30 May 2015 at 09:14, ketmar via Digitalmars-d digitalmars-d@puremagic.com wrote: On Fri, 29 May 2015 11:58:09 -0700, H. S. Teoh via Digitalmars-d wrote: On Fri, May 29, 2015 at 06:50:02PM +, Dicebot via Digitalmars-d wrote: On Friday, 29 May 2015 at 18:38:20 UTC, H. S. Teoh wrote:

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-05-29 Thread weaselcat via Digitalmars-d
On Saturday, 30 May 2015 at 04:01:00 UTC, Manu wrote: I'm having a pretty good experience with win64 ldc lately. Obviously the fact that there's no debug info is a gigantic hole. I have a hack environment where I dmd in debug and ldc for release builds, but it's really not ideal. And you're

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-05-29 Thread Manu via Digitalmars-d
I'm having a pretty good experience with win64 ldc lately. Obviously the fact that there's no debug info is a gigantic hole. I have a hack environment where I dmd in debug and ldc for release builds, but it's really not ideal. And you're limited to code that doesn't expose bugs in both compilers.

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-05-29 Thread Rikki Cattermole via Digitalmars-d
On 30/05/2015 1:43 p.m., Manu via Digitalmars-d wrote: On 30 May 2015 at 09:14, ketmar via Digitalmars-d digitalmars-d@puremagic.com wrote: On Fri, 29 May 2015 11:58:09 -0700, H. S. Teoh via Digitalmars-d wrote: On Fri, May 29, 2015 at 06:50:02PM +, Dicebot via Digitalmars-d wrote: On

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-05-29 Thread ketmar via Digitalmars-d
On Sat, 30 May 2015 11:43:07 +1000, Manu via Digitalmars-d wrote: * I don't mean to down-play GDC, but it can't give us Windows or iOS, which are critical targets. just to note: ARM is supported in GDC (althru i never tested that support myself), and there are semi-official windows builds of

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-05-29 Thread H. S. Teoh via Digitalmars-d
On Fri, May 29, 2015 at 06:13:02PM +, weaselcat via Digitalmars-d wrote: In nearly every benchmark I see D in, the default compiler used is dmd which runs computationally intense tasks 4-5x+ slower than GDC/LDC As I keep saying, in my own compute-intensive projects I have consistently found

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-05-29 Thread weaselcat via Digitalmars-d
On Friday, 29 May 2015 at 19:01:18 UTC, H. S. Teoh wrote: On Fri, May 29, 2015 at 06:50:02PM +, Dicebot via Digitalmars-d wrote: On Friday, 29 May 2015 at 18:38:20 UTC, H. S. Teoh wrote: This will probably offend some people, but I think LDC/GDC should be the default download on dlang.org,

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-05-29 Thread H. S. Teoh via Digitalmars-d
On Fri, May 29, 2015 at 06:50:02PM +, Dicebot via Digitalmars-d wrote: On Friday, 29 May 2015 at 18:38:20 UTC, H. S. Teoh wrote: This will probably offend some people, but I think LDC/GDC should be the default download on dlang.org, and dmd should be provided as an alternative for those

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-05-29 Thread Andrei Alexandrescu via Digitalmars-d
On 5/29/15 12:13 PM, weaselcat wrote: In nearly every benchmark I see D in, the default compiler used is dmd which runs computationally intense tasks 4-5x+ slower than GDC/LDC example of a random blog post I found: http://vaskir.blogspot.com/2015/04/computing-cryptography-hashes-rust-vs-f.html

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-05-29 Thread Steven Schveighoffer via Digitalmars-d
On 5/29/15 12:58 PM, H. S. Teoh via Digitalmars-d wrote: On Fri, May 29, 2015 at 06:50:02PM +, Dicebot via Digitalmars-d wrote: On Friday, 29 May 2015 at 18:38:20 UTC, H. S. Teoh wrote: This will probably offend some people, but I think LDC/GDC should be the default download on dlang.org,

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-05-29 Thread weaselcat via Digitalmars-d
On Friday, 29 May 2015 at 20:23:13 UTC, Vladimir Panteleev wrote: On Friday, 29 May 2015 at 19:17:14 UTC, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote: On 5/29/15 12:13 PM, weaselcat wrote: In nearly every benchmark I see D in, the default compiler used is dmd which runs computationally intense tasks 4-5x+

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-05-29 Thread weaselcat via Digitalmars-d
On Friday, 29 May 2015 at 20:02:49 UTC, Martin Krejcirik wrote: Note to benchmark users: please use ldc compiler with -inline -O -boundscheck=off (or whatever is correct for LDC) options for best results AFAIK you shouldn't use the -inline flag with LDC, as it tells LDC to run the inline

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-05-29 Thread Martin Krejcirik via Digitalmars-d
IMHO all what is needed is to update the download page with some description of deferences between the compilers, like: dmd - reference compiler, Digital Mars backend - best for latest dlang features, fast compile times gdc - GNU gcc backend based compiler - best for portability and

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-05-29 Thread Dennis Ritchie via Digitalmars-d
On Friday, 29 May 2015 at 20:02:49 UTC, Martin Krejcirik wrote: IMHO all what is needed is to update the download page with some description of deferences between the compilers, like: +1

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-05-29 Thread Iain Buclaw via Digitalmars-d
On 29 May 2015 20:15, weaselcat via Digitalmars-d digitalmars-d@puremagic.com wrote: In nearly every benchmark I see D in, the default compiler used is dmd which runs computationally intense tasks 4-5x+ slower than GDC/LDC example of a random blog post I found:

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-05-29 Thread Chris via Digitalmars-d
On Friday, 29 May 2015 at 18:38:20 UTC, H. S. Teoh wrote: On Fri, May 29, 2015 at 06:13:02PM +, weaselcat via Digitalmars-d wrote: In nearly every benchmark I see D in, the default compiler used is dmd which runs computationally intense tasks 4-5x+ slower than GDC/LDC As I keep saying,

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-05-29 Thread weaselcat via Digitalmars-d
On Friday, 29 May 2015 at 18:38:20 UTC, H. S. Teoh wrote: On Fri, May 29, 2015 at 06:13:02PM +, weaselcat via Digitalmars-d wrote: In nearly every benchmark I see D in, the default compiler used is dmd which runs computationally intense tasks 4-5x+ slower than GDC/LDC As I keep saying,

Re: dmd makes D appear slow

2015-05-29 Thread Vladimir Panteleev via Digitalmars-d
On Friday, 29 May 2015 at 19:17:14 UTC, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote: On 5/29/15 12:13 PM, weaselcat wrote: In nearly every benchmark I see D in, the default compiler used is dmd which runs computationally intense tasks 4-5x+ slower than GDC/LDC example of a random blog post I found: