on 10/17/01 6:08 AM, Paul Ilechko [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Whatever Jon is or isn't is not my place to say, but I think I
was pretty
clear that we are NOT looking to dump a project on Apache, that we ARE
continuing to work on ASPizer and support it, and have described the
commitment
Here is my proposal for new project creation guidelines. I have not linked
it into the main site until I can get 3 +1 votes from the PMC and 0 -1 votes
from the PMC.
http://jakarta.apache.org/site/newproject.html
I will accept any patches against this document and/or direct commits from
PMC
From: Avi Cherry [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Instead, he
questioned the motives of the developer offering their code, implying
that he was being selfish in wanting to have the Apache group take
the project in. This was obviously not his intent,
It might have been obvious to you, but it
on 10/17/01 9:36 PM, Tim Vernum [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
When I first read the original mail my reaction was Someone with
a homeless project looking for an owner.
I must be tainted from having been around here so long. I see right through
his proposal.
In fact Paul's most recent mail says
On Mon, 15 Oct 2001, Jon Stevens wrote:
| on 10/15/01 11:15 AM, Paul Ilechko [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
|
| Peter and Jon, thanks for the feedback, sorry I didn't get a chance to respond
| sooner.
|
| A few comments:
|
| ASPizer is currently a production quality product, and in fact is being
Endre,
Although Jon might not be the most politically-correct person around,
he is usually right. Jon is correct to observe that Jakarta is not a
dumping ground for .bomb projects.
I am very grateful to Jon for having the courage to speak up his
mind. One might be crititical of Jon but he
--- Ceki Gulcu [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Endre,
Although Jon might not be the most politically-correct person around,
he is usually right. Jon is correct to observe that Jakarta is not a
dumping ground for .bomb projects.
Project X is written because it is useful to Company Y.
I am very grateful to Jon for having the courage to speak up his
mind.
It is only a pity when he speaks his mind BEFORE making his mind.
Sometimes his remarks just have no grounds because he did not study
a subject before talking about it. And this seems to be the case.
OTOH, one sure can
On Wed, 17 Oct 2001, Ceki Gulcu wrote:
|
| Endre,
|
| Although Jon might not be the most politically-correct person around,
| he is usually right. Jon is correct to observe that Jakarta is not a
| dumping ground for .bomb projects.
Of course it's not a dumping ground.
This is about whether the
Alex McLintock at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Project X is written because it is useful to Company Y.
Company Y attempts to market Project X because they think it is useful to
others.
Company Y decides they wont get enough money for Project X
Company Y offers Project X to the Opensource
I think there may be a problem with searching in the bug database. I know
that bug 1669 contains the word deadlock in its summary. If I search for
deadlocK in the database, however, it returns no bugs. I tried searching
for substrings instead, such as lock. In this case bugs whose summaries
Whatever Jon is or isn't is not my place to say, but I think I was pretty clear that
we are NOT looking to dump a project on Apache, that we ARE continuing to work on
ASPizer and support it, and have described the commitment we expect to make. Now, if
anyone wants to look more closely at the
On Tuesday, October 16, 2001, at 07:03 PM, Clark Richey wrote:
I am trying to connect Tomcat 4.0 to IIS with little luck. Can anyone
point
me to some documentation on how to do this or provide me with
instructions?
the help you need can best be found on the tomcat-user list.
- robert
Endre,
Of course it's not a dumping ground.
This is about whether the Open Source Community at Apache would be
interested in a project. Starting the debate from Apache's side with such
crude, ugly, disrespectful remarks like Jon's coming up with is just not
fair. This company is dumping a
on 10/17/01 9:24 AM, Pier Fumagalli [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Nothing, but from a community standpoint, the ASF would rather incorporate
projects that are not backed up by a self-sustained open-development
community... Look at our last addition, Log4J, it was an IBM project, they
dumped it,
on 10/17/01 6:08 AM, Paul Ilechko [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Whatever Jon is or isn't is not my place to say, but I think I was pretty
clear that we are NOT looking to dump a project on Apache, that we ARE
continuing to work on ASPizer and support it, and have described the
commitment we
In message [EMAIL PROTECTED], Ceki Gulcu writes:
Coming back to the issue at hand, if ASPizer authors are truly
committed to open source and the Apache model, they should counter
Jon's remarks and justify the reasons why their product should be part
of Jakarta.
...
I did not read anyone but Jon
on 10/17/01 9:35 AM, Ceki Gulcu [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Jakarta is not a dumping ground for .bomb projects. Untactful?
Yes. Accurate statement? Yes.
Let me point out that I tried tact the first time I responded:
There is nothing in your proposal discussion WHY you would want to give this
Jon,
This is a nice entry for the FAQ you are talking about. It is quite
reasonable and all.
Copying and pasting this somewhere and putting the corresponding
question before it is better than nothing and you get an URL to use
next time the problem pops up.
I quite like your well tempered
On Wed, 17 Oct 2001, Ceki Gulcu wrote:
| As a coder, I've mentioned before, he's apparently very good. And his
| observations and whatnot are also _insightful_, but nothing more.
|Why not just package things just a little bit nicer? Or just whatever?
| Be a bit more polite? Be, you know,
On Wed, 17 October 2001, Jon Stevens wrote:
Let me point out that I tried tact the first time I responded:
There is nothing in your proposal discussion WHY you would want to give this
to the ASF other than because you think you have a cool product. Nor is
there anything that suggests
on 10/17/01 1:21 PM, Endre Stølsvik [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Jon's last post is just so very much better. Why not start with something
like that? It's still pretty direct, but in a much nicer, somewhat
diplomatic way.
I did start nice. How come you choose to ignore that?
I'm not. It's
on 10/17/01 12:42 PM, Paul Ilechko [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Actually, I responded to all your points, then you decided it was time to
insult us, at which point it no longer seemed worthwhile responding to you at
all. Fortunately, not everyone on the list has the same attitude problem.
You
At 22:21 17.10.2001 +0200, Endre Stølsvik wrote:
On Wed, 17 Oct 2001, Ceki Gulcu wrote:
| As a coder, I've mentioned before, he's apparently very good. And his
| observations and whatnot are also _insightful_, but nothing more.
|Why not just package things just a little bit nicer? Or just
At 12:42 17.10.2001 -0700, Paul Ilechko wrote:
On Wed, 17 October 2001, Jon Stevens wrote:
Let me point out that I tried tact the first time I responded:
There is nothing in your proposal discussion WHY you would want to give this
to the ASF other than because you think you have a cool
on 10/17/01 12:24 PM, Paul Ilechko [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
No, this is not what we said. We said we cannot fund taking the product to
market, which is vastly different than being able to fund development. We are
primarily a consulting company, and we have used ASPizer for a client project.
Let me quote you:
However, due to various economic factors such as the decline in the ASP
market and the recent difficulties in obtaining venture capital, we have
decided that at this time it is not feasible for is to continue in that
direction.
And:
We intend to continue to provide
-Original Message-
From: Ceki Gülcü [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Wednesday, October 17, 2001 11:54 PM
I am sorry but what insult are you referring to?
Calling someone's hard-worked project .bomb, without even
trying to get informed about it.
Does this qualify?
Have fun,
on 10/17/01 4:29 PM, Paulo Gaspar [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Calling someone's hard-worked project .bomb, without even
trying to get informed about it.
Does this qualify?
It is a .bomb project though. I have an entire corporation of them (yes, I
am the proud owner of a rather large worthless
I don't have any more time for this. End of discussion. I'm not going to
change my mind.
-1
My suggestion:
Put your project on SourceForget.net. There is another project there that is
now hugely successful that we also rejected here and which I hosted for a
number of years on my own dime, the
Jon justifiably told Ranjit Mathew that Jakarta
was not a dumping ground. He also outlined that unlikely promises were not
good enough. While one may criticize his direct style, Jakarta is not a
popularity contest.
As an unbiased observer, I fully support Jon's behavior here and appreciate his
Daniel Rall wrote:
ASPizer guys: you have the option to re-submit your proposal in a
manner which directly addresses the questions raised here. People do
sometimes change their minds when presented with a comprehensive set
of information in a format desirable to them.
+1
Just remember,
At 8:00 PM -0400 10/17/01, Scott Tacares wrote:
I don't care if he was here before time and space there is no excuse! He
does damage to the entire open source community with his crude and
unjustified remarks. It makes people shy away from participating in fear
that he may belittle them, this is
In message
[EMAIL PROTECTED], Endre
Stølsvik [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes
I'm not. It's trying to point something out to Jon, actually. But he
definately does have a load of followers in this forum, protecting his 5
years earned rights to be rude. But I do know that there is several other
people
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