POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics?
On 1/17/06, Ridder, Fred wrote: > I'm not sure I'd call this the "ultimate redefinition solution" because > it completely ignores the fact that there should be some underlying > *reason* why you need to present a word or phrase in boldface (or > italic or whatever). A large segment of the people responding to the > original survey question indicated that they use multiple character > format names that all produce a boldface result, because the > different tag names allow them to capture some semantic metadata > about what makes the word or phrase special. Of course, the kind of person who uses CTRL+B to get the bold characteristic onto text doesn't care about metadata, so it all depends on your audience. This solution would be good enough for them, though it might not be for others. And there's always an underlying reason to apply bolding or italics...some people don't care whether that reason is made obvious in the way that metadata makes it. Moreover, it would be simple to use scripts to assign your entire format catalog to keyboard shortcuts. --Doug > > My opinions only; I don't speak for Intel. > Fred Ridder (fred dot ridder at intel dot com) > Intel > Parsippany, NJ > > > > -Original Message- > From: framers-bounces+fred.ridder=intel.com at lists.frameusers.com > [mailto:framers-bounces+fred.ridder=intel.com at lists.frameusers.com] On > Behalf Of Doug > Sent: Tuesday, January 17, 2006 2:57 PM > To: framers at lists.frameusers.com > Subject: Re: POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics? > > > I've redefined over 60 shortcuts so they open a catalog instead > > of creating an override. > > Of course, IMO the ultimate redefinition solution is to redefine the > shortcuts so they apply character and/or paragraph formats. What > could be simpler than redefining CTRL+B to apply a bold character > format? This could benefit both novice and experienced writers alike. > I'm surprised this functionality isn't built into Frame, or at least > into Framescript (I haven't delved into the latter deeply enough to > discover it, if FS does indeed possess this functionality). > > --Doug > ___ > >
RE: POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics?
In documents that will endure and need to be updated, its always via character styles In throw-away docs (e.g. one-time memo, fax cover page...) I use both named styles and ad hoc formatting: Control-B, Control-I, etc., depending on what is set up in the template. In structured docs there are special character-range formatting elements. On Monday, January 16, 2006 03:30 PM, John Wilcox wrote: | This came up as a possible style standards issue here. Please | reply off-list, and I'll summarize the results next week. | Thanks for your time! | | A. Click the B and I buttons, or press Ctrl+B and Ctrl+I. | B. Select Bold and Emphasis from the Character Catalog. - Lester --- Lester C. Smalley Email: lsmalley AT infocon DOT com Information Consultants, Inc. Phone: 302-239-2942 FAX: 302-239-1712 Yorklyn, DE 19736 Web: www.infocon.com --- ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics?
I'm with Bill here, and it looks like 99% of the pollsters. Character catalog. ALWAYS, and FOREVER. From the beginning of FM use, I've been told by too many Framers that the B and I buttons, or Ctrl B and Ctrl I (aka, inline styles) can really mess you up in ways you don't ever want to know about. So, rather then test the dreaded experience, I've avoided A like the plague, and been successful at avoiding problems, even though I have no idea what the problems might be. Maybe we could start a new thread, the horrors of FM inline styles, and how I survived the experience. ;-) Might be fun, eh? Rita Muller Technical Writer Morrow Technologies Corporation -- Message: 30 Date: Mon, 16 Jan 2006 18:14:34 -0500 From: Bill Swallow [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics? To: John Wilcox [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: framers@lists.FrameUsers.com framers@lists.frameusers.com Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Character catalog. Always. On 1/16/06, John Wilcox [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: This came up as a possible style standards issue here. Please reply off-list, and I'll summarize the results next week. Thanks for your time! A. Click the B and I buttons, or press Ctrl+B and Ctrl+I. B. Select Bold and Emphasis from the Character Catalog. -- Bill Swallow HATT List Owner WWP-Users List Owner 42.8162,-73.7736 http://techcommdood.blogspot.com I support Char James-Tanny for STC Secretary. ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
RE: POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics?
John Wilcox wrote: This came up as a possible style standards issue here. Please reply off-list, and I'll summarize the results next week. Thanks for your time! A. Click the B and I buttons, or press Ctrl+B and Ctrl+I. B. Select Bold and Emphasis from the Character Catalog. Well, everyone else is replying on list, so... I use named char tags always. Like Andrew Becraft, I prefer tags that provide metadata (indicate the purpose or meaning of the text). In the last round of template revisions, I had to back away from that somewhat to accommodate others' preferences and reduce the number of char tags. But we still have, for instance, Emphasis, NewTerm, and Title -- all defined as As Is + Italic. I've gone a step farther than most, though. Starting from Schlomo Perets' Express Customization kit for FM (no longer available for free; replaced by the more comprehensive Toolbar Plus; see www.MicroType.com), I've further customized my toolbars, menus, and shortcuts to remove all opportunities for ad hoc formatting. I don't have the B, I, and U buttons, or the Align Left, Center, and Align Right buttons. If I press Ctrl+B or Ctrl+I, it opens the character catalog. I've redefined over 60 shortcuts so they open a catalog instead of creating an override. The only way I can create an override or ad hoc formatting is via the Designer dialogs. If you're in charge of template compliance, and especially if you're a tech pubs manager, you might want to learn how to customize the FM interface -- it's much easier to avoid overrides and ad hoc formatting if the tools for creating them simply aren't there. :-) Richard -- Richard G. Combs Senior Technical Writer Polycom, Inc. richardDOTcombs AT polycomDOTcom 303-223-5111 -- rgcombs AT gmailDOTcom 303-777-0436 -- ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
Re: POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics?
If you're in charge of template compliance, and especially if you're a tech pubs manager, you might want to learn how to customize the FM interface -- it's much easier to avoid overrides and ad hoc formatting if the tools for creating them simply aren't there. :-) Being a manager and until recently a template owner, I completely disagree. UI tweaks passively hinder misuse. Proper training and education for writers actively prevents misuse, and even initiates their own investigation into other ways to prevent needless headaches in a documentation effort. -- Bill Swallow HATT List Owner WWP-Users List Owner 42.8162,-73.7736 http://techcommdood.blogspot.com I support Char James-Tanny for STC Secretary. ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
RE: POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics?
I favor the idea that quality starts with designing the process to avoid mistakes. If we agree that formatting standards for documents produce quality documents, then logically we should set up our tools so that those standards are the only possible way to format. I haven't yet seen an instance where ad hoc formatting was absolutely necessary, but then again, I'm a relative newcomer. Someone should suggest an instance in which they had to override a character or paragraph tag. This, by the way, is why I am such a fan of structured FM. Note that I often *change* the definition of a character or paragraph format. Alas, I'm starting a department from scratch, so I have to design as I go. As much as I can, I change the template as soon as I'm sure my override is what I want. Quality also involves feedback. Joe Malin Technical Writer (408)625-1623 [EMAIL PROTECTED] www.tuvox.com The views expressed in this document are those of the sender, and do not necessarily reflect those of TuVox, Inc. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Bill Swallow Sent: Tuesday, January 17, 2006 6:44 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: framers@lists.frameusers.com Subject: Re: POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics? Maybe we could start a new thread, the horrors of FM inline styles, and how I survived the experience. ;-) Might be fun, eh? Might be. ;-) Horrors: * inability to globally update a document from a template (let's say you need to change style based on rebranding) * inability to get consistent output using WWP or M2G * one step farther away from going structured/XML * the WTF moments upon inheriting a book from another author * once you start manually overriding character formats, custom character and paragraph formats aren't far behind... ***chills*** ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
RE: POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics?
Bill Swallow wrote: Being a manager and until recently a template owner, I completely disagree. UI tweaks passively hinder misuse. Proper training and education for writers actively prevents misuse, and even initiates their own investigation into other ways to prevent needless headaches in a documentation effort. All well and good, but the certainty of retribution is better. In structured Frame, retribution is certain. Tell your writers that each document they turn in for edit/review will first be subjected to the following steps: 1. Open the writer's submission. 2. Open the applicable structured template. 3. Import formats from the template with Format/Overrides turned on. 4. Import the element definitions from the template with Format Rules Overrides turned on. 5. Validate the writer's submission to detect any structure violations, including detection of failure to enter values for required attributes. To impress new writers with all the implications of this process, have a sample demonstration document with instances of each type of violation, and demonstrate what happens when the above steps are taken. Dan Emory Associates FrameMaker/FrameMaker+SGML Document Design Database Publishing DW Emory [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
Re: POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics?
I favor the idea that quality starts with designing the process to avoid mistakes. What a silly notion! ;-) LOL!!! I totally agree with you, Joe. If we agree that formatting standards for documents produce quality documents, then logically we should set up our tools so that those standards are the only possible way to format. I haven't yet seen an instance where ad hoc formatting was absolutely necessary, but then again, I'm a relative newcomer. Someone should suggest an instance in which they had to override a character or paragraph tag. There is no reason why anyone *needs* to use overrides, really. It's a matter of want and the lack of understanding to know any other way around the problem (or lack of thought or planning to avoid the situation). This, by the way, is why I am such a fan of structured FM. It's growing on me, too. ;-) Note that I often *change* the definition of a character or paragraph format. Alas, I'm starting a department from scratch, so I have to design as I go. As much as I can, I change the template as soon as I'm sure my override is what I want. Quality also involves feedback. Designing as you go works, but you can still put some mechanics around it to best define your templates right the first time. Let's say you're working on book A and you need a custom style. It should be at that point that you raise the issue with your team and determine if books B and C would also use the format. If yes, then use it. Of no, then determine if it's an absolute need for book A or if you could go about it a bit differently with conventional styles. If you absolutely need it, build it into the core template and name it appropriately. We support over 400 books and use one set of core templates to do so. The trick is to know the information types at play in your product documentation and stick to them, and when unique cases come up, investigate their need before implementing anything. And, it takes much less time to do this than you'd think. The benefits? Ability to apply global template updates to all books with no manual intervention beyond applying the template, portability of information, and no need for custom learning of book mechanics from one project to the next. -- Bill Swallow HATT List Owner WWP-Users List Owner 42.8162,-73.7736 http://techcommdood.blogspot.com I support Char James-Tanny for STC Secretary. ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
Re: POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics?
And I'm a perfect example of this. As I wrote, when I started using Frame, I was told in no uncertain terms to stay the heck away from the toolbar. Fearing the wrath of the production guru, I complied. ;) In conclusion, if you are a manager, don't fix the interface, simply intimidate your workers into compliance. G Ron Bill Swallow wrote: If you're in charge of template compliance, and especially if you're a tech pubs manager, you might want to learn how to customize the FM interface -- it's much easier to avoid overrides and ad hoc formatting if the tools for creating them simply aren't there. :-) Being a manager and until recently a template owner, I completely disagree. UI tweaks passively hinder misuse. Proper training and education for writers actively prevents misuse, and even initiates their own investigation into other ways to prevent needless headaches in a documentation effort. -- Bill Swallow HATT List Owner WWP-Users List Owner 42.8162,-73.7736 http://techcommdood.blogspot.com I support Char James-Tanny for STC Secretary. ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/ronsmiller%40comcast.net Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info. ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
RE: POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics?
This is becoming way too many inbound emails for me. I hate to leave this discussion group, but Outlook filters don't seem to work because of the way the listserve functions. Any words of advice? If not, can someone please tell me how to unsubscribe? Thanks, Stacy -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Peter Gold Sent: Tuesday, January 17, 2006 11:28 AM To: Bill Swallow Cc: framers@lists.frameusers.com Subject: Re: POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics? Bill: One reason is to adjust text pagination, for final revision. Overriding keep-with, widow/orphan, start-position, and some other properties of paragraph formats may be necessary. However, it's easy to manage or restore original formatting by one or more of these methods: * Save a pagination-only copy of the file * Reapply the catalog definitions of the paragraph formats by importing them from the current document to itself, or by importing them from a master template, with Remove Manual Page Breaks, and Remove Other Format Overrides both turned on. An alternative approach is to create dedicated variations of paragraph formats; this means more formats to manage, and no easy to revert the custom tweaks, aside from having saved an untweaked copy. There is no reason why anyone *needs* to use overrides, really. It's a matter of want and the lack of understanding to know any other way around the problem (or lack of thought or planning to avoid the situation). -- Regards, Peter Gold KnowHow ProServices [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/stacydow%40yahoo-inc.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info. ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
Re: POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics?
One reason is to adjust text pagination, for final revision. Overriding keep-with, widow/orphan, start-position, and some other properties of paragraph formats may be necessary. However, it's easy to manage or restore original formatting by one or more of these methods: Trust me... if you put careful thought into how your information types are used in your documentation, no overrides are necessary, even for pagination. -- Bill Swallow HATT List Owner WWP-Users List Owner 42.8162,-73.7736 http://techcommdood.blogspot.com I support Char James-Tanny for STC Secretary. ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
RE: POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics?
I'm not sure I'd call this the ultimate redefinition solution because it completely ignores the fact that there should be some underlying *reason* why you need to present a word or phrase in boldface (or italic or whatever). A large segment of the people responding to the original survey question indicated that they use multiple character format names that all produce a boldface result, because the different tag names allow them to capture some semantic metadata about what makes the word or phrase special. My opinions only; I don't speak for Intel. Fred Ridder (fred dot ridder at intel dot com) Intel Parsippany, NJ -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Doug Sent: Tuesday, January 17, 2006 2:57 PM To: framers@lists.frameusers.com Subject: Re: POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics? I've redefined over 60 shortcuts so they open a catalog instead of creating an override. Of course, IMO the ultimate redefinition solution is to redefine the shortcuts so they apply character and/or paragraph formats. What could be simpler than redefining CTRL+B to apply a bold character format? This could benefit both novice and experienced writers alike. I'm surprised this functionality isn't built into Frame, or at least into Framescript (I haven't delved into the latter deeply enough to discover it, if FS does indeed possess this functionality). --Doug ___ ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics?
Ditto, we use "C". But we've managed to end up with a format named "Bold" too. We use that when we want to make something bold and one of the named formats doesn't apply. ;-( Using character formats isn't necessarily foolproof. Last week, someone accidentally updated one of our formats and made it use a particular font etc, instead of being "as is" for everything but the property it wanted to change. Don't suppose anyone knows of a way to prevent that? Cheers, Rebecca >>> "Joe Malin" 17/01/06 10:07:42 >>> If the methods are A. Click the B and I buttons, or press Ctrl+B and Ctrl+I. B. Select Bold and Emphasis from the Character Catalog. C: Create special character formats with meta-information (purpose or meaning). then I use C, although it may appear sometimes that I'm using B. While my brain was recovering from a bad sector, I named a character format "Bold" rather than "Strong". I also have some formats that use Italic instead of Emphasis. The horror, the horror! As Andrew noted, this may result in more tags or elements. Perhaps this is a good thing, if it makes us re-examine our typographical conventions. Joe Malin Technical Writer (408)625-1623 jmalin at tuvox.com www.tuvox.com The views expressed in this document are those of the sender, and do not necessarily reflect those of TuVox, Inc. -Original Message- From: framers-bounces+jmalin=tuvox@lists.frameusers.com [mailto:framers-bounces+jmalin=tuvox.com at lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of Andrew Becraft Sent: Monday, January 16, 2006 12:40 PM To: framers at lists.FrameUsers.com Subject: Re: POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics? John Wilcox wrote: > This came up as a possible style standards issue here. Please reply > off-list, and I'll summarize the results next week. Thanks for your > time! > > A. Click the B and I buttons, or press Ctrl+B and Ctrl+I. > B. Select Bold and Emphasis from the Character Catalog. Or: C: Create special character formats that indicate the purpose or meaning of the text (rather than their intended appearance) and apply them. ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as rebecca.officer at alliedtelesyn.co.nz. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscribe at lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/rebecca.officer%40alliedtelesyn.co.nz Send administrative questions to lisa at frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info. NOTICE: This message contains privileged and confidential information intended only for the use of the addressee named above. If you are not the intended recipient of this message you are hereby notified that you must not disseminate, copy or take any action in reliance on it. If you have received this message in error please notify Allied Telesyn Research Ltd immediately. Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender, except where the sender has the authority to issue and specifically states them to be the views of Allied Telesyn Research.
POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics?
In documents that will endure and need to be updated, its always via character styles In "throw-away" docs (e.g. one-time memo, fax cover page...) I use both named styles and ad hoc formatting: Control-B, Control-I, etc., depending on what is set up in the template. In structured docs there are special character-range formatting elements. On Monday, January 16, 2006 03:30 PM, John Wilcox wrote: | This came up as a possible style standards issue here. Please | reply off-list, and I'll summarize the results next week. | Thanks for your time! | | A. Click the B and I buttons, or press Ctrl+B and Ctrl+I. | B. Select Bold and Emphasis from the Character Catalog. - Lester --- Lester C. Smalley Email: lsmalley AT infocon DOT com Information Consultants, Inc. Phone: 302-239-2942 FAX: 302-239-1712 Yorklyn, DE 19736 Web: www.infocon.com ---
POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics?
I'm with Bill here, and it looks like 99% of the pollsters. Character catalog. ALWAYS, and FOREVER.
POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics?
> Maybe we could start a new thread, "the horrors of FM inline styles, and how > I survived the experience." ;-) > > Might be fun, eh? Might be. ;-) Horrors: * inability to globally update a document from a template (let's say you need to change style based on rebranding) * inability to get consistent output using WWP or M2G * one step farther away from going structured/XML * the WTF moments upon inheriting a book from another author * once you start manually overriding character formats, custom character and paragraph formats aren't far behind... ***chills*** -- Bill Swallow HATT List Owner WWP-Users List Owner 42.8162,-73.7736 http://techcommdood.blogspot.com I support Char James-Tanny for STC Secretary.
POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics?
John Wilcox wrote:
> This came up as a possible style standards issue here. Please
> reply off-list, and I'll summarize the results next week.
> Thanks for your time!
>
> A. Click the B and I buttons, or press Ctrl+B and Ctrl+I.
> B. Select Bold and Emphasis from the Character Catalog.
Well, everyone else is replying on list, so...
I use named char tags always. Like Andrew Becraft, I prefer tags that
provide metadata ("indicate the purpose or meaning of the text"). In the
last round of template revisions, I had to back away from that somewhat
to accommodate others' preferences and reduce the number of char tags.
But we still have, for instance, Emphasis, NewTerm, and Title -- all
defined as As Is + Italic.
I've gone a step farther than most, though. Starting from Schlomo
Perets' Express Customization kit for FM (no longer available for free;
replaced by the more comprehensive Toolbar Plus; see www.MicroType.com),
I've further customized my toolbars, menus, and shortcuts to remove all
opportunities for ad hoc formatting.
I don't have the B, I, and U buttons, or the Align Left, Center, and
Align Right buttons. If I press Ctrl+B or Ctrl+I, it opens the character
catalog. I've redefined over 60 shortcuts so they open a catalog instead
of creating an override.
The only way I can create an override or ad hoc formatting is via the
Designer dialogs.
If you're in charge of template compliance, and especially if you're a
tech pubs manager, you might want to learn how to customize the FM
interface -- it's much easier to avoid overrides and ad hoc formatting
if the tools for creating them simply aren't there. :-)
Richard
--
Richard G. Combs
Senior Technical Writer
Polycom, Inc.
richardDOTcombs AT polycomDOTcom
303-223-5111
--
rgcombs AT gmailDOTcom
303-777-0436
--
POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics?
At 9:25 am -0700 17/1/06, Combs, Richard wrote: >If you're in charge of template compliance, and especially if you're a >tech pubs manager, you might want to learn how to customize the FM >interface -- it's much easier to avoid overrides and ad hoc formatting ...and Silicon Prairie's Paragraph and Character tools provide an easy method of detecting character and paragraph format overrides. Although, unfortunately, not who applied them ;-) -- Steve (who also votes for metadataiferous separation of presentation and intent)
POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics?
> If you're in charge of template compliance, and especially if you're a > tech pubs manager, you might want to learn how to customize the FM > interface -- it's much easier to avoid overrides and ad hoc formatting > if the tools for creating them simply aren't there. :-) Being a manager and until recently a template owner, I completely disagree. UI tweaks passively hinder misuse. Proper training and education for writers actively prevents misuse, and even initiates their own investigation into other ways to prevent needless headaches in a documentation effort. -- Bill Swallow HATT List Owner WWP-Users List Owner 42.8162,-73.7736 http://techcommdood.blogspot.com I support Char James-Tanny for STC Secretary.
POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics?
Bra-vo! -Original Message- I've redefined over 60 shortcuts so they open a catalog instead of creating an override.
POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics?
Bill Swallow wrote: > Being a manager and until recently a template owner, I > completely disagree. UI tweaks passively hinder misuse. > Proper training and education for writers actively prevents > misuse, and even initiates their own investigation into other > ways to prevent needless headaches in a documentation effort. Well, horses for courses. But I came by my opinion from a non-manager perspective. The only person whose FM interface I have control over is _me_, and I've modified mine as I described in order to _help_me_ avoid errors or carelessness. Then again, maybe I just don't respect my own autonomy enough. ;-) Richard -- Richard G. Combs Senior Technical Writer Polycom, Inc. richardDOTcombs AT polycomDOTcom 303-223-5111 -- rgcombs AT gmailDOTcom 303-777-0436 --
POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics?
I favor the idea that quality starts with designing the process to avoid mistakes. If we agree that formatting standards for documents produce quality documents, then logically we should set up our tools so that those standards are the only possible way to format. I haven't yet seen an instance where ad hoc formatting was absolutely necessary, but then again, I'm a relative newcomer. Someone should suggest an instance in which they had to override a character or paragraph tag. This, by the way, is why I am such a fan of structured FM. Note that I often *change* the definition of a character or paragraph format. Alas, I'm starting a department from scratch, so I have to design as I go. As much as I can, I change the template as soon as I'm sure my override is what I want. Quality also involves feedback. Joe Malin Technical Writer (408)625-1623 jmalin at tuvox.com www.tuvox.com The views expressed in this document are those of the sender, and do not necessarily reflect those of TuVox, Inc. -Original Message- From: framers-bounces+jmalin=tuvox@lists.frameusers.com [mailto:framers-bounces+jmalin=tuvox.com at lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of Bill Swallow Sent: Tuesday, January 17, 2006 6:44 AM To: rmuller at morrowcorp.com Cc: framers at lists.frameusers.com Subject: Re: POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics? > Maybe we could start a new thread, "the horrors of FM inline styles, > and how I survived the experience." ;-) > > Might be fun, eh? Might be. ;-) Horrors: * inability to globally update a document from a template (let's say you need to change style based on rebranding) * inability to get consistent output using WWP or M2G * one step farther away from going structured/XML * the WTF moments upon inheriting a book from another author * once you start manually overriding character formats, custom character and paragraph formats aren't far behind... ***chills***
POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics?
> Bill Swallow wrote: > > Being a manager and until recently a template > owner, I completely disagree. UI tweaks passively hinder > misuse. Proper training and education for writers actively > prevents misuse, and even initiates their own investigation > into other ways to prevent needless headaches in a > documentation effort. All well and good, but the certainty of retribution is better. In structured Frame, retribution is certain. Tell your writers that each document they turn in for edit/review will first be subjected to the following steps: 1. Open the writer's submission. 2. Open the applicable structured template. 3. Import formats from the template with Format/Overrides turned on. 4. Import the element definitions from the template with Format Rules Overrides turned on. 5. Validate the writer's submission to detect any structure violations, including detection of failure to enter values for required attributes. To impress new writers with all the implications of this process, have a sample demonstration document with instances of each type of violation, and demonstrate what happens when the above steps are taken. Dan Emory & Associates FrameMaker/FrameMaker+SGML Document Design & Database Publishing DW Emory
POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics?
> I favor the idea that quality starts with designing the process to avoid > mistakes. What a silly notion! ;-) LOL!!! I totally agree with you, Joe. > If we agree that formatting standards for documents produce quality > documents, then logically we should set up our tools so that those > standards are the only possible way to format. I haven't yet seen an > instance where ad hoc formatting was absolutely necessary, but then > again, I'm a relative newcomer. Someone should suggest an instance in > which they had to override a character or paragraph tag. There is no reason why anyone *needs* to use overrides, really. It's a matter of want and the lack of understanding to know any other way around the problem (or lack of thought or planning to avoid the situation). > This, by the way, is why I am such a fan of structured FM. It's growing on me, too. ;-) > Note that I often *change* the definition of a character or paragraph > format. Alas, I'm starting a department from scratch, so I have to > design as I go. As much as I can, I change the template as soon as I'm > sure my override is what I want. Quality also involves feedback. Designing as you go works, but you can still put some mechanics around it to best define your templates right the first time. Let's say you're working on book A and you need a custom style. It should be at that point that you raise the issue with your team and determine if books B and C would also use the format. If yes, then use it. Of no, then determine if it's an absolute need for book A or if you could go about it a bit differently with conventional styles. If you absolutely need it, build it into the core template and name it appropriately. We support over 400 books and use one set of core templates to do so. The trick is to know the information types at play in your product documentation and stick to them, and when unique cases come up, investigate their need before implementing anything. And, it takes much less time to do this than you'd think. The benefits? Ability to apply global template updates to all books with no manual intervention beyond applying the template, portability of information, and no need for custom learning of book mechanics from one project to the next. -- Bill Swallow HATT List Owner WWP-Users List Owner 42.8162,-73.7736 http://techcommdood.blogspot.com I support Char James-Tanny for STC Secretary.
POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics?
Bill, You're singing to the choir dude. ;-) I planned out a global template for the long term. It's worked well for over four years and some 100+ manuals so far. What you describe as "The benefits" are exactly what I'm reaping as a result. It's a beautiful thing! Certainly worth the little bit of extra development time it took to do. Rita Muller Technical Writer Morrow Technologies Corporation >>And, it takes much less time to do this than you'd think. The benefits? Ability to apply global template updates to all books with no manual intervention beyond applying the template, portability of information, and no need for custom learning of book mechanics from one project to the next. -- Bill Swallow<<
POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics?
Bill: One reason is to adjust text pagination, for final revision. Overriding keep-with, widow/orphan, start-position, and some other properties of paragraph formats may be necessary. However, it's easy to manage or restore original formatting by one or more of these methods: * Save a pagination-only copy of the file * Reapply the catalog definitions of the paragraph formats by importing them from the "current" document to itself, or by importing them from a master template, with Remove Manual Page Breaks, and Remove Other Format Overrides both turned on. An alternative approach is to create dedicated variations of paragraph formats; this means more formats to manage, and no easy to revert the custom tweaks, aside from having saved an untweaked copy. >There is no reason why anyone *needs* to use overrides, really. It's a >matter of want and the lack of understanding to know any other way >around the problem (or lack of thought or planning to avoid the >situation). -- Regards, Peter Gold KnowHow ProServices peter at knowhowpro.com
POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics?
And I'm a perfect example of this. As I wrote, when I started using Frame, I was told in no uncertain terms to stay the heck away from the toolbar. Fearing the wrath of the production guru, I complied. ;) In conclusion, if you are a manager, don't fix the interface, simply intimidate your workers into compliance. Ron Bill Swallow wrote: >>If you're in charge of template compliance, and especially if you're a >>tech pubs manager, you might want to learn how to customize the FM >>interface -- it's much easier to avoid overrides and ad hoc formatting >>if the tools for creating them simply aren't there. :-) > > > Being a manager and until recently a template owner, I completely > disagree. UI tweaks passively hinder misuse. Proper training and > education for writers actively prevents misuse, and even initiates > their own investigation into other ways to prevent needless headaches > in a documentation effort. > > -- > Bill Swallow > HATT List Owner > WWP-Users List Owner > 42.8162,-73.7736 > http://techcommdood.blogspot.com > > I support Char James-Tanny for STC Secretary. > ___ > > > You are currently subscribed to Framers as ronsmiller at comcast.net. > > To unsubscribe send a blank email to > framers-unsubscribe at lists.frameusers.com > or visit > http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/ronsmiller%40comcast.net > > Send administrative questions to lisa at frameusers.com. Visit > http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info. >
POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics?
This is becoming way too many inbound emails for me. I hate to leave this discussion group, but Outlook filters don't seem to work because of the way the listserve functions. Any words of advice? If not, can someone please tell me how to unsubscribe? Thanks, Stacy -Original Message- From: framers-bounces+stacydow=yahoo-inc@lists.frameusers.com [mailto:framers-bounces+stacydow=yahoo-inc.com at lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of Peter Gold Sent: Tuesday, January 17, 2006 11:28 AM To: Bill Swallow Cc: framers at lists.frameusers.com Subject: Re: POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics? Bill: One reason is to adjust text pagination, for final revision. Overriding keep-with, widow/orphan, start-position, and some other properties of paragraph formats may be necessary. However, it's easy to manage or restore original formatting by one or more of these methods: * Save a pagination-only copy of the file * Reapply the catalog definitions of the paragraph formats by importing them from the "current" document to itself, or by importing them from a master template, with Remove Manual Page Breaks, and Remove Other Format Overrides both turned on. An alternative approach is to create dedicated variations of paragraph formats; this means more formats to manage, and no easy to revert the custom tweaks, aside from having saved an untweaked copy. >There is no reason why anyone *needs* to use overrides, really. It's a >matter of want and the lack of understanding to know any other way >around the problem (or lack of thought or planning to avoid the >situation). -- Regards, Peter Gold KnowHow ProServices peter at knowhowpro.com ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as stacydow at yahoo-inc.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscribe at lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/stacydow%40yahoo-inc.com Send administrative questions to lisa at frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics?
> One reason is to adjust text pagination, for final revision. > Overriding keep-with, widow/orphan, start-position, and some other > properties of paragraph formats may be necessary. However, it's easy > to manage or restore original formatting by one or more of these > methods: Trust me... if you put careful thought into how your information types are used in your documentation, no overrides are necessary, even for pagination. -- Bill Swallow HATT List Owner WWP-Users List Owner 42.8162,-73.7736 http://techcommdood.blogspot.com I support Char James-Tanny for STC Secretary.
POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics?
Now if Ron (of all people) could be intimidated into compliance, then it *must* work! LOL!!! Seriously though, you get more mileage from shared knowledge than from systematic limitations. On 1/17/06, Ron Miller wrote: > And I'm a perfect example of this. As I wrote, when I started using > Frame, I was told in no uncertain terms to stay the heck away from the > toolbar. Fearing the wrath of the production guru, I complied. ;) > > In conclusion, if you are a manager, don't fix the interface, simply > intimidate your workers into compliance. -- Bill Swallow HATT List Owner WWP-Users List Owner 42.8162,-73.7736 http://techcommdood.blogspot.com I support Char James-Tanny for STC Secretary.
POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics?
> I've redefined over 60 shortcuts so they open a catalog instead > of creating an override. Of course, IMO the ultimate redefinition solution is to redefine the shortcuts so they apply character and/or paragraph formats. What could be simpler than redefining CTRL+B to apply a bold character format? This could benefit both novice and experienced writers alike. I'm surprised this functionality isn't built into Frame, or at least into Framescript (I haven't delved into the latter deeply enough to discover it, if FS does indeed possess this functionality). --Doug
POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics?
I'm not sure I'd call this the "ultimate redefinition solution" because it completely ignores the fact that there should be some underlying *reason* why you need to present a word or phrase in boldface (or italic or whatever). A large segment of the people responding to the original survey question indicated that they use multiple character format names that all produce a boldface result, because the different tag names allow them to capture some semantic metadata about what makes the word or phrase special. My opinions only; I don't speak for Intel. Fred Ridder (fred dot ridder at intel dot com) Intel Parsippany, NJ -Original Message- From: framers-bounces+fred.ridder=intel@lists.frameusers.com [mailto:framers-bounces+fred.ridder=intel.com at lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of Doug Sent: Tuesday, January 17, 2006 2:57 PM To: framers at lists.frameusers.com Subject: Re: POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics? > I've redefined over 60 shortcuts so they open a catalog instead > of creating an override. Of course, IMO the ultimate redefinition solution is to redefine the shortcuts so they apply character and/or paragraph formats. What could be simpler than redefining CTRL+B to apply a bold character format? This could benefit both novice and experienced writers alike. I'm surprised this functionality isn't built into Frame, or at least into Framescript (I haven't delved into the latter deeply enough to discover it, if FS does indeed possess this functionality). --Doug ___
POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics?
- Original Message -
From: "Doug" <dbailey4...@gmail.com>
To:
Sent: Tuesday, January 17, 2006 2:57 PM
Subject: Re: POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics?
> I've redefined over 60 shortcuts so they open a catalog instead
> of creating an override.
Of course, IMO the ultimate redefinition solution is to redefine the
shortcuts so they apply character and/or paragraph formats. What
could be simpler than redefining CTRL+B to apply a bold character
format? This could benefit both novice and experienced writers alike.
I'm surprised this functionality isn't built into Frame, or at least
into Framescript (I haven't delved into the latter deeply enough to
discover it, if FS does indeed possess this functionality).
--Doug
Hello All,
Funny that you should mention this. I wrote up this short FrameScript script
today. It traps the Ctl-B or the Bold formatting button (also the Ctl-I or
Italic button) and applies the named format instead. It will also create the
character format if it is not already present. You can choose any name you
wish (or better yet, choose an appropriate name from your template).
This script must be installed because it is an event script that waits
quietly in the background for an appropriate event to occur.
This script can serve as a template for overriding just about any Frame
Function that translates into an FCode.
Frank Elmore
Project leader for FrameScript
//--
// This is an Event Script. It must be 'Installed' to function. Use the
FrameScript->Install command or
// the Install Script FrameScript command.
// You can replace the Character Format names below with ones of your own
choosing.
Event Initialize
// Names of the character formats to create/apply
Set gvTxtBoldCharFmtName = 'MyBold';
Set gvTxtItalicCharFmtName = 'MyItalic';
EndEvent
Event NotePreFunction
If FrameDoc
If IParm = eUtl.FCode{'TxtBold'} // FCode for the Ctl-B or Bold
Formatting Button
Run ApplyBoldCharFmtToSelection pvDoc(FrameDoc);
Return Cancel; // Cancel the original BOLD (Ctl-B or B Button)
command
ElseIf IParm = eUtl.FCode{'TxtItalic'} // FCode for the Ctl-I or
Italic Formatting Button
Run ApplyItalicCharFmtToSelection pvDoc(FrameDoc);
Return Cancel; // Cancel the original ITALIC (Ctl-I or I Button)
command
EndIf
EndIf
EndEvent
// The following subroutine gets the Character Format (specified by
gvTxtBoldCharFmtName) and applies
// it to the current selection. A new character format is created if it does
not exist.
Sub ApplyBoldCharFmtToSelection using pvDoc
Local lvCharFmt;
Get Object DocObject(pvDoc) Type(CharFmt) Name(gvTxtBoldCharFmtName)
NewVar(lvCharFmt);
If lvCharFmt = 0
// If not present, make a new one
Local lvStat lvPos;
Find Member('Bold') InList(FontWeightNames) ReturnStatus(lvStat)
ReturnPos(lvPos);
If lvStat
// Create character format with everything As Is except the Font
weight which is Bold.
New CharFmt NewVar(lvCharFmt) DocObject(pvDoc)
Name(gvTxtBoldCharFmtName) FontWeight(lvPos - 1);
EndIf
EndIf
If lvCharFmt
Apply TextProperties TextRange(pvDoc.TextSelection)
Properties(lvCharFmt.Properties);
EndIf
EndSub
// The following subroutine gets the Character Format (specified by
gvTxtItalicCharFmtName) and applies
// it to the current selection. A new character format is created if it does
not exist.
Sub ApplyItalicCharFmtToSelection using pvDoc
Local lvCharFmt;
Get Object DocObject(pvDoc) Type(CharFmt) Name(gvTxtItalicCharFmtName)
NewVar(lvCharFmt);
If lvCharFmt = 0
// If not present, make a new one
Local lvStat lvPos;
Find Member('Italic') InList(FontAngleNames) ReturnStatus(lvStat)
ReturnPos(lvPos);
If lvStat
// Create character format with everything As Is except the Font
Angle which is Italic.
New CharFmt NewVar(lvCharFmt) DocObject(pvDoc)
Name(gvTxtItalicCharFmtName) FontAngle(lvPos - 1);
EndIf
EndIf
If lvCharFmt
Apply TextProperties TextRange(pvDoc.TextSelection)
Properties(lvCharFmt.Properties);
EndIf
EndSub
___
You are currently subscribed to Framers as elmsoft at comcast.net.
To unsubscribe send a blank email to
framers-unsubscribe at lists.frameusers.com
or visit
http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/elmsoft%40comcast.net
Send administrative questions to lisa at frameusers.com. Visit
http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
RE: POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics?
John, I must assume you are looking at Unstructured FrameMaker users. In Structured FrameMaker, if you haven't accommodated your Character Tags with an Element, or Elements, both of the methods you list are blown away as soon as you reapply the EDD. My answer is through a Phrase Element that has, as attributes, Bold, Emphasis (Italics), etc. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] m] On Behalf Of John Wilcox Sent: Monday, January 16, 2006 2:30 PM To: 'framers@lists.FrameUsers.com' Subject: POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics? This came up as a possible style standards issue here. Please reply off-list, and I'll summarize the results next week. Thanks for your time! A. Click the B and I buttons, or press Ctrl+B and Ctrl+I. B. Select Bold and Emphasis from the Character Catalog. _ Regards, John Wilcox, Technical Writer Zetron, Redmond The information contained in this message may be privileged and confidential and protected from disclosure. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, or an employee or agent responsible for delivering this message to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any reproduction, dissemination or distribution of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us immediately by replying to the message and deleting it from your computer. Thank you. Tellabs ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
Re: POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics?
Character catalog John Posada Senior Technical Writer So long and thanks for all the fish. ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
Re: POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics?
When I started using Frame a number of years ago, I was told in no uncertain terms by the person who designed the template to stay away from the Bold and Italic buttons. In fact, I was told to assume they didn't exist. So for me, at least, since I've kept that lesson with me always, it's B. Ron John Wilcox wrote: This came up as a possible style standards issue here. Please reply off-list, and I'll summarize the results next week. Thanks for your time! A. Click the B and I buttons, or press Ctrl+B and Ctrl+I. B. Select Bold and Emphasis from the Character Catalog. _ Regards, John Wilcox, Technical Writer Zetron, Redmond ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/ronsmiller%40comcast.net Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info. ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
Re: POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics?
Hi, John. John Wilcox wrote: This came up as a possible style standards issue here. Please reply off-list, and I'll summarize the results next week. Thanks for your time! A. Click the B and I buttons, or press Ctrl+B and Ctrl+I. B. Select Bold and Emphasis from the Character Catalog. I created specific items in the Character Catalog and apply them as needed. The Control-B and Control-I approach is too easy to accidentally remove. Zaeem ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
RE: POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics?
Ditto, we use C. But we've managed to end up with a format named Bold too. We use that when we want to make something bold and one of the named formats doesn't apply. ;-( Using character formats isn't necessarily foolproof. Last week, someone accidentally updated one of our formats and made it use a particular font etc, instead of being as is for everything but the property it wanted to change. Don't suppose anyone knows of a way to prevent that? Cheers, Rebecca Joe Malin [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17/01/06 10:07:42 If the methods are A. Click the B and I buttons, or press Ctrl+B and Ctrl+I. B. Select Bold and Emphasis from the Character Catalog. C: Create special character formats with meta-information (purpose or meaning). then I use C, although it may appear sometimes that I'm using B. While my brain was recovering from a bad sector, I named a character format Bold rather than Strong. I also have some formats that use Italic instead of Emphasis. The horror, the horror! As Andrew noted, this may result in more tags or elements. Perhaps this is a good thing, if it makes us re-examine our typographical conventions. Joe Malin Technical Writer (408)625-1623 [EMAIL PROTECTED] www.tuvox.com The views expressed in this document are those of the sender, and do not necessarily reflect those of TuVox, Inc. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Andrew Becraft Sent: Monday, January 16, 2006 12:40 PM To: framers@lists.FrameUsers.com Subject: Re: POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics? John Wilcox wrote: This came up as a possible style standards issue here. Please reply off-list, and I'll summarize the results next week. Thanks for your time! A. Click the B and I buttons, or press Ctrl+B and Ctrl+I. B. Select Bold and Emphasis from the Character Catalog. Or: C: Create special character formats that indicate the purpose or meaning of the text (rather than their intended appearance) and apply them. ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/rebecca.officer%40alliedtelesyn.co.nz Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info. NOTICE: This message contains privileged and confidential information intended only for the use of the addressee named above. If you are not the intended recipient of this message you are hereby notified that you must not disseminate, copy or take any action in reliance on it. If you have received this message in error please notify Allied Telesyn Research Ltd immediately. Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender, except where the sender has the authority to issue and specifically states them to be the views of Allied Telesyn Research. ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
RE: POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics?
Press Ctrl+B Ctrl+I -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of John Wilcox Sent: Monday, January 16, 2006 3:30 PM To: 'framers@lists.FrameUsers.com' Subject: POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics? This came up as a possible style standards issue here. Please reply off-list, and I'll summarize the results next week. Thanks for your time! A. Click the B and I buttons, or press Ctrl+B and Ctrl+I. B. Select Bold and Emphasis from the Character Catalog. _ Regards, John Wilcox, Technical Writer Zetron, Redmond ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/convextech%40alltel.net Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info. ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
Re: POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics?
Character catalog. Always. On 1/16/06, John Wilcox [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: This came up as a possible style standards issue here. Please reply off-list, and I'll summarize the results next week. Thanks for your time! A. Click the B and I buttons, or press Ctrl+B and Ctrl+I. B. Select Bold and Emphasis from the Character Catalog. -- Bill Swallow HATT List Owner WWP-Users List Owner 42.8162,-73.7736 http://techcommdood.blogspot.com I support Char James-Tanny for STC Secretary. ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics?
This came up as a possible style standards issue here. Please reply off-list, and I'll summarize the results next week. Thanks for your time! A. Click the B and I buttons, or press Ctrl+B and Ctrl+I. B. Select Bold and Emphasis from the Character Catalog. _ Regards, John Wilcox, Technical Writer Zetron, Redmond
POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics?
John, I must assume you are looking at Unstructured FrameMaker users. In Structured FrameMaker, if you haven't accommodated your Character Tags with an Element, or Elements, both of the methods you list are blown away as soon as you reapply the EDD. My answer is through a Phrase Element that has, as attributes, Bold, Emphasis (Italics), etc. -Original Message- From: framers-bounces+david.spreadbury=tellabs@lists.frameusers.com [mailto:framers-bounces+david.spreadbury=tellabs.com at lists.frameusers.co m] On Behalf Of John Wilcox Sent: Monday, January 16, 2006 2:30 PM To: 'framers at lists.FrameUsers.com' Subject: POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics? This came up as a possible style standards issue here. Please reply off-list, and I'll summarize the results next week. Thanks for your time! A. Click the B and I buttons, or press Ctrl+B and Ctrl+I. B. Select Bold and Emphasis from the Character Catalog. _ Regards, John Wilcox, Technical Writer Zetron, Redmond The information contained in this message may be privileged and confidential and protected from disclosure. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, or an employee or agent responsible for delivering this message to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any reproduction, dissemination or distribution of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us immediately by replying to the message and deleting it from your computer. Thank you. Tellabs
POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics?
Character catalog John Posada Senior Technical Writer "So long and thanks for all the fish."
POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics?
> From: Spreadbury, David [mailto:david.spreadbury at tellabs.com] > I must assume you are looking at Unstructured FrameMaker users. Yes, Unstructed FM. I should have specified that. :) jw
POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics?
John Wilcox wrote: > This came up as a possible style standards issue here. Please reply > off-list, and I'll summarize the results next week. Thanks for your > time! > > A. Click the B and I buttons, or press Ctrl+B and Ctrl+I. > B. Select Bold and Emphasis from the Character Catalog. Or: C: Create special character formats that indicate the purpose or meaning of the text (rather than their intended appearance) and apply them. Taking DocBook as my model, I've created GUILabel, GUIButton, and GUIMenu formats -- all bold. Similarly, UserInput and Filename are both Courier New italic. Doing it this way, I can change my mind about how I want to display these inline text elements without having to reapply character formats throughout the document. The same applies to single-sourcing. I might want to render elements that are formatted the same way in print differently in HTML. Yes, this means I have more character formats than I might otherwise have. No, I'm not using Structure. :-) Andrew Becraft Senior Technical Writer Singlestep Technologies, Seattle
POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics?
When I started using Frame a number of years ago, I was told in no uncertain terms by the person who designed the template to stay away from the Bold and Italic buttons. In fact, I was told to assume they didn't exist. So for me, at least, since I've kept that lesson with me always, it's B. Ron John Wilcox wrote: > This came up as a possible style standards issue here. Please reply > off-list, and I'll summarize the results next week. Thanks for your time! > > A. Click the B and I buttons, or press Ctrl+B and Ctrl+I. > B. Select Bold and Emphasis from the Character Catalog. > > _ > Regards, > John Wilcox, Technical Writer > Zetron, Redmond > > > > > ___ > > > You are currently subscribed to Framers as ronsmiller at comcast.net. > > To unsubscribe send a blank email to > framers-unsubscribe at lists.frameusers.com > or visit > http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/ronsmiller%40comcast.net > > Send administrative questions to lisa at frameusers.com. Visit > http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info. >
POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics?
Hi, John. John Wilcox wrote: > This came up as a possible style standards issue here. Please reply > off-list, and I'll summarize the results next week. Thanks for your time! > > A. Click the B and I buttons, or press Ctrl+B and Ctrl+I. > B. Select Bold and Emphasis from the Character Catalog. I created specific items in the Character Catalog and apply them as needed. The Control-B and Control-I approach is too easy to accidentally remove. Zaeem
POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics?
If the methods are A. Click the B and I buttons, or press Ctrl+B and Ctrl+I. B. Select Bold and Emphasis from the Character Catalog. C: Create special character formats with meta-information (purpose or meaning). then I use C, although it may appear sometimes that I'm using B. While my brain was recovering from a bad sector, I named a character format "Bold" rather than "Strong". I also have some formats that use Italic instead of Emphasis. The horror, the horror! As Andrew noted, this may result in more tags or elements. Perhaps this is a good thing, if it makes us re-examine our typographical conventions. Joe Malin Technical Writer (408)625-1623 jmalin at tuvox.com www.tuvox.com The views expressed in this document are those of the sender, and do not necessarily reflect those of TuVox, Inc. -Original Message- From: framers-bounces+jmalin=tuvox@lists.frameusers.com [mailto:framers-bounces+jmalin=tuvox.com at lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of Andrew Becraft Sent: Monday, January 16, 2006 12:40 PM To: framers at lists.FrameUsers.com Subject: Re: POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics? John Wilcox wrote: > This came up as a possible style standards issue here. Please reply > off-list, and I'll summarize the results next week. Thanks for your > time! > > A. Click the B and I buttons, or press Ctrl+B and Ctrl+I. > B. Select Bold and Emphasis from the Character Catalog. Or: C: Create special character formats that indicate the purpose or meaning of the text (rather than their intended appearance) and apply them.
POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics?
Press Ctrl+B & Ctrl+I -Original Message- From: framers-bounces+convextech=alltel@lists.frameusers.com [mailto:framers-bounces+convextech=alltel.net at lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of John Wilcox Sent: Monday, January 16, 2006 3:30 PM To: 'framers at lists.FrameUsers.com' Subject: POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics? This came up as a possible style standards issue here. Please reply off-list, and I'll summarize the results next week. Thanks for your time! A. Click the B and I buttons, or press Ctrl+B and Ctrl+I. B. Select Bold and Emphasis from the Character Catalog. _ Regards, John Wilcox, Technical Writer Zetron, Redmond ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as convextech at alltel.net. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscribe at lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/convextech%40alltel.net Send administrative questions to lisa at frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics?
Character catalog! Karen L. Zorn Zorn Technologies, Inc. Mesa, AZ -Original Message- From: framers-bounces+k.zorn=zorntech@lists.frameusers.com [mailto:framers-bounces+k.zorn=zorntech.com at lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of rebecca officer Sent: Monday, January 16, 2006 2:32 PM To: framers at lists.FrameUsers.com; John Wilcox >> "Joe Malin" 17/01/06 10:07:42 >>> If the methods are A. Click the B and I buttons, or press Ctrl+B and Ctrl+I. B. Select Bold and Emphasis from the Character Catalog. C: Create special character formats with meta-information (purpose or meaning). then I use C, although it may appear sometimes that I'm using B. While my brain was recovering from a bad sector, I named a character format "Bold" rather than "Strong". I also have some formats that use Italic instead of Emphasis. The horror, the horror! As Andrew noted, this may result in more tags or elements. Perhaps this is a good thing, if it makes us re-examine our typographical conventions. Joe Malin Technical Writer (408)625-1623 jmalin at tuvox.com www.tuvox.com The views expressed in this document are those of the sender, and do not necessarily reflect those of TuVox, Inc. -Original Message- From: framers-bounces+jmalin=tuvox@lists.frameusers.com [mailto:framers-bounces+jmalin=tuvox.com at lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of Andrew Becraft Sent: Monday, January 16, 2006 12:40 PM To: framers at lists.FrameUsers.com Subject: Re: POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics? John Wilcox wrote: > This came up as a possible style standards issue here. Please reply > off-list, and I'll summarize the results next week. Thanks for your > time! > > A. Click the B and I buttons, or press Ctrl+B and Ctrl+I. > B. Select Bold and Emphasis from the Character Catalog. Or: C: Create special character formats that indicate the purpose or meaning of the text (rather than their intended appearance) and apply them. ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as rebecca.officer at alliedtelesyn.co.nz. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscribe at lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/rebecca.officer%40allied telesyn.co.nz Send administrative questions to lisa at frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info. NOTICE: This message contains privileged and confidential information intended only for the use of the addressee named above. If you are not the intended recipient of this message you are hereby notified that you must not disseminate, copy or take any action in reliance on it. If you have received this message in error please notify Allied Telesyn Research Ltd immediately. Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender, except where the sender has the authority to issue and specifically states them to be the views of Allied Telesyn Research. ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as k.zorn at zorntech.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscribe at lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/k.zorn%40zorntech.com Send administrative questions to lisa at frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
POLL: Which method do you use to apply bold and italics?
Character catalog. Always. On 1/16/06, John Wilcox wrote: > This came up as a possible style standards issue here. Please reply > off-list, and I'll summarize the results next week. Thanks for your time! > > A. Click the B and I buttons, or press Ctrl+B and Ctrl+I. > B. Select Bold and Emphasis from the Character Catalog. -- Bill Swallow HATT List Owner WWP-Users List Owner 42.8162,-73.7736 http://techcommdood.blogspot.com I support Char James-Tanny for STC Secretary.
