Cocoon GetTogether 2004 (11-12/Oct) open for registration

nfo is available at http://www.orixo.com/events/gt2004/ Further information enquiries can be sent to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cheers, , Orixo GT organizing puppet -- Steven Noelshttp://outerthought.org/ Outerthought - Open Source Java & XMLAn Orixo Member Read my w

Re: Scalability and oversight (Was: Just in case you're curious)

- http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0061015725/), it's funny to try and invent some parallels between open source software communities and the agent swarms outlined in his novel. Freaky. -- Steven Noelshttp://outerthought.org/ Outerthought - Open Source

Re: karma for jakarta-site

they know what is happening. In good faith, I added you to the avail file, so you should be all set. -- Steven Noelshttp://outerthought.org/ Outerthought - Open Source Java & XMLAn Orixo Member Read my weblog athttp://blogs.cocoondev.org

Re: Another installment of the "Jakarta bad imports" page is out...

hese stats! -- Steven Noelshttp://outerthought.org/ Outerthought - Open Source, Java & XML Competence Support Center Read my weblog athttp://blogs.cocoondev.org/stevenn/ stevenn at outerthought.orgstevenn

[vote] XMLBeans to enter XML incubation [was: Re: Vote for XMLBeansproposal in the XML Project (was RE: Vote for XMLBeans proposal)]

as a form for this as well, but I cannot locate it anymore -- Steven Noelshttp://outerthought.org/ Outerthought - Open Source, Java & XML Competence Support Center Read my weblog athttp://blogs.cocoondev.org/stevenn/ stevenn at

Re: Vote for XMLBeans proposal

LGPL Piccolo issue is resolved, it seems like we're heading somewhere. Attracting new committers is easier when the project is already under incubation. -- Steven Noelshttp://outerthought.org/ Outerthought - Open Source, Java & XML Competence Support Center

Re: Issues with XMLBeans proposal

to migrate everything to Apache. Presumably in that time they are also getting used to Apache and can develop an understanding of where they feel their project fits best. Not jumping to any conclusion, I'm very happy to see a positive and constructive discussion happening. Thanks, all.

Re: [VOTE] Howard Lewis Ship PMC Nomination

On 4/07/2003 0:08 Henri Yandell wrote: He's a multi-millionaire who we're being nice to in the hope that he'll start paying us all full time wages to work from home for Apache. Yuck. I want power as well, not money. Bo for Howard! The King is dead!

Re: [VOTE] Howard Lewis Ship PMC Nomination

On 4/07/2003 0:03 Henri Yandell wrote: +1 Howard for King +1 Power to Howard. (Who is that guy, BTW?) -- Steven Noelshttp://outerthought.org/ Outerthought - Open Source, Java & XML Competence Support Center Read my weblog athttp://blogs.cocoondev

Re: The vendors page

/she serves his customers well. Suggestion: move this page away from the Jakarta main site, and stimulate subprojects to host their own vendor pages. -- Steven Noelshttp://outerthought.org/ Outerthought - Open Source, Java & XML Competence Support Center Read

Re: Sun copies Jakarta?

ings might also be expected over there, which is good since they won't come knock on our doors then. -- Steven Noelshttp://outerthought.org/ Outerthought - Open Source, Java & XML Competence Support Center Read my weblog athttp://blogs.cocoondev.org/

Re: Sun copies Jakarta?

On 10/06/2003 9:48 Nicola Ken Barozzi wrote: or MS (http://www.gotdotnet.com/community/workspaces/directory.aspx)? Or Sourceforge? Savannah? Diversity is what keeps Darwin's sledgehammer away, IMHO. -- Steven Noelshttp://outerthought.org/ Outerthought - Open S

Re: Sun

On 28/05/2003 16:38 Conor MacNeill wrote: Yeah, prunes will do that. LOL! -- Steven Noelshttp://outerthought.org/ Outerthought - Open Source, Java & XML Competence Support Center Read my weblog athttp://blogs.cocoondev.org/stevenn/ steven

Re: Sun

ather watcher, I'm becoming part of the wind itself. :-D -- Steven Noelshttp://outerthought.org/ Outerthought - Open Source, Java & XML Competence Support Center Read my weblog athttp://blogs.cocoondev.org/stevenn/ stevenn at outerthought.org

Re: Sun

quite feodal by design. If there's one guy to blame for that, it must be Marc, I reckon. But Andy tells me I'm wrong. Oh well. -- Steven Noelshttp://outerthought.org/ Outerthought - Open Source, Java & XML Competence Support Center Read my weblog

Re: Sun

JBoss - the project - being presented at a (large) Java users conference. -- Steven Noelshttp://outerthought.org/ Outerthought - Open Source, Java & XML Competence Support Center Read my weblog athttp://blogs.cocoondev.org/stevenn/ stevenn at outerth

Re: Sun

ith ours. And I believe the testosteroid behaviour of its speaking puppet might be detrimental in the end. There's no black & white and deliberation should be made. -- Steven Noelshttp://outerthought.org/ Outerthought - Open Source, Java & XML Compet

Re: Sun

alid if anyone else would come and present JBoss (the project). Sun should be happy that people create cheap implementations of their APIs. If their own implementations would be any better, they might also be making money of them. ;) Cheers, -- Steven Noelshtt

Re: Sun and the JCP 2.5

s for clarifying this. -- Steven Noelshttp://outerthought.org/ Outerthought - Open Source, Java & XML Competence Support Center Read my weblog athttp://blogs.cocoondev.org/stevenn/ stevenn at outerthought.org

Re: [Proposal] SuperXMailer

executive management consultant rather than these IBMGS wannabees. Respectfully yours, -- Steven Noelshttp://outerthought.org/ Outerthought - Open Source, Java & XML Competence Support Center Read my weblog athttp://blogs.cocoondev.org/stevenn/ ste

Re: [Proposal] SuperXMailer

issy, don't you know? -- Steven Noelshttp://outerthought.org/ Outerthought - Open Source, Java & XML Competence Support Center Read my weblog athttp://blogs.cocoondev.org/stevenn/ stevenn at outerthought.org

Re: [Proposal] SuperXMailer

On 1/04/2003 22:03 Andrew C. Oliver wrote: I'm pleased to finally propose the SuperXMailer for Jakarta via the incubator. :-D Nice one! -- Steven Noelshttp://outerthought.org/ Outerthought - Open Source, Java & XML Competence Support Center Read my

Re: Free java profiler tools for open source projects?

to you.. Sure, please do. If I can be of any assistance w.r.t. Amstelveen: just yell / geef maar een kreet ;-) -- Steven Noelshttp://outerthought.org/ Outerthought - Open Source, Java & XML Competence Support Center Read my weblog at

Re: Free java profiler tools for open source projects?

otisg wrote: That is the one. As good as it looks, it's Windows-only, I guess. Bummer. -- Steven Noelshttp://outerthought.org/ Outerthought - Open Source, Java & XML Competence Support Center Read my weblog athttp://blogs.cocoondev.org/stevenn/ s

Free java profiler tools for open source projects?

remembers. More specifically, I was hoping one of the Java profiler tool vendors like Borland is doing something similar with OptimizeIT. Anyone who remembers that thread, or knows about some freebie Java profiling tool for ASF projects? Thanks, -- Steven Noelshttp://o

Re: New Project

en then, it will be checked for these warning signs. Hope this helps, -- Steven Noelshttp://outerthought.org/ Outerthought - Open Source, Java & XML Competence Support Center Read my weblog athttp://blogs.cocoondev.org/stevenn/ stevenn at outerthought.or

Re: Réf. : Re: cvs checkout on cvs.apache.org doesn't work ...?

[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I can't ping cvs.apache.org. Actually, I have to deal with an http proxy ( and I was'nt aware that cvs doesn't work with ) Is it possible to configure cvs to work with it ? have a look at http://cvsgrab.sourceforge.net/

Re: nice

the naive interpretation of that, but still it's a good way to deal with the so-called 'real-life' without becoming a cynic. -- Steven Noelshttp://outerthought.org/ Outerthought - Open Source, Java & XML Competence Support Center Read my weblog at

Re: Forum Software.

27;t frequest many webbased forums, but I doubt the web paradigm will be scalable enough to offer easy access to this amount of information. -- Steven Noelshttp://outerthought.org/ Outerthought - Open Source, Java & XML Competence Support Center Read my web

Re: New Jakarta proposal: Pluto

too. That makes 3 of us who will make sure Pluto integrates with Cocoon. -- Steven Noelshttp://outerthought.org/ Outerthought - Open Source, Java & XML Competence Support Center Read my weblog athttp://blogs.cocoondev.org/stevenn/ stevenn at ou

Re: New Jakarta proposal: Pluto

Sam Ruby wrote: Steven Noels wrote: > > I was trying not to post the obvious, but yes: this seems largely > premature. Deja vu. What else could one expect ;-) Check back next week for the inevitable complaint that Pluto is too mature. > No code, a restricted communi

Re: New Jakarta proposal: Pluto

Henri Yandell wrote: Is this not-invented-here-ism or maintaining scope? From my part: scope & fairness. -- Steven Noelshttp://outerthought.org/ Outerthought - Open Source, Java & XML Competence Support Center Read my weblog at

Re: New Jakarta proposal: Pluto

de, a restricted community, too much committers coming from one company, I've seen better proposals being fought over lately. Also, possible future integration 'ideas' with some related projects would be comforting (Jetspeed, Tomcat, Struts/Tiles, and the Cocoon portal framework for a s

Re: Incubator home page (was Tapestry)

suggested. I would cut off on 18 chars width. -- Steven Noelshttp://outerthought.org/ Outerthought - Open Source, Java & XML Competence Support Center Read my weblog athttp://blogs.cocoondev.org/stevenn/ stevenn at outerthought.orgsteven

[Fwd: Bounce messages triggering moderation request]

ohale saata. Emaili aadressi [EMAIL PROTECTED] ei eksisteeri! -- peter royal -> [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> For additional commands, e-mail: <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> -- Steven Noelshttp://outerthought.o

Re: GUI of the website, where's an overview? (not simply found)

ly (slowly) working on this: http://cocoon.cocoondev.org/mount/trove/ - which should, amongst others, be dependant on Gump data. I'm going offline for a week or so - but I'll get back to this when I had some progress. -- Steven Noelshttp://outerthought.org/ Outert

Re: Short Apache licence for source files

Ceki Gülcü wrote: -- Ceki, expounding not accusing. Very nicely put. -- Steven Noelshttp://outerthought.org/ Outerthought - Open Source, Java & XML Competence Support Center Read my weblog at http://radio.weblogs.com/0103539/ steven

Re: Short Apache licence for source files

#x27;s just that I don't like it when a discussion gets cut off by someone using that imaginary firewall as a reason - even adding a redirect to some other place where it is deemed more appropriate for the discussion to be held. Oh well ;) -- Steven Noelshtt

Re: Short Apache licence for source files

uestions to the licensing list. -- Steven Noelshttp://outerthought.org/ Outerthought - Open Source, Java & XML Competence Support Center Read my weblog at http://radio.weblogs.com/0103539/ stevenn at outerthought.orgstevenn at apache.org --

Re: Short Apache licence for source files

trolls' thread over at [EMAIL PROTECTED] I now see that my remark has been duly noted, and I can only hope that it somehow penetrates the firewall between us and The Members. -- Steven Noelshttp://outerthought.org/ Outerthought - Open Source, Java & XML Com

Re: Short Apache licence for source files

Ceki Gülcü wrote: I never expected the ASF to falter and fold. However, I do expect the ASF to act reasonably which implies that it can explain/document its decisions. Feeling very patronized if I see such threads...: +1 -- Steven Noelshttp://outerthought.org

Re: Short Apache licence for source files

members... Which is kinda strange since it is the license which _committers_ also need to abide... -- Steven Noelshttp://outerthought.org/ Outerthought - Open Source, Java & XML Competence Support Center Read my weblog at http://radio.weblogs.com/010

Re: Short Apache licence for source files

Nicola Ken Barozzi wrote: Should or must? :-) "Let your yes be yes, no be no" Should means "should". http://www.ietf.org/rfc/rfc2119.txt -- Steven Noelshttp://outerthought.org/ Outerthought - Open Source, Java & XML Competence Support

Re: IDE Developers' guide

; Thanks for your help! >>> >>> -Andy >> >> Great document Andy. >> >> The more idiot guides we have, the less idiots we will have. >> >> -jon > > > You underestimate the idiots. > > Lance If it wasn't for the users, we would no

Re: [DRAFT2] Jakarta Newsletter - June 2002

Rob Oxspring wrote: > Please find attached the xdoc/html/txt versions of the the second draft > (zipped). > Rob, in the HTML version, your name is stated as being 'Oxsping'. Regards (nice work, BTW), -- Steven Noelshttp://outerthought.org/

RE: [PROPOSAL] Committer access and responsibilities...

> From: Jon Scott Stevens [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] > Subject: Re: [PROPOSAL] Committer access and responsibilities... > Strong case in pointthe jakarta.apache.org and > www.apache.org websites > are built with Anakianot that XSLT crap. [shrug] -- To unsubscribe, e-mail:

RE: You guys are so funny.

Pedantic, I know, but here goes anyway: Leo wrote: > Avalon currently uses cocoon (sort of an eat-your-own-dogfood > case), and > other developers would like this to stay that way. There is a tool(4) > that does the same thing as the jakarta project, created by > people from > xml.apache. The to

RE: You guys are so funny.

Jon wrote: > on 5/2/02 11:52 AM, "Andrew C. Oliver" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > 1. I need something that supports XSL in my build framework > > Somehow I doubt that. > > -jon I will submit this thread as background material for my JSR proposal based upon the existing JSR-57: "Long-Term Pers

RE: You guys are so funny.

Jon wrote: > People > -- > > Needless to say, the attitudes here are becoming more and > more familiar. > Andrew reminds me of the early days of dealing with Peter > Donald (credit to > Peter for eventually coming to his senses...I think joining > the PMC helped). > Steven reminds me of P

RE: [PROPOSAL] Centaven and Friends (was Re: You make the decision(was Re: Quick! convert all your projects to maven!))

Leo wrote: > However, the implicit argument "home-brewn solutions are worse than > standards" simply doesn't always hold true. It doesn't here. Both XSLT > and DVSL are here at Apache, which, for me, is enough of a "standard". > > Basically, all this is to point out masquerading of egotism > as t

RE: [PROPOSAL] Centaven and Friends (was Re: You makethedecision(was Re: Quick! convert all your projects to maven!))

Jon wrote: > on 5/2/02 12:22 AM, "Steven Noels" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > My point is that projects are being attacked here *solely* > because they > > prefer XSLT instead of DVSL. > > Where the heck did you see someone being 'attacked&#

RE: [PROPOSAL] Centaven and Friends (was Re: You make thedecision(was Re: Quick! convert all your projects to maven!))

Jon wrote: > > Wasn't this entire thing > > about community building? So what do we really want: using > technology we > > invented on our own, alienating possible new users, or sticking to > > common standards? > > Using technology that is well supported, developed by a > community of people > w

RE: [PROPOSAL] Centaven and Friends (was Re: You make thedecision (was Re: Quick! convert all your projects to maven!))

Jon wrote: > I can agree with that. Hell, the dvsl vs. xsl is a showstopper for me. > > I can't stand XSL... > > > I'm also a little worried about the size/vocality of the centipede > > developer community. Krysalis lists (in the archive) total > 53 posts. Maven > > dev (includes cvs) has 780, an

RE: cross-project communications

Geir wrote: > -1 because I think we should ease into this slowly - from > what I understand, > we are way more chatty and entropic than the XML community, > so we might > shock them :) ouch - that hurts :-) -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: For additional commands, e-m

RE: cross-project communications

Good point. I for one am rather 'amused' in the difference of style *and* momentum in between both general@ lists and projects, and indeed there exists some partisanship that divides both. Duh. Oh well, part of the fun over here is exactly participating in this electronic biosphere while observin

RE: GUMP RULEZ WAS: Re: Quick! convert all your projects to maven!

Berin wrote: > Translation: > > Jakarta = jakarta.apache.org > XML = xml.apache.org > > And the reason on XML.apache.org there is no discussion is: > everyone seems to be on board with Forrest--which is using Centipede. I wouldn't say so - while I would like the idea. But if this is the kind of

RE: GUMP RULEZ WAS: Re: Quick! convert all your projects to maven!

Berin, > How does that match up with the NIH attitude towards Krysalis? > > I wasn't aware of a Jakarta/XML project named cruise control.? Hey, this is a [EMAIL PROTECTED] discussion. For some strange and perhaps slightly biased reason, I'm not too surprised thr

RE: Trademarks, copyright etc

Dirk, the question was whether the creation of a mailing list for discussion of legal and commercial matters around Apache technology wouldn't be useful. I.e. Dion's original question whether he could explicitely refer to Apache projects (he's involved in or working with), whether he should do pr

RE: Trademarks, copyright etc

Pier Fumagalli wrote: > "Alex McLintock" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > I don't think there is any forum appropriate for that yet, > and I can see > > that some people (such as Pier above) isn't so keen on > discussing it on the > > existing mailing lists. :-) [...] > I would be keen to see

RE: [VOTE] Switching development to C#

Erik, I do not want to disappoint you, but be warned: the Paperclip Office Assistent *isn't real*. cheers, > -Original Message- > From: Erik Hatcher [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] > Sent: dinsdag 2 april 2002 5:51 > To: Jakarta General List > Subject: Re: [VOTE] Switching development to C

RE: subproject layout conventions

Leo Simons wrote: > It has been brought up by many people that there > is no common way of organising subproject websites. > I propose we draft a set of guidelines (_not_ > rules) on a general structure. > > Lets start with some discussion :) All this and more is being tackled (slowly but steadi

RE: the story continues... JSPA community draft ballot results

I wrote: > The > comments of IBM and the like clearly indicate to me that the revised > JSPA will be 'nirvana'. ^^^ Uh-oh... 'not be nirvana', of course. Must go to bed ;-) -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: For additional commands, e-mail:

RE: the story continues... JSPA community draft ballot results

Pier Fumagalli wrote: > I don't know how much "sadness" there is in that vote. Of > course it's not a > victory, but reading from the comments of the different voters (at the > bottom), the issues we raised were listened to, and given > some thought. Well, this is a vote prior to going public dr

the story continues... JSPA community draft ballot results

Sad, but true: http://jcp.org/jsr/results/99-7-1.jsp -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: For additional commands, e-mail:

RE: JakartaOne

would charge a minimal entrance fee to cover expenses (food, location, etc), unless we find sponsors. People (seriously) interested to help us organizing the event are invited to get in touch with us. Regards, Steven Noels http://outerthought.org/ (+32)478 292900 -- To unsubscribe, e-mai