Re: Upgrade Product - Vsam Files
W dniu 2014-05-07 01:21, Tony Harminc pisze: On 6 May 2014 16:02, Darth Keller darth.kel...@.com wrote: So maybe this is nit-picking but It is VSAM datasets, not files How does one distinguish between a dataset a file? By name? Well, a file name looks like /usr/foo/bar or foo/bar or just bar . A dataset name looks like USER.FOO.BAR or USER.FOO.BAR(MEMBER) or in the TSO context, 'USER.FOO.BAR' or 'USER.FOO.BAR(MEMBER)' . What about files in CICS? What about ALLOC FILE in TSO ? ANother meaning: compare REPRO IFILE and INDATASET. In that context file means ddname, dataset means direct dataset named directly. So a lot depends on context... And that's just syntax; what a file and a dataset *are* is a topic of its own. Yes, a lot. Regarding data set vs dataset pointless discussion: In English there is data set, but computer technology provided many new terms like volser or just dataset, and I'm not talking about commands/keywords/parameters, because it's yet another story. It's worth to keep in mind the language is to communicate, so as long both data set and dataset are understandable and do not make a confusion, both are OK. BTW: The worst translation I hear is datasets (or data sets) - zestawy danych. Polish mainframe folks just use English term dataset, so such translation is really misleading. That's why sometimes I prefer English versions of some applications, user manuals, etc. -- Radoslaw Skorupka Lodz, Poland -- Treść tej wiadomości może zawierać informacje prawnie chronione Banku przeznaczone wyłącznie do użytku służbowego adresata. Odbiorcą może być jedynie jej adresat z wyłączeniem dostępu osób trzecich. Jeżeli nie jesteś adresatem niniejszej wiadomości lub pracownikiem upoważnionym do jej przekazania adresatowi, informujemy, że jej rozpowszechnianie, kopiowanie, rozprowadzanie lub inne działanie o podobnym charakterze jest prawnie zabronione i może być karalne. Jeżeli otrzymałeś tę wiadomość omyłkowo, prosimy niezwłocznie zawiadomić nadawcę wysyłając odpowiedź oraz trwale usunąć tę wiadomość włączając w to wszelkie jej kopie wydrukowane lub zapisane na dysku. This e-mail may contain legally privileged information of the Bank and is intended solely for business use of the addressee. This e-mail may only be received by the addressee and may not be disclosed to any third parties. If you are not the intended addressee of this e-mail or the employee authorized to forward it to the addressee, be advised that any dissemination, copying, distribution or any other similar activity is legally prohibited and may be punishable. If you received this e-mail by mistake please advise the sender immediately by using the reply facility in your e-mail software and delete permanently this e-mail including any copies of it either printed or saved to hard drive. mBank S.A. z siedzibą w Warszawie, ul. Senatorska 18, 00-950 Warszawa, www.mBank.pl, e-mail: kont...@mbank.pl Sąd Rejonowy dla m. st. Warszawy XII Wydział Gospodarczy Krajowego Rejestru Sądowego, nr rejestru przedsiębiorców KRS 025237, NIP: 526-021-50-88. Według stanu na dzień 01.01.2014 r. kapitał zakładowy mBanku S.A. (w całości wpłacony) wynosi 168.696.052 złote. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Upgrade Product - Vsam Files
Personally I prefer data set but comprehend dataset. A bit like Full Function English and Limited Function English. :-) Lights blue touch paper but fails to stand well back. :-) Cheers, Martin Martin Packer, zChampion, Principal Systems Investigator, Worldwide Banking Center of Excellence, IBM +44-7802-245-584 email: martin_pac...@uk.ibm.com Twitter / Facebook IDs: MartinPacker Blog: https://www.ibm.com/developerworks/mydeveloperworks/blogs/MartinPacker From: retired mainframer retired-mainfra...@q.com To: IBM-MAIN@listserv.ua.edu Date: 06/05/2014 22:47 Subject:Re: Upgrade Product - Vsam Files Sent by:IBM Mainframe Discussion List IBM-MAIN@listserv.ua.edu :: -Original Message- :: From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On :: Behalf Of Gerhard Postpischil :: Sent: Tuesday, May 06, 2014 2:10 PM :: To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU :: Subject: Re: Upgrade Product - Vsam Files :: :: If we're nitpicking, it is data sets, not datasets Considering that IBM (which I believe coined the word) uses the word dataset over 1300 times (plus another 100+ occurrences of datasets) in the SMS bookshelf alone, you are picking at the wrong nit. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN Unless stated otherwise above: IBM United Kingdom Limited - Registered in England and Wales with number 741598. Registered office: PO Box 41, North Harbour, Portsmouth, Hampshire PO6 3AU -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Upgrade Product - Vsam Files
I always thought file went with DD and data set with physical object. Cheers, Martin Martin Packer, zChampion, Principal Systems Investigator, Worldwide Banking Center of Excellence, IBM +44-7802-245-584 email: martin_pac...@uk.ibm.com Twitter / Facebook IDs: MartinPacker Blog: https://www.ibm.com/developerworks/mydeveloperworks/blogs/MartinPacker From: R.S. r.skoru...@bremultibank.com.pl To: IBM-MAIN@listserv.ua.edu Date: 07/05/2014 07:37 Subject:Re: Upgrade Product - Vsam Files Sent by:IBM Mainframe Discussion List IBM-MAIN@listserv.ua.edu W dniu 2014-05-07 01:21, Tony Harminc pisze: On 6 May 2014 16:02, Darth Keller darth.kel...@.com wrote: So maybe this is nit-picking but It is VSAM datasets, not files How does one distinguish between a dataset a file? By name? Well, a file name looks like /usr/foo/bar or foo/bar or just bar . A dataset name looks like USER.FOO.BAR or USER.FOO.BAR(MEMBER) or in the TSO context, 'USER.FOO.BAR' or 'USER.FOO.BAR(MEMBER)' . What about files in CICS? What about ALLOC FILE in TSO ? ANother meaning: compare REPRO IFILE and INDATASET. In that context file means ddname, dataset means direct dataset named directly. So a lot depends on context... And that's just syntax; what a file and a dataset *are* is a topic of its own. Yes, a lot. Regarding data set vs dataset pointless discussion: In English there is data set, but computer technology provided many new terms like volser or just dataset, and I'm not talking about commands/keywords/parameters, because it's yet another story. It's worth to keep in mind the language is to communicate, so as long both data set and dataset are understandable and do not make a confusion, both are OK. BTW: The worst translation I hear is datasets (or data sets) - zestawy danych. Polish mainframe folks just use English term dataset, so such translation is really misleading. That's why sometimes I prefer English versions of some applications, user manuals, etc. -- Radoslaw Skorupka Lodz, Poland -- Treść tej wiadomości może zawierać informacje prawnie chronione Banku przeznaczone wyłącznie do użytku służbowego adresata. Odbiorcą może być jedynie jej adresat z wyłączeniem dostępu osób trzecich. Jeżeli nie jesteś adresatem niniejszej wiadomości lub pracownikiem upoważnionym do jej przekazania adresatowi, informujemy, że jej rozpowszechnianie, kopiowanie, rozprowadzanie lub inne działanie o podobnym charakterze jest prawnie zabronione i może być karalne. Jeżeli otrzymałeś tę wiadomość omyłkowo, prosimy niezwłocznie zawiadomić nadawcę wysyłając odpowiedź oraz trwale usunąć tę wiadomość włączając w to wszelkie jej kopie wydrukowane lub zapisane na dysku. This e-mail may contain legally privileged information of the Bank and is intended solely for business use of the addressee. This e-mail may only be received by the addressee and may not be disclosed to any third parties. If you are not the intended addressee of this e-mail or the employee authorized to forward it to the addressee, be advised that any dissemination, copying, distribution or any other similar activity is legally prohibited and may be punishable. If you received this e-mail by mistake please advise the sender immediately by using the reply facility in your e-mail software and delete permanently this e-mail including any copies of it either printed or saved to hard drive. mBank S.A. z siedzibą w Warszawie, ul. Senatorska 18, 00-950 Warszawa, www.mBank.pl, e-mail: kont...@mbank.pl Sąd Rejonowy dla m. st. Warszawy XII Wydział Gospodarczy Krajowego Rejestru Sądowego, nr rejestru przedsiębiorców KRS 025237, NIP: 526-021-50-88. Według stanu na dzień 01.01.2014 r. kapitał zakładowy mBanku S.A. (w całości wpłacony) wynosi 168.696.052 złote. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN Unless stated otherwise above: IBM United Kingdom Limited - Registered in England and Wales with number 741598. Registered office: PO Box 41, North Harbour, Portsmouth, Hampshire PO6 3AU -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Upgrade Product - Vsam Files
Hello All, I am working on the upgrade plan for one of our product. The product has several VSAM files that also needs to repro'ed to a newly created VSAM for the newer version of product. Here my question is 1 ) Is it good to use the same old VSAM for the Newer Release of Product(After a upgrade) ? I understand the Older VSAM might have some CI splits to avoid that the Product Guide suggest to do a repro. 2 ) Is there a way to examine the OLDer vsam file for any error ? So That I can correct those Error and start using the same File. I am just looking for a VSAM utility which can examine the VSAM error, so that I can correct those errors. Any suggestions would be highly appreciated. Peter -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Upgrade Product - Vsam Files
I don't believe the answer to (1) is YES if the vendor recommends it (which I'm assuming since you said 'needs'). - -teD - Original Message From: mf db Sent: Tuesday, May 6, 2014 11:53 To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Reply To: IBM Mainframe Discussion List Subject: Upgrade Product - Vsam Files Hello All, I am working on the upgrade plan for one of our product. The product has several VSAM files that also needs to repro'ed to a newly created VSAM for the newer version of product. Here my question is 1 ) Is it good to use the same old VSAM for the Newer Release of Product(After a upgrade) ? I understand the Older VSAM might have some CI splits to avoid that the Product Guide suggest to do a repro. 2 ) Is there a way to examine the OLDer vsam file for any error ? So That I can correct those Error and start using the same File. I am just looking for a VSAM utility which can examine the VSAM error, so that I can correct those errors. Any suggestions would be highly appreciated. Peter -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Upgrade Product - Vsam Files
mf db wrote: I am working on the upgrade plan for one of our product. The product has several VSAM files that also needs to repro'ed to a newly created VSAM for the newer version of product. It is VSAM datasets, not files. Why REPRO? Layout of record changes? Performance? Backout to old version? Moving and modifying some or all records? Alternate Index(es) changes? 1 ) Is it good to use the same old VSAM for the Newer Release of Product(After a upgrade) ? I understand the Older VSAM might have some CI splits to avoid that the Product Guide suggest to do a repro. Like Ted, I would also say, probably not YES. If the vendor says, you need to REPRO to new datasets, you better listen to them. 2 ) Is there a way to examine the OLDer vsam file for any error ? So That I can correct those Error and start using the same File. I am just looking for a VSAM utility which can examine the VSAM error, so that I can correct those errors. Use IDCAMS diagnostic tools. If the records / keys layout changed, you need to do the hard work (perhaps trying to read all and every records) yourself, unless the same vendor supplies the diagnostic tools. What type of error(s) on those datasets are you expecting? Groete / Greetings Elardus Engelbrecht -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Upgrade Product - Vsam Files
So maybe this is nit-picking but It is VSAM datasets, not files How does one distinguish between a dataset a file? dd keller So on a 2nd look - definitely nit-picking, but it's been that kind of a day. ** This e-mail message and all attachments transmitted with it may contain legally privileged and/or confidential information intended solely for the use of the addressee(s). If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any reading, dissemination, distribution, copying, forwarding or other use of this message or its attachments is strictly prohibited. If you have received this message in error, please notify the sender immediately and delete this message and all copies and backups thereof. Thank you. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Upgrade Product - Vsam Files
:: -Original Message- :: From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On :: Behalf Of Gerhard Postpischil :: Sent: Tuesday, May 06, 2014 2:10 PM :: To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU :: Subject: Re: Upgrade Product - Vsam Files :: :: If we're nitpicking, it is data sets, not datasets Considering that IBM (which I believe coined the word) uses the word dataset over 1300 times (plus another 100+ occurrences of datasets) in the SMS bookshelf alone, you are picking at the wrong nit. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Upgrade Product - Vsam Files
You're probably seeing references to the DATASET class in RACF or the DATASET parm to the EXAMINE command or the like. IBM is pretty consistent about using the term data set. (See the title of the book Using Data Sets for instance) Regards, Greg Shirey Ben E. Keith Company -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of retired mainframer Sent: Tuesday, May 06, 2014 4:47 PM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: Upgrade Product - Vsam Files Considering that IBM (which I believe coined the word) uses the word dataset over 1300 times (plus another 100+ occurrences of datasets) in the SMS bookshelf alone, you are picking at the wrong nit. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Upgrade Product - Vsam Files
On 6 May 2014 16:02, Darth Keller darth.kel...@assurant.com wrote: So maybe this is nit-picking but It is VSAM datasets, not files How does one distinguish between a dataset a file? By name? Well, a file name looks like /usr/foo/bar or foo/bar or just bar . A dataset name looks like USER.FOO.BAR or USER.FOO.BAR(MEMBER) or in the TSO context, 'USER.FOO.BAR' or 'USER.FOO.BAR(MEMBER)' . Or in the TSO context, BAR or bar or BAR(MEMBER) or bar(member) . So a lot depends on context... And that's just syntax; what a file and a dataset *are* is a topic of its own. Tony H. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Upgrade Product - Vsam Files
While some of the uses are what you describe, there are hundreds like these samples from DFSMSdfp Diagnosis: the dataset control block multivolume dataset does not reside in captured into the trace dataset. Unexpected EOF on unload dataset It is true that data set is the more common term but I wouldn't call IBM particularly consistent. :: -Original Message- :: From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On :: Behalf Of Greg Shirey :: Sent: Tuesday, May 06, 2014 3:01 PM :: To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU :: Subject: Re: Upgrade Product - Vsam Files :: :: You're probably seeing references to the DATASET class in RACF or the :: DATASET parm to the EXAMINE command or the like. IBM is pretty :: consistent about using the term data set. (See the title of the book :: Using Data Sets for instance) :: :: Regards, :: Greg Shirey :: Ben E. Keith Company :: :: :: -Original Message- :: From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On :: Behalf Of retired mainframer :: Sent: Tuesday, May 06, 2014 4:47 PM :: To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU :: Subject: Re: Upgrade Product - Vsam Files :: :: Considering that IBM (which I believe coined the word) uses the word :: dataset over 1300 times (plus another 100+ occurrences of datasets) :: in the SMS bookshelf alone, you are picking at the wrong nit. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
