Re: Is your elbow conscious?

On 5/18/2019 5:28 PM, John Clark wrote: On Sat, May 18, 2019 at 7:54 PM 'Brent Meeker> wrote: >>Evolution is unlikely to have stumbled upon a complex method of achieving intelligence if there was a much simpler basic procedure

Re: Is your elbow conscious?

On 5/18/2019 3:10 PM, Philip Thrift wrote: It's not erring, so much as I think it's completely *unuseful* (of no practical value, unhelpful). The contrary, which you advocate, is essentially to assume that however intelligent and human-like you make a robot, it has no feelings.  This

Re: Is your elbow conscious?

On 5/18/2019 12:55 PM, Philip Thrift wrote: On Saturday, May 18, 2019 at 2:39:29 PM UTC-5, Brent wrote: On 5/18/2019 6:37 AM, Philip Thrift wrote: /A simulated human brain could describe it's back pain in every detail, write whole paragraphs about what it's like, while

Re: Is your elbow conscious?

On 5/18/2019 12:19 PM, Philip Thrift wrote: On Saturday, May 18, 2019 at 10:47:15 AM UTC-5, Brent wrote: On 5/17/2019 11:11 PM, Philip Thrift wrote: On Friday, May 17, 2019 at 6:09:18 PM UTC-5, Brent wrote: On 5/17/2019 3:33 PM, Philip Thrift wrote: On

Re: Is your elbow conscious?

On Sat, May 18, 2019 at 7:54 PM 'Brent Meeker < everything-list@googlegroups.com> wrote: >>Evolution is unlikely to have stumbled upon a complex method of achieving >> intelligence if there was a much simpler basic procedure to do the same >> thing > > > *> You must not have looked at how DNA is

Re: My book "I Am" published on amazon

On Fri, May 17, 2019 at 10:47:36PM +1000, Bruce Kellett wrote: > On Fri, May 17, 2019 at 10:14 PM Bruno Marchal wrote: > > On 16 May 2019, at 03:27, Bruce Kellett wrote: > > On Thu, May 16, 2019 at 12:59 AM Bruno Marchal > wrote: > > The first order theory of

Re: Is your elbow conscious?

On Sat, May 18, 2019 at 6:19 PM Philip Thrift wrote: >> It's weird, perhaps it comes from watching too much Star Trek but I >> don't understand why so many people believe it's inherently more difficult >> to produce emotion than intelligence when Evolution found the exact >> opposite to be true.

Re: Is your elbow conscious?

On 5/18/2019 9:32 AM, John Clark wrote: /Or maybe it has a function in the way human intelligence is implemented, but it wouldn't have a function is some other implementation./ Evolution is unlikely to have stumbled upon a complex method of achieving intelligence if there was a

Re: Is your elbow conscious?

On Saturday, May 18, 2019 at 11:44:33 AM UTC-5, John Clark wrote: > > > > On Sat, May 18, 2019 at 9:37 AM Philip Thrift > wrote: > > *A simulated human brain could read the Wikipedia article on pain [ >> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pain ] >> and

Re: Is your elbow conscious?

On Saturday, May 18, 2019 at 4:09:51 PM UTC-5, Jason wrote: > > > > On Sat, May 18, 2019 at 2:56 PM Philip Thrift > wrote: > >> >> >> On Saturday, May 18, 2019 at 2:39:29 PM UTC-5, Brent wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>> On 5/18/2019 6:37 AM, Philip Thrift wrote: >>> >>> *A simulated human brain could

Re: Is your elbow conscious?

It's harder in a science lab to produce either, unless we are speaking of the researchers themselves. No emotional machine Mr Spok, no great leap forward in intelligence, YET. I would harness AI to producing new inventions, much, much, faster-if I could?  -Original Message- From: John

Re: Is your elbow conscious?

On Sat, May 18, 2019 at 2:56 PM Philip Thrift wrote: > > > On Saturday, May 18, 2019 at 2:39:29 PM UTC-5, Brent wrote: >> >> >> >> On 5/18/2019 6:37 AM, Philip Thrift wrote: >> >> *A simulated human brain could describe it's back pain in every detail, >> write whole paragraphs about what it's

Re: Is your elbow conscious?

On Saturday, May 18, 2019 at 2:39:29 PM UTC-5, Brent wrote: > > > > On 5/18/2019 6:37 AM, Philip Thrift wrote: > > *A simulated human brain could describe it's back pain in every detail, > write whole paragraphs about what it's like, while according to the theory > of substrate dependence, it

Re: Is your elbow conscious?

On 5/18/2019 6:37 AM, Philip Thrift wrote: /A simulated human brain could describe it's back pain in every detail, write whole paragraphs about what it's like, while according to the theory of substrate dependence, it knows nothing of what it's writing about. Where then does this knowledge

Re: Is your elbow conscious?

On Saturday, May 18, 2019 at 10:47:15 AM UTC-5, Brent wrote: > > > > On 5/17/2019 11:11 PM, Philip Thrift wrote: > > > > On Friday, May 17, 2019 at 6:09:18 PM UTC-5, Brent wrote: >> >> >> >> On 5/17/2019 3:33 PM, Philip Thrift wrote: >> >> >> >> On Friday, May 17, 2019 at 5:21:41 PM UTC-5,

Re: Is your elbow conscious?

On Sat, May 18, 2019 at 9:37 AM Philip Thrift wrote: *A simulated human brain could read the Wikipedia article on pain [ > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pain ] > and integrate this knowledge into its knowledge base, but it could not > experience pain.* It's

Re: Is your elbow conscious?

On Fri, May 17, 2019 at 7:12 PM 'Brent Meeker' < everything-list@googlegroups.com> wrote: >> Even if we got super mega ultra lucky and Evolution just happened to >> produce a mutated gene that gave a being consciousness it would be lost in >> just a few generations due to genetic drift because

Re: The anecdote of Moon landing

On Friday, May 17, 2019 at 4:45:25 PM UTC-5, Cosmin Visan wrote: > > Of course. Do you think that what they teach you at school is the truth ? > History is invented by the winners. History is just an anecdotal story. > History is nuanced, but I think we can be sure that Julius Caesar was real,

Re: Are AI fanboys aware of the fact that consciousness is a unity ?

Did you?  Have you not heard of synesthesia? "Processing" means forming memories and drawing conclusions about action (including not taking action).  Mere measuring or recording is not the kind of processing that could produce qualia. Brent On 5/18/2019 12:27 AM, 'Cosmin Visan' via

Re: Is your elbow conscious?

On 5/17/2019 11:11 PM, Philip Thrift wrote: On Friday, May 17, 2019 at 6:09:18 PM UTC-5, Brent wrote: On 5/17/2019 3:33 PM, Philip Thrift wrote: On Friday, May 17, 2019 at 5:21:41 PM UTC-5, Brent wrote: On 5/16/2019 11:51 PM, Philip Thrift wrote: On

Re: Is your elbow conscious?

On Saturday, May 18, 2019, Philip Thrift wrote: > > > On Saturday, May 18, 2019 at 8:00:42 AM UTC-5, Jason wrote: >> >> >> >> On Saturday, May 18, 2019, Philip Thrift wrote: >> >>> >>> >>> On Friday, May 17, 2019 at 6:09:18 PM UTC-5, Brent wrote: On 5/17/2019 3:33 PM, Philip

Re: Is your elbow conscious?

On Saturday, May 18, 2019 at 8:00:42 AM UTC-5, Jason wrote: > > > > On Saturday, May 18, 2019, Philip Thrift > > wrote: > >> >> >> On Friday, May 17, 2019 at 6:09:18 PM UTC-5, Brent wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>> On 5/17/2019 3:33 PM, Philip Thrift wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>> On Friday, May 17, 2019 at

Re: The anecdote of Moon landing

On Fri, May 17, 2019 at 7:26 PM howardmarks wrote: > Lots of people have "premonitions" and beliefs they experience telepathy Richard Feynman has a story about that. One day when he was a undergraduate out of the blue he suddenly had a premonition that his grandmother had died, seconds later

Re: Is your elbow conscious?

On Saturday, May 18, 2019, Philip Thrift wrote: > > > On Friday, May 17, 2019 at 6:09:18 PM UTC-5, Brent wrote: >> >> >> >> On 5/17/2019 3:33 PM, Philip Thrift wrote: >> >> >> >> On Friday, May 17, 2019 at 5:21:41 PM UTC-5, Brent wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>> On 5/16/2019 11:51 PM, Philip Thrift wrote:

Re: Are AI fanboys aware of the fact that consciousness is a unity ?

Consciousness monism is incoherent if one maintains that there is an objective reality at all. If one rejects objective reality (a reality independent of oneself, or any self-aware conscious entity) then all bets are off. But I guess there are "AI fanboys" (as I understand what you mean) who

Re: Are AI fanboys aware of the fact that consciousness is a unity ?

Did you understand what I just wrote ? On Saturday, 18 May 2019 01:45:25 UTC+3, Brent wrote: > > > > On 5/17/2019 2:25 PM, 'Cosmin Visan' via Everything List wrote: > > Are AI fanboys aware of the fact that consciousness is a unity ? For > > example, hearing something and seeing something don't

Re: Is your elbow conscious?

On Friday, May 17, 2019 at 6:09:18 PM UTC-5, Brent wrote: > > > > On 5/17/2019 3:33 PM, Philip Thrift wrote: > > > > On Friday, May 17, 2019 at 5:21:41 PM UTC-5, Brent wrote: >> >> >> >> On 5/16/2019 11:51 PM, Philip Thrift wrote: >> >> >> >> On Thursday, May 16, 2019 at 5:14:46 PM UTC-5, John