Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
Hey, you were the one who said to Salyavin, Or maybe I'm confused. (See below in red.) I was just confirming that yes, you were confused. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote : You are the one confused - I was addressing Sal and something he said - try to see a mental health care professional to get treatment for your obsessive need to correct everyone in the world. Or get a session with Barry - oh how I wish he were here. From: authfriend@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2015 11:36 PM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug Gimme a break. You were wondering what I was talking about. You were confused. I unconfused you. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote : i was talking to Sal not u From: authfriend@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2015 8:46 PM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug You're a little confused. See my third paragraph below. All three of 'em are doing it. (I'm not talking about *sexual* harassment, BTW, just continued annoying dumb attacks, typically gratuitous.) ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote : I think she was accusing anartaxius of harassing her not you, or maybe I am confused From: salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2015 12:52 PM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote : You are a bit over the top in your reaction I think J, I don't think he's harassing you, but that would be in the mind of the receiver of the comments wouldn't it? Anartax certainly can't be accused of harassing TM'ers. He is pretty balanced in most of his posts actually. No. I'm not harassing anyone, I'm just calling them out on their hypocrisy. You can't expect to launch a sneering pile-on and not get other people objecting if they like the work of the poster. Me harassing TMers would also be silly as I am one. I do like analysing the cult of TM though, maybe that's what she means, but I never lose sleep over that as the TM movement claims to be scientific and science actually proceeds by criticism. If an idea is a bad explanation it won't stand up to scrutiny and should be discarded. Easy to forget that. And it is what this place is for. A healthy mind challenges its own assumptions etc... From: authfriend@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2015 11:40 AM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug I do not say this. But sometimes it's obvious what state of mind a poster is in. salyavin was just demanding that Ann quit what he called her dumb harassment of Xeno. How about you quit your dumb harassment of me and other TM supporters? Or is the idea to make up for Barry's absence by emulating his harassing behavior? You, salyavin, and Curtis seem to be working pretty hard at it, if not very coherently. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, anartaxius@... wrote : Ah. The master projector oracle speaks. I know, she says, exactly what everyone is really thinking and why.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend@... wrote : You're a little confused. See my third paragraph below. All three of 'em are doing it. (I'm not talking about *sexual* harassment, BTW, just continued annoying dumb attacks, typically gratuitous.) Me: There are no attacks and no one was being harassed. Those are inappropriately dramatic terms for me communicating with you here about a topic we disagreed with each other on. Is your memory going too? You called me dishonest (and then denied you had done so, apparently not realizing I'd quote you doing so). That was an empty, false accusation, and you knew it. Ergo, harassment. Me2: Yes it is true that I forgot I had made my suspicions explicit. With your latest stunt this view has been vindicated. In your dreams, toots. (We will get to that post later, it must be savored on the palette like a very old port.) And it finally led you to at least say some of the right things about this mess which was my goal. I'd already said those things, Curtis. That you don't read (or don't remember) my posts doesn't make me dishonest. And the whole thing was accomplished with mostly cordial exchanges. None of that was cordial. You don't get to have a cordial exchange when you start off by falsely accusing somebody of being dishonest. Not without a retraction and apology. Me2: How about a reaffirmation that the charge was valid? Of dishonesty? Are you drunk-posting? You took one quote out of context and hyper-focused on it, demonstrating one of your biggest and most consistent cognitive errors. Then you threw in a little fallacious slippery slope argument to prove that it as in intentional deception. Want to try that last line again? Your syntax has gotten rather shaky. In any case, it wasn't a deception, intentional or otherwise. Cordial is relative to the poster. For you, that was cordial. Except for your inappropriate drama queenery, but that is part of the package and I accept that. And what characterizes your many posts to and about Doug? Drama kingery? Or is it only appropriate when you do it? Me2: Judy isn't often intentionally funny so let's give her a little credit her. My charges are specific and have not been labeled as more than they are. Judy in a previous post: As I've said, I object to Doug's attempt to moderate the David Lynch post. I object to his not revealing why he bounced Barry. Me: Thanks for making that clear, you have redeemed yourself a bit. I had already made that clear in other posts, as I told you. Judy: I can't object to his bouncing Barry without knowing why he did it. Me: Agreed, a reasonable reaction. Judy:If he did it because Barry openly defied him, I support it. I'm not into anarchy. Me: This is where we disagree. You are invoking the fallacy of he slippery slope and it does not fly. Barry objected to a person in charge who is capable of doing exactly what he did. And how could you believe he was going to actually ignore someone after he has told you that one thousand times while continuing to read and respond to some of your posts. Why you somehow believe he was serious here suddenly is a byproduct of your Barry bias. Oh, I see, that's the excuse now, Barry was JUST KIDDING. Ha ha ha. Jeez, how can you look at yourself in the mirror? I wasn't authorized to bounce him, or I'd have done it long since. So he couldn't have been just kidding when he said he'd never read or respond to my posts. Rather, he was LYING. Me2: Well if you take it as a lie then Buck's actions are unjustified just the same. No, I don't think he was either lying or kidding. Barry has very serious problems with self-control, and they've been getting worse and worse. I didn't say he was just kidding, he was blowing off steam at a moderator gone rogue and he realized he was getting unfairly set up for exactly what happened. Barry went nuclear over what you have called a classic new-to-power rookie mistake. There was no gone rogue about it. Doug stumbled out of the gate, and Barry decided he was going to shoot him right there on the track. Fortunately Doug took his gun away before he could do any damage (except to himself). Now you and the rest of Barry's Boys are making up elaborate stories about all the terrible things Doug has (not yet) done. It's just a big farce, Curtis. Except it's not funny, it's pathetic. The section below is my new favorite exchange with Judy of ALL TIME. Its perfection must be swirled in my mouth, first noticing the oaky notes in the back of my olfactory chamber,then each part of my tongue will be attended to in sequence from the back to the front and finally taken as a whole
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend@... wrote : You're a little confused. See my third paragraph below. All three of 'em are doing it. (I'm not talking about *sexual* harassment, BTW, just continued annoying dumb attacks, typically gratuitous.) Me: There are no attacks and no one was being harassed. Those are inappropriately dramatic terms for me communicating with you here about a topic we disagreed with each other on. Is your memory going too? You called me dishonest (and then denied you had done so, apparently not realizing I'd quote you doing so). That was an empty, false accusation, and you knew it. Ergo, harassment. Me2: Yes it is true that I forgot I had made my suspicions explicit. With your latest stunt this view has been vindicated. (We will get to that post later, it must be savored on the palette like a very old port.) And it finally led you to at least say some of the right things about this mess which was my goal. I'd already said those things, Curtis. That you don't read (or don't remember) my posts doesn't make me dishonest. And the whole thing was accomplished with mostly cordial exchanges. None of that was cordial. You don't get to have a cordial exchange when you start off by falsely accusing somebody of being dishonest. Not without a retraction and apology. Me2: How about a reaffirmation that the charge was valid? You took one quote out of context and hyper-focused on it, demonstrating one of your biggest and most consistent cognitive errors. Then you threw in a little fallacious slippery slope argument to prove that it as in intentional deception. Cordial is relative to the poster. For you, that was cordial. Except for your inappropriate drama queenery, but that is part of the package and I accept that. And what characterizes your many posts to and about Doug? Drama kingery? Or is it only appropriate when you do it? Me2: Judy isn't often intentionally funny so let's give her a little credit her. My charges are specific and have not been labeled as more than they are. Judy in a previous post: As I've said, I object to Doug's attempt to moderate the David Lynch post. I object to his not revealing why he bounced Barry. Me: Thanks for making that clear, you have redeemed yourself a bit. I had already made that clear in other posts, as I told you. Judy: I can't object to his bouncing Barry without knowing why he did it. Me: Agreed, a reasonable reaction. Judy:If he did it because Barry openly defied him, I support it. I'm not into anarchy. Me: This is where we disagree. You are invoking the fallacy of he slippery slope and it does not fly. Barry objected to a person in charge who is capable of doing exactly what he did. And how could you believe he was going to actually ignore someone after he has told you that one thousand times while continuing to read and respond to some of your posts. Why you somehow believe he was serious here suddenly is a byproduct of your Barry bias. Oh, I see, that's the excuse now, Barry was JUST KIDDING. Ha ha ha. Jeez, how can you look at yourself in the mirror? I wasn't authorized to bounce him, or I'd have done it long since. So he couldn't have been just kidding when he said he'd never read or respond to my posts. Rather, he was LYING. Me2: Well if you take it as a lie then Buck's actions are unjustified just the same. I didn't say he was just kidding, he was blowing off steam at a moderator gone rogue and he realized he was getting unfairly set up for exactly what happened. The section below is my new favorite exchange with Judy of ALL TIME. Its perfection must be swirled in my mouth, first noticing the oaky notes in the back of my olfactory chamber,then each part of my tongue will be attended to in sequence from the back to the front and finally taken as a whole noticing the back notes and the after taste. Then it will be expectorated into the spittoon which is its rightful place. I owe you the reference on Buck's deception: Buck being channeled though Doug: Yes, Turqb and Serious are gone from FFL by moderation. I am only the CEO. My master is the list owner. We had quite sufficient back and forth about this before taking our additional time to go in to pull the moderation levers in the controls Where does Doug say bouncing Barry was a joint decision by him and Rick? Isn't that what you accused him of lying about? I don't see it. This refers to I am only the CEO. My master is the list owner. Entirely proper, and what Rick said as well (If Doug abuses his authority and/or fails to moderate fairly and objectively, I will revoke his moderator status). Pull the moderation levers in the controls refers to Rick changing the member settings for the group to allow Doug to moderate (delete
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
You are the one confused - I was addressing Sal and something he said - try to
see a mental health care professional to get treatment for your obsessive need
to correct everyone in the world.
Or get a session with Barry - oh how I wish he were here.
From: authfri...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]
FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2015 11:36 PM
Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
Gimme a break. You were wondering what I was talking about. You were
confused. I unconfused you.
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote :
i was talking to Sal not u
From: authfriend@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2015 8:46 PM
Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
You're a little confused. See my third paragraph below. All three of 'em are
doing it.
(I'm not talking about *sexual* harassment, BTW, just continued annoying dumb
attacks, typically gratuitous.)
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote :
I think she was accusing anartaxius of harassing her not you, or maybe I am
confused
From: salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2015 12:52 PM
Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote :
You are a bit over the top in your reaction I think J, I don't think he's
harassing you, but that would be in the mind of the receiver of the comments
wouldn't it? Anartax certainly can't be accused of harassing TM'ers. He is
pretty balanced in most of his posts actually.
No. I'm not harassing anyone, I'm just calling them out on their hypocrisy. You
can't expect to launch a sneering pile-on and not get other people objecting if
they like the work of the poster.
Me harassing TMers would also be silly as I am one. I do like analysing the
cult of TM though, maybe that's what she means, but I never lose sleep over
that as the TM movement claims to be scientific and science actually proceeds
by criticism. If an idea is a bad explanation it won't stand up to scrutiny and
should be discarded. Easy to forget that. And it is what this place is for.
A healthy mind challenges its own assumptions etc...
From: authfriend@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2015 11:40 AM
Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
I do not say this. But sometimes it's obvious what state of mind a poster is in.
salyavin was just demanding that Ann quit what he called her dumb harassment
of Xeno. How about you quit your dumb harassment of me and other TM supporters?
Or is the idea to make up for Barry's absence by emulating his harassing
behavior? You, salyavin, and Curtis seem to be working pretty hard at it, if
not very coherently.
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, anartaxius@... wrote :
Ah. The master projector oracle speaks. I know, she says, exactly what everyone
is really thinking and why.
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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
The deleted posts weren't critical of Doug. They were instructions for Barry on how to circumvent the ban and post on FFL the way Ravi does. Doug is a moderator, and Barry must respect his authoritah, so the posts were deleted. IMO, the deletions were not unreasonable, but they were deletions. Respect my authoritah! (Compilation) https://youtu.be/k1vKDM7wfiA https://youtu.be/k1vKDM7wfiA Respect my authoritah! (Compilation) https://youtu.be/k1vKDM7wfiA This feature is not available right now. Please try again later. View on youtu.be https://youtu.be/k1vKDM7wfiA Preview by Yahoo ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sun...@yahoo.com wrote : I see what you are saying. I didn't realize that the deleting was done selectively. I was glad to see Ravi posting again, but I did not realize that the post which was deleted was the one critical of Doug, while the other ones were left standing. Yes, that is a little disturbing. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, j_alexander_stanley@... wrote : Actually, just this morning, Doug did his first exertion of editorial control by deleting Ravi's Barry - here's the gameplan thread. Granted, I can understand why he deleted it, but a deletion is a deletion. Thankfully, the offsite archive is under Rick's control, and the only way stuff gets deleted over there is if Rick emails the site's admin... like he's got the time and attention for that. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sundur@... wrote : quite an exaggeration, I'd say. we know negativity, and we know what an edge is. everyone likes edge, no one lines trolling. it sounds Curtis, like you have a fervent wish for Doug to turn into the tyrant, he shows no sign of turning into. he banned Barry, because he obviously felt the site would be better off without an individual declaring, loudly, continually, that he was going to undermine him, the moderator, at every turn. since then, there has been no, as in zero, evidence of Doug exerting editorial control over the site. in fact, what we have, and what we haven't had in a long time is, ironically, the free expression of ideas, without someone with an overriding agenda putting the bum's rush on any idea he didn't like. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : snip And the people who didn't like the person look the other way and say,let's move along and not be negative. And the people who have seen this all before and know where it leads stand up and speak out. Then one of two things happen. Maharishi visits the course and kicks out the power-grabbing guru wanna-be for abusing his power, or the other voices get quelled one by one. Time will tell. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote : And I notice that Dougy is still not responding to Curtis' request for an explanation to Turq's getting the boot - ignoring what needs to be addressed and blabbering about a bunch of other stuff is spot on TMO behavior. From: anartaxius@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, June 24, 2015 8:53 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sundur@... wrote : This is not a place for someone who has a stated agenda to prove his point that an organization is a cult, and to label anyone who may defend the organization as cult apologist. According to the spiel on the Fairfield Life home page, this is the perfect place to discuss whether the TM Org is a cult. If what you say is true, then you feel this place has a stated agenda to prove the point that the TM Org is not a cult. This is a blatant statement showing you wish to suppress opposing points of view, as do many others here. Remember the first quotation on that page: What is wanted is not the will to believe, but the wish to find out, which is the exact opposite. ~ Bertrand Russell
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
Oh, I see. Thanks for the clarification. I read too quickly, often. It does, however, make me feel better. I feel recharged some in an effort to keep the membership roll as it is at present. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, j_alexander_stanley@... wrote : The deleted posts weren't critical of Doug. They were instructions for Barry on how to circumvent the ban and post on FFL the way Ravi does. Doug is a moderator, and Barry must respect his authoritah, so the posts were deleted. IMO, the deletions were not unreasonable, but they were deletions. Respect my authoritah! (Compilation) https://youtu.be/k1vKDM7wfiA https://youtu.be/k1vKDM7wfiA Respect my authoritah! (Compilation) https://youtu.be/k1vKDM7wfiA This feature is not available right now. Please try again later. View on youtu.be https://youtu.be/k1vKDM7wfiA Preview by Yahoo ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sundur@... wrote : I see what you are saying. I didn't realize that the deleting was done selectively. I was glad to see Ravi posting again, but I did not realize that the post which was deleted was the one critical of Doug, while the other ones were left standing. Yes, that is a little disturbing. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, j_alexander_stanley@... wrote : Actually, just this morning, Doug did his first exertion of editorial control by deleting Ravi's Barry - here's the gameplan thread. Granted, I can understand why he deleted it, but a deletion is a deletion. Thankfully, the offsite archive is under Rick's control, and the only way stuff gets deleted over there is if Rick emails the site's admin... like he's got the time and attention for that. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sundur@... wrote : quite an exaggeration, I'd say. we know negativity, and we know what an edge is. everyone likes edge, no one lines trolling. it sounds Curtis, like you have a fervent wish for Doug to turn into the tyrant, he shows no sign of turning into. he banned Barry, because he obviously felt the site would be better off without an individual declaring, loudly, continually, that he was going to undermine him, the moderator, at every turn. since then, there has been no, as in zero, evidence of Doug exerting editorial control over the site. in fact, what we have, and what we haven't had in a long time is, ironically, the free expression of ideas, without someone with an overriding agenda putting the bum's rush on any idea he didn't like. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : snip And the people who didn't like the person look the other way and say,let's move along and not be negative. And the people who have seen this all before and know where it leads stand up and speak out. Then one of two things happen. Maharishi visits the course and kicks out the power-grabbing guru wanna-be for abusing his power, or the other voices get quelled one by one. Time will tell. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote : And I notice that Dougy is still not responding to Curtis' request for an explanation to Turq's getting the boot - ignoring what needs to be addressed and blabbering about a bunch of other stuff is spot on TMO behavior. From: anartaxius@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, June 24, 2015 8:53 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sundur@... wrote : This is not a place for someone who has a stated agenda to prove his point that an organization is a cult, and to label anyone who may defend the organization as cult apologist. According to the spiel on the Fairfield Life home page, this is the perfect place to discuss whether the TM Org is a cult. If what you say is true, then you feel this place has a stated agenda to prove the point that the TM Org is not a cult. This is a blatant statement showing you wish to suppress opposing points of view, as do many others here. Remember the first quotation on that page: What is wanted is not the will to believe, but the wish to find out, which is the exact opposite. ~ Bertrand Russell
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
to enlighten the less intellectually capable among us. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sundur@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : Me: Whenever I lurked in the last few months I would see you responding to Barry. You spent time doing this. It was your choice. What you wrote about someone putting a the bum's rush on ideas is a weird statement that hands the power of your own mind and intellectual boundaries over to someone else here. S:Curtis, my buttons can get pushed, and do get pushed every day. I venture to say that this is no different than anyone. Set aside for a moment the more technical definition of a bully and go with the definition of a bully we grew up with. I will take a stand against a bully whether it is a physical bully, or an intellectual bully. And when the bully states that he does what he does to make people uncomfortable, then I am not able to stand by and tolerate that. If this means I have lost my intellecual integrity, then I have done so. I have taken as much fire from as many people as anyone here Steve. I was able to choose whose criticism I would respond to. I am curious why you feel unable to make this choice yourself and why you would let anyone's other opinion on a topic give your ideas the bum's rush? When you and I disagree, we have a civil discussion like this one. If Barry didn't treat you that way then why did you respond to him so much? I think I know. Same reason I interact with people I don't agree with, because it is a great writing prompt for uncovering our own ideas in writing to people we disagree with. I didn't do this with the last R because he was not capable of discussion. But with the other two I did for the same reasons you did with Barry I'll bet. S: Of course there was not discussion with Barry, as I was on his DNR list. It was strictly an antagonistic one way relationship, with me finding fault with what I felt were his lies and misrepresentations and trolling for reactions. All three R's rode my jock for legions of posts. None of them deserved to get booted because they went after everything I wrote with their idiotic personal attacks. None of them gave any of my ideas the bums' rush. They mostly just proved my point with their behavior. Buck has violated the trust of this place by being dishonest and if you were being honest you would just admit that your personal position on Barry has distorted your sense of right and wrong on this issue. Moderators need to give reasons for booting people, not lie about it and blame it on other people. And if as a group we don't buy the reason, Rick should be informed that his moderator is not running the site as the free though forum it was intended to be. S: Yes, I own up to the fact that I am happy to see him go. And if Doug booted him for less than a bootable reason, I will compromise my standards in this regard for what I think is a greater good. But the reality is that I think, the means justify the ends in this case. In other words, there are exceptions for every rule, and I embrace this exception. And when what goes around, comes around in this regard, I hope I'll be ready. Barry didn't need to be a weatherman to see which way the wind was blowing. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : snip And the people who didn't like the person look the other way and say,let's move along and not be negative. And the people who have seen this all before and know where it leads stand up and speak out. Then one of two things happen. Maharishi visits the course and kicks out the power-grabbing guru wanna-be for abusing his power, or the other voices get quelled one by one. Time will tell. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote : And I notice that Dougy is still not responding to Curtis' request for an explanation to Turq's getting the boot - ignoring what needs to be addressed and blabbering about a bunch of other stuff is spot on TMO behavior. From: anartaxius@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, June 24, 2015 8:53 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sundur@... wrote : This is not a place for someone who has a stated agenda to prove his point that an organization is a cult, and to label anyone who may defend the organization as cult apologist. According to the spiel on the Fairfield Life home page, this is the perfect place to discuss whether the TM Org is a cult. If what you say is true, then you feel this place has a stated agenda to prove the point that the TM Org is not a cult. This is a blatant statement showing you wish to suppress opposing points of view, as do many others here. Remember the first quotation on that page: What is wanted
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
I see what you are saying. I didn't realize that the deleting was done selectively. I was glad to see Ravi posting again, but I did not realize that the post which was deleted was the one critical of Doug, while the other ones were left standing. Yes, that is a little disturbing. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, j_alexander_stanley@... wrote : Actually, just this morning, Doug did his first exertion of editorial control by deleting Ravi's Barry - here's the gameplan thread. Granted, I can understand why he deleted it, but a deletion is a deletion. Thankfully, the offsite archive is under Rick's control, and the only way stuff gets deleted over there is if Rick emails the site's admin... like he's got the time and attention for that. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sundur@... wrote : quite an exaggeration, I'd say. we know negativity, and we know what an edge is. everyone likes edge, no one lines trolling. it sounds Curtis, like you have a fervent wish for Doug to turn into the tyrant, he shows no sign of turning into. he banned Barry, because he obviously felt the site would be better off without an individual declaring, loudly, continually, that he was going to undermine him, the moderator, at every turn. since then, there has been no, as in zero, evidence of Doug exerting editorial control over the site. in fact, what we have, and what we haven't had in a long time is, ironically, the free expression of ideas, without someone with an overriding agenda putting the bum's rush on any idea he didn't like. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : snip And the people who didn't like the person look the other way and say,let's move along and not be negative. And the people who have seen this all before and know where it leads stand up and speak out. Then one of two things happen. Maharishi visits the course and kicks out the power-grabbing guru wanna-be for abusing his power, or the other voices get quelled one by one. Time will tell. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote : And I notice that Dougy is still not responding to Curtis' request for an explanation to Turq's getting the boot - ignoring what needs to be addressed and blabbering about a bunch of other stuff is spot on TMO behavior. From: anartaxius@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, June 24, 2015 8:53 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sundur@... wrote : This is not a place for someone who has a stated agenda to prove his point that an organization is a cult, and to label anyone who may defend the organization as cult apologist. According to the spiel on the Fairfield Life home page, this is the perfect place to discuss whether the TM Org is a cult. If what you say is true, then you feel this place has a stated agenda to prove the point that the TM Org is not a cult. This is a blatant statement showing you wish to suppress opposing points of view, as do many others here. Remember the first quotation on that page: What is wanted is not the will to believe, but the wish to find out, which is the exact opposite. ~ Bertrand Russell
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
: ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : Me: Whenever I lurked in the last few months I would see you responding to Barry. You spent time doing this. It was your choice. What you wrote about someone putting a the bum's rush on ideas is a weird statement that hands the power of your own mind and intellectual boundaries over to someone else here. S:Curtis, my buttons can get pushed, and do get pushed every day. I venture to say that this is no different than anyone. Set aside for a moment the more technical definition of a bully and go with the definition of a bully we grew up with. I will take a stand against a bully whether it is a physical bully, or an intellectual bully. And when the bully states that he does what he does to make people uncomfortable, then I am not able to stand by and tolerate that. If this means I have lost my intellecual integrity, then I have done so. I have taken as much fire from as many people as anyone here Steve. I was able to choose whose criticism I would respond to. I am curious why you feel unable to make this choice yourself and why you would let anyone's other opinion on a topic give your ideas the bum's rush? When you and I disagree, we have a civil discussion like this one. If Barry didn't treat you that way then why did you respond to him so much? I think I know. Same reason I interact with people I don't agree with, because it is a great writing prompt for uncovering our own ideas in writing to people we disagree with. I didn't do this with the last R because he was not capable of discussion. But with the other two I did for the same reasons you did with Barry I'll bet. S: Of course there was not discussion with Barry, as I was on his DNR list. It was strictly an antagonistic one way relationship, with me finding fault with what I felt were his lies and misrepresentations and trolling for reactions. All three R's rode my jock for legions of posts. None of them deserved to get booted because they went after everything I wrote with their idiotic personal attacks. None of them gave any of my ideas the bums' rush. They mostly just proved my point with their behavior. Buck has violated the trust of this place by being dishonest and if you were being honest you would just admit that your personal position on Barry has distorted your sense of right and wrong on this issue. Moderators need to give reasons for booting people, not lie about it and blame it on other people. And if as a group we don't buy the reason, Rick should be informed that his moderator is not running the site as the free though forum it was intended to be. S: Yes, I own up to the fact that I am happy to see him go. And if Doug booted him for less than a bootable reason, I will compromise my standards in this regard for what I think is a greater good. But the reality is that I think, the means justify the ends in this case. In other words, there are exceptions for every rule, and I embrace this exception. And when what goes around, comes around in this regard, I hope I'll be ready. Barry didn't need to be a weatherman to see which way the wind was blowing. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : snip And the people who didn't like the person look the other way and say,let's move along and not be negative. And the people who have seen this all before and know where it leads stand up and speak out. Then one of two things happen. Maharishi visits the course and kicks out the power-grabbing guru wanna-be for abusing his power, or the other voices get quelled one by one. Time will tell. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote : And I notice that Dougy is still not responding to Curtis' request for an explanation to Turq's getting the boot - ignoring what needs to be addressed and blabbering about a bunch of other stuff is spot on TMO behavior. From: anartaxius@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, June 24, 2015 8:53 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sundur@... wrote : This is not a place for someone who has a stated agenda to prove his point that an organization is a cult, and to label anyone who may defend the organization as cult apologist. According to the spiel on the Fairfield Life home page, this is the perfect place to discuss whether the TM Org is a cult. If what you say is true, then you feel this place has a stated agenda to prove the point that the TM Org is not a cult. This is a blatant statement showing you wish to suppress opposing points of view, as do many others here. Remember the first quotation on that page: What is wanted is not the will to believe, but the wish to find out, which is the exact opposite. ~ Bertrand Russell
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
Ah. The master projector oracle speaks. I know, she says, exactly what everyone
is really thinking and why.
From: authfri...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]
FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2015 5:00 AM
Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sundur@... wrote :
I would certainly have to agree with you, xeno.
The question is how, or why do you respond to someone who, for a great majority
of the time, is just going for a reaction.
It is a total waste of time, for which I am guilty.
I agree that Barry was likely never upset when he posted.
I beg to differ with both of you. He was often incoherent with rage and
completely out of control when he posted after someone had dissected one of his
posts. You could count on it: he would very rarely respond directly to
criticism, but a day or so later, he'd come out with one of his long posts
attacking the critic on whatever grounds he could dream up.
All his bluster about folks being attached to the self was projection; he was
as attached as anybody and much more attached than some.
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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend@... wrote : My first send hasn't shown up. Maybe Doug has decided to hold my posts for approval. Let's see if this second try makes it... ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend@... wrote : Sure. Your accusation today that it was dishonest of me to post the last paragraph of Barry's post in which he declares he's going to ignore Doug completely. That was harassment, for the reasons I've already stated. C: I said it was slippery. You said it was dishonest: Judy, who is the first to make a stink about the context of a quote when it serves her own purposes has clipped out this paragraph of Barry's from the thread context, dishonestly making it look like Barry said this in a vacuum. Which it was. Me2: Well as long as we agree on its dishonesty, my point has been made. Don't be ridiculous. I explained to you why it was silly. You ignored that explanation and decided you wanted to talk about something else. So any opposition to your POV is harassment? Where did I say or suggest such a thing? Making up a dumb, frivolous accusation for the sole purpose of getting someone you don't like is harassment. Let me add this: Everybody was following the Doug-Barry confrontation with bated breath. Nobody thought he'd written that paragraph in a vacuum. And all they had to do was click on the link I provided if there was any question in their minds. Me2: OK now that we have done the Judy dance I will state my point again. By singling out that quote you give an impression that was not true about Barry. In the context of being threatened by a moderator over his comment about Lynch and having just waded through some convoluted and fey logic about how his statement violated the yahoo guidelines, and in the context of a plea to Rick to stop this nonsensical farce, his comment was highly restrained although he was obviously pissed off which is understandable IN CONTEXT. So you chose to isolate it from that context to impose yours on it. I guess you do have the moderator you deserve. Prattle. Me2: Excellent archaic word choice, I'm sure the equally old-timey Buck will approve. But my point does not fold under your obfuscation by over focusing on the details that don't matter. You Judy are being hypocritical about this issue because of your bias. You should be he first to object to this behavior by Buck. He banned Barry after making up a bogus charge. He refused to answer question about why even from Alex. He is acting against Rick's specific instructions and desires for his own group. He lied about Rick being involved in the decision. And here you are Judy, showing up as the perfect hypocrite, claiming I am harassing you by calling you on your BS. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend@... wrote : I do not say this. But sometimes it's obvious what state of mind a poster is in. salyavin was just demanding that Ann quit what he called her dumb harassment of Xeno. How about you quit your dumb harassment of me and other TM supporters? Or is the idea to make up for Barry's absence by emulating his harassing behavior? You, salyavin, and Curtis seem to be working pretty hard at it, if not very coherently. Me: You are making a false accusation Judy. Or perhaps you would like to post a single example of me emulating harassing behavior?
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
My first send hasn't shown up. Maybe Doug has decided to hold my posts for approval. Let's see if this second try makes it... ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend@... wrote : Sure. Your accusation today that it was dishonest of me to post the last paragraph of Barry's post in which he declares he's going to ignore Doug completely. That was harassment, for the reasons I've already stated. C: I said it was slippery. You said it was dishonest: Judy, who is the first to make a stink about the context of a quote when it serves her own purposes has clipped out this paragraph of Barry's from the thread context, dishonestly making it look like Barry said this in a vacuum. Which it was. Don't be ridiculous. I explained to you why it was silly. You ignored that explanation and decided you wanted to talk about something else. So any opposition to your POV is harassment? Where did I say or suggest such a thing? Making up a dumb, frivolous accusation for the sole purpose of getting someone you don't like is harassment. Let me add this: Everybody was following the Doug-Barry confrontation with bated breath. Nobody thought he'd written that paragraph in a vacuum. And all they had to do was click on the link I provided if there was any question in their minds. I guess you do have the moderator you deserve. Prattle. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend@... wrote : I do not say this. But sometimes it's obvious what state of mind a poster is in. salyavin was just demanding that Ann quit what he called her dumb harassment of Xeno. How about you quit your dumb harassment of me and other TM supporters? Or is the idea to make up for Barry's absence by emulating his harassing behavior? You, salyavin, and Curtis seem to be working pretty hard at it, if not very coherently. Me: You are making a false accusation Judy. Or perhaps you would like to post a single example of me emulating harassing behavior?
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
Sure, an interesting question. I believe Edg provided an answer to this yesterday, and my thinking is somewhat aligned with that. But, get this. What we are seeing, is that the tone of place is changing. So, for whatever reason, people are feeling more comfortable posting. I mean, I guess different personalities react differently to this getting your buttons pushed meme, and I suppose if you dig into it, maybe you'd find personality quirks, but why argue with results. I'd love it if you felt inclined to offer some feedback on this. Thanks ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, j_alexander_stanley@... wrote : I've always favored people being self-sufficient in filtering their own online experience over external censorship. In stepping out of my bubble of Clever Swissness, I will admit that Barry was a mixed bag, to be sure. But, I don't buy the argument that his abusive stuff was some kind of valuable and appropriate spiritual lesson for those on the receiving end for the simple fact that FFL is not Uncle Tantra's Crazy Wisdom Online Ashram, where such behavior could be expected. On the other hand, for the life of me, I can not understand why his targets would constantly give away their power and react to him. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sundur@... wrote : thanks Curtis. I'm still voting for the current status quo, though.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
Some of us wonder Judy what you do with your time when you are not reviling folks on FFL. From: authfri...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2015 11:18 AM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug Oh, blow it out your I/O port, Curtis. I note that you don't mention the context of *my* post, because it's embarrassing to one of your compatriots in trying to make up in nastiness for Barry's absence. And you didn't complain when I quoted Barry's post to you without the accompanying quote from Doug last week. Obviously he'd taken exception to something Doug had said, and everybody knows Barry was hassling Doug about his David Lynch mistake. And both times I supplied the URL of Barry's post for folks who wanted to know the context. The only part that was *relevant* to my response to JamesAlan was that last paragraph. JamesAlan had claimed (as you know; it's quoted below) of Steve's post that Steve was saying I choose to believe and do whatever suits my desired ends. Fine for Barry (and everybody else) to scream at Doug about the David Lynch post. Doug was wrong, and apparently he knows it, because he never deleted the post. But there's a HUGE difference between talking back to the moderator and declaring you are going to ignore him no matter what he says. I know you're having to scramble for ammunition against me, Curtis, but you're gonna have to do better than this. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : There is something slippery going on here. Judy, who is the first to make a stink about the context of a quote when it serves her own purposes has clipped out this paragraph of Barry's from the thread context, dishonestly making it look like Barry said this in a vacuum. The context was Buck continuing to make a case that criticizing David Lynch was a violation of the Yahoo guidelines. This quote was contained in a plea to Rick to remove an obviously highly biased moderator who was gunning to kick Barry off. (Which then actually happened.) Here is the more complete thread giving Buck's absurd accusations and Barry's response. To me it looks like a rational response to lunacy. I will put Buck's first so his apologists can take a crack at explaining how this is a reasonable position to take concerning calling David Lynch an idiot. BUCK: Additionally, “Exploitative or degrading comments are not welcome in Groups.”“..and don't invade other people's privacy.”The dragging of someone in to an unrelated thread as a means to slur them using FFL, a yahoo-group..Whoa,for instance DLynch as a practitioner of TM worked with MaharishiMahesh Yogi quite a lot on the teaching of TM quite evidently for goodreasons and quite evidently Lynch knew well enough the scope of the'what for and why' he was there. Quite evidently Turqb here is activelytrying to slur and degrade DLynch personally by jumping in to thisthread with an unqualified non sequitur posting publicly using ['exploitative' ] a Yahoo-group [FFL]. Nowin a choice of moderation Turqb can go back in and delete this postingof his post haste and protect his membership status here or will this beleft to the FFL moderators to go in and do it? The choice is Turq's.-JaiGuruYou Barry: This has really become too sad to get involved with. Rick,please do something to help Doug -- like removing him from his positionas moderator. The responsibility and the genuine impossibility of thetask have clearly caused him to become mentally ill. It was entertaining for a while when he was just embarrassing himself. But now he's embarrassing the whole forum. Moderatoror not, Doug is now officially back on my Troll List. I will no longerbother to read anything he says or reply to anything he posts. Like ourrecently departed member, he no longer exists. By acting this crazy, hehas effectively -- and ironically -- deleted himself. From: dhamiltony2k5@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, June 17, 2015 9:13 PM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: On Gratuitous invasions of privacy Additionally, “Exploitative or degrading comments are not welcome in Groups.”“..and don't invade other people's privacy.”The dragging of someone in to an unrelated thread as a means to slur them using FFL, a yahoo-group..Whoa,for instance DLynch as a practitioner of TM worked with MaharishiMahesh Yogi quite a lot on the teaching of TM quite evidently for goodreasons and quite evidently Lynch knew well enough the scope of the'what for and why' he was there. Quite evidently Turqb here is activelytrying to slur and degrade DLynch personally by jumping in to thisthread with an unqualified non sequitur posting publicly using ['exploitative' ] a Yahoo-group [FFL]. Nowin a choice of moderation Turqb can go back in and delete this postingof his post haste
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
I do not say this. But sometimes it's obvious what state of mind a poster is in. salyavin was just demanding that Ann quit what he called her dumb harassment of Xeno. How about you quit your dumb harassment of me and other TM supporters? Or is the idea to make up for Barry's absence by emulating his harassing behavior? You, salyavin, and Curtis seem to be working pretty hard at it, if not very coherently. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, anartaxius@... wrote : Ah. The master projector oracle speaks. I know, she says, exactly what everyone is really thinking and why. From: authfriend@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2015 5:00 AM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sundur@... wrote : I would certainly have to agree with you, xeno. The question is how, or why do you respond to someone who, for a great majority of the time, is just going for a reaction. It is a total waste of time, for which I am guilty. I agree that Barry was likely never upset when he posted. I beg to differ with both of you. He was often incoherent with rage and completely out of control when he posted after someone had dissected one of his posts. You could count on it: he would very rarely respond directly to criticism, but a day or so later, he'd come out with one of his long posts attacking the critic on whatever grounds he could dream up. All his bluster about folks being attached to the self was projection; he was as attached as anybody and much more attached than some.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
Maybe you should get her to do a reading for you.
From: Xenophaneros Anartaxius anartax...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]
FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2015 9:50 AM
Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
Ah. The master projector oracle speaks. I know, she says, exactly what
everyone is really thinking and why.
From: authfri...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]
FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2015 5:00 AM
Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sundur@... wrote :
I would certainly have to agree with you, xeno.
The question is how, or why do you respond to someone who, for a great majority
of the time, is just going for a reaction.
It is a total waste of time, for which I am guilty.
I agree that Barry was likely never upset when he posted.
I beg to differ with both of you. He was often incoherent with rage and
completely out of control when he posted after someone had dissected one of his
posts. You could count on it: he would very rarely respond directly to
criticism, but a day or so later, he'd come out with one of his long posts
attacking the critic on whatever grounds he could dream up.
All his bluster about folks being attached to the self was projection; he was
as attached as anybody and much more attached than some.
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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote : And I notice that Dougy is still not responding to Curtis' request for an explanation to Turq's getting the boot - ignoring what needs to be addressed and blabbering about a bunch of other stuff is spot on TMO behavior. From: anartaxius@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, June 24, 2015 8:53 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sundur@... wrote : This is not a place for someone who has a stated agenda to prove his point that an organization is a cult, and to label anyone who may defend the organization as cult apologist. According to the spiel on the Fairfield Life home page, this is the perfect place to discuss whether the TM Org is a cult. If what you say is true, then you feel this place has a stated agenda to prove the point that the TM Org is not a cult. This is a blatant statement showing you wish to suppress opposing points of view, as do many others here. Remember the first quotation on that page: What is wanted is not the will to believe, but the wish to find out, which is the exact opposite. ~ Bertrand Russell ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jamesalan735@... wrote : The responses below are some of the least rational, internally most contradictory responses that I have come across here. How the writer (apparently) considers these to constitute even a remotely coherent argument (and fails to see his responses as a complete surrender of moral principle to I choose to believe and do whatever suits my desired ends) is beyond me. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sundur@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : Me: Whenever I lurked in the last few months I would see you responding to Barry. You spent time doing this. It was your choice. What you wrote about someone putting a the bum's rush on ideas is a weird statement that hands the power of your own mind and intellectual boundaries over to someone else here. S:Curtis, my buttons can get pushed, and do get pushed every day. I venture to say that this is no different than anyone. Set aside for a moment the more technical definition of a bully and go with the definition of a bully we grew up with. I will take a stand against a bully whether it is a physical bully, or an intellectual bully. And when the bully states that he does what he does to make people uncomfortable, then I am not able to stand by and tolerate that. If this means I have lost my intellecual integrity, then I have done so. I have taken as much fire from as many people as anyone here Steve. I was able to choose whose criticism I would respond to. I am curious why you feel unable to make this choice yourself and why you would let anyone's other opinion on a topic give your ideas the bum's rush? When you and I disagree, we have a civil discussion like this one. If Barry didn't treat you that way then why did you respond to him so much? I think I know. Same reason I interact with people I don't agree with, because it is a great writing prompt for uncovering our own ideas in writing to people we disagree with. I didn't do this with the last R because he was not capable of discussion. But with the other two I did for the same reasons you did with Barry I'll bet. S: Of course there was not discussion with Barry, as I was on his DNR list. It was strictly an antagonistic one way relationship, with me finding fault with what I felt were his lies and misrepresentations and trolling for reactions. All three R's rode my jock for legions of posts. None of them deserved to get booted because they went after everything I wrote with their idiotic personal attacks. None of them gave any of my ideas the bums' rush. They mostly just proved my point with their behavior. Buck has violated the trust of this place by being dishonest and if you were being honest you would just admit that your personal position on Barry has distorted your sense of right and wrong on this issue. Moderators need to give reasons for booting people, not lie about it and blame it on other people. And if as a group we don't buy the reason, Rick should be informed that his moderator is not running the site as the free though forum it was intended to be. S: Yes, I own up to the fact that I am happy to see him go. And if Doug booted him for less than a bootable reason, I will compromise my standards in this regard for what I think is a greater good. But the reality is that I think, the means justify the ends in this case. In other words, there are exceptions for every rule, and I embrace this exception. And when what goes around, comes around in this regard, I hope I'll be ready. Barry didn't need to be a weatherman
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend@... wrote : Oh, blow it out your I/O port, Curtis. Me: Buck please deal with this violation of the kindness yahoo guideline. Judy: I note that you don't mention the context of *my* post, because it's embarrassing to one of your compatriots in trying to make up in nastiness for Barry's absence. And you didn't complain when I quoted Barry's post to you without the accompanying quote from Doug last week. Me: This point means nothing. I hadn't gone back and read the full thread again last week, I was dealing with your point at face value. But now I am dealing with it in context and it makes your point even more ridiculous. J: Obviously he'd taken exception to something Doug had said, and everybody knows Barry was hassling Doug about his David Lynch mistake. And both times I supplied the URL of Barry's post for folks who wanted to know the context. Me: Today I decided to talk about how absurd your focus on part of his reaction was. And all your fussing and fuming doesn't cover up your lack of ability to defend his indefensible attack on Barry's comment. I am not confused that you are dodging the main issue here. Buck never claimed this was the reason he banned Barry, he has not told us why. Your guess is all made-up nonsense to cover for a moderator acting in secret to ban one of your enemies. It only looks worse in context. J: The only part that was *relevant* to my response to JamesAlan was that last paragraph. JamesAlan had claimed (as you know; it's quoted below) of Steve's post that Steve was saying I choose to believe and do whatever suits my desired ends. Fine for Barry (and everybody else) to scream at Doug about the David Lynch post. Doug was wrong, and apparently he knows it, because he never deleted the post. But there's a HUGE difference between talking back to the moderator and declaring you are going to ignore him no matter what he says. I know you're having to scramble for ammunition against me, Curtis, but you're gonna have to do better than this. Me: You are on the wrong side of this and I know it Judy. But I need no ammo for you because I don't care about your partisan hypocrisy about this. It amuses me. What I do care about is having the site hijacked by a person who would attempt such a ridiculous accusation, transparently gunning for an individual poster, then ban him, then lie about whose decision it was, and then stonewall any questions about what the specific reason was that he got banned. I know for a fact that he is violating the explicit directions from the list owner. You have posted endlessly about your virtuous love of truth and honesty. When it is tested with someone you don't like, you fold. It was all for show. The get-Barry crew has shown their true ethical colors, and they stink. Alex was doing fine, there was no problem to solve that needed Buck. He invented this role as a ruse and immediately did what anyone can see who doesn't have Barry is bad blinders on. What makes your position doubly idiotic is that you could easily have been subject to this kind of mistreatment if the moderation fell into different partisan hands. And here is the kicker, I would have fought it just as hard for you as I am doing now, just as I spoke against banning the R trinity until two of them crossed clear ethical lines and I had to support it. I find this whole experience instructive concerning some people's ethics when self interest is in the way of doing the right thing. It disgusts me. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : There is something slippery going on here. Judy, who is the first to make a stink about the context of a quote when it serves her own purposes has clipped out this paragraph of Barry's from the thread context, dishonestly making it look like Barry said this in a vacuum. The context was Buck continuing to make a case that criticizing David Lynch was a violation of the Yahoo guidelines. This quote was contained in a plea to Rick to remove an obviously highly biased moderator who was gunning to kick Barry off. (Which then actually happened.) Here is the more complete thread giving Buck's absurd accusations and Barry's response. To me it looks like a rational response to lunacy. I will put Buck's first so his apologists can take a crack at explaining how this is a reasonable position to take concerning calling David Lynch an idiot. BUCK: Additionally, “Exploitative or degrading comments are not welcome in Groups.” “..and don't invade other people's privacy.” The dragging of someone in to an unrelated thread as a means to slur them using FFL, a yahoo-group.. Whoa, for instance DLynch as a practitioner of TM worked with Maharishi Mahesh Yogi quite a lot on the teaching of TM quite evidently for good reasons and quite evidently Lynch knew well enough the scope of the 'what for and why' he was there. Quite
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
Then lemme have a go at it. David Lynch is a lying hypocritical mentally screwed up individual who has made it his personal agenda to rook as many people as possible into getting on board with a meditation that has limited good effects and is backed by poor to dubious so-called science. His films are showcases of a sick mentality that seems to orient around the bizarre and around abuse of women. If you go by the TMO's standards of what kind of energy do we create, then Lynch is doing a great deal of harm in the world through the sick twisted energy his movies pump out, and doing harm through his promotion of a cult organization that falsely pretends to be a world savior. David Lynch is a screwball and any of the TMO leaders who don't like me saying so can bite me. From: curtisdeltabl...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2015 9:26 AM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug There is something slippery going on here. Judy, who is the first to make a stink about the context of a quote when it serves her own purposes has clipped out this paragraph of Barry's from the thread context, dishonestly making it look like Barry said this in a vacuum. The context was Buck continuing to make a case that criticizing David Lynch was a violation of the Yahoo guidelines. This quote was contained in a plea to Rick to remove an obviously highly biased moderator who was gunning to kick Barry off. (Which then actually happened.) Here is the more complete thread giving Buck's absurd accusations and Barry's response. To me it looks like a rational response to lunacy. I will put Buck's first so his apologists can take a crack at explaining how this is a reasonable position to take concerning calling David Lynch an idiot. BUCK: Additionally, “Exploitative or degrading comments are not welcome in Groups.”“..and don't invade other people's privacy.”The dragging of someone in to an unrelated thread as a means to slur them using FFL, a yahoo-group..Whoa, for instance DLynch as a practitioner of TM worked with Maharishi Mahesh Yogi quite a lot on the teaching of TM quite evidently for good reasons and quite evidently Lynch knew well enough the scope of the 'what for and why' he was there. Quite evidently Turqb here is actively trying to slur and degrade DLynch personally by jumping in to this thread with an unqualified non sequitur posting publicly using [ 'exploitative' ] a Yahoo-group [FFL]. Now in a choice of moderation Turqb can go back in and delete this posting of his post haste and protect his membership status here or will this be left to the FFL moderators to go in and do it? The choice is Turq's. -JaiGuruYou Barry: This has really become too sad to get involved with. Rick, please do something to help Doug -- like removing him from his position as moderator. The responsibility and the genuine impossibility of the task have clearly caused him to become mentally ill. It was entertaining for a while when he was just embarrassing himself. But now he's embarrassing the whole forum. Moderator or not, Doug is now officially back on my Troll List. I will no longer bother to read anything he says or reply to anything he posts. Like our recently departed member, he no longer exists. By acting this crazy, he has effectively -- and ironically -- deleted himself. From: dhamiltony2k5@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, June 17, 2015 9:13 PM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: On Gratuitous invasions of privacy Additionally, “Exploitative or degrading comments are not welcome in Groups.”“..and don't invade other people's privacy.”The dragging of someone in to an unrelated thread as a means to slur them using FFL, a yahoo-group..Whoa, for instance DLynch as a practitioner of TM worked with Maharishi Mahesh Yogi quite a lot on the teaching of TM quite evidently for good reasons and quite evidently Lynch knew well enough the scope of the 'what for and why' he was there. Quite evidently Turqb here is actively trying to slur and degrade DLynch personally by jumping in to this thread with an unqualified non sequitur posting publicly using [ 'exploitative' ] a Yahoo-group [FFL]. Now in a choice of moderation Turqb can go back in and delete this posting of his post haste and protect his membership status here or will this be left to the FFL moderators to go in and do it? The choice is Turq's. -JaiGuruYou ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jamesalan735@... wrote : The responses below are some of the least rational, internally most contradictory responses that I have come across here. How the writer (apparently) considers these to constitute even a remotely coherent argument (and fails to see his responses as a complete surrender of moral
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
Oh, blow it out your I/O port, Curtis. I note that you don't mention the context of *my* post, because it's embarrassing to one of your compatriots in trying to make up in nastiness for Barry's absence. And you didn't complain when I quoted Barry's post to you without the accompanying quote from Doug last week. Obviously he'd taken exception to something Doug had said, and everybody knows Barry was hassling Doug about his David Lynch mistake. And both times I supplied the URL of Barry's post for folks who wanted to know the context. The only part that was *relevant* to my response to JamesAlan was that last paragraph. JamesAlan had claimed (as you know; it's quoted below) of Steve's post that Steve was saying I choose to believe and do whatever suits my desired ends. Fine for Barry (and everybody else) to scream at Doug about the David Lynch post. Doug was wrong, and apparently he knows it, because he never deleted the post. But there's a HUGE difference between talking back to the moderator and declaring you are going to ignore him no matter what he says. I know you're having to scramble for ammunition against me, Curtis, but you're gonna have to do better than this. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : There is something slippery going on here. Judy, who is the first to make a stink about the context of a quote when it serves her own purposes has clipped out this paragraph of Barry's from the thread context, dishonestly making it look like Barry said this in a vacuum. The context was Buck continuing to make a case that criticizing David Lynch was a violation of the Yahoo guidelines. This quote was contained in a plea to Rick to remove an obviously highly biased moderator who was gunning to kick Barry off. (Which then actually happened.) Here is the more complete thread giving Buck's absurd accusations and Barry's response. To me it looks like a rational response to lunacy. I will put Buck's first so his apologists can take a crack at explaining how this is a reasonable position to take concerning calling David Lynch an idiot. BUCK: Additionally, “Exploitative or degrading comments are not welcome in Groups.” “..and don't invade other people's privacy.” The dragging of someone in to an unrelated thread as a means to slur them using FFL, a yahoo-group.. Whoa, for instance DLynch as a practitioner of TM worked with Maharishi Mahesh Yogi quite a lot on the teaching of TM quite evidently for good reasons and quite evidently Lynch knew well enough the scope of the 'what for and why' he was there. Quite evidently Turqb here is actively trying to slur and degrade DLynch personally by jumping in to this thread with an unqualified non sequitur posting publicly using [ 'exploitative' ] a Yahoo-group [FFL]. Now in a choice of moderation Turqb can go back in and delete this posting of his post haste and protect his membership status here or will this be left to the FFL moderators to go in and do it? The choice is Turq's. -JaiGuruYou Barry: This has really become too sad to get involved with. Rick, please do something to help Doug -- like removing him from his position as moderator. The responsibility and the genuine impossibility of the task have clearly caused him to become mentally ill. It was entertaining for a while when he was just embarrassing himself. But now he's embarrassing the whole forum. Moderator or not, Doug is now officially back on my Troll List. I will no longer bother to read anything he says or reply to anything he posts. Like our recently departed member, he no longer exists. By acting this crazy, he has effectively -- and ironically -- deleted himself. From: dhamiltony2k5@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, June 17, 2015 9:13 PM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: On Gratuitous invasions of privacy Additionally, “Exploitative or degrading comments are not welcome in Groups.” “..and don't invade other people's privacy.” The dragging of someone in to an unrelated thread as a means to slur them using FFL, a yahoo-group.. Whoa, for instance DLynch as a practitioner of TM worked with Maharishi Mahesh Yogi quite a lot on the teaching of TM quite evidently for good reasons and quite evidently Lynch knew well enough the scope of the 'what for and why' he was there. Quite evidently Turqb here is actively trying to slur and degrade DLynch personally by jumping in to this thread with an unqualified non sequitur posting publicly using [ 'exploitative' ] a Yahoo-group [FFL]. Now in a choice of moderation Turqb can go back in and delete this posting of his post haste and protect his membership status here or will this be left to the FFL moderators to go in and do it? The choice is Turq's. -JaiGuruYou ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com,
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
You are a bit over the top in your reaction I think J, I don't think he's
harassing you, but that would be in the mind of the receiver of the comments
wouldn't it? Anartax certainly can't be accused of harassing TM'ers. He is
pretty balanced in most of his posts actually.
From: authfri...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]
FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2015 11:40 AM
Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
I do not say this. But sometimes it's obvious what state of mind a poster is in.
salyavin was just demanding that Ann quit what he called her dumb harassment
of Xeno. How about you quit your dumb harassment of me and other TM supporters?
Or is the idea to make up for Barry's absence by emulating his harassing
behavior? You, salyavin, and Curtis seem to be working pretty hard at it, if
not very coherently.
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, anartaxius@... wrote :
Ah. The master projector oracle speaks. I know, she says, exactly what everyone
is really thinking and why.
From: authfriend@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2015 5:00 AM
Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sundur@... wrote :
I would certainly have to agree with you, xeno.
The question is how, or why do you respond to someone who, for a great majority
of the time, is just going for a reaction.
It is a total waste of time, for which I am guilty.
I agree that Barry was likely never upset when he posted.
I beg to differ with both of you. He was often incoherent with rage and
completely out of control when he posted after someone had dissected one of his
posts. You could count on it: he would very rarely respond directly to
criticism, but a day or so later, he'd come out with one of his long posts
attacking the critic on whatever grounds he could dream up.
All his bluster about folks being attached to the self was projection; he was
as attached as anybody and much more attached than some.
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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
And (continuation of post #417750), the authfriend clone is the other one who
always knows what others are thinking and why.
From: awoelfleba...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]
FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2015 4:48 AM
Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, anartaxius@... wrote :
From: steve.sundur@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2015 3:44 AM
Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
I am in disagreement with xeno's assertion that he (Barry) was just too clever
in his arguments such that no one could offer an effective rebuttal.
I did not say Turq was too clever, I implied that those who could not provide
an effective rebuttal could not find the right angle of attack or response.
Generally if you are attacked and have an emotional response, your IQ drops
because the fight or flight response tends to reallocate bodily resources away
from the cerebral cortex. So the first thing one had to do to respond to Turq
was not to get emotional about anything he said. You had to be neutral. That is
just the first step, and that does not mean if you chill out, it will then
work. It provides a platform from which to try various kinds of responses. To
my mind, Turq was never upset when he posted, so he was in an optimum form to
respond or not to respond what came back. If you have strong likes and dislikes
when posting, that works against you when posting against Turq.
Trust me Xeno, you are imagining things if you don't think bawee has strong
emotional responses to those he was responding to. He could not tolerate those
who didn't suck up to him or support him. Every single person who took
exception to his rantings and repetitive nonsense was an enemy in his brain and
he disliked, intensely, many people at FFL including myself. He probably has
stronger feelings about me than I do about him, in fact. For example, if you
could see him reading this right now you would see the steam emanating from
every orifice he possesses.
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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
I've always favored people being self-sufficient in filtering their own online experience over external censorship. In stepping out of my bubble of Clever Swissness, I will admit that Barry was a mixed bag, to be sure. But, I don't buy the argument that his abusive stuff was some kind of valuable and appropriate spiritual lesson for those on the receiving end for the simple fact that FFL is not Uncle Tantra's Crazy Wisdom Online Ashram, where such behavior could be expected. On the other hand, for the life of me, I can not understand why his targets would constantly give away their power and react to him. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sun...@yahoo.com wrote : thanks Curtis. I'm still voting for the current status quo, though.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
It's none of your business what I'm doing these days. But I'll be back at it very shortly. I've just been taking a break here. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote : Some of us wonder Judy what you do with your time when you are not reviling folks on FFL.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend@... wrote : I do not say this. But sometimes it's obvious what state of mind a poster is in. salyavin was just demanding that Ann quit what he called her dumb harassment of Xeno. How about you quit your dumb harassment of me and other TM supporters? Or is the idea to make up for Barry's absence by emulating his harassing behavior? You, salyavin, and Curtis seem to be working pretty hard at it, if not very coherently. Me: You are making a false accusation Judy. Or perhaps you would like to post a single example of me emulating harassing behavior? ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, anartaxius@... wrote : Ah. The master projector oracle speaks. I know, she says, exactly what everyone is really thinking and why. From: authfriend@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2015 5:00 AM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sundur@... wrote : I would certainly have to agree with you, xeno. The question is how, or why do you respond to someone who, for a great majority of the time, is just going for a reaction. It is a total waste of time, for which I am guilty. I agree that Barry was likely never upset when he posted. I beg to differ with both of you. He was often incoherent with rage and completely out of control when he posted after someone had dissected one of his posts. You could count on it: he would very rarely respond directly to criticism, but a day or so later, he'd come out with one of his long posts attacking the critic on whatever grounds he could dream up. All his bluster about folks being attached to the self was projection; he was as attached as anybody and much more attached than some.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend@... wrote : (snippo) J: Obviously he'd taken exception to something Doug had said, and everybody knows Barry was hassling Doug about his David Lynch mistake. And both times I supplied the URL of Barry's post for folks who wanted to know the context. Me: Today I decided to talk about how absurd your focus on part of his reaction was. Context switching, full speed ahead! I thought you had decided to talk about how dishonest I was to quote that single paragraph from Barry's post. And all your fussing and fuming doesn't cover up your lack of ability to defend his indefensible attack on Barry's comment. I am not confused that you are dodging the main issue here. That's right, I'm not defending it. I'm not *addressing* it, other than having said three or four times that it was a mistake. Others have made fine posts explaining *why* it was a mistake; I don't feel the need to add anything. Buck never claimed this was the reason he banned Barry, he has not told us why. Your guess is all made-up nonsense to cover for a moderator acting in secret to ban one of your enemies. It only looks worse in context. I stand by what I've said about it. You know as well as I do that it's a very likely guess. J: The only part that was *relevant* to my response to JamesAlan was that last paragraph. JamesAlan had claimed (as you know; it's quoted below) of Steve's post that Steve was saying I choose to believe and do whatever suits my desired ends. Fine for Barry (and everybody else) to scream at Doug about the David Lynch post. Doug was wrong, and apparently he knows it, because he never deleted the post. But there's a HUGE difference between talking back to the moderator and declaring you are going to ignore him no matter what he says. I know you're having to scramble for ammunition against me, Curtis, but you're gonna have to do better than this. Me: You are on the wrong side of this and I know it Judy. But I need no ammo for you because I don't care about your partisan hypocrisy about this. It amuses me. Oh, fiddle-faddle. You're in no position to talk about partisan hypocrisy, first of all. Second, I'm a partisan of truth, accuracy, and fairness, and you'd have to stand on your head to find me guilty of hypocrisy. What I do care about is having the site hijacked by a person who would attempt such a ridiculous accusation, transparently gunning for an individual poster, then ban him, then lie about whose decision it was, and then stonewall any questions about what the specific reason was that he got banned. When did he lie about whose decision it was? Somehow I missed that. Doug should not be stonewalling, just for the record. I know for a fact that he is violating the explicit directions from the list owner. You have posted endlessly about your virtuous love of truth and honesty. When it's been challenged, yes, but rarely otherwise, as you know. When it is tested with someone you don't like, you fold. It was all for show. The get-Barry crew has shown their true ethical colors, and they stink. Horse puckey. Prattle, as Richard would say. I haven't folded. You and I disagree. I don't even have a damn dog in the fight, because I ain't gonna be here. That's why I haven't done much more than point out a few of the more blatant instances of corruption from certain quarters. As I said earlier, I didn't quit posting last June because of anything to do with FFL. But the increasing putrefaction of the swamp FFL had become--and still is--made it easy to stop. And I'm about to leave you to wallow in it again. Alex was doing fine, there was no problem to solve that needed Buck. He invented this role as a ruse and immediately did what anyone can see who doesn't have Barry is bad blinders on. What makes your position doubly idiotic is that you could easily have been subject to this kind of mistreatment if the moderation fell into different partisan hands. And here is the kicker, I would have fought it just as hard for you as I am doing now, just as I spoke against banning the R trinity until two of them crossed clear ethical lines and I had to support it. I find this whole experience instructive concerning some people's ethics when self interest is in the way of doing the right thing. It disgusts me.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
Of course you did not say it. I was pretending I know what your are thinking
and what you are feeling when you post something. Now when you post, what do
you do?
From: authfri...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]
FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2015 3:40 PM
Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
I do not say this. But sometimes it's obvious what state of mind a poster is in.
salyavin was just demanding that Ann quit what he called her dumb harassment
of Xeno. How about you quit your dumb harassment of me and other TM supporters?
Or is the idea to make up for Barry's absence by emulating his harassing
behavior? You, salyavin, and Curtis seem to be working pretty hard at it, if
not very coherently.
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, anartaxius@... wrote :
Ah. The master projector oracle speaks. I know, she says, exactly what everyone
is really thinking and why.
From: authfriend@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2015 5:00 AM
Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sundur@... wrote :
I would certainly have to agree with you, xeno.
The question is how, or why do you respond to someone who, for a great majority
of the time, is just going for a reaction.
It is a total waste of time, for which I am guilty.
I agree that Barry was likely never upset when he posted.
I beg to differ with both of you. He was often incoherent with rage and
completely out of control when he posted after someone had dissected one of his
posts. You could count on it: he would very rarely respond directly to
criticism, but a day or so later, he'd come out with one of his long posts
attacking the critic on whatever grounds he could dream up.
All his bluster about folks being attached to the self was projection; he was
as attached as anybody and much more attached than some.
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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
and not be negative. And the people who have seen this all before and know where it leads stand up and speak out. Then one of two things happen. Maharishi visits the course and kicks out the power-grabbing guru wanna-be for abusing his power, or the other voices get quelled one by one. Time will tell. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote : And I notice that Dougy is still not responding to Curtis' request for an explanation to Turq's getting the boot - ignoring what needs to be addressed and blabbering about a bunch of other stuff is spot on TMO behavior. From: anartaxius@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, June 24, 2015 8:53 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sundur@... wrote : This is not a place for someone who has a stated agenda to prove his point that an organization is a cult, and to label anyone who may defend the organization as cult apologist. According to the spiel on the Fairfield Life home page, this is the perfect place to discuss whether the TM Org is a cult. If what you say is true, then you feel this place has a stated agenda to prove the point that the TM Org is not a cult. This is a blatant statement showing you wish to suppress opposing points of view, as do many others here. Remember the first quotation on that page: What is wanted is not the will to believe, but the wish to find out, which is the exact opposite. ~ Bertrand Russell
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend@... wrote : Sure. Your accusation today that it was dishonest of me to post the last paragraph of Barry's post in which he declares he's going to ignore Doug completely. That was harassment, for the reasons I've already stated. C: I said it was slippery. Which it was. So any opposition to your POV is harassment? I guess you do have the moderator you deserve. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend@... wrote : I do not say this. But sometimes it's obvious what state of mind a poster is in. salyavin was just demanding that Ann quit what he called her dumb harassment of Xeno. How about you quit your dumb harassment of me and other TM supporters? Or is the idea to make up for Barry's absence by emulating his harassing behavior? You, salyavin, and Curtis seem to be working pretty hard at it, if not very coherently. Me: You are making a false accusation Judy. Or perhaps you would like to post a single example of me emulating harassing behavior? ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, anartaxius@... wrote : Ah. The master projector oracle speaks. I know, she says, exactly what everyone is really thinking and why. From: authfriend@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2015 5:00 AM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sundur@... wrote : I would certainly have to agree with you, xeno. The question is how, or why do you respond to someone who, for a great majority of the time, is just going for a reaction. It is a total waste of time, for which I am guilty. I agree that Barry was likely never upset when he posted. I beg to differ with both of you. He was often incoherent with rage and completely out of control when he posted after someone had dissected one of his posts. You could count on it: he would very rarely respond directly to criticism, but a day or so later, he'd come out with one of his long posts attacking the critic on whatever grounds he could dream up. All his bluster about folks being attached to the self was projection; he was as attached as anybody and much more attached than some.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote : You are a bit over the top in your reaction I think J, I don't think he's harassing you, but that would be in the mind of the receiver of the comments wouldn't it? Anartax certainly can't be accused of harassing TM'ers. He is pretty balanced in most of his posts actually. No. I'm not harassing anyone, I'm just calling them out on their hypocrisy. You can't expect to launch a sneering pile-on and not get other people objecting if they like the work of the poster. Me harassing TMers would also be silly as I am one. I do like analysing the cult of TM though, maybe that's what she means, but I never lose sleep over that as the TM movement claims to be scientific and science actually proceeds by criticism. If an idea is a bad explanation it won't stand up to scrutiny and should be discarded. Easy to forget that. And it is what this place is for. A healthy mind challenges its own assumptions etc... From: authfriend@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2015 11:40 AM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug I do not say this. But sometimes it's obvious what state of mind a poster is in. salyavin was just demanding that Ann quit what he called her dumb harassment of Xeno. How about you quit your dumb harassment of me and other TM supporters? Or is the idea to make up for Barry's absence by emulating his harassing behavior? You, salyavin, and Curtis seem to be working pretty hard at it, if not very coherently. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, anartaxius@... wrote : Ah. The master projector oracle speaks. I know, she says, exactly what everyone is really thinking and why. From: authfriend@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2015 5:00 AM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sundur@... wrote : I would certainly have to agree with you, xeno. The question is how, or why do you respond to someone who, for a great majority of the time, is just going for a reaction. It is a total waste of time, for which I am guilty. I agree that Barry was likely never upset when he posted. I beg to differ with both of you. He was often incoherent with rage and completely out of control when he posted after someone had dissected one of his posts. You could count on it: he would very rarely respond directly to criticism, but a day or so later, he'd come out with one of his long posts attacking the critic on whatever grounds he could dream up. All his bluster about folks being attached to the self was projection; he was as attached as anybody and much more attached than some.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
Ahhh, the dulcet, mellifluous tones of a Judy post. How refreshing compared to
the rest of the plebeians, and how sattvic!
From: authfri...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]
FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2015 11:45 AM
Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
It's none of your business what I'm doing these days. But I'll be back at
it very shortly. I've just been taking a break here.
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote :
Some of us wonder Judy what you do with your time when you are not reviling
folks on FFL.
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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
Sure. Your accusation today that it was dishonest of me to post the last paragraph of Barry's post in which he declares he's going to ignore Doug completely. That was harassment, for the reasons I've already stated. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend@... wrote : I do not say this. But sometimes it's obvious what state of mind a poster is in. salyavin was just demanding that Ann quit what he called her dumb harassment of Xeno. How about you quit your dumb harassment of me and other TM supporters? Or is the idea to make up for Barry's absence by emulating his harassing behavior? You, salyavin, and Curtis seem to be working pretty hard at it, if not very coherently. Me: You are making a false accusation Judy. Or perhaps you would like to post a single example of me emulating harassing behavior? ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, anartaxius@... wrote : Ah. The master projector oracle speaks. I know, she says, exactly what everyone is really thinking and why. From: authfriend@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2015 5:00 AM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sundur@... wrote : I would certainly have to agree with you, xeno. The question is how, or why do you respond to someone who, for a great majority of the time, is just going for a reaction. It is a total waste of time, for which I am guilty. I agree that Barry was likely never upset when he posted. I beg to differ with both of you. He was often incoherent with rage and completely out of control when he posted after someone had dissected one of his posts. You could count on it: he would very rarely respond directly to criticism, but a day or so later, he'd come out with one of his long posts attacking the critic on whatever grounds he could dream up. All his bluster about folks being attached to the self was projection; he was as attached as anybody and much more attached than some.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
He's been harassing me on a regular basis, and harassing others over on The Peak. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote : You are a bit over the top in your reaction I think J, I don't think he's harassing you, but that would be in the mind of the receiver of the comments wouldn't it? Anartax certainly can't be accused of harassing TM'ers. He is pretty balanced in most of his posts actually. From: authfriend@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2015 11:40 AM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug I do not say this. But sometimes it's obvious what state of mind a poster is in. salyavin was just demanding that Ann quit what he called her dumb harassment of Xeno. How about you quit your dumb harassment of me and other TM supporters? Or is the idea to make up for Barry's absence by emulating his harassing behavior? You, salyavin, and Curtis seem to be working pretty hard at it, if not very coherently. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, anartaxius@... wrote : Ah. The master projector oracle speaks. I know, she says, exactly what everyone is really thinking and why. From: authfriend@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2015 5:00 AM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sundur@... wrote : I would certainly have to agree with you, xeno. The question is how, or why do you respond to someone who, for a great majority of the time, is just going for a reaction. It is a total waste of time, for which I am guilty. I agree that Barry was likely never upset when he posted. I beg to differ with both of you. He was often incoherent with rage and completely out of control when he posted after someone had dissected one of his posts. You could count on it: he would very rarely respond directly to criticism, but a day or so later, he'd come out with one of his long posts attacking the critic on whatever grounds he could dream up. All his bluster about folks being attached to the self was projection; he was as attached as anybody and much more attached than some.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend@... wrote : My first send hasn't shown up. Maybe Doug has decided to hold my posts for approval. Let's see if this second try makes it... ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend@... wrote : Sure. Your accusation today that it was dishonest of me to post the last paragraph of Barry's post in which he declares he's going to ignore Doug completely. That was harassment, for the reasons I've already stated. C: I said it was slippery. You said it was dishonest: Judy, who is the first to make a stink about the context of a quote when it serves her own purposes has clipped out this paragraph of Barry's from the thread context, dishonestly making it look like Barry said this in a vacuum. Which it was. Me2: Well as long as we agree on its dishonesty, my point has been made. As you know, Which it was is a quote from your own post. Talk about slippery! Don't be ridiculous. I explained to you why it was silly. You ignored that explanation and decided you wanted to talk about something else. So any opposition to your POV is harassment? Where did I say or suggest such a thing? Making up a dumb, frivolous accusation for the sole purpose of getting someone you don't like is harassment. Let me add this: Everybody was following the Doug-Barry confrontation with bated breath. Nobody thought he'd written that paragraph in a vacuum. And all they had to do was click on the link I provided if there was any question in their minds. Me2: OK now that we have done the Judy dance I will state my point again. It doesn't get any better with repetition, Curtis (nor is my point diminished by your calling it the Judy dance). Yours is a stupid point intended to harass and score for your side, as well as obfuscate the fact that Barry openly defied the group moderator appointed by Rick, the group owner. By singling out that quote you give an impression that was not true about Barry. In the context of being threatened by a moderator over his comment about Lynch and having just waded through some convoluted and fey logic about how his statement violated the yahoo guidelines, and in the context of a plea to Rick to stop this nonsensical farce, his comment was highly restrained although he was obviously pissed off which is understandable IN CONTEXT. Of course it was understandable that he was pissed off, and expected. That doesn't give him license to announce publicly that he was going to ignore the moderator and not get sanctioned for it. As I said in my earlier post to which you did not respond, try doing that to the umpire of a football game you're playing in. What you're doing is promoting anarchy but trying to make it look virtuous. So you chose to isolate it from that context to impose yours on it. Same context. I provided a link to the original post both times I quoted it. Everybody knew what it was in any case. I guess you do have the moderator you deserve. Prattle. Me2: Excellent archaic word choice, I'm sure the equally old-timey Buck will approve. But my point does not fold under your obfuscation by over focusing on the details that don't matter. You Judy are being hypocritical about this issue because of your bias. You should be he first to object to this behavior by Buck. As I've said, I object to Doug's attempt to moderate the David Lynch post. I object to his not revealing why he bounced Barry. I can't object to his bouncing Barry without knowing why he did it. If he did it because Barry openly defied him, I support it. I'm not into anarchy. He banned Barry after making up a bogus charge. He refused to answer question about why even from Alex. He is acting against Rick's specific instructions and desires for his own group. He lied about Rick being involved in the decision. Oddly enough, you don't seem to want to explain where and when he told this purported lie. And here you are Judy, showing up as the perfect hypocrite, claiming I am harassing you by calling you on your BS. You forget how well I know your tactics, Curtis. *This* is the bogus charge and the hypocrisy. That's just what you do. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend@... wrote : I do not say this. But sometimes it's obvious what state of mind a poster is in. salyavin was just demanding that Ann quit what he called her dumb harassment of Xeno. How about you quit your dumb harassment of me and other TM supporters? Or is the idea to make up for Barry's absence by emulating his harassing behavior? You, salyavin, and Curtis seem to be working pretty hard at it, if not very coherently. Me: You are making a false accusation Judy. Or perhaps you
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
Gimme a break. You were wondering what I was talking about. You were confused. I unconfused you. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote : i was talking to Sal not u From: authfriend@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2015 8:46 PM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug You're a little confused. See my third paragraph below. All three of 'em are doing it. (I'm not talking about *sexual* harassment, BTW, just continued annoying dumb attacks, typically gratuitous.) ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote : I think she was accusing anartaxius of harassing her not you, or maybe I am confused From: salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2015 12:52 PM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote : You are a bit over the top in your reaction I think J, I don't think he's harassing you, but that would be in the mind of the receiver of the comments wouldn't it? Anartax certainly can't be accused of harassing TM'ers. He is pretty balanced in most of his posts actually. No. I'm not harassing anyone, I'm just calling them out on their hypocrisy. You can't expect to launch a sneering pile-on and not get other people objecting if they like the work of the poster. Me harassing TMers would also be silly as I am one. I do like analysing the cult of TM though, maybe that's what she means, but I never lose sleep over that as the TM movement claims to be scientific and science actually proceeds by criticism. If an idea is a bad explanation it won't stand up to scrutiny and should be discarded. Easy to forget that. And it is what this place is for. A healthy mind challenges its own assumptions etc... From: authfriend@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2015 11:40 AM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug I do not say this. But sometimes it's obvious what state of mind a poster is in. salyavin was just demanding that Ann quit what he called her dumb harassment of Xeno. How about you quit your dumb harassment of me and other TM supporters? Or is the idea to make up for Barry's absence by emulating his harassing behavior? You, salyavin, and Curtis seem to be working pretty hard at it, if not very coherently. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, anartaxius@... wrote : Ah. The master projector oracle speaks. I know, she says, exactly what everyone is really thinking and why.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend@... wrote : You're a little confused. See my third paragraph below. All three of 'em are doing it. (I'm not talking about *sexual* harassment, BTW, just continued annoying dumb attacks, typically gratuitous.) Me: There are no attacks and no one was being harassed. Those are inappropriately dramatic terms for me communicating with you here about a topic we disagreed with each other on. Is your memory going too? You called me dishonest (and then denied you had done so, apparently not realizing I'd quote you doing so). That was an empty, false accusation, and you knew it. Ergo, harassment. And it finally led you to at least say some of the right things about this mess which was my goal. I'd already said those things, Curtis. That you don't read (or don't remember) my posts doesn't make me dishonest. And the whole thing was accomplished with mostly cordial exchanges. None of that was cordial. You don't get to have a cordial exchange when you start off by falsely accusing somebody of being dishonest. Not without a retraction and apology. Except for your inappropriate drama queenery, but that is part of the package and I accept that. And what characterizes your many posts to and about Doug? Drama kingery? Or is it only appropriate when you do it? Judy in a previous post: As I've said, I object to Doug's attempt to moderate the David Lynch post. I object to his not revealing why he bounced Barry. Me: Thanks for making that clear, you have redeemed yourself a bit. I had already made that clear in other posts, as I told you. Judy: I can't object to his bouncing Barry without knowing why he did it. Me: Agreed, a reasonable reaction. Judy:If he did it because Barry openly defied him, I support it. I'm not into anarchy. Me: This is where we disagree. You are invoking the fallacy of he slippery slope and it does not fly. Barry objected to a person in charge who is capable of doing exactly what he did. And how could you believe he was going to actually ignore someone after he has told you that one thousand times while continuing to read and respond to some of your posts. Why you somehow believe he was serious here suddenly is a byproduct of your Barry bias. Oh, I see, that's the excuse now, Barry was JUST KIDDING. Ha ha ha. Jeez, how can you look at yourself in the mirror? I wasn't authorized to bounce him, or I'd have done it long since. So he couldn't have been just kidding when he said he'd never read or respond to my posts. Rather, he was LYING. I owe you the reference on Buck's deception: Buck being channeled though Doug: Yes, Turqb and Serious are gone from FFL by moderation. I am only the CEO. My master is the list owner. We had quite sufficient back and forth about this before taking our additional time to go in to pull the moderation levers in the controls Where does Doug say bouncing Barry was a joint decision by him and Rick? Isn't that what you accused him of lying about? I don't see it. This refers to I am only the CEO. My master is the list owner. Entirely proper, and what Rick said as well (If Doug abuses his authority and/or fails to moderate fairly and objectively, I will revoke his moderator status). Pull the moderation levers in the controls refers to Rick changing the member settings for the group to allow Doug to moderate (delete posts, bounce people, approve posts before they go up, etc.). Where's the lie, Curtis? Yer gettin' old, Curtis. Your technique is becoming calcified. ME: And for context: Fairfield Life https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/FairfieldLife/conversations/messages/417326 https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/FairfieldLife/conversations/messages/417326 Fairfield Life https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/FairfieldLife/conversations/messages/417326 Fairfield Life focuses on topics of interest to seekers (and finders) of truth and liberation everywhere. Fairfield, Iowa is home to Maharishi ... View on groups.yahoo.com https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/FairfieldLife/conversations/messages/417326 Preview by Yahoo
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
You're a little confused. See my third paragraph below. All three of 'em are doing it. (I'm not talking about *sexual* harassment, BTW, just continued annoying dumb attacks, typically gratuitous.) ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote : I think she was accusing anartaxius of harassing her not you, or maybe I am confused From: salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2015 12:52 PM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote : You are a bit over the top in your reaction I think J, I don't think he's harassing you, but that would be in the mind of the receiver of the comments wouldn't it? Anartax certainly can't be accused of harassing TM'ers. He is pretty balanced in most of his posts actually. No. I'm not harassing anyone, I'm just calling them out on their hypocrisy. You can't expect to launch a sneering pile-on and not get other people objecting if they like the work of the poster. Me harassing TMers would also be silly as I am one. I do like analysing the cult of TM though, maybe that's what she means, but I never lose sleep over that as the TM movement claims to be scientific and science actually proceeds by criticism. If an idea is a bad explanation it won't stand up to scrutiny and should be discarded. Easy to forget that. And it is what this place is for. A healthy mind challenges its own assumptions etc... From: authfriend@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2015 11:40 AM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug I do not say this. But sometimes it's obvious what state of mind a poster is in. salyavin was just demanding that Ann quit what he called her dumb harassment of Xeno. How about you quit your dumb harassment of me and other TM supporters? Or is the idea to make up for Barry's absence by emulating his harassing behavior? You, salyavin, and Curtis seem to be working pretty hard at it, if not very coherently. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, anartaxius@... wrote : Ah. The master projector oracle speaks. I know, she says, exactly what everyone is really thinking and why. From: authfriend@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2015 5:00 AM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sundur@... wrote : I would certainly have to agree with you, xeno. The question is how, or why do you respond to someone who, for a great majority of the time, is just going for a reaction. It is a total waste of time, for which I am guilty. I agree that Barry was likely never upset when he posted. I beg to differ with both of you. He was often incoherent with rage and completely out of control when he posted after someone had dissected one of his posts. You could count on it: he would very rarely respond directly to criticism, but a day or so later, he'd come out with one of his long posts attacking the critic on whatever grounds he could dream up. All his bluster about folks being attached to the self was projection; he was as attached as anybody and much more attached than some.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
i was talking to Sal not u
From: authfri...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]
FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2015 8:46 PM
Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
You're a little confused. See my third paragraph below. All three of 'em
are doing it.
(I'm not talking about *sexual* harassment, BTW, just continued annoying dumb
attacks, typically gratuitous.)
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote :
I think she was accusing anartaxius of harassing her not you, or maybe I am
confused
From: salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2015 12:52 PM
Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote :
You are a bit over the top in your reaction I think J, I don't think he's
harassing you, but that would be in the mind of the receiver of the comments
wouldn't it? Anartax certainly can't be accused of harassing TM'ers. He is
pretty balanced in most of his posts actually.
No. I'm not harassing anyone, I'm just calling them out on their hypocrisy. You
can't expect to launch a sneering pile-on and not get other people objecting if
they like the work of the poster.
Me harassing TMers would also be silly as I am one. I do like analysing the
cult of TM though, maybe that's what she means, but I never lose sleep over
that as the TM movement claims to be scientific and science actually proceeds
by criticism. If an idea is a bad explanation it won't stand up to scrutiny and
should be discarded. Easy to forget that. And it is what this place is for.
A healthy mind challenges its own assumptions etc...
From: authfriend@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2015 11:40 AM
Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
I do not say this. But sometimes it's obvious what state of mind a poster is in.
salyavin was just demanding that Ann quit what he called her dumb harassment
of Xeno. How about you quit your dumb harassment of me and other TM supporters?
Or is the idea to make up for Barry's absence by emulating his harassing
behavior? You, salyavin, and Curtis seem to be working pretty hard at it, if
not very coherently.
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, anartaxius@... wrote :
Ah. The master projector oracle speaks. I know, she says, exactly what everyone
is really thinking and why.
From: authfriend@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2015 5:00 AM
Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sundur@... wrote :
I would certainly have to agree with you, xeno.
The question is how, or why do you respond to someone who, for a great majority
of the time, is just going for a reaction.
It is a total waste of time, for which I am guilty.
I agree that Barry was likely never upset when he posted.
I beg to differ with both of you. He was often incoherent with rage and
completely out of control when he posted after someone had dissected one of his
posts. You could count on it: he would very rarely respond directly to
criticism, but a day or so later, he'd come out with one of his long posts
attacking the critic on whatever grounds he could dream up.
All his bluster about folks being attached to the self was projection; he was
as attached as anybody and much more attached than some.
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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
I think she was accusing anartaxius of harassing her not you, or maybe I am
confused
From: salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2015 12:52 PM
Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote :
You are a bit over the top in your reaction I think J, I don't think he's
harassing you, but that would be in the mind of the receiver of the comments
wouldn't it? Anartax certainly can't be accused of harassing TM'ers. He is
pretty balanced in most of his posts actually.
No. I'm not harassing anyone, I'm just calling them out on their hypocrisy. You
can't expect to launch a sneering pile-on and not get other people objecting if
they like the work of the poster.
Me harassing TMers would also be silly as I am one. I do like analysing the
cult of TM though, maybe that's what she means, but I never lose sleep over
that as the TM movement claims to be scientific and science actually proceeds
by criticism. If an idea is a bad explanation it won't stand up to scrutiny and
should be discarded. Easy to forget that. And it is what this place is for.
A healthy mind challenges its own assumptions etc...
From: authfriend@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2015 11:40 AM
Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
I do not say this. But sometimes it's obvious what state of mind a poster is in.
salyavin was just demanding that Ann quit what he called her dumb harassment
of Xeno. How about you quit your dumb harassment of me and other TM supporters?
Or is the idea to make up for Barry's absence by emulating his harassing
behavior? You, salyavin, and Curtis seem to be working pretty hard at it, if
not very coherently.
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, anartaxius@... wrote :
Ah. The master projector oracle speaks. I know, she says, exactly what everyone
is really thinking and why.
From: authfriend@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2015 5:00 AM
Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sundur@... wrote :
I would certainly have to agree with you, xeno.
The question is how, or why do you respond to someone who, for a great majority
of the time, is just going for a reaction.
It is a total waste of time, for which I am guilty.
I agree that Barry was likely never upset when he posted.
I beg to differ with both of you. He was often incoherent with rage and
completely out of control when he posted after someone had dissected one of his
posts. You could count on it: he would very rarely respond directly to
criticism, but a day or so later, he'd come out with one of his long posts
attacking the critic on whatever grounds he could dream up.
All his bluster about folks being attached to the self was projection; he was
as attached as anybody and much more attached than some.
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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend@... wrote : You're a little confused. See my third paragraph below. All three of 'em are doing it. (I'm not talking about *sexual* harassment, BTW, just continued annoying dumb attacks, typically gratuitous.) Me: There are no attacks and no one was being harassed. Those are inappropriately dramatic terms for me communicating with you here about a topic we disagreed with each other on. And it finally led you to at least say some of the right things about this mess which was my goal. And the whole thing was accomplished with mostly cordial exchanges. Except for your inappropriate drama queenery, but that is part of the package and I accept that. Judy in a previous post: As I've said, I object to Doug's attempt to moderate the David Lynch post. I object to his not revealing why he bounced Barry. Me: Thanks for making that clear, you have redeemed yourself a bit. Judy: I can't object to his bouncing Barry without knowing why he did it. Me: Agreed, a reasonable reaction. Judy:If he did it because Barry openly defied him, I support it. I'm not into anarchy. Me: This is where we disagree. You are invoking the fallacy of he slippery slope and it does not fly. Barry objected to a person in charge who is capable of doing exactly what he did. And how could you believe he was going to actually ignore someone after he has told you that one thousand times while continuing to read and respond to some of your posts. Why you somehow believe he was serious here suddenly is a byproduct of your Barry bias. I owe you the reference on Buck's deception: Buck being channeled though Doug: Yes, Turqb and Serious are gone from FFL by moderation. I am only the CEO. My master is the list owner. We had quite sufficient back and forth about this before taking our additional time to go in to pull the moderation levers in the controls ME: And for context: Fairfield Life https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/FairfieldLife/conversations/messages/417326 https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/FairfieldLife/conversations/messages/417326 Fairfield Life https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/FairfieldLife/conversations/messages/417326 Fairfield Life focuses on topics of interest to seekers (and finders) of truth and liberation everywhere. Fairfield, Iowa is home to Maharishi ... View on groups.yahoo.com https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/FairfieldLife/conversations/messages/417326 Preview by Yahoo ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote : I think she was accusing anartaxius of harassing her not you, or maybe I am confused From: salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2015 12:52 PM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote : You are a bit over the top in your reaction I think J, I don't think he's harassing you, but that would be in the mind of the receiver of the comments wouldn't it? Anartax certainly can't be accused of harassing TM'ers. He is pretty balanced in most of his posts actually. No. I'm not harassing anyone, I'm just calling them out on their hypocrisy. You can't expect to launch a sneering pile-on and not get other people objecting if they like the work of the poster. Me harassing TMers would also be silly as I am one. I do like analysing the cult of TM though, maybe that's what she means, but I never lose sleep over that as the TM movement claims to be scientific and science actually proceeds by criticism. If an idea is a bad explanation it won't stand up to scrutiny and should be discarded. Easy to forget that. And it is what this place is for. A healthy mind challenges its own assumptions etc... From: authfriend@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2015 11:40 AM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug I do not say this. But sometimes it's obvious what state of mind a poster is in. salyavin was just demanding that Ann quit what he called her dumb harassment of Xeno. How about you quit your dumb harassment of me and other TM supporters? Or is the idea to make up for Barry's absence by emulating his harassing behavior? You, salyavin, and Curtis seem to be working pretty hard at it, if not very coherently. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, anartaxius@... wrote : Ah. The master projector oracle speaks. I know, she says, exactly what everyone is really thinking and why. From: authfriend@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2015 5:00 AM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sundur@... wrote : I would certainly have to agree with you, xeno
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
Thanks for keeping the thread alive Michael. We have a fascinating power dynamic in play here that students of cult bullshittery like us can have some fun dissecting. Buck/Doug felt abused by the TM group when they yanked his badge for not following their rules about seeing other saints. This was before your posting period but his group spamming back then was all about the unfairness and lack of transparency in the TM group. Post after post on how badly he was treated. He finally wore them down and got back in the dome. From that moment he began the routine of glorifying the dome and castigating the quitters using every weird term for someone who does not go along with the group think. His lowest point was invoking the Maoist term running dog in his contempt for nonbelivers. As you are well aware he has used the images of drone strikes to silence critics like yourself. I don't know when the Buck persona arose. At first it seemed to be a parody of movement rigidity but then it became clear that Buck IS Doug and that the artifice was a dodge to be personally accountable for his actual intolerant views. With such a huge target of hypocrisy to shoot at, Barry posted a number of posts that Buck did not like. So became the gollum-esque campaign for Buck to have his precious the right to silence an outspoken critic and not be held accountable for it. He wore Rick down and got his one ring to rule them all. First he tried to make it appear as if there was a justification for removing his enemy by contriving a fey interpretation of the guidelines and pinning it on an idiotic example, criticism of Lynch. This was a classic new-to-power rookie mistake. In his eagerness to assert his personal agenda he miscalculated how transparent his agenda would be if he used an obviously bogus excuse. So backing off of that he switched to a lie, that Rick was the driving force and he was just a servant. Anyone can verify this was a deliberate lie with an email to the list owner. I did, and it turned out to be a fabrication. The abused is now the abuser. Because Barry made some enemies here, people are going along as if nothing happened. It is a classic case of people's values being exposed about what is right and wrong because of their personal self interest and petty vendettas. So here we all are back in the movement. Maharishi is too busy to micro-manage a course so a leader arises using lots of poetic bullshittery to make it seem as if they are speaking for their master. He was carrying a secret wound of when the leader had been abused by the movement's authoritarian policies, Then the leader carries out his personal revenge vendetta against people he does not like to get them kicked off the course. And the people who didn't like the person look the other way and say,let's move along and not be negative. And the people who have seen this all before and know where it leads stand up and speak out. Then one of two things happen. Maharishi visits the course and kicks out the power-grabbing guru wanna-be for abusing his power, or the other voices get quelled one by one. Time will tell. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote : And I notice that Dougy is still not responding to Curtis' request for an explanation to Turq's getting the boot - ignoring what needs to be addressed and blabbering about a bunch of other stuff is spot on TMO behavior. From: anartaxius@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, June 24, 2015 8:53 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sundur@... wrote : This is not a place for someone who has a stated agenda to prove his point that an organization is a cult, and to label anyone who may defend the organization as cult apologist. According to the spiel on the Fairfield Life home page, this is the perfect place to discuss whether the TM Org is a cult. If what you say is true, then you feel this place has a stated agenda to prove the point that the TM Org is not a cult. This is a blatant statement showing you wish to suppress opposing points of view, as do many others here. Remember the first quotation on that page: What is wanted is not the will to believe, but the wish to find out, which is the exact opposite. ~ Bertrand Russell
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
And I notice that Dougy is still not responding to Curtis' request for an
explanation to Turq's getting the boot - ignoring what needs to be addressed
and blabbering about a bunch of other stuff is spot on TMO behavior.
From: anartax...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]
FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, June 24, 2015 8:53 AM
Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sundur@... wrote :
This is not a place for someone who has a stated agenda to prove his point that
an organization is a cult, and to label anyone who may defend the organization
as cult apologist.
According to the spiel on the Fairfield Life home page, this is the perfect
place to discuss whether the TM Org is a cult. If what you say is true, then
you feel this place has a stated agenda to prove the point that the TM Org is
not a cult. This is a blatant statement showing you wish to suppress opposing
points of view, as do many others here. Remember the first quotation on that
page:
What is wanted is not the will to believe, but the wish to find out, which is
the exact opposite. ~ Bertrand Russell
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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
quite an exaggeration, I'd say. we know negativity, and we know what an edge is. everyone likes edge, no one lines trolling. it sounds Curtis, like you have a fervent wish for Doug to turn into the tyrant, he shows no sign of turning into. he banned Barry, because he obviously felt the site would be better off without an individual declaring, loudly, continually, that he was going to undermine him, the moderator, at every turn. since then, there has been no, as in zero, evidence of Doug exerting editorial control over the site. in fact, what we have, and what we haven't had in a long time is, ironically, the free expression of ideas, without someone with an overriding agenda putting the bum's rush on any idea he didn't like. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : snip And the people who didn't like the person look the other way and say,let's move along and not be negative. And the people who have seen this all before and know where it leads stand up and speak out. Then one of two things happen. Maharishi visits the course and kicks out the power-grabbing guru wanna-be for abusing his power, or the other voices get quelled one by one. Time will tell. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote : And I notice that Dougy is still not responding to Curtis' request for an explanation to Turq's getting the boot - ignoring what needs to be addressed and blabbering about a bunch of other stuff is spot on TMO behavior. From: anartaxius@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, June 24, 2015 8:53 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sundur@... wrote : This is not a place for someone who has a stated agenda to prove his point that an organization is a cult, and to label anyone who may defend the organization as cult apologist. According to the spiel on the Fairfield Life home page, this is the perfect place to discuss whether the TM Org is a cult. If what you say is true, then you feel this place has a stated agenda to prove the point that the TM Org is not a cult. This is a blatant statement showing you wish to suppress opposing points of view, as do many others here. Remember the first quotation on that page: What is wanted is not the will to believe, but the wish to find out, which is the exact opposite. ~ Bertrand Russell
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
. Time will tell. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote : And I notice that Dougy is still not responding to Curtis' request for an explanation to Turq's getting the boot - ignoring what needs to be addressed and blabbering about a bunch of other stuff is spot on TMO behavior. From: anartaxius@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, June 24, 2015 8:53 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sundur@... wrote : This is not a place for someone who has a stated agenda to prove his point that an organization is a cult, and to label anyone who may defend the organization as cult apologist. According to the spiel on the Fairfield Life home page, this is the perfect place to discuss whether the TM Org is a cult. If what you say is true, then you feel this place has a stated agenda to prove the point that the TM Org is not a cult. This is a blatant statement showing you wish to suppress opposing points of view, as do many others here. Remember the first quotation on that page: What is wanted is not the will to believe, but the wish to find out, which is the exact opposite. ~ Bertrand Russell
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
The responses below are some of the least rational, internally most contradictory responses that I have come across here. How the writer (apparently) considers these to constitute even a remotely coherent argument (and fails to see his responses as a complete surrender of moral principle to I choose to believe and do whatever suits my desired ends) is beyond me. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sundur@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : Me: Whenever I lurked in the last few months I would see you responding to Barry. You spent time doing this. It was your choice. What you wrote about someone putting a the bum's rush on ideas is a weird statement that hands the power of your own mind and intellectual boundaries over to someone else here. S:Curtis, my buttons can get pushed, and do get pushed every day. I venture to say that this is no different than anyone. Set aside for a moment the more technical definition of a bully and go with the definition of a bully we grew up with. I will take a stand against a bully whether it is a physical bully, or an intellectual bully. And when the bully states that he does what he does to make people uncomfortable, then I am not able to stand by and tolerate that. If this means I have lost my intellecual integrity, then I have done so. I have taken as much fire from as many people as anyone here Steve. I was able to choose whose criticism I would respond to. I am curious why you feel unable to make this choice yourself and why you would let anyone's other opinion on a topic give your ideas the bum's rush? When you and I disagree, we have a civil discussion like this one. If Barry didn't treat you that way then why did you respond to him so much? I think I know. Same reason I interact with people I don't agree with, because it is a great writing prompt for uncovering our own ideas in writing to people we disagree with. I didn't do this with the last R because he was not capable of discussion. But with the other two I did for the same reasons you did with Barry I'll bet. S: Of course there was not discussion with Barry, as I was on his DNR list. It was strictly an antagonistic one way relationship, with me finding fault with what I felt were his lies and misrepresentations and trolling for reactions. All three R's rode my jock for legions of posts. None of them deserved to get booted because they went after everything I wrote with their idiotic personal attacks. None of them gave any of my ideas the bums' rush. They mostly just proved my point with their behavior. Buck has violated the trust of this place by being dishonest and if you were being honest you would just admit that your personal position on Barry has distorted your sense of right and wrong on this issue. Moderators need to give reasons for booting people, not lie about it and blame it on other people. And if as a group we don't buy the reason, Rick should be informed that his moderator is not running the site as the free though forum it was intended to be. S: Yes, I own up to the fact that I am happy to see him go. And if Doug booted him for less than a bootable reason, I will compromise my standards in this regard for what I think is a greater good. But the reality is that I think, the means justify the ends in this case. In other words, there are exceptions for every rule, and I embrace this exception. And when what goes around, comes around in this regard, I hope I'll be ready. Barry didn't need to be a weatherman to see which way the wind was blowing. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : snip And the people who didn't like the person look the other way and say,let's move along and not be negative. And the people who have seen this all before and know where it leads stand up and speak out. Then one of two things happen. Maharishi visits the course and kicks out the power-grabbing guru wanna-be for abusing his power, or the other voices get quelled one by one. Time will tell. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote : And I notice that Dougy is still not responding to Curtis' request for an explanation to Turq's getting the boot - ignoring what needs to be addressed and blabbering about a bunch of other stuff is spot on TMO behavior. From: anartaxius@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, June 24, 2015 8:53 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sundur@... wrote : This is not a place for someone who has a stated agenda to prove his point that an organization is a cult, and to label anyone who may defend the organization as cult apologist. According to the spiel on the Fairfield Life home page, this is the perfect place to discuss whether the TM
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : Me: Whenever I lurked in the last few months I would see you responding to Barry. You spent time doing this. It was your choice. What you wrote about someone putting a the bum's rush on ideas is a weird statement that hands the power of your own mind and intellectual boundaries over to someone else here. S:Curtis, my buttons can get pushed, and do get pushed every day. I venture to say that this is no different than anyone. Set aside for a moment the more technical definition of a bully and go with the definition of a bully we grew up with. I will take a stand against a bully whether it is a physical bully, or an intellectual bully. And when the bully states that he does what he does to make people uncomfortable, then I am not able to stand by and tolerate that. If this means I have lost my intellecual integrity, then I have done so. I have taken as much fire from as many people as anyone here Steve. I was able to choose whose criticism I would respond to. I am curious why you feel unable to make this choice yourself and why you would let anyone's other opinion on a topic give your ideas the bum's rush? When you and I disagree, we have a civil discussion like this one. If Barry didn't treat you that way then why did you respond to him so much? I think I know. Same reason I interact with people I don't agree with, because it is a great writing prompt for uncovering our own ideas in writing to people we disagree with. I didn't do this with the last R because he was not capable of discussion. But with the other two I did for the same reasons you did with Barry I'll bet. S: Of course there was not discussion with Barry, as I was on his DNR list. It was strictly an antagonistic one way relationship, with me finding fault with what I felt were his lies and misrepresentations and trolling for reactions. All three R's rode my jock for legions of posts. None of them deserved to get booted because they went after everything I wrote with their idiotic personal attacks. None of them gave any of my ideas the bums' rush. They mostly just proved my point with their behavior. Buck has violated the trust of this place by being dishonest and if you were being honest you would just admit that your personal position on Barry has distorted your sense of right and wrong on this issue. Moderators need to give reasons for booting people, not lie about it and blame it on other people. And if as a group we don't buy the reason, Rick should be informed that his moderator is not running the site as the free though forum it was intended to be. S: Yes, I own up to the fact that I am happy to see him go. And if Doug booted him for less than a bootable reason, I will compromise my standards in this regard for what I think is a greater good. But the reality is that I think, the means justify the ends in this case. In other words, there are exceptions for every rule, and I embrace this exception. And when what goes around, comes around in this regard, I hope I'll be ready. Barry didn't need to be a weatherman to see which way the wind was blowing. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : snip And the people who didn't like the person look the other way and say,let's move along and not be negative. And the people who have seen this all before and know where it leads stand up and speak out. Then one of two things happen. Maharishi visits the course and kicks out the power-grabbing guru wanna-be for abusing his power, or the other voices get quelled one by one. Time will tell. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote : And I notice that Dougy is still not responding to Curtis' request for an explanation to Turq's getting the boot - ignoring what needs to be addressed and blabbering about a bunch of other stuff is spot on TMO behavior. From: anartaxius@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, June 24, 2015 8:53 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sundur@... wrote : This is not a place for someone who has a stated agenda to prove his point that an organization is a cult, and to label anyone who may defend the organization as cult apologist. According to the spiel on the Fairfield Life home page, this is the perfect place to discuss whether the TM Org is a cult. If what you say is true, then you feel this place has a stated agenda to prove the point that the TM Org is not a cult. This is a blatant statement showing you wish to suppress opposing points of view, as do many others here. Remember the first quotation on that page: What is wanted is not the will to believe, but the wish to find out, which is the exact opposite. ~ Bertrand Russell
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sundur@... wrote : Here's my take, and please correct me if I'm wrong. Ravi posted, and no one probably thought much about it. However, you reminded the denizens that Ravi had been banned, and so, it would follow, that if someone had been banned, and posted under another name, then that post would be deleted by the moderator. Me: Only he didn't delete the post that went after me, he chose to leave it. He went after the post that addressed himself. S: To do otherwise, would, I believe, open the moderator to accusations of favoritism and inconsistency. Me: Which is exactly how he used his power...again. Personally, if someone has been banned and wants to come back and post two or three years later, I'd say they should be given a chance. In fact, if someone has been banned, or their posting privileges revoked, I would say they should be allowed to come back and post after a six month period. That, in fact, is what I'd like to see happen in the case currently being debated. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, j_alexander_stanley@... wrote : Actually, just this morning, Doug did his first exertion of editorial control by deleting Ravi's Barry - here's the gameplan thread. Granted, I can understand why he deleted it, but a deletion is a deletion. Thankfully, the offsite archive is under Rick's control, and the only way stuff gets deleted over there is if Rick emails the site's admin... like he's got the time and attention for that. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sundur@... wrote : quite an exaggeration, I'd say. we know negativity, and we know what an edge is. everyone likes edge, no one lines trolling. it sounds Curtis, like you have a fervent wish for Doug to turn into the tyrant, he shows no sign of turning into. he banned Barry, because he obviously felt the site would be better off without an individual declaring, loudly, continually, that he was going to undermine him, the moderator, at every turn. since then, there has been no, as in zero, evidence of Doug exerting editorial control over the site. in fact, what we have, and what we haven't had in a long time is, ironically, the free expression of ideas, without someone with an overriding agenda putting the bum's rush on any idea he didn't like. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : snip And the people who didn't like the person look the other way and say,let's move along and not be negative. And the people who have seen this all before and know where it leads stand up and speak out. Then one of two things happen. Maharishi visits the course and kicks out the power-grabbing guru wanna-be for abusing his power, or the other voices get quelled one by one. Time will tell. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote : And I notice that Dougy is still not responding to Curtis' request for an explanation to Turq's getting the boot - ignoring what needs to be addressed and blabbering about a bunch of other stuff is spot on TMO behavior. From: anartaxius@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, June 24, 2015 8:53 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sundur@... wrote : This is not a place for someone who has a stated agenda to prove his point that an organization is a cult, and to label anyone who may defend the organization as cult apologist. According to the spiel on the Fairfield Life home page, this is the perfect place to discuss whether the TM Org is a cult. If what you say is true, then you feel this place has a stated agenda to prove the point that the TM Org is not a cult. This is a blatant statement showing you wish to suppress opposing points of view, as do many others here. Remember the first quotation on that page: What is wanted is not the will to believe, but the wish to find out, which is the exact opposite. ~ Bertrand Russell
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sundur@... wrote : quite an exaggeration, I'd say. we know negativity, and we know what an edge is. everyone likes edge, no one lines trolling. it sounds Curtis, like you have a fervent wish for Doug to turn into the tyrant, he shows no sign of turning into. Me: It has already happened and because you also hated Barry you are twisting your ethics around to make it sound OK. S: he banned Barry, because he obviously felt the site would be better off without an individual declaring, loudly, continually, that he was going to undermine him, the moderator, at every turn. Me: This term undermine the moderator interests me. What specific actions could a non moderator take that would undermine a person with the power to banish? Could he state his different opinion perhaps? What Barry was doing was to voice his objections to Rick giving this kind of power to a person he predicted would abuse it and low and beholdthat is exactly what he did as soon as he could. Your story does not fit the facts or even what Buck himself has stated. He never gave this reason, you are repeating Judy's attempt to make this all sound reasonable. It is a made-up reason after the fact. I laid out the history of how it went down and you are ignoring the facts. S: since then, there has been no, as in zero, evidence of Doug exerting editorial control over the site. Me: Yeah I get it, it was just Holland. He would never go for Poland... S: in fact, what we have, and what we haven't had in a long time is, ironically, the free expression of ideas, without someone with an overriding agenda putting the bum's rush on any idea he didn't like. Me: Whenever I lurked in the last few months I would see you responding to Barry. You spent time doing this. It was your choice. What you wrote about someone putting a the bum's rush on ideas is a weird statement that hands the power of your own mind and intellectual boundaries over to someone else here. I have taken as much fire from as many people as anyone here Steve. I was able to choose whose criticism I would respond to. I am curious why you feel unable to make this choice yourself and why you would let anyone's other opinion on a topic give your ideas the bum's rush? When you and I disagree, we have a civil discussion like this one. If Barry didn't treat you that way then why did you respond to him so much? I think I know. Same reason I interact with people I don't agree with, because it is a great writing prompt for uncovering our own ideas in writing to people we disagree with. I didn't do this with the last R because he was not capable of discussion. But with the other two I did for the same reasons you did with Barry I'll bet. All three R's rode my jock for legions of posts. None of them deserved to get booted because they went after everything I wrote with their idiotic personal attacks. None of them gave any of my ideas the bums' rush. They mostly just proved my point with their behavior. Buck has violated the trust of this place by being dishonest and if you were being honest you would just admit that your personal position on Barry has distorted your sense of right and wrong on this issue. Moderators need to give reasons for booting people, not lie about it and blame it on other people. And if as a group we don't buy the reason, Rick should be informed that his moderator is not running the site as the free though forum it was intended to be. Barry didn't need to be a weatherman to see which way the wind was blowing. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : snip And the people who didn't like the person look the other way and say,let's move along and not be negative. And the people who have seen this all before and know where it leads stand up and speak out. Then one of two things happen. Maharishi visits the course and kicks out the power-grabbing guru wanna-be for abusing his power, or the other voices get quelled one by one. Time will tell. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote : And I notice that Dougy is still not responding to Curtis' request for an explanation to Turq's getting the boot - ignoring what needs to be addressed and blabbering about a bunch of other stuff is spot on TMO behavior. From: anartaxius@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, June 24, 2015 8:53 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sundur@... wrote : This is not a place for someone who has a stated agenda to prove his point that an organization is a cult, and to label anyone who may defend the organization as cult apologist. According to the spiel on the Fairfield Life home page, this is the perfect place to discuss whether the TM Org is a cult. If what you say is true, then you
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
was blowing. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : snip And the people who didn't like the person look the other way and say,let's move along and not be negative. And the people who have seen this all before and know where it leads stand up and speak out. Then one of two things happen. Maharishi visits the course and kicks out the power-grabbing guru wanna-be for abusing his power, or the other voices get quelled one by one. Time will tell. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote : And I notice that Dougy is still not responding to Curtis' request for an explanation to Turq's getting the boot - ignoring what needs to be addressed and blabbering about a bunch of other stuff is spot on TMO behavior. From: anartaxius@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, June 24, 2015 8:53 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sundur@... wrote : This is not a place for someone who has a stated agenda to prove his point that an organization is a cult, and to label anyone who may defend the organization as cult apologist. According to the spiel on the Fairfield Life home page, this is the perfect place to discuss whether the TM Org is a cult. If what you say is true, then you feel this place has a stated agenda to prove the point that the TM Org is not a cult. This is a blatant statement showing you wish to suppress opposing points of view, as do many others here. Remember the first quotation on that page: What is wanted is not the will to believe, but the wish to find out, which is the exact opposite. ~ Bertrand Russell
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
but do the same damn thing. It is not a bannable offense. If I have other comments to make, I will need to make them later. I gotta go now. All three R's rode my jock for legions of posts. None of them deserved to get booted because they went after everything I wrote with their idiotic personal attacks. None of them gave any of my ideas the bums' rush. They mostly just proved my point with their behavior. Buck has violated the trust of this place by being dishonest and if you were being honest you would just admit that your personal position on Barry has distorted your sense of right and wrong on this issue. Moderators need to give reasons for booting people, not lie about it and blame it on other people. And if as a group we don't buy the reason, Rick should be informed that his moderator is not running the site as the free though forum it was intended to be. Barry didn't need to be a weatherman to see which way the wind was blowing. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : snip And the people who didn't like the person look the other way and say,let's move along and not be negative. And the people who have seen this all before and know where it leads stand up and speak out. Then one of two things happen. Maharishi visits the course and kicks out the power-grabbing guru wanna-be for abusing his power, or the other voices get quelled one by one. Time will tell. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote : And I notice that Dougy is still not responding to Curtis' request for an explanation to Turq's getting the boot - ignoring what needs to be addressed and blabbering about a bunch of other stuff is spot on TMO behavior. From: anartaxius@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, June 24, 2015 8:53 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sundur@... wrote : This is not a place for someone who has a stated agenda to prove his point that an organization is a cult, and to label anyone who may defend the organization as cult apologist. According to the spiel on the Fairfield Life home page, this is the perfect place to discuss whether the TM Org is a cult. If what you say is true, then you feel this place has a stated agenda to prove the point that the TM Org is not a cult. This is a blatant statement showing you wish to suppress opposing points of view, as do many others here. Remember the first quotation on that page: What is wanted is not the will to believe, but the wish to find out, which is the exact opposite. ~ Bertrand Russell
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
Oh God what a great post! I appreciate the history, I was unaware of the extent of Buck's complaints before my arrival and am surprised but not surprised that he did a 180 after being reinstated to the extent of calling non-Domers neganauts etc. I did get an inkling when I bought and read Joe Weber's excellent book TM in America which featured Doug in a one chapter and how he was kicked around by the TMO. The Ring analogy is excellent and spot on - I never thought of it before, but the idea of TM and Dome attendance being the salvation of the world, and Doug by participation a savior under the wings of Saint Marshy seems to be Doug's Precious. He may in fact be winning as I have begun to mull over the idea of starting my own group, but it won't be on yahoo, which I hate. From: curtisdeltabl...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, June 24, 2015 10:24 AM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug Thanks for keeping the thread alive Michael. We have a fascinating power dynamic in play here that students of cult bullshittery like us can have some fun dissecting. Buck/Doug felt abused by the TM group when they yanked his badge for not following their rules about seeing other saints. This was before your posting period but his group spamming back then was all about the unfairness and lack of transparency in the TM group. Post after post on how badly he was treated. He finally wore them down and got back in the dome. From that moment he began the routine of glorifying the dome and castigating the quitters using every weird term for someone who does not go along with the group think. His lowest point was invoking the Maoist term running dog in his contempt for nonbelivers. As you are well aware he has used the images of drone strikes to silence critics like yourself. I don't know when the Buck persona arose. At first it seemed to be a parody of movement rigidity but then it became clear that Buck IS Doug and that the artifice was a dodge to be personally accountable for his actual intolerant views. With such a huge target of hypocrisy to shoot at, Barry posted a number of posts that Buck did not like. So became the gollum-esque campaign for Buck to have his precious the right to silence an outspoken critic and not be held accountable for it. He wore Rick down and got his one ring to rule them all. First he tried to make it appear as if there was a justification for removing his enemy by contriving a fey interpretation of the guidelines and pinning it on an idiotic example, criticism of Lynch. This was a classic new-to-power rookie mistake. In his eagerness to assert his personal agenda he miscalculated how transparent his agenda would be if he used an obviously bogus excuse. So backing off of that he switched to a lie, that Rick was the driving force and he was just a servant. Anyone can verify this was a deliberate lie with an email to the list owner. I did, and it turned out to be a fabrication. The abused is now the abuser. Because Barry made some enemies here, people are going along as if nothing happened. It is a classic case of people's values being exposed about what is right and wrong because of their personal self interest and petty vendettas. So here we all are back in the movement. Maharishi is too busy to micro-manage a course so a leader arises using lots of poetic bullshittery to make it seem as if they are speaking for their master. He was carrying a secret wound of when the leader had been abused by the movement's authoritarian policies, Then the leader carries out his personal revenge vendetta against people he does not like to get them kicked off the course. And the people who didn't like the person look the other way and say,let's move along and not be negative. And the people who have seen this all before and know where it leads stand up and speak out. Then one of two things happen. Maharishi visits the course and kicks out the power-grabbing guru wanna-be for abusing his power, or the other voices get quelled one by one. Time will tell. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote : And I notice that Dougy is still not responding to Curtis' request for an explanation to Turq's getting the boot - ignoring what needs to be addressed and blabbering about a bunch of other stuff is spot on TMO behavior. From: anartaxius@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, June 24, 2015 8:53 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sundur@... wrote : This is not a place for someone who has a stated agenda to prove his point that an organization is a cult, and to label anyone who may defend the organization as cult apologist. According to the spiel on the Fairfield Life home page
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
Actually, just this morning, Doug did his first exertion of editorial control by deleting Ravi's Barry - here's the gameplan thread. Granted, I can understand why he deleted it, but a deletion is a deletion. Thankfully, the offsite archive is under Rick's control, and the only way stuff gets deleted over there is if Rick emails the site's admin... like he's got the time and attention for that. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sun...@yahoo.com wrote : quite an exaggeration, I'd say. we know negativity, and we know what an edge is. everyone likes edge, no one lines trolling. it sounds Curtis, like you have a fervent wish for Doug to turn into the tyrant, he shows no sign of turning into. he banned Barry, because he obviously felt the site would be better off without an individual declaring, loudly, continually, that he was going to undermine him, the moderator, at every turn. since then, there has been no, as in zero, evidence of Doug exerting editorial control over the site. in fact, what we have, and what we haven't had in a long time is, ironically, the free expression of ideas, without someone with an overriding agenda putting the bum's rush on any idea he didn't like. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : snip And the people who didn't like the person look the other way and say,let's move along and not be negative. And the people who have seen this all before and know where it leads stand up and speak out. Then one of two things happen. Maharishi visits the course and kicks out the power-grabbing guru wanna-be for abusing his power, or the other voices get quelled one by one. Time will tell. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote : And I notice that Dougy is still not responding to Curtis' request for an explanation to Turq's getting the boot - ignoring what needs to be addressed and blabbering about a bunch of other stuff is spot on TMO behavior. From: anartaxius@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, June 24, 2015 8:53 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sundur@... wrote : This is not a place for someone who has a stated agenda to prove his point that an organization is a cult, and to label anyone who may defend the organization as cult apologist. According to the spiel on the Fairfield Life home page, this is the perfect place to discuss whether the TM Org is a cult. If what you say is true, then you feel this place has a stated agenda to prove the point that the TM Org is not a cult. This is a blatant statement showing you wish to suppress opposing points of view, as do many others here. Remember the first quotation on that page: What is wanted is not the will to believe, but the wish to find out, which is the exact opposite. ~ Bertrand Russell
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
Here's my take, and please correct me if I'm wrong. Ravi posted, and no one probably thought much about it. However, you reminded the denizens that Ravi had been banned, and so, it would follow, that if someone had been banned, and posted under another name, then that post would be deleted by the moderator. To do otherwise, would, I believe, open the moderator to accusations of favoritism and inconsistency. Personally, if someone has been banned and wants to come back and post two or three years later, I'd say they should be given a chance. In fact, if someone has been banned, or their posting privileges revoked, I would say they should be allowed to come back and post after a six month period. That, in fact, is what I'd like to see happen in the case currently being debated. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, j_alexander_stanley@... wrote : Actually, just this morning, Doug did his first exertion of editorial control by deleting Ravi's Barry - here's the gameplan thread. Granted, I can understand why he deleted it, but a deletion is a deletion. Thankfully, the offsite archive is under Rick's control, and the only way stuff gets deleted over there is if Rick emails the site's admin... like he's got the time and attention for that. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sundur@... wrote : quite an exaggeration, I'd say. we know negativity, and we know what an edge is. everyone likes edge, no one lines trolling. it sounds Curtis, like you have a fervent wish for Doug to turn into the tyrant, he shows no sign of turning into. he banned Barry, because he obviously felt the site would be better off without an individual declaring, loudly, continually, that he was going to undermine him, the moderator, at every turn. since then, there has been no, as in zero, evidence of Doug exerting editorial control over the site. in fact, what we have, and what we haven't had in a long time is, ironically, the free expression of ideas, without someone with an overriding agenda putting the bum's rush on any idea he didn't like. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : snip And the people who didn't like the person look the other way and say,let's move along and not be negative. And the people who have seen this all before and know where it leads stand up and speak out. Then one of two things happen. Maharishi visits the course and kicks out the power-grabbing guru wanna-be for abusing his power, or the other voices get quelled one by one. Time will tell. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote : And I notice that Dougy is still not responding to Curtis' request for an explanation to Turq's getting the boot - ignoring what needs to be addressed and blabbering about a bunch of other stuff is spot on TMO behavior. From: anartaxius@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, June 24, 2015 8:53 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sundur@... wrote : This is not a place for someone who has a stated agenda to prove his point that an organization is a cult, and to label anyone who may defend the organization as cult apologist. According to the spiel on the Fairfield Life home page, this is the perfect place to discuss whether the TM Org is a cult. If what you say is true, then you feel this place has a stated agenda to prove the point that the TM Org is not a cult. This is a blatant statement showing you wish to suppress opposing points of view, as do many others here. Remember the first quotation on that page: What is wanted is not the will to believe, but the wish to find out, which is the exact opposite. ~ Bertrand Russell
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
That was fascinating, thanks for the heads up Alex. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, j_alexander_stanley@... wrote : Actually, just this morning, Doug did his first exertion of editorial control by deleting Ravi's Barry - here's the gameplan thread. Granted, I can understand why he deleted it, but a deletion is a deletion. Thankfully, the offsite archive is under Rick's control, and the only way stuff gets deleted over there is if Rick emails the site's admin... like he's got the time and attention for that. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sundur@... wrote : quite an exaggeration, I'd say. we know negativity, and we know what an edge is. everyone likes edge, no one lines trolling. it sounds Curtis, like you have a fervent wish for Doug to turn into the tyrant, he shows no sign of turning into. he banned Barry, because he obviously felt the site would be better off without an individual declaring, loudly, continually, that he was going to undermine him, the moderator, at every turn. since then, there has been no, as in zero, evidence of Doug exerting editorial control over the site. in fact, what we have, and what we haven't had in a long time is, ironically, the free expression of ideas, without someone with an overriding agenda putting the bum's rush on any idea he didn't like. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : snip And the people who didn't like the person look the other way and say,let's move along and not be negative. And the people who have seen this all before and know where it leads stand up and speak out. Then one of two things happen. Maharishi visits the course and kicks out the power-grabbing guru wanna-be for abusing his power, or the other voices get quelled one by one. Time will tell. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote : And I notice that Dougy is still not responding to Curtis' request for an explanation to Turq's getting the boot - ignoring what needs to be addressed and blabbering about a bunch of other stuff is spot on TMO behavior. From: anartaxius@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, June 24, 2015 8:53 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sundur@... wrote : This is not a place for someone who has a stated agenda to prove his point that an organization is a cult, and to label anyone who may defend the organization as cult apologist. According to the spiel on the Fairfield Life home page, this is the perfect place to discuss whether the TM Org is a cult. If what you say is true, then you feel this place has a stated agenda to prove the point that the TM Org is not a cult. This is a blatant statement showing you wish to suppress opposing points of view, as do many others here. Remember the first quotation on that page: What is wanted is not the will to believe, but the wish to find out, which is the exact opposite. ~ Bertrand Russell
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
S: Oh, okay, so you are now the mind reader, knowing how I feel about someone. w Me: It is in your actual words that you write. If I had to mind read I would never have guessed you would go this way on this issue. S: This sounds an awful lot like twisting ethics to make something sound okay. Me: So you can't give an example of how anyone without moderator power could undermine? (R gave a pretty good one actually) There was nothing unethical about Barry's disapproval of Buck being a moderator. S: Yes, I am in agreement with Judy. If the David Lynch situation did not technically quality for suspension, I will state that the constant declaration that he would defy and oppose the new moderator at every turn was grounds to have his posting privileges suspended. I am sorry if you take issue with that decision. The end result, whether you agree, or not, is that it has changed the discourse of the site in what appears to be a more tolerant atmosphere, at least in my opinion. C: You mean the intolerance was toward someone you don't like. Talking back to a moderator is not a violation of Yahoo guidelines which is the only power Rick gave Buck. Being opposed to a guy with a history of intolerance is a rational reaction. And in the end it actually went down exactly that way. Me: And you are free to make your case here because you were not banned by an enemy here. S: That bothers me. If I were a different type of person, I could ignore that, but I guess I am not, for better or worse. S: And again, when someone states that it is their intent to push other people's buttons, I find that to be a pretty poor grounds for discussion. And so, if as Xeno states, I am complicit in the crime, then, guilty as charged. Me: Barry stated the obvious about himself that some others try to hide but do the same damn thing. It is not a bannable offense. As far as I know, Curtis, Barry and Richard were the only ones here who made a career out twisting the intentions and opinions of what other people posted. I am in disagreement with xeno's assertion that he (Barry) was just too clever in his arguments such that no one could offer an effective rebuttal. I call what he (Barry), and Richard did here mostly troll baiting, and in their absence, I think the results speak for themselves.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
Hard to really get a feel of where you're coming from James, as you post so infrequently. I'd be inclined to put your comments in the category of sour grapes. Perhaps you can reveal more of yourself here, so we can get a better idea of where you are coming from. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jamesalan735@... wrote : The responses below are some of the least rational, internally most contradictory responses that I have come across here. How the writer (apparently) considers these to constitute even a remotely coherent argument (and fails to see his responses as a complete surrender of moral principle to I choose to believe and do whatever suits my desired ends) is beyond me. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sundur@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : Me: Whenever I lurked in the last few months I would see you responding to Barry. You spent time doing this. It was your choice. What you wrote about someone putting a the bum's rush on ideas is a weird statement that hands the power of your own mind and intellectual boundaries over to someone else here. S:Curtis, my buttons can get pushed, and do get pushed every day. I venture to say that this is no different than anyone. Set aside for a moment the more technical definition of a bully and go with the definition of a bully we grew up with. I will take a stand against a bully whether it is a physical bully, or an intellectual bully. And when the bully states that he does what he does to make people uncomfortable, then I am not able to stand by and tolerate that. If this means I have lost my intellecual integrity, then I have done so. I have taken as much fire from as many people as anyone here Steve. I was able to choose whose criticism I would respond to. I am curious why you feel unable to make this choice yourself and why you would let anyone's other opinion on a topic give your ideas the bum's rush? When you and I disagree, we have a civil discussion like this one. If Barry didn't treat you that way then why did you respond to him so much? I think I know. Same reason I interact with people I don't agree with, because it is a great writing prompt for uncovering our own ideas in writing to people we disagree with. I didn't do this with the last R because he was not capable of discussion. But with the other two I did for the same reasons you did with Barry I'll bet. S: Of course there was not discussion with Barry, as I was on his DNR list. It was strictly an antagonistic one way relationship, with me finding fault with what I felt were his lies and misrepresentations and trolling for reactions. All three R's rode my jock for legions of posts. None of them deserved to get booted because they went after everything I wrote with their idiotic personal attacks. None of them gave any of my ideas the bums' rush. They mostly just proved my point with their behavior. Buck has violated the trust of this place by being dishonest and if you were being honest you would just admit that your personal position on Barry has distorted your sense of right and wrong on this issue. Moderators need to give reasons for booting people, not lie about it and blame it on other people. And if as a group we don't buy the reason, Rick should be informed that his moderator is not running the site as the free though forum it was intended to be. S: Yes, I own up to the fact that I am happy to see him go. And if Doug booted him for less than a bootable reason, I will compromise my standards in this regard for what I think is a greater good. But the reality is that I think, the means justify the ends in this case. In other words, there are exceptions for every rule, and I embrace this exception. And when what goes around, comes around in this regard, I hope I'll be ready. Barry didn't need to be a weatherman to see which way the wind was blowing. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : snip And the people who didn't like the person look the other way and say,let's move along and not be negative. And the people who have seen this all before and know where it leads stand up and speak out. Then one of two things happen. Maharishi visits the course and kicks out the power-grabbing guru wanna-be for abusing his power, or the other voices get quelled one by one. Time will tell. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote : And I notice that Dougy is still not responding to Curtis' request for an explanation to Turq's getting the boot - ignoring what needs to be addressed and blabbering about a bunch of other stuff is spot on TMO behavior. From: anartaxius@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, June 24, 2015 8:53 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug ---In FairfieldLife
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sundur@... wrote : This is not a place for someone who has a stated agenda to prove his point that an organization is a cult, and to label anyone who may defend the organization as cult apologist. According to the spiel on the Fairfield Life home page, this is the perfect place to discuss whether the TM Org is a cult. If what you say is true, then you feel this place has a stated agenda to prove the point that the TM Org is not a cult. This is a blatant statement showing you wish to suppress opposing points of view, as do many others here. Remember the first quotation on that page: What is wanted is not the will to believe, but the wish to find out, which is the exact opposite. ~ Bertrand Russell
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
From: steve.sun...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]
FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2015 3:44 AM
Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
I am in disagreement with xeno's assertion that he (Barry) was just too clever
in his arguments such that no one could offer an effective rebuttal.
I did not say Turq was too clever, I implied that those who could not provide
an effective rebuttal could not find the right angle of attack or response.
Generally if you are attacked and have an emotional response, your IQ drops
because the fight or flight response tends to reallocate bodily resources away
from the cerebral cortex. So the first thing one had to do to respond to Turq
was not to get emotional about anything he said. You had to be neutral. That is
just the first step, and that does not mean if you chill out, it will then
work. It provides a platform from which to try various kinds of responses. To
my mind, Turq was never upset when he posted, so he was in an optimum form to
respond or not to respond what came back. If you have strong likes and dislikes
when posting, that works against you when posting against Turq.
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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, anartaxius@... wrote : From: steve.sundur@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2015 3:44 AM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug I am in disagreement with xeno's assertion that he (Barry) was just too clever in his arguments such that no one could offer an effective rebuttal. I did not say Turq was too clever, I implied that those who could not provide an effective rebuttal could not find the right angle of attack or response. Generally if you are attacked and have an emotional response, your IQ drops because the fight or flight response tends to reallocate bodily resources away from the cerebral cortex. So the first thing one had to do to respond to Turq was not to get emotional about anything he said. You had to be neutral. That is just the first step, and that does not mean if you chill out, it will then work. It provides a platform from which to try various kinds of responses. To my mind, Turq was never upset when he posted, so he was in an optimum form to respond or not to respond what came back. If you have strong likes and dislikes when posting, that works against you when posting against Turq. Trust me Xeno, you are imagining things if you don't think bawee has strong emotional responses to those he was responding to. He could not tolerate those who didn't suck up to him or support him. Every single person who took exception to his rantings and repetitive nonsense was an enemy in his brain and he disliked, intensely, many people at FFL including myself. He probably has stronger feelings about me than I do about him, in fact. For example, if you could see him reading this right now you would see the steam emanating from every orifice he possesses.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
I would certainly have to agree with you, xeno. The question is how, or why do you respond to someone who, for a great majority of the time, is just going for a reaction. It is a total waste of time, for which I am guilty. I agree that Barry was likely never upset when he posted. We were in two different universes. I still prefer mine, with all of its flaws and soft spots, but hopefully, a desire to interact honestly with people. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, anartaxius@... wrote I am in disagreement with xeno's assertion that he (Barry) was just too clever in his arguments such that no one could offer an effective rebuttal. I did not say Turq was too clever, I implied that those who could not provide an effective rebuttal could not find the right angle of attack or response. Generally if you are attacked and have an emotional response, your IQ drops because the fight or flight response tends to reallocate bodily resources away from the cerebral cortex. So the first thing one had to do to respond to Turq was not to get emotional about anything he said. You had to be neutral. That is just the first step, and that does not mean if you chill out, it will then work. It provides a platform from which to try various kinds of responses. To my mind, Turq was never upset when he posted, so he was in an optimum form to respond or not to respond what came back. If you have strong likes and dislikes when posting, that works against you when posting against Turq.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Time to come clean Doug
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sundur@... wrote : I would certainly have to agree with you, xeno. The question is how, or why do you respond to someone who, for a great majority of the time, is just going for a reaction. It is a total waste of time, for which I am guilty. I agree that Barry was likely never upset when he posted. I beg to differ with both of you. He was often incoherent with rage and completely out of control when he posted after someone had dissected one of his posts. You could count on it: he would very rarely respond directly to criticism, but a day or so later, he'd come out with one of his long posts attacking the critic on whatever grounds he could dream up. All his bluster about folks being attached to the self was projection; he was as attached as anybody and much more attached than some.
