[gay_bombay] great mail from the Gaycalcutta list
from the Gaycalcutta list, an excellent mail from Pawan in answer to a deeply felt mail from Joy (which I'm giving before Pawan's mail, its rather long and rambles a bit, but at least skim through it before reading the reply). Joy's sentiments may sound excessive, but many may have felt them and that's what makes Pawan's very balanced and positive answer so well worth reading. I particularly like the way Pawan points out that there's nothing particularly wrong about the way so many of the guys in the community meet primarily for sex (as long as its safe and consensual and not exploitative). For practial reasons Gaybombay tries to keep sex out of its spaces and that's often interpreted to mean that we're against gay guys having sex with each other or that we're all moralistic about it. I really don't think that's the majority view. As I said, we keep it out for practical reasons, but beyond that I hope we take as balanced a view as Pawan does, Vikram PS: Before I post the mails, one small crib: THERE IS NO SUCH WORD AS 'GAYISM'!!! You can talk about being gay, about homosexuality, about the gay/queer/lgbt movement or anything like that, but PLEASE, not 'gayism'. Joy's mail: joy kolkata <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: to every one who belongs to the gay world... dear friends ... plz tell me wheter gayism is all about sex and fun and only sex and fun are we sex mongers???sex starved beast.. rather sex starved rational animals... more fierce than a hungry tiger who is chained in front of a baby shhep.. is our sexuality is as same asteh hunger of the starved tiger??? if gayism is such than i am sorry to say that i am ashamed of being a gay. hello whats happening yaar??? and what the hell are the so called leaders of the gay world are doing. are yaar what r u all doing... u people have to set trends so that other people gathere enough courage to wqalk on that path... but what we really see??? the picture is very pathetic. so called gay clubs are helding parties which is nothing but an encouragement to open beastly one night sex.. aur bass raat gayiii baat gayiii aree is se to acha hain woh prostitute joo bazarmain apna sarrir bechtii hain... kam se kam woh to hypocrate nahin hain.. woh sarir bechti haina ur joor se kabul vi karti hain.. par hum log kya kar rahe hain??? pyar ke naam ma apne app ko khud ki gunegar bana rahe hain... pyar kya sirf jism kya khel hain sayed ek dialogue thik hi hain... hum logo ka jism pyar karna nahin janta.. janta hain to sirf bhukkjism ki bhuk acha ek cheez hame bataoo dostonn.. kya hum logo ko saram nehi atta? hum log iske babjut bhi kyaese aiine ke samne apna chehera dekh pate hain hum log is samaj ki gunegarr hain... hamlog jo eyese karte hain is karan see pura gay world ko log ek majak ke nazariya se dekhte hain... hum log purii duniya ke gay worlds ke gunegar hain kabhikabhi apni wazood se mujhe ghin se lagtaa hain... lagta hain jaise me kisi bacche ka katil huun.. woh baccha koii aur nahii .. woh mera atma hain... asli baat hain ke hum log jante hain gay namm ki arr main humlogg jo kuch bhii kar rahe hain woh galat hain parr usike sathsathh hum apnii galatiooo ke upor parda bhii dall dete hainn. humjitna jorr lagayenge apnii ek duniya basane ke liye utnii hii hum log is samaz me majak ban jayengewe have to make our world but not coming out of the present society .. rather we shouyld try to make our own life by living in this society...walking hands in hands... hum logo ko ek sath kadam barana hain.. is raftar ke saath hi agge barna hain,... barna rassi tut jayega.. saath chut jayega... to get anew dimention doesnt mean to break evry thing that is existing... by askin/demanding special place we ourself is creating the humiliation for us adhikar manga nahin jata... usee hasil karna parta hainn.. aur issi karun tum khudko itna ucha karloo ke bakii sab tumhare samne chota par jaye.. tab dekhna tumhe adhikar nehi mangna parega,... tumhe khud hi adhikar milega... to agar tumhare vitar sacha lagan hayy.. agar tumhe apnii wajuud pee naaz hain.. agar tum chaho ke tum he wahii samman mile jo aur bakii sabhi ko milta hain... to choro weh sirf fijull ke sex aur sirf sex.. arre yaar sex is only the part of the game not the heart... apni wajuud itna majbuut karto ke koii tumhe unglii na dikha sake... adhiikarr mangoo.. par uske pehele adhikar pane ke kabill banoo... aur ek batt to OUR RESPECTED LEADERS OF THE GAY WORLD... PLZX DONT MISGUIDE THE MEMBERS... SORRY TO SAY BUT U ALLS STRATEGY IS VERYYY WRONG. U ALL WANT JUST TO COME IN THE LIME LIGHT AND NOTHING ELSE... BASOCALLY U ALL ARE ENCASHING THAT. TELL ME ONE THINGF... WHAT U HAVE REALYY DONE FOR THE GAY WORLD... RALLIES...SEMINARS AND PARTIES...? BASSS AUR KUCH NAHIN. MAKE UP KAR KE PARK CIRCUS
[gay_bombay] Re: tres botas 'last' nite
Tres not taking off is a bit of a mystery. As you say, its one place that has tried to have a regular gay night and it was a pretty cool place. Yet after the first night it was never really that packed. Two possible reasons: - it was expensive : not just the Rs300 entry, but the drinks were pretty steep as well. So even though you could redeem your entry fee for a drink, buying another pretty much broke the bank. And while you're right that people seem to pay the same at P&P in Delhi, in Bombay there are other alternatives - Voodoos and the GB parties - and the booze at both places is cheaper. - no Bollywood music : Tres didn't play this, it wasn't their image, but I'm involved with the GB parties and if there's one thing we've learned its that the Bombay crowd wants Bollywood. Sometime back we tried having a Seventies night with Seventies music, but after three tracks everyone was screaming for Bollywood. I wish this wasn't the case, since personally I'd like more variety and in an ideal world we would have different hang outs for people who life different types of music. But while I'm sure there are guys who want something other than Bollywood, they either aren't there in large enough numbers or aren't motivated enough to land up at Tres. Beyond that I don't know. Perhaps guys in Bombay aren't ready for a regular place. Perhaps Tuesday nights was a bummer, esp since there is Voods on Saturdays and the GB parties are tending more towards Fridays and Saturdays. I also think guys in Bombay want variety in venues - at one point we were moving to make Copas a regular weekly place, but numbers fell so we dropped the idea. Also parties in different parts of town seem to be in demand, because there are hard core bunches of guys who won't travel. The whole suburban-downtown thing is much more of an issue in Bombay unlike Delhi where guys seem more willing to travel. Anyway, that's just off the top of my head. Hopefully the owners might consider having more occasional events at Tres, Vikram Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~--> Yahoo! Domains - Claim yours for only $14.70 http://us.click.yahoo.com/Z1wmxD/DREIAA/yQLSAA/WfTolB/TM ~-> Group Site: http://www.gaybombay.info == NEW CLASSIFIEDS SECTION SEEKING FRIENDS? VISIT www.gaybombay.info click on classified section and type your message in the post section once the link opens What's hot? What's not? Where are the LGBT parties being held and when? Click here!! http://calendar.yahoo.com/YYY,04497/srt,0/gaybombaygroup/?v=42&POS= Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/gay_bombay/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[gay_bombay] GB Meeting on Friendship on 1st August
Rather late in the day to post a mail about the subject for tomorrow's GB meeting, but it only just occurred to me, even though its quite an obvious well - tomorrow is Friendship Day. I didn't think about it earlier I guess because I've always vaguely associated this with something to do with Bombay colleges and friendship bands and other fairly icky things, but suddenly it did occur to me that friendship was a good topic to discuss in a GB meeting. People who are looking to become active in the gay community in Bombay often ask me if by doing so they will find a partner. I don't think I'd be wrong in saying that many of us do join groups like these looking for a partner. And many of us find one (I did!). But everyone won't and there's no point in being evasive on this. What I do tell people though is that they can't be sure of finding a partner, but they can be sure of finding friendship. Because that's one thing the gay community does provide and in abundance. We may meet someone for the first time, or just fleetingly, and yet once we know they are gay, is amazing how quickly people become friendly. I've landed up in cities in other countries, at the houses of friends of friends, people I never knew. But just the gay connection makes automatic friends of us. I can't remember how many great evenings I've had just drinking and eating and laughing with friends made that same day, just because we're both gay. Please note I'm not talking sex here. That's important and has its part, but what I'm talking here is just friendship and undemanding support. Sometimes one starts off with sex, but it then becomes a warm and real friendship. Sometimes it goes the other way. As with everything, there can be negatives. People have sometimes complained that gay friendships can be claustrophobic. That uncertain time when you are hooking up with someone who might be a long term partner is always tricky. Your friends might not approve of him, or they might be jealous, and I've known people who have deliberately cut themselves off from their friends until they were secure in their new relationships. But that's one aspect of many and most aspects of gay friendships are overwhelmingly positive. 'Friends' the serial may have taught the world at large about how friends can be a family of sort, but its something the gay community has long known. So lets discuss all these aspects of friendship in the gay community at the GB meeting tomorrow. Vikram Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~--> Yahoo! Domains - Claim yours for only $14.70 http://us.click.yahoo.com/Z1wmxD/DREIAA/yQLSAA/WfTolB/TM ~-> Group Site: http://www.gaybombay.info == NEW CLASSIFIEDS SECTION SEEKING FRIENDS? VISIT www.gaybombay.info click on classified section and type your message in the post section once the link opens What's hot? What's not? Where are the LGBT parties being held and when? Click here!! http://calendar.yahoo.com/YYY,04497/srt,0/gaybombaygroup/?v=42&POS= Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/gay_bombay/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[gay_bombay] Wislawa on friendship
take their feelings or their friendship for granted. Nor does it mean I love my boyfriend any the less for the intensity a relationship demands. What we get from each other, no friend could get, which is why we are together. Of course, there are elements of both relationships in each other. My boyfriend and I do have easy, just friendly times; there are friends where there is almost an element of love in what we have. Yet the truth of what Wislawa says mostly holds. I owe my boyfriend for the love we have, for the relationship between us. I owe my friends for the love we don't have, the lightness of connection, the ease of support that only real friendship brings. Vikram Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~--> Yahoo! Domains - Claim yours for only $14.70 http://us.click.yahoo.com/Z1wmxD/DREIAA/yQLSAA/WfTolB/TM ~-> Group Site: http://www.gaybombay.info == NEW CLASSIFIEDS SECTION SEEKING FRIENDS? VISIT www.gaybombay.info click on classified section and type your message in the post section once the link opens What's hot? What's not? Where are the LGBT parties being held and when? Click here!! http://calendar.yahoo.com/YYY,04497/srt,0/gaybombaygroup/?v=42&POS= Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/gay_bombay/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[gay_bombay] Re: amsterdam?
(Parts of this post are from a mail I'd written sometime back on the gaybombay list on the Homomonument) Apart from all the sex on offer in Amsterdam, there is also the small matter of the Homomonument, the world's first memorial to all those who have been persecuated and victimised because of their sexuality. This is on a canal just behind the Westerkerk, a big church next to Anne Frank's House, probably Amsterdam's biggest tourist attraction. Its very well worth visiting, even though it takes sometime for you to get it, or even realise its there at all. Its not one of those stand up and hit you in the eye memorials. Its a quiet, almost hidden one, as were the lives of many of those it commemorates. You have to sit around, or even on it, for it to get to you. Apparently the location near the Westerkerk was chosen because in the 17th and 18th centuries, churches in Amsterdam, including the Westerkerk itself, were among the few public places where gay men could cruise each other. The monument consists of three big triangles made of pink granite that themselves form the tips of a larger triangle. The reference is obviously to the pink triangles that the Nazis made gay men wear in concentration camps. There is some symbolism about the directions in which the triangles point, which I forget. The main point to note is that one triangle is raised off the ground, forming a place where people can sit, often without realising its a monument. The second triangle is exactly level with the ground and people can walk over it. It has some words on in Dutch: "Aan eenen jongen visscher" which translates as "Such a boundless desire for friendship". They are from a poem by Jacob Israkl de Haan, a gay Jewish Dutch writer and are taken from a poem called 'To a Young Fisherman' Here are the relevant lines in translation: No roses are as thy cheeks nip'd, No tulips as thy feet so velv't, In no eyes afore I e'er beheld, Such a boundless longing for friendship. Behind us was the sea's eternity... OK, the poem isn't going to win any prizes (certainly not phrased like that). Yet by itself and at your feet in the quiet square near the Westerkerk, its hard not to be moved that line. There's a strong sense of the loneliness and the longing to connect that all of us know. The final triangle is below ground level and projects as a pier into the canal. This is the Keizersgracht, one of the four main canals that the old city of Amsterdam is built around. Like with most parts of these canals it manages to combine a fair amount of activity, with boats going down it and people on its banks, with an essential stillness and serenity in its waters, the ducks swimming , and the old buildings reflected in it. The granite pier looks a bit out of place at first, jutting into the canals. But its a pleasant place to sit and people, quite often couples, are frequently usually sitting there. I'm told that people play music and dance or have performances there, yet the only times I've seen it its always been peaceful and quiet and never seems crowded. The one thing that catches your eye though is that at the tip of this triangle, just above water level, there are always flowers. Always. The flowers are sometimes withered, or starting fade, and a man comes along now and then and clears them away. But there are always flowers that come to replace it. This doesn't happen by design, but spontaneously. People are always leaving flowers there in memory of friends, lovers, people they have known. We were told that many people who have died, most of course from AIDS, have left instructions for their ashes to be put in the waters at that point. The flowers are for them and others like them. It is hard to convey how moving this is. Just the constancy of those flowers, on the stone above the water It has, I think, something to do with the the matter of fact way in which these flowers are left. These aren't formal flowers, like the ornate wreaths you see left at more grandiose monuments. These flowers are personal and almost casual - and all the more moving for that. We were sitting there once when someone left flowers. He was an oldish man on his own, dressed in a formal business suit despite the quite hot sunshine, with a briefcase like he was on his way to an appointment, and a a bunch of red roses with him. He came down the steps and because there were some people on the tip he just placed them on the side. And he stood for a minute and then went away. And I know it sounds so corny when I describe it, but at that moment it was really hard not to cry. Vikram Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~--> Make a clean sweep of pop-up ads. Yahoo! Companion Toolbar. Now with Pop-Up Blocker. Get it for free! http://us.click.yahoo.com/L5YrjA/eSIIA
[gay_bombay] GB Meet: what does independence mean to you?
Its a no brainer really - our regular GB Sunday meet falls on August 15th this year, so what better subject for discussion than independence in whatever way we want to see it? And there are many ways, for example: - Does being gay mean independence from the normal bounds of family life? Or is that an unwanted independence which we should seek to recreate through gay marriage? - Most people in India live lives fairly closely bound by family and community. Does being gay give us an independence to look beyond these? Many gay people say they have a much wider range of friends than their straight peers would have. But how wide is this really? Do we put limits of class and other boundaries on who we would accept as community? - Its a cliché that gay people are more creative than straight people. The number of really uncreative gay people we all know should put the lie to that! But perhaps there's some plausibility in the fact that being gay puts one on the margins of society, and these marginal viewpoints are often what leads to different, creative takes on life. Do you think being gay has given you the independence to look at your life and what you do in a different way? - Instead of just independence, we can also talk of Independence in the national sense. Is there any way in which being gay and Indian is subtly different from being gay anywhere else? Or are gay people just the same everywhere? - Finally, lets not forget that the need for independence can arise anywhere - even within the gay community. Do people feel there are stereotypes, ways of thinking and behaving within the gay community that can become oppressive? Is there a need for independence from within the gay community as well? Those are some of the questions I've been able to think of offhand on what independence might mean to gay people. If you have different ideas, or different takes on these ideas, or just want to take part in an interesting discussion in a cool and comfortable gay space then do make time for the Gaybombay meeting this Sunday. It will, as usual, take place in Bandra and for details about time and venue check our website at www.gaybombay.cc If you have any specific questions about this meet, mail me directly at [EMAIL PROTECTED] or [EMAIL PROTECTED] Newcomers who have never come for a gay meeting and might be too nervous are particularly urged to come. The Gaybombay meetings are designed to be a safe and comfortable space in which to make your first contact with the community. If you have any specific questions on this, mail me at the addresses above, Vikram Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~--> Make a clean sweep of pop-up ads. Yahoo! Companion Toolbar. Now with Pop-Up Blocker. Get it for free! http://us.click.yahoo.com/L5YrjA/eSIIAA/yQLSAA/WfTolB/TM ~-> Group Site: http://www.gaybombay.info == NEW CLASSIFIEDS SECTION SEEKING FRIENDS? VISIT www.gaybombay.info click on classified section and type your message in the post section once the link opens What's hot? What's not? Where are the LGBT parties being held and when? Click here!! http://calendar.yahoo.com/YYY,04497/srt,0/gaybombaygroup/?v=42&POS= Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/gay_bombay/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[gay_bombay] from Outsports.com: The Rise and Fall of Gender Testing
I thought the only queer angle to the Olympics was the presence - or more accurately, non-presence - of out queer athletes, but I hadn't realised there was another, more serious side to it. The long history of gender testing at the Olympics is a rather tragic aspect of how queer issues have combined with the games. How the people affected would describe themselves - gay, lesbian, bi, straight, intersexed, trans - is perhaps not gone into too closely since being so clearly boxed seems to have been the problem for them. Its one of those times when that catch-all label queer seems most appropriate and queer many of them certainly were - and suffered for it. But its a complex story, with lots of places for questions - not all the protests of the athletes who competed with them can be dismissed as prejudice. For those who have access to the Financial Times' excellent Weekend section (not available online without subscription), Simon Kuper, their very good sports columnist had an excellent and concise piece on the subject in the July31-August 1st issue. Below is a good, though considerably longer piece from Outsports by Patricia Nell Warren on the same subject, and a couple of other pieces below that. Its very well worth reading as the Olympics are going on. The Rise and Fall of Gender Testing How the Cold War and Two "Masculine" Soviet Sisters Led to a Propaganda Campaign By Patricia Nell Warren Special to Outsports.com In the late `90s, as the Olympic Games finally dropped their long- hated requirement for women's gender-testing, the Gay Games stumbled into hot water with its own gender policies. First the 1998 Amsterdam Games required that any competitors who had changed their birth gender to the opposite gender must provide medical proof of "completed gender transition." Organizers also decreed that mixed- sex couples (including transgendered persons who couldn't prove "transition" on paper) would not be allowed in the ballroom- dancing event. Then the 2002 Sydney Games tried a different tack, by dividing competitions into two divisions: "male" or "female." Everybody, including transgendered and intersex athletes, had to choose which box they wanted to compete in, based on what their passport or birth certificate said about their gender. Writing for Independent Gay Forum, Stephen H. Miller argued: "You'd think this would be a no-brainer. After all, the reason that men compete against men, and women against women, is because the male body is, well, different from the female body and same-sex competition ensures a level playing field, gender wise." Curiously, this was almost the same language that the International Olympic Committee (IOC) had used to defend its gender testing for nearly four decades. Some GLBT athletes and activists bristled at both Gay Games' rules. As the Gay Games wrestles with gender policy, the real reason why gender became an issue at the Olympic Games, back in the mid-1900s, is almost forgotten -- along with the two Soviet sisters whose "masculine" appearance pushed gender testing into place. War and Peace After World War II, as the United States and the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics struggled to avoid total war on the battlefield, these two superpowers also sought victories away from the battlefield. They did this by ruthless use of propaganda. General Eisenhower was still U.S. President, and Stalin was still Soviet premier. Which was better, democracy or communism? East or West? Each nation kept its spin doctors working to prove that it was better, wealthier, more powerful, with nastier weapons and bigger harvests and harder-working, more patriotic citizens. The Soviets extolled their freedom from religion, while many Americans extolled their belief in God. Naturally that fierce competition extended into international amateur sport. Each side interpreted the Olympic motto "citius, altius, fortius" as meaning that its athletes would go "faster, higher, stronger." Gender testing was a propaganda by-product of the Cold War. Based on the discovery of DNA in 1951-53, new gene technology burst into the sports scene during 40 long years of global jitters, when the world felt it was teetering on the brink of nuclear war. The era also spawned new military technology -- the B-52 bomber, the intercontinental ballistic missile, the nuclear submarine, the space race. In the U.S., demand for gender testing came out of the same superheated conservative climate that produced the 1950s McCarthy hearings, which aimed to root communists and homosexuals out of our society. In many Americans' minds, there was a link between "not being a real American" and "not being a real woman or man." It wasn't till 1952 that the USSR decided to join in post-war Olympic competition. Still rebuilding out of wartime rubble, the Soviets patched together their first world-class team for the Helsinki summer games. Co
[gay_bombay] Re: If Pushkin was murdered for black mailing people ........
--- In [EMAIL PROTECTED], jennifer thomson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Hi Guys, > > If Pushkin was murdered for black mailing people with > pictures taken by him then he deserves to be taught a > lesson ..who ever he may be... > > There is something called UNSPOKEN TRUST in this > circle where you safe guard another guys idendity even > without the other guy requesting you to do so.Because > everyone is discreet and do not want to be looked down > by the society and they want to safe guard their > families. Where exactly is there any proof that Pushkin was blackmailing anybody? There has been one rather hysterical mail on this list alleging that, but on what basis it didn't make clear. The other allegations about blackmail have come from newspaper reports which were obviously reflecting, almost verbatim, what they were being fed by the police. And one can see how, for the police, blackmail is a neat and rather lazy theory. They find an obviously gay guy and in their minds gay = criminal anyway. They find pictures of porn, perhaps some taken of Pushkin and his partners. Since no one apart from the police has seen these pix we have no idea if these seemed to be willingly taken pictures or hidden ones. The chances are that they are the former since it would require a fair amount of enterprise on Pushkin's part to take hidden ones and there's no reason why he needed to - more on that in a moment) We don't even know if they were porn pictures. The police has found porn, its found pictures taken at gay parties and its let the assumption be made that they are porn pictures of Delhi people. If someone raided any gay guy's apartment they might find some porn and some pictures of their gay friends in totally normal contexts, but leak this to some crime journalist lackey and hey, you have a blackmailer on your hands. I didn't know Pushkin personally, but I have friends who did, and they say there was absolutely no reason for Pushkin to be a blackmailer. He came from a well off family and he was hardly as totally estranged from them as the media reports make out. He had his own apartment for reasons of his own convenience, but he was out to them, and he had parties there for both his gay and straight friends and no one had a problem with it. He also had an excellent NGO job, so there was no monetary reason to be a blackmailer. And from what I've heard of his personality, which seems to have been kind and generous, if perhaps too trusting, he would be the last person to turn blackmailer. I am saying this all at length because there is a really ugly tendency when its a crime with a gay person as the victim to twist things around to make it seem like the gay guy was really the villain. It can be as ordinarily homophobic as to say "well he deserved it, he must have provoked it" to as truly vile as trying to concoct reasons to prove he was really a criminal. Some variation of this seems to be going on in Delhi - from the media coverage you would hardly think Pushkin was the person who was killed. Given the fact that the car and his credit cards were missing isn't there an equally, if not more, strong case that this was just a murder for money with the extreme violence being explained by homophobia or, even more plausibly, the fact that the guys who did it were on drugs? But these are all speculations and its not fair assuming anything for or against Pushkin until the killers are caught and some more unbiased evidence comes out. If the Delhi police can or would want to produce it, that is. Vikram Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~--> $9.95 domain names from Yahoo!. Register anything. http://us.click.yahoo.com/J8kdrA/y20IAA/yQLSAA/WfTolB/TM ~-> Group Site: http://www.gaybombay.info == NEW CLASSIFIEDS SECTION SEEKING FRIENDS? VISIT www.gaybombay.info click on classified section and type your message in the post section once the link opens What's hot? What's not? Where are the LGBT parties being held and when? Click here!! http://calendar.yahoo.com/YYY,04497/srt,0/gaybombaygroup/?v=42&POS= Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/gay_bombay/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[gay_bombay] Re: NDTV 24x7 The Big Fight August 21, 2004
Geeta has confirmed that this is on tonight at 8 pm with a repeat at 12.00 midnight and on Sunday at 12.00 noon. She says it went off well and was quite dramatic, including a clash with a homophobic Christian pastor who she says they took to pieces! Also check the piece on Pushkin in today's Times of India Delhi by my colleague Dibs who was a friend of Pushkin's and has written a much needed corrective to all the awful reports circulating about his lifestyle and how he might have been a blackmailer. We protested to the editor of the Times who was most responsive and instructed the Delhi office to cover the case with more sensitivity and also to carry this piece and maybe one by me next week. I think Ramki has already posted Nina Martyris' excellent piece in the Times on these lists. And there was Namita's piece in HT. Lets see what the weeklies say. I spoke to a friend at Outlook and hopefully their coverage will be positive. So its good to see that the response to the awful initial media reports is happening. Next time round - and lets not kid ourselves, there will be a next time - perhaps we should be better prepared and respond sooner. The Times editor told us that part of the problem was that no one responded at first from his family or friends, so it was just the lurid police fabrications that were being published. That sort of thing can be corrected. If we are better prepared then that's one way of ensuring some good comes out of this tragedy. Vikram --- In [EMAIL PROTECTED], "Nitin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > NDTV 24x7 The Big Fight August 21, 2004 > > FYI > > Saturday's edition of The Big Fight is supposed to be a debate > on `homosexuality: how open is it and how acceptable?' or something > on those lines. Panelists include Anjali Gopalan, Ashok Row Kavi, > and Suhel Seth. > > Airs on Saturday night at 8 p.m. > Repeats Sunday at 12 p.m. > > Nitin Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~--> $9.95 domain names from Yahoo!. Register anything. http://us.click.yahoo.com/J8kdrA/y20IAA/yQLSAA/WfTolB/TM ~-> Group Site: http://www.gaybombay.info == NEW CLASSIFIEDS SECTION SEEKING FRIENDS? VISIT www.gaybombay.info click on classified section and type your message in the post section once the link opens What's hot? What's not? Where are the LGBT parties being held and when? Click here!! http://calendar.yahoo.com/YYY,04497/srt,0/gaybombaygroup/?v=42&POS= Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/gay_bombay/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[gay_bombay] from Pushkin's father
The Pioneer in Delhi has had some of the worst coverage of Pushkin's death - one piece on Wednesday was so luridly written it was almost funny - but I think they have redeemed themselves in a very small way by carrying this very dignified and moving speech by Pushkin's father at the memorial service for his son: 'Remember me for what I am' By Avinash Dutt Anil Kumar Chandra, a retired IAS officer of the MP cadre, gave this speech at a prayer meeting held in memory of his son Pushkin Chandra on Wednesday at Chinmaya Mission, Lodhi Road. Friends, As a father, I was at first reluctant to speak but this afternoon I felt I owe it to Pushkin to say something. I wish to say that I have had a wonderful journey with Pushkin for 38 years - full of fun, caring and sharing. There were moments of highs and lows in this journey but behind it all was love and understanding. He was a very lovable and warm-hearted boy with a very sharp analytical mind packed with phenomenal knowledge. You talk to him on any subject - be it national politics, international affairs, investments, economics, computers, who in the world makes the best cartoon films or what is the difference between Confucianism and the Zen philosophy of Japan and he had the answers which were so full of facts and figures that they left one with hardly any scope of further discussion. He also had a great sense of humour. I remember when he was a boy of nine or ten, he had to write a short essay for admission to a private school in Delhi. The topic was "What would you do if you become the Prime Minister of India?" While all students quickly got down to writing that they would make bridges, roads, canals and set up factories, Pushkin's answer was something to this effect: "I do not want to be the Prime Minister of India. The PM has to get up early, work very hard during the day and sleep late. As I do not like getting up early, am lazy, I do not want to become the Prime Minister." I thought his answer was brilliant but he was rejected. He was full of puns on his teachers at school, college and many others he knew ... they are too many to recount. Pushkin was also a great conversationalist. He loved talking and could go on talking for hours. He best epitomised the Urdu verse of Ali Sardar Jafri: Guftgu band naa ho Baton se baat chale Subah shaam mulakat chale Hum se hansti hooee taro bhari raat chale Translated in English, it roughly means : Let the conversations never end Let talk lead to talk Mornings, evenings let the meetings continue Let our laughter of star-filled nights Always continue In the context of his sudden death, I owe it to Pushkin and you all to say that while in the USA in the late 90s, he once sent me a letter through e-mail in which among other things he sent me a small poem. I was touched and have preserved it. It reads: Dear Papa, Remember me for what I am We are all different and so am I But always remember, I love you both Please and papa, always remember I love you both Friends, I will conclude by reading a small Urdu poem which somewhat reflects my mixed feelings and sentiments on this occasion. Ujale apni yadon ke Hamare saath rehne do Na jaane kis gali mein Zindagi ki shaam ho jaye In English, it means: Let the embers of our memories Always remain with me I do not know on which street The evening of our lives arrives Ladies and Gentlemen, I have reached the evening of my life. Pushkin has gone. But his yadein (memories) will always remain with me. On behalf of my family, all our relatives and friends, I thank you, one and all, for coming and sharing our grief with us. Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~--> $9.95 domain names from Yahoo!. Register anything. http://us.click.yahoo.com/J8kdrA/y20IAA/yQLSAA/WfTolB/TM ~-> Group Site: http://www.gaybombay.info == NEW CLASSIFIEDS SECTION SEEKING FRIENDS? VISIT www.gaybombay.info click on classified section and type your message in the post section once the link opens What's hot? What's not? Where are the LGBT parties being held and when? Click here!! http://calendar.yahoo.com/YYY,04497/srt,0/gaybombaygroup/?v=42&POS= Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/gay_bombay/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[gay_bombay] more voices on Pushkin
Swapan's piece is disgusting and rather disturbing too - the man isn't an idiot and what he has put together could be described as the "Acceptable" Argument for Homophobia. Its no less based on hate, and his arguments can and should be attacked (as is happening on Rediff, though more support is needed there), but its all just superficiously smooth and convincing enough to take in the unsuspecting or the willing to be persuaded. I can even imagine some of the more closeted gay types nodding in agreement. We will probably be seeing more of this thing, and as Ashok says, we need to prepare ourselves for it. On a better note, more voices are coming out to counter the awful coverage of the first few days. Its happening on TV, as witness the the easy victory in the Big Fight, and the story is coming up in other talk shows as well. Outlook has an excellent story with a particularly pertinent box on why gays make easy targets. (India Today has a more equivocal, but still not bad piece, but I can't access that online). Chapal Mehra wrote a strong attack on the coverage in HT and my colleague Dibs wrote a moving personal tribute to Pushkin. I'll post all three below. There was also my op-ed piece from today's Times which I'm also posting below. Thanks to all those who wrote to me directly saying they liked the piece. I was also very happy to get positive reactions from my parents and my colleagues at work, though its sad that its taken Pushkin's death to bring these out, Vikram from Outlook: The Nowhere Men The gory murder of two gay men in Delhi exposes the darkness, and despair, prevalent in the community SUVEEN K. SINHA Pushkin Chandra wasn't just a murder statistic; he was a calamity waiting to happen. In a gruesome case that had Delhi alternately horrified and titillated by each appalling new revelation, the 38- year-old USAID worker and Kuldeep, a young man who may have been his partner, were killed just before Independence Day. The case was under investigation by the Delhi police at the time of writing and the perpetrators hadn't been identified or caught. Lines of inquiry at the time suggest that Kuldeep knew the killers, and they had all attended a party that evening before returning to Pushkin's home in Delhi's upmarket Anand Lok. Yet amid the ghastly details it yielded in every installment of newsnude bodies with multiple stab wounds, evidence of bondage, stacks of pornography, Pushkin's own rather privileged background (the Doon School alumnus had a US MBA and was the son of a former senior civil servant) and the contrast with Kuldeep's considerably less privileged historyit also highlighted the darkness lurking at the soul of Gay India's life. It was perhaps only a matter of heartless misfortune that unleashed this nightmare for Pushkin's family and friends, because Pushkin was not alone in his doomed quest for companionship. Every night in India men from all sorts of backgrounds set out in search of love and company from men because that is how Nature has wired them. The laws of Manu, 11.58 and 11.174, state that men who participate in anal intercourse lose caste and prescribe penance for a man who has shed semen in another male. Our British rulers chose to enforce Manu's ancient laws as the Hindu civil code. We now have Article 377 of the Indian Penal Code, a 141-year-old law that declares anal and non-procreative sex "against the order of nature" and a crime even if undertaken in private by consenting adults. Anyone caught in the act faces up to 10 years in prison. This is effectively coercing a person to kill a desire that is natural, regardless of any shock value it may carry. It makes the law a violation of the right to life and livelihood, says Human Rights Law Networks' senior legal advisor Parul Sharma. Snubbed by society and the law, gays struggle to come to terms with their inclinations against the backdrop of their upbringing in a set- up that extols marriage between men and women as a milestone in life and making babies its primary function. Tales abound of families reacting adversely to their sons coming out. The gay scion of a prominent Chennai business family was horrified at his parents' reaction when they realised his friend and business partner was something more than that. They were considering aversion therapya practice now banned in the West, but often used in India to force young gay men into marriage. It involves shock treatment and drugs. Helplines routinely get calls from gays ready to do anything to become straight and get married to a woman. That's one option born of desperation. Another is to look for a partner. But what do you do when you can't find what you're seeking in your social circle? "In the absence of a conducive environment to find partners, they
[gay_bombay] The GB Siblings meet on Raksha Bandhan
The Siblings Meeting This siblings meet is a spin-off of sorts from our parents meetings. In the past we probably lumped siblings along with parents as part of the family we might be thinking of coming out to and not considering their feelings as separate from the parents. We've realised over time this is a BIG mistake. As just a moment's thought about our own brothers and sisters might have told us, our siblings are people in their own right and there's no reason their reactions should be the same as those of our parents. Our siblings are close to us - but not that close. Parental bonds are usually very strong, for better or for worse. Sibling bonds can be close, but often not that strong. Where for most parents their lives are bound up with their children, our siblings have their own lives to lead and that impacts how they deal with our sexuality. So where we might except our siblings to be supportive when we come out to them - and many of us do come out to our siblings first - in reality they might feel threatened or appalled. They might wonder what this says about themselves. They might fear for how it will affect the family - and by extension themselves. If they are married, or about to be, they might wonder how the in- laws will deal with it. They might feel a sense of responsiblity towards you - and resent that. They might even just feel jealous because they will see this as just another way in which you are attracting attention to yourself. The problem is that feelings with siblings are deep and complicated by the shared experience of growing up together. So childhood rivalries and hatreds come into play, also feelings of protectiveness and control. Matters are complicated by whether the siblings are older or younger (or twins!), how many siblings there and the relations between all of them, on whether they are brothers or sisters, whether they are married or not, whether they have children or not... With so many issues its a wonder we can have normal relations with our siblings at all! Yet the fact is that many of us do and more than normal. For every sibling who reacts negatively to their brother or sister coming out, others react hugely positively, sometimes even coming closer. Often the siblings become the only people in the family who know about us, or who know about our partners. And they will defend and become allies to us when we come out to our parents. So there's lots to talk about and what better day to do this than Raksha Bandhan which this year actually falls on the of our meeting. So do try and come for this meeting - and if your brother or sister is willing to come along, all the better. At least a few of us will be bringing a sibling along, so they won't be the only straight people in the room! As usual this meeting will be taking place in Bandra and for details check our regular mails or the www.gaybombay.cc website. If you have any questions about this meet and particularly if you want to bring your brother or sister, get in touch with me directly at [EMAIL PROTECTED] Vikram Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~--> $9.95 domain names from Yahoo!. Register anything. http://us.click.yahoo.com/J8kdrA/y20IAA/yQLSAA/WfTolB/TM ~-> Group Site: http://www.gaybombay.info == NEW CLASSIFIEDS SECTION SEEKING FRIENDS? VISIT www.gaybombay.info click on classified section and type your message in the post section once the link opens What's hot? What's not? Where are the LGBT parties being held and when? Click here!! http://calendar.yahoo.com/YYY,04497/srt,0/gaybombaygroup/?v=42&POS= Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/gay_bombay/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[gay_bombay] The Hottest Sport?
I would have said this was swimming, no question about it, just one look at this tiny Speedos and everything above and below and, of course, in them would confirm that. But then they started wearing those body suits and most of the interest vanished at once. Also do others feel that the current batch of swimmers isn't that good looking, all those great bodies apart? Thorpe was cute when he was younger and still seems like a very nice guy, but he's strictly OK in the looks department now. Michael Phelps looked hot in the Bruce Weber Vanity Fair Olympians portfolio (you HAVE to see this), but then Bruce Weber could make almost anyone look hit. In real life Phelps doesn't seem to have a chin. Some of the others are hot like Piet van whatever and Rick Nythling, but swimming doesn't do it for me now. There's diving of course and they still wear Speedos, but the attraction of seeing the objects of your interest upside down does sort of pall. I mean, once you've gone through the obvious fantasy, what is left? I thought gymnastics might be a good alternative. Yes, they're covered up, but its skin tight and they always seem to be almost bursting out down below. But Paul Hamm has the attraction of cold meat and none of the others really hits you. So there I was wondering about cycling or weightlifting and of course Irfan would direct me to wrestling, but I was really getting into any of them. And then Outsports.com directed me to... water polo! I guess I didn't take this seriously earlier because they wear these really dumb head coverings which makes them look like they're doing surgery in the pool But then I realised through the wisdom of Outsports photographer who took pix of the guys outside the pool that water polo is where its at - BIG TIME! They take those head coverings off out of the water, and they still wear Speedos and the guys are HOT! Even more, they are hot in a natural way, not ultra shaved like the swimmers or with unrealistically large muscles in certain areas like most other athletes. Water polo players are all around fit and they don't seem to shave their bodies either so there's just the right amount of hair on them. It all makes for a great pictures, especially since there are usually several of them together. Check all these Outsports galleries from this link, but I'd say that on looks alone, its the Spanish team that should be taking home all the medal! http://www.outsports.com/photogallery/waterpolo2004/waterpolo2004galle ry3.htm Vikram Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~--> $9.95 domain names from Yahoo!. Register anything. http://us.click.yahoo.com/J8kdrA/y20IAA/yQLSAA/WfTolB/TM ~-> Group Site: http://www.gaybombay.info == NEW CLASSIFIEDS SECTION SEEKING FRIENDS? VISIT www.gaybombay.info click on classified section and type your message in the post section once the link opens What's hot? What's not? Where are the LGBT parties being held and when? Click here!! http://calendar.yahoo.com/YYY,04497/srt,0/gaybombaygroup/?v=42&POS= Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/gay_bombay/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[gay_bombay] Sancharam: The Journey
l be going back to the US, where she lives, but she will now be finalising the formal release of Sancharam, entering it for festivals, looking for distributors and so on. Perhaps if we're lucky it might find commercial distribution, but one way or the other, most people should be able to see it soon. Don't miss seeing it if you get a chance! Vikram Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~--> $9.95 domain names from Yahoo!. Register anything. http://us.click.yahoo.com/J8kdrA/y20IAA/yQLSAA/WfTolB/TM ~-> Group Site: http://www.gaybombay.info == NEW CLASSIFIEDS SECTION SEEKING FRIENDS? VISIT www.gaybombay.info click on classified section and type your message in the post section once the link opens What's hot? What's not? Where are the LGBT parties being held and when? Click here!! http://calendar.yahoo.com/YYY,04497/srt,0/gaybombaygroup/?v=42&POS= Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/gay_bombay/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[gay_bombay] Shaleen's leader in TOI
More positive media coverage resulting from the Pushkin affair - or more correctly, the initial coverage of it. The first is Shaleen's excellent leader in today's TOI, the second a long and well written account from the Hindustan Times of a gay man's coming out to himself and his experiences of the Delhi gay scene: from The Times of India LEADER ARTICLE Blame the Law: Section 377 Drives Gays Into A Twilight Zone SHALEEN RAKESH [ TUESDAY, AUGUST 31, 2004 12:00:00 AM ] It takes a tragedy to make people sit up and take notice. Therefore, in the context of Pushkin Chandra's recent murder, it becomes imperative to examine the socio-legal situation regarding homosexuality in India. It's not easy to be gay in our country. There is immense social stigma attached to it. Families and friends assume that everyone is heterosexual. The abuse starts the moment a young gay person realises his desires. He is suddenly confronted with his 'otherness'. He fails to see any recognition for his feelings, his instincts and his emotions. On the other hand, everything around him says he isn't normal, an aberration, someone who went wrong along the way. It's hard to maintain your self-esteem in the face of such forceful opposition. Many gay men succumb to this rampant homophobia. Some become depressive, fragile and diffident. Others make choices to please others, they get married and repress their real desires for a lifetime. Very few are able to stand up to the onslaught and try living on their own terms. In a culture, which cannot support long- term stable same sex relationships, many of these men live a life in which they struggle to steal moments to love each other. Now, consider this: Section 377 of the Indian Penal Code makes it a criminal act for two people of the same sex to love each other by sharing physical intimacy to express that love. A portion of the Section 377 defines "unnatural offences" as "whoever voluntarily has carnal intercourse against the order of nature with any man, woman or animal shall be punished with imprisonment of either description for a term which may extend up to 10 years and shall be liable to be fined". The term "unnatural offences" has been interpreted to include sodomy and oral sex. The section was put into the Indian Penal Code by the British way back in the 1868. They introduced this section based on Christian morality in all their colonies. The section has since been repealed in most countries including Britain itself. India, on the other hand, continues to hang on to this ridiculous and outdated colonial legacy. What does this section mean for Indian gay people? To begin with, it makes criminals out of innocent men and boys. It hits at their self- esteem, erodes their self-confidence and mocks their personal identity. Section 377 is enough to keep them in the closet. In addition to such gross violation of human rights, Section 377 creates an environment which makes gay men extremely vulnerable to HIV. There are several reasons for this. The section prevents the government from using our education materials, which educate people on HIV transmission through homosexual behaviour. Lack of information and education means several myths and misconceptions persist. One of the biggest myths is that HIV is only transmitted through vaginal sex and that anal sex is safe. Lack of privacy is a big issue for most gay men. Section 377 prevents the constitution of legitimate spaces (like marriage), which gives same-sex sexual activity a legal sanction. This means many gay men have sex in public places where space and time are constraints and it's difficult to negotiate safer sex. There are 50 million men who have sex with men (MSM), the community is both stigmatised and denied relevant safer sex information. A New Delhi based NGO that works with MSM and gay men, on December 7, 2001 moved the Delhi high court challenging the constitutional validity of Section 377 (unnatural offences) of the Indian Penal Code. The matter is still sub-judice. The writ petition argues: "Section 377 creates an arbitrary and unreasonable classification between natural (penile-vaginal) and unnatural (penile- non-vaginal) sexual acts that is violative of Article 14's guarantee of equal protection before and under the law. Socio-scientific evidence also suggests that the prohibited acts are indeed not 'unnatural'. This classification has no rationale as it is culturally accepted that sex is not engaged in for procreation alone. Socio-scientific evidence has also suggested that the prohibited acts are indeed not 'unnatural'." HIV/AIDS outreach workers are constantly harassed in the field by the police constables who invoke and misuse Section 377 to prevent HIV intervention efforts. The moment a constable on beat, for instance, senses that somebody is gay, he feels at liberty to charge him under Section 377. This is preposterous because the law cri
[gay_bombay] Karan Thapar in HT
An interesting column from Karan Thapar last Sunday. Obviously his programme on homosexuality has got him thinking! What do people feel - do you think its possible? Could a Private Member's Bill be the route to abolish 377? Would any politicians be willing and what would the likely response be? Looking at how the current Parliament is mostly focused on fighting between parties, passing bills as important as the Budget without any discussion in the lulls, perhaps something like this might just be possible? Vikram Can he do it? SUNDAY SENTIMENTS | Karan Thapar August 28 When the thought first entered my head I dismissed it as flippant. But it wouldn't go away. It kept repeating itself until I realised I had to take it seriously. That's what I intend to do today. It all started when one of our new young MPs who, understandably, must remain nameless asked me "how do you think I should make my mark?" His desire to rise above the herd and distinguish himself by association with a cause was understandable. At the time, I could only think of routine humdrum issues of caste, religion, law and order or even economic affairs. But later that evening, as I reflected on this young man's ambitiousness, it struck me like a bolt of lightening. Now I've had time to cogitate I know it's the right thing to do. My advice to this young MP is to move a private member's bill decriminalising homosexuality by repealing Section 377 of the Indian Penal Code. Written in 1871 it reads: "Whosoever voluntarily has anal intercourse against the order of nature with any man, woman or animal shall be punished with imprisonment for life." The case against Section 377 is almost irrefutable. Firstly, India is perhaps the only serious democracy where the law criminalises what consenting male adults choose to do in the privacy of their bedroom. Even if at some point in history this was considered justified today it's not the business of the law to interfere. But by continuing to do so we make a mockery of our commitment to human rights leave aside all the Geneva conventions we have signed up to. So, for the sake of our democracy, this must be repealed. There is, however, a second argument based on practicality rather than principle. By criminalising the sexual orientation of homosexuals society forces them to seek their pleasures furtively and thus makes them liable to blackmail and criminal vendetta. And if they catch infection it's unlikely they will openly seek treatment. Fear of the law prevents it and that, in turn, undermines efforts to control AIDS. The argument against repealing Section 377 is of two types. First is the position that homosexuality is evil and sinful. This, to be honest, is the traditional position of the Church but it's not limited to one religion alone. But then remember in the 17th century left-handedness and hexadectylism were considered signs of sinful deviance. Today we've outgrown such nonsense so why are we unable to cast aside narrow outdated positions on homosexuality? A more potent argument is the claim that in a democracy the law must reflect the consensus of the majority and in India this is against decriminalising homosexuality. On the surface this appears to be an unassailable defence. But is it? Our politicians led from the front rather than follow the pack when it came to reservation for dalits and reform of the Hindu faith. In fact they did so in the teeth of opposition from the majority. Then why not here? The truth of the matter is that sex between men is not as exceptional as we think it is. Nor is the taboo against it universal. A recent but unpublished study by the UNFPA has revealed that unmarried men in rural India are more likely to have sex with another man than with commercial sex workers. They may not consider it homosexuality and, technically, it may not be but an aversion to such sexual relations is clearly missing. The Greeks used to consider it the purest form of love and Pathan poetry is full of it. The `modern' taboo is Christian in origin and, I'm told, alien to India's traditional attitude to sex. Yet the irony is that in Christian countries like Britain and France the law criminalising homosexuality has been repealed. In Britain it happened in 1967 when Leo Abse moved a private member's bill which rapidly won support from Roy Jenkins, the Home Secretary. Today that bill is recognised as a symbol of contemporary Britain. Leo Abse is one of its heroes. So you see why the idea that started of as flippant could be irresistibly serious? I would hope that the young first time MP has the courage to take on this challenge. If he does the major political parties might support him with a genuine vote of conscience. And if that happens I'm sure the law will be repealed. The credit would go to the
[gay_bombay] from: Salon.com Dan Savage on James McGreevey
Dan Savage's take on the James McGreevey affair - the New Jersey governor who resigned because he was gay and being blackmailed about it - is of particularly interest to us because it focuses on something we're familiar with, gay men who are married to women. The role of McGreevey's wife, last seen standing in sort of frozen support of him, is interesting because, as Dan points out, it brings out two interesting points: (1) perhaps she knew and was OK with it, and that highlights the fact that there are more reasons for people to be married rather than just heterosexual pairing off. (2) maybe she didn't know and McGreevey married her for his career reasons, but this sort of mockery of marriage is OK under the current laws, but now two gay men getting married because they genuinely love and want to partner each other. Point (1) is likely to appeal to the several married men on these lists who try to tell us that what they've done is find because they are good husbands, their wives would not like to know, marriage happens for many reasons, etc, etc. This is still the same self serving bullshit it always is and it is NOT what Dan is talking about since what he envisages is a marriage where both parties know about each other's sexualities and still get married. I know of a case like that and it didn't end happily, but I'll accept it can happen. But it starts with the wife knowing about her husband and then deciding to get married, which is worlds apart from what happens with most married gay men in India. Vikram When gay Americans marry What the partnership of Gov. and Mrs. McGreevey says about the absurdity of banning gay marriage. - - - - - - - - - - - - By Dan Savage Aug. 17, 2004 | New Jersey Gov. James "I'm a Gay American" McGreevey has a pretty mouth. Has any pol ever looked better wrapping his lips around his own resignation? That was my first thought while watching the big gay press conference last week that served as the 47- year-old governor's coming out and resignation -- followed closely by, "Wait, what the hell is up with his wife?" If I called a press conference to announce that I was a straight American, that I had conducted an affair with a woman that was going to destroy my career (much of which is based on my cocksucking cred), the only way my boyfriend would stand at my side beaming would be if he was holding my recently amputated testicles behind his clenched teeth. The reaction of the wronged wife is almost always the most interesting aspect of a juicy political sex scandal; the public seems to look to her before deciding how it should react. Remember when William Jefferson Clinton was impeached for ... well, take your pick: for having an adulterous affair, for lying under oath about having an adulterous affair, for having the nerve to win two elections. When Hillary made it clear she was going to stick with Bill, the American public did the same. Of course, it helped that rumors about Clinton's zipper problems had trailed him throughout his political career -- Americans knew he was a horndog when we elected him. Finding out he got it on with an intern didn't tell us anything we didn't already know or suspect. When the Lewinsky scandal broke, there was a lot of speculation about What Hillary Knew and When She Knew It. Many wondered if Bill and Hillary's marriage wasn't a loveless, sexless sham, a marriage of political convenience, a marriage about power, not love. Many concluded that Bill and Hillary must have had an "understanding" about outside sexual contact. For some, Hillary's decision to stay with Bill confirmed their suspicions about the existence of an understanding: Hillary wasn't angry, the "understanding" theorists concluded, because Bill wasn't doing anything she hadn't given him the green light to do. (Except, of course, for getting caught.) Watching Mrs. McGreevey beam at her pretty-mouthed gay American husband, I found myself wondering aloud to my pretty-mouthed gay American boyfriend (I have a thing for pretty mouths, what can I say?) whether like the Clintons before them, Mr. and Mrs. McGreevey might have had an understanding. Just as Hillary had to know Bill could be true to her only in his fashion, so it seems pretty clear that Mrs. McGreevey had to know her husband was a homo all along. The first Mrs. McGreevey apparently knew: When asked by the New York Times whether she was aware of her former husband's sexuality, the woman who divorced McGreevey pointedly refused to answer the question. In the Seattle Times, McGreevey's former mother-in-law flat- out said that she knew. And then there were all those rumors about McGreevey that have been circulating in New Jersey for years. To my mind, only having already known could explain Mrs. McGreevey
[gay_bombay] things aren't what they seem sometimes...
Here are three postings from the Outsports.com website that, I thinkm tell an interesting story, apart from being quite cool to read in themselves (the last one that is, with the actual interview with the gymnasts). I think people from the community are often too quick to imagine homophobia, when it can be just confusion and decisions that are practical rather than homophobic. The response to the original story has a nice twist and the interview with the gymnasts is nice too, for showing how accepting they are of their gay fans and how they have gay relatives themselves. This, in a way, shows the real change that has happened, which all the real homophobes will never be able to reverse: Handled Badly How this gay reporter was kept from the Hamm brothers By Cyd Zeigler Jr.orkout gear underwear gay lesbian I had gotten wind of a media opportunity with Olympic medalists Paul and Morgan Hamm, just a block away from my apartment in Manhattan, through my editor at the New York Blade (in addition to running Outsports.com, I am also the associate editor of the Blade). On their way back from Athens, the Hamms were scheduled to be at Chelsea Piers, the largest sports complex in New York City, on Thursday, Aug. 26, from 10 a.m. to 11 a.m.. So I RSVP'd and went to the event, camera, pad and pen in hand, and arrived just before 10 as the twins were finishing up a TV interview. There were about a dozen photographers, another dozen TV crewmembers and a smattering of print journalists. I immediately asked the athletes' agent, Sheryl Shade, if I could get 60 seconds with them. "Sure, I'm sure that's fine," she said to me as she was making a phone call on her cell phone. After a few minutes, I was told the brothers were being taken downstairs to talk with a group of kids from a gymnastics camp, but they would return for more interviews. After an inspiring question-and-answer session with the 6-year-olds, the brothers went back to the media area. They immediately began doing another TV interview. I asked one of the men from the PR agency whether I would be able to talk with them. When he asked me what paper I was from, I told him the New York Blade. "Uh, I'll have to check," he said. Another reporter I had been talking to from the New York Daily News had gotten wind of an interview session with the Associated Press and other print journalists. As the Hamms were walking into the soundproof room, along with several other journalists, I asked if I could sit in on it as well. The man from the PR agency to whom I had spoken earlier approached Keith Sherman, the head of the agency. "Can the New York Blade sit in on this?" I overheard him ask. "No," Sherman replied instantly. When all was said and done, every print journalist left there had been allowed into the interview, except for me. Sherman approached me several minutes later and said he was sorry, but only sports reporters were allowed in the interview. I told him I am a sports reporter. "Oh," he replied. It obviously hadn't occurred to him that someone could be a sports reporter from a gay publication. "Well, I'm sorry." I then asked him if it was because I was from a gay publication. He said it wasn't. I asked him why I wasn't going to be able to talk with them. "I'm sorry, we're running out of time," he said as he walked away to join the interview. After the 15-minute interview (which he had said would be "seven or eight minutes"), I asked one of the women in the room if she was a sports reporter. She said she was not. The twins did another TV interview and were whisked away by Sherman, with Shade in tow. While they "had" to leave by 11 a.m., they stopped to talk to Roland Betts, the owner of Chelsea Piers and a member of the United States Olympic Committee, at 10:59. That conversation lasted eight minutes quite leisurely for a group that was "out of time" and had to "get to the airport." Then they took some photos with a group of kids. That took two more minutes. At 11:10, they finally headed to their car. I left as well, pretty upset and wondering how I could be discriminated against yet again in the sports world. Then the kicker: I saw the Hamms, Shade and Sherman being followed by another man who had come at the very end of their stint at Chelsea Piers. I saw him take out a notebook and start asking them questions. Once he was finished (it was now 11:14), I asked him if he got to talk with them. "Yeah, I got 90 seconds with them," he said. That was even more than the time I had initially requested 60 seconds. He also said he had just gotten there and that Sherman had told him he could interview the young men on their walk to the car er SUV. At the end of it, I was the only person who was rejected for an interview. Sherman said it wasn't because I was gay, but the writing is on the wall. I was rejected from the group interview because I was from the New York Blade
[gay_bombay] MOBO controversy
forwarding this mail I posted on the Khush list. Its an interesting issues, so do others on these lists have opinions? I am curious to know what people on the Khush list make of this controversy about whether rap singers with homophobic lyrics should be banned from the MOBO awards, and the music industry in general (posting three articles from the Guardian below). Peter Tatchell, who's spearheading it, seems to be one of those half admirable, half insanely annoying people - you think he's got a point, but why does he always have to be protesting, and does his protesting achieve results or does it just antagonise people further. The second article illustrates this by bringing out the racism charge that some black people are levelling at him. And the third muddies waters even further by bringing up the case of black queer parties where rap music is played, including the homophobic stuff. Its all thought provoking, but I have to say, that from my limited reading on the subject, and despite finding much of what he does annoying, I think I'm on Tatchell's side on this one. And it is, I think, the views quoted in the other two pieces that convinced me. I don't doubt much of what they're saying - there's obviously racism in the gay community and the points that they raise about the negative effects of Tatchell's campaign sound true as well. Yet there seems to be a sort of unwillingness to confront the homophobia in the lyrics in their attitudes which instinctively doesn't feel right to me. Is everything solved by just shrugging and partying on? Also this argument about cultural exceptions strikes me as one that can be strained beyond a point. Adjustments must be made to different cultures and no one is suggesting pride parades in Kingstown (though that might be nice, with rap music too). But at what point does making allowances become tacit acceptance? That's a question with ramifications far beyond just this case. But, as I said, this particular case is something I don't really know much about and I'd be interested in the comments of people like Ayaz who I think would have a wider perspective on it, Vikram (articles below) It isn't racist to target Beenie Man But it is to remain indifferent to the persecution of Jamaican gays Peter Tatchell Tuesday August 31, 2004 The Guardian 'I wake up in the morning not knowing whether today I will live or die," one gay Jamaican told me. Until three years ago, hardly anyone knew, or cared, about this reign of terror. Now the whole world knows about the suffering of Jamaican gays. At the request of gay Jamaicans, and working with black gay people in Britain, the gay rights group OutRage! has organised an international solidarity campaign that has spread across Europe and the US. It is targeting eight Jamaican reggae singers whose songs incite listeners to shoot, burn, stab and drown gay people: Beenie Man, Bounty Killer, Buju Banton, Capleton, Sizzla, TOK, Elephant Man and Vybz Kartel. Last week, we called on the organisers the Mobo awards to drop the nominations of the last two performers in the list. These artists have a right to criticise homosexuality, but free speech does not include the right to commit the criminal offence of incitement to murder. Already, we have secured the cancellation of dozens of concerts. The huge financial losses incurred, together with the threat of prosecutions, have forced Jamaican music chiefs to consider abandoning murderous homophobic lyrics. These successes show our tactics were right. We are now accused of racism by sections of the black community and the left. But I ask myself: how can it be racist to support black victims of homophobia and oppose violent homophobes in the music industry? The real racism is not our campaign against murder music, but most people's indifference to the persecution of gay Jamaicans. No one would tolerate such abuses against white people in Britain; it is racist to allow them to happen to black people in another country. Some of our critics disagree. They say black people are an oppressed minority and therefore any criticism of aspects of black culture is de facto racism. But since when has being oppressed given anyone the right to oppress others? Or the right to be immune from rebuke? People who suffer injustice are entitled to fight back against their persecutors, no matter who they are. I refuse to tolerate racism in the gay community. Why are some people making excuses for homophobic black music? They say it is "cultural imperialism" to challenge gay rights abuses in Jamaica. I don't remember anyone accusing me of cultural imperialism when I supported the ANC's freedom struggle against apartheid. In those days we called it international solidarity. Some defend violently anti-gay reggae music on the grounds that homop
[gay_bombay] Re: Shaleen Rakesh Gay Rights Activist on the High Court decision to dismiss .....
I appreciate your sentiments, but your solution is absurd. We can only get our rights by going out there and engaging with the world, rather than sitting like children crying that we won't eat till we get our rights. Nobody is going to care if gays do or don't vote, but at least if we vote, and take part in the life of this country, can we have some hope to change things. There is certainly a lot that people can do, which is be more open about being gay, try and change people's ideas about gays, lobby with media and other influential groups (not just politicians) to change things. Not as easy as just staying at home on election day, but a lot more effective, Vikram --- In [EMAIL PROTECTED], Rocky Sharma <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: THIS IS ABOUT GAY RIGHTS. Dear Friend & All those who fight for Gay Rights. I would kindly like to suggest all my friends. That unless & Until the decision in the Court is not declare positively. All the gays, Lesbians & ... Must protect themselves from Voting rights. No one should vote unless & until we get our rights. Please remember In India there are 5 millions gays. Which will effect a lot to our leaders. Please think, Thanks. Anil Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~--> $9.95 domain names from Yahoo!. Register anything. http://us.click.yahoo.com/J8kdrA/y20IAA/yQLSAA/WfTolB/TM ~-> Group Site: http://www.gaybombay.info == NEW CLASSIFIEDS SECTION SEEKING FRIENDS? VISIT www.gaybombay.info click on classified section and type your message in the post section once the link opens What's hot? What's not? Where are the LGBT parties being held and when? Click here!! http://calendar.yahoo.com/YYY,04497/srt,0/gaybombaygroup/?v=42&POS= Post:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Digest Mode:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] No Mail Mode:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Individual Mail Mode:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Contact Us:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Groups Homepage:- http://groups.yahoo.com/group/gay_bombay Unsubscribe:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/gay_bombay/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[gay_bombay] action on Dr.Girish Sanghvi
This is about the dangerously inaccurate 'advice' that a Dr.Girish Sanghvi has been passing off in the Maharashtra Times. Shailen has written an excellent mail giving a link for those who can read Marathi, and detailing Dr.Sanghvi's claims in case you don't. I have pasted Shailen's mail at the end of this one. I have spoken to Mr.Sanjeev Sabade, who edits the Mumbai Times supplement in Maharashtra Times (which is where I think Dr.Sanghvi's column appeared), and he is willing to carry letters in rebuttal of Dr.Sanghvi's views. As soon as the piece came out the Humsafar centre had sent them a detailed response from one of its counsellors, and hopefully this will be carried in full by Maharashtra Times. But we can also help by sending in letters to help convince Maharshtra Times how seriously we feel about this issue. The paper may not carry all the letters, but the more they receive, the more seriously they will take us, and at least some of the responses might be carried, especially if they are sent in Marathi. (But send in anyway, even if you can't write in Marathi). If you do want to write in Marathi, but don't have the necessary language fonts, you could either mail in Marathi written in Roman letters, or you could simply fax the paper, or even post to them. Mark the mails to Mr.Sanjeev Sabade at Mumbai Times, and highlight that its about Dr.Sanghvi. The addresses to send to are: Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fax: (91-22) 22731144 or 22731401 Post: Mr.Sanjeev Sabade, Mumbai Times, Maharashtra Times, Times of India Building, Dr.D.N.Road, Mumbai-41 Some Suggested Guidelines (based on my experience as a journalist, of how to get a paper to take you seriously. But as I said, these are just suggestions, so feel free to disregard them). 1) Keep the mails short and polite. Angry mails get disregarded as coming from single issue nutcases. Mails which are polite, but firm are harder to ignore. 2) Focus on the many factual errors Dr.Sanghvi has made and on the parts where he is passing off speculation as fact. 3) Point to the negative effect of articles like these. 4) If you like - and this might justify - a longer post, give your personal experiences, particularly if they refute his suggestion that its all down to bad parenting, or his contention that homosexuality is reversible. Personal experiences always make more impact than abstract arguments. 5) Suggest the paper finds alternative people to comment on matters like this and if you know any, suggest them. This can really work as was shown, several years back, when Radhika Chandiramani of TARSHII got the Asian Age to change a viciously homophobic 'counsellor' by confronting the paper and suggesting that it take her viewpoints instead. She proceeded to write the most gay friendly series of columns possible - talk about pendulum swings! Please note that you don't have to be gay to protest this, so if you know of people who would be sympathetic and willing to respond in Marathi, please pass this on to them. If you can get experts on the subject to respond even better (best of all, if you could get your parents to respond...) I think there is real potential to get Maharashtra Times to do something here. I certainly don't think the people running the paper are homophobic, but they probably didn't think the issue through and perhaps were also mislead by Dr.Sanghvi's apparently supportive opening. A strong protest from our end might help change this. This is also a chance to get positive coverage in the Indian language press, something we often tend to overlook or just conclude is likely to be negative. I think the problem is that most of the time we just don't communicate with the Indian language press, so this is a chance to try. You've got this long Ganpathi weekend ahead of you so get writing! Vikram Shailen's mail: Date: Thu Sep 23, 2004 7:25 pm Subject: the ignorant Dr. Girish Sanghvi Read this astonishing piece today in the net-version of the leading Marathi daily 'Maharashtra Times' - it is titled 'Why hate Homosexuals?' implying gays should not be hated. It appears in what seems to be a psychotherapeutic column run by one Dr. Girish Sanghvi and although he strikes an accomodative note through his title, the rest of the contents demand the classic Marathi adjective 'Muktafaley'. As it is in Marathi, I thought prudent to give a jist of what the doctor has written: http://maharashtratimes.indiatimes.com/articleshow/846776.cms the article begins with forwarding a unique theory about the origins of Homosexuality: the dynamics between parents and the child as the latter grows up. Dr. Sanghvi says: "We see certain wrong customs perpetrated in our society.Children blame parents for irresponsible parenting and parents end up having exaggerated expectations from th
[gay_bombay] Re: A different note on gay gods
Ajit on the Gaybombay list made the good point that the objections to this discussion seem to be coming from people who have been taught to put their lives into boxes where Sex is labelled Dirty, even if its enjoyable (so sex and guilt tend to get linked) while there are other boxes labelled Family, God, etc and woe betide you if you mix the two. So as Ajit said, such people seem to imagine their parents never had sex - their own existence presumably being the result of a virgin birth. This rather disgusting message from John illustrates this mentality. In one leap he's gone from a discussion on the sexuality of gods to accusing gay men of wanting to sleep with their parents. Because anything connected with sex seems to be equally dirty and unclean to him. The problem for such people is how are they going to deal with their own homosexuality in any balanced way? Because homosexuality is undeniably linked to sex, but for those who don't see sex as somehow dirty, its just one aspect in their larger lives and they don't feel any guilt about it. But if you see sex as dirty then you have to see homosexuality as dirty and any practice of it by yourself can only lead to guilt. The chances of you having a balanced life, with hating yourself for the way you are, see rather low. Its sad. Vikram --- In [EMAIL PROTECTED], john ferns <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Hi there! I have been reading the letters posted on Gods and Gays!! This entire issue of trying to get your GOD's to be Gay or NOT, is really, amazing. Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~--> $9.95 domain names from Yahoo!. Register anything. http://us.click.yahoo.com/J8kdrA/y20IAA/yQLSAA/WfTolB/TM ~-> Group Site: http://www.gaybombay.info == NEW CLASSIFIEDS SECTION SEEKING FRIENDS? VISIT www.gaybombay.info click on classified section and type your message in the post section once the link opens What's hot? What's not? Where are the LGBT parties being held and when? Click here!! http://calendar.yahoo.com/YYY,04497/srt,0/gaybombaygroup/?v=42&POS= Post:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Digest Mode:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] No Mail Mode:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Individual Mail Mode:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Contact Us:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Groups Homepage:- http://groups.yahoo.com/group/gay_bombay Unsubscribe:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/gay_bombay/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[gay_bombay] more on the Gaybombay Financial Planning Meet - Sunday 3rd October
Just a quick note on what this GB Financial Planning meet this Sunday will be about. This is a repeat of a very succesful meet we had last year. Its conducted by Binay, a long time GB member and a finance professional and is simply about how gay guys should plan their finances. There is, of course, no special and different way for gay guys to plan their finances, and if you're savvy about your finance planning anyway, a lot of this may seem elementary. But many of us are hazy or halfhearted about doing our financial planning properly and Binay, very simply and clearly, will indicate how to go about doing it. In case anyone thinks this isn't a gay issue, think of it this way. Most of us are trying to live our lives as self acknowledged gay men and for this a good financial basis is critical. If we want to live separately from our families, if we want to plan for an old age when we may or may not be with partners, but most of us will probably be childless, if we want to survive in a society where automatic financial safety nets simply don't exist - we're going to need some money. And we're going to have to find a way to make sure the money we do make can support us when we need it. There are lots of way of investing money and now all of them make sense for gay people. Life insurance, for example, which we're constantly exhorted to buy, makes little sense if we don't have a partner to who we can will it (and even if we have a partner, we can't be sure the money will go to him, so life insurance may still not make sense). You're better looking at medical insurance and annuities which will matter to you when you're still alive. Binay is not going to produce the perfect 12 step plan towards a safe financial future for gay men. That would assume all gay men are alike and God knows we're not (oops, apologies for dragging God into a discussion on a gay topic! Sorry, couldn't resist that). He's simply going to take us through the options available and suggest simple ways to take to start looking at our finances. This is one of the most useful and practical sessions that GB offers, so do try and come for it. Please forward this mail to other gay people you think might be interested (I hope I don't need to say that lesbians are very welcome as always). If you have any queries on this, or any apprehensions about coming for a meet for the first time, mail me at [EMAIL PROTECTED] Vikram Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~--> Make a clean sweep of pop-up ads. Yahoo! Companion Toolbar. Now with Pop-Up Blocker. Get it for free! http://us.click.yahoo.com/L5YrjA/eSIIAA/yQLSAA/WfTolB/TM ~-> Group Site: http://www.gaybombay.info == NEW CLASSIFIEDS SECTION SEEKING FRIENDS? VISIT www.gaybombay.info click on classified section and type your message in the post section once the link opens What's hot? What's not? Where are the LGBT parties being held and when? Click here!! http://calendar.yahoo.com/YYY,04497/srt,0/gaybombaygroup/?v=42&POS= Post:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Digest Mode:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] No Mail Mode:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Individual Mail Mode:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Contact Us:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Groups Homepage:- http://groups.yahoo.com/group/gay_bombay Unsubscribe:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/gay_bombay/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
g_b Canning the Carrot
I have never agreed with the postings from our Mr.Carrot (as someone on the Gaybombay list dubbed Mr.Gajjar, but I've thought that they do at least stir up debate on the lists, and in many cases are also amusing for the way they display the man's total, almost manic self absorbtion. And like the moderator here, I do not like the idea of banning people from lists like this. Yet there have to be limits on things, and I think the Carrot has crossed them. As Viraf has pointed out, he never debates, just hectors and criticises, but does nothing positive ever. This sort of entirely one way communication is ultimately I think something close to spam, and spam should definitely be banned as counterproductive to lists like this - especially when it comes filled with such hate as the Carrot crams his mails with. I think it was Asfan who correctly identified the Carrot's condition as being of a sort of paranoid egotism (I forget the precise term) which is fulfilled by attention of any kind, negative or positive. Ignoring doesn't work, since the condition pushes such people into even greater and more shocking ways of attracting attention - and morphing Pushkin's picture is an example of this. The only solution with such people is simply banning them. We can have a debate about this, if you like, but I think ultimately the decision should be the moderator's and that he shouldn't agonise unduly about taking it. This list is his to build as well as he can and I think most of us trust him to build it very well indeed, so if he decides to can the Carrot, he's won't get many complaints. Vikram Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~--> Make a clean sweep of pop-up ads. Yahoo! Companion Toolbar. Now with Pop-Up Blocker. Get it for free! http://us.click.yahoo.com/L5YrjA/eSIIAA/yQLSAA/WfTolB/TM ~-> Group Site: http://www.gaybombay.info == NEW CLASSIFIEDS SECTION SEEKING FRIENDS? VISIT www.gaybombay.info click on classified section and type your message in the post section once the link opens What's hot? What's not? Where are the LGBT parties being held and when? Click here!! http://calendar.yahoo.com/YYY,04497/srt,0/gaybombaygroup/?v=42&POS= Post:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Digest Mode:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] No Mail Mode:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Individual Mail Mode:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Contact Us:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Groups Homepage:- http://groups.yahoo.com/group/gay_bombay Unsubscribe:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/gay_bombay/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
g_b Johann Hari on Transsexual Rights
Excellent article by Johann Hari on transsexuals and their often strained relations with the rest of the queer community: Transsexual Rights The story of a much-abused minority Johann Hari By the time you read this, Britain's biggest popularity contest Channel 4's reality show Big Brother will almost certainly have been won by a sexy, shrieking transsexual, Nadia Almada. At the same time, the British government is pushing through Parliament a huge package of rights for transsexuals, including full legal recognition of their `new', real gender, and the right to marry and adopt. Transsexuals and gay people have stood together on the same barricades against prejudice, from Stonewall to Big Gay Out. Now we are advancing together too. Claire McNab is a sultry 41 year-old woman with long dark hair and a laugh more infectious than e-bola. She has been a journalist, a campaigner, and a man. Like Nadia, nobody would mistake her today for a victim or for a bloke, but it has taken a long time to reach this position of strength. "I was born in Ireland into what I call the Chernobyl of nuclear families," she explains over lunch, dragging the first of a thousand cigarettes. "I first realised I was a woman when I was ten years old when I read the autobiography of Jan Morris, the transsexual travel writer," she continues. "But it was only in the early 1990s, when I became suicidal, that I really admitted to myself that I was living in the wrong gender. I knew then I had to either make the full transition to being a woman, or I would have to give up on life." Like around a third of transsexuals, her gender identity was blurred from birth. "My childhood was odd. I was born with what they call `ambiguous genitalia': it wasn't clear what my gender was when I was born, so the doctors tried to craft a penis out of what was there." She eventually put right the work that nature and the womb got wrong. Since she completed the transition in 2000, she explains, her life has never been better. "The thing that surprises me most is that before, I didn't make friends easily. I was gruff. I was really tough work. But since I have been living in the right gender, I have discovered this sounds very Oprah, I know that if I could like myself then I could like other people. It's been the most amazing revelation for me. Now I have a better relationship with my mother than ever, a better relationship with my friends, a better relationship with life itself." Claire's is a typical story. The transphobic parts of the media step forward, the Daily Mail says that all transsexuals are miserable, and surgery only leaves them "even more unhappy, but now with mutilated genitalia to make it even worse." In fact, the vast majority of Britain's 5000 transsexuals have found that surgery has made their lives bearable for the first time. Only 2% of transsexuals decide to reverse their surgery, an almost unparalleled success rate; over 90% describe themselves as "much happier" ten years after the transition. Up until this year, there has been one overwhelming obstacle blocking transsexuals' path to happiness: they could change their gender medically and physically, but the law always considered them to be the same old gender. So until the change in the law passes, they cannot marry. They cannot adopt. Every time they use a credit card, they are humiliated: the card calls women `mister' and men `miss'. Every time they take out car insurance, they risk being prosecuted for fraud, because there is no legal clarity about which gender they should sign under. If they go to prison and there are at least twelve transsexuals in jail in Britain today women are often sent to men's prisons and vice versa. Only in 2004 and following a ruling in the European Court of Human Rights that the current situation is "intolerable" did this legislative cruelty get addressed. Okay, so Iran under the Ayatollah Kohmeini got there before us. Okay, so we are one of only three other countries in Europe who haven't taken this basic step. But better late than endlessly inhuman. The critics of the Gender Recognition Bill have come from two directions. The first group are the Usual Suspects, the posse of homophobic, transphobic bigots surrounding Norman "buggery causes obesity" Tebbit. In its lowest moment since they tried to rescue Section 28 from abolition, the British right is forming a rearguard action to leave Claire, Nadia and thousands like them in legal limbo. Yes, Ann Widdecombe, the Evangelical Alliance, the Daily Mail and the Daily Telegraph (what a victory party they would throw) have been crusading to prevent the legal recognition of transsexuals. For them, transsexuals are a symbol of the decline of Western civilisation. "Common sense", Tebbit and friends proclaim, dictates that everyone is clearly born either male or female. "Even a five- year old can tell the difference
g_b from Page3 Tabloid - Feng Shui for Gays & Lesbians!!!!
There's this new tabloid that's just been launched in Bombay called, yes honestly, Page3 Tabloid and perhaps the name says it all, but it still has to be seen to be believed. Lets just say it makes Bombay Times look like the New Yorker! (Of course, they had approached GB for the inevitable story on the "dark underworld of gays in India", those are the very words their correspondent used, so I'm not exactly expecting much from her story, if it ever appears). But even by the rather unique standards this tabloid sets, there's a column in the latest issue that is, sorry to be repetitive, quite unbelievable. Its called 'Feng Shui for Gays & Lesbians' by some guy called Mohan Deep and would be offensive if it wasn't so hilarious. The article is not available on the Net and I can't bring myself to type such nonsense, but here are some highlights: Mr Mohan Deep starts by displaying his tolerant side by saying "I have always believed that everyone has a right to his (or her) sexual preference as long as it doesn't encroach on someone else's." (This could strictly speaking mean he only approves of masturbation, but I guess that's now what he means). But Mr Mohan Deep notes, there's a big problem: "being gay is extra baggage in a society that treats homosexuality as a 'mental disease'." He notes with horror that parents try shock treatment for their kids, before going on to a case where he was approached by the wife. "For over a year her husband had shown no interest in sex. And because of an unusual intimacy between her husband and his male friends, she suspected him of being gay. I suggested changes that included the colour of her husband's briefs which worked and the marriage was consummated." HELP! Who knew the colour of our underwear could be so powerful!!! Though it has to be said that perhaps Mr Mohan Deep's cure was not all that powerful. As he admits, with true scientific scrulousness, "His involvement with his friend continues. But she is keeping her fingers crossed." In the next case he gives it seems that he was consulted by a gay guy who wanted "Feng Shui help to trigger his Relationship corner." He quotes the guy telling him (and I can just IMAGINE the guy): "Dude, y relationships do not seem to last. I want a loyal, committed relationship." Could he be a member of GB? Needless to say, Mr Mohan Deep has the solution. In Feng Shui, he tells us, "The celestial Dragon and Phoenix are considered to be the perfect couple. Together, they represent matrimonial bliss and a harmonious balance in any household. The Dragon is a pure Yang creature while the Phoenix is pure Ying." So his solution to this guy was simple: he made a painting for him that showed two Dragons hugging and placed it on the southwest wall. That did the trick so listen up all you guys with boyfriend problems, go and get a picture of two Dragons hugging (two Phoenixes hugging if you're lesbian, Mr.Mohan Deep says, precisely) and all will be well. Whether they should be particularly well hung Dragons is perhaps a matter of individual taste. Unfortunately at the last moment Mr.Mohan Deep gets cold feet. Perhaps he's fearing attacks from the Vatican for promoting gay marriage by irresponsibly handing out double-Dragon pictures. So he ends his column with this admonition: "Everything that surrounds you matters. The little painting of two women talking intimately may need to be thrown out and replaced with a statue of a couple. The man's red briefs or a see-through shirt with a flowery design may need to be consigned to the dust bin..." In the face of such wisdom, I am left speechless!!! Vikram === vikram just for info. mohan deep is scum-bag. one of the most vituperative, bad-mouthing person, whose only claim to fame long ago was slandering film-star rekha in some sort of unauthorized biography. rekha of course never gave him the time of the day and his so-called rekha biography was trashed by almost every one as it read more like a porno novel , the anonymous kind and less like a genuine biography. in any case, whenever and whatever i have read about him /his so-called books--- yes , he has written some other trashy stuff as well i always got a feeling that he and his writing don't deserve one bit of any sensible person's time. best ignored. ketan Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~--> $9.95 domain names from Yahoo!. Register anything. http://us.click.yahoo.com/J8kdrA/y20IAA/yQLSAA/WfTolB/TM ~-> Group Site: http://www.gaybombay.info == NEW CLASSIFIEDS SECTION SEEKING FRIENDS? VISIT www.gaybombay.info click on
g_b Larzish passes
The second Larzish Film Festival, of Sexuality and Gender Plurality, will soon be on us and its looking pretty exciting. TimeOut Mumbai has an excellent piece this new issue on the film festival and its film listings section provide a day by day guide. Its happening downtown this time, at a larger venue at KC College (I think, need to confirm this) and as the mail below from the Larzish organisers explains will have much more than just films, but presentations and discussions. It all seems calculated to draw in a larger and more diverse crowd than normally comes for queer events, and I can tell you that this is one of the really exciting parts of Larzish - the way it creates a space to see people who don't normally encounter queer issues having to grapple with them in (hopefully) a positive way. I've got a bunch of passes for the festival so those who want to attend can mail me directly. Or I'm taking a bunch to the GB party at Razz Rhino tomorrow so you can collect them from me there. There are also a couple more GB events planned before Larzish (our annual iftaar on the 30th and the regular meet on the 31st) so you could also collect them - if there are any left! Vikram (read the message below for more on Larzish and how to volunteer to help if you're interested). Greetings from Larzish, 2nd International Film Festival of Sexuality and Gender Plurality, India!! We are extremely excited to inform you that the film festival this year will be taking place between 4th 7th November, 2004. In these four days are going to be packed and stimulating with films, presentations and panel discussions on many themes relating to sexuality and gender. The festival every year makes an effort to bring filmmakers in attendance as well as activists from different parts of India, working on these issues. After it's resounding success last year, the festival has grown, there is a bigger venue, more guests, more films etc and more fun and and But we need help and support to make it happen. Larzish and Humjinsi have been organising film screenings at different colleges and many students have shown interest to volunteer and participate at the festival. Hence, the 2nd volunteer meeting of Larzish film festival is being held on 24th Oct, 2004, Sunday, at 5pm. The venue is Just Around The Corner (JATC), Bandra W, Mumbai Directions are as follows, At Bandra Station, on the WEST side, take a rickshaw to Turner Road; at Turner Road take a right at Tawaa Restaurant (you will see an ICICI Bank on your left after the turn). Keep goingstraight for about two minutes; you will see the big blue signboard of 'JUST AROUND THE CORNER' on the left. If you are however coming from Linking Road, take the very next left turn from the first petrol pump, leading to the Flying Machine Store. On driving down the crossing of two lanes you shall see a huge blue colored board with "JUST AROUND THE CORNER" written onto it. You can also take a bus going down Turner Road (Khar Station bus or Chumm Village bus). Get off near Tawaa Restaurant and walk to JATC in 5 minutes. So come and join us, we need help with the poster campaign, if you have always dreamt of being an usherette in some art house cinema, or to be a bouncer at the gate or try your hand at selling festival publicity material, interact with filmmakers, here is the chance .bring your friends along!! And we look forward to meeting you. Regards, Larzish Team Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~--> $9.95 domain names from Yahoo!. Register anything. http://us.click.yahoo.com/J8kdrA/y20IAA/yQLSAA/WfTolB/TM ~-> Group Site: http://www.gaybombay.info == NEW CLASSIFIEDS SECTION SEEKING FRIENDS? VISIT www.gaybombay.info click on classified section and type your message in the post section once the link opens What's hot? What's not? Where are the LGBT parties being held and when? Click here!! http://calendar.yahoo.com/YYY,04497/srt,0/gaybombaygroup/?v=42&POS= Post:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Digest Mode:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] No Mail Mode:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Individual Mail Mode:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Contact Us:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Groups Homepage:- http://groups.yahoo.com/group/gay_bombay Unsubscribe:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/gay_bombay/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: g_b Confused about sexuality.....Need Help!
--- In [EMAIL PROTECTED], amit patti <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Hi Prashant ! > > I have a bit different look on this. One thing is very clear, you are either man or a woman. As a man u may luv a man or a woman or both. What difference do it make to world or others ? Why should anyone brand you straight, gay or bi...??? why ??? > > You do what u feel convenient and satisfy your love and sex life.. > > What difference it really make if he is a married, or a bachelor male.If they prefer it that way..why should anyone have a problem with it. > > I mean the whole question is who decided these terms " gay, bi or whatever to differentiate sexual preferences. Why should we do it. We never did it in India before thou everything was accepted. Should we do it becos western culture did that and define it like that ?? These differentiataion like gay, bi or whatever is done in west. In India we had only man, woman or Hijras. Hijras were the people with sexual organs disorientations. Even if a man had a sex with man or woman, we never called him by some another name. same for woman. > > I hope I am clear on this... > > CHEERS!! > > amit I think the only thing you're clear on is that you don't think people don't have responsibilities to other people when it comes to having sex. So people can do whatever they want and as long as its in the name of satisfying their sexual desire that's all that matters. Which is why you don't see any difference between a bachelor and a married guy. The fact that a married guy has responsibilities to his wife, who may not be OK with him sleeping around (either with a man or a woman) is presumably just a minor detail to you? Vikram Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~--> Make a clean sweep of pop-up ads. Yahoo! Companion Toolbar. Now with Pop-Up Blocker. Get it for free! http://us.click.yahoo.com/L5YrjA/eSIIAA/yQLSAA/WfTolB/TM ~-> Group Site: http://www.gaybombay.info == NEW CLASSIFIEDS SECTION SEEKING FRIENDS? VISIT www.gaybombay.info click on classified section and type your message in the post section once the link opens What's hot? What's not? Where are the LGBT parties being held and when? Click here!! http://calendar.yahoo.com/YYY,04497/srt,0/gaybombaygroup/?v=42&POS= Post:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Digest Mode:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] No Mail Mode:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Individual Mail Mode:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Contact Us:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Groups Homepage:- http://groups.yahoo.com/group/gay_bombay Unsubscribe:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/gay_bombay/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
g_b The Buttiglione battle
The American election is dominating the news to such an extent, with any space on the side being taken up by the Middle East, that a number of other interesting issues are getting marginalised. There are two really interesting battles taking place elsewhere both of which have gay rights at their heart - one in the bureacratic environment of the European Commission and Parliament, the other in the Anglican church. And in both cases the outcomes are uncertain with, quite likely, the immediate battle being lost from the gay rights point of view. Yet in both cases the very fact that these battles are being fought so strongly and with so much support from people in general, whether straight or gay that I think the long term benefit is probably to us. There's a palpable sense of horror on the part of the homophobes at how the tables seem to have turned on them and that attitudes which they could comfortably claim were the norm, are now being seen for the intolerance and hate that they represent. They are even complaining about being marginalised now! Here are a couple of pieces on Buttiglione and then I'll post one on the Anglican battle: An Italian opera buffa Oct 21st 2004 | ROME >From The Economist print edition The row over Rocco Buttiglione's nomination to be the European Commissioner for justice and home affairs continues AFTER learning that he had been named as Italy's next commissioner in Brussels, Rocco Buttiglione was quoted as saying: "I may be a nobody in Italy. But in Europe I will be someone." Propheticif not in the way he envisaged. A soft-spoken academic with a gracious manner and an engagingly toothy smile, Mr Buttiglione is scarcely the stuff of which scandals are made. Yet, for the past two weeks, he has been at the centre of a storm in Brussels. On October 11th, he became the first commission nominee to be rejected by a European Parliament committee, when the civil-liberties committee voted 27-26 to reject his nomination to the justice and home affairs portfolio. The majority's ire was roused by his comment, in response to the committee's questions, that "I may think homosexuality is a sin, but this has no effect on politics unless I say homosexuality is a crime." The vote prompted many in Italy, not just on the right, to note that Mr Buttiglione was merely echoing papal orthodoxy. As one cardinal deplored a "lay inquisition", Catholic commentators asked if believers could any longer aspire to high European office. They have a point. A gulf has opened between mainstream European thought on a range of social issues and the unyielding Catholicism of Pope John Paul. --- Also from the Economist: The European Parliament posts questions and replies (general and specific) given by Rocco Buttiglione during his hearing. Whilst the Committee on Legal Affairs endorsed him, the Committee on Civil Liberties, Justice and Home Affairs did not. Yet when Mr Buttiglione protests that he is being persecuted for his thoughts not his actions, he is being disingenuous. He is a lifelong member of a conservative organisation, Communion and Liberation, that is known for seeking to bring religious values into political life. After being made Europe minister in 2001, Mr Buttiglione astonished colleagues with a string of demands that went far beyond his remit. Within days, he had called for a ban on artificial insemination, for state funding for private schools and for payments to women who rejected abortions. As The Economist went to press, the incoming commission president, José Manuel Barroso, appeared to be mulling a compromise that would strip Mr Buttiglione of responsibility for anti-discrimination policies. But this may not be enough. The Socialist leader in the parliament, Martin Schulz, said he wanted a "complete change in portfolio for Mr Buttiglione" as the price for not voting down Mr Barroso's entire team. His stance followed a report this week in Britain's Daily Telegraph that the commissioner-designate had been under investigation in Monaco on suspicion of money-laundering. A magistrate in Monte Carlo was quoted as saying that Mr Buttiglione had been suspected of involvement in a plot to funnel cash illegally to his party, the Christian Democrat Union of Centre Democrats (UDC), though the case was later dropped. However, neither his Catholicism nor any alleged investigation is the best argument for questioning Mr Barroso's wisdom in earmarking the justice brief for a politician with Mr Buttiglione's friends and record. For the past four years, Mr Buttiglione's right-hand man, the head of his ministerial secretariat, has been Giampiero Catone. In May 2001, just before the election that brought Silvio Berlusconi to power, Mr Catone was arrested and jailed, accused of fraudulently obtaining government subsidies for companies he owns. He has since been charged, but not yet
g_b The Anglican battle
Here's the second battle, being fought in the Anglican church after the release of a report on the American Episcopal Church's ordination of an openly gay bishop. The immediate situation doesn't look good here for the gay Christian movement, since the African and other conservative churches are totally implacable. But the American church, while regretting the pain that their decision caused, is not backtracking either. This report from Time that connects this battle with the Buttiglione one and other current debates, but there's plenty more on the Net (check Google News) specifically on the gay Anglican debate: The Fight Over Gay Fights Moves to give gay couples the same status as heterosexual ones have reopened the fault lines between Europe's religious and secular institutions BY JAMES GRAFF Rocco Buttiglione could hardly have anticipated the firestorm he was about to unleash. Appearing earlier this month at what should have been a routine hearing before a European Parliament committee, the E.U. Commissioner designate for Justice, Freedom and Security was asked about discrimination against homosexuals. In response Buttiglione, a close friend and a biographer of Pope John Paul II, cited his Roman Catholic faith and said he considered homosexuality a "sin" and marriage an institution intended to give women "the right to have children and the protection of a man." What happened next was anything but routine. Many committee members were furious at what they considered such blatantly discriminatory views from a man who would be tasked with defending sexual equality, and demanded that the Commission's President designate, José Manuel Durão Barroso, either sack Buttiglione or move him to another post. Barroso didn't budge. Unless a compromise can be foundor one side backs downthe dispute could scuttle the entire 25 member European Commission before it even takes office, as scheduled, on Nov. 1. The episode is a reminder of how, despite the secular values professed by many Europeans, church and state can still clashwith powerful and unpredictable results. Cultural and religious fault lines have opened up around issues like stem cell research, therapeutic cloning, assisted reproduction and euthanasia, but gay rights is perhaps the most divisive. In Spain, whose kings and queens were once the most fervent defenders of the Christian faith, the Socialist government has launched a radical reform of family law that will grant gays and lesbians full legal status as parents and allow them to marry. In Ireland, another former Roman Catholic bastion, politicians from all parties meet this week to discuss whether the constitution should be changed to give homosexual couples the same rights as heterosexual ones. In England, the leaders of the worldwide Anglican Communion last week issued a report saying that if its pro and anti gay factions couldn't reconcile their differences then "we shall have to begin to learn to walk apart." And in Sweden, evangelical pastor Ake Green is appealing a one month prison sentence for preaching that homosexuality represents "a deep cancerous tumor in society." Although Europe has a long tradition of protecting gay rightsDenmark was the first to introduce registered partnerships for gay couples in 1989, while the Dutch legalized same sex marriage in 2001the issue still has the power to polarize. What's remarkable in this battle is how deeply each side feels itself a victim of the other's intolerance. The Green group in Parliament claimed that Buttiglione's "personal beliefs make it unlikely that he will take any positive initiative on gender equality." Martin Schulz, head of the Socialist group, bluntly accused Buttiglione of espousing "19th century values." But Carlo Giovanardi, Italy's Minister of Parliamentary Affairs and a Buttiglione ally, says a "Taliban" mentality has consumed his opponents: "We haven't seen an attack against religious freedom like this since the end of World War II. It's a new witch hunt." One of the Vatican's most outspoken Cardinals, former U.N. emissary Renato Raffaele Martino, lashed out at what he called a "new Holy Inquisition" led by a "powerful cultural, economic and political lobby against all that is Christian." Spain, for the moment, is where the battle rages fiercest. The Socialist led government will allow homosexuals to marry and adopt children; the Church has called on Spanish Catholics to fight the legislation. Javier Garcia, 40, who wants to marry his Brazilian partner, Mario Almeida, thinks the Church's opposition is wrongheaded. Both men are Roman Catholic. "Most Christians think homosexuals should be able to get married," he says. Indeed, polls show that some 60% of Spaniards support legalizing gay marriage, and around 250,000 couples are awaiting the new law, which will be debated in parliament in the next few weeks and is almost certai
g_b from the Far Eastern Economic Review: Tolerance Pays. Special Report on Gay Asia
A long post, apologies, which I'm giving in full both because its interesting and because the Far Eastern Economic Review (FEER) site, while free, requires a rather lengthy registeration. Its a report on trends in attitudes towards homosexuality in the the Far East with the main focus being Singapore, Indonesia, Hong Kong and the Philippines. Its an interesting report partly because of where its appearing. FEER, like The Economist, covers more than just business and economics, but its roots are clearly in the business world. This is reflected in the perspective it brings to social and political issues and as a business journalist myself I'd say this has both advantages and disadvantages. Blindly applying business-driven solutions to social problems can have problems: life can be more complicated outside the workplace which, in general, tends to be more structured and goal oriented. And everything doesn't come down to money. Yet against that, not all social problems are that complex and sometimes economics is really what underpins the problems. At any rate, its interesting looking at issues through an economic viewpoint and that's what FEER does, at least in the lead piece. And I'd say its justified in doing so because it really does seem that economics is behind the most surprising change in the Asian gay scene - the way Singapore has suddenly become tolerant and how this is being followed in several other countries. I'm not familiar with Singapore, but I have seen both the before and after in Hong Kong. I first went there just before the British handover and the gay scene was really underground. There was rumoured to be one club, you could buy gay porn from streetside sellers and that was largely it - sound familiar? And the general expectation was that things would get worst post-handover. People spoke darkly about gays being persecuted in China and no one knew anything, but the default was paranoia. This may be the only time I am going to acknowledge something remotely good about the Chinese communists, but post the handover they didn't crack down and in fact things improved for the better. Perhaps getting rid of those prudish Brits helped, but when I went back to HK the chance was amazing. Lan Kwai Fong had open gay bars, there were bathhouse and several bookshops selling gay books. That's the phenomenon FEER addresses and it does seem plausible to argue that in these most business driven of countries, concerns for business have played their role in changing attitudes. Those two dread words 'pink dollar' are part of it, but as they point out, the real change seems to come from Richard Florida's thesis about the creative class. Florida is a professor of regional economic development and in a very widely read book, The Rise of the Creative Class, he argues that if cities want to attract the young, creative professionals who run industries like entertainment and infotech - and you can bet cities do - then they need to look at the factors that attract them. One of the things he looked at was an Index that measured gay friendliness of cities. Florida found a high correlation between that and creative cities and concluded that creative people liked to work in gay friendly environments. Its not just that many of these creative people were gay, but the factors that made cities gay friendly - tolerance of unmarried relationships, respect of privacy, friendliness, cultural and lifestyle options - were also what attracted creative people in general. Florida's arguments have been disputed, but on the surface at least they sound plausible and they certainly seem to have convinced the authorities in Singapore, a city-state that desperately wants to attract creative people. Hence the change - but as the article notes, its change with limits. The traditional Singapore patriarchal attitude persists, just with a few things tweaked. This all raises very important questions of what this means for queer activism, for queer people and for other queer movements in Asia, like in India. I certainly do think there are things to learn from what's happening, but I also acknowledge the limitations. What's needed is debate and I hope there are at least a few who have managed to read to the end of this mail, and the FEER article that follows - and still have survived enough to mail their views! Vikram SPECIAL REPORT: GAY ASIA Gay Asia: Tolerance Pays In this special report, we examine the changing lives of Asia's gays. We begin in Singapore, a state where contradictions abound, but where one message has hit home: Gay rights make economic sense By Gordon Fairclough/SINGAPORE Issue cover-dated October 28, 2004 For many, the journey has yet to begin, but a growing number of Asian gay men and women are finally on the road to winning social and legal acceptance. Some a
g_b Re: SOS -- Please Help -- SOS
--- In [EMAIL PROTECTED], Ravi <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I was thinking to consult any doctor to `formulate' > any reason which I can put forward as a reason for not > getting married. Does anyone know any good doctors who > can help me out (Please note that I am based in > Mumbai)? Hi Ravi, its great to see that despite the pressure from your parents, you're not taking the easy route out and getting married to some unsuspecting girl. As Mal, Benny and the others have pointed out, you would be exchanging one set of people you are disappointing for another one - and for this second disappointment you would be directly responsible. So stick it out. As to how to do that, some suggestions that have come up on these lists: 1) Brazen it out. This sort of marriage pressure goes in cycles. There'll be a lot now. Keep saying no. They'll stop after a way. And then come again, but with any luck with less force. And so on and on. All you have to do is keep saying no. 2) Go spiritual. Say you're a brahmachari. Won't probably work for too long, but it can be a delaying tactic, mainly because traditional and religious people are left a bit tongue tied by traditional and religious argumens. 3) Throw a tantrum. This can be fun. When they start yelling, you yell back, say they're not respecting your wishes, scream, shout, cry a bit, threaten to walk out. Will probably shake everyone enough to buy you some time. Their threats of having heart attacks can be countered by your threats of thinking of committing suicide. 4) Leave. Get a job in another city, another country. Won't diminish the pressure, but it makes it harder for them to act on it. 5) Come out to them. Yes, I know you've ruled it out and in practical terms its not such a good move since it will only redouble the pressure on their part to get you married - "it will cure you!" But on the first point - about them being too old and traditional they won't know what it means - I keep hearing this and frankly I don't buy it. Our parents are not stupid or unwordly. The problem is that we rarely think of our parents as people in their own right, they are these sort of mythical figures looming over us since childhood. Yet they are also people and take it from me, these people know about homosexuality. There's much wider awareness of it in society, especially now. Yes, they probably also have wrong notions about homosexuality, but that's a different problem to tackle. But if, as I said, coming out makes no difference to the marriage pressure, why do it. For your sake. Coming out puts an end to all the hiding and subterfuges which can in time be emotionally very crippling. Hiding from those we love, we become instinctively secretive people, often hiding from our own selves. Once you come out, for better or worse its on the table, and you can deal with it or ignore it, but there will at least be an end to evading and to manufacturing excuses. Since you're in Bombay, you have the option of taking the help of some of the resources that exist here. As Nisha says the counsellers at the Humsafar Centre have dealt with many cases like yours and you should definitely call them. Gaybombay as also had several meetings for the parents of queer people and once - if - you come out, the reports of these meetings could be useful to show your parents. It helps them realise there are others like them and it looks at queer issues through a parents focus. It might even be possible to set up interactions between your parents and some of the parents of kids who have come out, perhaps at a meeting, perhaps one to one. And please note, language is not an issue. Sometime back, for example, we got a mail from a guy in Atlanta who wanted us to help his parents who he had just come out to. They only spoke Marathi, so people from the group who speak Marathi got in touch with them, and helped them come to a parents meeting, where they talked and interacted with other parents very well. Last year they went to stay with him and his partner in Atlanta. His mother even taught his boyfriend how to make rotis! So there are happy endings, however hard the problems seem. Stand firm against the pressure and consider some of the options suggested on this list. If you're interested in the Gaybombay parents meetings, mail me directly at [EMAIL PROTECTED], best Vikram Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~--> $9.95 domain names from Yahoo!. Register anything. http://us.click.yahoo.com/J8kdrA/y20IAA/yQLSAA/WfTolB/TM ~-> Group Site: http://www.gaybombay.info == NEW CLASSIFIEDS SECTION SEEKING FRIENDS? VISIT www.gaybombay.info click on classified section and type your message in the
g_b from Salon.com: Down low blues
Sometime back I think I'd posted a long article in the New York Times that described life on the "down low" - a world of secret homosexual encounters that many black men in the US are engaging in, because of the very particular homophobia that black men face, both from their own community and others around. Its a depressing read, not least because of the many obvious parallels with much homosexual life in India, but all the more worth reading for that. Here's another good article on that subject from Salon.com Vikram Down low blues All I want is a boyfriend. But as a black gay man, I keep hooking up with men who not only shun commitment -- they don't even want to come out of the closet. - - - - - - - - - - - - By Adam Phillips Aug. 12, 2004 | I met Rick on a Thursday night at a club called Vapor. He was somewhere below average height and stood against the walls, away from the light. Even in the dark his brown skin glowed. All the men at Vapor were dressed similarly: long shirt, baggy pants, jewelry, scowl. Rick had on a Chicago Bears jersey that he seemed too old and too serious for. Ditto for the thick gold chain that he had the good sense to keep inside the jersey. But he wore them the same way he held his plastic cup of ice and liquor: with an attitude. I could feel his slow eyes on my back. I knew that eye contact between us would collapse into a staring contest. He was very sexy, hiding in the dark. He looked guilty, scared of getting caught, but kind of turned on to be doing something he obviously thought was bad. It's worth noting that Vapor's black gay night was called "Taboo," where most white bars used campy names like "Paradise," "Oasis" and "Heaven." You had to pass through a sort of ectoplasm of shame to enter Taboo. And "gay" night is what I call it. The management, if they called it anything, used the word "alternative," as though upon entering you might find Bjork or a Foo Fighter. "Alternative" was the safe word bouncers used to make sure the seemingly straight people had come to the right place. After over an hour of staring and several rounds of the slow motion nod that confirms attraction, Rick finally came over and spoke to me. He had a smooth, husky rasp and a gentlemanly approach to conversation. He said he had just moved to our northeastern city from Chicago. I told him that I'd just moved from New York. He was a salesman, and he'd just finished with some clients. "Dressed like that?" He said he had the jersey in his car and often changed clothes out of the trunk. "I travel a lot," he said. "Why did you move here? Work?" I told him yes, and I kept talking because he kept listening. When he spoke, there was sex in his voice and sex in his eyes, and I tried to put some in my voice and eyes. He asked if he could drive me home, and I said yes. So we got in his very clean car, and he drove. He told me he was on the low, or the DL -- which is short for "down low," but could just as easily mean "dumb lie" or "devoid of love." A lot of men on the DL just want sex with men, and will usually commit only to a woman -- and they'll never acknowledge what they do as gay behavior. It's a game, like that staring contest, that's hot because they have this idea that it's, well, taboo. Before Rick, there were Omar, Kyle, Andrew, Nate, John, Jon, and Johnny. They all found it hard to see me as more than a hard dick and a firm ass. Or both. We'd move the child's seat to fumble in the back of the car; we'd do it in the lobby of their friend's apartment; we'd fuck in the last car of the train at three o'clock in the morning. Afterwards I'd always climb into my own bed wondering why I was sleeping alone, while they went home to their wives and girlfriends. Why hadn't anybody told me that being comfortably gay could feel lonelier than life in the closet? Rick was the first intelligent, educated adult who had interested me in months. I went to a predominately white Ivy League school, and so accordingly most of my friends are white. My good friends of color are all women. If black America is lamenting the dearth of educated black men, then educated black men who are gay and OK with it seem like an endangered species. Black men tend to see me, though, where men of other races simply don't. I've noticed a strange sort of racism in the gay community that tends to render black men invisible. Maybe it's the paranoid, stigmatizing reporting on black men and AIDS; maybe it's something as dumb but insidious as the lack of black models in the Abercrombie & Fitch ad campaign. Who knows; maybe it's that I just don't do it for a sizable portion of the white communit
g_b And its over. Now what?
Well, it looks like its over. Kerry has probably done the best thing and decided not to put everyone through the agony of an Ohio recount. All that's to be done is to make the best of things and that's what Andrew Sullivan has done, reflecting from a gay viewpoint and I'm posting that below. It has to be said that, while recriminations are pointless, the total rejection of the gay marriage amendments coupled with the closeness of the vote makes one wonder whether the gay community played into Republican hands on this one. Gay marriage really seems to have worked as a divisive issue and a way of getting the evangelicals to the polls. And presumably those voters who rejected it, also voted Bush. Does this point I wonder to a more cautious approach to pushing issues like this? Gay activists like Barney Frank warned about the dangers of pushing this and now they seem justified, especially when some of them, of a more radical bent, never had much liking for marriage anyway. I can imagine there some pissed off feelings among Democrats about the backlash from this. (I hate to say this but Nader's disparaging phrase about the dangers of gonadal politics has sort of stuck with me). But then getting pissed off with the gay marriage movement is assuming that such things can be controlled. The fact that it came up against the warnings of people like Frank shows what an wellspring of feeling there was on this, so perhaps it was not controllable and would have happened anyway. Just a pity the Republicans were able to twist it to their advantage so well. Vikram from andrewsullivan.com THE IMPACT ON GAYS: I've been trying to think of what to say about what appears to be the enormous success the Republicans had in using gay couples' rights to gain critical votes in key states. In eight more states now, gay couples have no relationship rights at all. Their legal ability to visit a spouse in hospital, to pass on property, to have legal protections for their children has been gutted. If you are a gay couple living in Alabama, you know one thing: your family has no standing under the law; and it can and will be violated by strangers. I'm not surprised by this. When you put a tiny and despised minority up for a popular vote, the minority usually loses. But it is deeply, deeply dispiriting nonetheless. A lot of gay people are devastated this morning, and terrified. We have seen, and not for the first time, how using fear of a minority can be so effective a tool in building a political movement. The single most important issue for Republican voters, according to exit polls, was not the war on terror or Iraq or the economy. It was "moral values." Karl Rove understood the American psyche better than I did. By demonizing gay couples, the Republicans were able to bring in whole swathes of new anti-gay believers into their party. With new senators Jim DeMint and Tom Coburn, two of the most anti-gay politicians in America, we can only brace ourselves for what is now coming. FEDERALISM WORKS: At the same time, gays can still appeal to the fair- minded center. After fanning the flames of fear for much of the year, the president himself recently came out in favor of civil unions. That puts him at odds with the initiatives passed so easily across the country. I do not believe a majority exists for denying gay couples legally protected relationships. The national exit polls showed that 27 percent support marriage rights, 37 percent support civil unions and only 35 percent want to keep gay couples from having any rights at all. There are still many states where it is safe to be a gay couple or an openly gay person. We have the right to marry in one state, and in that state, pro-equality legislators were all re- elected handily. In California, we are on the brink of having almost- equality under the law. Around the civilized world, gay relationships are increasingly accepted as worthy of dignity and respect. The passage of so many anti-gay amendments in so many states reduces the need, by any rational measure, for a federal amendment that would scar the Constitution with discrimination. We need therefore to be even more emphatic about the need for a federalist response to an issue best left to the states. If we can avoid the FMA, we can live to fight another day. STAND TALL: But one more thing is important. The dignity of our lives and our relationships as gay people is not dependent on heterosexual approval or tolerance. Our dignity exists regardless of their fear. We have something invaluable in this struggle: the knowledge that we are in the right, that our loves are as deep and as powerful and as God-given as their loves, that our relationships truly are bonds of faith and hope that are worthy, in God's eyes and our own, of equal respect. Being gay is a blessing. The minute we let their fear and ignorance
Re: g_b And its over. Now what?
If Mary Cheney hasn't totally lost it, this is what she should ask for, in return for what the Republicans put her through. Its the sort of quid pro quo politicians understand - we get elected, you get civil unions, that's how politics works. And civil unions will not be nothing - or why do you think the homophobes hate even them. The wording on most of the anti-gay marriage amendments that passed explicitly excluded even civil unions, which is going to open up the possibilities of lots of legal battles in the Supreme Court and, once its clear that gay marriage is off the cards, there might be some tacit support on this from the Administration, no matter how much the evangelicals howl. always insanely optimistically! Vikram Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~--> $9.95 domain names from Yahoo!. Register anything. http://us.click.yahoo.com/J8kdrA/y20IAA/yQLSAA/WfTolB/TM ~-> Group Site: http://www.gaybombay.info == NEW CLASSIFIEDS SECTION SEEKING FRIENDS? VISIT www.gaybombay.info click on classified section and type your message in the post section once the link opens What's hot? What's not? Where are the LGBT parties being held and when? Click here!! http://calendar.yahoo.com/YYY,04497/srt,0/gaybombaygroup/?v=42&POS= Post:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Digest Mode:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] No Mail Mode:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Individual Mail Mode:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Contact Us:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Groups Homepage:- http://groups.yahoo.com/group/gay_bombay Unsubscribe:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/gay_bombay/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
g_b Theo van Gogh (not directly queer related)
Two pieces on the Theo van Gogh murder and while there is no direct queer link here, as there was with Pim Fortuyn's murder, the issue is an important one for anyone concerned with the problems of dealing with religious intolerance. Vikram Outside View: Challenging Islam is risky By Irshad Manji Outside View commentator Toronto, ON, Nov. 2 (UPI) -- Tuesday's slaying of Theo van Gogh, a Dutch filmmaker who criticized Islamic practices, reminds all of a nagging truth: More than 15 years after the government of Iran issued a death warrant against novelist Salman Rushdie, challenging Muslims remains a risky business. As a Muslim dissident, I speak from experience. My book, "The Trouble with Islam," has put me on the receiving end of anger, hatred and vitriol. That's because I'm asking questions that we Muslims can no longer hide from. Why, for example, are we squandering the talents of half of God's creation, women? What's with the stubborn streak of anti-Semitism in Islam today? Above all, how can even moderate Muslims view the Koran literally when it, like every holy text, abounds in contradictions and ambiguity? The trouble with Islam today is that literalism is going mainstream. Muslims who take offense at these points often wind up reinforcing them in their responses to me. I regularly get death threats through my Web site. Some of my would-be assassins emphasize the virtues of martyrdom, wanting to hurl me into the "flames of hell" in exchange for 72 virgins. Others simply want to know what plane I'm next boarding, so they can hijack it. Somehow, I don't feel the urge to share my schedule. A few threats have been up-close and personal. At an airport in North America, a Muslim man approached my traveling companion to say, "You're luckier than your friend." When she asked him to explain, he turned his hand into the shape of a gun and pulled the trigger. "She will find out later what that means," he intoned. But, for all of the threats, there's good news: I'm hearing more support, affection and even love from fellow Muslims than I thought possible. Two groups in particular -- young Muslims and Muslim women - - have flooded my Web site with letters of relief and thanks. They are relieved that somebody is saying out loud words they have only whispered, and grateful that they're being given the permission to think for themselves. That's why I don't take my bodyguard everywhere I go. It may be necessary to have one when I visit France next week. But in my day-to- day life, I refuse to be closely protected. If I'm going to have credibility conveying to Muslims that we can, indeed, live while dissenting with the establishment, I can't have a big, burly fellow looking over my shoulder. I must lead by example. So far, so good. To be sure, I haven't tried visiting Egypt, Syria, Saudi Arabia or Pakistan since the release of my book. (One challenge at time, please!) Still, the relative safety with which I've debated Islam in the West -- from Britain to Belgium, from Australia to Canada, from the Netherlands to the United States -- convinces me that Muslims in the West have a sterling opportunity. They are best poised to revive Islam's tradition of independent reasoning. Why in the West? Because it's here that we already enjoy the precious freedoms to think, express, challenge and be challenged -- all without fear of state reprisal. I'm not denying that some Muslims have been targeted for harassment, profiling and discrimination by Western governments. I faced the same during the 1991 Gulf War when I was marched out of a federal building in Ottawa, Canada for no apparent reason. However, none of this negates a basic fact: If Muslims in the West dare to ask questions about our holy book, and if we care to denounce human rights violations being committed under the banner of that book, we need not worry about being raped, flogged, stoned or executed by the state for doing so. What in God's name are Muslims in the West doing with our freedoms? I know what many young Muslim would like us to be doing -- thinking critically about ourselves and not solely about Washington. Indeed, a huge motivation for having written my book came from young Muslims on American and Canadian campuses. Even before 9/11, I spoke at universities about the virtues of diversity, including diversity of opinion. After many of these speeches, young Muslims emerged from the audiences, gathered at the side of stage, chatted excitedly among themselves, and then walked over to me. "Irshad," I would hear, "we need voices such as yours to help us open up this religion of our because if it doesn't open up, we're leaving it." They're on the front lines in the battle for the soul of Islam. Whateve
g_b was it really gay marriages?
One week later and as the anguish ebbs, a few more rational voices are being heard. Asking, for example, if the initial reaction of "It was the gay marriages that did it!" is really that correct. The numbers don't necessarily indicate that, as pointed out by Paul Freedman, in his piece from Slate reproduced below. An even better piece from David Brooks, the lone conservative columnist in the New York Times, tackles it from an interesting angle: why are we so ready to believe that it was gay marriage and 'values' in general that propelled the Bush voters. Brooks is a writer I admire, although he has been criticised for the pop- sociology tone of some of his writing. He's certainly got a neat way with the labels - Bourgeois Bohemian, Patio Man, Realtor Mom - but while I can't comment on the absolute accuracy of his analyses, he does seem to grasp larger points and trends in a convincing way. I certainly, shamelessly (but with acknowledgements), ripped off his Patio Man explanation of the Great American Divide, for my own desperate post election piece (link below for those interested). In this piece I think Brooks really hits the nail on the head when he says the way the 'values' argument is being brandished around, does seem to stem from a need on the part of the Left to say that, yes, 'values' were a deciding factor and ours are better than theirs, therefore those who voted for Bush were inferior human beings. This is good for the ego, but isn't going to help get back the White House anytime soon. As Brooks points out - and as many Indian writers have been happy to overlook in their haste to depict the US as the most backward and barbarous place on earth - this is to overlook realities like the fact that, believe it or not, America isn't really such a homophobic place: "Kohut, whose final poll nailed the election result dead-on, reminds us that public opinion on gay issues over all has been moving leftward over the years. Majorities oppose gay marriage, but in the exit polls Tuesday, 25 percent of the voters supported gay marriage and 35 percent of voters supported civil unions. There is a big middle on gay rights issues, as there is on most social issues." If Brooks is right, then flailing around about how backward American voters are, is both wrong and a waste of time. If a Democrat or moderate Republican is to capture the White House four years from now, they need to start asking hard questions about why they're not connecting with so many people who are actually probably quite ready to connect with them. Vikram http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/articleshow/910079.cms from andrewsullivan.com: THE CONVENTIONAL WISDOM TURNS: I have to say that the more you look at the data, the less convincing it is that Bush won based on a religious right, anti-gay swing. Glenn has more details. One other thing: there were three swing states in which anti-marriage amendments were on the ballot. In Michigan and Oregon, the bans on gay unions passed, and Kerry still won. Ohio was the exception. If the GOP decides that the lesson of all this is to press on and make anti-gay amendments their signature issue, they will over-play their hand. Especially on the federal level. After all, isn't the logic of state amendments a federalist one? Let each state decide. Don't nationalize this issue one way or the other. OP-ED COLUMNIST The Values-Vote Myth By DAVID BROOKS In very election year, we in the commentariat come up with a story line to explain the result, and the story line has to have two features. First, it has to be completely wrong. Second, it has to reassure liberals that they are morally superior to the people who just defeated them. In past years, the story line has involved Angry White Males, or Willie Horton-bashing racists. This year, the official story is that throngs of homophobic, Red America values-voters surged to the polls to put George Bush over the top. This theory certainly flatters liberals, and it is certainly wrong. Here are the facts. As Andrew Kohut of the Pew Research Center points out, there was no disproportionate surge in the evangelical vote this year. Evangelicals made up the same share of the electorate this year as they did in 2000. There was no increase in the percentage of voters who are pro-life. Sixteen percent of voters said abortions should be illegal in all circumstances. There was no increase in the percentage of voters who say they pray daily. It's true that Bush did get a few more evangelicals to vote Republican, but Kohut, whose final poll nailed the election result dead-on, reminds us that public opinion on gay issues over all has been moving leftward over the years. Majorities oppose gay marriage, but in the exit polls Tuesday, 25 percent of the voters
g_b from the Washington Post: Felicia's story
Here's the second in the Washington Post series. Its about Felicia, a young black lesbian growing up in a gritty urban area. The context may seem quite different from that of Michael in the first story - downbeat city rather than small town America. But the problems are no less, just substitute homophobic young men for the homophobic evangelicals that Michael had to face. Felicia might seem to have an advantage in one way. A paternalistic society can scorn gay men as weak and inferior, but aggressive butch lesbians can sometimes gain some standing simply by tapping into masculine confidence. But as this story shows, its a severely limited standing, always liable to turn from acceptance to hate and violence at this 'unnaturalness'. It can also lead to unexpected and, ultimately, damaging reactions from women as this passage shows: "Felicia herself is a mirage. Some straight women are so starved for companionship on the loveless boulevards of Newark that they overlook her gender. Seeing her ball cap and the hip-hop slouch, feeling her charm and attentiveness, they squeeze their eyes and imagine. It is almost always Felicia who pays the emotional price." This would really resonate with some of my lesbian friends. Many of them have experienced becoming the focus of a very intense passion from women who seemed to be till then quite straight. And perhaps they are because often these women hardly seem to be lesbian or evince much interest in other lesbians - its the confidence and independence of this one lesbian that draws them. So they throw themselves at them and my friends have usually been swept off their feet and finally go along. Only to find themselves on an insane emotional rollercoaster. Because very few of these women ever seem to want to follow things through right to the end. They'll have the affair, they'll come out to their friends and family (which is what differentiates them from most married men who have a gay fling, but keep mum about it), there's chaos, confusion, turmoil... and at the end of it all, they go back to their families - usually citing their inability to leave their children - and my lesbian friends are left wondering what hit them. So all you guys who moan about being shortchanged by married men, remember it happens to women too! Vikram Braving the Streets Her Way By Anne Hull Washington Post Staff Writer Sunday, October 3, 2004; Page A01 Part III The belt buckle says SEXY. The silk jersey says Denver Nuggets. Both are laid out on the bed as Felicia Holt stands at the ironing board, trying to press some perfection into her Friday night. Her T-shirt is fresh from the store package and goes on warm. Two dabs of Egyptian musk oil on the neck. Hair braided short like an NBA star. A do-rag carefully tied over her braids. A voice rolls down the hall. "Felicia, is your room clean?" "Yeah, Ma." Felicia picks a cap from her vast collection on the dresser and stands in front of the mirror. With sleepy eyes and a smooth jaw, she cocks her chin with satisfaction. What stares back is the creamiest thug on the block. To be a young lesbian from the trash-blown and violent streets of Newark takes a measure of imagination. Felicia uses a soapy toothbrush to buff her Timberlands, diligently and delicately, still believing that a Friday night can hold some wonder. She contemplates the splendor of Jersey Gardens mall until she remembers the weekend crowds on a city bus, everyone packed like sardines and breathing each others' necks. "No seats," Felicia says, fastening her rainbow necklace. "I got a date, and I don't want her to stand." What is gay America? It is this 17-year-old who lives with her mother and two teenage sisters in an apartment on working-class Eckert Avenue. There is a Bible on the coffee table and fish frying in the kitchen. With no cell phone to receive text messages, Felicia keeps her folded love notes in a shoe box. I just want to kick it with you, one girl writes. In courtrooms, statehouses and city halls across the country, a historic battle is being fought over the expansion of rights for gay people. Far below the revolution is Felicia Holt, whose life is as hidden from the national debate as her box of stashed love notes. She cares less about wedding bells than dodging stray bullets and storefront preachers who keep the word "abomination" on the tips of their tongues, reserved for the likes of this high school senior now pulling the brim of her hat low over one eye. Newark. Brick City. Twenty-eight percent living in poverty, 54 percent African American, 30 percent Hispanic, Newark is just a $1.50 PATH train ride from Manhattan, but Felicia hardly ever crosses the river. Her world is Newark and she knows every inch of it, every shortcut through every vacant field. The Pabst brewery h
g_b from the New Yorker: Almodóvar
For all film buffs, an excellent article by David Denby in the New Yorker on Pedro Almodovar. I'm posting the link here since Denby has interesting things to say about Almodovar's frenetic and emotional roller coasters of films, including specifically on how Almodovar's homosexuality has shaped his view of life and women in particular, the reasons he so-often features omnisexual transvestites in his films and what this means for his latest films, Talk To Her and Bad Education where his focus is finally on men. The link and some quotes: http://newyorker.com/critics/cinema/?041122crci_cinema "Leaving out the transvestites, the men in the movies Almodóvar made before "Talk to Her" are mostly handsome stiffs. Straight or gay, they are all caught up in the comic insanity of machismo. The Almodóvaran male was a Lothario, a betrayer who muttered fatalistic Spanish nonsense into a woman's ear; he was a relentless predator who longed to dominate some love object; he was a luscious young virgin, slender, cherubic, bare-rumped. (Antonio Banderas, with dark, liquid eyes and swollen lips, played both the second and third types in his youth.) Until recently, Almodóvar had shown little interest in men as people. Is he a caricaturist, then? An ironist? How could a director working out of what appears to be a gay-cabaret sensibility achieve such renown? Surely there has never been a world-famous director whose work is essentially camp. Or is Almodóvar's work not camp at all? The most readily enjoyable of all art-house directorsa natural- born entertainerAlmodóvar also has his mysteries. This teasing melodramatist-modernist may be something unprecedented in movie history." "Almodóvar's interest in molten-eyed transvestites and vamping, sequinned drag queens may be the product of more than sexual curiosity. Such men open the floodgates of emotion without shame, and, however wistful and mixed up, they represent hope, as do the tall, restless street hustlers who become not transsexuals but omnisexualsthey have beautiful new breasts, which they show off to anyone who's interested, but they still have a male organ. They haven't changed genderthey've added one. Almodóvar's embrace of such men is so affectionate that we think less about perversion than about the manifold carnal possibilities of lifethe unwillingness to give up anything. In "Law of Desire," Carmen Maura plays Tina, an actress who was born a boy. As a child, she ran off with her father and, at his urging, had a sex-change operation. Then he left her, and she became a lesbian and mothershe's raising her lover's daughter. Tina could be a joke on all the solemn talk of "gender" in recent years: her identity is not so much unstable as universal. In Almodóvar's films, identity is not "constructed" by social forces but created by fantasy, will, and humor. Self-generated, his people don't behave according to traditional stereotypes, but they don't behave according to liberationist stereotypes, either. What matters to the director is not whether they are straight or gay (the issue is hardly discussed) but what they want and what they do. "In "High Heels," there is a tall drag queen named Femme Letal (pronounced "Lay-thal," which sounds a lot more lethal). At the end of her act, a young woman walks backstage to say hello, and, to her astonishment (and ours), Letal, still in lipstick and mascara, jumps her. Gorgeous, hilarious, and highly gymnastic sex follows, and, eventually, a child is born. Fellini made people like Letal into grotesque freaks; Almodóvar unfreaks them. A credit at the end of "All About My Mother" reads, "Dedicated to Bette Davis, Gena Rowlands, Romy Schneider. . . . To all actresses who have played actresses. To all women who act. To all men who act and become women. To all people who want to be mothers. To my mother." In Almodóvar's world, you begin with the nurturing images of Hollywood and you end with mom. Just like everyone else, the transvestites and omnisexuals get grouchy, hungry, or tired, and some of them long for children. They leave the audience in remarkably good humor, relieved by the appearance of what the Spanish director Miguel Albaladejo called "the daily ordinariness of the extraordinary." That doesn't sound like camp at all. " "In "Talk to Her," the first of Almodóvar's recent male-centered movies, two men, strangers, attend a Pina Bausch ballet. Onstage, women, their eyes closed, bounce off the walls in anguish, while a man rushes to and fro in front of them, hastily moving chairs out of their way. The two spectators are touched, and they later form a bond, in a clinic where each cares for a comatose woman he idolizes. The ballet, with its themes of isolation and dependency, sets up the narrative in a manner that's poetically satisfying rather than explicit. Earlier, in his celebrations of female temperament, Almodóvar's dominant colors were oversatur
g_b from the New Yorker: David Sedaris on monogamy
I am not a proponent of monogamy in relationships - or more accurately I'm a proponent of people doing whatever they want in their relationships, without any need to become moralistic about it, as long as both parties are OK with it. But if anyone could persuade me it might be David Sedaris, the gay humourist, who's writing here in the New Yorker. Of course, Sedaris isn't trying to persuade, just observe what works for him and his boyfriend, which I'd say is actually quite close to my view. And I definitely agree with him that the one way to test real closeness is when your partner will agree to perform some painful and embarassing, quasi-medical procedure for you! Vikram Here's the link to the whole story and an extract: http://www.newyorker.com/fact/content/?041129fa_fact1 -- OLD FAITHFUL by DAVID SEDARIS Out of nowhere I developed this lump. I think it was a cyst or a boil, one of those words you associate with trolls, and it was right on my tailbone, like a peach pit. That's what it felt like, anyway. I was afraid to look. At first it was just this insignificant knot, but as it grew larger it started to hurt. Sitting became difficult, and forget about lying on my back or bending over. By day five my tailbone was throbbing and I told myself, just as I had the day before, that if this kept up I was going to see a doctor. "I mean it," I said. I even went so far as to pull out the phone book and turn my back on it, hoping that the boil would know that I meant business and go away on its own. But of course it didn't. All of this took place in London, which is cruelly, insanely expensive. My boyfriend, Hugh, and I went to the movies one night, and our tickets cost a total of forty dollars, this after spending sixty dollars on pizzas. And these were mini-pizzas, not much bigger than pancakes. Given the price of a simple evening out, I figured that a doctor's visit would cost about the same as a customized van. More than the money, though, I was afraid of the diagnosis. "Lower- back cancer," the doctor would say. "It looks like we'll have to remove your entire bottom." Actually, this being England, he'd probably have said "bum," a word I have never really cottoned to. The sad thing is that they could remove my ass and most people wouldn't even notice. It's so insubstantial that the boil was actually an improvement, something like a bustle but filled with poison. The only real drawback was the pain. For the first few days I kept my discomfort to myself, thinking all the while of what a good example I was setting. When Hugh feels bad, you hear about it immediately. A tiny splinter works itself into his palm and he claims to know exactly how Jesus must have felt on the Cross. He demands sympathy for insect bites and paper cuts, while I have to lose at least a quart of blood before I get so much as a pat on the hand. One time in France we were lucky enough to catch an identical stomach virus. It was a twenty-four-hour bug, the kind that completely empties you out and takes away your will to live. You'd get a glass of water, but that would involve standing, and so instead you just sort of stare toward the kitchen, hoping that maybe one of the pipes will burst, and the water will come to you. We had the exact same symptoms, yet he insisted that his virus was much more powerful than mine. I suspected the same thing, so there we were, competing over who was the sickest. "You can at least move your hands," he said. "No," I told him, "it was the wind that moved them. I have no muscle control whatsoever." "Liar." "Well, that's a nice thing to say to someone who'll probably die during the night. Thanks a lot, pal." At such times you have to wonder how things got to this point. You meet someone and fall in love, then thirteen years later you're lying on the floor in a foreign country, promising, hoping, as a matter of principle, that you'll be dead by sunrise. "I'll show you," I moaned, and then I must have fallen back to sleep. When Hugh and I bicker over who is in the most pain, I think back to my first boyfriend, whom I met while I was in my late twenties. Something about our combination was rotten, and as a result we competed over everything, no matter how petty. When someone laughed at one of his jokes, I would need to make that person laugh harder. If I found something at a yard sale, he would have to find something betterand so on. My boyfriend's mother was a handful, and every year, just before Christmas, she would schedule a mammogram, knowing she would not get the results until after the holidays. The remote possibility of cancer was something to hang over her children's heads, just out of reach, like mistletoe, and she took grea
g_b Piku Bhalo Achay: a screening in Madras
idence of so much good that's happening. The problems facing the queer movement are so many, there are problems within it as well and the gains sometimes seem so low, that occasionally we end up undervaluing the movement that we have. Yet friends from other countries, both from struggling movements in the developing world and increasingly complacent ones in the developed world, often tell us they are almost envious of what we have. It's a vigorous and rapidly spreading movement particularly as seen in the youth and the confidence of many of those now coming into it. And I can't think of a better sign of it than a young man in Calcutta, from hardly any particularly privileged background, making a film in Bengali about his coming out. Also for me there was the added satisfaction of seeing it in Madras, the city I grew up in, but the most conservative of large cities, the most reluctant to develop a queer movement and at least part of the reason I left was frustration that it would never happen. But this was a public screening and finally there were many queer people I knew in the audience, through the efforts of groups like Sahodharan, SAATHII, SIAAP and others, and lists like [EMAIL PROTECTED], lgbt- [EMAIL PROTECTED] and [EMAIL PROTECTED] It was a great feeling and I knew that Riyad would have been happy. His legacy of queer filmmaking in India is in good hands with people like Tirthankar. And the queer movement that he helped started is also doing just fine. Vikram Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~--> Make a clean sweep of pop-up ads. Yahoo! Companion Toolbar. Now with Pop-Up Blocker. Get it for free! http://us.click.yahoo.com/L5YrjA/eSIIAA/yQLSAA/WfTolB/TM ~-> Group Site: http://www.gaybombay.info == NEW CLASSIFIEDS SECTION SEEKING FRIENDS? VISIT www.gaybombay.info click on classified section and type your message in the post section once the link opens This message was posted to the gay_bombay Yahoo! Group. Responses to messages (by clicking "Reply") will also be posted on the eGroup and sent to all members. If you'd like to respond privately to the author of any message then please compose and send a new email message to the author's email address. For Parties and evenets go to: http://calendar.yahoo.com/YYY,04497/srt,0/gaybombaygroup/?v=42&POS= Post:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Digest Mode:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] No Mail Mode:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Individual Mail Mode:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Contact Us:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Archives are at http://www.mail-archive.com/gay_bombay%40yahoogroups.com/maillist.html Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/gay_bombay/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
g_b Leavitt, Mitchell & Raj Rao on Gay Writing @ Crossword, Thursday Dec 23rd
Hi all, here's to announce a really exciting event coming up next week. David Leavitt, the very well known American 'gay writer' (see below for why I've used the apostrophes!) and Mark Mitchell, his co-editor of 'The Penguin of Gay Short Stories' (1994, substantially revised 2003) and 'Pages Passed from Hand to Hand: The Hidden Tradition of Homosexual Literature in English from 1748 to 1914' (Mitchell also independently edited The Penguin Book of International Gay Writing) are in India and they've agreed to have a discussion on gay writing at Crossword in Bombay. R.Raj Rao, the author of The Boyfriend, will be joining them to bring an Indian perspective. More details below, so all I'm going to say now is - THIS IS NOT AN EVENT TO MISS!!! Its going to make for a fascinating discussion and thanks to Crossword (a tip of the hat to R.Sriram, the manager, who readily agreed to doing this) we've got a great venue for it. Make sure you're there and make sure you forward this info to as many people as you can. For those who haven't read any of Leavitt and Mitchell's books, Crossword is trying to get as many copies as possible, particularly of The New Penguin of Gay Short Stories. BE THERE! Vikram David Leavitt, Mark Mitchell and R.Raj Rao discuss Gay Writing at Crossword (below the flyover, Kemps Corner, Mumbai) on Thursday, December 23rd Bios: David Leavitt: David Leavitt is the author of the short story collections Family Dancing (finalist for the PEN/Faulkner Prize and the National Book Critics' Circle Award), A Place I've Never Been, Arkansas, and The Marble Quilt, as well as the novels The Lost Language of Cranes, Equal Affections, While England Sleeps (Finalist for the Los Angeles Times Fiction Prize), The Page Turner, Martin Bauman, or A Sure Thing and most recently, The Body of Jonah Boyd. In 2002, he published Florence, A Delicate Case as part of Bloomsbury's series "The Writer and the City." His Collected Stories was published this fall by Bloomsbury. He has just finished The Man Who Knew Too Much: Alan Turing, Mathematics, and the Origins of the Computer. With Mark Mitchell (see below) he has co-authored two books on travel writing and two anthologies. He teaches at the University of Florida. Mark Mitchell: Mark Mitchell is the author of Virtuosi: A Defence and a (Sometimes Erotic) Celebration of Great Pianists, most recently, Vladimir de Pachmann: A Piano Virtuoso's Life and Art. The anthologies he has edited include The Penguin Book of International Gay Writing and, with David Leavitt, The Penguin of Gay Short Stories (1994, substantially revised 2003) and Pages Passed from Hand to Hand: The Hidden Tradition of Homosexual Literature in English from 1748 to 1914. He and Leavitt have also edited E.M.Forster's Selected Stories for Penguin Classics. They have also co-authored two books on travel writing: Italian Pleasures and In Maremma: Life and a House in Southern Tuscany. R.Raj Rao: R.Raj Rao was born in Bombay. He studied in India and the UK, and in 1996 attended the International Writing Programme, Iowa. He is the author of Slide Show (poems), One Day I Locked My Flat In Soul City (short stories), The Wisest Fool on Earth and Other Plays, Nissim Ezekiel: The Authorized Biography and, most recently The Boyfriend (a novel). He has also edited Ten Indian Writers in Interview and co- edited Image of India in the Indian Novel in English (1960-1980). A professor of English at the University of Pune, Rao is also one of India's leading gay-rights activists. Discussing Gay Writing Gay writing is a recent and rapidly growing field. There has long been writing on homosexual subjects, of course, but its easy to forget how hard it was, till quite recently, to tackle these openly and in any but the most superficial way. As David Leavitt reminds us in the extract below E.M.Forster could not have his gay writings published until after his death in 1970. The openness with which we can now deal with the subject is obviously an excellent change - yet its one that has brought its own problems in its wake. Who is a `gay writer'? Can't he or she just be a `writer' or is the adjective inescapable? Must a `gay writer' tackle gay subjects only and if so, are there constraints on how he or she can do that? Does a `gay writer' have to be a gay rights activist, or is he or she one by definition? Is `gay writing' a single definable school or should we recognise distinctions within it? As homosexuality comes out of the closet across the world, will gay writing spread? And will this new gay writing from the developing world differ from what has come from the developed world? David Leavitt, Mark Mitchell and R.Raj Rao will be discussing these questions at Crossword on November 23rd at 7.00 p.m. M
g_b Leavitt, Mitchell & Raj Rao @ Crossword @ 7.30 pm Thurs Dec 23rd
Apologies, forgot to mention the time of this event. We're planning to start at 7.30 pm and the shop shuts at 9.pm, so if we can start on time, we'll have more time for discussion. Please come to the store between 7.00 and 7.30 pm. Also, if you haven't been to Crossword in the last few months, please note its moved from its old Mahalakshmi location to an even larger space at Kemp's Corner. Its by the side of the flyover next to the Be and Noah's Ark shops. And finally, since some people have told me they would like to come, but are wary about being outed by attending such a prominent gay event, here's some good advice from Elizabeth on the Gay_bombay list: From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: Leavitt, Mitchell & Raj Rao on Gay Writing @ Crossword, Thursday Dec ... sounds like a great time...if crosswords is not a gay bookstore...and you do not want to let people know you are gayshow up a bit late...and stand there listening like a confused outsidermy father always said nobody ever really knows what is going on in another person's mind... elizabeth Hope that answers all questions about the event. Any further questions, mail me directly at [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please tell as many people as you can about it. This will be of more than just gay interest, anyone interested in the varieties of literature should find this event interesting. See you all there! Vikram Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~--> Make a clean sweep of pop-up ads. Yahoo! Companion Toolbar. Now with Pop-Up Blocker. Get it for free! http://us.click.yahoo.com/L5YrjA/eSIIAA/yQLSAA/WfTolB/TM ~-> Group Site: http://www.gaybombay.info == NEW CLASSIFIEDS SECTION SEEKING FRIENDS? VISIT www.gaybombay.info click on classified section and type your message in the post section once the link opens This message was posted to the gay_bombay Yahoo! Group. Responses to messages (by clicking "Reply") will also be posted on the eGroup and sent to all members. If you'd like to respond privately to the author of any message then please compose and send a new email message to the author's email address. For Parties and events go to: http://calendar.yahoo.com/YYY,04497/srt,0/gaybombaygroup/?v=42&POS= Post:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Digest Mode:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] No Mail Mode:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Individual Mail Mode:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Contact Us:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Archives are at http://www.mail-archive.com/gay_bombay%40yahoogroups.com/maillist.html Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/gay_bombay/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
g_b 'My Brother Nikhil' - coming in Feb
There's a film coming up for launch in Feb which promises to be quite exciting. Its name is 'My Brother Nikhil' and its based on the real life story of Dominic D'Souza who was one of the first guys to test as HIV +ve in India and the really awful reaction he had to face. And what's really great is that the film makers are not ducking the fact that Dominic was gay. Its a fictionalised version, of course, so the story is not exactly the same. Since its Bollywood I'm also assuming its not going to end entirely grimly - but I don't know. What I do know is that the director definitely seems gay friendly because not only was he honest about Dominic/Nikhil's sexuality, but he approached us asking for inputs from gay people to ensure that sensitivities were respected. (This is all that I've had to do with the film, so this write up is quite unsolicited). I didn't have time to see the rushes myself, but Sopan did and he says they are looking pretty good (Sopan, want to tell us more). I guess they can't help but look good because - and here's the other exciting part - he has got a HOT cast. Sanjay Suri as Nikhil. Purab Kohli as his boyfriend. Shayan Munshi as another friend (I don't know if this character is also gay, but what's more important is that, like Nikhil, he's a swimming champion in the film, so look forward to plenty of Speedo exposure!). Juhi Chawla is the sister who tells Nikhil's story. Lilette Dubey is his mother. Victor Banerjee his father. So this case isn't just hot, but its pretty good too. The website for the film has just be launched so take a look here. Lots of pictures, which look GOOD. And bits about the film which suggest, just hopefully, that here we might really be looking forward to something good. Spread the word! http://www.mybrothernikhil.com Vikram Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~--> Make a clean sweep of pop-up ads. Yahoo! Companion Toolbar. Now with Pop-Up Blocker. Get it for free! http://us.click.yahoo.com/L5YrjA/eSIIAA/yQLSAA/WfTolB/TM ~-> Group Site: http://www.gaybombay.info == NEW CLASSIFIEDS SECTION SEEKING FRIENDS? VISIT www.gaybombay.info click on classified section and type your message in the post section once the link opens This message was posted to the gay_bombay Yahoo! Group. Responses to messages (by clicking "Reply") will also be posted on the eGroup and sent to all members. If you'd like to respond privately to the author of any message then please compose and send a new email message to the author's email address. For Parties and events go to: http://calendar.yahoo.com/YYY,04497/srt,0/gaybombaygroup/?v=42&POS= Post:- gay_bombay@yahoogroups.com Subscribe:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Digest Mode:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] No Mail Mode:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Individual Mail Mode:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Contact Us:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Archives are at http://www.mail-archive.com/gay_bombay%40yahoogroups.com/maillist.html Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/gay_bombay/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
g_b GB New Year's party contributions to tsunami relief funds
We've received several suggestions from people about adding a contribution to tsunami relief to the cost of the cover charge for the GB New Year's party. I don't think people would refuse to pay this, but I do know some people who might find this hard to pay since the cost of the New Year's party is, unfortunately, already double out normal party cover charges. So we have decided to work out things so that Rs25 from the existing charge of Rs900 goes towards tsunami relief funds. And if over and above that people want to contribute, the donation boxes will be there. After the party, we'll announce on the lists the amount collected and the fund to which we are donating it and a receipt from the fund will be obtained, in case anyone wants to see it. If possible, we'll also try and have a fund raiser early in Jan specifically for this where the donation will be announced in advance. Vikram Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~--> $4.98 domain names from Yahoo!. Register anything. http://us.click.yahoo.com/Q7_YsB/neXJAA/yQLSAA/WfTolB/TM ~-> Group Site: http://www.gaybombay.info == NEW CLASSIFIEDS SECTION SEEKING FRIENDS? VISIT www.gaybombay.info click on classified section and type your message in the post section once the link opens This message was posted to the gay_bombay Yahoo! Group. Responses to messages (by clicking "Reply") will also be posted on the eGroup and sent to all members. If you'd like to respond privately to the author of any message then please compose and send a new email message to the author's email address. For Parties and events go to: http://calendar.yahoo.com/YYY,04497/srt,0/gaybombaygroup/?v=42&POS= Post:- gay_bombay@yahoogroups.com Subscribe:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Digest Mode:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] No Mail Mode:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Individual Mail Mode:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Contact Us:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Archives are at http://www.mail-archive.com/gay_bombay%40yahoogroups.com/maillist.html Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/gay_bombay/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
g_b My Brother Nikhil: clarifications + compensation!
I spoke to my film critic friend today who had put me in touch with the director of My Brother Nikhil. She's seen the full film so I asked her exactly how open the film is, if at all, about a relationship between Nikhil (Sanjay Suri) and Nigel (Purab Kohli). Her view is that it is open - but its also discreet. She told me that at the story stage the relationship was explicit, but when it came to the visual depiction, cold feet and compromises might have come in, so there is some ambiguity. Nikhil does have a fiancee in the film, but she's disposed of pretty quickly. The bulk of the film is about how he is rejected by everyone - except his sister and Nigel. And that its pretty clear that there is real love and affection between Nikhil and Nigel. So are we going to get both of them in bed? Well, no. But lots of images of them together, arms across each other's shoulders, the two of them together when everyone else, except Anamika (Juhi Chawla), is against them. She thinks its quite obvious that the two are in a relationship, but if people choose not to believe this, then I guess the ambiguity allows that. My friend also says the director was very keen NOT to link the fact that of Nikhil being gay to his becoming positive. So he could have got it from a visit to the dentist or whatever. From my conversations with the director he seems a really sincere guy and keen to get good feedback from the gay community, so perhaps this really was his concern, but if so I have to say that its a somewhat misplaced concern. I don't think its going to come as news to many people that homosexuals are a high risk group for AIDS. But then that's Bollywood, and to get a film made, with not entirely unknown stores and to aim for at least a semi-commercial release, was going to take some compromises and if my friend is right, the film doesn't turn the story totally straight the way Phir Milenge did with Philadelphia, and overall she says its very well made and is trying to be as different as it can. And it does have some super-hot studs in it, so there are reasons for seeing it, even if we're not getting direct man on man action (that's what our imaginations are for). So apologies if any expectations have been dashed, and lets welcome the film for what it is and what we have ahead of us - another year of many compromises, lots of irritations, quite a few failures, but at the end of it all, just a little, but definite, progress. I hope lots of you will be at the GB party tonight and for all the guys, click on this link for some compensation. It links to the webpage for the amazing calendar that the French national rugby team produces, and it should keep your spirits (among other things) up in the year ahead. (Apologies to moderators if sending this link breaks any list restrictions, but it is New Year!) http://www.stade.fr/uploads_stade/html/dds2005/index.htm Happy New Year! Vikram Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~--> Make a clean sweep of pop-up ads. Yahoo! Companion Toolbar. Now with Pop-Up Blocker. Get it for free! http://us.click.yahoo.com/L5YrjA/eSIIAA/yQLSAA/WfTolB/TM ~-> Group Site: http://www.gaybombay.info == NEW CLASSIFIEDS SECTION SEEKING FRIENDS? VISIT www.gaybombay.info click on classified section and type your message in the post section once the link opens This message was posted to the gay_bombay Yahoo! Group. Responses to messages (by clicking "Reply") will also be posted on the eGroup and sent to all members. If you'd like to respond privately to the author of any message then please compose and send a new email message to the author's email address. For Parties and events go to: http://calendar.yahoo.com/YYY,04497/srt,0/gaybombaygroup/?v=42&POS= Post:- gay_bombay@yahoogroups.com Subscribe:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Digest Mode:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] No Mail Mode:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Individual Mail Mode:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Contact Us:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Archives are at http://www.mail-archive.com/gay_bombay%40yahoogroups.com/maillist.html Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/gay_bombay/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
g_b Gore Vidal: Was Lincoln Bisexual?
A wonderful and absolutely must read piece from Gore Vidal on the question of Abraham Lincoln's sexuality. This particular question doesn't really interest me much, since it seems to fall into the area of internally unprovable questions on which much time and passion can be spent if one has nothing better to do with one's time. But the piece Gore Vidal has written is, as expected, trenchant and very funny, and with some historical interest too - I didn't know Vidal was one of the people interviewed by Kinsey. The descriptions of attitudes towards homosexuality in the America of Lincoln's time and even up to the mid-20th century when Sandburg was writing his (completely over the top) biography are also strikingly reminiscent of how at least parts of India still feels. Am posting both the link here and the full piece - it absolutely has to be read. Vikram http://www.vanityfair.com/commentary/content/printables/050103roco02? print=true Was Lincoln Bisexual? By Gore Vidal In a Web-only exclusive, the author examines C. A. Tripp's long- awaited, hotly contested book, The Intimate World of Abraham Lincoln and ponders American sexuality a century before Kinsey As a schoolboy I read most of Carl Sandburg's six-volume biography of Abraham Lincoln. Sandburg was a poet-performer, and I tended to skip his rhapsodic passages, thus missing some key points. Even so, I was sufficiently drawn to his Lincoln well, to be precise, there is no Sandburg Lincoln, only a sort of grab bag of anecdotes, a do-it- yourself folklore Lincoln, using material that, with time's passage, has been more and more rejected by those scholar squirrels who are always in attendance upon the Lincoln brigade's stern academic icon- dusters. Eventually, I came to write my own Lincoln, dealing with the master politician as a counterbalance to the folksy figure so beloved of apolitical chroniclers, particularly in the early part of the 20th century, when the sex life of a Mount Rushmoreite was taboo and speculation was neither encouraged nor pursued by those with tenure rather than truth in mind. The Second World War changed everything. Over 13 million American males served in Europe, the Pacific, and, most exotic of all, that unknown land the United States of America, which suddenly became a place of sexual marvels unknown to previous generations. But then, in 1945, when much of the war ended, we were abruptly translated from the Land of Oz back to drearyeven bloody Kansas, not to mention Indiana, where one Alfred C. Kinsey was scientifically analyzing our intimations and dreams of Oz as well as who did what sexually and why. Among Kinsey's researchers was C. A. Tripp, who had become interested in the sexuality of our greatest president, but I am now ahead of our story. In 1948, Alfred C. Kinsey published Sexual Behavior in the Human Male. He also wrote me a note of appreciation for my "work in the field": The City and the Pillar, a novel about a star-crossed love affair between two "normal" young male athletes with which I had shocked America well, the New York Times, by making the point that their affair was a perfectly natural business, despite so many popular superstitions derived from our various Bronze Age religions. At about that time I met Tripp, whose posthumous The Intimate World of Abraham Lincoln has at last been published by Free Press. What the Kinseyites and I had in common so long ago was the knowledge that homosexual and heterosexual behavior are natural to all mammals, and that what differs from individual to individual is the balance between these two complementary but not necessarily conflicted drives. So, what has all this to do with our greatest president? The young Lincoln had a love affair with a handsome youth and store owner, Joshua Speed, in Springfield, Illinois. They shared a bed for four years, not necessarily, in those frontier days, the sign of a smoking gunonly messy male housekeeping. Nevertheless, four years is a long time to be fairly uncomfortable. The gun proved to be the letters that passed between them when Joshua went home to Kentucky to marry, while Lincoln was readying himself for marriage in Springfield. Each youth betrays considerable anxiety about the wedding night ahead. Can they hack it? To Sandburg's credit he picked up on this (who could not after reading the letters?), but, first time around, I skipped his poetical comments on Lincoln's "streak of lavender and spots soft as May violets." Sandburg was a typical American of his time and place; he knew that any male with sexual feelings for another male was a maiden trapped inside a male body. Even the great Mae West, our first commanding sexologist, was convinced that fairies were simply women, obliged, through no fault of their own, to inhabit crude male bodies: Plangently Doctor
g_b Re: Gay Guy Duped In Matunga. Another Entrapment Case. Please Help.
I got in touch with Harsha and offered some solutions. There have also been some mails on the GB list about that, which I'm crossposting here so people get some idea of what can be done in such circumstances: --- In [EMAIL PROTECTED], Guy InBlack [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Vikram, Even after filing a complaint does it really help ?? I am just curious to know how actively to the police react to such cases. And btw I am sure that no amount of lawyers will be able to help. Coz i know how slow the law works in out lands. We don't know how the police responds to such cases since, to the best of my knowledge, no one has filed a complaint. In most cases the victim is too scared to do anything or just wants to put the whole experience behind him. One case I got to know of through the bf of the victim, and the only reason the bf got to know was because the guy had to call him for money. After that he has refused to speak to anyone, even the bf, about the experience. Neil Pate, a journalist from the Times of India who did a story on these blackmailing cases, spoke to the joint commissioner for crime (the previous one, Satyapal Singh) and he said that people should report such cases and the police would act on them because they were there to help all victims of crime, and the fact that they were gay didn't make a difference since they were citizens just like anyone else. This might just be words, but it was still good to hear a senior police officer saying that gay people had the same rights as other citizens. I do know a foreigner who took such a case to the police and because he was a foreigner and influential, they got the guy and beat him up, really badly. There is some visceral pleasure in this happening, certainly, but I don't think its a long term solution, not everyone is influential enough to get the police to do their bidding and, call me stupid, but getting the police to beat someone up for you, is not the solution we should be advocating. Harsha firstly ask your friend to stop being scared. I dont think anyone is going to call up his office. And if they do call, then set up a meeting with them for the balance money. Take the police with you and kick their butts to the jail. He should rather pay the police 1 bucks and get the blackmailer's butts kicked than paying that ronit guy another single penny. Harsh That's pretty much the advice I gave Harsha, which I'm reproducing here in case anyone else has such problems: What your friend should do depends on how out he is, how willing he is to call these guys' bluff and whether he wants to do anything about it. At the most basic level, I don't think there's much threat to him. He can simply not take their calls or, if they start calling from different numbers, he must just tell them he doesn't know who they are and they don't have any proof of anything. Even if they have taken his card or personal details, they could have got that from anywhere (or stolen them). That's why I actually think its unlikely these guys will call him. In most such cases they know that their main advantage is in the victim's immediate panic. Once the victim can think about it more, they usually calm down, ask friends and can resist. So these guys often don't call again unless they are really greedy - or if they think the guy is deep in the closet, in which case he's a good blackmail victim. If this is the case, then the ball is really in your friend's court. If they have his home numbers and know he's in the closet they can threaten to tell his family. Your friend can either agree to go along with this, and resign himself to paying out huge amounts for ages (one guy paid over a lakh over three years). Or he can call their bluff and dare them to tell his family. Often they won't bother, but they might and in that case he has to be prepared to come out. Finally there's the question of whether he wants to do something about it. This might mean filing a police case (but then he does have to be prepared to come out, at least to some extent). Even better is the chance of trapping them - in whcih case we should really hope they call. If your friend is at all willing to consider this, then get in touch with me and we can meet the lawyers at the India Centre for Human Rights and Law in Dongri. Vikram --- In gay_bombay@yahoogroups.com, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi All, This is again a case of a guy getting duped. This is my friends case. He was chatting with a guy in yahoo chat room whose id was metheman_manonly. That guy told he was a ramp model and looking for a decent guy. My Friend who is a very simple guy innocent guy..believed him and had gone to meet him. That Guy, whose name was Ronit, had asked my friend to meet him at Matunga. My Friend had gone there..he was asked to meet near some ice cream parlour and
g_b Re: dear vikram
Hi Ram, the best option for you to watch gay films is to come for Gaybombay's film screenings which are now scheduled to happen once every two months. We hire an auditorium for one Sunday, currently that of National College in Bandra (the principal is supportive), and show queer themed films through the day. There is no entry charge for this. If there's a film playing in the theatres with a gay theme we also try and organise a joint outing to see it - we're planning on seeing Alexander tomorrow (check www.gaybombay.org for details). In both cases please note we're talking of feature films or documentaries and NOT porn. So consider it and come tomorrow or the next time we have a film screening (Feb 13th, I think, is the next date). Gay friendly cybercafes - well perhaps others on this list could answer that? I've found the Satyam Infoway guys are the least interested in what you're upto, because its a franchise the guys running it have less interest. But in general, most places don't care what you're watching, unless its porn but that's another matter, best Vikram --- In gay_bombay@yahoogroups.com, ram singh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > dear vikram > > i have joined the group some time back > i stay in south mumbai > > i hope you will be able to help me > > i am interested in watching gay films but this is usually at the cyber cafe or at > after office hours. > this is no fun > i would like to watch it with like minded gays in privacy and enjoy the film > > is it possible fo you to help me in this request ? > also i would like to know gay owned or friendly cyber cafe or other establishments > and patronise them especially in south mumbai till prabhadevi > > do answer my mail whatever your reply > thanks > ram > Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~--> DonorsChoose. A simple way to provide underprivileged children resources often lacking in public schools. Fund a student project in NYC/NC today! http://us.click.yahoo.com/5F6XtA/.WnJAA/E2hLAA/WfTolB/TM ~-> Group Site: http://www.gaybombay.info == NEW CLASSIFIEDS SECTION SEEKING FRIENDS? VISIT www.gaybombay.info click on classified section and type your message in the post section once the link opens This message was posted to the gay_bombay Yahoo! Group. Responses to messages (by clicking "Reply") will also be posted on the eGroup and sent to all members. If you'd like to respond privately to the author of any message then please compose and send a new email message to the author's email address. For Parties and events go to: http://calendar.yahoo.com/YYY,04497/srt,0/gaybombaygroup/?v=42&POS= Post:- gay_bombay@yahoogroups.com Subscribe:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Digest Mode:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] No Mail Mode:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Individual Mail Mode:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Contact Us:- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Archives are at http://www.mail-archive.com/gay_bombay%40yahoogroups.com/maillist.html Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/gay_bombay/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
g_b Susan Sontag and a Case of Curious Silence
An interesting and rather depressing angle on the recent death of Susan Sontag: from andrewsullivan.com: THE INNING OF SONTAG: I have to say I'm amazed at the fact that almost all the obituaries for Susan Sontag omitted her primary, longtime relationship with Annie Leibovitz, the photographer. Of 315 articles in Nexis, only 29 mention Leibovitz, and most of them referred merely to their joint projects. Leibovitz was unmentioned as a survivor in the NYT and Washington Post. It's striking how even allegedly liberal outlets routinely excise the homosexual dimension from many people's lives - even from someone dead. But perhaps it is reflective of Sontag's own notions of privacy and identity. She championed many causes in her day, but the gay civil rights movement was oddly not prominent among them. MORE ON SONTAG: I'm not the only one to notice how the big media has essentially lied by omission about Susan Sontag's life. An op-ed in today's L.A. Times notes the following: An unauthorized biography written by Carl Rollyson and Lisa Paddock and published by W.W. Norton in 2000, reports that Sontag was, for seven years, the companion of the great American playwright Maria Irene Fornes (in Sontag's introduction to the collected works of Fornes, she writes about them living together). She also had a relationship with the renowned choreographer Lucinda Childs. And, most recently, Sontag lived, on and off, with Leibovitz. Even Hitchens mentions only her ex-husband. Privacy? From a woman who detailed every aspect of her own illnesses? From someone whose best work is redolent with homosexual themes? But, of course, Sontag understood that her lesbianism might limit her appeal in a homophobic culture - even on the extreme left, where she comfortably lived for decades. That was her prerogative. But that's no reason for the media to perpetuate untruths after her death. And it's certainly reason to review her own record in confronting injustice. Just as she once defended the persecution of gay people in Castro's Cuba, she ducked one of the burning civil rights struggles of her time at home. But she was on the left. So no one criticized. DE-GAYING SONTAG: Here's Daniel Okrent's defense of why the New York Times omitted the fact that Susan Sontag was a lesbian: Spurred by challenges and queries from several readers, I looked into the charge that The Times had willfully suppressed information about Susan Sontag's relationship with Annie Leibovitz. My inquiry indicates that the subject was in fact discussed before publication of the Sontag obituary, but that The Times could find no authoritative source who could confirm any details of a relationship. According to obituaries editor Chuck Strum, "It might have been helpful if The Times could have found a way to acknowledge the existence of a widespread impression that Susan Sontag and Annie Leibovitz were more than just casual friends. But absent any clarifying statements from either party over the years, and no such corroboration from people close to her, we felt it was impossible to write anything conclusive about their relationship and remain fair to both of them." Ms. Leibovitz would not discuss the subject with The Times, and Ms. Sontag's son, David Rieff, declined to confirm any details about the relationship. Some might say that such safely accurate phrases as "Ms. Sontag had a long relationship with Annie Leibovitz" would have sufficed, but I think anything like that would not only bear the unpleasant aroma of euphemism, but would also seem leering or coy. Additionally, irrespective of the details of this particular situation, it's fair to ask whether intimate information about the private lives of people who wish to keep those lives private is fair game for newspapers. I would personally hope not. The closet remains intact. Privacy? Sontag informed the world about her cancers and even an abortion. And her relationships with several women were not state secrets. Recall also that Sontag's career took off with her rightly celebrated essay on camp, an essay that she would had a hard time writing without intimate familiarity with gay life and culture. The golden rule here is to ask what the NYT would have done if Sontag had lived with a man for a couple of decades on and off, and had written essays on various aspects of sex, love and heterosexuality. Do you think they would have never mentioned her actual love life? Or if she had had serious relationships with a variety of male artists and thinkers, some of whom had influenced her work. Would this be regarded as an invasion of her privacy? The question answers itself. from the LA Times: Susan Sontag and a Case of Curious Silence By Patrick Moore, Patrick Moore is the author of "Beyond Shame: Reclaiming the Abandoned History of Radical Gay Sexuality" (Beacon Press, 2004). On Dec. 29, 2004, major gay and lesbian news organizations announced th
g_b The Queer Azadi March is ON!
The Queer Azadi March is ON! Date: Saturday, August 16th Route: From August Kranti Maidan (in between Kemps Corner and Grant Road Station) to Girgaum Chowpatty. Time: 2 pm to 4.30 pm. I haven't posted much on the Queer Azadi March before this, but this is because until as late as last night there were questions about whether there would be a march at all. Getting all the police permissions has been a real circus, a nine day long battle with the bureaucracy and one really homophobic senior cop who almost succeeded in stopping us. But just as bad things can have good consequences, this one did too, because when things really looked desperate, we started looking for help and found it with a number of influential people - politicians, journalists, even past senior police officers, who quietly pulled strings behind the scenes and finally ensured that we got our permission today. So its ON! We have had to make some changes, but the basic route has remained the one we wanted. We will start from August Kranti Maidan, where Mahatma Gandhi issued the call for the British to Quit India, and will march from there to Nana Chowk, turn left to Kennedy Bridge, down to Opera House, turn right over the railway tracks to Sukh Sagar and down to Chowpatty Beach where we will disperse. The change has been the timings. The police want to make sure that the march is over by 4.30 after which peak hour traffic starts, and in the civic interest we have agreed. So now the march will start after lunch this Saturday, August 16th. Everyone must assemble at August Kranti Maidan from 2 pm and the march is scheduled to start at 2.30. There will be a few speeches and then we will set out, walking in twos and as far as possible on the footpath (again, this is at the request of the traffic police), to arrive at Chowpatty just before our 4.30 pm deadline. This is going to be an orderly march, and we will do our best to walk peacefully and disrupting the area as little as possible. Media will be present at the march, and for those who this is an issue, we will be providing masks. But I'd urge you not to let this be an overriding concern for one simple reason - there are going to be many more than just queer people at the march. The one thing that has overwhelmed us is the amount of interest shown by straight people in marching with us. Some of them are celebs like Celina Jaitley, who gave a moving story in MidDay and TV yesterday of how she was going to march in memory of gay friend who committed suicide sometime back. But as important will be the very many other people - friends, families, human rights activists, just general supporters - who will also be marching. Like a call I just got from a cousin of my mother who knows I am gay, but has never really discussed it. She told me that her daughter who has just returned from studying in the US, where she clearly had many gay friends, is insisting on taking part in the march in solidarity with them, and she wanted her mother to come too. So her mother called me and asked me a few questions about the march and then decided she would come too with her daughter. There are many others who are coming like that and they will make this march really special. So please consider coming, and please consider bringing your family and friends too. See you on the 16th! Vikram
g_b LGBT Sandwich
I don't generally post my current TimeOut column online (buy the most queer friendly magazine in India!), but with so much discussion on labelling (on the GB list) I can't resist posting this, which just came out today. I will only add that the person who introduced the sandwich is a much loved member of the community here and he did it entirely knowingly. So if you can, order the sandwich! from TimeOut Mumbai: Queer I Consuming Communities Ally Gator I have got many reactions to the term `LGBT'. Confusion: "Is it a cellphone model?" (No, it stands for Lesbian Gay Bisexual Transgender, a more inclusive grouping than just `gay', and more neutral than queer, which many find stigmatizing). Derision: "All you activists are so full of jargon!" Disputation: "What about indigenous identities like hijras and kothis?" But this was the first time that the only possible reaction was Consumption. What else could you do with a Lettuce, Gouda cheese, Basil oil and Tomato sandwich? I encountered this concoction, which really is labelled `LGBT Sandwich', in Coffee Bean & Tea Leaf, a new café chain that has started in Delhi and Hyderabad and will soon open in Mumbai. Is it a coincidence or is the chain quietly signalling support of diversity? Whatever the reason, I can report that the LGBT Sandwich was quite good, though I wish they'd used something with a bit more taste than iceberg lettuce (peppery arugula would better suit many of the lesbians I know!) and the basil was barely detectable, another sad sign of how often bisexuals are marginalized. Still, the LGBT Sandwich was welcome because I've always wished for explicitly gay food. I think its because community identities so often seem bound up with their cuisines, like East Indian bottle masala or Parsi dhansak. But as the gay writer Edmund White once wrote "gays don't have a national cuisine unless its quiche." (He added that if we're butch we serve meat loaf and if we're lesbians we serve whole grains). Even if we don't have our own dishes though, food is hugely important to the LGBT community. Since most of us must start meeting others outside our homes, restaurants end up being backdrops to large parts of our lives. After fashion, the food business also seems to attract many community members I know of several Indian chefs abroad who are gay, and a notable lesbian one in India. At home too, with many of us living alone, cooking is a necessary skill and many become really good. Activist Ashok Row Kavi is famous for his fish dishes, but the most passionate cook I know is my lesbian friend Lesley who, when I was setting up my kitchen, firmly took me in hand and told me what to buy. And my boyfriend insists that few chicken curries can match the one made by our trans activist friend Gauri. No wonder that the regular cooking meets held by the Gaybombay group are always packed. But it still doesn't mean specifically gay food, which is why I got so excited with an idea for Kolkata's Gay Pride. What better way to celebrate in that sweets obsessed city with a special Rainbow Pride Mishti? With the reluctant help of a friend's mother we tried getting it made, but lack of time and permissible food colours came in the way. I'm still hoping to do it next year, but if it doesn't happen we could just serve LGBT Sandwiches! Ends
g_b from HT: Indrajit Hazra on the Law Ministry's unnatural attitude
On a personal level I find their attitude a bit silly and indicative of their own insecurities. Completely secure people don't need to justify themselves but then completely secure male journalists are a rare commodity! Hazra's column makes one appreciate all the more the few who can deal with homosexuality without discomfort, like Vir Sanghvi, Abijit Majumdar of HT and a few others. On an activist level though I think piece like these are just what we need at this time. First, they are reiterating the correct basic argument - the law has to change. Hazra's piece is particularly welcome since the Law Ministry statement REALLY needed answering for its sheer pig headed stupidity (Voices Against 377 did send a letter to HT, but it wasn't carried, so its all the more welcome that this column was). Second, I think such columns may connect with many people who are instinctively homophobic, though intellectually know they should not be. It would be nice if they changed their instinctive views, and perhaps as they get to know more queer people they will - we underestimate how many people are prejudiced simply because they don't know many queer people personally. So once the law changes hopefully more people will come out and in time such instinctive attitudes will change. But till then I can live with them in deference to the larger goal. What columns like the recent ones by Hazra, Nandy and Suraiya are saying is what the wider community needs to be told just now: that you might not be comfortable with homosexuality, just as we are not, but that is not an excuse for treating homosexuals as criminals. Vikram
g_b from HT: apro Queen!
HT also had a nice double page feature by Barney Henderson on how Freddie Mercury is remembered by his old school St Peter's at Panchgani. Apparently the school regularly gets Freddie fans turning up, but they're a bit embarassed about it all because of his flamboyance and homosexuality, which seems to have been pretty evident from early on: ""It was very obvious that Freddie was different from the other boys," Smith recalls. "He would run around calling everyone `darling' and he often got over-excited. At that time we didn't understand things like being gay. I once asked my mother why he was like that and she just told me that some people are different." What's good about the story is that it brings up the gay angle a lot, showing how it causes problems for a lot of silly people who should be proud about their association with the biggest Queen of all. HT, which was really milking the story (a low news weekend, maybe) ran several side stories (which I can't access, unfortunately since they have started charging for their archives) with reactions from people like a trustee of the Parsi Panchayat who said they could not accept Freddie because Zoroastrianism condemns homosexuality. All one can say to that is that Zoroastrianism might, but most Parsis don't! The community has always had a high level of tolerance which goes along with the feeling that those who really take their religion seriously are slightly bonkers, and going on the evidence of the Wapiz-wallas, or that creep Cyrus Mistry who mercifully has moved on from afflicting us in Bombay Times, who can say they are wrong? In tribute to all such right thinking Parsis, both queens and commoners, I'm reproducing a column I did for TimeOut ages back after Barney's piece: from HT: Panchgani's wild strawberry Barney Henderson http://www.hindustantimes.com/StoryPage/StoryPage.aspx?id=173cd9be- 1124-4e5f-9b58-50905da4e364 Freddie mercury lead singer of the group Queen learnt to play the piano and perform on the stage of St Peter's boarding school in Panchgani, Maharashtra. He also had his first homosexual relationship at the school, his teachers say. India has however turned its back on the man that many claim is its only truly global superstar. Very few people now think of Freddie Mercury as an Indian Parsi. Listed as one of the 100 Greatest Britons in a 2002 BBC poll, there is a statue of Freddie in Switzerland, and a huge figure of him has looked down on central London, to promote the hit Queen musical, We Will Rock You, since 2002. In India, all that remains is the burnt- out shell of a Moutrie piano. The beginnings Farrokh was born to Parsi parents Bomi and Jer Bulsara in Zanzibar. The family surname is derived from the town of Bulsar (also known as Valsad) in southern Gujarat. When he was seven, Farrokh moved to Mumbai where he stayed with an aunt and in February 1955, he was sent to St Peter's a boarding school in the English tradition, high in the foothills around Pune. There was an emphasis on etiquette at the school that remains, and cricket continues to be played in perfect, lily-white flannels. Farrokh, they say, was a quiet child who excelled at art and music. He was a good footballer and also boxed for the school, although his left hook wasn't up to much. Academically, his strengths were English and history. At 12, he was awarded a Junior All-Rounder trophy for all his achievements. Looking back at Farrokh The only teacher at the school who has any memory of the prodigy is Peter Patrao, the school's ecological curriculum advisor and former maths teacher. "He was a fairly nondescript boy with buckteeth," Patrao recalls. "The other boys called him `Buckie', which he hated and that was may be how he came up with the name Freddie, to beat the bullies. (Freddie's famous overbite was caused by the presence of four extra teeth that pushed his incisors out. He never had surgery on it for fear of it affecting his unique voice). Freddie formed his first band at the school with four other pupils and played concerts that were popular with the town's 3,000 inhabitants. "His band was called The Hectics, but everyone in the town knew them as The Heretics because they were so different and extreme for the time," said Patrao. The Hectics covered hits of Cliff Richard, Elvis Presley and Little Richard, as well as more traditional Indian classical music and choir music. Freddie later listed Lata Mangeshkar and Kishore Kumar as his early musical idols, and it is not hard to spot the Bollywood influences on Queen's high camp splendour and ceremony or the baroque flourishes in their music. Early gay days It was around this time that the young Freddie began to explore his sexuality, and in the all-male dormitories, it is likely that he had his first homosexual experiences. "Homosexuality exists in any school and it was certainly did in St Peter's at the time that Freddie was
g_b Mumbai- rental accomodation available
Hey, We have a place in Mumbai that we wish to rent out. Description: Its on worli Sea face - 2nd floor, overlooks the sea. 310 sq ft, has a kitchen, one room and separate bathroom and toilet. The building is part of the MHADA reconstruction, so its quite new. Has a lift and a good garbage collection system. The people around are friendly. The entrance to the building is not too great (as parts around the building are still under construction - no noise, just dirt!) and a few small shops make the car entry road look like a small colony. But the house itself faces the sea and is really airy and open. Its great for one person, though we were 2 people living there (very comfortably, may I add). We had a fully functional kitchen and cooked regularly and have a functional gas stove, cylinder connection that we can totally keep for the incoming person. Rent: 9000 per month (we dont care if u split with someone or wanna live alone). Electricity extra (typically 250 to 300 Rs per month). Water supply: 3 times a day (1 hour each). the bathroom has a tank that stores water for the entire day so its not a problem at all. We never have water or electricity cuts. Internet: We have a set 24 hour internet broadband connection line (unlimited). U can change the plan etc. and will save on setup costs. Any other questions are welcome. Please email back only on my email for more details or if you want to see the place. We are open to renting it out as soon as possible. Thanks. Vikram Add more friends to your messenger and enjoy! Go to http://messenger.yahoo.com/invite/
g_b why?
Dear Moderator, I sent out an email advertising a house up for rent and it hasnt shown up. Just wanna know if it was blocked, and if so ..why? Really wanna offer it to GB members first, before offering it to everyone coz i know the difficulties of searching for a house in Mumbai, esp new gay migrants (some of my friends' experiences).. If its against a rule, i'd like to know so i can channel it some other way. Thanks! Vikram --- it was posted yesterday moderator
g_b Jailbird T-shirts & GB fundraiser for Voices Against 377
I just posted a mail on GB about the very popular queer T-shirts that Jailbird is producing in Mumbai. The info might be of interest to others so am posting again here. The gurrrls behind Jailbird have put up a blog which has pix of the Ts and other stuff. Here's the link: http://jailbird-tshirts.blogspot.com/search/label/t-shirts There is stuff on the blog about ordering and emailing them, but they've just told me that that has run into problems so they're not doing it. The best way to contact them now, they say, is to go the Jailbird listing on Facebook and contact them from there. And, of course, if you're in Mumbai, you could just come to our GB Fundraiser Party for Voices Against 377 this Saturday and buy directly from them at their informal stall. Part of their proceeds always go back to the community, and this time, they tell, they will be giving the profits from sale of the Ban 377 Ts to the fund for Voices Against 377, so that's all the more reason for you to come and buy in bulk from them there! And please note everyone, even if you're not a regular party animal, its worth coming for this one to help in the fundraising. We will also be taking direct donations for Voices Against 377 - our professor friend A kindly kick-started that with a donation at the last GB meet - so if you really really don't want to or can't come, send your donation in with a friend who's going! Vikram
g_b Got a question for John Abraham? GB will get it to him!
Want to find out how John practiced being gay for Dostana? Want to ask if he got propositioned by gay guys in Miami? Want to find out exactly how tight those yellow briefs were? You can ask all these and more questions to John Abraham courtesy Gaybombay! A journalist friend has offered to take our questions and ask them to John Abraham. The results of this GB interview of John will be printed in Mid-Day this week. In all the publicity for Dostana John has turned out to be super gay friendly (just posing like he did on Filmfare's cover was pretty gay friendly!) and this is one more initiative. But we don't have much time. The questions have to be sent to him by tomorrow afternoon, so please mail them to me at [EMAIL PROTECTED] ASAP! Don't waste time, just think, what would you really like to ask John Abraham. (leaving aside fantasies and pornographic thoughts, of course!)? Vikram
g_b Dushmani Hatao! Dostana Bhadao!
Please note everyone that this protest against the abuse of sexual minorities in Bangalore is ON for this Thursday from 2-4 pm (press conference) and then 4-5.30 pm (demonstration). This issue is important because its a disturbing sign of what could happen as queer people become more visible. Bangalore has long been considered a really safe city for queer people, but it no longer seems to be so with this new police policy. What was shocking in this case was how the police not only arrested the hijras, but also the people who tried to come - legally and properly - to their rescue. And if you're telling yourself that this is bad, but doesn't really affect you, think again. This sort of crackdown always starts with the most vulnerable members, and then grows in confidence till it feels it can take on others because they won't dare fight back and that their protests can be ignored. From arresting hijras to raiding parties is not really such a big step. This is why its important to react by showing that we are not letting this incident get forgotten, and that we want this police brutality exposed. For this event we have been lucky enough to get Nepal's Sunil Pant, South Asia's first openly parliamentarian to come down, and if you haven't met Sunil its worth coming to this meeting to do so. Here's some more on him: http://www.nytimes.com/2008/09/20/world/asia/20pant.html The meeting and demonstration is open to all, gay or straight, so please try and come. Here's the information: Public Protest Against Abuse of Sexual Minorities! Dushmani Hatao! Dostana Bhadao! Queer Azaadi Mumbai invites you to a public protest and press conference on Thursday 13th October at 2.00 pm at the Mumbai Marathi Patrakar Sangh against brutalities recently committed on hijras and activists by the Bangalore police. On 20th October, the police arrested and tortured 5 hijras and over 30 activists who came to their defence. At a time when Home Minister Shivraj Patil says that Section 377 is not a problem and when Bollywood is showing us happy pictures of gay life abroad, we want to expose the tragic reality of life for sexual minorities in India. To help us address this Sunil Pant, South Asia's first openly gay Parliamentarian from Nepal and also a member of its Constituent Assembly will be speaking at the meeting. The new Nepali Constitution that is now being written includes committees working on same sex marriage rights and protection of sexual minorities. He will tell us how Nepal has succeeding in accepting queer rights in a way that India has not. He'll be joined by Sumathi Murthi, one of the victims of the police campaign against hijras in Bangalore, Gauri Shankar, a transgender activist from Mumbai and other speakers for queer issues and against police brutality. There will be a press conference from 2-4 pm, followed by a demonstration at Azad Maidan from 4-5.30pm. The theme of the meeting is Dushmani Hatao, Dostana Badhao! This is NOT a protest against the film Dostana. But we just want to point out the other reality of gay life in India as well. It is time to end the hatred and accept sexual minorities.
g_b I loved Dostana - here's why
garters...) 6. Homosexuality is shown as bad: The evidence here is the Maa ka ladla song, or the reactions of Neha's aunt or even the repugnance of the guys themselves to acting gay. But consider this, the one entirely modern, sane, sympathetic character in the film is Neha and she clearly has no problem with homosexuality at all. Those who do are either silly (Auntie) or hidebound by traditional (Sameer's Mother) or macho manipulative dolts (the guys themselves). And all of them more or less learn better whether its Auntie's acceptance for reasons of convenience, or the Mother's acceptance for reasons of love (and that WAS affecting) or the guys acceptance for reasons of... discovering that two men can find some love for each other, as Kunal admits to Sameer when he thanks him when they finally get their residency papers (no surprises then that its Kunal who actually does the kiss). You might leave the film thinking that gays are funny, but you would have to be a real idiot to leave feeling that gays are bad and should be treated as criminals. As against these negatives, let me also suggest why, in some ways, the film is really quite subversive: 1. The obvious one is in the actual imagery. True, we rarely see the guys snuggling up in bed, but they dance, Kunal kicks the rice pot like a bride, there's the kiss, and did we just have the first suggestions of anal and oral sex in Bollywood? Its easy to dismiss the power of such images, but just presenting them presents the possibility that they may happen in real life. 2. Sameer's suggestions of gay angles to Bollywood classics. Yes, it's a bit odd he suggests Gabbar rather than Jay or Viru in Sholay (but let's get real, we're talking Amitabh's son delivering these lines). But Munna and Circuit is bang on (has there been anything more bromantic in Bollywood recently than their reconciliation on that pier in Lage Raho Munnabhai?), and the thing is, these are the ways people in the gay community have seen things, but here its being brought out in the open, in a mass market Bollywood film. It can seem disconcerting, but is also rather exhilarating in a way, it's just like coming out feels! It's not like talking about Queering Bollywood just in academic circles, but here Bollywood is doing it itself! 3. You can make a family of your friends. And this is the real subversion in Dostana. After all those endless Bollywood films promoting family values above all, here comes a film that gently suggests that friends can be family too. Which is what the queer community has always said, and here is a Bollywood film saying it for us. And even though Neha gets married in the end, the last shot shows that the family endures in ways even they may not imagine. Finally, just two thoughts. Going back over the negative gay reactions to the film I began wondering if there isn't some double standard here. God knows we've all endured so many lame ass gay films, documentaries, stories, all replete with stereotypes and we've said well, you know its good, its community, etc etc. But here comes a big budget mainstream film, that will reach thousands more than any gay production can, which is made to production standards way above any gay production can, and which indulges in only a fraction of some of the crap that some gay films have put us through. And we start throwing up on it? What gives? Isn't it just a bit silly and insecure, like when someone does something much better than we could have done it, and all we can point out is the flaws? Second, in the LA Times article by Anupama Chopra before the launch of the film she quoted me saying that Karan Johar was a class act, and I am so glad I did because the film confirms that. I don't want to minimise Tarun Mansukhani's role in it, since he's clearly responsible for the slick production and the pace and the skill with which its all handled. And yet I rather doubt if anything like this would have been achieved if Karan (who I don't know at all, in case anyone is wondering why I'm doing a puff for him here) wasn't the producer. The way the film has been done, bringing up homosexuality in a really up front and risque way, yet so smartly packaged that it got a 'U' rating is all typical of how Karan pulls off things. Which is why I don't understand all those questions one keeps getting about why he doesn't come out. Why does he need to? He's never denied anything and never shied away from gay themes - he could have just gone into the Bollywood closet so many are in and not touched gay themes, or edited out all the gay jokes in his TV show. But he didn't. He left them in, but made sure they were presented in as smooth a way as possible, yet without compromising on their essential subversion. Its an incredibly skilful job, all the more for being done on something he knows will affect people's views of him, and in doing so he is helping the gay rights movement in India in amazing ways. I suppose we could have sent Karan a 'Ban 377' t-shirt, but I doubt he'd wear it unless we could get it done by Prada! Well, too bad about that, but I think our thanks must still definitely go out to him, Vikram
g_b Trying to Grow reprinted
Long long ago, in a galaxy far away, when the GB list was just starting, I posted a mail recommending Firdaus Kanga's Trying to Grow, one of the first Indian novels I'd read with an uninhibited and unapologetic portrayal of a gay protagonist. The book was out of print then and was not reprinted, partly because Firdaus himself has gone off to the UK and seemed to have no interest in pushing it. "Oh, god I'll have to go looking for all those papers!" he said, when I pushed him on this during one of his infrequent visits to Bombay. Well, I don't know if he found those papers or not, but the novel has finally been reprinted thanks to Penguin taking over the backlist of his publisher Ravi Dayal (which they did about five years ago, so please don't think I'm attributing great efficiency to Penguin). But anyway its out again and as charming and fun as ever, so go out and buy it! Here's my original mail from January 1999: Guys- writing that mega-spiel abut the McD meeting reminded me about one thing. One of the things we had spoken about at the meeting was gay related books, and I was surprised because most of the guys said they hadn't read Firdaus Kanga's Trying To Grow. So Umang suggested I post a message recommending it and I'm finally doing that now. I can't recommend it highly enough. It a wonderful book! You may know the outlines - its about this Parsi boy with a bone disease that leaveshis severely crippled, and about his life growing up in Bombay in the Seventies and Eighties. This may sound depressing, but its anything but. The book is full of life and humour and happiness. The hero, Brit (short for brittle)'s family is as lively and funny and crazy as most families - dare I say, with affection, most Parsi families are in real life - and the book is thoroughly charming and easy to read. Where its interesting for us is Brit's sexuality. He's gay, at least initially and real quite cool about it. He has this crush on his very handsome neighbour Cyrus and spends a lot of time shagging off thinking of him. Unfortunately, at some point, Brit decides he's not gay and I don't think its a coincidence that the book loses a lot of its life at that point. Its like having created this immensely believable character and his problems, his sexuality is just one problem too many for the writer to deal with. So Brit becomes straight and falls in love with Amy who is easily the most boring and one dimensional character in the book. It ends on a sort of flat note, though that doesn't really distract from the good feeling that reading the book leaves you with. Firdaus Kanga, the writer is also severely handicapped and the book is pretty obviously autobiographical. And as Kanga's second book, a rather disappointing travelogue called Heaven On Wheels makes clear, he's openly gay. I think he now lives in the UK and he's just finished the film version of the book which is called Seventh Heaven. If Kanga ever reads this, I would like to thank him because the book affected me a lot. For the first time I was reading about a gay character in a setting quite close to my own and while sure he had problems, he wasn't despairing and suicidal. And I hope Kanga won't be offended if I say that that shook me - if he, with his severe disbility had no problems being openly gay, then I, with no problems as bad as that, had simply no excuse for being in the closet. I think Trying To Grow was one of the biggest influences on my decision to come out of the closet, and I really hope you guys who haven't read it will - even if not to come out of the closet, but just for its liveliness and charm. The book is published by Ravi Dayal and I think is temporarily out of print, though bookshops may have copies. Try Bookpoint in Ballard Estate, they're often good for out of print books. Vikram
g_b Special Gaybombay Meeting on Safer Sex and Living with HIV
Special Gaybombay Meeting on Safer Sex and Living with HIV DNA recently ran this report on on the latest figures from the National AIDS Control Organisation's HIV tracking studies: http://www.dnaindia.com/report.asp?newsid=1209233 As the report noted there's some good news, because rates of infection have been falling in some geographical areas, and also in some communities like female sex workers and from women who are tested at ante-natal clinics. And the bad news? Rates are definitely rising among intravenous drug users and men who have sex with men. This is no surprise to us at GB. From anecdotal evidence, and actual cases that we're getting to know of, rates of infection in the gay community in Mumbai are definitely on the rise. What's really alarming though is not just that more guys are testing positive, but that we're hearing remarks like "if you sleep with guys from south Mumbai you're less likely to get HIV than from someone in the suburbs." This was really reported to us. What is disturbing in that remark is not the stupidity of south- mumbai vs, suburbs prejudice, but just the absolute stupidity from a gay man who should have some basics of HIV clear. Which is that it doesn't respect classes and communities, that there's no way of telling who has it and who doesn't and that if you don't practice safer sex you'll very likely get - like does anyone want to bet that the guy who made that remark either has HIV or soon will? And here's another disturbing trend. We are seeing more deaths. This should not be happening. These are not deaths from people who have had HIV for years and have been through all the treatment regimens and have exhausted all the drugs (an increasingly rare case). These are deaths of guys who were positive just for a couple of years and who didn't even go on drugs. In some cases they chose not to. Or they went on them too late. Or were detected too late. We don't know. All we know is that neither the infections nor the deaths should be happening at a time when information on both safer sex and living with HIV (with reasonably cheap access to drugs) are increasingly available. Yes, the fact that being gay is still technically illegal puts off guys from actively looking for information - yet it is there if we need to look for it, and we definitely do. So to help us get better informed on both how to have safer sex and how to live with HIV we're organising a special meeting this Sunday, 30th November at Zouk (Hotel Imperial Palace) in Andheri West, near Andheri Railway Station. I'll ask the moderator to put this mail out again with full details of how to get there, but for now please note the meeting is ON, from 4-7 pm. And there is absolutely no cost for attending. For those who are put off at the idea of being lectured to, believe me it won't be that way. We'll be having a very informal interactive talk from our regular member Zoraster on safer sex (OK, maybe not that interactive...!). We're also hoping to have a few guys who'll tell us in very ordinary terms what it means to live with HIV. The whole discussion will be kept open for anyone to say anything relevant, whether its experiences, suggestions, appeals, information. And finally, if you've read this mail and thought to yourself, well this doesn't apply to me, please go back and read that DNA report. We all think HIV doesn't apply to us, that we and our friends and partners are just too smart to do the unsafe sex thing and aren't at risk. A lot of guys feel that and they're now positive. You never know when you might need information on HIV, for your friends, for your partner, for yourself. So get to know about it now. If anyone has any concerns or queries on this meeting, please mail me at [EMAIL PROTECTED] Specifically, if you are positive and are worried about being outed about your status at this meeting, please be assured that NO ONE will be asked about their status whether positive or negative. A few people might volunteer personal information, but NO ONE will be forced to reveal anything. Vikram
g_b three new stories
The media wave of queer coverage continues, some Dostana related, some not, some good, some crap. Aditya and others have posted some of the main links, but here are a few more: For a business newspaper Mint's coverage of queer issues is really excellent. Here's a link to Namita Bhandare's column on Dostana: http://www.livemint.com/2008/11/25005212/Gay-rights-movement-gets-a- 8.html Then here, in full, is Shanta Gokhale's column from today's Mumbai Mirror on a performance of the late Chetan Datar's Ek Madhavbagh. I wish I'd known about this. I've only read this very moving one actor play, and I would have liked to see it: from Mumbai Mirror: Queer's no reason to fear People should understand that the compulsions of heterosexuality are just as natural, powerful and unalterable as those experienced by homosexuals By Shanta Gokhale So mamma, this is the way I am," confesses the woman's favourite son. She is horrified. "There are fair-skinned people, fat people, people with ugly bodies, people with amazing brain power, and there are people like me. It's an act of nature. This is your son a man whose emotional-sexual preference is a little different from that of others." The confession comes halfway through Chetan Datar's one-actor play, 1, Madhav Baug, staged last week at Awishkar's theatre space in Mahim. The youth has already described to his mother the painful but vain attempts he has made to `improve'. Finally, in an epiphanic moment, when he is alone with God, the truth is revealed to him: "Why should I need to reform myself? The power that is responsible for my DNA and genes, is also responsible for my life. There must be some design, some unknown purpose in making me what I am." Suddenly he is free to be different. This brings to mind an evocative passage from Amitav Ghosh's The Glass Palace. Matthew, the plantation owner, is conducting Uma through his rubber plantation. She is amazed to see that every tree here is exactly like its neighbour, in height, structure and yield. Her host explains that they are all clones. "We pay a lot of money to make sure we get reliable clonal seed. But look at this tree," he says, leading her to the only tree that refused to yield a single drop of sap. Dismissing the elaborate explanations of botanists, geologists and soil experts for the phenomenon, he says, simply, that the tree `is fighting back'. Here's a hard-nosed businessman for whom it would make perfect sense to axe down the unproductive tree. But he lets it stay, accepting the difference. The mother in 1, Madhav Baug cannot accept it. Why was such a son born to me, she cries. She is filled with revulsion and fear, like our law-makers who are afraid that if homosexuality is legitimised, it will spread and `corrupt' society. What a strange thought! Is this an infection? Why then, with the advances medicine has made, are there no cures for it? Is it an addiction that can tempt innocents so that, before you know what, everyone is doing it like everyone is smoking, doing drugs or chewing gutkha? Why can't we believe that the compulsions of heterosexuality are just as natural, powerful and unalterable as homosexuality? The mother in 1, Madhav Baug, does not see it this way, rejects her son and drives him to suicide. But that's not how Chetan Datar ends his play. He casts it in an ingenuous form that allows a second ending. The actress (Rama Joshi) clarifies before she begins her reading that the writer of the play is amongst us and is fully responsible for what transpires in it; also that this is not her story, though there are similarities. As a professional actress, she gives a powerful performance as the shocked, anguished mother. But when the play ends, her anger against the writer explodes. She tears up and flings away the script as the work of a `homophobe'. "How dare you kill off a young man with one stroke of the pen??" she demands. "Who do you think you are? God?" With that she tells us how her story has ended. When her son told her of his sexual preference, she hugged him first. Then said, "Whatever you are, you are mine and that's the way I love you." She then assures us that even without the support she gave her son, he would still not have killed himself. The actress-mother now prepares to leave. "The journey ahead is long," she tells us. "Getting there isn't easy. There are potholes, blockages, bottlenecks and bad weather. One has to think of these things. But finally, the important thing is to get there, isn't it?" ends And finally from Outlook, a positive, but really very silly story on how gay men are straight women's best friends. I'm usually all for trivial stories like this (along with the serious ones), but this one seems to reduce gay men to the latest fashion accessory. Poor marks to Outlook whose queer coverage has not been up to the mark - even India Today has done better with Shohini Ghosh's long piece:
g_b hoping
It seems futile to post on anything at this moment, but I hope everyone on this list and their friends and family are safe? I'm hearing of a number of people who had near misses, but so far, touch wood, no casualties. I hope this doesn't change as the names of the victims start being released. Vikram
g_b Whistling in the Dark: 21 Queer Interviews
Here's a new queer book by R.Raj Rao and Dibyajyoti Sharma. It's just released by Sage and sounds interesting and topical, given the greatly increased general interest in queer issues. I haven't seen it yet, though should be getting a review copy soon: WHISTLING IN THE DARK Twenty-one Queer Interviews edited by: R RAJ RAO University of Pune DIBYAJYOTI SARMA Times of India, Pune Published : December 2008 Pages : 300 Imprint : SAGE India Whistling in the Dark: Twenty-one Queer Interviews focuses on issues like sexuality, sexual identity, marriage, gay marriage, heteronormativity, gay utopia, gay activism, gay bashing, police atrocities and the laws vis-à-vis these. The interviewees represent a cross section of society ranging from university professors, gay rights activists and students, on the one hand, to working class men such as office boys, auto-rickshaw drivers and even undertrials who have served prison sentences, on the other. The thought-provoking narratives in this book are the outcome of probing and incisive questions put to the respondents by the editors R. Raj Rao and Dibyajyoti Sarma. Appealing to a wide readership, the narratives go beyond the conventional and provide a rare insight into the private lives of the respondents. Besides being a must read for gay activists and organisations, the book will also be a useful resource for post-graduate students and academics working in the fields of sexuality studies, feminism and alternative literature. THE CONTRIBUTORS: Hoshang Merchant / Sushil Patil / Manish Pawar / Kama Maureemootoo / Christopher Benninger and Ram Naidu / Satish Ranadive / Mahohar Shitole / Thomas Waugh / Narendra Binner / Arman Pasha / Aslam Shaikh / Ana Garcia-Arroyo / Avinash Gaitonde / Ankit Gupta / Ganesh Holay / Raja Chandraratne / Darius Ankleshwaria / Dilip Sheth / Shivji Panikkar / Mohammad Soltani / Bindumadhav Khire To order this book in North and South America visit www.sagepub.com and in UK, Europe, Africa and the Middle East visit www.sagepub.co.uk
g_b New Yorker profile of Barney Frank
The New Yorker has this profile of Barney Frank, the openly gay US congressman who's become one of the most powerful people in the effort to rescue the US financial system. I'd mentioned him in a recent column which I may not have posted on these lists, so I'm pasting it after: http://www.newyorker.com/reporting/2009/01/12/090112fa_fact_toobin Queer I The Frank Rule Ally Gator, Mumbai, 21/10/2008 Anyone who's been watching TV about the global financial crisis and it you haven't you either have no money or too much has probably seen Barney Frank, the US congressman who as chairman of the Financial Services Committee of the House of Representatives was at the centre of the dramatic votes on the all-important $700 billion bail-out package. Frank's grey haired, plump-jowled presence was a TV constant, excoriating Republicans, and whipping fellow Democrats into line. But Frank is of interest for more than just bail-outs. He's one of the few openly gay members of the US Congress, having come out in 1987 and even survived a scandal over a male prostitute in 1990, to become such a popular politician that Republicans rarely even bother contesting his seat. He's campaigned for gay and lesbian rights in many ways, but what I find particularly interesting is his formulation of what's called the Frank Rule. This deals with the controversial practice of `outing', publicly revealing the homosexuality of someone who would much rather keep it in the closet. Gay activists made much use of this, particularly during the AIDS crisis in the late `80s, to name and shame influential gay people who could have done more to help. Which was understandable, yet outing remains controversial for many gay people, not least because we've all felt the acute sense of vulnerability when our sexuality suddenly gets revealed. We often talk about wanting to out so and so film director or businessman, but the memories of those vulnerable moments (and practical issues of proof) hold us back. Frank's Rule offers a balanced view. He said: "I think there's a right to privacy. But that right to privacy should not be a right to hypocrisy. And people who want to demonize other people shouldn't then be able to go home and close the door and do it themselves." That makes sense in the US where there are many who demonize homosexuality, but in India where attitudes tend to range between benign ignorance or lukewarm tolerance there's obviously less call for outing. I have to say though I wonder about some of our opponents in the legal battle to decriminalise homosexuality. The relish with which their lawyers talk about kinky sex practices in San Francisco makes one wonder if someone wasn't getting turned on while researching their case. Acute homophobia is often rooted in repressed homosexuality like with Senator Larry Craig, who lead the fight to have Frank suspended after his male escort scandal, but who was recently caught propositioning an undercover cop in a toilet! Most Indian cases for outing would be far less lurid than that. The tricky cases, I think, would involve gay men marrying to women without telling them about their gay lives. Such men aren't directly harming the gay community (unless they pretend to be ex-gays, who denounce homosexuality), but there's harm done against the women, and usually plenty of hypocrisy too. You just need read the magazine interview that a prominent Delhi industrialist's son gave, going all mushy about matrimony, to feel he had it coming when his Mumbai socialite fiancée later dumped him for being gay. An Asian Age article suggests that more putative brides are checking this by getting detective agencies to check out the sexuality of prospective grooms. The agencies apparently do this by sending attractive women to `honeytrap' the men, but if aim is to find gay men shouldn't they should be sending out attractive men? Gay groups could even offer vetting services, which would certainly be fun, if perhaps not quite sanctioned under the Frank Rule! ends
g_b Dinesh Gupta in Mumbai Mirror
A moving piece from today's Mumbai Mirror about Dinesh Gupta who has suffered from birth from osteogenesis imperfecta, a crippling disease (and the same I think that Firdaus Kanga suffered from, and wrote about in Trying To Grow). With a lot of courage, and the help of counselling from Humsafar, Gupta has come to terms both with his disability and the fact that he is gay and wants to be open about it. This is particularly important since I think there is a real reluctance in the disability rights community to dealing with sexuality. Some of this is possibly die to homophobia but, I think it also comes from the tragic knowledge that many disabled people are vulnerable to sexual abuse, so any talk of sex tends to raise red flags. Also, from a practical point of view, disabled people generally need to take the feelings of their caregivers into account. Yet while these concerns are justified, they can also run the risk of infantilising many disabled people and prevent them from dealing with their sexuality. This is why its so important for people like Kanga and Gupta to speak out. I've spoken a couple of times to Gupta and he seems like a really brave and determined guy. Kudos to him for doing this: http://www.mumbaimirror.com/article/9/2009010720090107020606793d7b7aa1 9/The-unbreakable The unbreakable A genetic disorder had Dinesh Gupta nursing 14 fractures by the time he was 13. He recounts his battle against the brittle bone disorder and coming to terms with his sexual orientation By Lekha Menon Posted On Wednesday, January 07, 2009 at 02:06:06 AM At the age of 35, I went to school! And it was at that `ripe' age that I experienced the thrill of attending classes, making friends, going to the cafeteria and doing assignments - things that are a part of `regular, daily' life for most people. But my life has been anything but `regular'. I was born with Osteogenesis Imperfecta (OI), or brittle bone disease, a disorder characterised by bones that break easily, often from little or no apparent cause. As a two-month-old baby I suffered the first fracture when I merely crossed my legs. Four months later, I sustained another one. Between two and eight, I had many fractures - sometimes when I walked, at other times, when I simply turned in my bed! But these would heal in a few days. The severity of the disease struck only when I suffered a severe, extremely painful fracture to my femur (thigh bone) during a trip to Ludhiana. At eight, I was disabled for life - unable to stand or walk. By the time I turned 13, I had suffered 14 fractures on various parts below the waist (my upper body was thankfully intact). But it left me and my family completely disillusioned. I stopped schooling and was forced to complete my studies from home. OI is a genetic disorder. I inherited it from my mom, a diabetes patient, who suffered a severe fracture at 40. One of my sisters and niece also suffer from OI, but they are mild cases. Since I was born a few years after my mother's attack, I was severely afflicted. My last fracture was at 13; it happened while I was sleeping! Apart from the excruciating pain, the worse part about OI is not knowing when you will suffer the next fracture. At times, it can strike the same body part. Thankfully, my bones stopped breaking after 13. But I was going through another turmoil in my mind. The turning point After I attained puberty, I realised that I was attracted to men. Puberty, in many ways, was a blessing for me, for it not only stopped my fractures, but also aided my sexual development. Though I had not realised the implications of being gay, I confessed my feelings to my sister who supported and counselled me. Being practically bed-ridden, my social life was negligible so I never really understood the situation in its correct perspective, until years later. Meanwhile, my struggle and the urge to lead a normal life continued. Despite the odds, I managed to score distinction in the SSC and completed my graduation as well. After my SSC, I decided to get operated to enable me to walk again. The surgery at Hinduja hospital improved my mobility to a great extent. Within a year and a half, I started walking slowly, albeit with the help of a walker. It was an amazing feeling - I was actually walking after a gap of nine years! However, it was only after I turned 25, that I started walking around my society premises (with a walker). The sense of freedom it gave me was indescribable. I slowly started going out for movies, to the beach and the ISKON temple, saw the setting sun and other sights of nature. During this time I also discovered my sexuality. I had a few relationships which gave me the confidence to confront my sexual orientation head on. I approached the Humsafar Trust, and the counselling and interaction changed my perspective towards life. After my mother's demise a couple of years ago, I decided to come out o
g_b planning for 377 decision
y and draw up this list soon. It would be nice also to get family members and straight supporters. And as we learned at the March, celebrities get out the press like nothing else. The impression we could try to convey, if we win, is that this isn't just a victory for just one part of society, but a step towards freedom for all - so it should be even harder for the government to go on appeal against the decision in the Supreme Court. That's the rough plan. Any other thoughts or suggestions? The more we can do the better, but remember we will probably have only a night to prepare. Vikram
g_b Interview with Justice Edwin Cameron of the Constitutional Court of South Africa
Aditya recently posted the very welcome news that Edwin Cameron has just been named to join the Constitutional Court in South Africa. Cameron will be the first openly gay and openly HIV+ve judge to be named to the Court - and to a supreme court anywhere since Michael Kirby, whose retirement from the Australian High Court also recently made the news, was not out when he joined the court. As I posted at that time, we in India owe a big debt to Kirby and Cameron who did a series of very important programmes with Indian lawyers and judges some years back, , organised by Lawyer's Collective, where they came here and spoke very openly and frankly on issues of human rights, HIV, sexuality and other issues. I had earlier posted an interview I'd done at that time with Kirby. I just remembered I also did one with Cameron, so here it is. It was done around 5 years back and somethings have changed since then - like Thabo Mbeki happily no longer in the SA Presidency spreading his bizarre and destructive theories on HIV. At that time Cameron had, I think, just finished a temporary stint on the Constitutional Court, but thanks to Mbeki's views on HIV, he was not confirmed there and went back to lower Court of Appeal. Now with Mbeki gone Cameron has been confirmed on the Constitutional Court, which is excellent news even for us in India, for it ensures that there is a very well respected legal authority out there, who knows India, and who can be guaranteed to carry on Kirby's advocacy of human rights for all. Interview with Justice Edwin Cameron of the Constitutional Court of South Africa Vikram: Is this the first time you're coming to India? Cameron: No, I was here about a year ago to conduct a similar programme. That was just for judges, of the High Courts, District Courts and Sessions Courts. Michael of course is much more familiar with India. He's spent quite a long time driving through the country in the past. Vikram: What's the level of awareness you've found among the legal community in India regarding AIDS issues? Cameron: Not very high. There are of course a few people who are involved and aware of the issues. But there's a noticeably lower level of information among non-specialists in the legal community. Vikram: So what have you done on this current trip? Cameron: We have been subjected to cruel and unusual punishment! We have been slave driven by Mandeep and Anand! We've spent five days in four different cities and addressed seven public meetings. In all these meetings we've been talking about the urgency of the AIDS problem and how the legal community needs to become aware of it. And we have been emphasising the importance of a non-discriminatory response to the issue since discrimination will just drive the problem underground and make it harder to deal with. Vikram: What sort of response have you got? Cameron: Very positive. People have really responded very well at the meetings. Mandeep: The Chief Justice of the Delhi High Court even suggested that they return for a national level workshop for judges from across the country. I think that's tremendous progress. Vikram: How did you get involved with this programme? Cameron: Mandeep and Anand had heard me speak in Greece on this subject, and they approached me there and asked me if I'd be interested in speaking with Michael on this subject in India. And of course I said yes. I was really keen on doing this because I can see so many parallels between the situation in India and South Africa. As I said in my speech we have the historical links with Mahatma Gandhi and both countries have been though similar freedom struggles They are both large third world countries facing issues of poverty and equality. Both are tremendously vulnerable to the threat of AIDS. And in both countries there is a commitment to justice under law through a constitution. There are differences of course. For one, our democracy is a much younget one. And in South Africa at the moment we are facing a crime wave which is threatening the existing legal system. But there are many parallels between the two countries. Vikram: In your speech you mentioned your regret that one thing President Mandela did not do was take leadership of the AIDS issue. Why do you think that happened? Cameron: Its true. I've gone on record saying this. President Mandela did not show the sort of commitment to the AIDS that I wish he had. I do not for a moment underestimate what he did for the country. President Mandela saved our country. Partly he did this by developing a huge rapport with the young people of the country. And that is the tragedy - he could have used that rapport to do so much on the AIDS issue. I suppose he just felt it was not important enough or he didn't have the time for it. He's an old man, a proud and stubborn man, an
g_b Gaybombay's Kite Flying Event on Sunday 18th Jan
Gaybombay is happy to announce what is always one of our most popular events - GB's Rainbow Kite Flying! On Sunday 18th January at Juhu Beach, from 3 pm till sundown. We'll supply the beautiful rainbow kites, you come and get them up! This is always the first big event we have to kick off the year, and it is always a blast. Its one event that always gets lots of guys - and we're particularly happy that this is one event that gets a lot of the girls too (we're less happy about the fact that they always fly their kites better than we do, and cut ours too - but lets see if they do that this year!) It has something to do with the weather, which is always nice now, and also to do with being out in the open - most of our events always happen indoors and in private, so there's something so liberating about being in the open among all the friends and families on Juhu Beach, just another bunch of friends and family which is just the way it should be. It also has to do with the fact that there's no agenda other than having fun. Yes, the kites are a queer pride statement, but really no one gets it or cares (its always cool to see some foreigners doing a double take when they see it and realise it really is the gay rainbow flag). All that matters is that the kites are beautiful (we always have people wanting to buy them) and eye catching and that its WONDERFUL seeing them go up. We're hoping the kites will be really good this year. The last couple of years we've been getting the kites from Gujarat, which has been cost effective, but perhaps not the best quality - well, that at least is what the kitemaker in Dongri we went to this year told us. He's promised us that the kites this year will be really good and will really fly, so lets hope they do! So it all promises to be another great event, so make sure you don't miss. Just come to Juhu and help us go fly a kite! More details and explanation: Place & Time: Juhu beach. We'll meet near the Shivaji Statue outside the Palm Beach Hotel. This year we are going to try to start from 3.00 pm, which is early, but we need to because sundown is by 6.30 and if we start, as we always do, by 4.30-5.00 it doesn't give us much time to fly. So we'll assemble at the statue from 3.00-3.30 and after that just come down to the beach and look for rainbow kites! What to bring: There's no cost for this event. We are getting 100 beautiful rainbow kites, and perhaps a few other pink kites. You are welcome to bring your own kites, but please try and stick to the queer colour schemes (rainbow or plain pink). We will get some manja firkis (spools of kite flying thread), but please also bring your own since the more we have, the more kites we can get up. We'll also be getting some yuppy snacks, with special emphasis on appropriate winter dishes like til ladus, undhiu puri and other snacks, so you won't go home hungry! For those who want background explanation on the kite flying: Its January and in Gujarat and Maharashtra that means just one thing: its time to start flying kites again! At this time of the year the breezes are strong and the weather is pleasant enough for people to spend all day flying kites from their rooftops. Go to Bhuleshwar, one of the older districts in Bombay on Sunday, and you'll find the streets full of kite shops below and the skies full of kites overhead. In particular people fly kites on Makar Sankranti in Maharashtra and Utraan in Gujarat. This year Makar Sankranti falls on the 14th of January and as always GB will do its kite flying on a close Sunday, this time the Sunday after, on the 18th of Jan (not the 17th, as has mistakenly been printed in TimeOut Mumbai). We do this every year and it is great fun. Here's a report on a past kite flying: http://www.gaybombay.org/event/rep0011.html After reading it we're sure you'll want to come, so see you there! Vikram
g_b Operation Flood launches! (+ a Milk Memoir)
Operation Flood launches! (+ a Milk Memoir) We've had an excellent response to Operation Flood. It seems to have caught on as a viral campaign, because just hours after I send out the first mail, I was getting it back from people I hadn't sent it to! After pink chaddis, it looks like some pink power can be shown here. Actually, what I feel really good about is that a lot of the enthusiasm seems to be coming from my straight friends. I expected the queer community would watch (those that hadn't already seen it on pirated DVDs), but its good to see such enthusiasm from straight supporters. So now just in case any closeted guys were worried about being seen as gay if you went to see Milk, don't worry because so many straight people are going too! GB is planning to meet this Friday at Metro in town at 8.10 pm, on Saturday at Glamour in Bandra at 10.30 pm (these will be slightly cheaper tickets) and on Sunday at 2.55 at R.Mall in Mulund. We aren't booking in advance, since tickets won't be a problem, so if you're coming for these shows just book yourself or land up and buy and look out for us! If you can't make it for these shows I'm putting the list of shows and timings down here. These details have been got directly from the distributor so are more accurate than the ad that's coming in the papers. Please do try and make it for one (or more!) and take along friends and family. And as a final inducement, I'm pasting my latest TimeOut column which offers a glimpse of the time and place the film is set in by Sri Lankan activist Rosanna Flamer-Caldera. She is well known to us as a leader of the queer rights movement in Asia, but many don't know that was a young dyke just coming out in the San Francisco of Harvey Milk: Milk in Mumbai (all shows pm unless stated) Andheri: Fame Adlabs - 3.20 Fun Republic - 8.20 Bandra: Gem - 1.45 Glamour - 11.30 am, 10.30 Downtown: INOX Nariman Point - 3.15, 11.10 Metro - 12.20, 8.20 Sterling - 11.30 am, 2.30, 7.15 Goregaon: PVR Goregaon - 11.20 am, 1.10, 6.00, 11.10 Kanjurmarg: Huma Adlabs - 5.35 Lower Parel: PVR Phoenix Mills - 10.35 am, 3.40, 8.45, 10.55 Mulund PVR Mulund - 1.10, 6.00, 11.00 R.Mall Adlabs - 2.55 Versova: Cinemax - 10.00 am, 5.30 pm Wadala: IMAX Wadala - 8.20 from TimeOut Mumbai: Queer I Harvey Milk (unedited version) Ally Gator There is a famous photo of Harvey Milk sitting exultant on the back of a car. It was in the middle of the Gay Freedom Day Parade in 1978 when 375,000 people came together for San Francisco's biggest gathering of the decade. It was also the largest queer rights march anywhere in the world till then, and Milk was its motivating force. I haven't yet seen Milk, the Oscar nominated film, but this must be one of its high points. My friend Rosanna Flamer-Caldera was actually there in 1978 at the parade and remembers it as one of the most amazing moments of her life. "I just stood and watched with my mouth open," she says. As a young lesbian who had just come from Sri Lanka, she had never imagined something like this was possible. San Francisco at that time was a beacon for queer people from across the USA, and some from abroad too. Rosanna had gone to San Francisco because she had family there, not for its queer scene, but it certainly helped though when an understanding cousin took her to Maud's, a legendary lesbian bar. "I stepped inside and it was like coming home," she remembers. Rosanna doesn't remember meeting other South Asian queer people there at that time. "I used to hang out with these Filipina lesbians because that was as close as I could get," she says. It's been noted that Milk has relatively few lesbians, but Rosanna remembers that as how it was. "The lesbian scene was low key," she says. "It was only later that women really started getting involved in activism." Rosanna says the film really made her remember things. "I remember Sylvester (a famous drag queen) performing in the Castro (the gay district). And of course I remember seeing Harvey Milk there. He was such an amazing man!" What was remarkable, she recalls, was his ability to build coalitions, like with the Teamsters, the notorious truckers union, which was protesting anti-union policies of beer companies like Coors. Rosanna remembers how Milk got gay bars to boycott Coors, which forced it to sign the union deal. In return the Teamsters started accepting openly gay and lesbian truck drivers. And Rosanna remembers the shock of his assassination. "I was at work when the news came that Mayor Moscone and Harvey had been shot dead. We all left and went down to the Castro, and everyone was standing around, not talking, all sombre." There was a candlelight march after that, which is shown in the documentary The Times of Harvey Milk, which has already won an Oscar, in 1985. There's an incredible moment when the camera slowly pans back and you can see the candles going
g_b Operation Flood is a success!
OK, I'll admit, we got a helping hand from a small guy called Oscar... but however is happened, the main objective has been met since Ajay Gupta of Multivision, the distributor, has just informed me that Milk will be releasing in Delhi and Bangalore on the 6th (this Friday). Gupta says the weekend receipts for Milk (before the Oscars) were good, though it unquestionably increased after the Oscars. Since then its been good enough for a third week release in Mumbai, in addition to the launches in Delhi and Bangalore. (Since they have limited prints, I guess they've only been able to move on to other cities, once demand in Mumbai eased up). In Mumbai it will be on eight screens in its third week which is really quite good for a non-comedy, non-action niche film on a subject matter that a leading broadcaster felt was controversial enough to censor! So if you haven't caught it, catch it now! Or see it again! And if you're in Delhi or Bangalore, then some Flooding might be in order, to make sure it moves on to Chennai and other centres. The anecdotal evidence I got on Operation Flood was mixed. Many people said they saw the film in nearly empty theatres. I think the distributor got too many prints - fewer screenings might have made for fuller halls. But then smaller theatres like Glamour did sell out - when GB went for its viewing that Saturday many people couldn't get tickets and had to hotfoot it to screens in Parel or Juhu to catch it! And on Sunday a friend from Pune told me the theatre was half full for a matinee show and after the film was over most of the audience stood up and applauded! It was also rather cool seeing so many friends, gay or straight, in the theatre. When I went to buy tickets at Metro a friend and her boyfriend were in the line behind me. I hadn't texted her, so she got it from someone else. There were other friends in the row behind, and in the popcorn queue in the interval I heard two guys I didn't know, but were clearly gay, chatting each other up. Perhaps they got more than just popcorn that night. I think this sort of response was the best part of taking part in this campaign - even more than the success in sending the film to other cities, though that's nice too. And I think the difference came from the straight people we sent it to. Its quite common for people in the community to send out alerts about queer interest films coming up, but this was one time when the effort was sent out to straight people as well. And I realised how powerful this could be when about an hour after I sent out the sms, I started receiving the same sms back from unknown numbers! Soon it went viral to the extent that newspapers were calling to do a story (I think links to the HT and DNA ones have already been posted). We even made it to the international media in this article by Sandip on Huffington Post, one of the top news blogs in the US. Here's the link: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/sandip-roy/slumdog-vs-milk---the-ide_b_169371.html So all in all I'd call this a pretty decent demo of what the community can do when we hit our cellphones. Now to repeat this when the 377 verdict comes in (if it ever does...) Vikram
g_b Re: The GayBombay Sunday Meet on 05 April 2009 at Bandra
This is to remind everyone that at tomorrow's meeting Harish will be speaking and leading a discussion on dealing with abuse as a child. There's been some concern from people who want to come for this because of their own past history, but who are not going to be comfortable talking about it. Please note, you will NOT be forced to reveal anything, talk about anything. While we do like everyone to participate in the meeting, we understand that people find it hard to talk, especially if they are coming for the first time, and a subject like this makes it harder. So rest assured, you can speak or not, entirely as you feel free. But don't miss what promises to be an exceptional meeting. --- In gaybom...@yahoogroups.com, "GayBombay Events" wrote: > > The GayBombay Sunday Meet > > Day, Date & Time: > Sunday 05 April 2009, between 6:00 to 6:30 pm > (Note the change in timings) > > Venue: > JATC (Just Around The Corner), Bandra. > (We may then move to another venue close by for an informal chat) > > Directions: > At Bandra Station, on the WEST side, take a rickshaw to Turner Road; at > Turner Road take a right at Tawaa Restaurant (you will see ICICI Bank on your > left after the turn). Keep going straight for about two minutes; you will see > the big blue signboard of 'JUST AROUND THE CORNER' on the left. > > Cover: > Free Entry > > Note: > 1. Do get your friends along to help them gain access to a group especially > if they are not netizens. You do not have to be "out" to the world to attend. > This is a discreet event being held as a clean, safe & social get-together of > a non-sexual nature. Hardly any of those attending are "out" as such. > > 2. You need to be at least 18 years of age to attend. > > 3. There may be many who will prefer being discreet or may be still be coming > to terms with themselves hence a request that all be sensitive to this and > act and dress accordingly. > > 4. Ensure that you get to JATC before 6:30 pm - the evening carries over to > another gay-friendly place close by. > > 5. To identify the group look out for someone wearing a BLACK cap. > > > > > This event is organised by: http://www.gaybombay.org > Right of admission reserved.,_._,___ > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >
g_b What were you doing when...
The day the Delhi High Court delivered its verdict a friend who was part of the struggle for equal rights in South Africa texted me: "Start recording everything that's happening, you don't know how soon you'll forget it!" It seems hard to imagine we'd forget such a moment, but the truth is that in time memories get blurred, and in the long slog ahead of us and probable - but temporary! - setbacks, it will probably happen. And that would be a pity when that moment was so amazing, moving - and occasionally funny - for so many of us. That was shown at yesterday's GB meeting where we varied our usual routine where everyone introduces themselves, by introducing ourselves and saying what we were doing when we heard about the verdict. And while with most people it was variations on jumping for joy and then texting/mailing as many friends as possible, we got some interesting variations, like: - the time of 10.30 am (and on the dot, which surprised many people more used to Indian Stretchable Time) meant that most of us were in office or had just reached it. That meant some of us got it during meetings or at times when we couldn't be checking the news all the time. - Kris was resourceful and asked for permission to see TV online, so he did his jumping for joy at his desk, and got congratulations from all his colleagues. - one of the heartwarming aspects of most people's reactions was the happiness shown by straight friends and colleagues. Calvin was told about it by a straight neighbour at home who yelled out to him to check what was happening. People who were out were deluged by congratulations from straight friends. I got a sms from a cousin of my mother who, unknown to me, since I'd never really discussed being gay with her, joined last year's march with her super gay friendly daughter - and she smsed me that morning. - one of the best office stories was from one guy who couldn't stay calm, so he ran out of office and bought sweets for everyone. Except that he wasn't really out so he found himself distributing sweets to people who all asked him why. And he couldn't tell them, so just kept saying, "its a very special day for me, its a very special day for me." His boss probably guessed, since he asked him with a smile: "Will it really make so much of a difference for you?" And he took a sweet. - I wasn't aware of how many late risers we had in the community. Several guys who woke late said they slept through it, but were woken by insistent calls from friends who normally knew better than to wake them at that time, but this time insisted. (On the other hand, there were those who just couldn't sleep through the night before). - Anirudhha tells me he was really moved when he got a sms from a friend that said: "Congrats on the triumph...I know u have been working with this for some time but I kept mum... Gret work. I am always ur good friend. Don't ever doubt that." Ani tells me he had postponed telling this friend about his sexuality - and now he didn't need to. - On a more sardonic note, my mother, never one to let the chance for smart comment go by, texted me: "So is tomorrow's headline going to be FREE WILLY! ?" - My own experience was almost frustrating. I knew the verdict was due at 10.30 and that I'd better be in office to deal with the demand for stories, so I came in really early that day, around 9.30. Which may not seem that early by most office standards, but if you know anything about newspapers, which start late and end late, the only people around at that time are the cleaning staff. So I came in and switched on the lights and my computer and around 10.30 looked for a TV to watch the verdict on. I had friends in the courtroom but I knew they would have to switch their phones off so it would have to be a TV channel, and I knew NDTV, CNNibn and TimesNOW were all waiting for the verdict so it would be almost live. And like most newspaper offices today ours is full of TV everywhere. So I switched one on and got a business channel - no surprise, since I work for a business paper, but I knew that wouldn't have the news. So I looked for the remote and couldn't find it, because they'd been put away since they had started disappearing, and I couldn't find where. I told myself that it wasn't a problem, there were so many TVs, one had to be showing a news channel, and even if there were none in the Economic Times, the Times of India newsroom next door would have one. And I started going around switching on the TVs - but no, all those in ET were on business channels, except for one... which was playing a Marathi entertainment channel. Now I knew what the guards were watching late at night! Getting more panicky now, since it was almost 10.30 I ran over to the Times which was almost as empty and started switching on channels. The sportwriters TV were all playing sports channels. At Bombay Times it was fashion or music channels. NO TVs W
g_b Government says no stay needed on 377 verdict! + request
Today was the day the Supreme Court had set for its next hearing on the Special Leave Petitions against the Delhi High Court's verdict in the 377 case. These SLPs have been gathering thick and fast - first Kaushal's, then Baba Ramdev's through some stooge of his, and now a new one from something called the Apostolic Churches Alliance, a group of evangelical churches in Kerala. All this was expected (even if the exact people who would file them weren't). What we have never known is what the government's reaction will be, especially after the new improved UPA government came in. We knew that individual members were supportive, but there was all the confusion created by Moily, going back and forth on the verdict, the negative comments by some like Vyalar Ravi and the long dismal track record of the Congress in giving in to religious groups. So we had no idea what stand the government would take when the Attorney General Ghoolam Vahanvati would take when he got up in the Supreme Court today. He's a good guy, who's probably individually supportive, but has to do his duty. Now I've just got the answer: the government has said it opposes a stay on the Delhi High Court verdict! And the Chief Justice agreed so for now the Delhi High Court verdict stands! He has given the government and us eight weeks in which to consider and file our rejoinders to the SLPs. What also could be good news is the tone the government now seems to be taking. The AG said that the government needed more time to reconsider its earlier stand in the Delhi High Court (which was very hostile). This does NOT mean they have altogether come onto our side, but the language - 'reconsider' - gives grounds for hope. NONE of this means the battle has been won. The Supreme Court is unpredictable, the judges don't seem particularly sympathetic and as we now know for sure, the SLPs against us will argued with real passion and with every attempt that the Baba and co can do to use their considerable backdoor clout. There may also be even more SLPs against us, further adding to the number that we will have to counter. The worst mistake we could make now is to bask in this verdict and take things lightly. So please continue to oppose and reason with our opponents on any forum you can find. Please continue to use all your contacts to come out with statements in our support and to use any influence you have with the government. And PLEASE contribute to the funds that must be collected to help our lawyers in what is now certain to be a long battle. The senior lawyers who are appearing for us in this case are doing so pro bono, but they need to be helped and prepared for this, and while the young lawyers who are doing this are also doing this pro bono there are unavoidable and increasing costs. The very least we can do is contribute to help fund this case. Aditya has posted details on how this can be done formally, through CREA's account, but we will be happy to help those who don't want to do this and are willing to trust GB to get the money, in full and with no deductions, to the Voices team in Delhi. We are still trying to see if the Dio's party this weekend can be done as a formal fundraiser, but if this is a problem with the management then we'll simply be collecting it directly from people. If you don't want to come to the party, send it with a friend who is coming, or get in touch with the organisers directly. All contributions are welcome (but lets be honest here, we're hoping for a few big ones!) Today has been a small gain towards making the Delhi High Court's verdict a permanent one. Now lets help make it really last. Vikram
g_b Is McD learning from GB?
GB started its meetings in the McDonald's on Linking Road in Bandra so I was happy to see this. Could this possibly be our influence: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qiQxgteurU8
g_b from Slate: gender testing
Am I Not a Woman? How to perform a gender test. By Melonyce McAfee Updated Wednesday, Dec. 20, 2006, at 6:49 PM ET Indian runner Santhi Soundararajan may be stripped of her Asian Games silver medal, after the Indian Olympic Association announced Monday that she had failed a gender test shortly after competing. Is a "gender test" as simple as it sounds? No. You can't tell for sure if an athlete is a man or a woman just by glancing at his or her genitalia. That's because some people are born with ambiguous sex organs, and others have a visible anatomy that doesn't match up with their sex chromosomes. Fears that male Olympic athletes might be competing as women led to mandatory physicals for females in the 1960s, which soon gave way to chromosome-based gender testing. Officials collected mouth scrapings and ran a simple test for the presence of two X chromosomes. The method proved to be unreliable, since it's possible for a biological male to have an extra X chromosome (XXY) or a female to only have one X chromosome. The gender of an embryo is determined during its early development. If certain sex-determining genes are present, the fetus will develop testes, which in turn produce testosterone. It's the testosterone that makes the fetus into a boy. The genes that are important for this switch are generally located on the Y chromosome. By the 1992 Winter Games, officials started testing for one of these genes, called SRYif you had it, you couldn't compete as a woman. - --- - --- That test didn't work, either. Having the SRY gene material, or even a Y chromosome, doesn't always make you a man. Some people born with a Y chromosome develop all the physical characteristics of a woman except internal female sex organs. This can result from a defect in one of genes that allows the body to process testosterone. Someone with this condition (known as "androgen insensitivity syndrome") might be XY, and she might develop testes. But she'll end up a woman, because her body never responds to the testosterone she's producing. Other signs of AIS include hairless genitalia and the absence of menstruation. (There are reports that Soundararajan had "not attained puberty yet.") Since testosterone helps in building muscle and strength, a case of androgen insensitivity syndrome wouldn't give an XY-female athlete any kind of competitive advantage; if anything, it would be a liability. Seven of the eight women who tested positive for Y- chromosomal material during the 1996 Summer Games in Atlanta had some form of AIS. They were allowed to compete. By the late 1990s, the International Olympic Committee turned to a more comprehensive evaluation by a panel of specialists to account for all these ambiguities. The panel now includes gynecologists, endocrinologists, psychologists, and experts on transgender issues. The examiners still test for the Y-chromosomal genes; gynecologists perform physical exams; endocrinologists diagnose gene disorders and resulting hormonal conditions; and athletes may be given psychological help to deal with the situation. Mandatory gender testing of Olympic athletes was stopped altogether in 1999, but Olympic and IAAF rules allow for gender tests if an athlete's gender is challenged by another athlete or team, or event officials. (Soundararajan's screening is said to have originated with such a protest.) Some athletes are called in for a complete exam after they give their urine sample during a doping test. Officials watch the whole process to make sure the athletes don't swap in someone else's pee, so they can flag anyone whose genitalia don't appear consistent with his or her stated gender. Athletes who have undergone sex-reassignment are allowed to compete alongside their new gender, provided they follow regulations.
g_b Christmas Day trauma
I'm posting this on behalf of a gay guy who had a terrible experience on Christmas Day. As I told him when he called me he was both really stupid to get into this (going there with so many valuables) and really lucky - because he could easily not have got free or they could have become even more violent. We know of two cases of guys who died this year most likely at the hands of guys they hooked up with for sex, and this guy could have become the third. Perhaps the fact that it was Christmas did have something to do with it after all. I don't think the guy is on this list, but if you post comments and mails I'll forward them to him, Vikram Dear All, I just want to relate an incident that happened on Christmas day. I had met this commercial guy through a friend sometime back. His name Rahul [though not sure if this is a fake name I later got to know that his name could be Jai or J something] He is fair, about 5.9 feet, slim, okay physique. [he has a good chest, but they look sagging ?] The first time I met him, I did not fancy him too much so didn't bother calling him again, though had asked incase he knew anyone good. He called me sometime later but since I was not interested and busy did not take his call. He then tried me from a PCO not knowing who it was, I took the call and then he told me that he had someone who was just my type. I then got interested and said that we could meet on Monday, 25th Dec around 6.00 pm as I would go out later. He told me that it would not be possible around then but later like 8.30/9.00 pm. We finally met and I took him to my friend's place [I had the keys to the house and he was not living there] with his friend - really cannot remember his name, Wasim, I think. He said he stayed at Mira Road. He is fair, shortish, good physique, wears silver earrings on both ears, nice eyebrows that meet at the centre. [Just my type]. They then came over and wanted to have a drink. I said that if they came earlier, it would be possible and to do it someother time. They told me it would be better as they were in the mood for drinks. So I gave Rahul 60 bucks to buy a beer. Meanwhile, I was chatting with Wasim. I asked him how much money he would charge ? He said he did not know anything about money and was doing it more for friendship sake. I felt good about it and told him we could be friends etc. and that I could also give him some money and we could keep in touch again. The other guy then came with a quarter of some cheap whisky and we started drinking. I was not keen, but they poured me a little. So I had a bit to give them company. After chatting for a while and drinking for about half and hour, I told the other guy Rahul to go in the next room and I could have some fun with Wasim. Wasim said that he was a bit nervous to do it alone and if we could do a threesome. Found that strange, but I told them that it's very confusing and so we could start and then later maybe he could join in. I told him to take his shirt off and I took mine including my pants. We had not closed the door. He then went in the next room and then the other guy too came and said lets do together and before anything, they started catching me and closing my mouth etc. I screamed a bit in fright [am getting goose bumps while writing this part] they then took me to the other room and closed my mouth. I realized then that there was a third person too [one of them when they had gone to get the booze or cigarettes must have got the third person in] The third person was weathish complexion, thin tall 5.8 and had longish hair. Not good looking. They tied my mouth with some cloth, they also tied my hands and legs not just with cloth but with electric wire too which I realized later. And they tied it quite tight. My hands were getting cramps after a while I was pleading with them to make it loose atleast. They even had some knives / daggers which they were using to threaten me. [I guess the third guy must have carried this with him] They took my credit cards and one of them went to the ATM while the two remained with me. They threatened me to give them the correct passwords, which I did. Luckily, for me in my debit card I had not much money. Maybe just 700/- and I also had a third card which was brand new. [I honestly could not remember that password since I had not used that card.] I was tied for about 2 hours approximately. They then called from the bank and said that the passwords were not correct but I told them that they were and also told him that there would not be much in the Debit card so they could withdraw a maximum of Rs.500 /- from there. I pleaded with them to let me go. I told them that I have old parents to look after etc. They told me the usual story "why do you do such things its wrong etc. Anyways, now good it will help you not to do thin
g_b Sheepish pleasures: the last word on gay sheep
from The New Yorker: SHEEPISH by Paul Rudnick "Charles Roselli set out to discover what makes some sheep gay. Then the news media and the blogosphere got hold of the story." The Times. Enough already. I'm Troy, a gay sheep, and I'll tell you the truth. Although I'm conflicted about calling myself a gay sheep, because I don't like to think that my sexuality defines me; let's just say that I'm a sheep who happens to be gay. Being gay is just a simple biological fact, like having a fleecy undercoat or bleating while you're being shorn, or getting aroused whenever you see a bulky turtleneck sweater. When I was growing up, I assumed that I'd be just like everybody else, and that someday I'd be bred with a ewe and slaughtered. But, of course, those other feelings were always there; even when I was only a few years old I would gaze at another male lamb and think about sharing a stall, with just enough hay and maybe a nice mid- century trough. I tried not to focus on my urges, and whenever my mom caught me rubbing up against the fence post that I called Skipper I'd pretend I had lice. But as the years went by I started to act on my desires, first with Ed, who was a ram, if you know what I mean. Later, I became involved with Rick, a sheep my own age, although after our encounters Rick would always claim that he was drunk on compost, and he'd butt me with his head and insist, "Dude, let's go get us some mutton." Finally, my dad found me with Rick, and he flew into a blind rage, yelling that he had no son, and that if I was lucky I'd end up as a cheap Peruvian cardigan worn by a truck-stop hooker in Alaska. And so I ran away, and I went wild. I experimented with everyone and everything. Bulls. Mules. Duck, duck, goose. I found out exactly why they're called the Three Little Pigs. Call me Old McDonald, because I had the farm. I even made some adult films, and maybe you've heard of them: "Wet Wool," "Lassie, Come Here," and the mega-selling "Hoof and Mouth." Then, one morning, I woke up next to a horse, a hen, and an ear of cornthat's right, all the food groups. And I was disgusted with myself. What was I, livestock? And so I re-joined my flock, up on Brokeback. I didn't expect to be accepted; I just needed some time to graze and grow. I had some terrific long talks with a wise old mountain goat, who told me, "Look, you can be anything you want to begay, straight, pashmina, whatever." And I found my faith again, when I realized that, hey, there were sheep on the ark. There were sheep in the manger. And at the Last Supper there was stew. At long last, I found the strength to come out to my family, my friends, and even my co-workers, to say right out loud, I'm Troy and I'm gay, but I hope that isn't the most interesting thing about me. I'm just like you: I like to stand around in the rain and get caught in barbed wire and defecate while I'm asleep. And the amazing thing wasit was no big deal. Everyone nuzzled me, and my mom said that deep down she'd always known, and that she'd hoped that I'd grow up to be an artist or a performer or a cashmere crewneck. Of course, Little Bo Peep, my shepherdess, got a little teary at first. "Are you sure?" she wondered. "I mean, you're so masculine." And I informed her that being gay doesn't mean you have to act like a hummingbird or a Chihuahua. And then she asked, very confidentially, "Is it true about Elsie the cow? And Ellen?" And I just rolled my eyes and said, "Darling." Right about then is when I met Doug. I saw him across the pasture, and I just knew. I assumed there'd be talkhe's a black sheep. And, I'll confess, I used the oldest line in the barn. I sidled right up to him and I said, "Baa baa, black sheep, have you any wool?" And he looked me right in the eye and murmured, "Yes, sir, yes, sir, three bags full." And I replied, "I can see that." We've been together ever since, and we don't care what anyone thinks. Because, baby, at the end of the day we're all just animals.
g_b Valentine's Day - remind everyone its not just for straights!
If you've opened the paper or listened to FM radio, you'll be more than aware that Valentine's Day is coming soon. Because advertisers love V-Day, the media does too and one thing papers and radio stations have started doing is allowing readers and listeners to place personal ads for their real or desired partners. Of course, they're assuming these are heterosexual partners, but why should we let them rest in that assumption? These Valentine's Day specials give us a fun opportunity to remind people that love isn't just a straight thing. And what's best of all is that we can do this for little effort and no risk of exposing ourselves if we don't want to. Its really simple. When you hear a radio channel saying they you can sms Valentine's Day messages to your partners, just send them a sms which makes it clear that you and your partner are of the same sex (of course, it helps here if you do have a partner, but for purposes of queering Valentine's Day you can invent one (and hey, it may come true!). If they are taking calls and you're OK with it, call in. If there are newspapers offering to print free messages, send one in. Of course, in most cases the RJs or people at the papers will ignore your message or be too embarassed to use it, but so what? It will have taken a few minutes of your time, and if nothing else you're communicating with that RJ or newspaper person. And quite often they might be intruiged or surprised enough to use them. (The chances of them exposing you are close to zero - nobody is really going to bother to track you down). A few of us did this last year and it worked quite nicely. I think it was the Go, now RadioOne, morning show which we sent in sms to, and some did get read out. The RJ just gabbled them out, so I think she was a bit disconcerted, but she did read them and it was cool hearing R wishing his bf V lots of love for Valentine's Day. So lets try and do it even more this year, and you can help by alerting us on this list to shows or papers that are taking messages. Just send us a number to sms to, or an address to mail. And then lets all do our best to show Bombay that love isn't only for straights! Vikram
g_b Sunil Gupta's exhibition of photographs in Mumbai
Sunil Gupta, the well known photographer, who's also a greatly valued member of the commmunity, is having an exhibition at the Bombay Art Gallery till the 28th of this month. As he says in the article below Gupta has never avoided the labels that others run away from. He's been called 'coloured', 'gay', 'HIV+', all of which are true, as is yet another label, which is simply 'good'. His pictures are always honest and moving and well worth to trip to Malabar Hill to see them, Vikram Camera conscious The Delhi photographer presents a minority report Georgina Maddox http://cities.expressindia.com/fullstory.php?newsid=222370 "I don't mind prefixes to my name," says Sunil Gupta when Aditya Ruia insists he does not want to position the photographer's exhibit as a gay man's show. "I've been called coloured, gay and now HIV-positive. They are all a part of me and they feed my work," says Gupta, currently showing his work from the '80s, '90s and 2000 at The Bombay Art Gallery, at Ruia House. In a deliberately measured manner, Gupta recalls some of his life's toughest moments without much ado. "In the 1980s while I was at Royal College of Art (RCA), I found no reflection of my gay identity in the photographs I took. Then I joined a group called Black Art that was tracing English colonisation from Ireland and right up to India. We were trying to create positive images for blacks and Asians since there was such little of it around," says Gupta, munching on a sandwich. His images may raise the ire of certain right-wing groups but Gupta has faced far too many cases of homophobia and prissy moralists to be deterred. In the West, being gay and coloured is a dilemma too. "I found that a lot of white men preferred each other and had issues with coloured men, the food they ate and the way they smelled." His black-and-white pictures depict black men as glamorous and sexy, shot in a nostalgic Casablanca style. The series titled Exiles(1989) has several shots of coloured men dressed in tuxedos dancing closely, in the smoky mist of a café. One can read the picture as a comment on being gay and coloured, but it also reclaims the romantic era of film noir and places it in a gay context. Another set of images (that get attention from viewers like actor Rehaan Engineer) is a captivating set titled Looking for Langston. The stills are part of the film shot for Channel 4 in the UK. "The poet-politician Langston Hughes repressed his sexuality given he was in the public eye, but had a recurring fantasy where he is walking toward his object of desirea male torso," says Gupta mischievously. In both, the film and Gupta's stills, Hughes walks toward and then looks beyond his dream. Coming to India post graduation, he found the gay community was far more closeted. "I tried to discover ways of making pictures since sneaking up on unsuspecting folks, camera in hand, was not working," chuckles Gupta. Eventually, he found a way to represent gay men in the public space. "I staged real-life situations, with gay men who were out and willing to be photographed giving the images a kind of a documentary feel." In the series titled Trespass,we see men hugging, holding hands or leaning on each other at Nehru Park and the India Gate. "Nehru Park is a big cruising area in Delhi, now muggers haunt it," he says pointing at some screaming headlines in a Delhi tabloid he's carrying with him.
g_b Flared Like a Trumpet: GB meet on the history of S.377
Who were Khanu, Lohana and Brother John Anthony? What did Mr.Minwalla do with the truck driver? Can you have sex with a buffalo's nostril? And what does any of this have to do with you? For answers to these questions come to Flared Like a Trumpet: a talk on the history and use of S.377 of the Indian Penal Code to criminalise homosexuals, by Alok Gupta at the GB meet this Sunday, 25th Feb at Zouk, Andheri. Section 377 of the Indian Penal Code hovers like an uncertain threat over the queer community in India. We know its there and we know it might be a problem, but we're not sure how its been used in the past and how it could be used in the future. Alok has been researching the history of Section 377 and some of his work was recently published in the Economic and Political Weekly. I'd posted that article online, but for those who didn't have time to read it, Alok will be talking about his work this Sunday. And if you think this is going to be a serious and depressing talk, well, think again. A lot of the cases are bizarre, even funny (at least for us now) and Alok uses them to keep the talk fun and engaging. His talk has been very well received at several conferences, most recently the World Social Forum in Kenya, not before time, so we've asked him to do it for us now. After the talk we can have a more general discussion on the topic and Alok will take Q&As on his work. So if you have thoughts or queries on Section 377 and what it means for queer people in India this is the chance to bring them up. (The only thing we won't be talking about is the current case in the Delhi High Court since that's still going on). More details on the meet and how to get there: The GB Meet: a talk on Section 377 followed by FREE Hepatitis-B shots! Venue: Zouk, Hotel Imperial Palace, Telli Galli, Andheri (East); Mumbai 400069. Time: 5 pm to 7 pm. Entry: Free. > This is to remind all those who were present at the Hep B Vaccination drive on 30th July, 2006, that your Third Hepatitis B innoculation is due by the last week of February, 2007. GB has organised a meet on 25th February, which combines a talk on Section 377, with a following Q & A round. The time for the vaccinations will be from 6 - 7pm. NO LATER THAN THAT! Hepatitis-B is a serious and potentially fatal disease that is spread, among other means, through sexual contact. For people leading an active sexual life it can be as serious a threat as HIV - except that for Hepatitis-B there is now an effective vaccine. GB is offering FREE innoculation against Hepatitis-B. If you do this at a regular clinic it could cost you around Rs 500 or even more for a shot. The reason for this is that each dose of vaccine is meant for about 10 people and once it is opened it has to be used at once. We are keeping our costs down by getting the vaccine at a special price and by innoculating many people at once. So this is a really good opportunity. Please note that if you take this vaccination now you will have to get booster shots at certain intervals later. The vaccine will be administered by an experienced and highly qualified doctor. He will also be making a presentation on Sexually Transmitted Diseases. For those who have already been vaccinated through GB earlier, If you would rather get the innoculation done elsewhere, that is perfectly fine, as long as it is done within the last week of February. < Directions: Hotel Imperial Palace is a 5 minute walk from Andheri station on the East side. Walk up the Andheri Kurla Road (towards the Highway) and turn right into Telli Galli. It's the 3rd building on your right. But if you're driving and taking the Andheri flyover, from West to East, make a left turn at the signal at the end of the flyover. Or if you're driving on the highway make a left turn at the Andheri flyover road and a right turn at the signal before the flyover. This is Telli Galli. Almost towards the end of this road, close to Andheri Kurla Road (perpendicular to Telli Galli), is Hotel Imperial Palace, on your left. < SOME DON'TS: `GB, as a support group, has created this comfort/safe space for gays. Many people at the event may be "newbies" (those still coming to terms with their sexuality and/or those who have mustered the courage to come to such an event for the first time). We request you to be sensitive to the comfort levels of others and to behave and dress accordingly. `No dark rooms; if found indulging in any "hanky panky" you will be asked to leave the event. > This event is organized by: http://www.gaybombay.org You have to be above the age of 18 to attend the event. Right of admission reserved. --
g_b Siddharth on Gaydar
Siddharth responded to my mail on what Gaydar has meant for people on these lists with this excellent piece: After read Vikram's posting on the death of the creator of Gaydar Gary Frisch, I was tempted to write about what the website has meant for me. - Siddharth Signed on to Gaydar My friend Alok introduced me to Gaydar when I was living in Delhi around two years ago. "It's a great website to hook up, but make sure you upload a photo or the chances of people messaging you are slim" he said, before showing me how to set up an account. I was a bit skeptical at first. The only connotation Gaydar had for me until then was the ability to spot other gay people in a crowd. I had tried chatting on websites earlier, and had never had the patience or inclination to make friends or hook up through these chats. But I was willing to try Gaydar as hooking up with gay men in Delhi had proved to be much more difficult than I had imagined. Tuesday nights at PnP was dicey, some visits were very fruitful, while others proved to be excruciatingly boring. I was not a natural conversationalist when it came to strangers, and it took me quite a while to muster the courage to strike up a conversation with the person standing next to me. I spent many anxious moments watching people on the dance floor, often waiting to see if I would initiate conversation. More often than not the conversation never happened. I was invited to a few parties, but getting around in Delhiwithout transport was difficult at first, and I often felt out of place amongst crowds where people seemed to know each other already. So I was quite willing to give Gaydar a chance. The first few days of setting up an account had proved to be fun -- choosing a handle, slotting myself in various categories, listing my favorite movies, sports and sexual preferences, and of course writing a few lines about myself while trying not to sound while trying not to sound too earnest. I can't remember the first messages I got or what they said. But I do remember being thrilled to bits. Soon I learnt that messages on Gaydar had to be direct and to the point, as most people did not pay to be on it and so did not enjoy the privilege of unlimited messages. Many of the people I met did not check Gaydar too often, and wanted to meet then and there. Many of these were people visiting Delhi on work and put up in hotel rooms. Soon, I discovered the large number of men of various nationalities visiting Delhilooking for uncomplicated sex. Some of them were here on business, others just holidaying. Some of them were employed in detective agency; others bought silver furniture for sheikhs in Dubai. Two years ago, I met up with a friend from South Africa who I knew was gay, and thought was cute. We'd had a drink and then joined some common friends for dinner at a restaurant nearby. I was completely unaware of the "eyes" he was making at me from across the table, and so didn't bother offering to take him home with me when we left the restaurant. When I got back home, and logged on t Gaydar, there he was surfing for men, like me. One or two messages later, we had fixed for him to come home and spend the night at my place for some of the most fun and comfortable sex I had had in years. Of late the number of messages I get on Gaydar has come down to trickle. I no longer spend hours before the computer with Gaydar open while I check email. I've moved on to more widely used websites like G4M. But a new message on Gaydar continues to send a jolt of anticipation down my spine. Yes, Gaydar is primarily about the physical appearance of people. Yes sometimes it could be height, weight, or skin colour that people look for. Yes, it's not about creating a sense of community, and more about individual hook ups. But there are people who ask for only "fat people", and others who want only men above 40. Those willing to experiment with a variety of sexual practices Gaydar could make that explicit on their profiles. If you were looking for 'friendship' and not '1-on-1 sex' that could be stated clearly as well. I did not know that Gaydar was created by Gary Frisch till I read about his death in Vikram's posting on this list. While I used this site I didn't think twice about how it started, but the more I think about it now, the more I'm amazed by the utility of such a simple idea. Some of my most embarrassing sexual encounters have been with men from Gaydar, and so have some of the most intimate. Thank you Mr. Frisch, wherever you are now!
g_b Indian mothers teach the West!
Sometime back I posted a mail from Praveen wbout how he dealt with the problems he faced from homophobic (Indian) colleagues at the company he works for in the US. His mother back home in Chennai played a small, but crucial role in that, calling those colleagues and taking them to task. This was pretty devastating for them since they never imagined an Indian mother supporting her gay son, let alone actively intervening on his behalf. Now Praveen's mother has worked her magic again, this time second hand through Praveen, and not with Indians, but an American gay kid and his mom. Its an excellent reversal of stereotypes and I only wish that all those people who go on about what India can teach the West could take up this story as an example. Here's the story, and after that a letter that Praveen's mother had written which is archived on the excellent Tamil/English queer rights list www.orinam.org Vikram >From Praveen: It has been almost three months since I moved to Hickory for my latest Project. I just wanted to move out of Atlanta at least for some months and luckily I got this project in right moment. Though I was so happy for that, immediate thought was how the queer scene would be, in North Hickory. Especially, Hickory is a small town in NC (it is almost 75 minutes drive from Charlotte which is the nearest notable city), wherein people living are very biblical and conservative. No complaints though, as I'm allowed to rent cars on client' expenses, I can move around and 75 minutes drive is not too far. First month went on very quickly as I had loads of work to do on weekdays and I drove back to Atlanta on weekends (which is in 260 miles distance from hickory - it just takes 180 to 200 mins to cover this distance - driving on highways is real fun) My roommates are very accepting and complete fun to be with. They like my presence so much as I'm the source of their sex-education + discussions and they think I'm trendy and fashionable! !! (No wonder, I'm Gay). Apart from this, I go clubbing with the trikone friends (of course, gay clubs) on weekends... It's fun to be in those clubs, with those mind blowing music transcends through your body that shakes you completely and makes anyone to dance without their conscious. I dance (at least, that's what I thought I was doing) till each cell in my body exhausts completely in the form of sweat, with the place becoming warmer minute-by-minute. .. There will be nothing but void in your mind when you come out, thanks to the high decibels of music Quite a refreshing tHing to do Few weeks back, Ryan, an American friend of mine who is gay and who lives in the same Apartment community in which I live in Atlanta, introduced a guy named Ray, during a weekend dinner session. I kept in touch with that guy only through phone even after I came back to Hickory; he is a student and he also works part-time. We both were busy and I went back to Atlanta on every weekend, so we didn't get to meet each other. But couples of weeks back he called me on a Monday and asked whether I wanted to meet for coffee.. So I directly went to meet him after work. At first sight, he was good looking and when I spoke to him he sounded intelligent too, despite the fact he is blonde. (We have a bad joke in USA that blondes are stupid, like our puns about sardarjis, haha) We soon become comfortable with each other, the coffee meet extended to dinner... we talked a lot about mutual countries, family, culture, blah blah blah... Then when we started speaking about orientation he wondered how I'm so open to talking about sexuality and orientation, having brought up in a country, which he thought to be very conservative. .. And when I said that I'm out to my family, he was totally surprised and completely dumbstruck when he heard about my mom Then he was like all praise for my mom [he completely ditched me here :( ] Then he wanted to know the complete version of how I told my mom and how my mom responded and everything.. . I promised to forward some of my mails regarding this. Next day, he called me early in the morning (god, it was 6 am... ) and said he read all those mails and my blog (of course, with lot of apologies for disturbing me early in the morning). After that, I didn't get to hear from him till last week when he called me. As I was busy, I said I would call him later. He insisted me in returning the call without fail, as it's very important... After work, while driving back to home, I called him and asked the reason for his call. He said that he is out to his parents now He said his mom stopped talking to him after that, and his father has asked him to move out. I was very sorry for him; but he asked me to help him to make their parents understand this... I did not know how to react to it... how can I go and advice someo
g_b from DNA: can brands go bent?
Yet another non-story created primarily out of a desire to fill space and look cool by taking a gay angle. Still this is marginally better done than some of the others that have appeared recently. Like the HT story (front page lead!) which tried to interpret the Motorola ad with the Dolce and Gabbana endorsement as evidence that Motorola was advertising to gays in India (would have loved to be in the Motorola office when that came out!). Followed by another in HT about how St.Petersburg was now the Indian gay holiday destination of choice. I know quite a few rich gay guys, but they're more likely to go to Panjim than St.Petersburg! This story at least speaks to a few people and explores the issue of gay imagery in Indian ads - though the writer misses out on several old ones, like some print ads with explicit gay angles, mostly intended to shock, a Chlorets ad which I think is now on corporateclosets.com or that Onida (?) ad with a trans character. And the story does seem to acknowledge that the situation is a sad one which should change as attitudes change in India. On the whole, as a gay man, I'm glad to see such stories which talk about gay issues in India in generally positive terms, however much, as a journalist, I might deplore their essential vacuousness. And DNA carried the story well, giving it large space and a decent layout. Also particular thanks to the writer for not using 'pink rupee', a term that particularly makes me want to throw up! Vikram Brands stray off the straight path... Sumita Vaid Dixit Friday, March 02, 2007 23:53 IST http://www.dnaindia.com/report.asp?NewsID=1082761 ...Some of them are coming out of the closet. Have you seen an Orangee ad? The Parle candy makes men, women and kids pucker their lips as they suck the liquid. In one ad, two men are shown peeing, and one of them begins to pucker his lips, suggesting a certain kind of behaviour. However, it is the candy that compels people to pucker as the tag line suggests `Choos ke khao'. Then there's a suiting ad, where a dude congratulates his pal at his wedding and runs his fingers suggestively down his suiting-clad back. Tired of being straight?'' asks an ad from a Fructis hair styling product. Snap to two blonde girls looking suggestively at each other, spiked hair in place. Worldwide, a `Mechanics' spot for Snickers bar shows two mechanics eating opposite ends of the bar till their lips meet and they break apart Buckle up for what is viewed as homosexual behaviour, alternative sexuality, etc in communications. It hardly raises an eyebrow overseas, but could stir some excitement here. Then there's another ad for Parle Xhale which runs on the lines of adult mint Samarjeet Shimpi, associate vice-president, Triton Communications, says that the ad for Xhale was conceived from the perspective that the Xhale mint charms people. We see all the members of the girls family rubbing against the boy's toes under the table; it suggests an emotion that goes beyond the bounds of charm. The father who is authoritarian figure, in the end gives the boy a certain look that borders on alternate sexual behaviour. Shimpi clarifies again that the team had not set off on that intention, however, over several drafts and retakes, the storyline evolved. The ad was researched and no one found the ad objectionable. For that matter Parle had no apprehensions running the ad considering the ad touched upon a sensitive subject, though in a light manner. Far from it, the ad got a few laughs. As a matter of fact, this is the best ads can do with alternate sexuality in ads - get laughs. Shimpi says that at the moment, a bold subject such as homosexuality could be dealt with in storylines to the point of humour. Overstep that and one would be in a dangerous territory. No wonder, homosexuality rarely finds expression in mainstream media. The fashion industry seems to be the only community to have accepted it, but otherwise, the subject and its expression remain largely tabooed. The reason for this is essentially closed Indian society. "It is still conservative, and to talk about homosexuality needs great courage. Perhaps the next generation may be more open to talking about such matters," says Sagar Mahabaleshwarkar, creative director, Ogilvy & Mather. Just as much such subjects are little talked about in public forums, storylines or plots with gay or lesbians couples are hardly seen in Indian ads. "You can't force fit an ideology into an ad. That would be false, and most probably result in awful advertising. But, I think if an idea organically needs someone who is gay or lesbian or needs to touch on that universe, then it should," says Zubin Driver, network creative director, TV18 Group. In fact, if the creative people do not use such a situation it is because ads merely refle
g_b from NYT: generation change
Grounds for hope maybe? And will we see the same shift in this country? from the New York Times: The Way We Live Now: Beyond the Pleasure Principle By ANN HULBERT Published: March 11, 2007 It is a point of pride among baby boomers that after our kids leave home, we enjoy a continuing closeness with them that our parents rarely had with us. We certainly do keep in touch: 80 percent of 18- to 25-year-olds had talked to their parents in the past day, according to "A Portrait of Generation Next," a recent study conducted by the Pew Research Center in tandem with MacNeil/Lehrer Productions. Yet if the survey is any guide, Gen Nexters aren't getting the credit they deserve for being as many of them told pollsters they felt they were "unique and distinct." It is not easy carving out your niche in the shadow of parents who still can't get over what an exceptional generation they belong to. So what is special about Gen Nexters? Don't count on them to capture their own quintessence. "The words and phrases they used varied widely," the Pew researchers noted, "ranging from `lazy' to `crazy' to `fun.' " But if you look closely, what makes Gen Nexters sui generis and perhaps more mysterious than their elders appreciate are their views on two divisive social topics, abortion and gay marriage. On the by-now-familiar red-and-blue map of the culture wars, positions on those issues are presumed to go hand in hand: those on the right oppose both as evidence of a promiscuous society and those on the left embrace them as rights that guarantee privacy and dignity. Yet as a group, Gen Nexters seem to challenge the package deals. Young Americans, it turns out, are unexpectedly conservative on abortion but notably liberal on gay marriage. Given that 18- to 25- year-olds are the least Republican generation (35 percent) and less religious than their elders (with 20 percent of them professing no religion or atheism or agnosticism), it is curious that on abortion they are slightly to the right of the general public. Roughly a third of Gen Nexters endorse making abortion generally available, half support limits and 15 percent favor an outright ban. By contrast, 35 percent of 50- to 64-year-olds support readily available abortions. On gay marriage, there was not much of a generation gap in the 1980s, but now Gen Nexters stand out as more favorably disposed than the rest of the country. Almost half of them approve, compared with under a third of those over 25. It could simply be, of course, that some young people are pro-gay marriage and others are pro-life and that we can expect more of the same old polarized culture warfare ahead of us. But what if Gen Nexters, rather than being so, well, lazy, are forging their own new crossover path? When I contacted John Green, an expert on religious voters who is currently working at the Pew Forum on Religion and Public Life, he said that pollsters hadn't tackled that question. But after crunching some numbers, he suggested that there might indeed be a middle way in the making. Many individual Gen Nexters hold what seem like divergent views on homosexuality and government involvement with morality either liberal on one while being conservative on the other or else confirmed in their views on one question while ambivalent on the other. Oh, how these young people can confound us! All this could amount to no more than what the experts call a "life-cycle effect": Gen Nexters may hold heterogeneous views now because they are exploring diverse values that may congeal in more conventional ways as they get older. But a more intriguing possibility is that it is a "cohort effect," a distinctive orientation that will stick with them. Liberals could take heart that perhaps homosexual marriage has replaced abortion as the new "equality issue" for Gen Nexters, suggested John Russonello, a Washington pollster whose firm is especially interested in social values; Gen Nexters may have grown up after the back-alley abortion era, but they haven't become complacent about sexual rights. Conservatives might take comfort from a different hypothesis that Green tried out: maybe Gen Nexters have been listening to their parents' lectures about responsibility. Don't do things that make you have an abortion, young people may have concluded, and do welcome everyone into the social bulwark of family responsibility. Put the two perspectives together, and an ethos emerges that looks at once refreshingly pragmatic and yet still idealistic. On one level, Gen Nexters sound impatient with a strident stalemate between entrenched judgments of behavior; after all, experience tells them that in the case of both abortion and gay rights, life is complicated and intransigence has only impeded useful social and political compromises. At the same time, Gen Nexters give every indication of being attentive to the moral issues at stake: they aren't willing to ig
g_b from the Times: Matthew Parris on John Inman and the value of open secrets
Those of us with long memories, and with nothing better to do, way back in early Eighties, than watch Doordarshan, will remember the British comedy series Are You Being Served that was intermittently aired. Set in a large department store, it was crude as hell, but god bless our innocent hearts because we all that it was cutting edge comedy (actually, maybe not, but we didn't have much choice), full of screamingly stereotyped characters - and no one more screaming than John Inman who played the obviously gay Mr.Humphries. Obviously, but never overtly stated, even when you get jokes like this: Miss Brahms (pretty shop assistant): Why are they call jockey shorts? Mr Humphries: Because you know you're past the winning line when you're close enough to grab the pole. Or words to that effect, which I'd certainly never heard before on DD or anywhere else for that matter (I was deprived, didn't go to boarding school). I'd only vaguely started realising what gay was, and here was an example right on my grandparent's TV (my parents didn't believe in having a TV, you see what I mean by deprived). I suppose if I knew more I might have been outraged by the stereotype of the campy queen, but I didn't and this was enough to work on for the moment then. A little later My Beautiful Launderette would be aired and all would be made quite clear by Daniel Day-Lewis and Gordon Warnecke (so lovely, whatever happened to him?). But John Inman was clearly important, for me and so many others, as is evident from the flood of reminiscences and tributes that have followed his death last week. Matthew Parris in the Times did a particular good one, expanding it to a larger tribute to that controversial thing: the open secret. The open secret is something we are, of course, familiar enough with here, and as Parris says, one can see its value. Karan Johar is the obvious example, though given the hints he drops on his show, its hardly much of a secret. There are others too I guess, and will be more since I think we're still at the open secret stage. But hopefully things will change, and one of these days we might be able, like Parris, to look back on it as something that was valuable, but whose time has largely passed, Vikram I'm free and it's all because of men like John Inman by Matthew Parris I raise a salute to that lifesaving human compromise, the open secret. I raise a salute to a band of comrades who, each in their different ways, were the keepers through a dark age of an open secret. My salute is to a dying breed: a breed whose ranks thinned again in the small hours of Thursday morning when John Inman passed away. Hail to them all: the ludicrous old queens; the drag artists; the pantomime homosexuals; the florid epicureans; the indulgent priests; the sensitive young men in tight trousers; and the wan aesthetes. And hail, too, to their quieter cousins: the discreetly confirmed bachelors and "he never married" brigade, the don't-ask-don't-tell soldiers, and the dignified loners who just preferred to stay single and wouldn't say why. Theirs all of theirs to protect and guard was a precious thing: the open secret. For gay men in the 20th century the open secret was sometimes literally a lifesaver. It was the narrowest of territories: the half- acre that lies somewhere between absolute denial and outright confession, between dishonesty and disgrace. This was a hard place to be in 1970, a narrow line to walk. If our oh-so-modern, who-gives-a- damn, 21st-century gays, of whom I am one, suppose that these men were not brave, that they were not trail-blazers, not part of the struggle, then we don't know the half of it. And some of us, it seems, don't. Already I hear the cry "living a lie", "set back the cause", "self-oppression", "an insulting stereotype" from a gay lobby that has taken about five minutes to forget what a dark age England was for us, what light an Inman, a Kenneth Williams, a Danny La Rue or, from America, a Liberace brought into it, and how outrageous, how valiant, those people were. About five minutes to forget, too, that the people who wanted these men taken off the stage, screen and wireless, were not the gay-rights campaigners but the bigots and guardians of conservative morality. "Sexual perversion", they said, wasn't entertainment: it was wicked and dangerous and bad taste. The BBC, contemplating making a series of Are You Being Served?, tried at first to insist that Mr Humphries was removed. How fast we forget context. Always a bit of a giggle to their own era, the Inmans, La Rues and Williamses of the last century are now disowned by their newly brave inheritors: the lately and boldly Out. John Inman's breath had barely left his body before right-on spokesmen
Re: g_b from DNA: can brands go bent?
I remember the ad. There was a lesbian equivalent as well. I think the brand name was Chelsea Jeans. --- In gay_bombay@yahoogroups.com, Yabadabadoo <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > hmmm, sometime in the 90's we had a brand of jeans or denims break that barrier in a not-so-subtle kind of way. i forget which brand it was, but i do remember the visual, where we had two muscled (read long haired, rock music maniac, swarthy macho) men, one with his back to the viewer, and one facing us with the look that defied any perceptions of the GAY man in India at that time (which was still not very different from the pinkoo character played by Anupam Kher in a cheese flick early on in the decade). Does anyone one know about it? it was a series of ads, of which one was this. i don't know if it created a furore in the moral sections of the society, but at least it had the i don't give a f$%& what you think! would love to get a copy of that ad. > > Vikram <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Yet another non-story created primarily out of a desire to fill space > and look cool by taking a gay angle. Still this is marginally better > done than some of the others that have appeared recently. > > Like the HT story (front page lead!) which tried to interpret the > Motorola ad with the Dolce and Gabbana endorsement as evidence that > Motorola was advertising to gays in India (would have loved to be in > the Motorola office when that came out!). Followed by another in HT > about how St.Petersburg was now the Indian gay holiday destination of > choice. I know quite a few rich gay guys, but they're more likely to > go to Panjim than St.Petersburg! > > This story at least speaks to a few people and explores the issue of > gay imagery in Indian ads - though the writer misses out on several > old ones, like some print ads with explicit gay angles, mostly > intended to shock, a Chlorets ad which I think is now on > corporateclosets.com or that Onida (?) ad with a trans character. And > the story does seem to acknowledge that the situation is a sad one > which should change as attitudes change in India. > > On the whole, as a gay man, I'm glad to see such stories which talk > about gay issues in India in generally positive terms, however much, > as a journalist, I might deplore their essential vacuousness. And DNA > carried the story well, giving it large space and a decent layout. > Also particular thanks to the writer for not using 'pink rupee', a > term that particularly makes me want to throw up! > > Vikram > > Brands stray off the straight path... > Sumita Vaid Dixit > Friday, March 02, 2007 23:53 IST > > http://www.dnaindia.com/report.asp?NewsID=1082761 > > ...Some of them are coming out of the closet. > > > Have you seen an Orangee ad? The Parle candy makes men, women and > kids pucker their lips as they suck the liquid. In one ad, two men > are shown peeing, and one of them begins to pucker his lips, > suggesting a certain kind of behaviour. However, it is the candy that > compels people to pucker as the tag line suggests `Choos ke khao'. > Then there's a suiting ad, where a dude congratulates his pal at his > wedding and runs his fingers suggestively down his suiting-clad back. > > Tired of being straight?'' asks an ad from a Fructis hair styling > product. Snap to two blonde girls looking suggestively at each other, > spiked hair in place. Worldwide, a `Mechanics' spot for Snickers bar > shows two mechanics eating opposite ends of the bar till their lips > meet and they break apart > > Buckle up for what is viewed as homosexual behaviour, alternative > sexuality, etc in communications. It hardly raises an eyebrow > overseas, but could stir some excitement here. > > Then there's another ad for Parle Xhale which runs on the lines of > adult mint > > Samarjeet Shimpi, associate vice-president, Triton Communications, > says that the ad for Xhale was conceived from the perspective that > the Xhale mint charms people. We see all the members of the girls > family rubbing against the boy's toes under the table; it suggests > an emotion that goes beyond the bounds of charm. > > The father who is authoritarian figure, in the end gives the boy a > certain look that borders on alternate sexual behaviour. Shimpi > clarifies again that the team had not set off on that intention, > however, over several drafts and retakes, the storyline evolved. The > ad was researched and no one found the ad objectionable. For that > matter Parle had no apprehensions running the ad considering the ad > touched upon a sensitive subject, though in a light manner. &g
g_b more selections for the Sex Appeal series
>From the Movenpik list, Praveen's selections below. Praveen also points to the one rather gay part of the game, the way the bowlers keep rubbing the ball against their crotch! But guys I asked for a World vs India team so there's still plenty of scope for inclusions. Today's Hindustan Times also a hottest guys 11 - check this link out for the pix. Ashish Bagai, gone from Delhi to Canada is one cute guy you may not have heard of! : http://epaper.hindustantimes.com/default.aspx HT Choice: 1 Andrew Flintoff He's not only one of the greatest all-rounders England has ever had, this attitude-personified Freddie sizzles on our style-o-meter as well. His rip-off act in Mumbai spurred Indians to clinch Nat West. 2 Mark Boucher Mr Hot-bod is undoubt edly the cutest. This South African wicket-keeper is the fastest to bell 100 batsmen behind the stumps. His glam quotient will bowl the maidens over. 3 Daniel Vettori A bowler with a boy next-door charm is the youngest to play Test cricket for the Kiwis. We like him better with his specs on. 4 Shane Bond Quickest New Zealander to reach 50 One-Day International wickets, Shane Bond sets the whole 22 yards on fire as he runs down the pitch. 5 Shane Watson His six-pack sends female fans aflutter. This Aussie all- rounder's first claim to fame was a nude photoshoot for a men's magazine. 6 Shahid Afridi He started of as a swash buckling opener. Many controversies later, this Pakistani spin wizard sits pretty on number six on our eye candy charts. 7 Jacques Kallis A chunky physique and a carefree attitude make this leading batsman from South Africa a sure-fire contender for our hottie top of the tops. 8 Brian Lara The man, the legend, this stylish southpaw, from the Windies has played brave innings with his winning smile and technical genius. He represents Caribbean charisma. 9 Michael Clarke This Aussie can steal the show..the thunder from Down Under can prove to be a one-man army when it comes to close finishes. 10 Kumar Sangakkara He took over where Kaluvitharana left off. Efficient behind the wickets and lethal in front of them, this Lankan tiger is number 10 on our style-check list. This demure hottie is touted to be the future captain. 11 Ashish Bagai Delhi-born Canadian wicketkeeper may not have a mane like that of Dhoni but his clean glovework and unassuming looks help him to make it on our list. Praveen's choice: My best 12 (11 + 1) Herschelle Gibbs(Opening batsman. South Africa) Chris Gayle (Batsman, westindies) Adam Gilchrist(Wicket Keeper, Australia) Shahid Afridi(Batsman, Pakistan) Graeme Smith(batsman, South Africa) Stephen Fleming(Batsman, Newzealand) Gautam Gambhir(Batsman, India) Salman Butt(Batsman, Pakistan) (that is his name and believe me he has got such a cute butt) Daniel Vettori (Off-spinner, new zealand) Love his inncoent looks and he looks awesome with glasses Brett Lee (Fast Bowler, Australia) (love his hairs facial(duh)) Zaheer khan (Fast medium, India) Irfan Pathan (Fast Medium, India) Favourite Umpires (I know it's too much) hahaha Simon Taufel(NewZealand) Billy Bowden(Newzealand) Match Referee (tooo much!!! lol) Javagal Srinath (India) Apart from that I remember one important former player from South Africa - Allan Donald I love his style of bowling but very cute things I love about him is, the way he shines the ball. In cricket, it's very important for the bowlers to have ball shining to bowl in desired pace and length. So usually they keep rubbing the ball on their clothes. Allan Donlad used to rub the ball on his thigh very close to his dick... Once a naughty(gay?) cameraman showed his complete process of rubbing the ball. Though he was wearing pants, it could so much imagine from the shape of you-know-what. Everyone were watching him making the ball shine, where as I was imagining those invisible balls behind it I know, It's nasty... I'm a nasty guy!!! ;) Regards, FTP --- In [EMAIL PROTECTED], Umesh Mehendale <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Harbhajan (I have a weakness for Sardarjis), Pathan and the sexy Shane Bond and Brett Lee are my choices > Umesh > > Salil <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > My choice for wicket keeper - Dhoni on both sides. > > Vikram <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: How many gay cricket fans out there? When Vivek wrote this piece for > outsports.com during the last World Cup he would complain he was the > only lonely gay cricket fan around. But surely that's changed by now, > with so many other gay men, of every type coming into the community, > there must be more gay cricket fans out there? > > And even if most of us aren't interested in the game itself, we'll > have to agree that some of the cricketers are... interesting. Who > would we select for a cricket eleven based on sheer sex a
g_b The Gay Side of Cricket + selecting teams for the Sex Appeal Series!
How many gay cricket fans out there? When Vivek wrote this piece for outsports.com during the last World Cup he would complain he was the only lonely gay cricket fan around. But surely that's changed by now, with so many other gay men, of every type coming into the community, there must be more gay cricket fans out there? And even if most of us aren't interested in the game itself, we'll have to agree that some of the cricketers are... interesting. Who would we select for a cricket eleven based on sheer sex appeal? Personally I think the Indian team has so many hotties, with the captain leading the list, that we would sweep such a list, so lets try and select two teams - India vs. Rest of World for a Sex Appeal Series! Here's my choice for captains: India: Rahul Dravid Rest of World: Stephen Fleming (yes, I know black makes everyone look better, but he's seriously hot). So come on everyone, who else? The Gay Side of Cricket (Editor's note: The Cricket World Cup in South Africa is captivating large parts of the globe, especially those countries that once were part of the British Empire. But we Americans could care less and were wondering what all the fuss was about. Vivek Divan, a cricket fan from Bombay, India, clues us in as to the sport's appeal). By Vivek Divan For Outsports.com Although the incredulous (bordering on derisive) looks and comments that I have received from gay folk when I show even the faintest enthusiasm for sport in general and cricket in particular haven't made me question my queerness (in fact it's been reinforced to an even greater degree!), they have certainly made me feel peeved about the injustice and intolerance of it all. Well, no, not exactly. Such barbs used to infuriate me but now I don't give a damn. Especially at this time when the Cricket World Cup is on, when there is so much eye candy in the press and on television, when there is all this terrific male bonding going on between guys in uniform. And when, like never before, cameras have access to the training sessions, with all those shirtless, strapping specimens. Whoa! The Kiwis have never been hotter. James Anderson has restored our faith in the cuteness of Englishmen. The Indian team has this alien (certainly un-Indian) fitness level and some lean, mean machines that bowl you over. The Pakistanis well, they've never flattered to deceive, at least in the hunk department. And with quite a sprinkling of gorgeousness all around, right now watching cricket is HOT STUFF! But, hey, I've always liked the sport regardless of the fact that this World Cup has turned out to be quite a catwalk. Although my interest in it did reach a nadir in the recent past, what with serious match-fixing information coming to light, I've been fascinated by it forever, collecting pictures of cricketers as a kid for my scrapbook. And yes, it is far more interesting than baseball, you Statesiders! No matter that Robin Williams may have called it baseball on valium. It is a pretty faggy sport, really. Especially when one reads its history (homoerotic references in one of Ramachandra Guha's brilliant writings on the game), sees old visual representations of it in art (rather queer-looking Englishmen in their starched whites) and recognizes the poetry of the game not just on the playing field but also the phenomenal writing it has engendered, possibly second only to golf. Its even got a ton of queer jargon (if you really let your imagination run wild!) long leg, short leg, third man, fine leg, deep fine leg, maiden, stump, square leg, deep square leg, forward short leg. It is (or was) full of etiquette, pomp and ceremony. It used to be formal, elite, languorous and ridiculously time-consuming (the Test Match version of the game the real thing still is). Players were steeped in fair play and magnanimity. Essentially, it was all quite utterly English, to my mind in some strangely Oscar Wildean way. It is astonishing how it has now become a sport so deeply rooted in the Indian subcontinent. And we in India seem to be taking it back out to the world now. There has never been a better time really our boys in blue are the best looking bunch we've ever had! As a gay sport freak there is just one regret about cricket though I wish it were more of a contact sport!.
g_b rainbow regiments: gays in the Indian armed forces?
Anyone who read the papers on Monday couldn't have missed the story about Nari Lepcha, the constable from the Sikkim battalion who went amok and killed five fellow constables, apparently because one of them attempted to have sex with him. Obviously it was a lazy Sunday with all the papers primed to cover the World Cup opening, but with it starting too late for morning deadlines, so they nearly all jumped on this story, put it as front page lead and covered it in the most lurid way possible. Every story played up the sodomy angle with the prize being won, hands down, by the Delhi edition of the Telegraph who started their story with a sentence so over the top it deserves some sort of prize. Here it is: "An alleged attempt at sodomy, a beast that is usually buried under the carpet to safeguard the morale of the men in uniform, drove a policeman to gun down five of his colleagues guarding a bank in the capital." I wish some paper had bothered to speak to gay rights activists who might have pointed out that the issue here wasn't sodomy, but attempted rape. God knows there would be plenty of women - or men - who could only have wished to have guns and axes (the weapons Lepcha used) at their disposal when they were being raped. Lepcha did and used them - this is not to condone the murders, but to place them in a slightly more reasonable context. But then the next day's stories went even more bonkers with claims that medical examination had shown that Lepcha was regularly being sodomised (so why go amok now?) and that the bank vault was a regular site for gay orgies. I've heard of plenty of locations being used for gay sex, but this is the first time for a bank vault - I guess its just another kind of locker room! There was also a HT edit that spoke vaguely about the real problems being the ones of lonely men posted far from home and suffering stress and boredom. I suppose it was expecting too much for them to talk about the need to accept same sex relations in the armed forces. But its made me think, what do people know about it in India? There's certainly anecdotal evidence of it happening, and perhaps indirect proof by way of the rising incidence of HIV in the armed forces. Then of course there are all the stories from queens who love going cruising near army and navy bases (never hear anything about air force, I wonder why). I also remember years back there was this really nice navy guy who was posted in Bombay who used to come to GB events - Bala and some others might remember him - who told us about the sort of same sex activity happening on the bases and how worried he was about the lack of condoms. He really wanted to do something to sensitise people in the navy about this, but he was discouraged by the sheer impossibility of changing attitudes and any chance of being open, and finally he sent us a sad mail saying he realised it was better he cut all ties. I wonder what has happened to him now? Does anyone have more stories about being gay in the Indian armed forces? Vikram PS: One aspect of Lepcha's story confuses me, well many aspects do, but this is a factual one. Is he in the armed forces or the police force? And if the latter, why is he described as being part of a battalion - are the police also organised in battalions? And why would a Sikkin police battalion be posted in Delhi? Indian Express story: Sikkim cop kills 5 jawans, cries sodomy Shooting at Dena Bank at dawn; accused Nari Lepcha called police from his mobile, tried to accuse colleague of crime New Delhi, March 11: A constable of the Sikkim Police's India Reserve Battalion posted in the treasury of a bank here, shot dead five of his colleagues early this morning, alleging that they had tried to sodomise him. After the murders, Nari Lepcha called the police from his mobile phone and tried to mislead them, accusing another Sikkim police constable of the murders. After extensive questioning, he allegedly admitted to committing the crime himself. Police officers told Newsline that they received a call at 4.50 am that gunshots had been heard at the Dena Bank branch opposite Golcha Cinema in Daryaganj. They reached the spot to find five bodies on the second floor of the building that functions as the bank's treasury. The victims are Lance Naik Kumar Basnett and constables Bishal Tiwari, Laxman Subba, Karma Bhutia and Santabir Tamang. Strangely, apart from bullet injuries, the bodies also bore wounds imparted by an axe. An officer on the site told Newsline that it appeared that the axe was used after the gun to ensure that no one survived. Three of the bodies were on charpoys, one on the floor, and another in an adjoining room. Some bottles of liquor were also found on the premises. Police found Nari Lepcha, one of the jawans on duty, had survived with a minor injury on his shoulder. Although
g_b Gaybombay Special Meeting on Financial Planning on 18/3
Gaybombay Special Meeting on Financial Planning on 18/3 Venue: Zouk, Andheri East Time: 4-7 pm, including tea and snacks Cost: zero This Sunday's GB meeting will be a special one on the importance of financial planning for people in the queer community. This is in line with our other special meetings which have tackled subjects like safe sex, STDs, depression in the community, legal issues facing the community. long term relationships in the community and, of course, our most popular ones, the parents' meets. In this series, financial planning may seem a bit of an odd choice: why should gay and lesbian people need to think about financial planning more than other people? Well perhaps its the living in the moment thing: for every queer person who has carefully planned their investments, there seem to be many more who haven't even started thinking about them. Or perhaps its the lack of having someone else to plan with: even most straight people usually don't think of financial planning until they're married and have kids. Whatever the reasons, financial planning is a must and if you haven't started doing it, all the more reason to come to this point. The discussion for this meet will be lead by Bala, who's an ace at taking a practical approach to financial planning - how to do it properly and covering all bases, without it necessarily taking up all your time and energy. To give an indication of the areas we'll cover I'm putting below a cute write up that Binay had done for our last meet, slightly adapted. Details of how to get to Zouk will be put out on the GB website and the formal list announcement. If you have any more queries about this meeting, please mail me at [EMAIL PROTECTED] Why Financial planning ? Well dear its just like Safe SEX. You don't like hearing about it, thinking about it or having to practise it. But you really have no choice. SO don't say Its not for ME ? Or I am too young to bother about this ? Well sorry but Like SAFE SEX there are no exclusions. Its vital for your own protection and well being of the people you love. The bottom line is You just have to do it. So all those questions you never wanted to bother about ... 1) Do I need Insurance ? How much ? Why do they have so many types to confuse me? Anyways my credit card comes with insurance ? 2) I need to have a house of my own. How do i plan for that? lets be practical not all of us are lucky enough to get them as gifts. And what do i do with all my credit card bills - they just never seem to stop coming - you can't expect me not to shop. 3) Who will take care of me when I am 'not so young'? Does life insurance make sense (especially if I won't have much of a life)? And what sort of medical insurance will I need? 4) So Ok I need to save & invest. But what next. What do I do with my savings ? How much do i invest , when do I invest , where do i invest ? so many choices so many numbers do u really expect a queen to decide ? 5) And what about all the tax stuff ? I need help - I better hire a cute accountant (Is there any such thing?!)
g_b Save Santa and Banta!
Santa and Banta jokes may soon be banned! Before that happens, here's the one gay Santa and Banta joke I've heard: Banta: Mainu lagda hai ki ji I am homo sexual. Santa: How? Banta: Oji, I have sex only at home. Santa: Te le, I am bisexual. I have sex with kamvali bai only.
g_b from Details: Why Gay Men Make the Best Bosses
Obviously I'd like to believe the contention in this piece, but I have to say I'm slightly dubious. First, I don't know why sexuality has to be singled out like this, even in a positive way. Some people are good bosses because their personalities are like that, and they could be gay or straight or any of the shades in between. Even if one allows, just for the sake of discussion, that sexuality might make a difference in your workplace skills, I still don't see why this should automatically make gay men better bosses. The article quotes a writer saying "Gay people are constantly having to dodge and weave and assess how and where they're going as they grow up. And that manifests itself as three huge skills: adaptability, intuitive communications, and creative problem-solving." And yes, I can see how that happens, but against it I can put other things. I know gay men who become so obsessed with controlling all aspects of their lives that it probably seeps into their work as well, making them annoying bosses. And if straight men can be affected by sexy women colleagues, gay men will be affected by sexy male colleagues - and that doesn't just have to manifest itself as sexually harassing them, as one nasty stereotype has it. In fact it can go the other way. You can be so scared of seeming to sexually harass someone that you just seize up and become ultra formal. I know that I'm not always comfortable around really good looking colleagues - not because I'm afraid I'll let go and ravish them, but because I often do become tongue tied and nervous around really good looking guys, whether at parties or the workplace. My own, very limited experience, of being a boss was certainly not great. Years back when I worked in advertising I had two people working under me - one, a guy, with who I got on famously (he was completely straight and I wasn't attracted to him, but he was cool and we became friends) and a woman with who, well, I did not. Normally I get on very well with women, but this one was just a cow and I loathed her and since I didn't know how to deal with women, I just stopped dealing with her and ended up doing most of her work. And I was doing most of the guy's work too because we were friends and I wasn't delegating to him as I should have. As might be expected my career as a boss was not great and it was one of the reasons that pushed me to leave advertising and become a journalist where I was careful never to get into a situation where I have people working under me. But this is me, and I can think of other gay guys who are probably great bosses. So what do people think - does your sexuality affect your ability to be a boss? And what have your experiences been? Vikram Why Gay Men Make the Best Bosses America's most desirable managers all have one thing in common: homosexuality. Read our take then post your comments below. By Danielle Sacks http://men.style.com/details/blogs/details/workplace_sexuality/index.h tml Only three months into his senior manager gig at a Fortune 500 company, Matthew Klein was in way over his head. "I finally walked into my boss's office, threw my hands in the air, and said, 'I'm feeling totally overwhelmed and inadequate,'" he explains. "I basically had a breakdown." Many managers would have reacted to such a display by telling him to get back out there and grow a pair. But Klein's boss had the opposite reaction: First he reassured Klein he was doing a great job, then he helped him prioritize his workload so that it became manageable. "It's not like he's this fuzzy guy who would reach across the table and hug you in a meetinghe's tough as nails," says Klein of Robert Ollander-Krane, who is director of learning and development for the company. "But he allowed me to be completely honest about my circumstances. Now we have this huge foundation of trust." Wouldn't that be nicea boss who actually gave a damn. And while it's not conclusive, evidence suggests that one of the reasons Ollander- Krane is so effective is that he's part of a new breedgay managers who could be becoming America's most desirable bosses. In The G Quotient: Why Gay Executives Are Excelling as Leaders . . . and What Every Manager Needs to Know, author and USC business-school professor Kirk Snyder argues that gay bosses embody a style of personalized attention that allows high-maintenance Gen Xers and Yers to maximize their performance. "Gay executives tend to look at how each individual brings unique abilities, and they see their job as figuring out how best to take advantage of those skills," he says. In fact, during Snyder's five-year study of American executives, he stumbled on some startling findings: Gay male bosses produce 35 to
g_b tribute to Auden: A.E.Housman
A.E.Housman No one, not even Cambridge was to blame (Blame if you like the human situation): Heart-injured in North London, he became The Latin Scholar of his generation. Deliberately he chose the dry-as-dust, Kept tears like dirty postcards in a drawer; Food was his public love, his private lust Something to do with violence and the poor. In savage foot-notes on unjust editions He timidly attacked the life he led, And put the money of his feelings on The uncritical relations of the dead, Where only geographical divisions Parted the coarse hanged soldier from the don. W.H.Auden One gay poet writing on another. Apart from their sexuality, and the fact that both did badly at Oxford, Housman and Auden could not have been more different. Housman repressed his feelings, had few friends and presented a remote, cold personality, keeping all his feelings for his poems. Auden was warm, outgoing and relatively open for those times about his sexuality. But this difference didn't prevent Auden from achieving a sympathetic understanding of Housman in this poem (though not without one rather bitchy swipe at Housman's sexual preoccupations with soldiers and labourers.. "his private lust/ Something to do with violence and the poor." Check that carefully calibrated disdain in "something"!). The poem is a potted biography of Housman. He was a brilliant classics student at school and got a scholarship to Oxford, where he was also a brilliant scholar. Yet he failed his final exams, quite possibly because of the heartbreak of being rejected by his friend Moses Jackson, the love of his life. He went to London to work, leading a self consciously arid life at the Patents Office, but continuing his Latin studies on the side. Here to though he chose a particularly dull Latin poet to specialise in, but his criticism was brilliant, though really savage - his essays are worth reading just for their brutality. All Housman's anger at life seemed to work itself out through the essays. His essays finally got him the recognition he deserved, "The Latin Scholar of his generation", and he became a professor, first in London, then Cambridge. Meanwhile the emotions which he didn't permit himself to indulge in - "Kept tears like dirty postcards in a drawer" in Auden's wonderful line - came through in his poems. Housman was death obsessed and his poems are full of hanged men, dead soldiers, athletes all cut off in their prime. Auden suggests this stemmed from his unhappiness with life, where all the problems of being homosexual and unable to find love made him idealise death where everyone could be equal and all things possible. This could not have been further from Auden's view, at least when he was young, but he could understand it enough to write of it in his tribute to Housman. Vikram
g_b tribute to Auden: Truth of Love
XII. Truth of Love
(from Twelve Songs)
Some say that love's a little boy,
And some say it's a bird,
Some say it makes the world go round,
And some say that's absurd,
And when I asked the man next--door,
Who looked as if he knew,
His wife got very cross indeed,
And said it wouldn't do.
Does it look like a pair of pyjamas,
Or the ham in a temperance hotel?
Does its odour remind one of lammas,
Or has it a comforting smell?
Is it prickly to touch as a hedge is,
Or soft as eiderdown fluff?
Is it sharp or quite smooth at the edges?
O tell me the truth of love.
Our history books refer to it
In cryptic little notes,
It's quite a common topic on
The Transatlantic boats;
I've found the subject mentioned in
Accounts of suicides,
And even seen it scribbled on
The backs of railway--guides.
Does it howl like a hungry Alsatian,
Or boom like a military band?
Could one give a first--rate imitation
On a saw or a Steinway Grand?
Is its singing at parties a riot?
Does it only like Classical stuff?
Will it stop when one wants to be quiet?
O tell me the truth about love.
I looked inside the summer--house;
It wasn't ever there:
I tried the Thames at Maidenhead,
And Brighton's bracing air.
I don't know what the blackbird sang,
Or what the tulip said;
But it wasn't in the chicken--run,
Or underneath the bed.
Can it pull extraordinary faces?
Is it usually sick on a swing?
Does it spend all its time at the races,
Or fiddling with pieces of spring?
Has it views of its own about money?
Does it think Patriotism enough?
Are its stories vulgar or funny?
O tell me the truth about love.
When it comes, will it come without warning
Just as I'm picking my nose?
Will it knock on my door in the morning,
Or tread in the bus on my toes?
Will it come like a change in the weather?
Will its greeting be courteous or rough?
Will it alter my life altogether?
O tell me the truth about love.
W.H.Auden
A lighter poem, and one that shows Auden's technical skill with
writing different types of verse, including a jogging along song like
this. And note the teasing possible gay reference in the first
lines: "And when I asked the man next-door,/ Who looked as if he
knew,/ His wife got very cross indeed,/And said it wouldn't do."
Auden wrote a lot of lighter verse, and this poem with its satirical
lines ("It's quite a common topic on/ The Transatlantic boats") or
absurd images seems to be one of them. But perhaps because its Auden
writing it, one gets a sense of something more being said, a feeling,
sometimes menacing, sometimes (as in this poem) yearning beneath the
light words.
Underneath the easy surface this poem is asking painful questions
about the nature of love and how little we know of it. Will it
happen? How will we recognise when it happens? How much will it
change us when it happens? What happens if it never happens? Do we
want it to happen if we don't know what will happen when it happens?
All questions we ask ourselves all the time.
Vikram
g_b Romeo without Juliet coming soon
Forgot where I saw this news item but it sounds very promising. Apart from the general idea of a Romeo with a male lover being cool, the fact that its going to come from Matthew Bourne makes it all that more exciting. How many people here have seen his version of Swan Lake with male swans, on film, or if they were really lucky, in read life? I saw the film (the BCL has a copy, I think) and it was quite amazing. The swans, men with bare torsos and feathered leggings, were really hot and the main swan, danced by Adam Cooper, was just incredibly sexy. More than just the hunk factor though the way the story of the ballet was worked out to suit the male swans idea was fascinating (lots of swipes at British royalty) and by the time you came to the main duet between the prince and the swan the idea of it being done between two men had stopped seeming like a gimmick, but something quite natural and exciting within the storyline - as well as being amazingly hot. I wonder if a film like this could be shown at our film screenings. Our screenings happen so rarely (next is on April 1st) and there's always so much good stuff to show that we tend to stick to more conventional films. Would people sit through over an hour and a half of ballet, no words, just dance and music, but with hot guys? Vikram Gay Romeo ballet gives Juliet kiss-off Steven Swinford ALAS, poor Juliet. Matthew Bourne, Britain's most successful choreographer, is to give Romeo a male lover in a gay version of the romantic tragedy. Bourne, whose all-male Swan Lake has enthralled audiences for more than a decade, is again using an all-male cast for Romeo, Romeo his version of Prokofiev's ballet Romeo and Juliet, based on the Shakespeare play. For Bourne, 47, the challenge is to portray a convincing gay relationship in dance. He said last week: "It's more to do with dancing than with sexuality. A male dancer, whether he's gay or straight, fits into a relationship with a female partner very happily. "Getting away from that, making a convincing love duet, a romantic, sexual duet, for two men that is comfortable to do and comfortable to watch I don't know if you can. I've never seen it done." Bourne's Swan Lake, in which all the swans and cygnets are male, was first staged at Sadler's Wells theatre in London in 1995, and became the longest-running ballet in London's West End and on Broadway. But although it was critically celebrated, Bourne has long had concerns that it was short of being a true homosexual work of art, since many of the performers were not playing people. He said: "I have a way of approaching it so as to make it I hate to say `acceptable', it's a terrible thing to say but so that people don't run screaming from the theatre. I let them find their own way with it, take it as far as they want in their own heads." While a gay interpretation of Romeo and Juliet has the potential to be more provocative, critics have often pointed to homosexual undertones in Shakespeare's work. Many of his sonnets were addressed to a young man, and there has also been speculation about the sexuality of the lead male characters in Romeo and Juliet, particularly Mercutio, Romeo's best friend, and Benvolio, his cousin. Bourne plans to improvise movements and scenes for Romeo, Romeo with small groups of dancers later this summer. If successful, rehearsals with the whole company could begin next year. Since West Side Story translated Romeo and Juliet to the gang warfare of 1950s New York City, the play has often been reinterpreted. In 1996, Baz Luhrmann, the director, cast Leonardo DiCaprio and Claire Danes in the title roles, retaining the poetry, but updating the story to replace rapiers with pistols.
g_b tribute to Auden: Since
Since On a mid-December day, frying sausages for myself, I abruptly felt under fingers thirty years younger the rim of a steering wheel, on my cheek the parching wind of an August noon, as passenger beside me You as then you were. Slap across a veg-growing alluvial plain we raced in clouds of white dust, and geese fled screaming as we missed them by inches, making a bee-line for mountains gradually enlarging eastward, joyfully certain nightfall would occasion joy. It did. In a flagged kitchen we were served boiled trout and a rank cheese: for a while we talked by the fire, then, carrying candles, climbed steep stairs. Love was made then and there: so halcyoned, soon we fell asleep to the sound of a river swabbling through a gorge. Since then, other enchantments have blazed and faded, enemies changed their address, and War made ugly an uncountable number of unknown neighbors, precious as us to themselves: but round your image there is no fog, and the Earth can still astonish. Of what, then, should I complain, pottering about a neat suburban kitchen? Solitude? Rubbish! Its social enough with real faces and landscapes for whose friendly countenance I at least can learn to live with obesity and a little fame. W.H.Auden One of Auden's later poems, written in 1965. By then his relationship with Chester Kallman had settled into a regular, though not terribly happy pattern. They were still a couple and Auden at least considered himself married to Kallman, but they had long stopped sleeping together. Perhaps Kallman didn't love Auden equally (according to Auden - its odd how little one hears Kallman's views in so much writing on Auden), perhaps he no longer found him sexually attractive, perhaps he was champing at being always seen as Auden's appendage when he sought to be a creative artist himself. So they still continued to spend part of the year together in the house Auden had bought in Austria, but for the rest Auden went to the US, and Kallman went to Greece where at some point he had another lover. Auden accepted the situation and found other lovers for sex. The situation did make him a little bitter though, bringing out all his old insecurities about himself and his complicated feelings about his sexuality. But he never doubted that Kallman was the love of his life and his partner, and it was moments like the one recorded in his poem that kept this constancy. The poem is of a memory that becomes almost a vision, of a time long back when they were first in love and of a perfect moment at that perfect time. Since then things have changed much, in the world and with them, but the memory of that perfect moment, of "You as then you were" has not. And that sustains the poet through all the changes and disappointments of time. Auden knew that love often turns out disappointing, but that disappointment should not negate the reality of what had once happened. To have known real love at least once is to know that "the Earth/ can still astonish" and life has meaning. As to the rest its just living and can be done easily enough. With practice one can even "learn/ to live with obesity/ and a little fame." Vikram
g_b from Mid-Day: patronising concern & excellent reply
My YahooGroups account was giving problems or I would have posted this earlier. Last Sunday Mid-Day published a superficially supportive, but in fact deeply patronising mail from a reader, Sunita Banerjee, on homosexuality, which I've pasted below. Ms.Banerjee certainly seems well-meaning (more so than Dr.Mohana Krishnaswamy who made a similar in the Hindu a few months back), but in her conviction that homosexuality is a problem, and the medical gibberish she cites to support this, she ends up subverting her larger intention. In the general course of things I think we should be happy for any support we get, but not this kind. Luckily, Umesh Mehendale, who I think is on some of these lists posted an excellent, dignified and succinct response, which I've pasted below hers. So congratulations Umesh for that quick response, and if anyone else wants to add to his reply you can mail Mid-Day at [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please give a definite name and address, and as always, such letters stand a higher chance of being published if they are polite and to the point. Lets not lose this chance to prove to Ms.Banerjee that while we want support, we don't want to be patronised with misinformed attitudes either, Vikram from Mid-Day, 31/3/2007: Don't persecute homosexuals Sunita Banerjee says homosexuality is a medical problem and should be treated that way http://epapers2.mid-day.com/midday/scripts/epaper/epapermain.aspx? queryed=9&eddate=4/4/2007 I READ a report in the MiDDAY recently that a serial killer had targeted his victims because they were homosexuals. It was reported that homosexuality is not accepted in Christianity and Islam and that ''the killer had acted under the influence of a religious leader, who bayed for the blood of homosexuals.'' It is important for us to know that homosexuality is the result of an imbalance in the chromosomes. Homosexuals who say they feel feminine are said to have an excess of the 'X' (female) chromosomes, over the 'Y' (male) chromosomes. This is a medical problem that must be treated as such. The medical fraternity should pay attention to this problem and find a solution to cure the imbalance and help homosexuals lead a normal life. I have read reports quoting an Italian minister as saying that homosexuality is a sin. A prominent American woman was also quoted as saying something similar. Some religious groups label homosexuality as immoral. This is utter nonsense. I remember my father telling me once that nature does play tricks. None other than the renowned British naturalist Charles Darwin had said that nature can be cruel. Homosexuality may be repulsive to some. But it is a medical problem for those who suffer it and they need help to set it right. Contrary to what some people propagate, homosexuality is not a Western phenomena. It must be mentioned that a British scientist of the 19th century committed suicide following persecution for being a homosexual. I, therefore, appeal to religious leaders to explain the problem to the members of their community, so that homosexuals are not treated cruelly. Rather, we ought to help them overcome the problem. Sunita Banerjee lives at Bhulabhai Desai Road. --- Misconceptions about homosexuality http://epapers2.mid-day.com/midday/scripts/epaper/epapermain.aspx? queryed=9&eddate=4/4/2007 I REFER to the message 'Don't persecute homosexuals' from Sunita Banerjee (MyNEWS, March 31). While I appreciate her sentiments, warning those who ridicule homosexuals, Banerjee is incorrect when she describes homosexuality as a medical problem. Homosexuality is in fact regarded as a biological condition. There are many myths about homosexual persons. A homosexual person is not abnormal. Homosexuals are normal people with a different sexual orientation. The problem occurs when a homosexual person is compelled to comply with the rules of society (in fact family pressure) to marry, and in this process may ruin his/her own life, as well as that of the person he/she is married to. Umesh Mehendale Goregaon umeshmehendale@ yahoo.co.in ---
g_b mail to Mallya and response
Like Aditya I had written to Vijay Mallya about his comments on Koffee with Karan. I've given my letter below, along with a couple of media articles that have appeared so far. I sent my letter to him privately through two people I know who work with him, one in his corporate communications department and one with his political work. Both of them were genuinely shocked since they said the remark was quite at odds with Mallya's generally easygoing attitude. They promised to do their best to bring my letter to his notice, and I too took pains to write the letter in as constructive a spirit as possible. I have to say that I was disappointed with the time Mallya took to get back. In fact it looked like he was not going to get back at all, perhaps mostly because he was so busy, but also because he didn't seem to take this issue seriously. I think it was only thanks to the pressure from my two contacts that he finally responded today, and I really must acknowledge their help for that. So here it is. Its something that we got a response at all, though its hardly the most wonderful of responses: -- Clarification from Dr.Vijay Mallya. "This remark was made on the spur of the moment. To me personally, homosexuality may be distasteful but I have absolutely nothing against it. I have many many gay friends." (Statement issued through Prakash Mirpuri, senior general manager, corporate media relations, UB Group) -- The question we need to think about is whether and how to take this forward. Given the problems getting even this from Mallya I very much doubt we're likely to get anything more. We could count it as a gain that he was at least made to confront it, realise that he offended people and offer a clarification, however half-hearted. Its not nothing. Also, we need to be practical. Our chances of affecting Mallya through a boycott of his airline or products in India are next to negligible. He is simply too large, and our leverage as consumers is simply too nonexistent for it to make a difference. And something like a demonstration against him might even benefit him - he's a publicity hound and having us against him might suit his hypermacho image. That, at least, is how I see it. Personally I think the only thing we can do is use this over the long term, pointing to his instinctive reaction, to his long delay in responding and to the grudging way he responded when he did, as proof of his lack of tolerance for diversity. And in the long run that will affect him if he has real ambitions for going global. At the moment Mallya has left for the UK where he's negotiating to buy Whyte and Mackay. UB is selling Kingfisher there and over there its a small brand, not a big one. He's trying to attract global managers, and get taken seriously as a global manager. So how long can he continue acting in India in a way that goes against global best practices? Mallya is always trying for a cool, young image, but he should realise that cool, young people around the world no longer share his prejudices. Also, lets not get too hung up on Mallya, just one macho jerk among many. The only difference is that he actually said what many people think and in a way I'm almost grateful to him for that. Its given us an example to take up this issue and bring more attention to in the media, both in India and abroad. I'm certainly telling my contacts in the media in Bombay about it and trying to get them to do stories. That's my take on Mallya remark and clarification. What do others feel? Vikram -- My original letter to Mallya: Dear Dr.Mallya, I'm a Mumbai based journalist, but I'm writing this entirely in my private capacity, as one of the organisers of Gaybombay, a support group for gay men in this city. You can see our website at www.gaybombay.org I think I'm speaking for a lot of people in saying that I was really disappointed to hear your reaction to Karan Johar's question in the rapid-fire round of his show, when you replied to his one word question of "Homosexuality?" with a very heartfelt sounding "UGH!" Immediately after the show I got calls from people expressing their dismay. On Tuesday Sarita Tanwar who edits the HitList section of Mid- Day in Mumbai write a piece that summed up this sentiment very well, which I'll paste below. Dr.Mallya, no one would deny your right to express your views, and no one would deny that homophobia exists quite openly in India. But like Sarita and so many others, we are srurprised to find it coming from you. Its comes from the the sort of ultra-conservative, intolerant, moralistic mindset that one would not associate with the cosmopolitan, open minded sort of businessman that you have always seemed to be. For this re
