[DNG] Fwd: [kbd] [ANNOUNCE] kbd-2.3.0

I thought this might be of interest to some. Clarke Forwarded Message Subject:[kbd] [ANNOUNCE] kbd-2.3.0 Date: Fri, 10 Jul 2020 20:18:30 +0200 From: Alexey Gladkov Reply-To: Linux console tools development discussion To: Linux console tools development

Re: [DNG] FF now defaults to DNS-over-HTTPS for US

On 2020-03-03 5:45 p.m., spiralofhope wrote: This helps me remember: E for English "grEy" A for American "grAy" I attempt to be trilingual in "English". Thanks, that memory tool is great. In Canada we say GrEh, but we spell it the English way. (-; Clarke

Re: [DNG] Result of the Debian vote 'General Resolution: Init systems and systemd'

On 2019-12-28 5:03 a.m., Alexis PM via Dng wrote: My comments: A mediocre result, neither good nor bad. The best option for people who don't want to use systemd, Option 6 "E: Support for multiple init systems is Required", came in last. But Option 1 "F: Focus on systemd" came in second place,

Re: [DNG] New Tilda documentation

On 2019-08-17 10:00 a.m., Steve Litt wrote: Hi all, I know of three dropdown terminals: Guake, Tilda and Deepin Terminal. Guake is getting more wedded to Gnome3 every day, so I decided to try Tilda. It's very nice. There is also QTerminal drop down as another possible option. Clarke

Re: [DNG] Way forward

It looks like Devuan just got knocked sideways, although I don't worry about the loss of forward momentum. A voice inside my head is hoping this too is merely a joke. Clarke ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org

Re: [DNG] logging uses of machine-id

On 2019-03-17 6:05 p.m., Jaromil wrote: On Thu, 14 Mar 2019, goli...@dyne.org wrote: On 2019-03-14 03:48, Rick Moen wrote: Quoting KatolaZ (kato...@freaknet.org): I just wonder whether your nice solution is enough for a wider audience used to have things popping up around all the time. I

Re: [DNG] tried testing elogind and libelogind0 241.1-1

On 2019-03-12 12:42 p.m., KatolaZ wrote: Just try: # apt-get install libelogind0 it should remove libsystemd0, and life should continue as before. If you have multi-arch enabled with support for i386, you might want to install also libelogind0:i386. That worked for me, I was worried with

Re: [DNG] Request for testing of slim/experimental

Rebooted to experimental slim, shut down and rebooted again just to see. AMD64 hardware, beowulf/ceres, elogind, lxqt. All seems to be running well for me, so a thumbs up from this seat. Clarke ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org

Re: [DNG] unatternded upgrades by default in Debian

I'm also a person who thinks unattended security upgrades should be an informed choice of an installer not a default. My perspective is a little distorted due to experiences in a past life with Microsoft Windows "Automatic Updates" run amok. In fact these days, other than the occasional

Re: [DNG] Systemd as tragedy

On 2019-01-31 1:22 a.m., Rick Moen wrote: As I'm (like you) an LWN.net subscriber, I can furnish a 'subscriber link' for the benefit of Dng readers. Enjoy. https://lwn.net/SubscriberLink/777595/c64f9542bdd40595/ Thanks Rick, I appreciate this. Reading it was like reading the incomplete logic

Re: [DNG] Drive-by critique

On 2018-12-20 6:00 p.m., Steve Litt wrote: On Thu, 20 Dec 2018 14:07:11 -0800 Rick Moen wrote: Quoting Simon Hobson (li...@thehobsons.co.uk): In part, Linux adoption is held back by its perceived difficulty Just a brief comment about this in passing, as this is an antique debate point

Re: [DNG] /usr to merge or not to merge... that is the question

Roger, I appreciate you taking the time for the explanation of the flow of logic driving the developments. It adds some depth that the average user, like me is not normally exposed to. I remember doing installations with various partitions for directories, as much for coolness as anything,

Re: [DNG] no-usr-merged: let's get concrete

On 2018-11-19 10:08 a.m., KatolaZ wrote: We are not saying we will ask the question to all the users. The "knob" will be probably available only in expert install, once we are sure that there are no major issues there, and the default will most probably be non-merged-usr. For testing purposes it

Re: [DNG] /usr to merge or not to merge... that is the question??

On 2018-11-16 4:11 a.m., Daniel Reurich wrote: Hi Devuan followers, fans and friends, Debian as of the upcoming Buster release looks to be implementing a merged /usr by default. At this stage there is no plan to make it forced... but you never know what happens when their Technical Committee

Re: [DNG] Red Hat ends KDE support

On 2018-11-06 5:14 a.m., Adam Borowski wrote: The less people use Red Hat, the more migrate our way. Meow! I'm having a deja vu over this, IIRC Red Hat did this before probably about 20 years ago and it caused me to jump ship. It was a prelude to their short lived Gnome reblend as one

Re: [DNG] Excessive Bounces

I too get 'em on my gmail account once in a while and have to confirm my subscription. It happens once every 2 months or so, therefore in my case I would not consider it excessive. (-; Clarke ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org

Re: [DNG] apt update ceres 403-Forbidden

On 2018-08-27 1:17 p.m., KatolaZ wrote: On Mon, Aug 27, 2018 at 01:50:51PM +0100, leloft wrote: Hi, I've been getting 403 Forbidden errors while trying to update packages from the ceres/main repo for the last 24/48 hours. The other repos seem to be ok, with just the occasional timeouts on

Re: [DNG] keys & subsystems

On 2018-07-27 03:17 PM, Eric Lee Elliott wrote: How can I make hardware keys work in a Thinkpad T500?  Vol+, Vol- & Mute are only ones I would use. In other Linux distros the mute, vol+ & vol - keys work.  A link to a way would be good enough for me. Do you have tpb installed? According to

Re: [DNG] Provides: libsystemd0 (was Re: systemd and ssh-server)

On 2018-07-26 11:09 PM, spiralofhope wrote: On Thu, 26 Jul 2018 21:49:45 +0900 Olaf Meeuwissen wrote: KatolaZ writes: The medium-term plan is to replace libsystemd0 with a libnosystemd ... +1, although I'd prefer a more original and playful name ;-) libsystemc =p That's going to fly

Re: [DNG] Home server replacement hardware suggestions?

On 2018-07-10 11:41 AM, John Franklin wrote: On Jun 25, 2018, at 6:14 PM, taii...@gmx.com wrote: I have to say your current computer is more than powerful enough for your current uses and I would advise saving your money instead, perhaps instead just buy a SSD for the primary drive and some

Re: [DNG] Home server replacement hardware suggestions?

On 2018-06-25 08:03 AM, wirelessd...@gmail.com wrote: I have an old desktop at home running Devuan ascii for some basic server/file storage functions. Unfortunately the disk sounds like it's almost dead so I took a clonezilla backup and now want to find some replacement hardware. Looking to

Re: [DNG] One week into Devuan 2.0 ASCII -- Some stats

In my neck of the woods in Canada a lot of 64bit capable computers came off the store shelves with 32 bit flavours of Microsoft Windows. This seemed to continue through Win 7, the 8's and I've seen a few cheap laptops with the 32 bit Windows 10. I don't know the reasoning, reliability, the devil

Re: [DNG] One week into Devuan 2.0 ASCII -- Some stats

On 2018-06-18 08:32 AM, Jaromil wrote: yay. Today also distrowatch has published a pretty realistic review of our desktop. something to learn there. The install would have given a more Debian-esque picture if it had been carried out from other than the "Live" media. As for the coherence of

Re: [DNG] Requesting translations for dev1fanboy wiki

On 02/27/2018 04:48 AM, KatolaZ wrote: On Tue, Feb 27, 2018 at 04:00:30AM -0500, Chillfan wrote: In my testing from stretch there was no traditional networking there which makes networking a difficult transition. But I wasn't aware of this particular issue. I've made a note just now that

Re: [DNG] googling devuan ascii leads to spam sites

On 2018-01-20 02:31 PM, Hendrik Boom wrote: I googles "devuan ascii" today and in the top few finds there were three spam sites -- sites which either jut advertised expensive junk, or else pretended to be my ISP doing a survey and as a reward offering expensive junk such as (probably fake)

Re: [DNG] Which is Free, Which is Open Source, is there any difference?

I think systemd plays by the rules as regards both Free and Open Source software, where it falls short is when it comes to the Debian Manifesto https://www.debian.org/doc/manuals/project-history/ap-manifesto.en.html The Manifesto really foresees the situation that has been allowed to occur

Re: [DNG] Happy New Year!

On 2018-01-01 08:05 AM, aitor_czr wrote: Devuana is to Devuan, like Tijuana to Tijuan... Devuana, Banana..good karma. Happy 2018 to all. Clarke ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng

Re: [DNG] URL - The importance of Devuan

On 12/12/17 02:25 AM, Lars Noodén wrote: Yet, as is their habit, their response is to go ad hominem rather than address the points made. Money is a great motivator for company managers, especially at the C level. M$ pointed out ages, albeit inadvertently via leaked documents, that any company

Re: [DNG] ..forensics on systemd or journald logs

On 25/11/17 11:10 PM, zap wrote: The troublesome routers I would temporarily try a "factory reset" on https://www.dd-wrt.com/wiki/index.php/Hard_reset_or_30/30/30 and set them up from scratch and attempt installation of the most current firmware. It you are having pop-up warnings I would take

Re: [DNG] ..forensics on systemd or journald logs

On 25/11/17 03:23 AM, leloft wrote: I have learned more about deep-security issues from this list than from all other sources combined. It is probably my most important resource for informations of this kind: it makes me think in ways that I would never have even considered, and is as far

Re: [DNG] ..forensics on systemd or journald logs, was: rc.local removed from Debian 9, rly?

On 2017-11-22 09:46 AM, Arnt Gulbrandsen wrote: Aldemir Akpinar writes: No, I've actually asked an honest question. In that case you'll get my honest answer. I've implemented several file/network formats vaguely like that journal format, one of them has likely been used by millions of

Re: [DNG] Expansion of the development team

controlled to trickle down to the shareholders and the improvement flow controlled to the users.   It is a well proven model for commercial operating systems and one that GNU/Linux tends, by its very nature, to throw a wrench into. Clarke Sideroad

Re: [DNG] Debian testing drop redis non systemd

On 18/10/17 09:46 AM, Bardot Jérôme wrote: redis (4:4.0.2-3) unstable; urgency=medium   This version drops the Debian-specific support for the   /etc/redis/redis-{server}.sentinel.{pre,post}-{up,down}.d directories in   favour of using systemd's ExecStartPre, ExecStartPost, ExecStopPre,  

Re: [DNG] Gnome?

On 09/18/2017 03:02 AM, Narcis Garcia wrote: > Is there some published procedure to install Gnome in Devuan 8/9 ? > > I need this to migrate desktop users from Debian & Ubuntu. > While as others have said Gnome is an intertwined mess with systemd, there has been a continuing effort by dantrell to

[DNG] Warning: Not important, (May contain non-PC humour.)

So I'm happily catching up on my latest email on my fresh Devuan 1.0.0 installation and I notice a recent one from a MacTechie friend, it was pointing out a few new-ish pieces of malware targeting OS X. Not normally interested in Apples unless I have to be for some reason, I usually just skim

Re: [DNG] We need to speak up

You can add Marcus Coles to the list, but this really is a waste of time. If the list get several thousand names, it won't be enough to convince the loud mouth indoctrinated sheep that have taken charge of the barn yard and will be thought about only long enough to twist into a negative.

[DNG] Fwd: [kbd] [ANNOUNCE] kbd-2.0.4 (stable)

Hi All, I expressed interest in this earlier for Devuan, when Debian orphaned it. Currently it seems I currently do not have the the time nor the necessary skills to build a proper package for Devuan. None the less I thought I should bring notice of this latest stable release to the attention

Re: [DNG] Networking on installation: was Devuan GNU+Linux Beta2 release

I believe software should not be patent-able although could/should be protected under a shortened copyright term at worst. Software when you get right down to it is a presentation of an idea using math, ideas are free, math is free, so why a patent? Clarke

Re: [DNG] trouble with wifi one step away

On 11/29/2016 08:02 PM, Hendrik Boom wrote: > I'm looking for ideas to solve this problem. > > Something's wrong. When I an in myt regular coffee shop, my phone has > no trouble using the wifi, but my Devuan laptop cannot. > > My laptop will connect to the coffee shop'w wifi modem, which has

Re: [DNG] Devuan GNU+Linux Beta2 release

Thank you and the whole community for this. I feel this distribution is crucial to the future of freedom of choice in Linux. There are of course other sans-systemd distros, but IMHO this one has the potential to have the greatest, most widespread impact in the battle to maintain Linux freedom.

Re: [DNG] Refracta on Distrowatch

On 10/17/2016 09:49 AM, Go Linux wrote: FYI . . . Refracta 8.0 gets a nice review on Distrowatch http://distrowatch.com/weekly.php?issue=20161017#refracta Way to go fsmithred! +1 to the above. It looks like it is trending very well over there too. A lot more detailed and accurate than the

Re: [DNG] eudev [was: vdev]

I think kdbus is dead due to the bad press, but I believe there is bus1 coming along to replace that. https://github.com/bus1/bus1 http://www.bus1.org/ Some familiar names, but possibly not directly part of systemd Clarke ___ Dng mailing list

[DNG] Systemd Starts Mounting

Well at least they have not swallowed Mount.yet. Slow Monday? Some humour here: https://linux.slashdot.org/story/16/08/21/2259219/systemd-rolls-out-its-own-mount-tool Clarke ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org

Re: [DNG] Distrowatch Devuan poll do-over

On 08/20/2016 05:02 AM, Didier Kryn wrote: What can prevent a single person from voting multiple times? I have voted - once only - but I think this kind of poll is, at the minimum, terribly biased. It probably only allows one per IP address per day. So if you are on a dynamically

Re: [DNG] systemd==bad

On 02/20/2016 02:56 PM, Edward Bartolo wrote: > Hi, > > I will add my two cents to the stream of comments. > > I think systemd is aimed at desktop users assuming that most Linux > users are also desktop users. It is also aiming at > unifying/streamlining Linux base commands so that users from

Re: [DNG] Bad UEFI: was Systemd at work: rm -rf EFI

On 02/05/2016 09:38 PM, fsmithred wrote: > On 02/05/2016 08:48 PM, Joel Roth wrote: >> Didier Kryn wrote: >>> The ability to brick the motherboard is brand new. Therefore admins >>> should be seriously protected and warned against this eventuality, at least >>> until it percolates into the

Re: [DNG] Systemd at work: rm -rf EFI

On 02/01/2016 08:59 PM, Clarke Sideroad wrote: > On 02/01/2016 06:12 PM, Wim wrote: >> Hi all, >> >> It seems you can delete EFI vars if you're not careful. Someone found >> that executing "rm -rf --no-preserve-root /" also deleted EFI vars, >> turning hi

Re: [DNG] Systemd at work: rm -rf EFI

On 02/01/2016 06:12 PM, Wim wrote: > Hi all, > > It seems you can delete EFI vars if you're not careful. Someone found > that executing "rm -rf --no-preserve-root /" also deleted EFI vars, > turning his MSI Notebook into a brick. > > It also seems mounting these is hardcoded into systemd: > >

Re: [DNG] Debian is endorsed by Microsoft

On 21/01/16 08:21 AM, Marlon Nunes wrote: On 2016-01-21 09:32, KatolaZ wrote: On Thu, Jan 21, 2016 at 12:08:19PM +, Simon Hobson wrote: KatolaZ wrote: > Well, not everybody pays his bills developing open source software, > but if I were a Debian developer, who had

Re: [DNG] Predictable Network Interface Names - Stupid or good idea?

On 09/01/16 01:44 PM, shraptor wrote: On 2016-01-09 19:17, Anto wrote: On the topic. It would be quite interesting how vdev will be (or is) managing this network interface naming assignment. Do you have any comment on this, Jude? vdev uses by default old naming convention but has a file

Re: [DNG] kbd, init curtain call in Debian

On 09/01/16 03:23 AM, Daniel Reurich wrote: On 09/01/16 21:15, Jaromil wrote: dear Clarke, thanks for the notice On Fri, 08 Jan 2016, Clarke Sideroad wrote: It looks like the choice loss and changes creep on. It popped up on my sid/ceres/no-systemd box today: kbd (2.0.3-2

[DNG] kbd, init curtain call in Debian

It looks like the choice loss and changes creep on. It popped up on my sid/ceres/no-systemd box today: | | |kbd (2.0.3-2) unstable; urgency=medium The kbd init script is no longer supported. If configuration in /etc/kbd/config and /etc/kbd/remap is unmodified there will be an attempt to

Re: [DNG] FW: support for merged /usr in Debian

On 01/01/2016 03:06 AM, Daniel Reurich wrote: > So the potteringisation continues... > > Are we going to allow this sort of behaviour into Devuan?? > I have no say in the matter, but I do feel free to express my opinion here. (-: Devuan _is_, at least at this point, "Debian without systemd",

Re: [DNG] Proposals for an xfce-desktop-lite

On 12/31/2015 03:47 AM, Simon Wise wrote: > > Personally I like Rox as a light file manager, it has its own unique > workflow which takes a little getting used to but after that it offers > a GUI interface that is very usable via keyboard alongside text > interfaces as well as via mouse and via

Re: [DNG] Proposals for an xfce-desktop-lite

On 12/28/2015 12:37 PM, Steve Litt wrote: > On Mon, 28 Dec 2015 11:16:17 +0100 > aitor_czr wrote: > >> Hi, >> >> On 12/28/2015 02:07 AM, Go Linux e.org wrote: >>> It's quite a long list. If you see anything in there you can live >>> without, please post

Re: [DNG] the consistency of omelette

On 17/12/15 04:30 AM, Florian Zieboll wrote: From LWN.net's Distribution quotes of the (last) week: You know, I am certainly not the person who wouldn't agree to the concept of breaking eggs to make an omelette. But it's completely unnacceptable to go to the supermarket and break

Re: [DNG] Interesting read from RMS

On 12/11/15 08:44 AM, Emiliano Marini wrote: Interesting article from Richard Stallman. https://www.gnu.org/philosophy/applying-free-sw-criteria.html It starts with:/ / / / /"For a software package to be free, all the code in it must be free. But not only the code. Since documentation files

Re: [DNG] I am not using systemd and plan to avoid it

On 07/16/2015 07:57 AM, Miles Fidelman wrote: Let's not get carried away here. The poll has a rather small sample size, and probably not representative of the full universe of *nix users. Then again, distrowatch visitors are probably more knowledgeable users - and are probably more likely to

Re: [DNG] bummer

On 07/06/2015 01:39 PM, Klaus Fuerstberger wrote: Debian wheezy ISO images still exist: https://www.debian.org/releases/oldstable/debian-installer/ Also the Debian wheezy repositorys: deb http://ftp.debian.org/debian/ wheezy main contrib non-free deb http://security.debian.org/ wheezy/updates

Re: [DNG] Linus answers a question about systemd

On 07/01/2015 02:21 PM, Aldemir Akpinar wrote: It's the second question: http://linux.slashdot.org/story/15/06/30/0058243/interviews-linus-torvalds-answers-your-question?utm_source=feedly1.0mainlinkanonutm_medium=feed I think Linus is right when it comes to systemd as an init, but really

Re: [DNG] We Must be Prepared ....

On 06/19/2015 02:59 AM, Arnt Gulbrandsen wrote: Clarke Sideroad writes: I hoping the Kernel Developers as a combined whole would see the bigger Linux picture well beyond the desktop. I can't see the Kernel being made to swallow something that would poison the whole multifaceted structure

Re: [DNG] We Must be Prepared ....

I hoping the Kernel Developers as a combined whole would see the bigger Linux picture well beyond the desktop. I can't see the Kernel being made to swallow something that would poison the whole multifaceted structure in the way that the various distros swallowed the, just another init, what's

Re: [Dng] printing (was Re: Readiness notification)

On 06/13/2015 11:03 AM, Hendrik Boom wrote: On Sat, Jun 13, 2015 at 10:22:29AM -0500, Nate Bargmann wrote: * On 2015 13 Jun 08:08 -0500, LM wrote: Laurent Bercot wrote: It would be great if Devuan became the Linux distribution that offered its users alternatives to more commonly used, often

Re: [Dng] Systemd sneaks in was file download zone

On 06/11/2015 11:04 AM, Steve Litt wrote: On Thu, 11 Jun 2015 08:35:34 -0400 Clarke Sideroad clarke.sider...@gmail.com wrote: It seems my fresh netboot install this morning has swallowed and installed systemd. It was an expert 64bit install of jessie with XFCE and subsequently firmware-linux

Re: [Dng] Systemd sneaks in was file download zone

On 06/11/2015 02:17 PM, Jude Nelson wrote: Hi Clarke, Can you: * give us a listing of which systemd packages are installed (something like aptitude search systemd | egrep ^i)? * use apt-cache rdepends to show us which packages depend on them? Hi Jude, I'll do a reinstall this evening and

Re: [Dng] file download zone

Thanks for this, very handy. My previous playing had been on a hacked Debian install with added Devuan repos and added pieces that interested me. I grabbed the 64 bit netboot to install on a spare drive that I can swap in and out of use on my main desktop if anything doesn't work for me or

Re: [Dng] straw poll, non-free firmware for installers

On 06/04/2015 07:23 AM, KatolaZ wrote: On Thu, Jun 04, 2015 at 11:36:22AM +0100, David Harrison wrote: On 04/06/2015 02:52, dng-requ...@lists.dyne.org wrote: If it is the resounding will of the community to absolutely not ship the default installer with this approach, then I will withdraw from

Re: [Dng] straw poll, non-free firmware for installers

On 06/03/2015 04:37 AM, Daniel Reurich wrote: Hi, I'd like a straw poll on whether we should include non-free firmware in our installers by default. It's a deviation from Debians traditional position, but a pragmatic one that shows we care about the end users. Keen for feedback. I like

Re: [Dng] Fwd: Lennart reacts to the release of Devuan

On 05/31/2015 05:05 AM, Edward Bartolo wrote: To state the obvious, public figures are invariably criticized and ridiculed, sometimes in a cruel manner. A high dose of humour usually heals wounds caused by aggressive criticism. Humour has no side effects apart from a more balanced view of the

Re: [Dng] Contact

On 04/06/2015 05:04 PM, T.J. Duchene wrote: Anyone wants to contact me is certainly welcome to do so off of the Devuan list, on any subject they please. I’m not trying to be dramatic, but I believe that it is in Devuan’s best interest that I leave. By removing myself from the list,

Re: [Dng] Devuan's release date ?

On 04/05/2015 08:32 AM, Hendrik Boom wrote: On Sun, Apr 05, 2015 at 01:15:07PM +0200, Martial Bornet (gmail) wrote: Hello everyone, do you have any idea of the date when the 1st release will be available ? Thanks. Not before it's ready, I hope. The pre-alpha has been out for a while.

Re: [Dng] [dng] vdev status update and milestone

As history marks the rise and fall of systemd, contributions such as yours will make the the bigger picture of this time period net positive. Thank you, Clarke ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org

Re: [Dng] John Goerzen asks, Has modern Linux lost its way?

IMHO Linux has not lost its way but most of the Distros have. Back when I discovered Linux and the Linux Desktop I was like a fat kid at the Free Candy Store. I'd read about something find it slightly interesting or think I might be able to use it in the future and add it to my installation.

Re: [Dng] Wheezy

I recently unintentionally installed systemd and a bunch of the related tentacles. It was a new Wheezy install w/XFCE from a DVD I figured I'd be safe from systemd with wheezy, but for some hardware (AMD A10-7850K Kaveri) I needed a newer kernel and so I enabled backports. I obviously was