Re: Philip Ball, MWI skeptic

2015-03-05 Thread Bruce Kellett
Russell Standish wrote: On Fri, Mar 06, 2015 at 02:20:21PM +1100, Bruce Kellett wrote: Russell Standish wrote: On Thu, Mar 05, 2015 at 04:05:07PM +1100, Bruce Kellett wrote: There is mathematically no way to choose a set of vectors that are simulatneously eigenvalues of both operators. That co

Re: Philip Ball, MWI skeptic

2015-03-05 Thread Russell Standish
On Fri, Mar 06, 2015 at 02:20:21PM +1100, Bruce Kellett wrote: > Russell Standish wrote: > >On Thu, Mar 05, 2015 at 04:05:07PM +1100, Bruce Kellett wrote: > >>>There is mathematically no way to choose a set of vectors that are > >>>simulatneously eigenvalues of both operators. That comes from the >

Re: Philip Ball, MWI skeptic

2015-03-05 Thread Bruce Kellett
Russell Standish wrote: On Thu, Mar 05, 2015 at 04:05:07PM +1100, Bruce Kellett wrote: There is mathematically no way to choose a set of vectors that are simulatneously eigenvalues of both operators. That comes from the Hilbert space structure, which in turn is a consequence of invoking an obser

Re: Philip Ball, MWI skeptic

2015-03-05 Thread Russell Standish
On Thu, Mar 05, 2015 at 07:55:42PM +0100, Bruno Marchal wrote: > > On 05 Mar 2015, at 06:12, Russell Standish wrote: > > >On Wed, Mar 04, 2015 at 06:06:35PM +0100, Bruno Marchal wrote: > >> > >>My opinion has not much changed since the last critics. It is a very > >>nice derivation, but too much

Re: Philip Ball, MWI skeptic

2015-03-05 Thread Russell Standish
On Thu, Mar 05, 2015 at 04:05:07PM +1100, Bruce Kellett wrote: > > > >There is mathematically no way to choose a set of vectors that are > >simulatneously eigenvalues of both operators. That comes from the > >Hilbert space structure, which in turn is a consequence of invoking an > >observer and Kol

Re: Philip Ball, MWI skeptic

2015-03-05 Thread LizR
On 6 March 2015 at 06:22, Bruno Marchal wrote: > > On 04 Mar 2015, at 21:36, LizR wrote: > > On 5 March 2015 at 04:37, Bruno Marchal wrote: > >> >> So it is not the state of the halting problem which are physical, it is >> the physical which needs to be redefined in term of a measure (or the log

Re: Philip Ball, MWI skeptic

2015-03-05 Thread Jason Resch
On Thu, Mar 5, 2015 at 12:55 PM, Bruno Marchal wrote: > > On 05 Mar 2015, at 06:12, Russell Standish wrote: > > On Wed, Mar 04, 2015 at 06:06:35PM +0100, Bruno Marchal wrote: >> >>> >>> My opinion has not much changed since the last critics. It is a very >>> nice derivation, but too much quick a

Quantum Computers

2015-03-05 Thread John Clark
There is a important paper in today's journal Nature on error correction that would be needed to make Quantum Computers practical. Although they still can't protect individual Qubits they could protect the entanglement of 3 or more particles (the Greenberger–Horne–Zeilinger state) and they could u

Re: Why is there something rather than nothing? From quantum theory to dialectics?

2015-03-05 Thread meekerdb
On 3/5/2015 10:21 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 04 Mar 2015, at 23:05, meekerdb wrote: On 3/4/2015 10:43 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 13 Feb 2015, at 20:40, Samiya Illias wrote: My faith encourages me to pursue the sciences, to use my faculties and intelligence for reason and logic, and the s

Re: Philip Ball, MWI skeptic

2015-03-05 Thread meekerdb
On 3/5/2015 9:22 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: But that would entail: provable(false) -> false, which is equivalent with: not-provable(false). But that is consistency, and is not provable. So in general, due to the second theorem of incompleteness, we don't have in general that: provable(p) -> p.

Re: Philip Ball, MWI skeptic

2015-03-05 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 05 Mar 2015, at 06:12, Russell Standish wrote: On Wed, Mar 04, 2015 at 06:06:35PM +0100, Bruno Marchal wrote: My opinion has not much changed since the last critics. It is a very nice derivation, but too much quick at some step, assuming the reals, derivative, effectivity, etc. It go in th

Re: Philip Ball, MWI skeptic

2015-03-05 Thread meekerdb
On 3/5/2015 7:14 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 04 Mar 2015, at 21:32, meekerdb wrote: On 3/4/2015 7:51 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: If we are in a simulated world, we are in all simulated world, some normal, or some "perverse bostromian" (made by our normal descendents who would like to fake our r

Re: Why is there something rather than nothing? From quantum theory to dialectics?

2015-03-05 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 04 Mar 2015, at 23:05, meekerdb wrote: On 3/4/2015 10:43 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 13 Feb 2015, at 20:40, Samiya Illias wrote: My faith encourages me to pursue the sciences, to use my faculties and intelligence for reason and logic, and the study of the sciences is not doubt. Doubt

Re: Philip Ball, MWI skeptic

2015-03-05 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 04 Mar 2015, at 23:02, meekerdb wrote: On 3/4/2015 10:21 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: The SWE contains observables (operators) such as position, energy and momentum and so on. What bases do we choose for these operators? The default, that no one ever questions (to the extent that I doubt t

Re: Philip Ball, MWI skeptic

2015-03-05 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 04 Mar 2015, at 22:53, meekerdb wrote: On 3/4/2015 10:00 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: It seems that this kind of information theoretic question might be one that mind-as-computation could address: Why is it we can only think of the world in these limited, classical ways (if indeed that's

Re: Philip Ball, MWI skeptic

2015-03-05 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 04 Mar 2015, at 22:13, LizR wrote: On 5 March 2015 at 09:32, meekerdb wrote: On 3/4/2015 7:51 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: If we are in a simulated world, we are in all simulated world, some normal, or some "perverse bostromian" (made by our normal descendents who would like to fake our rea

Re: Philip Ball, MWI skeptic

2015-03-05 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 04 Mar 2015, at 21:36, LizR wrote: On 5 March 2015 at 04:37, Bruno Marchal wrote: So it is not the state of the halting problem which are physical, it is the physical which needs to be redefined in term of a measure (or the logic of the measure one, of that measure) on the halting pr

Re: Philip Ball, MWI skeptic

2015-03-05 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 04 Mar 2015, at 21:32, meekerdb wrote: On 3/4/2015 7:51 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: If we are in a simulated world, we are in all simulated world, some normal, or some "perverse bostromian" (made by our normal descendents who would like to fake our reality). We can test computationalism V