John Howell [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
The problem is actually that the trumpet has become the all-purpose
instrument, needed for orchestral work, jazz band work, and marching
band work. The cornet, especially one played with the proper
mouthpiece and technique, is a vanishing voice out of
than mine. Would you like me ot send you a
promo-blurb, David?
Aaron J. Rabushka
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://users.waymark.net/arabushk
- Original Message -
From: dhbailey [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: finale@shsu.edu
Sent: Saturday, August 25, 2007 8:10 AM
Subject: Re: [Finale] Turn-of-the-century
Ken Moore wrote:
John Howell [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
The problem is actually that the trumpet has become the all-purpose
instrument, needed for orchestral work, jazz band work, and marching
band work. The cornet, especially one played with the proper
mouthpiece and technique, is a
dhbailey wrote:
Ken Moore wrote:
John Howell [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
The problem is actually that the trumpet has become the all-purpose
instrument, needed for orchestral work, jazz band work, and marching
band work. The cornet, especially one played with the proper
mouthpiece and
dhbailey wrote:
Ken Moore wrote:
John Howell [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
The problem is actually that the trumpet has become the all-purpose
instrument, needed for orchestral work, jazz band work, and marching
band work. The cornet, especially one played with the proper
mouthpiece and
the different sound from the two?
Guy Hayden
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of
Raymond Horton
Sent: Sunday, August 26, 2007 10:28 AM
To: finale@shsu.edu
Subject: Re: [Finale] Turn-of-the-century Band Music
dhbailey wrote:
Ken Moore wrote
Guy Hayden wrote:
I have found that trumpeters who do not play cornet will insist that there
is no difference between the two instruments. OTH, cornetists will insist
that a marked difference exists. As both a band and orchestra conductor I
do recognize a difference in the sound. Mind you, I
And while we're on the subject, my current project calls for three players
to alternate quite often between fluegelhorns and trumpets. Can any of the
trumpeters here enlighten me as to whether orchestral trumpters would have
preferences for the trumpet parts to be written in B-flat or C in these
Hey Aaron,
It will definitely be easier on the player to write for Bb trumpet
doubling fluegelhorn, so that the entire part is in Bb.
Cheers,
- Darcy
-
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Brooklyn, NY
On 26 Aug 2007, at 1:43 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
And while we're on the subject, my current
On 26-Aug-07, at 1:43 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
And while we're on the subject, my current project calls for three
players
to alternate quite often between fluegelhorns and trumpets. Can any
of the
trumpeters here enlighten me as to whether orchestral trumpters
would have
preferences
Guy Hayden wrote:
I have found that trumpeters who do not play cornet will insist that there
is no difference between the two instruments.
I suspect that you would also find that those players use mouthpieces
with the same cup, throat, and rim as their trumpet mouthpieces, the
only
At 3:17 PM -0400 8/26/07, John Howell wrote:
Guy Hayden wrote:
I have found that trumpeters who do not play cornet will insist that there
is no difference between the two instruments.
I suspect that you would also find that those players use
mouthpieces with the same cup, throat, and rim as
-of-the-century Band Music
Hey Aaron,
It will definitely be easier on the player to write for Bb trumpet
doubling fluegelhorn, so that the entire part is in Bb.
Cheers,
- Darcy
-
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Brooklyn, NY
On 26 Aug 2007, at 1:43 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
And while we're
that adamant
about it. Glad some people out there feel the same way.
- Original Message -
From: dhbailey [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: finale@shsu.edu
Sent: Saturday, August 25, 2007 7:19 AM
Subject: Re: [Finale] Turn-of-the-century Band Music
David W. Fenton wrote:
[snip]
Am I misinterpreting
Agree with you, John! Every part is independent!
- Original Message -
From: John Howell [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: finale@shsu.edu
Sent: Saturday, August 25, 2007 4:37 PM
Subject: Re: [Finale] Turn-of-the-century Band Music
At 2:40 PM -0400 8/25/07, Andrew Stiller wrote:
On Aug 24
Cornets are actually enjoying a bit of a renaissance on the NYC jazz
scene. Dave Douglas, one of the most influential and critically
acclaimed trumpet players of the past ten years, has switched from
trumpet to cornet as his primary instrument. He was following in the
footsteps of a lot of
Daniel Wolf wrote:
I have a general aesthetic question for people involved in bands. Is
there a rationale beyond the pedagogical for wanting band scores to meet
some prescribed contemporary and standardized instrumentation? Might
there not be some legitimate musical reasons for omitting
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
And, as one who can be excessively finicky about which instrument plays
what, I swore a long time ago that the word band would never appear on
any of my title pages precisely because of its imprecise meaning. It's
interesting that MMB Music wrote Wind Ensemble on my
Christopher Smith wrote:
On Aug 24, 2007, at 11:00 AM, Daniel Wolf wrote:
There is a great deal of continuity between Sousa's instrumentation
and that of contemporary bands,
[snip]
The band membership also included a female vocalist, a violinist, and
a harpist as soloists,
Heh, heh! My
David W. Fenton wrote:
[snip]
Am I misinterpreting the discussion here? Is my position basically
what all y'all were advocating? Or do even university-level and
professional bands seldom/never adapt their instrumentation to the
music they are playing?
I think you would find that the upper
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Very often in school bands there's an unspoken requirement that everyone
be playing most of the time to keep them occupied. When I wrote my first
wind ensemble piece my intent was NOT to write yet another John
Cacavas-type excursion into razzle-dazzle, I was roundly
]
To: finale@shsu.edu
Sent: Saturday, August 25, 2007 8:10 AM
Subject: Re: [Finale] Turn-of-the-century Band Music
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
And, as one who can be excessively finicky about which instrument plays
what, I swore a long time ago that the word band would never appear on
any of my
A tricky situation indeed. While on the topic, what Band publishers
are presently accepting submissions?
Dean
On Aug 25, 2007, at 5:25 AM, dhbailey wrote:
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Very often in school bands there's an unspoken requirement that
everyone
be playing most of the time to keep
Hmm, sort of a compromise between Flug and Tpt.
Dean
On Aug 24, 2007, at 10:58 PM, Darcy James Argue wrote:
Cornets are actually enjoying a bit of a renaissance on the NYC
jazz scene. Dave Douglas, one of the most influential and
critically acclaimed trumpet players of the past ten years,
At 10:56 PM -0400 8/24/07, David W. Fenton wrote:
On 24 Aug 2007 at 22:29, John Howell wrote:
Yes, I understand exactly what you're saying, and of course it's
possible to delete instruments from a given ensemble, but you'd have
to have a conductor who believes in doing so, and players who
On Aug 24, 2007, at 9:29 PM, David W. Fenton wrote:
Now, in college-level bands, surely the tenor sax majors and many of
the altos also double on soprano, so I don't see how that would be
incredibly difficult to come by one player for it
Any saxophonist worthy of the name can play every
On Aug 25, 2007, at 2:14 PM, Andrew Stiller wrote:
There are also national variations, as I found to my surprise when
presented with a piece scored for the standard Maltese band of
today, which is so different from the American one that I felt
compelled to add this note to the
On Aug 24, 2007, at 10:29 PM, John Howell wrote:
It's considered prestigious to be the person selected to play the Eb
soprano. Same thing is true for the alto, bass, and lower clarinets.
When I was in bands (admittedly a long time ago now) it was definitely
*not* prestigious to play the
And some of the Czech folk bands I saw in Moravia were also interesting--I
don't know all of the ins and outs, but tenor tubas of some sort were always
there (no problems finding one for my recordings) along wih clarinets,
trumpets, tuba, slide trombones, and an occasional valve 'bone. When
On 25 Aug 2007 at 14:34, Christopher Smith wrote:
On Aug 25, 2007, at 2:14 PM, Andrew Stiller wrote:
There are also national variations, as I found to my surprise when
presented with a piece scored for the standard Maltese band of
today, which is so different from the American one that
On Aug 25, 2007, at 1:10 PM, Dean M. Estabrook wrote:
Hmm, sort of a compromise between Flug and Tpt.
That's the problem right there: there isn't enough space between those
two insts. to put in a third.
Actually, those proclaiming the death of the cornet are off by a
couple of
At 7:51 AM -0400 8/25/07, dhbailey wrote:
Sousa's band didn't march more than a couple of times. At least his
civilian band. The Marine Band marched, and the band he led in WWI
at the Great Lakes Naval Training Center marched, but his civilian
band mostly just played concerts.
Hey, they
At 8:25 AM -0400 8/25/07, dhbailey wrote:
It's a very tricky situation, and one that composers have always had
to navigate carefully. John Cacavas sold an awful lot of band
music. His arrangements have something for everyone and
doublings/cues for those situations when the originally
At 2:40 PM -0400 8/25/07, Andrew Stiller wrote:
On Aug 24, 2007, at 10:29 PM, John Howell wrote:
It's considered prestigious to be the person selected to play the
Eb soprano. Same thing is true for the alto, bass, and lower
clarinets.
When I was in bands (admittedly a long time ago now) it
Hmm...would've been interesting to hear Omar Khayyam set to music by Sousa
(assuming, of course, that he could've gotten permission!).
Aaron J. Rabushka
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://users.waymark.net/arabushk
This band talk started me doing some surfing, which turned up this quote:
A horse,
There is a great deal of continuity between Sousa's instrumentation and
that of contemporary bands, but there are couple of features worth
noting. All flutes doubled on piccolo. Two oboes, 2nd doubling EH. The
Bb clarinet section was large (12-27 players), with only one alto and
one bass
I have a general aesthetic question for people involved in bands. Is
there a rationale beyond the pedagogical for wanting band scores to meet
some prescribed contemporary and standardized instrumentation? Might
there not be some legitimate musical reasons for omitting certain
instruments or
Think it's time for a HIP band movement? I'm impressed that anyone here
has actually SEEN a d-flat piccolo. (And then there are Wagner's d-flat
trumpets and horns (assuming that they were intended to be for real))
Aaron J. Rabushka
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://users.waymark.net/arabushk
At 9:17 AM -0500 8/24/07, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Think it's time for a HIP band movement? I'm impressed that anyone here
has actually SEEN a d-flat piccolo. (And then there are Wagner's d-flat
trumpets and horns (assuming that they were intended to be for real))
The use of Db piccolos
As someone who writes a lot for band, I can say that a great deal of
flexibility already exists. There is no prescribed standard.
This works both for and against the composer: I can ask for just about
anything (8 horns, bass sax, harp, electric bass), but I have also
seen pieces with a more
At 5:00 PM +0200 8/24/07, Daniel Wolf wrote:
There is a great deal of continuity between Sousa's instrumentation
and that of contemporary bands, but there are couple of features
worth noting. All flutes doubled on piccolo. Two oboes, 2nd
doubling EH. The Bb clarinet section was large (12-27
On Aug 24, 2007, at 11:00 AM, Daniel Wolf wrote:
There is a great deal of continuity between Sousa's instrumentation
and that of contemporary bands,
[snip]
The band membership also included a female vocalist, a violinist,
and a harpist as soloists,
Heh, heh! My association of Sousa
Don't forget Woody Allen marching with the cello in TAKE THE MONEY AND RUN...
From: Christopher Smith
Sent: Fri 24-Aug-07 11:37
To: finale@shsu.edu
Subject: Re: [Finale] Turn-of-the-century Band Music
On Aug 24, 2007, at 11:00 AM, Daniel Wolf wrote:
There is a great deal of continuity
Hmm...very luxuriant! Such a wide selection of double reeds is quite a
luxury in many bands nowadays (I remember only being able to write one
each oboe and bassoon part when I wrote my HS band stuff).
Aaron J. Rabushka
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://users.waymark.net/arabushk
There is a great deal
At 4:33 PM +0200 8/24/07, Daniel Wolf wrote:
I have a general aesthetic question for people involved in bands.
Is there a rationale beyond the pedagogical for wanting band scores
to meet some prescribed contemporary and standardized
instrumentation? Might there not be some legitimate musical
Ah, many thanks.
Dean
On Aug 23, 2007, at 7:37 PM, John Howell wrote:
At 6:47 PM -0700 8/23/07, Dean M. Estabrook wrote:
Hey, John ... could you clue me in as to what site you visited to
get the PDF's? Are they in score format, condensed, or what? I'm
attempting to upgrade my
Daniel Wolf wrote:
There is a great deal of continuity between Sousa's instrumentation
and that of contemporary bands, but there are couple of features worth
noting. All flutes doubled on piccolo. Two oboes, 2nd doubling EH.
The Bb clarinet section was large (12-27 players), with only one
Ray-
Who's doing your double bell??
Jim
From: Raymond Horton
Sent: Fri 24-Aug-07 14:18
To: finale@shsu.edu
Subject: Re: [Finale] Turn-of-the-century Band Music
Daniel Wolf wrote:
There is a great deal of continuity between Sousa's instrumentation
and that of contemporary bands
Marching was only an occasional, necessary evil for these guys.
Generally it was two to three concerts a day, in different locations.
We are talking about the biggest name in popular music of his day. In
those decades - the peak year being 1910, there were hundreds of
professional bands
And, as one who can be excessively finicky about which instrument plays
what, I swore a long time ago that the word band would never appear on
any of my title pages precisely because of its imprecise meaning. It's
interesting that MMB Music wrote Wind Ensemble on my recently published
Haydn
On Aug 24, 2007, at 4:35 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
And, as one who can be excessively finicky about which instrument
plays
what, I swore a long time ago that the word band would never
appear on
any of my title pages precisely because of its imprecise meaning. It's
interesting that MMB
On 24 Aug 2007 at 16:33, Daniel Wolf wrote:
I have a general aesthetic question for people involved in bands. Is
there a rationale beyond the pedagogical for wanting band scores to
meet some prescribed contemporary and standardized instrumentation?
Might there not be some legitimate musical
Very often in school bands there's an unspoken requirement that everyone
be playing most of the time to keep them occupied. When I wrote my first
wind ensemble piece my intent was NOT to write yet another John
Cacavas-type excursion into razzle-dazzle, I was roundly criticized for
not having
A couple of observations.
One - on those recordings, if you check the later set of recordings,
(the last two sets were done in the last two weeks) you'll see the
instrumentation shift a bit, as different players become available, I
suppose (a few more clarinets, mainly).This type of
At 6:03 PM -0400 8/24/07, David W. Fenton wrote:
Am I misinterpreting the discussion here? Is my position basically
what all y'all were advocating? Or do even university-level and
professional bands seldom/never adapt their instrumentation to the
music they are playing?
No, I don't think
At 11:15 PM -0400 8/23/07, Raymond Horton wrote:
Missing the Eb soprano cornet is a problem for modern band with
these older works, but with more woodwinds in the modern band this
can often suffice. I've been working a lot with British-style
brass bands, lately, and the Eb soprano cornets
On 24 Aug 2007 at 19:26, Raymond Horton wrote:
I'll go out on a limb and say that _generally_ Fulton, Sousa, and
modern university and pro bands play/played pieces like marches with
whomever they have/had present at the time. The instrumentation
varied for Sousa, certainly, over the years,
On 24 Aug 2007 at 20:43, John Howell wrote:
As to adapting instrumentation to the music, I tried to point out that
most bands do not and cannot, with the possible exceptions of the wind
ensembles at large music schools or bands that consider themselves
truly professional. And of course among
At 9:29 PM -0400 8/24/07, David W. Fenton wrote:
Now, in college-level bands, surely the tenor sax majors and many of
the altos also double on soprano, so I don't see how that would be
incredibly difficult to come by one player for it (just as it's not
hard to put a Bb Clarinet player on Eb --
On 24 Aug 2007 at 22:29, John Howell wrote:
Yes, I understand exactly what you're saying, and of course it's
possible to delete instruments from a given ensemble, but you'd have
to have a conductor who believes in doing so, and players who accept
that it is a good idea to have a few minutes
Oh, the instrument (Eb Cornet) is available, for certain, and still
standard for brass bands, as are a whole set of Bb Cornets. It is not a
standard instrument in concert bands anymore. College wind ensembles
could use it for historical performances if they wish, or sub an Eb
trumpet, (which
I just became aware of this:
http://www.forgottenamericanmusic.com/new_fulton_band2.htm
And I think the music is quite delightful. And, despite certain
infelicities, the recordings are quite listenable, even though they
were accomplished with a single sight-reading session for each piece.
At 9:17 PM -0400 8/23/07, David W. Fenton wrote:
I just became aware of this:
http://www.forgottenamericanmusic.com/new_fulton_band2.htm
And I think the music is quite delightful. And, despite certain
infelicities, the recordings are quite listenable, even though they
were accomplished with a
John Howell wrote:
At 9:17 PM -0400 8/23/07, David W. Fenton wrote:
I just became aware of this:
http://www.forgottenamericanmusic.com/new_fulton_band2.htm
And I think the music is quite delightful. And, despite certain
infelicities, the recordings are quite listenable, even though they
were
David W. Fenton wrote:
I just became aware of this:
http://www.forgottenamericanmusic.com/new_fulton_band2.htm
And I think the music is quite delightful. And, despite certain
infelicities, the recordings are quite listenable, even though they
were accomplished with a single sight-reading
Hey, John ... could you clue me in as to what site you visited to get
the PDF's? Are they in score format, condensed, or what? I'm
attempting to upgrade my bandstrating skills, and find that score
study is an excellent way to do it, especially if a performance is
available.
Thanks,
At 10:00 PM -0400 8/23/07, Raymond Horton wrote:
The instrumentation difference is not quite as major as you make it
seem, really. Just look at this list from David's link:
---
* Full Score
* (4) C Flute + opt Pic * (1) Eb Clarinet
* (3) 1'st Bb Clarinets
* (3) 2'nd Bb
At 6:47 PM -0700 8/23/07, Dean M. Estabrook wrote:
Hey, John ... could you clue me in as to what site you visited to
get the PDF's? Are they in score format, condensed, or what? I'm
attempting to upgrade my bandstrating skills, and find that score
study is an excellent way to do it,
John Howell wrote:
The marches and smears I downloaded have a few more problems. ALWAYS
Db piccolo, and sometimes no C flute parts. Sometimes oboe, sometimes
not, and bassoons likewise. Sometimes no saxes, but other times saxes
including soprano (and never 1st and 2nd alto). And the
This band talk started me doing some surfing, which turned up this quote:
A horse, a dog, a girl, a gun, and music on the side that is my
idea of heaven.
- John Phillip Sousa
It's
Just a comment on the subject of music from this period: there used
to be (now lost) in our school music library, an LP of Sousa marches
directed by some of his family descendants. It was remarkably light
and clear, more transparently orchestrated and played than anything
we hear now. It
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