Re: Hard drive failing!
It is a WD though. Couldn't pay me to use one. YMMV but MM has been very very bad with them. On 1/29/2011 10:34 PM, JoeTaxpayer wrote: Ben's bargains has a 2TB WD from New Egg for $70 after rebate. 2TB! On Jan 29, 10:54 pm, Sean Carrollcedarwaxw...@att.net wrote: Current (failing) is a Seagate ST3250824AS 250GB Hard Drive. Seagate Barracuda, 3.5, 7200rpm, 8 MB cache, SATA. Seeking recommendations for replacement. Operator Headgap has a factory recertified Seagate Barracuda, 3.5, 7200 RPM, 32 MB cache, SATA, 750 GB going for $59 and change. http://stn2.headgap.com/resale/FMPro?-token=13626219- db=ProductsC.fp3-lay=WEB-format=items.htm-sortfield=SortID- Max=40category=intdrivessata-find Sean -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: Hard drive failing!
Fair enough. I have 5 MDD G4s, along with (too many) TiVos. In 25 Mac years, I've only had one drive fail me, a Seagate in a TiVo. Never had a failed Maxtor or WD. (I know Seagate bought Maxtor) So for me, I have no significant failure experience on any drives. The one SG was under warranty, and they swapped it out based on date code, no hassle over no receipt, and gave me a UPS label. So that fail gave me good vibes on their cust service. On Jan 30, 3:16 am, Jason Brown jason_brown1...@att.net wrote: It is a WD though. Couldn't pay me to use one. YMMV but MM has been very very bad with them. -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: Mac Mini Max Resolution?
On Jan 27, 7:39 pm, James Therrault jetas...@netzero.com wrote: The best that I can get with my 22 Samsung Synchmaster 22 wide screen is 1680x1050. Do I have to utilize both video ports to achieve higher resolution? Seems I was doing better than this when hooked up to my old G4 Gigabit with a measly 16MB Vram. JT (Late 2009 Core duo Mini with Nividia graphics/256MB Vram shared with main memory (4GB)) My ancient 22 Apple Cinema Display only gets 1600x1024. I still prefer it over my 21.5 Acer @ 1920x1080. The Apple monitor seems a fair bit larger than .5 would suggest. Maybe it's the 16:10 vs 16:9 aspect ratio... -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: Dual G5 Dilemma
On Jan 27, 6:24 am, dc dbc...@verizon.net wrote: On Jan 26, 3:50 pm, imrazor evol...@gmail.com wrote: I'm facing a dilemma about what to do with my (formerly) trusty dual G5. When I first got it used about two or three years ago, the package was damaged in shipping and warped the chassis, such that the G5 tilts to one side. Up until recently, the G5 worked fine in spite of that. Recently, however, the optical drive has quit ejecting properly. If you force open the tray, you can get it to eject with a paper clip, but that's rather inconvenient. I bought a used G5 in the same condition several years ago. I was able to fix the optical drive issue by removing the drive and adjusting the small mounting screws on the bottom. I ran the G5 for several years with a paperback book under the damaged corner (there, I fixed it!). Last summer I decided to really fix it and I transplanted everything into a used case that I picked up from the LEM swap list. I don't recommend that. It took me all day, plus searching around several hardware stores for the right tool to remove the processors. I'd suggest you first try to sell it as is. Thanks for the feedback, folks. It seems the best idea is not to part it out. I may try to sell it as a whole unit after dropping the stock video card back in, and selling the upgraded card seperately. I think it still has some value, even if it is a flashed PC card. As for the G5 itself, I think I'll try propping it up with a/some book(s), and perhaps adjusting the optical drive mounting screws. Sooner or later, I'll probably end up freecycling it... -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: Hard drive failing!
On Jan 30, 2:16 am, Jason Brown jason_brown1...@att.net wrote: It is a WD though. Couldn't pay me to use one. YMMV but MM has been very very bad with them. I've had bad luck with WD AND Seagate drives. The only brands I've not had fail on me are Fujitsu and Samsung, but I use those pretty rarely. The 5 year Seagate warranty is nice, though. If you want to count on that, though, I think you have to buy a retail drive as opposed to a bare/OEM model. -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: Mac Mini Max Resolution?
On Jan 30, 2011, at 10:13 AM, imrazor wrote: On Jan 27, 7:39 pm, James Therrault jetas...@netzero.com wrote: The best that I can get with my 22 Samsung Synchmaster 22 wide screen is 1680x1050. Do I have to utilize both video ports to achieve higher resolution? Seems I was doing better than this when hooked up to my old G4 Gigabit with a measly 16MB Vram. JT (Late 2009 Core duo Mini with Nividia graphics/256MB Vram shared with main memory (4GB)) My ancient 22 Apple Cinema Display only gets 1600x1024. I still prefer it over my 21.5 Acer @ 1920x1080. The Apple monitor seems a fair bit larger than .5 would suggest. Maybe it's the 16:10 vs 16:9 aspect ratio... I believe at that time that Samsung was building the Apple displays and my 22 Synchmaster 225bw is probably very similar including the max resolution. Dual link is the answer but Apple's solution doesn't get anywhere near rave reviews... JT Ring in the New Year. Start the year off right with a free camera phone from ATT. http://thirdpartyoffers.netzero.net/TGL3241/4d45a0b7a41fff8667st01duc -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Unstable PowerMac G4
Hi All, Setup: PM G4 1.25gH, Model M8570, 80GB HD, 1 GB RAM, either a Nividia Geforce4 Ti or a ATI Radeon 9000 Pro both have 128 MB of VRAM, OS 10.4.11, Geekbench result 771-785. Very clean cabinet in and out. No signs of damage in or out. Symptom: Will boot and operate properly. With or without activity will freeze with no repeatability. If it goes to sleep it will wake up but not respond consistently. What I have tried: 1) Different configurations (1-256, 2-256, 4-256, 1-512, 2-512, 4-512) of RAM and manufactures. Ran Memtest on all and tested sat. 2) Both video cards. 3) Reformatted the internal HD. Wrote zeros to it in erase mode. 4) Fresh install of OS 10.4.6 upgraded to 10.4.11 using a downloaded copy of OS 10.4.11 Combo Updater. No other third party software other than Geekbench. 5) New PRAM battery. Voltage installed with power removed is 3.6Vdc. Reset PRAM. 6) Booted on a XHD with 10.4.11 7) Booted on a XHD with 10.3.4 8) Booted on the internal drive with OS 9.2.2 9) Booted on all of the above OSs with the internal HD and optical drive disconnect. 10) Safe boot. (Wish it were like OS 9, and back, where you could select what was being enabled and disabled) 11) Single user mode. 12) All PCI and external devices removed/disconnected. KB and mouse are connected. Findings: 1) Least stable on OS 10.4.11 booted on either an internal or external HD but has never frozen in safe boot or single user mode. 2) Stable on OS 9.2.2 and OS 10.3.4. 3) No different effect with different RAM configurations. 4) No different effect with either video card installed. 5) One of the three fans audible sounds like it slows when I connect a bus powered portable 2.5 FW drive. Fan pitch also goes down when running Geekbench. I believe it is the main cabinet fan. Ultimate I want to set this up with my main TV to stream children's videos, run OS 9 (in classic) and OS 10.4.X preschool educational and game applications, and play online applications such as found at the Disney site. Any help, advice, or suggestions will be greatly appreciated. R/ Deaner -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: Unstable PowerMac G4
On 1/30/2011 7:46 PM, Deaner Lawless Jr. wrote: Hi All, Setup: PM G4 1.25gH, Model M8570, 80GB HD, 1 GB RAM, either a Nividia Geforce4 Ti or a ATI Radeon 9000 Pro both have 128 MB of VRAM, OS 10.4.11, Geekbench result 771-785. Very clean cabinet in and out. No signs of damage in or out. Symptom: Will boot and operate properly. With or without activity will freeze with no repeatability. If it goes to sleep it will wake up but not respond consistently. What I have tried: 1) Different configurations (1-256, 2-256, 4-256, 1-512, 2-512, 4-512) of RAM and manufactures. Ran Memtest on all and tested sat. 2) Both video cards. 3) Reformatted the internal HD. Wrote zeros to it in erase mode. 4) Fresh install of OS 10.4.6 upgraded to 10.4.11 using a downloaded copy of OS 10.4.11 Combo Updater. No other third party software other than Geekbench. 5) New PRAM battery. Voltage installed with power removed is 3.6Vdc. Reset PRAM. 6) Booted on a XHD with 10.4.11 7) Booted on a XHD with 10.3.4 8) Booted on the internal drive with OS 9.2.2 9) Booted on all of the above OSs with the internal HD and optical drive disconnect. 10) Safe boot. (Wish it were like OS 9, and back, where you could select what was being enabled and disabled) 11) Single user mode. 12) All PCI and external devices removed/disconnected. KB and mouse are connected. Findings: 1) Least stable on OS 10.4.11 booted on either an internal or external HD but has never frozen in safe boot or single user mode. 2) Stable on OS 9.2.2 and OS 10.3.4. 3) No different effect with different RAM configurations. 4) No different effect with either video card installed. 5) One of the three fans audible sounds like it slows when I connect a bus powered portable 2.5 FW drive. Fan pitch also goes down when running Geekbench. I believe it is the main cabinet fan. Ultimate I want to set this up with my main TV to stream children's videos, run OS 9 (in classic) and OS 10.4.X preschool educational and game applications, and play online applications such as found at the Disney site. Any help, advice, or suggestions will be greatly appreciated. R/ Deaner If 10.4 doesn't work well, it could be memory speeds. Do they all have the same speed? Are they all Apple original? -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: Unstable PowerMac G4
At 8:02 PM +0200 1/30/2011, Illirik Smirnov wrote: If 10.4 doesn't work well, it could be memory speeds. Do they all have the same speed? Are they all Apple original? A possibility. But typically memory issues cause a kernel panic -- the OP says the system is freezing. - Dan. -- - Psychoceramic Emeritus; South Jersey, USA, Earth. -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: Unstable PowerMac G4
At 12:46 PM -0500 1/30/2011, Deaner Lawless Jr. wrote: PM G4 1.25gH, Model M8570, 80GB HD, 1 GB RAM, either a Nividia Geforce4 Ti or a ATI Radeon 9000 Pro both have 128 MB of VRAM, OS 10.4.11 Will boot and operate properly. With or without activity will freeze with no repeatability. If it goes to sleep it will wake up but not respond consistently. Freeze - not a kernel panic, just a complete system lock-up - no activity in windows, menu bar items don't update, and the mouse cursor is immobile? Are there any crash or panic logs at all? Any errors being thrown into system.log shortly before or at the freeze? What I have tried: [snip] Seems like you covered the bases quite well ! Have you reseated the power supply connections? (long shot; doesn't really jive with it being stable under 9.2.2 or Panther). In Tiger, if you turn off Spotlight's indexing (mdutil, fm Terminal), does the system become more stable? (Spotlight and other services that touch the HDs often are not running in Safe or Single User modes. I'm contemplating internal HD or cable or bus issues). See if Tiger is stable while booted on an external drive after you've disconnected the data cable to the internal drive(s). - Dan. -- - Psychoceramic Emeritus; South Jersey, USA, Earth. -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: Unstable PowerMac G4
-- Original message -- Subject: Unstable PowerMac G4 Date:Sunday, 30. January 2011 From:Deaner Lawless Jr. law...@gmail.com To: g3-5-list@googlegroups.com 5) One of the three fans audible sounds like it slows when I connect a bus powered portable 2.5 FW drive. Fan pitch also goes down when running Geekbench. I believe it is the main cabinet fan. Could this be a PSU problem? Normally, when Geekbench starts its performance test, the CPU heat will increase. If the fan pitch is a direct indication of the fan speed (what I believe it to be) it doesn't make much sense to me that the fan speed goes down. If you have access to an alternate power supply unit for your Mac, try it with Mac OS X 10.4.11 and see if that does any good. Cheers, Andreas aka Mac User #330250 -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: Unstable PowerMac G4
On Jan 30, 2011, at 1:02 PM, Illirik Smirnov wrote: If 10.4 doesn't work well, it could be memory speeds. Do they all have the same speed? Are they all Apple original? I don't think what I have is OEM. Here is what I do have and tried: 2- Kingston KVR400/1GR, 1GB, DDR PC3200 CL3 non-ECC Unbuffered, 400mHz; all match 4- NANYA 256MB, PC3200U; all match 4- NANYA NT512D64S8HCOG5T, 512MB, DDR PC3200U CL3 400mHz; all match All pass Memtest in the machine R/ Deaner -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: Unstable PowerMac G4
On Jan 30, 2011, at 1:23 PM, Dan wrote: Freeze - not a kernel panic, just a complete system lock-up - no activity in windows, menu bar items don't update, and the mouse cursor is immobile? Yes. Use the power button to shut down. Boots right back and operates ok. I have only used Safari, Geekbench and System Preference apps since the clean install. Are there any crash or panic logs at all? Glad you asked. That is where my experience falls short. Be glad to review/send it. I have looked at Console but need your help for what to look for. Any errors being thrown into system.log shortly before or at the freeze? Same as above Dan. What I have tried: [snip] Seems like you covered the bases quite well ! Thanks. Have you reseated the power supply connections? Yes all connectors have been reseated. (long shot; doesn't really jive with it being stable under 9.2.2 or Panther). Think maybe the video card extensions may be in conflict? Boot in OS 9 I was able to determine which extension play pretty with the ATI card. Only like 4 out of the 7 or 8. I am tempted to pull all ATI from extensions from the OS 10.4.11's System/Library/Extensions Folder and see how it runs like that. In Tiger, if you turn off Spotlight's indexing (mdutil, fm Terminal), does the system become more stable? (Spotlight and other services that touch the HDs often are not running in Safe or Single User modes. I'm contemplating internal HD or cable or bus issues). No but will try. See if Tiger is stable while booted on an external drive after you've disconnected the data cable to the internal drive(s). Done this. It is unstable on an XHD as well. An XHD with OS9.2.2 is how I found it was stable. Then did a internal HD install of OS 9.2.2. Back in the OS 6,7,8, and 9 this sort of problem was usually resolved with the Extension Mgr or manually removal of file. R/ Deaner -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: Unstable PowerMac G4
On Jan 30, 2011, at 1:32 PM, Mac User #330250 wrote: Could this be a PSU problem? Normally, when Geekbench starts its performance test, the CPU heat will increase. If the fan pitch is a direct indication of the fan speed (what I believe it to be) it doesn't make much sense to me that the fan speed goes down. If you have access to an alternate power supply unit for your Mac, try it with Mac OS X 10.4.11 and see if that does any good. Since this is Mirror Door model I believe the main cabinet fan is what is changing in speed. The strange part is when I connect my 2.5 portable HD via FW400 that slows it as well. Powered XHDs don't have the same effect. I wish I had a second PSU for the machine. I do have a good 340watt PSU used in earlier PM G4 models. Will have to check compatibility. R/ Deaner -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: Unstable PowerMac G4
At 2:05 PM -0500 1/30/2011, Deaner Lawless Jr. wrote: Are there any crash or panic logs at all? Glad you asked. That is where my experience falls short. Be glad to review/send it. I have looked at Console but need your help for what to look for. Any errors being thrown into system.log shortly before or at the freeze? Same as above Dan. View the logs with Console.app - it's in /Applications/Utilities/. Tell it to show you the log list; there are quite a few! console.log contains stuff local to your user (application errors and such). The interesting system-wide / hardware stuff is in system.log. Everything is time stamped. Give it a peruse... it is read-only, so you can't damage anything. Of particular interest are entries made a minute or two before and during the freeze. (long shot; doesn't really jive with it being stable under 9.2.2 or Panther). Think maybe the video card extensions may be in conflict? Boot in OS 9 I was able to determine which extension play pretty with the ATI card. Only like 4 out of the 7 or 8. I am tempted to pull all ATI from extensions from the OS 10.4.11's System/Library/Extensions Folder and see how it runs like that. Can't hurt to try! - Dan. -- - Psychoceramic Emeritus; South Jersey, USA, Earth. -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: Odd QuickSilver Dual boot behavior
On 1/29/11 11:46 PM, Kris Tilford of ktilfo...@cox.net sent On Jan 29, 2011, at 9:27 PM, DLC wrote: If I boot into OS 9 straight (normal), I will not get a screen to show (remains black) - lack of HD activity makes me suspect that no booting is engaged either. By normal I assume you mean selecting the OX 9 in Startup Disk? Since support for Classic ended at OS 10.4.11, there's a chance that Startup Disk in 10.5.8 doesn't handle OS 9 booting correctly? 10.5.8 is unsupported for the Quicksilver. There's another way to select OS 9 or OS X by keyboard commands. You can hold the 9 key to boot OS 9, or the X key to boot OS X. IF, however, I start up, hold left-shift key, and then choose OS 9 from the OS selection panel that appears, the unit boots into OS 9 and operates fine. I think you mean the Option key rather than the left-Shift key. The Shift key gives a Safe Boot in OS X; and no extensions in OS 9. The Option key gives the bootable devices menu. Personally, I wouldn't worry about it, how often do you boot OS 9? If you use OS 9 that much, it'd probably be better to install OS 10.4.11 and use Classic emulation within OS X. As an added perk, Tiger is about 20% faster than Leopard on PPC CPUs. Hello Kris (and Clark), Thank you both for the input. Some clarification €Yes, I meant the left option key to call up the bootable device menu screen €No, I am not referring to Classic emulation within OS X 10.5 €If I call up the System Preference StartUp Disk, and select OS 9, then Restart the unit will not successfully boot into 9 (black/blank screen) If I repeat the scenario, but add the left-option key gesture, the QS WILL boot up into OS 9 €The QS DID boot up off the OS 9.22 (universal install) CD (so that install of the OS was successful), but on the subsequent restart was treated to my black screen of death €If this is consistent enough, I'll leave it as is - I'll have to acquiesce to the actual owner's wishes; if he really needs to get into OS 9 consistently, I would back it down to Tiger, as (yes, I agree) it is faster on PPCs as you said, Kris. However, I have a sneaky suspicion that that would not solve the problem :-) Am curious if the QS needs a certain enabler in OS 9 - were enablers needed by this time (2001-02)? I seem to recall that the MDDs, in using 9.2.2, needed a machine-specific extension/ROM image added to the System Folder. In the end, I find this curious (and not obstructive), as when the unit IS in OS 9, it runs just fine (as it does in OS X). Thanks, Dana -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: Unstable PowerMac G4
-- Original message -- Subject: Re: Unstable PowerMac G4 Date:Sunday, 30. January 2011 From:Deaner Lawless Jr. law...@gmail.com To: g3-5-list@googlegroups.com If you have access to an alternate power supply unit for your Mac, try it with Mac OS X 10.4.11 and see if that does any good. Since this is Mirror Door model I believe the main cabinet fan is what is changing in speed. The strange part is when I connect my 2.5 portable HD via FW400 that slows it as well. Powered XHDs don't have the same effect. This behaviour would indicate an electrical issue. But it's hard to be sure without a reference system to test. I had a MDD Dual-1.0 GHz once and don't remember any fan reactions when plugging in external USB devices. I never used FW400 though. And the USB drivers where either 2.5 USB-bus-powered or 3.5 external powered hard disk drives, connected to a USB-2.0 PCI expansion card. I wish I had a second PSU for the machine. I do have a good 340watt PSU used in earlier PM G4 models. Will have to check compatibility. I don't think that MDD PSUs are the same as, say, QS or DA ones. But I don't really know either… Good luck! I hope you'll find a solution… Cheers, Andreas aka Mac User #330250 -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: Odd QuickSilver Dual boot behavior
On Jan 30, 2011, at 3:49 PM, Dana Collins wrote: QS DID boot up off the OS 9.22 (universal install) CD (so that install of the OS was successful) I don't believe there's such as thing as a 9.2.2 universal install CD. The final retail OS 9 disc was the OS 9.1 disc that's white with the orange/yellow 9 on it. This disc installs OS 9.1 and is the only universal disc I'm aware of. It requires both a 9.2.1 and a 9.2.2 update to reach the final OS 9.2.2 installation. There were quite a few of the grey OS 9.2.1 discs that shipped with most of the G3 G4 Macs that came with OS X as the original OEM OS. The only 9.2.2 discs I'm aware of came with the MDD and were specific to the MDD. There's also the free download of the 9.2.2 netboot OS X installer package:http://support.apple.com/kb/DL1192 If you use this, remove the two netboot extensions from the System FolderExtensions Folder. but on the subsequent restart was treated to my black screen of death It sure sounds like what you're calling your black screen of death is simply a computer that isn't finding a bootable drive. Normally a Mac would eventually default back to a firmware screen with an icon of a folder with a flashing ? on it. Since you're not seeing this, and you've said the HDs aren't doing anything, it doesn't seem likely to me that it's a video card issue. It seems like a PRAM/NVRAM issue. You should reset the NVRAM using these instructions: 1)Boot holding the Cmd-Opt-O-F keys 2)at the Open Firmware prompt, type: set-defaultsReturn reset-allReturn where Return means to hit the Return key You should see a response of ok to the 1st command, and a restart after hitting the Return key of the 2nd command. Hopefully this will straighten out your startup disk issues. If not, you may have a bad HD or other hardware issue? -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: Odd QuickSilver Dual boot behavior
I have a disc labeled 9.2.1. I got the MDD and Apple sent this for $10 shortly after as part of some upgrade program. I don't believe there's such as thing as a 9.2.2 universal install CD. The final retail OS 9 disc was the OS 9.1 disc that's white with the orange/yellow 9 on it. This disc installs OS 9.1 and is the only universal disc I'm aware of. It requires both a 9.2.1 and a 9.2.2 update to reach the final OS 9.2.2 installation. -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: Odd QuickSilver Dual boot behavior
On Jan 30, 2011, at 8:38 PM, JoeTaxpayer wrote: I have a disc labeled 9.2.1. Yes, this is the standard grey semi-universal disc that ships with Macs that come with OS X standard. It will install a bootable System on almost all Macs, so it's universal in the sense that you'll get a bootable System, but it's not universal in the sense that it's missing extensions for earlier PowerMac models that didn't ship with OS X. For example, the Beige G3 series requires special extensions to enable the Wings AV personality card, and while the grey disc will give you 9.2.1 that boots, it won't enable the Wings AV card, so it's not a universal installer. I got the MDD and Apple sent this for $10 shortly after as part of some upgrade program. The MDD shipped with Jaguar 10.2. Retail boxes of Jaguar 10.2 also contained a retail 9.1 CD. The grey 9.2.1 was probably an additional disc with a Panther upgrade disc set? The grey 9.2.1 disc is very common, more common than the 9.1 retail disc. For most purposes, the differences between these discs (white 9.1 retail grey 9.2.1 universal) is negligible, but in certain rare circumstances it can be slightly problematic. If your 9.2.1 disc was shipped for a MDD, it's likely the rarest 9.2 disc, the special MDD disc that adds specific support for the MDD only. I don't know, but I assume the special MDD disc is a superset disc that will work on all earlier Macs also? -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: Odd QuickSilver Dual boot behavior
Hi Kris, As below: On 1/30/11 7:08 PM, Kris Tilford of ktilfo...@cox.net sent On Jan 30, 2011, at 3:49 PM, Dana Collins wrote: QS DID boot up off the OS 9.22 (universal install) CD (so that install of the OS was successful) I don't believe there's such as thing as a 9.2.2 universal install CD. The final retail OS 9 disc was the OS 9.1 disc that's white with the orange/yellow 9 on it. This disc installs OS 9.1 and is the only universal disc I'm aware of. It requires both a 9.2.1 and a 9.2.2 update to reach the final OS 9.2.2 installation. There were quite a few of the grey OS 9.2.1 discs that shipped with most of the G3 G4 Macs that came with OS X as the original OEM OS. The only 9.2.2 discs I'm aware of came with the MDD and were specific to the MDD. There's also the free download of the 9.2.2 netboot OS X installer package:http://support.apple.com/kb/DL1192 If you use this, remove the two netboot extensions from the System FolderExtensions Folder. I have been using a retail install of OS 9.2.1. It was a disc that came as part of a package set issued by Apple which included OS 10.2 and some educator's development tools. Then using a .img of 9.2.2 update to arrive at my final destination. but on the subsequent restart was treated to my black screen of death It sure sounds like what you're calling your black screen of death is simply a computer that isn't finding a bootable drive. Normally a Mac would eventually default back to a firmware screen with an icon of a folder with a flashing ? on it. Since you're not seeing this, and you've said the HDs aren't doing anything, it doesn't seem likely to me that it's a video card issue. It seems like a PRAM/NVRAM issue. You should reset the NVRAM using these instructions: 1)Boot holding the Cmd-Opt-O-F keys 2)at the Open Firmware prompt, type: set-defaultsReturn reset-allReturn Did this, no change for better, or worse where Return means to hit the Return key You should see a response of ok to the 1st command, and a restart after hitting the Return key of the 2nd command. Hopefully this will straighten out your startup disk issues. If not, you may have a bad HD or other hardware issue? This may help. I have developed a scenario, involving the boot up from left-option key, then select the OS 9 (.22) drive, then holding down the left-shift (as if I want to start w/ no extensions). What happens is, immediately after the OS 9.2 splash screen (happy Mac 2-face), I get the following message: The built-in memory test has detected a problem with cache memory. Please contact a service technician for assistance. The OS then proceeds to boot (with extensions - no-extensions keystroke ignored) normally, and operate normally. This warning is splayed even after turning off the memory test and reducing the system cache. It would help if I knew this: does anyone know IF the OWC Mercury G4 (1.5GHz, rev. 2, not 3) processor upgrade was supposed to have an L3 cache or not? Here's a picture for identification: http://eshop.macsales.com/images/Items/owcmeg4/card.jpg About this Mac in Leopard does not show an L3 cache present, so I'm just wondering. Thank you for the consideration. Best regards, Dana -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: Odd QuickSilver Dual boot behavior
On 1/30/11 10:11 PM, Kris Tilford of ktilfo...@cox.net sent On Jan 30, 2011, at 8:38 PM, JoeTaxpayer wrote: I have a disc labeled 9.2.1. Yes, this is the standard grey semi-universal disc that ships with Macs that come with OS X standard. It will install a bootable System on almost all Macs, so it's universal in the sense that you'll get a bootable System, but it's not universal in the sense that it's missing extensions for earlier PowerMac models that didn't ship with OS X. For example, the Beige G3 series requires special extensions to enable the Wings AV personality card, and while the grey disc will give you 9.2.1 that boots, it won't enable the Wings AV card, so it's not a universal installer. I got the MDD and Apple sent this for $10 shortly after as part of some upgrade program. The MDD shipped with Jaguar 10.2. Retail boxes of Jaguar 10.2 also contained a retail 9.1 CD. The grey 9.2.1 was probably an additional disc with a Panther upgrade disc set? The grey 9.2.1 disc is very common, more common than the 9.1 retail disc. For most purposes, the differences between these discs (white 9.1 retail grey 9.2.1 universal) is negligible, but in certain rare circumstances it can be slightly problematic. If your 9.2.1 disc was shipped for a MDD, it's likely the rarest 9.2 disc, the special MDD disc that adds specific support for the MDD only. I don't know, but I assume the special MDD disc is a superset disc that will work on all earlier Macs also? Hi Kris, Sent you and everyone a longer response with some new, maybe telling, developments. My OS 9.2.1 install CD is as you described: white background, big yellow 9 in the center, apropos logos and copyright stuff on it. Part no. 691-3334-A. I used this to install the OS 2nd time around. First time was indeed a universal grey label version of 9.2.2 - I scrubbed the drive clean and used this retail version of 9.2.1 hoping that it might make some sort of difference. Thanks, Dana -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: Odd QuickSilver Dual boot behavior
On Jan 30, 2011, at 10:14 PM, Dana Collins wrote: The built-in memory test has detected a problem with cache memory. Please contact a service technician for assistance. The OS then proceeds to boot (with extensions - no-extensions keystroke ignored) normally, and operate normally. This warning is splayed even after turning off the memory test and reducing the system cache. Normally on upgrade CPUs you need to use a 3rd-party cache enabler software, which would be required in both OS 9.x and OS X. The specific enabler isn't normally important, they either work, or they don't. My preferences from best to worst would be: PowerLogix CPU Director, Sonnet Cache, XLR8 MachSpeed Control (NOT FREE), followed by a bunch of others that are normally not worth messing with. I'd suggest you install these cache control extensions for both OS 9.x and OS X. You should be able to see if the cache is correctly enabled in Apple System Profiler or System Profiler. If it's not enabled correctly, you should be able to tell easily, everything will be SLOW. I'm not sure why you're having to boot OS 9.2.2 with extensions off? I don't remember you saying anything about an extension conflict or issue? I thought you said if you used the Option key alone it would boot OK? Have you tried the 9 X keyboard boots? Sorting out an extension problem can be time consuming. Most extensions are shown in the parade and if you're having a problem right at the start, it's likely a very basic extension. I know the better cache enabler extensions load first so that the cache can speed up the entire boot process. If the cache loads later, everything is slow until the cache enabler extension loads. The video extensions also load early. Generally you have to use Extensions Manager to turn-off specific extensions until you find the specific extension causing the problem. Often making new sets can help. For example, you can duplicate the set that's causing problems, and then turn off the 1st half of the extensions and boot with only the 2nd half. You'll still have the original unaltered set for backup, and when you boot with half extension set you should quickly know which half of these extensions contains the conflict. Then you repeat, splitting the offending set again, and again, until you get to the single specific extension that's causing the problem. It gets harder with two bad extensions, and nearly impossible with three, so if you have an extension conflict, hope it's only one. It sounds like a problem with your CPU upgrade, which may require reseating the CPU if you can't get it working normally. I just realized, you may already have working cache software installed because any time you boot holding the Shift key for extensions-off you'll disable the cache extension and should always get that warning message. If your only problem is that you need to hold the Option key to boot into OS 9, that's not much of a problem, I'd live with it. -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
