RE: helper object? what's that? (was Re: [flexcoders] To code-behind or not to code-behind?)
Dear to the heart, indeed! A recent lane-split passed 5 cars recently on I66 has me revisiting the pattern in this lane-splitting-illegal state of VA. Luckily the whole experience was one of braking, because I'd have only had ~30hp to put to the road if acceleration was involved : ) "So of course, I wanted something equipped to drive across arctic tundra. It just makes me feel better." Good times, good times! From: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Roger GonzalezSent: Thursday, November 03, 2005 1:20 PMTo: flexcoders@yahoogroups.comSubject: RE: helper object? what's that? (was Re: [flexcoders] To code-behind or not to code-behind?) OK, we're analysing this to a level it was never meant to be analysed at. This often seems to happen, though. I find design patterns to beincredibly useful for attaching names to common code constructs (bothfor describing how something was implemented or how it could/should beimplemented) but I find them unhelpful whenever they're wedged into acontext where the potential user of the pattern hasn't previously workedon the problem and personally experienced the pain of coding themselvesinto a corner. They get locked up in a terror that they aren'tfollowing the pattern to the letter, and freak out when the patternisn't a 100% match for what they're trying to do. I once saw some codethat had a class factory that produced class factories, for no reasonother than they didn't dare put two factory methods on the same object,because the pattern didn't say that was ok.To bring it back to an area near and dear to my heart, its likeexplaining lanesplitting techniques to a motorcyclist who lives in arural area with no traffic. Sure, there are lots of best practices andpotential gotchas and what-to-do-when, but they're only interesting froma theoretical perspective if you're never in that situation. However,they'll make a lot more sense -after- a cell-phone-babbling soccer momin a Maibatsu Monstrosity suddenly realizes she needs to exit soon andcuts you off, forcing you to threshold brake, release, swerve a fulllanes-width in front of a bus to the next gap between lanes, and thenaccelerate so hard you pull a small wheelie off a rain-slicked Bott'sDot while still leaned over, three cylinders of bottled impatiencehowling as you feed 120hp to the ground via a sticky rubber contactpatch the size of a deck of cards[1] (Ah, Lanesplitting Pattern #4, on-and off-ramps are like tributaries in the traffic stream, they causeturbulence...)-rg[1] Part of my employment agreement is that I must checkpoint my codeinto source control a bit more frequently than my sane coworkers. -- Flexcoders Mailing List FAQ: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/files/flexcodersFAQ.txt Search Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com SPONSORED LINKS Web site design development Software design and development Macromedia flex Software development best practice YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "flexcoders" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
RE: helper object? what's that? (was Re: [flexcoders] To code-behind or not to code-behind?)
Douglas, Got me thinking thoughin OOP terms just what is a helper object? I don't recall seeing these in say Java, or maybe they have a different name. View Helper was one of the Core J2EE Patterns, that would most usually have been implemented as a custom-tag in JSP. It's nothing magical, just a pattern to be aware you can refactor towards. Sometimes patterns make the simple sound magical. But the View Helper ain't that. It's simple. Steven -- Steven Webster Practice Director (Rich Internet Applications) Macromedia Consulting EMEA Office: + 44 (0) 131 338 6108 Mobile: +44 (0) 7917 428 947 Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- Get Bzzzy! (real tools to help you find a job). Welcome to the Sweet Life. http://us.click.yahoo.com/A77XvD/vlQLAA/TtwFAA/nhFolB/TM ~- -- Flexcoders Mailing List FAQ: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/files/flexcodersFAQ.txt Search Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: helper object? what's that? (was Re: [flexcoders] To code-behind or not to code-behind?)
Yeah, I understand the ViewHelper. The more generic 'helper object' though I have not heard of. So, View Helper is a helper obejct. So, say I have a Front Controller object that needs some 'help', would I apply a Front Controller Helper object? Obvioulsy this depends on the problem to solve, abstractly though is this idea sound? I'm no master of patterns, but sounds like the view helper may come from a larger parent pattern called Helper or something. Does UK English really use ain't? lol! DK On 11/3/05, Steven Webster [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Douglas, Got me thinking thoughin OOP terms just what is a helper object? I don't recall seeing these in say Java, or maybe they have a different name. View Helper was one of the Core J2EE Patterns, that would most usually have been implemented as a custom-tag in JSP. It's nothing magical, just a pattern to be aware you can refactor towards. Sometimes patterns make the simple sound magical. But the View Helper ain't that. It's simple. Steven -- Steven Webster Practice Director (Rich Internet Applications) Macromedia Consulting EMEA Office: + 44 (0) 131 338 6108 Mobile: +44 (0) 7917 428 947 -- Flexcoders Mailing List FAQ: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/files/flexcodersFAQ.txt Search Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com Yahoo! Groups Links -- Douglas Knudsen http://www.cubicleman.com this is my signature, like it? Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- Get Bzzzy! (real tools to help you find a job). Welcome to the Sweet Life. http://us.click.yahoo.com/A77XvD/vlQLAA/TtwFAA/nhFolB/TM ~- -- Flexcoders Mailing List FAQ: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/files/flexcodersFAQ.txt Search Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
RE: helper object? what's that? (was Re: [flexcoders] To code-behind or not to code-behind?)
See my previous reply for a concrete example. I just meant an extra object that encapsulates a well defined piece of functionality, aggregated into your application. I wasn't alluding to any particular GoF-blessed pattern, but if you really need to get pedantic, the application is probably best described as using the bridge pattern. Helpers can be anything from flyweights to factories. I personally consider it bad mojo to have the application's implementation details exposed, so I abstract out pieces of functionality through interfaces, build helper classes that implement those interfaces, and only pass the interfaces around. This is a bit of leftover habit from keeping gigantic C++ apps from turning into dependency hairballs. An additional benefit is that you can then move those reusable bits off into RSLs, decoupling development. If you only change implementation code but keep the interface constant, you don't need to recompile clients of the interface. This sort of development has some small development overhead in extra interfaces and whatnot, but pays off as your code scales. -rg -Original Message- From: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Douglas Knudsen Sent: Thursday, November 03, 2005 8:13 AM To: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: helper object? what's that? (was Re: [flexcoders] To code-behind or not to code-behind?) Yeah, I understand the ViewHelper. The more generic 'helper object' though I have not heard of. So, View Helper is a helper obejct. So, say I have a Front Controller object that needs some 'help', would I apply a Front Controller Helper object? Obvioulsy this depends on the problem to solve, abstractly though is this idea sound? I'm no master of patterns, but sounds like the view helper may come from a larger parent pattern called Helper or something. Does UK English really use ain't? lol! DK On 11/3/05, Steven Webster [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Douglas, Got me thinking thoughin OOP terms just what is a helper object? I don't recall seeing these in say Java, or maybe they have a different name. View Helper was one of the Core J2EE Patterns, that would most usually have been implemented as a custom-tag in JSP. It's nothing magical, just a pattern to be aware you can refactor towards. Sometimes patterns make the simple sound magical. But the View Helper ain't that. It's simple. Steven -- Steven Webster Practice Director (Rich Internet Applications) Macromedia Consulting EMEA Office: + 44 (0) 131 338 6108 Mobile: +44 (0) 7917 428 947 -- Flexcoders Mailing List FAQ: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/files/flexcodersFAQ.txt Search Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com Yahoo! Groups Links -- Douglas Knudsen http://www.cubicleman.com this is my signature, like it? Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- Get Bzzzy! (real tools to help you find a job). Welcome to the Sweet Life. http://us.click.yahoo.com/A77XvD/vlQLAA/TtwFAA/nhFolB/TM -- --~- -- Flexcoders Mailing List FAQ: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/files/flexcodersFAQ.txt Search Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com Yahoo! Groups Links Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- Get Bzzzy! (real tools to help you find a job). Welcome to the Sweet Life. http://us.click.yahoo.com/A77XvD/vlQLAA/TtwFAA/nhFolB/TM ~- -- Flexcoders Mailing List FAQ: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/files/flexcodersFAQ.txt Search Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: helper object? what's that? (was Re: [flexcoders] To code-behind or not to code-behind?)
Just so I can get some context, it seems the Yahoo! Maps API follows this route; the majority of the controls all follow the 5 main interfaces. Is that an example of a real-world usage scenario using what you describe below in a Flex context? - Original Message - From: Roger Gonzalez [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, November 03, 2005 12:03 PM Subject: RE: helper object? what's that? (was Re: [flexcoders] To code-behind or not to code-behind?) See my previous reply for a concrete example. I just meant an extra object that encapsulates a well defined piece of functionality, aggregated into your application. I wasn't alluding to any particular GoF-blessed pattern, but if you really need to get pedantic, the application is probably best described as using the bridge pattern. Helpers can be anything from flyweights to factories. I personally consider it bad mojo to have the application's implementation details exposed, so I abstract out pieces of functionality through interfaces, build helper classes that implement those interfaces, and only pass the interfaces around. This is a bit of leftover habit from keeping gigantic C++ apps from turning into dependency hairballs. An additional benefit is that you can then move those reusable bits off into RSLs, decoupling development. If you only change implementation code but keep the interface constant, you don't need to recompile clients of the interface. This sort of development has some small development overhead in extra interfaces and whatnot, but pays off as your code scales. -rg -Original Message- From: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Douglas Knudsen Sent: Thursday, November 03, 2005 8:13 AM To: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: helper object? what's that? (was Re: [flexcoders] To code-behind or not to code-behind?) Yeah, I understand the ViewHelper. The more generic 'helper object' though I have not heard of. So, View Helper is a helper obejct. So, say I have a Front Controller object that needs some 'help', would I apply a Front Controller Helper object? Obvioulsy this depends on the problem to solve, abstractly though is this idea sound? I'm no master of patterns, but sounds like the view helper may come from a larger parent pattern called Helper or something. Does UK English really use ain't? lol! DK On 11/3/05, Steven Webster [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Douglas, Got me thinking thoughin OOP terms just what is a helper object? I don't recall seeing these in say Java, or maybe they have a different name. View Helper was one of the Core J2EE Patterns, that would most usually have been implemented as a custom-tag in JSP. It's nothing magical, just a pattern to be aware you can refactor towards. Sometimes patterns make the simple sound magical. But the View Helper ain't that. It's simple. Steven -- Steven Webster Practice Director (Rich Internet Applications) Macromedia Consulting EMEA Office: + 44 (0) 131 338 6108 Mobile: +44 (0) 7917 428 947 -- Flexcoders Mailing List FAQ: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/files/flexcodersFAQ.txt Search Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com Yahoo! Groups Links -- Douglas Knudsen http://www.cubicleman.com this is my signature, like it? Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- Get Bzzzy! (real tools to help you find a job). Welcome to the Sweet Life. http://us.click.yahoo.com/A77XvD/vlQLAA/TtwFAA/nhFolB/TM -- --~- -- Flexcoders Mailing List FAQ: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/files/flexcodersFAQ.txt Search Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com Yahoo! Groups Links -- Flexcoders Mailing List FAQ: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/files/flexcodersFAQ.txt Search Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com Yahoo! Groups Links Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- Get Bzzzy! (real tools to help you find a job). Welcome to the Sweet Life. http://us.click.yahoo.com/A77XvD/vlQLAA/TtwFAA/nhFolB/TM ~- -- Flexcoders Mailing List FAQ: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/files/flexcodersFAQ.txt Search Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
RE: helper object? what's that? (was Re: [flexcoders] To code-behind or not to code-behind?)
OK, we're analysing this to a level it was never meant to be analysed at. The ViewHelper is a name borrowed from the Core J2EE Pattern catalogue. As far as I'm aware, it's just a name, it's not a more generic or specific form of another pattern, it's just an observation that sometimes it makes sense to take functionality out of a big thing, and stick it in a smaller thing. If you abstract functionality out of a Front Controller and stick it in a class that you think helps it; give it a name that makes sense ? There are no pattern gods that will strike you down for not calling it a Front Controller Helper. Code communicates intent. So whatever you intend, communicate it. Steven -- Steven Webster Practice Director (Rich Internet Applications) Macromedia Consulting EMEA Office: + 44 (0) 131 338 6108 Mobile: +44 (0) 7917 428 947 -Original Message- From: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Douglas Knudsen Sent: 03 November 2005 16:13 To: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: helper object? what's that? (was Re: [flexcoders] To code-behind or not to code-behind?) Yeah, I understand the ViewHelper. The more generic 'helper object' though I have not heard of. So, View Helper is a helper obejct. So, say I have a Front Controller object that needs some 'help', would I apply a Front Controller Helper object? Obvioulsy this depends on the problem to solve, abstractly though is this idea sound? I'm no master of patterns, but sounds like the view helper may come from a larger parent pattern called Helper or something. Does UK English really use ain't? lol! DK On 11/3/05, Steven Webster [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Douglas, Got me thinking thoughin OOP terms just what is a helper object? I don't recall seeing these in say Java, or maybe they have a different name. View Helper was one of the Core J2EE Patterns, that would most usually have been implemented as a custom-tag in JSP. It's nothing magical, just a pattern to be aware you can refactor towards. Sometimes patterns make the simple sound magical. But the View Helper ain't that. It's simple. Steven -- Steven Webster Practice Director (Rich Internet Applications) Macromedia Consulting EMEA Office: + 44 (0) 131 338 6108 Mobile: +44 (0) 7917 428 947 -- Flexcoders Mailing List FAQ: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/files/flexcodersFAQ.txt Search Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com Yahoo! Groups Links -- Douglas Knudsen http://www.cubicleman.com this is my signature, like it? Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- Get Bzzzy! (real tools to help you find a job). Welcome to the Sweet Life. http://us.click.yahoo.com/A77XvD/vlQLAA/TtwFAA/nhFolB/TM -- --~- -- Flexcoders Mailing List FAQ: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/files/flexcodersFAQ.txt Search Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com Yahoo! Groups Links Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- Get Bzzzy! (real tools to help you find a job). Welcome to the Sweet Life. http://us.click.yahoo.com/A77XvD/vlQLAA/TtwFAA/nhFolB/TM ~- -- Flexcoders Mailing List FAQ: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/files/flexcodersFAQ.txt Search Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
RE: helper object? what's that? (was Re: [flexcoders] To code-behind or not to code-
Dave,
If all you have is a hammer, everything looks like a nail.
Too much of anything is a bad thing, and people who just blindly and
unobjectively turn everything into a pattern, focus so much on
shoehorning a solution, they don't stop to think what the problem is
they're trying to solve in the first place.
However, with the appropriate and prerequisite knowledge that was behind
the design pattern movement, they are a useful abstraction for software
engineers to apply to address complexity (not introduce it) and increase
code clarity (not obfuscate it) in a team environment.
Blame the player, don't blame the game.
Steven
--
Steven Webster
Practice Director (Rich Internet Applications)
Macromedia Consulting EMEA
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Office: + 44 (0) 131 338 6108
Mobile: +44 (0) 7917 428 947
-Original Message-
From: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Dave Wolf
Sent: 03 November 2005 17:48
To: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com
Subject: helper object? what's that? (was Re: [flexcoders] To
code-behind or not to code-
I actually don't think there are pattern gods. There are
just pattern devils. Maybe they are gremlins? They like to
creep into simple problems and make them big and confusing.
ducking back into my dark closet/
--
Dave Wolf
Cynergy Systems, Inc.
Macromedia Flex Alliance Partner
http://www.cynergysystems.com
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Office: 866-CYNERGY
--- In flexcoders@yahoogroups.com, Steven Webster
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
OK, we're analysing this to a level it was never meant to
be analysed
at.
The ViewHelper is a name borrowed from the Core J2EE
Pattern catalogue.
As far as I'm aware, it's just a name, it's not a more generic or
specific form of another pattern, it's just an observation that
sometimes it makes sense to take functionality out of a big
thing, and
stick it in a smaller thing.
If you abstract functionality out of a Front Controller and
stick it
in a class that you think helps it; give it a name that
makes sense ?
There are no pattern gods that will strike you down for not
calling it
a Front Controller Helper.
Code communicates intent. So whatever you intend, communicate it.
Steven
--
Steven Webster
Practice Director (Rich Internet Applications) Macromedia
Consulting
EMEA
Office: + 44 (0) 131 338 6108
Mobile: +44 (0) 7917 428 947
-Original Message-
From: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Douglas Knudsen
Sent: 03 November 2005 16:13
To: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: helper object? what's that? (was Re:
[flexcoders] To code-behind or not to code-behind?)
Yeah, I understand the ViewHelper. The more generic
'helper object'
though I have not heard of. So, View Helper is a helper obejct.
So, say I have a Front Controller object that needs some 'help',
would I apply a Front Controller Helper object?
Obvioulsy this depends on the problem to solve,
abstractly though is
this idea sound? I'm no master of patterns, but sounds like the
view helper may come from a larger parent pattern called
Helper or
something.
Does UK English really use ain't? lol!
DK
On 11/3/05, Steven Webster [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Douglas,
Got me thinking thoughin OOP terms just what is a
helper object?
I don't recall seeing these in say Java, or maybe
they have a
different name.
View Helper was one of the Core J2EE Patterns, that would
most usually
have been implemented as a custom-tag in JSP.
It's nothing magical, just a pattern to be aware you
can refactor
towards. Sometimes patterns make the simple sound magical.
But the
View Helper ain't that. It's simple.
Steven
--
Steven Webster
Practice Director (Rich Internet Applications) Macromedia
Consulting
EMEA
Office: + 44 (0) 131 338 6108
Mobile: +44 (0) 7917 428 947
--
Flexcoders Mailing List
FAQ:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/files/flexcodersFAQ.txt
Search Archives:
http://www.mail-archive.com/flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com
Yahoo! Groups Links
--
Douglas Knudsen
http://www.cubicleman.com
this is my signature, like it?
Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
~-- Get Bzzzy! (real tools to help
you find a
job). Welcome to the Sweet Life.
http://us.click.yahoo.com/A77XvD/vlQLAA/TtwFAA/nhFolB/TM
--
--~-
--
Flexcoders Mailing List
FAQ:
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Search Archives:
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Yahoo! Groups Links
RE: helper object? what's that? (was Re: [flexcoders] To code-behind or not to code-behind?)
OK, we're analysing this to a level it was never meant to be analysed at. This often seems to happen, though. I find design patterns to be incredibly useful for attaching names to common code constructs (both for describing how something was implemented or how it could/should be implemented) but I find them unhelpful whenever they're wedged into a context where the potential user of the pattern hasn't previously worked on the problem and personally experienced the pain of coding themselves into a corner. They get locked up in a terror that they aren't following the pattern to the letter, and freak out when the pattern isn't a 100% match for what they're trying to do. I once saw some code that had a class factory that produced class factories, for no reason other than they didn't dare put two factory methods on the same object, because the pattern didn't say that was ok. To bring it back to an area near and dear to my heart, its like explaining lanesplitting techniques to a motorcyclist who lives in a rural area with no traffic. Sure, there are lots of best practices and potential gotchas and what-to-do-when, but they're only interesting from a theoretical perspective if you're never in that situation. However, they'll make a lot more sense -after- a cell-phone-babbling soccer mom in a Maibatsu Monstrosity suddenly realizes she needs to exit soon and cuts you off, forcing you to threshold brake, release, swerve a full lanes-width in front of a bus to the next gap between lanes, and then accelerate so hard you pull a small wheelie off a rain-slicked Bott's Dot while still leaned over, three cylinders of bottled impatience howling as you feed 120hp to the ground via a sticky rubber contact patch the size of a deck of cards[1] (Ah, Lanesplitting Pattern #4, on- and off-ramps are like tributaries in the traffic stream, they cause turbulence...) -rg [1] Part of my employment agreement is that I must checkpoint my code into source control a bit more frequently than my sane coworkers. Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- Get Bzzzy! (real tools to help you find a job). Welcome to the Sweet Life. http://us.click.yahoo.com/A77XvD/vlQLAA/TtwFAA/nhFolB/TM ~- -- Flexcoders Mailing List FAQ: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/files/flexcodersFAQ.txt Search Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: helper object? what's that? (was Re: [flexcoders] To code-behind or not to code-behind?)
Anyone else break into a cold sweat reading that last part? Whew... that was nice, John Woo style! - Original Message - From: Roger Gonzalez [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, November 03, 2005 1:20 PM Subject: RE: helper object? what's that? (was Re: [flexcoders] To code-behind or not to code-behind?) OK, we're analysing this to a level it was never meant to be analysed at. This often seems to happen, though. I find design patterns to be incredibly useful for attaching names to common code constructs (both for describing how something was implemented or how it could/should be implemented) but I find them unhelpful whenever they're wedged into a context where the potential user of the pattern hasn't previously worked on the problem and personally experienced the pain of coding themselves into a corner. They get locked up in a terror that they aren't following the pattern to the letter, and freak out when the pattern isn't a 100% match for what they're trying to do. I once saw some code that had a class factory that produced class factories, for no reason other than they didn't dare put two factory methods on the same object, because the pattern didn't say that was ok. To bring it back to an area near and dear to my heart, its like explaining lanesplitting techniques to a motorcyclist who lives in a rural area with no traffic. Sure, there are lots of best practices and potential gotchas and what-to-do-when, but they're only interesting from a theoretical perspective if you're never in that situation. However, they'll make a lot more sense -after- a cell-phone-babbling soccer mom in a Maibatsu Monstrosity suddenly realizes she needs to exit soon and cuts you off, forcing you to threshold brake, release, swerve a full lanes-width in front of a bus to the next gap between lanes, and then accelerate so hard you pull a small wheelie off a rain-slicked Bott's Dot while still leaned over, three cylinders of bottled impatience howling as you feed 120hp to the ground via a sticky rubber contact patch the size of a deck of cards[1] (Ah, Lanesplitting Pattern #4, on- and off-ramps are like tributaries in the traffic stream, they cause turbulence...) -rg [1] Part of my employment agreement is that I must checkpoint my code into source control a bit more frequently than my sane coworkers. -- Flexcoders Mailing List FAQ: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/files/flexcodersFAQ.txt Search Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com Yahoo! Groups Links Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- Get Bzzzy! (real tools to help you find a job). Welcome to the Sweet Life. http://us.click.yahoo.com/A77XvD/vlQLAA/TtwFAA/nhFolB/TM ~- -- Flexcoders Mailing List FAQ: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/files/flexcodersFAQ.txt Search Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: helper object? what's that? (was Re: [flexcoders] To code-behind or not to code-behind?)
yeah right! I even ran to the kawasaki web site just to peek...neat little flash there. Ok, sorry for sounding all pedantic, was just curious is all. I'm certainly far from the pattern spouting zealot. The ideas do make me miss college/academia though :( DK On 11/3/05, JesterXL [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Anyone else break into a cold sweat reading that last part? Whew... that was nice, John Woo style! - Original Message - From: Roger Gonzalez [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, November 03, 2005 1:20 PM Subject: RE: helper object? what's that? (was Re: [flexcoders] To code-behind or not to code-behind?) OK, we're analysing this to a level it was never meant to be analysed at. This often seems to happen, though. I find design patterns to be incredibly useful for attaching names to common code constructs (both for describing how something was implemented or how it could/should be implemented) but I find them unhelpful whenever they're wedged into a context where the potential user of the pattern hasn't previously worked on the problem and personally experienced the pain of coding themselves into a corner. They get locked up in a terror that they aren't following the pattern to the letter, and freak out when the pattern isn't a 100% match for what they're trying to do. I once saw some code that had a class factory that produced class factories, for no reason other than they didn't dare put two factory methods on the same object, because the pattern didn't say that was ok. To bring it back to an area near and dear to my heart, its like explaining lanesplitting techniques to a motorcyclist who lives in a rural area with no traffic. Sure, there are lots of best practices and potential gotchas and what-to-do-when, but they're only interesting from a theoretical perspective if you're never in that situation. However, they'll make a lot more sense -after- a cell-phone-babbling soccer mom in a Maibatsu Monstrosity suddenly realizes she needs to exit soon and cuts you off, forcing you to threshold brake, release, swerve a full lanes-width in front of a bus to the next gap between lanes, and then accelerate so hard you pull a small wheelie off a rain-slicked Bott's Dot while still leaned over, three cylinders of bottled impatience howling as you feed 120hp to the ground via a sticky rubber contact patch the size of a deck of cards[1] (Ah, Lanesplitting Pattern #4, on- and off-ramps are like tributaries in the traffic stream, they cause turbulence...) -rg [1] Part of my employment agreement is that I must checkpoint my code into source control a bit more frequently than my sane coworkers. -- Flexcoders Mailing List FAQ: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/files/flexcodersFAQ.txt Search Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com Yahoo! Groups Links -- Flexcoders Mailing List FAQ: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/files/flexcodersFAQ.txt Search Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com Yahoo! Groups Links -- Douglas Knudsen http://www.cubicleman.com this is my signature, like it? Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- Fair play? Video games influencing politics. Click and talk back! http://us.click.yahoo.com/T8sf5C/tzNLAA/TtwFAA/nhFolB/TM ~- -- Flexcoders Mailing List FAQ: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/files/flexcodersFAQ.txt Search Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: helper object? what's that? (was Re: [flexcoders] To code-behind or not to code-behind?)
ps no offense about comparing you to my ex-girlfriend's mother lol ;-) i'm sure you're not a crazy feminist lesbian On 11/4/05, Julian Suggate [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Damn that wasgood! Perhaps we should start calling you Speedy Gonzalez :-) You sound like my ex-girlfriend's mother. She was totally sick on a bike. Used to get off the back of her wheels with legs like spaghetti and a head full of thunderous ear-splitting panic. Took me right back. Mate that used to wake me up in the mornings that's for sure. Cheers, Jules On 11/4/05, Roger Gonzalez [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: OK, we're analysing this to a level it was never meant to be analysed at.This often seems to happen, though.I find design patterns to be incredibly useful for attaching names to common code constructs (bothfor describing how something was implemented or how it could/should beimplemented) but I find them unhelpful whenever they're wedged into a context where the potential user of the pattern hasn't previously workedon the problem and personally experienced the pain of coding themselvesinto a corner.They get locked up in a terror that they aren'tfollowing the pattern to the letter, and freak out when the pattern isn't a 100% match for what they're trying to do.I once saw some codethat had a class factory that produced class factories, for no reasonother than they didn't dare put two factory methods on the same object, because the pattern didn't say that was ok.To bring it back to an area near and dear to my heart, its likeexplaining lanesplitting techniques to a motorcyclist who lives in arural area with no traffic.Sure, there are lots of best practices and potential gotchas and what-to-do-when, but they're only interesting froma theoretical perspective if you're never in that situation.However,they'll make a lot more sense -after- a cell-phone-babbling soccer mom in a Maibatsu Monstrosity suddenly realizes she needs to exit soon andcuts you off, forcing you to threshold brake, release, swerve a fulllanes-width in front of a bus to the next gap between lanes, and then accelerate so hard you pull a small wheelie off a rain-slicked Bott'sDot while still leaned over, three cylinders of bottled impatiencehowling as you feed 120hp to the ground via a sticky rubber contactpatch the size of a deck of cards[1](Ah, Lanesplitting Pattern #4, on- and off-ramps are like tributaries in the traffic stream, they causeturbulence...)-rg[1] Part of my employment agreement is that I must checkpoint my codeinto source control a bit more frequently than my sane coworkers. Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~--Get Bzzzy! (real tools to help you find a job). Welcome to the Sweet Life. http://us.click.yahoo.com/A77XvD/vlQLAA/TtwFAA/nhFolB/TM~---Flexcoders Mailing ListFAQ: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/files/flexcodersFAQ.txtSearch Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexcoders%40yahoogroups.comYahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/* To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED]* Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ -- Flexcoders Mailing List FAQ: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/files/flexcodersFAQ.txt Search Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "flexcoders" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
Re: helper object? what's that? (was Re: [flexcoders] To code-behind or not to code-behind?)
Damn that wasgood! Perhaps we should start calling you Speedy Gonzalez :-) You sound like my ex-girlfriend's mother. She was totally sick on a bike. Used to get off the back of her wheels with legs like spaghetti and a head full of thunderous ear-splitting panic. Took me right back. Mate that used to wake me up in the mornings that's for sure. Cheers, Jules On 11/4/05, Roger Gonzalez [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: OK, we're analysing this to a level it was never meant to be analysed at.This often seems to happen, though.I find design patterns to be incredibly useful for attaching names to common code constructs (bothfor describing how something was implemented or how it could/should beimplemented) but I find them unhelpful whenever they're wedged into a context where the potential user of the pattern hasn't previously workedon the problem and personally experienced the pain of coding themselvesinto a corner.They get locked up in a terror that they aren'tfollowing the pattern to the letter, and freak out when the pattern isn't a 100% match for what they're trying to do.I once saw some codethat had a class factory that produced class factories, for no reasonother than they didn't dare put two factory methods on the same object, because the pattern didn't say that was ok.To bring it back to an area near and dear to my heart, its likeexplaining lanesplitting techniques to a motorcyclist who lives in arural area with no traffic.Sure, there are lots of best practices and potential gotchas and what-to-do-when, but they're only interesting froma theoretical perspective if you're never in that situation.However,they'll make a lot more sense -after- a cell-phone-babbling soccer mom in a Maibatsu Monstrosity suddenly realizes she needs to exit soon andcuts you off, forcing you to threshold brake, release, swerve a fulllanes-width in front of a bus to the next gap between lanes, and then accelerate so hard you pull a small wheelie off a rain-slicked Bott'sDot while still leaned over, three cylinders of bottled impatiencehowling as you feed 120hp to the ground via a sticky rubber contactpatch the size of a deck of cards[1](Ah, Lanesplitting Pattern #4, on- and off-ramps are like tributaries in the traffic stream, they causeturbulence...)-rg[1] Part of my employment agreement is that I must checkpoint my codeinto source control a bit more frequently than my sane coworkers. Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~--Get Bzzzy! (real tools to help you find a job). Welcome to the Sweet Life. http://us.click.yahoo.com/A77XvD/vlQLAA/TtwFAA/nhFolB/TM~---Flexcoders Mailing ListFAQ: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/files/flexcodersFAQ.txtSearch Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexcoders%40yahoogroups.comYahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/* To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED]* Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ -- Flexcoders Mailing List FAQ: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/files/flexcodersFAQ.txt Search Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "flexcoders" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
