I notice that the online archive and the emails I've received all stop
at Thursday, Aug. 6th...
Did I missing something, or has everyone just been *really* quiet for
six days?
- CONFIDENTIAL-
This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential, and may also be
legally privileged.
Hi All,
I'm working on a DITA/Frame project right now and am faced with a graphics
challenge go figure. The client currently uses EPS illustrations with
callouts and leader lines applied to the drawing in the Frame graphics box.
Most are simple lettered callouts but there are also some
Is there a problem with the Mailman software? I haven't received a
message from the list since last Thursday. I just checked the archives
(so the server is up), and the last message there is from Thursday, too.
Richard G. Combs
Senior Technical Writer
Polycom, Inc.
richard.co...@polycom.com
Hi,
I have a table with titles in the header area and
also in the left column (let's say the headers
are stats and the lines are cities), and would
like the header cell in the upper left corner to
have a diagonal line from top left to bottom
right where I could type Stats above the diagonal
It seems that the problem with the page numbering in the TOC was that
one paragraph was shifting to the next page when I updated the TOC, but
it was not shifting to the next page in the PDF. I haven't quite figured
out how that could have happened, but I solved the problem for now buy
reducing
I'm having two problems with a TOC (using Frame 9 p237).
1. The page numbers for a lot of the TOC entries are wrong. When I click
on the links they go to the right pages, but not the pages listed in the
TOC. It starts in the middle of one of the chapters - the page numbers
in the TOC is one
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Hi, everyone.
Is there a way to establish variables in the first file in your book file and
have them carry through all the remaining files?
The appeal is, I establish book title, part number, and rev date variables on
the cover page of my book; I then use those variables in the headers and
Hello Fellow Framers,
I thought Ian's instructions over at
http://www.sundorne.com/FrameMaker/Freeware/setPrint.htm were pretty
straightforward, but when I tried to follow them, my copy of FM9 (with
the TCS 2.0) isn't setting the default to Adobe PDF as it should.
I downloaded the SetPrint.dll
We're in the final (hopefully) stages of setting up our FrameMaker
documentation set of manuals to generate PDF and HTML files as part of a
nightly build, and the programmers are somewhat surprised at how
difficult this has been. We have FrameMaker 7.2 running on Windows XP.
We're using Mif2Go to
The Layer Assistant was recently integrated into the Presentation Assistant
(v.3), offering the following capabilities:
-- Text/Symbol Layer shortcuts
Add the specified string, associated with a layer (with control over font,
size and color; horizontal/vertical location adjustment)
-- Shape
What do you call it when you exit a program and return to the main log
in screen:
log out, logout or
log off, logoff
Best regards,
Verner
Radiometer Medical ApS
Akandevej 21
2700 Bronshoj
Denmark
Phone: +45 38 27 38 27
CVR: 27
We're in the final (hopefully) stages of setting up our FrameMaker
documentation set of manuals to generate PDF and HTML files as part of a
nightly build, and the programmers are somewhat surprised at how
difficult this has been. We have FrameMaker 7.2 running on Windows XP.
We're using Mif2Go to
Dear Fellow Framers,
I am a prat! I've figured out what I did wrong - I put the SetPrint
stuff in the wrong Plugins folder - I seem to have 2:
C:\Program Files\Adobe\Adobe Technical Communication Suite 2\Adobe
FrameMaker 9\plugins
and
C:\Program Files\Adobe\Adobe Technical Communication
I'm using FM8 to build PDF documents
Yesterday, I spent quite a while building a flowchart. Each step is a hotspot
that takes them to the relavant topic in the manual. I got it done just in
time to insert it to the manual, PDF it and send it to tech. support.
Today, I'd like to take that
Dear all,
while downloading Skype, I noticed a nice zoom effect on screenshots of their
procedure:
http://www.skype.com/intl/en/download/skype/windows/downloading/
Do you know which tool can do this (possible with Snagit?)
Thank you all!
Mathieu
I have a client who is using the new Framemaker 9.0 on her windows xp
machine. She is trying to output a 30% spot color plus her black for
the printer.
No matter whether we print to postscript or create a pdf directly, the
color always comes out at 100 percent. We even tried building a new
No, just (yet another) server outage, I think.
The Free Framers list (hosted at omsys.com, the Tech Comm Suite Users
group (http://groups.google.com/group/TCS-Users?hl=en, and the Adobe
User-to-user forum are more reliable.
Art
Art Campbell
art.campb...@gmail.com
... In my
Mollye:
There was some discussion of images in DITA last month in this thread:
http://lists.frameusers.com/pipermail/framers/2009-July/017669.html
You might find useful information there.
Nadine
--- On Wed, 8/12/09, Mollye Barrett mol...@clearpath.cc wrote:
From: Mollye Barrett
Set up one file in the book with the variables the way you want 'em.
Then, in the book file, select all the files to which you want to
apply them and execute File Import Formats.
Select Variables. Apply.
Art
Art Campbell
art.campb...@gmail.com
... In my opinion, there's
Two points...
The directions actually say to create a SetPrint directory _under_
\Plugins, which I don't think you did. (then copy SetPrint.dll to a
new directory named C:\Program
Files\Adobe\FrameMaker6.0\fminit\Plugins\SetPrint)
And the web page does point out that it was only tested with FM 6
Anybody have any experience with SetPrint in FM 9? Does having the TCS
make any difference?
It's working fine for me in FM9, but I don't have TCS.
Mike Wickham
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We call it log out, unless the app has a specific button to sign out or
log off. Meaning call it whatever the button says, if there is more than
just clicking the red X in Windows.
Hope that helps!
Kristy
-Original Message-
From: framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com
Yes, there must have been a problem. There's a similar posting from
Carla Martinek. That's why I re-sent my email to the list; it never
showed up and no one responded. Sorry about the duplicate, and thanks
Nadine for the answer. I had forgotten about WebWorks.
Mailman seems to be back.
Fei Min
Are you using runfm.exe from Omsys, or some other method?
And, what, specifically is or isn't happening?
Art
Art Campbell
art.campb...@gmail.com
... In my opinion, there's nothing in this world beats a '52
Vincent and a redheaded girl. -- Richard Thompson
I have looked before but not found any Frame built-in capability that did this.
BookVars is the best way to go here! I could not do without it. My
most-oft-used add-on! :)
Z
-Original Message-
From: framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com
[mailto:framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com] On
Try keying in:
Esc F l k
the file lock command toggle, and see if anything changes. You should
see the menus change immediately and be able to work in the file.
If nothing at all happens, do it a second time to toggle it off.
Art Campbell
art.campb...@gmail.com
... In my
If it is a web site or something like that, I would use either log out
or log off as the instruction.
However, if it is a local program, then a simple exit the program or
exit is better.
Z
-Original Message-
From: framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com
Short Answer:
No.
Longer answer with mini rant:
It is just a conditional format except we can't adjust its properties.
(although, I have had some success saving it down to 7.2 and adjusting
it there).
It is a particular pet peeve of mine. People are used to seeing added
text in red - and the
DELANO Karen V (AREVA NP INC) would like to recall the message, Can we change
the track text edit marker colours in FM8?.
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To
Hello,
I have a question about the Headings reference page. Has anyone
ever modified it by changing its name? Does anyone know anyone who
has? I need to find out if the name is likely to change on a project.
Wait, two questions. Has anyone, even if the name of the page was
changed, ever
Classification: NOT PROTECTIVELY MARKED
I don't know if this is a bug but I can't find anything about it
anywhere else.
I have a number of docs with text insets. When I do an update, an extra
carriage return is added at the end of the inset which duplicates the
paratag of the first line of
We use log out and log in. Some companies use log off an log on.
Meenakshi
--
Meenakshi Sharma
Director of Marketing
eGain Communications
Mountain View, CA
On Mon, Aug 17, 2009 at 7:19 AM, Andersen, Verner Engell VEA
verner.ander...@radiometer.dk wrote:
What do you call it when you exit a
Hi fellow Framers
I appreciate this group and have found it very helpful when working on projects.
I am currently seeking a new employment opportunity in the SF Bay Area.? If any
of you have leads for a contract or perm job, please pass them along.
Thank you so much..
Deborah
Hi Cynthia
I don't know if this will help or not...I ran into something many years ago,
only it was an autonumbered paragraph not a page break. After much futzing,
fiddling and testing, I came up with something that works.
1. Make sure the end-of-file marker is immediately after the last
My team had issues with this a long time ago until we considered the
gerund and past tense forms of the term:
logout--logouting; log out--logging out.
Logout--logouted; log out--logged out.
As a result, the terms log out and log in made more sense.
Jon Harvey
Manager, Desktop Documentation
Milton, Cynthia wrote:
I have a number of docs with text insets. When I do an update, an
extra
carriage return is added at the end of the inset which duplicates the
paratag of the first line of the inset. The first paratag is a section
head with a page break, so this also is duplicated. The
Hi Karen,
I am pretty sure I replied to Heidi directly, but you can change the
color/style properties with FrameScript. If you are interested in a script
to do it, please contact me off list. Thank you very much.
Rick Quatro
Carmen Publishing Inc.
r...@frameexpert.com
585-659-8267
Short
Eduardo,
You wrote:
Next: The dilemma. I am trying to figure out whether FrameMaker
has the capability of being able to make or handle the issue of font
transparency. Yup, being able to view a graphic behind the text in
front of itartsy stuff.
The theoretical is having a graphic and
Hi, all.
As stated previously, I am aware of the Import function.
I thought I had read of some way to set up some document features once, in the
book file, and have them ripple automatically through the rest of the book
files. My question is, has anyone heard of this?
Thanks.
It would be
Hi Framers,
I have Frame 8 with all the updates/patches running on a WinXp system
with 3gig RAM, 500gig HD, and a 2GHz Core 2 CPU. I have about 55
drawings imported by reference in a single Frame file. When one or more
of the imported by reference drawings changes, Frame gives the option to
Nancy,
You can do it with cross references, but that can have it's own set of
problems.
You need to use each variable at least once in your title chapter. Each
one has to be in a paragraph by itself, possibly be on an unused master
page. Then create a cross reference marker in the paragraph that
Is it possible that either you've imported the PDF of the chart into
the frame that held the drawn graphic chart, or you've inadvertently
copied a frame on top of the frame that contains the chart? I suspect
this happened when you dragged the frame on the master page, if, while
you held Ctrl to
Amazon has it for $1699. Only 2 left in stock ...
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Technical-Communication-Suite-2/dp/B001OBGLZ
W/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8qid=1250609744sr=8-1
Z
-Original Message-
From: framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com
[mailto:framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of
Rick,
The only way that I can see is that something in the path or filename of the
graphics must be different or you aren't saving the Frame file once you have
redirected the file to point to the proper graphic file location.
When you open a Frame file, that can't locate a referenced graphic, and
Thank you for your quick response David. I cant get by the Missing File
window. I can click on ignore or skip 100 times and Frame just keeps
redisplaying the Missing File window. Frame will not allow me to skip or
ignore, I cannot get access to the Frame file unless I update to the new
drawing.
Nancy Allison wrote:
As stated previously, I am aware of the Import function.
I thought I had read of some way to set up some document features
once, in
the book file, and have them ripple automatically through the rest of
the
book files. My question is, has anyone heard of this?
Rick,
On your first email, I opened a graphic and made some edits. I did not
change the graphic filename. Then open the corresponding Frame file without
any problems.
I renamed the graphic file and reopened the Frame book. When it ran into the
missing graphic, I selected Ignore and it just
I'm not seeing in your mention that you're working on the Master pages
that control formatting for all pages in a file. Any global changes
such as this need to be made on Master pages, not the body pages that
carry the copy (and which are controlled by the Masters).
Art
Art Campbell
If you mean the dialog boxes with the magnified buttons, it looks like a
composite graphic to me. You could do that in any image editing software.
Nadine
--- On Tue, 8/18/09, mathieu jacquet bobi...@hotmail.com wrote:
From: mathieu jacquet bobi...@hotmail.com
Subject: Nice zoom effect
To:
Yes I did simply modify the specific page rather than the Master Page but I've
now had some wonderful help from Rick Quattro and I understand what I did wrong
- hopefully I'll remember all the details for next time!
He talked me through the process, I've re-imported all the entries and
In the Missing File dialog, you're selecting Ignore All Missing Files
and clicking Continue, and FM just keeps displaying the dialog? That's
decidedly odd...
YES, exactly ! Or skip.
-Original Message-
From: Combs, Richard [mailto:richard.co...@polycom.com]
Sent: Tuesday, August 18,
Peter,
You win the prize! I had a text frame covering the entire chart. I
often inadvertently copy by continuing to hold the Ctrl key while I
attempt to move a frame. I'm sure that must've happened and I didn't
notice.
Thanks for solving the mystery and saving me a ton of time!
Judy
Peter
I was unemployed for a while a few years ago and through the generosity
of Omni Systems, I received a copy of MIF2Go. After the response below,
wash as MIF caught my attention I Googled it. This appears to be a
function of MIF2Go, I am probably stating what everyone already knows
:-) Anyway, I do
Hi Rick:
As far as I know, you have to install Mif2Go to get the Wash via MIF
option on the File menu. If you don't still have your copy, you could
download the trial version and see if that feature works for you.
Fei Min
-Original Message-
From: framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com
I always thought that Wash as MIF could also mean, Save an FM file as a
MIF file within FM, then open it in FM. It's a habit from the previous
century. Am I misinformed?...Kelly.
-Original Message-
From: framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com
[mailto:framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com] On
No, SaveAs MIF and the Omsys Wash As MIF menu entry do the same thing.
Only difference is that SaveAs takes a couple manual steps and the
menu is a single click.
Art
Art Campbell
art.campb...@gmail.com
... In my opinion, there's nothing in this world beats a '52
Vincent and a
Yes, that's right. Then you'll get the following added to your menu to
simplify the whole MIF-saving and reopening process:
http://tinypic.com/r/98ht00/3.
Jim
-Original Message-
From: framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com
[mailto:framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of Fei Min
I still have my copy of MIF2Go, I just don't know if there were any changes
over the years, and the menu option is not there. But I will do the Save as Mif
from Framemaker and see if that addresses the problem.
Rick
-Original Message-
From: framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com
Boy do I feel stupid :-)
I am trying to open a file to save it as a MIF file to clean out any
impurities that I am unable to open because of the impurities. I cannot get by
the Missing File box! HELP :-)
-Original Message-
From: framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com
For the record, the Wash as MIF command works perfectly in the free trial
version of Mif2Go. The only thing affected by the trial version vs. the fully
licensed version is that the word order is randomized in many of the converted
output formats (e.g. HTML Help) so that you cannot use the
Oops, l should be the one feeling stupid for recommending the MIF save when the
problem is that you can't successfully open the file. Duh!
Will heroic open get you past the Missing File dialog?
Or another approach to try is using FileImportFile to import the content of
the reluctant file
Richard Melanson wrote:
Boy do I feel stupid :-)
I am trying to open a file to save it as a MIF file to clean out any
impurities that I am unable to open because of the impurities. I
cannot
get by the Missing File box! HELP :-)
Um, you can't open it because it can't find one or more
My apologies Richard, you did state this in an earlier response.
I use the import by reference function as a kind of alerting system. My
Engineering group has a bunch of directories filled with schematic and
mechanical drawings they convert to jpg or png or pdf. I then import by
reference from
Stephen,
The only thing I can think of is to make an anchored frame in the cell
and locate it outside the frame, then move it over the cell and make a
diagonal line touching the middle of the cell border lines (corners).
Then resize the frame and locate it so that it will show the whole
line.
If
Fei Min,
Have you considered FrameScript? There are a lot of guys on this list
that could help with that (not me, though :-( ).
Bodvar Bjorgvinsson
2009/8/17 Fei Min Lorente feimin.lore...@onsemi.com:
We're in the final (hopefully) stages of setting up our FrameMaker
documentation set of
Nancy,
At my last full-time position we developed our documents to a
telecommunications spec. In the spec there is defined a DocID (Document
Identifier) file. In this file, which is not published with the book, we had
place holders for all of the book-wide variables; title, doc no., doc date,
Richard Melanson wrote:
I use the import by reference function as a kind of alerting system.
My
Engineering group has a bunch of directories filled with schematic and
mechanical drawings they convert to jpg or png or pdf. I then import
by
reference from these directories into my Frame file
Bodvar Bjorgvinsson wrote:
I would say that combined in one word each referenced item is
a noun. So when you log in (out) you have the state of login
(logout), as in a login window.
Yes, the usual rule is noun form is one word, verb form is two. To this I
would add that many style guides
Thank you for your input Richard, unfortunately, I am completely
dependent on them and their system, when they are changing a file, it is
moved to a pending directory. I have no say in this matter. I am just
doing the best I can with what I have. Any idea why I still have the
problem? Thank you.
Hi, Judy:
On Tue, Aug 18, 2009 at 12:55 PM, Judyj...@hypack.com wrote:
Peter,
You win the prize! I had a text frame covering the entire chart. I often
inadvertently copy by continuing to hold the Ctrl key while I attempt to
move a frame. I'm sure that must've happened and I didn't notice.
Hello,
With Acrobat Pro when I print FM books to PS and the convert to PDFs the
colored images become grey. Any idea why? Do I need to change/configure any
settings? I do not face this issue when I print a MS Word file to PS and then
to PDF.
B/R
Garnier
Yahoo! recommends that you
Exactly how are you printing FM books to PS?
Assuming that you really want to manually produce PostScript and then distill
same,
the proper manner to do this is to print to the Adobe PDF PostScript Printer
Driver
instance but directed to file. That method uses the Distiller PPD. My best
guess
Dear all,
while downloading Skype, I noticed a nice zoom effect on screenshots of their
procedure:
http://www.skype.com/intl/en/download/skype/windows/downloading/
Do you know which tool can do this (possible with Snagit?)
Thank you all!
Mathieu
I have a client who is using the new Framemaker 9.0 on her windows xp
machine. She is trying to output a 30% spot color plus her black for
the printer.
No matter whether we print to postscript or create a pdf directly, the
color always comes out at 100 percent. We even tried building a new
No, just (yet another) server outage, I think.
The Free Framers list (hosted at omsys.com, the Tech Comm Suite Users
group (http://groups.google.com/group/TCS-Users?hl=en, and the Adobe
User-to-user forum are more reliable.
Art
Art Campbell
art.campbell at gmail.com
"... In my
>From the originating address of the responses I would venture a guess that
the mail server is down.
All of the responses are coming from framers-bounces at lists.frameusers.com.
David Spreadbury
Sr, Technical Writer
-Original Message-
From: framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com
Mollye:
There was some discussion of images in DITA last month in this thread:
http://lists.frameusers.com/pipermail/framers/2009-July/017669.html
You might find useful information there.
Nadine
--- On Wed, 8/12/09, Mollye Barrett wrote:
From: Mollye Barrett
Subject:
Set up one file in the book with the variables the way you want 'em.
Then, in the book file, select all the files to which you want to
apply them and execute File > Import > Formats.
Select Variables. Apply.
Art
Art Campbell
art.campbell at gmail.com
"... In my opinion, there's
Two points...
The directions actually say to create a SetPrint directory _under_
\Plugins, which I don't think you did. ("then copy SetPrint.dll to a
new directory named C:\Program
Files\Adobe\FrameMaker6.0\fminit\Plugins\SetPrint")
And the web page does point out that it was only tested with FM
Yay! The list is working again!
David Spreadbury wrote:
> From the originating address of the responses I would venture a guess
that
> the mail server is down.
>
> All of the responses are coming from
framers-bounces at lists.frameusers.com.
You're letting the word "bounces" fool you. That's
> Anybody have any experience with SetPrint in FM 9? Does having the TCS
> make any difference?
It's working fine for me in FM9, but I don't have TCS.
Mike Wickham
We call it log out, unless the app has a specific button to sign out or
log off. Meaning call it whatever the button says, if there is more than
just clicking the red X in Windows.
Hope that helps!
Kristy
-Original Message-
From: framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com
Yes, there must have been a problem. There's a similar posting from
Carla Martinek. That's why I re-sent my email to the list; it never
showed up and no one responded. Sorry about the duplicate, and thanks
Nadine for the answer. I had forgotten about WebWorks.
Mailman seems to be back.
Fei Min
Are you using runfm.exe from Omsys, or some other method?
And, what, specifically is or isn't happening?
Art
Art Campbell
art.campbell at gmail.com
"... In my opinion, there's nothing in this world beats a '52
Vincent and a redheaded girl." -- Richard Thompson
Somebody rebooted the mail server. Things are good, again!!
-Original Message-
From: Combs, Richard [mailto:richard.co...@polycom.com]
Sent: Tuesday, August 18, 2009 9:34 AM
To: David Spreadbury; framers at lists.frameusers.com
Subject: RE: Problem with list?
Yay! The list is working
I have looked before but not found any Frame built-in capability that did this.
BookVars is the best way to go here! I could not do without it. My
most-oft-used add-on! :)
Z
-Original Message-
From: framers-bounces at lists.frameusers.com
[mailto:framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com]
Try keying in:
Esc F l k
the file lock command toggle, and see if anything changes. You should
see the menus change immediately and be able to work in the file.
If nothing at all happens, do it a second time to toggle it off.
Art Campbell
art.campbell at gmail.com
"... In my
If it is a web site or something like that, I would use either "log out"
or "log off" as the instruction.
However, if it is a local program, then a simple "exit the program" or
"exit" is better.
Z
-Original Message-
From: framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com
[mailto:framers-bounces at
We use "log out" and "log in." Some companies use "log off an "log on."
Meenakshi
--
Meenakshi Sharma
Director of Marketing
eGain Communications
Mountain View, CA
On Mon, Aug 17, 2009 at 7:19 AM, Andersen, Verner Engell VEA <
verner.andersen at radiometer.dk> wrote:
> What do you call it when
Hi fellow Framers
I appreciate this group and have found it very helpful when working on projects.
I am currently seeking a new employment opportunity in the SF Bay Area.? If any
of you have leads for a contract or perm job, please pass them along.
Thank you so much..
Deborah
Hi Cynthia
I don't know if this will help or not...I ran into something many years ago,
only it was an autonumbered paragraph not a page break. After much futzing,
fiddling and testing, I came up with something that works.
1. Make sure the end-of-file marker is immediately after the last
My team had issues with this a long time ago until we considered the
gerund and past tense forms of the term:
logout-->logouting; log out-->logging out.
Logout-->logouted; log out-->logged out.
As a result, the terms "log out" and "log in" made more sense.
Jon Harvey
Manager, Desktop
Milton, Cynthia wrote:
> I have a number of docs with text insets. When I do an update, an
extra
> carriage return is added at the end of the inset which duplicates the
> paratag of the first line of the inset. The first paratag is a section
> head with a page break, so this also is duplicated.
Hi Karen,
I am pretty sure I replied to Heidi directly, but you can change the
color/style properties with FrameScript. If you are interested in a script
to do it, please contact me off list. Thank you very much.
Rick Quatro
Carmen Publishing Inc.
rick at frameexpert.com
585-659-8267
Short
Eduardo,
You wrote:
> Next: The dilemma. I am trying to figure out whether FrameMaker
>has the capability of being able to make or handle the issue of font
>transparency. Yup, being able to view a graphic behind the text in
>front of it"artsy" stuff.
> The theoretical is having a
Hi Fei Min,
For FrameMaker scripting, nothing beats FrameScript. I have written a bunch
of FrameMaker to PDF scripts over the years.
Rick Quatro
Carmen Publishing Inc.
rick at frameexpert.com
585-659-8267
-Original Message-
From: framers-boun...@lists.frameusers.com
Hi, all.
As stated previously, I am aware of the Import function.
I thought I had read of some way to set up some document features once, in the
book file, and have them ripple automatically through the rest of the book
files. My question is, has anyone heard of this?
Thanks.
> It would be
Hi Framers,
I have Frame 8 with all the updates/patches running on a WinXp system
with 3gig RAM, 500gig HD, and a 2GHz Core 2 CPU. I have about 55
drawings imported by reference in a single Frame file. When one or more
of the imported by reference drawings changes, Frame gives the option to
Nancy,
You can do it with cross references, but that can have it's own set of
problems.
You need to use each variable at least once in your title chapter. Each
one has to be in a paragraph by itself, possibly be on an unused master
page. Then create a cross reference marker in the paragraph that
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