Re: [Flightgear-users] FlightGearTools Version 1.0 now available
Le dimanche 02 octobre 2005 à 18:28 -0400, Ed Baker a écrit : Hi George, P.S. Some people in the Linux/Unix camp tend to look down on MS-Windows users. I used to be in that camp myself. I've been an active unix user since 1979 and I owned a copy of Slackware linux when it was distributed on 19 three and one half inch floppies. I'm not a rooky when it comes to working in Unix. However, I refuse to run Flightgear on a unix box. I'll concede that Unix/Linux is great ... no doubt about it ... but, as they say two hundred and twenty five million Beatles fans can't be all wrong. If Flightgear plans to draw a large audience (and I think it is worthy of it), the Flightgear community HAS TO REALIZE that they MUST appeal to the MS-Windows community. That's just the facts ... it's not an opinion, it's not an us versus them scenario. It's just what it is. There's no denying it. Your remark is rather funny for me. I am one of the Linux users who will never exchange 1 thousand of MS- Windows with a little Linux. In the past, i spent too much time in difficulties to make something working correctly with MS-Windows. I spent money in adding and adding extra power and memory to make it working. Fortunately today I am free to use the operating system i want. The future., about the market you should look at Chinese and Russian place before any conclusions. Up to MS-Windows users to patch and develop in their MS BOX. Cheers -- Gerard ___ Flightgear-users mailing list Flightgear-users@flightgear.org http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-users 2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d
Re: [Flightgear-users] Aircraft downloads displayed vs filename versions
Le dimanche 02 octobre 2005 à 19:19 -0500, Dave Culp a écrit : BTW, where does one get CH47 model seen as featured on the OV-10 page? That's a low-polygon model I made. I'll email it to you if you'd like. Reply offline and I'll send it. Dave Unfortunately within JSB we are not able to Simulate an Helicopter, And the existing Yasim FDM CH47 is wrong. Bad Mass, bad Rotor characteristics, bad engine power. Gerard ___ Flightgear-users mailing list Flightgear-users@flightgear.org http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-users 2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d
Re: [Flightgear-users] Tutorial
In a message dated 10/2/2005 1:02:21 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: [EN] I'm sorry but that would need too much time. If somebody owns a good English-French translator software, I'll take the time to polish the result. I tried using the Google and Altavista translators but they're really bad. français: Essayez ceci que cela fonctionne le joli puits http://babelfish.altavista.com/tr Translated from my English Try this it works pretty well. Here is your original French using their engine I am sorry but that would take too much time to me. If somebody has a software French English translator of quality, I will take time necessary to correct the result. I tested by using the translators of Google and of Altavista but the result is too bad. Ray ___ Flightgear-users mailing list Flightgear-users@flightgear.org http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-users 2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d
Re: [Flightgear-users] FlightGearTools Version 1.0 now available
On Sun, 02 Oct 2005 18:28:25 -0400, Ed wrote in message [EMAIL PROTECTED]: If Flightgear plans to draw a large audience ..precisely. If. ;o) (and I think it is worthy of it), the Flightgear community HAS TO REALIZE that they MUST appeal to the MS-Windows community. That's just ..bull. You are welcome to compare the merits of what you have experienced with Wintendo, with what you learn with FlightGear. ;o) the facts ... it's not an opinion, it's not an us versus them scenario. It's just what it is. There's no denying it. ..this sounds more like some MSFS folks bracing themselves for the Horrors of Capitalism, like in Competition on Tech etc Merits. ;o) Bring it on! ;o) -- ..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt... ;o) ...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry... Scenarios always come in sets of three: best case, worst case, and just in case. ___ Flightgear-users mailing list Flightgear-users@flightgear.org http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-users 2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d
Re: [Flightgear-users] FlightGearTools Version 1.0 now available
Le lundi 03 octobre 2005 à 18:46 +0200, Arnt Karlsen a écrit : On Sun, 02 Oct 2005 18:28:25 -0400, Ed wrote in message [EMAIL PROTECTED]: If Flightgear plans to draw a large audience ..precisely. If. ;o) (and I think it is worthy of it), the Flightgear community HAS TO REALIZE that they MUST appeal to the MS-Windows community. That's just ..bull. You are welcome to compare the merits of what you have experienced with Wintendo, with what you learn with FlightGear. ;o) the facts ... it's not an opinion, it's not an us versus them scenario. It's just what it is. There's no denying it. ..this sounds more like some MSFS folks bracing themselves for the Horrors of Capitalism, like in Competition on Tech etc Merits. ;o) Bring it on! ;o) Your remarks sound to me like a Sibelius Symphony :-)) -- Gerard ___ Flightgear-users mailing list Flightgear-users@flightgear.org http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-users 2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d
Re: [Flightgear-users] FlightGearTools Version 1.0 now available
Hi, The whole problem is that MS-Windows users are quite prepared to use the better products from the Open Source world, but are at the same time simply too stupid and/or too lazy to work on those projects themselves ;-) If they think FlightGear is worthy of MSWindows (I wouldn't be proud of it ...) they should simply start contributing to it . There is no such thing as a free meal, albeit it may not be money you'll have to invest this time ;-) Bye, Kees Lemmens PS : Eric Brasseur , thanks for your excellent contribution (the tutorial) ! On Monday 03 October 2005 18:55, Gerard ROBIN wrote: Le lundi 03 octobre 2005 à 18:46 +0200, Arnt Karlsen a écrit : On Sun, 02 Oct 2005 18:28:25 -0400, Ed wrote in message [EMAIL PROTECTED]: If Flightgear plans to draw a large audience ..precisely. If. ;o) (and I think it is worthy of it), the Flightgear community HAS TO REALIZE that they MUST appeal to the MS-Windows community. That's just ..bull. You are welcome to compare the merits of what you have experienced with Wintendo, with what you learn with FlightGear. ;o) the facts ... it's not an opinion, it's not an us versus them scenario. It's just what it is. There's no denying it. ..this sounds more like some MSFS folks bracing themselves for the Horrors of Capitalism, like in Competition on Tech etc Merits. ;o) Bring it on! ;o) Your remarks sound to me like a Sibelius Symphony :-)) ___ Flightgear-users mailing list Flightgear-users@flightgear.org http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-users 2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d
Re: [Flightgear-users] FlightGearTools Version 1.0 now available
On Monday 03 October 2005 19:49, Kees Lemmens wrote: If they think FlightGear is worthy of MSWindows (I wouldn't be proud of it ...) they should simply start contributing to it . I think it should be noted that several FG developers work mainly or solely on Windows. It's easy to generalise, but not all Windows users are idiots, and not all *nix users are clued-up programmers! The only other thing I would like to point out is that if someone is going to the effort of making nice graphical front-ends for FG it would make a lot of sense to try and use cross-platform tools so that everyone can benefit. There are plenty of Linux / Mac users (not me, but I know of a few) who would find such a thing very useful too... AJ ___ Flightgear-users mailing list Flightgear-users@flightgear.org http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-users 2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d
Re: [Flightgear-users] FlightGearTools Version 1.0 now available
Kees Lemmens schrieb: Hi, The whole problem is that MS-Windows users are quite prepared to use the better products from the Open Source world, but are at the same time simply too stupid and/or too lazy to work on those projects themselves ;-) If they think FlightGear is worthy of MSWindows (I wouldn't be proud of it ...) they should simply start contributing to it . There is no such thing as a free meal, albeit it may not be money you'll have to invest this time ;-) Bye, Kees Lemmens People, think about it: this is a very bad style to misuse my topic to make a flame war over another theme. If you read the original topic, it was just an announcement for a tool and asking developers who have some knowledge about ATLAS and/or MAP to have a look at the manual to correct possible errors. I don't really understand all that bullsh.. which came afterwards. Please use another topic if you are interested in fighting each other. My intention is to start some work for FlightGear, not war. Regards Georg EDDW ___ Flightgear-users mailing list Flightgear-users@flightgear.org http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-users 2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d
[Flightgear-users] FG 0.9.8 fail to recognise joystick settings
Hi folks - I'm running FG 0.9.8 on Win 2000 (binaries obained from flightgear.org) and tried to correctly install my joystick. I use a Logitech Extreme 3D Pro USB. (The sick itself works, as js_demo.exe suggests) I had to slightly modify the corresponding (adjust name) *.xml file. The excerpt from the log (i set debugging level to info) seems to tell me that the stick had been recognised. However, the stick only behaves like a default stick and non of the specific settings work. It was verified by looking at browse internal properties. What may be wrong? Hoping for help, Stefan -- from log --- Looking for bindings for joystick Logitech Extreme 3D Pro USB Trying Analog 4-axis 4-button joystick Trying CH PRODUCTS CH PRO PEDALS USB Trying CH Products CH Pro Pedals USB Rudder Pedals Trying CH PRO PEDALS USB Trying CH PRODUCTS CH FLIGHT SIM YOKE USB Trying CH FLIGHT SIM YOKE USB Trying Logitech Inc. WingMan Extreme Digital 3D Trying Logitech Logitech Extreme 3D Pro Trying Logitech WingMan Extreme Digital 3D (USB) Trying Logitech WingMan Force Trying Logitech Inc. WingMan Force 3D Trying Logitech Inc. WingMan RumblePad Trying WingMan RumblePad Trying Logitech Extreme 3D Pro USB Found bindings FGMultiplayTxMgr::init - txaddress= 0 FGMultiplayTxMgr::init - txport= 0 FGMultiplayTxMgr::init - Tx Port is zero. Multiplay out disabled. FGMultiplayRxMgr::init - rxaddress= 0 FGMultiplayRxMgr::init - rxport= 0 FGMultiplayRxMgr::init - callsign= callsign Adding subsystem nasal -- end log --- ___ Flightgear-users mailing list Flightgear-users@flightgear.org http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-users 2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d
[Flightgear-users] Can you set the frame rate in Flightgear?
Is it possible to specify the frame rate in flightgear? I am running flightgear as a visualisation tool for a Matlab/Simulink model and would like to limit the amount of processing power it uses so that more is available for Matlab and other programs. At the moment I don't have the option of running Matlab on a separate machine. Mick. -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.344 / Virus Database: 267.11.9/116 - Release Date: 30/09/2005 ___ Flightgear-users mailing list Flightgear-users@flightgear.org http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-users 2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d
Re: [Flightgear-users] Appealing to MS Windows community
-- Fortune Cookie : Pure drivel tends to drive ordinary drivel off the TV screen. ___ Flightgear-users mailing list Flightgear-users@flightgear.org http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-users 2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d
[Flightgear-users] re: FG 0.9.8 fail to recognise joystick settings
On Oct 3, 2005, at 5:12 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Break Message: 4 Date: Mon, 03 Oct 2005 22:02:54 +0200 From: Stefan M?ller-Pfeiffer [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [Flightgear-users] FG 0.9.8 fail to recognise joystick settings To: flightgear-users@flightgear.org Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Hi folks - I'm running FG 0.9.8 on Win 2000 (binaries obained from flightgear.org) and tried to correctly install my joystick. I use a Logitech Extreme 3D Pro USB. (The sick itself works, as js_demo.exe suggests) I had to slightly modify the corresponding (adjust name) *.xml file. The excerpt from the log (i set debugging level to info) seems to tell me that the stick had been recognised. However, the stick only behaves like a default stick and non of the specific settings work. It was verified by looking at browse internal properties. What may be wrong? Hoping for help, Stefan Stefan. I was having problems trying to get the Extreme 3D pro joystick working on my Mac under OS X.4 and I succeeded with the following fix. It may not work with Win 2000, but it may give you another direction to investigate. Finally got my logitech extreme 3D pro joystick to work.Took 3 steps. 1. Transfered the xml discription from the 3D pro Win file to the 3D pro file (the description was exchanged). ((So you may not need this change. check the xml file)) 2. opened the default folder in folder input, opened the joystick.xml file. 3. replaced the joystick.xml file with the content of the changed 3D pro xml file. The FG will now use the extreme 3D pro xml as the default. This may be a rough hack but it does work. The descriptions of the keys are listed in the extreme 3D pro xml. Ed ___ Flightgear-users mailing list Flightgear-users@flightgear.org http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-users 2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d
Re: [Flightgear-users] Appealing to MS Windows community
Paul Surgeon wrote: On Monday 03 October 2005 00:28, Ed Baker wrote: P.S. Some people in the Linux/Unix camp tend to look down on MS-Windows users. I used to be in that camp myself. I've been an active unix user since 1979 and I owned a copy of Slackware linux when it was distributed on 19 three and one half inch floppies. I'm not a rooky when it comes to working in Unix. However, I refuse to run Flightgear on a unix box. I'll concede that Unix/Linux is great ... no doubt about it ... but, as they say two hundred and twenty five million Beatles fans can't be all wrong. If Flightgear plans to draw a large audience (and I think it is worthy of it), the Flightgear community HAS TO REALIZE that they MUST appeal to the MS-Windows community. That's just the facts ... it's not an opinion, it's not an us versus them scenario. It's just what it is. There's no denying it. I'm *way* behind on my email here, so I'm not sure why I'm replying to this first, but ... For what it's worth, if you look at things like web hits from windows browsers versus web hits from any other platform, or if you look at the number of people downloading the windows version versus the number of people downloading the source code ... it's clear that windows users are by far and away the dominant portion of our user base. Every time I see someone mention appealing to windows, or appealing to the MSFS crowd, I keep thinking back to the old your appeal is fruitless pun, but I can never think of a good clean way to work that in. I don't personally have time to be full time marketing director and the project can't afford to hire anyone to be marketing director (or anything else for that matter), so FlightGear really isn't being actively marketed to anyone specifically, not unix, not mac, not windows. When I've been marketing FlightGear recently, I've been pushing it as an engineering tool. Notice the recent matlab interface supported by matlab. I probably see some stuff that not everyone else sees, but if you don't pick this up from the mailing lists, take it from me, FlightGear is getting used extensively in the aerospace industry. FlightGear is being used as part of many different UAV projects, from simulation to flight computer development to training to real time visualization ... both in academia and in industry. FlightGear is even being used as part of product being marketed to people who develop modern fly by wire jets. Oh, not to mention the guy who plans to add portions of FlightGear to his FAA Level A certified full motion simulator. FlightGear is used as part of a number of other simulator projects that I'm aware of. One simulator recently was setup at a university in Naples Italy. It's a dual driving/flight simulator. There's a lot of *really* cool stuff going on. It's not just about downloading FlightGear and running it on your home computer (windows, mac, linux, freebsd, etc.) Don't get me wrong, that's one of our primary target audiences, and most of our developers come from that world, but FlightGear is so much more than just a home desktop simulator. Could we do things to make life easier for windows users? Certainly, but we have been making steady improvements all along as we've gone. Could we make things easier for linux or mac or sgi or solaris or freebsd users, yes, and we are working in those directions too. Sometimes we make changes for one platform that adversely affect another platform, but that's never intentional. Each platform needs a strong defender! :-) But this all takes time and effort, and we are all volunteers, and some of this stuff is really hard and really time consuming. And don't forget, we all bring our own personal preferences and personal agendas to the project. That's just the way life works in just about any organization. So individually there may be disparranging comments once in a while towards other platforms. We really need to try to keep those to a minimum if not eliminate them entirely. But on the flip side, if you see one of those remarks come scrolling across your screen, you need to realize that person speaks pretty much just for themselves. Anyway that is just my 2 cents, speaking mostly on behalf of myself. ;-) My only issue with windows right now is the crappy video capture app we have for our live wireless uav footage deletes the movie automatically if it detects too much snow. So we don't have footage from our crash to try to analyze what happened. That was almost two weeks ago now and I'm still pissed! But I'll stop before I start overly generalizing. :-) Curt. -- Curtis Olsonhttp://www.flightgear.org/~curt HumanFIRST Program http://www.humanfirst.umn.edu/ FlightGear Project http://www.flightgear.org Unique text:2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d ___ Flightgear-users mailing list Flightgear-users@flightgear.org
Re: [Flightgear-users] Appealing to MS Windows community
The truth is that Flightgear does run cross platform. As to getting a larger audience, then simply drop the sophisticated flight models, and make it more like an X Box game Is that what the mailing list really wants ? As to Linux versus Windows, is the Flightgear mailing list the place to debate such a topic ? The debate is better analysed by psychologists than computer scientists. ___ Flightgear-users mailing list Flightgear-users@flightgear.org http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-users 2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d
Re: [Flightgear-users] Appealing to MS Windows community
No, don't drop the flight models. We don't need another game (speaking for the Win freaks here). Though I run Nix myself, I use Windows too and 99% of my job is on Windows, both in the business home user sectors. I guess over the past few years I have distributed several hundred FlightGear CDs - all to Windows users. For those interested, I preinstall it and set it up - scenery and all and test it - on the PCs I sell. When PCs are in the shop, again, I install it and make sure it runs for those interested. The feedback has almost always been phenominal. Users love it. But that is the sticking point - almost all of them are simply average Windows users, or to be more accurate, clusers. Windows users are used to - put the CD in, answer a few questions and POOF! its done. Just because a user is interested in flying or a good challenge does not mean they are even marginaly technically competent on a PC. They never have had to really think about it as it is pretty much done for them - so this is what we get, many clusers. What Windows user group are we trying to appeal to? The clusers? If so, you need more people who do what I do in promoting FlightGear - some one to hold their hand. Or we need to package it all up in a nice, neat MSI package and front end that takes care of the technical issues behind the scenes. The tech crowd? No problem - they can handle it just the way it is, but they are definitely the minority. I guess me point is, who do we want to appeal to? Do we want FlightGear to be a common program such as MS FS2004? That will determine what we need to do. Does making to program easy to install and manage (in the Windows sense here) somehow cheapen its worth? Rant off. -- Chris Ridley OnCall Solutions Onsite Technology Solutions [EMAIL PROTECTED] - I like long walks, especially when they are taken by people who annoy me. On 10/3/05, David Ginger [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The truth is that Flightgear does run cross platform. As to getting a larger audience, then simply drop the sophisticated flight models, and make it more like an X Box game Is that what the mailing list really wants ? ___ Flightgear-users mailing list Flightgear-users@flightgear.org http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-users 2f585eeea02e2c79d7b1d8c4963bae2d
