Re: ISO image: where is the CLANG compiler?

[A. Wilcox]

On 19/01/17 03:16, O. Hartmann wrote:
> I created images on CURRENT of my own - they all lack in the ability of having
> the necessary tools aboard. So I consider every image useless for rescue
> operations except, maybe, the DVD image - but this one is not provided 
> anymore.
> For what reason? Time? Accepted. Space/disk usage? Well, welcome back in the
> stoneage of computer technology ... 
> 
> I remember faintly that there was a small discussion on the @CURRENT list, but
> I didn't realize that the result would be the extraction of the compiler.
> 
> Just for the record: most servers delivered to us do not have CD/DVD drives
> anymore - they are outdated and considered an extra these days. Purchasing 1 
> GB
> USB thumbdrives is getting even harder, smallest size my employer provides now
> is 2 GB. And most optical drives are DVD. From my point of view - and this is 
> a
> personal view - the "standard" is > 1GB so there is no need to break down by
> force the FreeBSD image (if size is the reason) down to < 800 MB or < 1 GB. 
> I'd
> consider having < 2GB the line of standards (2 GB USB mem drive).
> And for those, with need of very small images, smaller images could be 
> provided
> as the extra.


Installation media is not rescue media.  Perhaps there should be a
dedicated rescue disc that does not contain bsdinstall and the sets (we
used to have "fixit" media until at least 8.x days).

Everything else I have to say, I have said before:

 Forwarded Message 
Received: (qmail 20810 invoked from network); 12 Jul 2016 21:08:51 -
Subject: Re: FreeBSD-11.0-BETA1-amd64-disc1.iso is too big for my 700MB CD-r
To: freebsd-current@freebsd.org
From: A. Wilcox 
Message-ID: <5785692e.8090...@wilcox-tech.com>
Date: Tue, 12 Jul 2016 17:03:26 -0500
In-Reply-To: <51734d0a-60da-6439-b5c1-1af14e740...@multiplay.co.uk>

On 12/07/16 15:58, Steven Hartland wrote:
> On 12/07/2016 21:50, Slawa Olhovchenkov wrote:
>> On Tue, Jul 12, 2016 at 01:39:34PM -0700, Conrad Meyer wrote:
>>
>>> Maybe Tier 2 can deal with just bootonly.iso.  Or your machines should
>>> be dropped from Tier 2 if they don't support USB and we aren't okay
>>> with dropping disc1 support for all of Tier 2.

That is pretty much all SPARC hardware and a lot of POWER hardware.  Not
to mention newer rack-mount servers that have no USB on front (IBM).

And what of the servers that already have functional CD drives?  Do we
really now have to recommending buying SCSI/SATA slimline or USB DVD
drives just to boot installation media?  That's a heavy cost when you
can fit nearly all other BSDs on a single regular 650 (84 MB for NetBSD
7.0.1 + 223 MB for OpenBSD 5.9 + 385 MB for "TrueOS"/PC-BSD Server 10.3
= 692 MB, all sizes amd64 install iso including sets).

>> Not all BIOS can be boot from USB.
>> I am have Fujitsu notebook not support USB boot.
> From a USB Pen drive I can understand but from a USB DVD Drive that
> would be some seriously antiquated hardware!

I have a Core 2-era Xeon board (Wolfdale-DP, Intel 5000 based) that
cannot under any circumstances boot from a connected USB device.  It
won't boot from a USB DVD, USB CD, USB pen, or USB hard disk (USBMSC).
I hardly consider a server that is 7 years old "antiquated" though I
concede it is not the newest.

Beyond that, there are security issues with allowing servers to boot off
of any random USB device that an admin has lying around.  Most will be
configured by good admins to not do such a thing.

In summary: NAK NAK NAK.  USB is not a solution.  Bringing down the
bloat on disc1 or returning to miniinst is the proper solution.

~arw


-- 
A. Wilcox (awilfox)
Open-source programmer (C, C++, Python)
https://code.foxkit.us/u/awilfox/



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Re: ISO image: where is the CLANG compiler?

[Jeffrey Bouquet]

On Sat, 21 Jan 2017 16:47:56 -0600, Benjamin Kaduk  wrote:

> On Thu, Jan 19, 2017 at 07:38:30PM +, Glen Barber wrote:
> > 
> > Random thought:
> > 
> > Brought up out-of-band, can you try this from a memstick.img and your
> > already-built userland/kernel to do what you had originally tried to
> > install the system?
> > 
> >  # make -C /usr/src WITHOUT_SYSTEM_COMPILER=1 DESTDIR=/wherever installworld
> > 
> > I think this is why cc(1)/clang(1) is not being used from /usr/obj, and
> > you don't have a compiler to compile the compiler.
> 
> Sorry for jumping in late, and thanks for bringing this up -- I was surprised
> that we had gone so long without someone making the claim that a compiler
> should not be necessary for installworld/installkernel (as was my 
> understanding).
> If indeed a compiler is necessary for those (perhaps only under certain
> circumstances such as those experienced by Oliver) it would be good to 
> understand
> why.
> 
> -Ben
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That may be a reason to develop the not-specific (sorry...) idea that 
installworld
should install to a small duplicate of  where it Does, and  complete, before 
the Actual
installworld so that if the latter cannot complete, a small rescue shell with 
rsync
embedded or an equivalent can copy the bare-minimum set of files over the 
mixture of new and old... which I have had to several times do more or less
piecemeal, and more often than not sufficed to bring the system back whole. 
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Re: ISO image: where is the CLANG compiler?

[O. Hartmann]

Am Thu, 19 Jan 2017 19:38:30 +
Glen Barber  schrieb:

> On Thu, Jan 19, 2017 at 07:10:00PM +, Glen Barber wrote:
> > On Thu, Jan 19, 2017 at 10:16:46AM +0100, O. Hartmann wrote:  
> > > On Thu, 19 Jan 2017 06:58:16 +0100
> > > Matthias Apitz  wrote:
> > >   
> > > > El día Wednesday, January 18, 2017 a las 08:00:04PM -0500, Allan Jude
> > > > escribió:
> > > >   
> > > > > On 2017-01-18 14:37, O. Hartmann wrote:
> > > > > > Am Wed, 18 Jan 2017 16:38:32 +0100
> > > > > > Matthias Apitz  schrieb:
> > > > > > 
> > > > > >> Why you do not just boot from USB some mem stick image, mount some 
> > > > > >> disk
> > > > > >> space to /mnt, svn checkout CURRENT to /mnt and build a booteable 
> > > > > >> system
> > > > > >> (world and kernel) and install to DESTDIR=/mnt ?
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >> I do not understand all this hassle?
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >>matthias
> > > > > >>
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > Wow!
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > As I initially stated, that is EXACTLY what I was inclined to do 
> > > > > > except
> > > > > > the fact that I had already an intact /usr/obj and usr/src with a
> > > > > > complete compiled system.
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > I booted from mem stick and I was lost due to no cc!
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > Even for "make installworld" it seems I have to rely on the 
> > > > > > compiler. And
> > > > > > the images (ISO, memstick et cetera) provided these days do not 
> > > > > > contain
> > > > > > any clang.
> > > > 
> > > > Yes, you will need it and it will complain about missing it, if for
> > > > example you moved 'obj and 'src' to other dirs after 'make build...'
> > > > 
> > > > But, in your case the mem image really is lacking the cc/clang; I
> > > > fetched the image an did:
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > # mdconfig -a -t vnode -u 1 -f
> > > > ~guru/Downloads/FreeBSD-11.0-RELEASE-amd64-memstick.img # mount -o
> > > > ro /dev/md1p3 /mnt # find /mnt -name clang
> > > > /mnt/usr/share/doc/llvm/clang
> > > > /mnt/usr/lib/clang
> > > > /mnt/usr/lib/debug/usr/lib/clang
> > > > # find /mnt -name cc
> > > > /mnt/usr/include/netinet/cc
> > > > 
> > > > With this img  alone, you can't compile a system :-(
> > > > 
> > > > Setup a system from DVD and build your own image containing a complete
> > > > system on an USB key; with this boot your damaged system, recompile and
> > > > reinstall world and kernel. If you (O. Hartmann) need a step by step
> > > > guide, I could send it to you.
> > > > 
> > > > matthias
> > > >   
> > > 
> > > Hello,
> > > 
> > > thanks for your help offering! very kind.
> > > 
> > > I've already solved the problem - not with the suggested process, but via
> > > copying missing libs and files from and identical intact source. After 
> > > that, I
> > > ran make buildword/buildkernel and was able to successfully install the 
> > > new
> > > system.
> > > 
> > > As I stated before: I already had a complete compiled world and kernel 
> > > existing
> > > in their proper, intact folders (usr/src and usr/obj). There was no need 
> > > to
> > > compile a whole world.
> > > Intending to "make installworld" failed, this is the real problem, 
> > > because the
> > > ISO/memstick images provided lack obviously in the required 
> > > infrastructure and
> > > so these images are worthless for sophisticated rescue operations - or 
> > > even
> > > such a simple ask as described initially in my posting.
> > > 
> > > I created images on CURRENT of my own - they all lack in the ability of 
> > > having
> > > the necessary tools aboard. So I consider every image useless for rescue
> > > operations except, maybe, the DVD image - but this one is not provided 
> > > anymore.
> > > For what reason? Time? Accepted. Space/disk usage? Well, welcome back in 
> > > the
> > > stoneage of computer technology ... 
> > > 
> > > I remember faintly that there was a small discussion on the @CURRENT 
> > > list, but
> > > I didn't realize that the result would be the extraction of the compiler.
> > > 
> > > Just for the record: most servers delivered to us do not have CD/DVD 
> > > drives
> > > anymore - they are outdated and considered an extra these days. 
> > > Purchasing 1 GB
> > > USB thumbdrives is getting even harder, smallest size my employer 
> > > provides now
> > > is 2 GB. And most optical drives are DVD. From my point of view - and 
> > > this is a
> > > personal view - the "standard" is > 1GB so there is no need to break down 
> > > by
> > > force the FreeBSD image (if size is the reason) down to < 800 MB or < 1 
> > > GB. I'd
> > > consider having < 2GB the line of standards (2 GB USB mem drive).
> > > And for those, with need of very small images, smaller images could be 
> > > provided
> > > as the extra.
> > >   
> > 
> > I do want to weigh in here and inform I am actively watching this
> > thread.  clang(1) is not in disc1.iso or bootonly.iso because the
> > MK_TOOLCHAIN knob is disabled in the 

Re: ISO image: where is the CLANG compiler?

[O. Hartmann]

Am Sat, 21 Jan 2017 22:20:01 +0100
"O. Hartmann"  schrieb:

> Am Thu, 19 Jan 2017 19:38:30 +
> Glen Barber  schrieb:
> 
> > On Thu, Jan 19, 2017 at 07:10:00PM +, Glen Barber wrote:  
> > > On Thu, Jan 19, 2017 at 10:16:46AM +0100, O. Hartmann wrote:
> > > > On Thu, 19 Jan 2017 06:58:16 +0100
> > > > Matthias Apitz  wrote:
> > > > 
> > > > > El día Wednesday, January 18, 2017 a las 08:00:04PM -0500, Allan Jude
> > > > > escribió:
> > > > > 
> > > > > > On 2017-01-18 14:37, O. Hartmann wrote:  
> > > > > > > Am Wed, 18 Jan 2017 16:38:32 +0100
> > > > > > > Matthias Apitz  schrieb:
> > > > > > >   
> > > > > > >> Why you do not just boot from USB some mem stick image, mount 
> > > > > > >> some disk
> > > > > > >> space to /mnt, svn checkout CURRENT to /mnt and build a 
> > > > > > >> booteable system
> > > > > > >> (world and kernel) and install to DESTDIR=/mnt ?
> > > > > > >>
> > > > > > >> I do not understand all this hassle?
> > > > > > >>
> > > > > > >>  matthias
> > > > > > >>  
> > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > Wow!
> > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > As I initially stated, that is EXACTLY what I was inclined to do 
> > > > > > > except
> > > > > > > the fact that I had already an intact /usr/obj and usr/src with a
> > > > > > > complete compiled system.
> > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > I booted from mem stick and I was lost due to no cc!
> > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > Even for "make installworld" it seems I have to rely on the 
> > > > > > > compiler. And
> > > > > > > the images (ISO, memstick et cetera) provided these days do not 
> > > > > > > contain
> > > > > > > any clang.  
> > > > > 
> > > > > Yes, you will need it and it will complain about missing it, if for
> > > > > example you moved 'obj and 'src' to other dirs after 'make build...'
> > > > > 
> > > > > But, in your case the mem image really is lacking the cc/clang; I
> > > > > fetched the image an did:
> > > > > 
> > > > > 
> > > > > # mdconfig -a -t vnode -u 1 -f
> > > > > ~guru/Downloads/FreeBSD-11.0-RELEASE-amd64-memstick.img # mount -o
> > > > > ro /dev/md1p3 /mnt # find /mnt -name clang
> > > > > /mnt/usr/share/doc/llvm/clang
> > > > > /mnt/usr/lib/clang
> > > > > /mnt/usr/lib/debug/usr/lib/clang
> > > > > # find /mnt -name cc
> > > > > /mnt/usr/include/netinet/cc
> > > > > 
> > > > > With this img  alone, you can't compile a system :-(
> > > > > 
> > > > > Setup a system from DVD and build your own image containing a complete
> > > > > system on an USB key; with this boot your damaged system, recompile 
> > > > > and
> > > > > reinstall world and kernel. If you (O. Hartmann) need a step by step
> > > > > guide, I could send it to you.
> > > > > 
> > > > >   matthias
> > > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > Hello,
> > > > 
> > > > thanks for your help offering! very kind.
> > > > 
> > > > I've already solved the problem - not with the suggested process, but 
> > > > via
> > > > copying missing libs and files from and identical intact source. After 
> > > > that, I
> > > > ran make buildword/buildkernel and was able to successfully install the 
> > > > new
> > > > system.
> > > > 
> > > > As I stated before: I already had a complete compiled world and kernel 
> > > > existing
> > > > in their proper, intact folders (usr/src and usr/obj). There was no 
> > > > need to
> > > > compile a whole world.
> > > > Intending to "make installworld" failed, this is the real problem, 
> > > > because the
> > > > ISO/memstick images provided lack obviously in the required 
> > > > infrastructure and
> > > > so these images are worthless for sophisticated rescue operations - or 
> > > > even
> > > > such a simple ask as described initially in my posting.
> > > > 
> > > > I created images on CURRENT of my own - they all lack in the ability of 
> > > > having
> > > > the necessary tools aboard. So I consider every image useless for rescue
> > > > operations except, maybe, the DVD image - but this one is not provided 
> > > > anymore.
> > > > For what reason? Time? Accepted. Space/disk usage? Well, welcome back 
> > > > in the
> > > > stoneage of computer technology ... 
> > > > 
> > > > I remember faintly that there was a small discussion on the @CURRENT 
> > > > list, but
> > > > I didn't realize that the result would be the extraction of the 
> > > > compiler.
> > > > 
> > > > Just for the record: most servers delivered to us do not have CD/DVD 
> > > > drives
> > > > anymore - they are outdated and considered an extra these days. 
> > > > Purchasing 1 GB
> > > > USB thumbdrives is getting even harder, smallest size my employer 
> > > > provides now
> > > > is 2 GB. And most optical drives are DVD. From my point of view - and 
> > > > this is a
> > > > personal view - the "standard" is > 1GB so there is no need to break 
> > > > down by
> > > > force the FreeBSD image (if size is the reason) down to < 800 MB or < 1 
> > > > GB. I'd
> > > > consider having 

Re: ISO image: where is the CLANG compiler?

[Benjamin Kaduk]

On Thu, Jan 19, 2017 at 07:38:30PM +, Glen Barber wrote:
> 
> Random thought:
> 
> Brought up out-of-band, can you try this from a memstick.img and your
> already-built userland/kernel to do what you had originally tried to
> install the system?
> 
>  # make -C /usr/src WITHOUT_SYSTEM_COMPILER=1 DESTDIR=/wherever installworld
> 
> I think this is why cc(1)/clang(1) is not being used from /usr/obj, and
> you don't have a compiler to compile the compiler.

Sorry for jumping in late, and thanks for bringing this up -- I was surprised
that we had gone so long without someone making the claim that a compiler
should not be necessary for installworld/installkernel (as was my 
understanding).
If indeed a compiler is necessary for those (perhaps only under certain
circumstances such as those experienced by Oliver) it would be good to 
understand
why.

-Ben
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Re: ISO image: where is the CLANG compiler?

[Matthias Apitz]

El d�a Friday, January 20, 2017 a las 09:39:06AM +0100, Andreas Nilsson 
escribi�:

> Good good. I am in no way opposed to the "infrastructure" change of
> separating the targets, sounds like a bit of makefile-fun actually. And
> having tools to create memsticks from ones preferred environment would be
> sweet.
> 
> Maybe someone could add a target in the makefiles for a rescue image, which
> basically would be the complete FreeBSD system one would get after untaring
> base, kernel and src?

One can install a complete system into a target directory:

# mkdir /foo
# make install DESTDIR=/foo

and use the scripts in src/release/*/make-memstick.sh
to create an image of the system below /foo

What else do you need?

matthias

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Re: ISO image: where is the CLANG compiler?

[Andreas Nilsson]

On Thu, Jan 19, 2017 at 8:58 PM, Glen Barber  wrote:

> On Thu, Jan 19, 2017 at 08:50:34PM +0100, Andreas Nilsson wrote:
> > On Thu, Jan 19, 2017 at 8:10 PM, Glen Barber  wrote:
> > > I do want to weigh in here and inform I am actively watching this
> > > thread.  clang(1) is not in disc1.iso or bootonly.iso because the
> > > MK_TOOLCHAIN knob is disabled in the targets that generate them.  This
> > > has actually been the case for quite some time for these images.
> > >
> > > dvd1.iso does contain clang, but very rarely (if ever, actually) are
> > > there dvd1.iso images produced for development snapshots.  This is, in
> > > part, solely because of the additional space/bandwidth required on the
> > > mirrors (not just mirrors controlled by the Project, but third-party
> > > mirrors as well).
> > >
> > > I am working on splitting out how the memstick.img and disc1.iso images
> > > are produced, but ran into a problem which I'm looking into a
> workaround
> > > that is backwards-compatible.  Since for USB images, a 700MB limit does
> > > not make sense, and right now it just so happens that the memstick.img
> > > is created from the same contents of disc1.iso.
> > >
> > > I know this does not help with the immediate issue, but wanted to chime
> > > in with I do see and understand the larger issue, and am working on
> > > a more long-term resolution instead of a one-line workaround.
> > >
> > >
> > Good to see discussion, but my 5c is: do not enlarge regular install
> media,
> > it is hefty enough. I'd rather see it shrink, although without the
> > limitations of old cd's rescue-env.
> >
> > Install media is install media, not live image. Live usb-sticks are so
> easy
> > to do on your own, why waste the Projects storage and bandwidth on it?
> >
>
> For cases like what initiated this thread, actually.  But, I'm not
> looking to increase the disc1.iso size, but separate the disc1.iso and
> memstick.img targets, which then can be created from different userland
> environments (one with /usr/bin/clang and one without, for example).
>
> But, I do agree with you that keeping the downloadable installer medium
> as small as possible (while still being usable for "rescue" cases like
> this) is ideal.
>
> Glen
>
>

Good good. I am in no way opposed to the "infrastructure" change of
separating the targets, sounds like a bit of makefile-fun actually. And
having tools to create memsticks from ones preferred environment would be
sweet.

Maybe someone could add a target in the makefiles for a rescue image, which
basically would be the complete FreeBSD system one would get after untaring
base, kernel and src?

Best regards
Andreas
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Re: ISO image: where is the CLANG compiler?

[Glen Barber]

On Thu, Jan 19, 2017 at 08:50:34PM +0100, Andreas Nilsson wrote:
> On Thu, Jan 19, 2017 at 8:10 PM, Glen Barber  wrote:
> > I do want to weigh in here and inform I am actively watching this
> > thread.  clang(1) is not in disc1.iso or bootonly.iso because the
> > MK_TOOLCHAIN knob is disabled in the targets that generate them.  This
> > has actually been the case for quite some time for these images.
> >
> > dvd1.iso does contain clang, but very rarely (if ever, actually) are
> > there dvd1.iso images produced for development snapshots.  This is, in
> > part, solely because of the additional space/bandwidth required on the
> > mirrors (not just mirrors controlled by the Project, but third-party
> > mirrors as well).
> >
> > I am working on splitting out how the memstick.img and disc1.iso images
> > are produced, but ran into a problem which I'm looking into a workaround
> > that is backwards-compatible.  Since for USB images, a 700MB limit does
> > not make sense, and right now it just so happens that the memstick.img
> > is created from the same contents of disc1.iso.
> >
> > I know this does not help with the immediate issue, but wanted to chime
> > in with I do see and understand the larger issue, and am working on
> > a more long-term resolution instead of a one-line workaround.
> >
> >
> Good to see discussion, but my 5c is: do not enlarge regular install media,
> it is hefty enough. I'd rather see it shrink, although without the
> limitations of old cd's rescue-env.
> 
> Install media is install media, not live image. Live usb-sticks are so easy
> to do on your own, why waste the Projects storage and bandwidth on it?
> 

For cases like what initiated this thread, actually.  But, I'm not
looking to increase the disc1.iso size, but separate the disc1.iso and
memstick.img targets, which then can be created from different userland
environments (one with /usr/bin/clang and one without, for example).

But, I do agree with you that keeping the downloadable installer medium
as small as possible (while still being usable for "rescue" cases like
this) is ideal.

Glen



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Re: ISO image: where is the CLANG compiler?

[Andreas Nilsson]

On Thu, Jan 19, 2017 at 8:10 PM, Glen Barber  wrote:

> On Thu, Jan 19, 2017 at 10:16:46AM +0100, O. Hartmann wrote:
> > On Thu, 19 Jan 2017 06:58:16 +0100
> > Matthias Apitz  wrote:
> >
> > > El día Wednesday, January 18, 2017 a las 08:00:04PM -0500, Allan Jude
> > > escribió:
> > >
> > > > On 2017-01-18 14:37, O. Hartmann wrote:
> > > > > Am Wed, 18 Jan 2017 16:38:32 +0100
> > > > > Matthias Apitz  schrieb:
> > > > >
> > > > >> Why you do not just boot from USB some mem stick image, mount
> some disk
> > > > >> space to /mnt, svn checkout CURRENT to /mnt and build a booteable
> system
> > > > >> (world and kernel) and install to DESTDIR=/mnt ?
> > > > >>
> > > > >> I do not understand all this hassle?
> > > > >>
> > > > >>matthias
> > > > >>
> > > > >
> > > > > Wow!
> > > > >
> > > > > As I initially stated, that is EXACTLY what I was inclined to do
> except
> > > > > the fact that I had already an intact /usr/obj and usr/src with a
> > > > > complete compiled system.
> > > > >
> > > > > I booted from mem stick and I was lost due to no cc!
> > > > >
> > > > > Even for "make installworld" it seems I have to rely on the
> compiler. And
> > > > > the images (ISO, memstick et cetera) provided these days do not
> contain
> > > > > any clang.
> > >
> > > Yes, you will need it and it will complain about missing it, if for
> > > example you moved 'obj and 'src' to other dirs after 'make build...'
> > >
> > > But, in your case the mem image really is lacking the cc/clang; I
> > > fetched the image an did:
> > >
> > >
> > > # mdconfig -a -t vnode -u 1 -f
> > > ~guru/Downloads/FreeBSD-11.0-RELEASE-amd64-memstick.img # mount -o
> > > ro /dev/md1p3 /mnt # find /mnt -name clang
> > > /mnt/usr/share/doc/llvm/clang
> > > /mnt/usr/lib/clang
> > > /mnt/usr/lib/debug/usr/lib/clang
> > > # find /mnt -name cc
> > > /mnt/usr/include/netinet/cc
> > >
> > > With this img  alone, you can't compile a system :-(
> > >
> > > Setup a system from DVD and build your own image containing a complete
> > > system on an USB key; with this boot your damaged system, recompile and
> > > reinstall world and kernel. If you (O. Hartmann) need a step by step
> > > guide, I could send it to you.
> > >
> > > matthias
> > >
> >
> > Hello,
> >
> > thanks for your help offering! very kind.
> >
> > I've already solved the problem - not with the suggested process, but via
> > copying missing libs and files from and identical intact source. After
> that, I
> > ran make buildword/buildkernel and was able to successfully install the
> new
> > system.
> >
> > As I stated before: I already had a complete compiled world and kernel
> existing
> > in their proper, intact folders (usr/src and usr/obj). There was no need
> to
> > compile a whole world.
> > Intending to "make installworld" failed, this is the real problem,
> because the
> > ISO/memstick images provided lack obviously in the required
> infrastructure and
> > so these images are worthless for sophisticated rescue operations - or
> even
> > such a simple ask as described initially in my posting.
> >
> > I created images on CURRENT of my own - they all lack in the ability of
> having
> > the necessary tools aboard. So I consider every image useless for rescue
> > operations except, maybe, the DVD image - but this one is not provided
> anymore.
> > For what reason? Time? Accepted. Space/disk usage? Well, welcome back in
> the
> > stoneage of computer technology ...
> >
> > I remember faintly that there was a small discussion on the @CURRENT
> list, but
> > I didn't realize that the result would be the extraction of the compiler.
> >
> > Just for the record: most servers delivered to us do not have CD/DVD
> drives
> > anymore - they are outdated and considered an extra these days.
> Purchasing 1 GB
> > USB thumbdrives is getting even harder, smallest size my employer
> provides now
> > is 2 GB. And most optical drives are DVD. From my point of view - and
> this is a
> > personal view - the "standard" is > 1GB so there is no need to break
> down by
> > force the FreeBSD image (if size is the reason) down to < 800 MB or < 1
> GB. I'd
> > consider having < 2GB the line of standards (2 GB USB mem drive).
> > And for those, with need of very small images, smaller images could be
> provided
> > as the extra.
> >
>
> I do want to weigh in here and inform I am actively watching this
> thread.  clang(1) is not in disc1.iso or bootonly.iso because the
> MK_TOOLCHAIN knob is disabled in the targets that generate them.  This
> has actually been the case for quite some time for these images.
>
> dvd1.iso does contain clang, but very rarely (if ever, actually) are
> there dvd1.iso images produced for development snapshots.  This is, in
> part, solely because of the additional space/bandwidth required on the
> mirrors (not just mirrors controlled by the Project, but third-party
> mirrors as well).
>
> I am working on splitting out how the memstick.img 

Re: ISO image: where is the CLANG compiler?

[Glen Barber]

On Thu, Jan 19, 2017 at 07:10:00PM +, Glen Barber wrote:
> On Thu, Jan 19, 2017 at 10:16:46AM +0100, O. Hartmann wrote:
> > On Thu, 19 Jan 2017 06:58:16 +0100
> > Matthias Apitz  wrote:
> > 
> > > El día Wednesday, January 18, 2017 a las 08:00:04PM -0500, Allan Jude
> > > escribió:
> > > 
> > > > On 2017-01-18 14:37, O. Hartmann wrote:  
> > > > > Am Wed, 18 Jan 2017 16:38:32 +0100
> > > > > Matthias Apitz  schrieb:
> > > > >   
> > > > >> Why you do not just boot from USB some mem stick image, mount some 
> > > > >> disk
> > > > >> space to /mnt, svn checkout CURRENT to /mnt and build a booteable 
> > > > >> system
> > > > >> (world and kernel) and install to DESTDIR=/mnt ?
> > > > >>
> > > > >> I do not understand all this hassle?
> > > > >>
> > > > >>  matthias
> > > > >>  
> > > > > 
> > > > > Wow!
> > > > > 
> > > > > As I initially stated, that is EXACTLY what I was inclined to do 
> > > > > except
> > > > > the fact that I had already an intact /usr/obj and usr/src with a
> > > > > complete compiled system.
> > > > > 
> > > > > I booted from mem stick and I was lost due to no cc!
> > > > > 
> > > > > Even for "make installworld" it seems I have to rely on the compiler. 
> > > > > And
> > > > > the images (ISO, memstick et cetera) provided these days do not 
> > > > > contain
> > > > > any clang.  
> > > 
> > > Yes, you will need it and it will complain about missing it, if for
> > > example you moved 'obj and 'src' to other dirs after 'make build...'
> > > 
> > > But, in your case the mem image really is lacking the cc/clang; I
> > > fetched the image an did:
> > > 
> > > 
> > > # mdconfig -a -t vnode -u 1 -f
> > > ~guru/Downloads/FreeBSD-11.0-RELEASE-amd64-memstick.img # mount -o
> > > ro /dev/md1p3 /mnt # find /mnt -name clang
> > > /mnt/usr/share/doc/llvm/clang
> > > /mnt/usr/lib/clang
> > > /mnt/usr/lib/debug/usr/lib/clang
> > > # find /mnt -name cc
> > > /mnt/usr/include/netinet/cc
> > > 
> > > With this img  alone, you can't compile a system :-(
> > > 
> > > Setup a system from DVD and build your own image containing a complete
> > > system on an USB key; with this boot your damaged system, recompile and
> > > reinstall world and kernel. If you (O. Hartmann) need a step by step
> > > guide, I could send it to you.
> > > 
> > >   matthias
> > > 
> > 
> > Hello,
> > 
> > thanks for your help offering! very kind.
> > 
> > I've already solved the problem - not with the suggested process, but via
> > copying missing libs and files from and identical intact source. After 
> > that, I
> > ran make buildword/buildkernel and was able to successfully install the new
> > system.
> > 
> > As I stated before: I already had a complete compiled world and kernel 
> > existing
> > in their proper, intact folders (usr/src and usr/obj). There was no need to
> > compile a whole world.
> > Intending to "make installworld" failed, this is the real problem, because 
> > the
> > ISO/memstick images provided lack obviously in the required infrastructure 
> > and
> > so these images are worthless for sophisticated rescue operations - or even
> > such a simple ask as described initially in my posting.
> > 
> > I created images on CURRENT of my own - they all lack in the ability of 
> > having
> > the necessary tools aboard. So I consider every image useless for rescue
> > operations except, maybe, the DVD image - but this one is not provided 
> > anymore.
> > For what reason? Time? Accepted. Space/disk usage? Well, welcome back in the
> > stoneage of computer technology ... 
> > 
> > I remember faintly that there was a small discussion on the @CURRENT list, 
> > but
> > I didn't realize that the result would be the extraction of the compiler.
> > 
> > Just for the record: most servers delivered to us do not have CD/DVD drives
> > anymore - they are outdated and considered an extra these days. Purchasing 
> > 1 GB
> > USB thumbdrives is getting even harder, smallest size my employer provides 
> > now
> > is 2 GB. And most optical drives are DVD. From my point of view - and this 
> > is a
> > personal view - the "standard" is > 1GB so there is no need to break down by
> > force the FreeBSD image (if size is the reason) down to < 800 MB or < 1 GB. 
> > I'd
> > consider having < 2GB the line of standards (2 GB USB mem drive).
> > And for those, with need of very small images, smaller images could be 
> > provided
> > as the extra.
> > 
> 
> I do want to weigh in here and inform I am actively watching this
> thread.  clang(1) is not in disc1.iso or bootonly.iso because the
> MK_TOOLCHAIN knob is disabled in the targets that generate them.  This
> has actually been the case for quite some time for these images.
> 
> dvd1.iso does contain clang, but very rarely (if ever, actually) are
> there dvd1.iso images produced for development snapshots.  This is, in
> part, solely because of the additional space/bandwidth required on the
> mirrors (not just mirrors controlled by the Project, 

Re: ISO image: where is the CLANG compiler?

[Glen Barber]

On Thu, Jan 19, 2017 at 10:16:46AM +0100, O. Hartmann wrote:
> On Thu, 19 Jan 2017 06:58:16 +0100
> Matthias Apitz  wrote:
> 
> > El día Wednesday, January 18, 2017 a las 08:00:04PM -0500, Allan Jude
> > escribió:
> > 
> > > On 2017-01-18 14:37, O. Hartmann wrote:  
> > > > Am Wed, 18 Jan 2017 16:38:32 +0100
> > > > Matthias Apitz  schrieb:
> > > >   
> > > >> Why you do not just boot from USB some mem stick image, mount some disk
> > > >> space to /mnt, svn checkout CURRENT to /mnt and build a booteable 
> > > >> system
> > > >> (world and kernel) and install to DESTDIR=/mnt ?
> > > >>
> > > >> I do not understand all this hassle?
> > > >>
> > > >>matthias
> > > >>  
> > > > 
> > > > Wow!
> > > > 
> > > > As I initially stated, that is EXACTLY what I was inclined to do except
> > > > the fact that I had already an intact /usr/obj and usr/src with a
> > > > complete compiled system.
> > > > 
> > > > I booted from mem stick and I was lost due to no cc!
> > > > 
> > > > Even for "make installworld" it seems I have to rely on the compiler. 
> > > > And
> > > > the images (ISO, memstick et cetera) provided these days do not contain
> > > > any clang.  
> > 
> > Yes, you will need it and it will complain about missing it, if for
> > example you moved 'obj and 'src' to other dirs after 'make build...'
> > 
> > But, in your case the mem image really is lacking the cc/clang; I
> > fetched the image an did:
> > 
> > 
> > # mdconfig -a -t vnode -u 1 -f
> > ~guru/Downloads/FreeBSD-11.0-RELEASE-amd64-memstick.img # mount -o
> > ro /dev/md1p3 /mnt # find /mnt -name clang
> > /mnt/usr/share/doc/llvm/clang
> > /mnt/usr/lib/clang
> > /mnt/usr/lib/debug/usr/lib/clang
> > # find /mnt -name cc
> > /mnt/usr/include/netinet/cc
> > 
> > With this img  alone, you can't compile a system :-(
> > 
> > Setup a system from DVD and build your own image containing a complete
> > system on an USB key; with this boot your damaged system, recompile and
> > reinstall world and kernel. If you (O. Hartmann) need a step by step
> > guide, I could send it to you.
> > 
> > matthias
> > 
> 
> Hello,
> 
> thanks for your help offering! very kind.
> 
> I've already solved the problem - not with the suggested process, but via
> copying missing libs and files from and identical intact source. After that, I
> ran make buildword/buildkernel and was able to successfully install the new
> system.
> 
> As I stated before: I already had a complete compiled world and kernel 
> existing
> in their proper, intact folders (usr/src and usr/obj). There was no need to
> compile a whole world.
> Intending to "make installworld" failed, this is the real problem, because the
> ISO/memstick images provided lack obviously in the required infrastructure and
> so these images are worthless for sophisticated rescue operations - or even
> such a simple ask as described initially in my posting.
> 
> I created images on CURRENT of my own - they all lack in the ability of having
> the necessary tools aboard. So I consider every image useless for rescue
> operations except, maybe, the DVD image - but this one is not provided 
> anymore.
> For what reason? Time? Accepted. Space/disk usage? Well, welcome back in the
> stoneage of computer technology ... 
> 
> I remember faintly that there was a small discussion on the @CURRENT list, but
> I didn't realize that the result would be the extraction of the compiler.
> 
> Just for the record: most servers delivered to us do not have CD/DVD drives
> anymore - they are outdated and considered an extra these days. Purchasing 1 
> GB
> USB thumbdrives is getting even harder, smallest size my employer provides now
> is 2 GB. And most optical drives are DVD. From my point of view - and this is 
> a
> personal view - the "standard" is > 1GB so there is no need to break down by
> force the FreeBSD image (if size is the reason) down to < 800 MB or < 1 GB. 
> I'd
> consider having < 2GB the line of standards (2 GB USB mem drive).
> And for those, with need of very small images, smaller images could be 
> provided
> as the extra.
> 

I do want to weigh in here and inform I am actively watching this
thread.  clang(1) is not in disc1.iso or bootonly.iso because the
MK_TOOLCHAIN knob is disabled in the targets that generate them.  This
has actually been the case for quite some time for these images.

dvd1.iso does contain clang, but very rarely (if ever, actually) are
there dvd1.iso images produced for development snapshots.  This is, in
part, solely because of the additional space/bandwidth required on the
mirrors (not just mirrors controlled by the Project, but third-party
mirrors as well).

I am working on splitting out how the memstick.img and disc1.iso images
are produced, but ran into a problem which I'm looking into a workaround
that is backwards-compatible.  Since for USB images, a 700MB limit does
not make sense, and right now it just so happens that the memstick.img
is created from the 

Re: ISO image: where is the CLANG compiler?

[Ultima]

If you plan on running a desktop environment like this make sure its super
speed usb 3.0 or the system will be considerably slow. This is a perfect
backup plan and I always have one for the ready. This is especially
important when on current. I don't think you have to worry so much about
having a smaller usb, it can always be partitions to fit the you're needs.

On Thu, Jan 19, 2017 at 5:12 AM, Matthias Apitz  wrote:

> El día Thursday, January 19, 2017 a las 10:16:46AM +0100, O. Hartmann
> escribió:
>
> > I created images on CURRENT of my own - they all lack in the ability of
> having
> > the necessary tools aboard. So I consider every image useless for rescue
> > operations except, maybe, the DVD image - but this one is not provided
> anymore.
> > For what reason? Time? Accepted. Space/disk usage? Well, welcome back in
> the
> > stoneage of computer technology ...
>
> No. The process I'm using to create an image for an USB stick leads to a
> complete system from which you can even, after booting it, 'make
> install...'
> to another system mounted on /mnt to the booted USB stick. You can even
> enrich the USB stick with 'pkg install ...' up to a complete running KDE
> desktop system, all running from the USB stick, to test, for example, a
> new hardware if it fits your needs. The stick must be of some 16
> marketing-GB, or bigger.
>
> This has nothing todo with stoneage, but is just a matter of preparing
> something for your needs. Again, let me know if you need this guide.
>
> matthias
>
>
>
> --
> Matthias Apitz, ✉ g...@unixarea.de, ⌂ http://www.unixarea.de/  ☎
> +49-176-38902045
> "Wo ist der antiimperialistische Schutzwall, wenn man ihn braucht?
> US-Panzertransport durch ex-DDR"
> "Where is the anti-imperialistic  wall, if it's needed? Transport of
> US-tanks through the ex-GDR"
> https://deutsch.rt.com/kurzclips/45282-us-panzertransporte-durch-ex-ddr/
> ___
> freebsd-current@freebsd.org mailing list
> https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current
> To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-current-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"
>
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Re: ISO image: where is the CLANG compiler?

[Matthias Apitz]

El día Thursday, January 19, 2017 a las 10:16:46AM +0100, O. Hartmann escribió:

> I created images on CURRENT of my own - they all lack in the ability of having
> the necessary tools aboard. So I consider every image useless for rescue
> operations except, maybe, the DVD image - but this one is not provided 
> anymore.
> For what reason? Time? Accepted. Space/disk usage? Well, welcome back in the
> stoneage of computer technology ... 

No. The process I'm using to create an image for an USB stick leads to a
complete system from which you can even, after booting it, 'make install...'
to another system mounted on /mnt to the booted USB stick. You can even
enrich the USB stick with 'pkg install ...' up to a complete running KDE
desktop system, all running from the USB stick, to test, for example, a
new hardware if it fits your needs. The stick must be of some 16
marketing-GB, or bigger.

This has nothing todo with stoneage, but is just a matter of preparing
something for your needs. Again, let me know if you need this guide.

matthias



-- 
Matthias Apitz, ✉ g...@unixarea.de, ⌂ http://www.unixarea.de/  ☎ 
+49-176-38902045
"Wo ist der antiimperialistische Schutzwall, wenn man ihn braucht? 
US-Panzertransport durch ex-DDR"
"Where is the anti-imperialistic  wall, if it's needed? Transport of US-tanks 
through the ex-GDR"
https://deutsch.rt.com/kurzclips/45282-us-panzertransporte-durch-ex-ddr/
___
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https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current
To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-current-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Re: ISO image: where is the CLANG compiler?

[O. Hartmann]

On Thu, 19 Jan 2017 06:58:16 +0100
Matthias Apitz  wrote:

> El día Wednesday, January 18, 2017 a las 08:00:04PM -0500, Allan Jude
> escribió:
> 
> > On 2017-01-18 14:37, O. Hartmann wrote:  
> > > Am Wed, 18 Jan 2017 16:38:32 +0100
> > > Matthias Apitz  schrieb:
> > >   
> > >> Why you do not just boot from USB some mem stick image, mount some disk
> > >> space to /mnt, svn checkout CURRENT to /mnt and build a booteable system
> > >> (world and kernel) and install to DESTDIR=/mnt ?
> > >>
> > >> I do not understand all this hassle?
> > >>
> > >>  matthias
> > >>  
> > > 
> > > Wow!
> > > 
> > > As I initially stated, that is EXACTLY what I was inclined to do except
> > > the fact that I had already an intact /usr/obj and usr/src with a
> > > complete compiled system.
> > > 
> > > I booted from mem stick and I was lost due to no cc!
> > > 
> > > Even for "make installworld" it seems I have to rely on the compiler. And
> > > the images (ISO, memstick et cetera) provided these days do not contain
> > > any clang.  
> 
> Yes, you will need it and it will complain about missing it, if for
> example you moved 'obj and 'src' to other dirs after 'make build...'
> 
> But, in your case the mem image really is lacking the cc/clang; I
> fetched the image an did:
> 
> 
> # mdconfig -a -t vnode -u 1 -f
> ~guru/Downloads/FreeBSD-11.0-RELEASE-amd64-memstick.img # mount -o
> ro /dev/md1p3 /mnt # find /mnt -name clang
> /mnt/usr/share/doc/llvm/clang
> /mnt/usr/lib/clang
> /mnt/usr/lib/debug/usr/lib/clang
> # find /mnt -name cc
> /mnt/usr/include/netinet/cc
> 
> With this img  alone, you can't compile a system :-(
> 
> Setup a system from DVD and build your own image containing a complete
> system on an USB key; with this boot your damaged system, recompile and
> reinstall world and kernel. If you (O. Hartmann) need a step by step
> guide, I could send it to you.
> 
>   matthias
> 

Hello,

thanks for your help offering! very kind.

I've already solved the problem - not with the suggested process, but via
copying missing libs and files from and identical intact source. After that, I
ran make buildword/buildkernel and was able to successfully install the new
system.

As I stated before: I already had a complete compiled world and kernel existing
in their proper, intact folders (usr/src and usr/obj). There was no need to
compile a whole world.
Intending to "make installworld" failed, this is the real problem, because the
ISO/memstick images provided lack obviously in the required infrastructure and
so these images are worthless for sophisticated rescue operations - or even
such a simple ask as described initially in my posting.

I created images on CURRENT of my own - they all lack in the ability of having
the necessary tools aboard. So I consider every image useless for rescue
operations except, maybe, the DVD image - but this one is not provided anymore.
For what reason? Time? Accepted. Space/disk usage? Well, welcome back in the
stoneage of computer technology ... 

I remember faintly that there was a small discussion on the @CURRENT list, but
I didn't realize that the result would be the extraction of the compiler.

Just for the record: most servers delivered to us do not have CD/DVD drives
anymore - they are outdated and considered an extra these days. Purchasing 1 GB
USB thumbdrives is getting even harder, smallest size my employer provides now
is 2 GB. And most optical drives are DVD. From my point of view - and this is a
personal view - the "standard" is > 1GB so there is no need to break down by
force the FreeBSD image (if size is the reason) down to < 800 MB or < 1 GB. I'd
consider having < 2GB the line of standards (2 GB USB mem drive).
And for those, with need of very small images, smaller images could be provided
as the extra.

Thank you very much,

kind regards,
Oliver
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Re: ISO image: where is the CLANG compiler?

[Matthias Apitz]

El día Wednesday, January 18, 2017 a las 08:00:04PM -0500, Allan Jude escribió:

> On 2017-01-18 14:37, O. Hartmann wrote:
> > Am Wed, 18 Jan 2017 16:38:32 +0100
> > Matthias Apitz  schrieb:
> > 
> >> Why you do not just boot from USB some mem stick image, mount some disk
> >> space to /mnt, svn checkout CURRENT to /mnt and build a booteable system
> >> (world and kernel) and install to DESTDIR=/mnt ?
> >>
> >> I do not understand all this hassle?
> >>
> >>matthias
> >>
> > 
> > Wow!
> > 
> > As I initially stated, that is EXACTLY what I was inclined to do except the 
> > fact that I
> > had already an intact /usr/obj and usr/src with a complete compiled system.
> > 
> > I booted from mem stick and I was lost due to no cc!
> > 
> > Even for "make installworld" it seems I have to rely on the compiler. And 
> > the images
> > (ISO, memstick et cetera) provided these days do not contain any clang.

Yes, you will need it and it will complain about missing it, if for
example you moved 'obj and 'src' to other dirs after 'make build...'

But, in your case the mem image really is lacking the cc/clang; I
fetched the image an did:


# mdconfig -a -t vnode -u 1 -f 
~guru/Downloads/FreeBSD-11.0-RELEASE-amd64-memstick.img
# mount -o ro /dev/md1p3 /mnt
# find /mnt -name clang
/mnt/usr/share/doc/llvm/clang
/mnt/usr/lib/clang
/mnt/usr/lib/debug/usr/lib/clang
# find /mnt -name cc
/mnt/usr/include/netinet/cc

With this img  alone, you can't compile a system :-(

Setup a system from DVD and build your own image containing a complete
system on an USB key; with this boot your damaged system, recompile and
reinstall world and kernel. If you (O. Hartmann) need a step by step
guide, I could send it to you.

matthias

-- 
Matthias Apitz, ✉ g...@unixarea.de, ⌂ http://www.unixarea.de/  ☎ 
+49-176-38902045
"Wo ist der antiimperialistische Schutzwall, wenn man ihn braucht? 
US-Panzertransport durch ex-DDR"
"Where is the anti-imperialistic  wall, if it's needed? Transport of US-tanks 
through the ex-GDR"
https://deutsch.rt.com/kurzclips/45282-us-panzertransporte-durch-ex-ddr/
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Re: ISO image: where is the CLANG compiler?

[Allan Jude]

On 2017-01-18 14:37, O. Hartmann wrote:
> Am Wed, 18 Jan 2017 16:38:32 +0100
> Matthias Apitz  schrieb:
> 
>> Why you do not just boot from USB some mem stick image, mount some disk
>> space to /mnt, svn checkout CURRENT to /mnt and build a booteable system
>> (world and kernel) and install to DESTDIR=/mnt ?
>>
>> I do not understand all this hassle?
>>
>>  matthias
>>
> 
> Wow!
> 
> As I initially stated, that is EXACTLY what I was inclined to do except the 
> fact that I
> had already an intact /usr/obj and usr/src with a complete compiled system.
> 
> I booted from mem stick and I was lost due to no cc!
> 
> Even for "make installworld" it seems I have to rely on the compiler. And the 
> images
> (ISO, memstick et cetera) provided these days do not contain any clang.
> 
> So, I tried /usr/src/release ... for the first time. The image does also not 
> contain the
> necessary tools for a full "make installworld installkernel" - not to speak of
> "compiling" world. I dodn't work (at least for me). 
> 
> I try to figure out how to avoid this crazy and useless shrinking of the ISO 
> images -
> somehow when building NanoBSD, there are knobs with which we can prevent the 
> build and/or
> installation of subsets like compiler, toolchain et cetera. The way such 
> thing is
> provided via src.conf and make.conf is fine and sophisticated. But "RELEASE" 
> seems to
> handle things different, and the standard is useless for a rescue mission.
> 
> So far.
> 
> It might be that I have overlooked something ...
> 
> Regards,
> 
> oh
> 

The DVD should still contain clang. Only the smaller images (bootonly,
disc1) should have clang removed.

-- 
Allan Jude



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Re: ISO image: where is the CLANG compiler?

[Polytropon]

On Wed, 18 Jan 2017 20:37:26 +0100, O. Hartmann wrote:
> Am Wed, 18 Jan 2017 16:38:32 +0100
> Matthias Apitz  schrieb:
> 
> > Why you do not just boot from USB some mem stick image, mount some disk
> > space to /mnt, svn checkout CURRENT to /mnt and build a booteable system
> > (world and kernel) and install to DESTDIR=/mnt ?
> > 
> > I do not understand all this hassle?
> > 
> > matthias
> > 
> 
> Wow!
> 
> As I initially stated, that is EXACTLY what I was inclined to do except
> the fact that I
> had already an intact /usr/obj and usr/src with a complete compiled system.
> 
> I booted from mem stick and I was lost due to no cc!

That is the core problem here: cc is not contained in the USB
(memstick) image. It _might_ be contained on the live system
media, but I'm not sure about this...



> Even for "make installworld" it seems I have to rely on the compiler.
> And the images
> (ISO, memstick et cetera) provided these days do not contain any clang.

Then there would be at least the following option:

>From the installation media, you can manually extract the
distribution files for the base system and use their content
to overwrite your non-functional (zero size) files on disk.
The task here is to perform archive extraction, and the
extractor should be there (simply because the installer uses
it as well). With those tools established, you can recompile
your system, or "make installworld" from the already populated
/usr/obj subtree. Of course, you need to pay attention to
have the _correct_ version.



> I try to figure out how to avoid this crazy and useless shrinking
> of the ISO images -
> somehow when building NanoBSD, there are knobs with which we can
> prevent the build and/or
> installation of subsets like compiler, toolchain et cetera. The way
> such thing is
> provided via src.conf and make.conf is fine and sophisticated. But
> "RELEASE" seems to
> handle things different, and the standard is useless for a rescue
> mission.

So having a more or less complete (!) live system image (for CD
or DVD, depending on result size) would probably be a good idea
and a versatile tool in case of emergencies.

The size limitations, in my opinion, are okay for CD media (650 MB)
and DVD media (4,7 GB), but for USB media, I don't see a significant
problem making the image 4 or even 8 GB in size. It's actually quite
complicated to buy smaller USB sticks or SD cards (sizes < 4 GB)
for the few devices they are still required...

FreeBSD has always been a "self-contained" system that could
"reproduce itself", given that all the sources and the compilation
tools were included with the OS. This should be an important goal
to achieve with a USB-based _live_ system, and even if you run
it from slow USB (instead of fast HDD or SSD), there are still
situations where those systems can prevent you from a complete
system re-installation. Additionally, USB provides permanent
storage (which CDs and DVDs obviously do not).

Of course you can more or less manually create such a live media
and prepare an image for it, but it would be really nice if such
an image would be provided for download. I imagine the initial
tasks to be mostly a buildworld/installword into a custom root
directory and then creating an image from it, prepending it with
the typical boot loader so it becomes a "disk image" (USB image,
of course).



> Ich widerspreche der Nutzung oder Übermittlung meiner Daten für
> Werbezwecke oder für die Markt- oder Meinungsforschung (§ 28 Abs. 4 BDSG).

"Das interessiert uns nicht!" - gez. die Werbewirtschaft. :-)


-- 
Polytropon
Magdeburg, Germany
Happy FreeBSD user since 4.0
Andra moi ennepe, Mousa, ...
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Re: ISO image: where is the CLANG compiler?

[Matthias Apitz]

(I adjuested To/cc)

El día Wednesday, January 18, 2017 a las 08:37:26PM +0100, O. Hartmann escribió:

> Wow!
> 
> As I initially stated, that is EXACTLY what I was inclined to do except the 
> fact that I
> had already an intact /usr/obj and usr/src with a complete compiled system.
> 
> I booted from mem stick and I was lost due to no cc!
> 
> Even for "make installworld" it seems I have to rely on the compiler. And the 
> images
> (ISO, memstick et cetera) provided these days do not contain any clang.
> 
> So, I tried /usr/src/release ... for the first time. The image does also not 
> contain the
> necessary tools for a full "make installworld installkernel" - not to speak of
> "compiling" world. I dodn't work (at least for me). 

What gives:

# rm -r /usr/obj
# cd /usr/src
# make buildworld
# make buildkernel

matthias

-- 
Matthias Apitz, ✉ g...@unixarea.de, ⌂ http://www.unixarea.de/  ☎ 
+49-176-38902045
"Wo ist der antiimperialistische Schutzwall, wenn man ihn braucht? 
US-Panzertransport durch ex-DDR"
"Where is the anti-imperialistic  wall, if it's needed? Transport of US-tanks 
through the ex-GDR"
https://deutsch.rt.com/kurzclips/45282-us-panzertransporte-durch-ex-ddr/
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Re: ISO image: where is the CLANG compiler?

[O. Hartmann]

Am Wed, 18 Jan 2017 16:38:32 +0100
Matthias Apitz  schrieb:

> Why you do not just boot from USB some mem stick image, mount some disk
> space to /mnt, svn checkout CURRENT to /mnt and build a booteable system
> (world and kernel) and install to DESTDIR=/mnt ?
> 
> I do not understand all this hassle?
> 
>   matthias
> 

Wow!

As I initially stated, that is EXACTLY what I was inclined to do except the 
fact that I
had already an intact /usr/obj and usr/src with a complete compiled system.

I booted from mem stick and I was lost due to no cc!

Even for "make installworld" it seems I have to rely on the compiler. And the 
images
(ISO, memstick et cetera) provided these days do not contain any clang.

So, I tried /usr/src/release ... for the first time. The image does also not 
contain the
necessary tools for a full "make installworld installkernel" - not to speak of
"compiling" world. I dodn't work (at least for me). 

I try to figure out how to avoid this crazy and useless shrinking of the ISO 
images -
somehow when building NanoBSD, there are knobs with which we can prevent the 
build and/or
installation of subsets like compiler, toolchain et cetera. The way such thing 
is
provided via src.conf and make.conf is fine and sophisticated. But "RELEASE" 
seems to
handle things different, and the standard is useless for a rescue mission.

So far.

It might be that I have overlooked something ...

Regards,

oh

-- 
O. Hartmann

Ich widerspreche der Nutzung oder Übermittlung meiner Daten für
Werbezwecke oder für die Markt- oder Meinungsforschung (§ 28 Abs. 4 BDSG).


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Description: OpenPGP digital signature

Re: ISO image: where is the CLANG compiler?

[Matthias Apitz]

Why you do not just boot from USB some mem stick image, mount some disk
space to /mnt, svn checkout CURRENT to /mnt and build a booteable system
(world and kernel) and install to DESTDIR=/mnt ?

I do not understand all this hassle?

matthias

-- 
Matthias Apitz, ✉ g...@unixarea.de, ⌂ http://www.unixarea.de/  ☎ 
+49-176-38902045
"Wo ist der antiimperialistische Schutzwall, wenn man ihn braucht? 
US-Panzertransport durch ex-DDR"
"Where is the anti-imperialistic  wall, if it's needed? Transport of US-tanks 
through the ex-GDR"
https://deutsch.rt.com/kurzclips/45282-us-panzertransporte-durch-ex-ddr/
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Re: ISO image: where is the CLANG compiler?

[Slawa Olhovchenkov]

On Wed, Jan 18, 2017 at 10:19:15AM +0100, O. Hartmann wrote:

> Hello Daniel,
> 
> thank you very much for responding!
> 
> I just looked into "makeing release". I have a lot of NanoBSD images and build
> environments for our purpose at work, but I always strip off the compiler,
> too :-(
> 
> I was realy badly surprised that on the ISOs the compiler is not present - for
> the sake of space? If so, then best practice would be to melt everything down
> to 1,66 MB size - as an ancient floppy would contain. Or better, Null.
> Sorry ... It is hard these days to purchase 1GB USB flash drives, most of them
> do have 2 GB at least.

ISO images limited by size, for fit to real CD-R blank disks.
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Re: ISO image: where is the CLANG compiler?

[O. Hartmann]

On Wed, 18 Jan 2017 10:43:58 +0200
Daniel Kalchev  wrote:

> I never use the pre-built ISO images for tasks like this. Here is a script I
> use to build my own USB boot drive. The drive contains the full OS to boot
> and also a copy used to create a new system. I make these boot drives from
> time to time, to stay current. Please note the script is few years old (for
> 9-stable) and you might want to twiddle with boot partition size if they
> grew. You need to have done bouildworld/buildkernel on the host before using
> this script.
> 
> $ cat createuboot
> #!/bin/sh
> # target USB drive to write to
> disk=da1
> # use the current date for labels
> today=`date "+%Y%m%d"`
> # wipe out partition data form drive
> # do it twice to wipe more stuff (might not be needed anymore)
> gpart destroy -F $disk   
> gpart create -s GPT $disk
> gpart destroy -F $disk
> # GPT label the drive
> gpart create -s GPT $disk  
> # bootstrap partition 
> gpart add -b 34 -s 128 -t freebsd-boot $disk   
> # partition for the OS
> gpart add -a 4k -t freebsd-ufs -l boot$today $disk 
> # write bootstrap code
> gpart bootcode -b /boot/pmbr -p /boot/gptboot -i 1 $disk
> 
> # format file system
> newfs  /dev/gpt/boot$today
> 
> # mount file system
> mount -o async /dev/gpt/boot$today /mnt
> 
> # install FreeBSD
> cd /usr/src
> make installworld DESTDIR=/mnt
> make distribution DESTDIR=/mnt
> make installkernel DESTDIR=/mnt
> # Create new “clean” copy of FreeBSD for later use
> mkdir -p /mnt/root/FreeBSD
> make installworld DESTDIR=/mnt/root/FreeBSD
> make distribution DESTDIR=/mnt/root/FreeBSD
> make installkernel DESTDIR=/mnt/root/FreeBSD
> 
> # copy scripts
> cp -r ~/scripts /mnt/root
> 
> echo /dev/gpt/boot$today / ufs rw,noatime 0 1 > /mnt/etc/fstab
> umount /mnt
> 
> 
> You might add more customizations, such as dhclient and starting sshd
> in /etc/rc.conf of the boot drive.
> 
> Hope this helps…
> 
> Daniel
> 
> 
> > On 18.01.2017 г., at 9:45, O. Hartmann  wrote:
> > 
> > I ran into a very nasty situation where I need to save/restore/reinstall a
> > in-installworld-crashed recent current.
> > 
> > While the /usr/obj and /usr/src as well as /etc folders are intact
> > (residing on a Samsung 850 pro SSD with UFS and journaling), /boot/kernel
> > vanished and most binaries in /bin and /sbin are of Null size.
> > 
> > I treid to rescue the system by intending to use the most recent CURRENT ISO
> > image found on the snapshot server for USB drives, booted this successfully
> > and then mounted the failes filesystems into the proper place (/usr/obj
> > and /usr/src onto USB devices /usr/obj and /usr/src respectively, the rest
> > goes into /mnt).
> > 
> > I tried then to perform a make installworld with DESTDIR=/mnt set. But I
> > fail: the minimalistic USB image does not have any CLANG/LLVM stuff
> > required for the rescue!
> > 
> > Where the hell did this stuff go? Has it been ripped off due to the 1 GB
> > ancient flash size? 
> > 
> > Help is needed. I've already posted to CURRENT a message, but I guess I
> > always hit the wrong subject line. It seems that the key to my saviour is
> > to have a flash drive with a recent CURRENT containing a cc compiler -
> > otherwise /usr/obj is useless.
> > 
> > Kind reards,
> > 
> > Oliver
> > ___
> > freebsd-current@freebsd.org mailing list
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> 
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Hello Daniel,

thank you very much for responding!

I just looked into "makeing release". I have a lot of NanoBSD images and build
environments for our purpose at work, but I always strip off the compiler,
too :-(

I was realy badly surprised that on the ISOs the compiler is not present - for
the sake of space? If so, then best practice would be to melt everything down
to 1,66 MB size - as an ancient floppy would contain. Or better, Null.
Sorry ... It is hard these days to purchase 1GB USB flash drives, most of them
do have 2 GB at least.

As your own approach indicates, the ISOs are useless in such cases and I
consider them as a toying thingi, nothing more. it is probably the best to have
a complete emergency ISO at hand - as your script provides.

Again, thanks for the script. I need to adjust the kernel and will create then
my own USB drive.

Kind regards,

Oliver
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Re: ISO image: where is the CLANG compiler?

[Daniel Kalchev]

I never use the pre-built ISO images for tasks like this. Here is a script I 
use to build my own USB boot drive. The drive contains the full OS to boot and 
also a copy used to create a new system. I make these boot drives from time to 
time, to stay current. Please note the script is few years old (for 9-stable) 
and you might want to twiddle with boot partition size if they grew. You need 
to have done bouildworld/buildkernel on the host before using this script.

$ cat createuboot
#!/bin/sh
# target USB drive to write to
disk=da1
# use the current date for labels
today=`date "+%Y%m%d"`
# wipe out partition data form drive
# do it twice to wipe more stuff (might not be needed anymore)
gpart destroy -F $disk   
gpart create -s GPT $disk
gpart destroy -F $disk
# GPT label the drive
gpart create -s GPT $disk  
# bootstrap partition 
gpart add -b 34 -s 128 -t freebsd-boot $disk   
# partition for the OS
gpart add -a 4k -t freebsd-ufs -l boot$today $disk 
# write bootstrap code
gpart bootcode -b /boot/pmbr -p /boot/gptboot -i 1 $disk

# format file system
newfs  /dev/gpt/boot$today

# mount file system
mount -o async /dev/gpt/boot$today /mnt

# install FreeBSD
cd /usr/src
make installworld DESTDIR=/mnt
make distribution DESTDIR=/mnt
make installkernel DESTDIR=/mnt
# Create new “clean” copy of FreeBSD for later use
mkdir -p /mnt/root/FreeBSD
make installworld DESTDIR=/mnt/root/FreeBSD
make distribution DESTDIR=/mnt/root/FreeBSD
make installkernel DESTDIR=/mnt/root/FreeBSD

# copy scripts
cp -r ~/scripts /mnt/root

echo /dev/gpt/boot$today / ufs rw,noatime 0 1 > /mnt/etc/fstab
umount /mnt


You might add more customizations, such as dhclient and starting sshd in 
/etc/rc.conf of the boot drive.

Hope this helps…

Daniel


> On 18.01.2017 г., at 9:45, O. Hartmann  wrote:
> 
> I ran into a very nasty situation where I need to save/restore/reinstall a
> in-installworld-crashed recent current.
> 
> While the /usr/obj and /usr/src as well as /etc folders are intact (residing 
> on
> a Samsung 850 pro SSD with UFS and journaling), /boot/kernel vanished and
> most binaries in /bin and /sbin are of Null size.
> 
> I treid to rescue the system by intending to use the most recent CURRENT ISO
> image found on the snapshot server for USB drives, booted this successfully 
> and
> then mounted the failes filesystems into the proper place (/usr/obj
> and /usr/src onto USB devices /usr/obj and /usr/src respectively, the rest 
> goes
> into /mnt).
> 
> I tried then to perform a make installworld with DESTDIR=/mnt set. But I fail:
> the minimalistic USB image does not have any CLANG/LLVM stuff required for the
> rescue!
> 
> Where the hell did this stuff go? Has it been ripped off due to the 1 GB
> ancient flash size? 
> 
> Help is needed. I've already posted to CURRENT a message, but I guess I always
> hit the wrong subject line. It seems that the key to my saviour is to have a
> flash drive with a recent CURRENT containing a cc compiler - otherwise 
> /usr/obj
> is useless.
> 
> Kind reards,
> 
> Oliver
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ISO image: where is the CLANG compiler?

[O. Hartmann]

I ran into a very nasty situation where I need to save/restore/reinstall a
in-installworld-crashed recent current.

While the /usr/obj and /usr/src as well as /etc folders are intact (residing on
a Samsung 850 pro SSD with UFS and journaling), /boot/kernel vanished and
most binaries in /bin and /sbin are of Null size.

I treid to rescue the system by intending to use the most recent CURRENT ISO
image found on the snapshot server for USB drives, booted this successfully and
then mounted the failes filesystems into the proper place (/usr/obj
and /usr/src onto USB devices /usr/obj and /usr/src respectively, the rest goes
into /mnt).

I tried then to perform a make installworld with DESTDIR=/mnt set. But I fail:
the minimalistic USB image does not have any CLANG/LLVM stuff required for the
rescue!

Where the hell did this stuff go? Has it been ripped off due to the 1 GB
ancient flash size? 

Help is needed. I've already posted to CURRENT a message, but I guess I always
hit the wrong subject line. It seems that the key to my saviour is to have a
flash drive with a recent CURRENT containing a cc compiler - otherwise /usr/obj
is useless.

Kind reards,

Oliver
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