Re: advice needed for Star Trek talk

2010-11-27 Thread Jason Resch
Ronald, There is also a thread with some other good justifications for the belief in everything: https://groups.google.com/group/everything-list/browse_thread/thread/6c77322d47582932/16f35cf51ed74d1c?lnk=gst&q=wei+dai#16f35cf51ed74d1c Jason On Sat, Nov 27, 2010 at 2:35 PM, Jason Resch wrote:

Re: Against Mechanism

2010-11-27 Thread Brent Meeker
On 11/27/2010 1:06 PM, Jason Resch wrote: On Sat, Nov 27, 2010 at 12:49 PM, Rex Allen > wrote: Even if you have used some physical system (like a computer) that can be interpreted as executing an algorithm that manipulates bits that can be interpreted

Re: Compatibilism

2010-11-27 Thread Brent Meeker
On 11/27/2010 12:53 PM, Rex Allen wrote: On Fri, Nov 26, 2010 at 7:44 AM, 1Z wrote: On Nov 26, 6:31 am, Rex Allen wrote: Any defense of "free will" must allow for ultimate responsibility for actions. Mine does Random events don't qualify as free will. A deterministi

Re: Against Mechanism

2010-11-27 Thread Brent Meeker
On 11/27/2010 11:21 AM, Evgenii Rudnyi wrote: on 27.11.2010 20:08 1Z said the following: On Nov 27, 6:49 pm, Rex Allen wrote: Given that there are an infinite number of ways that your information could be represented, how likely is it that your experience really is caused by a biological br

Re: Against Mechanism

2010-11-27 Thread Jason Resch
On Sat, Nov 27, 2010 at 12:49 PM, Rex Allen wrote: > On Thu, Nov 25, 2010 at 7:40 PM, Jason Resch wrote: > > On Thu, Nov 25, 2010 at 3:38 PM, Rex Allen > wrote: > >> > >> But I also deny that mechanism can account for consciousness (except > >> by fiat declaration that it does). > >> > > > > Re

Re: Compatibilism

2010-11-27 Thread Rex Allen
On Fri, Nov 26, 2010 at 7:44 AM, 1Z wrote: > On Nov 26, 6:31 am, Rex Allen wrote: >> Any defense of "free will" must allow for ultimate responsibility for >> actions. > > Mine does Random events don't qualify as free will. A deterministic process doesn't qualify as free will. Random events fe

Re: advice needed for Star Trek talk

2010-11-27 Thread Jason Resch
Ron, I think the most convincing approach is to start with how unlikely a universe with life is. I like how Loenard Susskind explains it here: http://www.closertotruth.com/video-profile/Is-the-Universe-Fine-Tuned-for-Life-and-Mind-Leonard-Susskind-/431 There are a few other approaches, such as

Re: Compatibilism

2010-11-27 Thread Rex Allen
On Fri, Nov 26, 2010 at 7:17 AM, 1Z wrote: > On Nov 26, 6:01 am, Rex Allen wrote: >> So Agrippa's Trilemma revolves around the question of how we can >> justify our beliefs. >> >> It seems to me that an entirely acceptable solution is just to accept >> that we can't justify our beliefs. > > ..in

Re: Against Mechanism

2010-11-27 Thread Rex Allen
On Sat, Nov 27, 2010 at 2:08 PM, 1Z wrote: > > > On Nov 27, 6:49 pm, Rex Allen wrote: > >> Given that there are an infinite number of ways that your information >> could be represented, how likely is it that your experience really is >> caused by a biological brain?  Or even by a representation o

Re: Against Mechanism

2010-11-27 Thread Evgenii Rudnyi
on 27.11.2010 20:08 1Z said the following: On Nov 27, 6:49 pm, Rex Allen wrote: Given that there are an infinite number of ways that your information could be represented, how likely is it that your experience really is caused by a biological brain? Or even by a representation of a biologic

Re: Against Mechanism

2010-11-27 Thread 1Z
On Nov 27, 6:49 pm, Rex Allen wrote: > Given that there are an infinite number of ways that your information > could be represented, how likely is it that your experience really is > caused by a biological brain?  Or even by a representation of a > biological brain? Occam's razor: BIV, matrix

Against Mechanism

2010-11-27 Thread Rex Allen
On Thu, Nov 25, 2010 at 7:40 PM, Jason Resch wrote: > On Thu, Nov 25, 2010 at 3:38 PM, Rex Allen wrote: >> >> But I also deny that mechanism can account for consciousness (except >> by fiat declaration that it does). >> > > Rex, > I am interested in your reasoning against mechanism. Assume there

Re: advice needed for Star Trek talk

2010-11-27 Thread ronaldheld
Jason(and any others) Both. Level IV Universe is hard to explain even if real. Bruno's reality is equally hard to convincing present. Ronald On Nov 26, 12:02 am, Jason Resch wrote: > On Wed, Nov 24, 2010 at 1:50 PM, ronaldheld wrote: > > Jason: > >  I see what y

Re: Compatibilism

2010-11-27 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 26 Nov 2010, at 22:55, Brent Meeker wrote: On 11/26/2010 12:33 PM, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 25 Nov 2010, at 22:38, Rex Allen wrote: How does ignorance of what choice you will make lead to ultimate responsibility for that choice? Because I can have a pretty good pictures of the alterna