On 3/5/2015 10:21 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote:
On 04 Mar 2015, at 23:05, meekerdb wrote:
On 3/4/2015 10:43 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote:
On 13 Feb 2015, at 20:40, Samiya Illias wrote:
My faith encourages me to pursue the sciences, to use my faculties and intelligence
for reason and logic, and the study of the sciences is not doubt.
Doubt is the lack of faith!
I am not sure I commented on this. It might be the heart of the matter.
Science is only doubt. But as Descartes saw, we cannot doubt of everything, and so, we
do trust something. The more we are able to doubt, the more we can see what remains
undoubtable, and faith can build on that.
So, those who have the faith have no problem doubting any theories, texts, etc. The
faith rises from within, and is definitely beyond words, texts, theories, equations, etc.
The universal machines are confronted to something similar when they introspect
themselves (in the sense of Kleene second recursion diagonal way).
In front of the absolute truth, science can only augment the doubt, but without ever
needing to abandon faith.
It is the faith in the ineffable which invites the doubt on *all* the fables.
So you must have faith - but not in anything in particular?
Why? I didn't say that.
Of course you didn't. It's ineffable. :-)
I can see why a logician would think that way; since he always wants to start from
axioms he assumes.
Not at all. Humans start from a reality and develop beliefs on that reality, and they
assume axioms to have their theories, but they doubt the theory, as they trust the
reality. Fundamental reality kicks back all theories, but that is nice, as it is a
promise of infinite learning and surprises.
But note the Google paper on "Knowledge Based Trust" which tries to operationalize the
coherence theory of truth.
Not too bad blaspheme for the practical purpose, although it can't really work, but that
is another topic.
Fundamentally you should not like it, as it confuse truth and reality
(possibility/consistency). It confuses p and <>p.
It confuses "p is true" with there is a reality in which p is true.
Does "p is true" mean p is true in *this* reality, or what?
Brent
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