Re: [Haifux] lecture idea
+1 On May 23, 2013 2:05 PM, boazg boaz.ge...@gmail.com wrote: hi, is you may know i'm a biologist these days, and about 50% of my work is bioinformatics. surprisingly, a huge part of this is large scale string manipulation, and i end up using huge quantities of bash it's friends. i was thinking a lecture about the type of problems my type of bioinformatics involves, and why shell is such a good solution, would be a nice lecture. i can explain the needed biology, in computer terms, so no biology background will be needed. sound interesting? boazg. ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://haifux.org/mailman/listinfo/haifux ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://haifux.org/mailman/listinfo/haifux
Re: [Haifux] Router question
What do you guys think about this issue? I want to say that it's pressing, but: 1. This is the only remaining problematic protocol for me. SSH works perfectly, and git works just as well over HTTP nowadays, if I'm not mistaken. 2. It seems unnecessary, in my opinion, for this protocol to exist - it should just be done over HTTP. However, network neutrality is always important, and Bezeq International's claims of we don't block any ports become problematic (albeit technically true). Is there anything that can be done about this? On Mon, Oct 18, 2010 at 1:38 AM, Kohn Emil Dan em...@cs.technion.ac.ilwrote: Hi, I am also connected to Bezeq Beinleumi (actually 'upgraded' to it after Actcom's demise). I have tried your gpg command, and I found IMO some interesting results. Doing an nslookup on subkeys.pgp.net reveals that this host has a number of IP addresses: $ nslookup Note: nslookup is deprecated and may be removed from future releases. Consider using the `dig' or `host' programs instead. Run nslookup with the `-sil[ent]' option to prevent this message from appearing. subkeys.pgp.net Server: 10.71.0.138 Address:10.71.0.138#53 Non-authoritative answer: Name: subkeys.pgp.net Address: 114.31.78.196 Name: subkeys.pgp.net Address: 208.72.157.55 Name: subkeys.pgp.net Address: 195.113.19.83 Name: subkeys.pgp.net Address: 213.239.206.174 Name: subkeys.pgp.net Address: 213.239.212.133 Name: subkeys.pgp.net Address: 64.71.173.107 I tried your gpg command using the host name subkeys.pgp.net and then with each IP address instead of the host name. Using the host name subkeys.pgp.net causes the command to hang (I guess because the command tries only the first IP address). The command succeeds if using the IP addresses 208.72.157.55 and 195.113.19.83 while it fails for the rest of the addresses. For the last IP address (i.e. 64.71.173.107) causes the command to fail with No route to host, while with the rest of the problematic addresses it just hangs Regards, Emil On Sat, 16 Oct 2010, Ohad Lutzky wrote: Hello everyone, I have a Linksys DSL-2760u router/DSL modem, using a Wow (Bezeq) connection to the Bezeq International ISP. It seems that various outgoing ports are blocked - HTTP, HTTPS, bittorrent and SSH work well enough, but - for example - I can't download Android apps from the Market. Easier to test, I can't download PGP public keys. For example: gpg -v -v --keyserver subkeys.pgp.net --recv F120156012B83718 gpg: requesting key 12B83718 from hkp server subkeys.pgp.net This hangs indefinitely. So does this: telnet subkeys.pgp.net 11371 Trying 195.113.19.83... The same occurs for other keyservers, git-protocol, and various other unconventional high-port usage. I've gone over the router settings, disabled its firewall (but not NAT, which I need), added my machine to the DMZ (this actually seems to help, sometimes, for git - and even then, only once), tried port triggering... I can't get a consistent result. I should note that this issue only exists for *outgoing* ports. I have no problem mapping *incoming* ports (such as my openssh server or bittorrent web interface). -- Man is the only animal that laughs and weeps, for he is the only animal that is struck with the difference between what things are and what they ought to be. - William Hazlitt Ohad Lutzky -- Man is the only animal that laughs and weeps, for he is the only animal that is struck with the difference between what things are and what they ought to be. - William Hazlitt Ohad Lutzky ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux
Re: [Haifux] Router question
On Mon, Oct 18, 2010 at 2:36 PM, Tzafrir Cohen tzaf...@cohens.org.ilwrote: On Mon, Oct 18, 2010 at 02:23:46PM +0200, Ohad Lutzky wrote: What do you guys think about this issue? I want to say that it's pressing, but: 1. This is the only remaining problematic protocol for me. SSH works perfectly, and git works just as well over HTTP nowadays, if I'm not mistaken. 2. It seems unnecessary, in my opinion, for this protocol to exist - it should just be done over HTTP. Surely not. A different protocol makes it easy for the provider to treat this protocol differently. All the more reason to do it over HT... oh, I see what you did there. -- Man is the only animal that laughs and weeps, for he is the only animal that is struck with the difference between what things are and what they ought to be. - William Hazlitt Ohad Lutzky ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux
Re: [Haifux] Router question
I don't understand, does removing the virus filtering change the routing? On Mon, Oct 18, 2010 at 3:18 PM, Ariel Haviv ariel.ha...@gmail.com wrote: Hi there, I had a similar problem a couple of months ago with Bezeqint (regarding ports of stock market trading software). Check with them that your account doesn't have any automatic Benefits from the ISP - e.g. Virus filtering or such. As soon as I asked them to remove any of those so-called benefits from my account, all the problems were gone. (My assumption was they were probably routing traffic through those nasty service providers like the Italian one you mentioned) Hope that helps, for what it's worth. Best regards, Ariel Haviv On Mon, Oct 18, 2010 at 3:03 PM, Ohad Lutzky o...@lutzky.net wrote: On Mon, Oct 18, 2010 at 2:36 PM, Tzafrir Cohen tzaf...@cohens.org.ilwrote: On Mon, Oct 18, 2010 at 02:23:46PM +0200, Ohad Lutzky wrote: What do you guys think about this issue? I want to say that it's pressing, but: 1. This is the only remaining problematic protocol for me. SSH works perfectly, and git works just as well over HTTP nowadays, if I'm not mistaken. 2. It seems unnecessary, in my opinion, for this protocol to exist - it should just be done over HTTP. Surely not. A different protocol makes it easy for the provider to treat this protocol differently. All the more reason to do it over HT... oh, I see what you did there. -- Man is the only animal that laughs and weeps, for he is the only animal that is struck with the difference between what things are and what they ought to be. - William Hazlitt Ohad Lutzky ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux -- Man is the only animal that laughs and weeps, for he is the only animal that is struck with the difference between what things are and what they ought to be. - William Hazlitt Ohad Lutzky ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux
[Haifux] Router question
Hello everyone, I have a Linksys DSL-2760u router/DSL modem, using a Wow (Bezeq) connection to the Bezeq International ISP. It seems that various outgoing ports are blocked - HTTP, HTTPS, bittorrent and SSH work well enough, but - for example - I can't download Android apps from the Market. Easier to test, I can't download PGP public keys. For example: gpg -v -v --keyserver subkeys.pgp.net --recv F120156012B83718 gpg: requesting key 12B83718 from hkp server subkeys.pgp.net This hangs indefinitely. So does this: telnet subkeys.pgp.net 11371 Trying 195.113.19.83... The same occurs for other keyservers, git-protocol, and various other unconventional high-port usage. I've gone over the router settings, disabled its firewall (but not NAT, which I need), added my machine to the DMZ (this actually seems to help, sometimes, for git - and even then, only once), tried port triggering... I can't get a consistent result. I should note that this issue only exists for *outgoing* ports. I have no problem mapping *incoming* ports (such as my openssh server or bittorrent web interface). -- Man is the only animal that laughs and weeps, for he is the only animal that is struck with the difference between what things are and what they ought to be. - William Hazlitt Ohad Lutzky ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux
Re: [Haifux] Router question
traceroute is ICMP. I'm having trouble with specific ports on TCP. On Sat, Oct 16, 2010 at 7:53 PM, Dave Roi david...@gmail.com wrote: Did you try running traceroute to the pgp server or android market server? See how many hops it does go and see in which one it gets stuck. On Sat, Oct 16, 2010 at 19:36, Ohad Lutzky o...@lutzky.net wrote: Hello everyone, I have a Linksys DSL-2760u router/DSL modem, using a Wow (Bezeq) connection to the Bezeq International ISP. It seems that various outgoing ports are blocked - HTTP, HTTPS, bittorrent and SSH work well enough, but - for example - I can't download Android apps from the Market. Easier to test, I can't download PGP public keys. For example: gpg -v -v --keyserver subkeys.pgp.net --recv F120156012B83718 gpg: requesting key 12B83718 from hkp server subkeys.pgp.net This hangs indefinitely. So does this: telnet subkeys.pgp.net 11371 Trying 195.113.19.83... The same occurs for other keyservers, git-protocol, and various other unconventional high-port usage. I've gone over the router settings, disabled its firewall (but not NAT, which I need), added my machine to the DMZ (this actually seems to help, sometimes, for git - and even then, only once), tried port triggering... I can't get a consistent result. I should note that this issue only exists for *outgoing* ports. I have no problem mapping *incoming* ports (such as my openssh server or bittorrent web interface). -- Man is the only animal that laughs and weeps, for he is the only animal that is struck with the difference between what things are and what they ought to be. - William Hazlitt Ohad Lutzky ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux -- Man is the only animal that laughs and weeps, for he is the only animal that is struck with the difference between what things are and what they ought to be. - William Hazlitt Ohad Lutzky ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux
Re: [Haifux] Router question
Okay, that's something I can use! Here's what I get - all hope up to and including 7 are from within bezeqint (without useful reverse dns resolutions). Hop 8 is sudo tcptraceroute -i eth0 -n 195.113.19.83 11371 traceroute to 195.113.19.83 (195.113.19.83), 30 hops max, 60 byte packets 1 10.0.0.138 4.018 ms 4.000 ms 3.993 ms 2 212.179.37.1 20.982 ms 22.589 ms 22.581 ms 3 212.179.87.173 24.302 ms 27.114 ms 28.475 ms 4 212.179.152.157 29.563 ms 30.513 ms 31.462 ms 5 212.179.124.145 37.292 ms 37.288 ms 37.274 ms 6 212.179.124.162 40.561 ms 51.928 ms 54.370 ms 7 62.219.189.14 4317.354 ms 212.179.124.26 4303.544 ms 4301.958 ms 8 77.67.66.9 199.620 ms * * 9 * * * 10 * * * 11 * * * 12 * * * 13 * * * 14 * * * 15 * * * 16 * * * 17 * * * 18 * * * 19 * * * 20 * * * 21 * * * 22 * * * 23 * * * 24 * * * 25 * * * 26 * * * 27 * * * 28 * * * 29 * * * 30 * * * On Sat, Oct 16, 2010 at 8:48 PM, guy keren c...@actcom.co.il wrote: you should have a traceroute-line utility that runs on TCP ports of your choice. for example, tcptraceroute. see an explanation here: http://christophe.vandeplas.com/2007/11/04/using-traceroute-icmp-and-tcp --guy Ohad Lutzky wrote: traceroute is ICMP. I'm having trouble with specific ports on TCP. On Sat, Oct 16, 2010 at 7:53 PM, Dave Roi david...@gmail.com mailto: david...@gmail.com wrote: Did you try running traceroute to the pgp server or android market server? See how many hops it does go and see in which one it gets stuck. On Sat, Oct 16, 2010 at 19:36, Ohad Lutzky o...@lutzky.net mailto:o...@lutzky.net wrote: Hello everyone, I have a Linksys DSL-2760u router/DSL modem, using a Wow (Bezeq) connection to the Bezeq International ISP. It seems that various outgoing ports are blocked - HTTP, HTTPS, bittorrent and SSH work well enough, but - for example - I can't download Android apps from the Market. Easier to test, I can't download PGP public keys. For example: gpg -v -v --keyserver subkeys.pgp.net http://subkeys.pgp.net --recv F120156012B83718 gpg: requesting key 12B83718 from hkp server subkeys.pgp.net http://subkeys.pgp.net This hangs indefinitely. So does this: telnet subkeys.pgp.net http://subkeys.pgp.net 11371 Trying 195.113.19.83... The same occurs for other keyservers, git-protocol, and various other unconventional high-port usage. I've gone over the router settings, disabled its firewall (but not NAT, which I need), added my machine to the DMZ (this actually seems to help, sometimes, for git - and even then, only once), tried port triggering... I can't get a consistent result. I should note that this issue only exists for *outgoing* ports. I have no problem mapping *incoming* ports (such as my openssh server or bittorrent web interface). -- Man is the only animal that laughs and weeps, for he is the only animal that is struck with the difference between what things are and what they ought to be. - William Hazlitt Ohad Lutzky ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org mailto:Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux -- Man is the only animal that laughs and weeps, for he is the only animal that is struck with the difference between what things are and what they ought to be. - William Hazlitt Ohad Lutzky ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux -- Man is the only animal that laughs and weeps, for he is the only animal that is struck with the difference between what things are and what they ought to be. - William Hazlitt Ohad Lutzky ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux
Re: [Haifux] [Fwd: Re: [HAIFUX LECTURE] Packaging in Debian - Ohad Lutzky]
Hello all, I'm terribly sorry, but I will not be able to give today's lecture due to should-have-foreseen-them-but-still-didn't circumstances. I do intend to give this lecture in a near-future open spot. Sorry for the mess... :/ -- Man is the only animal that laughs and weeps, for he is the only animal that is struck with the difference between what things are and what they ought to be. - William Hazlitt Ohad Lutzky ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux
[Haifux] Lecture proposal: Packaging in Debian
Debian is one of the more popular Linux distributions, well-known for its excellent package management. Debian has also been known to be the base for many other distributions, such as knoppix and ubuntu. I can show how to build packages, how to build repositories, how to version-control the whole thing by example of git, as well as a short overview of the extensive documentation available on the subject. ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux
Re: [Haifux] SVN quota
If anything, make the quota soft, with no hard quota - and set up mails to be sent when the quota is reached - just to be aware that something is going on. On Thu, Jan 21, 2010 at 2:09 PM, Shahar Dag d...@cs.technion.ac.il wrote: Hello As I already said, setting quota on an SVN project is more a meter of awareness, then a real disk space limitation. The idea of using the pre-commit hock to limit the size of a commit is very interesting. Quick google came with several sites: http://www.davidgrant.ca/limit_size_of_subversion_commits_with_this_hook http://svn.haxx.se/users/archive-2009-09/0928.shtml I also found this, but I totally don't understand it http://lists.freebsd.org/pipermail/svn-src-svnadmin/2008-November/09.html I don't have time now to dig into the suggestions. I will update the list after I will have a working hock Shahar - Original Message - From: Nadav Har'El n...@math.technion.ac.il To: Shahar Dag d...@cs.technion.ac.il Cc: Haifaux haifux@haifux.org Sent: Thursday, January 21, 2010 10:43 AM Subject: Re: [Haifux] SVN quota On Tue, Jan 19, 2010, Shahar Dag wrote about Re: [Haifux] SVN quota: It is true that users can't delete data from the SVN. The only thing users can do is ask for additional quota. If they know that they are running out of quota in advanced, they can ask to enlarge the quota before they are out of disk space (which usually happens 01:00 ). Then I can check if the disk space usage is justify and respond on time. Shachar Shemesh made a very good point. There's very little point in a quota system if the person who is reaching the end of his quota can't do anything about it to clean up his act. If the only thing he can do is to ask you to increase his quota (and you never refuse), why have a quota in the first place - to make people feel bad about taking up space? To add beaurocracy? I have several years experience with using and administering SVN repositories, and my experience is that problems with repository sizes always stem from one issue: that somebody, usually mistakenly or due to lack of understanding of what SVN is supposed to do, did one huge commit. E.g., somebody added some huge test data or outputs to the repository, which they shouldn't have done in the first place. Once the user added a huge commit, Subversion doesn't give you any (convenient) facility to remove this commit, or the huge files in it, from the history. You can get mails that you are close to your quota until hell freezes over - and there's nothing you can do about it but say I'm sorry... If you must have SVN quotas, one thing I'd try first is to try to enforce first some sort of limit the size of a single commit. For example, if you give people a 100 MB quota for the repository, limit a single commit size to 30 MB; If somebody fills up more than 30% of his quota in a single commit - something is probably wrong. If you let him do it, he'll probably be sorry later because he'll not have enough space to continue using his repository. Of course, you can play with this 30% number. Perhaps enforce this single-commit-quota just after 50% of the total quota is finished - or come with whatever policy makes sense for you. Also, you'll need to figure out how to enforce this policy :-) (some sort of commmit hook might work, but I really didn't try to implement this idea). Nadav. -- Nadav Har'El| Thursday, Jan 21 2010, 6 Shevat 5770 n...@math.technion.ac.il |- Phone +972-523-790466, ICQ 13349191 |Why aren't fishmongers generous? Their http://nadav.harel.org.il |business makes them selfish. ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux -- Man is the only animal that laughs and weeps, for he is the only animal that is struck with the difference between what things are and what they ought to be. - William Hazlitt Ohad Lutzky ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux
Re: [Haifux] QEMU/KVM vs. VMWare: The beauty and the beast
On Mon, Jan 11, 2010 at 2:51 PM, Eli Billauer e...@billauer.co.il wrote: Shachar Raindel wrote: A. VMware workstation used to be a GUI only program, but it is getting much better scripting abilities lately, and it supports roll-backs much better than how QEMU supports them (same back-end functionality, much easier to use GUI). Their USB support used to be very unstable about 2 years ago, but it is much better now. I don't know about VMware workstation, since I run VMPlayer. Right now I wonder if there's a nice way to tell a running vmplayer instance to shut down gracefully (something you'd like to do a minute before shutting down the whole system during an UPS situation). Check the vmrun command. I use this at work for a similar purpose. D. Your comparison is very task oriented - you are looking for a free solution to migrate your old computers, and are willing to spend considerable amount of time on that. Yes, indeed. This is all about my own situation, as I said from the beginning. Even so, I think you can learn more from someone who tried to do something specific for a real-life purpose. And yes, I'm ready to spend a lot of time on a free solution (even as in beer), even though some $200 are worth spending on that. I have a few problems with a paid-for solution: (1) The piracy watchguard tends to kill the software sooner or later (what if someone wants to install XP on year 2020?) (2) Users of supported software are commonly forced upgrades (and I hate playing with a working system) (3) VMWare's site gives me the feeling that they are the kind of guys to drive you to a nasty point, and then ask for enterprise-scale kind of money to get out of it. That's why I began with asking if VMPlayer is a honey trap. This has not been the case in my work. We still use VMWare Workstation 5.5 in various applications. Eli -- Web: http://www.billauer.co.il ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux -- Man is the only animal that laughs and weeps, for he is the only animal that is struck with the difference between what things are and what they ought to be. - William Hazlitt Ohad Lutzky ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux
Re: [Haifux] Technion video
The X2 velocity terminology is confusing, let's try and set it straight: What students want to do is watch videos at increased speed, without affecting pitch (usually speeding up playback of audio causes pitch to rise, which causes a chipmunk voice effect). There are several libraries for Linux which increase audio speed without affecting pitch, the best-known being libsoundtouch. To my knowledge, libsoundtouch has no been formally incorporated into any media player. However, there is a relatively new project called ScaleTempo (http://scaletempo.sh.net) which provides this capability for several media players, including VLC (into which the patch has formally been accepted). Please test a ScaleTempo-enabled version of whatever media player is currently used to view Technion video (vlc, if I'm not mistaken). 2009/11/18 Shahar Dag d...@cs.technion.ac.il Hello One of the complains I gets from students in SSDL is that they can't view the Technion's video in X2 velocity. I talked with the people from computer center and they told me that: the video server is MS windows media server 9 the video encoding is MS windows media video the transmission protocol is RTSP over TCP is there is a way to view the video on Linux (Ubuntu) in high speed? Thanks in advanced Shahar Dag System Software Development Laboratory (SSDL) Computer Science Department Technion - Israel Institute of Technology Haifa, Israel Tel. 972-4-829-4880 Fax 972-4-829-4878 ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux -- Man is the only animal that laughs and weeps, for he is the only animal that is struck with the difference between what things are and what they ought to be. - William Hazlitt Ohad Lutzky ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux
Re: [Haifux] Technion video
Pardon, the URL is http://scaletempo.sf.net On Thu, Nov 19, 2009 at 9:47 AM, Ohad Lutzky o...@lutzky.net wrote: The X2 velocity terminology is confusing, let's try and set it straight: What students want to do is watch videos at increased speed, without affecting pitch (usually speeding up playback of audio causes pitch to rise, which causes a chipmunk voice effect). There are several libraries for Linux which increase audio speed without affecting pitch, the best-known being libsoundtouch. To my knowledge, libsoundtouch has no been formally incorporated into any media player. However, there is a relatively new project called ScaleTempo (http://scaletempo.sh.net) which provides this capability for several media players, including VLC (into which the patch has formally been accepted). Please test a ScaleTempo-enabled version of whatever media player is currently used to view Technion video (vlc, if I'm not mistaken). 2009/11/18 Shahar Dag d...@cs.technion.ac.il Hello One of the complains I gets from students in SSDL is that they can't view the Technion's video in X2 velocity. I talked with the people from computer center and they told me that: the video server is MS windows media server 9 the video encoding is MS windows media video the transmission protocol is RTSP over TCP is there is a way to view the video on Linux (Ubuntu) in high speed? Thanks in advanced Shahar Dag System Software Development Laboratory (SSDL) Computer Science Department Technion - Israel Institute of Technology Haifa, Israel Tel. 972-4-829-4880 Fax 972-4-829-4878 ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux -- Man is the only animal that laughs and weeps, for he is the only animal that is struck with the difference between what things are and what they ought to be. - William Hazlitt Ohad Lutzky -- Man is the only animal that laughs and weeps, for he is the only animal that is struck with the difference between what things are and what they ought to be. - William Hazlitt Ohad Lutzky ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux
Re: [Haifux] [W2L] Call for lecturer + Linux guru
In the case that this is only a 20 minute lecture, I wholeheartedly agree. I do think that git should be mentioned, in a one-liner, as a more advanced tool that also allows you to work offline. So, while I agree that git is too complicated to learn in 20 minutes (takes 1-2 hours from my experience), it has a different upside when compared to subversion: Administration is far easier. This is true for any DVCVS, and stems from the fact that nobody needs write-access to anything but his own files. Users will want to use whatever VCS is taught in order to collaborate, and this requires some support work from the admins, which should be taken into account. Either that or an alternative free, easy-to-setup, fast and technion-accessible solution should be shown. On Sun, Oct 18, 2009 at 8:37 AM, Shachar Shemesh shac...@shemesh.bizwrote: Ohad Lutzky wrote: Of course it would. But this one puts a lot of candy down that same path as well. These mines hurt, but are not fatal (again, from my experience, all mistakes can be recovered if detected within a reasonable time), and git's features make it, IMO, worth the trouble. For example, while many people find the staging area confusing (you have to add a file you've changed again in order to commit it, or just use commit -a to automatically add all changed files), it allows git to do awesome stuff like git add -p; this command goes over the differences from the previous version (like git diff), and asks you which hunks to stage. This means you can make a set of changes, realize it can be logically split into two, smaller sets of changes, and proceed to commit it as two sets of changes. Or, for a more common case, it allows you to stage only your actual fix to the commit without the various debugging statements you've added across your code in order to track down a bug, and do a quick git reset --hard afterwards. There's a succinct list of reasons I like git here: http://whygitisbetterthanx.com/ I'm getting the sense that this conversation has gone off the main track a little. This is, I'll admit, also my fault. The question here is not which VCS is better (for which my answer, if you look at it, is depends), but which VCS should we teach in the dev lecture of the W2L series. Here's the thing. When you first start to use a new system, what you see is mostly the mines. If this is the first system of its kind, you are likely to run into mines that are not really mines, but your misunderstanding of what the system is supposed to do, but still, the mines (real and conceptual) are mostly what you see. You do not, typically, see the candies, for the very simple reason that you do not understand the system well enough to appreciate or make use of them. As you use of the system matures, you learn to change your thinking to not regard some things as mines, and avoid the real ones. As that happens, the mines become less and less important, and the candies become more and more interesting. The main pre-requisite for that happening is that YOU HAVE NOT GIVEN UP ON THE TOOL! This thread started around a very specific question - should Haifux teach git, or some other version control system, as part of the development tools lecture. Any answer should take into account that amount of time given for this part of the lecture (between 10 and 20 minutes), and the amount of tutoring the students will have down the road (none unless they seek it). Under those conditions, in my opinion, git is the wrong tool because: - Anyone who has any experience with VCS will, likely, have used server based ones. Git, for them, contains all of the misconception mines that go with a distributed revision control - Git has some actual bone-fide mines, lain on the path traversed even by relatively basic VCS operations. - None of the candies matter, as you only have 20 minutes (best case) to show them the tool and set them on their way, and the candies require the user to get version control in order to be appreciated. With the amount of time you have, you will be lucky to get 20% to appreciate the fact they can restore any version they checked in in the past. Showing them git because it can split a single change into multiple commits will fly so far over their heads, I'm afraid none of them will even run a single git command to even check out the water. Shachar -- Shachar Shemesh Lingnu Open Source Consulting Ltd.http://www.lingnu.com -- Man is the only animal that laughs and weeps, for he is the only animal that is struck with the difference between what things are and what they ought to be. - William Hazlitt Ohad Lutzky ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux
Re: [Haifux] [W2L] Call for lecturer + Linux guru
This is for their instructor to do, and for them to be taught about later on :)I'll only teach them how to check out older versions after I explain branches - that way they can be aware of the dangers of committing on non-branches. On Sat, Oct 17, 2009 at 11:12 PM, Shachar Shemesh shac...@shemesh.bizwrote: Ohad Lutzky wrote: I specifically didn't teach them checkout, for this exact reason... To me, being able to check out an older version is the number 1 use of a version control system. I fail to see the use of the whole thing without it. Shachar -- Shachar Shemesh Lingnu Open Source Consulting Ltd.http://www.lingnu.com -- Man is the only animal that laughs and weeps, for he is the only animal that is struck with the difference between what things are and what they ought to be. - William Hazlitt Ohad Lutzky ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux
Re: [Haifux] [W2L] Call for lecturer + Linux guru
Of course it would. But this one puts a lot of candy down that same path as well. These mines hurt, but are not fatal (again, from my experience, all mistakes can be recovered if detected within a reasonable time), and git's features make it, IMO, worth the trouble. For example, while many people find the staging area confusing (you have to add a file you've changed again in order to commit it, or just use commit -a to automatically add all changed files), it allows git to do awesome stuff like git add -p; this command goes over the differences from the previous version (like git diff), and asks you which hunks to stage. This means you can make a set of changes, realize it can be logically split into two, smaller sets of changes, and proceed to commit it as two sets of changes. Or, for a more common case, it allows you to stage only your actual fix to the commit without the various debugging statements you've added across your code in order to track down a bug, and do a quick git reset --hard afterwards. There's a succinct list of reasons I like git here: http://whygitisbetterthanx.com/ On Sun, Oct 18, 2009 at 12:56 AM, Shachar Shemesh shac...@shemesh.bizwrote: Ohad Lutzky wrote: This is for their instructor to do, and for them to be taught about later on :) I'll only teach them how to check out older versions after I explain branches - that way they can be aware of the dangers of committing on non-branches. Wouldn't it be simpler to teach them a version control that does not put mines in your path? Shachar -- Shachar Shemesh Lingnu Open Source Consulting Ltd.http://www.lingnu.com -- Man is the only animal that laughs and weeps, for he is the only animal that is struck with the difference between what things are and what they ought to be. - William Hazlitt Ohad Lutzky ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux
Re: [Haifux] [W2L] Call for lecturer + Linux guru
I tend to disagree about git being too complex. I currently have three students (in a military setting), which have never used any form of version control before, and have been taught basic usage of git - init, add, commit, log, diff, remote, and pull. I've received no complaints as of yet. As long as you're not doing rebases or working with multiple branches (which are much more complicated to do in SVN, and useless in the situation at any rate), the data loss problems mentioned above don't exist. Git gives the added bonus of being able to work offline, which is indispensable for a student on a laptop. -- Man is the only animal that laughs and weeps, for he is the only animal that is struck with the difference between what things are and what they ought to be. - William Hazlitt Ohad Lutzky ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux
Re: [Haifux] [W2L] Call for lecturer + Linux guru
I specifically didn't teach them checkout, for this exact reason... Yes, warnings about these things are in order when you're using git. (Specifically we have always mind your current branch and rebasing is a destructive operation, but also you can always fix these things if you notice early enough, early enough being a rather loose from my experience). On the specific matter of non-branch commits, git does some work to actively warn you when you do so, but I think this could be improved. I still believe that with warning on those two issues, git is simple enough to use, and that the ability to work offline is well worth it. On Fri, Oct 16, 2009 at 9:53 PM, Shachar Shemesh shac...@shemesh.bizwrote: Ohad Lutzky wrote: As long as you're not doing rebases or working with multiple branches (which are much more complicated to do in SVN, and useless in the situation at any rate), the data loss problems mentioned above don't exist. Not true. The problem can happen if you just check out a commit which is not at the head of a branch (say, because you were doing regression testing), and then perform a commit. No branching required. Git gives the added bonus of being able to work offline, which is indispensable for a student on a laptop. True, but it steps up the complexity considerably. Well, you step it up to begin with when you say that publishing your work requires two stages (three if you count the add) - commit and then push. This means that for several people working on one repository, you would usually try to simplify things by telling them to git add + commit + push. Then, when you try take the laptop away, you find that you split an operation that used to be atomic, and the complexity comes back. True, working with a centralized repository means that this is downright impossible, but I still maintain that working offline is no novice task. Shachar -- Shachar Shemesh Lingnu Open Source Consulting Ltd.http://www.lingnu.com -- Man is the only animal that laughs and weeps, for he is the only animal that is struck with the difference between what things are and what they ought to be. - William Hazlitt Ohad Lutzky ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux
Re: [Haifux] Idea: Welcome to Open Source instead of Welcome to Linux this year
I agree. Welcome to Linux and FOSS should be the name, and a short (no more than 20 words) explanation of the name should preclude the event. On Fri, Sep 11, 2009 at 1:06 PM, boazg boaz.ge...@gmail.com wrote: IMHO it's a branding issue. Linux is a brand name. When you say Welcome to Linux it has associations. When you say welcome to FOSS, people give you a blank stare, and then you have to explain, all the while making sure your arguments don't enter tin-foil-hat land. It's not as if Welcome to Linux involves compiling your kernel, loading modules, or creating device nodes. It has very little to do with Linux itself and could be done on BSD or HURD for all intents and purposes. You show them gnome/KDE, firefox, OOo, gimp, etc. So in short, while it's a great idea, I think there's an advantage to the branding that gets people to come. On Fri, Sep 11, 2009 at 12:19, Shlomi Fish shlo...@iglu.org.il wrote: Hi all! When talking with someone a few days ago, I had a moment of Serendipity (see: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Serendipity ). Why don't we do a Welcome-to- FOSS (Free and Open Source Software) this year instead of Welcome-to-Linux? We could show people some cool stuff about FOSS in both Linux and Windows: 1. Cross-platform (or even Windows-only) User-oriented FOSS - Firefox, OpenOffice.org, Inkscape, VirtualBox, GIMP, 7-zip, Notepad++, Audacity, various FOSS games, other stuff here - http://wiki.perl.org.il/index.php/FOSS_on_Windows and here - http://www.opensourcewindows.org/ 2. Open Source Development with a focus on rapid scripts/GUI-programs/etc. development using Perl/Python/Ruby/etc.[ScriptLang] 3. Don't be afraid of the command line. - why the UNIX command line can be useful. 4. The Free and Open Source Software philosophy and ideology and its positive implications on FOSS development and the computer and software industry: - http://www.shlomifish.org/philosophy/foss-other-beasts/ - http://www.shlomifish.org/philosophy/obj-oss/ - Also see the links from there. (Ori would probably be happy to give it.) 5. And naturally and possibly - something about how to try out Linux, possibly using a VirtualBox/etc. VM. -- I think that now FOSS is more ubiquitous and mainstream than just on alternative, fully open-source, operating systems such as Linux. One should also remember that the main issue at hand is not Linux vs. Windows but rather the freedom of software and its open nature. Porting to Windows is no different from porting one's software to proprietary UNIXes such as Mac OS X, AIX, HP/UX or Solaris before it became OpenSolaris. [Windows] So what do you think? Am I crazy or am I on to something? Two people I talked with liked the idea, and a different one had some doubts. Regards, Shlomi Fish Footnotes: -- [ScriptLang] - we can have a colour of the bikeshed argument of which agile language to teach later on, but ultimately it's up to who volunteers to prepare the slides and present the presentation. [Windows] - Windows is indeed less compatible to Linux than other UNIXes, but: 1. There are many incompatibilities between the different UNIXes. 2. There are some operating systems that are still being used (such as HP's VMS) which are even harder to port to than Windows. 3. Reality to be conquered must be obeyed. -- - Shlomi Fish http://www.shlomifish.org/ First stop for Perl beginners - http://perl-begin.org/ Chuck Norris read the entire English Wikipedia in 24 hours. Twice. ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux -- Joan Crawfordhttp://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/authors/j/joan_crawford.html - I, Joan Crawford, I believe in the dollar. Everything I earn, I spend. ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux -- Man is the only animal that laughs and weeps, for he is the only animal that is struck with the difference between what things are and what they ought to be. - William Hazlitt Ohad Lutzky ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux
Re: [Haifux] some addendums to today's gdb meeting
Also, if anyone has information on the quick and easy way to debug libc functions (such as tzset), I'd much appreciate it. On Mon, May 4, 2009 at 11:34 PM, Hai Zaar haiz...@gmail.com wrote: On Mon, May 4, 2009 at 10:04 PM, guy keren c...@actcom.co.il wrote: i think there was something else we wanted an answer for - does anyone remember? Hi, Guy! Thank for the real goo lecture. I remind you address these topic mentioned today but not covered: * Debugging python C modules * Share you experience about debugging optimized code Thanks again! -- Zaar ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux -- Man is the only animal that laughs and weeps, for he is the only animal that is struck with the difference between what things are and what they ought to be. - William Hazlitt Ohad Lutzky ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux
[Haifux] Fun with timezones in Linux
Hello folks, I've recently been dealing with an odd timezone issue at work, which has to do with daylight savings time. I've published a blog post about it, and I'd very much appreciate any input you might have. http://blog.lutzky.net/2009/04/18/timezones-are-fickle/ Many thanks! -- Man is the only animal that laughs and weeps, for he is the only animal that is struck with the difference between what things are and what they ought to be. - William Hazlitt Ohad Lutzky ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux
Re: [Haifux] Fun with timezones in Linux
Note that using TZ=GMT-3 has several disadvantages for me: timezone is set incorrectly (to -10800), is_dst is not set, and the timezone abbreviation shows up as GMT. I can get a better result with my one-liner zic source. This has the added bonus that applications will read it on a call to tzset, without my having to change their environment variables. On Sun, Apr 19, 2009 at 4:46 AM, Tzafrir Cohen tzaf...@cohens.org.ilwrote: On Sat, Apr 18, 2009 at 07:17:27PM +0300, Ohad Lutzky wrote: Hello folks, I've recently been dealing with an odd timezone issue at work, which has to do with daylight savings time. I've published a blog post about it, and I'd very much appreciate any input you might have. http://blog.lutzky.net/2009/04/18/timezones-are-fickle/ Many thanks! Pure timezones with no DST mess? TZ=GMT-3 date TZ=GMT-2 date Sure, there are many ways you can shoot yourself in the foot. -- Tzafrir Cohen | tzaf...@jabber.org | VIM is http://tzafrir.org.il || a Mutt's tzaf...@cohens.org.il || best ICQ# 16849754 || friend ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux -- Man is the only animal that laughs and weeps, for he is the only animal that is struck with the difference between what things are and what they ought to be. - William Hazlitt Ohad Lutzky ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux
Re: [Haifux] The 10th tip?
The choice of shell isn't the worst part (although, seriously... tcsh? holy crap!). Read the assignment itself. A system to manage and analyze a list of delay tickets for public transportation. Good idea for perl (which is explicitly forbidden IIRC, as are sed and awk)? Certainly. But for tcsh? Afterwards (in Matam and in Data Structures, for example), people don't even consider writing a tiny test suite for their applications, even though it's under 10 lines of tcsh and they're given expected input-output pairs as part of the assignment. On Sat, Feb 7, 2009 at 10:50 PM, Tzafrir Cohen tzaf...@cohens.org.ilwrote: On Sat, Feb 07, 2009 at 10:12:00PM +0200, Oron Peled wrote: * The Unix part is tragic story in itself. Let's start with the simple fact it uses csh/tcsh (Nee, nee, nee, nee) Nope :-( http://webcourse.cs.technion.ac.il/234122/Winter2008-2009/en/syllabus.html Even Mac OSX defaults to a posix shell (bash). -- Tzafrir Cohen | tzaf...@jabber.org | VIM is http://tzafrir.org.il || a Mutt's tzaf...@cohens.org.il || best ICQ# 16849754 || friend ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux -- Man is the only animal that laughs and weeps, for he is the only animal that is struck with the difference between what things are and what they ought to be. - William Hazlitt Ohad Lutzky ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux
Re: [Haifux] The 10th tip?
man -k is also known as apropos :) On Fri, Feb 6, 2009 at 5:36 PM, Sorana Fraier sf10...@gmail.com wrote: I would add 2 useful commands: ls -at will show the files sorted by time. The newest will appear first. The second command that I highly recommend is for those who don't know which command to apply. A highly educative learning tool. For instance man -k directory will print all the commands related to directory that can be applied. A partially output of the above command is: mdel (1) - delete an MSDOS file mdeltree - recursively delete an MSDOS directory and its contents mdeltree (1) - recursively delete an MSDOS directory and its contents mdir (1) - display an MSDOS directory mdu (1) - display the amount of space occupied by an MSDOS directory mkdir(2) - create a directory mkdir(3p) - make a directory mkdirat (2) - create a directory relative to a directory file descriptor mkdtemp (3) - create a unique temporary directory mkfifoat (3) - make a FIFO (named pipe) relative to a directory file descriptor mkfontdir(1) - create an index of X font files in a directory mkfontdir(1x) - create an index of X font files in a directory mklost+found (8) - create a lost+found directory on a mounted Linux second extended file system mknod(3p) - make a directory, a special file, or a regular file rm (1p) - remove directory entries rmdir(2) - delete a directory rmdir(3p) - remove a directory It doesn't require root permissions. Sorana On Fri, Feb 6, 2009 at 4:06 PM, Yossi Gil yossi@gmail.com wrote: Friends, I wrote a short 10 tips for beginner Linux users document (see the attached), but I am missing a 10th tip... So, if you had to add one more tip, which one would that be? Note that I could not add any tips which require root privileges... Also note that out of the 9 I have, 7 are command line specific, 1 is general, and only 1 is GUI related. Any thoughts on a good GUI tip? Yossi ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux -- Man is the only animal that laughs and weeps, for he is the only animal that is struck with the difference between what things are and what they ought to be. - William Hazlitt Ohad Lutzky ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux
Re: [Haifux] Student complaints.
Point of information: VLC can, in fact, play the Technion videos, and is configured properly to do this at the lab. Ask the advisor (Tzafrir, last I checked) about this. On Mon, Feb 2, 2009 at 3:31 PM, Dotan Cohen dotanco...@gmail.com wrote: 3. If they choose to use the same OS at home, they can get it absolutely free. Last time I checked, students always complain about the lack of money - so I find it hard to understand their desire to pay for Windows and the outrageously-expensive MS-Office. The Technion already bought all the students MS Windows, Office, and other software. So price is not an issue. Furthermore, piracy is the norm at the Technion and in Israel in general. Sorry, Linux cannot compete on price when Windows is essentially free. Worse, students ask why should they use 'free' when 'expensive' is available for the same price. You don't need to lecture me about the reasons, I know them well, but I am telling you what you are up against. 4. A typical Linux system has a much bigger variety of software than Windows, simply because on Windows every piece of commercial software (which is the type of software these students are wishing for) costs money. In a software development lab, most likely nobody will purchase software for photo editing, for OCR, for PDF encoding, for speech synthesis, or who knows what a student might need for his or her project or personal interests. On Linux, all of these things come (depending on how/what you installed) already with your OS, absolutely free. Linux has a broader selection of software, but it is the _wrong_ software. My faculty (mechanical engineering) insists upon sending us DOC files that do not display properly in OOo. There is no viable CAD software for Linux. No Linux video player can play the Technion's video lecture files. Shall I go on? I only have Ubuntu on my personal computers. That means that for all intents and purposes, I have no computer at all. I am stuck in the Technion computer farms at 3 am waiting for the Arabs to finish their C homework (the Turbo C version, mind you, not GCC compatible) or watch their lectures, or read their mail. But one good thing comes out of this: I see that the Arab students, the only students other than us Linux users who don't seem to have their own computers, are the most serious students at the Technion. They work hard and they work late. I learned a few things about study discipline from them. -- Dotan Cohen http://what-is-what.com http://gibberish.co.il א-ב-ג-ד-ה-ו-ז-ח-ט-י-ך-כ-ל-ם-מ-ן-נ-ס-ע-ף-פ-ץ-צ-ק-ר-ש-ת ا-ب-ت-ث-ج-ح-خ-د-ذ-ر-ز-س-ش-ص-ض-ط-ظ-ع-غ-ف-ق-ك-ل-م-ن-ه-و-ي А-Б-В-Г-Д-Е-Ё-Ж-З-И-Й-К-Л-М-Н-О-П-Р-С-Т-У-Ф-Х-Ц-Ч-Ш-Щ-Ъ-Ы-Ь-Э-Ю-Я а-б-в-г-д-е-ё-ж-з-и-й-к-л-м-н-о-п-р-с-т-у-ф-х-ц-ч-ш-щ-ъ-ы-ь-э-ю-я ä-ö-ü-ß-Ä-Ö-Ü ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux -- Man is the only animal that laughs and weeps, for he is the only animal that is struck with the difference between what things are and what they ought to be. - William Hazlitt Ohad Lutzky ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux
Re: [Haifux] LINUX and SSDL
Yes, this is exactly what I meant. On Tue, Jan 27, 2009 at 12:48 PM, Yossi Gil yossi@gmail.com wrote: Ohad, Thanks for the tip. I updated the wiki so as to help the students. http://ssdl-linux.cs.technion.ac.il/wiki/index.php/Beginning_SSDL_users#What_if_Firefox_becomes_very_slow tell me what you think. ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux -- Man is the only animal that laughs and weeps, for he is the only animal that is struck with the difference between what things are and what they ought to be. - William Hazlitt Ohad Lutzky ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux
Re: [Haifux] The use of SSDL...
smlnj is used for ML, last I checked. It works well, expect for not having Readline support (specifically, you can't press up to get previous commands you've typed) On Tue, Jan 27, 2009 at 9:50 PM, Yossi Gil yossi@gmail.com wrote: Hi Tzafrir, I am not sure which ML and which Prolog are used. Also, I do not know which tools are used in verification. I believe Rational Rose / Rhapsody are used for some of the courses. Yossi ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux -- Man is the only animal that laughs and weeps, for he is the only animal that is struck with the difference between what things are and what they ought to be. - William Hazlitt Ohad Lutzky ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux
Re: [Haifux] Student complaints.
On Mon, Jan 26, 2009 at 11:34 PM, Orna Agmon Ben-Yehuda ladyp...@gmail.com wrote: Hi Yossi, Regarding the portable document editing, I suggest introducing the students to latex at an early stage. In addition to being portable, it is also a handy (and sometimes mandatory) tool for writing papers. With Beamer it also becomes a very powerful tool for slideshows. Using LyX will reduce students' complaints :) From the other angle, I believe CS staff should be a model regarding open standards, by publishing documents (either slides or exercises) in open,portable formats such as pdf or simple text. Part of the problem is that students like (or at least used to like) using the lab for all of their Technion work, and unfortunately many courses still distribute MS Word files. Also, many students collaborate on exercises with people not in the lab, and receive MS Word files from them. Ii suggest also to make the students aware of decent distributed version control tools (I'm aiming at a talk about hg in Haifux, somewhere down the queue). I can reprise my git talk as well, if it helps. Another tool with appeal on Linux is valgrind, which can make the students prefer working on Linux, because of the time saving they get. I'm not sure how relevant this is, as (IIRC) the projects in this lab are in Java. -- Man is the only animal that laughs and weeps, for he is the only animal that is struck with the difference between what things are and what they ought to be. - William Hazlitt Ohad Lutzky ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux
[Haifux] URLs re. Ruby
Here are some relevant URLs for anyone interested in Ruby: The official website, with lots of links and info: http://ruby-lang.org A fantastic (and thoroughly weird) book about ruby: http://poignantguide.net Ruby on Rails (a website framework which has brought Ruby to fame): http://rubyonrails.org There is also a fantastic book by Pragmatic Programmer on Ruby (called Programming Ruby), known as the Pickaxe book. The 1st edition is freely [legally] available online, but the 2nd edition is a great improvement over it. -- Man is the only animal that laughs and weeps, for he is the only animal that is struck with the difference between what things are and what they ought to be. - William Hazlitt Ohad Lutzky ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux
Re: [Haifux] W2L + Installation party?
On Wed, Sep 17, 2008 at 5:18 PM, Orr Dunkelman [EMAIL PROTECTED]wrote: Hi, On Wed, Sep 17, 2008 at 1:30 PM, Dave Roi [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi, I believe instaparties are still needed, just with more focus on post install configuration and usage instructions. I think a good answer to whether these are needed or not is the attendance in the last few ones. I haven't been to the last one (where Moshik Afia has arrived), but I've been to many before, and the last three I've attended were more populated with installers than installees. Yes. We are talking about less than 20 installation the whole day (or even less). Agreed. In case an instaparty does happen: I suggest focusing on installing all the cool packages that are needed but aren't installed by default like setting up the dial up connections to their ISPs, codecs, fonts, rar, ace, etc.. most people do not use dial-up these days. moreover, if you'll get many people, you won't have time for that. If you'll get a few - what's the point in the whole event? Two more points: 1. Dial-up (and by this I mean DSL and cablemodem) configurations are in wide use today, and are a prime source of problems (cablemodem especially) for new users. However, an ordinary instaparty is useless for this, as it would have a simple routerDHCP-autoconfig based setup which works out-of-the-box. Moreover, the previous instaparty had no internet access *at all*. At the very least, a wi-fi router should be present so wireless cards can be tested. If any help is to be given in an instaparty regarding DSL and (again, especially) cablemodem connections, such a connection must be available in the instaparty, or the whole thing is pointless. Show them the fun stuff, the cool music players like amarok and Listen, After installation? This should be the deal-maker that leads people to install. But they will need to use openoffice as well... Why not just have a SiL lecture titled fun stuff in Linux to show this stuff off? It does wonders for adoptation (especially glitzy 3D desktop effects). How about a few stations on the side for people to play Nexuiz against each other? :-) LAN party! This goes well with my hands-on suggestion. I say lectures aren't needed, just have lots of veterans going around helping people. Should we have lectures on other days? One additional point - almost all of the linux adoptation I've seen in the Technion works like this: People see it, use it for a course, avoid it for a (geometrically distributed) while, then decide to install it (by themselves. All of the adopters I've seen are perfectly capable of performing a google search for the distribution they've seen, burning an ISO, and hitting next a couple of times). They seek a guru (or ask on the forums) for some help, are given a pointer in the general direction, and are happy. Sometimes they come seeking more help for tougher issues (laptop doesn't enter suspend-to-RAM properly, cablemodem issues, or they decided to go to a bleeding-edge version, broke a few things, and are interested in knowing how to fix them without going back to a stable version). I move that instaparties, at least in the Technion context, are obsolete. -- Man is the only animal that laughs and weeps, for he is the only animal that is struck with the difference between what things are and what they ought to be. - William Hazlitt Ohad Lutzky ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux
Re: [Haifux] W2L + Installation party?
First, I strongly support Tzafrir's point, which is echoed here by Adir: On Wed, Sep 17, 2008 at 7:06 PM, Adir Abraham [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: You can add a special table for configurations. It's been done in the past. Most of the requests are the same. Let's call that place Practical FAQ :-) That's the only thing which would be truly useful. However, I still think that an instaparty or a supportparty would not be helpful: Consider the climate: Linux is often touted as easy-to-install and easy-to-use. Someone who heard this would not understand why he needs to carry his cumbersome computer to an event to get this done for him, or take specific time out of his day to come in with his laptop. He is told he can do this at his own leisure - and this is what he prefers. Furthermore, he wouldn't want to install a yet-unknown (especially to his neighbours' kid) operating system if he didn't know he could handle it himself. Figuring out the downloading installing part on his own is very useful to gain this confidence (i.e. if I'm going to use this, I better be able to install it myself, I don't want those guys to do it for me and when I get home I'll be lost without their assistance). This occurs no matter how much you assure the people that we'll install it in such a way that you can use it forever and ever by yourself without our help. This creates a situation in which everyone would want to install Linux in their own time, meaning they'd need any initial support at a different time. For this reason, I send new installers to this mailing list if they have any problems, hoping that they might bring their computer into the next Haifux meeting so someone could help them. An organized event might raise awareness, but installations would happen afterwards, at home. I think Orr said it best - what we need is SiL lectures, and lots of them. We can use the W2L advertisements to promote some SiL lectures, perhaps in higher density (and perhaps about topic which are more attractive to new users) around the W2L date. -- Man is the only animal that laughs and weeps, for he is the only animal that is struck with the difference between what things are and what they ought to be. - William Hazlitt Ohad Lutzky ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux
Re: [Haifux] UBUNTU instalation
On Tue, Sep 9, 2008 at 9:31 AM, Shahar Dag [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Hi
I am installing Ubuntu 8.04 workstation (i386) on 2 different PCs (different
hardware).
I want the 2 PCs to be installed the same
On the first pc
I installed Ubuntu from the CD and then using synaptic package manager I
installed a long list of packages
To get the list in a file I used:
dpkg-query -W -f='${status} ${Package}=${Version}\n'|grep ^install ok
installed| cut -d' ' -f4,4 pkg_list.1
On the second computer
I installed Ubuntu from the CD and then used
cat pkg_list.1 | sudo aptitude install
sudo aptitude upgrade
dpkg-query -W -f='${status} ${Package}=${Version}\n'|grep ^install ok
installed| cut -d' ' -f4,4 pkg_list.2
The problem is that pkg_list.1 pkg_list.2 are different
How do I make the installed list to be identical
I think it would be useful to know what the difference between the lists is.
--
Man is the only animal that laughs and weeps, for he is the only
animal that is struck with the difference between what things are and
what they ought to be.
- William Hazlitt
Ohad Lutzky
___
Haifux mailing list
Haifux@haifux.org
http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux
Re: [Haifux] [HAIFUX Lecture] The Ruby programming language by Ohad Lutzky
Hello All, I'm afraid I'm going to have to postpone Monday's lecture to the following Monday, as it turns out I won't be able to arrive. I suggest that the W2L discussion remain. On Fri, Sep 5, 2008 at 5:41 PM, Orr Dunkelman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Next Monday, 8th of September, at 18:30, haifux is about to meet and hear Ohad Lutzky's talk about The Ruby programming language Ruby is a modern, elegant programming language. It can be described as dynamic and object-oriented. Others call it a scripting language. It has recently become quite popular, thanks to the Ruby on Rails web development kit. In this lecture I will present the language and try to show some of the neat things about it. A background in programming (and preferably some knowledge of object-oriented programming) will be required for this lecture. == Before the talk, a short discussion (10 minutes tops!) of how, when, and if to hold W2L series will take place. It'll start exactly on 18:30. All comments and views are welcome. == We meet in Taub building, room 6. For instructions see: http://www.haifux.org/where.html Attendance is free, and you are all invited! == We are always interested in hearing your talks and ideas. If you wish to give a talk, hold a discussion, or just plan some event haifux might be interested in, please contact us at [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Orr Dunkelman, [EMAIL PROTECTED] a scientific man ought to have no wishes, no affections, -- a mere heart of stone - Charles Darwin. GPG fingerprint: C2D5 C6D6 9A24 9A95 C5B3 2023 6CAB 4A7C B73F D0AA (This key will never sign Emails, only other PGP keys. The key corresponds to [EMAIL PROTECTED]) ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux -- Man is the only animal that laughs and weeps, for he is the only animal that is struck with the difference between what things are and what they ought to be. - William Hazlitt Ohad Lutzky ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux
[Haifux] [lecture proposal] Ruby
Ruby is a dynamic, open source programming language with a focus on simplicity and productivity. It has an elegant syntax that is natural to read and easy to write. Hello world in ruby is: print Hello World! (or, alternatively, for interactive ruby, just Hello World!) Anyone interested? -- Man is the only animal that laughs and weeps, for he is the only animal that is struck with the difference between what things are and what they ought to be. - William Hazlitt Ohad Lutzky ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux
Re: [Haifux] [lecture proposal] Ruby
On Wed, Aug 27, 2008 at 7:00 PM, ik [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I've made a lecture abotu Ruby last month on Telux, and I think i should have made it different, but you can download my slides at: http://ik.homelinux.org/index.rhtml/lectures/puts_ruby Most of my code is bad I know, it was supposed to give an examples on what ruby can do and not how to write things correctly. Ido There's some good stuff in there, and I might just use it in my own slides. Thanks! -- Man is the only animal that laughs and weeps, for he is the only animal that is struck with the difference between what things are and what they ought to be. - William Hazlitt Ohad Lutzky ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux
Re: [Haifux] Autoconf/Automake lecture tomorrow - please cancel
I'm up for it On Sun, Jul 27, 2008 at 9:38 PM, Leon Romanovsky [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I do. Oron Peled wrote: On Sunday, 27 בJuly 2008, Hai Zaar wrote: I was going to give autoconf/automake lecture tomorrow. Unfortunately I can't make it - unexpected business meeting came in. We can reschedule it somewhere in late September/October. If anyone want, I'm willing to do tomorrow my autotools lecture (autoconf/automake/libtool). Just let me know if anyone interested. -- Leon Romanovsky - Change is inevitable; progress is optional. ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux -- Man is the only animal that laughs and weeps, for he is the only animal that is struck with the difference between what things are and what they ought to be. - William Hazlitt Ohad Lutzky ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux
Re: [Haifux] Ideas for meetings
Same here On Mon, Jul 14, 2008 at 12:57 PM, Yotam Medini יותם מדיני [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I am interested. -- yotam On Mon, Jul 14, 2008 at 12:40 PM, Hai Zaar [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I can give a very throughout lecture about Autoconf/Automake and friends. Is anyone interested? ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux -- Man is the only animal that laughs and weeps, for he is the only animal that is struck with the difference between what things are and what they ought to be. - William Hazlitt Ohad Lutzky ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux
[Haifux] Lightning talk! LEHITPAKED
(I couldn't find any appropriate translation. Anyone know one?) Time limit for this session: 7 minutes! Everyone participating, please list the topics you'll be talking about. (That's 7 separate minutes for each topic, switching speakers after every topic) If anyone has a ding (that is, a small counter-top bell), bring it :) I have three topics to talk about, time granting: 1. Writing a small application to get around a clunky website (specifically on the Egged website's free text search) 2. Git's patch-add and interactive-rebase modes (sure to impress users of other VCSs as well :)) 3. TTime, a rewrite of fork of a clone of a clone of Marprog, the Technion timetable schedular -- Man is the only animal that laughs and weeps, for he is the only animal that is struck with the difference between what things are and what they ought to be. - William Hazlitt Ohad Lutzky ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux
Re: [Haifux] Lightning talk! LEHITPAKED
No! You must give a full hour, at another time! XD I guess we can fit you in. On Wed, Jul 9, 2008 at 2:38 PM, Hai Zaar [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'll talk about using ident to mark your binaries - the right way to do it. About libbash - it will not fit in 7 minutes. I'll need about 20. What do we do? -- Zaar -- Man is the only animal that laughs and weeps, for he is the only animal that is struck with the difference between what things are and what they ought to be. - William Hazlitt Ohad Lutzky ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux
Re: [Haifux] Lightning talk! LEHITPAKED
On Wed, Jul 9, 2008 at 11:04 PM, boazg [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: hi i'm in a graphics mood cairo, anyone? Yes please! (Just everyone suggest everything, I doubt we'll have to filter anything out) On Wed, Jul 9, 2008 at 12:16, Ohad Lutzky [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: (I couldn't find any appropriate translation. Anyone know one?) Time limit for this session: 7 minutes! Everyone participating, please list the topics you'll be talking about. (That's 7 separate minutes for each topic, switching speakers after every topic) If anyone has a ding (that is, a small counter-top bell), bring it :) I have three topics to talk about, time granting: 1. Writing a small application to get around a clunky website (specifically on the Egged website's free text search) 2. Git's patch-add and interactive-rebase modes (sure to impress users of other VCSs as well :)) 3. TTime, a rewrite of fork of a clone of a clone of Marprog, the Technion timetable schedular -- Man is the only animal that laughs and weeps, for he is the only animal that is struck with the difference between what things are and what they ought to be. - William Hazlitt Ohad Lutzky ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux -- Robert Benchley - Drawing on my fine command of the English language, I said nothing. -- Man is the only animal that laughs and weeps, for he is the only animal that is struck with the difference between what things are and what they ought to be. - William Hazlitt Ohad Lutzky ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux
Re: [Haifux] Lightning talks session proposal
My topics are: 1. A few tips and tricks for git (rebase --interactive, add --patch, and a tip for working on USB keys) 2. Using Wireshark and scripting to get around clunky websites On Tue, Jun 17, 2008 at 4:09 AM, Hai Zaar [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Good day, dear list! I'd like to propose lightning talks session. Session subject: anything! My topics are: 1. Using ident to mark your binaries - the right way to do it 2. Code reuse in bash scripts - introducing libbash You are welcome to introduce your topics and/or show intrest. -- Zaar ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux -- Man is the only animal that laughs and weeps, for he is the only animal that is struck with the difference between what things are and what they ought to be. - William Hazlitt Ohad Lutzky -- Man is the only animal that laughs and weeps, for he is the only animal that is struck with the difference between what things are and what they ought to be. - William Hazlitt Ohad Lutzky ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux
Re: [Haifux] MiShenichnas Adar Marbin Be'hartza'a
The ceremony created around this commemoration has evolved into high levels of complexity, including such elements as the Queries: SELECT * FROM attributes WHERE last_change = TONIGHT(); On Tue, Mar 25, 2008 at 9:45 PM, Eran Tromer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Orr, On 2008-03-25 11:26, Orr Dunkelman wrote: Soon, passover will arrive. Passover, as you all know, is the holiday when we commemorate the move Bnei Israel have done from using Microsoft Office Pyramid (tm) into FreePeople Linux distribution. To cherish the event, I would like to ask those of you who wish to speak on the miracles (like the burning CPU that still computed correctly, the fact that the hard drives carried by Bnei Israel from Egypt were not ruined by the dead sea, while their storage bank went completely blank, and of course, the acceptance of the Linux kernel at mount Sinai) to step forward. Don't forget the less glorious aspects such as the worship of the Golden Gnu, the whining of the People about incompatible meat-pot drivers, or R. Akiva's creative benchmarks showing 250 Plagues of Egypt. Eran ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux -- Man is the only animal that laughs and weeps, for he is the only animal that is struck with the difference between what things are and what they ought to be. - William Hazlitt Ohad Lutzky ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux
[Haifux] Active Directory integration with Likewise Open
Likewise Open is meant to be integrated into Ubuntu Hardy (8.04). It's available for gutsy, but poorly documented. Nevertheless, it seems to work very well, with far less painful configuration. The only caveat I can find is that the group\username string has to be entered as the username, and I don't think this can change. Any opinions? (Active Directory integration is a must for me, and SFU's LDAP option isn't an option for me as I cannot change the active directory structure) -- Man is the only animal that laughs and weeps, for he is the only animal that is struck with the difference between what things are and what they ought to be. - William Hazlitt Ohad Lutzky ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux
[Haifux] Can anyone give a GVFS lecture?
It's the next generation of Gnome-VFS (a total rewrite, it seems), due for the next Gnome (and Ubuntu) and I was wondering whether anyone knows it well enough (and if anyone else cares) to give a lecture. -- Man is the only animal that laughs and weeps, for he is the only animal that is struck with the difference between what things are and what they ought to be. - William Hazlitt Ohad Lutzky ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux
Re: [Haifux] Syncing Nokia phones
Works perfectly! Much thanks. On 2/25/08, Dave Roi [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: This should work: http://www.goosync.com/SupportedDevices.aspx your cellphone is listed as supported. It syncs it over the internet. no need for a computer. Dave. On Sun, Feb 24, 2008 at 3:13 PM, Ohad Lutzky [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi guys, I have a shiny new Nokia 6120 Classic, and I find myself using its built-in calendar a lot. I'd like to sync it against Google Calendar, as some people rely on my free/busy information there. I know Haggai has an... interesting... solution to the problem, if you could detail it I'd be very happy :) Is there something straightforward which would work on a Debian/Ubuntu system relatively cleanly, and preferably use USB (and not bluetooth)? Much thanks, Ohad. -- Man is the only animal that laughs and weeps, for he is the only animal that is struck with the difference between what things are and what they ought to be. - William Hazlitt Ohad Lutzky ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux -- Sent from Gmail for mobile | mobile.google.com Man is the only animal that laughs and weeps, for he is the only animal that is struck with the difference between what things are and what they ought to be. - William Hazlitt Ohad Lutzky ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux
Re: [Haifux] Syncing Nokia phones
Actually, I was thinking of the VMWare/OSX solution :) ScheduleWorld sounds like a good option, but all I'm getting is a godaddy parked domain. (Google seems to know the site though). On Sun, Feb 24, 2008 at 4:49 PM, Haggai Eran [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi, There are many solutions to this, but I still haven't found a good one. Using ScheduleWorld. A website that allows synchronization of phones directly with Google Calendar through SyncML. Requires a cellular Internet connection. Synchronize your desktop Evolution with Google Calendar directly (readonly with the ical files published by Google) or through ScheduleWorld, using SyncEvolution: a utility that syncrhonizes Evolution with a SyncML server. Then synchronize Evolution with your phone using OpenSync. It currently kinda supports bluetooth/obex and bluetooth/syncml directly but it may also support USB connections using gnokii or some other hack. Did I miss anything out? Haggai On 24/02/2008, Ohad Lutzky [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi guys, I have a shiny new Nokia 6120 Classic, and I find myself using its built-in calendar a lot. I'd like to sync it against Google Calendar, as some people rely on my free/busy information there. I know Haggai has an... interesting... solution to the problem, if you could detail it I'd be very happy :) Is there something straightforward which would work on a Debian/Ubuntu system relatively cleanly, and preferably use USB (and not bluetooth)? Much thanks, Ohad. -- Man is the only animal that laughs and weeps, for he is the only animal that is struck with the difference between what things are and what they ought to be. - William Hazlitt Ohad Lutzky ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux -- Man is the only animal that laughs and weeps, for he is the only animal that is struck with the difference between what things are and what they ought to be. - William Hazlitt Ohad Lutzky ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux
[Haifux] Simulated permissions on VFAT
Hi everybody, I'm trying to use my DoK for various things which are sensitive to the executable (chmod +/-x) bit. As I want to be able to use this DoK on Windows systems as well, it's formatted to VFAT (NTFS is also an option, thanks to ntfs-3g). Is there any way to get any form of simulated permission bits for the file system, which Linux will take heed of? (For example, an option to a VFAT filesystem module which will read/write such permission data to dotfiles in each directory, and subsequently hide those files from me). Mac discussions talk about a Sparse filesystem - I imagine that what they mean is a filesystem-in-a-file, which expands and shrinks to accomodate its contents. This would work well too. ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux
Re: [Haifux] Simulated permissions on VFAT
Looking for a simpler solution (although UMSDOS, upon re-reading, seems to do exactly what I wanted, but is discontinued), here's an alternative problem to solve: What I *REALLY* want to do is use my DoK to synchronize two computers, when one of them has very poor upstream (otherwise I'd use the excellent unison over the net). I already currently do this using unison, but I lose permissions, which is a problem. One solution would be to save my files onto the DoK in archived form, something along the lines of this: Write: tar jcvf sync.tar.bz2 files_to_sync/ rsync sync.tar.bz2 /media/DoK/sync.tar.bz2 Read: rsync /media/DoK/sync.tar.bz2 sync.tar.bz2 tar jxvf sync.tar.bz2 However, this would be very slow, even without compression. Any ideas on how to make it faster? -- Man is the only animal that laughs and weeps, for he is the only animal that is struck with the difference between what things are and what they ought to be. - William Hazlitt Ohad Lutzky ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux
[Haifux] Git Lecture discussion
I hope my lecture was bearable :) Regarding keyword substituion: It turns out that Linus thinks it's a horrible idea: http://kerneltrap.org/mailarchive/git/2006/10/9/223932 (This has the unfortunate consequence of making several of the attendees ugly. Sorry everybody ;) ). It turns out I did something very similar on a whim (not having known keyword substitution beforehand) --- I've created a make a tarball of this revision script, which tags it appropriately (in a place appropriate to the application) according to the tag I've selected. Regarding rebasing: Indeed, it is only meant to be used when developing a private branch, and later submitting using git format-patch. (These patches are later applied using git am, and merging/rebasing works properly, leaving no duplicate commits). When working on a public topic branch, rebasing will cause problems for anyone pulling from the repository, so it's best to resort to ordinary merging. As patches usually don't need to be formatted for this usage, this isn't a big price to pay. There were several other issues explored which I couldn't answer properly... can anyone please remind me? Thank you all for coming! -- Man is the only animal that laughs and weeps, for he is the only animal that is struck with the difference between what things are and what they ought to be. - William Hazlitt ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux
Re: [Haifux] Proposal: Git lecture
On Sun, Jan 27, 2008 at 08:57:06AM +0200, Mark Silberstein wrote: Just to let you guys know, google talks hosted such a lecture by Linus. Still, it by no means implies that such lecture is not a good idea! That is very true! The lecture can be seen here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4XpnKHJAok8 Linus's talk is about the merits of git (or why CVS and SVN suck so bad), and I recommend watching it before my talk, in case you're curious as to how it compares with other systems - for the simple reason that I've never used anything other than SVN and git. Linus's talk does not have any examples, which is what I intend to bring to the table :) On Jan 27, 2008 7:45 AM, Yotam Medini יותם מדיני [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Jan 26, 2008 1:01 PM, Ohad Lutzky [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Anyone interested in hearing about *using* it? yes - me. -- yotam ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux -- Man is the only animal that laughs and weeps, for he is the only animal that is struck with the difference between what things are and what they ought to be. - William Hazlitt ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux
[Haifux] [Job Offer] Sysadmin at a Technion EE Lab
Hi guys, I'm the Linux Sysadmin of the SIPL lab in EE, Technion. Next semester is my final one, so I need someone to replace me. Job includes pretty basic administration of about 4 linux servers. The position is pretty much intended for a Technion student, hopefully one who plans on being around for a while (that is, not in his late semesters). Anyone interested? -- Man is the only animal that laughs and weeps, for he is the only animal that is struck with the difference between what things are and what they ought to be. - William Hazlitt Ohad Lutzky ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux
Re: [Haifux] Update of the Club's lecture hall
I'm all for it. On 12/14/07, Dave Roi [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi, I'm Dave, some of you know me from my work in the CS farm, I've been in charge of the Linux stations there for the past year and a half since Boaz and Lutzky left it. I recently started another job at Sun microsystems and I'd like to give some OpenSolaris related lectures such as ZFS, DTRACE, Solaris ZONES etc.. If the response will be good I can do lectures on all of them. I was thinking about starting with a ZFS lecture, which I think is cool but I can start with something else if people are more interested. Tell me what you guys think. Thanks, Dave. On Dec 7, 2007 11:19 PM, Orr Dunkelman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Dear all, I was informed by the CS dept. that haifux will no longer be holding its meetings in Taub 3. We were re-assigned Taub 6, on the first floor. Also, if you'll notice the queue currently contains only one lecture. If you are interested to speak about anything (including - how to write crawlers to get data for your experiments, how to develop software in Linux while running a VMWare, and/or how to re-install FC 8 (after FC 7 was acting more nicely) please contact the webmasters ([EMAIL PROTECTED]). Regards to all, -- Orr Dunkelman, [EMAIL PROTECTED] Any human thing supposed to be complete, must for that reason infallibly be faulty -- Herman Melville, Moby Dick. GPG fingerprint: C2D5 C6D6 9A24 9A95 C5B3 2023 6CAB 4A7C B73F D0AA (This key will never sign Emails, only other PGP keys. The key corresponds to [EMAIL PROTECTED]) ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux ___ Haifux mailing list Haifux@haifux.org http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/haifux
[Haifux] Django Lecture by Meir Kriheli
Meir has agreed to give a lecture about Django on the 23rd. Is this OK, or did I miss a scheduling conflict? -- Man is the only animal that laughs and weeps, for he is the only animal that is struck with the difference between what things are and what they ought to be. - William Hazlitt Ohad Lutzky - Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Anyone interested in a Django lecture?
Django (djangoproject.com) is a high-level Python Web framework that encourages rapid development and clean, pragmatic design. From the little of it I seem, an apt description seems to be Python on Rails. In the last lecture, the new Lahak CMS, custom-tailored for the whatsup site (currently testing at http://schools.whatsup.org.il as part of the Vaya project), was presented, and seems very impressive. Meir said he might give a lecture about Django. Anyone interested? -- Man is the only animal that laughs and weeps, for he is the only animal that is struck with the difference between what things are and what they ought to be. - William Hazlitt Ohad Lutzky - Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [Haifux] Linux Ubuntu in Haifa - help was needed , now some advise
Since these days anybody with Nvidia/ATI card has to fight to have minimal 3D (even to play tuxracer, not to mention beryl/compiz fun) I think that rules them out. I see you haven't tried Ubuntu Feisty yet... it automatically detects those cards (at least nVidia, from my experience), warns about the drivers being properietary, asks if you want to install them anyway, and goes ahead to install... :) -- Protect your digital freedom and privacy, eliminate DRM, learn more at http://www.defectivebydesign.org/what_is_drm Ohad Lutzky - Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Legal issues regarding iwlib and wireless linux extensions
Hello hackers :) I'm doing an academic project at the Technion, which relates to wireless networking. My host wants to use the project as a base for a free-beer application, but is not willing - at least at this point - to make the source code available to everyone. Now, to utilize wireless networking in Linux, the sensible path seems to be along iwconfig, which uses iwlib, which in turn uses ioctl calls to communicate with the wireless extensions in the Linux kernel. Using iwconfig directly with system calls is most likely out of the question, for being slow, unclean, and perhaps of changing interface. Using iwlib directly would be a far better option - but it's licensed under the GPL, and AFAIK linking against a library counts as 'distributing' it, which would force our software to be under the GPL. Using ioctl calls directly seems to be in the clear, but we might have to use hacks from libiw, which would, again, be problematic... Can anyone help make the legal situation here clearer? -- Protect your digital freedom and privacy, eliminate DRM, learn more at http://www.defectivebydesign.org/what_is_drm Ohad Lutzky - Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [Haifux] Windows in Haifux
Just a few more points to throw in here - In the short time I've been in Haifux, it's been mostly a 'vote-with-your-feet' club. People show up to lectures which interest them, and speak in favor of them on the mailing list. The reason, I believe, we mostly have our tight-knit linux-related lectures (taking all three terms with a grain of salt), is that the topics we choose grow mostly out of the heavily community-oriented Linux/F/OSS... er... community. That is, where Microsoft might [send someone to] give a lecture about .NET, the body to give a lecture about upcoming versions of Perl, for example, would be the perl mongrels themselves. Therefore, the other-OS-tolerance is there, just on different topics. So while a lecture about here's how wireless networking drivers work in Windows wouldn't be so interesting, I believe, to Haifux-goers, a lecture about here's how to get Windows wireless networking drivers to work in Linux using ndiswrapper - which would certainly include parts of the former - would be very interesting to many of us. Other lectures which might be of interest, of relation to this topic are (off the top of my head) - * An introduction to WiPeer, when (or perhaps more interestingly - while) it is being ported to Linux * Open formats - Opendocument and its implementation in various word processors, perhaps including MS's * Writing cross-platform software (I can already see the subtitle... or: why Firefox is so damned slow on Linux) * Something heavier - design principles comparison between the NT kernel and Unix-style kernels (please don't stone me :)) -- Protect your digital freedom and privacy, eliminate DRM, learn more at http://www.defectivebydesign.org/what_is_drm Ohad Lutzky - Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [Haifux] lecture proposal
I certainly trust Boaz's judgement on this one. Besides, the way the queue looks, it seems like even two hours on the benefits and issues of Rocket Jumping in various versions of Quake would be a welcome lecture :/ On 4/5/07, Orr Dunkelman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I looked in the website for our charter ;), We had in the past talks about proprietary software (at the early beginning). In any case, if Boaz is giving the lecture, I'm sure he will be able to address relevant issues. Orr. On 4/5/07, Muli Ben-Yehuda [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mon, Apr 02, 2007 at 04:10:08PM +0300, boazg wrote: i was wondering if there is enough interest for a lecture on AIX? I don't quite see how a talk about a proprietary OS fits Haifux's charter? Cheers, Muli - Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Orr Dunkelman, [EMAIL PROTECTED] , [EMAIL PROTECTED] Any human thing supposed to be complete, must for that reason infallibly be faulty -- Herman Melville, Moby Dick. Spammers: http://vipe.technion.ac.il/~orrd/spam.html GPG fingerprint: C2D5 C6D6 9A24 9A95 C5B3 2023 6CAB 4A7C B73F D0AA (This key will never sign Emails, only other PGP keys.) -- Protect your digital freedom and privacy, eliminate DRM, learn more at http://www.defectivebydesign.org/what_is_drm Ohad Lutzky - Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [Haifux] lecture proposal
Hear hear. People are interested, we should have the lecture. If anyone isn't interested, simply don't show up. (Liking the ice-cream manufacturing idea... Boaz?) -- Protect your digital freedom and privacy, eliminate DRM, learn more at http://www.defectivebydesign.org/what_is_drm Ohad Lutzky - Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [Haifux] lecture proposal
I'm all for it! On 4/2/07, Orr Dunkelman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: as haifux. We already had talks about OpenSolaris. And given the fact that Boaz has just volunteered himself, I think we can trust him to put enought emphasis on the relation between AIX and Linux. Orr. On 4/2/07, Orna Agmon Ben-Yehuda [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mon, 2 Apr 2007, Orr Dunkelman wrote: Date: Mon, 2 Apr 2007 15:14:14 +0200 From: Orr Dunkelman [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: Haifa Linux Club haifux@haifux.org Subject: Re: [Haifux] lecture proposal Yes! Under Haifux as a Linux Club or as a free software club? On 4/2/07, boazg [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: i was wondering if there is enough interest for a lecture on AIX? Orna. -- Orna Agmon Ben-Yehuda http://ladypine.org/ ICQ: 348759096 - Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Orr Dunkelman, [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED] Any human thing supposed to be complete, must for that reason infallibly be faulty -- Herman Melville, Moby Dick. Spammers: http://vipe.technion.ac.il/~orrd/spam.html GPG fingerprint: C2D5 C6D6 9A24 9A95 C5B3 2023 6CAB 4A7C B73F D0AA (This key will never sign Emails, only other PGP keys.) -- Protect your digital freedom and privacy, eliminate DRM, learn more at http://www.defectivebydesign.org/what_is_drm Ohad Lutzky - Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [Haifux] Call for experts (for the Linux for CS lecture)
On 3/23/07, guy keren [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: i don't like encouraging people into using something that does not fit them - so i try to make sure they understand they are expected to do some learning, in order to get by. You are correct in the sense that they are expected to do some learning, and I think it's evident from my lecture slides. Furthermore, this lecture is meant as an addition to the Matam course, which already aims to teach the students programming in a Unix environment. don't worry - i'm not going to jump during the lecture and shout don't listen to him!. just during the QA session. if you were teaching people that never saw MS software - i might have had a different opinion. but once they saw it - anything else will be considered not as good - even if it is better but different. I find that the not as good resistance breaks down once valgrind is shown :) lets not argue here - i think that the MS environment in inferior to the tools i like - but i can see the advantages it does have for people with slow fingers, short memories and moderate laziness ;) The issue is that the Matam homework is checked on T2, a solaris computer, with very strict gcc flags. While many have successfully written and tested their code in Microsoft tools and had it running perfectly on T2, these are usually only the ones who are excellent programmers to begin with. For most people, finishing the exercise only to find that they have a lot of debugging to do on T2 is a problem - as they will not have had experience debugging and coding in a Unix environment. Furthermore, the TCSH exercise will force them to use a Unix environment. My point is that the lecture's focus isn't one of use Linux for your programming, it's better than anything else! - rather, it's you're forced to do Unix programming, but it's not as bad as you might think. -- Protect your digital freedom and privacy, eliminate DRM, learn more at http://www.defectivebydesign.org/what_is_drm Ohad Lutzky - Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] [HAIFUX] [Haifux Lecture] Linux for CS Students - A primer
This Wednesday (2007-3-8), at 18:30, Haifa Linux Club will gather to hear Ohad Lutzky talk about Linux for CS Students (A primer) In several CS courses - mainly Matam, Data Structures and Operating Systems, students face the often-unfamiliar Linux environment, and use it to hand in course exercises. Experienced users have often seen them have difficulty with these topics, which the lecture will cover: - Getting around in a Linux environment (through graphical UI and commandline) - Compiling multi-source-file programs properly - first into object (.o) files, then linking - Creating and using Makefiles The 2-hour session will start with a 1-hour lecture, and be followed by a 1-hour QA session. Experienced Linux users will be arriving to answer questions the students may have about using Linux. The only recommended prior knowledge is basic C programming (for example, Intro to CS). The lecture will demonstrate on a Linux environment, but the topics apply also to using T2 directly. This lecture and QA session should be of particular interest to Matam students. We meet in Taub building, room 3. For instructions see: http://haifux.org/where.html Attendance is free, and you are all invited! We are always looking for interesting lectures. If you wish to contribute a lecture to the 2006/7 lecture season - please contact [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Protect your digital freedom and privacy, eliminate DRM, learn more at http://www.defectivebydesign.org/what_is_drm Ohad Lutzky - Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Re: [HAIFUX] [Haifux Lecture] Linux for CS Students - A primer
Pardon, this is 2007-3-28 of course. On 3/22/07, Ohad Lutzky [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: This Wednesday (2007-3-8), at 18:30, Haifa Linux Club will gather to hear Ohad Lutzky talk about Linux for CS Students (A primer) In several CS courses - mainly Matam, Data Structures and Operating Systems, students face the often-unfamiliar Linux environment, and use it to hand in course exercises. Experienced users have often seen them have difficulty with these topics, which the lecture will cover: - Getting around in a Linux environment (through graphical UI and commandline) - Compiling multi-source-file programs properly - first into object (.o) files, then linking - Creating and using Makefiles The 2-hour session will start with a 1-hour lecture, and be followed by a 1-hour QA session. Experienced Linux users will be arriving to answer questions the students may have about using Linux. The only recommended prior knowledge is basic C programming (for example, Intro to CS). The lecture will demonstrate on a Linux environment, but the topics apply also to using T2 directly. This lecture and QA session should be of particular interest to Matam students. We meet in Taub building, room 3. For instructions see: http://haifux.org/where.html Attendance is free, and you are all invited! We are always looking for interesting lectures. If you wish to contribute a lecture to the 2006/7 lecture season - please contact [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Protect your digital freedom and privacy, eliminate DRM, learn more at http://www.defectivebydesign.org/what_is_drm Ohad Lutzky -- Protect your digital freedom and privacy, eliminate DRM, learn more at http://www.defectivebydesign.org/what_is_drm Ohad Lutzky - Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Using Wordpress for the Haifux Website
Hello all, I've just had the dubious pleasure of updating the Haifux Website. Mountains of perl scripts and makefiles, a very inconvenient system. My suggestion: Wordpress. It's a 'weblog' application written in PHP, but from my experience with it - it would be perfect for our needs. It supports uploading files, tagging (for example, by lecturer), and is much easier to update. While this is Free software which can be installed on Vipe, it might be beneficial - if this is, in your eyes, acceptable - to use Wordpress.com for hosting - it's free, with no ads, and one only needs to pay for upgraded storage, as they only give 50MB for free. What do you think of this? -- Protect your digital freedom and privacy, eliminate DRM, learn more at http://www.defectivebydesign.org/what_is_drm Ohad Lutzky - Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [Haifux] Call for experts (for the Linux for CS lecture)
On 3/22/07, Peleg Sapir [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: errr... am I considered expert enough? If so, I would gladly come ;-) You're more of a henchman, but OK ;) (Anyone who is capable of compiling, debugging, valgrinding and creating a makefile for a multi-source-file C and C++ program in Linux would fall under the category of expert for this lecture) On 3/22/07, Ohad Lutzky [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: You know who you are :) It'll be useful to have a few more experts around for the QA session. Any volunteers? -- Protect your digital freedom and privacy, eliminate DRM, learn more at http://www.defectivebydesign.org/what_is_drm Ohad Lutzky - Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Peleg S. Predictable Peace, love, and Linux makes me think of a guy with excessive facial hair in a tidy t-shirt, shorts, and sandals saying You can't use that distribution MAN You can't like, own an OS, MAN (bash quote #4395) -- Protect your digital freedom and privacy, eliminate DRM, learn more at http://www.defectivebydesign.org/what_is_drm Ohad Lutzky - Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [Haifux] Call for experts (for the Linux for CS lecture)
On 3/22/07, guy keren [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: i guess i might fall into that category, then. i'll try to come. of-course, that means i'll tell them students to stick with windows and visual studio - unless they are courageous enough and stubborn enough for self-learning. Guy, please don't tell them that within my lecture :/ Feel free to argue with me (and the audience, hopefully) about it during the QA session though. -- Protect your digital freedom and privacy, eliminate DRM, learn more at http://www.defectivebydesign.org/what_is_drm Ohad Lutzky - Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [Haifux] An introductory of sorts
Define equal and fair. My intention is to show a few screenshots, say that many prefer it, that many of those do prefer it because it's similar to certain other operating systems, that applications which work here almost always work identically there, that there are distributions (I plan on demonstrating Ubuntu, so I'll mention Kubuntu) which have it installed by default, and then get on with demonstrating Gnome. On 2/5/07, boazg [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: sounds like a great idea. just remember to use only well-tested stable beryl plug-ins. and give KDE an equal and fair chance. On 2/4/07, guy keren [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Ohad Lutzky wrote: On 2/4/07, guy keren [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: and then you'll come and say oh, we need to give the lecture about debugging and developing on linux. wasn't it already agreed to re-run it for the spring semester students? Well, definitely, but this isn't what I had in mind. I was thinking more along the lines of there's this thing called Linux, and you'll be using it this semester, and you'll hear lots of horror stories, but here are a few cool things about it - proceed to show off stuff like desktop environments, package management, Beryl, LiveCDs... Stick a bit of lightweight F/OSS ideology and history in there... that is, something to make the people feel more at ease with Linux. Otherwise the clash with the unknowns of the commandline one experiences in Matam is often all that it takes to keep him locked in Proprietaria forever. well, go ahead and prepare this. then be ready to add the dev tools re-run ;) --guy - Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Protect your digital freedom and privacy, eliminate DRM, learn more at http://www.defectivebydesign.org/what_is_drm Ohad Lutzky - Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] An introductory of sorts
It's that time again... Spring semester coming up soon, and I was wondering what we can do to pester non-linux-users around us :) I was thinking something small, CS faculty, a few printed A4s. One lecture, one hour, a bit CS-second-semester-oriented, but not technical. That is, we should say something motivational about you'll have to use this anyway, and that's it. What do you guys think? -- Protect your digital freedom and privacy, eliminate DRM, learn more at http://www.defectivebydesign.org/what_is_drm Ohad Lutzky - Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [Haifux] Re: version control wiki
I (n-verb) that. TRAC is amazing, and very comfortable to use. its functionality can also be augmented through many available plugins. On 1/24/07, boazg [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: i too recommend TRAC. ive worked with it on some projects, and it is quite an impressive combination. On 1/24/07, Jacob Broido [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I second that one, TRAC! This suite is just brilliant: wiki,svn,project management, bugtask management, extendable and pluggable, not bloated.. Go with TRAC and you'll never look back. On 1/24/07, Diego Iastrubni [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: TRAC, only trac. It integrates bugzilla(like)+svn+wiki in one tight nice integration. When you start using it, everything else just stinks. ביום רביעי 24 ינואר 2007, 11:27, נכתב על ידי Nadav Har'El: On Wed, Jan 24, 2007, Shahar Dag wrote about version control wiki: 1.. Can you recommend a good implementation of version control wiki (we would like to use free software) I am not aware of a version control + wiki combination (but maybe someone can correct me?), so you will have to choose each one separately. For version control, I would recommend Subversion. It is very similar in its basic philosophy to CVS, but it's simply better in many ways (I'm sure that Google can return heaps of comparisons of Subversion to every other version control system under the sun). For Wiki, I don't have any experiance of actually *installing* such a system, but from a user's perspective, I'd recommend MediaWiki, because it has the most familar syntax (at least to the hundreds of thousands of people which contribute to Wikipedia). To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Not gonna be king of the world if you're slave to the grind - Skid Row -- Protect your digital freedom and privacy, eliminate DRM, learn more at http://www.defectivebydesign.org/what_is_drm Ohad Lutzky
Re: [Haifux] Please read the following with a smile
It is a sad state of affairs in which I can't even give the lectures I've been planning to... not this semester, anyway. I'm hoping to rerun C without a spoon for the beginning of next semester, as well as my Linux for CS student lectures. Spring is a bigger Matam semester, so it should be quite successful. However, I don't think I have anything particularily interesting to show for intermediate users upwards... On 1/16/07, Alon Altman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hello all, I'm sorry to say, that due to several deadlines on the end of January I will probably not be able to prepare the DV lecture on time, or at least not with all the demos I planned. Please suggest a different lecture for the same date. Alon On Tue, 16 Jan 2007, Orr Dunkelman wrote: Dear Tzadikim Sheli, The time has come that the queue of future lectures is empty. Thus, it is high time to open your hearts (and calendars!) and try to see what you can contribute to the club. For example, if you know of a topic you can pass, or you know of a topic that someone else can pass - please share. Don't use lame excuses (like I'm not even in Israel) prevent you from giving such a lecture (or finding someone else who can). May the Penguin be with y'all. Orr. -- Orr Dunkelman, [EMAIL PROTECTED] If it wasn't for C, we'd be writing programs in BASI, PASAL, and OBOL, anon Spammers: http://vipe.technion.ac.il/~orrd/spam.html GPG fingerprint: C2D5 C6D6 9A24 9A95 C5B3 2023 6CAB 4A7C B73F D0AA (This key will never sign Emails, only other PGP keys.) -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- This message was sent by Alon Altman ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) ICQ:1366540 GPG public key at http://8ln.org/pubkey.txt Key fingerprint = A670 6C81 19D3 3773 3627 DE14 B44A 50A3 FE06 7F24 -- -=[ Random Fortune ]=- O imitators, you slavish herd! -- Quintus Horatius Flaccus (Horace) - Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Protect your digital freedom and privacy, eliminate DRM, learn more at http://www.defectivebydesign.org/what_is_drm Ohad Lutzky - Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [Haifux] Proposition for a lecture next monday
Actually, I'd rather switch that around. Next monday is less comfortable for me, it turns out. I've spoken with Peleg, he has no problem giving his lecture next monday. On 11/26/06, guy keren [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: by the way, regarding timing of the lecture, since there is already a promise to give a 'debugging in linux' lecture for the CS students next week, and to avoid disrupting the normal club operations, this linux, GNUs and penguins lecture will have to be done in 3 weeks from now. this means that this week there'll be a standard meeting (about LVM2), as far as i understand. --guy On Thu, 2006-11-23 at 04:28 +0200, Shai Shkolnitsky wrote: אני מסכים עם גיא קרן. אישית אני חושב שזה חשוב שכמה שיותר חברי חיפוקס יהיו נוכחים בהרצאה שלך, שגם הם יוכלו לתת תשובות. הרעיון של גיא לשם הוא נחמד ביותר, אם יורשה לי אני אציע וריאציה של השם שלו: Linux, of GNUs and Penguins לדעתי שלושת הנושאים הכי חשובים בהרצאה הם (לוא דווקא בסדר זה): - Where the hell is the C:\ Drive- The major differences (and similarities) between Linux and Windows - Linux, the myth of usability-it is sure as hell User Friendly- The major aspects of User Friendliness in Linux - Open Source software, the rights are yours- The Ideas that drive the Open Source community אני חושב ששלושת אלה הם די והותר להרצאה של שעתיים. הרצאה על הקרנל, על ההפצות השונות, על שורת הפקודה וכד' היא חשובה, אבל משנית בחשיבותה אם אתה רוצה יותר אנשים שעוברים לעבוד עם לינוקס. הניסיון שלי עם משתמשי וינדוס הוא בערך כזה(לדעתי זה מאוד חשוב להבין איך הם חושבים ותופסים את לינוקס כדי להסביר להם, צריך לדעת אילו מיתוסים להפריך): היום (כבר אתמול) דיברתי עם חבר שלי, סטודנט להנדסת חשמל, הוא אמר לי אני נכנסתי לחוות לינוקס, לראות מה זה, איפה כונן סי? טענות האנטי לינוקס של אבא שלי הן כאלה: מי לעזאזל משמש בזה, מי צריך את זה? זה בכלל לא ידידותי למשתמש, אי אפשר להשתמש בזה אין אף תוכנה נורמלית בשביל לינוקס, אתה מתקין, ומה הלאה, איך אתה עובד עם זה? קודם כל אתה צריך לתת לקהל שלך שיחון לינוקס-וינדוס. איזשהו אוסף של מושגים שהם יכולים להבין, לקשר ולעשות אסוציאציות לוינדוס. לאחר מכן תסביר להם שלינוקס, בניגוד מוחלט למיתוס היא ידידותית למשתמש ושמישה ביותר, אפילו יותר מווינדוס (מגוון רחב של שפות ממשק, ממשק משתמש נוח ואינטואיטיבי למשתמשים). אגב, חוות הלינוקס בטכניון היא לא דוגמה טובה. היום הייתי בה, היא לא כזו שמישה. חוץ מזה, חושב להדגיש, שיש(!) המון המון המון תוכנות ללינוקס שטובות אף יותר מאלה לווינדוס, וכמותן גדולה פי עשרות מונים. החלק הראשון של ההרצאה צריך להיות היסטוריה קצרה של גנו\לינוקס. סטלמן, טורבלדס, ומה שביניהם. וכמובן מה הרעיון שעומד מאחורי תוכנה חופשית (למה זה יותר מחינם, ולמה זה קיים בכלל). דווקא החלק הזה צריך להיות קצר יותר, אחרת הקהל יירדם מהר מאוד, אם הוא ייכנס לעניין של לינוקס הוא יקרא על זה לבד בהרחבה. ההיסטוריה השלמה והמלאה של הקוד הפתוח מתחילת הרעיון ועד היום זה דווקא רעיון להרצאה מעניינת לחברי חיפוקס הלינוקסאים כבר. אני גם חושב שלא יזיק לעשות בעקבות ההרצאה שלך מסיבת התקנה (מאוד מאוד מאוד כדאי, זה ימנע מאנשים להירתע מהתקנה כושלת). בשלב הבא, בתור הרצאה למתחילים (אוסף הרצאות שלדעתי צריך להיות בתחילת כל שנה, עבור סטודנטים חדשים) צריך באמת להתמקד בלהסביר לקהל מה הן ההפצות העיקריות, למה שורת פקודה זה לא פרמיטיבי וכו'. באופן עקרון הרעיון שלך להרצאה הוא נהדר. היעדר מקור מידע היה הקושי העיקרי שלי בלהתחיל להשתמש בלינוקס. נ.ב: אם אתה צריך כל סוג של עזרה לגבי ההרצאה הזו, אני אשמח לעזור. - Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Protect your digital freedom and privacy, eliminate DRM, learn more at http://www.defectivebydesign.org/what_is_drm Ohad Lutzky
Re: [Haifux] Re: A bit of help regarding my upcoming lecture
No such files here either. On 11/27/06, Shlomi Fish [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Monday 27 November 2006 10:59, Shai Shkolnitsky wrote: I have found some important thing regarding my upcoming lecture, that would help expand it a bit (And maybe make it interesting for non SiL guys). Yet, with all the inconsistencies between the distributions I want to make sure if that kind of thing is at all valid. If you would be so kind as to check whether the following files exist on your system as well, I would be really grateful. /usr/lib/cron/run-crons /etc/sysconfig/cron Neither of them exists in my Mandriva 2007 system. And one more thing, if you have spare time. Please search a dir named crontabs or cron/tabs, possibly in /var/spool/ (Permission to the parent directory might be privileged). [EMAIL PROTECTED] shlomi]# locate crontabs [EMAIL PROTECTED] shlomi]# locate tabs | grep cron/tabs Regards, Shlomi Fish - Shlomi Fish [EMAIL PROTECTED] Homepage:http://www.shlomifish.org/ Chuck Norris wrote a complete Perl 6 implementation in a day but then destroyed all evidence with his bare hands, so no one will know his secrets. - Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Protect your digital freedom and privacy, eliminate DRM, learn more at http://www.defectivebydesign.org/what_is_drm Ohad Lutzky - Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [Haifux] additions for today's LVM2 lecture
On 11/28/06, guy keren [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: here are some issues that were raised during today's LVM2 lecture, and some answers i found for them: *snip* I would like to add something from the manpage, which answers the question I asked (and I believe is important): To move all logical extents of any logical volumes on /dev/hda4 to free physical extents elsewhere in the volume group, giving verbose runtime information, use: pvmove -v /dev/hda4 How cool is that? :) -- Protect your digital freedom and privacy, eliminate DRM, learn more at http://www.defectivebydesign.org/what_is_drm Ohad Lutzky - Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Lecture announcement: Linux for CS Students
This Monday (20.11.06), at 18:30, Haifa Linux Club will gather to hear Ohad Lutzky talk about Linux for CS Students (A primer) In several CS courses - mainly Matam, Data Structures and Operating Systems, students face the often-unfamiliar Linux environment, and use it to hand in course exercises. Experienced users have often seen them have difficulty with these topics, which the lecture will cover: - Getting around in a Linux environment (through graphical UI and commandline) - Compiling multi-source-file programs properly - first into object (.o) files, then linking - Creating and using Makefiles The 2-hour session will start with a 1-hour lecture, and be followed by a 1-hour QA session. Experienced Linux users will be arriving to answer questions the students may have about using Linux. The only recommended prior knowledge is basic C programming (for example, Intro to CS). The lecture will demonstrate on a Linux environment, but the topics apply also to using T2 directly. We meet in Taub building, room 3. For instructions see: http://haifux.org/where.html Attendance is free, and you are all invited! (This mail has been forwarded to CS TAs and Lecturers for the appropriate courses) Haifux members: You are all invited to help answer questions, and find my mistakes in the first part :) -- Protect your digital freedom and privacy, eliminate DRM, learn more at http://www.defectivebydesign.org/what_is_drm Ohad Lutzky - Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Fwd: New year, new matam
In relation to the lecture I've proposed on November 9th... -- Forwarded message -- From: Maayan Keshet [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Nov 12, 2006 11:55 AM Subject: New year, new matam To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Hi Ohad! It's a new semester and as always there are new people doing matam and new students in our faculty. We should prepare and give the newcomers guide to programming in linux (@haifux). Last semester (while I was at my 2nd semester) Haifux gave the lecture too late - the turnout could have been higher and many people complained that they could've used linux in their first/second project. haifux.org.il doesn't even mention such a lecture in the foreseeable future. I would be glad to help in organizing/giving such a lecture. Regards, Maayan Keshet It's easier to invent the future than to predict it. -- Alan Kay -- Protect your digital freedom and privacy, eliminate DRM, learn more at http://www.defectivebydesign.org/what_is_drm Ohad Lutzky - Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Lecture proposal: Basics of compiling projects in Linux
(Name tentative. Well, name sucks, please suggest a better one if you have it) A common problem for many CS students is compiling their C project - for example in the Matam (Introduction to Systems Programming) and Mivne (Data Structures 1) courses. While Matam's tutorials supposedly explain how to do this, and even supposedly explain Makefiles, it turns out that most students find themselves fumbling around, compiling manually, and having all sorts of problems. The lecture I propose is intended for such CS students, and will contain 3 parts: * A basic overview of getting a 'Hello World' program compiled, in C, using gcc, and a very short explanation of the -Wall -pedantic-errors flags. (The latter is mostly because many students actually write -wall -pedantic -errors instead) * An example of compiling and linking objects - essentially in this context, multiple-source-file C programs. Advantages of compiling to object files and linking rather than compiling all files at once. * How to write a basic (!) makefile and use it - including specifying the compiler linker (showing what needs to be done for C++ as well), explicit compilation instructions and why they can be omitted, and the 'all' and 'clean' targets. Additional hints at what can be done with more advanced makefiles. (recursion, for example) This is meant to be a one-hour, non-in-depth lecture (but with information as to where in-depth material can be found), followed by a somewhat amorphic QA session: Essentially, people should ask for clarifications on the lecture's material, or ask question wholly unrelated to the lecture (for example, I'm actually taking the OS course, and am having some trouble writing this Kernel module... can any kernel hacker take a look?). Furthermore, if everyone ends up leaving, I have high hopes that the whole thing will devolve into a discussion on some random FOSS-related subject. It might seem that I'm malevolently pushing my 1-hour-lecture 1-hour-non-lecture agenda into this lecture proposal, and that's because I am. But there is a point to it, obviously - this lecture should be a test of whether my ideas are any good. Which brings me to my next point: The Matam, Mivne and OS staffs (staves?) should be notified of this. Last time we tried that, response was tremendous. Let's hope it works this time too. -- Protect your digital freedom and privacy, eliminate DRM, learn more at http://www.defectivebydesign.org/what_is_drm Ohad Lutzky - Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [Haifux] Haifux 2.0 (was: Moving to Tuesday)
freedom and privacy, eliminate DRM, learn more at http://www.defectivebydesign.org/what_is_drm Ohad Lutzky - Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [Haifux] Haifux 2.0 (was: Moving to Tuesday)
On 11/1/06, guy keren [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: ok. can you take it upon yourself to write a short list of topics for a coherent set of SiL meetings? i can participate by directing (ha. i'm avoiding the 'l' word) one of those meetings. please write, along each meeting's topic, what it'll cover. note that it is far easier to plan a 2-hours meeting then a 1-hour meeting - so you'll have to be carefull to make sure the material is short enough for a 1-hour meeting. the detail level must be high enough (at least in the first few meetings), and come with live demonstrations. Can do this, but next week. -- Protect your digital freedom and privacy, eliminate DRM, learn more at http://www.defectivebydesign.org/what_is_drm Ohad Lutzky - Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [Haifux] Haifux 2.0 (was: Moving to Tuesday)
On 10/31/06, Shlomo Touboul [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: How do I get out of this list? How parade-rainy of you :) (Alon? Answer?) From: Eli Billauer [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] If I want to be optimistic, I would hope that Haifux is being reborn. Let's hope that the club is starting over, with infancy problems, as generation II, with hopefully a new, fresh and enthusiastic group of people. Those I can arrange for - infancy problems are quite easy to generate, no doubt, but I'm also talking about the people. Many CS undergrads had some interest in Haifux for a long time, but felt alienated by the high level of the lectures, and the low undergrad attendance. I believe those two can be fixed by A. 'Dumbing down' the lectures. That sounds awful, doesn't it? But I'm talking about encouraging additional entry-level lectures. I can put my money (=time) where my mouth is, and give those myself, and I have some more people in mind which I'll be talking to about them giving lectures. B. Working with the CS undergrad courses. This semester I mentioned my VIM lecture to a Matam TA, who mentioned it to Kimchi, who mentioned it to his class... and Taub 3 instantly became packed. Unfortunately, I didn't know that was going to happen, so the lecture was quite a bit too-high level. Still, almost everybody stayed for the full two hours, and several came for more lectures. I'm not saying that we oldies should quit. Please don't! None of us youngsters have the experience and knowledge required to give the interesting high-level lectures, which we (and I'm speaking for the more advanced users) really enjoy. BTW, I'm fine with tuesday. \m/ -- Protect your digital freedom and privacy, eliminate DRM, learn more at http://www.defectivebydesign.org/what_is_drm Ohad Lutzky - Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [Haifux] Haifux 2.0 (was: Moving to Tuesday)
meetings - preperation/feedback for W2L/SiL/Linuxday, promoting linux, etc. - Advanced lectures - All the rest we know and love: programming, internals, security protocols, lambda calculus, ... It seems like the queue we have now is mostly advanced lectures, though my lecture can be considered basic. Alon On Tue, 31 Oct 2006, Ohad Lutzky wrote: Those I can arrange for - infancy problems are quite easy to generate, no doubt, but I'm also talking about the people. Many CS undergrads had some interest in Haifux for a long time, but felt alienated by the high level of the lectures, and the low undergrad attendance. I believe those two can be fixed by A. 'Dumbing down' the lectures. That sounds awful, doesn't it? But I'm talking about encouraging additional entry-level lectures. I can put my money (=time) where my mouth is, and give those myself, and I have some more people in mind which I'll be talking to about them giving lectures. B. Working with the CS undergrad courses. This semester I mentioned my VIM lecture to a Matam TA, who mentioned it to Kimchi, who mentioned it to his class... and Taub 3 instantly became packed. Unfortunately, I didn't know that was going to happen, so the lecture was quite a bit too-high level. Still, almost everybody stayed for the full two hours, and several came for more lectures. I'm not saying that we oldies should quit. Please don't! None of us youngsters have the experience and knowledge required to give the interesting high-level lectures, which we (and I'm speaking for the more advanced users) really enjoy. BTW, I'm fine with tuesday. \m/ -- This message was sent by Alon Altman ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) ICQ:1366540 GPG public key at http://8ln.org/pubkey.txt Key fingerprint = A670 6C81 19D3 3773 3627DE14 B44A 50A3 FE06 7F24 -- -=[ Random Fortune ]=- Solutions are obvious if one only has the optical power to observe them over the horizon. -- K. A. Arsdall - Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- guy For world domination - press 1, or dial 0, and please hold, for the creator. -- nob o. dy -- Protect your digital freedom and privacy, eliminate DRM, learn more at http://www.defectivebydesign.org/what_is_drm Ohad Lutzky - Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Moving to Tuesday
How does everybody feel about moving Haifux meetings to Tuesdays rather than Mondays? I have a serious conflict on Mondays at the moment, and if I'm not mistaken it's also problematic for the debate club. -- Protect your digital freedom and privacy, eliminate DRM, learn more at http://www.defectivebydesign.org/what_is_drm Ohad Lutzky - Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [Haifux] A question on Ubuntu 6.0.6 - Edimax EW-7108 hangs network service
You seem to have missed the original point of Asaf's message. Before I continue - it's Ubuntu. With three U's. Not Ubunto, or anything else. You don't see anyone talking about 'Susa' or 'Mandrek' or 'Slackerware'. You seem to be quite disrepectful of this distribution, but please... Furthermore, he did try to use the relevant commandline utilities (iwconfig). pppd is irrelevant, and only used for dial-up or DSL connections. Now, to attempt and answer the original question: The Technion's 'registration' system doesn't operate on your computer. All it does is register your MAC address. This is why you can do it as an unpriveleged user. It is not clear why they demand a restart - perhaps some kind of measure against MAC spoofing. It works without a restart, anyway. I don't know what's causing your current problem though. If I understand correctly - the problem is that the machine hangs if you boot with the wireless card connected, but if you connect the wireless card afterwards, everything works fine. Sounds like a bug worth submitting :( On 7/17/06, yakoub abaya [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Asaf Cohen wrote: Hi all, I hope I am not troubling the readers of this mailing list, but after a few nights of trying all kinds of work-arounds I was told this is the place to ask for help. After a lot of searching, I bought the Edimax EW-7108PCg wireless card. It should have worked 100% on linux. Indeed, when I first inserted it and booted up the system I saw the activity light on the card blinking, all looked well, I saw that the rt2500 was loaded, and even manged to connect to a network - the link light turned on, the dhcp request was answered by the network, I got an IP an DNS entries - all looked great. The Technion network required MAC authentication: it identified the MAC address of my card, asked me for my password (not a network password, just a one confirming I am a student in the Technion) and I was told that registration for the network is complete, and I have to restart my computer. When restarting, the lights on the card did not blink, there was no activity at all, as if the card is dead. Moreover, the card somehow made the whole networking services get stuck - I cannot open system-networking, kill or restart the dhclient, issue iwconfig, connect using my ethernet - nothing. The computer is 90% stuck. It is needless to say that if I reboot without the wireless card everything is working well. Even if I boot from a live CD WITH the wireless card -all is well, the card is identified and active... (so the cards works on Ubuntu, after all it is an pen driver) It seams like something in my network configuration/services was changed after first connecting successfully to the Technion wireless network and ever since plugging in the wireless card (or booting up when it is inside) makes the whole system get stuck. Any ideas? just one idea : automated graphical administration programs in linux are still very weak and troublesome they are not an alternative to learn how to do things manually by running daemons from console my advise is to forget system-networking and learn about pppd or whatever is relevant for your connection i know little about networking but my best guess is some script in /etc/rc.d in configured badly try to run your distribution's initial network setup scripts in slackware it is simply netconfig but ubunto must have very stupidly made the user unaware of that script by doing the initial setup automatically Thanks a lot!!! Asaf. -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To necessity... and beyond! Ohad Lutzky -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [Haifux] Disappointing Linux Day
On 6/25/06, Alon Altman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The linux day should not be about installing linux anymore. Installing linux is trivial, and anyone with a basic background in computers can manage this on her own. I do not completely agree here. Installation help is important for the simple reason of the fear factor. People want their helping hand. However, I totally agree that the format of the linux day should be extended. The problem most people have is with configuration. The #1 problem is connecting to the Internet, a problem unsolved at all in the linux day in its current format. The next slew of problems all need internet access to be fixed. I want to emphasize that this should not be the limitation - all sorts of problems, hardware, software and networking alike, can be solved. The following three forms of problems should be incorporated: * Known-in-advance, massive (e.g. a known fix for USB ADSL modems) * Planned ahead (person mails in about a problem he would like personal assistance with) * On-the-spot (person comes in with a problem, we do our best to help) This actually DID happen... we just didn't announce it as such, and didn't put enough emphasis on it. Get Bezeq and Hot to supply several (2-3 each) lines with ADSL/Cable connections for the party. Ask people to bring their modems with them. Get Bezeq to sell linux-compatible routers and network cards AT THE PARTY. Prepare CDs with drivers for all ADSL and cable modems in circulation and cable scripts for most ISPs (especially Bezeqint, Netvison, Actcom, and Technion). Have additional stands with working internet connections for other configurations and have gurus do the configurations quickly. Hell yeah. I would like to add another related issue: Wifi. Have a hotspot around, for both general-purpose usage and testing. Preferably, have an additional, encrypted one around, for testing that capability. About the advertising issue, the linux day must be part of a greater advertising campaign to increase awareness. It must be planned months ahead of time, and the date MUST NOT BE CHANGED close to the event. If the set date must be changed due to extreme circumstances, the event should be cancelled and rescheduled several months later, as all the advertisment and publicity should restart with the new date. Definetely. I attribute much of the failure of this linux day to the rushed advertising which was caused by the delay. If we are already on the subject of format changes, I have another suggestion: The delightful delicacies, fortune cookies of information, tidbits of geekly pleasure we have all come to know and love as LIGHTNING TALKS. Topics should be SIL, but lectures should be short (under 30min, preferably actual lightning talk 5min). We should recall that we are in the technion, and not pull back from giving (extremely!) relevant lectures - ps/pdf conversion, where to get basic development tools (build-essential, essentially), perhaps a primer on LyX. This is not to say that more popular subjects should be avoided - lectures on usage of wifi (with network-manager, preferably), The Gimp, Thunderbird, etc., would be welcome. But don't let me do all of the lectures... I had some much-appreciated help in the history lecture, and I do think it's more interesting for people to hear from multiple speakers. A strong point I would like to emphasize is that this shouldn't be a noob-only event, as this one was. It should cater to intermediate, and perhaps even advanced users. I do believe we can do this without hurting the novice users, seeing as we bring them up to speed rather quickly. -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [Haifux] Disappointing Linux Day
On 6/25/06, Adir Abraham [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'm sorry to tell you that I did my own tests, and no distribution's decision is finite. In your case, however, you go with Ubuntu since v1. This is your own blind decision. I'm sorry, but I have to disagree here. How is that decision 'blind'? I've used many distributions over the years, and kept comparing them to each other as they progressed - Mandrake, Gentoo, Fedora Core, Debian, RHEL, various Live distros, and more. And time after time, ever since it was released, Ubuntu has proven to be a better choice for new-intermediate users than the others, and by its own right a very powerful and comfortable OS. I've seen many people switch from other distros to it, and be very happy. Admittedly, I have nil experience with SuSE, but saying that my decision for Ubuntu is blind, well, that's a bit much. I'm glad that you achieved a 2 years experience(!) with Ubuntu. Happy for you. If you ever want to do an Ubuntu Linux Party, you go and do it. You have no right to complain here. You didn't like the decision from the beginning. Every time you could just leave, and I wouldn't try to hold you. Ah, but here you miss the point. I don't work for Ubuntu and I couldn't care less if people run it or something else. My interest was to better the experience of the installfest for the installees (to promote F/OSS, blah blah blah - but specifically, to make the linux day a good linux day). And I believed then as I still do now that Ubuntu would have been a better choice of distro. However, seeing as you wouldn't accept this option (at least not until installations failed left and right, and/or the first person without the DVD drive came along), I was faced with two options: Either refuse to help, or help. Believing that I can indeed help, I stayed on board. But that doesn't revoke my right to bitch about the distro. -- To necessity... and beyond! Ohad Lutzky -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [Haifux] Linux Day: Choosing the right distribution
Umm... What's wrong with Gentoo's Hebrew support? I mean, yeah, okay, Ubuntu's is better, but Gentoo's isn't BAD. On 6/16/06, Michael Vasiliev [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Sunday June 11 2006 14:51, boazg wrote: me and the farm crowd strongly stand behind ubuntu. First of all, it is very nice to hear that the farm crowd still exists. I certainly would like to hear more about it. the 6.06 release takes simple to a whole new level. it has hebrew, a new, much nicer, clearlooks derivative theme, and apt is quite the leader in package management. they;ve also put a frontend on apt simpler than synaptic for people who want to save time. backed by automatix, a script making installation of common non-ubuntu things (like swiftfox, or w32codecs), very simple, and by HebUbuntu which sets up in one stroke most things needed for the israeli crowd, i believe ubuntu will be the simplest most elegent choice. and please tell me FC5 is nothing like RHEL4. It's better when it comes to managing the system without tribal dancing around it, but not that good if we speak about a beginner's box. It should come with a little adjustable headband cushion to protect you from all the rakes you are going to step on... I vote for Ubuntu, though I've never used it :) Well, not enough to call it a use really. I am a Gentoo guy myself, that's why I vote for another distro to be chosen :) Also, hebrew support is crucial, and with the lack of devs that care about it, it is not a strong side of Gentoo. -- Sincerely Yours, Michael Vasiliev Confidence is the feeling you have before you understand the situation. -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To necessity... and beyond! Ohad Lutzky -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [Haifux] Linux Day: Choosing the right distribution
On 6/11/06, Diego Iastrubni [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Nadav Har'El wrote: On the contrary - this is the STRONG side of Fedora. On every other distro, when the next version is released, the last release is unsupported. With Fedora, you have another year of updates, not security, but real updates, like new OpenOffice, a new Gnome, a new KDE, a new Kernel etc. What's the point of that? Upgrading packages in an existing distribution is necessarily limiting. Using new features to their full extent requires much changes, which will change things too much to be a simple upgrade. As far as simple upgrades go, they are rarely any better than security updates. Furthermore, in Debian-based distros, upgrading to the newest distribution is one command away. Taking Ubuntu as an example, when Dapper was released, the graphical update manager (same one which is used for security updates) had a big 'new version, click to upgrade' button. Clicked. Upgraded. DONE. New packages et al. -- To necessity... and beyond! Ohad Lutzky -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] FatNS code + Ruby for loop
Heh, interesting... that's not in the book :)
Anyway, I've submitted a request for the project to be hosted at
sourceforge. For now, it is available using anonymous svn at
https://yasmin.technion.ac.il/svn/fatns
On 6/6/06, Michael Bar David [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
hi all
Where can I get FatNS code ? I want to review it.
Moreover, Boaz said there are no for loops in Ruby. If this isn't a
for loop, I don't know what to say:
for i in 1..5
puts #{i}
end
works on Ruby 1.8 and 1.9
Michael
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Re: [Haifux] Scheduling question
Yay, IDE vs. Text editor bashing! Yes, I would like to see this lecture. Any lecture about an IDE I do not loathe should be interesting :) On 5/31/06, Orr Dunkelman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi everybody, Would you like to hear a lecture about Eclipse on Tue. 12th Sept? I need a show of hands in favor (if you don't want such a lecture --- just don't say so). It's preferable you'll send it to me in private (or to [EMAIL PROTECTED]), and no, I can't change the date (the lecturer is coming from abroad). -- Orr Dunkelman, [EMAIL PROTECTED] If it wasn't for C, we'd be writing programs in BASI, PASAL, and OBOL, anon Spammers: http://vipe.technion.ac.il/~orrd/spam.html GPG fingerprint: C2D5 C6D6 9A24 9A95 C5B3 2023 6CAB 4A7C B73F D0AA (This key will never sign Emails, only other PGP keys.) -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To necessity... and beyond! Ohad Lutzky -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [Haifux] T2 vim configuration
Also, that's the backspace behavior. You'll usually want :set bs=2 That has backspace delete empty lines as well. On 5/30/06, Michael Bar David [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: hi all I'v some problems with vim on my T2 account, may somwone can help: 1.its black-white (mabye global bash config ?) 2. backspace doesn't work most of the times 3. all the numbers in the right side, don't work as numbers (numlock on) 4. I can't delete lines - if hit return, and then backspace, it doesn't work, and I must use dd I guess these are only config problems, but I don't know what settings to change thanks Michael -- To necessity... and beyond! Ohad Lutzky -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [Haifux] vim was so nice
:set nocompatible? On 5/25/06, boazg [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: it was a redhat thing, and due to messing stuff up it was cancelled afaik. vim shouldnt do to many stuff out of the box. vim7, btw works very well with a proper vimrc btw. On 5/25/06, Orna Agmon [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi All, My system was recently updated from Red Hat Enterprize 3 to RHE4, this update including an updated of vim, from 6.1.320 to 6.3.82. Now, with the new vim, many nice features were lost: *syntax highlighting *automatically viewing gzip compressed files *directory browsing *remembering the last search string *remembering, for each file, the line I was at. This is just what I found so far. Before that, when I tried vim version 7.something (an alpha version), I felt like I was walking even backwards - moving with arrows while in insert mode produced ^A, ^B, ^C and ^D, like in really old vi versions (before vim). What is happening? Is there a global switch to get back modernism into my life? Alternatively, how can I re-configure all those options on? This solution is not as good as a global solution, because every day I find another feature which was lost. I should mention that both my .vimrc and my .virc are empty and have always been. My home directory was not changed during the transfer - it is NFS mounted. Thanks, Orna. -- Orna Agmon http://ladypine.org/ http://haifux.org/~ladypine/ ICQ: 348759096 -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org ) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To necessity... and beyond! Ohad Lutzky
Re: [Haifux] Security issues in Linux
I love the whole live-to-press nature of it all... you'd think the
researchers would have discussed it with Mackall themselves first.
On 5/10/06, Muli Ben-Yehuda [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
On Wed, May 10, 2006 at 02:14:19AM -0400, Tzafrir Cohen wrote:
One small point that still bothers me:
On Wed, May 10, 2006 at 01:22:18AM +0300, Michael Vasiliev wrote:
For the less security aware, there is the kernel support for hardware
generators on the motherboard in the current kernel that is about as hard to
get as running make menuconfig and enabling an option. (Well, maybe they
miss it because they analyze the kernel source snapshot of December 2004,
can
anyone confirm?)
Will that work on every motherboard? On every architecture?
No, it depends on the existence of the HW RNG on a given board.
Anyway, has there been any discussion of their claims after the article
was published but before it made it to the press? Two monthes is a long
time. I also read somewhere that the authors claimed that they have
brought the problems to the attention of kernel developers but nothing
was done.
Anybody with more information?
I discussed this paper with Matt Mackall, the Linux /dev/random
maintainer, a while ago. As far as I can recall, he thought most of
the claims were pretty dated (i.e., known). He also thought there was
one interesting bit, but we didn't get a chance to discuss it
further.
Cheers,
Muli
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Re: [Haifux] Security issues in Linux
By the way, why would they have to _reverse engineer_ the kernel's PRNG? Isn't it GPLd like the rest? On 5/9/06, Tzafrir Cohen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, May 09, 2006 at 10:44:54AM +0300, Orr Dunkelman wrote: Nahum shalom, thanks for the information. However, next time, please consider sending us all the link instead the PDF. Seems to have been published two monthes ago: http://www.gutterman.net/blog/2006/03/new_paper_online_to_appear_in.html (link from LinMagazine) A copy of the paper: http://eprint.iacr.org/2006/086.pdf http://www.gutterman.net/publications/GuttermanPinkasReinman2006.pdf A quick search did not provide any discussion of this up until Zvi Gutterman's company published a press release on 1-May . -- Tzafrir -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To necessity... and beyond! Ohad Lutzky
Re: [Haifux] Suspend-to-RAM on IBM r50e
No RTFM from me. First because it's mean, second because it's nontrivial.
You need a module called ibm_acpi, available at
http://ibm-acpi.sourceforge.net/ - this module, among other things,
will be able to generate an ACPI event for Fn+F4. However, you will
have to enable this by loading it with the parameter
hotkey=enable,0x (that's well-documented in the package, for more
tinkering). Once this works, use acpid to read the event by creating
an appropriate file (easy to do by example) in /etc/acpi/events.
On 3/26/06, Shachar Shemesh [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Ohad Lutzky wrote:
So happy to have figured this one out, I thought I'd post the solution here:
Save me the RTFM and tell me where to hook this so it works with fn+F4?
I'm sure hotplug has something to that effect.
Shachar
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Lingnu Open Source Consulting ltd.
Have you backed up today's work? http://www.lingnu.com/backup.html
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Ohad Lutzky
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Re: [Haifux] Suspend-to-RAM on IBM r50e
That's regrettable, seeing as the power button is better used, IMHO, for a 'halt' command rather than a violent shutdown. Have you tried using acpi_listen and attempting to generate various events (such as closing the lid) to see what other ACPI events you can catch? On 3/26/06, Oron Peled [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Sunday, 26 בMarch 2006 19:52, Shachar Shemesh wrote: Save me the RTFM and tell me where to hook this so it works with fn+F4? I'm sure hotplug has something to that effect. As others noted, you need ACPI support. In my laptop (regretfully an HP one), I found it far easier to catch via ACPI the *power* button instead of the Fn-keys. So now it functions as follows: - A short press activate my suspend2ram script. - It is revived automatically with LID open -- probably BIOS magic). - A few seconds press is total poweroff (normal BIOS behavior, not configured by me). -- Oron Peled Voice/Fax: +972-4-8228492 [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.actcom.co.il/~oron ICQ UIN: 16527398 The future is here, it's just not evenly distributed yet. - William Gibson -- To necessity... and beyond! Ohad Lutzky
Re: [Haifux] Matam students for lectures (or vice versa)
On 3/24/06, Eli Billauer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Ohad Lutzky wrote: This week I gave my VIM lecture, and Taub 3 was quite literally packed with Matam students. Ah, it sounds like a smash hit! I take my hat off (not the red one ;). So let me ask this: What made this success? What's the secret? Was the lecture announced in the course? Maybe we're on to something here: If a lecture in some UNIX related issue manages to fill a class, and two of those participants discover Haifux, then something like three-four such lectures per year can keep the the blood streaming. That's my simple math. Pretty much a paraphrasing of my own post :) Yes, the lecture was announced in the course, and that is definetely what made it so popular. So Ohad, I suppose that the VIM lecture will be running next semester as well, and the next, and the next... ;) Guess so, as long as I manage to keep my grades high and green uniform tucked neatly in my closed :) But what can we learn from this? How can we pack Taub 3 with eager CS students again? What do they want, that we can easily give? I know that for Matam (and this extends to Data Structures), the answer is programming comfortably in a Unix environment. In the Matam course, Makefiles are barely mentioned. No text editor is taught properly. sed and awk, being disallowed in the CShell exercise, are not taught. Shell scripting is taught as a generic means for parsing text, and its true power is not shown. And its true power is quite necessary in the course - generating large, random testfiles for our programs for instance. For Operating Systems, well, I guess our resident kernel hackers can answer that... -- To necessity... and beyond! Ohad Lutzky
Re: [Haifux] Matam students for lectures (or vice versa)
Much agreed. But I think a generalization is in order - not just one course. Not just one lecture. A more general emphasis - like we have SiL lectures, we should also have CSs (CS students) lectures. Ones on generally useful subjects, a great example being valgrind, with details sent to courses we think the lecture might be useful for (for example, in Valgrind's case, these would include Matam, Data structures and probably OS). If we make this a one-shot deal, we won't have anyone left over to keep coming for further lectures and a more general interest in FOSS. Furthermore, I believe that these subjects are interesting to most regular Haifux members as it is... On 3/24/06, Gabi Kliot [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi I definitely agree with you that the new blood for Haifux can come from CS students. Matam is a good target and given the support of the TA in charge there, you can definitely publish more lectures there and attract more students. Yet, I think that the main target for newcomers for the club should be OS course graduates. Guys - it seems that the club is not aware of the fact the OS course does not teach XINU any longer. The Haifux has made (for my opinion) no special attempts to address those students. Yet, those are usually forth, fifth semester students, much more mature and ready to learn new stuff. In the OS course we do not get enough chances to teach them Linux from the user perspective. We concentrate mainly on kernel. At the end of the course those students have a very decent knowledge at the kernel level and they are not afraid of Linux any more. This is your chance to convert them to Linux. The lectures can be specifically targeted to those students: Muli's lecture on writing device drivers, Advanced Socket Programming, administration, Development Tools for Linux. Tools like strace, Valgrind, ... Some of those lectures would be actually worth giving during the semester, giving the students those additional tools, while they are deep inside the business, working on Linux. This is the point in time when those students need this additional knowledge the most and this is where they can be attracted. We can not teach all this stuff at the tutorials, since we just haven't got enough time for that. I mean - look at it: ~100 students graduate EXTREMELY advanced course on Linux each semester, yet almost none of them joins the club. Something is fishy here, don't you think? And I am sure Haifux will get the full support of the course TAs and the lecturer. Best regards, Gabi Kliot Quoting Eli Billauer [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Ohad Lutzky wrote: I know that for Matam (and this extends to Data Structures), the answer is programming comfortably in a Unix environment. In the Matam course, Makefiles are barely mentioned. So if we're talking about the Programming C in Linux survival guide, what subjects are hot? I would suggest: 1. Convenient multi-file C programming (C files, their header files, etc.) 2. Compiling and linking with gcc make (basic things, like I actually do when I develop my own small things) 3. Common flags (-m, -Dsomething, -I, -g, -Wall) 4. The ddd graphic debugger 5. Valgrind Would this make a hit? Anything else worth covering? Eli -- Web: http://www.billauer.co.il -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To necessity... and beyond! Ohad Lutzky
[Haifux] Matam students for lectures (or vice versa)
A spinoff of the 'honey, I shrunk the club' thread, I'd like this thread to take a look at the Matam (or similar courses) students. This week I gave my VIM lecture, and Taub 3 was quite literally packed with Matam students. Even after the (quite clumsy, seeing as I had to change my lecture on-the-fly) first hour - which made it clear that this lecture was not mandatory, and that the discussed material is hard to get the hang of when compared to other solutions - most people stayed for the second. Many people stayed after the lecture to ask further questions. I was very pleased, as I thoroughly enjoyed helping out Matam students last semester and the one before. Now, I figure that Haifux's 'blood' comes from two main sources - people who are already familiar with Linux, and people who were very recently introduced to Linux for hobby/business purposes. Now, I definetely wasn't the first to figure - we're in the Technion CS faculty, people are being taught Unix and Linux - why not 'recruit' Haifux members there? And apparently, an extremely effective way to do this is to ask a friendly TA-in-charge to post a recommendation for our lectures in the course mailing list. As for content - I imagine that a rivaling Emacs lecture (which I'd love to hear, all jokes aside) is in order. But most of all, I'd very much enjoy a rerun of C without a spoon, as I only got to see one of the lectures. What are your thoughts on this? -- To necessity... and beyond! Ohad Lutzky
[Haifux] Suspend-to-RAM on IBM r50e
So happy to have figured this one out, I thought I'd post the solution here:
Make sure you have EHCI and UHCI (those are USB support) compiled as
modules. Then, use the following shell script to get your computer to
hibernate:
#!/bin/bash
/usr/bin/chvt 1
/bin/sync
/sbin/rmmod ibm_acpi
/sbin/rmmod ipw2200
/sbin/rmmod ehci_hcd
/sbin/rmmod uhci_hcd
cat /proc/bus/pci/00/02.0 /var/cache/video.config
echo -n mem /sys/power/state
cat /var/cache/video.config /proc/bus/pci/00/02.0
# touch /var/tmp/sleep.skip
/sbin/modprobe ibm_acpi hotkey=enable,0x experimental=1
/sbin/modprobe ehci_hcd
/sbin/modprobe uhci_hcd
/usr/bin/chvt 7
Note the commented-out line: Its purpose is that if you have your
laptop sleep without closing the lid, and thus have to wake it up by
use of the power button - then have the ACPI power button event not
shut down the laptop right after wakeup. Naturally, this required
changes to the ACPI-shutdown script... another way to do this would be
to unload and reload the relevant module that handles the ACPI
powerbutton event (for me it's compiled into the kernel).
Enjoy :)
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Re: [Haifux] Mazal tov, Dr. Orr Dunkelman
Congrats, doc! :) On 3/23/06, Adir Abraham [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: (at least that's what the undergraduate site says, so I guess it's official now :) I won't add another word. Simply - congratulations :) Best regards, Adir. -- Adir Abraham [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To necessity... and beyond! Ohad Lutzky
Re: [Haifux] Honey, I shrunk the club
Hear hear for more lectures, shorter lectures, 'check it out, here it is, get info here here and here' lectures. Now, specifically, not ALL lectures... some lectures do deserve the full two-hour span, but not all. Now, the question is does this mean more lectures (because they'd be easier and more attractive to write) (always good), same amount, or less lectures (because we'll be running out of subjects)? In the third case, will we have Orna coming up with a gavel and asking if there's any new business? On 3/15/06, Eli Billauer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Erez Hadad wrote: OMG people. You sound like its time to close the shop and go home. Noone wants to close the shop. But we need to find out why the sales go down. I didn't answer my own question, by the way: I have found myself coming less, simply because I know much more about Linux than I did six years ago. Guy's lecture about GTk opened my eyes to a tool I couldn't dream of, at the time. But this has happened less and less, as time went by. And let's face it, guys (and girls): This shop has been open for seven years, and has kept more or less the same format. Time to open our eyes, and realize that the world around us has changed? For example: 1. Linux and open source are not small and unknown movements anymore. 2. Most computer-competent people are not afraid of installing Linux (technically). 3. The amount of information about Linux on the web has increased dramatically (answered questions in forums and survival guides in particular) ...etc. One of the outcomes is that it becomes less and less relevant to cover a subject completely, top to bottom. The info is all in the web. If you know that a tool exists, and you know a few keywords to google for, you have all you need to get going. The Perl community has realized this a long time ago. They have lightning talks. We had one such session, and I think we all agree that it was a success. But rather than forcing people down to 5 or 10 minutes, I would encourage people to make short talks about those things that are too small for a two hours lecture. How many times have you found yourself discovering something, saying to yourself that you have to tell everyone about it, but realized that you'll have to work too hard to develop that into a full lecture? So I think we should try another format: Several short talks for each lecture. Short could be anything from five minutes to one hour, if the subject is cool enough. With or without slides, with live demonstrations whenever possible. Show the point. Share the main pieces of wisdoms. Links and google words. Thank you. Next. It should be less of a bother to prepare a lecture, and less of a headache to listen to it. And if not anything else, several lecturers assures a minimal number of participants. ;) What do you think? Eli -- Web: http://www.billauer.co.il -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To necessity... and beyond! Ohad Lutzky
