Re: [flexcoders] OpenLaszlo.org supports Flex, Silverlight, AJAX, soon Quicktime, and also DHTML and W3C
I agree, I doubt it would happen, and MS isn't very successful at buying out large companies due to "perceived risk" of getting into a Sherman Act type of thing again. I'd rather Apple not also, I'm abandoning Adobe unless I hear something different. If I can't get my money back from purchases, I'll just let it go, and do Audio Unit and NVIDIA CUDO programming on Mac OS X. I have an 8- core 3.4, 32GB, 4 bay 300GBx15krpm RAID0, dual 30" with NVIDIA 5500. The things that I'm working on as an accepted CUDO developer are amazing. I hope to encourage Papervision3D to add support for CUDO and to go out on their own and develop their own plug-in. NOW is the perfect TIME for Papervision3D to do this, not later. I'd be a happy camper then and hide 9 of my fingers for a second a send the photoship to Ablwme Corp. whom just a week ago I continiued to lovenot after what I've discovered in the past few days. -r On Aug 30, 2008, at 10:59 PM, Sherif Abdou wrote: Apple will not buy Adobe, Microsoft would not let it without a fight and $22.7 billion is a big chunk of change and that's just the market cap now add a premium and they are looking at $30billion, that's amost 20% of Apple's market cap. Also, I really don't want them to ruin everything, i dont wana end up saying IFlash , IFlex, IPhotoshop :) - Original Message - From: Robert Thompson To: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, August 30, 2008 9:40 PM Subject: Re: [flexcoders] OpenLaszlo.org supports Flex, Silverlight, AJAX, soon Quicktime, and also DHTML and W3C Actually the rumor was and may still be that Apple will buy Adobe. Now that would be good news to me. Steven Jobs is the one figure I've been following since I was a kid. Out of all the CEO's from the old Borland, to Microsoft, to Zinc (when AOL was a little DOS app.), he seems to be the only one to maintain a calm integrity and come out on top. You can see it when he gives a speech. Steve Ballmer when to school here in my home state of Michigan and Country Day Prep academy (unfortunately with my attorney when to school with him at the same time in my "thing" which is described not by me but by someone writing about the Federal Circuit of appeals; they went to school together in '72 '74) and Ballmer is still on the board. Can you ever imagine the cool and calm Jobs doing a dance like Steve Ballmer did - the contrast is amazing to anyone who's Scene7 or more Jobs' speeches. In any event, I put Apple over every other company -- that's just me -- may not be others, so it's all good, don't flame me. But I've spent nearly $5,000 on Adobe software and I'd like to return every bit of it if this chosen date by them of Sept. 11th Webinar proves to be what I think it is. I'm sure they're listening and may put a spin on it, but please, for your own sakes, do not trust any Corporations words, trust only the Actions they take. Take it from a 40 year old telling a 20-25 year old, please use your talents wisely and be careful who you dedicate yourself too. Ultimately, you should dedicate yourself to you and your family, if you have one, and take the route that will keep your investment in time and money safe. If your a 9-5'er, and I know a lot of them in this Big3 area, there are different kinds of risks, that have a lot less to do with Flex (usually those are the people that had bosses shell out the $20,000 or so, I forget the exact price, for FLEX 1.0). -r On Aug 30, 2008, at 6:50 PM, Paul Andrews wrote: - Original Message - From: "[EMAIL PROTECTED]" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: Sent: Saturday, August 30, 2008 11:02 PM Subject: Re: [flexcoders] OpenLaszlo.org supports Flex, Silverlight, AJAX, soon Quicktime, and also DHTML and W3C > There is a different way to look at this. Right now, Flash is still just > and "on-line" technology in the view of most people. Even though AIR > does a lot of things, people still don't think it is very important. > Similar problem that Microsoft had with VB being considered only a > desktop tech and almost none taking it seriously as a server until > Microsoft built server based applications. > > For me, Mass appeal of AIR is huge! It would mean that I can push Flex > as a Desktop as well as a Web application. It becomes the replacement > for VB and .net which then lets me solidify the build once/deploy > everywhere that we have been talking about since the early Java days. > > I understand your concern that Adobe is doing similar things as you are > however, Micorsoft, IBM, Oracle and most others also make a lot of > applications that are similar to what their developers build also. The > differ
Re: [flexcoders] OpenLaszlo.org supports Flex, Silverlight, AJAX, soon Quicktime, and also DHTML and W3C
Apple will not buy Adobe, Microsoft would not let it without a fight and $22.7 billion is a big chunk of change and that's just the market cap now add a premium and they are looking at $30billion, that's amost 20% of Apple's market cap. Also, I really don't want them to ruin everything, i dont wana end up saying IFlash , IFlex, IPhotoshop :) - Original Message - From: Robert Thompson To: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, August 30, 2008 9:40 PM Subject: Re: [flexcoders] OpenLaszlo.org supports Flex, Silverlight, AJAX, soon Quicktime, and also DHTML and W3C Actually the rumor was and may still be that Apple will buy Adobe. Now that would be good news to me. Steven Jobs is the one figure I've been following since I was a kid. Out of all the CEO's from the old Borland, to Microsoft, to Zinc (when AOL was a little DOS app.), he seems to be the only one to maintain a calm integrity and come out on top. You can see it when he gives a speech. Steve Ballmer when to school here in my home state of Michigan and Country Day Prep academy (unfortunately with my attorney when to school with him at the same time in my "thing" which is described not by me but by someone writing about the Federal Circuit of appeals; they went to school together in '72 '74) and Ballmer is still on the board. Can you ever imagine the cool and calm Jobs doing a dance like Steve Ballmer did - the contrast is amazing to anyone who's Scene7 or more Jobs' speeches. In any event, I put Apple over every other company -- that's just me -- may not be others, so it's all good, don't flame me. But I've spent nearly $5,000 on Adobe software and I'd like to return every bit of it if this chosen date by them of Sept. 11th Webinar proves to be what I think it is. I'm sure they're listening and may put a spin on it, but please, for your own sakes, do not trust any Corporations words, trust only the Actions they take. Take it from a 40 year old telling a 20-25 year old, please use your talents wisely and be careful who you dedicate yourself too. Ultimately, you should dedicate yourself to you and your family, if you have one, and take the route that will keep your investment in time and money safe. If your a 9-5'er, and I know a lot of them in this Big3 area, there are different kinds of risks, that have a lot less to do with Flex (usually those are the people that had bosses shell out the $20,000 or so, I forget the exact price, for FLEX 1.0). -r On Aug 30, 2008, at 6:50 PM, Paul Andrews wrote: - Original Message - From: "[EMAIL PROTECTED]" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: Sent: Saturday, August 30, 2008 11:02 PM Subject: Re: [flexcoders] OpenLaszlo.org supports Flex, Silverlight, AJAX, soon Quicktime, and also DHTML and W3C > There is a different way to look at this. Right now, Flash is still just > and "on-line" technology in the view of most people. Even though AIR > does a lot of things, people still don't think it is very important. > Similar problem that Microsoft had with VB being considered only a > desktop tech and almost none taking it seriously as a server until > Microsoft built server based applications. > > For me, Mass appeal of AIR is huge! It would mean that I can push Flex > as a Desktop as well as a Web application. It becomes the replacement > for VB and .net which then lets me solidify the build once/deploy > everywhere that we have been talking about since the early Java days. > > I understand your concern that Adobe is doing similar things as you are > however, Micorsoft, IBM, Oracle and most others also make a lot of > applications that are similar to what their developers build also. The > difference is customization as well as usage. I think if Adobe can > produce good desktop and Web applications that we can showcase, we will > be able to move the market away from Microsoft and Sun and increase the > viability of using Flex in corporations. > > For me, at my company we were choosing between Silverlight, JavaFX, Doja > and Flex. It was the fact that Microsoft had released Photoshop Express > that helped to sell Flex. Scary. Microsoft just bought Adobe. Shriek! The development world is big and Adobe consulting doesn't come cheap, so I think there's those that can afford the cream of the crop no matter what the cost and then there's the rest of the world that have budgets, so there's always going to be room for everyone. Paul > That is my .02. > > > Robert Thompson wrote: >> >> I agree. Let's see what happen
Re: [flexcoders] OpenLaszlo.org supports Flex, Silverlight, AJAX, soon Quicktime, and also DHTML and W3C
Actually the rumor was and may still be that Apple will buy Adobe. Now that would be good news to me. Steven Jobs is the one figure I've been following since I was a kid. Out of all the CEO's from the old Borland, to Microsoft, to Zinc (when AOL was a little DOS app.), he seems to be the only one to maintain a calm integrity and come out on top. You can see it when he gives a speech. Steve Ballmer when to school here in my home state of Michigan and Country Day Prep academy (unfortunately with my attorney when to school with him at the same time in my "thing" which is described not by me but by someone writing about the Federal Circuit of appeals; they went to school together in '72 '74) and Ballmer is still on the board. Can you ever imagine the cool and calm Jobs doing a dance like Steve Ballmer did - the contrast is amazing to anyone who's Scene7 or more Jobs' speeches. In any event, I put Apple over every other company -- that's just me -- may not be others, so it's all good, don't flame me. But I've spent nearly $5,000 on Adobe software and I'd like to return every bit of it if this chosen date by them of Sept. 11th Webinar proves to be what I think it is. I'm sure they're listening and may put a spin on it, but please, for your own sakes, do not trust any Corporations words, trust only the Actions they take. Take it from a 40 year old telling a 20-25 year old, please use your talents wisely and be careful who you dedicate yourself too. Ultimately, you should dedicate yourself to you and your family, if you have one, and take the route that will keep your investment in time and money safe. If your a 9-5'er, and I know a lot of them in this Big3 area, there are different kinds of risks, that have a lot less to do with Flex (usually those are the people that had bosses shell out the $20,000 or so, I forget the exact price, for FLEX 1.0). -r On Aug 30, 2008, at 6:50 PM, Paul Andrews wrote: - Original Message - From: "[EMAIL PROTECTED]" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: Sent: Saturday, August 30, 2008 11:02 PM Subject: Re: [flexcoders] OpenLaszlo.org supports Flex, Silverlight, AJAX, soon Quicktime, and also DHTML and W3C > There is a different way to look at this. Right now, Flash is still just > and "on-line" technology in the view of most people. Even though AIR > does a lot of things, people still don't think it is very important. > Similar problem that Microsoft had with VB being considered only a > desktop tech and almost none taking it seriously as a server until > Microsoft built server based applications. > > For me, Mass appeal of AIR is huge! It would mean that I can push Flex > as a Desktop as well as a Web application. It becomes the replacement > for VB and .net which then lets me solidify the build once/deploy > everywhere that we have been talking about since the early Java days. > > I understand your concern that Adobe is doing similar things as you are > however, Micorsoft, IBM, Oracle and most others also make a lot of > applications that are similar to what their developers build also. The > difference is customization as well as usage. I think if Adobe can > produce good desktop and Web applications that we can showcase, we will > be able to move the market away from Microsoft and Sun and increase the > viability of using Flex in corporations. > > For me, at my company we were choosing between Silverlight, JavaFX, Doja > and Flex. It was the fact that Microsoft had released Photoshop Express > that helped to sell Flex. Scary. Microsoft just bought Adobe. Shriek! The development world is big and Adobe consulting doesn't come cheap, so I think there's those that can afford the cream of the crop no matter what the cost and then there's the rest of the world that have budgets, so there's always going to be room for everyone. Paul > That is my .02. > > > Robert Thompson wrote: >> >> I agree. Let's see what happens. >> >> >> Everyone here is an individual that can judge for themselves. >> >> I myself and quite concerned. >> >> I hope to be more informed than the Press Releases, White-paper and >> list of Clients already served by Adobe with a solution akin to the >> "Hybrid" or "Flex Store" and based on a high-performance platform. >> >> Great. But where does that FLEX mass-appeal product leave the >> developers. >> >> If Scene7.com did it themselves great. But Adobe has purchased them, >> the CEO of Adobe resigned about the same time, and now we have a new >> Adobe who is building a hybrid lightweight operating system in AIR >> that
Re: [flexcoders] OpenLaszlo.org supports Flex, Silverlight, AJAX, soon Quicktime, and also DHTML and W3C
I like you're opinion. Except the part about IBM and Microsoft developing similarly. I'm not a Microsoft lover, but I used to be, long story. But since I've recovered from the Ballmer dance most seen on YouTube, I kind of like them now. I've done 4 ASP.Net projects, and 2 very large VB.Net projects. My problem with MS in the 90's was them taking applications written by the ISVs that made them popular, and including them one by one as time went on, in the OS itself. The worst of this came in the SUN v Microsoft debate. To actually see in discovery that they hacked Java so it would perform poorly. Hopefully most of those people are gone by now, and I hope, though will never know, that Gates now having a family has changed his outlook on how he treats young grads. coming out of college to start small businesses or freelance. With Adobe and Scene7.com, do to their great Imaging applications and history with users using applications like Lightroom, is see a very real close together magnet here (as an analogy IBM, Microsoft and others do highly sophisticated contracts that only they could do and as far as a gauge for us being in the middle of 2 attracting magnets; one being IBM for example and the other being the company we'd like to serve; the magnets are far apart). But with Adobe those magnets are very close together, and I see a very user friendly E-Commerce system that almost directly mirrors the Adobe "Hybrid" Store, or the Full Store, only even better, and incorporating possibly Edge and Grid computing, as well as what Scene7 really was, as that is the way they can color images. So Adobe is on the road to producing an extremely easy to use eCommerce application for the masses, and we will be left with applications in other areas. But as time goes by, this will narrow more and more. I've been in the business since 1988 when IBM chose me over 8 other graduate applicants (and I was the only other undergrad applicant) for a Windows project for an ATM Performance Analyzer with the EE Dept. I was chosen because I showed up for the Interview with the application 50% done. So I went into Windows and I have to be careful about my story, but there is a public article not of my doing here at FedCir "Federal Circuit" / only I had to bow out because since I first met with them in August of 2001 the following day I had a seizure and I've had a seizure condition every since. Life is no longer a long and winding yellow brook road for me, I'm doing things in music that help Epilepsy, my SWF and CoreAudio, etc. development for the future will be my future as I'm on Medicaid now. However, I did eventually get a great eCommerce platform done, and it will last probably a year or so and I'll get a client when I can (my income is capped anyway) and it will be worth little after Scene7 is out for a few years. So I have a very large perspective on this, and "it isn't looking pretty". If you research my past posts, you'll find extreme excitement by me about AIR, asking Adobe to find a way to integrate OpenGL before Silverlight leveraged DirectX against it. Now I feel differently. The CEO resigned last Fall, and whoever is in charge now has a different plan that effects us developers. Scene7 attorneys, as far as I know, are "Thompson Reuters" in NYC and Mary A. Fracis is the executing attorney on some of their issues, and I've called her as well as people at Scene7 twice to get more clear on the issues. The 2nd call to Scene7 made very very clear that they do intend to do exactly what I felt they would, only they call it "eCataloging" which is a pre-cursor to doing anything eCommerce with the special imaging that Scene7 does on, for example, changing the color of a sweater. The difference is, Adobe is not bringing this to us as far as I was told, they are, and I asked directly, "So is it possible that Adobe could bid against another company using FLEX to do a contract for a company?" (I used a shoe company earlier because Nike is one of their many, many clients). I'm not worried about bidding on Fortune 500, I'm worried about the more and more often complaint of users who know more and more about what's going on saying, No, I just bought Scene7 LE, for example, and it makes it so easy. I don't need any custom development. This single step that Adobe has taken has totally blurred the line that would have never been blurred at Macromedia, Adobe is now both a Premiere Imaging Firm, and a Firm using the very programming tools it sells, not to integrate into a big operating system, but to Bid on contracts using it, even against their own developer community, and in the long run, AIR is virtually a "lightweight operating system" of global proportions. My thinking is that the new CEO of Adobe has lust in his eyes, but I don't know that for a fact because I've never seen hi
Re: [flexcoders] OpenLaszlo.org supports Flex, Silverlight, AJAX, soon Quicktime, and also DHTML and W3C
- Original Message - From: "[EMAIL PROTECTED]" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: Sent: Saturday, August 30, 2008 11:02 PM Subject: Re: [flexcoders] OpenLaszlo.org supports Flex, Silverlight, AJAX, soon Quicktime, and also DHTML and W3C > There is a different way to look at this. Right now, Flash is still just > and "on-line" technology in the view of most people. Even though AIR > does a lot of things, people still don't think it is very important. > Similar problem that Microsoft had with VB being considered only a > desktop tech and almost none taking it seriously as a server until > Microsoft built server based applications. > > For me, Mass appeal of AIR is huge! It would mean that I can push Flex > as a Desktop as well as a Web application. It becomes the replacement > for VB and .net which then lets me solidify the build once/deploy > everywhere that we have been talking about since the early Java days. > > I understand your concern that Adobe is doing similar things as you are > however, Micorsoft, IBM, Oracle and most others also make a lot of > applications that are similar to what their developers build also. The > difference is customization as well as usage. I think if Adobe can > produce good desktop and Web applications that we can showcase, we will > be able to move the market away from Microsoft and Sun and increase the > viability of using Flex in corporations. > > For me, at my company we were choosing between Silverlight, JavaFX, Doja > and Flex. It was the fact that Microsoft had released Photoshop Express > that helped to sell Flex. Scary. Microsoft just bought Adobe. Shriek! The development world is big and Adobe consulting doesn't come cheap, so I think there's those that can afford the cream of the crop no matter what the cost and then there's the rest of the world that have budgets, so there's always going to be room for everyone. Paul > That is my .02. > > > Robert Thompson wrote: >> >> I agree. Let's see what happens. >> >> >> Everyone here is an individual that can judge for themselves. >> >> I myself and quite concerned. >> >> I hope to be more informed than the Press Releases, White-paper and >> list of Clients already served by Adobe with a solution akin to the >> "Hybrid" or "Flex Store" and based on a high-performance platform. >> >> Great. But where does that FLEX mass-appeal product leave the >> developers. >> >> If Scene7.com did it themselves great. But Adobe has purchased them, >> the CEO of Adobe resigned about the same time, and now we have a new >> Adobe who is building a hybrid lightweight operating system in AIR >> that I have been very excited about in the past in my posts here, and >> in an OpenGL display framework (Papervision3D to the rescue), but now >> Adobe has just added a new dimension to all of thiscompetition in >> a very real sense against a developer, for example, bidding for a >> Small Running Shoe company. Do they choose Adobe Scene7 or do they >> choose a developer? Probably Adobe. >> >> A ran 8:52 for the 3200m in college, All SEC twice, and NCAA >> Division-1, 3rd place championship team, and had a good running >> career, which is why I brought up the example of a running shoe store. >> >> -r >> >> **
Re: [flexcoders] OpenLaszlo.org supports Flex, Silverlight, AJAX, soon Quicktime, and also DHTML and W3C
There is a different way to look at this. Right now, Flash is still just and "on-line" technology in the view of most people. Even though AIR does a lot of things, people still don't think it is very important. Similar problem that Microsoft had with VB being considered only a desktop tech and almost none taking it seriously as a server until Microsoft built server based applications. For me, Mass appeal of AIR is huge! It would mean that I can push Flex as a Desktop as well as a Web application. It becomes the replacement for VB and .net which then lets me solidify the build once/deploy everywhere that we have been talking about since the early Java days. I understand your concern that Adobe is doing similar things as you are however, Micorsoft, IBM, Oracle and most others also make a lot of applications that are similar to what their developers build also. The difference is customization as well as usage. I think if Adobe can produce good desktop and Web applications that we can showcase, we will be able to move the market away from Microsoft and Sun and increase the viability of using Flex in corporations. For me, at my company we were choosing between Silverlight, JavaFX, Doja and Flex. It was the fact that Microsoft had released Photoshop Express that helped to sell Flex. That is my .02. Robert Thompson wrote: > > I agree. Let's see what happens. > > > Everyone here is an individual that can judge for themselves. > > I myself and quite concerned. > > I hope to be more informed than the Press Releases, White-paper and > list of Clients already served by Adobe with a solution akin to the > "Hybrid" or "Flex Store" and based on a high-performance platform. > > Great. But where does that FLEX mass-appeal product leave the developers. > > If Scene7.com did it themselves great. But Adobe has purchased them, > the CEO of Adobe resigned about the same time, and now we have a new > Adobe who is building a hybrid lightweight operating system in AIR > that I have been very excited about in the past in my posts here, and > in an OpenGL display framework (Papervision3D to the rescue), but now > Adobe has just added a new dimension to all of thiscompetition in > a very real sense against a developer, for example, bidding for a > Small Running Shoe company. Do they choose Adobe Scene7 or do they > choose a developer? Probably Adobe. > > A ran 8:52 for the 3200m in college, All SEC twice, and NCAA > Division-1, 3rd place championship team, and had a good running > career, which is why I brought up the example of a running shoe store. > > -r > > ** > * *
Re: [flexcoders] OpenLaszlo.org supports Flex, Silverlight, AJAX, soon Quicktime, and also DHTML and W3C
I agree. Let's see what happens. Everyone here is an individual that can judge for themselves. I myself and quite concerned. I hope to be more informed than the Press Releases, White-paper and list of Clients already served by Adobe with a solution akin to the "Hybrid" or "Flex Store" and based on a high-performance platform. Great. But where does that FLEX mass-appeal product leave the developers. If Scene7.com did it themselves great. But Adobe has purchased them, the CEO of Adobe resigned about the same time, and now we have a new Adobe who is building a hybrid lightweight operating system in AIR that I have been very excited about in the past in my posts here, and in an OpenGL display framework (Papervision3D to the rescue), but now Adobe has just added a new dimension to all of thiscompetition in a very real sense against a developer, for example, bidding for a Small Running Shoe company. Do they choose Adobe Scene7 or do they choose a developer? Probably Adobe. A ran 8:52 for the 3200m in college, All SEC twice, and NCAA Division-1, 3rd place championship team, and had a good running career, which is why I brought up the example of a running shoe store. -r On Aug 30, 2008, at 1:39 AM, Vivian Richard wrote: As you said Alex, started a new thread and lets see what happens. On Fri, Aug 29, 2008 at 8:52 PM, Alex Harui <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Didn't take much time at all. Wrote it while running unit tests. Please > start a new thread about a scheduling framework and what is missing. I > doubt I will have time to do anything, but maybe someone else in the > community can. > > > > From: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On > Behalf Of Vivian Richard > Sent: Friday, August 29, 2008 8:14 PM > To: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [flexcoders] OpenLaszlo.org supports Flex, Silverlight, AJAX, > soon Quicktime, and also DHTML and W3C > > > > Wow Alex you definitely did spent a lot of time to write > this email. Your time is really precious for the whole user > group. I am sure you could come up with another excellent > flex example if you would code during this time!!! :-) Alex > please develop a good example of flex schedule framework. > It is been a while that "flex schedule framework" came out > and there are no good examples out there. Now we > are looking at you to show us the way. Please give us time > and develop ALEXIAN example of "flex schedule frame work". > It is not a rude demand but a humble request. Cheers > > On Fri, Aug 29, 2008 at 7:39 PM, Alex Harui <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> Matt Chotin is away this week and has moved from development to product >> management and therefore must now choose his words carefully. I'm still in >> development so maybe I can get away with more. >> >> >> >> Robert, I don't think we've met, and I haven't gone back to see your past >> history with Flex, but I would like to ask you to think twice about the >> way >> you are trying to get your message across before hitting send. Sending >> high >> priority messages, and maybe not having all of your facts straight, >> discredits your message and invites others to get mad or poke fun or both. >> I believe your message is that Adobe also sells solutions via Scene7 and >> Adobe Consulting and could purposefully or accidentally end up competing >> with independents like yourself, and that there are alternatives to Flex >> such as OpenLaszlo and Silverlight and Quicktime. That part of your >> message >> is not really debatable. I've worked for Lotus and IBM in my past and they >> also both sold development tools and had solutions teams and there is a >> fine >> line they have to walk. Occasionally, they stepped on one of their >> independents. >> >> >> >> It is unfortunate that you've been burned in the past, and you and others >> should definitely keep on the lookout for competition whether from Adobe >> or >> other independents. However, the call to arms to have everyone attend a >> webinar did not warrant "red alert" status. Yellow maybe. And based on >> your past, I'm surprised you would place so much weight on what you would >> hear in a webinar or in any public statement by Adobe. This is a fast >> moving marketplace and Adobe can change its mind right after talking to >> you. You'll always have to read the tea leaves and be ready to change >> course yourself. >> >> >> >> Finally, this forum is not an Adobe forum. There are non-Adobe moder
Re: [flexcoders] OpenLaszlo.org supports Flex, Silverlight, AJAX, soon Quicktime, and also DHTML and W3C
Alex, I appreciated your post. It was helpful. There have been others that have sent me a nice reply saying that it is good to keep any eye out, and for those that look into Scene7, they can make their own conclusions. I appreciated your time and post and thanked you. I wouldn't demand anything from you - and I don't think anyone else should either. I would demand that Adobe not compete against FLEX users by combining the Scene7 platform with a FLEX based user interface that serves the masses, and will cause, at the very least, many potential clients to say "No" early on, and then never re-connect again whether they have success with Scene7 or not - and it's relevant because it's a FLEX based interface for corporations. I'm for everyone at this point, except those who don't have ethics. -r On Aug 29, 2008, at 11:52 PM, Alex Harui wrote: Didn’t take much time at all. Wrote it while running unit tests. Please start a new thread about a scheduling framework and what is missing. I doubt I will have time to do anything, but maybe someone else in the community can. From: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Vivian Richard Sent: Friday, August 29, 2008 8:14 PM To: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [flexcoders] OpenLaszlo.org supports Flex, Silverlight, AJAX, soon Quicktime, and also DHTML and W3C Wow Alex you definitely did spent a lot of time to write this email. Your time is really precious for the whole user group. I am sure you could come up with another excellent flex example if you would code during this time!!! :-) Alex please develop a good example of flex schedule framework. It is been a while that "flex schedule framework" came out and there are no good examples out there. Now we are looking at you to show us the way. Please give us time and develop ALEXIAN example of "flex schedule frame work". It is not a rude demand but a humble request. Cheers On Fri, Aug 29, 2008 at 7:39 PM, Alex Harui <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Matt Chotin is away this week and has moved from development to product > management and therefore must now choose his words carefully. I'm still in > development so maybe I can get away with more. > > > > Robert, I don't think we've met, and I haven't gone back to see your past > history with Flex, but I would like to ask you to think twice about the way > you are trying to get your message across before hitting send. Sending high > priority messages, and maybe not having all of your facts straight, > discredits your message and invites others to get mad or poke fun or both. > I believe your message is that Adobe also sells solutions via Scene7 and > Adobe Consulting and could purposefully or accidentally end up competing > with independents like yourself, and that there are alternatives to Flex > such as OpenLaszlo and Silverlight and Quicktime. That part of your message > is not really debatable. I've worked for Lotus and IBM in my past and they > also both sold development tools and had solutions teams and there is a fine > line they have to walk. Occasionally, they stepped on one of their > independents. > > > > It is unfortunate that you've been burned in the past, and you and others > should definitely keep on the lookout for competition whether from Adobe or > other independents. However, the call to arms to have everyone attend a > webinar did not warrant "red alert" status. Yellow maybe. And based on > your past, I'm surprised you would place so much weight on what you would > hear in a webinar or in any public statement by Adobe. This is a fast > moving marketplace and Adobe can change its mind right after talking to > you. You'll always have to read the tea leaves and be ready to change > course yourself. > > > > Finally, this forum is not an Adobe forum. There are non-Adobe moderators. > As far as I'm concerned, you can get on your soapbox anytime you want, but > if you want to reach a wide audience, fire and brimstone may not be the best > approach. If you just want to vent, please warn us up front. And when you > get on your soapbox, sometimes you just have a clever comeback line or just > ignore the hecklers, including me. Yelling back at them is a waste of your > energy. Take the high road, choose your technologies, remain nimble and > good luck to you. > > > > -Alex > > > > From: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On > Behalf Of Robert Thompson > Sent: Friday, August 29, 2008 3:50 PM > To: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com > Cc: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [flexcoders] OpenLaszlo.org supports Flex, Silverl
Re: [flexcoders] OpenLaszlo.org supports Flex, Silverlight, AJAX, soon Quicktime, and also DHTML and W3C
I apologize to you Alex. You seem level headed, and I agree, after reading some of the things I have, perhaps it was perceived as Fire and Brimstone. One sure fact is, I've spent 3 years developing my own eCommerce Platform based on FLEX and an XML storage repository. To see the press release about Adobe creating applications just like the ones I, and I'm sure others, had and have planned, seems to be to be not the safest technology base to be in. I have had a good look at OpenLaszlo.org and in Version 4.0 it looks like a great way to integrate things similar to Papervision3D, or even a CUDO based plug-in for NVIDIA CUDO 'C' programming language based GPU (graphics processing language) usage. Macromedia has never taken a step like I saw in the press release and Whitepaper and client-list as Adobe has with Scene7 that will effect FLEX developers more than the majority of them realize right now. Believe it or not, I'm on the "SilverLight" soap-box now also. I'm on it all...no more blind happy pappa dedication to Adobe, they've made their plans clear. So that's just my apology and response to you and to anyone I've offended. I'm not making any money or getting off on these posts, I am genuinely concerned. -r On Aug 29, 2008, at 10:39 PM, Alex Harui wrote: Matt Chotin is away this week and has moved from development to product management and therefore must now choose his words carefully. I’m still in development so maybe I can get away with more. Robert, I don’t think we’ve met, and I haven’t gone back to see your past history with Flex, but I would like to ask you to think twice about the way you are trying to get your message across before hitting send. Sending high priority messages, and maybe not having all of your facts straight, discredits your message and invites others to get mad or poke fun or both. I believe your message is that Adobe also sells solutions via Scene7 and Adobe Consulting and could purposefully or accidentally end up competing with independents like yourself, and that there are alternatives to Flex such as OpenLaszlo and Silverlight and Quicktime. That part of your message is not really debatable. I’ve worked for Lotus and IBM in my past and they also both sold development tools and had solutions teams and there is a fine line they have to walk. Occasionally, they stepped on one of their independents. It is unfortunate that you’ve been burned in the past, and you and others should definitely keep on the lookout for competition whether from Adobe or other independents. However, the call to arms to have everyone attend a webinar did not warrant “red alert” status. Yellow maybe. And based on your past, I’m surprised you would place so much weight on what you would hear in a webinar or in any public statement by Adobe. This is a fast moving marketplace and Adobe can change its mind right after talking to you. You’ll always have to read the tea leaves and be ready to change course yourself. Finally, this forum is not an Adobe forum. There are non-Adobe moderators. As far as I’m concerned, you can get on your soapbox anytime you want, but if you want to reach a wide audience, fire and brimstone may not be the best approach. If you just want to vent, please warn us up front. And when you get on your soapbox, sometimes you just have a clever comeback line or just ignore the hecklers, including me. Yelling back at them is a waste of your energy. Take the high road, choose your technologies, remain nimble and good luck to you. -Alex From: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Robert Thompson Sent: Friday, August 29, 2008 3:50 PM To: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com Cc: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [flexcoders] OpenLaszlo.org supports Flex, Silverlight, AJAX, soon Quicktime, and also DHTML and W3C If you would just read your own comments you'd realize I'm posting objectively and angering just the few of you. I'm thankful to the posters the other day who said, essentially, if you're not interested don't read it. If your thankful to get some information to get to the root of the matter, look into it. I spent $1,777 on FLEX 3.0 with ILOG Elixr, and a lot more on Master Suite. So don't tell me I don't have the right to question the money I've spent and the time invested, and cut my losses, and simply make others aware that there is a "War of the RIAs going on" and if you care to look into it, here's an article on it, http://counternotions.com/2007/11/15/apple-runtime-answer-2/ I have asked questions about coding. But I'm also looking for the stability of the platform. I pushed very hard from someone to step up and create an OpenGL framework, and although I'm
Re: [flexcoders] OpenLaszlo.org supports Flex, Silverlight, AJAX, soon Quicktime, and also DHTML and W3C
As you said Alex, started a new thread and lets see what happens. On Fri, Aug 29, 2008 at 8:52 PM, Alex Harui <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Didn't take much time at all. Wrote it while running unit tests. Please > start a new thread about a scheduling framework and what is missing. I > doubt I will have time to do anything, but maybe someone else in the > community can. > > > > From: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On > Behalf Of Vivian Richard > Sent: Friday, August 29, 2008 8:14 PM > To: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [flexcoders] OpenLaszlo.org supports Flex, Silverlight, AJAX, > soon Quicktime, and also DHTML and W3C > > > > Wow Alex you definitely did spent a lot of time to write > this email. Your time is really precious for the whole user > group. I am sure you could come up with another excellent > flex example if you would code during this time!!! :-) Alex > please develop a good example of flex schedule framework. > It is been a while that "flex schedule framework" came out > and there are no good examples out there. Now we > are looking at you to show us the way. Please give us time > and develop ALEXIAN example of "flex schedule frame work". > It is not a rude demand but a humble request. Cheers > > On Fri, Aug 29, 2008 at 7:39 PM, Alex Harui <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> Matt Chotin is away this week and has moved from development to product >> management and therefore must now choose his words carefully. I'm still in >> development so maybe I can get away with more. >> >> >> >> Robert, I don't think we've met, and I haven't gone back to see your past >> history with Flex, but I would like to ask you to think twice about the >> way >> you are trying to get your message across before hitting send. Sending >> high >> priority messages, and maybe not having all of your facts straight, >> discredits your message and invites others to get mad or poke fun or both. >> I believe your message is that Adobe also sells solutions via Scene7 and >> Adobe Consulting and could purposefully or accidentally end up competing >> with independents like yourself, and that there are alternatives to Flex >> such as OpenLaszlo and Silverlight and Quicktime. That part of your >> message >> is not really debatable. I've worked for Lotus and IBM in my past and they >> also both sold development tools and had solutions teams and there is a >> fine >> line they have to walk. Occasionally, they stepped on one of their >> independents. >> >> >> >> It is unfortunate that you've been burned in the past, and you and others >> should definitely keep on the lookout for competition whether from Adobe >> or >> other independents. However, the call to arms to have everyone attend a >> webinar did not warrant "red alert" status. Yellow maybe. And based on >> your past, I'm surprised you would place so much weight on what you would >> hear in a webinar or in any public statement by Adobe. This is a fast >> moving marketplace and Adobe can change its mind right after talking to >> you. You'll always have to read the tea leaves and be ready to change >> course yourself. >> >> >> >> Finally, this forum is not an Adobe forum. There are non-Adobe moderators. >> As far as I'm concerned, you can get on your soapbox anytime you want, but >> if you want to reach a wide audience, fire and brimstone may not be the >> best >> approach. If you just want to vent, please warn us up front. And when you >> get on your soapbox, sometimes you just have a clever comeback line or >> just >> ignore the hecklers, including me. Yelling back at them is a waste of your >> energy. Take the high road, choose your technologies, remain nimble and >> good luck to you. >> >> >> >> -Alex >> >> >> >> From: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On >> Behalf Of Robert Thompson >> Sent: Friday, August 29, 2008 3:50 PM >> To: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com >> Cc: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com >> Subject: Re: [flexcoders] OpenLaszlo.org supports Flex, Silverlight, AJAX, >> soon Quicktime, and also DHTML and W3C >> >> >> >> If you would just read your own comments you'd realize I'm posting >> objectively and angering just the few of you. >> >> I'm thankful to the posters the other day who said, essentially, if you're >> not interested don't read it. >> >> If your thankful to get some
RE: [flexcoders] OpenLaszlo.org supports Flex, Silverlight, AJAX, soon Quicktime, and also DHTML and W3C
Didn't take much time at all. Wrote it while running unit tests. Please start a new thread about a scheduling framework and what is missing. I doubt I will have time to do anything, but maybe someone else in the community can. From: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Vivian Richard Sent: Friday, August 29, 2008 8:14 PM To: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [flexcoders] OpenLaszlo.org supports Flex, Silverlight, AJAX, soon Quicktime, and also DHTML and W3C Wow Alex you definitely did spent a lot of time to write this email. Your time is really precious for the whole user group. I am sure you could come up with another excellent flex example if you would code during this time!!! :-) Alex please develop a good example of flex schedule framework. It is been a while that "flex schedule framework" came out and there are no good examples out there. Now we are looking at you to show us the way. Please give us time and develop ALEXIAN example of "flex schedule frame work". It is not a rude demand but a humble request. Cheers On Fri, Aug 29, 2008 at 7:39 PM, Alex Harui <[EMAIL PROTECTED]<mailto:aharui%40adobe.com>> wrote: > Matt Chotin is away this week and has moved from development to product > management and therefore must now choose his words carefully. I'm still in > development so maybe I can get away with more. > > > > Robert, I don't think we've met, and I haven't gone back to see your past > history with Flex, but I would like to ask you to think twice about the way > you are trying to get your message across before hitting send. Sending high > priority messages, and maybe not having all of your facts straight, > discredits your message and invites others to get mad or poke fun or both. > I believe your message is that Adobe also sells solutions via Scene7 and > Adobe Consulting and could purposefully or accidentally end up competing > with independents like yourself, and that there are alternatives to Flex > such as OpenLaszlo and Silverlight and Quicktime. That part of your message > is not really debatable. I've worked for Lotus and IBM in my past and they > also both sold development tools and had solutions teams and there is a fine > line they have to walk. Occasionally, they stepped on one of their > independents. > > > > It is unfortunate that you've been burned in the past, and you and others > should definitely keep on the lookout for competition whether from Adobe or > other independents. However, the call to arms to have everyone attend a > webinar did not warrant "red alert" status. Yellow maybe. And based on > your past, I'm surprised you would place so much weight on what you would > hear in a webinar or in any public statement by Adobe. This is a fast > moving marketplace and Adobe can change its mind right after talking to > you. You'll always have to read the tea leaves and be ready to change > course yourself. > > > > Finally, this forum is not an Adobe forum. There are non-Adobe moderators. > As far as I'm concerned, you can get on your soapbox anytime you want, but > if you want to reach a wide audience, fire and brimstone may not be the best > approach. If you just want to vent, please warn us up front. And when you > get on your soapbox, sometimes you just have a clever comeback line or just > ignore the hecklers, including me. Yelling back at them is a waste of your > energy. Take the high road, choose your technologies, remain nimble and > good luck to you. > > > > -Alex > > > > From: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com<mailto:flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com> > [mailto:flexcoders@yahoogroups.com<mailto:flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com>] On > Behalf Of Robert Thompson > Sent: Friday, August 29, 2008 3:50 PM > To: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com<mailto:flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com> > Cc: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com<mailto:flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com> > Subject: Re: [flexcoders] OpenLaszlo.org supports Flex, Silverlight, AJAX, > soon Quicktime, and also DHTML and W3C > > > > If you would just read your own comments you'd realize I'm posting > objectively and angering just the few of you. > > I'm thankful to the posters the other day who said, essentially, if you're > not interested don't read it. > > If your thankful to get some information to get to the root of the matter, > look into it. > > I spent $1,777 on FLEX 3.0 with ILOG Elixr, and a lot more on Master Suite. > > So don't tell me I don't have the right to question the money I've spent and > the time invested, and cut my losses, and simply make others aware that > there is a "War of the RIAs going on" and if
Re: [flexcoders] OpenLaszlo.org supports Flex, Silverlight, AJAX, soon Quicktime, and also DHTML and W3C
Wow Alex you definitely did spent a lot of time to write this email. Your time is really precious for the whole user group. I am sure you could come up with another excellent flex example if you would code during this time!!! :-) Alex please develop a good example of flex schedule framework. It is been a while that "flex schedule framework" came out and there are no good examples out there. Now we are looking at you to show us the way. Please give us time and develop ALEXIAN example of "flex schedule frame work". It is not a rude demand but a humble request. Cheers On Fri, Aug 29, 2008 at 7:39 PM, Alex Harui <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Matt Chotin is away this week and has moved from development to product > management and therefore must now choose his words carefully. I'm still in > development so maybe I can get away with more. > > > > Robert, I don't think we've met, and I haven't gone back to see your past > history with Flex, but I would like to ask you to think twice about the way > you are trying to get your message across before hitting send. Sending high > priority messages, and maybe not having all of your facts straight, > discredits your message and invites others to get mad or poke fun or both. > I believe your message is that Adobe also sells solutions via Scene7 and > Adobe Consulting and could purposefully or accidentally end up competing > with independents like yourself, and that there are alternatives to Flex > such as OpenLaszlo and Silverlight and Quicktime. That part of your message > is not really debatable. I've worked for Lotus and IBM in my past and they > also both sold development tools and had solutions teams and there is a fine > line they have to walk. Occasionally, they stepped on one of their > independents. > > > > It is unfortunate that you've been burned in the past, and you and others > should definitely keep on the lookout for competition whether from Adobe or > other independents. However, the call to arms to have everyone attend a > webinar did not warrant "red alert" status. Yellow maybe. And based on > your past, I'm surprised you would place so much weight on what you would > hear in a webinar or in any public statement by Adobe. This is a fast > moving marketplace and Adobe can change its mind right after talking to > you. You'll always have to read the tea leaves and be ready to change > course yourself. > > > > Finally, this forum is not an Adobe forum. There are non-Adobe moderators. > As far as I'm concerned, you can get on your soapbox anytime you want, but > if you want to reach a wide audience, fire and brimstone may not be the best > approach. If you just want to vent, please warn us up front. And when you > get on your soapbox, sometimes you just have a clever comeback line or just > ignore the hecklers, including me. Yelling back at them is a waste of your > energy. Take the high road, choose your technologies, remain nimble and > good luck to you. > > > > -Alex > > > > From: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On > Behalf Of Robert Thompson > Sent: Friday, August 29, 2008 3:50 PM > To: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com > Cc: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [flexcoders] OpenLaszlo.org supports Flex, Silverlight, AJAX, > soon Quicktime, and also DHTML and W3C > > > > If you would just read your own comments you'd realize I'm posting > objectively and angering just the few of you. > > I'm thankful to the posters the other day who said, essentially, if you're > not interested don't read it. > > If your thankful to get some information to get to the root of the matter, > look into it. > > I spent $1,777 on FLEX 3.0 with ILOG Elixr, and a lot more on Master Suite. > > So don't tell me I don't have the right to question the money I've spent and > the time invested, and cut my losses, and simply make others aware that > there is a "War of the RIAs going on" and if you care to look into it, > here's an article on it, > > http://counternotions.com/2007/11/15/apple-runtime-answer-2/ > > I have asked questions about coding. But I'm also looking for the stability > of the platform. I pushed very hard from someone to step up and create an > OpenGL framework, and although I'm sure there are others, I was one of them, > rooting for Adobe, and Macromedia developers like Matt Chotin and a few > others appreciated it. > > Most of these responses are just anger letting outit's the nature of the > game when posting a controversial warning about the coding your doing and > it
RE: [flexcoders] OpenLaszlo.org supports Flex, Silverlight, AJAX, soon Quicktime, and also DHTML and W3C
Matt Chotin is away this week and has moved from development to product management and therefore must now choose his words carefully. I'm still in development so maybe I can get away with more. Robert, I don't think we've met, and I haven't gone back to see your past history with Flex, but I would like to ask you to think twice about the way you are trying to get your message across before hitting send. Sending high priority messages, and maybe not having all of your facts straight, discredits your message and invites others to get mad or poke fun or both. I believe your message is that Adobe also sells solutions via Scene7 and Adobe Consulting and could purposefully or accidentally end up competing with independents like yourself, and that there are alternatives to Flex such as OpenLaszlo and Silverlight and Quicktime. That part of your message is not really debatable. I've worked for Lotus and IBM in my past and they also both sold development tools and had solutions teams and there is a fine line they have to walk. Occasionally, they stepped on one of their independents. It is unfortunate that you've been burned in the past, and you and others should definitely keep on the lookout for competition whether from Adobe or other independents. However, the call to arms to have everyone attend a webinar did not warrant "red alert" status. Yellow maybe. And based on your past, I'm surprised you would place so much weight on what you would hear in a webinar or in any public statement by Adobe. This is a fast moving marketplace and Adobe can change its mind right after talking to you. You'll always have to read the tea leaves and be ready to change course yourself. Finally, this forum is not an Adobe forum. There are non-Adobe moderators. As far as I'm concerned, you can get on your soapbox anytime you want, but if you want to reach a wide audience, fire and brimstone may not be the best approach. If you just want to vent, please warn us up front. And when you get on your soapbox, sometimes you just have a clever comeback line or just ignore the hecklers, including me. Yelling back at them is a waste of your energy. Take the high road, choose your technologies, remain nimble and good luck to you. -Alex From: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Robert Thompson Sent: Friday, August 29, 2008 3:50 PM To: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com Cc: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [flexcoders] OpenLaszlo.org supports Flex, Silverlight, AJAX, soon Quicktime, and also DHTML and W3C If you would just read your own comments you'd realize I'm posting objectively and angering just the few of you. I'm thankful to the posters the other day who said, essentially, if you're not interested don't read it. If your thankful to get some information to get to the root of the matter, look into it. I spent $1,777 on FLEX 3.0 with ILOG Elixr, and a lot more on Master Suite. So don't tell me I don't have the right to question the money I've spent and the time invested, and cut my losses, and simply make others aware that there is a "War of the RIAs going on" and if you care to look into it, here's an article on it, http://counternotions.com/2007/11/15/apple-runtime-answer-2/ I have asked questions about coding. But I'm also looking for the stability of the platform. I pushed very hard from someone to step up and create an OpenGL framework, and although I'm sure there are others, I was one of them, rooting for Adobe, and Macromedia developers like Matt Chotin and a few others appreciated it. Most of these responses are just anger letting outit's the nature of the game when posting a controversial warning about the coding your doing and it's value 2 years from now when nearly everything can be done (I estimate 80% of what is commonly done in eCommerce, will be done using Scene7.com, not a FLEX developer earning a living). Fyi, I made no claim that OpenLaszlo.org is a new effort, it's in version 4, but what is happening in version 4i is newer. Throw the chip on your shoulder at someone else; I'm trying to warn some of those out there that may blindly make the same mistakes I made in my 20's by blindly trusting Microsoft and believing being chosen for an event to showcase my product was a good thing, an endorsement. It wasn't. It was a precursor for a patent. Try to take the emotions out of this with the words like "Crap" and such. -r On Friday, August 29, 2008, at 03:01PM, "Michael Schmalle" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]<mailto:teoti.graphix%40gmail.com>> wrote: >Doug, > >I take your hand and walk through fiery hell in hopes the Mr. Person might >be exorcised. > >Mike > >On Fri, Aug 29, 2008 at 5:59 PM, Doug McCune <[EMAIL >
Re: [flexcoders] OpenLaszlo.org supports Flex, Silverlight, AJAX, soon Quicktime, and also DHTML and W3C
Robert I supported your initial posting on this issue, but I also said you'd need to keep it concise and not overstay your welcome. Unfortunately, your posts are getting longer and even less focussed and factual. If you have facts we should be aware of, state them clearly and concisely. If you don't, don't post. Long-winded and vague posts full of arm-waving are not going to win the argument for you, but will piss people off. This list is also not for promoting other technologies. If you find something else you like, post a link for those interested and leave it at that. Any more than that will (quite rightly) be seen as spamming, trolling, or both. Guy On 30/08/2008, at 9:20 AM, Robert Thompson wrote: Stop making personal comments, okay. Stop painting me black...it IS about options. You'll find out if you take the blinders off. Just leave it alone and stop making it personal. On Aug 29, 2008, at 7:17 PM, Paul Andrews wrote: - Original Message - From: "Robert Thompson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: Cc: Sent: Friday, August 29, 2008 11:41 PM Subject: Re: [flexcoders] OpenLaszlo.org supports Flex, Silverlight, AJAX, soon Quicktime, and also DHTML and W3C > I've ready half a dozen articles on OpenLaszlo.org and I like it. > > It's another option. > > -r For goodness sake, this is flexcoders not 'the other options' list. We all know you're not happy with Adobe. Let it be, we can work things out for ourselves. Enjoy OpenLaszlo - go and tell them they've got it right and forget flexcoders.
Re: [flexcoders] OpenLaszlo.org supports Flex, Silverlight, AJAX, soon Quicktime, and also DHTML and W3C
Stop making personal comments, okay. Stop painting me black...it IS about options. You'll find out if you take the blinders off. Just leave it alone and stop making it personal. On Aug 29, 2008, at 7:17 PM, Paul Andrews wrote: - Original Message - From: "Robert Thompson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: Cc: Sent: Friday, August 29, 2008 11:41 PM Subject: Re: [flexcoders] OpenLaszlo.org supports Flex, Silverlight, AJAX, soon Quicktime, and also DHTML and W3C > I've ready half a dozen articles on OpenLaszlo.org and I like it. > > It's another option. > > -r For goodness sake, this is flexcoders not 'the other options' list. We all know you're not happy with Adobe. Let it be, we can work things out for ourselves. Enjoy OpenLaszlo - go and tell them they've got it right and forget flexcoders.
Re: [flexcoders] OpenLaszlo.org supports Flex, Silverlight, AJAX, soon Quicktime, and also DHTML and W3C
- Original Message - From: "Robert Thompson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: Cc: Sent: Friday, August 29, 2008 11:41 PM Subject: Re: [flexcoders] OpenLaszlo.org supports Flex, Silverlight, AJAX, soon Quicktime, and also DHTML and W3C > I've ready half a dozen articles on OpenLaszlo.org and I like it. > > It's another option. > > -r For goodness sake, this is flexcoders not 'the other options' list. We all know you're not happy with Adobe. Let it be, we can work things out for ourselves. Enjoy OpenLaszlo - go and tell them they've got it right and forget flexcoders.
Re: [flexcoders] OpenLaszlo.org supports Flex, Silverlight, AJAX, soon Quicktime, and also DHTML and W3C
If you would just read your own comments you'd realize I'm posting objectively and angering just the few of you. I'm thankful to the posters the other day who said, essentially, if you're not interested don't read it. If your thankful to get some information to get to the root of the matter, look into it. I spent $1,777 on FLEX 3.0 with ILOG Elixr, and a lot more on Master Suite. So don't tell me I don't have the right to question the money I've spent and the time invested, and cut my losses, and simply make others aware that there is a "War of the RIAs going on" and if you care to look into it, here's an article on it, http://counternotions.com/2007/11/15/apple-runtime-answer-2/ I have asked questions about coding. But I'm also looking for the stability of the platform. I pushed very hard from someone to step up and create an OpenGL framework, and although I'm sure there are others, I was one of them, rooting for Adobe, and Macromedia developers like Matt Chotin and a few others appreciated it. Most of these responses are just anger letting outit's the nature of the game when posting a controversial warning about the coding your doing and it's value 2 years from now when nearly everything can be done (I estimate 80% of what is commonly done in eCommerce, will be done using Scene7.com, not a FLEX developer earning a living). Fyi, I made no claim that OpenLaszlo.org is a new effort, it's in version 4, but what is happening in version 4i is newer. Throw the chip on your shoulder at someone else; I'm trying to warn some of those out there that may blindly make the same mistakes I made in my 20's by blindly trusting Microsoft and believing being chosen for an event to showcase my product was a good thing, an endorsement. It wasn't. It was a precursor for a patent. Try to take the emotions out of this with the words like "Crap" and such. -r On Friday, August 29, 2008, at 03:01PM, "Michael Schmalle" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >Doug, > >I take your hand and walk through fiery hell in hopes the Mr. Person might >be exorcised. > >Mike > >On Fri, Aug 29, 2008 at 5:59 PM, Doug McCune <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >> God forgive me, for I have sinned. I am responding to a thread I know >> I absolutely should not have replied to. Sorry for encouraging the >> ranting, I just couldn't not reply when this amazing email came into >> my inbox. Robert, I'll address each paragraph one at a time and tell >> you exactly why this message, as well as the ones you have been >> sending in the last day or so, are in fact complete spam and worthy of >> the comments you have received. >> >> >> On Fri, Aug 29, 2008 at 2:33 PM, Robert Thompson <[EMAIL >> PROTECTED]> >> wrote: >> > >> > OpenLaszlo.org supports Flex, Flash, Silverlight, AJAX, soon Quicktime >> >> Simply incorrect. OpenLaszlo has been around for years and has always >> targeted both the Flash runtime and AJAX. That's what it does and >> that's what it has always done. You write an app and you can target >> Flash or DHTML. There it no support for Silverlight, there is no >> "support" for Flex (what woudl that even mean?), I don't know what you >> are suggesting when you claim they "support" Quicktime but that >> doesn't even make sense. If you are going to make wild claims please >> back them up with references so we can verify. I also want to point >> out that this sentence and only one other short sentence later in this >> message (also completely factually incorrect) are the only two parts >> of this email that have anything at all to do with the subject of this >> thread. >> >> > First of all to the gentlemen suggesting I'm slamming the list. I am not >> and I take offense at that. Don't accuse me when I am responding to someone >> else. I posted only 2 original posts and they were in the best interest of >> the [flexcoders] community, some agreed, some did not. Do not accuse me of >> spamming unless you are from Adobe and moderating this list. >> >> This has nothing to do with the topic you posted. If you have a gripe >> about someone's reply then reply to that. By creating a new thread and >> filling it with completely unrelated paragraphs like this you are in >> fact spamming the list. >> >> > Second of all, I've been continuing to research this, and have a simple >> answer to the "Runtime Wars" that are very real and goign on and are a part >> of the acquisition of Scene7 which DIRECTLY RELATES TO FLEXCODERS. Don't >> question, Mr. Person who accuses me of spamming, my motives when I'm trying >> to get to the bottom of this. >> >> Completely unrelated to the subject you posted. >> >> > Thirdly, OpenLazlo.org has also scene the shifting going on in the >> industry between Silverlight and Flex/Swf, Quicktime SDK, and others and has >> begun and open source solution. So there you have it. Do not accuse me and >> get aggressive without doing your own research. >> >> Again, OpenLazlo has been around for years, I assume most peop
Re: [flexcoders] OpenLaszlo.org supports Flex, Silverlight, AJAX, soon Quicktime, and also DHTML and W3C
I've ready half a dozen articles on OpenLaszlo.org and I like it. It's another option. -r On Friday, August 29, 2008, at 02:59PM, "Doug McCune" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >God forgive me, for I have sinned. I am responding to a thread I know >I absolutely should not have replied to. Sorry for encouraging the >ranting, I just couldn't not reply when this amazing email came into >my inbox. Robert, I'll address each paragraph one at a time and tell >you exactly why this message, as well as the ones you have been >sending in the last day or so, are in fact complete spam and worthy of >the comments you have received. > >On Fri, Aug 29, 2008 at 2:33 PM, Robert Thompson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> >> OpenLaszlo.org supports Flex, Flash, Silverlight, AJAX, soon Quicktime > >Simply incorrect. OpenLaszlo has been around for years and has always >targeted both the Flash runtime and AJAX. That's what it does and >that's what it has always done. You write an app and you can target >Flash or DHTML. There it no support for Silverlight, there is no >"support" for Flex (what woudl that even mean?), I don't know what you >are suggesting when you claim they "support" Quicktime but that >doesn't even make sense. If you are going to make wild claims please >back them up with references so we can verify. I also want to point >out that this sentence and only one other short sentence later in this >message (also completely factually incorrect) are the only two parts >of this email that have anything at all to do with the subject of this >thread. > >> First of all to the gentlemen suggesting I'm slamming the list. I am not and >> I take offense at that. Don't accuse me when I am responding to someone >> else. I posted only 2 original posts and they were in the best interest of >> the [flexcoders] community, some agreed, some did not. Do not accuse me of >> spamming unless you are from Adobe and moderating this list. > >This has nothing to do with the topic you posted. If you have a gripe >about someone's reply then reply to that. By creating a new thread and >filling it with completely unrelated paragraphs like this you are in >fact spamming the list. > >> Second of all, I've been continuing to research this, and have a simple >> answer to the "Runtime Wars" that are very real and goign on and are a part >> of the acquisition of Scene7 which DIRECTLY RELATES TO FLEXCODERS. Don't >> question, Mr. Person who accuses me of spamming, my motives when I'm trying >> to get to the bottom of this. > >Completely unrelated to the subject you posted. > >> Thirdly, OpenLazlo.org has also scene the shifting going on in the industry >> between Silverlight and Flex/Swf, Quicktime SDK, and others and has begun >> and open source solution. So there you have it. Do not accuse me and get >> aggressive without doing your own research. > >Again, OpenLazlo has been around for years, I assume most people on >this list know about it. And even if not this post does not provide >any new information whatsoever, and instead only provides misleading >and factual incorrect information. > >> I'm in this to better our investments in time and money (for those who care >> about it). If you continue to defame me with an accusation of Spamming you >> better back it up with an Original Posting by me that is off topic. I am not >> Spamming, and if you feel I have, show me, and If it's true I will stop it. >> But I intend to get to the bottom of this legally or otherwise. > >Fine, cheers, have fun. But this post does not have any information >regarding the topic you posted, so please keep the personal monologues >under wraps unless you are talking about something. You want an >original posting that is off-topic? THIS ONE. > >> EVERYONE BE AN INDIVIDUAL: Don't let anyone sucker you into thinking for >> you. Do your own research and look to OpenLaszlo.org which appears to be a >> noble effort recognizing the struggles going on in Adobe with the >> resignation of the CEO last Fall. > >Again, OpenLazlo is not new. It has nothing to do with the Adobe CEO >at all. Do your own research before spamming with incorrect >information please. > >> [flexcoders] should be aware that they have multiple options and One blasted >> person trying to tape my mouth shut by claiming I'm spamming had better be >> from Adobe and not just another developer trying to cut-down free speech >> that IS ON TOPIC WITH THE FUTURE of our Investment in Time and Money. Do any >> of us want to waste 4 years only to find out it was for not? > >I don't think anyone is denying there are multiple options, we're just >saying that you going off on long rants without any information of >substance is getting annoying. > >> If you claim I'm spamming the list by providing a URL, my URL earlier posted >> was so I could present the research I'm doing w/o posting to this group and >> offending people like you who just get in the way. > >No, we're claiming you're spamming the list by messag
Re: [flexcoders] OpenLaszlo.org supports Flex, Silverlight, AJAX, soon Quicktime, and also DHTML and W3C
Doug, I take your hand and walk through fiery hell in hopes the Mr. Person might be exorcised. Mike On Fri, Aug 29, 2008 at 5:59 PM, Doug McCune <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > God forgive me, for I have sinned. I am responding to a thread I know > I absolutely should not have replied to. Sorry for encouraging the > ranting, I just couldn't not reply when this amazing email came into > my inbox. Robert, I'll address each paragraph one at a time and tell > you exactly why this message, as well as the ones you have been > sending in the last day or so, are in fact complete spam and worthy of > the comments you have received. > > > On Fri, Aug 29, 2008 at 2:33 PM, Robert Thompson <[EMAIL > PROTECTED]> > wrote: > > > > OpenLaszlo.org supports Flex, Flash, Silverlight, AJAX, soon Quicktime > > Simply incorrect. OpenLaszlo has been around for years and has always > targeted both the Flash runtime and AJAX. That's what it does and > that's what it has always done. You write an app and you can target > Flash or DHTML. There it no support for Silverlight, there is no > "support" for Flex (what woudl that even mean?), I don't know what you > are suggesting when you claim they "support" Quicktime but that > doesn't even make sense. If you are going to make wild claims please > back them up with references so we can verify. I also want to point > out that this sentence and only one other short sentence later in this > message (also completely factually incorrect) are the only two parts > of this email that have anything at all to do with the subject of this > thread. > > > First of all to the gentlemen suggesting I'm slamming the list. I am not > and I take offense at that. Don't accuse me when I am responding to someone > else. I posted only 2 original posts and they were in the best interest of > the [flexcoders] community, some agreed, some did not. Do not accuse me of > spamming unless you are from Adobe and moderating this list. > > This has nothing to do with the topic you posted. If you have a gripe > about someone's reply then reply to that. By creating a new thread and > filling it with completely unrelated paragraphs like this you are in > fact spamming the list. > > > Second of all, I've been continuing to research this, and have a simple > answer to the "Runtime Wars" that are very real and goign on and are a part > of the acquisition of Scene7 which DIRECTLY RELATES TO FLEXCODERS. Don't > question, Mr. Person who accuses me of spamming, my motives when I'm trying > to get to the bottom of this. > > Completely unrelated to the subject you posted. > > > Thirdly, OpenLazlo.org has also scene the shifting going on in the > industry between Silverlight and Flex/Swf, Quicktime SDK, and others and has > begun and open source solution. So there you have it. Do not accuse me and > get aggressive without doing your own research. > > Again, OpenLazlo has been around for years, I assume most people on > this list know about it. And even if not this post does not provide > any new information whatsoever, and instead only provides misleading > and factual incorrect information. > > > I'm in this to better our investments in time and money (for those who > care about it). If you continue to defame me with an accusation of Spamming > you better back it up with an Original Posting by me that is off topic. I am > not Spamming, and if you feel I have, show me, and If it's true I will stop > it. But I intend to get to the bottom of this legally or otherwise. > > Fine, cheers, have fun. But this post does not have any information > regarding the topic you posted, so please keep the personal monologues > under wraps unless you are talking about something. You want an > original posting that is off-topic? THIS ONE. > > > EVERYONE BE AN INDIVIDUAL: Don't let anyone sucker you into thinking for > you. Do your own research and look to OpenLaszlo.org which appears to be a > noble effort recognizing the struggles going on in Adobe with the > resignation of the CEO last Fall. > > Again, OpenLazlo is not new. It has nothing to do with the Adobe CEO > at all. Do your own research before spamming with incorrect > information please. > > > [flexcoders] should be aware that they have multiple options and One > blasted person trying to tape my mouth shut by claiming I'm spamming had > better be from Adobe and not just another developer trying to cut-down free > speech that IS ON TOPIC WITH THE FUTURE of our Investment in Time and Money. > Do any of us want to waste 4 years only to find out it was for not? > > I don't think anyone is denying there are multiple options, we're just > saying that you going off on long rants without any information of > substance is getting annoying. > > > If you claim I'm spamming the list by providing a URL, my URL earlier > posted was so I could present the research I'm doing w/o posting to this > group and offending people like you who just get in the way. > > No, we're claiming you're spamming the list
Re: [flexcoders] OpenLaszlo.org supports Flex, Silverlight, AJAX, soon Quicktime, and also DHTML and W3C
God forgive me, for I have sinned. I am responding to a thread I know I absolutely should not have replied to. Sorry for encouraging the ranting, I just couldn't not reply when this amazing email came into my inbox. Robert, I'll address each paragraph one at a time and tell you exactly why this message, as well as the ones you have been sending in the last day or so, are in fact complete spam and worthy of the comments you have received. On Fri, Aug 29, 2008 at 2:33 PM, Robert Thompson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > OpenLaszlo.org supports Flex, Flash, Silverlight, AJAX, soon Quicktime Simply incorrect. OpenLaszlo has been around for years and has always targeted both the Flash runtime and AJAX. That's what it does and that's what it has always done. You write an app and you can target Flash or DHTML. There it no support for Silverlight, there is no "support" for Flex (what woudl that even mean?), I don't know what you are suggesting when you claim they "support" Quicktime but that doesn't even make sense. If you are going to make wild claims please back them up with references so we can verify. I also want to point out that this sentence and only one other short sentence later in this message (also completely factually incorrect) are the only two parts of this email that have anything at all to do with the subject of this thread. > First of all to the gentlemen suggesting I'm slamming the list. I am not and > I take offense at that. Don't accuse me when I am responding to someone else. > I posted only 2 original posts and they were in the best interest of the > [flexcoders] community, some agreed, some did not. Do not accuse me of > spamming unless you are from Adobe and moderating this list. This has nothing to do with the topic you posted. If you have a gripe about someone's reply then reply to that. By creating a new thread and filling it with completely unrelated paragraphs like this you are in fact spamming the list. > Second of all, I've been continuing to research this, and have a simple > answer to the "Runtime Wars" that are very real and goign on and are a part > of the acquisition of Scene7 which DIRECTLY RELATES TO FLEXCODERS. Don't > question, Mr. Person who accuses me of spamming, my motives when I'm trying > to get to the bottom of this. Completely unrelated to the subject you posted. > Thirdly, OpenLazlo.org has also scene the shifting going on in the industry > between Silverlight and Flex/Swf, Quicktime SDK, and others and has begun and > open source solution. So there you have it. Do not accuse me and get > aggressive without doing your own research. Again, OpenLazlo has been around for years, I assume most people on this list know about it. And even if not this post does not provide any new information whatsoever, and instead only provides misleading and factual incorrect information. > I'm in this to better our investments in time and money (for those who care > about it). If you continue to defame me with an accusation of Spamming you > better back it up with an Original Posting by me that is off topic. I am not > Spamming, and if you feel I have, show me, and If it's true I will stop it. > But I intend to get to the bottom of this legally or otherwise. Fine, cheers, have fun. But this post does not have any information regarding the topic you posted, so please keep the personal monologues under wraps unless you are talking about something. You want an original posting that is off-topic? THIS ONE. > EVERYONE BE AN INDIVIDUAL: Don't let anyone sucker you into thinking for you. > Do your own research and look to OpenLaszlo.org which appears to be a noble > effort recognizing the struggles going on in Adobe with the resignation of > the CEO last Fall. Again, OpenLazlo is not new. It has nothing to do with the Adobe CEO at all. Do your own research before spamming with incorrect information please. > [flexcoders] should be aware that they have multiple options and One blasted > person trying to tape my mouth shut by claiming I'm spamming had better be > from Adobe and not just another developer trying to cut-down free speech that > IS ON TOPIC WITH THE FUTURE of our Investment in Time and Money. Do any of us > want to waste 4 years only to find out it was for not? I don't think anyone is denying there are multiple options, we're just saying that you going off on long rants without any information of substance is getting annoying. > If you claim I'm spamming the list by providing a URL, my URL earlier posted > was so I could present the research I'm doing w/o posting to this group and > offending people like you who just get in the way. No, we're claiming you're spamming the list by messages exactly like these. > I like the earlier posting of the individual lady who said, let it live, or > feed it. The comments thereafter were uneeded and more contrary to the > policies of polite procedure of this group than trying to inform. others. > I've been
Re: [flexcoders] OpenLaszlo.org supports Flex, Silverlight, AJAX, soon Quicktime, and also DHTML and W3C
Ok, Since one of the people you are talking to me, let this be straight. I have seen you 2 years ago on this list spreading propaganda just like you are doing right now. Propaganda... you are now dousing everybody with YOUR crap, that is what propaganda is. This list is for flex development. I agree with whoever said start your own blog, get it aggregated and you will have plenty of people giving you what you want, attention. Another question, do you ever read what you have written before you send it? Your structure in language is read from my eyes as paranoid. A tell in paranoid witting is how many parenthesis the writer uses. I would say your use of them ranks pretty high. I think anybody that cares about this list and it's integrity definitely do not want more people spewing like you have done this week. Mike On Fri, Aug 29, 2008 at 5:33 PM, Robert Thompson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>wrote: > > OpenLaszlo.org supports Flex, Flash, Silverlight, AJAX, soon Quicktime > > First of all to the gentlemen suggesting I'm slamming the list. I am not > and I take offense at that. Don't accuse me when I am responding to someone > else. I posted only 2 original posts and they were in the best interest of > the [flexcoders] community, some agreed, some did not. Do not accuse me of > spamming unless you are from Adobe and moderating this list. > > Second of all, I've been continuing to research this, and have a simple > answer to the "Runtime Wars" that are very real and goign on and are a part > of the acquisition of Scene7 which DIRECTLY RELATES TO FLEXCODERS. Don't > question, Mr. Person who accuses me of spamming, my motives when I'm trying > to get to the bottom of this. > > Thirdly, OpenLazlo.org has also scene the shifting going on in the industry > between Silverlight and Flex/Swf, Quicktime SDK, and others and has begun > and open source solution. So there you have it. Do not accuse me and get > aggressive without doing your own research. > > I'm in this to better our investments in time and money (for those who care > about it). If you continue to defame me with an accusation of Spamming you > better back it up with an Original Posting by me that is off topic. I am not > Spamming, and if you feel I have, show me, and If it's true I will stop it. > But I intend to get to the bottom of this legally or otherwise. > > EVERYONE BE AN INDIVIDUAL: Don't let anyone sucker you into thinking for > you. Do your own research and look to OpenLaszlo.org which appears to be a > noble effort recognizing the struggles going on in Adobe with the > resignation of the CEO last Fall. > > [flexcoders] should be aware that they have multiple options and One > blasted person trying to tape my mouth shut by claiming I'm spamming had > better be from Adobe and not just another developer trying to cut-down free > speech that IS ON TOPIC WITH THE FUTURE of our Investment in Time and Money. > Do any of us want to waste 4 years only to find out it was for not? > > If you claim I'm spamming the list by providing a URL, my URL earlier > posted was so I could present the research I'm doing w/o posting to this > group and offending people like you who just get in the way. > > I like the earlier posting of the individual lady who said, let it live, or > feed it. The comments thereafter were uneeded and more contrary to the > policies of polite procedure of this group than trying to inform. others. > I've been there, I've been screwed by a large company who did a very similar > thing that is happening now; so if you don't want to listen, skip the > posting and stop accusing me. > > -r > > -- Teoti Graphix, LLC http://www.teotigraphix.com Teoti Graphix Blog http://www.blog.teotigraphix.com You can find more by solving the problem then by 'asking the question'.
[flexcoders] OpenLaszlo.org supports Flex, Silverlight, AJAX, soon Quicktime, and also DHTML and W3C
OpenLaszlo.org supports Flex, Flash, Silverlight, AJAX, soon Quicktime First of all to the gentlemen suggesting I'm slamming the list. I am not and I take offense at that. Don't accuse me when I am responding to someone else. I posted only 2 original posts and they were in the best interest of the [flexcoders] community, some agreed, some did not. Do not accuse me of spamming unless you are from Adobe and moderating this list. Second of all, I've been continuing to research this, and have a simple answer to the "Runtime Wars" that are very real and goign on and are a part of the acquisition of Scene7 which DIRECTLY RELATES TO FLEXCODERS. Don't question, Mr. Person who accuses me of spamming, my motives when I'm trying to get to the bottom of this. Thirdly, OpenLazlo.org has also scene the shifting going on in the industry between Silverlight and Flex/Swf, Quicktime SDK, and others and has begun and open source solution. So there you have it. Do not accuse me and get aggressive without doing your own research. I'm in this to better our investments in time and money (for those who care about it). If you continue to defame me with an accusation of Spamming you better back it up with an Original Posting by me that is off topic. I am not Spamming, and if you feel I have, show me, and If it's true I will stop it. But I intend to get to the bottom of this legally or otherwise. EVERYONE BE AN INDIVIDUAL: Don't let anyone sucker you into thinking for you. Do your own research and look to OpenLaszlo.org which appears to be a noble effort recognizing the struggles going on in Adobe with the resignation of the CEO last Fall. [flexcoders] should be aware that they have multiple options and One blasted person trying to tape my mouth shut by claiming I'm spamming had better be from Adobe and not just another developer trying to cut-down free speech that IS ON TOPIC WITH THE FUTURE of our Investment in Time and Money. Do any of us want to waste 4 years only to find out it was for not? If you claim I'm spamming the list by providing a URL, my URL earlier posted was so I could present the research I'm doing w/o posting to this group and offending people like you who just get in the way. I like the earlier posting of the individual lady who said, let it live, or feed it. The comments thereafter were uneeded and more contrary to the policies of polite procedure of this group than trying to inform. others. I've been there, I've been screwed by a large company who did a very similar thing that is happening now; so if you don't want to listen, skip the posting and stop accusing me. -r