Re: [Elecraft] FS: New CM500 headset
This will be my final post on this topic which has morphed to hearing loss. I had my annual hearing test today. I asked for a chart and out of curiosity we looked back to my first exam in 1996 which resulted initially getting hearing aids. Apparently little change but my audiologist remarked that i had significant loss even back then at age 52. I will summarize the chart L-ear/R-ear: 250-1000 Hz -55 dB 1000-1500 Hz -60/65 dB 1500-3000 Hz -80/70 dB 3000-4000 Hz -80/80 dB >4000 Hz -110 dB/95 dB Equipment unable to produce sounds that I can detect - essentially deaf above 4-KHz. testing speech recognition without hearing aids I get about 50% understanding - mostly via right earl My hearings are 22-ch A/D and we made some radical adjustments including a feature that translated some sounds at high freq to a lower freq where I have better hearing. Anti-feedback is right on margin which would explain sensitivity to the CM500 headset. She made several adjustments to equalize my hearing for each ear. Really works much better so will be interested to see how that affects hearing weak-signals (aka eme signals). Probably a good point to end this discussion on the list. Contact me off list if you want further comment. 73, Ed - KL7UW http://www.kl7uw.com Dubus-NA Business mail: dubus...@gmail.com __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] FS: New CM500 headset
The National Health Service in the UK tends to use slightly modified commercial designs that are maybe a couple of years old, and their input costs are something like that. However, I don't think self fitting would be allowed in the UK, as setting the gain too high can cause unnecessary damage to residual hearing, and many new users would set it too low to be effective. Mobile phones are also not accurately calibrated. The other reason for not allowing self fitting of real hearing aids is that hearing loss can be a warning of more serious things, like brain tumours, and a proper audiologist will refer patients for more detailed investigation if there are hints of that. Also, this is only going to work with open fit aids. You can have just a few sizes of fitting. They do tend to work well for people with age related loss, where most of the loss is in the high frequencies. People with more complex losses require custom made ear moulds, and the most difficult cases actually require aids that change the frequency of the sounds. It looks like Olive only address the easy end of the market. I'm not even sure it would be classified as a hearing aid in the UK (hearing aids are prescription only - RX Only in US terms). I can find none of the technical documentation that I would expect for a normal aid, and, in particular, I can find no graphs showing the performance envelope. It looks like it has something more like an in the ear headphone fitting than the sort of fitting you would expect on a normal hearing aid. It has enough output to damage hearing if used incorrectly. It looks to only have one microphone, and loss of directionality is one of the big problems with using hearing aids. Multiple microphones allow some beam forming. Hearing aid pricing is complex, because the marginal cost of manufacture is quite low, but there are are high R costs for the noise reduction and automatic adaptation. A lot of the R will be recovered by private buyers paying a large premium for the latest technology (a bit like films take a lot from theatre audiences, but eventually are sold cheaply to TV stations). Also the service costs in prescribing and maintaining can be high. For the NHS these dominate the cost of the physical instruments. -- David Woolley On 28/11/2018 02:48, John Simmons wrote: A friend of mine told me about the new Olive hearing aids coming from S. Korea. They are currently being sold only on Indiegogo and one ear is $139 instead of the multikilobuck jobs. I'm interested to hear how they work for him. You configure the amplification and response curves using a smartphone app. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] FS: New CM500 headset
David Woolley wrote: "Are you sure of those figures? 30dB is normally only considered mild loss. 15dB is in the normal range." Good question - I am unsure. I have my annual hearing test tomorrow and will ask my audiologist for a spectrum chart for each ear. I have an optional remote that provides bluetooth connection which I use with my iphone. It also has a little plug-in adapter to provide bluetooth connection to any audio source (probably intended for computer soundcard connection). I have not tried it. The hearing aids provide for T-coil connection but I found that not good for my use. Picks up too much magnetic fields and noise. Let you know my results after my checkup. 73, Ed - KL7UW http://www.kl7uw.com Dubus-NA Business mail: dubus...@gmail.com __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] FS: New CM500 headset
A friend of mine told me about the new Olive hearing aids coming from S. Korea. They are currently being sold only on Indiegogo and one ear is $139 instead of the multikilobuck jobs. I'm interested to hear how they work for him. You configure the amplification and response curves using a smartphone app. -John NI0K David Woolley wrote: Are you sure of those figures? 30dB is normally only considered mild loss. 15dB is in the normal range. I have at least 40dB. across the spectrum, in one ear, and 15dB at 500Hz, degrading to 70dB at 8kHz, in the other, and I'm only classed as having a moderate loss. These figures are a few years old, so the current ones are marginally worse. If you have severe enough loss to need full ear moulds, I think all modern aids have various options to directly feed the aid with, at least mono, audio, and some headsets will naturally work with aids that can be set to an induction loop setting. Typical options for full stereo, are blank headsets, that just create an induction field, ear hooks that hook over the ear and create an induction field, and direct audio input shoes that plug into over the ear aids, and allow a copper connection to the aid. For most aids you can get a bluetooth adapter, that you wear on a, conductive, neck loop. This is generally mono. You can typically provide a copper audio feed to these, in which case there is no bluetooth (the near field link uses a different protocol, and at HF, not SHF), or you can remote bluetooth adapters, which have low latency, as well as the normal bluetooth adapters, with their high latency. The Phonak brand name for this feature is ComPilot. My aids are Oticon, for which it is ConnectLine. I think the open fit aids, used by people with, typical, age related, high frequency loss may be more of a challenge, as they are designed to pass the low frequencies directly and only amplify the high ones. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] FS: New CM500 headset
Are you sure of those figures? 30dB is normally only considered mild loss. 15dB is in the normal range. I have at least 40dB. across the spectrum, in one ear, and 15dB at 500Hz, degrading to 70dB at 8kHz, in the other, and I'm only classed as having a moderate loss. These figures are a few years old, so the current ones are marginally worse. If you have severe enough loss to need full ear moulds, I think all modern aids have various options to directly feed the aid with, at least mono, audio, and some headsets will naturally work with aids that can be set to an induction loop setting. Typical options for full stereo, are blank headsets, that just create an induction field, ear hooks that hook over the ear and create an induction field, and direct audio input shoes that plug into over the ear aids, and allow a copper connection to the aid. For most aids you can get a bluetooth adapter, that you wear on a, conductive, neck loop. This is generally mono. You can typically provide a copper audio feed to these, in which case there is no bluetooth (the near field link uses a different protocol, and at HF, not SHF), or you can remote bluetooth adapters, which have low latency, as well as the normal bluetooth adapters, with their high latency. The Phonak brand name for this feature is ComPilot. My aids are Oticon, for which it is ConnectLine. I think the open fit aids, used by people with, typical, age related, high frequency loss may be more of a challenge, as they are designed to pass the low frequencies directly and only amplify the high ones. -- David Woolley Owner K2 06123 On 27/11/2018 01:20, Edward R Cole wrote: > Firstly, I have extreme hearing loss. Without my Phonac-Silvia hearing > aids the world it very quiet. I have something like 30-dB loss in both > ears so not wearing __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] FS: New CM500 headset
Well I got quite a few comments back on the CM500. Firstly, I have extreme hearing loss. Without my Phonac-Silvia hearing aids the world it very quiet. I have something like 30-dB loss in both ears so not wearing them with headphones is not an option. As many of you may know, hearing loss is not simply lack of volume. I have a lot of problem with speech recognition. For instance even wearing my hearing aids (which cost me $5200) I still need closed-captioning when watching TV (at any volume). Hearing weak-signals on ham radio I use my headsets a lot (while wearing the hearing aids). My (now pretty old) Sony MDR-V600 stereo headphones do pretty well. Never any feedback with my over the ear aids). Unfortunately the acoustic design of the CM500 produced immediate and continuous feedback. I bought them along with the AntLion boom mic for comparison. The AntLion installed on my "old" Sony headset work just fine and I got great audio reports with the boom mic. So that made an easy decision not requiring engineering solutions or "fixes" by my audiologist. Main purpose was acquiring a boom mic for portable operating situations. Also hearing SSB with either NB or NR causes enough distortion of the sound to make it harder to understand speech (yes I have tried all the different settings). My hearing rolls off at 1000-Hz so I lose the consonant sounds. Lake/take/bake/make... all sound like eight or ate. Digital modes work well for me: I can read FB; volume can be set to zero. When I run my 1500w amp for eme I do not wear my hearing aids to lower blower noise (probably > 120 dba). CW I would need 40-dB or higher isolation in the headset. I'm moving all my QRO amps out of the shack for this reason (and for less coax line loss). Thanks for all the helpful suggestions. Simple solution was to sell the CM500. 73, Ed - KL7UW http://www.kl7uw.com Dubus-NA Business mail: dubus...@gmail.com __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] FS: New CM500 headset
I have to take my hearing aids out to use the headphones. Also, saves battery time on the hearing aids. 73, Troy, W6HV On 11/25/2018 11:00 AM, Fred Jensen wrote: You might check with your audiologist to see if the anti-feedback on your aids can be adjusted. Mine basically don't work under headphones ... gain it high enough that anti-feedback can't totally compensate, but if I turn them down, they work OK under my CM500. I'm probably a poor example since I'm nearly 100% CW, but I have found that the K3 RXEQ can work wonders without the hearing aids. 73, Fred ["Skip"] K6DGW Sparks NV DM09dn Washoe County __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] FS: New CM500 headset
You might check with your audiologist to see if the anti-feedback on your aids can be adjusted. Mine basically don't work under headphones ... gain it high enough that anti-feedback can't totally compensate, but if I turn them down, they work OK under my CM500. I'm probably a poor example since I'm nearly 100% CW, but I have found that the K3 RXEQ can work wonders without the hearing aids. 73, Fred ["Skip"] K6DGW Sparks NV DM09dn Washoe County On 11/25/2018 1:24 AM, Edward R Cole wrote: I bought a new Yamaha CM500 headset last spring to compare with AntLion boom mic. The AntLion attaches to my trusty Sony MDR-V800 stereo headset and got good reports on the air. I tried the CM500 and immediately my hearings howled with feedback even with headset not connected to a radio. Totally unsuitable for use by me so I am selling the CM500 (which I bought for $59.99) asking $48.00 (including priority mail shipping which cost me $13.65). Current best price is $58.29 on Amazon.com with free shipping. You save $10.29. I prefer PayPal but will accept check or money order. 73, Ed - KL7UW __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] FS: New CM500 headset
My hearing aids require the use of headphones that have deep earcups. The CM500 does not qualify. However, my hearing in the low frequency region is close to normal, so I remove my hearing aids when I use my CM500. Not all older hams have that advantage. I have a couple Sony headphones (not with a microphone) that I can use with my hearing aids on. I normally use speakers - but the hamshack is in a quiet place. 73, Don W3FPR On 11/25/2018 7:49 AM, Charlie T wrote: To quote that ancient Chinese philosopher: Sum-Ting-Wong" Find that and your "howls" will go away. There's far too many satisfied users of the CM-500's for anything that drastic to be the norm. 73, Charlie k3ICH -Original Message- From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net On Behalf Of Edward R Cole Sent: Sunday, November 25, 2018 4:24 AM To: Elecraft Reflector Subject: [Elecraft] FS: New CM500 headset I bought a new Yamaha CM500 headset last spring to compare with AntLion boom mic. The AntLion attaches to my trusty Sony MDR-V800 stereo headset and got good reports on the air. I tried the CM500 and immediately my hearings howled with feedback even with headset not connected to a radio. Totally unsuitable for use by me so I am selling the CM500 (which I bought for $59.99) asking $48.00 (including priority mail shipping which cost me $13.65). Current best price is $58.29 on Amazon.com with free shipping. You save $10.29. I prefer PayPal but will accept check or money order. 73, Ed - KL7UW http://www.kl7uw.com Dubus-NA Business mail: dubus...@gmail.com __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to pin...@erols.com __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to donw...@embarqmail.com __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] FS: New CM500 headset
Good point Charlie. I have a Sony MDR-7506 headset, with is a "cover the ear" type... and have not issues with my hearing aids. If Ed can't find the cause and sells the CM-500... it's a good deal for someone. I'm tempted myself, but I really don't "need" it. These days, I'm trying to be very cautious about accumulating more stuff. We had a ham in my local club who passed away, but left behind an enormous stash of gear. It's been almost two years, and there still is stuff looking for a new home... even at $free. 73 de Ray K2ULR KX3 #211 -Original Message- From: Charlie T To: elecraft Sent: Sun, Nov 25, 2018 7:50 am Subject: Re: [Elecraft] FS: New CM500 headset To quote that ancient Chinese philosopher: Sum-Ting-Wong" Find that and your "howls" will go away. There's far too many satisfied users of the CM-500's for anything that drastic to be the norm. 73, Charlie k3ICH -Original Message- From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net On Behalf Of Edward R Cole Sent: Sunday, November 25, 2018 4:24 AM To: Elecraft Reflector Subject: [Elecraft] FS: New CM500 headset I bought a new Yamaha CM500 headset last spring to compare with AntLion boom mic. The AntLion attaches to my trusty Sony MDR-V800 stereo headset and got good reports on the air. I tried the CM500 and immediately my hearings howled with feedback even with headset not connected to a radio. Totally unsuitable for use by me so I am selling the CM500 (which I bought for $59.99) asking $48.00 (including priority mail shipping which cost me $13.65). Current best price is $58.29 on Amazon.com with free shipping. You save $10.29. I prefer PayPal but will accept check or money order. 73, Ed - KL7UW http://www.kl7uw.com Dubus-NA Business mail: dubus...@gmail.com __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to pin...@erols.com __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to raysil...@verizon.net __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] FS: New CM500 headset
To quote that ancient Chinese philosopher: Sum-Ting-Wong" Find that and your "howls" will go away. There's far too many satisfied users of the CM-500's for anything that drastic to be the norm. 73, Charlie k3ICH -Original Message- From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net On Behalf Of Edward R Cole Sent: Sunday, November 25, 2018 4:24 AM To: Elecraft Reflector Subject: [Elecraft] FS: New CM500 headset I bought a new Yamaha CM500 headset last spring to compare with AntLion boom mic. The AntLion attaches to my trusty Sony MDR-V800 stereo headset and got good reports on the air. I tried the CM500 and immediately my hearings howled with feedback even with headset not connected to a radio. Totally unsuitable for use by me so I am selling the CM500 (which I bought for $59.99) asking $48.00 (including priority mail shipping which cost me $13.65). Current best price is $58.29 on Amazon.com with free shipping. You save $10.29. I prefer PayPal but will accept check or money order. 73, Ed - KL7UW http://www.kl7uw.com Dubus-NA Business mail: dubus...@gmail.com __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to pin...@erols.com __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
[Elecraft] FS: New CM500 headset
I bought a new Yamaha CM500 headset last spring to compare with AntLion boom mic. The AntLion attaches to my trusty Sony MDR-V800 stereo headset and got good reports on the air. I tried the CM500 and immediately my hearings howled with feedback even with headset not connected to a radio. Totally unsuitable for use by me so I am selling the CM500 (which I bought for $59.99) asking $48.00 (including priority mail shipping which cost me $13.65). Current best price is $58.29 on Amazon.com with free shipping. You save $10.29. I prefer PayPal but will accept check or money order. 73, Ed - KL7UW http://www.kl7uw.com Dubus-NA Business mail: dubus...@gmail.com __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
