On Thu, 12 Feb 2015 17:59:33 +0100, Warren Young w...@etr-usa.com wrote:
On Feb 12, 2015, at 9:55 AM, j. van den hoff
veedeeh...@googlemail.com wrote:
making the probability threshold user settable instead seems less
convenient since it is just
a statistical measure and it is
On Thu, Feb 12, 2015 at 2:55 PM, Warren Young w...@etr-usa.com wrote:
I would still prefer that Fossil self-tune, however. While it is true
that my formula doesn’t give intuitive p values, it is also true that you
cannot pick sensible d values for a repository without knowing various
On Feb 12, 2015, at 10:55 AM, j. van den hoff veedeeh...@googlemail.com
wrote:
p = 0.1 suggests that I easily will get a collision in my interaction with
fossil while all it tells is that in about 10% of repos of this size there
will
be somewhere a collision
Fair point.
I would still
On Thu, 12 Feb 2015 21:17:41 +0100, Ron W ronw.m...@gmail.com wrote:
On Thu, Feb 12, 2015 at 2:55 PM, Warren Young w...@etr-usa.com wrote:
I would still prefer that Fossil self-tune, however. While it is true
that my formula doesn’t give intuitive p values, it is also true that
you
cannot
On 2/12/2015 1:30 PM, j. van den hoff wrote:
it would be good if the user could just do
`fossil set prefix-length 12' thus getting rid of the
collisions and proceed. in short: an option to
customize the length might still be useful.
For small and young projects, a prefix of 10 feels
On Feb 11, 2015, at 7:23 AM, Richard Hipp d...@sqlite.org wrote:
On 2/11/15, j. van den hoff veedeeh...@googlemail.com wrote:
whatever the reason, the netbsd example (a worst case scenario, really)
would suggest to chose 12 instead of 10 as the future default length
to avoid collisions
On Thu, 12 Feb 2015 17:21:50 +0100, Warren Young w...@etr-usa.com wrote:
On Feb 11, 2015, at 7:23 AM, Richard Hipp d...@sqlite.org wrote:
On 2/11/15, j. van den hoff veedeeh...@googlemail.com wrote:
whatever the reason, the netbsd example (a worst case scenario, really)
would suggest to
On Feb 12, 2015, at 9:55 AM, j. van den hoff veedeeh...@googlemail.com
wrote:
making the probability threshold user settable instead seems less convenient
since it is just
a statistical measure and it is counterintuitive in the sense that it tells
you something about
chance of
On Feb 12, 2015, at 9:59 AM, Warren Young w...@etr-usa.com wrote:
Any value for d 40 gives p 1.0. :)
Ooops. I mean p 0.
And yes, I realize that p never goes to 0, but since 40 digits puts the chance
of collision into “heat death of the universe” territory, it’s close enough to
0 for my
On Feb 12, 2015, at 9:21 AM, Warren Young w...@etr-usa.com wrote:
d = log2(n^2 / 2p) / 4
In C:
double n = num_artifacts;
double p = acceptable_probability_of_collision;
assert(p 0.002);
int d = ceil(log2((n * n) / (2 * p)) / 4.0);
n needs to be a double because squaring 5 and
On 2/11/15, j. van den hoff veedeeh...@googlemail.com wrote:
whatever the reason, the netbsd example (a worst case scenario, really)
would suggest to chose 12 instead of 10 as the future default length
to avoid collisions these next some hundred years.
Maybe the default prefix lengths should
On Wed, 11 Feb 2015 15:24:04 +0100, Joerg Sonnenberger
jo...@britannica.bec.de wrote:
On Wed, Feb 11, 2015 at 02:13:10PM +0100, j. van den hoff wrote:
for the netbsd repo (presuming there are half a million checkins in it)
Hash conflicts likely count all artifacts, so it would be more like
On Wed, 11 Feb 2015 15:23:55 +0100, Richard Hipp d...@sqlite.org wrote:
On 2/11/15, j. van den hoff veedeeh...@googlemail.com wrote:
whatever the reason, the netbsd example (a worst case scenario, really)
would suggest to chose 12 instead of 10 as the future default length
to avoid collisions
On 2/11/2015 6:23 AM, Richard Hipp wrote:
On 2/11/15, j. van den hoff veedeeh...@googlemail.com wrote:
whatever the reason, the netbsd example (a worst case scenario, really)
would suggest to chose 12 instead of 10 as the future default length
to avoid collisions these next some hundred years.
On 2/11/15, Ross Berteig r...@cheshireeng.com wrote:
On 2/11/2015 6:23 AM, Richard Hipp wrote:
On 2/11/15, j. van den hoff veedeeh...@googlemail.com wrote:
whatever the reason, the netbsd example (a worst case scenario, really)
would suggest to chose 12 instead of 10 as the future default
On Wed, 11 Feb 2015 01:21:22 +0100, Warren Young w...@etr-usa.com wrote:
On Feb 10, 2015, at 4:34 PM, Richard Hipp d...@sqlite.org wrote:
On 2/10/15, Warren Young w...@etr-usa.com wrote:
Seems like a risky gamble to me.
Risk? It's a low-probability of a minor ambiguity in the display
On 2/11/15, j. van den hoff veedeeh...@googlemail.com wrote:
I'd say one can live with this potential annoyance (not danger) of getting
a collision of the sub-hashes
even with 10 digits (although 12 would mean that for the foreseeable
future number of actual collisions
in all existing fossil
On Wed, 11 Feb 2015 12:56:58 +0100, Richard Hipp d...@sqlite.org wrote:
On 2/11/15, j. van den hoff veedeeh...@googlemail.com wrote:
I'd say one can live with this potential annoyance (not danger) of
getting
a collision of the sub-hashes
even with 10 digits (although 12 would mean that for
On Tue, Feb 10, 2015 at 7:17 AM, j. van den hoff veedeeh...@googlemail.com
wrote:
this seems a rather special/remote problem, no? I don't know
javascript/jason
but would presume, that it would be easy to enforce correct interpretation
in this case (enforcing interpretation as string format by
Assuming some fixed strings lengths and formats on processing the output of
program you didn't write is definitely bad design and in result a buggy
program.
I would suggest to scan for an a tag, with class=timelineHistLink. This
tag always contains _some part_ of the hash value as a
I was talking about the CLI of fossil, not the web interface.
It doesn't matter. It is even more simple, just detect the first hex number,
enclosed in square brackets and you will be fine, notice, without assuming any
length at all. If you want to use finfo with -b option, simply scan to the
On Tue, 10 Feb 2015 19:25:58 +0100, John Found johnfo...@asm32.info
wrote:
Assuming some fixed strings lengths and formats on processing the output
of program you didn't write is definitely bad design and in result a
buggy program.
I would suggest to scan for an a tag, with
On Tue, 10 Feb 2015 21:49:06 +0100, Richard Hipp d...@sqlite.org wrote:
There are two cases:
(1) SHA1 prefixes for human-consumption
(2) SHA1 prefixes as part of URLs
What do people think would be a good default length for each case?
Jan prefers the full 40-characters for (2) and went to a
On Tue, Feb 10, 2015 at 3:49 PM, Richard Hipp d...@sqlite.org wrote:
There are two cases:
(1) SHA1 prefixes for human-consumption
The default length of (1) has traditionally be 10 characters, though
as J notes, that is sometimes extended in order to find a character in
the range of [a-f].
Thus said John Found on Tue, 10 Feb 2015 21:32:09 +0200:
It doesn't matter. It is even more simple, just detect the first hex
number, enclosed in square brackets and you will be fine, notice,
without assuming any length at all. If you want to use finfo with -b
option, simply scan to
On Tue, 10 Feb 2015 21:23:09 +0100, Andy Bradford
amb-fos...@bradfords.org wrote:
Thus said John Found on Tue, 10 Feb 2015 21:32:09 +0200:
It doesn't matter. It is even more simple, just detect the first hex
number, enclosed in square brackets and you will be fine, notice,
without
On Tue, 10 Feb 2015 20:32:09 +0100, John Found johnfo...@asm32.info
wrote:
I was talking about the CLI of fossil, not the web interface.
It doesn't matter. It is even more simple, just detect the first hex
number, enclosed in square brackets and you will be fine, notice,
without
There are two cases:
(1) SHA1 prefixes for human-consumption
(2) SHA1 prefixes as part of URLs
What do people think would be a good default length for each case?
Jan prefers the full 40-characters for (2) and went to a lot of
trouble to change that at one point . But I find those 40-character
Thus said Richard Hipp on Tue, 10 Feb 2015 15:49:06 -0500:
But I find those 40-character long URL parameters annoying a have been
slowing reducing the length of (2) in specific places where it annoys
me. I propose either 16 or 20 as the default length for (2). Probably
the shorter.
For a
On Feb 10, 2015, at 2:36 PM, j. van den hoff veedeeh...@googlemail.com
wrote:
On Tue, 10 Feb 2015 21:49:06 +0100, Richard Hipp d...@sqlite.org wrote:
I'm ok with making the
length of (1) the same in all cases. A value of 10 or 12 seems like a
reasonable default to me.
10 or 12
On Feb 10, 2015, at 4:34 PM, Richard Hipp d...@sqlite.org wrote:
On 2/10/15, Warren Young w...@etr-usa.com wrote:
Seems like a risky gamble to me.
Risk? It's a low-probability of a minor ambiguity in the display
Further up the thread people were talking about parsing these numbers out
On 2/10/15, Warren Young w...@etr-usa.com wrote:
Seems like a risky gamble to me.
Risk? It's a low-probability of a minor ambiguity in the display, not
its internal representation. We're still keeping all 40 digits
internally. So if within some project two check-ins collide in their
first
On 2/10/15, Warren Young w...@etr-usa.com wrote:
On Feb 10, 2015, at 4:34 PM, Richard Hipp d...@sqlite.org wrote:
On 2/10/15, Warren Young w...@etr-usa.com wrote:
Seems like a risky gamble to me.
Risk? It's a low-probability of a minor ambiguity in the display
Further up the thread
On Tue, 10 Feb 2015 10:06:57 +0100, Stephan Beal sgb...@googlemail.com
wrote:
On Tue, Feb 10, 2015 at 7:17 AM, j. van den hoff
veedeeh...@googlemail.com
wrote:
this seems a rather special/remote problem, no? I don't know
javascript/jason
but would presume, that it would be easy to enforce
On Tue, 10 Feb 2015 00:23:00 +0100, Stephan Beal sgb...@googlemail.com
wrote:
On Mon, Feb 9, 2015 at 7:57 PM, j. van den hoff
veedeeh...@googlemail.com
wrote:
(1) Minimum of 10 characters
(2) Longer as needed to include at least one character in [a-f]
why this constraint (requiring
maybe a stupid question, but I've just seen this for the first time. in my
timeline there is an entry
with a sha1 hash display of [52060472835f] which clearly stands out from
the other entries since
the string length is 12 instead of the usual 10.
I understand of course that the full hash is
On 2/9/15, j. van den hoff veedeeh...@googlemail.com wrote:
maybe a stupid question, but I've just seen this for the first time. in my
timeline there is an entry
with a sha1 hash display of [52060472835f] which clearly stands out from
the other entries since
the string length is 12 instead of
On Mon, Feb 9, 2015 at 11:17 PM, j. van den hoff veedeeh...@googlemail.com
wrote:
and if one cannot agree on whether this is good or bad when using 10 char
substrings (or whatever length), I would
like to have a flag/option enforcing the use of the full 40 char hashes in
the generated
On Mon, 09 Feb 2015 18:47:17 +0100, Richard Hipp d...@sqlite.org wrote:
On 2/9/15, j. van den hoff veedeeh...@googlemail.com wrote:
maybe a stupid question, but I've just seen this for the first time. in
my
timeline there is an entry
with a sha1 hash display of [52060472835f] which clearly
On Mon, 09 Feb 2015 18:47:17 +0100, Richard Hipp d...@sqlite.org wrote:
On 2/9/15, j. van den hoff veedeeh...@googlemail.com wrote:
maybe a stupid question, but I've just seen this for the first time. in
my
timeline there is an entry
with a sha1 hash display of [52060472835f] which clearly
On 2/9/15, j. van den hoff veedeeh...@googlemail.com wrote:
in view of this I would be really glad to learn why the variable length
sha1 substrings as they are appearing in the timeline (and usual `finfo'
output without the `-b' flag) are beneficial rather than always just using
the fixed
On Mon, 09 Feb 2015 22:35:52 +0100, Richard Hipp d...@sqlite.org wrote:
Probably we would be well-served to clean this all up. But first all
the committers have to agree on a particular style to use. Then we
have to hunt down and change every place that prints out a SHA1 hash.
And, so far,
same as last mail (sorry), but with one important typo corrected
On Mon, 09 Feb 2015 22:35:52 +0100, Richard Hipp d...@sqlite.org wrote:
Probably we would be well-served to clean this all up. But first all
the committers have to agree on a particular style to use. Then we
have to hunt
On Mon, Feb 9, 2015 at 7:57 PM, j. van den hoff veedeeh...@googlemail.com
wrote:
(1) Minimum of 10 characters
(2) Longer as needed to include at least one character in [a-f]
why this constraint (requiring occurence of one out of [a-f])? at which
point would something happen
without it? it
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