Re: Apple Aluminium Keyboard (w/ numpad) woe

[Polytropon]

On Fri, 10 Aug 2012 00:10:46 +0100, Steve Roome wrote:
> Hi all, has anyone got any pointers for why my Apple (A1243)
> wired USB keyboard (with numpad, gb/uk model) doesn't want to
> report > F13 (and some other keys).

Seems to be related not only to this model. I have the
old version here ("white plastic", german layout), and
F13-F16 and the four keys on the top right don't seem
to generate anything. I've checked both text mode and
xev (in X) - and made almost the same observations as
you did. I don't have that kind of strange behaviour
with other multifunctional keyboards (Sun type 6 and 7,
german layout).



> Thanks very much, and apologies if there's a known answer, it's
> not something I've managed to find yet if it is.

Sorry, no solution here, only confirmation... :-(




-- 
Polytropon
Magdeburg, Germany
Happy FreeBSD user since 4.0
Andra moi ennepe, Mousa, ...
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Re: Apple & FreeBSD relationship

[Julian H. Stacey]

> Sorry,  Julian, but Chuck had it _legally_ correctly, for the U.S.A..
... etc ...

Thanks for the explanation Robert.  Sad that people are not free to speak.

Cheers,
Julian
-- 
Julian Stacey, BSD Unix Linux C Sys Eng Consultants Munich http://berklix.com
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 Reply below text sections not at top, to avoid breaking cumulative context.
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Re: Apple & FreeBSD relationship

[Jon Radel]

On 3/10/11 2:39 PM, Adam Vande More wrote:


On Thu, Mar 10, 2011 at 1:35 PM, Charlie Kesterwrote:


Especially if you earmark it for a specific
project.



You can't do that via a donation to the FreeBSD Foundation, only offer a
suggestion.



If the amount of money is large enough, I strongly suspect you could 
negotiate an exception to that


--

--Jon Radel
j...@radel.com
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Re: Apple & FreeBSD relationship

[Nikola Pavlović]

On Wed, Mar 09, 2011 at 02:00:37PM -0800, Nerius Landys wrote:
> This is not a technical question.
> 
> Basically I have some cash sitting around.  I'm thinking of investing
> part of it with a company that I believe in.  Apple came to mind.  You
> could say that I'd like to judge Apple's moral character before
> investing money with them. 

A public company can't really have moral character. They are required to
do whatever it takes to maximize profit for it's shareholders regardless
of any moral considerations. Any ethical behaviour a public company may
or may not display is determined by law and/or PR requirements. What I'm
trying to say is that expecting a public company to be somehow
inherently ethical or unethical is unreasonable (except Google and Facebook, 
of course, they're evil :D)


> Does anyone know how Apple reciprocates to
> FreeBSD?  After all a lot of MacOSX is borrowed from FreeBSD.  I am
> not seeing Apple's name on this page:
> http://www.freebsdfoundation.org/donate/sponsors.shtml .  Are there
> other ways in which Apple might be reciprocating?
>

As far as I'm aware their free/open source software contributions are
not strictly FreeBSD specific, but FreeBSD does benefit. Off the top of my
head, there's the Grand Central Dispatch framework which got ported to
FreeBSD, and the LLVM/Clang which will soon replace GCC as the system
compiler in FreeBSD (both very cool stuff).

I'd say that if your investment criterion is "how much is company X
giving back to the community", you could do a lot worse than Apple. 

Since you say you want to *invest* I won't try to persuade you to donate
to the FreeBSD Foundation ;).


-- 
No one should have to wait until after ten o'clock for his english muffin!
-- Snoopy

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Re: Apple & FreeBSD relationship

[Chad Perrin]

On Thu, Mar 10, 2011 at 01:48:05PM -0500, Jerry wrote:
> 
> Personally, I donate to the Sloan-Kettering Cancer Center. I find
> donating money to help find a cure for a disease or aid those that have
> all ready contracted it far more satisfying that giving it away to a
> foundation in the hopes that someday, perhaps they will write a
> functioning driver for a wireless N device.

On the other hand, as computing technology continues to advance at an
accelerating rate, we will increasingly see such technology serving an
ever-more important role in reasearch within innumerable fields,
including cancer research.  Consider an analogy that should be familiar
with sysadmins everywhere:

You need to do something two or three times a day.  To accomplish
this task, you make a change to a configuration file, then issue a
command like /etc/rc.d/foo restart.  There are three possible changes
you might need to make to the configuration file.  It'll take you
about twenty seconds to make the change, and another three to five
seconds to issue that command and wait for the service to restart.

You could spend up to twenty-five seconds for all this to happen, or
you could write a script that takes a single argument specifying
which of three edits you want to apply to the config file and, after
making that change, restarts the service in question.  This entire
process of writing the script takes about five minutes, plus three to
five to run your new script.  Five minutes and five seconds is a lot
longer than twenty-five seconds.

. . . but your sum total time spent on each subsequent occasion is
only that five seconds.  By spending four and a half minutes or so up
front, you save yourself (conservatively estimating) about five
minutes within three weeks.

This is what automation buys us -- and automation is what computers
provide . . . very *easy* automation.  I've rambled on about this subject
to some extent in another venue:

Code Reuse and Technological Advancement
http://blogstrapping.com/?page=2011.060.00.28.21

My point, though, is sipmle.  Initial investment in something that is not
direct work on a goal that is important to you can, if it helps to
automate the tasks that *do* work directly toward that goal, is often the
wisest investment toward that end.  This is why we have admin scripts
instead of doing everything by hand every time.  It is also why, all else
being equal, I prefer to invest in the advancement of computing
technology rather than picking and choosing between other things that are
important to me (including research in cancer and Alzheimer's medical
fields).  Just as the script in my hypothetical example above automates
not one, but *three* different (but related) use cases, investing in
computing technology provides greater research leverage in not one, but
*many* other fields.

More to the point, because of some of the realities of code reuse as
described in the above-mentioned essay *Code Reuse and Technological
Advancement*, I make a point of focusing my efforts on copyfree licensed
software such as the (majority of) the FreeBSD project.

Your mileage may vary.

-- 
Chad Perrin [ original content licensed OWL: http://owl.apotheon.org ]


pgpzzi3sLHFKc.pgp
Description: PGP signature

Re: Apple & FreeBSD relationship

[Adam Vande More]

On Thu, Mar 10, 2011 at 1:35 PM, Charlie Kester wrote:

> Especially if you earmark it for a specific
> project.


You can't do that via a donation to the FreeBSD Foundation, only offer a
suggestion.

-- 
Adam Vande More
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Re: Apple & FreeBSD relationship

[Charlie Kester]

On Thu 10 Mar 2011 at 10:48:05 PST Jerry wrote:

On Thu, 10 Mar 2011 08:39:04 -0800
Charlie Kester  articulated:


On Thu 10 Mar 2011 at 05:51:06 PST Tom Worster wrote:
>and as far as investing in corporate stock is concerned, oss virtue
>(like environmental virtue or sweat shop virtue) is just so much
>marketing blather. a corporation's responsibility is to make money
>for its investors. business ethics is and always will be purely
>utilitarian. apple has good marketing but don't kid yourself.

Unless you're buying newly-minted stock, you aren't giving any money
to Apple when you buy shares of AAPL.  You're giving money to some
other person, who bought the shares a while ago and now wants to cash
in.  In turn, he might have bought them from another investor.  In
many cases, you have to go a long way back, sometimes all the way to
the IPO, before the money goes to the company.  They get money when
they issue stock, not when it's traded.

What you're doing when you buy stock -- especially stock that pays
little or no dividends -- is placing a bet that sometime in the future
you'll be able to find someone willing to buy it from you at a higher
price than you paid.  


Moreover, the price of most stocks is determined solely by what people
are willing to pay for them.  Forget all that noise about sales
forecasts, P/E, etc. There is no direct, causal connection between
those "fundamentals" and the stock price.  They're as pertinent as a
baseball player's batting average is to the price of the bubblegum
card with his picture on it.  You're trading collectibles, and
they're subject to the whims of fashion.

In summary, I agree with what has been said about contributing to the
FreeBSD Foundation if you really want to help the project.  It's a
much better use of your money.  But if you'd rather trade baseball
cards, no one's stopping you.


Actually, if the individual buys stock, and there are different types,
the purchaser has a possibility of making a profit on his investment.


I certainly wouldn't deny this.  I said as much, when I talked about
finding a buyer willing to pay more for the shares than you did.  


There are other ways to profit, as you've pointed out.  I don't deny
those either.

My main point was that buying stock is usually an ineffective way to
support a company that is doing something you like.  At best, by bidding
up the stock price, you increase the value of the portfolios held by the
company's executives and board members.  


But whether they will interpret that increase in their wealth as a
signal that they should do more of what you like is the big question.
In Apple's case, I think they would be more likely to see it as a reason
to do more of the proprietary and immensely profitable kind of things
they've been doing with the iPhone.

Giving the money to the FreeBSD Foundation sends a clearer signal about
how you want it spent.  Especially if you earmark it for a specific
project.
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Re: Apple & FreeBSD relationship

[Jerry]

On Thu, 10 Mar 2011 10:53:47 -0800
David Brodbeck  articulated:

> On Thu, Mar 10, 2011 at 8:57 AM, Mark Felder  wrote:
> > On Wed, 09 Mar 2011 17:31:32 -0600, Frank Shute
> >  wrote:
> >
> >> Apple produces the clusterfuck that is CUPS, I believe.
> >
> >
> > Apple took over the CUPS project. They didn't write it. They're
> > improving it a lot with every major OSX release, so I'm not sure
> > why you're so upset.
> 
> I think a lot of the hate for CUPS here is NIH syndrome.

Seriously, it goes way, way beyond CUPS. Just look at the debauchery
regarding a HAL replacement. Instead of the different distros creating a
uniform replacement, they are each intent on reinventing the wheel with
their own implementation. In the end, nobody gains and the status quo
per se remains as fragmented as ever.

-- 
Jerry ✌
freebsd.u...@seibercom.net

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Re: Apple & FreeBSD relationship

[Robert Huff]

David Brodbeck writes:

>  >> Apple produces the clusterfuck that is CUPS, I believe.
>  >
>  > Apple took over the CUPS project. They didn't write it. They're
>  > improving it a lot with every major OSX release, so I'm not
>  > sure why you're so upset. 
>  
>  I think a lot of the hate for CUPS here is NIH syndrome.

In my case, the "hate" is caused by the difficulty in
configuration and trouble-shooting (and of course the related
documentation mega-fail).
Beyond that, it seems to work as advertised.


Robert Huff

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Re: Apple & FreeBSD relationship

[David Brodbeck]

On Thu, Mar 10, 2011 at 8:57 AM, Mark Felder  wrote:
> On Wed, 09 Mar 2011 17:31:32 -0600, Frank Shute  wrote:
>
>> Apple produces the clusterfuck that is CUPS, I believe.
>
>
> Apple took over the CUPS project. They didn't write it. They're improving it
> a lot with every major OSX release, so I'm not sure why you're so upset.

I think a lot of the hate for CUPS here is NIH syndrome.
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Re: Apple & FreeBSD relationship

[Jerry]

On Thu, 10 Mar 2011 08:39:04 -0800
Charlie Kester  articulated:

> On Thu 10 Mar 2011 at 05:51:06 PST Tom Worster wrote:
> >and as far as investing in corporate stock is concerned, oss virtue
> >(like environmental virtue or sweat shop virtue) is just so much
> >marketing blather. a corporation's responsibility is to make money
> >for its investors. business ethics is and always will be purely
> >utilitarian. apple has good marketing but don't kid yourself.
> 
> Unless you're buying newly-minted stock, you aren't giving any money
> to Apple when you buy shares of AAPL.  You're giving money to some
> other person, who bought the shares a while ago and now wants to cash
> in.  In turn, he might have bought them from another investor.  In
> many cases, you have to go a long way back, sometimes all the way to
> the IPO, before the money goes to the company.  They get money when
> they issue stock, not when it's traded.
> 
> What you're doing when you buy stock -- especially stock that pays
> little or no dividends -- is placing a bet that sometime in the future
> you'll be able to find someone willing to buy it from you at a higher
> price than you paid.  
> 
> Moreover, the price of most stocks is determined solely by what people
> are willing to pay for them.  Forget all that noise about sales
> forecasts, P/E, etc. There is no direct, causal connection between
> those "fundamentals" and the stock price.  They're as pertinent as a
> baseball player's batting average is to the price of the bubblegum
> card with his picture on it.  You're trading collectibles, and
> they're subject to the whims of fashion.
> 
> In summary, I agree with what has been said about contributing to the
> FreeBSD Foundation if you really want to help the project.  It's a
> much better use of your money.  But if you'd rather trade baseball
> cards, no one's stopping you.

Actually, if the individual buys stock, and there are different types,
the purchaser has a possibility of making a profit on his investment. If
the stock loses money, there is a real possibility of a tax write off.
However, if he donates it to a properly certified organization for a
tax write off, then that is all that they will ever receive. If the
investor has no use for his money other than creating a tax write off,
then that is fine. Of course, we have to keep in mind that the OP did
not disclose a specific figure for his investment nor his income
bracket, so everything is basically speculation as to what monetary
help investing or donating would have on his financial health. He would
probably be well advise to see a professional tax consultant prior to
following either avenue.

Personally, I donate to the Sloan-Kettering Cancer Center. I find
donating money to help find a cure for a disease or aid those that have
all ready contracted it far more satisfying that giving it away to a
foundation in the hopes that someday, perhaps they will write a
functioning driver for a wireless N device.

-- 
Jerry ✌
freebsd.u...@seibercom.net

Disclaimer: off-list followups get on-list replies or get ignored.
Please do not ignore the Reply-To header.
__
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you are an exceptionally good liar.

Jerome K. Jerome
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Re: Apple & FreeBSD relationship

[Charlie Kester]

On Wed 09 Mar 2011 at 14:00:37 PST Nerius Landys wrote:

This is not a technical question.

Basically I have some cash sitting around.  I'm thinking of investing
part of it with a company that I believe in.  Apple came to mind.  You
could say that I'd like to judge Apple's moral character before
investing money with them.  Does anyone know how Apple reciprocates to
FreeBSD?  After all a lot of MacOSX is borrowed from FreeBSD.  I am
not seeing Apple's name on this page:
http://www.freebsdfoundation.org/donate/sponsors.shtml .  Are there
other ways in which Apple might be reciprocating?


If memory serves, they've been heavily involved in the LLVM/Clang
project.

That said, see my other reply today about what buying stock is really
all about.
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Re: Apple & FreeBSD relationship

[Robert Bonomi]

> To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org
> From: "Julian H. Stacey" 
> Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2011 16:36:29 +0100
> Subject: Re: Apple & FreeBSD relationship 
>
> Aside, On Disclaimers::
>  Chuck Swiger wrote:
>   > Hi--
>   >
>   > #include 
>   >
>   > It wouldn't be considered appropriate for Apple employees or 
>   > contractors (well, outside of the folks working in investor 
> relations, 
>   > perhaps) to try to persuade someone to invest in a particular company 
>   > because of which open source projects Apple might be contributing 
>   > towards.  In another context, someone from Apple who was familiar 
> with 
>   > those contributions might be free to discuss them, but they would 
>   > generally be expected to not identify their affiliation with Apple to 
>   > avoid unduly influencing other people or creating a real or perceived 
>   > conflict of interest.
>
>  To not declare affiliation for fear it might tilt perception of 
>  recipient, would be misguided.  A disclaimer such as
>   "I work for XYZ. I do not speak for XYZ."
>   would suffice.  One declares affiliations to be fair to recipients & 
>   safeguard oneself. Recipients are informed, can draw their own 
>   conclusions, & not roast one for undeclared interest :-).  Examples:
>
>   http://www.ofcom.org.uk/about/how-ofcom-is-run/ofcom-board-2/policy-on-c
>   onflicts-of-interest/
>
>Section 6:
>"PROVIDED .. there is full
>transparency about any such interests."

Sorry,  Julian, but Chuck had it _legally_ correctly, for the U.S.A..

As soon as someone so much as mentions 'investing' in a company, a whole
bunch of rather draconian laws kick in about the offering of "investment 
advice" by someone affiliated with the investment entity.  This has become
very much of a 'hot button' issue in recent years, with a lot of new,
*very*strict* laws being enacted, in part because of some of the recent
major investment scandals, like "Enron", "AIG", etc..

Secondly, there is a matter of the 'company policy' of his employer with
regard to employees giving 'investment advice' -- even if it is 'on their
own time' -- about the company.  Even if it isn't against the law, it 
could easily get him fired, instantly.

Almost all publicly held companies (at least in the USA) have an 'investor
relations' department, and those are the _only_ employees, other than the 
CEO, who are authorized give out investment-related information. Further,
everything they _do_ give out has been (a) approved by senior management,
and (b) 'vetted' by the legal department.


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Re: Apple & FreeBSD relationship

[Mark Felder]

On Wed, 09 Mar 2011 17:31:32 -0600, Frank Shute  wrote:


Apple produces the clusterfuck that is CUPS, I believe.



Apple took over the CUPS project. They didn't write it. They're improving  
it a lot with every major OSX release, so I'm not sure why you're so  
upset. Apple is the company that is convincing HP, Brother, Lexmark, etc  
to agree on a common interface for printing, scanning, faxing, etc.  
They're doing a lot of good in the printing world.



Regards,


Mark
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Re: Apple & FreeBSD relationship

[Charlie Kester]

On Thu 10 Mar 2011 at 05:51:06 PST Tom Worster wrote:

and as far as investing in corporate stock is concerned, oss virtue
(like environmental virtue or sweat shop virtue) is just so much
marketing blather. a corporation's responsibility is to make money for
its investors. business ethics is and always will be purely
utilitarian. apple has good marketing but don't kid yourself.


Unless you're buying newly-minted stock, you aren't giving any money to
Apple when you buy shares of AAPL.  You're giving money to some other
person, who bought the shares a while ago and now wants to cash in.  In
turn, he might have bought them from another investor.  In many cases,
you have to go a long way back, sometimes all the way to the IPO, before
the money goes to the company.  They get money when they issue stock,
not when it's traded.

What you're doing when you buy stock -- especially stock that pays
little or no dividends -- is placing a bet that sometime in the future
you'll be able to find someone willing to buy it from you at a higher
price than you paid.  


Moreover, the price of most stocks is determined solely by what people
are willing to pay for them.  Forget all that noise about sales
forecasts, P/E, etc. There is no direct, causal connection between those
"fundamentals" and the stock price.  They're as pertinent as a baseball
player's batting average is to the price of the bubblegum card with his
picture on it.  You're trading collectibles, and they're subject to the
whims of fashion.

In summary, I agree with what has been said about contributing to the
FreeBSD Foundation if you really want to help the project.  It's a much
better use of your money.  But if you'd rather trade baseball cards, no
one's stopping you.
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Re: Apple & FreeBSD relationship

[Daniel Staal]

On Thu, March 10, 2011 8:51 am, Tom Worster wrote:
> i think it's deeper than that. they know what they are doing.
>
> back at the beginning, os x was great. finally a decent, user-friendly gui
> on top of a decent unix-like thing, which, oh joy, felt like bsd. for
> years, apple improved os x and did some oss work. e.g. webkit is decent
> stuff. life was good. ms word in this window, terminal in that one, mysql,
> perl,
>
> then the iphone and the disaster of not having an sdk ready (other than
> mobile safari) happened. they wised up and everything changed.
>
> with ios apple has a strategy to get away from all that openness. they are
> steering developers away from the web and portable web apps. so they are
> backpedaling on safari and os x as best they can. if they can dominate in
> mobile hardware for a while longer they may achieve some serious api
> lock-in. then we will be in trouble. it is the same strategy ms used after
> they won the browser war with netscape -- they backpedaled on IE, got very
> deep windows api lock in, and made a load of money.

There's another business reason for it as well, I think:

When OS X first came out, Apple was a serious underdog.  Nearly out of the
game entirely, really.  That openness helped them by lowering the
cost-to-entry of products, and bringing in any product that already
supported the standards.  Building on open-source technologies also meant
they could pick up something that was pre-written, and well-tested.

So they got goodwill, a cheap product, and support from third-parties. 
All of which were vitally important to a company that was battling for
it's life against Microsoft.

Now they have recovered, and are a solid contender on the desktop on their
own, as well as being the undisputed leader in mobile computing. 
(iPhone/iPad level mobile, though even their laptops have a greater
marketshare than their desktops do.)  The only one of those reasons that
still really applies is goodwill: They already have their product, and
third-parties will always try to support the dominant force in the market.
 (Because that's where their customers are.)  Openness in many ways is now
a threat: It means that someone who can create a new system that supports
the open standards can grab all of Apple's customers easily.  Proprietary
lock-in is a better bet, as it means that the customers they have will be
less likely to leave.  It becomes a pain for them to transfer their stuff
out of the proprietary ecosystem.

This is actually a typical cycle, both in the industry and for Apple
itself.  The Apple II series was fairly open, and the Mac series was more
closed and closed off further until Apple realized they'd gotten
themselves in a bad position.  Then they opened up again with OS X.  To
me, at least, it was fully expected.  Apple produces awesome, open
products, when they have less than 40% or so marketshare.  (Extremely
random number there.)  Above that level of marketshare, their products are
usually awesome, but closed, and the awesomeness may or may not be
something you use/want.

Daniel T. Staal

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Re: Apple & FreeBSD relationship

[Julian H. Stacey]

Hi questions@,
Original question from Nerius Landys  :

> Basically I have some cash sitting around.  I'm thinking of investing
> part of it with a company that I believe in.  Apple came to mind.  You
> could say that I'd like to judge Apple's moral character before
> investing money with them.  Does anyone know how Apple reciprocates to
> FreeBSD?  After all a lot of MacOSX is borrowed from FreeBSD.  I am
> not seeing Apple's name on this page:
> http://www.freebsdfoundation.org/donate/sponsors.shtml .  Are there
> other ways in which Apple might be reciprocating?

Apple has always enjoyed its dedicated customer base.  
(Many computer companies have liked to keep users locked,
eg Burroughs Algol extensions limiting emigration, IBM PC
hardware patents on hardware clones, Microsoft & its tricks,
Sun Java being logged, licensed & not anonymous ftp, &
mobile phones locked to providers, etc).

Apple have used BSD, employed some BSD people, & contributed to whatever,  

But ...  Considering an Apple PDA, I asked questions of an Apple enthusiast
~ 3 months back eg: I'd like to code on FreeBSD, & mabe
cross compile, or just vi on FreeBSD then rdist / rsync or
nfs + amd mount to my [maybe Apple] slim device, & have ssh
rlogin csh/ bash gcc bsd-make,  etc on the slim device, &
share screens under X etc ...  is that possible, free &
easy ?  Answer received: No, You'd need an Apple with OS cracks
that voids the warranty 
Didn't seem so BSD friendly to me.

Disclaimer/Disclosure: I have no past, present, direct, indirect,
  employment, trade, investment, with Apple or [PDA etc] competitors.

-

Aside, On Disclaimers::
Chuck Swiger wrote:
> Hi--
> 
> #include 
> 
> It wouldn't be considered appropriate for Apple employees or 
contractors (well, outside of the folks working in investor relations, perhaps) 
to try to persuade someone to invest in a particular company because of which 
open source projects Apple might be contributing towards.  In another context, 
someone from Apple who was familiar with those contributions might be free to 
discuss them, but they would generally be expected to not identify their 
affiliation with Apple to avoid unduly influencing other people or creating a 
real or perceived conflict of interest.

To not declare affiliation for fear it might tilt perception of
recipient, would be misguided.  A disclaimer such as 
"I work for XYZ. I do not speak for XYZ."
would suffice.  One declares affiliations to be fair to
recipients & safeguard oneself. Recipients are informed,
can draw their own conclusions, & not roast one for
undeclared interest :-).  Examples:


http://www.ofcom.org.uk/about/how-ofcom-is-run/ofcom-board-2/policy-on-conflicts-of-interest/

Section 6:
"PROVIDED .. there is full
transparency about any such interests."

http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/ld/ldcond/code.pdf
P3
"a full list of Members' financial and other
interests is published in the Register of
Lords' Interests."

Probably more here etc:
http://www.transparency.org/
http://ethics.senate.gov/fd.htm

Cheers,
Julian
-- 
Julian Stacey, BSD Unix Linux C Sys Eng Consultants Munich http://berklix.com
 Mail plain text;  Not quoted-printable, Not HTML, Not base 64.
 Reply below text sections not at top, to avoid breaking cumulative context.
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Re: Apple & FreeBSD relationship

[Tom Worster]

On 3/9/11 8:57 PM, "mikel king"  wrote:

>In recent years their marketing as gone to some lengths to scrub the
>references to BSD & UNIX from the brochures. It's like they are ashamed
>of their roots, again personally I think they hired some new anti-geeks
>that just don't get it.

i think it's deeper than that. they know what they are doing.

back at the beginning, os x was great. finally a decent, user-friendly gui
on top of a decent unix-like thing, which, oh joy, felt like bsd. for
years, apple improved os x and did some oss work. e.g. webkit is decent
stuff. life was good. ms word in this window, terminal in that one, mysql,
perl, 

then the iphone and the disaster of not having an sdk ready (other than
mobile safari) happened. they wised up and everything changed.

with ios apple has a strategy to get away from all that openness. they are
steering developers away from the web and portable web apps. so they are
backpedaling on safari and os x as best they can. if they can dominate in
mobile hardware for a while longer they may achieve some serious api
lock-in. then we will be in trouble. it is the same strategy ms used after
they won the browser war with netscape -- they backpedaled on IE, got very
deep windows api lock in, and made a load of money.

it's been a curious inversion. 10 years ago, in terms of how scared i am,
i'd have ranked ms, apple and google with ms at the top and both apple and
google as not very scary. now i am terrified of google, very scared of
apple and i hardly even think about ms.

so i think the change is very canny and comes from the top, not from some
anti-geeks that don't get it.

and as far as investing in corporate stock is concerned, oss virtue (like
environmental virtue or sweat shop virtue) is just so much marketing
blather. a corporation's responsibility is to make money for its
investors. business ethics is and always will be purely utilitarian. apple
has good marketing but don't kid yourself.


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Re: Apple & FreeBSD relationship

[Chuck Swiger]

Hi--

#include 

It wouldn't be considered appropriate for Apple employees or contractors (well, 
outside of the folks working in investor relations, perhaps) to try to persuade 
someone to invest in a particular company because of which open source projects 
Apple might be contributing towards.  In another context, someone from Apple 
who was familiar with those contributions might be free to discuss them, but 
they would generally be expected to not identify their affiliation with Apple 
to avoid unduly influencing other people or creating a real or perceived 
conflict of interest.

Someone who was looking for more information about this would find the investor 
relations page, corporate governance section, and the Business Conduct Policy 
documents informative, which are all publicly documented here:

  http://www.apple.com/investor/
  http://phx.corporate-ir.net/phoenix.zhtml?c=107357&p=irol-govHighlights
  
http://phx.corporate-ir.net/External.File?item=UGFyZW50SUQ9NTQ1NTF8Q2hpbGRJRD0tMXxUeXBlPTM=&t=1
   (PDF warning)

Regards,
-- 
-Chuck

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Re: Apple & FreeBSD relationship

[mikel king]

On Mar 10, 2011, at 6:00 AM, Nerius Landys wrote:

> This is not a technical question.
> 
> Basically I have some cash sitting around.  I'm thinking of investing
> part of it with a company that I believe in.  Apple came to mind.  You
> could say that I'd like to judge Apple's moral character before
> investing money with them.  Does anyone know how Apple reciprocates to
> FreeBSD?  After all a lot of MacOSX is borrowed from FreeBSD.  I am
> not seeing Apple's name on this page:
> http://www.freebsdfoundation.org/donate/sponsors.shtml .  Are there
> other ways in which Apple might be reciprocating?
> 
> - Nerius

Apple has had a mixed relationship giving back to the BSD community. They did 
hire several developers over time and do have several projects that they have 
open sourced. Launchd & iCal server are two of the bigger ones. I personally 
feel that they could do better and certainly could have done things differently 
in a way that would have helped the community and built an even stronger 
product base but let's face it they sure aren't listening to me.

In recent years their marketing as gone to some lengths to scrub the references 
to BSD & UNIX from the brochures. It's like they are ashamed of their roots, 
again personally I think they hired some new anti-geeks that just don't get it.

I would suggest you look at spreading your investment around to several BSD 
supportive companies.  Obviously Apple and Juniper pop up to the top of the 
list. I would have offered Isilon but they have been assimilated into the beast 
know as EMC so that may not be an option.

At the end of the day they are a company, and companies must make money in 
order to survive. Therefore, do not get too attached to their BSD rhetoric 
because the winds of business can change direction at any moment.

On a side note: I would love to find a comprehensive list of both public and 
private companies that are BSD supportive.

Regards,
Mikel King
BSD News Network
http://bsdnews.net
skype: mikel.king
http://twitter.com/mikelking

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Re: Apple & FreeBSD relationship

[Reed Loefgren]

On 03/09/11 16:31, Frank Shute wrote:

On Wed, Mar 09, 2011 at 02:00:37PM -0800, Nerius Landys wrote:

This is not a technical question.

Basically I have some cash sitting around.  I'm thinking of investing
part of it with a company that I believe in.  Apple came to mind.

Don't invest your cash in a company that has reached it's peak and is
on it's way down after it's charismatic leader dies sooner rather than
later.

2nd biggest company by cap after Exxon?! Can you say "overpriced"?



You could say that I'd like to judge Apple's moral character before
investing money with them.  Does anyone know how Apple reciprocates
to FreeBSD?  After all a lot of MacOSX is borrowed from FreeBSD.  I
am not seeing Apple's name on this page:
http://www.freebsdfoundation.org/donate/sponsors.shtml .  Are there
other ways in which Apple might be reciprocating?

Apple produces the clusterfuck that is CUPS, I believe. They do also
produce good stuff that is bsd licensed like GCD. But even if they
produce magical pixie dust they're still overpriced.



- Nerius

Regards,

At US$591.77 and little product in sight, I'd say nerd paramour Google 
is overpriced too. They're *all* defacto overpriced once one takes into 
consideration the price is set in large part by the herd mentality. 
Perhaps fortunately, this works for the underpriced stocks too. The 
trick is telling which is which. Always has been, unless you're Goldman 
Sachs.


Apple bought CUPS for something like 20 million at some point in the not 
too distant past. It works great for me with an HP3600n and an HP 
laserjet4 but, if not for the 3600, I'd be on lpd again in a heartbeat. 
If you think CUPS is a clusterfuck now you should check out the sundry 
linux lists pre-sale date. The noobs were tearing their hair out. It's 
come a long way.


The OP can invest where they'd like but like others I'd recommend a 
small gift to the FreeBSD Foundation. I make one every year at tax time. 
Feels good...


Regards,

r
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Re: Apple & FreeBSD relationship

[David Kelly]

On Mar 9, 2011, at 4:50 PM, Chad Leigh -- Shire.Net LLC wrote:

> There are some/a few/several people working at Apple that play or used to 
> play a large role in FreeBSD.  So they were basically paying these people's 
> salaries for their day job which allowed them to be active in FreeBSD.  Also, 
> there is some code put-back I believe.

Of particular note was the contributions of patches to fix NFS race conditions. 
Plus tools to stress and duplicate those conditions.

> Most of what Apple used from FreeBSD was the userland and the kernel 
> interface so that the Darwin kernel could be used with FreeBSD userland 
> utilities that affect the kernel etc.Mac OS X uses a totally different 
> underlying kernel and architecture but made a FreeBSD like kernel interface 
> in order to be able to use certain sets of FreeBSD stuff.

Believe a number of FreeBSD drivers made it into MacOS X. Don't know of any 
Apple product which used Intel Etherexpress Pro chipsets but I popped a PCI 
card in a Mac one day and it magically worked as if it had always been there.

--
David Kelly N4HHE, dke...@hiwaay.net

Whom computers would destroy, they must first drive mad.



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Re: Apple & FreeBSD relationship

[David Kelly]

On Mar 9, 2011, at 5:31 PM, Frank Shute wrote:

> Don't invest your cash in a company that has reached it's peak and is
> on it's way down after it's charismatic leader dies sooner rather than
> later.


They said that at $50/share.
At $100.
At $200.
At $300.
And continue to say it at $350.

There are a lot of smart people at Apple who have had nothing better to do the 
past 10 years than to study and learn from Steve Jobs.

I'm waiting for $500.

--
David Kelly N4HHE, dke...@hiwaay.net

Whom computers would destroy, they must first drive mad.



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Re: Apple & FreeBSD relationship

[Milo Hyson]

Guess that depends on how one calculates the price.

- Milo Hyson
Chief Scientist
CyberLife Labs, Inc.

On Mar 9, 2011, at 3:31 PM, Frank Shute wrote:

> On Wed, Mar 09, 2011 at 02:00:37PM -0800, Nerius Landys wrote:
> 
> But even if they produce magical pixie dust they're still overpriced.


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Re: Apple & FreeBSD relationship

[Frank Shute]

On Wed, Mar 09, 2011 at 02:00:37PM -0800, Nerius Landys wrote:
>
> This is not a technical question.
> 
> Basically I have some cash sitting around.  I'm thinking of investing
> part of it with a company that I believe in.  Apple came to mind.  

Don't invest your cash in a company that has reached it's peak and is
on it's way down after it's charismatic leader dies sooner rather than
later.

2nd biggest company by cap after Exxon?! Can you say "overpriced"?


> You could say that I'd like to judge Apple's moral character before
> investing money with them.  Does anyone know how Apple reciprocates
> to FreeBSD?  After all a lot of MacOSX is borrowed from FreeBSD.  I
> am not seeing Apple's name on this page:
> http://www.freebsdfoundation.org/donate/sponsors.shtml .  Are there
> other ways in which Apple might be reciprocating?

Apple produces the clusterfuck that is CUPS, I believe. They do also
produce good stuff that is bsd licensed like GCD. But even if they
produce magical pixie dust they're still overpriced.


> 
> - Nerius

Regards,

-- 

 Frank

 Contact info: http://www.shute.org.uk/misc/contact.html




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Description: PGP signature

Re: Apple & FreeBSD relationship

[Chad Leigh -- Shire.Net LLC]

On Mar 9, 2011, at 3:00 PM, Nerius Landys wrote:

> This is not a technical question.
> 
> Basically I have some cash sitting around.  I'm thinking of investing
> part of it with a company that I believe in.  Apple came to mind.  You
> could say that I'd like to judge Apple's moral character before
> investing money with them.  Does anyone know how Apple reciprocates to
> FreeBSD?  After all a lot of MacOSX is borrowed from FreeBSD.  I am
> not seeing Apple's name on this page:
> http://www.freebsdfoundation.org/donate/sponsors.shtml .  Are there
> other ways in which Apple might be reciprocating?


There are some/a few/several people working at Apple that play or used to play 
a large role in FreeBSD.  So they were basically paying these people's salaries 
for their day job which allowed them to be active in FreeBSD.  Also, there is 
some code put-back I believe.

Most of what Apple used from FreeBSD was the userland and the kernel interface 
so that the Darwin kernel could be used with FreeBSD userland utilities that 
affect the kernel etc.Mac OS X uses a totally different underlying kernel 
and architecture but made a FreeBSD like kernel interface in order to be able 
to use certain sets of FreeBSD stuff.


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Re: Apple & FreeBSD relationship

[Sander Remie]

The core of apple's os is built on top of darwin which is composed of BSD
and others http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Darwin_(operating_system)

But everything you see in apple's os (that smooth UI) is not BSD, only the
underlying core is. Better do some research of your own.

On Wed, Mar 9, 2011 at 11:11 PM, Chip Camden wrote:

> Quoth Nerius Landys on Wednesday, 09 March 2011:
> > This is not a technical question.
> >
> > Basically I have some cash sitting around.  I'm thinking of investing
> > part of it with a company that I believe in.  Apple came to mind.  You
> > could say that I'd like to judge Apple's moral character before
> > investing money with them.  Does anyone know how Apple reciprocates to
> > FreeBSD?  After all a lot of MacOSX is borrowed from FreeBSD.  I am
> > not seeing Apple's name on this page:
> > http://www.freebsdfoundation.org/donate/sponsors.shtml .  Are there
> > other ways in which Apple might be reciprocating?
> >
> > - Nerius
> > ___
> > freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
> > http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
> > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "
> freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"
>
> Better yet, just send the money to the FreeBSD Foundation.
>
> --
> Sterling (Chip) Camden | sterl...@camdensoftware.com | 2048D/3A978E4F
> http://chipsquips.com  | http://camdensoftware.com   |
> http://chipstips.com
>



-- 
See my Google profile here 
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Re: Apple & FreeBSD relationship

[Kristofer M White]

You could donate directly to the FreeBSD foundation, I'm sure... :)

Nerius Landys  wrote:

>This is not a technical question.
>
>Basically I have some cash sitting around.  I'm thinking of investing
>part of it with a company that I believe in.  Apple came to mind.  You
>could say that I'd like to judge Apple's moral character before
>investing money with them.  Does anyone know how Apple reciprocates to
>FreeBSD?  After all a lot of MacOSX is borrowed from FreeBSD.  I am
>not seeing Apple's name on this page:
>http://www.freebsdfoundation.org/donate/sponsors.shtml .  Are there
>other ways in which Apple might be reciprocating?
>
>- Nerius
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Re: Apple & FreeBSD relationship

[Chip Camden]

Quoth Nerius Landys on Wednesday, 09 March 2011:
> This is not a technical question.
> 
> Basically I have some cash sitting around.  I'm thinking of investing
> part of it with a company that I believe in.  Apple came to mind.  You
> could say that I'd like to judge Apple's moral character before
> investing money with them.  Does anyone know how Apple reciprocates to
> FreeBSD?  After all a lot of MacOSX is borrowed from FreeBSD.  I am
> not seeing Apple's name on this page:
> http://www.freebsdfoundation.org/donate/sponsors.shtml .  Are there
> other ways in which Apple might be reciprocating?
> 
> - Nerius
> ___
> freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
> http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
> To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"

Better yet, just send the money to the FreeBSD Foundation.

-- 
Sterling (Chip) Camden | sterl...@camdensoftware.com | 2048D/3A978E4F
http://chipsquips.com  | http://camdensoftware.com   | http://chipstips.com


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Description: PGP signature

Re: [OT] Re: apple mac laptop.

[John Almberg]

I don't think it's far OT, either, since IMHO, Mac desktops and
FreeBSD servers are the perfect, practical combination for many
organizations, including my own.



This might better be asked offlist, but there may be others like
me who are clueless, and since you are familiar, I'll ask you.
How "interact-able" are FBSD and (say) MacBook?  E.g., is there a
"BSD-way" of my creating an account of the Apple and using is?
It's got @G of RAM, and a 160G drive [!].  Apple says in plain
text that is is UNIX.  (or maybe Berkeley Unix).

So besides the mac firewall [whatever], the laptop will be
behind my pfSense box.  So... --and to be completely honest, the
main reason for this >> $1000 laptop is *security*.  When she was
younger I wasn't that concerned is some kiddie cracker learned
that her favorite pet was a kitty.  Different now.

Another question: can I install X11 without it bothering whatever
kind of mac front-end windowing comes with?  Be great if I could
admin this BSD-based computer from my office.

thankee much!



X11 is integrated with the Apple desktop, so you can run X11  
applications, like OpenOffice, from the desktop, more or less  
seamlessly. The only difference that I've noted is that X11  
applications use Ctrl-C, etc., for copy/paste instead of the usual  
Apple-C, etc, that normal Apple applications use. This is a minor  
inconvenience, but it reminds me that there are two different types  
of applications on the desktop.


Basically, OSX *is* BSD so you can mount server disks, etc., as usual.

The main benefit to me is that administering Apples is very similar  
to administering a FreeBSD server, so I don't need to learn two  
completely different OSs (one is more than enough for me!)


I basically think of OSX as BSD with a really, really good GUI. Blows  
the doors off the usual Unix desktops (which is why I switched.)


-- John

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Re: [OT] Re: apple mac laptop.

[Mikel King]

On Aug 8, 2008, at 3:44 PM, Gary Kline wrote:


This might better be asked offlist, but there may be others like
me who are clueless, and since you are familiar, I'll ask you.
How "interact-able" are FBSD and (say) MacBook?  E.g., is there a
"BSD-way" of my creating an account of the Apple and using is?
It's got @G of RAM, and a 160G drive [!].  Apple says in plain
text that is is UNIX.  (or maybe Berkeley Unix).

So besides the mac firewall [whatever], the laptop will be
behind my pfSense box.  So... --and to be completely honest, the
main reason for this >> $1000 laptop is *security*.  When she was
younger I wasn't that concerned is some kiddie cracker learned
that her favorite pet was a kitty.  Different now.

Another question: can I install X11 without it bothering whatever
kind of mac front-end windowing comes with?  Be great if I could
admin this BSD-based computer from my office.

thankee much!

gary

--  
Gary Kline  [EMAIL PROTECTED]  http://www.thought.org  Public  
Service Unix

   http://jottings.thought.org   http://transfinite.thought.org



Gary,

	I also strongly encourage you to install MacPorts.org, when you  
install x11 and xcode from the install media. There are methods of  
adding users via CLI however since the Apple setup is rather  
sophisticated I would recommend that you stick with the system  
preferences panel to start with.


m!

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Re: [OT] Re: apple mac laptop.

[David Kelly]

On Aug 8, 2008, at 2:44 PM, Gary Kline wrote:


So besides the mac firewall [whatever], the laptop will be
behind my pfSense box.  So... --and to be completely honest, the
main reason for this >> $1000 laptop is *security*.  When she was
younger I wasn't that concerned is some kiddie cracker learned
that her favorite pet was a kitty.  Different now.


MacOS X comes with good old ipfw. Apple has added a 2nd firewall on  
top of that for 10.5, but apparently not pf.



Another question: can I install X11 without it bothering whatever
kind of mac front-end windowing comes with?  Be great if I could
admin this BSD-based computer from my office.



Yes, Apple provides X11 as an optional install on the included system  
DVD, but not preloaded from the factory.


While you are loading X11 I suggest you also install Xcode. Then again  
I think Xcode was pre-installed on my Mac Pro. Xcode is Apple's  
software development environment.


--
David Kelly N4HHE, [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Whom computers would destroy, they must first drive mad.

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Re: [OT] Re: apple mac laptop.

[Gary Kline]

On Fri, Aug 08, 2008 at 08:47:50AM -0400, John Almberg wrote:
> >>(And yes, while one can run FreeBSD just fine on a Macbook, Sahil is
> >>right that the question is off-topic for these lists.  :-)
> >
> >
> > Well, considering that they asked us (and NetBSD) for clues when
> > they were porting OSX, it didn't seem like my post was *that*
> > far Off! maybe a tiny bit.
> >
> > Anyway, thanks to everybody who replied onlist and off.
> >
> > gary
> >
> 
> I don't think it's far OT, either, since IMHO, Mac desktops and  
> FreeBSD servers are the perfect, practical combination for many  
> organizations, including my own.


This might better be asked offlist, but there may be others like
me who are clueless, and since you are familiar, I'll ask you.
How "interact-able" are FBSD and (say) MacBook?  E.g., is there a 
"BSD-way" of my creating an account of the Apple and using is?
It's got @G of RAM, and a 160G drive [!].  Apple says in plain
text that is is UNIX.  (or maybe Berkeley Unix).  

So besides the mac firewall [whatever], the laptop will be
behind my pfSense box.  So... --and to be completely honest, the
main reason for this >> $1000 laptop is *security*.  When she was
younger I wasn't that concerned is some kiddie cracker learned
that her favorite pet was a kitty.  Different now.

Another question: can I install X11 without it bothering whatever
kind of mac front-end windowing comes with?  Be great if I could
admin this BSD-based computer from my office.

thankee much!

gary


> 
> -- John
> 

-- 
 Gary Kline  [EMAIL PROTECTED]  http://www.thought.org  Public Service Unix
http://jottings.thought.org   http://transfinite.thought.org


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Re: [OT] Re: apple mac laptop.

[John Almberg]

(And yes, while one can run FreeBSD just fine on a Macbook, Sahil is
right that the question is off-topic for these lists.  :-)



Well, considering that they asked us (and NetBSD) for clues when
they were porting OSX, it didn't seem like my post was *that*
far Off! maybe a tiny bit.

Anyway, thanks to everybody who replied onlist and off.

gary



I don't think it's far OT, either, since IMHO, Mac desktops and  
FreeBSD servers are the perfect, practical combination for many  
organizations, including my own.


-- John

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Re: [OT] Re: apple mac laptop.

[Gary Kline]

On Thu, Aug 07, 2008 at 04:15:30PM -0700, Chuck Swiger wrote:
> On Aug 7, 2008, at 3:42 PM, Gary Kline wrote:
> >My daughter wants a laptop; the only brand [ AFAIC ] is Apple.
> >amazon.com seems to have a fair price.  Her school requires Word, for
> >some reason.  {maybe because we're in X-Bill country:}
> >
> >Anyway, if anybody onlist knows of a better place to buy an online Mac
> >laptop, please drop a line.
> 
> Well, students, teachers, and so forth can get about a 10% discount  
> via the Apple Education stores:
> 
>   http://store.apple.com/us/browse/home/education_routing/
> 
> (And yes, while one can run FreeBSD just fine on a Macbook, Sahil is  
> right that the question is off-topic for these lists.  :-)


Well, considering that they asked us (and NetBSD) for clues when
they were porting OSX, it didn't seem like my post was *that*
far Off! maybe a tiny bit.  

Anyway, thanks to everybody who replied onlist and off.  

gary


> 
> Regards,
> -- 
> -Chuck
> 
> PS: #include 
> 

-- 
 Gary Kline  [EMAIL PROTECTED]  http://www.thought.org  Public Service Unix
http://jottings.thought.org   http://transfinite.thought.org


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[OT] Re: apple mac laptop.

[Chuck Swiger]

On Aug 7, 2008, at 3:42 PM, Gary Kline wrote:

My daughter wants a laptop; the only brand [ AFAIC ] is Apple.
amazon.com seems to have a fair price.  Her school requires Word, for
some reason.  {maybe because we're in X-Bill country:}

Anyway, if anybody onlist knows of a better place to buy an online Mac
laptop, please drop a line.


Well, students, teachers, and so forth can get about a 10% discount  
via the Apple Education stores:


  http://store.apple.com/us/browse/home/education_routing/

(And yes, while one can run FreeBSD just fine on a Macbook, Sahil is  
right that the question is off-topic for these lists.  :-)


Regards,
--
-Chuck

PS: #include 

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Re: apple mac laptop.

[Sahil Tandon]

Gary Kline <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> My daughter wants a laptop; the only brand [ AFAIC ] is Apple.
> amazon.com seems to have a fair price.  Her school requires Word, for
> some reason.  {maybe because we're in X-Bill country:}
> 
> Anyway, if anybody onlist knows of a better  place to buy an online Mac
> laptop, please drop a line.  
   
You are asking on the wrong mailing list; see http://www.apple.com.

-- 
Sahil Tandon <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
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RE: apple bonjour served up on FBSD

[Ted Mittelstaedt]

I covered making all this run on this list back on 9-23-07
look in the list archives for the "Netatalk" thread.

Ted

> -Original Message-
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of brad davison
> Sent: Wednesday, November 28, 2007 10:33 AM
> To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org
> Subject: RE: apple bonjour served up on FBSD
>
>
>
> the mDNSResponder port is up to date (moreso than even the apple
> download site) so i installed that with the port.
>
> it requires swig13 port as well.. which installed from the port just fine.
>
> after you get all that installed and working w/o errors, there is
> a bonjour python script set that will at least test the
> functionality and get it registered for services.  I am still in
> the 'finding out' stages for this.  I will post my findings that
> might help someone else on their journey..
>
>
>
> > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org
> > Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2007 17:49:05 +
> > Subject: apple bonjour served up on FBSD
> >
> >
> > I am going to be making my BSD server at home available to my
> wife's macbook running Leopard.
> >
> > I am planning on implementing one of the mDNSResponder systems,
> but I am having some issues deciding which one to use.
> >
> > I have found the mDNSResponder from apple itself.
> >
> > I have also found (in no particular order)
> > avahi-server
> > p5-Net-Rendezvous
> >
> > My end goal is a server that will be able to share out iTunes
> and a printer to a Bonjour network.
> >
> > Does anyone have a suggestion on a recent setup?
> >
> >
>
> _
> Connect and share in new ways with Windows Live.
> http://www.windowslive.com/connect.html?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_Wave2_newwa
ys_112007___
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RE: apple bonjour served up on FBSD

[brad davison]

the mDNSResponder port is up to date (moreso than even the apple download site) 
so i installed that with the port.

it requires swig13 port as well.. which installed from the port just fine.

after you get all that installed and working w/o errors, there is a bonjour 
python script set that will at least test the functionality and get it 
registered for services.  I am still in the 'finding out' stages for this.  I 
will post my findings that might help someone else on their journey..



> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org
> Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2007 17:49:05 +
> Subject: apple bonjour served up on FBSD
> 
> 
> I am going to be making my BSD server at home available to my wife's macbook 
> running Leopard.
> 
> I am planning on implementing one of the mDNSResponder systems, but I am 
> having some issues deciding which one to use.
> 
> I have found the mDNSResponder from apple itself.
> 
> I have also found (in no particular order) 
> avahi-server
> p5-Net-Rendezvous
> 
> My end goal is a server that will be able to share out iTunes and a printer 
> to a Bonjour network.
> 
> Does anyone have a suggestion on a recent setup?
> 
> 

_
Connect and share in new ways with Windows Live.
http://www.windowslive.com/connect.html?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_Wave2_newways_112007___
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RE: apple share

[Tim Simmons]

That's where the tricky part comes in. We can't change any of the software
on the Mac server. I was looking for a gateway between the mac server and
our PCs. We have a login ID and password, but that's all. 


Timothy R. Simmons
IT Technician
Champion Realty Inc.
Direct Line: 410-975-3328
Office: 410-544-6004
E-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

-Original Message-
From: Steve Sullam [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: Wednesday, March 16, 2005 1:57 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: apple share

An easy solution is to install Dave (a commericial product) on the Apple
server if it is running Mac Classic. If it is running OSX you can use Samba.



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Re: Apple 1gz Server -- FreeBSD?

[Peter A. Giessel]

On Monday, 2004, August 23 at 15:35, [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Forrest Aldrich) wrote:

>We have a 1gz Apple 1U server here -- and I'm wondering if we could run 
>a *BSD on it, other than Darwin.
>
>Anyone have some info?

OpenBSD also has limited support.

http://www.openbsd.org/macppc.html#hardware
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Re: Apple 1gz Server -- FreeBSD?

[Eugene]

On Tue, Aug 24, 2004 at 09:14:16AM +0930, Tim Aslat wrote:
: In the immortal words of Forrest Aldrich <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>...
: >
: > We have a 1gz Apple 1U server here -- and I'm wondering if we could
: > run a *BSD on it, other than Darwin.
: 
: Well, I think the motto of NetBSD says it all
: 
: "Of course it runs NetBSD!"
: 
: You might want to check the specifics over at http://www.netbsd.org top
: be certain

http://www.netbsd.org/Ports/macppc/models.html#xserve

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Re: Apple 1gz Server -- FreeBSD?

[Tim Aslat]

In the immortal words of Forrest Aldrich <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>...
> We have a 1gz Apple 1U server here -- and I'm wondering if we could
> run a *BSD on it, other than Darwin.

Well, I think the motto of NetBSD says it all

"Of course it runs NetBSD!"

You might want to check the specifics over at http://www.netbsd.org top
be certain


Cheers

Tim

-- 
Tim Aslat <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Spyderweb Consulting
http://www.spyderweb.com.au
Phone: +61 0401088479
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Re: apple talk

[jan . muenther]

> is there software in the ports tree to read text files and speak the audio
> similar to apple talk?

Port:   festival-1.4.1_2
Path:   /usr/ports/audio/festival
Info:   Multi-lingual speech synthesis system

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RE: Apple?

[Michael Clark]

OpenBSD also supports the PowerPC platform.

-Original Message-
From: Matthew Seaman [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, January 27, 2004 4:26 AM
To: joost knetsch
Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Apple?


On Mon, Jan 26, 2004 at 09:55:10PM +0100, joost knetsch wrote:

> i wonder if its possible to install freebsd on a apple computer?
> I have a G4 500mhz  macintosh.
> ??

The FreeBSD PPC port is at quite an early stage of development still,
and not really suitable for any use other than development work yet.
See:

http://www.freebsd.org/platforms/ppc.html

There's some more up to date information on the mailing list:

http://lists.freebsd.org/pipermail/freebsd-ppc/

You could use NetBSD for your purposes:

http://www.netbsd.org/Ports/macppc/

Cheers,

Matthew

-- 
Dr Matthew J Seaman MA, D.Phil.   26 The Paddocks
  Savill Way
PGP: http://www.infracaninophile.co.uk/pgpkey Marlow
Tel: +44 1628 476614  Bucks., SL7 1TH UK


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Re: Apple?

[Matthew Seaman]

On Mon, Jan 26, 2004 at 09:55:10PM +0100, joost knetsch wrote:

> i wonder if its possible to install freebsd on a apple computer?
> I have a G4 500mhz  macintosh.
> ??

The FreeBSD PPC port is at quite an early stage of development still,
and not really suitable for any use other than development work yet.
See:

http://www.freebsd.org/platforms/ppc.html

There's some more up to date information on the mailing list:

http://lists.freebsd.org/pipermail/freebsd-ppc/

You could use NetBSD for your purposes:

http://www.netbsd.org/Ports/macppc/

Cheers,

Matthew

-- 
Dr Matthew J Seaman MA, D.Phil.   26 The Paddocks
  Savill Way
PGP: http://www.infracaninophile.co.uk/pgpkey Marlow
Tel: +44 1628 476614  Bucks., SL7 1TH UK


pgp0.pgp
Description: PGP signature

Re: Apple?

[lbland]

On Jan 26, 2004, at 3:55 PM, joost knetsch wrote:

i wonder if its possible to install freebsd on a apple computer?
I have a G4 500mhz  macintosh.
hi-

did you try darwin?

http://developer.apple.com/darwin/

-lance

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Re: apple files

[Tim Kellers]

If your client is using Appleworks, it's a bit more difficult.

I had a hacked up version of an Appleworks file format reader taken from OS X 
(server) 1.1 --or maybe the earlier version, circa 1999.  If yu need it let 
me know and I'll see if I can dig it up.

Tim Kellers
CPE/NJIT


On Sunday 20 July 2003 12:27 am, Bill Campbell wrote:
> On Sun, Jul 20, 2003 at 06:14:23AM +0200, Cliff Sarginson wrote:
> >Hello
> >I did have a look in the ports.
> >But does anyone know of a program I can use in mutt to read attachments
> >that arrive in apple file formats ?
> >I have to communicate a lot with an Apple user, using god alone knows
> >what word processor.  I think he is using Apple's verson of Word,
> >but it is hard to get this information out of him, since he is
> >about as technical as a mongoose.
>
> Antiword does a pretty decent job of turning M$ .doc files into ascii text,
> and it worked fine with a simple ``hello world'' type document created with
> M$ Office on OS X (typically the four word file took 19,456 bytes :-).
>
> All I'm using to handle this in mutt is one line in my ~/.mailcap:
>
> application/msword; antiword %s; copiousoutput
>
> Bill
> --
> INTERNET:   [EMAIL PROTECTED]  Bill Campbell; Celestial Software LLC
> UUCP:   camco!bill  PO Box 820; 6641 E. Mercer Way
> FAX:(206) 232-9186  Mercer Island, WA 98040-0820; (206)
> 236-1676 URL: http://www.celestial.com/
>
> ``... because most politicians and bureaucrats are technological idiots,
> it's going to be crucial for the rank and file members of the IT community
> to find its collective voice soon.'' --Michael Vizard, InfoWorld Editor in
> Chief.
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Re: apple files

[Bill Campbell]

On Sun, Jul 20, 2003 at 06:14:23AM +0200, Cliff Sarginson wrote:
>Hello
>I did have a look in the ports.
>But does anyone know of a program I can use in mutt to read attachments
>that arrive in apple file formats ?
>I have to communicate a lot with an Apple user, using god alone knows
>what word processor.  I think he is using Apple's verson of Word,
>but it is hard to get this information out of him, since he is
>about as technical as a mongoose.

Antiword does a pretty decent job of turning M$ .doc files into ascii text,
and it worked fine with a simple ``hello world'' type document created with
M$ Office on OS X (typically the four word file took 19,456 bytes :-).

All I'm using to handle this in mutt is one line in my ~/.mailcap:

application/msword; antiword %s; copiousoutput

Bill
--
INTERNET:   [EMAIL PROTECTED]  Bill Campbell; Celestial Software LLC
UUCP:   camco!bill  PO Box 820; 6641 E. Mercer Way
FAX:(206) 232-9186  Mercer Island, WA 98040-0820; (206) 236-1676
URL: http://www.celestial.com/

``... because most politicians and bureaucrats are technological idiots,
it's going to be crucial for the rank and file members of the IT community
to find its collective voice soon.'' --Michael Vizard, InfoWorld Editor in
Chief.
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