- Original Message -
From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Tuesday, August 29, 2000 7:50 AM
Subject: [hydroinformatics-asia-pacific] Cimate Change
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- Original Message -
From: Jan Slakov <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Saturday, February 12, 2000 7:43 AM
Subject: rn: 7th Generation Bill: an opportunity for fundamental change
> Dear RN,
>
> Mike Nickerson, who is on this list, has been workin
THINKING OF THE NEED FOR SOCIAL CHANGE
THESE FOUR ARTICLES WERE PRINTED IN
The San Francisco Chronicle, January 6, 2000
Book Links Campaign Gifts To Favors
WASHINGTON - Six of the Democratic Party's top 10 donors in the last
decade were labor unions, and in return the party has pro
Hello!
I changed my E-ddress about a week ago now and I am still getting messages
at the old address despite prodigious efforts to get all the lists I am
on to take note of it. Futureworks and basic incomes are almost the last
ones that I haven't gotten through to and I am starting to get very
and speed in the workplace.
Rather than high quality workmanship in either case we often get
shoddy products that are merely acceptable and use up precious
resources. There is a problem in the practical workings of
all of the human systems thus far with quality and creativity.
Neither Capitali
> The problem of health, commodities, the left vs.
> the right, or the mental models that we bring to
> these discussions seems to be making people angry
> everywhere .The future of work is an
> interesting thought except everyone only seems to
> want to discuss the future of their work or th
not overshadowing what is really important.
--
> Van: Jay Hanson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Aan: Michael Spencer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>;
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Onderwerp: Re: How hard is it to change opinions?
> Datum: zondag 21 februari 1999 19:12
>
> - Original
...
> Like it or not we have notions of good and evil, they're
> important and we're stuck with them.
I don't like the notions of "good" and "evil" as they imply
relative (thus non-existent) human values.
However there are objectively definable
and measurable qualities, such as human rights, i
es in terms of our own,
and then, we would need to
> change our own understanding because of it. We
would then be in search of
> knowledge for the sake of knowledge. Would
wisdom ever come?
John you assume a hell of alot about their ability
to understand, don't you think? After all ther
Good subject title! :-)
Jan Matthieu wrote:
> One wonders if there is no ecological list where these same ongoing crazy
> discussions are not overshadowing what is really important.
Hope you agree that "what is really important" is 100% OPINION.
> who now is going to take the place of evolutio
From: Jan Matthieu <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> Are billions of people to be condemed to death because of YOUR
>> hundreds-of-years-old "beliefs" about "rights"?
>
>So that's civilisation for you, doing away with everything valuable people
>have died FOR in the past, like democracy for example, and in
Mike raises the issue of human values - individual, cultural, and species
wide. The relationship of self-conscious free will and determinism as part
of nature is explored in a paper by Tom Clark linked below.
A main point I've tried rather unsuccessfully to make for the past two
years on this li
- Original Message -
From: Michael Spencer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> "An Englishwoman...was accused of heresy in 1704...
>> [splatter details elided]
>> Remember that all she had to do to avoid torture was to change her
>> opinion.
>
>You leave
Jay wrote:
> "An Englishwoman...was accused of heresy in 1704...
> [splatter details elided]
> Remember that all she had to do to avoid torture was to change her
> opinion.
You leave us to infer that so doing would have been "rational".
The scare quotes are intenti
gt; the bone, and she fainted. When she came to, she was once more flogged until
> her whole back was a mass of blood, and then threatened with the slipper on
> her other foot. Unsurprisingly, she signed her confession, and was
> eventually released." [ pp. 78-79, THE HISTORY OF
tened with the slipper on
her other foot. Unsurprisingly, she signed her confession, and was
eventually released." [ pp. 78-79, THE HISTORY OF TORTURE, by Brian Innes,
St Martin's Pr., 1998 ]
( Remember that all she had to do to avoid torture was to change her
opinion . )
That is p
mposite graph: http://dieoff.com/Yourhere.gif
"Business as usual" scenario from BEYOND THE LIMITS:
"In Scenario 1 the world society proceeds along its historical path as long
as possible without major policy change. Technology advances in agriculture,
industry, and social services
At 10:10 AM -0600 11/27/98, tom abeles wrote:
>Logic has never conversted a person- logic provides the rationalization
>for the decision.
>
>the "green utopia" doesn't seem to be worth the price to get their- it
>is not a resort destination but a destination of last resort- we get
>there if we
-Original Message-
From: tom abeles <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: fran^don <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: November 26, 1998 5:18 PM
Subject: Re: Caordic change and Greens?
>I can not argue with the assessment of the earth,
At 9:30 AM -0500 11/27/98, Brad McCormick, Ed.D. wrote:
<>
>
>... If our culture bestowed the highest honors
>on people who solved problems of preventive medicine, minimizing
>resources needed for production, etc., then that's what the
>brightest minds would eagerly
>work on, rather than searchin
Brad McCormick says, in a small part:
>Human creativity and intelligence, as Sophocles
>said in The Ode to Man in Antigone, is indifferently applicable to
>any problem. If our culture bestowed the highest honors
>on people who solved problems of preventive medicine, minimizing
>resources needed
d the planet can
>survive- humans get to live another day. yes, the air will be clean and
>the fields will be green and the waters blue. But what of the human
>spirit? And there is the rub.
DC
Tom, without human spirit, nothing positive will happen. It cannot be left
behind. It must be the driv
ce,
> >and that half is better at communication...
> >The point is, that without active and conscious
> >participation you cannot affect any change;
> >so we have no choice but to go for democracy.
> >Every option has risks, this one has the
> >most chance. Coo
in the future. But humans
learn from their mistakes quickly because intellegence is Lamarkian and
doens't require many generations of Darwinian evolution to change.
One can't argue with Jay's predictions on energy. One can make more
energy efficient "things" and find alterna
>
> ++ a steady state economy in a steady state population - even the
> requirement for a reduced population for Ontario is mentioned - and
> Wackerneigle's requisit extra planets;
> ++ a radical change in the control of the Central Bank, and the way debt and
> intere
Half of the population is above average intelligence,
and that half is better at communication...
The point is, that without active and conscious
participation you cannot affect any change;
so we have no choice but to go for democracy.
Every option has risks, this one has the
most chance
ter at communication...
>The point is, that without active and conscious
>participation you cannot affect any change;
>so we have no choice but to go for democracy.
>Every option has risks, this one has the
>most chance. Cooperation was always the main
>survivor feature of humans, mor
of
death, a Gaian disaster in progress.
About 1995/6:
A couple of years prior, I'd formed the Gaia Preservation Coalition (GPC),
and we were having regular meetings in Toronto, having occasionally, a
speaker who may enlighten. One of these speakers was the leader of the
Green Party o
dset"
stops the rest of humanity in cooperating to
save the planet and they have the physical means
and will to do so, than we would have to do
all we can, ultimately by force, to change their
"mind".
Eva
...
>
> There is nothing I fear more than that default characteristic. History
At 02:11 PM 11/25/98 -1300, pete wrote:
>It seems to me you (Eva) have been advocating a society with cooperative
>ownership - a variety of democratic socialism - along with large
>amounts of direct democracy. The problem is there is no guarantee
>that large amounts of direct democracy will neces
lists with the conscience/
guilty feelings are frightened of.
Eva
>
> -Original Message-
> From: fran^don <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Date: November 23, 1998 7:49 PM
> Subject: Re: Caordic change and the Story
>
&g
-Original Message-
From: fran^don <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: November 23, 1998 7:49 PM
Subject: Re: Caordic change and the Story
>
>My thought is that the time for philosophy and navel gazing is past, and we
>should th
At 09:49 AM 11/23/98 -0600, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>fran^don wrote, in a small part:
>
>> There is a growing chorus of people suggesting we need change, such as
>> Theobald, Raven, Moore, McMurtry, Rifkin, etc. who all tell of why the
>> existing must go.
>>
fran^don wrote, in a small part:
> There is a growing chorus of people suggesting we need change, such as
> Theobald, Raven, Moore, McMurtry, Rifkin, etc. who all tell of why the
> existing must go.
>
> I'm suggesting it's time we create a story of HOW success could em
From: tom abeles <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>In fact, there are a host of others who also have postive visions. there
>is Julian Simon and his associates. and there are even those such as
>thoughts?
If you are looking for a new god to lead the masses out of the wilderness,
the cargo cults exemplified
think it might be,
>should
>>be no reason for its rejection - a good story does not have to have angels.
>>
>>The Story does not have to be followed by, "Halaloolia", but by, "Hell, we
>>can do it!"
>>
>>There is a growing chorus of people s
oes not have to be followed by, "Halaloolia", but by, "Hell, we
>can do it!"
>
>There is a growing chorus of people suggesting we need change, such as
>Theobald, Raven, Moore, McMurtry, Rifkin, etc. who all tell of why the
>existing must go.
>
>I'm sugge
eir rigid view of how
history has unfolded in the past, and to participate in creating a new kind
of story to help create conditions where historical processes may shift -
perhaps as in a bifurcation branching from deepening chaos.
The Story does not have to be followed by, "Halaloolia"
>As the viability of the current paradigm faded, human survival became a
>topic of conversation - even more important than the President's sex life!
>Eventually a new recognition. Human population was recognized as one of the
>few controllable variable available to humans NOW. The aggregate lifeti
the terminal nature of the
problematique we voters would not permit our governments to make the
required corrections, even if they wanted to. We resist change. We cling to
obsolete tradition and values not appropriate in today's world.
A Brief Sketch of a Recovery Story
A recovery scenario i
-Original Message-
From: Steve Kurtz <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Friday, July 24, 1998 11:49 AM
Subject: Re: Technology and change...
>Greetings,
>
>Arthur thinking Pete may be on to something, quotes him:
>
>&g
from default (user85.easyinternet.net [207.176.244.85]) by
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-0400
From: "Ed Weick" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Eva Durant" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Cc: "Futurework" <[EMAIL PROT
Eva Durant:
>I thought technology is the most
costly for the capitalists, more so than labour,
this is the reason for the tendecy of the rate of profit
to fall, exploiting labour is more and more expensive.
Last time I looked, labour costs were more significant that other costs.
Traditionally,
>Ed Weick wrote:
>[snip]
>> The fact that women
>> have been able to enter the labour market in large numbers is at least
>> partly due to the fact that the amount of time needed for domestic
>> chores has been greatly diminished.
Brad McCormick::
>I know all this is rather superficial hear-say
Tom Walker(responding to Ed Weick):
> The short answer to the last question is that there has been tremendous
> catastrophe bundled with the benign "finding something better to do" as you
> put it. The adjustment from "1900 to now" has included depression,
> holocaust, world wars, revolutions, co
>Date: Fri, 22 May 1998 23:19:48 -0400
>Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>Sender: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>Precedence: bulk
>From: Robert Cohen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>To: ECOLOGICAL ECONOMICS <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Subject: FWD: International press release
>MIME-Version: 1.0
>X-Sender: Robert Cohen <[EMAIL PROT
-- Forwarded message --
Date: Sat, 21 Mar 1998 13:32:40 -0500
From: Douglass Carmichael <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: RE: Millennium bug forces halt to tax change, pension rules
some y2k social reaction scenarios at
http://tmn.com/~doug/year2000action.htm
Pat Gantt wrote,
>How does one accomplish change in one's life?
Try knocking over a parking meter with metaphysics. ;-)
Regards,
Tom Walker
^^^
knoW Ware Communications
Vancouver, B.C., CANADA
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
(604)
How does one accomplish change in one's life?
Pat Gantt
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Electronic Media Design and Support
>Date: Tue, 21 Oct 1997 12:14:38 -0400
>Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>Sender: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>Precedence: bulk
>From: Phil Kraft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>To: Labor Research and Action Project <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Subject: Conference: Work, Difference and So
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