Re: [Flightgear-devel] Re : Arresting Type Devices
Am 16.12.11 18:08, schrieb HB-GRAL: Am 16.12.11 11:26, schrieb HB-GRAL: Am 15.12.11 23:13, schrieb Martin Spott: Vivian Meazza wrote: The other one, which used to be non-op, seems to have gained operational capability along the way. You see, in order to avoid confusion, having just one operational arrestor would have been the clever solution. Maybe we need different devices. We're trying to simulate real-world, don't we ? Sure, we're not perfect but I think we're doing our best within the limits of our ressources. Thus, intentionally leaving an inoperational arrestor in place (instead of fixing it) sounds a bit odd Real-world means, there are some non-operational devices around ;-) Hm, just found this one and thought, sometimes it would make sense to engage the BAK-12 for a Cessna too, but thats not real world, is it? THE ACFT VEERED OFF THE RWY DURING TAKEOFF GROUND RUN AND NOSED OVER. THE PLT INIDCATED THAT DURING THE TAKEOFF HIS SEAT SLID REARWARD AND HE WAS UNABLE TO REACH THE THROTTLE OR THE RUDDER PEDALS. But this is not serious of course, Yves! Now the BAKs. Ai, ai, ai. It is more complicated than I thought (as ever, hrmpfl!). I can get some distances, but not all. And the points I provided are for BAK-9 and not BAK-12. And FAA does not have the BAK-12 or other device distances in the table (with some exceptions I will cover later). There are some standards defined (FAA AC 150/5220-9A): http://www.faa.gov/documentLibrary/media/advisory_circular/150-5220-9A/150_5220_9a.pdf (Hey, this is probably also a cool source to improve the model?) And here a link to a article with useful information chez boeing aeromagazine: http://www.boeing.com/commercial/aeromagazine/aero_13/runway_story.html - Here a short video of a mobile device in action http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zoyrDfA90Ac and more about mobiles: http://www.af.mil/shared/media/epubs/AFH10-222V8.pdf - Minimize the impact to commercial airplane operations http://www.boeing.com/commercial/airports/faqs/arrestingsystems.pdf - any other sources around I missed ? - Our model(s) should depend on runway width (maybe three models for 150/200/300' ar sufficient ?). (Another question came up btw. Shouldn’t this device data go into apt.dat runway definition somehow, like stopways and lightning ?. I would vote for that, but I do not see any possibilities unless we provide a own and modified apt.dat or xplane has some plans to improve this small part too, like it is in with stopways i.e.) Now when I look to charts I find visually more data than in FAA tables. But the overrun distances on runways are not reflected, the symbol is placed where it looks nice on a chart. So I need the length of the overrun from somewhere else, then I can calculate the device coordinates on runway. I found some values in FAA airport remarks and in NOTAMs, other values will be estimated, but I tend to take only data published in FAA data nd NOTAMs, and leave the rest. Now for preparing better data for the scenery I can a) take FAA defined base/reci EOR coords, subtracting overrun per runway (disadvantage: the updated FAA coords differ from xplane data someplaces, the runway ends and center may differ, so without change to the runway lines of the fg apt.dat facility the devive can be misplaced) b) take current FlightGear apt.dat center point of runway, calculate ends and subtract overrun where I can find it (disadvantage: when fg apt.dat is updated once with more accurate data the device will be misplaced too). c) Take xplane 8.50 runway data in the hope it is updated with current FAA data. (disadvantage: I always have to check 3 data sources for inconsistency, fg/xplane/FAA) Personally I prefer a), trying to provide also current runway data associated, published by FAA and not by xplane. I am not sure about that, but I think newer xplane data version are updated with FAA data anyway from time to time, and when WE go for an update, the runway AND device data will be correct. I can not estimate how many runways are affected with changes when I choose a), but I guess it is not that much. I would really like when someone starts to improve the model(s), probably think about scenerarios, making the barriers operational in a sophisticated way, cares about materials, cares about lbs, making it interactive (tower/pilot) Cheers, Yves -- Learn Windows Azure Live! Tuesday, Dec 13, 2011 Microsoft is holding a special Learn Windows Azure training event for developers. It will provide a great way to learn Windows Azure and what it provides. You can attend the event by watching it streamed LIVE online. Learn more at http://p.sf.net/sfu/ms-windowsazure ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Re : Arresting Type Devices
On Thu, 2011-12-15 at 23:09 +0100, HB-GRAL wrote: Attached you find the list. There are 55 BAK12 and 23 BAK14 devices, 156 items total, all in the US and found in recent FAA runway data. The coordinates comes from column base/reciprocal ends of runways, published by FAA, assuming myself this is the point where the device is installed ;-) That's probably wrong most of the time. I think the start of the blastpad is more accurate most of the time. Erik -- Learn Windows Azure Live! Tuesday, Dec 13, 2011 Microsoft is holding a special Learn Windows Azure training event for developers. It will provide a great way to learn Windows Azure and what it provides. You can attend the event by watching it streamed LIVE online. Learn more at http://p.sf.net/sfu/ms-windowsazure ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Re : Arresting Type Devices
Am 16.12.11 09:38, schrieb Erik Hofman: That's probably wrong most of the time. I think the start of the blastpad is more accurate most of the time. Erik Oh no! The blastpad is ALWAYS outside the runway. In xplane specs, and also in FAA specs ! Cheers, Yves -- Learn Windows Azure Live! Tuesday, Dec 13, 2011 Microsoft is holding a special Learn Windows Azure training event for developers. It will provide a great way to learn Windows Azure and what it provides. You can attend the event by watching it streamed LIVE online. Learn more at http://p.sf.net/sfu/ms-windowsazure ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Re : Arresting Type Devices
On Fri, 2011-12-16 at 09:42 +0100, HB-GRAL wrote: Am 16.12.11 09:38, schrieb Erik Hofman: That's probably wrong most of the time. I think the start of the blastpad is more accurate most of the time. Oh no! The blastpad is ALWAYS outside the runway. In xplane specs, and also in FAA specs ! Ok, just to make sure. Erik -- Learn Windows Azure Live! Tuesday, Dec 13, 2011 Microsoft is holding a special Learn Windows Azure training event for developers. It will provide a great way to learn Windows Azure and what it provides. You can attend the event by watching it streamed LIVE online. Learn more at http://p.sf.net/sfu/ms-windowsazure ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Re : Arresting Type Devices
Am 15.12.11 23:13, schrieb Martin Spott: Vivian Meazza wrote: The other one, which used to be non-op, seems to have gained operational capability along the way. You see, in order to avoid confusion, having just one operational arrestor would have been the clever solution. We're trying to simulate real-world, don't we ? Sure, we're not perfect but I think we're doing our best within the limits of our ressources. Thus, intentionally leaving an inoperational arrestor in place (instead of fixing it) sounds a bit odd Now, who would like to merge the best of both into one single model - before the feature freeze ? Cheers, Martin. Hi Martin As I understand Vivian’s model takes care about runway textures and is ready out of the box, but not perfect, as many other things in FlightGear. When someone wants to merge in another model or add new models for other device types, great! But this would be a another project. So there is no logical reason for me to put the data improvemment back to the fridge, just because the fridge has become that large from time to time, and just because we have the luxury of two models and a decision have to be made. I will try to take full responsabililty for the data I submitted, and I will check scenery (when someone wants to help here, please report AI traffic hanging in chains) ;-) But anyway, there is no hurry with such a detail like this devices. Was just an idea of a very small improvement and having more FAA data in FlightGear. Do what you want with this data and what is possible at the moment. Cheers, Yves -- Learn Windows Azure Live! Tuesday, Dec 13, 2011 Microsoft is holding a special Learn Windows Azure training event for developers. It will provide a great way to learn Windows Azure and what it provides. You can attend the event by watching it streamed LIVE online. Learn more at http://p.sf.net/sfu/ms-windowsazure ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Re : Arresting Type Devices
Am 16.12.11 11:26, schrieb HB-GRAL: Am 15.12.11 23:13, schrieb Martin Spott: Vivian Meazza wrote: The other one, which used to be non-op, seems to have gained operational capability along the way. You see, in order to avoid confusion, having just one operational arrestor would have been the clever solution. We're trying to simulate real-world, don't we ? Sure, we're not perfect but I think we're doing our best within the limits of our ressources. Thus, intentionally leaving an inoperational arrestor in place (instead of fixing it) sounds a bit odd Now, who would like to merge the best of both into one single model - before the feature freeze ? Cheers, Martin. Hi Martin Thought it is a standard distance, but ... c. A BAK-12 can be located anywhere on the runway or in the safety area depending upon the military mission requirements. I will try to provide individual distance from the end of runway in the data. Cheers, Yves -- Learn Windows Azure Live! Tuesday, Dec 13, 2011 Microsoft is holding a special Learn Windows Azure training event for developers. It will provide a great way to learn Windows Azure and what it provides. You can attend the event by watching it streamed LIVE online. Learn more at http://p.sf.net/sfu/ms-windowsazure ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
[Flightgear-devel] Re : Arresting Type Devices
Hello Yves, Arresting cables for runways do already exist in FG: see them in action at LFRJ Naval Base for instance. Olivier -- 10 Tips for Better Server Consolidation Server virtualization is being driven by many needs. But none more important than the need to reduce IT complexity while improving strategic productivity. Learn More! http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sdnl/114/51507609/___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Re : Arresting Type Devices
Am 15.12.11 18:26, schrieb Olivier: Hello Yves, Arresting cables for runways do already exist in FG: see them in action at LFRJ Naval Base for instance. Olivier Errm, Is this BAK12/14 or MA1A, ES or E28/B ? ;-) Cheers, Yves -- 10 Tips for Better Server Consolidation Server virtualization is being driven by many needs. But none more important than the need to reduce IT complexity while improving strategic productivity. Learn More! http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sdnl/114/51507609/ ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Re : Arresting Type Devices
HB-GRAL -Original Message- From: [mailto:flightg...@sablonier.ch] Sent: 15 December 2011 17:37 To: Olivier; FlightGear developers discussions Subject: Re: [Flightgear-devel] Re : Arresting Type Devices Am 15.12.11 18:26, schrieb Olivier: Hello Yves, Arresting cables for runways do already exist in FG: see them in action at LFRJ Naval Base for instance. Olivier Errm, Is this BAK12/14 or MA1A, ES or E28/B ? ;-) The ones I did in fgdata are BAK12. You can see them at Miramar (KNKX) Vivian -- 10 Tips for Better Server Consolidation Server virtualization is being driven by many needs. But none more important than the need to reduce IT complexity while improving strategic productivity. Learn More! http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sdnl/114/51507609/ ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Re : Arresting Type Devices
Vivian Meazza wrote: The ones I did in fgdata are BAK12. Just for the record, the original BAK-12 was provided by David Culp: http://scenemodels.flightgear.org/modeledit.php?id=918 We're having two models of a BAK-12 in the Base Package because some people here are incapable to comprehend the world beyond their own nose ;-) Cheers, Martin. -- Unix _IS_ user friendly - it's just selective about who its friends are ! -- -- 10 Tips for Better Server Consolidation Server virtualization is being driven by many needs. But none more important than the need to reduce IT complexity while improving strategic productivity. Learn More! http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sdnl/114/51507609/ ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Re : Arresting Type Devices
Am 15.12.11 20:39, schrieb Martin Spott: Vivian Meazza wrote: The ones I did in fgdata are BAK12. Just for the record, the original BAK-12 was provided by David Culp: http://scenemodels.flightgear.org/modeledit.php?id=918 We're having two models of a BAK-12 in the Base Package because some people here are incapable to comprehend the world beyond their own nose ;-) Cheers, Martin. And close to my nose I see here some mystic FAA data output: EDF 06 BAK12 61.248633 -149.844258333 EDF 16 BAK12 61.262069 -149.793475 BIG 19 BAK12 64.0077345 -145.707352861 EIL 14 BAK12 64.684208 -147.117919444 AKN 12 BAK12 58.68394-156.6647265 SYA 10 BAK12 52.716433 174.092125 MGM 10 BAK12 32.3023991944 -86.4099770278 FSM 07 BAK14 35.3336058056 -94.3814535556 LUF 03L BAK12 33.522975 -112.398563889 LUF 03R BAK12 33.526822 -112.38989 . . . Is this something that could/should come to the scenery database somehow ? Cheers, Yves -- 10 Tips for Better Server Consolidation Server virtualization is being driven by many needs. But none more important than the need to reduce IT complexity while improving strategic productivity. Learn More! http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sdnl/114/51507609/ ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Re : Arresting Type Devices
Martin Vivian Meazza wrote: The ones I did in fgdata are BAK12. Just for the record, the original BAK-12 was provided by David Culp: http://scenemodels.flightgear.org/modeledit.php?id=918 We're having two models of a BAK-12 in the Base Package because some people here are incapable to comprehend the world beyond their own nose ;-) Look under your own - one is non-op - the other functioning. You can pick whichever you prefer Vivian -- 10 Tips for Better Server Consolidation Server virtualization is being driven by many needs. But none more important than the need to reduce IT complexity while improving strategic productivity. Learn More! http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sdnl/114/51507609/ ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Re : Arresting Type Devices
HB-GRAL wrote: And close to my nose I see here some mystic FAA data output: [...] Is this something that could/should come to the scenery database somehow ? Generally I'd say: Great ! but I'd feel best if I knew that these positions really match the touchdown areas of 'our' runways. How many items are at disposal ? Cheers, Martin. -- Unix _IS_ user friendly - it's just selective about who its friends are ! -- -- 10 Tips for Better Server Consolidation Server virtualization is being driven by many needs. But none more important than the need to reduce IT complexity while improving strategic productivity. Learn More! http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sdnl/114/51507609/ ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Re : Arresting Type Devices
-Original Message- From: Martin Spott [mailto:martin.sp...@mgras.net] Sent: 15 December 2011 19:39 To: flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net Subject: Re: [Flightgear-devel] Re : Arresting Type Devices Vivian Meazza wrote: The ones I did in fgdata are BAK12. Just for the record, the original BAK-12 was provided by David Culp: http://scenemodels.flightgear.org/modeledit.php?id=918 We're having two models of a BAK-12 in the Base Package because some people here are incapable to comprehend the world beyond their own nose ;-) No, I'm wrong. The one I did which says this: * Add runway arrester gear type BAK-12. Based on Dave Culp's original work. is operational. The other one, which used to be non-op, seems to have gained operational capability along the way. It was the original intention to have 2 - a simpler, non-op one and a more complex functional one. The distinction seems to have become blurred along the way Vivian -- 10 Tips for Better Server Consolidation Server virtualization is being driven by many needs. But none more important than the need to reduce IT complexity while improving strategic productivity. Learn More! http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sdnl/114/51507609/ ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Re : Arresting Type Devices
Am 15.12.11 22:37, schrieb Martin Spott: HB-GRAL wrote: And close to my nose I see here some mystic FAA data output: [...] Is this something that could/should come to the scenery database somehow ? Generally I'd say: Great ! but I'd feel best if I knew that these positions really match the touchdown areas of 'our' runways. How many items are at disposal ? Cheers, Martin. Attached you find the list. There are 55 BAK12 and 23 BAK14 devices, 156 items total, all in the US and found in recent FAA runway data. The coordinates comes from column base/reciprocal ends of runways, published by FAA, assuming myself this is the point where the device is installed ;-) Cheers, Yves EDF 06 BAK12 61.248633 -149.844258333 EDF 16 BAK12 61.262069 -149.793475 BIG 19 BAK12 64.0077345 -145.707352861 EIL 14 BAK12 64.684208 -147.117919444 AKN 12 BAK12 58.68394-156.6647265 SYA 10 BAK12 52.716433 174.092125 MGM 10 BAK12 32.3023991944 -86.4099770278 FSM 07 BAK14 35.3336058056 -94.3814535556 LUF 03L BAK12 33.522975 -112.398563889 LUF 03R BAK12 33.526822 -112.38989 IWA 12C MA1A33.317611 -111.66592325 IWA 12L MA1A33.3175886389 -111.661311556 IWA 12R MA1A33.3176702778 -111.67286825 DMA 12 BAK12 32.1801661944 -110.898090139 TUS 03 E5 32.1171670556 -110.9590405 TUS 11L BAK14 32.1233695278 -110.947911944 NYL 03L E28 32.636783 -114.629393944 NYL 03R E5 32.64874-114.612527861 NID 03 E28B35.6756416667 -117.708389444 NID 14 E28B35.698758 -117.69319 EDW 04R BAK12 34.8945598056 -117.905011972 NJK 08 E28 32.829133 -115.687102778 NJK 12 E28 32.8297805556 -115.672102778 FAT 11L BAK12 36.7835047778 -119.72921 NTD 27 E28B34.11695-119.106325 RIV 14 BAK12 33.896428 -117.27063 NUC 05 E28 33.017812 -118.602484167 NKX 06L E28 32.864564 -117.164848056 NKX 06R E28 32.8654736111 -117.151668889 NKX 28 E28 32.8656980556 -117.12709 NZY 11 E28 32.7023291667 -117.221266944 NZY 18 E28 32.7100325 -117.211676667 VCV 17 BAK934.621652 -117.386785472 COS 13 MA1A38.8231551944 -104.715352944 AGR 05 BAK12 27.640811 -81.351061 EGI 18 BAK12 30.6613849722 -86.52268775 HST 05 E5 25.4787213889 -80.3964438889 JAX 08 BAK14 30.4962166389 -81.6999653611 NIP 10 E28B30.2316036111 -81.6897738889 NIP 32 E28 30.2310052778 -81.665369 NQX 03 E28 24.565717 -81.6959 NQX 07 E28B24.5724916667 -81.700078 NQX 13 E28 24.578978 -81.692233 HRT 18 MA1A-M 30.442083 -86.689872 NRB 05 E28B30.383319 -81.4331598333 PAM 13L BAK12 30.080043 -85.5844108333 PAM 13R BAK12 30.077445 -85.5882263889 NPA 01 E5 30.3420186111 -87.321569 NPA 07L E5 30.3507736111 -87.329109 NPA 07R E5 30.3489869444 -87.328289 MCF 04 MA1A27.8373916667 -82.532683 VPS 01 BAK12 30.472889 -86.517886 VPS 12 BAK12 30.488786 -86.5522027778 MGE 11 BAK12 33.919118 -84.5321747222 SAV 10 BAK14 32.1287536944 -81.2187920278 VAD 18L BAK12 30.981822 -83.1908027778 VAD 18R E5 30.979297 -83.195219 WRB 33 BAK14 32.626822 -83.580478 UAM 06L BAK12 13.580344 144.91562 UAM 06R BAK12 13.575319 144.916486111 HNL 04R BAK14 21.3139180278 -157.927134889 HNL 26L BAK14 21.3068010556 -157.910598472 NGF 04 E28 21.4438147222 -157.776901 JRF 04L E28B21.306836 -158.07206 BKH 16 BAK12 22.030915 -159.786599167 DSM 05 BAK14 41.5233680278 -93.6771125 DSM 13 BAK14 41.5456056944 -93.6744538611 SUX 13 BAK12 42.4091870278 -96.3977028889 BOI 10R BAK14 43.5700336944 -116.242615333 MUO 12 BAK12B 43.056711 -115.890258333 GUS 05 BAK12B 40.635825 -86.167869 IAB 01L BAK12B 37.607272 -97.2734805556 AEX 14 MA1A-M 31.3378769444 -92.5592268056 BAD 33 BAK12 32.487717 -93.653494 NBG 04 E28B29.823508 -90.037297 NBG 14 E28B29.823352 -90.033094 BAF 02 BAK14 42.1453001944 -72.7188199167 ADW 01R BAK14 38.7977364722 -76.86357625 NHK 06 E28B
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Re : Arresting Type Devices
Vivian Meazza wrote: The other one, which used to be non-op, seems to have gained operational capability along the way. You see, in order to avoid confusion, having just one operational arrestor would have been the clever solution. We're trying to simulate real-world, don't we ? Sure, we're not perfect but I think we're doing our best within the limits of our ressources. Thus, intentionally leaving an inoperational arrestor in place (instead of fixing it) sounds a bit odd Now, who would like to merge the best of both into one single model - before the feature freeze ? Cheers, Martin. -- Unix _IS_ user friendly - it's just selective about who its friends are ! -- -- 10 Tips for Better Server Consolidation Server virtualization is being driven by many needs. But none more important than the need to reduce IT complexity while improving strategic productivity. Learn More! http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sdnl/114/51507609/ ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Re : Arresting Type Devices
HB-GRAL wrote: The coordinates comes from column base/reciprocal ends of runways, is your definition supposed to be identical to runway centerline at threshold ? Cheers, Martin. -- Unix _IS_ user friendly - it's just selective about who its friends are ! -- -- 10 Tips for Better Server Consolidation Server virtualization is being driven by many needs. But none more important than the need to reduce IT complexity while improving strategic productivity. Learn More! http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sdnl/114/51507609/ ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Re : Arresting Type Devices
Am 15.12.11 23:21, schrieb Martin Spott: HB-GRAL wrote: The coordinates comes from column base/reciprocal ends of runways, is your definition supposed to be identical to runway centerline at threshold ? Cheers, Martin. It is Latitude/Longitude of physical runway base/reciprocal end as defined by FAA. I can also add the source and date of this point in the list, when it is useful. But I better do not add elevation of this point for fg scenery, right ? EDF 06 BAK12 61.248633 -149.844258333 AVN 08.11.03 EDF 16 BAK12 61.262069 -149.793475 AVN 08.11.03 BIG 19 BAK12 64.0077345 -145.707352861 AVN 02/16/2007 EIL 14 BAK12 64.684208 -147.117919444 MILITARY 07/16/2007 AKN 12 BAK12 58.68394-156.6647265NGS 06/17/2005 SYA 10 BAK12 52.716433 174.092125 MILITARY 07/18/2007 MGM 10 BAK12 32.3023991944 -86.4099770278 NGS 01/29/2003 Cheers, Yves -- 10 Tips for Better Server Consolidation Server virtualization is being driven by many needs. But none more important than the need to reduce IT complexity while improving strategic productivity. Learn More! http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sdnl/114/51507609/ ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Re : Arresting Type Devices
Am 15.12.11 23:49, schrieb HB-GRAL: EDF 06BAK12 61.248633 -149.844258333 AVN 08.11.03 EDF 16BAK12 61.262069 -149.793475 AVN 08.11.03 BIG 19BAK12 64.0077345 -145.707352861 AVN 02/16/2007 EIL 14BAK12 64.684208 -147.117919444 MILITARY 07/16/2007 AKN 12BAK12 58.68394-156.6647265NGS 06/17/2005 SYA 10BAK12 52.716433 174.092125 MILITARY 07/18/2007 MGM 10BAK12 32.3023991944 -86.4099770278 NGS 01/29/2003 Oh, can we have at least this one in the scenery ? EGI 18 BAK12 30.6613849722 -86.52268775MILITARY 09/29/2011 My 2 Rappen (swiss cents) this will make fg the leading and most recent arresting device simulator on earth. :-) Cheers, Yves -- 10 Tips for Better Server Consolidation Server virtualization is being driven by many needs. But none more important than the need to reduce IT complexity while improving strategic productivity. Learn More! http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sdnl/114/51507609/ ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
