Re: [Flightgear-devel] Announcement: First TerraGear landcover database
On Thu, 10 Nov 2005 14:11:00 -0600, Curtis wrote in message [EMAIL PROTECTED]: I should also point out that the next scenery build (which is happening concurrent to the v0.9.9 release and causing my head to spin 3x faster than normal (not factoring in beer)) will be based on this data export. ..how much size growth, compared to the (0.9.7?) last scenery? (url to the new?) -- ..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt... ;o) ...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry... Scenarios always come in sets of three: best case, worst case, and just in case. ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@flightgear.org http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel 2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Announcement: First TerraGear landcover database
Arnt Karlsen wrote: On Thu, 10 Nov 2005 14:11:00 -0600, Curtis wrote in message [EMAIL PROTECTED]: I should also point out that the next scenery build (which is happening concurrent to the v0.9.9 release and causing my head to spin 3x faster than normal (not factoring in beer)) will be based on this data export. ..how much size growth, compared to the (0.9.7?) last scenery? (url to the new?) I haven't really started building a lot of tiles yet. I'm still hung up on a shapefile processing issue. Might be shade bigger, but I'm not expecting a huge difference ... Curt. -- Curtis Olsonhttp://www.flightgear.org/~curt HumanFIRST Program http://www.humanfirst.umn.edu/ FlightGear Project http://www.flightgear.org Unique text:2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@flightgear.org http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel 2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Announcement: First TerraGear landcover database
On Sat, 12 Nov 2005 19:48:37 -0600, Curtis wrote in message [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Arnt Karlsen wrote: ..how much size growth, compared to the (0.9.7?) last scenery? (url to the new?) I haven't really started building a lot of tiles yet. I'm still hung up on a shapefile processing issue. Might be shade bigger, but I'm not expecting a huge difference ... ..thanks. :o) -- ..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt... ;o) ...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry... Scenarios always come in sets of three: best case, worst case, and just in case. ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@flightgear.org http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel 2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Announcement: First TerraGear landcover database
Martin Spott wrote: We proudly present the first export from the TerraGear landcover database or however you prefer to name it. [...] You'll find some further information on this page refinement in process: http://web44.netzwerteserver2.de/212.0.html Martin. -- Unix _IS_ user friendly - it's just selective about who its friends are ! -- ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@flightgear.org http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel 2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Announcement: First TerraGear landcover database
Martin Spott wrote: Martin Spott wrote: We proudly present the first export from the TerraGear landcover database or however you prefer to name it. [...] You'll find some further information on this page refinement in process: http://web44.netzwerteserver2.de/212.0.html Martin. I should also point out that the next scenery build (which is happening concurrent to the v0.9.9 release and causing my head to spin 3x faster than normal (not factoring in beer)) will be based on this data export. The editing details are not fully worked out, but the ultimate goal is that end users will be able to refine specific areas (things like city outlines, river routes, roads, etc.) and submit them for inclusion in the next scenery build. Curt. -- Curtis Olsonhttp://www.flightgear.org/~curt HumanFIRST Program http://www.humanfirst.umn.edu/ FlightGear Project http://www.flightgear.org Unique text:2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@flightgear.org http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel 2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Announcement: First TerraGear landcover database export
Ralf Gerlich wrote: Hi, Ampere K. Hardraade schrieb: I think you misunderstood. I was referring to the taxiways under map mode, not satellite mode. If you go in map mode, you will see that Google got some pretty accurate vector data for taxiways generation. Whoop, didn't see that. In that case: Yes, I misunderstood and join your inquiry ;-) The data comes from Navteq. Not really an option for us, as it would be horrendously expensive, then there's this: http://www.google.com/help/terms_local.html Jon ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@flightgear.org http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel 2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Announcement: First TerraGear landcover
Dave Martin wrote: On Saturday 10 September 2005 15:39, Martin Spott wrote: We have to be careful about simply dropping a shapefile into our landcover database. Wenever we add a road, river or some other data to the database we'll have to have a look if the respective object is already represented there. Is it possibly to remove the existing shapefile for a certain area from the landcover DB? Perhaps the UK landcover generated by Jon via openstreetmap.org could be kept seperately until more or less complete and then used to generate UK scenery. Honestly I think OSM will never reach a state where one could declare it as 'complete' - it lies in the nature of such a project that the state of 'completeness' will never occur. Maybe I should give a very small abstract on what the mentioned shapefiles actually represent. We have several 'layers' defined in the database where every layer contains objects which share unique characteristics. This means there is a _single_ layer that contains _all_ medium sized roads (line data) of the whole world (or at least those which are known in the dataset), another layer contains all inland lakes (polygons), a third one contains the location of the known towns (point data) and the GSHHS shorelines do have their very own layer as well. You can select from these layers using SQL commands - this is how QGIS operates on the database when you select data from a certain region in a certain layer. Distribution of all data which is contained in a layer is easily done by exporting the whole layer into a shapefile - which is what I'm doing here. The goal of the whole effort is to have a storage which enables us to merge landcover data from many different sources (and formats), to distribute the result using a standard/unified format and herewith to disburden the TerraGear maintainer(s) from the job of having to deal with different data sources for different locations. With this background it would be pretty unreasonable to drop the whole British island from the database. The way to go is to employ a method which enables us to continuously merge the OSM data into the landcover DB. Cheers, Martin. -- Unix _IS_ user friendly - it's just selective about who its friends are ! -- ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@flightgear.org http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel 2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Announcement: First TerraGear landcover database export
Dave Martin wrote: On Friday 09 September 2005 18:36, Jon Stockill wrote: I've just finished downloading and processing all the data to get my scenery build system back up and running after a disk crash, it's building tiles for a test of the OSM roads at the moment. I'll grab some screenshots when it's done. I look forward to seeing that. Here's a couple of pics, the first is looking west over the gherkin, and the second is looking out over regents park. Generation time was over an hour for that tile on a 1GHz athlon (the resource limits in fgfs-construct needed a significant increase). Memory usage was ok at around 140MB. http://flightgear.stockill.org.uk/scenery/osmroads1.jpg http://flightgear.stockill.org.uk/scenery/osmroads2.jpg It shows up a few limitations in the source data. The road segments are currently all represented seperately and not tied into a road object, this results in lots of short roads, and visible breaks on the outside of corners. This will improve as the open streetmap system matures (it's still very early days). Jon ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@flightgear.org http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel 2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Announcement: First TerraGear landcover database export
Hi, Jon Stockill schrieb: [SNIP] Here's a couple of pics, the first is looking west over the gherkin, and the second is looking out over regents park. Generation time was over an hour for that tile on a 1GHz athlon (the resource limits in fgfs-construct needed a significant increase). Memory usage was ok at around 140MB. http://flightgear.stockill.org.uk/scenery/osmroads1.jpg http://flightgear.stockill.org.uk/scenery/osmroads2.jpg This looks quite detailed. I'm not that familiar with the London area so would you say that there is a considerable amount of smaller streets missing in there? Even with not so much detailed streets - i.e., leaving all the back-streets out and having only freeways and mainstreets processed - the generation of scenery takes substantially longer than for the standard data. I have no numbers on this, but having to raise the resource limits in fgfs-construct considerably is quite a good indication. One other problem that'll probably become more serious with more detailed street-data is that the comparatively small streets not only produce lots of small triangles on the streets themselves but also raise the number of triangles on neighbouring polygons by splitting them. (Currently fgsd crashes on loading some of the more full tiles - possibly because of the sheer number of triangles; I will investigate further on that when I get the time) I currently do not have any solution for that and I know that there have been discussions before, but perhaps having more detailed scenery now may be a good reason for the experts here to reconsider this topic. It shows up a few limitations in the source data. The road segments are currently all represented seperately and not tied into a road object, this results in lots of short roads, and visible breaks on the outside of corners. This will improve as the open streetmap system matures (it's still very early days). This may be solvable by automatically snapping endpoints and recombining shorter segments into longer segments. Anyway recombination will only partially solve the problem, as on an intersection only pairs of participating line-segments can be joined. Perhaps we need a better way of making polygons from lines, much like the v.buffer operation of GRASS (http://grass.itc.it/grass61/manuals/html61_user/v.buffer.html). Regards, Ralf ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@flightgear.org http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel 2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Announcement: First TerraGear landcover database export
Ralf Gerlich wrote: This looks quite detailed. I'm not that familiar with the London area so would you say that there is a considerable amount of smaller streets missing in there? You can see the source data here: http://www.openstreetmap.org/ there are roads missing, simply because the map is not yet complete, nor are they categorised. Once there's some more data, the segments are correctly joined into roads, and the roads are classified then we can be more selective about the roads we include in the scenery. Even with not so much detailed streets - i.e., leaving all the back-streets out and having only freeways and mainstreets processed - the generation of scenery takes substantially longer than for the standard data. I have no numbers on this, but having to raise the resource limits in fgfs-construct considerably is quite a good indication. Yes, the cpu limit was set as 120 seconds - I increased it to an hour and *still* had failures, so it's now set at 4 hours here just to be safe. One other problem that'll probably become more serious with more detailed street-data is that the comparatively small streets not only produce lots of small triangles on the streets themselves but also raise the number of triangles on neighbouring polygons by splitting them. (Currently fgsd crashes on loading some of the more full tiles - possibly because of the sheer number of triangles; I will investigate further on that when I get the time) I've not had that problem yet, but so far the data only covers a relatively small area. I currently do not have any solution for that and I know that there have been discussions before, but perhaps having more detailed scenery now may be a good reason for the experts here to reconsider this topic. We've just been discussing another problem on irc - the green texture isn't really appropriate for a city, but I left out the city areas since the texture it uses contains its own roads. I'm not really sure of a solution to this. This may be solvable by automatically snapping endpoints and recombining shorter segments into longer segments. It will be solved in future versions of the openstreetmap data - at the moment it just exports as lots of short roads with a start and end point, eventually these will be chained together to form longer roads. Anyway recombination will only partially solve the problem, as on an intersection only pairs of participating line-segments can be joined. Perhaps we need a better way of making polygons from lines, much like the v.buffer operation of GRASS (http://grass.itc.it/grass61/manuals/html61_user/v.buffer.html). At the moment I'l just converting the exported openstreetmap data to the tguserdef format, which I suspect is less than ideal. It may be worth having something that will be a bit more intelligent, and resolve some of these problems as it parses the data. Jon ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@flightgear.org http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel 2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Announcement: First TerraGear landcover database export
On Saturday 10 September 2005 10:25, Jon Stockill wrote: Here's a couple of pics, the first is looking west over the gherkin, and the second is looking out over regents park. Generation time was over an hour for that tile on a 1GHz athlon (the resource limits in fgfs-construct needed a significant increase). Memory usage was ok at around 140MB. http://flightgear.stockill.org.uk/scenery/osmroads1.jpg http://flightgear.stockill.org.uk/scenery/osmroads2.jpg It shows up a few limitations in the source data. The road segments are currently all represented seperately and not tied into a road object, this results in lots of short roads, and visible breaks on the outside of corners. This will improve as the open streetmap system matures (it's still very early days). Jon That's really impressive Jon! I have a feeling as we get more road data, we're going to be seeing slight placement errors at the airports. Currently EGBB is placed over the A45 on the 0.9.8 scenery. If I can get that road mapped by GPS and a few others around it, we can probably move the airport to its correct location. ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@flightgear.org http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel 2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Announcement: First TerraGear landcover database export
Dave Martin writes: I have a feeling as we get more road data, we're going to be seeing slight placement errors at the airports. Currently EGBB is placed over the A45 on the 0.9.8 scenery. If I can get that road mapped by GPS and a few others around it, we can probably move the airport to its correct location. EGBB is spot-on in it's placement - the vmap0 road data is far worse. If you map the road with GPS around the airport it will sort the problem there. Cheers - Dave ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@flightgear.org http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel 2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Announcement: First TerraGear landcover database export
On Saturday 10 September 2005 13:19, Dave Martin wrote: I have a feeling as we get more road data, we're going to be seeing slight placement errors at the airports. Currently EGBB is placed over the A45 on the 0.9.8 scenery. If I can get that road mapped by GPS and a few others around it, we can probably move the airport to its correct location. I noticed that a lot of airports in the X-Plane DB are quite far out. Even some major airports like Sion were out by ~ 3 km. What I do find interesting is that the quality of the data seems to change for every country. South Eastern France's data was horrid, so was Switzerland's however Italy's data was almost spot on more than 90% of the time. Maybe someone corrected the data for Italy already or maybe it came from a different source. Also it appears that a lot of the data was pure guess work in a lot of cases. I saw plenty of runways that were more than 20 degrees out, runways that were more than 50% too short, wrong runway id's, wrong surface types, etc. Ever seen a military airport with a single 500m long grass runway that they use for F18's, Mirages, etc? :) Paul ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@flightgear.org http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel 2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Announcement: First TerraGear landcover database export
Paul Surgeon wrote: I noticed that a lot of airports in the X-Plane DB are quite far out. Even some major airports like Sion were out by ~ 3 km. What I do find interesting is that the quality of the data seems to change for every country. South Eastern France's data was horrid, so was Switzerland's however Italy's data was almost spot on more than 90% of the time. Maybe someone corrected the data for Italy already or maybe it came from a different source. Also it appears that a lot of the data was pure guess work in a lot of cases. I saw plenty of runways that were more than 20 degrees out, runways that were more than 50% too short, wrong runway id's, wrong surface types, etc. Ever seen a military airport with a single 500m long grass runway that they use for F18's, Mirages, etc? :) My understanding is that for the USA, the X-Plane data for runways comes primarily from DAFIF. Taxiways are all hand drawn and placed. Outside the USA the runway data is manually generated by anyone who wants to submit new airports, so quality and accuracy is all over the map. Curt. -- Curtis Olsonhttp://www.flightgear.org/~curt HumanFIRST Program http://www.humanfirst.umn.edu/ FlightGear Project http://www.flightgear.org Unique text:2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@flightgear.org http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel 2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Announcement: First TerraGear landcover
Jon Stockill wrote: http://flightgear.stockill.org.uk/scenery/osmroads1.jpg http://flightgear.stockill.org.uk/scenery/osmroads2.jpg Herewith I appoint you to the future maintainer of OSM-data in our kindcover database :-) Do they log the changes in their database, do they offer any 'raw' interface ? This would make it easier for us to track the development of their dataset. Do they differenciate between different sized roads ? To be honest I don't expect importing a bulk of tiny roads into our PostGIS-DB to be our primary goal. They are nice to have for those of us who operate on powerful hardware but the small roads probably won't make it into the default scenery. We should stuff everything into our database that we are able to 'classify' in a reasonable way (small, medium, large, ) and let everyone decide which data (s)he wants to use for his/her scenery. I just read that the current release 0.7 of QGIS is able to render directly into a PostGIS database - this might help a lot. Cheers, Martin. -- Unix _IS_ user friendly - it's just selective about who its friends are ! -- ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@flightgear.org http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel 2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Announcement: First TerraGear landcover
Martin Spott wrote: Herewith I appoint you to the future maintainer of OSM-data in our kindcover database :-) I should have kept my mouth shut :-) Do they log the changes in their database, do they offer any 'raw' interface ? The interface is explained here: http://www.openstreetmap.org/wiki/index.php/REST I used the map command to dump the data, then converted it to the tguserdef format in order to build the scenery, but a shapefile could just as easily be used as the intermediate format. This would make it easier for us to track the development of their dataset. Do they differenciate between different sized roads ? Not yet, although the intention is to have a key/value system which will allow the tagging of road types, names, numbers, etc. So the classifications will be available. Jon ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@flightgear.org http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel 2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Announcement: First TerraGear landcover
Martin Spott wrote: Herewith I appoint you to the future maintainer of OSM-data in our kindcover database :-) 'landcover' I can't tell how this could happen Martin. -- Unix _IS_ user friendly - it's just selective about who its friends are ! -- ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@flightgear.org http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel 2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Announcement: First TerraGear landcover
Jon Stockill wrote: I used the map command to dump the data, then converted it to the tguserdef format in order to build the scenery, but a shapefile could just as easily be used as the intermediate format. We have to be careful about simply dropping a shapefile into our landcover database. Wenever we add a road, river or some other data to the database we'll have to have a look if the respective object is already represented there. For example if you derive a road course from the OSM collection with the intention to add it to the landcover DB the respective road might already be present there - although likely at the wrong location. Now you have to make sure to remove the 'old' road. I expect this process to be fairly easy with a GIS tool that interfaces cleanly with such a GIS database as PostGIS because with such a tool you can identify a _single_ object and remove it from the layer. For other tools that can't interface directly we are building sort of a batch interface: You could create a shapefile for a specific layer and define a bounding box around your data. Now as you are going to drop this data into the landcover DB we have to expect that your shapefile contains _all_ data that belongs to the area inside the bounding box: Not only your addition but also the data that has already been there before - preferrably together with appropriate junctions between old and new data. I know that this method puts us at risk to cut single roads and/or rivers into pieces and I would not reject clever ideas on how to circumvent this risk ;-) The same applies to corrections of the shoreline, city outlines, lakes or whatever you could think of. Cheers, Martin. -- Unix _IS_ user friendly - it's just selective about who its friends are ! -- ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@flightgear.org http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel 2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Announcement: First TerraGear landcover database export
On Saturday 10 September 2005 15:28, Curtis L. Olson wrote: My understanding is that for the USA, the X-Plane data for runways comes primarily from DAFIF. Taxiways are all hand drawn and placed. Outside the USA the runway data is manually generated by anyone who wants to submit new airports, so quality and accuracy is all over the map. Oh! I never knew that. I thought DAFIF was a global database. That explains it then. Hehe ... I like your pun. (accuracy is all over the map) Paul ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@flightgear.org http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel 2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Announcement: First TerraGear landcover database export
On September 10, 2005 09:28 am, Curtis L. Olson wrote: My understanding is that for the USA, the X-Plane data for runways comes primarily from DAFIF. Taxiways are all hand drawn and placed. Outside the USA the runway data is manually generated by anyone who wants to submit new airports, so quality and accuracy is all over the map. Curt. Google has some pretty accurate taxiways for their map. Check out http://pigeond.net/flightgear/fg_server_map.html in map mode. Does anybody where Google got their data from? Ampere ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@flightgear.org http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel 2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Announcement: First TerraGear landcover database export
Hi, Ampere K. Hardraade schrieb: Google has some pretty accurate taxiways for their map. Check out http://pigeond.net/flightgear/fg_server_map.html in map mode. Does anybody where Google got their data from? You can get quite detailed aerial photos for most urban areas in the USA from http://www.terraserver-usa.com David Luff's TaxiDraw has support for automatically loading such photos and showing them in the editor. However, I'm still searching for free detailed aerial photos for other areas of the world such as Germany. Here the government wants you to pay twice for the photos: Once via tax and once when you want to use the photos. The license under which you get those photos here is quite limited as well. Regards, Ralf ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@flightgear.org http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel 2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Announcement: First TerraGear landcover
Ralf Gerlich wrote: However, I'm still searching for free detailed aerial photos for other areas of the world such as Germany. Here the government wants you to pay twice for the photos: Once via tax and once when you want to use the photos. The license under which you get those photos here is quite limited as well. Google maps might be of help in this case as well. The photo is not _that_ accurate but good enough to get the location - EDLN for example: http://maps.google.com/maps?ll=51.230356,6.504496spn=0.042828,0.058627t=h Cheers, Martin. -- Unix _IS_ user friendly - it's just selective about who its friends are ! -- ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@flightgear.org http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel 2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Announcement: First TerraGear landcover database export
On Saturday 10 September 2005 19:03, Ralf Gerlich wrote: However, I'm still searching for free detailed aerial photos for other areas of the world such as Germany. Here the government wants you to pay twice for the photos: Once via tax and once when you want to use the photos. The license under which you get those photos here is quite limited as well. That's a normal practice outside of North America. Don't you just love government surveyors. :-\ Paul ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@flightgear.org http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel 2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Announcement: First TerraGear landcover database export
On September 10, 2005 06:36 am, Jon Stockill wrote: We've just been discussing another problem on irc - the green texture isn't really appropriate for a city, but I left out the city areas since the texture it uses contains its own roads. I'm not really sure of a solution to this. Personally, I think green is fine in the near term. When more models are loaded for a city, the city would not appear to be so green. Ampere ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@flightgear.org http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel 2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Announcement: First TerraGear landcover database export
On September 10, 2005 01:03 pm, Ralf Gerlich wrote: You can get quite detailed aerial photos for most urban areas in the USA from http://www.terraserver-usa.com David Luff's TaxiDraw has support for automatically loading such photos and showing them in the editor. However, I'm still searching for free detailed aerial photos for other areas of the world such as Germany. Here the government wants you to pay twice for the photos: Once via tax and once when you want to use the photos. The license under which you get those photos here is quite limited as well. Regards, Ralf I think you misunderstood. I was referring to the taxiways under map mode, not satellite mode. If you go in map mode, you will see that Google got some pretty accurate vector data for taxiways generation. Ampere ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@flightgear.org http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel 2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Announcement: First TerraGear landcover database export
Hi, Ampere K. Hardraade schrieb: I think you misunderstood. I was referring to the taxiways under map mode, not satellite mode. If you go in map mode, you will see that Google got some pretty accurate vector data for taxiways generation. Whoop, didn't see that. In that case: Yes, I misunderstood and join your inquiry ;-) Ralf ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@flightgear.org http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel 2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Announcement: First TerraGear landcover
On Saturday 10 September 2005 15:39, Martin Spott wrote: We have to be careful about simply dropping a shapefile into our landcover database. Wenever we add a road, river or some other data to the database we'll have to have a look if the respective object is already represented there. Is it possibly to remove the existing shapefile for a certain area from the landcover DB? Perhaps the UK landcover generated by Jon via openstreetmap.org could be kept seperately until more or less complete and then used to generate UK scenery. Interestingly, I did a bit of poking around the openstreetmap documentation and it does actually provide for defining areas such as woodland/built-up/lakes etc. Further to this amateur cartography, it might be interesting to try to start a 'community' of people in the UK who can use a GPS to map their local area - maybe 150 or so 'adventurous' cartographers could get the majority of the UK's road layout done in a year or so (being a small island ;) ) ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@flightgear.org http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel 2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Announcement: First TerraGear landcover database export
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Ampere K. Hardraade schrieb: On September 10, 2005 09:28 am, Curtis L. Olson wrote: My understanding is that for the USA, the X-Plane data for runways comes primarily from DAFIF. Taxiways are all hand drawn and placed. Outside the USA the runway data is manually generated by anyone who wants to submit new airports, so quality and accuracy is all over the map. Curt. Google has some pretty accurate taxiways for their map. Check out http://pigeond.net/flightgear/fg_server_map.html in map mode. Hey, that's a cool application of Google Maps! Does anybody where Google got their data from? Didn't they get the data when they bought keyhole (or so)? (The company Google Earth was original from) CU, Chrisitan -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.0 (MingW32) iD8DBQFDI1CmlhWtxOxWNFcRAj41AJ4x6mLE3/xvlpSVgK5ZqXljetwRgQCdFJyh DTpPHcnPeP24FD5ZaYjRMSQ= =Gecy -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@flightgear.org http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel 2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Announcement: First TerraGear landcover database export
Martin Spott wrote: Good evening, We proudly present the first export from the TerraGear landcover database or however you prefer to name it. The contents is exactly the same as the landcover data that has previously been used for scenery generation - at least this is the intention. Excellent - I'll give it a try. I'm also experimenting with some early data from openstreetmap.org to add accurate roads to scenery. -- Jon Stockill [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@flightgear.org http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel 2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Announcement: First TerraGear landcover
Jon Stockill wrote: Excellent - I'll give it a try. I'm also experimenting with some early data from openstreetmap.org to add accurate roads to scenery. This is a nice idea, I also consider to import the major streets from TIGER. But before we start adding 'sophisticated' data we need to make sure that the machinery, that fills the gap between the PostGIS-DB and the TerraGear work-directories, actually works. Therefore I'm glad that you intend to have a look at it. Cheers, Martin. -- Unix _IS_ user friendly - it's just selective about who its friends are ! -- ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@flightgear.org http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel 2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Announcement: First TerraGear landcover database export
On Friday 09 September 2005 12:47, Jon Stockill wrote: Excellent - I'll give it a try. I'm also experimenting with some early data from openstreetmap.org to add accurate roads to scenery. Don't know why I didn't find openstreetmap.org when I was searching about for 'royalty free' mapping last week. Now that you've mentioned the site I'm all grins. Thanks very much Jon. :) -- Dave Martin museum.bounce-gaming.net ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@flightgear.org http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel 2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Announcement: First TerraGear landcover database export
Dave Martin wrote: Don't know why I didn't find openstreetmap.org when I was searching about for 'royalty free' mapping last week. Now that you've mentioned the site I'm all grins. Thanks very much Jon. :) There's anot a huge amount of data there yet, it's still in the very early stages, but if you own a GPS you could help change that ;-) I've just finished downloading and processing all the data to get my scenery build system back up and running after a disk crash, it's building tiles for a test of the OSM roads at the moment. I'll grab some screenshots when it's done. (The other good news is that now I have a working system again I'll be adding more stuff to the scenery database). -- Jon Stockill [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@flightgear.org http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel 2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Announcement: First TerraGear landcover database export
On Friday 09 September 2005 18:36, Jon Stockill wrote: There's anot a huge amount of data there yet, it's still in the very early stages, but if you own a GPS you could help change that ;-) I think I can get access to a suitable GPS but with fuel prices at £1/litre I think I'm going to be dusting off my bicycle and getting some much-needed exercise ;) I've just finished downloading and processing all the data to get my scenery build system back up and running after a disk crash, it's building tiles for a test of the OSM roads at the moment. I'll grab some screenshots when it's done. I look forward to seeing that. -- Dave Martin http://museum.bounce-gaming.net ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@flightgear.org http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel 2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Announcement: First TerraGear landcover database export
Dave Martin wrote: I think I can get access to a suitable GPS but with fuel prices at £1/litre I think I'm going to be dusting off my bicycle and getting some much-needed exercise ;) Inspired by the charity tube challenge a couple of weeks ago I'm currently considering making use of a day ticket on the local bus and train networks - could be a cheap way to cover a lot of distance, with the added advantage that I get to improve scenery local to me :-) -- Jon Stockill [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@flightgear.org http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel 2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d
[Flightgear-devel] Announcement: First TerraGear landcover database export
Good evening, We proudly present the first export from the TerraGear landcover database or however you prefer to name it. The contents is exactly the same as the landcover data that has previously been used for scenery generation - at least this is the intention. This release serves multiple goals: - It should encourage those people that are familiar with the process of creating FlightGear Scenery to test the process of scenery generation using Ralf Gerlich's shape-decode patch to terragear (http://web44.netzwerteserver2.de/195.0.html) together with the shapefiles presented here; - it should encourage as many people as possible to compare familiar places from the 'usual' scenery with the scenery generated from these shapefiles; - it should pave the way for Ralf's patch into the regular TerraGear source tree. We see these goals as the first step on our way to the incorporation of hand-crafted details into the 'official' scenery. Following steps include the manifestation of a nomenclatura that replaces the current layer names and which meets future demands regarding differentiation. After this is finished we'll allow limited direct access to the database itself and are open to accept submissions. Later on we intend to add the creation of TerraGear work-directories right out of the database which could be distributed via SVN to limit the traffic amount required for updates. The complete set of packed shapefiles is about 439 MByte in size, uncompressed about 1739 MByte: ftp://ftp.ihg.uni-duisburg.de/FlightGear/TGShapes/ Have fun, Martin. -- Unix _IS_ user friendly - it's just selective about who its friends are ! -- ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@flightgear.org http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel 2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d
