Re: OT: Staff take more time off for ill pets than relatives
Recently, I was talking to a fellow cat owner who asked how my two were doing. When I mentioned that the one had died, two days after his 12th birthday, a friend and coworker of mine overheard and went into a tantrum about, "You KNOW HIS BIRTHDAY? That's just about the most riduculous thing I've ever heard! Its an animal...who the hell remembers an animal's birthday" (This is a man who has volunteered THOUSANDS of hours for an artist organization that had recently given his notice of departure because the artists had renigged on the one thing he had asked them to do...support a community event, at no expense to themselves, in order for him to give his time...and he had done this for 7 years.) I was hurt at first...then gathered myself and shot back, "Yes, I remember his birthday. Its not like we celebrated with hats or anything, but I did celebrate the day he was born with a new toy for himThere is nothing wrong with marking the event of birth for something that gives you unconditional love for its entire life and asks only food in return.Its not like I forfitted thousands of hours of my time for a bunch of ungrateful people who refuse to help themselves" His reply. "Point taken." Sometimes, with people who don't understand...you just have to put it in perspective. Meanwhile, the powers that be in the town where I work, recently evicted dozens of people from the project neighborhood to raise the houses and build luxury town houses. Unfortunately, since the residents only had a few weeks notice, when they left, they left their animals...(mostly because many had to move into motels and such, where animals are not allowed). So for the rest of the summer, I will be trying to feed, catch, vet and place as many of these animals as I can, mostly cats. If anyone is in the MD, DE, PA area, and would like to make an addition to their family...or even foster, please let me know...Right now I have no idea of the health condition of these animals...I have pulled both healthy cats and a Felv+ cat from these streets in the past year. (I have no idea where the $$$ will come to do all this...but it has been my experience that homes, food and help will come. Meanwhile I'm going to contact the owner of the land and see if I can get him to put out some money on the grounds that the strays running around will be emotionally trying for any new residents that will be buying his high priced homes. But I'm not holding my breath on that oneperhaps a letter to the newspaper?...or do you think this might draw too many nerdowells? Dog fighting is big around hereI don't want to supply fresh bait if you get my meaning.) Thanks, T "Gloria B. Lane" [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: MC - I didn't know that! Hows about that! 10 hours for a parent? Anybody can see that's wrong. Wow -I remember when my horse died in about 1989 - I'd had her for about 28 years. A friend - a social worker in private counseling practice - had no clue about it - she said "explain to me how you can be sad about a horse dying". I was in shock. I suppose it was a legitimate question, but it just overwhelmed me.It's hard, the non-traditional losses... glad to know you specialize in that area.GloriaAt 01:03 PM 4/30/2005, you wrote:i'm trained as a grief counselor, and specialize in "unsanctioned"grief--which includes pets, gay/lesbian relationships, foster childrenleaving, miscarriage, etc.there was one study done where people were asked what the appropriateamount of time one should mourn for a parent. the answer (thisstill blows me away) TEN HOURS. so we expect people to understandabout our furkids??--MaryChristineAIM / YAHOO: TenHouseCatsMSN: [EMAIL PROTECTED]ICQ: 289856892__Do You Yahoo!?Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com
RE: OT: Staff take more time off for ill pets than relatives
Title: Message Hey Tamara, that's a great answer you gave that guy. (And it worked.) Your idea of approaching the owner for $$$ is a good one and worth a try--he can only say no. Re your very valid worry about neerdowells if you write a letter--could you ask for an adoption fee, to avoid that--isn't that what's usually done, to make sure you get only good faith people? (Or is that a fantasy world-I'm only gleaning what I've read elsewhere.) You're an angel for saving those animals. Hey, maybe you could prod your sceptical co-worker into helping you---he must havequite abit offree time now he's given up his volunteer work for ungrateful humans.Good luck, Tamara, Kerry -Original MessageFrom: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of tamara sticklerSent: Monday, May 02, 2005 9:47 AMTo: felvtalk@felineleukemia.orgSubject: Re: OT: Staff take more time off for ill pets than relatives Recently, I was talking to a fellow cat owner who asked how my two were doing. When I mentioned that the one had died, two days after his 12th birthday, a friend and coworker of mine overheard and went into a tantrum about, "You KNOW HIS BIRTHDAY? That's just about the most riduculous thing I've ever heard! Its an animal...who the hell remembers an animal's birthday" (This is a man who has volunteered THOUSANDS of hours for an artist organization that had recently given his notice of departure because the artists had renigged on the one thing he had asked them to do...support a community event, at no expense to themselves, in order for him to give his time...and he had done this for 7 years.) I was hurt at first...then gathered myself and shot back, "Yes, I remember his birthday. Its not like we celebrated with hats or anything, but I did celebrate the day he was born with a new toy for himThere is nothing wrong with marking t! he event of birth for something that gives you unconditional love for its entire life and asks only food in return.Its not like I forfitted thousands of hours of my time for a bunch of ungrateful people who refuse to help themselves" His reply. "Point taken." Sometimes, with people who don't understand...you just have to put it in perspective. Meanwhile, the powers that be in the town where I work, recently evicted dozens of people from the project neighborhood to raise the houses and build luxury town houses. Unfortunately, since the residents only had a few weeks notice, when they left, they left their animals...(mostly because many had to move into motels and such, where animals are not allowed). So for the rest of the summer, I will be trying to feed, catch, vet and place as many of these animals as I can, mostly cats. If anyone is in the MD, DE, PA area, and would like to make an addition to their family...or even foster, please let me know...Right now I have no idea of the health condition of these animals...I have pulled both healthy cats and a Felv+ cat from these streets in the past year. (I have no idea where the $$$ will come to do all this...but it has been my experience that homes, food and help will come. Meanwhile I'm going to contact the owner of the land and see ! if I can get him to put out some money on the grounds that the strays running around will be emotionally trying for any new residents that will be buying his high priced homes. But I'm not holding my breath on that oneperhaps a letter to the newspaper?...or do you think this might draw too many nerdowells? Dog fighting is big around hereI don't want to supply fresh bait if you get my meaning.) Thanks, T "Gloria B. Lane" [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: MC - I didn't know that! Hows about that! 10 hours for a parent? Anybody can see that's wrong. Wow -I remember when my horse died in about 1989 - I'd had her for about 28 years. A friend - a social worker in private counseling practice - had no clue about it - she said "explain to me how you can be sad about a horse dying". I was in shock. I suppose it was a legitimate question, but it just overwhelmed me.It's hard, the non-traditional losses... glad to know you specialize in that area.GloriaAt 01:03 PM 4/30/2005, you wrote:i'm trained as a grief counselor, and specialize in "unsanctioned"grief--which includes pets, gay/lesbian relationships, foster childrenleaving, miscarriage, etc.there was one study done where people were asked what the appropriateamount of time one ! should mourn for a parent. the answer (thisstill blows me away) TEN HOURS. so we expect people to understandabout our furkids??--MaryChristineAIM / YAHOO: TenHouseCatsMSN: [EMAIL PROTECTED]ICQ: 289856892 __Do You Yahoo!?Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com This email and any files transmit
Re: OT: Staff take more time off for ill pets than relatives
TenHouseCats [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:in terms of these little ones you're trying to save and rehome, every state has a yahoogroup dedicated to rescue-type work: marylandanimalrescue, delawareanimalrescue, etc. from there you ought to be able to access other groups who can help. also, have you contacted alleycat.org (alleycatallies) to see if they have any suggestions? or snapus.org (spay neuter assistance program) for help with that? Its been my experience that rescue groups are over-burdened as it is...and I've been a part of too many in the past,to trust how finances and even sometimes animals, are handled...even with the best intentioned...so I tend to stay as far away from such groups as possible. Howeverthe snapus looks promising...maybe they could help with some snap certificates. I'll check it out. Thanks.__Do You Yahoo!?Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com
Re: OT: Staff take more time off for ill pets than relatives
i'm trained as a grief counselor, and specialize in unsanctioned grief--which includes pets, gay/lesbian relationships, foster children leaving, miscarriage, etc. there was one study done where people were asked what the appropriate amount of time one should mourn for a parent. the answer (this still blows me away) TEN HOURS. so we expect people to understand about our furkids?? -- MaryChristine AIM / YAHOO: TenHouseCats MSN: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ICQ: 289856892
Re: OT: Staff take more time off for ill pets than relatives
Unbelievable. It takes me longer than 10 hours to get over the loss of a celebrity that I like and have never met! Very interesting about you being a grief counselor.. I should have guessed based on the extent I've gotten to know you, that you'd be involved in something as worthwhile as that. I'm sure it's difficult in many ways, but when your head exhaustedly hits the pillow at night it must be very rewarding to know you've made a quality difference in people's lives. Thank you Mary Christine for your contribution to the planet, Nina TenHouseCats wrote: i'm trained as a grief counselor, and specialize in unsanctioned grief--which includes pets, gay/lesbian relationships, foster children leaving, miscarriage, etc. there was one study done where people were asked what the appropriate amount of time one should mourn for a parent. the answer (this still blows me away) TEN HOURS. so we expect people to understand about our furkids??
Re: OT: Staff take more time off for ill pets than relatives
thank you, nina. i'm speechless. allowing people to mourn/process transition (of whatever sort--anything that changes how we identify ourselves is a loss of sorts, even the good things) seems such an obvious human need. of course, i feel the same way about loving one another, too -- MaryChristineAIM / YAHOO: TenHouseCatsMSN: [EMAIL PROTECTED]ICQ: 289856892
Re: OT: Staff take more time off for ill pets than relatives
WOW - right. When my boyfriend died in 1994, after being ill with cancer for a year and a half, a couple of people suggested that I was probably glad he was gone. Probably thinking I was tired of dealing with the illness. But it was so awful to hear someone say that - ya know - you must be glad that he's gone - as it wasn't my experience at all. Like yuk. And things like Well, ya gotta just move on and so on. Zowie. Someone asked me what seemed appropriate to me - it's something like I'm so sorry for your loss or I'm so sad xxx is gone and so on. Gloria At 02:51 PM 4/30/2005, you wrote: MC, I'd be interested to see that list, (even though it will probably churn my stomach). I've never been trained in grief counseling, and even though it's difficult, I do my best to reach out to those in sadness or trouble. I'm sure just having a sympathetic, nonjudgmental ear, helps, but, I'd like to make sure I'm not inadvertently saying something that would do more harm than good. I love the Goddess forbid, very telling :). Nina TenHouseCats wrote: it's one of the reasons we have daily, 365.25 days a year pet-loss support chats at pethobbyist don't get me started on our culture that so fears death that it chooses to belittle it than deal with it someplace i have a list of the least-helpful things people say to others when they lose a loved one (of any species)--and research shows that something ridiculous like 80% of what people say to someone in mourning IS more hurtful than helpful! it's a huge issue in the disability community, too--duh, gee, you mean that someone who suddenly can't support themselves and their families, whose body no longer does what they've always counted on its doing might be upset? or depressed? or, goddess forbid, ANGRY -- MaryChristine AIM / YAHOO: TenHouseCats MSN: [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] ICQ: 289856892
Re: OT: Staff take more time off for ill pets than relatives
I think I've changed my mind. Maybe I don't want to see that list after all. I forget how insensitive some well meaning people can be! Nina Gloria B. Lane wrote: WOW - right. When my boyfriend died in 1994, after being ill with cancer for a year and a half, a couple of people suggested that I was probably glad he was gone. Probably thinking I was tired of dealing with the illness. But it was so awful to hear someone say that - ya know - you must be glad that he's gone - as it wasn't my experience at all. Like yuk. And things like Well, ya gotta just move on and so on. Zowie. Someone asked me what seemed appropriate to me - it's something like I'm so sorry for your loss or I'm so sad xxx is gone and so on. Gloria At 02:51 PM 4/30/2005, you wrote: MC, I'd be interested to see that list, (even though it will probably churn my stomach). I've never been trained in grief counseling, and even though it's difficult, I do my best to reach out to those in sadness or trouble. I'm sure just having a sympathetic, nonjudgmental ear, helps, but, I'd like to make sure I'm not inadvertently saying something that would do more harm than good. I love the Goddess forbid, very telling :). Nina
Re: OT: Staff take more time off for ill pets than relatives
words are so inadequate gloria's suggestions are indeed the best i tell people i'm there if they need to talk or cry or scream; i'll also ask them (usually after the initial shock is over and they can think!) if there's anything specific i can do for them. everyone's experience is different, everyone's process is different--they are the best judge of what they need. letting them know in a way they can hear that you DO care is what's important. the number one, least-helpful thing on the list is, i know exactly what you're going through. well, no, you may know what YOU went through in a seemingly similar situation--saying that to someone tends to make them feel minimized the two most useful things others can do is to listen--over and over and over again, often--people need to make the experience real, and most folks are NOT willing to just listen. that, and just give them permission to grieve, to hurt, to cry, to be depressed--in truth, there are no wrong ways to grieve, short of hurting one's own self or others. denial serves a purpose; anger does as well--about the only thing that's really counterproductive is to STAY in denial. but even that is impossible to judge for someone else knowing it's okay to talk to you, tho, will make it much more likely that the person will pass through denial. it's so hard for people to talk about feelings, and you can't really force them to--just let them know you are available. offer them a list of phone support lines for pet-loss, on-line or local groups--then let them decide. when the loss is one of our critters, everyone is so different--some can't be with the animal when it's euthanized, others can't conceive of NOT being there. some need to go right out and get another cat or dog, others need to wait, and others refuse to ever love another critter that's gonna leave them. some find great peace in looking at photos of their bridge babies, others cannot bear to. think about what helped you get through a loss--and what did NOT; think about what you wish someone had said or done for you. part of giving permission to grieve is sharing your own stories--it can help the person realize their feelings ARE safe with you--but be sensitive: they probably do NOT need to hear your horror stories of the vet from hell, nor feel that they have to comfort you! if you knew the animal, talking about the silly and good times with the animal can be really helpful. yes, it brings up initial sadness about the critter's being gone, but it's a good way to remind everyone that the better times far outweigh the bad, and that the critter truly lives on in the hearts of those who knew and loved it. laughing about the cat who flooded the kitchen can be a good thing! no offense intended, but hard-core god stuff--of whatever flavor--usually is NOT a good idea unless you know that the person shares your belief system... i was a dog/cat mom for almost 20 years before i ever heard of the rainbow bridge--most people find a copy of the poem comforting and non-threatening. even if they don't believe it, it's a gentle way of showing you do care... and take care of yourself, too--listening can be hard work, especially when it is the 100th time you've heard the story--if you start to burn out, running screaming out of the room is generally not considered a therapeutic response... i personally don't buy the concept of pathological grief, because it's used as a weapon against dealing with the reality and terror of deep feelings--but if there's no progress, and you are being drained, find yourself someone to talk to; get some ideas on how best to support yourself. this might be the time to introduce your friend to a local pet-loss group, or an on-line chat or message board usually, however, it will not come to this point--just feeling safe enough to talk to someone who won't say, it was only a cat/horse/boyfriend, you can always get another one allows a person to go through the inevitable process of acceptance (and need i say that i live in fear of the day i have to be empathic to someone who's just lost their beloved tarantula??) -- MaryChristineAIM / YAHOO: TenHouseCatsMSN: [EMAIL PROTECTED]ICQ: 289856892
Re: OT: Staff take more time off for ill pets than relatives
Gag, I'd forgotten about that one! Good words, MC - keep it up - BTW, I drove by a Parrot Rescue in Texarkana (TX or AR) yesterday. Gloria At 04:09 PM 4/30/2005, you wrote: ... it was only a cat/horse/boyfriend, you can always get another one allows a person to go through the inevitable process of acceptance (and need i say that i live in fear of the day i have to be empathic to someone who's just lost their beloved tarantula??) -- MaryChristine AIM / YAHOO: TenHouseCats MSN: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED][EMAIL PROTECTED] ICQ: 289856892
